Latest / Aired Out / Vermonters speak out on the struggle with affordability and housing

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Vermonters speak out on the struggle with affordability and housing · Aired Out

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: You know, on the fly here and I haven't even
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: posted it up and I will, but I want to.
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: I just I'm just curious, do you believe that in
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: five years from now? And I'm just pulling five years
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: out of the rear, but I think it's a that's
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: a good that's a good point to to go ahead to.
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: Five years from now, we'll Vermont be struggling with affordability
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: in housing. What's say you about that? I wonder I
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: really do whether or not. I'm not trying to be
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: all you know, Debbie Downer, because there's plenty of those,
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: but I'm just saying, from a realistic, objective standpoint, where
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: do you fall with this? What is your opinion? Have
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: you ever wondered? Have you ever said to yourself? I
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: really believe that if Vermont stays on its current course,
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: it's current track of chipping away in Vermont, like every state,
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: we have a ton of issues. But I really believe
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: that if we stay on course right now, that in
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: a year or two we will have a real grasp
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: on affordability and housing. Listen, it's important for all of
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: us to have hope, right But do you actually think
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: or believe that what's being done right now in our legislature,
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: in our legislature and on a municipal level, our cities,
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: our towns, what we're doing in the backyard, that we
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: will have a really good grasp of these issues in
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: a couple of years. Or do you say to yourself,
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: if we keep if we keep going around and around
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: and around in circles like like some of you feel
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: that the state of from mind is that five years
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: from now we're going to be no different than where
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: we are today. We're still going to be struggling with
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: affordability in housing. I'll post it up as the FBQ today,
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: but I really, I really want to hear what you
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: have to say, and of course encourage you to be
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: up with what's being said and what's being done, and
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: what's being written up under the Golden Dome and the
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: efforts that your communities are making to tackle these issues.
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: I mean, I got I got some some comments here, yep, nope, yep, nope.
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: One one that says, yes, we will still be struggling
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: if something isn't done about what's making it unaffordable, then yes. Uh,
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: let's see any other comments that I'm getting here this morning. Uh,
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: they're going to cover the same old bullshit that they
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: bring up but never address. It's not just local government,
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: it's federal as well, so no money is being spent
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: in the wrong places. So yes, there will still be
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: issues in five years. What I would like to listen
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: at one o'clock today, and if I can't for whatever reason,
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: I will be going back and listening to it tonight.
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: Will G and I discuss this on Thursday, you bet
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: your ass, and I'm sure this will carry into Friday
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: mornings discussion with Rex. By the way, before I forget here,
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: Anthony and Brandy from the Vermont Coyotes are going to
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: be coming in here to reveal some really exciting news
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: about the Coyotes. They're going to be talking about what's
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: happening over at Windsor High School with that huge tournament
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: that's coming up real soon, and some really other exciting
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: things on the horizon. And I so much look forward
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: to to having both Brandy and Anthony from the VT
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: Coyotes in here tomorrow. It is going to be fantastic
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: Formont News. Some other headlines here that I'm following. Man
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: found dead in his parked car yesterday afternoon around four
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: o'clock is when the phone call came into the State
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: Police in Mendon, right along Route four by a hiking trailhead.
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: I'm assuming that that would be the long trail that
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: little parking lot up there at the top. Sixty year
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: old guy. I wish we knew more about this story.
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: Please say nothing suspicious and no cause for public concern.
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: And that's all we really know. We don't We don't
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: know how this sixty seven year old guy died in
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: his car? Was he homeless? Was he sleeping in it?
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: Did he have a heart attack? Did he overdose? I
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: would love to I'd love to hear more about this. Really,
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: what too bad? That stuff like this? You know, we
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: wake up and we hear we hear news like this.
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: Hopefully we'll find out more, well, learn more new toy
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: you with us?
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: Hey, I'm with you, man, You see my comment there
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: I did?
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: Would you would you mind h reading that? Would you
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: mind sharing that? Or would you like me too?
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Man, yeah, I'll do it.
• 8:16
  Speaker 3: Please, I'm with you.
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: Can you hear me that?
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: I can hear you perfectly. Yeah, I got you, love,
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: I'm clear, Okay.
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: Should I listen to you or the or the uh?
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: You should probably listen to You should probably listen to me,
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: and and kill your phone.
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: Okay, okay, I'll kill the phones.
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because you're going to get a wicked delay there.
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: But I just saw your comment and it's it. Basically,
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: it says this is a supply and demand problem. As
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: long as we allow out of stators to buy second
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: holmes here without a two hundred to three transfer tax,
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: they're going to continue you to buy every house that
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: hits the market in Vermont. The money these people have
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: and are willing to spend will always trump anything a
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: Vermont or can pay. We in Vermont have an invasion
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: of immigrants no different than that of what the US
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: has at the southern border. It's just that our invaders
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: who are taking all of our houses are wealthy white folks. Wow,
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: connect with me on the on the phone, buddy, Uh,
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: just just on your phone, So kill the uh kill
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: the Facebook feed? Is that really how you.
• 9:47
  Speaker 4: Feel about people agreeing with them on the Okay?
• 9:55
  Speaker 3: Yeah, m kill the.
• 9:59
  Speaker 4: All right?
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: Can you hear me?
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I can hear you. That's how you feel?
