Latest / The Inspired Stories Podcast / Solving the Childcare Crisis: Donna Sneeringer's Strategic Vision | Childcare Series

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Solving the Childcare Crisis: Donna Sneeringer's Strategic Vision | Childcare Series · The Inspired Stories Podcast

0:04
Welcome to another edition of Inspired Stories where leaders
0:07
share their experiences so we can learn from their successes,
0:10
how they've overcome adversity, and explore current challenges
0:13
they're facing. Welcome to another edition of
0:18
the Inspired Stories podcast where leaders share their
0:20
experiences so we can learn from their successes and be inspired
0:24
by how they've overcome adversity.
0:26
My name is Anthony Codispodi and today's guest is Donna
0:29
Snaringer, Vice President and Chief Strategy Officer of
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Childcare Resource Center, a community based nonprofit
0:36
organization that provides an array of services largely
0:39
focused on helping families raise their young kids to get
0:42
them off to a good start in life.
0:45
They work to provide childcare support, connect families with
0:47
childcare options including both private care as well as Head
0:50
Start. They coordinate payments for
0:53
care and offer additional support such as home visiting,
0:56
mental health consultation, and more.
0:59
Their organization also overseas government relations and
1:03
research efforts to drive public policies and funding related to
1:07
childcare. They currently serve about
1:09
50,000 kids through their subsidized childcare voucher
1:13
program. Donna brings a wide array of
1:16
experiences to the job, including government affairs,
1:18
public relations, public policy, nonprofit management, early care
1:23
and education, and child advocacy.
1:26
Now before we get into all that good stuff, today's episode is
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1:56
Now back to our guest today, the Vice President and Chief
2:00
Strategy Officer of Childcare Resource Center, Donna
2:03
Snaringer. Thanks for making your time to
2:05
Share your story today. Thanks so much for having me, I
2:08
really look forward to the conversation.
2:10
All right, so tell me about the path that LED you to your
2:14
current role at CCRC. Well, careers are a journey, as
2:20
as you know, and I started off with a degree in child
2:25
development from Cal State Northridge as a young person and
2:31
realized pretty quickly that I wanted to work on behalf of kids
2:35
but not directly with kids and fell into a job at the Child
2:41
Care Resource Center when it was a very small nonprofit.
2:45
In the earlier part of my career, I spent many years
2:49
working there in a lot of different capacities, doing
2:52
program work, helping families find childcare, working with
2:55
childcare providers to improve their business, and eventually
3:00
took a different position with another agency in Northern
3:03
California. Spent about 10 years there and
3:06
started to get more and more involved in public policy.
3:10
Went back to school, got a graduate degree in public
3:14
administration and political management from USC and really
3:20
made that transition to leaning into how do we make better
3:24
systems and how do we really craft access to supports and
3:29
programs for families and what they need today.
3:33
And so have been working in that ever since.
3:36
Have been with CCRC again for about 11 years and really enjoy
3:43
the work I do. Every year is different and it
3:47
really does give me an opportunity to take my
3:50
collective knowledge from all the years of working in this
3:53
industry and try to make things better.
3:57
Try to look at things more holistically and try to work
4:02
with decision makers and program administrators to to innovate
4:07
and create the best services that we can.
4:11
So what's the size difference between when you were first with
4:14
the organization and where it is now?
4:17
So when I worked for CCRC at the beginning of my career, I was
4:21
their 28th employee and we now have about 1300.
4:27
Wow, it's a pretty big size difference.
4:30
It's a pretty significant size, size difference and there were
4:33
some major policy shifts at the national level and in the in
4:39
California over the past couple of decades that really gave that
4:45
opportunity for growth. But also it came from really
4:49
expanding our view of the work that we do.
4:52
So instead of just relying on the core services, we started
4:57
with really branching out and adding in head start, adding in
5:02
a lot of other supportive service contracts so that we
5:05
could really be holistic in our approach.
