Latest / LAUNCH: Parenting Tips for Raising Adult Children & Building Better Relationships / #76: Are You Parenting the Adult Child in Front of You or the Child You Were | What Young Adults Need to Thrive

Transcript

#76: Are You Parenting the Adult Child in Front of You or the Child You Were | What Young Adults Need to Thrive · LAUNCH: Parenting Tips for Raising Adult Children & Building Better Relationships

• 0:01
  SPEAKER_03: I'm very doing it find it is live stuff.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_03: A podcast reparents with older children in their 20s and 30s who are struggling fast.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_03: We talk about strategies, relations, and actionable steps that you can take to understand your adult child and help them move forward faster, is a waste of this stuff.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_03: And although it might take some time as you rebuild your relationship and learn a new way of finding stuff, it will be still worth it in the end.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_03: My guest today is Dr.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_03: Breed Darns College, a licensed marriage and family therapist who specializes in the parent-child relationships.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_03: He's an associate professor of marriage and family therapy at Arizona Christian University, and the director of the Masters of Marriage and Family Therapy program.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_03: Dr.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_03: Breed has spent her career helping hundreds of parents break generational patterns and in the process prepare their relationships with their children.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_03: She's also the author of Parent the Child You Have, Not the Child You Were.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_03: This episode touches on so many important topics that I have no doubt you'll walk away from today's conversation a little wiser and hopefully more confident.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_03: So let's begin.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_01: Hi, so nice to see you.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_03: Same here.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you so much for joining me today on launch.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for having me.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_03: You know, one thing I love most about my guests is that each of you have a very personal connection to your work because of something that happened in your childhood.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_03: And we love hearing those stories because, first of all, they always make us feel that we're not alone and that we can overcome anything as long as we do the work.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_03: So if you don't mind, let's kick off this conversation with you sharing what motivated you to become the therapist that you are today.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_01: Such a good question.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_00: So I have always loved working with children because when I was young, I was probably in seventh grade, and I started having pretty severe panic attacks.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like they were, they were awful.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: And if you've ever experienced a panic attack before, you feel like you're dying.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_00: And when you're in seventh grade, you you I mean, it's it's really hard for a person to conceptualize it, let alone a young kid.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I didn't feel like I really had anybody to go to.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, I had parents that were just like, well, you just figured out, like you just keep pushing through through them.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, that that can't be right because my body is feeling out of control.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_00: And I went to school one day and our school counselor, um, Pat Beatty, I will never forget him.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_00: He pulled me into his office and he said, Hey, I'm here for you.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: You let me know what you need, you let me know how you're feeling, and we will figure this out together.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I kid you not, maybe three months later I felt like a totally different person.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: So it was him and his therapy dog, Sprockett, that I really think changed my life.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: And it really felt like I had somebody to go to.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: So, fast forward when I'm an undergrad, I'm at Penn State, uh, wanting to go be an engineer, and I'm doing math, and I'm sitting there thinking, I don't want to do math forever.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: Like this is kind of boring and tedious.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: So I start looking at fields that work with children, and I look at marriaging family therapy, and I look at how I can specialize in the parent-child relationship.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_00: And I thought to myself, I can't help kids without helping their parents.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_00: And so from that moment, I then actually transferred back to the University of Nevada, Las Vegas and born and raised in Las Vegas.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I got my degree in human services counseling and then my master's at Purdue at marriage for marriage and family therapy, and then my doctorate at Texas Tech for marriage and family therapy.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: And I've been working with kids since 2012, really specializing in the parent-child relationship.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because I I wanted every kid to feel like, hey, I have somebody who will listen to me and who I can talk to, and somebody who will help my parent learn how to listen to me, right?
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like I'm always trying to work myself out of a job.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: I don't want to take the role of a parent.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_00: I want the parent to learn how do you meet this child's need.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: Because so many times we inadvertently just fail because it's hard.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's hard to meet somebody else's needs because you're not in that person's head.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_00: You don't know exactly what they need.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_00: And for little kids, it's hard for them to articulate what they need.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: And so that's a big chunk of what I do as a family therapist is how do you identify your kiddos' needs and how do we then meet those needs in a good, safe, predictable way that's healthy for their development.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_02: Got it.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_02: And you know it's a good story.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_00: So, yep.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_00: So that's really what launched me into it.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then of course, we all have different family history and different family dynamics that kind of happen along the way.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and so yeah, I that that would be a huge chunk of why I became a marriage and family therapist.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_03: Good.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I have so many things I want to talk to you about, but let's start off with your book.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_03: It's called, and I love this title, Parent the Child You Have, Not the Child You Were, Break Generational Patterns, Raise Thriving Kids.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_03: Let's talk about that.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_03: Tell us why you felt compelled to write about that topic.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_00: So that book came out in three years ago now.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh, it's been three years.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: So when that book came out, um, when I started writing it, actually, I had had 10 years of experience watching this really interesting pendulum with parenting and how you've seen the different generations parent and how when their kids get older, they parent the exact opposite, oftentimes.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_00: And I started seeing this pendulum, and I started seeing parents come in saying the exact four phrases that I'm I was sitting there and I'm like, this can't be healthy.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_00: But it was things like, well, I do this because my parent did the exact opposite, and I want to do the exact opposite of what my parents did.
• 6:24
  SPEAKER_00: Or, well, my parents did this for me, and I turned out just fine.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: And so it was these types of phrases that I kept hearing over and over again that I'm like, wait a minute, you're parenting the kid that you were.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_00: You're not looking at the child that you need.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: And so, for instance, it was things like, well, I let my child have a phone at nine, 10 years old, like an iPhone, because I felt so isolated as a kid.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't have any friends, I didn't fit in, and I don't want my child to feel that way.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm gonna give them a phone at an age where I don't think a nine-year-old should have an iPhone.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: And so they're making these parenting decisions because they're trying to heal this past trauma that the parent has had.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_00: They're not looking at the needs of the child.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_00: And so for me, it was how do I help these parents identify that you're kind of parenting through your trauma and you're not parenting in the present.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_00: And so I work with a lot of my parents in how do we help you heal from the past stuff that you've been through so you can show up for your child right now and meet their needs and see what those needs are, which so that's actually been a big chunk of my work.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, I kept seeing this really interesting pendulum go back and forth.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: And one of my favorite phrases has been um, can we see this recently a lot in the parenting, parent-child dynamics?
