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Survivors Detail Abuse at Interlochen and Encounters With Jeffrey Epstein · The Epstein Chronicles

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  Speaker 1: What's up everyone and welcome to another episode of the
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  Speaker 1: Epstein Chronicles. Over the past 24 hours, we have received
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  Speaker 1: a 97-page investigation about Interlochen Center for the Arts, the
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  Speaker 1: school in Michigan where Jeffrey Epstein had a cabin on campus,
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  Speaker 1: and what that report found is absolutely terrifying. According to
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  Speaker 1: that report, over 70 students were abused, not only by
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  Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein, but by others as well. So in this episode,
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  Speaker 1: we're diving into an article from the Detroit News and
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  Speaker 1: the headline, Interlochen Report Finds 70 Students Accused, 47 Adults
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  Speaker 1: of Sex Abuse. This article was authored by Max Reinhart.
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  Speaker 1: And if you were wondering why Jeffrey Epstein was welcomed
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  Speaker 1: up on campus, well, here you go. So of course,
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  Speaker 1: the next question is, were any of those other people
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  Speaker 1: connected to Jeffrey Epstein? who were involved in abusing those kids.
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  Speaker 1: That has to be the next question, right? And even
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  Speaker 1: if it wasn't Jeffrey Epstein, whoever was involved, whoever did it,
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  Speaker 1: needs to be indicted, convicted, and then hung by their
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  Speaker 1: feet with the families able to beat them like a piñata.
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  Speaker 1: Decades of allegation of grooming, sexual abuse, and secrecy at
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  Speaker 1: one of Michigan's premier youth art academies were detailed in
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  Speaker 1: 70 first-hand accounts from students, according to the release Tuesday.
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  Speaker 1: of an independent report. The 97-page investigation by Massachusetts-based Sanghavi
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  Speaker 1: Law Office detailed sexual abuse reports spanning the 1950s through
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  Speaker 1: the 2010s at Interlochen Center for the Arts, the Northern
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  Speaker 1: Michigan School, and Summer Camp, where a financier, pedophile, and
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  Speaker 1: human trafficker, Jeffrey Epstein, recruited some of his victims. The
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  Speaker 1: fact that this dude had a cabin on that campus
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  Speaker 1: should have been a tell right away. Who the hell
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  Speaker 1: would approve that? Oh yeah, sure, Jeffrey Epstein, there's no
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  Speaker 1: rumors about him. Nobody's ever heard anything untowards about Jeffrey Epstein.
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  Speaker 1: Let's give him a cabin and access to children. And
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  Speaker 1: every single person who played a role in giving him
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  Speaker 1: that cabin, they should be held accountable. The center hired
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  Speaker 1: the firm, which has experience probing historical claims of abuse,
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  Speaker 1: to lead the review in summer of 2024. After leaders
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  Speaker 1: at the school were contacted about decades-old sexual misconduct, involving
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  Speaker 1: former faculty. Oh, they were just contacted, huh? Nobody ever
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  Speaker 1: talked about it then? It's always funny that after the fact,
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  Speaker 1: they're like, well, there were all these glaring signs, and
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  Speaker 1: we just missed them. No, you didn't miss them. You
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  Speaker 1: ignored them. In the following years, investigators spent hundreds of
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  Speaker 1: hours conducting about 180 separate interviews with approximately 150 former
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  Speaker 1: Interlochen students and camp attendees, resulting in 70 first-hand accounts
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  Speaker 1: alleging Physical sexual misconduct. The bulk of the allegations center
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  Speaker 1: around conduct from before the year 2000 and range from
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  Speaker 1: inappropriate comments to sexual assault and long-term sexual relationships between
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  Speaker 1: adults and students. And the truth is, this kind of
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  Speaker 1: stuff is more widespread than we know. I mean, how
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  Speaker 1: many people like Jeffrey Epstein are out there? That's the
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  Speaker 1: real question that we should be asking ourselves. And unfortunately,
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  Speaker 1: the answer is a lot. Now, maybe not to the
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  Speaker 1: level as far as being as connected, but there's a
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  Speaker 1: lot of sick people out there, folks. A whole lot
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  Speaker 1: of them. And unfortunately, some of them have access to
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  Speaker 1: your kids. I mean, who sends their kid to interlocking
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  Speaker 1: to go and learn some music or whatever and expect
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  Speaker 1: some shit like this? Nobody. Not one single parent. But
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  Speaker 1: you have to be on the lookout for it, unfortunately.
