Latest / For Azeroth!: A World of Warcraft Podcast / #317 - For Azeroth!: “Primordial Sean"

Transcript

#317 - For Azeroth!: “Primordial Sean" · For Azeroth!: A World of Warcraft Podcast

0:00
Can I say really quickly, when you were saying all that about
0:03
like 10.1 being kind of meaningless, I was like, Sean,
0:07
what are you talking about? The second patch of of
0:11
Dragonflight. That's when we killed for Rock,
0:13
and that's when I realized that 10.1 was so meaningless to me
0:16
that I'd forgotten it existed to the burning region.
0:24
For Gilnaeus, but has not died. For the.
0:28
Lich. King for the.
0:31
Sindora for the Alliance for. The Horn for Azeroth.
0:40
Hello and welcome back to another episode of For Azeroth.
0:45
I am one of your hosts, the true villain Manny, AKA Just Manny
0:50
and and I am joined once again by the triumphant We're we're
0:53
ditching to other names that keep getting me in trouble.
0:56
We have, of course, with the gleeful laugh there.
1:01
Lex, Lex, how are you doing? And welcome to the undermine.
1:06
I am good. I have finally actually played
1:08
World of Warcraft before logging into my World of Warcraft
1:11
podcast. So congratulations me.
1:14
Which is very fun. My puppy is very unhappy.
1:17
She this is the worst thing that's ever happened to her.
1:19
So she is learning that sometimes mommy doesn't snuggle
1:22
with her literally all night long.
1:24
And I'm learning that sometimes my puppy's a little disappointed
1:26
and that's OK. But I, yeah, I'm, I'm bopping
1:30
right along back in the World of Warcraft, this.
1:33
Is a good growth opportunity for you.
1:34
I'm glad that the World of Warcraft is giving you better
1:37
balance in your life. Few people can say that with a
1:40
straight face. It's great for my my family
1:43
balance. And of course, the man who knows
1:47
all about balancing World of Warcraft.
1:49
Sean, how are you doing? Manny, hello.
1:52
I'm doing great. I don't know what all about
1:54
balancing World of Warcraft, but I'm do my best to stay balanced
1:58
in Warcraft. Yeah, new patch days are
2:02
exciting days. I often they are I feel this one
2:09
has has got a lot of warts on it and I guess we can go right into
2:14
it because yes, we are recording this on the goblin.
2:18
It's got a lot of warts on it. Is that a Is that a goblin joke?
2:20
Are do are goblins? Are you just, Are you mixing up
2:23
goblins and witches? No, I assumed goblins were quite
2:28
warty. They look bumpy to me.
2:30
This. Is why this is what I'm saying.
2:31
I think that you are just seeing green faces and you're like,
2:35
that's a witch. They therefore they have warts
2:37
because witches have warts. Goblins don't have warts.
2:41
Tracks. I so like, I believe that some
2:45
subsection of goblins have warts.
2:47
Are goblins all warty? I think it's really based on
2:51
like the fiction you're in world of workout.
2:53
I don't think that they they have like facial skin issues as
2:57
like part of their stuff. I don't know, it's like trolls
3:01
and they're like, yeah, and they're like big bumps on their
3:04
nose and stuff like it's, it's in some fiction.
3:07
I can see where you're getting it from.
3:09
I don't think it's necessarily World of Warcraft.
3:11
That's fair. Maybe this is other goblins?
3:13
Yeah, I'd like to paraphrase the movie Role Models.
3:16
If you green you a witch, for those of you who are familiar
3:22
with that movie, you will know which portion of the movie I am
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paraphrasing. John, again with those deep,
3:29
deep cuts role models. Is a great movie, If you haven't
3:32
seen it, definitely check it out.
3:35
I guess a lot of movies I I want to see, but no Role Models is
3:38
not going on that list right now.
3:42
So yeah, we are here Wednesday. It is the second day of
3:48
Undermine in NA and the first day of Undermine in EU.
3:53
Tomorrow, or by the time that anybody is listening to this,
3:57
there will it will be live in all regions.
4:01
And yeah, it's been a bit rough for this launch.
4:07
Now in the, in one of the Discords that I'm in, there was
4:14
literally a bet on like when servers would actually show up.
4:17
They were like, OK, we're going to have the servers come up 3:00
4:20
PM PST. And nobody believed that, which,
4:26
you know, is already a kind of an indictment against Blizzard
4:30
and them holding to their maintenance schedule.
4:33
But it did not only come up without extension, it actually
4:40
came up a little bit earlier. And so good on Blizzard.
4:45
They did discover, though, a fun hack, which is that if your
4:48
servers aren't ready to come up but you want to put them up
4:50
anyway, you can just say they're up and then half the people
4:53
can't log in. And, like, that's so cute.
4:55
Technically, they're up besties. I was among the people who
4:59
couldn't log in. Yeah.
5:02
Yeah, that that was that was part of the first issue that
5:07
people could not log in. It was not technically up for
5:12
everybody, but also it technically wasn't up for some
5:15
servers because there were particular servers that were
5:18
just down altogether and nobody could log into those servers.
5:24
Sorry to those people, but they did get those up within that
5:28
same evening. People who tried repeatedly
5:33
could get in. And once you were in, I wish I
5:37
could say that that was the end of it, but no, the problems
5:40
continued. There were connection issues
5:43
with people connecting and then disconnecting and having to
5:46
reconnect. And there was consistent lag for
5:50
many people. Now, I happened to be one of
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those guys who, I don't know, danced between the rain.
6:00
I did not have lag issues on day one.
6:04
I was really happy I went through with my Warlock and did
6:09
all of the campaign and we'll talk about my impressions of
6:15
that later. But they knew that these were
6:20
issues were going through and so they took the servers down in NA
6:24
again this morning for another hour to help address this issue.
6:29
Sean, how did it go after that? There's still some lag.
6:34
It's, I don't know if you remember back in Dragonflight
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when that launched and the soup event would start and then all
6:41
of your spam would lag for 15 minutes while soup happened.
6:44
Well, we have that happening again now, but it's around.
6:48
There's another event. Spreading the gloves?
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No, Spreading the package, shipping the package.
6:55
I can't remember what it's called.
6:57
There's a world event that happens at the 30 minute mark
6:59
every hour, and for 10 minutes you're going to have lag.
