Latest / Motherhood Uncut / Hidden Anxiety in Motherhood | Motherhood Uncut Podcast | Season 5 Episode 3

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Hidden Anxiety in Motherhood | Motherhood Uncut Podcast | Season 5 Episode 3 · Motherhood Uncut

0:00
SPEAKER_00: Hey, it's Kate Kripke and welcome to the Motherhood Uncut podcast.
0:04
SPEAKER_00: Here we are committed to making sure that nobody ever needs to mother alone.
0:09
SPEAKER_00: We bring to you wherever you are the conversations that we need to have to survive and thrive in motherhood, but so often keep silent about the things that make us laugh, cry, celebrate, rage about, and reflect on, the things that bring tears of sorrow and tears of joy, confusion and wonder, fear and gratitude.
0:28
SPEAKER_00: We want you to feel good about your mothering and to feel supported along the often clunky adventure of life as a mom.
0:36
SPEAKER_00: In Motherhood Uncut, you can expect eye-opening conversations with experts in parenting, mental health, and women's health, as well as moving and inspiring conversations with moms who are out there paving the way for their children.
0:48
SPEAKER_00: You'll likely agree with some of what you hear and also disagree with some of what you hear.
0:53
SPEAKER_00: All we ask is this that you come with an open mind and boatloads of compassion for yourself and mothers everywhere.
1:00
SPEAKER_00: Pull up a chair, pour yourself a glass of wine or a cup of tea, put on your walking or running shoes, turn up the volume in your car during your commute or the pickup line at school.
1:09
SPEAKER_00: Just show up.
1:10
SPEAKER_00: And Mother of Thust, we have got you.
1:20
SPEAKER_00: Motherhood Uncut podcast is sponsored by the One Clock.
1:24
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1:31
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1:50
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1:54
SPEAKER_00: Hey, it's Kate.
1:55
SPEAKER_00: Welcome back to the podcast.
1:57
SPEAKER_00: Today I'm going to be talking with you about this idea of hidden anxiety in motherhood.
2:04
SPEAKER_00: There are a lot of us out there whose actions and behaviors are fueled by an anxiety that we've never actually paused to consider.
2:15
SPEAKER_00: And my hope today is to help you understand the ways in which this anxiety might be playing a really big part in what you feel as a new mom or a mom in general, not just a new mom, but a mom in general.
2:30
SPEAKER_00: And what you can do to unhook yourself from that, why it's important to recognize that that's happening, why it's important to understand that you don't have to feel anxious in order to achieve great things, and what you can do to unhook.
2:45
SPEAKER_00: So stick around.
2:46
SPEAKER_00: This is going to be a good one.
2:48
SPEAKER_00: Hey listeners, welcome back to the Motherhood Uncut Podcast.
2:53
SPEAKER_00: And um, this is episode three of our season.
2:58
SPEAKER_00: And I have to say, uh, I miss our girl Deb.
3:02
SPEAKER_00: I miss our girl Deb.
3:04
SPEAKER_00: And I know you do too, because um, you know, she brings a levity, she brings some humor, and she's my girl.
3:14
SPEAKER_00: And I just love talking through all of these things with her.
3:16
SPEAKER_00: So um I want you to know that she will be back, and um, we are going to continue along um having her here in spirit with us.
3:25
SPEAKER_00: But um I do want to be totally honest and say that jumping in this season without her has been a little daunting.
3:33
SPEAKER_00: It's so funny how we can so easily doubt ourselves, right?
3:39
SPEAKER_00: How we can think to ourselves, oh, but I can't do that thing, or I'm not good enough to do that thing.
3:45
SPEAKER_00: Or um, what if people don't like me?
3:48
SPEAKER_00: What if they're only here because Deb was here?
3:51
SPEAKER_00: That may certainly be true for some of our listeners.
3:53
SPEAKER_00: And guess what?
3:54
SPEAKER_00: Then they won't keep listening.
3:55
SPEAKER_00: But for those of you who are still here, my guess is that you are here for really good reason.
4:02
SPEAKER_00: And so, like Deb and I have been coaching all of you for the last several years of this podcast, I will coach myself and say, those are limiting thoughts and limiting beliefs that get me in the way of showing up for you, doing what I love, what I know I'm good at, and bringing really important information to all of you out there.
4:27
SPEAKER_00: So here I am, solo time with Kate Kripke.
4:31
SPEAKER_00: And Deb, I know you're listening, so you're missed.
4:35
SPEAKER_00: All right, folks.
4:36
SPEAKER_00: So um just a little bit of a re-intro about this season for Motherhood Uncut.
4:42
SPEAKER_00: Um, because we're gonna continue to do many of the same things.
4:46
SPEAKER_00: We're gonna bring stories of humor and um inspiration and um education and information and all those things that we all need to have in motherhood.
4:58
SPEAKER_00: We're gonna be bringing them here to you.
5:00
SPEAKER_00: Um and what I am really wanting to do this season is to inspire you to be the best version of yourself in service of your kids.
5:16
SPEAKER_00: What do I mean by that?
5:17
SPEAKER_00: Well, I mean that there is no denying the fact that when we as mothers are depleted, when we are disconnected from ourselves, when we are feeling a lack of purpose, a lack of joy, a lack of inspiration, when we are being self-critical, when we're comparing ourselves to others, we don't feel very good.
5:45
SPEAKER_00: I mean, seriously, if there's anyone out here there who's doing those things and feels good, I would love to hear from you.
5:51
SPEAKER_00: Because uh dare I say most of us, all of us, if we're doing those things, we're gonna feel pretty crappy.
5:59
SPEAKER_00: In our bodies and in our psyche, right?
6:03
SPEAKER_00: When we don't feel well, we cannot show up for our kids the way they need us to.
6:11
SPEAKER_00: We just can't.
6:12
SPEAKER_00: We can want to, but we can't.
6:15
SPEAKER_00: And too often I hear moms say things like, um, I can't do that thing I've always wanted to be, wanted to do.
