Latest / You Call That Radio? / 'Get Rich or Try Lying' w/ Gavin Bain (California Schemin')

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'Get Rich or Try Lying' w/ Gavin Bain (California Schemin') · You Call That Radio?

• 0:08
  Speaker A: Radio. We are going to go live with Brains, AKA Gavin Bain, who is celebrating the release of a movie about his real life experiences of being in the band that the act Syllable and Brains, which was a two piece from Dundee, who tried to go to Scotland, tried to go to London to get a record deal. They didn't like the Scottish accent so they pretended to be American. And if anyone has been watched the show before we spoke before, he's running. Both him and Billy have been in the show before talking about their experiences. I think that was in lockdown or something like that. And at the time they were talking about, I don't know if it was on air or off air that the movie was in the pipeline where. Well, now it's nationwide cinemas. It's called California Scheming. Go in and check it out. And yes, Gavin is with us now. How you doing, mate?
• 1:06
  Speaker B: I'm good though. I'm good.
• 1:07
  Speaker A: What up, folks?
• 1:08
  Speaker B: You know what sucks though? Life's like hemorrhoids. It's a pain in the butthole. And just jokes. Sometimes you watch everything you love get screwed in the butt like cuckolds. What's up, Mark? You good?
• 1:22
  Speaker A: I'm well, I'm well, I am, I'm very well and I'm. I'm. I'm glad I've not seen the movie yet because it's. I live in the, in the, the Inverce island, so there's not really much here. By the way, I've heard that. Yes, it's a beautiful place. It's a beautiful place, but not, not. And not cutting edge enough to have the new movies out. So, yeah, I'm going to hopefully see it at the weekend and I'm excited. So what, what can I expect to see?
• 1:53
  Speaker B: I think, you know what, like the Scottish audiences have. It popped, you know, it really popped in Scotland, like in the Glasgow Film Festival. I felt like, I felt like they got every joke. There's a. It's, it's very obviously it's very Scottish centric, you don't have to be a Scot. But I think when you watch it you get the inside jokes, you get all the kind of the local colloquialisms, you know, like. And I think it just really popped in Glasgow. Like every single. You see it a couple times you notice all the. Like, all right, there should be a laugh here, there should be this here. And in Glasgow and Dundee it was just like raucous. It was like laughs and you could hear people like start to kind of hold back tears. At points. So I think, yeah, it's quite. It's quite deep if you're. If you're, you know, like, if you've. If you've been in, like, trying to make it from Scotland, I think it'll really hit home some real. I think that that's the one thing that's quite surprising. I think more. A lot of people were saying, I didn't expect it to be that deep. And it's kind of like, why didn't you. Why do you know?
• 2:56
  Speaker A: Because.
• 2:57
  Speaker B: Do you think it's just gonna be a barrel ass? Like, we. We went through. We went kind of through hell, you know, it's like, it's quite deep. You know, it's quite a deep story. So, yeah, I. I think. I think you like it. I mean, hopefully you like it, but, yeah, it's. I think being, you know, a rapper and being. And knowing the scene and. And going through everything that you go through when you're doing a genre that, you know, like, isn't massive in your country. And when you're trying, as soon as you go out there and you got a bit of ambition and you try to get. Get it done, you know, and you're young, you're young, crazy young, and you're like, I want to take on the world, you know, and then you get that hit, you get that sucker punch to the gut. I think everyone who's kind of been through that, you know, might feel it. And I think that's the kind of. A lot of the things that, you know, when me and Bill, we knew what we'd been through, and I think a lot of people at first didn't know the full ins and outs of what actually happened. So I think now it's kind of like, all these years later, it's been good to kind of get our story out and show people actually what we went through and that, what our intentions were. And then, God, how things go off the rails when you're just young and crazy and you're just going for it, you know?
• 4:11
  Speaker A: And so. So I think the last time I spoke to you, as I just said the other. I can't remember if we spoke about off air or on air, that there was a film in the pipeline, because I think it was maybe still a secret at the time. You couldn't publicize because it was. It wasn't. Obviously, these things take ages to. To happen, so can. Now that we can talk about it freely. So. So at that point, was James McAvoy involved? How long has this been? I Mean, obviously, I know that the Great Hip Hop Hoax, the book, the documentary, has been about for ages. So at what point it was always destined to be a movie. But these things aren't easy. So take us back to. How does. How does James McAvoy get involved?
• 4:50
  Speaker B: It was a long journey, man. And I remember, yeah, having that chat. Like, I was. It was kind of happening. But, man, I just remember the first couple of deals that was in, like, early, you know, like 2010 and 2011. And, you know, like, Irvin Welsh was a part of, like, the first deal that we ever did. You know, Arvin was one of the first people to, like, reach out and be like, man. Because he was in the industry as well with Creation Records and that. And he was like, I really, you know, I get it. You know, and so he was like, I used to send him first little drafts of the. Of the book and stuff, and he was so. He was so good and helpful. And then, like, when you. That's your hero, like, in terms as a writer. And then that didn't end up happening. And I was so heartbroken every time we'd get down the line trying to get it made, trying to, like, raise funding, try to get the right reputable companies on board who aren't gonna just, like, see it as some sort of kind of gimmicky thing. Like, it would just keep falling through the last stage, you know. And so I was. So. I got to the point where I was so jaded, and I was like, you know what? I can't even. I'm not even gonna give it the big in and try talk with Chess, like, it's gonna get made. Cause I was just ready for it to get blown out the water. Like, even in trying to get this film made, you would not believe how many offices, how many places I walked into and said, here's the story. And, yeah, it's a Scottish story. And they'd be like, but could we move it to London? Could we move it to. The problem is it's just a bit too fucking Scottish. That's the problem. You know? And it's like the amount of times that happened, I was like, yeah, it's a Scott. Like, what do you mean? And the amount of times I just got told, nah, I don't think it. It's not really.
• 6:31
  Speaker A: That sounds like a sequel. That actually sounds like a sequel. That's. That's actually the trailer. Do you know what? I'm going to play the trailer. Just play the trailer. Because that's basically what. What the Trailer is about. And I mean the. The absolute sort of stupidity and snobbery for a London exec to think that this would work where an English accent. I mean, this doesn't make any sense.
• 6:56
  Speaker B: Oh man. 100.
• 6:59
  Speaker A: It doesn't make sense.
• 7:01
  Speaker B: All the way from California.
• 7:05
  Speaker A: Where are you guys from?
• 7:08
  Speaker B: Scotland, mate. Pj, spend that. Yo, NASA said pump with an edge.
• 7:15
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 7:15
  Speaker B: Correction. If F Pop was dead, we're his resurrection.
• 7:18
  Speaker A: Thank you so much. We're not finished.
• 7:20
  Speaker B: It's like the Rapping Proclaimers.
• 7:23
  Speaker A: It's okay, pal. It's just one audition. It wasn't the music they were laughing at. It was us back in the day. I know what people want to hear. The next Wu Tang Clan, the next Eminem. What we're gonna do is remix.
• 7:35
  Speaker B: Emmett, look. An American.
• 7:39
  Speaker A: If we're gonna do this, that means no more Scottish.
• 7:41
  Speaker B: We gotta walk, talk, freaking be American.
• 7:45
  Speaker A: We're from California. God bless America. I'm tired to talk.
• 7:49
  Speaker B: Wherever I roam I'm gonna look incredible. You're gonna look like a tat.