• 10:05
  Speaker 4: Yeah, dude, I mean I think that's that's a pretty
• 10:07
  Speaker 4: clear economic fact. I mean, you know what what happened
• 10:11
  Speaker 4: here is that remember pre COVID, all the houses were
• 10:16
  Speaker 4: you know, a reasonable price, and people in Vermont could
• 10:19
  Speaker 4: buy a house and live here and they could afford
• 10:21
  Speaker 4: to do it. And and then as soon as COVID hit,
• 10:26
  Speaker 4: all the people, you know, we live within an easy
• 10:30
  Speaker 4: day's drive two, three, four or five hours of several
• 10:34
  Speaker 4: major metropolitan areas. We got Boston, New York, even Montreal,
• 10:38
  Speaker 4: even though there's a US border between the two, you know,
• 10:42
  Speaker 4: is it's easy to get to Vermont from there, and
• 10:45
  Speaker 4: the word has gotten out that Vermont is a beautiful
• 10:49
  Speaker 4: place to live.
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: And it's cheap.
• 10:51
  Speaker 4: And when they started doing all the telework during the pandemic,
• 10:55
  Speaker 4: that made it not only beautiful and cheap, but easy
• 10:59
  Speaker 4: for them to live here and still still retain their
• 11:02
  Speaker 4: job out of state. So there's some of that going on.
• 11:06
  Speaker 4: There's some retirement that's going on where people are retiring
• 11:09
  Speaker 4: and buying houses here. There's a lot of it that's
• 11:12
  Speaker 4: just second homes. That's that's you know, people who live
• 11:16
  Speaker 4: in New York, Boston, Jersey, Connecticut, d C. And they're
• 11:21
  Speaker 4: just buying houses here because to them, half a million
• 11:25
  Speaker 4: bucks is nothing. It's nothing, and you know, so they'll
• 11:30
  Speaker 4: lay down half a million bucks for this little place
• 11:32
  Speaker 4: in Vermont, or even a million dollars in Vermont, and
• 11:36
  Speaker 4: they'll buy themselves whatever they want, and they'll outbid any
• 11:40
  Speaker 4: vermont who comes along on a house that used to
• 11:43
  Speaker 4: be selling for two hundred thousand dollars, now it's selling
• 11:47
  Speaker 4: for five because the flat Lander, all it takes is one.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: All it takes is.
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  Speaker 4: One willing to drop five hundred on that house that
• 11:55
  Speaker 4: used to be two, and the Vermonter is out of luck.
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: And that I think is the problem.
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: I I understand the point that you're making. I heard
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: you say cheap twice. I've never heard Vermont referred to
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: as cheap. And I know all things are relative here.
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: You know that.
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  Speaker 4: I'm saying that because when you're a multimillionaire and you
• 12:22
  Speaker 4: make you know, half a million dollars a year or whatever,
• 12:25
  Speaker 4: and you live in Connecticut, to them, a half a
• 12:29
  Speaker 4: million dollar house in Vermont is cheap. It's all a
• 12:33
  Speaker 4: matter of perspective. And that's that's the problem we're dealing
• 12:37
  Speaker 4: with here.
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: If you had a chance to sit and have a
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: beer with with Phil is it is this something that
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: you would would say to him today.
• 12:52
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, and I'm sure Phil knows that though, you know,
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: I mean this is I'm sure he does. You know,
• 13:01
  Speaker 4: the problem is that we also have this issue where
• 13:04
  Speaker 4: we need some at least especially younger working people, you know,
• 13:10
  Speaker 4: people who are of the working age between you know,
• 13:12
  Speaker 4: say twenty and sixty, to move.
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  Speaker 2: To Vermont.
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  Speaker 4: Because someone's got to generate taxes and someone's got to
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  Speaker 4: actually get into the the workforces that will help take
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  Speaker 4: care of, actually do the work of taking care of
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  Speaker 4: the older Vermonters, which we have an abundance of. I mean,
• 13:36
  Speaker 4: we have an amazingly high number of older Vermonters, partly
• 13:40
  Speaker 4: because Vermont has aged Vermonters themselves. People who actually grew
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  Speaker 4: up in Vermont have aged and a lot of them
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  Speaker 4: have left Vermont when they became old enough twenty years old,
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: they moved out of Vermont. Vermont had a brain drain
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  Speaker 4: for a long time, and you know where they move
• 13:59
  Speaker 4: out of Vermont for other opportunities. And then the ones
• 14:03
  Speaker 4: that are left have aged up and they're hitting retirement
• 14:06
  Speaker 4: age and they need to be cared for. I mean,
• 14:07
  Speaker 4: we have such a nursing shortage because like my god,
• 14:10
  Speaker 4: there's like there's people that are.
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: Growing in the nursing homes. You know how it is.
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: I know how it is. We've all been through this
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: with our families and the nursing homes.
• 14:17
  Speaker 4: They can't find staff, you know, because they need young
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: people to come in work and do that work.
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: And at the same time, those people, they are young people,
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: they want to.
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  Speaker 4: Have homes, they want to buy homes, they want to
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  Speaker 4: have families, and they can't afford to do it. They
• 14:34
  Speaker 4: can't afford to live in Vermont.
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: That's a huge problem.
• 14:38
  Speaker 4: But also we have people who are from out of
• 14:40
  Speaker 4: state who are buying their way into Vermont.
