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MDC Workshop: Coparenting through Divorce · Magic Divorce Club Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Hello and welcome to this November workshop for the Magic Divorce Club.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_01: And today I'm joined by Ashley Johnson,
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_01: who,
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know when to tell this story,
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_01: I might save it for the end,
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_01: but the first time I met you,
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_01: you weren't actually there.
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  SPEAKER_01: So I'll save it for later, a little hook.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_01: So Ashley is a beloved and an award-winning sexuality educator.
• 0:29
  She helps people have better relationships,
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  more confident and calm conversations.
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  SPEAKER_01: Can't wait to hear about this.
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  SPEAKER_01: She's a coach.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_01: She's train the trainer, which you might have to explain what that is.
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  SPEAKER_01: She's an advocate for children and youth.
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  SPEAKER_01: And over the last 20 years,
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  she's had experience which has and worked and reached and
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  positively impacted tens
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  SPEAKER_01: of thousands of individuals for the better and all by word of mouth.
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  SPEAKER_01: That's amazing.
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  SPEAKER_01: So welcome.
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  And I massively appreciate this because I am constantly
• 1:11
  struggling with this
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  SPEAKER_01: particular topic,
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  SPEAKER_01: which is co-parenting through divorce.
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  SPEAKER_01: It's an interesting one,
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  SPEAKER_01: which obviously if you have children,
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  SPEAKER_01: there'll be times when things are really smooth and you're like,
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  SPEAKER_01: this is a piece of cake.
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  SPEAKER_01: And other times,
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  SPEAKER_01: you just can't predict and it's not.
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  SPEAKER_01: And you get triggered all the way back to the start again.
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  SPEAKER_00: That's exactly right.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_00: That's exactly right.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much for having me, Hannah.
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  SPEAKER_00: I am so super excited to just share a couple of tips and things.
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  SPEAKER_00: I know things that have worked for me,
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  SPEAKER_00: which I think is probably the most important thing,
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  SPEAKER_00: like what's gone well.
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  SPEAKER_00: And the things that haven't too, like I'm real, like,
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  SPEAKER_00: Not everything has gone in ways that have been enjoyable by any means,
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  SPEAKER_00: but for the most part,
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  SPEAKER_00: my experience has been really positive.
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  SPEAKER_00: And so that's the stuff I'm wanting to like share out and resource with.
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  SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
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  SPEAKER_01: like it is important to be real about mistakes,
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  SPEAKER_01: I think,
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  SPEAKER_01: because often that's where the biggest learning is,
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  SPEAKER_01: of course,
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  SPEAKER_01: because you're like,
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  SPEAKER_01: I will never do that again.
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  But sometimes we don't have a choice and we've got to not beat
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  ourselves up for it,
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  SPEAKER_01: but just take the lesson and move on.
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  SPEAKER_01: So how did you come to this information?
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  SPEAKER_01: I believe there is a story.
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  SPEAKER_00: There is a story in here.
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  SPEAKER_00: So two things.
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  So one is I was going through a divorce myself in the States,
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  in the state of Colorado.
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  And one of the legal requirements for divorcing parents is to
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  take a parenting
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  SPEAKER_00: after divorce process.
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  SPEAKER_00: Amazing.
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  SPEAKER_00: Right.
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  SPEAKER_00: So you,
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  SPEAKER_00: you,
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  SPEAKER_00: I say have to,
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  SPEAKER_00: you're required to,
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  you're required to sit with a bunch of other people and you're
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  looking around
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  SPEAKER_00: going,
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  SPEAKER_00: oh,
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  SPEAKER_00: you're going through,
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  SPEAKER_00: oh God,
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  SPEAKER_00: you're going through divorce.
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  SPEAKER_00: Oh God, you're going through divorce.
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  SPEAKER_00: So you don't feel alone for one, right?
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  SPEAKER_00: All of us are going through this at the same time.
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  SPEAKER_00: You don't know them.
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  SPEAKER_00: You're not chatting with them,
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  SPEAKER_00: but there's someone presenting like saying,
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  SPEAKER_00: here's some things you need to know.
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  SPEAKER_00: Here's how to be better co-parents.
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  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, it,
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  SPEAKER_00: I actually did it twice.
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  My husband at the time and I were separating once in 2016,
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  reconciled and then divorced in 2024.
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  SPEAKER_00: So I actually went through the process twice.
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  SPEAKER_00: I know.
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  And I was,
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  as I was going through it,
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  like I said,
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  I'm like,
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  there's just stuff that's in here.
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  SPEAKER_00: That's really good.