• 7:53
  Speaker A: Blood, sweat and tears How I buil grow. Play young, play young. We'll show the industry up for what it is.
• 8:00
  Speaker B: I thought you were great. Yeah. We would like to sign you.
• 8:06
  Speaker A: Get the bubbles.
• 8:08
  Speaker B: They actually think you're American. Yeah, but how your accents are pure sh. I know.
• 8:12
  Speaker A: We'll le a single and then we'll
• 8:14
  Speaker B: come out fully Scottish and expose those wankers. Everyone loves you. Okay, let's do this, baby.
• 8:31
  Speaker A: Let's blow this wide open.
• 8:33
  Speaker B: You know none of this is real, right? You're losing it, Gav.
• 8:39
  Speaker A: This is what we wanted.
• 8:41
  Speaker B: This is not what we wanted.
• 8:43
  Speaker A: Stop looking back, dude. You got this, man.
• 8:53
  Speaker B: Part master hard disaster Jedi with a blaster. I think I'm in a screwdriver.
• 9:11
  Speaker A: You ready? I'm ready. Are you ready?
• 9:12
  Speaker B: I'm freaking ready. Let's go.
• 9:16
  Speaker A: There we go. And cinemas now. California scheming and. Yeah. When was the. The first time you saw it? So.
• 9:27
  Speaker B: Well, just. Just going back to like bringing James.
• 9:30
  Speaker A: Yeah, let's go back because I can interrupted you there so. Because I was just kind of sort of throwing off with the fact that a film about London execs not understanding a Scottish story within trying to turn that into an English story. But I'm not surprised. They're just throwing off. So continue.
• 9:46
  Speaker B: Just even before like I took the the deal work with Homefront who end up, you know, bringing James on board. I had a deal with offered from. Let's just say like, okay, I'm not going to Hate it. It was, like, from BBC Productions and it was like a massive money deal. They were going to throw all the money at it. And I was like, yeah, but what's your pitch? And their pitch was so weak, and it was so, like, they just didn't get the music side of it. And they didn't get. They were like, yeah, but, you know, can we make one of you this color? Can we make one of you a girl? And it's like, man, what are you talking about? Like, we need to kind of keep, like, the story of where we were from and tell. If you start changing all of that, it's just gonna come across like a worse lie. Like, what are you on about? And it was so. It was. So I just told them to get lost, anything. That there was a lot of money thrown. But it's like no one had a great idea and no one kind of saw or cared about the music. And then Homefront came along. They'd never made a movie. It's their first project, but their kids from Scotland, you know, and it was like, we get it. Like, we love the book. Like, you know, and so from there, it was like, even. Even at that point, they built an amazing team. Carol K. And like, all these people who were, like, just amazing, you know, David Gilchrist, like, who's a train spotting, you know, they put a good team together. And it. But it was just like, it was still going to fall apart. It was still going to fall through. And on the very last day of, you know, that deal about to run out, that's when James came on board. And I was just like. I couldn't actually believe it because obviously I've, like, followed all of his stuff. And I thought he was gonna be, you know, if I'm being real, I thought he was gonna be, like, kind of pompous. Cause obviously he's a massive star. And every time you, like, meet a big star or hero, they always end up being, like, disappointing. But then I sat down in a pub in Glasgow and he didn't. He wasn't like, walking in, going, oh, I'm James McAvoy. He was, you know, he had a massive movie and they see Enoch Center. There was a massive, massive poster of his face. The whole. The whole size building. And yet he came into this. This pub where, like, you know, just. People are just chilling, having a beer, sat down, high five me, got the pints in, and we just started talking about life as like a Scot. When you're. When you've got huge ambition and you and you want to, you. You really want to just say, give me a shot, give me a chance, like, and then he would always be like, yeah, no, no, kill. You're a really good actor, but could you, like, do it in a different. Can you do it in America in a. An English accent or can you do it in this Welsh accent? You know what I mean? It's like he had to fight for himself to be able to speak in his own accent, you know? So, like, I felt his anger and so we spoke for a little bit on that and the process. And then after a while we just had a couple of beers and I was like, I walked away from that going, man, this dude gets it. Like, he really gets it. And I felt like, all right, he's gonna like, you know, have like, real kind of smooth hands on this and that. And, you know, I mean, like. And then like just being a part of the process and stuff and seeing it, it was so quick from when he came on board. We're talking 15 years getting told no everywhere told no. And it took every part of me to just stay in the pocket. Obviously I'm just making music and touring and doing all the other things, but I kept lying awake some nights just going, you know, what? Like, what am I even doing? Like, who cares? I'm just, I've had enough. You know, it took James to come on board and just be like, nah, nah, honestly, I think we could do something good with this and like, and actually have it be like a positive thing for Scotland and not be some like, pony, you know, Hollywoodized garbage. You know, like even the fact that the Brixton show, he had a. He had something close with the Bara lands in him and he wanted to make that show about the Barra, you know, And I was like, man, that's, you know, everything that was coming out from them was like, actually more homage and home.
• 13:38
  Speaker A: I actually nearly went to that. There was a. For people who don't know, there was a 2000 capacity sold out show at the bar is filmed because everyone went along as extras. Is that right?
• 13:47
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And it was. And then that was the kind of the big. The big showpiece. And it was like they packed it out and like at the end, like, they. Everyone just started screaming like, here we go. You know, and it was like a proud moment because those boys, man, they aren't rappers and to learn some of the stuff, like, Bill and I always had quite technical little combined syllables that we used to move really fast, and I thought they were gonna Stay away from that. And then they actually did one of them in the film, the illnesse you legitimately giving my willy to women. They did that in the film. And I remember Seamus calling me up one day and going, like, dude, how do I do this? I'm now gonna teach him on the phone how to breathe in through his nose and sp. Hard stuff, you know, as a rapper, like, you know, people take it for granted, but a lot of this stuff takes a long time to, like, perfect even just the liquid in your mouth and you know, like. And all of that stuff is like, they didn't have a lot of time to do it and, you know, like, to see them pull that off, man, it was a real proud moment, you
• 14:52
  Speaker A: know, I mean, so. So that's interesting. So when can we talk about that? Sorry. So who are the actors? And so was that. Was that not part of the thing? Can you rap when they're going for their interview?
• 15:04
  Speaker B: Yeah. And it was a case of, like, obviously, like, you know, I met Seamus, obviously. His mom and dad are Deacon Blue, you know, like, so he comes from a kind of musical background, but obviously, like, rap's not his musical background, but, you know, but he's just. He's very adaptable. So Seamus MacLaine Ross. And when I first sat down with him, like, he started asking me about really deep things, like a lot of the trauma, you know, like landing in Motherwell and like the big traumatic event that happened to me, like, he was asking about that and that wasn't in the film. Like, that's a lot of context that doesn't happen in the film because, you know, like, if you're from. If you're from schemes of Scotland, like a huge chance, you've probably been jumped, you know, or a huge chance, you've. You've been involved in, like, Young Team kind of gang violence. Right.
• 15:53
  Speaker A: So just. I'm just away from. I just had lunch with somebody who told me that somebody get jumped in Motherwell 10 years ago. I just heard five minutes ago. So Motherwell jumping.
• 16:03
  Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, in that way.
• 16:04
  Speaker A: Motherwell.
