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Katherine Knight - Part 2 · Wicked and Grim: A True Crime Podcast

0:07
Speaker 1: Catherine Knight is a rare specimen. She is a female psychopath,
0:13
Speaker 1: and men are three to five times more likely to
0:16
Speaker 1: become psychopaths and women. In Part one, we covered her
0:19
Speaker 1: early life and her upbringing all the way up to
0:23
Speaker 1: her marriage now here. In Part two, we will continue
0:27
Speaker 1: to unravel her life and her horrific crime.
0:32
Speaker 2: My name's Ben and I'm Nicole, and you're listening to
0:35
Speaker 2: Wicked and.
0:36
Speaker 1: Grim, a true crime podcast.
0:39
Speaker 2: Warning.
0:40
Speaker 1: The following podcast jeans and material intended for a mature audience.
0:47
Speaker 1: Listener discretion is advised. So do I need to recap
1:09
Speaker 1: you a bit? Yeah, like thirty seconds ago and the
1:13
Speaker 1: goals like, wait, what are we doing again?
1:16
Speaker 2: Go for it? At nice? Actually it was a gooder.
1:22
Speaker 1: But yeah, you're all like, what case we're doing? You
1:25
Speaker 1: can't even remember last week?
1:26
Speaker 2: Well, I feel like last week was more than a
1:29
Speaker 2: week ago.
1:30
Speaker 1: Well a lot had happened.
1:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, it just seems like last week was busy, and
1:34
Speaker 2: I feel like that was like a month ago. So
1:36
Speaker 2: I need a recap. And some people now are just
1:40
Speaker 2: gonna be listening to part one and jumping right into
1:43
Speaker 2: part two.
1:43
Speaker 1: So we'll do it so they're fresh at least.
1:45
Speaker 2: Little middle recap.
1:47
Speaker 1: Okay, so little recap on this, We're gonna jump right
1:49
Speaker 1: into a recap here. Catherine Knight was brought up in
1:52
Speaker 1: kind of like a not a very good kind of atmosphere. Okay,
1:56
Speaker 1: quite a violent household and yeah, not so good. Eventually
2:01
Speaker 1: she would get married to an individual whose name is
2:04
Speaker 1: David Stanford Kellen, and their relationship is quite rocky, rather aggressive.
2:13
Speaker 1: For example, there was one incident on their honeymoon where
2:18
Speaker 1: David's life was in danger because he woke up to
2:20
Speaker 1: his now bride right strangling him because they did not
2:26
Speaker 1: have sex five times.
2:27
Speaker 2: Right, it was only three. Shit, this is ringing a bell. Yeah,
2:32
Speaker 2: it's gonna all just come back to me.
2:34
Speaker 1: Yeah. So now the most recent incident is that David
2:37
Speaker 1: had actually left her, right, had gone away with another woman.
2:41
Speaker 2: Right, I was going to say another woman.
2:42
Speaker 1: Yeah, yep. And now Catherine has kind of lost her shit,
2:47
Speaker 1: dropped her kid off in a railway track, was swinging
2:49
Speaker 1: an axe downtown. Thankfully, the kid was saved and she
2:53
Speaker 1: was put into an institution, but then subsequently released very
2:58
Speaker 1: soon after, got her kid back, and is now holding
3:02
Speaker 1: her neighbors at knife point to go track down David's mother.
3:07
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, and has said kid though right are we
3:12
Speaker 2: weren't or we left as we weren't sure or something.
3:14
Speaker 1: I couldn't Actually I did a little bit of searching
3:16
Speaker 1: on that I couldn't find if she got the kid
3:18
Speaker 1: back here, I don't. I don't know just yet, Okay,
3:24
Speaker 1: because yeah, some more stuff happens, and she'll end up
3:27
Speaker 1: in an institution again, and then okay.
3:30
Speaker 2: Well we'll just let Yeah, we'll just let you. We'll
3:32
Speaker 2: get there.
3:33
Speaker 1: Yeah. But that is the quick elevator pitch of episode one.
3:38
Speaker 1: If you haven't listened to, it makes she go do
3:40
Speaker 1: a lot of her upbringing and a lot of her
3:44
Speaker 1: I don't know her atmosphere, that sort of stuff her
3:47
Speaker 1: what's the word I'm looking for.
3:49
Speaker 2: Vibe?
3:50
Speaker 1: It's definitely not vibe. That's not what I'm thinking. Okay,
3:54
Speaker 1: like our surroundings, her surroundings, I think definitely planned to
3:59
Speaker 1: who she is today and is going to be an
4:02
Speaker 1: important integral piece for part two. When we actually listened
4:05
Speaker 1: to her later.
4:06
Speaker 2: Actions, Okay, how exciting. Yeah, shoot, what was I gonna say?
4:17
Speaker 2: It was there and then it just wasn't. Holy heck,
4:20
Speaker 2: I don't know. But anyway, one thing I was going
4:22
Speaker 2: to talk about. I had something else to talk about,
4:24
Speaker 2: but that's long gone. We had our true crime trivia night,
4:28
Speaker 2: which was a hit and a half.
4:31
Speaker 1: It was it was fantastic, so although rather quickly people
4:36
Speaker 1: loved it. Although holy shit, people know their true crime.
4:42
Speaker 2: Yeah, we thought that the questions were like fairly difficult.
4:47
Speaker 2: I even at one point was like, oh, I think
4:49
Speaker 2: we should throw in some easier ones. But they were
4:52
Speaker 2: easy apparently, like there wasn't any that any that everyone
4:56
Speaker 2: was stumped on.
4:57
Speaker 1: No, most I think I think most people got like
5:00
Speaker 1: at least like eighty percent of the questions. Yeah, it
5:03
Speaker 1: was absurd. I was kind of going for like intermediate
5:05
Speaker 1: questions where I'm like, okay, some I'll stump people. And
5:08
Speaker 1: it's like I think there was people who knew every
5:10
Speaker 1: single freaking question. It was just like ridiculous. Yeah, so
5:14
Speaker 1: hats off to everyone who was there. That was an
5:16
Speaker 1: incredible time. We're gonna be doing it again.
5:18
Speaker 2: They blew us away.
5:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I actually I thought of a fantastic question
5:22
Speaker 1: this morning when I, uh, like first thing when I
5:25
Speaker 1: woke up too, I was like, holy shit, I don't
5:27
Speaker 1: know why this popped into my head, but it was
5:29
Speaker 1: a really good one.
5:30
Speaker 2: Oh well, you're gonna have to share because yeah, after
5:32
Speaker 2: that night, Ben, Like, my goal is next trivia night. O.
5:37
Speaker 2: There's gonna be one question that no one is going
5:40
Speaker 2: to get.
5:40
Speaker 1: Yes, but I don't want it to just be like
5:42
Speaker 1: so obscure that no one gets.
5:44
Speaker 2: I want it to be like so hard, like you
5:46
Speaker 2: really have to all your shit.
5:47
Speaker 1: Well yes and no. I want it to be like
5:49
Speaker 1: hard that people aren't going to get it, but not
5:53
Speaker 1: so hard that it's like, oh, come on, no one's
5:55
Speaker 1: gonna know that. I want it to be a reasonable
5:57
Speaker 1: question that stumps everyone. That's what I want.
6:01
Speaker 2: That it's a question that they know the answer but
6:04
Speaker 2: they can't. They can't. They they're just there, but they
6:06
Speaker 2: can't grab it something they should know. Yeah, yeah, oh,
6:10
Speaker 2: I remember what I was going to say.
6:11
Speaker 1: Holy oh, what was it?
6:13
Speaker 2: Gosh. I actually find it fascinating that men are more
6:18
Speaker 2: likely to be a psychopath and I kind of want
6:21
Speaker 2: to know why, Like that's something I almost want to
6:24
Speaker 2: dig in a little bit because that's intriguing.
6:26
Speaker 1: So I do have a theory on this, and it's
6:30
Speaker 1: a theory kind of because men generally are more aggressive
6:34
Speaker 1: in nature. Yeah, right, Yeah, more rapists, killer, psychopaths. It's
6:40
Speaker 1: just higher up all around. I think our dogs are
6:42
Speaker 1: howking hor there?
6:43
Speaker 2: Well, no, they're playing. They have constantly been playing all
6:47
Speaker 2: day today on their beds. It's quite interesting to watch this.
6:50
Speaker 1: They just have a grand old time over there. My
6:53
Speaker 1: theory is I think it boils down to testosterone. And
6:58
Speaker 1: I'm I'm not a biologist or anything. I don't know
7:04
Speaker 1: my shit. I just did a quick Google search one
7:06
Speaker 1: day and was like, huh, I found this interesting. So,
7:09
Speaker 1: as far as I'm aware, testosterone levels increase during menstruation
7:15
Speaker 1: aka PMS pre menstrual syndrome. That's when the female natural
7:21
Speaker 1: body testosterone is at its highest, which makes you guys
7:25
Speaker 1: kind of act a little bit, you know, orinery cranky
7:28
Speaker 1: sometimes whatever. There's many different symptoms. Yeah, yeah, And I
7:31
Speaker 1: think it's testosterone that's naturally in men's system.
7:35
Speaker 2: That just push more of it.
7:37
Speaker 1: Yeah. So I think it's that chemical in the male
7:40
Speaker 1: genome that pushes them to be more like psychopaths, killers, whatever,
7:46
Speaker 1: because if you put that same chemical in females, you
7:50
Speaker 1: sort of see the same kind of spike in Yeah.
7:55
Speaker 2: Yeah, well it is interesting. I'll just say this really quickly.
7:58
Speaker 2: Is that lots of times I feel like men think
8:01
Speaker 2: women are the ones that don't have their shit together
8:05
Speaker 2: or a little nutt o a little nut. Oh, I'm
8:08
Speaker 2: just trying to word this nicely.