5:08
And it really allows us to provide the the greatest
5:13
opportunity to the kids and families that we work with.
5:16
What were some of the national policy changes that took place
5:19
which sort of opened up some of these opportunities for
5:22
expansion? So in the early 1990's, the
5:26
country passed the first Child Care and Development Block Grant
5:30
legislation, which is funding to help families pay for child
5:34
care. And it is a program that still
5:38
is in existence. It has grown over the years,
5:42
slowly, not as quickly as it probably needs to.
5:47
So that was the first real major investment that was made at the
5:51
federal level. And then welfare reform made
5:54
some major changes also in the later part of the 1990s where
5:59
there was an acknowledgement that you couldn't really ask
6:03
parents to go back to work if they didn't have care for their
6:06
kids. So you had a big shift with
6:09
that. And then more recently, really
6:12
since the pandemic, there has been both a national and state
6:17
understanding of the critical importance that child care plays
6:22
in making sure our, our economy runs.
6:26
You know, it was maybe 2 weeks into the pandemic in 2020 when
6:32
Governor Newsom at the time declared child care to be an
6:35
essential service because if nurses, doctors, first
6:39
responders, people that worked in food service logistics, if
6:43
they couldn't get to work because they had nowhere for
6:45
their children to go, everything would stop.
6:49
And so we were pulled into that essential service band at that
6:54
point. And I think it really was an eye
6:57
opening experience for for many folks who hadn't really paid
7:01
attention to the critical role that childcare played in
7:06
people's ability to get to work, that that really did change
7:11
things pretty significantly for us.
7:14
It wasn't like COVID was the first time that child care was
7:19
important. It was just the first time that
7:21
maybe a bigger spotlight got shown on it.
7:24
So people who don't have kids of that age are like, oh, yeah, I
7:29
guess that makes sense. You know there won't be a doctor
7:32
to see me or a nurse to help me out if somebody isn't there to
7:36
watch their kids. Absolutely.
7:38
And it's often been a hidden conversation.
7:42
It's a conversation that parents, often moms to be
7:48
honest, try to deal with quietly behind the scenes and have
7:52
historically there's a lot of familial support that happens
7:57
where you have family relative caregivers, but there also is
8:00
the formal child care system where you have child care
8:02
centers, licensed family child care homes and folks who provide
8:07
this service as a business. So I think that we've sort of
8:14
just let it be a hidden issue, something that I think from time
8:19
to time it bubbles up for employers that it's a issue for
8:22
their employees. But when it really came down to
8:26
they can't come to work that that was really an eye opening
8:31
moment. And I think, you know,
8:33
particularly for folks in the healthcare space, but if you
8:36
think about those of us who were lucky enough to shelter in the
8:40
in place at home, we relied on Amazon, we relied on, you know,
8:45
Grub, Grubhub and food delivery. And we still had to.
8:49
There were core functions that still had to keep going, and the
8:53
people that worked in those places needed that support.
8:57
And of course, that remains true even today.
9:00
There's, there's still workers across, you know, all kinds of
9:04
different parts of the economic spectrum that still need that
9:08
kind of help. And for some families, you know,
9:11
at one of the end of the economic spectrum, they can
9:15
afford to pay for the care folks maybe in the middle can afford
9:19
part of it. Some folks can't afford.
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So tell tell me how you can kind of step in and help people you
9:27
know, at all different stages. So I think it's it's important
9:31
to note that child care as an industry is a textbook example
9:38
of a failed economic market. Interesting, because the
9:42
economics of child care don't pencil out.
9:45
The cost of providing the service is more than the
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families mostly can afford to pay.