6:26
SPEAKER_00: I have to be here for my kids.
6:28
SPEAKER_00: Or I can't spend resources, be it time, money, energy, whatever it is, on myself in that way.
6:35
SPEAKER_00: Because I need to give those resources to my kids or some version of that.
6:40
SPEAKER_00: And my guess is that most of you listening have been there and maybe are there right now.
6:45
SPEAKER_00: And it's backwards thinking because what our kids need is for us to have the energy and the enthusiasm and the excitement and the inspiration for life.
7:02
SPEAKER_00: All of those things they need us to have so that uh they can be inspired by us, so that they feel good to be around us, so that we have the resilience to stay steady when shit hits the fan.
7:18
SPEAKER_00: It's not an either or do I uh dedicate time, energy, money, inspiration, creativity to myself, or do I dedicate that to my kids?
7:30
SPEAKER_00: Gotta get out of that all or nothing thinking.
7:33
SPEAKER_00: It's both and how can I do that in service of my kids?
7:38
SPEAKER_00: Now, many of the women who I work with happen to also be women who are pursuing careers of some sort.
7:46
SPEAKER_00: That could be a career in business, that could be entrepreneurship, that could be um sports and athletics, that could be um academia.
8:00
SPEAKER_00: Many of the women who I work with are also pursuing some sort of a profession or career outside of motherhood.
8:08
SPEAKER_00: But I want to be really clear that when I talk about this, I'm not just talking about working moms.
8:14
SPEAKER_00: I'm talking about any mom who has a passion or a purpose outside of her role as mom.
8:23
SPEAKER_00: Maybe that's a creative passion, maybe that's volunteering, maybe that's advising or being on a board.
8:33
SPEAKER_00: What we know is that folks who are purpose-driven feel better.
8:40
SPEAKER_00: When we are doing something in our lives in service of something bigger than ourselves, we feel better.
8:47
SPEAKER_00: And I'm gonna go out on a limb and say something, which I am sure people will on the back end, some people will come back and have things to say about this.
8:59
SPEAKER_00: But I do not believe that having our only purpose be our children is good for our children.
9:08
SPEAKER_00: And I don't believe it's good for us.
9:11
SPEAKER_00: If the only reason you are on this planet is to be a mom and you're dedicating everything you have to raising your children, I don't believe that that is good for your children.
9:23
SPEAKER_00: I also know that that's a recipe for burnout.
9:26
SPEAKER_00: All the all the data out there will tell us that burnout happens when we are not taking breaks from things, when we are overindulging in work.
9:45
SPEAKER_00: And to be a good mom, you need to take a break from your kids.
9:48
SPEAKER_00: You gotta take a break from mothering.
9:50
SPEAKER_00: So um, I am a major advocate for mothers, for women who are mothers, of also having some purpose outside of motherhood.
9:59
SPEAKER_00: And so, what we're talking about today, as I dive in, I really want you to know that um I'm speaking to all of you.
10:07
SPEAKER_00: I'm certainly speaking to those of you who are career-driven uh or in pursuit of some professional endeavor.
10:16
SPEAKER_00: And I'm talking to those of you who are quote unquote stay-at-home moms.
10:21
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
10:21
SPEAKER_00: You you all get to benefit from this conversation today.
10:27
SPEAKER_00: Okay, so um I want to talk today about this idea of hidden anxiety, because I've started talking about it this way because I've realized that one of the things happen that happens in the conversations I have on Instagram, conversations that I have with women really all over the world, um, in the larger virtual space, about motherhood when we talk about anxiety is almost um missing those women who most need to hear it.
11:04
SPEAKER_00: Why?
11:05
SPEAKER_00: Because many women don't identify with having or struggling with anxiety.
11:11
SPEAKER_00: It's not a terminology they might use.
11:14
SPEAKER_00: And because maternal and child mental health are so, so, so deeply interconnected, if a if a woman is just sort of used to feeling a certain way and is caught up in that, right?
11:28
SPEAKER_00: She's like so embedded in the systems that she has created in her life and so embedded in the thinking and so embedded of the habits that she can't see out of it, that if those habits are fueled by anxiety, her children are absorbing her anxiety.
11:46
SPEAKER_00: And just meant, let me take a side note to remind folks: what do we mean when we say maternal and child mental health are so intimately connected?
11:52
SPEAKER_00: Well, what children need from their parents, and because this is called motherhood uncut, I'm going to speak to mothers right now.
12:02
SPEAKER_00: Because what children need is for their mothers to be steady and stable, what they need is a sense of safety and security.
12:13
SPEAKER_00: They need their mothers to embody a sense of safety and security so that they feel safe and secure in the world.
12:23
SPEAKER_00: Does this mean that as mothers, we need to be stoic?
12:27
SPEAKER_00: No.
12:28
SPEAKER_00: Does this mean that we need to never feel any anxiety and be calm all the time?
12:34
SPEAKER_00: No.
12:36
SPEAKER_00: But it does mean that we need to begin to really challenge ourselves to work towards a mindset where we can both feel discomfort, whether that's physical or emotional discomfort, and trust that we're okay.
12:55
SPEAKER_00: Both those things can happen at the same time.
12:58
SPEAKER_00: What do I mean by okay?
13:00
SPEAKER_00: I mean that we trust that we have the capacity and the resiliency to get through to the other side.
13:07
SPEAKER_00: That's what we're going for here.
13:09
SPEAKER_00: Um, if we don't have that and we feel a state of anxiety or depression, but let's talk about anxiety, anxiety and angst and frenetic for that frenetic energy inside, and we're cut and we're kind of that's being fueled by fear.
13:26
SPEAKER_00: We're actually sending a message to our children that the world is not a safe place.
13:31
SPEAKER_00: Because if their mothers can't find a way to handle it, how the heck are they going to be able to handle it?
13:37
SPEAKER_00: So even though we don't intend to be sending that message of you're not safe, they're receiving that message.
13:46
SPEAKER_00: And they're more likely to struggle with anxiety, with behavioral challenges, with social challenges, with things like sleep, healthy sleep and healthy eating and healthy self-care.