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, well, I really didn't like my parents growing up, and I don't want my child to hate me, so I do everything I can to make them like me.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_00: And I I kid you not, Sherry, there's days I sit in my office, we all have six, seven clients, and I've heard that phrase with every single one of them.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I think to myself, okay, if we are parenting in order to be liked, we have already set ourselves up for failure.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_00: Like you now, except for rare instances like abuse and neglect, if your children really love how you're parenting them, you're probably doing something a little wrong.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_00: Like your 15-year-old.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_00: They're not supposed to like you.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: You should be like, wait a minute, like if they say, I want to curfew of midnight at 15, hey, bud, I don't think that that's appropriate.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you can go up for your with your friends, but you need to be home by 10.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_00: If you just let your kid do whatever you want to and they enjoy how you're parenting them, again, it really makes me question, how are you parenting them?
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_00: Or are you a friend?
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_00: And and there's two guardrails to every parent-child relationship where it's kindness and it's firmness.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm seeing more and more parents with kindness, and there's no firmness.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_00: And so unfortunately, it sets children up for failure because they're not held to a standard, they aren't held to an expectation, and they just think, well, my happiness is what matters most in the world.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: And if I'm not happy, then you're the problem.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_00: And so, yeah, I mean, it's it's been a really interesting process with this book.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and my publisher, I mean, when I first contacted them and said, Hey, I had this idea, they said, Bree, this is fascinating because we are all like parents over here, and we are all inadvertently doing this.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_00: And we had no idea that we were.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's it's created a really interesting conversation with the parents.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_03: So how do you help parents identify what their negative beliefs are, the ones that are not serving their child?
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_03: You know, like how what is your process for helping them to recognize and then to heal?
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_00: So a lot of times with the negative cognitions that we have, they were developed in childhood.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: And so unfortunately, I I will often ask parents, I want you to finish this sentence for me in a kind of a negative light.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like if you were to go negative, how would you finish this?
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: I am blank, or I am not blank.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: What's your gut reaction to that?
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_00: Or when you feel that you're being treated poorly, what's the explanation?
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: What does it say about you?
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: And usually the top common ones I hear are I'm not good enough, I'm not wanted, I'm not loved, and I'm not safe.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_00: Those are oftentimes the four that parents are dealing with.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_00: And 95% of my parents that I work with, and I again I think that this is just kind of part of mankind and society, um, is I'm not good enough.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think everybody kind of walks around with this negative cognition of, well, if I'm not good enough, right?
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_00: And if I have got my 14-year-old yelling at me, well, that means I'm not good enough.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm gonna change how I'm parenting so I feel good enough.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_00: Well, if you're expecting your 14-year-old to meet that need for you, that we shouldn't be doing that.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we need to be meeting that need ourselves.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_03: You know what?
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_03: I want to just say something.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_03: I'm gonna go back to the other topic, but I just want to say that the four things that you hear the most from parents, those negative cognitions, I hear that out of the adult children.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_03: I do you I do.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_00: Interesting.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_03: Say them again.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_03: I want I want the parent.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, say them again.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm not good enough, I'm not wanted, I'm not loved, and I'm not safe.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_03: Isn't that crazy?
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: It's the four that I I most commonly hear.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: And like I said, it they do really pop up in in early childhood, and they just stick with us unless you heal, right?
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_00: The the event or the trauma that caused them.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_03: So these parents who are feeling this way, who are trying to not have their children feel that way, are modeling exactly that behavior, and that's what's happening.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_03: And now these adult children they don't feel safe, they don't feel loved, they don't feel wanted, not necessarily by their parents, but by society, by their peers.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_03: Um, the the level of insecurity is is pervasive.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_03: And so are insecure parents who don't feel good about themselves, trying so very hard that in a way they are perpetuating that very pattern of feeling.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, I mean, I guess you see that throughout the generations is what you don't heal, you pass on.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and so I think there's a lot of people that I work with, even before they have kids, of hey, you know, I had this terrible relationship with my parent, and I don't want my kids to hate me like I hate my parent.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so before they even have kids, we are diving into the trauma work and we're diving into how do we heal so that you can show up and be the best parent you can be for whatever kid you end up having.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_03: So for the parent that's listening right now and is completely resonating with this conversation, what can they start to do to heal?
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_00: To be honest with you, I I really think the best place to do it is with a marriage and family therapist.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: I really think it's having it's it's having a safe place where you can go and have these dialogues and have someone like identify your patterns and help you identify where did the negative cognition come from.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_00: I do a lot of EMDR, which is the number one trauma treatment.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I do a lot of EMDR with clients and with parents to help heal those past traumas and those past memories.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_00: So honestly, my best piece of advice is to be is to find a therapist that you love and that you feel connected to, that has, you know, supports your values and beliefs as a person and someone that you can just go process these things with.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_03: Great.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, good.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_03: Um, when we were talking, um, not on this call, another time, you made a comment that I I wrote down.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_03: And it was when a parent is meeting their needs, they can't meet their kids' needs.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: Can you elaborate on that?
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_00: So it's interesting.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um, no, I don't have research to back this.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's just what I've seen in the past 14 years of treating people.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_03: It's good enough for me.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's really hard to meet two people's needs, like psychological, emotional needs.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_00: If you are constantly having to meet your needs of feeling good enough.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_00: Like let's say, hey, I just want to feel like a good enough mom, right?