8:09
Speaker 1: But I was trying to do the same. Don't worry.
8:11
Speaker 2: Hey, there's there's the stats there.
8:14
Speaker 1: Yeah.
8:14
Speaker 2: Women, women just you know, we have our shit together.
8:18
Speaker 2: It's right there.
8:18
Speaker 1: And like I say, I just think it comes down
8:20
Speaker 1: to testosterone affecting the brain. That's what I think.
8:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, it might be it would be interesting to talk
8:27
Speaker 2: to like a psychologist or something about this. But anyway,
8:30
Speaker 2: we have some lovely patrons to thing, do we not?
8:34
Speaker 1: We do. We have Haley Davis and Demig who both
8:37
Speaker 1: signed up this previous week, and they if they didn't,
8:41
Speaker 1: if they're not local, they didn't get to see the
8:45
Speaker 1: Trivia night live. The whole live stream is up on
8:48
Speaker 1: our patreons, so they can go check it out in
8:51
Speaker 1: whenever they want.
8:52
Speaker 2: Yeah, we did our best with that. It was a
8:54
Speaker 2: bit hard because like we had audience kind of there
8:56
Speaker 2: right and then also this camera. But I have I
8:59
Speaker 2: have more ideas to make it more a little bit
9:01
Speaker 2: more interactive next time, King, But it was still really cool.
9:04
Speaker 2: Like I hopefully they still felt like they were kind
9:06
Speaker 2: of a part of the event.
9:08
Speaker 1: Yeah, I do too, but like it's just kind of
9:10
Speaker 1: like unfortunately for the trivia thing, it's like that's the primary.
9:14
Speaker 1: So like going live stream, that's going to be a secondary.
9:17
Speaker 1: So we have to make sure we actually host the
9:20
Speaker 1: trivia first and foremost.
9:22
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it was our first one, so it was
9:24
Speaker 2: it was a learning thing. It was really cool though,
9:26
Speaker 2: and we're excited to do more.
9:27
Speaker 1: Yeah, anyways, should we get onto this because I think
9:30
Speaker 1: we've kind of yabbered a little bit.
9:31
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's do it.
9:32
Speaker 1: Okay. So when we left off, like I said, Catherine
9:35
Speaker 1: had her previous life, her marriage thing, and she currently
9:40
Speaker 1: is holding her neighbor's hostage by knife point and demanding
9:44
Speaker 1: that they drive her to David, her husband's mom's house,
9:48
Speaker 1: because she knows if she's going to get back at
9:51
Speaker 1: him for leaving her, the best way to do that
9:54
Speaker 1: is go after his mother.
9:55
Speaker 2: Oh that's next level, Hey.
9:58
Speaker 1: Next level? What'd you say, nuto Ndle?
10:01
Speaker 2: Is that his hand?
10:02
Speaker 1: Is that how you said it? So? Yeah, that's that's
10:06
Speaker 1: what she was doing. She was she was pulling the
10:08
Speaker 1: next level nutt and going after David's mom. Wow yea.
10:14
Speaker 1: So she managed to actually trick them by telling them
10:17
Speaker 1: that her daughter was sick and needed a ride to
10:20
Speaker 1: the hospital. So they came over to pick them up,
10:22
Speaker 1: and then that's when the Knight Point thing happened, right,
10:25
Speaker 1: So the family was forced to take her to the
10:28
Speaker 1: hospital or sorry, I mean David's mom in order to
10:31
Speaker 1: save themselves. So Catherine entered their vehicle and they ended
10:35
Speaker 1: up pulling out of the driveway with her brandishing a knife. Now,
10:40
Speaker 1: the family somehow miraculously managed to convince Catherine to let
10:45
Speaker 1: them stop at a service station, where a woman from
10:49
Speaker 1: the family managed to escape and called for help. Quickly
10:53
Speaker 1: the police arrived and they were able to apprehend and
10:56
Speaker 1: disarm Catherine to police with the help the service station manager,
11:04
Speaker 1: and just like before, she was admitted into psychiatric care.
11:09
Speaker 2: That's actually pretty impressive that they were able to get
11:11
Speaker 2: themselves out of that situation.
11:13
Speaker 1: It really is.
11:14
Speaker 2: That's really good.
11:15
Speaker 1: And this is kind of where I couldn't find if
11:17
Speaker 1: she did still have her child at this point, because
11:20
Speaker 1: it was only like a day or two prior that
11:22
Speaker 1: she was taken into care, and now it's taken into
11:25
Speaker 1: care again. So there's this like little window I am
11:28
Speaker 1: unsure of.
11:29
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, because I imagine there's well, I don't know,
11:31
Speaker 2: this is older and stuff, right, this is a little
11:34
Speaker 2: bit older of a case.
11:35
Speaker 1: Uh yeah, kind of.
11:37
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I imagine there even then, I'm sure there's
11:40
Speaker 2: like protocols and stuff and it's not like, oh, you
11:42
Speaker 2: come out of care and here's your kid, like it
11:45
Speaker 2: might take it a little bit.
11:47
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like this case I think is like right now,
11:49
Speaker 1: I think we're sitting in the eighties. Okay, so yeah, yeah.
11:54
Speaker 1: So Catherine, though like reported reportedly confessed to the nurse
11:59
Speaker 1: that her intents were also to kill the mechanic who
12:03
Speaker 1: worked at the service station. Why well, that's well why because,
12:09
Speaker 1: according to her, he had recently done repairs on David's car,
12:14
Speaker 1: so she believed that in doing so, the mechanic helped
12:18
Speaker 1: enable her husband to leave and run off with another woman.
12:21
Speaker 1: Oh that's why. So she claims she let the family
12:25
Speaker 1: stop at the service station.
12:26
Speaker 2: That's that's getting a little bit unreasonable there, Ye, do
12:30
Speaker 2: you think that her mind's really going a mile a minute?
12:33
Speaker 1: Last episode, she left her infant on railway tracks, and
12:38
Speaker 1: this you think she's getting unreasonable?
12:40
Speaker 2: A little bit, just a little I mean to have
12:43
Speaker 2: your brain wander to the fact that that mechanic helped
12:48
Speaker 2: your husband or whatever escape. That's wow.
12:52
Speaker 1: Yeah. So additionally, she did also plan to murder both
12:58
Speaker 1: her husband and his mother upon arrival in Queensland when
13:03
Speaker 1: she got there with this family. So when David eventually
13:07
Speaker 1: caught winto this incident, what do you think he decided
13:10
Speaker 1: to do?
13:11
Speaker 2: Run for the fucking hills?
13:13
Speaker 1: He ran back to her?
13:14
Speaker 2: What?
13:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, he decided he would go back to his wife.
13:18
Speaker 2: And I to protect his mom. Maybe no, because I.
13:22
Speaker 1: Don't think he had any idea that she was after
13:26
Speaker 1: him or her mother, because I think the idea of
13:29
Speaker 1: her confessing that she was going to murder them came
13:32
Speaker 1: out many years later. So what he did, and mad
13:36
Speaker 1: respect to him for this in all honesty, he went
13:41
Speaker 1: back to go take care of his wife.
13:44
Speaker 2: Oh, like he realized that she needed help.
13:47
Speaker 1: Basically really yeah, so he left his new girlfriend and
13:51
Speaker 1: relocated back to Aberdeen with his mother as well to
13:54
Speaker 1: help support and care for her.
13:56
Speaker 2: Well. I also imagine he was thinking about his child too, Yeah.
14:00
Speaker 1: Most likely, But yeah, he's like, I gotta go back,
14:04
Speaker 1: she needs help.
14:05
Speaker 2: Wow.
14:06
Speaker 1: So whether that's the right call or not. I'm not
14:10
Speaker 1: gonna argue on but holy shit, mad respect for someone
14:14
Speaker 1: to pick up the boots and take on that burden.
14:17
Speaker 2: Well, I mean he was very much so right. She
14:19
Speaker 2: does need some help, yeah.
14:21
Speaker 1: For sure. So it was on August ninth, nineteen seventy six,
14:25
Speaker 1: that's our current date, when David made his way to
14:29
Speaker 1: the institution that was caring for Catherine and she was
14:32
Speaker 1: released into his care along with his mother, and they
14:35
Speaker 1: also picked up their daughter.
14:38
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, okay, so the daughter's back now.
14:40
Speaker 1: The daughter is back in their care for sure. So
14:43
Speaker 1: the two were making another attempt at the relationship. They
14:46
Speaker 1: wanted a fresh start, and at first that's exactly what
14:49
Speaker 1: it was. But as time went on, the same problems
14:53
Speaker 1: began to arise. David was always walking on eggshells, truly
14:57
Speaker 1: convinced that if he said the wrong thing at the
15:00
Speaker 1: wrong time, he or someone else around would be killed.
15:05
Speaker 1: I can't imagine living that way.
15:07
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, it's one thing, kind of like walking
15:09
Speaker 2: on eggshells if like you're spouse is having a bad
15:11
Speaker 2: day or cranky or whatever, but like to be walking
15:14
Speaker 2: on eggshells because you're worried someone's gonna die, or that
15:18
Speaker 2: they're gonna you're gonna kill somebody. Oh yeah, that's that's
15:24
Speaker 2: almost hard to even like put yourself in those shoes.