14:03
SPEAKER_00: Um and they're likely to be really anxious.
14:09
SPEAKER_00: So we want to make sure that we know what we're working with here.
14:13
SPEAKER_00: Now, let me also say, if you move through this podcast today and you recognize that maybe you are struggling with anxiety, that does not mean that you need to run out and take medicine.
14:28
SPEAKER_00: I do believe that there is a very valid place for medicine as treatment for anxiety.
14:34
SPEAKER_00: And um, I hope that those of you who have made the decision with really good professional support to take medicine for symptoms of anxiety, I hope that you are um accepting and compassionate and kind and settled in that decision because I really do believe that there's a valid, valid time for medicine.
14:58
SPEAKER_00: I do not believe that everybody who's struggling with anxiety needs to take medicine.
15:04
SPEAKER_00: Um, I think there are a lot of other ways to work with the things that cause the anxiety and to treat the symptoms of anxiety.
15:13
SPEAKER_00: So if you walk out of this episode and you're like, oh my gosh, I think I am struggling with anxiety, please know that this does not mean that there's something terribly wrong with you and you're broken and you got to go rush out and get a therapist and find a doctor and take medicine.
15:27
SPEAKER_00: That's not what we're talking about here.
15:29
SPEAKER_00: But I do want you to be motivated to quote unquote do something about that, to learn how to manage your anxiety, to be able to talk about it so that you can get what you need to be and feel and show up in ways in your life that are more steady, that are more empowered, that are more um proactive, right?
16:00
SPEAKER_00: Y'all have heard me say this before.
16:01
SPEAKER_00: What part am I playing in the things that aren't working for me?
16:05
SPEAKER_00: The question is not, how is this my fault or where am I to blame?
16:08
SPEAKER_00: Please don't ask yourself those questions because those questions will send you into a spiral of more anxiety.
16:14
SPEAKER_00: Not helpful.
16:15
SPEAKER_00: But I do want you to ask yourself what part might I be playing?
16:19
SPEAKER_00: Because once you can ask that question, you can start to think about okay, what different decisions can I make?
16:25
SPEAKER_00: How can I think differently?
16:27
SPEAKER_00: How can I act differently?
16:28
SPEAKER_00: How can I show up differently so that I'm um no longer contributing to a situation that isn't working?
16:37
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
16:39
SPEAKER_00: So here we go.
16:41
SPEAKER_00: Let's talk about hidden anxiety in motherhood.
16:46
SPEAKER_00: This simply means what we're talking about: anxiety that exists for someone who's a mom, but is hidden or um buried or showing up as something else.
17:03
SPEAKER_00: Let's first redefine this idea of a high achieving and success-driven mom, right?
17:08
SPEAKER_00: We we talked, I talked about this a little bit just a few moments ago, but really I'm talking about that woman, that high achieving and success-driven woman is a woman who has throughout her lifetime set herself up for very high expectations.
17:28
SPEAKER_00: She is um, she has perfectionist tendencies.
17:35
SPEAKER_00: She is almost always, if not always, pushing herself to do better, to be better, to do better.
17:41
SPEAKER_00: And there's a push in that.
17:43
SPEAKER_00: There's a a bit of a critical stance on that.
17:47
SPEAKER_00: You're not good enough.
17:48
SPEAKER_00: This isn't good enough.
17:49
SPEAKER_00: Be better, do better, right?
17:51
SPEAKER_00: The high achieving and success-driven woman tends to be a doer.
17:55
SPEAKER_00: She tends to feel much more comfortable when she's being active and doing something versus quote unquote inactive and resting or sitting.
18:04
SPEAKER_00: Oftentimes, these women can't sit still for very long.
18:08
SPEAKER_00: They don't like sitting still.
18:10
SPEAKER_00: The idea of meditation might want them, make them want to gag, right?
18:15
SPEAKER_00: They're like, if it's not productive and proactive and efficient use of time, why would I do it?
18:22
SPEAKER_00: Right.
18:23
SPEAKER_00: These moms, these women, talking about women now, even before they're moms, these women tend to be, um to really thrive off being organized and in control.
18:35
SPEAKER_00: And so they tend to plan ahead to remove any unpredictability.
18:42
SPEAKER_00: Um, these women who are high achieving and success-driven, they really work to live up to other people's expectations.
18:54
SPEAKER_00: They will often compare themselves to others and almost have a little bit of a competitive stance in that, right?
19:04
SPEAKER_00: Like, I need to be not just better than this version of myself, but better than that version of that person, right?
19:13
SPEAKER_00: And and that can be fueling, right?
19:15
SPEAKER_00: It can be like can help people move up in the ladders at work or professionally.
19:20
SPEAKER_00: It can help motivate people to edit and edit and edit till they get the perfect document or the perfect talk or the perfect piece of writing or the perfect um, you know, if they're an athlete, the perfect time that they're doing something, the perfect form, whatever it is, right?
19:40
SPEAKER_00: So these women have been successful.
19:44
SPEAKER_00: These are probably women who have done pretty well in school, who have gotten accolades and awards for achievements, who who are looked up to by many people, um, and who have really achieved great things.
20:00
SPEAKER_00: And these women love being that woman.
20:06
SPEAKER_00: Right.
20:08
SPEAKER_00: These women love the feeling of being successful.
20:13
SPEAKER_00: And when they are failing at something, they freak out a little bit.
20:20
SPEAKER_00: Not okay.
20:21
SPEAKER_00: By the way, these women do not like the term good enough.
20:25
SPEAKER_00: Good enough.
20:26
SPEAKER_00: Like, what is that?
20:27
SPEAKER_00: Why would I ever want to be good enough?
20:28
SPEAKER_00: I don't want mediocracy, mediocrity, mediocracy.
20:32
SPEAKER_00: I want excellence.
20:34
SPEAKER_00: And they have achieved it.
20:38
SPEAKER_00: So that way of being in the world may have been sustainable for these women.