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_00: If that's your sole focus, you start making decisions to meet your needs.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_00: You can't even show up to identify what your kids' needs are, because you're so focused on your own.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, which necessarily it's not necessarily a bad thing to be aware of, hey, here's the stuff that I have going on.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_00: But it's how do I process that?
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: How do I heal that for myself and with a trusted therapist and maybe my partner so that I can show up for my kids' needs.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: And if my kids needing me to be there for a baseball game, I'm there going to my kids' baseball game because they need me to be there, not because, oh, this proves I'm a good enough mom.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: Because at the end of the day, I don't think anybody's ever gonna feel like a good enough mom.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_00: Like I think that we can try, but I think there's always gonna be moments when you're like, yep, I totally screwed that one up.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: Oh that's gonna happen.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, every every parent right now is yay, it's not just me.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_03: It's not just me.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not the only yeah, yeah, constantly.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_03: But we're figuring things out as we go.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_03: None of us really know what we're doing.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_03: We need practice and we need to screw up, and then we have to say sorry, and then we have to do it again and get it right, and then it's gonna be a new thing that we're dealing with.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, it's it's really rough.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_03: But um just just not that we're throwing, you know, names around, but it sounds like it's a narcissistic type of personality that has that mind needs first.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes, not all the time.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, not all the time, because a lot of times I do have parents that genuinely want to show up for their kids, but but their brain is so rooted in their trauma because it's not healed.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, the narcissisms that I see are, well, I'm such a great parent.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_00: You're the one with the problem.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: That's the type of narcissism that at least shows up in my office.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: It's the parents that are like, wait a minute, like I'm kind of nervous, I am screwing this up.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_00: Those parents are oftentimes the parents that are like healthy enough to see, like, hey, here's where I'm struggling.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: Here's what I can, what I want to fix.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_00: I see the narcissism of parents who who come in and and blame their kid and say, okay, well, here you fix my 12-year-old, here's everything they're doing wrong.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, wait, wait a minute.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_00: Like, there's a there's a lot that a 12-year-old can do wrong, but they are not the one in control in the house.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_00: That's right.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_00: And so, how is it that we can really sit and dial this back?
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, sometimes it it's not the narcissistic borderline personality parent that I see that comes in with, hey, I'm trying to get my needs first.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_00: Now that does happen that I would say on a spectrum, that's the very, very extreme that they're not even looking at their kid and they don't care that they're not looking at their kid.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_00: That's where I know there's narcissism.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: On the other side of the spectrum, is the parents I work with.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, hey, I'm not meeting my kid's needs, but it's completely inadvertent.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: And so sometimes it's just, I didn't even realize I wasn't meeting my kid's needs because I'm so focused on mine subconsciously.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes it's not even a conscious thought, but it's that parent who, and I I love going to the grocery store because I love to people watch.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_00: But when I see parents with their young kids walk down the cookie aisle, one, you've made a terrible mistake.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_00: Like you should never go down the cookie aisle.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: But when I see the kid freaking out and screaming and the parents looking around like, oh dear, like please, I don't want someone to think that I'm a terrible parent, and they throw the cookies in the basket to get the child to calm down.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_00: You have met your needs.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_00: You didn't meet your child's needs.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: And so sometimes we make those decisions so flippantly that that it just becomes second nature.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_03: Um I'm gonna be all over the place.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you, ADHD brain, but there's so many things I want to touch on with you.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_03: There's a topic that I haven't talked enough about on launch, and it's right up your alley.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_03: It's attachment styles.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_03: So I would love for you to share with the listener the different attachment styles of parents and children have and why they are so important.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, we can start off with what does a secure attachment look like?
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_00: So with a secure attachment, the way that you can really see if a kiddo is securely attached with a parent is when a kiddo feels like, hey, I am good when I'm with you, and I'm good when I'm away from you.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_00: I'm okay in community and in relationship when I'm with you, and I'm okay when you're gone.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_00: No matter what, I'm okay because I know I can rely on you and I know that you're predictable.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_00: Then you have three different types of insecure attachment.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_00: So, with the first type of insecure attachment, it's what we see the most, and it's an anxious attachment to where it looks like again, you're anxious about people leaving.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I need you to show up for me, I need you to come here, I need you to tell me I'm okay because you're so afraid of abandonment.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: You just don't want people to leave you.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_00: Then we have the complete opposite, which is avoidant.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_00: Those are the type of people who I don't want people too close to me because I push away.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_00: I I don't I don't find comfort when people are close to me.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_00: I find comfort when I'm kind of alone and doing my own thing.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: Then the third one that you have, which is the least common but the hardest one to treat, is the disorganized attachment.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_00: Now, depending on the book you're reading, these might be called something a little bit different.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: So those are the terms that are traditionally used, though.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: So the disorganized attachment is a combination of both.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's anxious and it's avoidant.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_00: So the way that this looks, and usually when I ask parents, how does your kid treat you?
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_00: The way that it looks and the way that it feels is hey, mom and dad, come close to me, but F you at the same time.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: So your kid is wanting you to come hang out, but then they treat you like garbage when you're in, when you're hanging out with them.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: And the parent is like, What in the world did I do to you?
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_00: Why are you so angry?
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_00: They're like, I thought you wanted me at your baseball game.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_00: And then when I'm here, you just lash out at me.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's really confusing for a parent to know what do I do in this situation?
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_00: Because your kid is all over the place.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: Those are the three insecure types.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: And usually in therapy, we we do a variety of different assessments to really tell what type of attachment a kid has with the parent.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I don't think a lot of people can have a secure attachment all of the time because life happens, right?
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_00: Life is fluid, um, scary things happen.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: And if you have one person leave you, that might trigger a little bit of an anxious attachment.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um, all of a sudden, if you're in a relationship and someone has an affair, they cheat on you.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_00: Well, wow, like that can be really shocking to your system.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: So it might create a little bit of an anxious attachment for you.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and that's pretty common.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_00: But overall, we try and look at more often than not, how do you feel when you're in relationships with people?
