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Discovering Jesus - Up Close with the team at CFU · Urantia Radio

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And welcome to another edition of the Urancha Radio Podcast.
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I'm very excited about this interview that we had with
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Gabriel Reinberg and his team at the Center for Unity project
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that has been going under way now for about 2 1/2 years.
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They've been working on various projects that involve bringing
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the narrative of the life and teachings of Jesus to life
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through various platforms and media.
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So we'll talk to some of the team members involved in the
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projects and where they're at with all of this, plus ways that
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you can participate. That's what's up next on the
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Urantia Radio Podcast. Welcome to another edition of
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the Urantia Radio Podcast. I'm Jim Watkins, your host.
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I want to talk about that on October 12th, 1955, into the
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hands of humanity came a four part book designated as a new
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Revelation of Truth. It came from our unseen friends
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in the spirit world, and the Urantia Book has resulted in the
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formation of thousands of study groups, hundreds of social
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groups who share a common belief that we have been provided with
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a new revelation of spiritual and historical truth.
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Coming on now, 70 years, 2 generations since the book
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became publicly available, and without any mass promotion or
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slick marketing, millions of people have found The Urantia
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Book. So why bring all of this up?
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Well, because now we get to hear from a group of people who are
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taking The Urantia Book to a new level of experience.
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It's a group called the Center for Unity, and it's comprised of
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people from at least four continents, if I'm counting
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them. And from all walks of life who
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have come together for a common cause to do something to help
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the Urantia Book reach even more people.
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Gabriel Reinberg is the head of CFU, and this November they will
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be making available the Discover Jesus app, an online immersive
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chronicle of the life and teachings of Christ, the 4th
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part of the Urantia Book, which details the life and teachings
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of Jesus. So let's meet the crew.
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Gabriel is also dealing with a major war in Israel at this
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moment, which is amazing because while we're talking about this
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globally important project a mere miles away, people are
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engaged in a bloody battle. So let's begin.
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How are you doing, Gabriel? Thank you Jim for this interview
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and also for caring. It's very challenging in Israel.
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We are taking it one day at a time.
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This is a very significant event and everybody's touched by it in
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one way or another. And I also fear that the entire
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world is touched by this event in one way or another.
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So keep us in your prayers. Send prayers for everybody.
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There's no sides. There's a lot of humans
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suffering, a lot of humans in pain and loss and.
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There's there's basically lose lose everywhere and I just pray
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that my personal prayer is that 1000 times more good comes out
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of this and I'm optimistic that this will happen maybe will take
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a long time but that's that's we can we can wish and pray for
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that so. Every time I ask myself what
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should I be doing with my time, I come back to the same answer.
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Double down on telling people that there are children of 1
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divine parent and they are all brothers and sisters even and
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especially when it's very hard to comprehend how humans treat
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each other there's pain and suffering for everybody involved
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And so I just double down and I one day at a time I I do what I
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can and. I'm I'm grateful that I have
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this opportunity to continue working an amazing, amazing
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team. Why don't you introduce the team
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who do we have joining us today on the program?
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So Mike is our project manager for the Discover Jesus app.
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Santiago and Lisa are executive team members of the CFU, the
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Center for Unity. Lisa is in charge of fundraising
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and marketing. Santiago is in charge of
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cinematic. And marketing and we're
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basically doing a lot of. Things, all of us.
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Gary is the artistic director and everything visual that you
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see is by his hands. Lisa Tao, his wife, is the UIUX.
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Lead. We have a large team of.
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Writers, editors Gary also paints all the pictures.
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Azure is our lead software developer is basically
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responsible for implementing the front end and back end.
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It's quite complicated. This software is is not trivial
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and he's one of the best. He's got 40 years of experience
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and over time we have you know I'm I'm just now for the launch
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preparing little party and I wrote down everybody who.
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Was part of this team over the last 2 1/2 years.
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And it's almost 30 people, 30. So there's a lot of people who
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contributed, and by my estimate it's 10s of.
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Thousands of hours of work, mostly volunteer work.
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This is a significant project. The Center for Unity has a
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couple of different projects. The chief one that we're going
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to talk about is Discover Jesus I think scheduled to be launched
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worldwide on the 15th of November.
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Is that right, Mike? How, how are things going?
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Is it going to happen and are? You ready for the world to
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embrace it? What's the process to launching
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this thing and then we'll delve into?
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Well, it's yeah, I mean to your first question, it is definitely
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our intent to have it launched and available on a public URL on
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November 15th and we're readying on many fronts to enable that to
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happen. It is not to say that it, it is
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the complete and finished and final product.
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It is a work in progress and as much as we continue to write.
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To other portions of part four of your entry book.
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So there there's a sufficient amount of content and images
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that we felt comfortable to release publicly what is
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available now as we continue to work and develop more content,
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more images and and release those incrementally as we go.
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So, you know, we're probably. These are rough estimates.
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You know probably about 1/4 of the way, or a third of the way,
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optimistically to how much content it will have ultimately
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by the time it's all done. But we'll have in excess of 100
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images and articles on people and events and topics and
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objects and groups and other segments that we curate from
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Part 4, the book. There's a lot of development
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work. There's a lot of behind the
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scenes things that that Gabriel can probably expand on more that
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that go into our planning to to launch and it can be added to.
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So this isn't like a finished product that you just mentioned.
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You're a third of the way through, which means you know
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what the what ultimately it's going to look like when it's
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done. And for those who have not
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experienced it, it will blow you away.
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So I have to assume there are people that don't know about the
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Urantia book that listen to the podcast, they discover it.
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So I want to be as clear with them as the seasoned.
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So imagine you have 700 pages of Jesus's life that's narrated
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like a true biography. What these people are doing is
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they're bringing this together in a format that allows you to
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cross reference all of the details that are contained in
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this 700 page text. So all of the people that are in
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Jesus's life, where he visited, what day he visited, what
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happened, how is this person connected to that person?
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And it's all done in a very easy to digest platform.
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It's unbelievable. I think this will change the way
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that people look at Jesus's life and they'll see the
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interconnectedness of all these seemingly incongruent points.
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And yet they're all related. And it shows the majestic way in
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which he connected everybody, even his trips to Rome.