15:27
Speaker 1: It was, And I got a little example here of
15:30
Speaker 1: how that played out. Just one second out. One more
15:32
Speaker 1: little point I want to make first. So one point
15:34
Speaker 1: first was Catherine was actually caught having an affair. At
15:36
Speaker 1: one point, she successfully begged David for another chance, even
15:40
Speaker 1: though a lot of her like shit in her own
15:43
Speaker 1: head was she was fearful of him cheating on her. Hmmm, yeah,
15:47
Speaker 1: so that's odd. But this one that's not unclear exactly
15:52
Speaker 1: where this falls in the timeline, but a friend of
15:55
Speaker 1: David and Catherine recalls a night where she witnessed Catherine
15:59
Speaker 1: holding their child under a tap of running hot water
16:03
Speaker 1: as the child was screaming and crying. So this is
16:08
Speaker 1: where David specifically shows that he's walking on eggshells because
16:12
Speaker 1: the friend reportedly told David about this, and he said,
16:17
Speaker 1: don't say anything to her. Do not say a word
16:20
Speaker 1: to her, otherwise you will die and she might kill
16:25
Speaker 1: me too.
16:26
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh.
16:29
Speaker 1: He's like, let me deal with this.
16:31
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, but like your kid is like in some
16:34
Speaker 2: super danger here. Yeah, yikes. I mean, yeah, he's really
16:40
Speaker 2: in a tough spot. But this is something has to
16:43
Speaker 2: happen here.
16:45
Speaker 1: So it would be in nineteen eighty when they would
16:50
Speaker 1: welcome their second child. Oh the world.
16:52
Speaker 2: Shit, that's not exactly where I was going with that. Yeah,
16:55
Speaker 2: something needs to happen.
16:56
Speaker 1: I agree. I don't think I would be vouching for
16:59
Speaker 1: them to have another child exactly.
17:02
Speaker 2: Wow.
17:03
Speaker 1: So the baby was little Natasha Marie Kellett, and it
17:06
Speaker 1: would be only four years later that Catherine would end
17:10
Speaker 1: up leaving David.
17:12
Speaker 2: Oh, okay, four years later that she left David.
17:15
Speaker 1: She left David.
17:16
Speaker 2: Okay, well, hopefully the kids remained with David.
17:20
Speaker 1: Well, not necessarily, but David was working as a truck
17:26
Speaker 1: driver and Catherine suspected him of sleeping with other women
17:30
Speaker 1: while he was on the road. So one night, when
17:33
Speaker 1: David came home, he found the house empty. She took
17:37
Speaker 1: everything and moved back to Aberdeen.
17:41
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, everything, including the kiddos.
17:44
Speaker 1: You bet you Now. In nineteen eighty six, Catherine would
17:48
Speaker 1: find herself entering another relationship. She met a man by
17:52
Speaker 1: the name of David Saunders, who was a thirty eight
17:55
Speaker 1: year old minder. So because David and David, I'm going
17:58
Speaker 1: to refer to this guy as Saunders by his.
18:01
Speaker 2: Last name, okay, yeah, because I was like, that's not
18:03
Speaker 2: going to be confusing at.
18:04
Speaker 1: All, Yeah, not at all. So soon they began living
18:08
Speaker 1: their life together with her two daughters, and Saunders knew puppy.
18:13
Speaker 2: Oh, a puppy.
18:15
Speaker 1: A puppy, the.
18:17
Speaker 2: First puppy's poor puppy.
18:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, poor puppy for sure. The first couple months were great,
18:24
Speaker 1: but just like Catherine's previous relationship, things would go downhill
18:28
Speaker 1: rather quickly, especially when she had reason to suspect of cheating.
18:34
Speaker 1: One occasion, when Sunders returned home late, Catherine was ironing
18:38
Speaker 1: and attacked him by swinging the hot iron at him
18:41
Speaker 1: and striking him across the face with Oh good god.
18:45
Speaker 1: Apparently the burn marks and like the holes that are
18:48
Speaker 1: in the iron from like little steam holes were visible
18:50
Speaker 1: on his visible on his face for like many weeks after.
18:53
Speaker 2: Well yeah, and I would imagine that would leave some
18:55
Speaker 2: sort of a scar.
18:56
Speaker 1: Too, potentially because that would hurt. Yeah, So she's like
19:00
Speaker 1: literally striking him with a scalding hot iron. Ouch.
19:05
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, I just oh, it's hard to put
19:08
Speaker 2: yourself in that situation, because that's terrifying. I couldn't imagine
19:13
Speaker 2: coming home and you doing something like that.
19:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, what about this, because that was only the beginning.
19:20
Speaker 1: In a very distressing incident in May of nineteen eighty seven,
19:24
Speaker 1: she callously took a knife to his two month old
19:26
Speaker 1: puppy and cut its throat as he helplessly watched.
19:32
Speaker 2: No. Yes, wow, Oh my gosh, this frickin' lady, I
19:39
Speaker 2: have some choice words that I'm just biting my tongue
19:42
Speaker 2: right now.
19:43
Speaker 1: A two month old puppy.
19:45
Speaker 2: Wow, she is peer evil.
19:49
Speaker 1: Another friend later on would talk about she would often
19:53
Speaker 1: swerve to try and hit dogs that were running across
19:55
Speaker 1: the road, and when questioned about it, she's like, I
19:57
Speaker 1: just don't like dogs.
19:59
Speaker 2: Who the fuck is like dogs?
20:00
Speaker 1: Apparently this bitch? Wow, she just saying. Oh, And this
20:06
Speaker 1: incident was merely a warning for the consequences if he
20:10
Speaker 1: did ever cheat or leave her.
20:12
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh.
20:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, And for one reason or another, Saunders actually did
20:17
Speaker 1: stay with her after this event. He did attempt to
20:21
Speaker 1: attempt to leave, but Catherine always managed to core her
20:24
Speaker 1: some to stay, whether it was begging or threats. Huh,
20:28
Speaker 1: So I can understand like there are toxic relationships and
20:32
Speaker 1: people like can't leave for various reasons. Oh yeah, I
20:35
Speaker 1: totally get that. Yeah, but yeah, the dog thing that
20:41
Speaker 1: that got to me when I was researching, and I
20:44
Speaker 1: knew it would probably get to you and many other
20:47
Speaker 1: people who are listening to this right now, So I'm
20:48
Speaker 1: sorry for that.
20:49
Speaker 2: Well, if you didn't know, we're big dog fans around here.
20:52
Speaker 1: We are. In June of nineteen eighty eight, two would
20:56
Speaker 1: conceive and welcome a daughter into the world, Sarah Saunders.
21:01
Speaker 1: Though they were far from a happy home. Eventually Saunders
21:04
Speaker 1: managed to leave Catherine and he understandably went into hiding
21:10
Speaker 1: in another town, so Catherine was unable to find him.
21:14
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was terrified.
21:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, and of course Catherine I can't talk today. Of
21:18
Speaker 1: course Katherine there we go, was enraged, but there wasn't
21:23
Speaker 1: much she could do about it because she had absolutely
21:26
Speaker 1: no idea of his whereabouts. So that kind of sucked
21:29
Speaker 1: on her end. But fantastic for Saunders getting out of
21:32
Speaker 1: the relationship, Like, uh.
21:33
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, that didn't seem like it was the healthiest
21:36
Speaker 2: of relationships.
21:37
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's one way to describe it.
21:39
Speaker 2: That's a good that's a nice way to describe.
21:42
Speaker 1: It very very nice way. I nineteen ninety one, Catherine
21:46
Speaker 1: would become pregnant with her fourth child with a man
21:49
Speaker 1: by the name of John Chillingworth, a former coworker from
21:53
Speaker 1: the Slaughterhouse, and in nineteen ninety two she gave birth
21:56
Speaker 1: to their son, Eric Chillingworth. Okay, now, despite their new son, though,
22:02
Speaker 1: the relationship was like all others we mentioned so far,
22:06
Speaker 1: violent and it wouldn't actually last too long. She would
22:10
Speaker 1: leave John after after three years.
22:13
Speaker 2: So at the beginning of her relationships, like she she must,
22:18
Speaker 2: she hides how she really is. Then, eh, you're like
22:22
Speaker 2: of time being. Well, I think it's the people.
22:24
Speaker 1: I think it's kind of like a honeymoon period, right once,
22:27
Speaker 1: like the hunt, like the oh my God, like lovey dovey,
22:29
Speaker 1: lovey dove Once it's like, Okay, well, all of a sudden,
22:33
Speaker 1: it's like he's coming home a little later from work
22:35
Speaker 1: because instead of like rushing home to see me and
22:39
Speaker 1: have dinner with me and romance me, he's like, oh,
22:42
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go with the guys tonight. Yeah, it's like,
22:44
Speaker 1: oh what about me?
22:46
Speaker 2: Okay, that makes sense because yeah, maybe the first few months,
22:49
Speaker 2: like you're almost like you're unseparable, right, yeah, inseparable.
22:56
Speaker 1: I think both could actually apply technically.
22:59
Speaker 2: And then yeah, I guess his life moves on like
23:01
Speaker 2: you kind of. You go back to a little bit
23:03
Speaker 2: of your day to day.
23:04
Speaker 1: Ye. So okay, And there is some speculation out there,
23:09
Speaker 1: and I don't want to say facts on it because
23:12
Speaker 1: it's just people talking. But there are some articles I
23:17
Speaker 1: read where she was apparently really good in bed, so
23:20
Speaker 1: that was part of that.
23:22
Speaker 2: Oh okay, that allure. That makes a lot of sense actually, yeah,
23:28
Speaker 2: huh wow. Okay.
23:31
Speaker 1: So anyways, she would leave John Chillington for John Price.
23:37
Speaker 2: Geez, why the fuck do all these people have the
23:39
Speaker 2: same name?
23:40
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, well John sorry, Chillingworth, not chilling ten.
23:45
Speaker 1: John Chillingworth was a very minor blip in this story.
23:49
Speaker 1: So the main John we are talking about here is
23:51
Speaker 1: John Price.
23:52
Speaker 2: Okay.