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  Speaker 1: And look, I don't have kids, but if I did,
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  Speaker 1: I wouldn't leave them in the presence of any stranger
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  Speaker 1: to tell you the truth. The accusations involved 47 different
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  Speaker 1: adults associated with the Northern Michigan School and Camp, including faculty,
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  Speaker 1: board members, administrators, camp counselors, trustees, donors, visiting artists, and
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  Speaker 1: other staff. Oh, everybody was in on it, huh? Had
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  Speaker 1: yourselves a fucking buffet of little children, you sick degenerate bastards. Helicopters, volcanoes,
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  Speaker 1: for everybody that's guilty. In a public statement, Interlochen President
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  Speaker 1: Trey Davey and Board Chair Barrett Rollins thanked participants for
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  Speaker 1: helping facilitate an honest reckoning with past harms reported by
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  Speaker 1: our alumni and other members of our community. I'm sure
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  Speaker 1: nobody reported it earlier. I'm sure nobody just swept it
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  Speaker 1: under the rug. I'm sure nobody just ignored it. I mean,
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  Speaker 1: you guys obviously were on your game. You had Epstein
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  Speaker 1: on campus, so that tells us everything we need to know.
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  Speaker 1: On behalf of Interlochen, we're deeply sorry for the harm
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  Speaker 1: experienced by members of our community, and extend our apologies
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  Speaker 1: to those impacted by abuse at Interlochen. The joint statement reads,
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  Speaker 1: We also want to say clearly Interlochen will not tolerate
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  Speaker 1: predators or those who enable them. Oh, well, that's nice,
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  Speaker 1: 25 years later. Who do they think they're kidding? Well,
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  Speaker 1: for 40 years, 50 years, we didn't protect anybody, but now, now,
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  Speaker 1: we're paying attention. Interlochen officials said the school had no
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  Speaker 1: direct influence over the report's content. The report stresses that
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  Speaker 1: the document's purpose is to archive and preserve alumni accounts
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  Speaker 1: rather than to determine legal culpability or liability. So in
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  Speaker 1: other words, cover your ass. That way, if they get sued,
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  Speaker 1: they can say, look, we had this external report and,
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  Speaker 1: you know, this is what it found. But if you
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  Speaker 1: have something like this going on and we have, what,
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  Speaker 1: 47 people, 70 people, whatever it is, I would say
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  Speaker 1: that there is some culpability and some liability. And considering
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  Speaker 1: it happened on this campus, then I'd say that Interlochen
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  Speaker 1: is culpable and they're liable. One alum said that during
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  Speaker 1: a party at Interlochen in the 60s, a faculty member
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  Speaker 1: made all kinds of innuendos towards her and later pinned
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  Speaker 1: her against the wall and French kissed her. She told
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  Speaker 1: an investigator she could feel that he had an erection.
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  Speaker 1: Hell of a teacher, that guy, huh? Another former student
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  Speaker 1: who attended Interlochen in the 70s said that a staff
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  Speaker 1: member initiated an unwanted sexual relationship with her after he
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  Speaker 1: wrote her a flattering poem. At one point, the staff
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  Speaker 1: member proceeded to have sex with the student even after
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  Speaker 1: she said, no, don't do that. During the encounter, he
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  Speaker 1: also told her to be quiet after she coughed loudly,
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  Speaker 1: according to the report. So who the fuck is that person?
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  Speaker 1: Staff member proceeded to have sex with her? Just random
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  Speaker 1: staff member? Casper the ghost? It was an actual person, right? Well,
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  Speaker 1: that person should have to answer for their bullshit. And
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  Speaker 1: if these reports were serious, and they really had teeth,
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  Speaker 1: that's what would happen. But too many times, these reports
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  Speaker 1: are nothing more than a whitewash. In the 1980s, an
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  Speaker 1: Interlochen Arts faculty member and a student took a trip
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  Speaker 1: together and shared a hotel room during a spring break. Yo,
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  Speaker 1: who the fuck is sharing a hotel room with a
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  Speaker 1: faculty member during spring break? That seems a bit out
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  Speaker 1: of pocket, no? There, the adult threw the student on
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  Speaker 1: the bed and forcefully had anal sex with her, leading
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  Speaker 1: her to let her seek medical attention. Hell of a guy,
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  Speaker 1: that faculty member. Imagine sending your kids to this place, interlocking.