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He planted the seed so that when the later apostles would get to
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Rome, that the teachings would be more receptive, you know, and
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that's that kind of planning that can only come from a
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creator's son who had unlimited knowledge.
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But it's it's it's laid out. So how did this add to your
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appreciation? And feel free.
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Anybody can jump in on that question?
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Well, I'll say first that. To your point about the
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interconnectedness of the of the parts of the book and the story,
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it's it's amazing when you part of my job in in editing and
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doing technical editing for the app was to find all the
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connections between people and offense and people in groups and
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topics and dates and. So you know, finding how much it
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interconnects to itself in terms of self referencing and knowing
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about who was involved and what event and where it took place
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and when it happened is is really fascinating.
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It really brought the text to life for me and to really
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appreciate the complexities and then in the narrative and the
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story. And so it was a great learning
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tool. I would have done it.
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You know, even if we weren't creating this project, it would
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have been a. A valuable experience for me to
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to interconnect all of those elements.
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Mike didn't reference this, but he's also doing like the bulk of
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the editing of the people that are contributing the writing.
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And so they're taking the person, they're taking the
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event, they're taking the topic, they're taking the place, and
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they are using the Urancho book as the text.
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But they are writing it in language that is.
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Accessible and easy to understand by people today.
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And then Mike edits that and he I had such writer's block doing
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the death of Joseph that it's not a huge event as far as the
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number of words that you need to write.
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But I just, it was so impactful in the life of Jesus that I
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would get emotional just thinking about it.
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So Mike was like just do it, just dive in and then we'll edit
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it and in doing it. I think it.
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I'd read it several times, but in writing it in words that
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other people would be able to access some of it, I don't know.
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It made me feel it more deeply. It made me appreciate the fact
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that he didn't get to be there and the family grieved so much
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that they didn't get to have that final blessing from Joseph
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and. Mike was just a dream to work
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with and edited it and was encouraging along the way.
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And I know that that takes an enormous amount of time for the
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team as well. This is Santiago.
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Yeah, I just wanted to add, I think that the day and age that
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we live in, with so much communications and the way that
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we process information nowadays, it's very important to have.
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This app, this, I mean, we're in a world not only really and
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technically advanced, but very individual in that sense, I
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mean, and now it's a time where people understand and and
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research and learn by themselves.
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So to have the story of Jesus as portrayed in the Erancha book,
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which I think for all of us was really a life.
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Changer you know from. Knowing that the traditional
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gospels to this expanded version of of his life and teachings,
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but to be able now to process it in an individual way through the
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technologies that we have. Mean we're bringing Jesus closer
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to. Not only young people, but
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anybody that wants to learn more about him and that wants to take
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out the teachings that he brought.
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So I think it's crucial for for our time to have something that
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is in the language and in the in the way that people now
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experience. Learning.
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Yeah. It's kind of like having, you
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know how Wikipedia is structured, where you're reading
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something on any subject and you've got links that cross
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reference. Well, this is like that, but on
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steroids. And a gentleman who's just
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joined us is Gary Tong who's artistic contribution.
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It's good to see you and we'll get to you.
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And I want to talk about the AI element of this because in in
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Mike Thompson's article, I think you you delved into and it was
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Gabriel describing how he used, Gary used AI when creating some
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of the imagery that Mike's talking about.
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That's going into the It's just unbelievable.
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Words cannot describe. When you're seeing pictures that
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depict the scene in which you're reading about, it's
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unbelievable. Now, I don't know about everyone
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else, but I was already a believer in Jesus before I read
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the Urantia Book. All the The Urantia Book just
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substantiated and enlarged that connection above and beyond what
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I could have possibly have imagined.
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So as a Christian reading the Arantia book, I didn't find the
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Arantia Book as a repudiation of the Bible.
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But there are people who do we have to imagine, you know, it's,
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you know, it is what it is. So how is this book going to be
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received by the Christian community, and what what
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experiences have you had so far in showing this to your
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Christian friends? I'll just say that I was born
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Jewish and until I was probably 40 years old.
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I knew almost nothing about Jesus.
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I knew he was crucified. I knew he was from Nazareth.
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And of course I knew that he is connected to Christianity.
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It's it's the, it's the center of Christianity.
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And that's all I knew. So for me the runcha book as
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being a life changer in understanding who Jesus was, is
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and and most importantly for me is.
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Understanding that the seeds and the the teachings that he left
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for us are going to pave the path for the evolution of
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humanity forward. There's one quote in the Arancha
14:43
book that really touches me very deeply, and it's when the
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Midwayers who are Celestials who were involved in this
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revelation, and they're still here, they said that, and
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they're talking to us humans. They said you've never really
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tried the experiment. Of living what Jesus told you to
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do, which is treat each other and not just as neighbors and
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love each other as neighbors, but as brothers and sisters
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because you have a divine parent.
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So there's two aspects each one of us is uniquely and infinitely
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loved by a divine parent. And if you believe in something
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bigger than you and you say it's a supreme force, or it's nature,
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or some people call it God. But when he said this thing,
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this being is a parent and we all have parents, We may not all
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be parents, but we all have parents.
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So we understand. And then he said, because of
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that, your brothers and sisters, and then leave that.
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What would this world look like if we do that in our
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relationships, in business, in politics, in economics, in
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theology, in every aspect of our lives?
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That's the experiment that we are asked to implement and it
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will take many years to do. But I think these projects that
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we're working on have a little role in showing this in great
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detail to people who would like to take on that experiment and
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letting them understand what is it that he did 2000 years ago in
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laying the foundation for our path forward as humans and
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especially in this time, you know.
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I posted something online. I didn't post much, but I posted
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something that was very difficult for me to grapple
16:32
with. Jesus said love your enemies.
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And in this day, in this week in this country, the country of
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Israel, that teaching is the most difficult of all.
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How on earth am I supposed to love my enemies?
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It's so difficult. I can.
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I can understand a little bit. Of course I can.
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But, you know, love my enemies, you know, And that's exactly
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what he said. So of course I'm falling way,
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way, way, way short. But what does it really mean?
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And how will this word look like when we all manage to love our
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enemies a little bit more? And I will say very clearly, I
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am completely not condoning any of the behavior that was
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exhibited. In the history of this conflict
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that I'm part of or the the recent part of this, so it has
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nothing to do with the the local events.