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  Speaker 2: They don't care that we have a housing shortage.
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: They don't care that there are Vermonters who are who
• 14:48
  Speaker 4: are becoming adults and cannot afford to live here and
• 14:51
  Speaker 4: cannot afford to even buy a home if they are
• 14:55
  Speaker 4: already starting a family here.
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: They're just going to come in here and be like, well,
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: that's that's not my problem.
• 15:01
  Speaker 4: I'm just going to write a check and buy that
• 15:04
  Speaker 4: house for half a million that used to sell for
• 15:05
  Speaker 4: two hundred thousand.
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: Reversing the tide against in aging demographic is one of
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: the things that our governors is going to be talking
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: about at one o'clock this afternoon. WDEV will carry the
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: feed at one pm. Will you be listening, watching, paying attention?
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: You bet your ass, I will, sir.
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: Meanwhile, wondering if you have any comments on this, and
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: we have a bunch of comments that are coming in
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: this morning. Nothing to do with out of staters. That
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: has to do with supply and demand and how many
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: houses are on the market. That's one of the comments
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: that's just come in.
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: And that is a problem that you know, we do have.
• 15:52
  Speaker 4: You know, we would have a supply and demand problem anyway,
• 15:55
  Speaker 4: but the number of out of stators who have moved
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: here in the last four years since the start of
• 16:02
  Speaker 4: the pandemic is extremely high. And that's that's causing a
• 16:08
  Speaker 4: huge problem. I mean that that's when things went nuts
• 16:12
  Speaker 4: economically in this state.
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: Man.
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: We're getting a lot of comments if Vermonors want to
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: keep ver honors in Vermont, then we need to focus
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: selling our properties to locals.
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and then I agree.
• 16:30
  Speaker 4: However, if I were selling a house and there's a
• 16:33
  Speaker 4: vermonterter offering me two hundred thousand and some other, some
• 16:37
  Speaker 4: other guy from outside the state is like, well, you know,
• 16:40
  Speaker 4: I can afford whatever this guy wants, and he'll just
• 16:44
  Speaker 4: he's gonna keep bidding up and bidding up and bidding
• 16:46
  Speaker 4: up until he gets it.
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: That is what's happening.
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: This morning. I see in the in the news that
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: the Burlington School District is proposing a four percent decrease
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: in property taxes for its next budget.
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: That's good to hear, Yeah, after they raised it how much?
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah? Right, But you know, the strength of the state's
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: education fund is apparently quite good. I don't know, buddy,
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: this is some murky shit here. There's no question about it.
• 17:32
  Speaker 4: They've got a lot of money in the in the
• 17:34
  Speaker 4: education fund. They have taxed the heck out of us.
• 17:36
  Speaker 4: But the problem is this is an inefficient state to
• 17:41
  Speaker 4: run an education funding system in because there's so many kids.
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: That are going to really small.
• 17:50
  Speaker 4: Schools we've got, we're running all kinds of schools out
• 17:53
  Speaker 4: in the sticks that are there. The cost for pupil
• 17:58
  Speaker 4: is astronomical. And heard of that is that the you know,
• 18:01
  Speaker 4: the progressive wing has has kept on adding adding services
• 18:06
  Speaker 4: to schools that are now considered education expenses that were
• 18:11
  Speaker 4: not before.
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: And you know, some of that is, you know, all
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: the all.
• 18:16
  Speaker 4: The mental health counseling that they hired for schools during
• 18:21
  Speaker 4: the pandemic.
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: The federal money for that went away two years ago.
• 18:26
  Speaker 4: And for month Vermonth's legislature, which was controlled at the time.
• 18:30
  Speaker 4: It was before this last election, so it was controlled
• 18:33
  Speaker 4: with a supermajority having the control, the supermajority of Progressive
• 18:39
  Speaker 4: Democrats having control over that. They wanted to keep all
• 18:42
  Speaker 4: that in keep all those positions in place and all
• 18:47
  Speaker 4: the costs associated with them. It's not just the salaries
• 18:49
  Speaker 4: but the healthcare for all of these people, and and
• 18:54
  Speaker 4: they didn't want to let that go. And the when
• 18:56
  Speaker 4: the federal money went away, so they kept it. And
• 18:59
  Speaker 4: now you know, a still paying for that and that's
• 19:01
  Speaker 4: all lumped into.
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: The education funding budget. And you know, my.
• 19:05
  Speaker 4: Taxes went up, Your taxes went up. Everybody's taxes keep
• 19:08
  Speaker 4: going up. I mean, it's insane not live here and
• 19:10
  Speaker 4: not be part of our economy. So if that house
• 19:14
  Speaker 4: is if they're gonna pay five hundred thousand dollars for
• 19:16
  Speaker 4: that house, make it a million five and the extra
• 19:19
  Speaker 4: million dollars in tax, that million dollars in tax goes
• 19:25
  Speaker 4: to the state of Vermont to be to be given
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: directly as grants to young Vermont Vermontors who grew.
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: Up here and need to buy a house. But I'm
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: telling you that we.
• 19:37
  Speaker 4: Need to do something about this problem because economically we
• 19:41
  Speaker 4: are in a position, you know, where we're located on
• 19:45
  Speaker 4: the map, that we've got a massive economic problem with
• 19:49
  Speaker 4: all of these people from out of state that have
• 19:51
  Speaker 4: massive amounts of money buying up every house we've got.