7:05
There's also OK I don't know if this is that I did something
7:09
weird somehow or if this is a universal issue.
7:13
I noticed that first of all I'm getting a weird number of like
7:15
conversations where I click on a quest giver and like nothing
7:18
happens and I have to run away so I can hear their exit line
7:21
and then go back. And I'm also noticing that my
7:24
mini map isn't tracking my main quest properly and sometimes my
7:28
full map isn't doing it. Like I'm not getting the little
7:30
arrow which isn't the end of the world.
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And long term gamers are going to be like oh you need the mini
7:36
map Can you not read your quest and have it tell you where the
7:39
quest is? But first, first of all, often
7:42
no. Like honestly they no longer
7:44
tell you where to go with the quest anymore half the time.
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And also, yeah, I'm a little baby.
7:50
I'm a little, I'm a little, you know, millennial Gen.
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Z cusp. And I like my quality of life.
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And I want I want a big golden arrow saying go that way if I
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hit track request and I would like it back, please.
8:02
Faz Dev. Well, I think that the quality
8:05
of life stuff that you're talking about was put in the
8:07
game for a reason. You're right that the that the
8:10
developers themselves now rely on it more than they used to, so
8:14
it's harder to find where to go without without it than it was
8:19
before they implemented that. I, I completely agree with you
8:23
on that and I was suffering a lot of the same things.
8:26
Quick little tip. If you are having that thing
8:29
where hey, you can't talk to somebody, talk, click and
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interact with another NPC and then click back on to them.
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And that's the same as if, if running away, if there's nobody
8:40
else you can actually have any kind of proper interaction with.
8:43
Yeah, you have to run away or you have to like reload.
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I've, I've done the reload because I just haven't wanted to
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run away. Or it's like maybe there's like
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a bunch of enemies around. I'm like, I don't want to fight
8:51
my way out and then fight my way back in.
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So that's been annoying. The quest tracking I have seen
8:57
as well and more after the reset than the before the reset.
9:04
The lag though, John, I have been experiencing that since the
9:11
reset and more consistently. Like I again, I was like dancing
9:17
between the raindrops before, before yesterday.
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So I didn't, I don't have the proper comparison, but yeah, I
9:24
was like checking my checking my, my lag and I'm like, no,
9:31
this is good on it's at the highest it was like 80 something
9:37
for like world and that's good. That's great for the lag.
9:43
And then when I took took a look at my frame rate, suddenly my
9:49
frame rate was garbage, like 24 seconds and stuff.
9:51
I'm like, why is this the issue? So I don't know like that that
9:57
was annoying. I I didn't experience like
10:01
jumped in it. So all I know is that lag is
10:05
abounding and undercity that here stealing my frames.
10:09
That's it. It's a real goblin problem.
10:11
We're on a pretty dead server. There's been like a little bit
10:14
of lag, nothing that has made it unplayable.
10:18
But I, I, I logged off last night about halfway through the
10:22
campaign just due to the like, I was feeling insanely overwhelmed
10:28
by just. There were so many things to do.
10:31
There were so many things popping up as I traveled around
10:34
the world. There's so much jammed in to
10:38
undermine itself. It's a gorgeous zone.
10:40
I love the detail. I love the goblin aesthetic, but
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it's just so much. It felt like I was in Vegas.
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There's just lights and flashing and things everywhere.
10:52
And I absolutely, I mean, I haven't used the drive system
10:56
outside of the tutorial because I do not enjoy that at all.
11:01
And yeah, so I logged off last night about halfway through the
11:04
campaign. I just got into the Kadrik
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Coast. That's when I logged off.
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So it's actually a little bit more than halfway through maybe
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and came back to it today started systematically go I I
11:15
completely pulled myself. I started last night in Hey,
11:18
let's immerse myself mode like I did at the start of War Within.
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I really wanted to get into the zone, get into the story, go
11:23
through everything. And that was I can't it's not.
11:28
I was unable to focus on the story because there's just so
11:32
much happening and I immediately shifted out of that into
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systematic open the box, close the box.
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Where do I go check it off to just to get the zone cleared out
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so that I can breathe in Undermine.
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I've completed the campaign, I've completed a lot of the side
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quests. I couldn't tell you a single
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thing that happens in any of them.
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But the the zone doesn't make me have a panic attack anymore when
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I'm walking around in it or riding my my slow ground
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mountain. It I I I do not like the drive
12:02
but. Yeah, I, I will say I just did
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like a, you know, an hour or so today.
12:08
I think the drive system was really fun.
12:10
In the tutorial I was having like I was like giggling and
12:12
kicking my feet and having a grand old time when I was
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zipping around and trying to go and doing a little thing.
12:17
The 2nd that I have to use it to do something important, I want
12:21
to throw it out the window. This is so annoying when I'm
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trying to go to a quest giver. I don't want to be driving in a
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car that like by definition on what like forces me to pass
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them. And then I like I just exit and
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walk half the time, which I either by the end of this patch,
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I am going to understand the drive system so well that it'll
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be great and I'll be zooming around.
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It'll be the time of my life or by the end of this patch, I will
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like have a permanent feud with whoever came up with the drive
12:51
system. It'll be one or the other.
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Because again, it's so like when when I'm just, when I'm just
12:55
using it to goof around. It's so cute.
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Like, it's so fun. And I love.
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Yeah, it's it's fun that I'm. I'm honking my horn.
13:01
If you saw me getting stuck between things and just honking
13:04
my horn out of rage, you know, it was fun.
13:06
That's silly. It's a silly little thing, but I
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don't want to have a silly little time when I'm trying to
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do my cross. So my tip to anybody like with
13:16
the drive system, it's fast. It is crazy like I could say
13:21
learn drift turning because that that'll help and it does.
13:25
But the atro pro tip, take your pedal off the gas.
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Like I when I'm driving around, I use the the mouse.
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I'm not really turning much with the keyboard and as I'm turning,
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I just I just take my take it off the gas and that slows me
13:46
down. I can make the corners and I'm
13:47
getting close to the thing and I take my pedal off the gas and
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being able to like dismount. It's hot keyed for me.
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So I'm just like, all right, I'm out of it.
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And I found that it's a lot easier when I'm going to
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particular things when I'm trying to like go all over the
14:01
place to be like, OK, let's see how fast I can go.
14:04
It's so crazy fast, but like it at that point it's fun.