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It has everything to do with how we treat each other as humans.
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And this is basically what Jesus one of the things that he came
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to teach us. So I hope that by by the things
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that we're doing, one more person can understand for their
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own and they say. You know what?
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I'm really going. I I am going to try.
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I'm going to do my best. To meet another person and treat
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them as my brother or as my sister.
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What does it really mean and how do I do it even when it's very,
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very, very hard? I think that's the main main
18:05
thing that I pray and hope that this will result in.
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Lisa, you want to say something? I'm.
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Just going to say that I think what Gabriel is talking about is
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that many people don't have that understanding of love.
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They think love means that you're all just, oh, you're the
18:20
best person in the world. And that's not what you mean by
18:24
talking about loving your neighbor.
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It's not saying that whatever they do is fine and that they
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can do whatever they want. And I feel like Jesus and his
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very own family showed us what it's like to love your family.
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When Jude was very difficult and his two of his other brothers
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were ready to boot him out of the family, like he was just
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really. Not falling in line.
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And he was an embarrassment and he was not living right.
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And Jesus talked to them and said, hey, lead by example and
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show him the love in your own life.
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And he managed to help hold that family together when two of them
19:07
were ready to kick Jude out to the curb.
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So that's that's the kind of love we're talking about.
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And hopefully it comes through because if if as being a
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Christian, if I had stumbled upon this Discover app, my first
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question might not be, well, how do they do all this?
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My first question might be, wow, how did they.
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This is a different story than I'm used to.
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You know, I'm not. I'm not There's all this detail
19:36
about this guy. I just thought he walked on
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water and went around and handed fish out to everybody, you know.
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And we all have to do this, you know.
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So do you think that this will be well received by the
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Christian community? Maybe that's a better question.
19:54
Anybody thoughts? And and the reason is, is
19:57
because we're sort of there are cousins, you know, in this, in
20:01
this plan, we have to acknowledge that we share a lot
20:05
of the same similarities. We're connected.
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They may not want to admit it, but we know better.
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I I would love to address this because when you mentioned that
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you were a Christian and so you didn't find anything, you didn't
20:17
discover Jesus through the Urantia book.
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It just enhanced your knowledge of who Jesus was.
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I was raised Christian, conservative, fundamentalist.
20:27
I was a pastor's daughter, knew the Bible very well, and I had
20:31
gone through a bit of and evolution in my own journey to
20:36
the place where I called myself a Christo Buddhist, that Jesus
20:40
was my teacher. But I did not align myself with
20:43
Christianity as a religion. And when I discovered the
20:47
Urancha Book, part of the many, many tears that I shed was that
20:52
it gave me back Jesus as my sovereign, as my creator son,
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as, as a beloved son of God who created this universe.
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And that I think that there are many people who have stopped
21:07
calling themselves Christian or identifying as religious
21:11
Christians who say they are religious but not Christian, who
21:17
this would appeal to. And it definitely appealed to
21:20
me. Good point Mike, or?
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Gary or Santiago? Just wanted to add to that I was
21:27
I was raised Catholic and I think this is a story that all
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the persons here in this. Call.
21:32
I've heard it along. Many times.
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But I became sort of disenfranchised with the
21:39
Catholic Church because a lot of the things didn't make sense,
21:42
you know, I mean, especially what I mentioned is the Trinity.
21:45
When they explained it to me, it was like, OK, there's one God,
21:48
three people, and I'm like, what do you mean there's three gods?
21:50
No, no, no, it's one God, three people.
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I don't get it. And they would just brush it up
21:55
and say, well, that's the the mystery of the Holy Trinity,
21:58
you're not supposed to get it. And I just took that when I was
22:01
younger, you know. But then I grew up, started
22:04
questioning a lot of the the, the fundamental teachings about
22:07
Christianity such as the atonement.
22:11
And I didn't really, not that I didn't understand, but didn't
22:14
really bought into that. And then I rediscovered and I
22:19
went through a similar path as Lisa and I just studied the, you
22:22
know, the Eastern religions and kind of enhanced my spirituality
22:27
and then rediscovered Jesus through the The Rancher book and
22:32
fell back in love to what he is. And you know what he did, who he
22:36
is and finally got my answers explained.
22:40
So I think if you just take the whole Christianity and bunch
22:44
them all together, of course. It's not, they're not all the
22:47
same colors, you know. There's people that might be too
22:51
attached to their beliefs and this is going to cause some, you
22:55
know, discrepancies or push back.
22:58
But other people that are not, you know, they, they believe in
23:01
Jesus but really don't understand a lot of the
23:03
concepts. But about the Church, the dogmas
23:07
and everything, this will take all that away.
23:10
This will, like it did too too many of us.
23:13
Clean the slate, you know and and and approach Jesus without
23:16
all those all that baggage that you sometimes have when you're
23:20
you're in an institutionalized religion.
23:23
And something you said earlier, Santiago, is nowadays everybody,
23:26
they're, they're getting information on a more personal,
23:29
individual level. So this Jesus discovered,
23:32
discovered Jesus app allowed it. It makes that possible.
23:37
Gary, I want to bring you in. You're the artist here and
23:39
you've contributed so much. And I'm not the first one to
23:42
tell you this, but I really have appreciated what you've been
23:46
doing. Now you're involved in this a
23:49
lot of projects and you're using AI and everybody's kind of
23:52
nervous about AI. So tell us how you integrate AI
23:56
into providing the illustrations that are in this app.
24:00
Well, I first was reading about AII was I was a little bit
24:06
concerned about it because the way it infringed on what is
24:09
effectively copyright. But when I read a bit more about
24:12
it I I came to an ethical position that if you're not
24:17
trying to earn profit from using it then I think it's OK to use
24:22
it. And that is most pivotal to me
24:27
in choosing to use it to create the work for I'm a sent to be
24:32
Unity to discover Jesus app and to talk around AIA little bit,
24:37
you know? AI is never going to have mind.
24:40
You can add a label to whatever you want, but it's you know AI
24:43
is is something that's extraordinarily good at doing
24:46
automation or or when it comes to visualization, compositing
24:52
billions of images together to find something that approximates
24:56
what you might need. And so I so my position on AI is
25:01
it can be a very powerful tool when it comes to creating art.