20:46
SPEAKER_00: And again, let me say it again.
20:48
SPEAKER_00: These people, these women are often having have some professional career in endeavor, but they may also be super strong or um, you know, very popular when they were growing up, or um great bakers, or right, um, very studious.
21:08
SPEAKER_00: So so it's just sort of uh it's almost like everything these women set their minds to, they do, they are, they are intentionally, it's not even intentionally, they are habitually and impulsively needing to do it well.
21:24
SPEAKER_00: I guess the other thing I want to say before I go a little bit farther is that one of the things that makes this really tricky is that these women are not just doing those things and achieving great things, but they're defining themselves by their achievements.
21:39
SPEAKER_00: So, in other words, if they weren't achieving great things, they wouldn't know who they were.
21:44
SPEAKER_00: Who are they beyond these great achievements?
21:47
SPEAKER_00: They feel lost.
21:48
SPEAKER_00: And so the need to keep getting that dopamine hit, to keep getting the kudos, to keep getting the recognition, it sort of fuels this behavior, which I Course is exhausting, right?
22:02
SPEAKER_00: If if you're out there, you you know, you don't need to be telling me to tell you how exhausting it is.
22:06
SPEAKER_00: You may know someone like that.
22:07
SPEAKER_00: It's exhausting, but it's also this sort of it's sort of this at this point necessary process because without it they feel lost.
22:17
SPEAKER_00: Okay, so maybe this was sustainable in life, right?
22:22
SPEAKER_00: Before you were a parent, before you were a mother, you could work all night and then sleep all morning, you know, crash after working all night.
22:33
SPEAKER_00: You could um you could um I mean, you could really do anything, right?
22:42
SPEAKER_00: You could um exercise whenever you wanted to relieve some of that stress.
22:48
SPEAKER_00: You could um go out and party if you needed to check out, right?
22:53
SPEAKER_00: All those things that may have actually, you know, been just a part of that whole life were easy for you to access.
23:03
SPEAKER_00: In fact, people probably called you a high-achieving go-getter, right?
23:08
SPEAKER_00: You not only uh benefited from this because of the achievements you accessed, but you benefited this because people were um admiring you.
23:20
SPEAKER_00: Admiring you.
23:23
SPEAKER_00: I do want to say, by the way, that all those things that I just listed, the perfectionist tendencies, the pushing yourself to do better, the being a duter, the thriving off of being organized and in control, the planning ahead to remove unpredictability, the living up to other people's expectations, these actually were coping mechanisms, oh my gosh, my brain, mechanisms, thank you, coping mechanisms for an underlying anxiety that was fueling that behavior.
24:03
SPEAKER_00: So rather than have to feel that anxiety, whether it's the shortness of breath or the tension and tightness in your chest or the turning of your belly, or the racing thoughts, rather than having to feel that anxiety, you did those things, right?
24:21
SPEAKER_00: You you obsessively exercised, or you obsessively cleaned your house, or you obsessively lived up to other people's expectations, or you planned and planned and planned, or you became more organized, or again, you were a doer, or you just kept pushing yourself to be better.
24:37
SPEAKER_00: All of those behaviors that actually fueled your success are also coping techniques for anxiety.
24:51
SPEAKER_00: So as long as you can do those things and no one's being negatively impacted except yourself, because of course it's exhausting, but we'll get to that later, then you can just keep doing it.
25:02
SPEAKER_00: Every time you feel a little bit anxious, you can do another edit to that thing to help you feel better about it, or stay up late working on something, or go for a run, or you know, whatever the thing is.
25:16
SPEAKER_00: That's why we say it's hidden, by the way, because the anxiety is hidden underneath the behaviors, and the behaviors lead you towards success, but in many ways, the behaviors that lead you towards success are being fueled by something that someone who's in the clinical field might call clinical anxiety.
25:42
SPEAKER_00: Okay, so maybe it was sustainable, and then you had a baby.
25:52
SPEAKER_00: And all of a sudden, you can't do whatever you want to do whenever you want to do it in order to distract yourself or push away or manage those feelings.
26:07
SPEAKER_00: So you can't sleep whenever you want, you can't eat whatever you want.
26:10
SPEAKER_00: I mean, you can, but right?
26:11
SPEAKER_00: You're you fill yourself with junk food, you're gonna feel pretty exhausted and not have the energy, right?
26:16
SPEAKER_00: Probably may even be in that situation where that's what's happening for you.
26:19
SPEAKER_00: But you can't sleep whenever you want, you can't exercise whenever you want and for however long you want.
26:23
SPEAKER_00: You can't work for as long as you want, whenever you want.
26:27
SPEAKER_00: You can't, you can't go out and party for as long, whenever you want.
26:31
SPEAKER_00: Again, you can, but once you have a baby, there are going to be very, very negative consequences for those things.
26:40
SPEAKER_00: So when those strategies are taken away, you begin to actually feel the feelings of anxiety.
26:48
SPEAKER_00: You feel the tightening in your chest, the unsettled tummy, the racing thoughts, the agitation, the irritability, the rage.
26:57
SPEAKER_00: You notice catastrophic thinking.
27:01
SPEAKER_00: And because you maybe can't plan ahead and plan ahead and plan ahead to get ahead of the catastrophic thinking and quote unquote, make sure nothing bad happens, that catastrophic feeling is just catastrophic feeling.
27:14
SPEAKER_00: Thinking is just catastrophic thinking, and then it leads to feelings of fear, and you're left with the fear.
27:20
SPEAKER_00: Now, what do you do when you notice the fear or the anxiety?
27:24
SPEAKER_00: Well, you try to put into place all of the coping mechanisms that you're used to.
27:32
SPEAKER_00: So you end up trying to get more things done on your to-do list.
27:39
SPEAKER_00: You try to get everything clean.
27:42
SPEAKER_00: You try to return every call and every email.
27:45
SPEAKER_00: You try to plan ahead and plan ahead and plan ahead to avoid uncertainty and unpredictability.