23:53
Speaker 1: So John Price was born on the fourth of April
23:55
Speaker 1: in nineteen fifty five and had three kids of his
23:58
Speaker 1: own when he began seeing Though his two year old
24:01
Speaker 1: daughter stayed with his former wife, he did have custody
24:04
Speaker 1: of his two older children, so he was described as
24:07
Speaker 1: a well liked individual, and in nineteen ninety five, Catherine
24:10
Speaker 1: would move in with John into his home, though it
24:13
Speaker 1: wasn't really a permanent situation. She still had kind of
24:16
Speaker 1: her own place. She just kind of treated his place
24:18
Speaker 1: like hers as well, So a lot of her stuff
24:21
Speaker 1: was there and kind of thing, you know.
24:23
Speaker 2: Like more than just the toothbrush.
24:25
Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely. So unfortunately for John Price, all those years
24:31
Speaker 1: of violent behaviors building up would come to a brutal
24:35
Speaker 1: climactic moment, if you will, at his expense.
24:41
Speaker 2: Oh okay, here, I was thinking that she might hurt
24:44
Speaker 2: his kids or something because what she did to that
24:46
Speaker 2: one guy's poppy gosh, or maybe she does. Okay, let's
24:50
Speaker 2: hear well.
24:52
Speaker 1: John was fully aware of Catherine's violent reputation. As I mentioned,
24:58
Speaker 1: it potentially could have that he was still in the
25:01
Speaker 1: relationship for sexual reasons. He actually does confirm that a
25:04
Speaker 1: little bit later on here, but I'll get to that
25:07
Speaker 1: at the beginning a part from the accasual violent argument.
25:10
Speaker 1: Life seemed quite pleasant and his children took a liking
25:13
Speaker 1: to her. Actually, so Price was earning good money working
25:17
Speaker 1: at the local minds, and overall things seemed positive. However,
25:21
Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety eight, Catherine and John began to clash
25:24
Speaker 1: over his refusal to marry her. It was after eighteen
25:28
Speaker 1: months that they began seeing each other that Catherine was
25:31
Speaker 1: pushing for marriage.
25:32
Speaker 2: Oh man, that's actually not very much time, really, it's not.
25:36
Speaker 1: However, John made it clear that he was only in
25:40
Speaker 1: it for the sex and the relationship and didn't want marriage.
25:44
Speaker 2: Like, is that what he actually said to her?
25:46
Speaker 1: I couldn't find an exact quote on what he said,
25:49
Speaker 1: but I found articles talking about that.
25:51
Speaker 2: That's probably something he kind of said hearsay, like after,
25:55
Speaker 2: I'm assuming not to her face.
25:58
Speaker 1: No, I think it was more so like yeah, no,
26:00
Speaker 1: I'm just like it's just a relationship for me, like
26:02
Speaker 1: the sex, the relationship, the fun. I think that's kind
26:05
Speaker 1: of what he was was after.
26:07
Speaker 2: Okay, well yeah, like he already had kids, been there,
26:10
Speaker 2: done that. Maybe yeah, he has divorced, so yeah, yeah, okay.
26:15
Speaker 1: And I mean to any regular person this sort of
26:17
Speaker 1: like conversation, they may take that as a sign that's like,
26:19
Speaker 1: you know what, Okay, we got to go different ways.
26:21
Speaker 1: This relationship clearly isn't gonna work. We want different things.
26:25
Speaker 1: Or maybe even it's a sign that okay, we got
26:27
Speaker 1: to work on some things together to get on track together.
26:30
Speaker 1: Maybe find a middle ground somehow or something, you know,
26:34
Speaker 1: maybe like a forever engagement ring, no paper signed, no nothing,
26:37
Speaker 1: but at least like give me some sort of commitment,
26:40
Speaker 1: commitment physical, you know, sign of a commitment. Yeah, something
26:43
Speaker 1: like some middle ground, let's talk about it, you know.
26:46
Speaker 2: Yeah.
26:46
Speaker 1: But for Catherine, it was of course much more so
26:51
Speaker 1: as Catherine had done in the past, you know, continuing
26:53
Speaker 1: with her douche canoe ways. She wanted to get revenge
26:58
Speaker 1: and turned to try and hurt some one close to John,
27:01
Speaker 1: because that's just what she does, yep, you know, trying
27:05
Speaker 1: to go after the mom, successfully going after the puppy.
27:10
Speaker 2: Shit, I think one of the kids is in danger here.
27:14
Speaker 1: Well, it wasn't physical harm that she attempted, but it
27:19
Speaker 1: was still traumatizing. So she would sit down with one
27:22
Speaker 1: of John's fourteen year old daughters and she began to
27:24
Speaker 1: tell her that John wasn't her real dad.
27:28
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, just making up some shit, yep.
27:30
Speaker 1: She just like started fucking spewing lies, bullshit. She's like, oh, yeah,
27:34
Speaker 1: he's not your dad. He's like, yeah, your mom was
27:36
Speaker 1: sleeping around a bunch and some other dude out there's
27:38
Speaker 1: your dad. John's just some guy she cheated on him.
27:42
Speaker 2: Whoa could you imagine at fourteen? Yeah, you would just
27:46
Speaker 2: be like hysterical. Yeah, okay, so.
27:50
Speaker 1: She tried, she pulled that, which is not fucking cool.
27:53
Speaker 2: No, but I did kind of expect that she was
27:56
Speaker 2: going to like kill one of them, not gonna lie.
27:58
Speaker 1: Luckily enough, she did no go after the kid in
28:02
Speaker 1: this instance, which is fantastic. So again, that sort of
28:06
Speaker 1: trauma not cool. So she continued to bother John about
28:10
Speaker 1: the whole marriage thing, and he held his ground, but
28:14
Speaker 1: it was becoming enough for him. He wanted her out
28:17
Speaker 1: of his house.
28:19
Speaker 2: Enough enough, Hey, enough's enough.
28:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, but she refused. Now, while in John's house, Catherine
28:28
Speaker 1: eventually found John's will and realized that he didn't have
28:32
Speaker 1: her on it at all.
28:34
Speaker 2: Okay, well have they like they've literally hardly been together
28:37
Speaker 2: here at this point.
28:39
Speaker 1: You can round it up and you can say two
28:41
Speaker 1: years just to be gracious, huh.
28:43
Speaker 2: Okay, she just oh, man, he's probably regretting some shit here.
28:47
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, she's looking at the will and it's all like, oh,
28:50
Speaker 1: you're leaving it to your ex wife and like your
28:52
Speaker 1: kids and stuff like That's I'm not in your fucking
28:54
Speaker 1: will and she thought this was absolute bullshit.
28:57
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, Yeah.
28:59
Speaker 1: Why don't you did to get them back this time?
29:01
Speaker 2: What?
29:02
Speaker 1: Well, she didn't go after the kids this time, she
29:04
Speaker 1: did go after him personally, okay. In retaliation, she secretly
29:08
Speaker 1: recorded John handling items items that she alleged were stolen
29:14
Speaker 1: from his workplace, and then she proceeded to take that
29:16
Speaker 1: recording and send the video to his boss at work. Really, yes,
29:24
Speaker 1: so the items in question were outdated medical kits in
29:27
Speaker 1: first aid supplies that John had salvaged from the company's garbage. However,
29:32
Speaker 1: this was enough for the company to see the theft,
29:34
Speaker 1: and they terminated his employment after seventeen years with the company.
29:39
Speaker 2: Wow, I don't even quite understand how that would like
29:42
Speaker 2: even benefit her, Like she is like literally this Like I.
29:46
Speaker 1: Don't she's a bitch, well shit, straight.
29:49
Speaker 2: Up crazy, But I don't know that's like maybe not
29:51
Speaker 2: the she's a crazy bitch she is though, like just
29:55
Speaker 2: like the way her her her mind's like thinking about
29:59
Speaker 2: all these thing she can do to just like ruin
30:01
Speaker 2: other people's lives and people that she's supposed to like
30:03
Speaker 2: care and love and stuff.
30:05
Speaker 1: Is well, and remember we we are dealing with a psychopath. Yeah,
30:09
Speaker 1: that is what she is.
30:11
Speaker 2: Yeah, holy I okay, that's and that's also kind of
30:16
Speaker 2: sad if they were expired first aid stuff that he'd
30:19
Speaker 2: like literally just took from the garbage that he was
30:21
Speaker 2: planning to use, which is better than them not being
30:23
Speaker 2: in the landfill. Yeah, and his work is.
30:26
Speaker 1: Just like no yeap terminated.
30:29
Speaker 2: Hmm, brutal.
30:31
Speaker 1: I mean, at least look at it from this from
30:33
Speaker 1: the workplace standpoint. Though I don't agree with him, I'm
30:36
Speaker 1: just Devil's advocate here. At the very least, you have
30:40
Speaker 1: what's now being spread around work I'm sure as video
30:43
Speaker 1: evidence of someone's stealing.
30:44
Speaker 2: From the company and then they don't do anything.
30:47
Speaker 1: And then they don't do anything. What's that going to promote?
30:49
Speaker 2: Yeah? You almost have to wonder though, if that was
30:52
Speaker 2: her way of trying to control him, more so in
30:56
Speaker 2: that he now doesn't have a job and maybe like
30:58
Speaker 2: needs to rely on her her and he's home more
31:02
Speaker 2: well something.
31:03
Speaker 1: I actually didn't go into this too much, but she
31:05
Speaker 1: worked at the Slaughterhouse for a little while, but then
31:08
Speaker 1: she ended up injuring her back somehow and was on disability,
31:11
Speaker 1: so she didn't have a whole lot of income. Either.
31:13
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, so sorry.
31:15
Speaker 1: Mosquitos one got in the house. I got him, I
31:19
Speaker 1: got him. It's good.
31:20
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're kind of bad today.
31:21
Speaker 1: Yeah so yeah. She didn't really have much of an
31:24
Speaker 1: income either, so.