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: There's there's plenty that will agree and plenty that will
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: disagree with what you're saying.
• 20:03
  Speaker 4: But I'm sure, I'm sure, and you know, I'm not
• 20:07
  Speaker 4: saying that my opinion is correct.
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: It's not thoroughly researched. I'm not a politician. It's not
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: my job to do this full time.
• 20:18
  Speaker 4: But but it's a start, and it's it's one perspective,
• 20:22
  Speaker 4: and I respect other people's opinions and other people's perspectives,
• 20:26
  Speaker 4: and they may have very good points.
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: If we can get everybody.
• 20:29
  Speaker 4: On the phone here on the you know, on the air,
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: would be that would be great. But you know, I
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: think that we all need to respect each other's opinions
• 20:38
  Speaker 4: because everybody has something to contribute to this conversation, you know.
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: But we're gonna have to get to so we're gonna
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: have to come up with some solutions. And you know, currently, uh,
• 20:49
  Speaker 4: it hasn't happened yet. Thank god, We've got a more
• 20:52
  Speaker 4: functional government government now that the uh, the supermajority is
• 20:57
  Speaker 4: gone and you know, the government actually has a veto
• 21:01
  Speaker 4: power again, and you know, things are a little more
• 21:05
  Speaker 4: balanced than they were. I mean, the you know, the
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: the Progressives still have a majority, but they don't have
• 21:12
  Speaker 4: a supermajority, so you know, at least things are getting
• 21:15
  Speaker 4: back to a more reasonable situation.
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: I'm going to jump on another call here, buddy. I
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: appreciate you so much. What do you say? What do
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: you say about all of this?
• 21:26
  Speaker 5: So I'm a builder and I disagree with this whole
• 21:29
  Speaker 5: thing about like this is other people's problems and out
• 21:33
  Speaker 5: of state people that it is causing the building prices
• 21:36
  Speaker 5: because it's not. I literally just got done a twenty
• 21:39
  Speaker 5: eight hundred square foot house for myself to turnaround and sell.
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: It cost me.
• 21:43
  Speaker 5: Fifty thousand dollars for the piece of land because it
• 21:46
  Speaker 5: was developed piece of land which was a half an acre,
• 21:49
  Speaker 5: had power, water, it had power right there, sewer right there,
• 21:53
  Speaker 5: no water. We bought the point one one acre next
• 21:58
  Speaker 5: to it, that was another seventeen thousand. So there's sixty
• 22:01
  Speaker 5: seven thousand dollars before I even start my infrastructure. I
• 22:05
  Speaker 5: spent another three hundred and thirty thousand dollars on materials
• 22:10
  Speaker 5: and labor to build it. Tell me again, how I'm
• 22:14
  Speaker 5: supposed to build a twenty eight hundred square foot house
• 22:16
  Speaker 5: for two hundred thousand dollars.
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: Let's be real.
• 22:20
  Speaker 5: Those days are gone. Those days are long gone. And
• 22:23
  Speaker 5: it has nothing to do It has to do with
• 22:24
  Speaker 5: supply and demand if there is If there's no houses
• 22:28
  Speaker 5: on the market, and one house comes on the market
• 22:30
  Speaker 5: and there's thirty people looking to buy, what happens.
• 22:34
  Speaker 3: Am I wrong in that thinking?
• 22:35
  Speaker 5: Or are we going to just start to keep blaming
• 22:39
  Speaker 5: non realistic I mean, I understand the whole compounding of things.
• 22:44
  Speaker 5: There's several things. We're getting overtaxed, we're fucking overregulated, there's
• 22:48
  Speaker 5: so many things causing that. But it's not the building prices.
• 22:53
  Speaker 5: It's an unrealistic expectation to think that those building prices
• 22:59
  Speaker 5: are going to somehow miraculously come down as lumber prices
• 23:03
  Speaker 5: are skyrocketing through the roof. I used to be able
• 23:06
  Speaker 5: to build, and I could hire guys twenty five dollars
• 23:09
  Speaker 5: an hour was top pay. Twenty five dollars an hour.
• 23:12
  Speaker 5: Won't even get a laborer on your jaw on your crew.
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: Now, we were talking yesterday about Paul and I were
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: talking about some of these proposed tariffs and what's going
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: to happen with Canada, And little did I know Canada
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: that the lumber that's that's coming out of Canada, it's
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: that's a that's a huge mark.
• 23:36
  Speaker 5: Do you think what do you think is going to
• 23:38
  Speaker 5: happen to roofing prices in Vermont next year? What do
• 23:42
  Speaker 5: you think is going to happen to building prices in Florida?
• 23:46
  Speaker 3: Do we know? So the old saying goes back to
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: be careful what you wish for.
• 23:51
  Speaker 5: We are all looking for that sledgehammer solution, and we
• 23:55
  Speaker 5: want to burn the system down and start over and hopefully,
• 23:59
  Speaker 5: but what we don't But what a lot of people
• 24:01
  Speaker 5: don't get is when you burn that system down, it
• 24:03
  Speaker 5: takes forever to rebuild it. So who's gonna get the
• 24:07
  Speaker 5: benefits of burning that system down? I'm not, you're not,
• 24:10
  Speaker 5: My kids aren't. It's going to take decades to rebuild
• 24:13
  Speaker 5: the system so our great grandkids might be able to benefit.