27:53
SPEAKER_00: You try to push yourself to be better.
27:56
SPEAKER_00: You try to live up to other people's expectations.
28:00
SPEAKER_00: You try to stay active and do and do and do and do.
28:04
SPEAKER_00: And now things are actually, rather than having those things lead you towards success, instead, what those coping behaviors are leading you towards is constant worry about your kids, whether or not they're okay.
28:24
SPEAKER_00: Overcompensating, swinging from telling yourself you have to, you know, just stay steady and just do everything the way you're supposed to until you finally explode and then you fall apart.
28:39
SPEAKER_00: And then you feel terrible about falling apart.
28:42
SPEAKER_00: And so you overcompensate by trying not to say no to your kid, right?
28:47
SPEAKER_00: There's all this overcompensating.
28:49
SPEAKER_00: That overcompensating can look in a million different ways.
28:52
SPEAKER_00: That's that all or nothing thinking and all or nothing behavior.
28:55
SPEAKER_00: You also begin to micromanage.
28:59
SPEAKER_00: You try to control everything around you, even those things that aren't actually in your control, how other people are thinking, how other people are feeling, choices other people are making.
29:11
SPEAKER_00: You begin to micromanage, you start losing your patience.
29:18
SPEAKER_00: You experience a ton of guilt.
29:23
SPEAKER_00: You engage in so much critical self-talk that actually starts leading to shame.
29:33
SPEAKER_00: You um notice and feel this deep lacking in confidence.
29:39
SPEAKER_00: Where did I go?
29:42
SPEAKER_00: You lose that confidence again when you're no longer when those strategies that you've used for so much of your life to um cope with anxiety, when those things no longer work, and in fact, not only do they not work, but they create more anxiety, you find yourself in this cycle where quote unquote, nothing you do is working.
30:14
SPEAKER_00: No matter how hard you try, no matter how much effort you put to get things off your to-do list, no matter how many times you try to clean the house, no many, no matter how many times you try to um not disappoint people, no matter how many times you try to um uh you know get something perfect for your children, tend to all their needs, they still want more.
30:40
SPEAKER_00: They still feel X, Y, or Z.
30:42
SPEAKER_00: Nothing works.
30:45
SPEAKER_00: You're exhausted, you feel lost, you kind of feel a little crazy in your head.
30:52
SPEAKER_00: You're showing up one way, you're you're trying to present one way to the world around you.
30:56
SPEAKER_00: You're so used to people seeing you as competent and confident and together that you work so hard to present that way.
31:03
SPEAKER_00: And then you go home at night and you close the door and you fall apart and you feel like an imposter.
31:10
SPEAKER_00: This is what happens.
31:13
SPEAKER_00: And what we say here is that, you know, while while so much of the language out there is as a culture, we talk, we kind of chalk this up to like, this is just mom guilt.
31:26
SPEAKER_00: This is just what life as a mom looks like.
31:30
SPEAKER_00: Which by the way, makes me crazy because then we get so used to feeling that way that we think there's no other way to feel.
31:42
SPEAKER_00: So we're like, yeah, well, quote unquote, all moms lose their patience, quote unquote, all moms feel guilty, quote unquote, all moms are exhausted.
31:51
SPEAKER_00: And it's not that it's not true, of course all moms lose their patience, of course all moms are tired a lot of the time, of course all moms have moments of feeling guilt.
32:02
SPEAKER_00: It's not that that's not true, but when we set ourselves up to expect that as the baseline, we miss the danger of that, which is that research has shown us over and over and over and over that this anxiety, whether it's hidden or not, is rubbing off on our children.
32:31
SPEAKER_00: It's leading to those unwanted consequences for our kids, like learning and behavioral difficulties, challenges with sleep, social difficulties, poor emotion regulation.
32:43
SPEAKER_00: I can't tell you how many times I've worked with moms who are trying to quote unquote sleep change train their babies or their children.
32:50
SPEAKER_00: And they run hot.
32:52
SPEAKER_00: These moms run hot, right?
32:54
SPEAKER_00: They're they're used to getting things done and succeeding and getting them done well, and they've become determined to help their kids sleep from that same place.
33:03
SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna plan ahead, I'm gonna learn, I'm gonna plan ahead, I'm gonna do it the right way, and it's gonna work.
33:09
SPEAKER_00: And if it doesn't work, it's not that my child is having a hard time sleeping.
33:13
SPEAKER_00: And what if, you know, we hold that lightly versus I'm doing something wrong, that my child is having a hard time sleeping.
33:19
SPEAKER_00: And so they put all this pressure on themselves and it comes time to bedtime and they're feeling all anxious, and they quote unquote do all the right things and they put their child to bed, but their baby still doesn't sleep.
33:30
SPEAKER_00: And what they're missing, maybe this is you.
33:34
SPEAKER_00: What they're missing is the reality that if if you, if me, if we are trying to help our children sleep, but we're doing that from a place of anxiety, there's no way our children are gonna sleep well.
33:51
SPEAKER_00: Because our children breathe in the air we breathe out.
33:56
SPEAKER_00: So if I am running hot, high pressure, high expectations, uh, that quote unquote hidden anxiety that's sort of fueling my motivation to learn more and do more, right?
34:11
SPEAKER_00: If underneath is that anxiety and it's sort of coming out of my pores, my children will feel that.
34:20
SPEAKER_00: Which means they will feel anxious.
34:22
SPEAKER_00: They won't sleep well, they will have big feelings and throw tantrums and be looking to us to help us stay steady and show them that they can both have big feelings and feel okay.
34:40
SPEAKER_00: But instead, we're feeling anxious.
34:42
SPEAKER_00: What can I do to make them stop feeling so angry?
34:45
SPEAKER_00: And so we try to micromanage and we come at it from an anxious place, and it's like kerosene on the fire.
34:54
SPEAKER_00: So I want to be really clear here and remind you that the goal of this is not to turn you, certainly hasn't been to turn myself.
35:07
SPEAKER_00: It's not the goal, it's not to turn you, us women, into people who don't achieve great things.