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, there's so much about this we can get into, but we're not going to dive too deep into it because of the whys and what do you do and all that stuff.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_03: I just want parents to be aware of these different attachment styles.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_03: But are you saying that a child can have a secure attachment with their parent, but then something happens in their life, like being cheated on in a relationship where all of a sudden now they've got this anxious attachment because of not something that their parents did.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm I maybe I'm trying to, you know, let some parents off the hook here that you might have done everything right.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_03: And a lot of us feel like we tried to do everything right, but at some point in time we set our children free into the world and shit happens out there.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_03: We can't keep them wrapped up in cotton batten or whatever that expression is all the time.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_03: The world is going to, you know, chew them up and spit them out.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_03: All we can do is prepare them.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_00: And a lot of times, like for examples where we might see this would be um adolescence.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_00: Adolescence is such a awful, horrible time for people.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_00: So with adolescence, you're really trying to figure out who you are.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_00: Well, if you go to school and you all of a sudden, out of nowhere, are bullied by maybe a good friend, maybe somebody that you really trusted, or somebody that you really trusted betrays you and shares information that you didn't want shared, that can really impact a kid.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_00: And so all of a sudden they might say, forget it, I don't want anybody around me.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_00: And so it might look like an avoidant attachment style to where it's nope, I'm gonna push the world away from me.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_00: Now as we get older too, I mean, when you start dating, when you start having teenagers and they start dating and they're in their early adulthood and they're dating, trying to find a spouse, the same thing can happen too.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it oftentimes can take just one bad incident with somebody for your whole worldview to be completely rocked and say, wow, like I didn't know that somebody was capable of treating me that poorly.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_00: And it it could really impact your attachment style.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_03: How can we help parents in these situations when they've got these adult kids?
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's a tough question, but I believe that there's a way to move forward, but they need some actionable steps, they need some advice, not just like, you know, warm and fuzzy thoughts.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_03: There's there are parenting coaches out there that just will love you to death every week that you get on a call with them.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_03: And I am not like that.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like, let's figure out how to help these parents connect with their kids, yeah, adults, and help them to start to feel good about themselves again.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_03: Any suggestions?
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: And to be honest with you, because you deal with a huge spectrum, right?
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like I can imagine that there's probably some adult children out there that that would like to launch and are struggling for a variety of different reasons.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_00: And then I wonder if there's adult children out there that don't really want to launch because it's pretty comfy at mom and dad's house, and it's pretty comfy that I don't have to pay bills.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_00: Which one are you seeing more of in your practice, do you think?
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_03: Comfy.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_03: There's no okay, there's the boundaries.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_03: Uh parents are just being told to leave me alone.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_03: They want to just do what they want to do.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_03: They don't want to go out into the world, but all of their needs are being met, all of their bills are being paid, uh, but they're not participating in anything around the house.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_03: They don't, they say they're trying to look for a job, but they're very fussy about the type of job they're getting, but they're saying it's it's too late now, I've missed the boat.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_03: So it's almost like, well, you sort of brought that on yourself.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_03: But um, I'm, you know, parents are just like they're they don't know what to do.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_03: The kid seems very comfortable.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_03: It's like they're they're running a hotel, um, and the and their their adult child is their you know guest.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm seeing the parents almost we need to give them permission, permission to set boundaries, to say things like, I'm not comfortable watching you live like this anymore.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_03: There are going to be consequences if you're gonna continue to live in this house in our home as a family and not participate, not make an effort, you know.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, parents will always say the same thing.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_03: What can I do?
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_03: How can I force them?
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_03: We're not asking you to force them, we're saying, you know, sit down with them.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_03: I I don't know if you've heard my living together agreement.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_03: I've been doing this for a couple of years now, years now, but it really gives parents like something to work with.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_03: These kids need structure, they need routine, they need to feel good about themselves.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_03: At the end of the day, when you get that to-do list and you get things done, you feel good about yourself.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_03: So it's it's about empowering them and building up their confidence.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_03: But I I think I've sort of answered your question and I want to know what what you what suggestions you might have.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_00: So if we're we're thinking about and talking about parents who've inadvertently um we'll say created a much too comfy lifestyle.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_00: And it could be, hey, I don't want to push my kid out of the nest because then what if they never come back?
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_00: What if they never talk to me?
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_00: What if I never get to meet my future grandkids, whose needs are being met?
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_00: And so it all goes back to in the relationships that you're in, whose needs are being met?
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't seem like you're meeting your child's needs if you're letting them live at home scot-free, not having any responsibilities.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_00: Your needs are being met.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_00: Because what's the worst that could happen?
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_00: What's the worst that could happen if you say, hey, I really need you to start contributing to the house?
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I need you to start paying$400 a month in rent because that's groceries or electric water.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so$400 a month in rent, and if you can't do that, we're gonna have to make other arrangements.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_00: So let's say the kid comes to you and says, Well, I don't have$400 a month, what's the boundary that you're gonna set then?
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_00: So, and then if you have to set an uncomfortable boundary, again, what's the worst that could happen?
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_00: And if if your first thought is, well, my kid will never talk to me again.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: If your kid never talks to you again because you asked them to pay$400 a month in rent in a home that you own that they are not contributing in, we have a way bigger problem on our hands.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: Because that that's not why kids are stopped talking to their parents right now, right?
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_00: Right now, we're seeing a lot of adult children estranged from their parents because adult children oftentimes have been treated very poorly by their parents.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but it's not for setting appropriate boundaries.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that that's where people have this really weird misconception about a boundary.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I have this conversation with everybody.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_00: I love the book Boundaries uh by John Townsend and Henry Cloud.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_00: Henry Cloud's actually a friend of mine, wonderful man.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_00: And so that book Boundary that really talks about it's not consequences or rewards.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's you're telling the other person, here's what I'm going to do if your behavior isn't A or B.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_00: And so you're not threatening, it's just, hey, this is what's gonna happen.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think parents are so afraid of setting those boundaries because, well, what if my kid ends up homeless?