• 16:05
  Speaker B: Motherwell Mother was a hard place to, like, get landed. And I totally get why. I understand. It's like post Thatcherism, you know, Raven's Craig had been shut down. It was like a town that went from really strong to like, suffering, you know. So, like, Seamus got that because he was asking questions about that. And so when you see him in the film that you see that he's bringing like, kind of this kind of pain in, you know, And I Think a lot of people will resonate with that pain, you know, if you've ever been jumped like that, you know, every day after that, you're trying to rebuild yourself, you know. And I went. I went to Dundee and Dundee. I always credit Dundee for like literally giving me back life, you know. And that's why a big part of the film is almost like a love story to Dundee. Like it's shot, so much is shot there. We didn't try to, like, you know, it's based in Dundee, but let's go shoot some scenes because it's cheaper shooting. I was. No, no, it's like it's heavily shot in Dundee, Glasgow, you know, so. But then Sam as well is really interesting because Sam's dad, I speak to Sam's dad and Sam's dad is a hip hop head. Like, he was. Me and him were talking for ages about like punchline rappers that he had put on an ipod, you know, for Sam, like years ago, you know. And he was talking to me about like the punchlines that Bill and I had, like, put a condom in your ear so you can't hear me coming. Like things like that. Like things that a lot of people who just like rap don't get. The, the multi layered punchlines. And Sam was just dead into it, you know. So, like those two, like together, their chemistry actually reminded me of like when Bill and I first started hanging out. And you're young and you just love it. You just want to entertain people with every breath, you know, like, they had that like chemistry and off camera now they hang out and you see them and every time I like catch them, I look over, I'm like, it's like a time loop. It takes me back to that, you know. So I think that was the key in casting those two because, like, they were good individually, but together it was like, that was it, you know.
• 17:58
  Speaker A: And so with. We said Dundee. So you did you. Because I'm confused. London was the premiere that was Friday. So you've been in London, Glasgow and Dundee this week.
• 18:10
  Speaker B: Yeah, so like the, the kind of world premiere was like in Tiff in Toronto and then the British premier was actually in Glasgow at the Glasgow Film Festival. Which was great because it was like, it was just a cinema full of people, you know, people from Glasgow. Like, you just absolutely like, got it, you know, and then we took it to Dundee and gave it like a homecoming screening. So, like, that was. That was also like, I was like, more emotional because then you've got like 250 people in a Cinema who, like, know you were there at the start, you know, and then. Yeah, like now it's just had its kind of like its opening weekend. And that was like the gala and the gala screening in Leicester Square, which is really cool because they also had some really cool Scots there. I met like, Chris Paul Lawler, who does the did you know in Scotland videos. Like, so it's really cool. It's. It's been a kind of a wacky journey, man. But.
• 19:05
  Speaker A: Oh, yeah. Did you know or did you know that in Scotland there is a secret cave?
• 19:10
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Did you know a rapper lives on this island,
• 19:22
  Speaker A: Secret island called Inverci Island? Yeah, I. No, that's good, man. That's good. So the. What the London premiere. Tell us about the London premier. So that's the opening gala weekend. That was in Friday or Saturday. 800 people on. Because I seen an interview with James McAvoy saying it was Cinema One or Cinema Two or something.
• 19:42
  Speaker B: Yeah, apparently.
• 19:43
  Speaker A: Which I wasn't really aware of, but apparently that's a big deal to get that.
• 19:48
  Speaker B: Yeah, it was like 790 odd people. And it was just massive, man. I think the difficulty was with. I'd seen it, obviously. The first time I saw it was in a smaller theater at the Glasgow Film Theater. And I was still kind of working on some of the music because, like, a lot. Some of the music in the film are beats that I made so many years ago. I don't even have the computers anymore that I made those beats. And when we were kind of talking about the music in the film, all of the cast and all of the kind of crew got given like 30 syllable and brain. So. And it was like, whatever everyone's singing or thinking about, then they'll tell me and I'll rebuild those tracks. And I was just praying that they didn't ask for this song, this song and this song. Cause I knew I didn't have the stems, I didn't have the. You know what I mean? And then they asked for those songs and so I had to rebuild them from scratch. And you know what that's like. It's like, you know, some of these. Some of them were samples. And the samples were from, like the 60s, you know, so now I have to rebuild a sample, but then I have to rebuild it in a way that it's not a sample. And it's like. Have you ever worked with, like an MPC 100? There was just our NPC 3. Sorry, 1,000, 3,000. There was just like, certain ways that you could warp shit on there that you can't recreate. I don't care what anyone says. Of course you can do crazy cool stuff on Ableton and with that VSTs. But those machines, man, I love those machines. And I did shit on those machines back in the day that I thought I'd never be able to recreate. So it took a lot to get that music. But I remember seeing it in the Glasgow Film Theater and it was like the music wasn't completely ready yet, but I got an idea. But then when I. So then when I saw it, like, again in another 200, 300, it's like perfect size. But when we went to the London gala, it was 700. It's like an auditorium, you know what I mean? It's like a massive, massive. And I thought, like, oh, I don't know, this might be a bit big, you know what I mean? Might lose the kind of quality of the sound, but it held up. But I definitely think the best place to see it is in like a 200, 300 seater, you know, because I think. And also sit centrally, you know, if you're a music fan. Sit centrally because there's a lot happening with the panning. You know, it's. It's a good experience. You know, the bass will hit you in the chest better if you sit centrally. You know what I mean? But. Nah, but it was still crazy, like, generally to, like to stand next to these people and just talk about the story. It was crazy. But I do think there's a lot of questions that were asked that were, like, I was saying, yes, like, a lot of reporters in media were saying, well, look, no, you know, now that kneecaps out and now that this is. This story's getting big, surely. No, like, you know, everyone's attitudes change to Scottish rap. Like, surely it'll be like a big. You know.
• 22:30
  Speaker A: And I wasn't.
• 22:31
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was saying that. I was like, I don't think it has, man. I really don't think it's got.
• 22:38
  Speaker A: I think it's Lehman Head. We were speaking about that just before we went there. Lehman Heads, Hopefully. I'm pronouncing that right as a Scottish Gaelic singer who's went viral with a tune in Gaelic.
• 22:50
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 22:51
  Speaker A: And which is interesting. And it's the same way. And I think that's. I think it's strange that Nika rapping and Irish Gaelic actually probably helped him in a lot of ways. Yeah, it's strange. So what is going on? Why. Why is this happening to this Country. Why does. Why is there stigma? Why is this taboo to rap in a Scottish accent?
• 23:15
  Speaker B: I think it's like when a country gets known for something. Like, obviously, for me, I always knew that you go to school in Scotland or whatever, you realize quite quickly Scotland's quite important in terms of the technology of the world. Throughout its history, it's always been extremely important. And all these different fields, scientists, sculptors, artists, there's always been phenomenal Scottish people all the way through Annie Lennox and, you know, like, the Rhythmics and, you know, all the great bands that existed all the way up to, like, then you get like, the modern era where the world is like, extremely Americanized and even Bey Clairo struggled. You know, Bethy Clairo got pushed.
• 23:58
  Speaker A: Shows come on good there, sir boys.
• 24:01
  Speaker B: Absolutely. And they got pushed down the road of like, nah. If you're doing grunge music, you've got to have that Seattle sound to your voice, you know, like. And it took them a while to like, get the power to be able to get to their third album and go, nah, we're gonna do it in our own way.