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And almost every dollar you pay for childcare goes into paying
9:57
the workers who care for the children, but their wages are
10:01
very, very low. And so one of the ways you
10:05
overcome a broken economic market is through public
10:08
investment. And so that is really what we
10:12
have seen begin to happen with the changes that have happened
10:17
over the past few decades where you had an influx of funding
10:20
from the child care and development block grant from the
10:23
welfare to work changes that happened in the 90s and, and
10:27
with a lot of money during the pandemic for pandemic relief,
10:32
child care was front and center and many of those conversations
10:36
to try to fill that gap so that people could have the care that
10:41
they needed. So the programs that we run are
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two types. One, where we enroll families
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based on their income and we assist in paying for their care.
10:55
It's limited. There aren't enough.
10:57
Dollars. Sorry, Donna, just to clarify,
10:58
are you enrolling them in one of your centers or?
11:01
No. So we're enrolling them in a
11:04
financial assistance program where they can pick care, they
11:08
can pick a child care center, a family child care provider, a
11:10
family Fender neighbor, and then we make arrangements to pay for
11:14
the service up to a ceiling that is set by the government.
11:20
Then we also run direct care programs like Head Start or
11:25
state preschool where we actually run the child care
11:27
facility and we enroll the families in those programs and
11:30
serve them directly there. So we we do both, both types of
11:35
support, but it is something that is in demand.
11:40
We just had a pretty major expansion of our funding in
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California. One of our major programs for
11:47
working families had significant investments made in it Quad.
11:53
Governor Newsom made a commitment and he has thus far
11:56
quadrupled the size of the program.
12:00
And we are now again fully enrolled and have 30,000 kids on
12:05
a waiting list. So the need for this service so
12:10
far outstrips the the available benefits that there is a
12:15
constant pressure to to try to make sure that we can serve as
12:21
many families as possible. And thus the the advocacy and
12:24
education that's needed to make sure that people are aware of
12:28
this, this gap. Is all the funding come from
12:32
different levels of government? Yes, primarily the funding comes
12:36
from government. As I mentioned, a lot of it
12:39
originates at the federal level. The State of California is
12:43
pretty generous in their contributions.
12:45
We do have some local government engagement.
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I think you'll see in the news periodically that there are
12:51
local government initiatives that have passed in different
12:55
jurisdictions where they're trying to add to the solution.
12:59
And it is something that I think is getting the kind of attention
13:03
it probably has needed for a long time.
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And there's more work to do to to really fix and build the
13:10
system for the future. Any thoughts on where that
13:13
additional funding can come from?
13:16
I mean, as I think about sort of the public school system K
13:19
through 12, I, I believe that most geographies fund that
13:24
through property tax, correct? It it varies from state to
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state. Some states don't have property
13:31
tax, some states don't have income tax.
13:33
So you have a little bit of variance depending on the state,
13:37
but clearly there are public investments needed to overcome
13:42
this shortfall. And we live in a world and an
13:46
economy that is running 24/7. Most families, every able bodied
13:53
adult needs to work to help make ends meet and really having
13:59
access to these types of support is going to be critical to
14:02
maintaining our our economic strength and and our ability to
14:07
grow going forward. So I'm 50 years old.
14:11
When I was a kid obviously I didn't understand what was going
14:15
on in the world, but I don't remember childcare being a
14:19
thing. Did I just grow up in a bubble
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or has it become way more prominent now?
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It has become way more prominent.
14:27
I'm around your age and I also probably had no idea that this
14:33
was an issue. But I also grew up in a time
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where it was very common to have mom at home and that that has
14:42
changed. We have a very different world.
14:46
And while there are families who make that choice, and that's a
14:51
valid choice if it works for them economically, for many it
14:56
doesn't work. You have single parent families
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where that's not an option at all.
15:02
And you have generations now of working women who have
15:07
tremendous education and skill that they're bringing into our
15:12
country and into our economy. And the loss of them from the
15:16
workforce at this point would be really difficult.
15:20
I forget I was at an event a couple years ago and over half
15:25
the graduates from MIT and engineering are women.