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  SPEAKER_00: I had,
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  SPEAKER_00: um,
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  SPEAKER_00: my boyfriend now,
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  SPEAKER_00: um,
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  was going through divorce right around the time I was going
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  through it for the
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  SPEAKER_00: second time or separating for the second time.
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  SPEAKER_00: And he's in Australia.
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  SPEAKER_00: They had nothing.
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  SPEAKER_00: They had absolutely nothing.
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  SPEAKER_00: He's like fumbling and navigating.
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  SPEAKER_00: And like,
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  SPEAKER_00: I'm learning the,
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  SPEAKER_00: I call it Australian rules,
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  SPEAKER_00: divorce,
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  SPEAKER_00: U S rules,
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  SPEAKER_00: divorce versus UK rules.
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  SPEAKER_00: The words are all different.
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  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: Watching.
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  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, you have no resources.
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  SPEAKER_00: You don't have a parenting after divorce class.
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  SPEAKER_00: You have a freaking lawyer.
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  SPEAKER_00: You have these, like, they have some insane laws in Australia around
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  SPEAKER_00: We can get to that at the end if we want to.
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  SPEAKER_00: But that was bringing those two things together where I'm like,
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  SPEAKER_00: ah,
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  SPEAKER_00: we're doing something actually pretty cool here in Colorado.
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  SPEAKER_00: I'm seeing someone go through this without these resources.
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  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, we need to talk about this.
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  SPEAKER_00: We need to get this information out.
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  SPEAKER_00: So that's how I came to it.
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  SPEAKER_01: Oh my God, I didn't know that.
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  SPEAKER_01: Like we have, I think if you end up in court, you're sent some links.
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  SPEAKER_01: Like read this if you want, but you're like, I don't really want to.
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  SPEAKER_01: No.
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  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
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  SPEAKER_00: And when it was forced on me,
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  SPEAKER_00: quote unquote,
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  SPEAKER_00: like,
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  SPEAKER_00: of course,
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  SPEAKER_00: I'm open to the content,
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  SPEAKER_00: but I'm stressed.
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  SPEAKER_00: I have right.
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  SPEAKER_00: I'm going through divorce.
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  SPEAKER_00: There is a legal piece of it.
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  SPEAKER_00: And so it was there was a piece of it where like having to do it.
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  SPEAKER_00: like got me over the hurdle.
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  SPEAKER_00: But once I was in there, I'm like, this is really good.
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  SPEAKER_00: This is important enough.
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  SPEAKER_00: Like we need to start talking about this, get this out there.
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  SPEAKER_00: Cause it can make things so much easier on the front end.
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  SPEAKER_00: And then to your point about when you're like,
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  SPEAKER_00: well,
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  SPEAKER_00: yeah,
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  there's just lessons we're going to learn the hard way or
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  lessons that we're going
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  SPEAKER_00: to learn.
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  SPEAKER_00: We just have to take them.
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  It almost makes that process easier because we have more
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  self-confidence and we're grounded.
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  SPEAKER_00: Right.
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  SPEAKER_00: So yeah,
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  SPEAKER_01: Okay, beautiful.
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  SPEAKER_01: That's a great place to start.
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  SPEAKER_01: We do not have that.
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  It's not enforced in this country,
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  which,
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  yeah,
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  I think it would be really helpful if it was.
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  SPEAKER_01: So what's your personal experience with divorce?
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  SPEAKER_01: You nearly split up in 2016 and then you kept going for ages after that.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: So we, let's see.
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  So in 2016,
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  we had younger kids and there was a year,
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  which we can unpack.
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  SPEAKER_00: Um, they were, Oh God, I think there were eight and five.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: They were eight and five at the time in 2016.
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  SPEAKER_00: And I was going through some stuff and needed a lot of space and
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  And,
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  um,
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  there were things in the marriage that were not like healthy,
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  right?
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  Like he definitely had his own stuff,
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  but at that moment,
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  I'm like,
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  I'm unregulated.
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  SPEAKER_00: I didn't have these words, but I'm unregulated.
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  SPEAKER_00: I can't be in my body.
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  SPEAKER_00: Things are coming up for me that have nothing to do with this marriage,
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  SPEAKER_00: but they're affecting this marriage.
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  SPEAKER_00: Um, and so we separated, um,
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  SPEAKER_00: two years.
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  SPEAKER_00: Oh, wow.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: He, I stayed in the house.
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  He,
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  um,
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  got an apartment and just,
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  you know,
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  got another apartment after that.
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  SPEAKER_00: And then, um, I wouldn't say reconciling happened as much as healing.
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  SPEAKER_00: Like I was able to heal.
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  SPEAKER_00: I was able to regulate that shifted the relationship.