14:06
I don't care. Like the frustration is
14:08
completely removed from it. So I would, I would just say
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left kick, right, left and right Click to go forward, take one
14:15
finger off to like be able to slow down and take that curve
14:19
without trying to like leave and learn how to drift.
14:21
It's it makes it a lot easier. Oh, and also no boost.
14:24
There's no point in the boost. That's fair.
14:27
That might be my problem is that I'm trying to use it the way
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that I think they want me to use it, which is to go really quick
14:31
and that's making it difficult to control and that's annoying
14:34
me. So maybe if I just didn't try to
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go really quick, it would be easier to control.
14:37
I will say I said that I might end this patch with a permanent
14:40
feud to whoever built the drive car.
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There is one exception to that and that is, and this might be
14:47
the same person, whoever put the horn in the car.
14:50
That's so fun. That's so cute.
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I have. I'm just driving a hawk in my
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That is the greatest thing that anyone's come up with.
14:56
I'm sure that anyone playing around me is so annoyed by me,
14:59
but I think it is adorable and it is making me so happy.
15:04
I want a week or that like every time I'm in that car, it's just
15:07
the theme song from Tokyo drift going that's all I want.
15:13
But yeah, the, the drive system is, is definitely a thing.
15:17
I 100% understand why Shawn's just like, Nope, no noble ground
15:21
mount because there was the first day I was playing.
15:24
I'm just like, I, I can't understand this, like I can't, I
15:27
cannot wrap my hand around this. And I was in, I was doing the
15:31
exact same thing, Shawn. I was like ground mount.
15:33
It was my second playthrough that I did today that I'm like,
15:35
OK, I'm going to figure this out and learn it.
15:38
And that's that's where I I found a little bit of success.
15:41
It's not the controls of the car.
15:42
The controls of the car are fine, it feels like.
15:44
I mean, I used to play a ton of Gran Turismo growing up and like
15:48
the car controls fine. It controls sort of like the if
15:51
you played Mass Effect one, there was a ground mount that
15:54
you would have when you go to the planets and it sort of was
15:56
like a bit all over the place. It controls like that.
15:59
The, the controls of the car are fine.
16:00
It's just super disorienting. I can't, I don't know where
16:02
anything is. I'm blasting by buildings.
16:05
I don't know where roads. I, I, I, I promise you, I unless
16:08
I'm forced to, I will never mount.
16:09
I will never use it again. I agree.
16:11
I'm not doing for the rest of this patch.
16:12
You are. You are not forced.
16:13
You're good. Yeah, so.
16:15
Well, we don't know. We'll see.
16:17
I, I, I will say I would, I don't actually remember whether
16:20
or not this is confirmed or just that everyone's been speculating
16:22
on it. Oh, I guess you guys would
16:24
actually know because you guys have done raid testing.
16:26
Is there a RAID? No there are no unless
16:29
Galliwicks requires it there. But they have done interviews
16:33
where they said no they don't. They don't plan to have it in
16:35
this raid like they did with dragon flying and.
16:39
We actually fully talked about this and I, I don't know where I
16:42
got in my head that they were doing it.
16:43
Never mind, never listen to me. I don't know anything.
16:45
Yeah, and if who loves drive? I don't want to, I don't want to
16:48
yuck some anybody's yummy fear out there.
16:50
And you're like, no, man, I love drive and this is great.
16:51
I'm zooming, I'm zipping, I'm bopping, I'm bamming.
16:54
Awesome. I'm really happy for you.
16:55
That's OK. I also don't drag and ride
16:57
anymore or dynamic flight, Zoomer flight.
16:59
I use boomer flight because that's my my preference.
17:01
So you want to play judge you. But if we're grouped together,
17:05
you're going to have to wait for me to get no shot.
17:11
I mean, people have to wait for me to to zone in, so I'm not
17:14
going to give anybody any Flack. I would say that outside of the
17:19
drive system, the thing that I'm really liking about this right
17:24
now is like basically what you're saying, Sean, that like
17:27
there's so much in not just in under in the Undercity or sorry,
17:33
in the Undermine, but like throughout the aisles, old
17:39
quests are suddenly relevant again to like alts.
17:42
I can like run and do the theater thing and my alt will
17:47
get like six 10619 gear and I'm like sweet deal.
17:52
I can go and spread the light in hollow fall and get the get good
17:56
goods out of that. Collecting wax is valuable.
18:00
Again, really enjoying enjoying that.
18:06
The biggest thing that I, I am worried about is longevity.
18:13
This is now like my second playthrough of like the intro
18:16
experience. The intro experience itself is
18:19
not the entirety of the campaign.
18:21
They've decided to split it up so that in the coming weeks
18:25
we'll get another chunk of it probably just beating towards
18:29
leading towards the right, being like, OK, now we're on your
18:32
front, front gate galley, galley Wicks.
18:35
And then likely just with what we had with the separate thread
18:42
that will go through the, the raid and then there'll be a
18:45
little bit afterwards. I do like that setup in a way.
18:53
I just, I kind of wish that the story continued.
18:57
Like I love the story moments. I love the questing.
19:01
I love all of the side quests and the the the bottom barrel
19:09
tenants and helping them and the like heist crew and all of these
19:14
great little side stories. I almost wish that these .5
19:17
patches just littered the whatever existing world with
19:22
just additional local stories because these local stories are
19:27
just killing it in in in my opinion.
19:31
I just I love doing them. Have you guys had a chance?
19:34
I know, Sean, you were kind of being overwhelmed, but you were
19:37
doing some of the local stories. Yeah, I did that Heist 1.
19:40
I don't. I think I saved a grandmother.
19:43
I did it, but I don't like like I said, there was just so much,
19:46
it was just sensory overload that I was unable to attempt to
19:51
enjoy this story like I did with The War Within.
19:53
And I like reverted back to Primordial Sean, where was
19:58
complete quest fill checkbox move the next quest.
20:02
So yeah, I did the the only one last night before I got into
20:05
Undermine. I did what is probably my
20:07
favorite quest chain ever in Warcraft, which was with the
20:10
Knights of the Brown Table. And I'm not going to say
20:14
anything about it because I don't think Lex has done it yet.
20:17
It's it's 10 out of 10. That's amazing.
20:20
And that was great because it's outside of Undermine.