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: I highly doubt your child will end up homeless.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_00: They might just need a very strong nudge in the right direction.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_00: Right now, again, to go back to those two guardrails that I was talking to you about, firmness and kindness or connection.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_00: We have a lot of these parents who might have a connection with their kid, but where's the firmness?
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_00: Where's the responsibilities?
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_00: Where are you helping your child uh realize their potential?
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_00: And so I wonder if you've kind of cheated your kid a little bit out of meeting a lot of these different goals and mile markers.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_00: And unfortunately, you've kind of done them a disservice for a variety of different reasons.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I oftentimes don't want to just blame the parent.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because once you're an adult child, I think that hey, you are an adult, right?
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_00: So you need to start really making these decisions and these choices.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_00: But my question also becomes how were they raised?
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_00: Between four and eighteen, did you set boundaries?
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_00: Did you set limits?
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_00: What did that look like?
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_00: Did you have a 16-year-old who could do whatever they wanted to whenever they wanted to?
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_00: And now you have a 26-year-old who does whatever they want to whenever they want to in your house.
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_00: And now you've completely lost control.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: And so, yeah, I I I'm hoping that answers your question.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_03: It does, it does, but it touches on a it touches on a few things because I first I'm going to put that boundaries book in the show notes because I think it's one of those things that parents struggle the most with.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_03: I've I've written scripts.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_03: I can't tell you how many times, how many things I've emailed parents about this is how you should say this, when it comes to boundaries.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_03: It's not about control, but it is about setting some stating how you feel about something, not what you should be doing.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_03: So even when a consequence, it's not even a bad thing.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_03: Consequences are life.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_03: But the consequences of you not respecting my boundaries are what?
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_03: What happens if you so it's not again, it's it's so many um confusions about are you is that an ultimatum?
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_03: Are you threatening me?
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_03: No, I'm just telling you what I'm not comfortable with.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_03: It's your choice what you're gonna do with what I'm not comfortable with.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm not bottom line, I'm not comfortable watching you waste your life.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_03: What are you gonna do about it?
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right?
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_00: Well, so boundaries, boundaries are like a very normal part of life, right?
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_00: But for some reason they're being broken down at home is this bad, naughty thing.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_00: But like think about your boss.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_00: If you're paid hourly, well, you go to work on Monday, great, you get paid for Monday.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_00: If you don't come to work on Tuesday, you don't get paid.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_00: That's a boundary.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's not an ultimatum, it's not a threat.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_00: It's just, hey, we don't pay people for not showing up to work.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_00: And so when you don't set a boundary for your child, you aren't demonstrating for them this is actually how the world works.
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_00: My husband and I have boundaries with each other, right?
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_00: Like when we got married, or before we got married, we had so many conversations.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_00: The poor guy married to a therapist.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_00: I can't imagine.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_00: But we had conversations of hey, what's an affair?
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_00: What's infidelity?
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_00: Because if you cheat, I leave.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_02: That's a beautiful example of a consequence and a boundary.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_00: And yes.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm not threatening you.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_00: It's not, I'm not being mean.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_00: It's just if this happens, if this is a choice that you make, here's going to be my healthy response.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_04: Yes.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_00: And so unfortunately, I do think that there's a lot of people out in the world that really don't want to put boundaries in place with other people because it's scary.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_00: And well, what if those people stop talking to me?
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_00: Or what if they stopped liking me?
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_00: To be honest with you, I've had to set boundaries with a few different people in my life, like family members, close family members.
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_00: And they didn't believe the boundary until it was said.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_00: And we said, look, I told you if this happened one more time, we would have a very different relationship.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_00: And now we have a very different relationship, um, which is hard, but it's kind of what I need for my sanity and what my husband and I need in order to make and create a wonderful, productive home for our family.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_03: This isn't ever for me, this is a never-ending topic.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_03: Never ending topic.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_03: Because I don't think there's anything wrong at all with, and but you're right.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_03: If if this, I'm gonna say this poor adult child had never had any boundaries set and they could run the house as the you know, gentle parenting um and did whatever they wanted.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_03: And it's okay, Billy, you know, use your words.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, you know, God bless them.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_03: Today it's not the same because those words are are disrespectful and parents are just taking it.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm like, you don't have to take that.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_03: Well, what am I supposed to do?
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_03: Don't tolerate it.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_03: Don't tolerate it.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_03: That's just saying you will not talk to me like that.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_03: We were not, we're not gonna have conversations anymore.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_03: That's a consequence.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_03: I will not talk to you if you talk to me like that.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_03: Like, I don't think it's so complicated, but I you know what you're right about the whole estrangement thing.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_03: I think people are parents are living in fear of that, but no child, and you you could talk about this more, uh will ever want to be estranged from their parent just because it was a boundary put on them.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_03: That's not why their estrangement happens.
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_00: It that is biologically incongruent with who we are as people.
• 35:52
  SPEAKER_00: I have worked with children who have endured some of the most awful traumatic abuse you could possibly imagine from a biological parent, sexual, physical, spiritual, and emotional, uh egregious, whatever you're picturing in your head, multiply it by 10.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_00: Those adult children who are in their 20s trying to heal from their abuse, they still look at me and say, you know what?
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_00: I still would like a relationship with like a healthy relationship.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_00: Doesn't mean that they're like codependent on that person, doesn't mean that it's unhealthy for them to want that relationship.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_00: Biologically, we as children want a relationship with our biological parents.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_00: And so the majority of adult children that I work with who have become estranged from their parent, it's because there's been years of unhelpful conversations, very damaging conversations, um, to where the adult parent isn't hearing what they're saying.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_00: And finally, the the child is like, I I give up.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_00: I I'm so done explaining myself to you and you don't care.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's interesting.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_00: I I ran in a lot of those different groups of adult children who have become estranged from their parents.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_00: And no kid is sitting there saying that that was an easy decision to make because it's quite difficult to say, I'm not gonna speak to one of my biological parents anymore because of how they've treated me.