15:28
So it's, you know, the odds of this spinning backward to where
15:33
you and I grow up is not likely. And for many people, I think it
15:38
wasn't really real then either. And for those that it worked
15:42
for, it worked. But it it, it wasn't ideal even
15:45
then. And a lot of the programs that
15:48
we administer really started in the mid 1970s.
15:53
And if you think back even further in history, the first
15:57
time the United States had a major investment in childcare
16:00
was during World War 2. And the reason was we needed
16:05
Rosie to go do her work with the rivets.
16:08
And we had to have a place for her to put her kids.
16:11
So the federal government during World War 2 passed the federal
16:14
Lanham Act, which set up the nation's first subsidized
16:18
childcare program to support the war effort.
16:21
So it's not a new concept. It's certainly been emerging.
16:26
And I think it is something that as we have had more equality in
16:31
the workplace, more opportunity for women, more opportunity for
16:37
families to make individual choices.
16:39
And if that that means pursuing career that there are ways to
16:44
support this differently. So a couple of the the ways that
16:48
you help families is you can either enroll them in your own
16:52
programs or you can help to fund care, you know, through other
16:58
methods, whether it's a family member or friend who's taking
17:01
care, a small childcare center or one of the, you know, bigger
17:04
stand alone centers. And so how do you sort of decide
17:08
who gets which type of service or is that something that the
17:12
family gets to choose? The family gets to choose, a lot
17:16
of it is based on availability and where there are
17:19
opportunities to enroll. As I mentioned, we have waiting
17:22
lists. So if you get an opportunity to
17:25
take a space that's in one of our facilities and there's no
17:29
availability for the the portable financial assistance,
17:33
then you know you'll take what families take what they can get
17:38
typically. And then if you are in our
17:43
financial assistance program where we assist in paying for
17:46
care, it is a parent choice program.
17:49
It is governed by a federal statute so the family can pick
17:52
whatever type of care they want and then they are able to pursue
17:58
the type of care that meets the needs of their kids and their
18:00
family. One of the things I'll I'll put
18:03
my child development hat on for a minute is what works for your
18:06
two year old might not work for your 4 year old or your 7 year
18:09
old. And the needs of families change
18:11
over time. Often they have more than one
18:13
child. So the the beauty of our
18:16
financial assistance programs that allow parents to choose as
18:21
they could change providers, they can use more than one
18:24
provider at a time. And as their children grow and
18:28
start school, they may not need a full day experience, but they
18:33
do need before and after school care.
18:35
And we have many, many families who work in our 24/7 economy who
18:40
need care evening, weekend, holiday.
18:43
And that program allows for them to find that during those hours
18:47
they needed as well. Can they use that financial
18:50
assistance anywhere or does it have to be like on a list, this
18:54
place that has to be on an approved list?
18:56
So it varies from state to state and in California they can
19:00
choose licensed care that is licensed by the state of
19:04
California. Most states have some sort of
19:07
licensing system. We also allow for what we
19:12
consider to be licensed exempt, which is the family, friend and
19:15
neighbor option. Some states do that, some states
19:19
don't. So the rules do vary nationally
19:22
a bit. So there are a number of other
19:26
organizations like yours around the country that provide similar
19:29
similar services. There are and because the
19:34
Federal Child Care and Development Block Grant is a
19:36
national program, there are organizations or state agencies
19:42
that do this type of work. We work through a National
19:46
Association called Child Care Aware of America, where wherever
19:51
you are in the country, you can go on their website and you can
19:54
identify where you could find a resource and referral agency
19:58
like us that will then connect you to.
20:01
What is available in your state and in your community?
20:06
And so are you the only one in your geographical region?
20:10
You're the only one in California.
20:12
How does this work? Do you get territories?
20:14
We are, we are regional. We all are assigned territories
20:20
based on our contracts with the state.
20:23
In California, there are about 60.
20:27
California's a pretty big state. Wow.
20:29
Yeah, California's a big state. So we have 58 counties.