31:27
Speaker 2: Well yeah, so I just don't quite like to see
31:29
Speaker 2: how that's going to benefit her in any way either revenge, well,
31:33
Speaker 2: I mean, but now, like they're going to be struggling
31:35
Speaker 2: for money and stuff.
31:36
Speaker 1: I don't think she cares. The biggest thing with her
31:38
Speaker 1: is she likes to see others suffer. Yeah, whether it's emotional, physical,
31:44
Speaker 1: she likes to see suffering. She likes to be the
31:47
Speaker 1: center of it. And she it's all about her. It
31:50
Speaker 1: doesn't matter anyone else. And if you wrong her, she's
31:53
Speaker 1: going to see you suffer so she can feel better.
31:56
Speaker 2: Geez it true makes me talking, so it must just
32:00
Speaker 2: makes me feel ill, like I want to barf.
32:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, fair enough, I can. Yeah, sympathize. That's what
32:10
Speaker 1: I was looking for. I can sympathize with that. Yeah. Well, anyways,
32:13
Speaker 1: John was absolutely fed up with Catherine, so he made
32:16
Speaker 1: the decision to finally kick her out of his house
32:19
Speaker 1: once and for all. Now. It was February twenty ninth
32:22
Speaker 1: that he visited the Scone Magistrate Courthouse on his way
32:26
Speaker 1: to work and obtained a restraining order in an attempt
32:29
Speaker 1: to protect himself and his children from Catherine. That afternoon,
32:34
Speaker 1: while at his new job. At work, John spoke to
32:36
Speaker 1: his coworkers about Catherine and was showing scars from physical
32:40
Speaker 1: abuse that he'd been enduring throughout the relationship. Reportedly, some
32:45
Speaker 1: of the scars were from her, though I couldn't find
32:48
Speaker 1: information on it. Stabbing him.
32:50
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh.
32:51
Speaker 1: So I don't know how deep or the extent or
32:54
Speaker 1: the tool or even the incident, because there's a lot
32:56
Speaker 1: of these incidents within her relationships. It's hard to sift
33:00
Speaker 1: through them all.
33:01
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, I could imagine the amount of like research
33:04
Speaker 2: you had to do for this. God.
33:06
Speaker 1: Well, it's over the course of entire lifetime, lifetime of
33:10
Speaker 1: abuse not only on her and her childhood, but in
33:13
Speaker 1: her adulthood, abusing others. So anyways, he was talking about it,
33:20
Speaker 1: and he showed the scars, and he also told his
33:22
Speaker 1: co workers He's like, Hey, if I don't show up
33:24
Speaker 1: for work tomorrow, it's because Catherine killed me.
33:27
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh.
33:28
Speaker 1: Just warning people, just warning people, and I mean respectably.
33:34
Speaker 1: His coworkers were pretty much begging him, like, don't fucking
33:38
Speaker 1: go home then, like if you are thinking you're going
33:42
Speaker 1: to be in danger like this, this woman is this
33:45
Speaker 1: off the wall, don't fucking go home.
33:49
Speaker 2: Yeah, but that's tough. Are they offering him somewhere to
33:54
Speaker 2: stay and stuff? Because it's hard?
33:55
Speaker 1: That's hard, right, Well, I'm sure someone would have offered
33:58
Speaker 1: him somewhere to stay. I guarantee you he would be
34:00
Speaker 1: able to find a place easy enough.
34:01
Speaker 2: Because yeah, you did say he was like well liked he.
34:04
Speaker 1: Was he was, And especially if someone's like I'm gonna
34:07
Speaker 1: get fucking murdered tonight. I don't think I know anyone
34:12
Speaker 1: who would say you cannot stay with me then like.
34:16
Speaker 2: Yeah, but then that's also kind of scary for them too.
34:19
Speaker 2: And he could even be thinking, well, he doesn't want
34:21
Speaker 2: to put other people in danger.
34:22
Speaker 1: Yeah, but if they don't know, especially in this is
34:25
Speaker 1: now in the eighties, there's the most cell phones, there's
34:27
Speaker 1: no internet, how are you going to fucking know that
34:29
Speaker 1: he's at? Yeah, Jeffrey's house did four blocks away.
34:33
Speaker 2: I guess or.
34:36
Speaker 1: It would be. But John's major reasoning though, why he
34:40
Speaker 1: was insisting that he does need to go home. He
34:43
Speaker 1: knew that there was a chance that she would harm
34:45
Speaker 1: his kids if he didn't go back home. That was
34:48
Speaker 1: the big thing for him, right. So, after a shift
34:51
Speaker 1: at work, he did as he always did, despite any
34:53
Speaker 1: danger that he thought he might be in, and he
34:55
Speaker 1: returned home as per usual. Now, when he was home,
35:01
Speaker 1: he discovered that Catherine had actually sent the children away
35:04
Speaker 1: for a sleepover at a friend's place. Now, relieved that
35:07
Speaker 1: his kids were safe, he actually spent the evening had
35:09
Speaker 1: his neighbor's place before returning home and going to bed
35:12
Speaker 1: at eleven PM. This spot is a little bit gray
35:16
Speaker 1: for me. I couldn't find if Catherine was there when
35:18
Speaker 1: he got home or not, or there must have been
35:21
Speaker 1: a note that she wrote or something saying that kids
35:24
Speaker 1: are away. Yeah, I'm assuming she wasn't there, the note
35:28
Speaker 1: was there, That's my assumption. Okay, so bear that in mind.
35:31
Speaker 2: He just on edge for the whole night, basically.
35:34
Speaker 1: Yes. Now, at six am the following day, a neighbor
35:38
Speaker 1: had noticed that John's car was still in his driveway
35:40
Speaker 1: when he usually has gone to work by Now, John's
35:43
Speaker 1: employer also sent a worker to check on him, as
35:48
Speaker 1: he didn't show up for his shift, and after repeatedly
35:51
Speaker 1: calling him on his phone, there was no answer. Oh no,
35:56
Speaker 1: So both the neighbor and the worker together were trying
35:59
Speaker 1: to get's attention. They were knocking on his bedroom window
36:03
Speaker 1: trying to get him to wake up, thinking that he
36:05
Speaker 1: must be in there. And they went to the front
36:08
Speaker 1: door to try and knock, and that's where they saw
36:10
Speaker 1: traces of blood on the front door, and they knew
36:13
Speaker 1: something wasn't.
36:15
Speaker 2: Right, dang it.
36:18
Speaker 1: So they quickly alerted police, who broke down the back
36:22
Speaker 1: door of his home on eighty fourth Saint Andrew's Street
36:24
Speaker 1: and discovered John's lifeless body.
36:27
Speaker 2: She got him, She got to him.
36:30
Speaker 1: So Catherine was also in the.
36:32
Speaker 2: Home alive, Yes, alive, Okay.
36:37
Speaker 1: She was found passed out in a comatose state from
36:40
Speaker 1: consuming a large amount of pills. She was lying next
36:44
Speaker 1: to the remains, mutilated remains of John Price.
36:48
Speaker 2: Whoa So was she like trying to kill herself commit suicide?
36:55
Speaker 2: Or that's a gray area.
36:56
Speaker 1: Maybe we'll we'll get onto that too.
36:58
Speaker 2: Okay.
36:59
Speaker 1: So Catherine had purchased the night before. Sorry, I'm a
37:03
Speaker 1: paragraph ahead of myself. So what had happened the night
37:06
Speaker 1: of John's death is odd? Bizarre string of events and
37:10
Speaker 1: somewhat argumentative of showing premeditation. Okay, so the night before
37:20
Speaker 1: she had purchased this lace black nightgown and headed over
37:24
Speaker 1: to see your kids at her place. She recorded them
37:31
Speaker 1: in what kind of almost seems like a last will
37:33
Speaker 1: and testament kind of way, okay, kind of talking on
37:36
Speaker 1: camera about certain items that, oh, this is this is mine.
37:39
Speaker 1: I've always loved this, so it's yours. What's mine is yours?
37:43
Speaker 1: Kind of attitude, right.
37:45
Speaker 2: Maybe a little bit different.
37:46
Speaker 1: Yeah, And after that she went to John's house. She
37:50
Speaker 1: showered and put on the nightgown, and at this time
37:55
Speaker 1: John was already home asleep, so she would sleep a
37:58
Speaker 1: little while and then woke up in the middle of
37:59
Speaker 1: the night, and then she also woke up John, and
38:03
Speaker 1: the two began having sex. Interesting after that a little while,
38:09
Speaker 1: kind of thing they did, thing they did, thing they did.
38:15
Speaker 1: John fell back asleep, and that's when the attack occurred.
38:20
Speaker 2: Is it because they only had sex one time?
38:22
Speaker 1: Maybe? I don't know. Catherine would reach forward and retrieve
38:27
Speaker 1: a butcher knife from its usual place hanging above the bed,
38:30
Speaker 1: and she proceeded to stab John a total of thirty
38:34
Speaker 1: seven times.
38:36
Speaker 2: Brutal.
38:38
Speaker 1: It is thought that John briefly regained consciousness during the attack,
38:42
Speaker 1: but unfortunately was unable to defend himself. There's also thoughts
38:47
Speaker 1: that he was able to stumble through the house a bit,
38:50
Speaker 1: exiting through the front door, and whether he fell back
38:53
Speaker 1: inside or was pulled back inside before the door was closed.
38:57
Speaker 1: On sure, but he would succumb to the injuries of
39:00
Speaker 1: the attack.
39:01
Speaker 2: You know. It's almost surprising to me though, that he
39:03
Speaker 2: was able to even fall asleep. Yeah, Like he must
39:08
Speaker 2: have really was able to sleep. Be Like, I just
39:11
Speaker 2: feel like I would have troubles falling asleep if you
39:15
Speaker 2: literally thought the person next to you was could murder you.