• 24:17
  Speaker 5: But don't we live in a time now where it's
• 24:20
  Speaker 5: about me.
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: That's it.
• 24:22
  Speaker 5: We don't care about our neighbors anymore. We only care
• 24:25
  Speaker 5: about what affects me in the immediate moment.
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: Comment here from Glenn Brummert saying, yeah, Rex, but who
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: the hell has that kind of money?
• 24:35
  Speaker 3: Banks?
• 24:35
  Speaker 5: Banks are the only ones with that kind of money,
• 24:38
  Speaker 5: and they loan it out to people every single day
• 24:41
  Speaker 5: with a credit score.
• 24:43
  Speaker 3: That's what nobody's buying. These houses pashed.
• 24:46
  Speaker 5: Once in a great, great while, you'll have a lucky
• 24:48
  Speaker 5: you'll get you'll.
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: Have a lucky sale. I'm not saying that doesn't happen.
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: You'll have a lucky sale of cash.
• 24:53
  Speaker 5: But the majority is there are mortgages, and if people
• 24:56
  Speaker 5: can't afford these mortgages, then we'll have the same crash
• 24:58
  Speaker 5: that we have in the nineties, and I'll go back
• 25:00
  Speaker 5: up and buy all those buildings up again that they
• 25:02
  Speaker 5: couldn't afford. That's it's not a housing bubble like that.
• 25:06
  Speaker 5: We're not loaning money out to people who can't afford it.
• 25:09
  Speaker 5: That's not what we're doing. The house that the first
• 25:11
  Speaker 5: housing crack because I was involved in that. I was
• 25:14
  Speaker 5: building during that time when Clinton with the housing crash.
• 25:16
  Speaker 5: I had a friend of mine I was investing, I
• 25:18
  Speaker 5: was buying buildings. He said, sell it. We're about to
• 25:21
  Speaker 5: have a bubble, and I did. I sold a bunch
• 25:23
  Speaker 5: of shit. I wish I hadn't, but I did. And
• 25:27
  Speaker 5: everything crashed because they were doing There was the subtrime market.
• 25:30
  Speaker 5: People were getting loans that should not have been getting loans.
• 25:33
  Speaker 5: That was back when you could sign a piece of
• 25:34
  Speaker 5: paper saying hey, I make ten million dollars a month.
• 25:37
  Speaker 5: They're like, cool, as long as you claim you do,
• 25:39
  Speaker 5: we'll sell you a house, whether you can afford.
• 25:40
  Speaker 3: It or not.
• 25:41
  Speaker 5: That's not what happened. That's not what's happening right now.
• 25:43
  Speaker 5: That's not what's causing our housing spike. Our housing spike
• 25:47
  Speaker 5: right now is supply and demand, and we cannot build
• 25:50
  Speaker 5: ourselves out of it here in Vermont.
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: Are you? Are you concerned about what's going to happen
• 25:57
  Speaker 1: with lumber coming out of Canada.
• 26:00
  Speaker 5: I'm concerned with everything, But the problem is is in
• 26:04
  Speaker 5: my business. Am I Okay? So here, I am bitching
• 26:07
  Speaker 5: about this, but I'm gonna make way more money. You
• 26:10
  Speaker 5: think next summer, when there's no Mexicans here to do roofing,
• 26:14
  Speaker 5: who's doing it? Because we've all got away from roofing
• 26:17
  Speaker 5: because we can't compete with those prices.
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: We just don't.
• 26:20
  Speaker 5: We're I'm not making my guys kill themselves for nothing.
• 26:23
  Speaker 5: I also have to go buy safety and all sorts
• 26:26
  Speaker 5: of stuff like that, So I don't care. So my business,
• 26:30
  Speaker 5: my business is probably gonna boom. It doesn't matter what
• 26:32
  Speaker 5: the lumber prices are when your roof is leaking on
• 26:34
  Speaker 5: your head, doesn't Old Eddy Barslow used to tell me,
• 26:37
  Speaker 5: he goes, you want a good gauge of how the
• 26:39
  Speaker 5: economy is doing, he goes. When the economy is doing good,
• 26:42
  Speaker 5: people are putting siding, kitchens, and bathrooms on their house.
• 26:45
  Speaker 5: When the economy is bad, they're only buying roofs. I
• 26:48
  Speaker 5: sell both, so I'm never I have a trade. I
• 26:53
  Speaker 5: self protected myself by learning a trade. That's what I
• 26:56
  Speaker 5: did for my own personal life. But there's a lot
• 27:00
  Speaker 5: of people out there going to be hurting, and it's
• 27:03
  Speaker 5: going to be the consumer.
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: In the news this morning, and you were you were you?
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: You just mentioned immigrants. Uh, the Vermont Construction Company, the
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: Vermont Construction Company is partnering up with a Minneapolis based
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: nonprofit to monitor and enforce labor and housing rights for
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: workers and subcontractors of the company the order they.
• 27:33
  Speaker 5: Just get busted for having a whole bunch of illegal
• 27:36
  Speaker 5: immigrants in connexes.
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: Yes, living in storage containers.