20:22
So I wasn't yet like at that point I was still like really
20:25
excited. I was really digging the voice
20:27
acting. I was really digging where they
20:28
were going, how the goblins felt real.
20:29
I almost race changed to goblin because of the intro up to
20:34
undermine itself and then I got into undermine and I was like,
20:37
no, I'm good. Yeah.
20:41
And I want to be like super clear.
20:43
I think the theme is great. I think that the zone itself, if
20:46
you can just stop and look at it is amazing.
20:49
But having to function in it for me, I had a really I'm, I mean,
20:55
I'm, I'm not having a hard time now because I have cleared off
20:59
the world quests. I have cleared off the one time
21:01
do these things in this zone. It was just everywhere I went,
21:05
things were popping up, new, new phrases were happening, quests
21:08
were alerting and it was just like, oh man, this is and then
21:11
all of every building has neon glowing signs on it.
21:15
It was just a lot. So Primordial Sean saved me.
21:20
Sean is. It's not a big city.
21:22
City Goblin. No Lex.
21:26
So you said you had like just pretty much an hour to really
21:30
get through it despite the the lag that we've talked about.
21:33
Like what what, what were your priorities?
21:36
How did you tackle it? I'm just going straight through
21:39
the main quest and then I'll decide like whether I want to do
21:42
side quests and stuff, which has been working for me and it's
21:46
usually pretty much how I play. I did get the car because I need
21:48
to get the car and OK, this is this is such a small little
21:53
complaint, but it annoyed me a ton.
21:56
The fact that when we're going through the Meet the main quest,
22:00
they have a voice actor for every single character except
22:06
what? I know why.
22:08
I can tell you why. I know why the act the voice
22:11
actor who voiced Renzik, because they did have voice acting done
22:15
for him, is currently on strike with whatever union he's with
22:20
and protesting the use of AI. Not AI Blizzard, but just AI in
22:25
general. But because of that strike,
22:27
Blizzard had to keep his voice lines encrypted and they weren't
22:30
allowed to use him. And that's why you don't have
22:33
him. Nobody has him there.
22:34
So there are voice lines for him.
22:36
They are in the game. Hopefully once the strike is
22:39
resolved then we'll get them with a patch.
22:43
But. Then I take it all back.
22:45
That's sick as hell. Don't cross the picket line.
22:47
We kill. Sorry.
22:48
You can, man. You can take that out if we
22:49
don't want to. Have me say no.
22:50
No, it's picket line. Totally.
22:53
I yeah, I I'm glad that that is the reason behind it.
22:57
That is like the best reason for it.
23:00
And I want to point everybody back to when we were talking
23:04
about sorry 11 point O 7. And I was like, Rizik's not
23:11
voice. And this is most likely why.
23:13
And yeah, we we end up being proved right.
23:15
So hey, guys. Yeah, the host of FAZ.
23:18
We we do know what we're talking about and.
23:19
That's also also maybe this is like, I don't know if this is
23:22
probably in his contract, but I also appreciate that they didn't
23:25
just like find someone to fill in which has the name that I
23:29
won't say on air. But anyway, oh scab.
23:32
Is is scab what you're worried about?
23:33
No, no, we. We can.
23:35
OK good, good for Azeroth is firmly pro union.
23:48
Anyway, so yeah, I, I, OK, never mind.
23:52
I take it all back. If I hear his voice before the
23:55
strike is over, if that character is voiced, I'll throw
23:57
a a whole tantrum. This kills.
23:59
I'm there. I have.
24:00
I have no notes. I will say that the entire story
24:05
of Undermine really feels like a love letter to our good old
24:09
Bobby Kotek. Or where people who were trying
24:13
to organize, like so much of this is like, oh, they're
24:16
crushed underneath the the heel of the overlords and like,
24:20
you've got to come together and like it it.
24:24
I want to know when they were writing this script because it
24:28
feels very personal in some ways.
24:31
There's a lot of allegories for sure, especially when it's like
24:36
we got to inform people and the like.
24:38
Goblins are like, why are you trying to make me read and then
24:42
get anger on you and try to kill you for making them read?
24:47
I did hear an interview on Live Laugh Floor last week, this
24:52
week. I heard it this week.
24:53
It was probably last week's episode where they talked to two
24:57
of the devs and they made they brought reference to the fact
24:59
that a lot of things that are happening in Undermine feel very
25:05
coded to to real world events. And they asked if there was any
25:11
coincidence there, if it was, if it was just coincidence.
25:14
And the devs did say that the planning for Undermine and and a
25:17
lot of the story was written far enough back that it wouldn't
25:21
have been influenced by by certain real world events.
25:26
But. Yeah.
25:27
They take so long, we have plausible deniability.
25:29
I mean, real other answers. Yeah, Yeah, no.
25:33
You guys, it's not that it was about Bobby Kodak, it's just
25:36
that Bobby Kodak is such an obvious villain that when you
25:39
have a big evil boss villain, it's going to feel like Bobby
25:42
Kodak. Yeah.
25:44
Can can I just say the cinematics, the facial
25:48
animation? The.
25:49
Way that like Bobby, what's his actual name?
25:56
Galliwicks, right, the way that Galliwicks like just his stare
26:01
and his gold Fang that I don't think that I've ever seen him
26:04
with the gold Fang before and everything was just like, wow,
26:10
the cinematic team did so well to bring those goblins to life
26:14
to like actually make me like care.
26:18
The I'm really glad that the cinematic when you open up the
26:25
the client, then I got to see that without any spoilers and
26:29
just live it for the first time. I, I there's a question about
26:35
like, does it matter so much if you see it on YouTube or when
26:39
you open up the game? And I don't know.
26:47
So I'm going to, I think I can speak to that because when I
26:50
first went to open up because I was having connection issues, I
26:53
went to open it up and I saw the first like 3 seconds and then my
26:56
game disconnected. And then I tried to log back in
26:59
and it didn't show it because I was like, oh, you saw this?
27:01
That's sick. And the first thing I did is I
27:04
ran to YouTube to find it and it was, I mean, it's the same
27:08
cinematic on the same screen. So it shouldn't have been
27:10
different, but it, yeah, it's a lot more fun to see it, you
27:13
know, pop up naturally and the World of War and because then
27:16
you're like getting in and then you just like immediately start
27:17
playing the game and you're like, in this world.
27:20
I love it. This might sound crazy.