25:06
But it's only really powerful in the hands of an artist.
25:09
You need to know what you're trying to do with it.
25:11
You could anybody could use it. And you can type a bunch of
25:14
prompts and then you can get some results and there's results
25:17
then varying in quality. And sometimes you'll get
25:22
something that's wonderful. Sometimes you'll get something
25:23
that doesn't make much sense. Sometimes you might get
25:26
something that's pretty funny. But as an artist tool when I use
25:31
it. When I use it for the Discover
25:32
Cheetah that. I use it with the mind of
25:35
getting something that's somewhat of an approximation and
25:37
then I I paint over that and I oh, I add to it.
25:41
Or I may be more rendered 2 AI images and then use some of my
25:46
own work and then mix them all together to get the the final
25:49
result. So I treat it like a tool, but
25:52
what what? What it Where?
25:54
It's really important for me on this app is we would not be able
26:00
to create the body of art. Without the buttressing of AI,
26:08
and if it wasn't for the scaffolding that AI gave them
26:14
some of it. Sometimes it's much more than
26:15
scaffolding. They I wouldn't be able to make
26:18
as many images, it would be floundering and like a tenth of
26:21
the images that we have currently.
26:24
It gives you the image working image and then you add to that
26:28
by layering it with different kinds of coloring and shades and
26:31
things of that nature. It it depends.
26:34
So sometimes yes there's a lot of that sometimes there's a
26:37
little bit left of that. I know also you cultivate the
26:40
way to prompt it so it's it's it's kind of obfuscating what
26:45
the result will be. Sometimes you have to you high
26:47
thread my prompt in a way that you kind of unusual to get the
26:51
result. You can't just tell it something
26:53
in plain English. I'll give you drop T your lunch
26:56
book quote about Jesus and Joseph into it.
26:58
It wouldn't know. It comes back with something
27:00
abstract didn't know. Yeah.
27:01
So it's kind of like triggering it.
27:04
I try. I try and sympathize the
27:06
algorithm. I guess Mr. Anthropomorphic
27:09
dichotomies not. But I I try and sympathize with
27:13
it and try and imagine what what I'd like to get it to look at
27:16
when I'm when I'm pointing its data, it's algorithmic data and
27:21
and so I get better results. Although it isn't, it certainly
27:25
isn't. Super fast.
27:27
Like I was working on an image and I can't remember which one
27:30
it was for. Discovered Jesus a couple of
27:32
days ago and it took me 3 hours to get the the end end prompt
27:39
results. Sometimes they're fast,
27:41
sometimes they're not. Sometimes they require multiple
27:43
passes, sometimes you're fiddling around with it and I
27:45
talk to other people who do that.
27:46
They use it the same way, you know.
27:49
It's also, I see it as a viable tool as somebody who used to be
27:53
a concept artist and a concept art director.
27:55
It would be a really viable tool.
27:56
Now it definitely is transforming how people might
28:00
start their creative process or use their creative process, but
28:04
definitively does not take the artist away.
28:06
I think a lot of people thought it would, but it doesn't.
28:10
But but it but it is. It is something that's actually
28:12
turned into. I've gone from being really
28:14
reluctant to use it to being to believing that I don't think
28:19
we'd be able to do this without it.
28:21
I'm kind of thankful for that because I I think we discover
28:24
Genius really requires some illustration, not just data
28:28
rich, it does. It needs to be a media rich
28:31
experience as well. Otherwise it just it's just too
28:34
much to read without anything to sort of.
28:36
I think I've seen like two or three images and and from what I
28:40
can see they really capture the essence and the mood of what
28:43
you're reading and that enhances the experience.
28:46
Of taking this information in. You could say that my
28:49
understanding of The Urantia Book and Part 4, The Urantia
28:51
Book helps too. So I'm being an artist and a
28:53
revelation student with utilizing AI.
28:56
So it because I read you the lines of it.
28:58
I'm like, what? What is, what am I emotively
29:00
feeling when I read that and then I'll cultivate that prompt
29:03
and what I'm trying to get from that so.
29:06
You you you integrate music and the artistry and imagery real
29:09
well. Are you also a musician?
29:11
No, I'm the person that does the music on.
29:16
But our videos is called Jeremy Daigle.
29:18
He's, I trust him implicitly. He really knows what he's doing.
29:22
Yeah. And there's a symbiosis the way
29:24
that we work together. And yeah, he he really gets what
29:28
I'm doing. And it's funny, I don't want to
29:31
go. I will go off on a tangent too
29:32
much. But when we're making these
29:34
videos, because I'm just giving myself to try and make the best
29:37
possible revelatory secondary works as I can.
29:40
I'll make like sections of effects or or diagrams or
29:43
whatever else I'm doing and I'll just guess that how long they
29:46
need to be. When I start slotting them into
29:48
the edit, they end almost always end up being exactly the length
29:51
I need them to be and the music ends up synchronizing as well.
29:55
So I I honestly feel a lot of the time I'm kind of to the side
29:58
of whatever's going on and it's happening past me and I'm quite
30:02
happy to do that, you know? I don't want credit for the
30:04
work. I want the work to make a
30:06
positive impact. Well, that Jeremy with this
30:08
whole thing. Without Jeremy I would be lost
30:10
though. And the thing that goes with
30:11
Andre related to not here but like he, he works on this
30:14
project too. But Andre voices a lot of the
30:17
videos, or Paula Thompson does without these people I
30:20
collaborate with, just like and. This.
30:23
Group here. The end result would be
30:25
significantly less good, I believe, wholeheartedly and the
30:29
teamwork that the arrangement book speaks about.
30:32
OK, so we have this project. The app comes out November 15th.
30:35
It's free. More accurately, a web app or a
30:38
web application. Now there's there's a few
30:42
reasons why, but the main reason became evident way after we
30:48
so-called took this decision. And if you imagine all the text
30:54
of that we're writing, and of course all the paintings are
30:58
going to be scraped by the Google algorithm, by the Bing
31:03
algorithm, and. By any present and future
31:08
companies that are looking for information to train their the
31:11
future large language models. So what we're writing is going
31:16
to go in many, many places that we don't even know.
31:20
If it was all inside an app then that would not be possible.