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_00: Because it does go against every fiber in your body.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um yeah.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_03: So for the parent listening, it's okay to set boundaries, it's okay to establish the, and by the way, I didn't even finish that sentence, establish consequences.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, when I was studying um psychology, we had to take some extracurricular, whatever, like school program, whatever.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not saying it properly, but you know, the added courses.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_03: And I took philosophy.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_03: And I remember the Kent, K-A-N-T philosopher, and he did this whole thing about if then if this happens, then that happens.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_03: It is part of life.
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_03: If then.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_03: So I just I want I want to keep giving parents permission to say, you know, in this home, we are all adults, we are all participating, and it is only fair that you do your share and contribute.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_03: And what if I don't?
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_03: What do you think should happen?
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_03: How about you decide what you think is fair?
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_03: Like I'll just throw it right back at them.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_03: Um we're we're getting close to our hour, and I like to be respectful of that, but there is one more thing that I want to bring up before we say goodbye, and that's the video that you posted.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, it got you 820,000 views.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_03: I'm sure it's still going.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_03: And it was the four things that 95% of 16-year-olds should be doing.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_03: Now, when I saw that video, I was like, yes.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_03: But I want you to know that it's the the four things that all young adults should be doing.
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_03: So for me, to give me joy for us to with our listener, can you please tell us what those four things are?
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know, and it's funny because the the comments on that video were not supportive of these four ideas.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_00: People were very uh angry and defensive and combative.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_00: And it's funny because every now and again I scroll through there and I see parents who said, My parents made me do this, I'm not gonna make my child do that.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I just shrug my shoulders, yeah, yeah.
• 39:47
  SPEAKER_00: I shrug my shoulders and say, Well, there we go.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_00: Let me send you a copy of my book.
• 39:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so those four things, and these are things that I have seen be incredibly helpful for the typical 16-year-old.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_00: Now, the first one that I I typically go with is I truly believe that an average 16-year-old needs to be working outside of the home or contributing outside of the home in some way, shape, or form.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_00: Now, when I say working, a lot of people took that out of context of I'm saying 40 hours a week.
• 40:19
  SPEAKER_00: Or labor.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_00: No, I didn't say 40 hours a week.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_00: Good heavens.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_00: But I see kids in our neighborhood, and we get kids walk up to our door all the time.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, do you have any weeds I can pull?
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like, can I mow your lawn?
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um, like they're very hard-working kids in our neighborhood now that I'm thinking about it.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_00: But even if your kid goes and babysits once a month, like you're working and you're contributing outside of the household.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_00: That can also look like volunteer work.
• 40:49
  unknown: That's right.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_00: Go have your kiddo volunteer at I actually volunteered at 15 at an animal hospital.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I just cleaned out the kennels.
• 40:57
  SPEAKER_00: It was fun playing with the dogs.
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_00: I'd move one dog to another kennel and clean up.
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_00: And again, you're you're contributing to society.
• 41:05
  unknown: Yeah.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_00: So your kid doesn't need to be working 40 hours a week, but even if they're working five to 10 hours a week, it can be very helpful for them and it gives them a lot of great life skills that schools aren't giving them.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_00: Now, a lot of parents also said, Well, my kid's in sports.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_00: I think sports are great.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_00: I grew up, I played five years of lacrosse, loved it.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_00: I think it taught me a lot of skills.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_00: I also worked while I played lacrosse.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 41:35
  SPEAKER_00: But what are the odds of your child even getting a college scholarship on the sport that they're playing?
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_00: So please take in consideration, like, yes, your kid might love this sport, but is it going to be worth them losing out on these other life skills that they could be learning?
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_00: And you also have summertime.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_00: Let's look at getting a summertime job because if your kid doesn't have a summertime job or volunteer work, are they sitting at home playing video games all summer long?
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_00: So that was the first one I thought about.
• 42:07
  SPEAKER_00: The second one that I mentioned was really basic life responsibilities.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_00: Your 16-year-old should be in charge of their laundry.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_00: They should be in charge of waking themselves up and getting themselves to school.
• 42:20
  SPEAKER_00: Now that might be the bus, or if you live pretty close to your school, or if your kids school is really far and you take them to a private school.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously, you might have to drive them there.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_00: But things like finances and things like budgeting, like they should really be learning these skills at 16 years old.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_00: They should be learning the value of a dollar.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I go back to the 10, 10, 80.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_00: 10% goes to tithing, 10 10% goes to savings, and then you can spend 80%.
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_00: But at 16, maybe we want to start saving for a car, or we need to start saving for college and textbooks.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_00: But really helping them learn basic life skills.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, there was a separate video I did on how your kid could really learn how to change a tire.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_00: The amount of kids that don't know how to change their tie their car tire is fascinating to me.
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_00: And so, yeah, being able to know how to load the dishwasher and unload and cook meals, right?
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_00: There's so many skills that 16-year-olds don't know anymore that they really should.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_00: The third one I talked about was emotional regulation.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_00: If you have a 16-year-old and there is screaming or yelling or raising of voices going on in your home, we have a problem.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_00: There should be emotional regulation to where, hey, I can share with you how I'm feeling, you can share with me how you're feeling.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_00: And nobody is leaving their window of tolerance, is what we call it.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_00: You can search that term.
• 43:51
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't create it.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_00: But in your window of tolerance, you should be able to give and take feedback and stay emotionally regulated.
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_00: If you're 16 year old Struggles a lot.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_00: With emotional regulation, we need to work on that.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like there needs to be a lot more um coping mechanisms.
• 44:11
  SPEAKER_00: There needs to be a lot more deep breathing going on because they're 16.