• 27:41
  Speaker 5: Storage container, that's right, But now they're going to advocate
• 27:44
  Speaker 5: to me on how to fucking treat people.
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: The organization is called the Building Dignity and Respect Standards Council,
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: and it is going to partner with Vermont's Vermont's Milk
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: with Dignity Standards Council, which monitors workers' rights in the
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: Vermont dairy industry here in Vermont. The preliminary agreement would
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: have the nonprofit oversee the company's job sites and worker
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: housing to ensure basic standards for treatment of workers being met.
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: The agreement is the first of its kind here in
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: Vermont's construction and building in building industry. According to Migrant Justice,
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: which is an organization here in Vermont, which says that
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: Vermont relies on immigrant workers and.
• 28:45
  Speaker 3: It's a huge part of our economy.
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and accountability within the labor contracting chain.
• 28:53
  Speaker 5: You'll see Vermont farms getting shut down because they can't.
• 28:56
  Speaker 5: I mean, you got your Vermont farms, your apple pickers,
• 28:58
  Speaker 5: and now you're roofers the same in Florida.
• 29:01
  Speaker 3: You think our economy is based on anywhere, wait until
• 29:04
  Speaker 3: it is Florida.
• 29:05
  Speaker 5: You notice where they're picking and choosing the cities to
• 29:08
  Speaker 5: go hunt immigrants in Florida. You notice the Red States
• 29:13
  Speaker 5: they stay away from. They're in Miami, but they're not
• 29:16
  Speaker 5: in Tampa. They're not up around all the building areas
• 29:20
  Speaker 5: around Orlando, Tampa and all them places they're specifically pointing out.
• 29:24
  Speaker 5: They're specifically making it hard for the Blue States. It's
• 29:28
  Speaker 5: the we're on the revenge tour. We're getting to see
• 29:31
  Speaker 5: it live firsthand, the thing that we weren't gonna be
• 29:34
  Speaker 5: have to worry about. But this is a revenge tour,
• 29:36
  Speaker 5: So suck it up, buttershop. This is where we're at
• 29:39
  Speaker 5: at this point. It's once again, the mindset, the culture
• 29:43
  Speaker 5: that we've turned into is me. Everything is about me,
• 29:48
  Speaker 5: me only, not my neighbor, not anyone else. Nobody cares
• 29:52
  Speaker 5: about what's happening to somebody else. If you did, I
• 29:55
  Speaker 5: would encourage you to go down there and with the
• 29:57
  Speaker 5: federal troops and walk into the school and help them
• 30:01
  Speaker 5: tear them kids out of there and see the human
• 30:04
  Speaker 5: side of this ship, see the families that have been
• 30:07
  Speaker 5: here for thirty fucking years, and then they rip their
• 30:10
  Speaker 5: dads out and go, nah, we can't. We don't care
• 30:12
  Speaker 5: that you were a productive part of this. We're just
• 30:14
  Speaker 5: we're taking you whatever.
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: Man.
• 30:17
  Speaker 5: I I didn't vote for that, and I don't care
• 30:19
  Speaker 5: what that's. We needed an immigration reform.
• 30:23
  Speaker 3: We needed that. And if that's the extreme the people
• 30:25
  Speaker 3: were gonna you'll see that. We'll see, we'll, we'll we'll,
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: We're gonna get exactly what we wish for.
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: Do you think Facebook questions the day, do you think
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: that five years from now that Vermont is is still
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: going to be struggling with affordability in housing?
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: Absolutely not.
• 30:42
  Speaker 5: In five years from now, you'll be lucky to see
• 30:44
  Speaker 5: America as a whole anymore.
• 30:46
  Speaker 3: You will see.
• 30:47
  Speaker 5: I think you're going to see America get broken up
• 30:49
  Speaker 5: like Russia was. And that's exactly what putin lawns. Ever
• 30:52
  Speaker 5: since we did it to him during the Cold War.
• 30:54
  Speaker 5: Why do you think he's involved in every one of
• 30:56
  Speaker 5: our elections? And shit, he would love to see us
• 31:00
  Speaker 5: and start a civil war, just like we did to
• 31:02
  Speaker 5: him in Russia. That's been Russian's plant, that's been Putin's
• 31:05
  Speaker 5: plan forever. But now all of a sudden, he's our buddy.
• 31:08
  Speaker 5: Come on, get the fuck out of here.
• 31:10
  Speaker 3: I don't believe.
• 31:11
  Speaker 5: I don't believe we can project five years from now.
• 31:15
  Speaker 5: We're we're in such a tinderbox.
• 31:18
  Speaker 3: I don't believe that. I barely believe we can fucking
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: plan for next year.
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that that was kind of reflective of my thought
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: this morning driving in And you know.
• 31:33
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and me and Big Ed Collins have these deep
• 31:36
  Speaker 5: philosophical conversations at five point thirty and six o'clock every
• 31:42
  Speaker 5: single morning.
• 31:45
  Speaker 3: You know what I mean.
• 31:45
  Speaker 5: I still have friends. I have a lot of friends
• 31:47
  Speaker 5: like this. This whole election thing fucked up a lot
• 31:50
  Speaker 5: of people in their heads. And I have a lot
• 31:52
  Speaker 5: of friends like just oh my, I can't be friends
• 31:55
  Speaker 5: with you if you vote for them whatever. And I mean,
• 31:59
  Speaker 5: I feel pretty strong only about all of this stuff,
• 32:01
  Speaker 5: but my friends and my family mean more to me
• 32:04
  Speaker 5: than any fucking politician.