27:23
Seeing it in game feels like I'm seeing it from my character's
27:28
point of view. Seeing it on YouTube feels like
27:30
I'm watching it on YouTube. Yeah, you know what I mean?
27:33
And and I mean, obviously your character's not in that scene,
27:36
but it just feels to me like when it happens in the game, it
27:39
feels like, oh, this is happening two or four or around
27:43
my character. But watching it on YouTube, it's
27:45
like, oh, this happened somewhere.
27:49
And that's I mean, that's that. That's as crazy as as saying I
27:53
can't use the drive machine because under undermined is too
27:57
busy for me. Right.
27:58
So it's brains are weird, folks. Brains are weird.
28:04
I'll go with Lex and say that they both make sense.
28:06
I think that it is more con your latter statement of like, hey,
28:12
the cinematic feels more directed at me, more immersive
28:15
when it's in the game is definitely something more
28:18
common, at least something that I'm feeling like I can relate to
28:22
more. Because like before this I would
28:23
be like, yeah, I don't care. I'll see it on either one and
28:25
it'd be fine. Part of my job, if you can just
28:29
call this a job, is being informed so I could talk to our
28:32
audience. So like, I often will see it
28:34
outside of its intended context, but getting this with it in its
28:39
intended context with no real warning beforehand, Man, I
28:44
really liked it. I really liked it a lot.
28:48
I will also say in to the talking about undermine being a
28:53
little over stimulating, I think that undermine might have almost
28:56
a little bit of the same issue that the MA had wherein it knows
29:02
what it's trying to do and it's a little too good at it, right?
29:06
Like it's the same as like the ma was supposed to feel like
29:11
dark and gloomy and lonely and bad and nothing good has ever
29:14
happened here. And like they did such a good
29:17
job of that that people would go into the maw and be like, this
29:19
sucks. This feels dark and gloomy and
29:21
bad and like nothing goodwill ever happen here.
29:23
I think that undermine is supposed to be over stimulating.
29:27
Like the point is it's this big flashy city and everything's
29:29
going on and there's people and everything's kind of a mess.
29:31
But like it's going and going and going and going and going.
29:35
And I think they did that so successfully that I also kind of
29:38
know what you're saying where I just go and I'm like, Jesus,
29:40
mother of God. That's why I don't live in a
29:41
city. I would send it, yeah.
29:46
Exactly. They wanted to give me a panic
29:47
attack, right? Yeah.
29:50
Thanks, Fazdem. I appreciate the anxiety pills.
29:55
I, I will say that I felt it more on my second playthrough
30:00
when all the world press were coming up right when I was in
30:02
the middle of trying to do the main storyline.
30:07
And it's just like, OK, you know what?
30:09
And I ended up for my second playthrough, I ended up being
30:11
like, OK, you know what? I'm just not doing this in
30:13
order. I'm here.
30:14
There's five things here. This part of the town is getting
30:17
cleaned out. And I ended up just being like,
30:19
OK, I went to like the Kaja coast right when I got into
30:25
undermine because there was 2 like exclamation marks there.
30:27
I'm like, all right, friends, what do you need?
30:29
Don't worry, I'll go, I'll go over there.
30:30
And I went, went out there, beat some skulls and came back and
30:33
said, are we done great, moved on and then did the intro right.
30:38
So like, I get that like it does seem a bit, a bit much when
30:43
everything is going coming at you.
30:46
But I also felt that like I was a little bit inoculated because
30:50
I had been on the PTR. So I already knew some of this
30:53
stuff I'd already like gone through and read all this quest
30:57
tech. So when I was in like primordial
31:02
Sean mode, we're calling it, I wasn't missing as much because
31:06
like I had the memory of, oh, I've done this on PTR and it had
31:08
and this hasn't changed on PTR. So I got to like just race
31:13
through it. The other part that that I think
31:18
was really good in the undermine was that once I had been through
31:23
the through the story, the city just felt like, oh, there's so
31:30
much stuff for me to to do here, like hunting down rears and
31:35
creating the stuff for the drive system.
31:37
I've only made one of them. I've sold a bunch of parts on
31:40
the auction house. I guess my tip guys, don't make
31:44
it yourself like there is nothing that you need in this
31:50
week in general from the from the story is story quest.
31:56
In fact, I am unsure because like I'm going through with my
32:00
shaman right now, but I'm unsure that the recipe, the cooking
32:03
recipe is even unlocked in this first section, right?
32:08
So my suggestion for any everybody is focus on the stuff
32:13
that you need to to get ready for next week.
32:16
This stuff is lagging. It'll be a smooth experience
32:19
later, right? Take your take your time with
32:22
it. If you are going to be like gold
32:26
making or getting stuff together to be able to do your mythic bus
32:30
and stuff, buy that now. Don't wait till Tuesday.
32:32
Oh my goodness, it'll be so expensive on Tuesday and get
32:37
that stuff together. I really appreciate that we do
32:43
have this intro week where there isn't some sort of, I don't want
32:46
to call it a gotcha mechanic, but some sort of mandatory
32:51
progression system that they used to bring in and haven't
32:54
done since shadow lands that I was like, OK, I got to go in and
32:58
I've got to do do all this. It's it's a, it's the best part
33:05
of Wow's new take it or leave it sort of experience that they
33:11
that they're doing. And I'm really appreciative
33:13
about that. But like at the same time, I can
33:19
see how quickly Undermine is going to fall flat.
33:23
Like from from this. I was just looking at it and I'm
33:27
like, OK, once dungeons open up next week, once delves open up
33:32
next week, once the raid opens up next week, does all of this
33:37
mean it become worthless? And yeah, I'm sorry to say, it
33:43
really feels like some people might not even complete the
33:47
story and they might just be like, oh good, my Mythic Plus
33:49
has opened up and just go off and do that and never set foot
33:54
in the undermine. And I hate that for the
33:58
undermine and I kind of hate that for myself.
34:02
It's the tragedy of the World of Warcraft City.
34:05
I feel that way every time I'm in Silver Moon, and this is
34:07
going to be a hot take. I also feel that every time I'm
34:10
in Undercity where I feel like they're so, and I mean to some
34:14
degree all cities, but those. And to be fair, I did my
34:16
role-playing on Horde. So that's why the Horde cities
34:18
are the ones that I'm like, oh wait, there's actually a lot of
34:19
really pretty cool detail here. And we're all just kind of
34:22
running through it and not really paying attention or not
34:24
even going if we can avoid it. I think that World of Warcraft
34:28
has genuinely some of the coolest cities I've seen.