• 24:15
  Speaker A: You know, at the same time as, you know, you had your Frightened Rabbits near Las Vegas and everybody sort of started, you know, when. When Jairobaby started, it was. Scottish accent was the only way to go. It was. It was.
• 24:28
  Speaker B: Without you.
• 24:29
  Speaker A: To be authentic, you've got to do it. And I think also not being a very good singer made me double down in the fact that I had to just find my own voice.
• 24:37
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 24:37
  Speaker A: And. And to be honest, no, I know it's great to see pretty much every. In the. In the punk, post punk, whatever you call it, grunge. Just that if you're a new band in Scotland, you are probably going to lean into your Scottish accent. Great bands like Dos have just sold at that school this weekend. Cowboy Hunters are about to say, like, King Touch and everyone's. The Scottish accent is completely accepted if you've got distortion pedals behind you, but yet still we do not have that. That one act to his. And what. It's fine with poetry, it's fine with comedy. It's fine where. Yeah, stand up comedy. Actors like James McAvoy, it's been very difficult for him, but people would come up with a big impact. The band scene is fine to be Scottish in the band, but we need. How the. The actual. What's the. Been the reaction to your. Obviously people. Millions of people are now watching your film this week. Have you been getting. Have you noticed an uptick in your. I Don't know your Spotify listeners or is there people paying attention to your music personally? You and Billy's music? I should say.
• 25:46
  Speaker B: Yeah. No, I think, like, people are interested in the music. Like, I think one of the things that, you know, people end up coming along to is just going, you know, if you're outside the context of Scotland and Britain, you know, England and England and Scotland, if you're outside of that context, what I normally find is I get like, so many Australian, so many American, so many Canadians, and they just. They'll hear it and kind of go, oh, that's cool. Like, they. They don't go. They just go, I don't see what the big deal is here. Like, they go, that's cool, right? But, like, try come here and understand how hard it was back in that day, even locally. Like, it wasn't just that A&Rs in London laughed at us, right? That was like, painful as it was, you know. And then one of the. One of the heads, for me, the hardest thing was like, one of the heads of Word Lab, who was Dave Loeb, who was running Hip Hop Connection. He ran the magazine. We went to see him on the same day that we got laughed out of that. You know, we thought, let's go see this guy. I was sending him beats and he was liking all the beats. And he said, you know, come see me, you know, but people say, come see me when you're in London, you know, So I thought. I said, you know, we've just been laughed out at that audition. And I thought, let's go and see Dave Loeb. Like, he runs Hip Hop Connection. Like, he's very British centric. Hopefully he'll give us a shot. And I remember sneaking into their offices and sitting down and being like, look, we're not leaving until you give us a listen. And I remember him playing the starter tracks and going, oh, man, this beat's sick. Bopping his head. And as soon as one of us would start rapping and he hears it's a broad Scottish accent, he would just skip to the next track. And for me sitting there, I was like, it's like being punched or stabbed in the chest. I'm like, no, no, I know why he's doing this. And then I remember sitting there and he was actually the guy who said, you sound like the Rapping Proclaimers. I remember him sitting there and he was like, look, man, I'll take the bill, buy the beats off you. I was like, we're a rap group, man. Like, what's the deal. And he's like, don't make me say it. And I was like, no, what do you mean? Like, say it. And he was like, don't make me say it. And I was like, say it, man. And he said, you sound like the fucking Rapping Proclaimers. And that for me was like, man, this is the guy.
• 27:53
  Speaker A: That was quite a common thing back then. I remember getting a review once that was. Sounds like the Proclaimers and Frankie Bo mixed with Nirvana. But I think that was a compliment.
• 28:05
  Speaker B: Yeah, they mean it as a compliment.
• 28:07
  Speaker A: This was a. This was. I think we got a. An 8 out of 10. Yeah, but it was a kind of. Back in that era, there was no context to. To that much music in a Scottish accent. Obviously, there's a. There's decades of Scottish artists that. There's Scottish music that kind of lives out with the mainstream, but it's passed down traditionally in Scotland and the folk scene, for example. And then you've got all these incredible pop stars that didn't tend to lean into their accent at all. But now. Now it is very common. So I think probably what respond Zeros actually commented there's a Scottish rapper. In my experience, the only people that Scottish rap are Scottish themselves. Well, let's talk about that specifically. So Scottish, the Scottish cringe. So is this because we are a colonized country? This is my. I'm asking you a question. That's my opinion. Is it because we're colonized? And is it because we sort of grow up watching, you know, back in the day, before. Before Internet, in fact, there wasn't even many satellite channels. Our whole generation, the generation and all the generations before us, the only time you've seen a Scottish guy was Trevor from EastEnders, who was a wife. Peter.
• 29:20
  Speaker B: Yeah, maybe.
• 29:21
  Speaker A: Maybe the po. Maybe a police, maybe someone like Tiger or something. But we're always Polish or petty thieves on the bill. And another thing is that makes people. I think made people cringe was every time a Scottish person comes on television, they have to sound out in a very unnatural way. So nobody in the UK has, or further afield has really held a normal Scottish accent. And what is a normal Scottish accent? There's so many different variations. So is that the case? Is it colonizations because we're. Is it because we're not independent? And is it because our media is not independent? Is it because we just don't have enough representation in the media?
• 30:08
  Speaker B: I think it's got to do a lot of stuff. Like, I could just go from my experience of, like, you know, like singing. Like you were saying, if there's distortion and there's melody, oh, then it's. Then it's cute, then it's like cool, you know. But I remember taking my demos and hanging outside Radio Tay and, you know, going to like, record stores and giving my stuff to like, DJs and stuff, and just like hoping that someone's just going to help me or get. Give me some advice, like, what do you do? You know what I mean? And there just wasn't really any of that, you know. So like local radio. I had a friend in local radio and he said that he was going to try play. He ran it. He did a hip hop show on local radio and it's like, obviously it was mad late at night and he promised he was going to play our tracks the one time. So we waited outside in the car and it was like, you know, if he plays them, like, we'll give him a hug when he comes out. If he doesn't play them, we'll just kick his head and like, let's jump him, you know, it's like, you're so angry, you know. And when we didn't, he didn't play the tracks and we were just like ready to go off on him. He was like, listen, man, look, I. It's my, it's my job, you know, like, the station will not let me play local rap. I'm sorry. You know, And I think that is like the ignorance of, like, there just isn't enough of it. I mean, I'm talking about early days. Like, this is like when, you know, there's like two Tone committee. There's like, you know, there's melod elements in Dundee.
• 31:31
  Speaker A: There's Powercot Productions.
• 31:33
  Speaker B: Yeah, there's like a. It's. It's this Rain Clan. And there's like early days even maybe before, before Scotland Yard. And you know, there's like, there's things happening, but it's like it's one act here, one act there. What? It's not like a scene yet, you know, So I can understand people are just going like. And obviously rap so big worldwide, I can understand them going, what? Like, nah, like, nah, that's kind of odd. But then you go, I would constantly say, well, how do we build this if no one's gonna give us a fucking chance, man? Like, no one's had. It just would have taken like one kind of label or maybe all the artists coming together. You know, a lot of, A lot of grips try to do that. Like Scotland Yard tried to Bring a whole bunch, you know, like the Shadow people. Try to bring people together. Like, a lot of people were trying to do something like create crews. Yeah, exactly. Like Dungeon tried to do it and Dundee as well. Like, there was a lot of people trying to get someone together, but it just needed someone with a bit of money. People who were, like, bringing big artists to Dundee. It would always annoy me because, like, big artists would play at, like, one of the venues, and we'd always, like, ask, like, can we support them? You know, and then they would get, like, a big DJ to, why can't you just put us on the bill with that, man? You know, like. And so it was kind of like there was even the kind of. So Spawn's kind of right. Because there was a bit of that. But I just think, like, it just would have taken, like, a label to just say. To come on board an independent to say, look, we are going to take one of the records or we're gonna put a mixtape and we're gonna push it. We're gonna, like, push it. You know, we're really gonna spend some money on this. And that's what I was saying in some of these interviews. They were like, ah, but surely there's. Surely I was like, tell me a Scottish rapper. Tell me. Because I know Shogun Joe Heron.