31:24
I see. I I will say that this version
31:28
is optimized for a large screen, so a desktop computer or maybe
31:32
an iPad. But we are working in parallel
31:35
on a version that would look great, and we'll have the same
31:38
exact information, but arranged differently on the screen for
31:42
smaller formats. How are the donations?
31:45
Let's talk about that a little bit.
31:46
The work, obviously this is an important project.
31:49
What's the reception? Are you are you getting people?
31:52
I'm hoping people listen to this program will help because that's
31:56
it's an important project. I'm so glad you asked.
32:00
We have a very exciting opportunity right now.
32:03
Donations have been fairly steady but slow.
32:08
I think to date we have around 170 a 180 donors that have
32:13
gotten us this far, but we have a very exciting opportunity.
32:19
An anonymous donor made a $100,000 matching fund donation
32:25
to us and they said between now and December 31st, whatever is
32:31
donated to the Center for Unity, they will match up to $100,000.
32:36
And we that started the first week in September and we are now
32:41
about $50,000 into that and we really want to be able to access
32:46
all of those matching funds before the end of the year.
32:50
So we're really putting out a push and we've created what is
32:54
called a peer-to-peer campaign because this is really bigger
32:59
than what any one of us can do by ourselves.
33:03
And like the Urancha book tells us that if you know 10 people,
33:08
if they're all just trying to lift on their own, can do about
33:12
the same as one person lifting on their own.
33:14
But if we all join together and lift at the same time, we can
33:18
get it forward. So we're really looking for
33:21
people to help us climb this mountain and get the word out.
33:25
And with this peer-to-peer campaign, and they can go to the
33:28
fundraising page, make their own fundraiser on behalf of it, have
33:33
a unique URL to share. And if they could find two 3-4
33:37
people that we wouldn't be able to reach, that they could find
33:41
who would be willing to donate to us, that would be
33:45
astonishing. And the really cool thing is
33:48
that monthly donations are so important to us because it helps
33:52
give us a sustaining base that we know monthly how much we're
33:56
getting in. And when we have, you know,
33:59
someone who's helping with the software that we need to pay, we
34:03
need to be able to pay our bills, and we don't want to
34:05
commit to paying someone if we don't know what money's coming
34:08
in. If someone makes a commitment of
34:10
I'm going to give $25.00 a month, the matching fund will
34:14
pay 12 months of that upfront. So if I say I'm going to give
34:17
25, the matching fund says OK, here's $300.
34:22
I'm I'm listening to this. Where do I go to donate and find
34:25
out more about this particular project?
34:27
Would that be if you? If you go to the Center for
34:30
Unity website, there is a bar at the top of the website that says
34:35
join the challenge and if you click on that, it'll take you to
34:39
the page where you can then Scroll down just below.
34:42
If if you don't want to do that and you want to donate, that's
34:45
lovely, we'll take that too. But if you Scroll down and say I
34:48
want to fundraise for this, it'll walk you through.
34:52
It takes 2 minutes to set it up and then you have a unique link
34:56
that you can e-mail to your friends or share on on social
34:59
media and say could you help us? OK, there's other projects you
35:04
guys are working on that are exciting as well.
35:07
The Jesus experience. The cinematic Jesus.
35:10
The Ask Jesus chat box. So how are all of these other
35:13
projects now? Everything is moving along in
35:16
parallel because we have different teams working on
35:19
different things. So Santiago here is working on
35:22
the cinematic I'm working on, on the Ask Jesus you met before.
35:30
They're not here today, but you've met Rick and Steven.
35:33
They're part of the Experience Project.
35:36
So just to recap very quickly, we've launched.
35:39
The recent version of the Ask Jesus chat bot has in its memory
35:43
the entire Urancha book encoded in chat bot memory.
35:49
It's different than every chat bot that was trained on the
35:52
Internet probably read the Urancha book.
35:54
This is different because we took each paragraph and
35:57
specifically encoded it in a way that the chat bot can access,
36:01
and with each question that you ask it, it's going first to this
36:05
memory of the Urancha book. And he's getting the relevant
36:08
paragraphs before it makes the before it formulates an answer
36:12
for you. How long did that take?
36:14
That must have taken five years. That was a.
36:18
That was a. One month, one month worth of
36:21
work. That's a million, a million
36:23
words, right? Isn't Somebody told me once
36:25
there's a million words in the Erancha book.
36:28
He was doing it hours and hours a day, and he had a huge smile
36:32
on his face every time I'd see him.
36:33
And he'd say this is just like fun for me.
36:37
I've been doing it for four hours.
36:38
I'd be like, OK, I'm glad it's fun for you.
36:43
I I have to say that I'm super excited because there's three
36:47
young, young like in not at they're millennials, but they're
36:52
young millennials and or maybe even Gen.
36:55
ZS. So there's two of them that are
36:57
in their 20s and one that is in his 30s and and I've been
37:01
chatting with them on your venture forms.
37:04
And they, all three of them have are joined this team.
37:08
So now I have we're four and they're going to crank up future
37:14
versions, all of us together of this chat bot.
37:16
So there's so many other things we can do to make it a real tool
37:21
for your run ship book students to study the revelation.
37:24
It's really like nothing else, you know it complements
37:27
everything else. It's it's much more than a
37:30
search engine because you can have a conversation.
37:33
So you can imagine this is like talking to a very, very advanced
37:40
you run your book student who knows everything by heart, the
37:43
entire book by heart and also understands the concept of
37:47
course not the same way a human would, but in a different way,
37:51
but still can converse with you. So and this technology is
37:55
continually being updated. So we're going to be.
37:59
We've been working on this. How do I get my hands on this?
38:02
This is amazing. It's on our website.
38:05
It is. OK.
38:06
It's like a resource really. You can if you're writing a
38:11
paper or if you instead of cuz like today.
38:13
I went and tried to find a passage and I looked through 300
38:17
paragraphs. This I could just ask it right
38:19
and it'll just tell me the answer.
38:21
Yeah, we're working so that the next version will give you
38:24
references to the Arancia book and hopefully accurate ones.
38:27
It's not that easy. But there's we have future
38:31
versions that we that were are going to make it even more
38:34
useful than it is today. Today it's doing very well with
38:38
concepts and ideas and less well with facts.