34:33
And I play Final Fantasy, so I know what a poorly designed city
34:36
looks like. I didn't say that stuff and all
34:38
anyway, so like I, I actually think that World of Warcraft
34:45
cities are really, really cool. And as somebody who has role
34:47
played walking through, like, like when you take the time to
34:53
really get into a city and spend, you know, hours walking
34:56
around trying to find the perfect little apartment to do
34:58
this one fancy role play and to claim it's your character's
35:01
house. And, and, you know, to like,
35:03
and, and you're seeing all the little details like, Oh, like,
35:04
and there's this like food thing laid out.
35:06
Oh my goodness. But like over here, there's this
35:08
painting and like, Oh, and if you put this together, it's so
35:10
cool. Like there's some really cool
35:12
stuff. And it's sad that we don't
35:14
really have reason to go there a lot.
35:17
Although the flip side of that is like, do I really I like,
35:19
it's not that I, I don't know what I would want them to do,
35:22
right? I don't want them to give me
35:23
quests that are like explore the city and I you know, also if
35:25
they call out all of the cute little once you call it, once
35:29
the the game calls out of detail, it's no longer an Easter
35:32
egg. It's just a thing you do in the
35:33
game, right. So it's not that I'm like, oh, I
35:35
want them to like have you go through the history of iron
35:39
forge and you have to go to all these different rooms.
35:41
They're like, Oh, and look, if you put together the fact that
35:44
this painting and that sort, it tells you this interesting fact.
35:48
I can't actually think of a room that does this, but like, that
35:51
wouldn't be as cool. But yeah, I, I, I agree, Manny.
35:54
I think that people are going to stop going here the same way
35:56
that every city people stop going to.
35:58
And it's going to be just a race to the, you know, the three
36:01
points that you need. And alas, life does not
36:07
experience. We do not experience joy and
36:09
beauty the way that we ought to in this world or role play.
36:13
Get into role play and you'll spend many hours in cities.
36:15
If you're role play, don't you worry, John.
36:21
Yeah, I was actually, but Lex just said made me really sad
36:26
because even the stuff that's not called up by the game that
36:29
is left in here is like Easter eggs and tips and secrets.
36:33
If you have handy notes installed, it's not a tip or a
36:36
secret. It's a check box on your map to
36:38
get off. So it tells you here's all of
36:42
the things to collect. Here's all of the notes to
36:44
collect, and you just go and do it.
36:46
There's no discovery anyway. I don't know anybody who doesn't
36:49
use handy notes, and maybe OK, you guys don't, but all right, I
36:55
don't. Know well, OK, but I guess I
36:57
have an an analogous program, so I'll like put my hand back down.
37:01
Yeah, if you're using like TomTom coordinates, whatever,
37:03
it's the same as using handy notes.
37:04
So that's but yeah, there's so there's no expression anymore.
37:08
And I'm, I mean, I'm one of those people that once Smithy
37:13
plus opens up and the raid opens up, unless it's a weekly quest
37:18
that I have to go here to get my spark for the week done.
37:22
I mean, I'll do my I'll do the daily.
37:25
I will do world quests until my Rep is maxed, but then I'll
37:29
never go back. Like I don't hang out in Dorn in
37:32
like the Isle of Dorn. Are there any deeps or Halo
37:35
fall? I don't I don't ever go to those
37:37
zone. I, I couldn't tell you the last
37:39
time I went to Halo Fall. I don't even go.
37:42
I just teleport to the other side of the dungeon and walk in.
37:45
I don't even fly to the dungeon. I do want to, I do want to put
37:50
in one thing, Yeah. I mean, like it's good to have
37:53
that convenience for sure. But I do want to say one thing
37:57
for anybody who has not done big Rep turn insurance or Rep turn
38:03
insurance at all, there's another reason to hold.
38:06
This is another tip we are right now recording at the end of
38:12
February at the first weekend of the of the new month, which will
38:18
be the second Dark Moon Fair is involved.
38:22
That will improve your Rep and therefore your renown.
38:25
Maybe you can go buy a contract if you are trying to push Rep
38:28
because you just want to push Rep and get it through.
38:30
You are in primordial Sean mode. Just hit those those systems min
38:33
Max right? Hold off turning any of those
38:37
in. Get your dark moon fair buff,
38:39
turn them all in. You can complete the you can
38:42
complete them like if you're doing the scrap pile and stuff,
38:44
you can complete them and then do your little run on the dark
38:48
moon fair merry go round. Turn all those in at high Rep
38:54
with whatever contracts you might have.
38:56
And that would be the best thing to do.
38:58
But yes, keep going going, John I.
39:02
Don't know what I was going to say but also the dungeon weekly
39:05
quest that you pick up in Tornago every week now has the
39:08
goblin Rep attached to it. So 5 CE Raiders jumped into a
39:15
heroic heroic carrot today and it took us.
39:20
It was less than 5 minutes to complete it.
39:25
I I ran in with a follower dungeon.
39:30
Oh yeah, follower dungeon works too.
39:31
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I guess we could have been normal.
39:35
I don't know why I queued a heroic, I thought.
39:41
When I did the, when I did the follower, I was like, oh.
39:44
Yeah, 5 minutes well spent. Oh yeah, I remember I was going
39:49
to say I, I'm OK with the overworld only having stuff for
39:53
me because I, I mean, ultimately I just want to play Dungeon Raid
39:56
Simulator. That's what's fun for me.
39:59
I've been playing a lot of Fellowship, the free beta this
40:02
week, which literally is a game that has no leveling.
40:05
No questing, no no overworld grind at all.
40:08
It is all dungeons. To put it in Wow terms.
40:11
You're in your Garrison where you do all of your equipment
40:18
equipping. Man, it's like your your.
40:20
Outside economy and all of your. That happens in your, in your
40:24
Garrison and then you hit Q and it drops you into a dungeon with
40:27
three other people. And it's, it's actually quite,
40:30
quite good. But I, that's how I like my
40:34
game. I mean I sit in the main city
40:36
and open up LFG and find my dungeon and go and teleport to
40:40
it. Not everything in this game is
40:42
for every person, right? I promise you there are people
40:45
who are going to spend hours and hours and hours in Undermine.