• 44:15
  SPEAKER_00: They should not still be, they shouldn't be yelling at a parent like you kind of would expect from a six, seven-year-old.
• 44:21
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_00: And then the last one I talked about, which I kind of already lumped that into the basic side responsibilities, is really thinking about budgeting and big life decisions.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what do you plan to do?
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_00: You have two short years left, but before you're an adult, where do you see your life going?
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I actually work at a college.
• 44:44
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a program director.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_00: I run a marriage and family therapy program.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think college is for everybody.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_00: I actually think that sometimes college can really be negative for a kid.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_00: I have seen it kind of go downhill.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and depending on where your kid is going to college, depending upon their degree.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_00: But I have loved when I have seen parents set boundaries with college and they say, hey, we will pay for it or we will contribute this amount if and only if you have a degree that's going to get you a job.
• 45:21
  SPEAKER_00: So if you go to school and you get your bachelor's in liberal arts, we're not paying for it.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_00: Because what are you going to do with a liberal arts degree?
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_00: But if you go to school and you become a mechanical engineer, great, we will happily pay for that.
• 45:35
  SPEAKER_00: And so, but even if your kid doesn't want to go to college, Ivy trade schools are wonderful right now.
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_00: There's going to be a shortage on plumbers and a shortage on electricians and HVAC employees here soon.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_00: So getting your kid to go to a trade school, but really getting them to think about what is it that you want to do, because you do have two years.
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_00: And by the time you hit 18, college is not for you to just go figure who out, figure out who you are.
• 46:06
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 46:06
  SPEAKER_00: That's not what college is meant.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_00: Somehow it became that over these years.
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_00: That college is four years of you identifying how do I want to spend the rest of my life.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_00: It shouldn't be partying, it shouldn't be getting drunk every night.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_00: It should be really dedicated towards learning a skill.
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_00: And if your kid's not going to learn a skill in college, they shouldn't be going.
• 46:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um now that's that's coming from someone who went to college for 10 years because I knew what I wanted to do.
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but if they need to take a gap year, great.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_00: Let's take a gap year.
• 46:41
  SPEAKER_00: Let's not throw you into college, maybe take a couple community college courses.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_00: I did that when I was in high school.
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_00: I took a community college class in interior design.
• 46:51
  SPEAKER_00: Figured out I can't see colors.
• 46:53
  SPEAKER_00: I don't have that skill as an interior designer.
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_00: But I was in a class and I was like, hey, I figured out that this isn't for me.
• 47:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 47:01
  SPEAKER_00: And so if your kid takes a gap year, great.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_00: But if you're gonna live under my roof, you need to be working full time.
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_00: And you get six months of living here rent-free before I start charging you rent.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_00: And if you don't have a job by then, you're going to be addicted.
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_00: Because this is just how the world works.
• 47:20
  SPEAKER_00: And you kind of hold their feet to the fire in a loving but firm way.
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_00: It's completely okay to do.
• 47:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_03: You know what you said why I loved it so much was because it's it's what the 20-somethings and 30-something year olds should be listening to, or the parents of these young adults.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_03: This is what they are not doing.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_03: The responsibilities are not there, the life skills are not there.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_03: It's not there, it's not happening.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_03: So even though you addressed for 16 to all the parents out there, this is what you should be thinking about right now, but that young adult in their room who's not doing any of this stuff.
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_03: It's okay to start putting, you know, to set it to be firm with them now.
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_03: So love it.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_00: And there was one more thing that you had brought up earlier.
• 48:08
  SPEAKER_00: I kind of want to go back and touch on just for a couple minutes.
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um, as a marriage and family therapist, I look at the entire family unit.
• 48:15
  unknown: Right.
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_00: And for some reason, and I want you to correct me if I'm wrong, do you work with a lot of moms?
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_04: I do.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_00: How many dads do you work with?
• 48:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like, would you say it's 80-20?
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_00: Would you say it's 50-50?
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_00: How many moms reach out to you compared to dads?
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_03: Well, first of all, I'll tell you the the parents come together.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_03: Um you make them.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_03: No, they come together, but not a hundred percent, not a hundred percent.
• 48:42
  SPEAKER_03: So to to add to that.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_03: So 80% of the parents will come together because they're both really struggling with this, right?
• 48:48
  SPEAKER_03: And it they they weren't always struggling with this.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_03: Um but at this point now, when they come to me, they're fed up and they really want to figure it out together, and they both have to be on board.
• 48:59
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so it's not the sometimes the the mother does continue on without the father around because she finds it's like micromanaging, like he's already got his agenda and he's fed up too, and it's hard for her to kind of learn what steps to do.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_03: But most I have to say, the majority of the fat the situations I'm dealing with, they're they're both in it together.
• 49:21
  SPEAKER_03: I got a lot of couples there.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_03: So, but again, they're really, really at their wits' end.
• 49:27
  SPEAKER_00: So they uh five years ago, I bet you they weren't on the same page.
• 49:32
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 49:32
  SPEAKER_00: Until one of them got to the point of I'm done.
• 49:35
  SPEAKER_00: The reason why I asked is because oftentimes when I get parents um that come in, if they're struggling with their adult child launching, which I actually have two current clients right now, and they can't get their child to even come to therapy.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I you can't course them when they're 26.
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I always have one parent who's passive.
• 49:55
  SPEAKER_00: I've got one parent who's, I need you out of my house.
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_00: I want you to launch.
• 50:00
  SPEAKER_00: And then I have another parent that's like, well, it is what it is.
• 50:03
  SPEAKER_00: And they've kind of just shrugged their shoulders and given up.
• 50:06
  SPEAKER_00: So I was curious if that's kind of what you've seen too.
• 50:09
  SPEAKER_00: But I love knowing and hearing that people are are teaming up with their spouses.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, they're so passive parents.
• 50:16
  SPEAKER_03: I don't got a passion.
• 50:17
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know.