39:18
Speaker 1: Yeah, but that might as much as I hate to
39:20
Speaker 1: give her this credit, that might just fall back onto
39:23
Speaker 1: the fact that she's just that good of a fucking lay.
39:25
Speaker 1: I don't know. Oh gosh, I mean, he's like dead asleep.
39:31
Speaker 1: He wakes up all of a sudden, he's getting like
39:34
Speaker 1: the lay of his life, and then just rolls over
39:36
Speaker 1: back to sleep again.
39:37
Speaker 2: Well yeah, and he's probably like, oh, like we just
39:40
Speaker 2: we just did this, like nothing bad it's gonna happen. Yeah,
39:44
Speaker 2: but he literally had no idea how nuts she was exactly.
39:49
Speaker 1: Yeah, so Catherine, unfortunately though, wasn't done killing him, wasn't
39:54
Speaker 1: just enough for her. She would then drag his body
39:58
Speaker 1: into an area where she would proceed to skin him
40:00
Speaker 1: and hang him hangs remains, in fact, from meat hooks
40:04
Speaker 1: in the living room.
40:05
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, that's gross.
40:07
Speaker 1: She would proceed to decapitate his body and dismember him.
40:11
Speaker 1: Not only that, but she began preparing pieces of his
40:14
Speaker 1: flesh to cook in a dish alongside potatoes, pumpkins, beets, zucchini, cabbage, squash,
40:20
Speaker 1: and even gravy. The fuck yeah, she's she's making in
40:25
Speaker 1: the middle of the night a roast with his basically, yeah,
40:30
Speaker 1: remains basically, Uh, she prepared a whole whole meal for herself,
40:37
Speaker 1: although evidence would at the crime scene suggest that she
40:41
Speaker 1: couldn't finish her plate, as portions of the meal were discarded,
40:44
Speaker 1: and that discarded it was actually discarded out in the
40:46
Speaker 1: backyard on the lawn somewhere, so it's kind of like
40:49
Speaker 1: odd spot to be discarded. But uh, half her plate
40:52
Speaker 1: was She finished half her plate.
40:54
Speaker 2: Basically, so like she literally ate some of him.
40:56
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, she consumed him.
40:58
Speaker 2: Huh.
40:59
Speaker 1: She cooked and can assumed.
41:00
Speaker 2: Him, Hey, well, can we please note that Ben is
41:02
Speaker 2: doing a cannibalism.
41:04
Speaker 1: Case and not Nicole.
41:06
Speaker 2: There you go, it's not always me, not always you.
41:10
Speaker 1: There's there's there's a once for everything. First time, first time,
41:15
Speaker 1: that's that's the same. That's it.
41:16
Speaker 2: We're really good with our words today. At least we
41:19
Speaker 2: can help each other out.
41:20
Speaker 1: Yeah, no kidding. So yeah. She prepared the meal for
41:25
Speaker 1: herself ate at least some of it in the discard
41:28
Speaker 1: of the rest. Subsequently, she would then lay down next
41:32
Speaker 1: to some of John's mutilated remains and ingest a significant
41:39
Speaker 1: amount of pills before she lost consciousness.
41:42
Speaker 2: Hmm, that is just so fucked well.
41:47
Speaker 1: The last little gory detail here. Amongst all the blood
41:50
Speaker 1: and gore around the house, law enforcement encombed another gruesome
41:54
Speaker 1: sight of John's severed head boiling in a pot of
41:57
Speaker 1: vegetables on the stove. I think this is now like
42:01
Speaker 1: the third or fourth case where there's been a head
42:03
Speaker 1: boiling on the stove.
42:05
Speaker 2: It's a thing. I don't I have absolutely no idea why.
42:08
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know either, but it's apparently a thing.
42:10
Speaker 2: It's like they're making stock for soup. Yeah, which is disturbing.
42:15
Speaker 1: Why don't know something else very disturbing about this. No, well,
42:18
Speaker 1: they also found two more fully set plates with food
42:22
Speaker 1: and flesh set at the table, each bearing a name
42:27
Speaker 1: tag next to it.
42:29
Speaker 2: For his kids.
42:30
Speaker 1: Two of his kids. Oh, apparently she left out one
42:34
Speaker 1: because she liked the kid. But the other two, Yeah,
42:38
Speaker 1: there were place sets with their dads cooked remains alongside
42:45
Speaker 1: healthy servings of vegetables and gravy ready to go. She
42:49
Speaker 1: fully intended to feed the kids their dad.
42:52
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, this just keeps getting worse, Like, are
42:56
Speaker 2: we done yet here?
42:59
Speaker 1: Well, what do you mean why we Like, I just.
43:01
Speaker 2: Cannot believe that this can keep going. Well, I mean
43:04
Speaker 2: she needs okay, at this point, if she if she's alive,
43:08
Speaker 2: she needs to be in jail. And like there's no
43:10
Speaker 2: literal chance that she can get out of jail at
43:13
Speaker 2: this point.
43:14
Speaker 1: You think, so, Yeah, okay, okay, Well, Catherine would wake up.
43:19
Speaker 1: Catherine was not dead. Police were able to wake her
43:22
Speaker 1: up on the scene, and of course, when she woke up,
43:25
Speaker 1: what do you think she did?
43:26
Speaker 2: Oh my god, what happened?
43:28
Speaker 1: Yeah, she played dumb and and claimed that she had
43:30
Speaker 1: no recollection of the incident that transpired.
43:35
Speaker 2: Okay, and they didn't buy it.
43:38
Speaker 1: I don't think so really, but who knows.
43:41
Speaker 2: She was pretty good, Like, she was pretty good at
43:45
Speaker 2: making people like manipulative, lah, well, manipulative.
43:49
Speaker 1: Manipulative, she was maculative. Yeah, well, just one little piece
43:53
Speaker 1: here to show her manipulation skills. There was a witness
43:56
Speaker 1: watching the police aftermath of the crime scene, the police
44:00
Speaker 1: bombarding the house because like it kind of caused a
44:02
Speaker 1: scene in the neighborhood. People were kind of gathered.
44:04
Speaker 2: Yeah, right, that would.
44:05
Speaker 1: And so a witness would talk about seeing Catherine actually
44:09
Speaker 1: walk out of the house with a very evil, malicious
44:13
Speaker 1: smile across her face. And at the hospital she would
44:19
Speaker 1: arrive on a bed.
44:23
Speaker 2: What does that mean?
44:24
Speaker 1: Catherine willingly walks out of the house smiling, But yeah,
44:27
Speaker 1: when she arrives at the hospital, she's in bed and
44:29
Speaker 1: very sick.
44:30
Speaker 2: Ah geez, yeah, oh just like kay. Was she like
44:37
Speaker 2: a good looking person? No, okay, no, some reason, I'm
44:41
Speaker 2: just like picturing this like just this babe. No okay, well,
44:46
Speaker 2: like I have no idea how she's getting away with
44:48
Speaker 2: this shit and stuff.
44:49
Speaker 1: I mean, objectively speaking, in her prime, was she horrible? No,
44:55
Speaker 1: I'd say she's I don't know, like average in her prime.
44:59
Speaker 2: Okay, but yeah, huh yeah, just that's quite a visual
45:07
Speaker 2: her just like walking out of there, just completely needing help,
45:12
Speaker 2: Like you have to be careful with the words you use, right,
45:15
Speaker 2: like she needs help and just like what she just did,
45:18
Speaker 2: and she is looking like pleased with herself about it.
45:22
Speaker 1: Yeah.
45:24
Speaker 2: Wow.
45:25
Speaker 1: There was one final little piece here that I'm going
45:27
Speaker 1: to talk about from the crime scene. On top of
45:30
Speaker 1: a photograph in the house of John, police also found
45:33
Speaker 1: a note Catherine had had written. It was stained with
45:36
Speaker 1: bits of blood and had bits of remaining flesh attached
45:40
Speaker 1: to it, just from residual handling. And though it's somewhat gibberish,
45:46
Speaker 1: the note reads this hopeful, hopefully you can kind of
45:50
Speaker 1: we'll walk through it a bit. Time got you back,
45:54
Speaker 1: Jonathan for raping my daughter. You to bec for Ross
45:59
Speaker 1: for little John. Now play with little John's dick, John Price.
46:06
Speaker 1: Now the individuals she's referring to, Beck Ross and Little
46:10
Speaker 1: John are apparently some of John's children or some of
46:13
Speaker 1: the children involved. Okay, So after a lengthy investigation, actually
46:18
Speaker 1: police found that the claims and accusations of raping were
46:22
Speaker 1: baseless and most likely fictitious.
46:25
Speaker 2: Almost her kind of throwing in an excuse there for
46:30
Speaker 2: what she did.
46:31
Speaker 1: Yeah right, yeah, kind of just saying like giving herself reason, saying, oh,
46:35
Speaker 1: this is why I did it, you know, trying to
46:37
Speaker 1: maybe give him a bad name in the aftermath too,
46:40
Speaker 1: who knows.
46:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
46:42
Speaker 1: So Catherine and her legal team initially offered a plea
46:46
Speaker 1: of guilty to manslaughter, which is basically like, oops, I
46:52
Speaker 1: accidentally killed someone, like hitting someone with a vehicle, right, like, yah,
46:57
Speaker 1: did not mean to kill them?
46:59
Speaker 2: Well, but tech, I honestly don't even one hundred percent
47:02
Speaker 2: feel like this could have been planned because like maybe
47:05
Speaker 2: she didn't necessarily plan to kill him, but like she
47:08
Speaker 2: has those knives in the spot and woke up and
47:11
Speaker 2: something pissed her off, and and here she went on
47:14
Speaker 2: a little rampage. Well.