35:16
SPEAKER_00: Not the point.
35:18
SPEAKER_00: Not the point.
35:20
SPEAKER_00: But the purpose is to help you understand that the way you're going about it is not working for you.
35:32
SPEAKER_00: The way you've been going about getting ahead of your anxiety may have served you before you were a mom.
35:38
SPEAKER_00: But now that you have a child and motherhood, having a baby, having a child is just uh characterized by uncertainty and unpredictability and messiness and chaos.
35:52
SPEAKER_00: What's not working is your strategy.
35:57
SPEAKER_00: There's nothing wrong with you.
35:59
SPEAKER_00: What's not working is your strategy.
36:04
SPEAKER_00: And what's important to get beyond that is to remove, understand first, pay attention to and get curious about, understand first any old methods for success and and and achieving that are A coping mechanism for anxiety and B simply not working in motherhood.
36:34
SPEAKER_00: We want to remove those and learn new ways to show up in our lives that both reduce this symptoms of hidden anxiety, right?
36:45
SPEAKER_00: That both treat, prevent, support those symptoms, and also set our kids up to thrive.
36:54
SPEAKER_00: Because when we're thriving, when we have better tools for managing our own anxiety, when we are engaging in purpose, here we are again, purpose-driven work, whether it's inside motherhood or outside motherhood, right?
37:12
SPEAKER_00: I'm sorry, inside the home or outside of the home, right?
37:15
SPEAKER_00: When we are fueling our desire to make a difference in the world and to positively impact people, but when we're doing that from a place of understanding our um tendencies towards anxiety and then managing those symptoms from a place that actually helps us do even more than we ever imagined we could do, but to do that from a place of health and well-being and groundedness, when we can do that, both us and our children thrive.
37:52
SPEAKER_00: All of us, we get better sleep, we do, and our children do.
37:56
SPEAKER_00: We have more energy, we do, and our children do.
38:00
SPEAKER_00: We have more deep and secure relationships with ourselves and others, we do, and our children do.
38:08
SPEAKER_00: We have lasting confidence in ourselves, we do, and our children do.
38:15
SPEAKER_00: We have more stability, more capacity to stay calm, even in the most hectic, uncomfortable moments.
38:24
SPEAKER_00: We do and our children do.
38:25
SPEAKER_00: We have more clarity in our thinking, we feel more joy, we do, and our children do.
38:34
SPEAKER_00: And it's really profound to watch that happen in real time.
38:41
SPEAKER_00: I'm so motivated by this.
38:43
SPEAKER_00: To remind you, I've talked about with this with Deb in other seasons of the podcast.
38:47
SPEAKER_00: I'm so motivated by this because this was me.
38:53
SPEAKER_00: I'm sure you've heard the stories before, but I was raised by two very high-achieving, very perfectionist, very anxious parents.
39:02
SPEAKER_00: And my mom in particular did freaking amazing things in the world.
39:08
SPEAKER_00: She was a badass.
39:10
SPEAKER_00: She was a powerhouse.
39:12
SPEAKER_00: Everyone loved her.
39:15
SPEAKER_00: She also said to me, uh, she died eight years ago.
39:18
SPEAKER_00: She also said to me, as I've said on this podcast, uh, the last time I saw her, she said to me tearfully, I have been running for class president every day of my entire life.
39:30
SPEAKER_00: She died at 71.
39:32
SPEAKER_00: Dang it, that's exhausting.
39:35
SPEAKER_00: No wonder she died suddenly and unexpectedly.
39:41
SPEAKER_00: Right?
39:42
SPEAKER_00: She ran herself into the ground.
39:46
SPEAKER_00: Now, again, I want to be really clear that it the achieving great things is not the problem.
39:53
SPEAKER_00: The modality and the um process and the strategies to get there can be problematic.
40:02
SPEAKER_00: Now, and it we just showed an example of how it was problematic for her.
40:06
SPEAKER_00: She ran herself into the ground.
40:08
SPEAKER_00: How was it problematic for me?
40:10
SPEAKER_00: I grew up believing I had to be perfect.
40:13
SPEAKER_00: I had massive panic attacks as a child, massive panic attacks.
40:18
SPEAKER_00: You know, something I haven't talked a whole lot about on this podcast is that when I was 18, I started a psychiatrist in New York City prescribed me Xanax.
40:30
SPEAKER_00: And I took Xanax every single day for 18 years.
40:35
SPEAKER_00: Now, many of you will know that that is not the appropriate use of a benzodiazepine like Xanax.
40:44
SPEAKER_00: Xanax is incredibly incredibly addictive.
40:48
SPEAKER_00: And it is a very important tool for some people.
40:53
SPEAKER_00: Um, but the way it was prescribed to me and the way I used it was not helpful, and it was very inappropriate.
40:59
SPEAKER_00: I think I saw my psychiatrist three times during that time.
41:04
SPEAKER_00: And I didn't need the medicine.
41:08
SPEAKER_00: What I needed was to learn how to approach and relate to the thoughts I was having that told me I wasn't good enough until I achieved X, Y, or Z, that gave me tools for self-compassion, that taught me how to take care of my brain, take care of my brain with things like sleep and exercise and nutrition and breath and hydration and mindfulness and play and being in nature, those things that we know help our brain function better.
41:47
SPEAKER_00: There were things I needed that I wasn't getting when I took medicine for 18 years.
41:54
SPEAKER_00: And when I finally decided not to take it, and side note, take us off on a little tangent here, why did I decide not to take it?
42:03
SPEAKER_00: Because I met my husband.
42:05
SPEAKER_00: And my husband, who grew up in Toledo, Ohio, and um really, I mean, love him dearly, but did not have the uh emotional intelligence or the the experience in psychological thinking and um, you know, mental health was like, uh, I'm not marinating you when you're on that medicine.
42:32
SPEAKER_00: I want to know who you are when you're off that medicine.
42:34
SPEAKER_00: I remember at the time I was like, how dare you?