38:41
So if you ask it, tell me about. How many planets are in this
38:47
section of the minor sector? He might not get it right
38:52
because the way it's encoded the information, he doesn't really
38:56
have access to specific numbers. But with the new version, we're
39:01
going to be combining a search engine with a chat bot.
39:04
And so that you can get both at at one sitting.
39:08
I do want to say before I give the the floor to Santiago to
39:12
explain what we're doing in cinematic.
39:15
The Jesus Experience Project has finished the the conceptual
39:19
Design. A preliminary conceptual design.
39:22
We produce a beautiful, beautiful donors kit and a
39:25
video, and we're now forming a steering committee of prominent
39:30
and leading names in the world of Jesus and his story.
39:36
They're not your ranchobook students.
39:38
All of them are going to be not your Ranchobook students.
39:42
And this body will steer the production of the content in a
39:46
way that really caters to everybody.
39:50
And so this is really a unique proposition.
39:54
Of course, we believe that the arrangement is a revelation, but
39:57
like you said, many people around the world still don't
40:00
know it and we still want to talk to them.
40:02
So we're making an effort with this steering committee to
40:06
attract people who are very knowledgeable about the
40:09
historical Jesus. About Christianity, but
40:12
archaeology of the Galilee, about what happened on this
40:17
planet, because Jesus was here during the last 2000 years and
40:21
this is a multidisciplinary work.
40:24
So I think it's a narrative like no other.
40:27
And I don't think anybody attempted to tell that story in
40:32
that many details of not only what happened 2000 years ago,
40:37
but what happened since because of the ideas of Jesus of
40:41
Nazareth. So he's now taking the next step
40:45
and I'm going to yield. I.
40:48
Was just going to. I was just going to insert
40:49
really, really quick that one of the recent developments of the
40:53
Jesus experience has been the addition of the idea that we
40:59
want to capture people's experience of Jesus from around
41:04
the world to be able to share there and online.
41:09
And people can record in video or audio format their experience
41:13
of Jesus so that we can share what we're calling my Jesus
41:17
experience. And we got our first submission,
41:21
audio submission of that and I listened to it and I was weeping
41:26
at the end. So it is it will be a way that
41:29
all of us can experience it, even without going to the Sea of
41:33
Galilee. Before I get to Santiago,
41:36
because I want to spend a little time on the cinematic Jesus, are
41:39
you guys thinking maybe you could take what you've done with
41:42
the 4th part of the book and do it for the third part, the 2nd
41:46
and the 1st? Or is that even feasible?
41:49
It's completely feasible but it's such a large project that
41:52
we will have to have to attract larger group of people like.
41:56
You'd need about $1,000,000 to do that, wouldn't you?
41:59
We can use the same technology that we've already developed.
42:02
It's it's writing and it's it's creating this web of it's a
42:09
graph basically that takes thousands and thousands of
42:12
hours. I I'm hoping and I'm already
42:15
trying different things that large language models can help
42:19
us because like I said it's like a very intelligent different
42:24
type of intelligence Human sorry non human who understands the
42:30
Rancho book in its own way and we can ask it to help us
42:34
generate the the information. When we started doing this for
42:39
part 4, this technology was existing but nobody knew about
42:43
it. Only very, very few people were
42:45
working with it and we have to remember it's it's really been
42:49
out for a year and we've been working on this project for 2
42:52
1/2 years. So.
42:54
But now I think it it is possible to use this technology
42:58
to speed up the process of generating the information and
43:02
perhaps also writing accessible essays that basically are
43:07
secondary works. I think it's it's going to be
43:10
much easier still there's going to be humans and I think long
43:14
term Uranjeburg students that are going to steer this project
43:18
and make sure that everything is really of high quality.
43:23
And and when those large language models don't get it
43:26
right there's a human there to correct it because we still need
43:30
it. Just like Gary basically takes
43:33
that as a tool we can use that as a tool but I haven't started
43:37
thinking about that. I I hope that if somebody is
43:40
listening to the this podcast and gets excited and goes to a
43:43
website and see sees what we did for part four and they approach
43:48
us, then we can start thinking about parts 1-2 and three which
43:52
I think is is really. Something we should do?
43:56
And there is a place on the website where people can let us
43:58
know if they want to volunteer, OK?
44:01
What about now? You weren't on the call earlier,
44:04
Santiago, but we were talking about George Lucas and that you
44:09
had read that he did in fact read the Urantia Book and that
44:13
did had some influence on Star Wars.
44:15
Do you know anything about that? Oh, well, I don't know exactly
44:21
about that, but I am a Star Wars fan.
44:24
My my son is called Luke and my daughter, one of my daughter's
44:28
is called Leia. So it's always something that I
44:31
when somebody tells me I'm a big Star Wars fan, I I tell my kids
44:34
names and they beat that. So.
44:38
But I do know that he studied, he was a a student of Joseph
44:43
Campbell. And I think Joseph Campbell
44:45
really took the, the, the mythical story.
44:48
Which is I think more important than in many, many cases,
44:52
religion, because that really molds us and gives us a purpose
44:55
in life if we don't have a mythical story of ourselves and
44:58
how we identify within our universe.
45:02
I mean, there's no, there's no point to it.
45:05
So I'm a I'm a real fan of Star Wars and all the mythical
45:09
stories, and I mean diving into into what we're the project that
45:15
we're we're. Headed in which I'm I'm working
45:19
hand in hand with Stephen Marble who actually knows George Lucas
45:22
and has worked with him in in some other projects.
45:27
We're developing something that is putting context.
45:30
I mean, it's a huge project and I think it's not just only what
45:33
feature film or streaming series.
45:36
But what we started with is a story that puts context of not
45:40
only the the the earthly situation and where Jesus was
45:45
born into, but the galactic or cosmic situation of our universe
45:51
with the the Lucifer rebellion and what everything was
45:55
happening in the evolution of our planet and our universe.
45:59
So we put that into context and I always like to say this isn't
46:02
your your Jesus grandma. I mean your grandma says Jesus
46:06
and and that we're telling the same story of the Gospels, but
46:09
we're giving another context where we can put him as a hero.
46:13
And I think that's very important for for new
46:14
generations to see Jesus as this hero that evolved from just the
46:20
the human aspect into the divine aspect.