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  Speaker 1: And then you see this report come out, find out
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  Speaker 1: this has been going on for decades. And remember, if
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  Speaker 1: Interlochen wasn't embarrassed over the Epstein affair, none of this
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  Speaker 1: would have ever come out. Interviewees describe certain adults at
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  Speaker 1: Interlochen as creepy into the 2000s. One student from that
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  Speaker 1: time period said an arts faculty member narrowed in on her,
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  Speaker 1: getting close to her emotionally and saying that she was
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  Speaker 1: really special and was mature beyond her years. The report states, Hello, groomer.
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  Speaker 1: Nice grooming activity you're engaging in. In total, 47 different
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  Speaker 1: adults associated with the school are accused of some level
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  Speaker 1: of misconduct. Epstein's name is mentioned 52 times in the report,
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  Speaker 1: while his sex trafficking partner, Ghislaine Maxwell's name, appears 13 times. Epstein,
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  Speaker 1: who attended the school's summer arts camp as a youth,
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  Speaker 1: donated hundreds of thousands of dollars to Interlochen in the
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  Speaker 1: 90s and 2000s. Alright, how many people... that were accused
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  Speaker 1: of abuse were connected to Jeffrey Epstein. I think that's
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  Speaker 1: a pretty important fact that we need to learn, right?
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  Speaker 1: The newly released report includes allegations from alumni who reported
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  Speaker 1: sexual contact with Epstein after meeting him through interlocking more
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  Speaker 1: than five years before his first criminal conviction in 2008.
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  Speaker 1: They alleged Epstein used his donor status in repeated visits
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  Speaker 1: to befriend female students, promising scholarships, or career opportunities, obtaining
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  Speaker 1: their contact information, and in some cases, later recruiting them
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  Speaker 1: into a sexual exploitation network. Well, that's a fact. And
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  Speaker 1: we heard from, what, two girls that went interlocking? That
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  Speaker 1: told us about Epstein and his bullshit? And about the cabin?
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  Speaker 1: Most individuals accused in the report are not identified by name.
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  Speaker 1: either to protect survivors' privacy or because doing so may
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  Speaker 1: interfere with ongoing or future law enforcement investigations. Officials said, well,
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  Speaker 1: that's nice. 70 people say they were abused. Probably a
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  Speaker 1: good idea to have an investigation that's led by the police.
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  Speaker 1: Individuals who are named include Thomas Clower, an arts faculty
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  Speaker 1: member at the school from 2003 to 2005. Clower was
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  Speaker 1: convicted of criminal sexual conduct in 2005 after Interlochen fired
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  Speaker 1: him and reported him to the police. Byron Hanson, a
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  Speaker 1: long-time faculty member and administrator from 1960 through 2015, who
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  Speaker 1: is now deceased. John Hood, a faculty member and administrator
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  Speaker 1: from 1963 to 1979, who continued to serve in seasonal
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  Speaker 1: positions until 2004. Charlie McWhorter, a former trustee at Interlochen
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  Speaker 1: from 1970 to 1999. Many alumni believe that many adults
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  Speaker 1: at the school either suspected or outright knew about the
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  Speaker 1: inappropriate conduct and that leadership at the institution felt to
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  Speaker 1: take appropriate steps to curb it. One alum shared that
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  Speaker 1: she could not say which trauma was greater, the conduct
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  Speaker 1: of the adult abuser At Interlochen towards her or the
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  Speaker 1: way she was treated by Interlochen staff once she reported
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  Speaker 1: the conduct. And that's something that has to be looked at.
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  Speaker 1: And if it comes out that that's the truth, then
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  Speaker 1: the school holds a whole bunch of liability. If people
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  Speaker 1: knew and nobody acted. Time to back up the Brinks truck.