42:37
SPEAKER_00: How dare you?
42:38
SPEAKER_00: This medicine helps me be more of who I am.
42:41
SPEAKER_00: Now, of course, part of that was I was terrified to go off the medicine because if I didn't have the medicine, how was I going to survive?
42:49
SPEAKER_00: That's what I had told myself.
42:51
SPEAKER_00: But I did.
42:52
SPEAKER_00: I went off the medicine with some really good support and really learned to rely on these other modalities for mental health and well-being that were in my control that I could make choices about and access.
43:11
SPEAKER_00: And ultimately, um, you know, I'm now 51 and yeah, I got my moments.
43:18
SPEAKER_00: Of course, anxiety as a mom, you know, we're gonna worry, we're gonna have moments, and I have some genetic predisposition, and I have, I know that I need, I know that I need things like sleep and nutrition and exercise and time with friends and my meditation practice in order to manage the likely symptoms of anxiety for me, but I manage them now.
43:40
SPEAKER_00: And now I'm able to take full responsibility for those feelings of anxiety when they come up.
43:49
SPEAKER_00: And rather than push myself to be perfect or take on those tendencies again, or push myself, demand that I do things better, or get Really active to do more or try to live up to other people's expectations and to plan and to micromanage.
44:06
SPEAKER_00: Instead of doing those things, I sit back and I go over here to my non-pharmaceutical prescription and I pull something from there.
44:15
SPEAKER_00: And when I can do that, I can show up with more steadiness for whatever's happening around me, whether it's a messy house or a child who's struggling or someone who's angry with me or disappointed or conflict with someone or a challenge with work or whatever it is.
44:33
SPEAKER_00: When I'm able to access my own mental well-being in new and different ways, and I don't have to jump to all those things that aren't helpful, right?
44:45
SPEAKER_00: That I can tend to my nervous system and stay steady and get curious with what's happening rather than uh judgmental, right?
44:56
SPEAKER_00: I can um help my kids feel understood and seen and heard.
45:03
SPEAKER_00: And I'll tell you something.
45:05
SPEAKER_00: I've posted this before on Instagram.
45:07
SPEAKER_00: When someone feels understood and seen and heard, they will love you forever.
45:14
SPEAKER_00: If you can do that for yourself, if you can understand, see, and hear yourself, you will love yourself forever.
45:22
SPEAKER_00: There's no fixing that that statement doesn't say when someone feels helped by you, they will love you forever.
45:30
SPEAKER_00: No, this is about getting tools to figure out in moments of chaos, in moments of uncertainty, in moments of unpredictability, what can I do?
45:42
SPEAKER_00: Not to make those moments go away, but to stay steady amidst those moments.
45:50
SPEAKER_00: And when you can do that, when you can do that, everything becomes more effortless.
45:59
SPEAKER_00: Parenting your kids becomes more effortless.
46:03
SPEAKER_00: Um, accessing that next thing you're working on at work, that next achievement you want, that next goal you're setting, that next um project you want to do, that next talk you want to give, that next thing you want to write, that next hard conversation you want to have, all of that stuff becomes more effortless when you have managed the undercurrent of hidden anxiety first.
46:32
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
46:34
SPEAKER_00: So there you have it.
46:36
SPEAKER_00: Are you coming out of this episode today thinking to yourself, oh my gosh, I've never considered that I might be struggling with anxiety?
46:43
SPEAKER_00: Or maybe you're someone that's like, yeah, yeah, I've heard all this.
46:46
SPEAKER_00: Yes, I am, I struggle with anxiety.
46:49
SPEAKER_00: Either of those two, we're gonna do a couple of things before we close down today.
46:54
SPEAKER_00: Number one, put your hand on your heart, feel your feet on the floor.
46:59
SPEAKER_00: Take a deep, long, steady inhale and a deep, long, steady exhale.
47:07
SPEAKER_00: And give yourself some compassion.
47:11
SPEAKER_00: You're one of many for one.
47:13
SPEAKER_00: So welcome to the party.
47:16
SPEAKER_00: You are not alone.
47:17
SPEAKER_00: So many of us understand that feeling.
47:21
SPEAKER_00: And number two, that way of being in the world, of trying to get ahead of hard feelings, of anxiety, of engaging in critical thinking, of pushing away any emotional discomfort, that was learned somewhere.
47:38
SPEAKER_00: And it was learned for good reason.
47:40
SPEAKER_00: At one point in your life, it was really helpful for you.
47:44
SPEAKER_00: By the way, many of those things have helped you succeed.
47:47
SPEAKER_00: I also want to say, just before we wrap up here, that it's not that you can never commit to living up to someone's expectations or to be organized and to manage for unpredictability.
48:04
SPEAKER_00: Those things are not bad in and of themselves.
48:07
SPEAKER_00: We just want you to know when they're going to be helpful and when they're not.
48:10
SPEAKER_00: And I'm telling you right now, in motherhood, they are not helpful.
48:15
SPEAKER_00: So you can save those for other areas of your life where they serve you.
48:20
SPEAKER_00: But in motherhood, they don't serve you.
48:25
SPEAKER_00: So honor that they were learned somewhere and they were learned somewhere for valid reason.
48:29
SPEAKER_00: And now we just need to help you access some other tools and and and be really kind and compassionate with yourself if you are noticing or begin beginning to get curious about your own children's struggle, their anxiety, their agitation, their challenges with certain behaviors, be it sleep or making friends or learning.
48:53
SPEAKER_00: And if you're beginning to step back enough to say that brave, wise, wise, wise, wise, why I've created creative question, what part might I have been playing in that?
49:05
SPEAKER_00: Remember, don't say, oh my God, it's all my fault.
49:07
SPEAKER_00: Don't do that.
49:09
SPEAKER_00: What part might I have been playing in that?
49:12
SPEAKER_00: If you can ask yourself that question and then say to yourself, okay, my kid is going to have his or her own life's challenges because every human does.