• 33:13
  Speaker A: Like, there's, like, there's a lot.
• 33:14
  Speaker B: There's evil, there's Silver tongue. There's a lot of these boys that are, like, super, super good rappers, and they're. They're marketable as well. Who's gonna. Who's gonna take them on board? Who's gonna give them, you know, who's gonna push these guys? Do you know what I mean?
• 33:31
  Speaker A: So I made a. I cashed in. And the fact that you were bringing us a film, Top 10 Scottish Rappers, to see if I could hijack your algorithm in case people were like, as those Scottish rappers. So I went. And I've been getting in trouble because obviously I didn't mention everybody, but I tried. It just. It's just an opinion. I just had to think fast. So I went for Physics, who is very marketable, but he. I don't think he would care, but he's got a good album. He's got an album coming up with Conscious that'll be banging this year. Stanley Odd, I think. What a. Dave.
• 34:00
  Speaker B: Stanley Odd.
• 34:01
  Speaker A: Yeah, it's a good show, I think. I think Dave Hook was really important in the sense that. Because I remember when there was. There was not really any representation, but Stanley Odd, they. They Charmed the blogosphere, the indie scene. Who started liking Stanley Odd and I think that made a big difference for the Skinny started covering Stanley Odd. They started covering people like Hector Berserk and Louis and stuff like that. And then I think run about the same time Muslim was doing the BBC introducing, I believe.
• 34:27
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 34:28
  Speaker A: And you would get out. You were getting. You would get some gas was played on it. Loki was played on it. So that's when things started changing a bit for a better empress. Amazing Sherlock boys, Shogun, gasp McRoy, Loki and Mog. It's not in any particular order. I didn't overthink it and I hope people don't get offended. And it's like I could have done. I could have easily did a top 20. But then the more. The more rappers I mention, then the mayor offense people are going to get taken. If I have a top 30 rappers and then number 32 is probably my best mate. So 10 Spain. And I'll bear in mind there is a thousand. I could probably name a thousand. And I would say 30 or 40 are good. Like all music. Not everybody's good.
• 35:17
  Speaker B: I mean that's the thing. It's like, you know, for me, like I love Z from Dungeon Dwellers because the dude, he so good at crafting punchline lyrics. But I would just always be like. And I'd do some beats with him or some. Some chorus. I'd like do a chorus on his track hopefully that, you know, then there's marketability around the song because I'd like if anyone's struggling to play it or maybe like just singing a catchy hook on the track would get them to like stick in, you know.
• 35:44
  Speaker A: She's a phenomenal battle rapper as well.
• 35:46
  Speaker B: Very good battle rappers with.
• 35:49
  Speaker A: With a lot of Z stuff. It's kind of more kind of. I don't know if it recently, I'm not having it much recently, but there was a kind of horror court element to all this stuff. And also would you. Would you say for your songs as well? Because obviously your songs are maybe like. There's a lot of like sort of innuendos, like punch lines that maybe aren't radio friendly. But I'm assuming because you were going for it, I'm assuming that you already had radio friendly things good to go.
• 36:16
  Speaker B: Yeah, you always. And that's the. That's the pressure you end up getting on. Like.
• 36:21
  Speaker A: But then you're sensing yourself.
• 36:22
  Speaker B: Yeah, you kind of. And your sense of humor and like, you know, like the stuff that would go down really well live if you Grab a mic and you've got like a thunderous beat, you know, like we had this track, the Bad Guys, and it was like, it's. And it's got all these like really cool stuff and then the hook's catchy, but like it's. It's because you've got that stupid sense of humor or you've got that kind of like what you find, like kind of funny, like stand up comedy, like inspiration, you know, like that sometimes people be like, oh, what do they say there? Like, you know, you got to worry about offending people. And then you got censor yourself and you know, it ends up being like, well, what, what am I putting out here? I just write some bland stuff to write some love stories or something just to get traction. And then you kind of go like, nah, I just think you got to do your own thing, you know. Like, for me, Loki's always been quite consistent. Darren, like, he's always been quite consistent in like storytelling and being what he's about. And I just think as well, like sometimes like what I used to get early on in my, in my kind of beat making career, I was always quite like darker kind of somber tones and so many people, obviously that doesn't really transcribe live because everything's about, let's go, you know, like. And so no one, like I remember, even friends would be like, dude, this isn't good to skate to. Like, you know, And I kind of. I was going through a lot. So the hardcore stuff that I wanted to write, hip hop for me it was like, okay, well you're not allowed to write that, you know. And everyone would say, why is your song so dark? Why. Why is your song so heartbreaking? And then I start, I realized like, oh man, nobody wants to hear me talk about all this kind of darkness. So then you get pushed and then you. Whenever you grab a mic and you start freestyling. And if you do battle rap, you realize, like, the punchline is the thing that gets everyone going. And so you just get addicted to like the art of writing the punch. And so I think that for me, and I love that art because that art of writing a punchline is transferable into book writing, into any kind of form of line. The way your mind kind of puts things together is a transferable skill. But I do say, now when I look at it, I teach young rappers as well. And I always say to them, so we'll spend a lot of time on song construction and composition, but I'll tell them about, look, think about the concept at the start, make a big hook, make something that's really catchy, then just go off and express yourself in the verses. But you need the hook, you know. And so that's why sometimes when I'd see Dave from Stanley Odd and like even like kerr from the LaFontaine's, I liked what they were doing with like just making hooks and like their songs and then they got to be expressive in their verses. So I liked a lot. Like there's so many good rappers and there's so many good songs that have come out of Scotland. Like hip hop wise.
• 39:07
  Speaker A: What's your. What's your. Who's your. Who's your top. I don't say top 10. Have you got a top three? Can you give us a top three, Pete in the sport?
• 39:12
  Speaker B: Yeah, I might be able to get a top 10 on the go. So I would say I used to really like Silver Tongue back in the day before he moved away. Did he move away to like.
• 39:20
  Speaker A: Yes, he went to Australia. Yeah. I do forget about. I forget about. I forgot about Silver Tongue as well. He was a phenomenal freestyle guy.
• 39:28
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And then I really liked some.
• 39:30
  Speaker A: He was legit, man. He was like kind of sort of almost Harry Mack level at times. And then you had. Then he went. He went Australia and when he went to Australia at first there was a couple of really big songs. He came at me and they look really well, really polished music videos. He was having a great time in Australia.
• 39:45
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 39:46
  Speaker A: I don't know if anyone knows. I don't know. I've not actually heard. He might have changed his name, to be honest. He might have. He might have rebranded his name.
• 39:53
  Speaker B: Yes. I do think someone that gets.