• 50:19
  SPEAKER_03: Both fed up.
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_03: But I'm telling you, they're really like that.
• 50:22
  SPEAKER_03: They're they're both fed up.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_03: I love it.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_03: They're so united.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_03: I can see sometimes where one was softer.
• 50:31
  SPEAKER_03: You can see the softness, but they've the softer one has come has definitely got on board because at this point now they're they're really worried.
• 50:39
  SPEAKER_03: They're very worried about their 28, 32-year-old.
• 50:43
  SPEAKER_03: They're they're worried and they're not seeing any future where they can retire.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I don't, but I don't, I don't have soft parents.
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_03: And I don't think soft parents would come to me.
• 50:52
  SPEAKER_03: I think I I I demand I'm I'm that I'm a kind of um parenting consultant where you if you listen to my videos or or even listen to these podcasts, I'm really serious.
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_03: Like we're getting shit done.
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_03: We are not messing around.
• 51:07
  SPEAKER_03: So they come to me.
• 51:08
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, they're ready.
• 51:09
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so I love it too.
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and you're modeling for them.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_00: It's okay to hold people's feet to the fire.
• 51:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I love that you're modeling for that.
• 51:18
  SPEAKER_00: That for that.
• 51:19
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I say to them, if if you don't, if you don't start like really getting serious about this, just take a snapshot of your life.
• 51:25
  SPEAKER_03: It's gonna be like this in a year from now.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_03: There, that's that's very scary for them because they've been at it for years.
• 51:32
  SPEAKER_03: It's a lot of it's it didn't just happen a year ago.
• 51:34
  SPEAKER_03: I don't get anybody.
• 51:35
  SPEAKER_03: They came home a year ago.
• 51:36
  SPEAKER_03: I get parents, they came home five years ago, and now we're done.
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_03: And and again, they're all around my age.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, I'm 61.
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_03: So I don't got I don't have 40 something year old parents.
• 51:46
  SPEAKER_03: I got you know, 55 to 70 year old parents that are getting like, we want to we want to sell the house.
• 51:53
  SPEAKER_03: We want to start traveling.
• 51:54
  SPEAKER_03: Like this kid is not doing anything, so they're all interesting.
• 51:58
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, ah, love that.
• 51:59
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, yeah, great.
• 52:01
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I always like to leave on a positive note.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I think I think I I always we always get so much great stuff by the time we're done.
• 52:09
  SPEAKER_03: But is there something that you want to leave our listener with today?
• 52:15
  SPEAKER_00: You know, oftentimes whenever I'm working with parents, um I truly believe from the bottom of my heart that the majority of parents, like an overwhelming majority, like 90% of them, are really trying to do the best they can.
• 52:30
  SPEAKER_00: I very, very rarely see a parent where they're just like, well, screw it.
• 52:34
  SPEAKER_00: I don't care.
• 52:35
  SPEAKER_00: Like that that usually doesn't happen.
• 52:38
  SPEAKER_00: And so I want to make sure that parents are like being gracious to themselves of, hey, this might be a long journey, but giving yourself that grace and giving yourself like, hey, you're gonna mess up.
• 52:49
  SPEAKER_00: Like I'm friends with a lot of therapists, it just comes with the territory.
• 52:53
  SPEAKER_00: And it's so funny when we talk about how we have messed up in our marriages or in our parenting, and we kind of laugh about it because we should know better and we still make those mistakes.
• 53:04
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 53:04
  SPEAKER_00: And so be kind to yourself, be gentle.
• 53:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, yeah, I mean, sometimes it's okay to do the hard things too.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_03: And patient, be patient.
• 53:14
  SPEAKER_03: It didn't this didn't happen overnight.
• 53:15
  SPEAKER_03: This has been a long process.
• 53:17
  SPEAKER_03: So parents are like, they're fed up, they want things to change quickly.
• 53:20
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm like, you can't change quickly, but you stick to it.
• 53:24
  SPEAKER_03: Stick to it, absolutely.
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_03: Bree, thank you so much for come for joining me today.
• 53:29
  SPEAKER_03: I I love everything you had said.
• 53:31
  SPEAKER_03: Throwing so much shit at you, and you just took it.
• 53:34
  SPEAKER_01: It just you're just the best, Jerry.
• 53:37
  SPEAKER_01: You're close to you're pretty close to my mom's age, and I'm kind of like, man, can you be my mom?
• 53:41
  SPEAKER_01: I would love to.
• 53:42
  SPEAKER_01: I would love to.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_01: I won't move it into your house.
• 53:45
  SPEAKER_01: Never move out.
• 53:46
  SPEAKER_01: You oh, you can move in.
• 53:47
  SPEAKER_02: Uh you I won't kick you out, but you will be working, you will be helping me do stuff.
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_03: Can rent.
• 53:54
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, but we'll be hanging out together and having fun too, for sure.
• 53:58
  SPEAKER_03: I promise you that.
• 54:00
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I'm gonna leave your book in the show notes, and you are in the Arizona area, right?
• 54:06
  SPEAKER_03: So if anybody wants to reach out to you, that's how they can.
• 54:08
  SPEAKER_03: And I am so glad that I connected with you.
• 54:11
  SPEAKER_01: You're absolutely glad.
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_03: All right.
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_03: I hope today's episode gave you valuable insights and actionable steps that will help you guide your young adult to launch successfully into adulthood.
• 54:26
  SPEAKER_03: If you found this topic helpful, feel free to leave a comment and hit the subscribe button so you never miss an episode.
• 54:33
  SPEAKER_03: Leaving a five-star review of us with more parents.
• 54:38
  SPEAKER_03: And if there's something you want to ask us, I invite you to join lots of advice.
• 54:51
  SPEAKER_03: Just quite a lot of lights in the show notes, and don't forget to email me your confidential questions.
• 54:56
  SPEAKER_03: And August 1st, 1958.
• 55:01
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know.