47:16
Speaker 1: The little argument for premeditation, though, is the kind of
47:20
Speaker 1: Will and Testament video prior to So it's like, oh,
47:25
Speaker 1: you're sitting here recording a video of like, oh, make
47:28
Speaker 1: sure that my kid gets this sort of thing, or
47:30
Speaker 1: like she didn't say that per se, but she henced
47:32
Speaker 1: a lot of that sort of stuff. It's like, oh,
47:34
Speaker 1: why are you kind of like doing a last Will
47:37
Speaker 1: and Testament thing? On a little video all of a
47:39
Speaker 1: sudden the night before this big murder. Clearly you were
47:42
Speaker 1: planning something.
47:43
Speaker 2: Well, she was planning to maybe kill herself, touche, but
47:47
Speaker 2: maybe not him, but probably him. I'm just I'm just.
47:50
Speaker 1: Well, even if that isn't the case, even if it
47:53
Speaker 1: was just a lapse in judgment a in the spur
47:57
Speaker 1: of the moment killing, she stabbed him thirty.
47:59
Speaker 2: Seven, Well, yeah, overkilled.
48:01
Speaker 1: She skinned him, She cut his head off, she boiled her,
48:05
Speaker 1: cooked him, she ate him. She also made vegetables alongside
48:10
Speaker 1: his fucking body.
48:12
Speaker 2: Yeah, that needs to be more than just a premeditation.
48:15
Speaker 1: Doesn't have to be like hours or days in advance.
48:17
Speaker 1: It can be like a few, like moments before.
48:19
Speaker 2: Yeah.
48:20
Speaker 1: If you intentionally say I'm gonna do this, and then
48:23
Speaker 1: seconds later you do it, that's pre meditation. Yeah, and
48:25
Speaker 1: that's exactly what she did. She's like, I'm going to
48:27
Speaker 1: fucking stab him more, I'm gonna cook him, I'm gonna
48:30
Speaker 1: eat him. I'm gonna make a plate for his kids.
48:33
Speaker 1: Like fuck that?
48:34
Speaker 2: Yeah what? Yeah, nope, Yeah, it eats more than that.
48:38
Speaker 1: Yeah.
48:38
Speaker 2: Sure.
48:39
Speaker 1: So she was like, yeah, I'll play guilty demandslaughter. Catherine
48:43
Speaker 1: would enter the plea sorry, it would be rejected, my apologies,
48:48
Speaker 1: and on March second, two thousand and one, she would
48:50
Speaker 1: officially be charged with murder of John Price, and she
48:53
Speaker 1: would enter the plea of not guilty. And though the
48:55
Speaker 1: trial was initially scheduled for the twenty third of July
48:58
Speaker 1: in two thousand and one, it would be postponed and
49:01
Speaker 1: it would eventually take place place on October fifteenth in
49:03
Speaker 1: two thousand and one. Okay, so, during the commencement of
49:07
Speaker 1: the trial, Justice Barry O'Keeffe offered all the sixty prospective
49:13
Speaker 1: jurors the option to be excused due to the graphic
49:15
Speaker 1: nature of the photographic evidence. That alone is wild to me.
49:20
Speaker 2: Okay, so this is like super disturbing. Then I'm about
49:23
Speaker 2: to say this, but if I'm like ever on a jury,
49:26
Speaker 2: this would be like the case that I want to
49:28
Speaker 2: be on. I would be so mortified and so disturbed
49:31
Speaker 2: and just sick to my stomach. But it would be
49:33
Speaker 2: like pretty fucking interesting.
49:35
Speaker 1: I have a feeling anyone lists out there listening to
49:38
Speaker 1: a true crime.
49:39
Speaker 2: Podcast, especially say the same thing.
49:41
Speaker 1: Yeah, especially if they're on part two and this deep
49:44
Speaker 1: into second part of this episode. I have a feeling
49:47
Speaker 1: they're all with you on that and they.
49:48
Speaker 2: Understand, but honestly, also, it would be traumatizing. Oh yeah,
49:53
Speaker 2: it would one hundred percent affect the rest of your life.
49:56
Speaker 1: Though definitely it'd be fucked up.
49:59
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it would be like, wow, it'd be fucked
50:01
Speaker 2: up a fascinating yeah.
50:03
Speaker 1: Yeah. So during the commencement of the trials, so I
50:07
Speaker 1: covered that there will be five jurors that actually took
50:10
Speaker 1: up the opportunity to be excused from this. So Catherine's
50:15
Speaker 1: defense had initially planned to argue her case based on
50:20
Speaker 1: claims of amnesia and disassociation, okay, which apparently had the
50:25
Speaker 1: support of most psychiatrists despite their acknowledgment of her sanity.
50:31
Speaker 1: So they're like, she's sane, but psychiatrists still support the
50:35
Speaker 1: idea of amnesia and disassociation.
50:38
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's well, I think that she was almost in
50:40
Speaker 2: some sort of state, because didn't at some point you
50:42
Speaker 2: say like there could be like a switch, Yeah.
50:45
Speaker 1: Right, well, it seemed like that it seemed like anything
50:47
Speaker 1: could just fucking set her off. Yeah yeah, So yeah,
50:50
Speaker 1: psychiatrists are like, yeah, she's completely sane, but yeah, I
50:52
Speaker 1: think there is something there that yeah, like you're saying
50:55
Speaker 1: this switch almost so two psychiatrists concluded that Catherine suffered
51:02
Speaker 1: from borderline personality disorder as well. Oh okay, so it's
51:06
Speaker 1: kind of like almost on the lines of bipolar, which
51:09
Speaker 1: would explain that switch and this whole situation. Now, the
51:14
Speaker 1: next day on Catherine's trial, unexpectedly, she changed her plea
51:21
Speaker 1: to guilty.
51:22
Speaker 2: Really, yes, she just decided to have a conscience overnight
51:27
Speaker 2: or what.
51:27
Speaker 1: I guess. She's like, no, I'm guilty, and her legal
51:30
Speaker 1: team's like what, no, no, and she's like, no, I'm guilty.
51:35
Speaker 1: I'm pleading guilty.
51:36
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh.
51:37
Speaker 1: And of course they can't make her not Yeah.
51:39
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, gosh, I feel like they should be happy. Gosh.
51:42
Speaker 2: Could you imagine defending her? Oh oh, I don't know
51:45
Speaker 2: if I couldn't accept that amount of money, Like I
51:49
Speaker 2: need endless amount of money to be able to do that.
51:52
Speaker 1: No kidding. So her legal team, though, did apparently know
51:56
Speaker 1: that she was changing her plea on the initial day
51:59
Speaker 1: of the trial. Is now day two when she's leaning
52:01
Speaker 1: guilty on day one, they knew that she was changing
52:04
Speaker 1: her plea. However, they wanted the overnight to basically get
52:07
Speaker 1: a psychiatric evaluation to determine if she was fully comprehending
52:11
Speaker 1: the implications of a guilty and yeah, she passes like, yeah,
52:16
Speaker 1: she knows what she's doing. She's perfectly fine, she can
52:19
Speaker 1: make the call herself totally.
52:21
Speaker 2: Yeah. But I'm like, this is good riddance, this is
52:23
Speaker 2: a good thing.
52:24
Speaker 1: Yeah. So Catherine never gave any sort of specific reason
52:29
Speaker 1: why she suddenly changed to a guilty plea huh. Yeah,
52:34
Speaker 1: And even after changing and pleading guilty, she continued to
52:38
Speaker 1: deny responsibilities for her actions.
52:39
Speaker 2: Though, Oh okay, that's a bit weird.
52:41
Speaker 1: Yeah, She's like, I did it, but I didn't do
52:44
Speaker 1: but I'm not responsible for it.
52:47
Speaker 2: I mean, unless she's kind of saying like that in
52:50
Speaker 2: that state. Yeah.
52:51
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I think what she was trying to do
52:54
Speaker 1: with this is trying to probably get a lesser sentence.
52:58
Speaker 1: She's like, yeah, I'm just gonna play guilty, and I'm
53:01
Speaker 1: just gonna say the psychiatrists will know that I'm like disassociating,
53:05
Speaker 1: borderline personality disorder, all this sort of stuff. If she's like,
53:09
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna play guilty, they know this, then perhaps
53:12
Speaker 1: it'll be a lesser sentence. Maybe I'll just go into
53:14
Speaker 1: psychiatric care. That could have been what she's hoping for, I.
53:19
Speaker 2: Guess, but I feel like I don't know if she
53:21
Speaker 2: just ran the course of the trial that she would
53:24
Speaker 2: have ended up getting lest But who knows.
53:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, who knows for sure. So during the sentence hearing,
53:30
Speaker 1: when details of a gruesome act of skinning in decapitation
53:33
Speaker 1: were being described, Catherine reportedly became quote hysterical and had
53:37
Speaker 1: to be sedated. Now I can't find facts on what
53:43
Speaker 1: hysterical exactly means. I'm assuming in like a like panic
53:48
Speaker 1: attack sort of way, not like a joker laughing maniacal way.
53:53
Speaker 2: Like almost Wow, I fucking did that? Potentially, I think so.
54:00
Speaker 1: So on the eighth of November, Catherine Knight was sentenced
54:03
Speaker 1: to life in prison without anything of a specification on
54:08
Speaker 1: a non parole period. So there's nothing in there saying
54:11
Speaker 1: about a parole period. However, on her papers, on her
54:15
Speaker 1: prison sentence papers, there is a phrase that the sentence
54:21
Speaker 1: had to be contained in this. So it's like the
54:23
Speaker 1: sentence is like, she's due to life, no parole specifications. However,
54:27
Speaker 1: the sentence papers have to say this definitely never to
54:33
Speaker 1: be released.
54:35
Speaker 2: Okay, oh my gosh.
54:38
Speaker 1: Could you imagine the fucking papers saying that definitely never
54:41
Speaker 1: to be released.