• 39:55
  Speaker A: Something like that happened.
• 39:56
  Speaker B: Quicksilver or something like that or something different. I remember.
• 39:59
  Speaker A: I think so.
• 40:00
  Speaker B: There was. There was some MCs in Scotland that I. That actually like when. When he'd go like if I went to the Bongo Club and first time I saw like Mr. Jinx, I thought like he already had like stage presence down and that's what. And I remember like grabbing the mic after one of his shows and just thinking like just the way he was. Like he had a bottle of his Bucky or whatever. But the way he rocked the stage, just being like comfortable, I was like, that was one of the earliest times I saw something. Yeah, this guy's got it. But like, obviously I really like the kid Evil as someone who I've like seen. And he's like also just incredibly good at freestyling. He's got punch lines. I like him. He's got. Also, he's good at transcribing them into songs. So he does write kind of hooks as well. But obviously, like, Joe.
• 40:48
  Speaker A: Joe, who has evil, went to he. Because obviously he was everywhere for a while. He was. It was. It was. It was because he was battle rapping. It was. It was releasing a stream of music. And he was quite good at the marketing side of it.
• 41:03
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. He was very, very busy online. I just don't know. Sometimes it's like. Sometimes I think. And it's not a criticism, but sometimes I think people, like, they go in hard, they realize that something can happen. And I'm like, I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna do this. But for me, there's no way out. It's like, if you. If you are gonna do it, do it and can. And it's the consistency and just keep going, keep going, keep going. And the only way you fail, essentially, is if you stop, you know? And like. And you should never stop because you should be doing the music side of it for the love. Like, you should love music. So why. Why stop? You know, for me, I never had an option of stopping because I love music, you know, I mean, so I'm gonna.
• 41:41
  Speaker A: I agree completely. But I just killed my band off last week, so we had a farewell gig. But that's not. That's. I'm not stopping music. It was just that particular project.
• 41:49
  Speaker B: Yeah. When a project runs its course, of course, you know, I mean, the guy's
• 41:54
  Speaker A: telling me, stop that.
• 41:55
  Speaker B: But, yeah, just start music. I mean, you'll always make music, of course.
• 42:00
  Speaker A: Well, I mean, I think for me, you know, writing is therapeutic. I love writing. I enjoy it. Then when you go to something and there's loads of stuff that never gets used, but then once you get something, you think, oh, that's good. I quite like that. I should maybe put that to music or whatever. And then if you put it to music, then why not. Why not release it? And then you really say, why not play it live?
• 42:21
  Speaker B: Absolutely, yeah. And you take a journey. I feel. I feel like every beat and then every rhyme you make, you're almost like. It's like you. They're your kids, you know, and you kind of ought to raise them right, you know, like, show them, take them out there.
• 42:37
  Speaker A: I've got boxes of them just lying about, so I need to look after they. Ones I've forgotten about. I've forgotten about some of them.
• 42:44
  Speaker B: You've got. You've got some abandoned Kids.
• 42:47
  Speaker A: I've got a lot of abandoned, abandoned
• 42:48
  Speaker B: kids, but also Joe absence.
• 42:52
  Speaker A: I'm above an absent father to seven boxes of. So I. There's some comments coming in. Can I just read the comments? Before Iona. It's weird how Kneecap can sell it, the O2 in Glasgow, but we won't even support local rappers. What is your thoughts on that?
• 43:13
  Speaker B: No, I know. This is what I mean. It's like, I think like, it's Kneecap have now and congrats to them for telling their story.
• 43:22
  Speaker A: It's not even though, just to clarify, that Kneecap are selling at the hydro now. Yeah, selling at the hydro.
• 43:28
  Speaker B: I mean, and they've got, like a lot of energy and I understand how infectious it is and it. And totally congrats to them for, like, taking their country and, like, doing their thing in the right way and then getting out there. It's just. How many others, like, so they're young as well, Syllable and brains, like California scheming. It's taken me 26 years, 26 years to get anyone to come round and go, would you guys like to play this venue or would you like to play this festival? And it's like, man, you're getting me. When I'm 44 years old, I'm not too tired. But it's like, it would have been nice if you were around when Cyllable Brains were, You know, we're actually going and pumping and had energy and we're like, let's kill it, you know? Yeah. So it's like, it's just unfortunate, but also, like, you know, there is so many good Scottish artists who is going to get them together, like, throw a Scottish rap festival, put it in the O2 or whatever, and, like, really promote it, man. Like, that for me would have been like the thing that I'd have loved to have seen. Just getting all, why don't you dip?
• 44:34
  Speaker A: Why don't you? Why don't you date?
• 44:37
  Speaker B: I'd love to do that, honestly. I think. Yeah.
• 44:39
  Speaker A: I mean, the Academies might be pushing it, but I'd love to hear Academy's pushing it.
• 44:46
  Speaker B: If anyone. Anyone who this is.
• 44:49
  Speaker A: This brings up the next thing. This is actually brings up the next thing, though, because if you were to pick 10 of the best, most active rappers and they all were up for it, would the scene support it or would the scene complain that them and their mates were not in the bill?
• 45:05
  Speaker B: That's the thing, you know? Yeah. I mean, and that, yeah, that kind of comes to the whole thing of, like, when you're Like I was saying, like, when you're a punk and when you're. When you're doing like kind of skating and punk bands and stuff, your mates all want to go touring together because it's like, oh, we'll go, we'll go have a laugh, you know, we'll cut the cost, we'll share all the costs of the hotels or we'll live in the van, you know, we'll do it all together. But with rap, man. I remember when we were starting out and we were talking to like the other local groups like Melod Elements and Second Nature and Glasgow, like just being like, let's go on a tour or something, man. Like, let's, let's get together, like. And Mellowed Elements were amazing to us because they let us rap on every show they had. They were our bigger brothers, they really were. And. But it would have been good if we could have got all the rappers at the time and let's do like a little tour or something, you know. And it just was like there was a lot of aggression towards each other because obviously rap is very competitive, especially battle rap. And so there was a lot of, like, a lot of the places where we started and we, and we'd come across each other were mostly battle rap events or like, or like a gig. Things would pop off, you know, like someone would say something. It would. And it would just. And so there was like area rivalry and stuff. And that, that kind of muddied up the waters of a lot of stuff, you know, which is a shame. And I think we felt a lot of that as well. It was like, you know, f off, you know, like, you know, you're not, you know, I mean, like, there was a lot of rivalry and, and it didn't help, you know, because especially if you're just like wanting to, like, let's just go, let's just do it. Let's take a whole bunch of Scottish rappers and go to Japan, you know, let's go to like, Canada. Let's go places that actually love Scotland. Let's like make a tour out there or something, you know, any kind of stuff like that that we try to get off in the early days.