46:23
And that really is something that is mentioned a lot in the
46:26
UN trip book that. We not only need to see Jesus as
46:30
our divine creator but also as our mortal brother that had to
46:35
struggle through the same trials and tribulations that we we
46:39
struggle with and and then once we create that that context and
46:44
we can bridge that and and show people that Jesus is a hero and
46:48
that he's I mean that the first hero I think and and or the OR
46:53
the top hero about this. People can relate to it and can
46:56
understand him better than just to see him as this so powerful
47:01
mighty all knowing person. But that he had to go through a
47:03
lot of struggles. And something that I always
47:07
think about is how did he accept this fate, you know, and and to
47:11
be tortured and crucified and and and deal with it in such a
47:15
graceful manner that is really, you know, that just takes you
47:21
away, you know and and trying to figure out.
47:24
How can you address your own trials and tribulations in that
47:28
same manner? So we're working on that story.
47:31
We're bringing in the story of Mary and Joseph.
47:35
And like Selma always mention in Joseph wasn't just the the
47:41
donkey handler, you know, he was something very important in
47:44
Jesus life fundamentally and how the the family relationship
47:49
developed is very important. So if you don't have all that
47:52
context to understand Jesus. It's going to be hard.
47:57
And I've often wondered how the Urantia book stories, everything
48:00
from Adam and Eve could be cinematic, what kind of impact
48:04
that would have. I bring up Star Wars a lot
48:07
because to me that's the gateway drug to The Urantia Book because
48:10
the premise, if you if you see some of the early there's a film
48:15
clip you'll find it on YouTube where George Lucas is describing
48:19
to his cast of directors and producers and.
48:22
Props, people and everything. He's describing the Force and it
48:26
sounds like he's reading right out of part one of the Urantia
48:29
book and and the drama that continually plays itself out on
48:35
the Universal level as well as the local level.
48:37
So. So that's exciting.
48:39
So there's sound. It's great the Center for Unity
48:42
is involved in these projects. Are you going to be involved in
48:45
future projects that you're now starting to think about and
48:48
formulate, or is this enough? In the in the cup, you know
48:53
we're we're launching this, the web app on November 15th and
48:57
we're going to send an invitation to everybody to join
49:00
the party. And I made a presentation and I
49:04
showed it to Sandra. And the main, my main answer to
49:09
your question is only our father knows.
49:13
It's full of surprises because if I look back even six years,
49:18
none of this was in my head or anybody's head, but it was there
49:23
potentially. And then we as a team had to
49:26
walk, you know, it's like a yellow brick road.
49:29
And when we do the action and you know, Gary and I spent
49:34
hundreds of hours talking 2 and 2 1/2 and three years ago where
49:39
there was nothing, we're just talking and brainstorming.
49:42
And and he said there's always a confluence of things happening
49:46
and it's divinely time. And so things arrive, people
49:51
arrive, resources arrive, time and treasure when we're ready
49:57
and I know that this team and the people who will join us down
50:03
the road, we can do beautiful things for this revelation.
50:08
And you know, one of the things that you said is, is looking at
50:12
the entire Rancho Book, we have one more project that we started
50:16
to work on, which we call the shared journeys platform, which
50:21
is basically a framework for sharing spiritual journeys with
50:27
other people. And this is way bigger than the
50:31
Rancho Book community because, you know, I'm looking at myself.
50:35
15 years ago, in the beginning of my spiritual journey, I had
50:37
nobody to talk to my father and and my mother was already
50:42
graduate. My father thought I was crazy.
50:44
My brother thought I was crazy. My wife at the time thought I
50:47
was crazy. None of my friends understood
50:50
the things that I was going through.
50:52
And when I started working with people who were understanding
50:56
that there is a spiritual dimension and they were telling
50:59
me things that I did not understand and I tried so many
51:03
things in my journey, I was dreaming of a place where people
51:09
who are in a spiritual journey can come together and share and
51:13
benefit from each other's understandings.
51:16
And this is non denominational, it's not necessarily about the
51:20
Urantia book. Urantia book is just one one
51:23
aspect or one source of spiritual teachings.
51:26
And we understand and and the numbers show that the younger
51:31
generations of today self identified as spiritual but not
51:36
religious or nothing. But they're still yearning the
51:40
nuns. They're still yearning the John
51:43
Templeton Foundation's recently awarded $2.2 million to study
51:49
this phenomenon of what they call the spiritual yearners and
51:54
what they need. So they're thinking this is
51:57
important to study. And you know, this is what this
52:01
is the context of. We would like to set up a a, a
52:05
place, a safe place where anybody who's on a spiritual
52:08
journey can come and share. And and so the chat bot, the
52:14
Discover Jesus app and other things that Santiago and Lisa
52:17
and I are working on with other people are going to be elements
52:21
of this grand vision. And even this vision is four
52:25
months old because before that we couldn't see it, so we were
52:28
doing deal things. And now will the sudden the
52:31
father gives us a bigger picture.
52:33
And so I know that I am personally devoted to this
52:40
ministry until I draw my last breath, wherever that might be.
52:45
And I don't know. So this is what I'm going to be
52:48
doing for the rest of my life and I'm sure somebody will put
52:52
ideas, bring people and time and treasure so that we can do more.
52:59
And, you know, I think we're just getting started.
53:02
And. It's exciting.
53:04
Well, listen, I wanted to say one thing to Gary.
53:07
We all want you. You've been to the Vegas ball
53:10
yet? Have you seen the giant Las
53:12
Vegas? Have you seen it?
53:14
I've. Have you gone?
53:16
And I've I've seen it, it looks pretty impressive.
53:18
We want, we want you to create the visual of of Havona and
53:23
Nebadon and the whole thing, and we want you to take it over to
53:27
them. And we'll introduce the world to
53:31
the Arrancha book through the visions of your work.
53:33
How's that sound? Can you do that?
53:35
That sounds that sounds fun, but you know, it's the first work I
53:39
did for the Arrancha book back in 2001 was painting 4
53:44
illustrations. One of them is known.
53:47
It's just used by everyone all over the planet.
53:50
Unwittingly, but ironically. I wish I'll show you.
53:53
I'll show you in a second. But anyway, I was at the time I
53:57
was. Idealistic.