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, express your opinion, no matter what it is.
• 32:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, that's what we need.
• 32:13
  Speaker 5: We need platforms where anybody can speak to mind anybody.
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: We should be able.
• 32:17
  Speaker 5: To speak our mind and get our our our stuff
• 32:21
  Speaker 5: out there. If you and and and we should have
• 32:23
  Speaker 5: healthy debates. Like the person you just had on there,
• 32:28
  Speaker 5: he he spouted off some statistics. So I looked up
• 32:31
  Speaker 5: the statistics and I was like, I don't agree with them.
• 32:34
  Speaker 5: See we cannot agree. And we can have healthy debates,
• 32:37
  Speaker 5: and we can. We can debate facts, we can debate statistics.
• 32:41
  Speaker 5: We can debate all of that stuff and get it
• 32:44
  Speaker 5: out there. And we don't have to be dicks to
• 32:46
  Speaker 5: each other. We can just we can do it.
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: You can.
• 32:48
  Speaker 5: But the problem is is people get angry. They get
• 32:51
  Speaker 5: so emotionally attached to the situation that it turns into
• 32:57
  Speaker 5: a personal and then blah blah be of shit. And
• 33:01
  Speaker 5: it's it's hard for people. That's why we leave it
• 33:04
  Speaker 5: to the politicians to debate. Yeah, even myself, Man, I
• 33:08
  Speaker 5: get fucking way out of hand. I get worked up
• 33:11
  Speaker 5: over this ship myself.
• 33:13
  Speaker 3: Ask anybody that follows me on Facebook.
• 33:16
  Speaker 5: And it's not I'm not angry. I'm just very passionate.
• 33:19
  Speaker 5: It's it's hard for me, just like anybody else. Like
• 33:22
  Speaker 5: I see things and I'm like, how do you not
• 33:24
  Speaker 5: fucking see that.
• 33:26
  Speaker 3: But then again there's people look at me and they're like,
• 33:28
  Speaker 3: how the fuck do you not see this? So it
• 33:30
  Speaker 3: works both ways. You know, I'll for it.
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: What what local uh? What local radio station? What local
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: podcast is is diving deep on stuff like this and
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: and having a conversation about this locally in our community.
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: There's not there's not, dude, nobody.
• 33:54
  Speaker 5: The only thing that they do each podcast, they have
• 33:57
  Speaker 5: their own agenda. That's what they have. They have They
• 34:00
  Speaker 5: want you to agree with their side, and that's it.
• 34:04
  Speaker 5: And Jade, I honestly say, like, you don't you want
• 34:07
  Speaker 5: to listen to both sides of this?
• 34:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 34:10
  Speaker 5: I mean obviously you have me on there, so and
• 34:12
  Speaker 5: I don't always and I don't agree with you, So
• 34:15
  Speaker 5: I go against a lot of shit that you say.
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, the the purpose I think of this
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: podcast more than anything, is to connect with people, no
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: matter where they stand or how they feel, and to
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: give them a voice in not just in our community,
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: but in our state and even beyond. To share why
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: not to share perspective about a bad thing?
• 34:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well, how is that a negative? How is that
• 34:45
  Speaker 3: a bad thing?
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: I don't know, Like Joe says, it's the only way
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: we we learn and grow. I mean, uh, you know,
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: I right, listen, I I.
• 34:59
  Speaker 5: If we're not having these hard conversations, somebody needs to
• 35:02
  Speaker 5: be having these hard conversations.
• 35:05
  Speaker 3: Our politicians aren't. Nobody's sitting down across.
• 35:08
  Speaker 5: The aisle and saying, hey, let's let's talk this out.
• 35:12
  Speaker 5: And I think if we started doing this, yeah, a
• 35:15
  Speaker 5: lot of people will find we're not really that far apart.
• 35:18
  Speaker 5: Politicians would make you think that on one issue, like
• 35:23
  Speaker 5: a politician will convince you that we are so far
• 35:26
  Speaker 5: apart it's not even funny, and that we can't negotiate
• 35:28
  Speaker 5: with them because they're just crazy.
• 35:30
  Speaker 3: And extreme on both sides.
• 35:32
  Speaker 5: Yeah, when in fact, if you sat down, like I
• 35:34
  Speaker 5: can sit down with my neighbor. My neighbor is Eddie Blow.
• 35:38
  Speaker 5: Eddie Blow is super extreme. I feel as a he
• 35:42
  Speaker 5: is a conservative. He is very vocal about it. But
• 35:46
  Speaker 5: the reality is me and Eddie Blow we get along fine.
• 35:50
  Speaker 5: I can sit down with Eddie and we can agree
• 35:52
  Speaker 5: on ninety eight percent of things. There's a small things
• 35:57
  Speaker 5: that I would do different, but a lot of things
• 35:59
  Speaker 5: we fucking agree on. In most Americans, I feel, are
• 36:02
  Speaker 5: the same way. It's hard to get past the hyper
• 36:05
  Speaker 5: bowl and the partisanship.
• 36:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, rooting for your.