40:49
Again, they are the role players and they may very well never
40:53
step foot in a raid, and that's OK.
40:54
That's not content for them. I'm also by and large just
40:57
coming in for my heroics and my, you know, basic quest and my
41:00
delves and my rating. That's okay.
41:03
I think that it the the we talk, we I say this, we all say this
41:08
all the time, that not everything in this game is for
41:10
everyone. And the flip side of that is the
41:12
the Blizzard team has done an exceptional job of making it so
41:16
whatever you do within this game, you can find joy in,
41:22
right? So yeah, the city is not for us
41:24
because we are not the type of people who are going to go to
41:26
every single room and spend hours looking at all the
41:28
decorations and putting all the pieces together.
41:30
There are people who do that, and they're going to have a
41:32
great time. And the fact that the art team
41:34
hasn't decided to like, you know, cut back on the cities
41:37
because, like, who even goes to the cities once the, you know,
41:40
dungeons open? I think that's really beautiful.
41:42
And I think that that's a testament to how much they're
41:44
focused on making sure that every player will find their joy
41:48
in World of Warcraft. I said next.
41:51
I agree, but what I would want them to do is now that it is not
41:59
for everybody to double down in what what makes it good for that
42:05
niche. So if you are an RP player,
42:08
you're a solo player. I want the quests or the
42:12
storyline to like be something that you can immerse your
42:17
yourself in a little bit more. So that if they like what I was
42:22
saying at the early parted episode, I'd love in a .5 patch
42:27
if they add in an additional wave of local stories.
42:31
If they throw in a campaign, I would love that if they did that
42:36
for like the old world. So if we found like how things
42:43
are progressing with the severed thread now that the Queen's been
42:46
deposed, no value to me as somebody who runs through mythic
42:51
bus, no value to me as somebody who does raids.
42:54
But to like actually have like a cool story element to find out
42:58
like, oh, what did happen there? And I think that's something
43:02
that would be that would be really welcome for a lot of
43:09
players who just love the story of the World of Warcraft to see
43:13
it further develop other than the, oh, we're going back there
43:17
because of coincidence. And like, look at this person
43:19
who's shown up and like, and oh, better make sure that you've
43:25
spent your valor because we're just going to dump valor on you
43:27
for this or like whatever system.
43:29
So like, I think that the story should be a reward in and of
43:34
itself, should be a thing that you could seek out in and of
43:37
itself. And I think that since we're no
43:41
longer needing to like, systemize this so much for
43:46
whatever power system is in a patch, that the story can take
43:50
front and center more. I'd love to.
43:52
I'd love to see that. That's true.
43:54
I think that we don't to my and you guys can correct me if you
43:59
disagree, but by and large, I think if you're doing all of the
44:01
quests, you're not doing them for rewards, right, You're doing
44:04
them because you want to do all the quests.
44:06
So I think having that, I mean, I'm, I'm always more down for
44:10
developing the story more and getting more side characters and
44:13
and building the world. I think every time they do that,
44:15
they do a really good job of it. As a serviceable question, Joy,
44:19
I feel like they've done a really good job of doing exactly
44:22
what you're asking for. They have detached a lot of the
44:27
zone story away from the campaigns and put it into the
44:31
the local stories. They started doing that and more
44:33
within heavily. And I think that is the best of
44:37
both worlds because it it the campaign itself is short enough
44:40
that you know, it's, it's a requirement for everyone to do
44:42
the campaign. But people who don't enjoy
44:45
questing aren't stuck in these long slogs.
44:47
And I really feel like the local, I mean, the local stories
44:51
in worth and proper were amazing.
44:56
Obviously 1110.0 point no 11 point 0.5 didn't bring it in
44:59
because it was the anniversary patch, and .7 didn't bring any
45:03
in because it was the ketchup patch.
45:05
Ketchup mechanic patch. Feel like siren Isles.
45:08
I'm. A mustard.
45:08
For all yeah, well, the Siren Isles purpose, I don't think the
45:14
purpose of the siren Isles was like it was literally just
45:17
here's a patch for ketchup gear for characters that are coming
45:20
back or alts. That's that's its entire
45:23
purpose. I think a lot of people are
45:24
really upset and going into that patch and I feel like I, I feel
45:29
like a lot of people knew that or should have done that.
45:31
But I, I mean, there was especially a video that came
45:34
with this week that people were like really upset with the Siren
45:36
Isles for not being this giant lore dump.
45:39
And it was like, it's a .7 patch.
45:41
It's literally just a gear up patch.
45:43
You're lucky there's any questions at all.
45:45
No, that's not, that's not necessarily true because if you
45:47
look at .7 patches as they've been shown in Dragonflight,
45:51
they've typically been precursor stuff like this is where we're
45:54
going. And .7 patch this time did have
45:58
a bit of that where we had the introduction of rather
46:04
reintroduction of forensic the Shiv and and gas low going into
46:10
see what was going on at the point, which was like the
46:13
precursor. I think that that could be
46:16
expanded upon. And yes, the local stories are
46:21
good way of detaching them and I think that they've done they've
46:24
done a fairly decent job with that, But I think that they are
46:28
they still remain relatively isolated side quests where they
46:33
could be almost small mini campaigns on their own.
46:39
Like there's no reason to not have.
46:43
Originally he was trainee goldmine that now comes back in
46:50
in this patch and like, Oh my goodness, goldmine, I haven't
46:52
seen you since cataclysm, right, And he's now pre expert build
46:59
mine and oh, like stay while listen, how did you get into the
47:05
situation and stuff or like finding out his backers and
47:08
stuff. And like there's like so much
47:10
story that could go off on that on that little sideline.
47:13
But the truth of the matter is like my biggest worry about this
47:17
entire storyline is that it feels like a Side Story for the
47:24
sake of having a .1 patch. I am really worried and I don't
47:32
want to go fully into spoilers, but anybody who has gone through
47:34
through the storyline thus far, the where it begins and where it
47:41
will end are going to end up meaning so little that you could
47:47
have entirely skipped it in the story.
47:50
Yeah, I haven't finished the story, but I will say so far, I
47:53
mean, unless there's a twist coming that I'm not expecting,
47:57
there's oh, Dolly Wicks is evil and he's the evil people are
48:03
doing the evil thing. Like I I, I haven't felt like
48:08
nothing. Nothing is is earth shattering.