53:58
And I was telling everyone that should be reading the arrange
54:00
book, and I really wanted to paint the grand universe, the
54:03
math universe. But now, 25 years after that
54:07
idealistic time, I'm much more reluctant to attempt it.
54:13
I have a significantly higher understanding of what it must be
54:17
like. There I could feel it, but I
54:19
know that I can't transmute that feeling into something that's
54:22
intellectual. But let me show you something
54:24
that's pretty funny. This isn't quite a long time ago
54:25
and a friend of mine asked me. About it a couple days ago.
54:29
So I got it down from upstairs and it was an article by Stephen
54:33
Hawking in a German I went butcher, the name of the German
54:37
science magazine. But he was talking about the
54:39
multiverse and they asked he, I presume here, to use my artwork
54:44
as proof of the multiverse. And I don't know where it is to
54:48
the center. Yeah, that's funny.
54:52
So he, I mean and I don't know what he's saying, it's trans
54:55
translates into German. But here's his.
54:57
And up to sort of the multiverse using an image that I've written
55:01
underneath of the credit line did.
55:04
He give you credit so. Yeah, yeah, they did.
55:07
And this is The funny thing about this image actually,
55:08
because the errors in that image when I get too technical.
55:13
I pointed out again the the configuration of a Bonson that
55:19
I've painted there is wrong. I know it's wrong and I know
55:22
that because I've studied it a lot more and I'm I.
55:25
I hang out with Andre Radetis and made it very clear that
55:27
we're we need to do a better job.
55:29
But but what make that era actually makes it more
55:33
approachable for people to enjoy the image because it's more like
55:36
what people expect to see in the universe.
55:40
Configurationally they expect the Milky Way or Avanton to look
55:44
like Andromeda and they don't. That's very where we live is a
55:48
modular super universe. But the the the era quote UN
55:52
quote. It actually makes it far more
55:56
easier for people to look at it. And then some people come to me
55:59
and they'll say, oh, I read the Iranian book because I saw your
56:01
painting, but they saw a painting that was erroneous, but
56:08
a closer step, a smaller step for them, it made it easier.
56:12
And this is something that we need to be conscious about all
56:14
the time. And I think that's what the
56:16
discovery Jesus app does, is what Jesus always did was meet
56:20
people where they were. Don't challenge people's
56:23
current. Beliefs give them something new,
56:26
give it to them in a way that they can understand it, that
56:29
they've that feels appropriate to them and not threatening.
56:33
And then let time and their own efforts push out the old and let
56:36
the new in. That's what we need to do.
56:38
And I recognize that we're the newer work I do, even though I'm
56:41
much more fastidious about getting the details right, I'm
56:44
always trying to make sure that we we land.
56:47
Where people can find it comfortable and edifying and not
56:50
threatening. And the same goes for the
56:52
paintings on this and the same goes for the writing.
56:54
You can read and cover Jesus, that it's all it's all need to
56:57
be like steps on a ladder, not a ladder with no rungs.
57:01
That you know is going somewhere wonderful, but you can't climb
57:05
that that that's really important.
57:06
Yeah. I think it's that balancing act,
57:09
Gary, too, between perfectionism when when we do want to strive
57:15
to be perfect and we're. A lot of us have that in us that
57:19
we want something to be perfect and yet the celestials God will
57:25
use what we put out there and we don't know.
57:27
I I would never probably have read the Urancha book without
57:31
your cover. Your cover was so beautiful that
57:36
like and it took 2 1/2 years and several different times where my
57:40
son had it laying on the table who has not read it yet himself.
57:44
Where I was like, that is so pretty and I just stopped
57:48
because I've always loved the Earth from outer space.
57:52
But you captured something more than just that, and that's what
57:57
led me to reading Part 4. That was my introduction to it,
58:00
so. That that's very humbling to
58:02
hear, and it reminds me of something, and I'm sorry, sort
58:05
of hijacking the conversation for a moment, but I was just
58:07
something I've been contemplating for about a
58:09
decade. The the concept of if God was
58:12
working in time. What would God do in time?
58:16
Would God do something existentially and eternally
58:19
perfect in time, and it wouldn't make any sense to the people
58:24
that that perfection was being done to?
58:26
Or would God strike step exactly at that time in those
58:29
circumstances? Then I could then do the most
58:32
valuable point at that point in that experience.
58:35
And the answer to me is easy. The best way to do have
58:39
effective changes to move one step forward.
58:43
When we're experiential beings, there's no way of shortcutting
58:46
ourselves to perfection. God would never be so naive as
58:50
to try and act existentially in time.
58:54
That's the act of ours. The consequences of Gods is US
58:58
doing those steps. And I think it's really
59:01
important to remember that that if we want, it's better to
59:05
slowly in the right direction than the idealistically looking
59:09
to a horizon we don't know the direction of.
59:12
Talking exactly about Eve's dilemma, right, Like she wanted
59:18
to. She came up with this plan with
59:20
him to like sort of jump it and no.
59:25
Paper Paper 53 was the same thing.
59:27
It's it's all, it's all basically a shortcut and we
59:30
still. I I often joke about people
59:33
today want you know people want fast food they want fast car
59:35
they want fast Internet. They want patience, but they
59:38
want that patience immediately. And these things are these
59:41
things are the diagnosis me on there, this world that there's
59:44
this lack of the the patience seems like laborers but really
59:49
isn't it patience? If you engage with it, that is
59:51
actually fortifying and you're more conscious about each step
59:55
of the effort and I think that's what what genus teaches that in.
1:00:01
Part or the arrangement. He teaches it beautifully and
1:00:04
for somebody that used to be in a hurry, I I've been working on
1:00:07
that. Centerforunity.org and Gabriel
1:00:11
and Lisa and Mike and Gary and Santiago.
1:00:14
Thank you all. It's been a real honor to sit in
1:00:17
and talk to you about all this stuff.
1:00:19
And so hopefully you've been able to gain a real appreciation
1:00:21
for the projects that the Center for Unity have underway.
1:00:26
And any way that you can support this.
1:00:28
This team is much appreciated. And of course, always a thank
1:00:33
you for stopping by and enjoying the Urancho Radio podcast, and
1:00:37
we look forward to having these people back on again soon.