• 36:09
  Speaker 5: Team, man, that's the problem. We have teams. What if
• 36:13
  Speaker 5: we didn't have teams? What if we just had representatives
• 36:17
  Speaker 5: that had to stand on their own voting record and
• 36:21
  Speaker 5: no longer stood on their party's voting record.
• 36:25
  Speaker 3: What Why would that be a bad thing?
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, yeah, now I no longer.
• 36:30
  Speaker 5: You don't have a you don't have a Democrat, you
• 36:31
  Speaker 5: don't have an independent, you don't have anything.
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: You just have a representative.
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I got I got crickets from Michael Potros.
• 36:40
  Speaker 5: Oh.
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: That's too bad, man, it is too bad. I'm still
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: waiting for a comment from him. He has an open invite,
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: as does anyone else, to come on the air and
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: voice their opinion about you know.
• 36:58
  Speaker 3: You know who I ended up, you know who I
• 37:00
  Speaker 3: sun out. You know I talked to Jay Smith. He's
• 37:04
  Speaker 3: another one we like.
• 37:06
  Speaker 5: If you saw our Facebook going back and forth, you
• 37:09
  Speaker 5: would think that we are on total opposite, opposite spectrums.
• 37:15
  Speaker 5: But when we actually start get digging into the root
• 37:18
  Speaker 5: of it, we are not.
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: We're not not even close.
• 37:22
  Speaker 5: Like most of the things we could agree on, we
• 37:25
  Speaker 5: could find because me and him and if, like I said,
• 37:28
  Speaker 5: people standing on the outside would think that we are
• 37:30
  Speaker 5: both extremes from the different side. But me and him
• 37:34
  Speaker 5: could sit down, we could come up with bipart like
• 37:37
  Speaker 5: we've already talked, and we've talked about shit like this,
• 37:40
  Speaker 5: Like yeah, I could agree with that fucking ray. You could.
• 37:44
  Speaker 5: That's all it takes is starting a conversation and having,
• 37:48
  Speaker 5: you know, have those hard conversations.
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: Even when we vehemently disagree with each other.
• 37:56
  Speaker 5: Yeah, but that's the thing. I don't believe we do.
• 37:58
  Speaker 5: I don't think we veet me.
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: I think I'm saying.
• 38:03
  Speaker 5: Right yes, out on the open, and you know, out
• 38:06
  Speaker 5: in whatever, there's this this huge disagreement or whatever. But
• 38:09
  Speaker 5: when you sit down and you start talking, you're like, okay,
• 38:12
  Speaker 5: wait a minute, I do agree. I think that we
• 38:15
  Speaker 5: should have immigration reform. I think that we should.
• 38:18
  Speaker 3: Have this and and and so there we are.
• 38:21
  Speaker 5: There's that that common I may not agree with how
• 38:26
  Speaker 5: it's happening, how fast is happening, in the consequences of
• 38:29
  Speaker 5: that that come with that, But I could sit down
• 38:32
  Speaker 5: with somebody on the right and come and come up
• 38:34
  Speaker 5: with a plan that both of us could agree on.
• 38:37
  Speaker 3: And you know what, I mean, there's never.
• 38:40
  Speaker 5: But I guess that's because we're Americans and our politicians
• 38:45
  Speaker 5: are someone else. I don't know who they are that
• 38:47
  Speaker 5: they don't they're so out of touch from us, they
• 38:50
  Speaker 5: don't I can I don't don't understand how they can
• 38:54
  Speaker 5: represent us because they they don't represent us.
• 38:58
  Speaker 3: How can they ignowl?
• 39:00
  Speaker 5: How can they address our struggles when they've never had
• 39:07
  Speaker 5: that struggle themselves?
• 39:08
  Speaker 3: Right, that's so I find that's hard for me. You know,
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: I don't know.
• 39:14
  Speaker 5: But the reason I called is because I I just
• 39:18
  Speaker 5: got done building that house, and I know what it
• 39:21
  Speaker 5: costs to build it out of pocket.
• 39:25
  Speaker 3: So could we have cut corner? Yeah?
• 39:27
  Speaker 5: I could have seen I should could have saved Nichols
• 39:29
  Speaker 5: and dimes here and there a little bit. But I'm
• 39:31
  Speaker 5: still not building a twenty eight hundred square foot house
• 39:34
  Speaker 5: for two hundred thousand dollars.
• 39:35
  Speaker 3: And that's a three bedroom, twenty eight hundred square foot house.
• 39:37
  Speaker 3: It's nothing. It's not enormous, it's not, but it's a
• 39:41
  Speaker 3: fly and demand.
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: I appreciate you calling me this morning, Wrecks Friday.
• 39:47
  Speaker 3: It's been expecting to get on air man. I was
• 39:49
  Speaker 3: calling up to.
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: Give you ship listen.
• 39:51
  Speaker 3: I didn't have time to be online. I got shit
• 39:53
  Speaker 3: I gotta.
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: Do, man, all right, get back to it. I'll see
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: you Friday, everybody.
• 39:57
  Speaker 5: I'll call you when you're not online, all right, throwing
• 40:00
  Speaker 5: me out there and putting me on the spot like that.
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: Friday morning, you'll be with me, of course I will.
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: All right. What we we've we've got it all set up,
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: ready to go. Have a great day, buddy, all right, man,
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: you pick