20:33
And so we've got some areas where there are more than one,
20:38
some areas where there's only one, some areas where one agency
20:41
covers multiple counties. It's, you know, depends on the
20:45
the population density. And it's all driven by the the
20:49
population base, where young kids are and how the agreements
20:54
are set up. Are they all set up as
20:56
nonprofits? Most some are also in county
21:02
offices of education, so the local school districts may have
21:05
these contracts. Some handful are in local
21:09
government in counties, but the I think the majority are in
21:13
community based nonprofits in California.
21:15
So no for profit organizations that are set up like this.
21:18
No, we're all nonprofit based. Do you feel like you're in
21:22
competition with any of these other organizations?
21:26
Are you competing for dollars or attention or anything else?
21:30
Other resources. I think in the nonprofit
21:32
community we are pretty collegial.
21:35
We we all work collaboratively together.
21:38
We have to transfer families. If so, if a family is receiving
21:42
services from us in Los Angeles and they move to Fresno, we work
21:45
with the agency in Fresno to make sure the Family Services
21:49
follow them. We are seeing more for profit
21:53
competition coming in. The challenge is they don't
21:57
necessarily have all of the information.
22:01
They aren't connected to the licensing entities and they may
22:06
not have the full picture where we are as contractors of the
22:10
state given regular updates and regular information so that we
22:14
are giving families as complete a picture as we can of what's
22:19
available in their community. What does for profit competition
22:23
look like? Because it seems like the
22:26
majority of your funding is coming from the government.
22:28
Can for profit entities get access to the same kind of
22:32
funding? They are funded differently.
22:35
Often they are working with businesses trying to work to
22:40
support employees that different businesses may be trying to
22:44
provide child care services to. I think one of the things we are
22:50
really eager to make sure that the broader community
22:54
understands is some of the things that they are offering
22:57
are already paid for by public funding and that businesses
23:01
really could access these private, non community based
23:04
nonprofits rather than having to expend resources, a for profit
23:09
entity. But there are different services
23:12
that they are offering. It's a pretty new development,
23:16
so we're trying to figure out how all the pieces may fit
23:20
together. But we certainly want to make
23:22
sure that people know that there are already available services
23:28
and that whatever the for profit community brings in as a value
23:33
add and not, you know, taking away from existing resources
23:40
that everyone should be able to access.
23:42
Because it sounds like you've got you're at full enrollment,
23:45
you've got a pretty big waiting list.
23:46
So this could be, you know, a help to that right for those
23:50
folks who are on that waiting list.
23:52
It could be, you know, and one of the things I know some of the
23:56
the companies we've been talking to where there are employers who
24:00
want to offer say a childcare benefit, where they want to
24:05
provide a stipend to their employees to help offset the
24:09
cost of childcare. You know, there there are
24:11
different arrangements that could be made and we would be
24:14
eager to do those things as well.
24:17
But it's it's a difficult landscape for employers.
24:21
I think many times employers are pressured to provide the care or
24:27
provide an on site child care option and that gets
24:31
complicated. It's a complicated business to
24:33
run. If you have a brick and mortar
24:35
child care facility, you often can't meet the needs of all of
24:38
your employees and your employees needs are changing
24:42
every day. Their children are growing.
24:45
You have new employees that come in and then there become equity
24:49
issues with your employees that don't have children that you're
24:52
providing a benefit there then not for them.
24:56
So we really encourage employers to seek out their nonprofit
25:02
partners and see what we could do to help them support the the
25:07
broader community based childcare system and not take
25:11
that responsibility on themselves when for many it's
25:14
just a burden they're not ready to get into.
25:18
Donna, help us understand what a chief strategy officer does.
25:24
I'm creating it as I go. You know, I think my job really
25:28
is to be up on in the the crow's nest of the ship, seeing where
25:36
we're headed, what possibilities are out there, what threats are
25:40
out there, and how we can really position our organization to
25:45
meet the needs of our community, live up to our mission, and
25:49
identify resources to expand and strengthen our services.