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  Speaker 1: because people are about to get paid. One alum noted
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  Speaker 1: that her awareness of conduct of a sexual nature by
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  Speaker 1: adults at Interlochen while she was there added to a
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  Speaker 1: feeling that students were on their own and had to
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  Speaker 1: fend for themselves. The report states that investigators at Sanghavi
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  Speaker 1: did not make judgments regarding whether the institutional response to
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  Speaker 1: allegations were adequate. They don't seem adequate to me. Seems
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  Speaker 1: like a bunch of bullshit, actually. And just more of
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  Speaker 1: a cover story. Oh, look, we had an investigation. It's
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  Speaker 1: all over and done with now, though. Yeah, why didn't
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  Speaker 1: you expose it back in the day when it was
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  Speaker 1: happening and people knew about it? Why did you ignore
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  Speaker 1: it then? Few incidents have been reported in the past
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  Speaker 1: 25 years, and according to the report, none of the
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  Speaker 1: individuals accused in the document are still employed by Interlochen.
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  Speaker 1: The school said it has instituted safety mechanisms, including mandatory
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  Speaker 1: reporting requirements. background checks, trainings, and reviews to ensure these
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  Speaker 1: practices are utilized effectively. Interlochen today is fundamentally different from
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  Speaker 1: the institution described in this report. Devi and Rollins said
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  Speaker 1: in their statement, the school also established a fund to
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  Speaker 1: help cover future therapeutic care for impacted individuals, overseen and
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  Speaker 1: administered by an independent third party with experience working with
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  Speaker 1: survivors of abuse, officials said. It also plans to commission
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  Speaker 1: a permanent art installation honoring survivors. Well, that's all fine
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  Speaker 1: and well. But what were you doing when they were
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  Speaker 1: being abused? This all seems like reputation enhancement and providing
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  Speaker 1: therapeutic services for these people. Sure, they're going to trust
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  Speaker 1: you after all this bullshit, after you ignored them for
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  Speaker 1: all these years. Now they trust you and they're going
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  Speaker 1: to go see your therapist. Interlochen will refer information about
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  Speaker 1: all individuals implicated in the report to Grand Traverse County's
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  Speaker 1: prosecutor and sheriff to consider the possibility of criminal charges.
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  Speaker 1: The school also said it will review buildings and other
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  Speaker 1: items named after individuals to ensure none after whom the
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  Speaker 1: buildings are named are accused of wrongdoing. Epstein's ties to
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  Speaker 1: the camp Epstein's financial contributions included funding for a cabin
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  Speaker 1: that was referred to as Jeffrey E. Epstein Scholarship Lodge.
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  Speaker 1: And knowing what we know now, how fucking creepy is that?
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  Speaker 1: Interlochen renamed the building Green Lake Lodge in 2009 following
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  Speaker 1: Epstein's first criminal conviction. The school has since planned to
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  Speaker 1: tear the building down. And the Interlochen Board of Trustees
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  Speaker 1: has approved the demolition. Well, that's good. And they should
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  Speaker 1: offer the survivors, people who were abused there, the chance
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  Speaker 1: to come in with some sledgehammers and help knock it down.
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  Speaker 1: A little destruction therapy. Interlochen, located on 1,200 acres in
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  Speaker 1: Grand Traverse County, is considered the home of prestigious summer
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  Speaker 1: arts camp and what it describes as the nation's premier
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  Speaker 1: arts boarding high school. It's described as a global destination
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  Speaker 1: for artists and art enthusiasts of all ages. Officials encouraged
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  Speaker 1: anyone who has additional information about misconduct to reach investigator
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  Speaker 1: Elizabeth Sanghavi at Elizabeth at SanghaviLawOffice.com by October. After that date,
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  Speaker 1: reports can be made directly to Interlochen at investigation at interlochen.org.
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  Speaker 1: All right, so this has been a long time coming,
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  Speaker 1: this report. And now that it's out, we're going to
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  Speaker 1: dive into it at some point. But I wanted to
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  Speaker 1: give you guys a basic rundown of what was found
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  Speaker 1: in that report and what they say was going on
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  Speaker 1: on this campus over the decades. And I have the
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  Speaker 1: actual report. So at some point, we'll get that added
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  Speaker 1: to the catalog. But for now, that's going to do
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  Speaker 1: it for this one. All the information that goes with
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  Speaker 1: this episode can be found in the description box.