48:10
Yet nothing pushes you to care. Like if it was like, you know
48:14
what? I don't like gobbins and I'm
48:15
going to leave them to to their desires.
48:19
It would be like AI guess like whatever Zalitaf is doing.
48:24
And again, I don't want to give sports storyteller spoilers, but
48:28
like you're being pulled in to deal with Zalitaf.
48:32
I don't want it to end in that. It doesn't.
48:37
Like this is the Indiana Jones problem where Indiana Jones is
48:41
the main character, but if he had shown up or didn't show up,
48:45
it would have ended the exact same way.
48:47
And I'm really worried that this storyline is going to be that
48:50
where it's like, listen, if the heroes hadn't shown up at all,
48:53
it would have gone the exact same way.
48:55
Except like this bit character that we weren't really concerned
49:00
about before all of this got to do some bad things so.
49:04
I think the the the grand scheme of the war within, I think it's
49:08
going to do exactly what you are worried it's going to do because
49:11
Zara like caverns did the same thing the end of a 10 point O
49:16
whereas I get freed the other primals we go to Zara like
49:21
cavern nothing happens. 10.2 for rock is attacking major so we
49:27
fight a primal like that's 111010.1 didn't have to exist at
49:31
all for rocks in there. He's breathing fire in the
49:33
caves. Nothing happens.
49:35
We accomplished nothing by going back to North Arian's lair other
49:37
than unlocking evokers augmentation evokers so that
49:41
patch could do. You could pull that patch out
49:43
entirely. Doesn't affect the story of
49:46
dragon fight at all. This is going to be the same way
49:48
in the grand scheme of the war within.
49:49
This patch is going to have no effect on the on the South story
49:52
because it's going to be it's going to be exactly like you
49:56
said, whether or not we were there.
49:57
This didn't happen. That's not why we're here in
49:59
Undermine. And I don't think that's the
50:00
purpose of this patch. The purpose of this patch is to
50:03
give flesh flesh out and give freedom to the goblins to not
50:07
make them one-dimensional characters.
50:08
We're not here in Undermine because of the Xalatath tie in.
50:13
And I actually think the Xalatath tie in should be a
50:17
lighter touch. It should be like, hey, do this
50:20
thing for me, OK, do this thing great, I'm leaving.
50:22
And then the focus should be us helping the goblins get out from
50:26
underneath Galliwick's, helping the people here and undermine
50:28
itself. We're not here because of the
50:31
Dark Soul and because of the World Soul Saga and because of
50:34
Zalatan with IN. We're in Undermine because of
50:37
Galliwick's and the oppression that his corporate society is
50:41
putting on goblins and all of the goblins that he just
50:45
arbitrarily fires for no reason with no actual proper analysis.
50:50
That's why we're in Undermine. That's the impact that we're
50:53
going to have in this story. I think Undermine's going to
50:55
have a bigger impact than than Avarice had.
50:58
But because it's we're here giving agency and helping the
51:04
goblins and seeing that they're not just, you know, Laffy, Laffy
51:09
exploding, you know, one-dimensional characters.
51:12
Can I say really quickly, when you were saying all that about
51:15
like 10.1 being kind of meaningless, I was like, Sean,
51:19
what are you talking about? The second patch of of
51:23
Dragonflight, that's when we killed for Rock, and that's when
51:26
I realized that 10.1 was so meaningless to me that I'd
51:28
forgotten it existed. No.
51:31
No, that's that's when for rock went from red to red and purple.
51:35
I. Mean, I think that's fair.
51:38
And I mean, I, I, I, I do, I am excited about the goblin story.
51:42
I am sorry. This is, has probably been
51:44
explained in the game and I'm somehow just forgetting it.
51:48
So I know that the wall was blown down.
51:51
Sorry, I don't mind. I don't spoil that.
51:52
But I mean, it's the first thing that happens.
51:54
Whatever I want, spoil it. So are we assuming that the
51:58
goblins knew about the everything going on that we've
52:03
just been a part of, or is it just that that like very thin
52:05
line they have not yet crossed? And so was it.
52:10
Did they tell us about that? Yeah, they found the goblins.
52:14
I mean, it's the Siren Isles. When we bring them up to speed,
52:16
we tell the goblins what's going on.
52:21
But how do they not know about each other if they're that
52:23
close? Oh sorry, who the goblins and
52:25
who? Sorry, the.
52:26
Goblins and the the the like everyone, the all the Cobols and
52:30
the. Yeah, well, they just hadn't dug
52:33
that far. They hadn't dug in that
52:34
direction, I guess for under mine.
52:36
Fair enough. It's a matter of the cartels and
52:39
like how freely they're sharing information between themselves.
52:44
Like you've got Gaslo and his group and they're doing stuff,
52:48
but Gaslo hasn't been back to the under mine in forever.
52:51
So he's very much in the dark what's going on there.
52:54
And information from his cartel isn't really freely given to the
53:00
other, other cartels. Then with Gaslo taking, taking
53:05
his action in there, you have the butting of the head, but on
53:08
the other end, you've got Galliwicks and his his
53:12
connection. And OK, like Zalitaf has come
53:16
come to him. And so he's working
53:18
independently and like how much he knows about what's been going
53:22
on, who knows? But also he's like, he is
53:27
unlikely to share that freely with the people below him
53:30
because he's just looking for compliance and for them to do
53:32
what, what they're told. So they don't need to know.
53:35
It's not need to know information.
53:36
So it depends which goblin you're asking how much they
53:39
actually do know right, But I'm I I do say whether you have to
53:45
or not, whether you are diving in the mythic plus or not do
53:49
finish the campaign having done it on the PTR.
53:55
It is it like continues along the the path that it it has been
54:00
going is very obvious even halfway through this portion of
54:05
the campaign where everything is going.
54:08
And, you know, maybe we need that right now.
54:12
Yeah, finish it, because there's a item at the end that gives you
54:15
a craft to the upgrade. That's why you should finish it.
54:20
There you go, There you go. But with that said, I hope that
54:25
all of you guys are having fun in the Undermine.
54:27
We will be back next week because there is a ton of things
54:31
that will be opening up. We'll be talking about Mythic
54:34
plus. We'll be talking about the raid
54:36
itself. We'll be talking about the new
54:38
Delve system. But until then, may all your
54:41
hits be good.