• 46:48
  Speaker A: It's just, yeah, what I would. It would take, it would take, it would take energy, what you said. So. So what you need is somebody. It's not about age, it's about energy. Who's got, who's willing to sleep on a floor and go to all these places. But it's interesting that we sponsored earlier on about Scottish I don't like it. I know he's getting on, on about that is because when you, you know, when I've, when I've played in different parts of, of Scotland or would have been in Holly, sorry, different parts of the uk, Ireland or when I've been abroad for whatever reason, when you play Scottish, a good Scottish hip hop to people that are actually into hip hop, I'm talking about hip hop heads. They really appreciate the sound and they love the accent. They know that they don't understand every bit of dialect, every word. But I mean we didn't understand half the words of the, of American hip hop and the golden era when we were listening to it. You just had to learn, you know, when you watched an American movie, you just had to figure out what they were saying and, and then you, you then that's how you, that's how you learn. So I suppose the problem is that the gatekeepers, for lack of a better word, not there's that many gatekeepers in Scotland is they're looking at something that's mainstream, that's sellable, when actually with a little bit of money and the right in the right act, you could take them to underground hip hop places up and then I know that there is people touring it and trying just that thing, but a little bit more. Yeah, it would take. Unfortunately you're going to have to invest money and in my opinion the best stuff comes from a working class background. That is the stuff that I'm interested in is from. I think we've lost Brains. Is he gone? We'll read the comments while Brains is logging back in. Petra, great stuff. So happy for you Gavin and Moirad. You can stop marketing and pushing the promo but still be fully engaged with creating and even performing. Because that's where the love is. Exactly. You don't need to, you don't need to. Some of the artists, we're not sure what they're up to. They could be recording, writing, recording and they just can't be bothered with the, the rollout. Because these days, to rule it out, you need to make a dance. You need dance and tick tock. You need some, you need to be very engaged with social media. Well, you don't need to be, but that's what it feels like. That's what the algorithm wants you to do. It wants you to make songs that last 60 seconds and they want you to make a video dancing to it. And then they want you to do that again every day with a different background for the rest of your life. Princess back Sorry, I don't know if you just missed that. I went and we ran there, but I was just talking about how you can stop marketing and pushing the promo and just be engaged with creating, even performing, because that's what the love is. And that's Moira, who's actually loves Scottish hip hop.
• 49:55
  Speaker B: And yeah, I think that's one of. That's one of the huge takeaways.
• 49:58
  Speaker A: If I.
• 49:59
  Speaker B: Thinking, like, that was almost for me, like a lot of the times what kept me going was like, look, it's just. It's got to be about love, you know, like some people have said, you know, Gav, like you. You know, you. You probably only stayed the path because, like, you thought there was money at the end of the rainbow. It's like, there's no money. You know, it's like, you don't do this for money.
• 50:23
  Speaker A: Somebody said that, though, that's what makes it on. That weirdly makes a Scottish hip hop kind of sort of authentic. Because the people. I'm doing it for the money for the most part. That I'm assuming some people are hoping the way I put. But if you're trying to make money, then the music industry in general is not the way forward. Not now, not with the touring costs, not with the fact that nobody's really buying the physicals as much anymore. It's got to be done for the love.
• 50:54
  Speaker B: It's got to be done for, like, the creative journey through art that you can take. So for me, it's like I'm at art uni.
• 51:00
  Speaker A: I'm.
• 51:01
  Speaker B: I'm painting things, I'm making things. I meet Bill, like. Like we're skaters. Like, we're very creative. We're doing kind of comedy, we're doing, like kind of improv with each other. But then this whole journey ends up like, you know, not just being in rap. It's like learning how to produce other music, meet other people, broaden the horizons and all of that, all the other genres you kind of mess around with flavors your other. Your hip hop very nicely because then you can become a little bit more original. You don't make the same things as everyone else. And then you take the. For me, it's like the chance to write a book and then now kind of write stories and screenwrite. All this is like, it's the art journey and it's. It's. That's for the love of it. Like, it's to learn and constantly keep learning, you know, that's what it's got to be about. It can't if it was ever about money, honestly, you'd quit so quick because you learn that there's, there's not enough.
• 51:52
  Speaker A: A lot of the time it costs money. A lot of the time, most of the time it costs money. And time is money. Time is more important than money. So when would you say that? When you. Do you look through the lens of the movie? Do you get. Do you look through that with rose tinted spectacles and nostalgia? When are you that. When were you the happiest in your career?
• 52:14
  Speaker B: For me, the happiest and also like. And this is the strange thing, I think people have kind of thought like, well, that's a weird thing to say, but I think the happiest and most honest times of my life were being up on stage and letting the child inside. Just play. Just, just do it, you know, like, forget about everything off stage. So like, you know, being able to do that D12 tour, like being able to have big shows and connect, as soon as it got bigger than that, you can't see anyone in the crowd and so you kind of lose it. But we did, after the first D12 show, we did a gig with 300 people in a small venue. That was the fire gig. That was like, it was so hot, the walls falling apart, like, you know, that was insane and that. But then to be on tour with your best friends, you know, people talk about making it. Like, what is making it? Making it is when you've got your best friends, you're on the road, you're living off each other, you're eating sleep, you're cuddling at each other in the van, you're living a kind of free life and you're getting to do shows every night. As a musician, as a rapper, that is making it. And I think sometimes we think there's got to be something else after it. That's it. It doesn't really get better than that. Like, you know, sure, someone can come on board. And for me, the most unhappiest times are when people put a lot of money, like through money at like the record deal. Seeing like a lot of money get put in your bank account and now you're a professional rapper. I felt so much anxiety coming from nothing. I didn't know what to do with the money. All I'm going to do is just drink loads and party and just, you know, I'm too young to understand what this money is. So I blew the money. Having the time of my life and touring and being with my friends, you know, and some people, oh, don't you don't you like have regrets for like not spending, not doing it, like buy a house or something, not do anything with that money. And I kind of go like, not really, man, because I just invested in having the best time of my life, you know, and, and then I wrote a story about it and then, you know, I like became a good musician. But I don't, I don't have regrets on that, you know, and so it's like the best times are like when you can just be with your friends, laughing on the road every day, rocking shows, because that, that feels like honest. All the other shit. When it comes to like marketing a record, you know, going out, doing interviews, it's like all that just feels like doing interviews.
• 54:40
  Speaker A: What's that about doing interviews?
• 54:43
  Speaker B: Well, not every interview.
• 54:46
  Speaker A: So maybe making it as the friends we made along the way.
• 54:50
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, it's the journey. It's not anything else, man. It's like it's not even the journey or the destination. It's, it's, it's who you become along the way. You know, people always say things like, you know, I was, you know, I was hearing a lot of stuff with this film. People saying like, you know, it's, you gotta be true to yourself. But when I, coming from South Africa, being beaten near to death, like moving these different places, I didn't know who myself was. I'm a kid who's myself, like, who knows themselves when they're super young. So for me, I was so conflicted. I was super, super conflicted in South Africa. We were a Scottish family and we never fit in, we didn't fit in. We moved to Scotland and now we're a South African family in Scotland and we don't fit in. I start rapping and then I go down with a Scottish accent. And I'm getting told by those in the industry, like, you can't be that you're not good enough. It's you, it's you, you know, so for me, like the whole journey at the start and this is like true to life when you're a young 18, 19 year old, you don't know yourself, you know, so. But like, you take the journey, you become everything. You try, you try, you try. And then hopefully along the way you become someone that you like to be, you know, And I think if you're, if you're about the stuff that, if you're about the art, if you're about the journey, if you're about like doing it with your mates, you know, I was saying the other Night when he did the screening, like, all of my best friends in South Africa, still my best friends. All my best friends. And Dundee, still my best friends, you know, like, it's. There's. There has to be consistency in your life for you to feel good, you know, like, never hurt anyone. Do it for the right reasons. But the thing you learn along the way, that it's got nothing to do with money. Fame is gross. The first time that the documentary went on the BBC iPlayer, or it went on BBC One down in London, the next day, I was on the tube and people came rushing up to me on the tube and I've never felt so unsafe. Especially like when you come from that trauma of being jumped. People just coming up to you on the tube, being like, oh, hey, man. And they're right up in your face and they're not nasty or anything, but it's just like, whoa. At any moment I could just be stabbed here. Like, someone could just dislike your story and just come up and stab you, you know, like. So I always felt like actually fame is like the.