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  SPEAKER_00: Um,
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  SPEAKER_00: things had to be brought to the table.
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  SPEAKER_00: Right.
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  SPEAKER_00: And that's one,
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  SPEAKER_00: one of the things I'll talk about is like,
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  SPEAKER_00: you're kind of forced to like,
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  SPEAKER_00: we have to talk about these things.
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  SPEAKER_00: Like we're not going to be living together anymore.
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  SPEAKER_00: And we have kids.
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  SPEAKER_00: So things were forced to the table to talk about.
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  SPEAKER_00: And we were able to do it just with more ease.
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  SPEAKER_00: And we just kept spending more time together.
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  SPEAKER_00: The family was together.
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  SPEAKER_00: And then it just got to a point, it was almost practical.
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  SPEAKER_00: Like we got to be good friends at that point.
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  SPEAKER_00: And then it's like, this is just kind of silly to have two houses.
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  SPEAKER_00: So we came back together.
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  SPEAKER_00: But I wouldn't say it,
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  I would say it was more like a really close friendship for a
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  number of years.
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  And then towards the end in 2003,
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  it was just like,
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  this isn't,
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  this,
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  this,
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  this isn't working.
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  SPEAKER_00: Like there was like, we just had different ideas about finances.
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  And like I said,
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  in hindsight,
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  it was more like,
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  this is more friendly than anything else.
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  SPEAKER_00: And we can, we can part amicably.
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  SPEAKER_00: There was still, there was still some strife.
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  SPEAKER_00: Don't get me wrong.
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  SPEAKER_00: There was definitely some strife.
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  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, that's the story.
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  SPEAKER_00: That's the story of how I personally got here.
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  SPEAKER_00: And now my kids are in their teen years.
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  And so I know divorce and co-parenting from like having a
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  five-year-old to an
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  SPEAKER_00: almost 18-year-old through all the years.
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  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_01: Cause I know quite a few people that are in the magic divorce club.
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  I think the parents who are more concerned are the ones with
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  the older kids.
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  SPEAKER_01: Like there's,
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  SPEAKER_01: I think when you've got younger kids,
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  SPEAKER_01: it's this like,
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  SPEAKER_01: it's just a lot for you personally to hold.
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  SPEAKER_01: Cause they're just like, you know, big energy.
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  But when you're getting the older kids that are starting to
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  understand what's going
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  SPEAKER_01: on,
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  SPEAKER_01: it's like,
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  SPEAKER_01: How are we going to support them?
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  SPEAKER_00: How do you talk to them?
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  SPEAKER_00: What's the problem?
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  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
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  SPEAKER_01: That makes sense.
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  SPEAKER_01: We can,
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  SPEAKER_01: I think we'll probably cover that later on in,
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  SPEAKER_01: I think in what we're talking about,
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  SPEAKER_01: but before we go in,
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  SPEAKER_01: I thought we'd spend maybe like five minutes just grounding our energy.
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  SPEAKER_01: And what I do,
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  SPEAKER_01: Ashley,
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  is I've got this thing called the Magic Clubhouse and it's like
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  a safe space.
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  SPEAKER_01: You can come and just be in.
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  So I'll take us through a little meditation where people can
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  come in there just
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  SPEAKER_01: because it is quite triggering talking about some of this stuff.
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  so just to know that we're held we're safe we're behind a
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  paywall which is an added
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  element on purpose because this stuff is so personal um so that
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  you know you come
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  to this information because you've chosen to and we're holding
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  you when you're in
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  it okay so if you just take a moment to feel settled feel your
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  feet your um all the
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  SPEAKER_01: places you're in contact with the ground
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  SPEAKER_01: And if it feels comfortable to close your eyes, just go on inside.
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  Just taking a few slow,
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  deep breaths to signify to your body that we're slowing down.
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  SPEAKER_01: Feeling the gentle support of the ground beneath you.
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  SPEAKER_01: We can inhale into the heart space, expanding the ribs.
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  SPEAKER_01: And as you exhale, roll your shoulders back and down.
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  SPEAKER_01: Do this one more time, inhaling into heart, expanding the ribs.
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  SPEAKER_01: Exhale and slowly rolling shoulders back and down.
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  Just letting the body know that you don't have to hold all of
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  this on your own.
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  SPEAKER_01: Let the arms and the legs feel heavy.
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  And if it feels comfortable,
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  I invite you to come into the magic divorce clubhouse.
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  SPEAKER_01: This is a huge protective space.
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  SPEAKER_01: As you walk in over the threshold,
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  you can feel all the parts of you that being pulled in
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  different directions.
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  SPEAKER_01: Maybe you have
• 13:00
  different bits that just don't really belong to you in your
• 13:04
  body right now.