54:43
Speaker 2: Well, thank goodness they say that.
54:45
Speaker 1: Yeah, and this marked the first time such a designation
54:49
Speaker 1: had ever and I mean ever, been imposed on a
54:53
Speaker 1: woman in Australian history, the first woman to ever serve
54:58
Speaker 1: a full or be given a full life sentence.
55:03
Speaker 2: Huh Is she still alive? You know?
55:07
Speaker 1: I actually that's one thing I didn't actually look up.
55:09
Speaker 1: We'll google it here at the end. I have one
55:10
Speaker 1: more paragraph. In June of two thousand and six, Catherine
55:14
Speaker 1: appealed her life sentence, arguing that a penalty of life
55:17
Speaker 1: imprisonment without the possibility of parole was overly severe for
55:21
Speaker 1: the crime she committed, but her appeal was of course denied. Now,
55:26
Speaker 1: I did assume Catherine is still alive, though I never
55:30
Speaker 1: did actually look it up. Per se, Nicole's doing it
55:33
Speaker 1: right now? What do you think?
55:34
Speaker 2: Well, I don't what the frick's her last name? Though?
55:36
Speaker 1: Night Okay, that's what I thought, k N I g H.
55:39
Speaker 2: T Okay, this could take me a minute here, Shit,
55:43
Speaker 2: I think she's still alive.
55:45
Speaker 1: I'm pretty I'm pretty sure she is, but I just
55:48
Speaker 1: didn't yes, because.
55:48
Speaker 2: It says she's sixty seven years old.
55:50
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, so Catherine, yeah, is still alive. Nicole just
55:53
Speaker 1: fact checked it.
55:55
Speaker 2: I really don't love that. I mean not that I'm
55:58
Speaker 2: saying like that I want her to die, but it's
56:00
Speaker 2: just like crazy that someone that's so like terrifying is
56:04
Speaker 2: out there is still alive.
56:05
Speaker 1: Like, I wonder what she's thinking right now.
56:09
Speaker 2: Oh, let's not, let's not wonder that.
56:13
Speaker 1: How do you think someone like that would live out
56:15
Speaker 1: their days behind bars? Well, someone and I don't mean
56:18
Speaker 1: someone like that, not someone like who commits that sort
56:21
Speaker 1: of atrocity. I'm talking like bare bones. What do you
56:24
Speaker 1: think goes through a psychopath's head once they are put
56:27
Speaker 1: behind bars? Just that alone?
56:31
Speaker 2: Well, it kind of depends because, like I need, I
56:34
Speaker 2: sort of would want to know if she has been
56:37
Speaker 2: getting help or if she's like on maybe some medication
56:40
Speaker 2: or whatever for like her mental health.
56:42
Speaker 1: I'm sure there definitely is some help.
56:44
Speaker 2: Because if yeah, if she wasn't, then I just think
56:46
Speaker 2: it wouldn't be pretty at all. But then if she is,
56:49
Speaker 2: I don't know, I feel like like someone like that,
56:53
Speaker 2: I think like strict routine would be really good for them.
56:56
Speaker 2: So I bet you she's actually really like doing pretty
56:58
Speaker 2: good in there.
56:59
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, right, it's probably where someone like that. And
57:04
Speaker 1: I don't mean it in a negative context, we're like, yeah,
57:06
Speaker 1: fucking burn and hell no, I mean, like I think,
57:09
Speaker 1: like you say, strict routine is probably good for someone
57:10
Speaker 1: like that. I think behind bars in prison is probably
57:14
Speaker 1: the best place for someone like that because it's going
57:17
Speaker 1: to offer rehabilitation, it's going to offer structure, it's going
57:20
Speaker 1: to offer rules, it's going to offer people watching and
57:23
Speaker 1: ensuring that there's no slip ups.
57:25
Speaker 2: Well yeah, and like I mean, there probably isn't a
57:29
Speaker 2: lot in there that's going to like set her off.
57:31
Speaker 1: Yeah, And now all that is hoping that she is
57:34
Speaker 1: in a good prison system where yeah, those rules are
57:36
Speaker 1: being upheld. Yeah, and not like shitty guards who are like,
57:41
Speaker 1: oh yeah, I'll get your cigarettes.
57:42
Speaker 2: For cheap, like you know, like she's really just not
57:45
Speaker 2: that old, she's not interesting, huh. Okay.
57:51
Speaker 1: And so that is the story of Catherine Knight, the
57:54
Speaker 1: cannibal who tried to feed a man to his own
57:58
Speaker 1: children and is the psychopath who is the first woman
58:03
Speaker 1: in Australia to receive a full life sentence.
58:07
Speaker 2: What a story, What a story.
58:10
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was a fun one to research.
58:12
Speaker 2: I actually think that would be hell to research.
58:15
Speaker 1: It would be you would know, Yeah, it really would be.
58:20
Speaker 2: I think that actually took a lot out of you.
58:23
Speaker 2: That did.
58:24
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't feel like emotionally distraught, but I
58:30
Speaker 1: just feel like physically drained, which is weird. Usually it
58:33
Speaker 1: like hits emotionally. This one was just like fuck.
58:36
Speaker 2: Well. Sometimes the two parters are a bit more draining too,
58:39
Speaker 2: because there's like so much information and you're trying to
58:42
Speaker 2: put it in an order that makes sense kind of,
58:46
Speaker 2: and and try not to forget things when because they
58:49
Speaker 2: do so much.
58:50
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, well she committed. It's so much a lot
58:53
Speaker 1: and a lot of little acts that balled up over decades, really,
58:58
Speaker 1: and it's impossible to cover every single little detail in
59:01
Speaker 1: this case. And I know we've said that a few
59:04
Speaker 1: other times before, but this was literally a lifetime of crime.
59:08
Speaker 2: Is that her?
59:09
Speaker 1: That's yeah?
59:10
Speaker 2: Okay, Yeah, she's not really a looker, is she. No?
59:12
Speaker 1: That's not her prime though, either, But no, she's not
59:15
Speaker 1: really a looker, like I say, in her prime, she's like,
59:17
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, you know, kind of.
59:18
Speaker 2: Average huh okay, interesting, Yeah, not really what I had
59:23
Speaker 2: pictured for some mind for reason.
59:25
Speaker 1: There are two mosquitos.
59:26
Speaker 2: Like I think I was kind of picturing because a
59:28
Speaker 2: lot of I was kind of picturing like a psychopath
59:32
Speaker 2: man that's a good looking like Ted Bundy or like
59:35
Speaker 2: Jeffrey Dahmer or what's the Barbie Ken? What the frick's
59:39
Speaker 2: his name? Again? Oh, I'm Karla Hamoka, And.
59:46
Speaker 1: Shit, this is why we're terrible through crime trivia. They
59:52
Speaker 1: were literally a question on this trivia too.
59:55
Speaker 2: I can. I have absolutely no idea what his name is.
59:58
Speaker 2: There's two mosquitoes people screaming at us.
1:00:01
Speaker 1: Are you hearing what I'm saying? This is the second
1:00:03
Speaker 1: time I've said it. There's two mosquitos in the wall
1:00:04
Speaker 1: behind you.
1:00:05
Speaker 2: What am I supposed to do about that? Right now?
1:00:06
Speaker 1: Get them, slap them, kill them, destroy them.
1:00:09
Speaker 2: Well, I'm currently trying to find what this guy's name was. Oh,
1:00:13
Speaker 2: Paul Bernard. It is as I was picturing, kind of
1:00:18
Speaker 2: like a good looking person like that kind of his example.
1:00:22
Speaker 1: Right, No, No, she just a good lay.
1:00:25
Speaker 2: I think you'd have to be real good.
1:00:30
Speaker 1: Apparently she was that.
1:00:32
Speaker 2: Good, like unnaturally good.
1:00:35
Speaker 1: Apparently she was.
1:00:38
Speaker 2: But I also don't think I mean, guys are different.
1:00:41
Speaker 2: But I was like I don't. I could probably have
1:00:43
Speaker 2: had the best lay in my life and I would
1:00:46
Speaker 2: still be running from the hills from that lady.
1:00:48
Speaker 1: Well yeah, fair enough, I can't argue that.
1:00:55
Speaker 2: Okay, well, well done yea.
1:00:59
Speaker 1: Hopefully you guys this episode. If you made it to
1:01:02
Speaker 1: the very end of part number two, we seriously appreciate you.
1:01:06
Speaker 1: We have all our links down in the description. We
1:01:08
Speaker 1: have Instagram, Facebook, YouTube, which we are coming out with
1:01:11
Speaker 1: many more vlogs.
1:01:12
Speaker 2: Yeah, we have some like plans we do.
1:01:14
Speaker 1: We have some tiny home specific ones coming up here shortly.
1:01:18
Speaker 1: We got a lot down there, so go ahead and
1:01:19
Speaker 1: check it out. We even have Patreon where you can
1:01:21
Speaker 1: go and support us a little more if you're up
1:01:23
Speaker 1: for it. If not, that's totally cool. What you can
1:01:26
Speaker 1: do to really support us, You can go ahead and
1:01:29
Speaker 1: rate our show. We appreciate that. That goes a long way.
1:01:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, we love ratings. Yeah, five star writings, five star
1:01:35
Speaker 2: or if.
1:01:36
Speaker 1: You want one star. We're not going to knock it.
1:01:38
Speaker 1: We're not going to say your opinion is wrong, even
1:01:40
Speaker 1: though it is.
1:01:41
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. Okay, well, we have some mosquitoes to
1:01:45
Speaker 2: go and tackle here, so until.
1:01:47
Speaker 1: Next week, stay wicked. That one sounded weird. You do it,
1:01:54
Speaker 1: You do a better job.
1:01:56
Speaker 2: Now. I'm on the spot here, stay wicked.
1:02:00
Speaker 1: There you go.