• 57:12
  Speaker A: Sorry, you just. You've got it there. You've cut out there. Gavin. The epimu says, cheers, Mark and Gavin, for sharing the love for music and promoting some amazing Scottish rap artists. This. And I'll do it. Anadoric Tongue and I think Brains. We'll give Brains a little minute. So California Scheming is out just now, so I'm hoping he's going to come back and get back to the D12 thing. I'd like to hear that before we go. So California Scheming, it's everywhere. It's in. It's in the GFT for sure. Because I'm going to go and watch at the GFT this weekend and based on the trailer, it looks great. If you need any more convincing, you can watch the Great Pop Hoax, which I believe was a Vice documentary. It's on YouTube. You can watch that right now for free. And there's also an interview where we go. Any more detail of the background of what actually happened is when you call that radio where it's called the Great Hip Hop Hoax as well. And when I spoke to both Gavin and Billy in part one and Part two, and maybe we'll get Billy one for part two. And next week, I think Brian might be back. Sorry, you're back, you're back. Cool. But, yeah, that's cool, man. But, yeah, so I was just saying that. Yeah, so and so, yeah, maybe get Billy on this, because last. The last time I did it on, on and to both parts. So what should be like, you'd be. What's it been like working with Billy again?
• 58:47
  Speaker B: I've not. We've not seen each other much. It's just been in Dundee and then we saw each other in London and it's just. And then we've kind of been like doing different promo in different places. He's up there so he can do some of that stuff. I'm down in London and so, yeah, we've not really seen that much of each other and it's just been kind of like. And then you get to the events and it's just like, go, go, go. It's mad. So they've not really been able to hang out or anything. Anything, you know, but. But, like, you know, it's just. Yeah, it's. It's. It's crazy. It's a crazy journey to get here. I was just saying before I cut off that, like, the worst thing you
• 59:16
  Speaker A: said, fame is
• 59:19
  Speaker B: fame. Fame is not what you want. Fame is like, sometimes it's the very worst thing because fame means like 50 of people like you and 50 of people hate you, you know, and that's what it is. But then again, it's like, how does Kneecap sell out these venues now? You know, because the Daily Mail hate them. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
• 59:42
  Speaker A: They severely wound up the establishment and made all the. The worst people in the world say bad things about them, which just attracted a lot of. A lot of people to say, oh, let me. I like. I like the fact that the bad people are getting wound up about them. Piers Morgan saying, this is outrageous. That will sell tickets.
• 1:00:00
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 1:00:02
  Speaker A: So, yeah, Petra is going to the movie theater in Perth this week, so it's out in Perth as well. And yeah, so, yeah, I was going to say with regards to the. The D12 thing. So, so how does. How is it. Is this. Is this stolen for people that don't know? D12 used to have Eminem in it. It was Eminem's band basically, back in the day. So this was the Eminem era D12.
• 1:00:31
  Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. And we obviously, like, when we were just like bantering and like we. When we got in and we like, obviously people now love it and it's like just always changed to some of the songs is like American accents. But like, when we first signed the record deal, I don't know if I'm gonna cut off here, but when we first signed the record deal, people just thought or assumed that because we were saying where we were were from and that we obviously Must have known Eminem. We must have known. And like, oh, yeah, cool. You know, like we're best friends, you know, like we were just blagging, surely thinking that someone's gonna just not. But surely you're not gonna believe us. You know what I mean? So, yeah, people did and then that grew. Grew legs. Grew legs. And then they come on tour and they, they take us on the road, you know, and it's kind of like crap. Now we have to convince them.
• 1:01:25
  Speaker A: I think there is a wi fi problem. I think at Gavin's end, what we done. We've done an hour. We've done an hour. Do you know what to find out the rest of that story, go as a cliffhanger. As a cliffhanger. Do you know what that means? To find out the story? Go watch the film California Scheming out on everything just now. Thank you to the patrons who support the show at patreon.com forward slash. You call that radio. And to make that show possible, last night I spoke to Tom Henley who just burnt all the bridges and spilled all the beans on and spiral carpets. I would watch that before somebody tells me to take it down. And I think we'll be back in Friday night. I think we've got a guest, a special guest lined up for Friday night as well. And if you go on to our page Views from the sea, then you. We've got. You can have your final word in a second. Gavin, in the middle of a promo thing, you can watch my top 10 Scottish rappers, which is a 25 minute love letter to the scene. It's on. On. You call that radio's YouTube channel channel and along with other views from the sea, basically commenting on the news and stuff. So. And yeah, and if you listen to the audio podcast, then yeah, well done because that exists too. Gavin, you've got bad wi fi. But it's. So I think just leave that story on a cliffhanger because it's in the movie. In it.
• 1:03:00
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. It's like one of the big moments, you know.
• 1:03:03
  Speaker A: Right, okay. We'll just leave it. You know what? I don't want. I know. I want. I'm going to watch the film this weekend. So let's leave it in a cliffhanger. So yeah. Any, any final, final, final, final thoughts? Nope. I think he. What he wants to say is he appreciates everyone who's been it got to the top 10 in the box office this week. So he's really. He wants to thank you all for supporting it. It's got 97 in rotten tomatoes. So thank you to everyone who's written it, everyone who's been talking about it. Word the mouth helps independent films. And yeah, he wants to thank all the team, everyone who worked in the movie and of course, Billy for going on that. John, the room, he wants to thank him. It wants to encourage us all to enjoy the movie. California Scheming is out now he's away or I think he is away. I think he's away. London's Internet seems. Yes, there was a bit of a spoiler there. There is no spoilers. Go and watch the movie. And thank you to Gavin for tuning in. Thank you, thank you to Captain for being a guest and thank you to everyone else for tuning in. I that Go and watch the film. And a special thank you to the patreons at patreon.com forward slash. You call that radio. You are the reason that there is no adverts, there's no sponsors and there's no funding throughout any of our shows. And if you want to support the show, then please feel free to join the Patreon Gang. We'd love to see you over there for some bonus material, some guest lists, some discounts, and we're throwing a couple parties over the summer that we'd like to invite you to as well. And I hope you enjoy watching California Scheming. I'm going to go and watch it tomorrow, so I'm excited for that. And if you've not listened to it yet, check out yesterday's show with Tom Hingley of the Inspiral Carpets. A very fascinating discussion that was. And, yeah, that came out yesterday. This one came out today. It's not how you're supposed to do podcasts. You're supposed to have a schedule release one a week, the same day every week. That's not how we do it here, unfortunately, respectfully, but we just. I've got. What's the point? Me holding on to this podcast for another week. That's not happening. We're doing one yesterday, we're doing one today and we're going to do another one tomorrow, which will either be beyond the Cringe Politics or Views from the Sea. I'm not sure yet it. But thank you to everyone for listening and I hope you enjoy the rest of your day or your evening or your morning. Bye.
• 1:05:59
  Speaker B: Yo, this is Charlie tuna from Jurassic 5, live and direct here in Glasgow, Scotland. And you call that radio?