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  SPEAKER_01: Your attention's being pulled.
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  As you step over the threshold,
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  all of these bits that shouldn't be in your body fizzle away.
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  SPEAKER_01: And as you step inside, you can feel the space that's being created.
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  You notice the golden blue sparkly energy,
• 13:32
  like little bits of dust floating all around you.
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  SPEAKER_01: And it's like you're walking into the warmest hug.
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  SPEAKER_01: Like the whole building is so happy to see you.
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  SPEAKER_01: It's rooting for you and it knows that you're doing enough.
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  you see a space that has your name on it you go over there it's
• 14:09
  filled with all of
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  your favorite things you wrap yourself up in a blanket that
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  feels like pure
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  compassion love and kindness wrapped around you just settle in
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  the space for a few
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_01: more breaths
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  allowing that energy of loving kindness to come in through your
• 14:39
  body with every breath.
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  SPEAKER_01: It's safe for you to slow down.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: It's safe for you to have support.
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  SPEAKER_01: You don't have to do this alone anymore.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_01: bringing hands to hearts, taking a deep breath into the heart space.
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  And we go into this class with the intention of hearing all the
• 15:45
  things we need to
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  SPEAKER_01: hear to opening our minds to a different possibility,
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_01: an easier option.
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  SPEAKER_01: And then gently feeling back into fingers and toes,
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  moving into any position that feels comfortable as we gently
• 16:13
  keep that space in our
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  SPEAKER_01: hearts.
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  SPEAKER_01: We'll come back to our lovely Ashley.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_00: Beautiful, Hannah.
• 16:23
  I was listening to one of your podcasts just to get a feel of
• 16:28
  the things you talk about.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_00: And at the end of one of them, you were like,
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: When I ask people what I do for them, I think you got a little teary.
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  SPEAKER_00: You're like, they say I create a safe space.
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  SPEAKER_00: You're like me.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: I create a safe space.
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  SPEAKER_00: And you too.
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  You just create such a beautiful,
• 16:45
  beautiful space in that magic divorce clubhouse.
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  SPEAKER_00: I love the way you hold it and articulate it.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_00: It's a place people can come in and settle.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, of course, of course.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_01: Okay,
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_01: so shall we go into co-parenting,
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_01: feeling grounded and safe as we explore how we're gonna do this?
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_01: So to kind of give us an idea of the framework that you use,
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_01: what are like the main themes of understanding co-parenting?
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: So three things that are super important to think about,
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  SPEAKER_00: especially as we're navigating the beginning of co-parenting,
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_00: right?
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_00: There's so much that's led up to divorce, separating, divorcing.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_00: So in that beginning time, communication.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_00: So when you're co-parenting,
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_00: communication.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_00: And as we'll see,
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_00: as I start to talk,
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_00: my framework is less about the other person and more about us.
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  SPEAKER_00: So that's number one is communication.
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  SPEAKER_00: The second is boundaries.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm going to talk about that in a little bit of a different way.
• 18:09
  I think people,
• 18:12
  you can never hear it enough,
• 18:13
  but people are quite familiar.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_00: Like, yes, I should be boundaried.
• 18:17
  Um,
• 18:18
  yes,
• 18:18
  I should,
• 18:19
  you know,
• 18:19
  state,
• 18:20
  this is what I need,
• 18:21
  or this isn't acceptable.
• 18:22
  But again,
• 18:23
  I'd come at it maybe from just a little bit of a different
• 18:26
  lens.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: Like it's, it's, it's about us.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's not about like pushing that person away or saying like F off.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: It's about us.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: So I'll talk about boundaries.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_00: And then the third thing, it's so specific.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_00: I can make it into a bigger thing.
• 18:45
  But the third thing is what happens at the other,
• 18:48
  at the co-parent's house?
• 18:50
  So when you're divorced and now your kids are in somebody,
• 18:54
  your ex partner's house,
• 18:57
  right?
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: They're in a different house, different roles.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_00: What are we going to do there?
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_00: How are we going to stay regulated?
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_00: How are we going to stay, um,
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_00: joyful and happier, whatever it is you want, right?
• 19:10
  Like how do we stay in the wholeness of ourselves when that
• 19:15
  small act of our
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: children leaving the doors and walking into someone else's,
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_00: like it has a,
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_00: it has an opportunity to dysregulate a lot.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah,
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: We'll have a conversation about that.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: So those are the big three things.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: So communication,
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: boundaries,
• 19:31
  and then that specific piece about what happens when your kids
• 19:35
  leave your home and
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_00: they're with your ex-spouse for however long.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: So should we start with communication?