49:25
SPEAKER_00: But I am going to tend to this hidden anxiety in service of them so that I can unhook myself from any challenges that they're having, so that I can begin to show up as a more steady, consistent, secure mother for them.
49:43
SPEAKER_00: Once you ask yourself that question, what part might I be playing?
49:46
SPEAKER_00: You can begin to do things differently.
49:48
SPEAKER_00: Like there's nothing more empowering than that.
49:51
SPEAKER_00: And it's never too late.
49:53
SPEAKER_00: So offer yourself some compassion.
49:56
SPEAKER_00: Offer yourself a whole lot of perspective here.
50:01
SPEAKER_00: Remind yourself that you're part of a big, big community of women who have struggled for many, many years, if not a whole lifetime, with things like anxiety.
50:12
SPEAKER_00: And recognize how brave it is to begin to ask those questions and to begin to take full ownership for, okay, so what now?
50:22
SPEAKER_00: Find yourself a therapist, find yourself a coach, commit to different levels of self-care and boundary them.
50:31
SPEAKER_00: One of the hardest things to do for women who are high achievers and success-driven is to actually pause and say, but what do I want?
50:42
SPEAKER_00: What do I need?
50:44
SPEAKER_00: And then to ask for support with those things, that's gonna be really hard for many of you.
50:50
SPEAKER_00: Find one thing.
50:52
SPEAKER_00: Find one thing and ask for support around it.
50:55
SPEAKER_00: Actually, a beautiful question I'm gonna leave you with today is what three things do you know that you need to be mentally well enough?
51:04
SPEAKER_00: And what I mean by that when I say mentally well enough, I mean we're not looking for like euphoria.
51:10
SPEAKER_00: We're not looking for like, I feel amazing all the time.
51:13
SPEAKER_00: We're looking for I feel more grounded.
51:15
SPEAKER_00: Okay, that's the question.
51:17
SPEAKER_00: What three things do you know that you need to be mentally well enough?
51:20
SPEAKER_00: And these need to be tangible things: sleep, exercise, healthy food, time with friends, a shower every day, time alone, time outdoors, um, a hobby, whatever it is, but you only get three.
51:39
SPEAKER_00: What are your top three?
51:41
SPEAKER_00: And these things become non-negotiable for you from this point forward.
51:48
SPEAKER_00: In whatever, I actually would love for you to take baby steps with this.
51:51
SPEAKER_00: So if it's exercise and it's non-negotiable, you don't have to start going to the gym every day.
51:56
SPEAKER_00: But you do need to start going for a 10-minute walk every day.
52:01
SPEAKER_00: If it's time with friends, you don't need to go out every night with your girlfriends, but you do need to schedule once a night or once a week hike, lunch, tea, coffee, dinner, whatever that thing is, where you're gonna connect with someone.
52:16
SPEAKER_00: And when you start noticing your brain, go, yeah, but with what time?
52:20
SPEAKER_00: Or but I can't do that, or I want you to see those as limiting beliefs.
52:24
SPEAKER_00: You've been taught that.
52:25
SPEAKER_00: You've learned to believe that.
52:27
SPEAKER_00: You've learned to believe that someone else is gonna suffer and struggle if you tend to what you want and need.
52:35
SPEAKER_00: That is a limiting belief.
52:38
SPEAKER_00: So find one thing.
52:40
SPEAKER_00: I'm sorry, three things, find three things and do we each one of those this week baby steps and begin to ask for support around those things.
52:53
SPEAKER_00: If it's exercising, find a babysitter, ask your partner to be with the kids, find a friend to be with your kids, have your kids go home with another kid, right?
53:03
SPEAKER_00: Is it if it's um time, let go of something else to make time for that?
53:10
SPEAKER_00: Maybe you begin to say, I won't return my emails every day until I've taken, till I've done three minutes of mindful breathing.
53:22
SPEAKER_00: I don't care what it is, but you gotta boundary it and treat it like a non-negotiable.
53:29
SPEAKER_00: Because when you do those things, you will become more resilient to stress.
53:34
SPEAKER_00: And when you become more resilient to stress and you're more steady, you will have less of a need to lean into perfectionist thinking or push yourself to do better or do more or micromanage or, you know, all those things that end up getting us into trouble.
53:55
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
53:56
SPEAKER_00: So there you have it.
53:57
SPEAKER_00: We'll put some resources in the show notes for anyone that wants to find support around these things in nationally in your area.
54:05
SPEAKER_00: Um, certainly I always welcome uh uh there's a link in the show notes always for you to schedule a free consultation with me if you want to talk more about what working with me might look like.
54:19
SPEAKER_00: Um and, you know, there are great apps out there, there are great local therapists, there's all kinds of great support for women who are struggling with anxiety.
54:30
SPEAKER_00: And let's let's get you to a place where you feel really empowered, where you feel really good, where you feel really purposeful, where you feel really alive, energetic, curious, creative, steady, patient.
54:49
SPEAKER_00: Because when you are there, your kids will benefit.
54:54
SPEAKER_00: You won't need to worry about them anymore the way you're worrying about them now.
54:58
SPEAKER_00: All right, listeners, you've got this.
55:01
SPEAKER_00: And I'll see you next week.
55:04
unknown: Bye.
55:06
SPEAKER_00: Hey listeners, we sure hope you enjoyed that episode.
55:10
SPEAKER_00: And if you did, we would really love for you to share this with a friend.
55:16
SPEAKER_00: So here's the deal: we're all in this together, and as a community of moms, we need to make sure that no one is left alone.
55:25
SPEAKER_00: So you can help us with that.
55:28
SPEAKER_00: Please share this episode or other episodes that you found useful for you.
55:33
SPEAKER_00: Please consider writing a review and rating this podcast because when you do, it actually makes it more accessible to other moms who might be looking for podcasts that they would also find useful.
55:44
SPEAKER_00: So we are so grateful you're here.
55:47
SPEAKER_00: And if you were interested in just taking a minute or two to share and rate and review, Dev and I would be so grateful.
55:56
SPEAKER_00: Thank you for mothering with us.