25:55
So in my work, I oversee all of our external communications
26:00
work. We have a pretty robust presence
26:04
in social media. We do a lot of video work, just
26:08
basic education, trying to help families understand what's
26:12
available to them, a lot of local outreach and engagement.
26:16
And we also do a lot of work with childcare providers to make
26:19
sure they have the resources that they need to run their
26:21
business. I'm also responsible for our
26:24
research division where we really take a deeper dive, do a
26:29
lot of needs assessment work, looking at where there are gaps,
26:33
what families are needing right now, what their their day-to-day
26:38
reality looks like and how we can design a system that meets
26:41
their needs. And our government relations
26:43
team, where we are really trying to partner with our elected
26:48
officials and their staff to make sure they are up to speed
26:53
on the realities in their communities.
26:56
We do a lot of education trying to explain to them what the
27:00
child care supply looks like, where there might be what we
27:03
call child care deserts, where there's not enough care to serve
27:07
the number of kids that are needing support, how many
27:12
families are receiving subsidized care, how many
27:15
families are in need of additional support.
27:19
And really trying to, as I said, craft the best solutions for the
27:26
most people. You know, I've had the chance to
27:29
talk with a number of child care center owners, several across
27:35
the state of California. And so anecdotally, I get to
27:38
hear a lot of stories about, you know, COVID was really tough.
27:45
Some people are still trying to recover from that.
27:48
A number of centers never recovered.
27:50
They shut down. They went under probably
27:52
contributing to this, you know, child care desert that you're
27:55
talking about in some locations. Again, like the stories I get to
27:59
hear, they're they're anecdotes. There are many of them that tell
28:02
the same kind of story. But I'm curious from a a data
28:05
point of view, what what does the big picture kind of look
28:08
like coming out of COVID? So coming out of COVID, I, I
28:12
think what you're hearing anecdotally is what we're seeing
28:14
more systemically. We are seeing a lot of providers
28:18
that are, you know, struggling with the increased cost of doing
28:23
business. One of the challenges is just
28:28
your cost for your employees has gone up.
28:30
We've seen multiple minimum wage increases in California, which
28:34
is great for the workers, but with such a small margin on your
28:38
business, there's very little room for error.
28:42
And I think we've also seen in California a pretty significant
28:46
increase in public investment in school based preschool where a
28:51
lot of four year olds are now going to transitional
28:53
kindergarten program at their local elementary school.
28:57
And often for child care providers, that 4 year old age
29:03
group was critical to their ability to break even
29:07
financially because of the adult to child ratios with younger
29:12
children that was kind of that age group where they could
29:15
really hold it together. So we really are seeing a lot of
29:18
struggling in our child care provider community.
29:21
We also have an aging population of family child care providers,
29:27
the folks who are licensed to do care in their own homes.
29:31
They are reaching a retirement age or past retirement age and
29:37
still doing that work. And the influx of new people
29:40
coming in is not as quick. And for for many reasons, the
29:46
workforce in childcare has largely been women, often women
29:50
of color, and it has been not a well compensated field
29:56
historically. And the good news for women is
30:01
there's a lot more opportunity for women.
30:03
And they've got a lot of women getting a much, much more robust
30:08
education. And they have a lot, a lot of
30:11
new opportunities where they don't necessarily have to take
30:14
that lower paying job. And we as a society have grown
30:18
accustomed to having that cheap labor.
30:20
And that's going away. And I think that's part of the
30:24
pressure on the system is, well, what are we going to do to make
30:28
these competitive wage jobs to attract young people to want to
30:33
work with young kids? I think it's some of the most
30:35
important work you could do. We know that the first three
30:40
years of a child's life are the most rapid period of brain
30:43
development. There's very few times that you
30:46
can have that kind of impact in the lives of others, but you
30:49
also have to pay your bills. So, you know, trying to to look
30:54
at the long term sustainability and what, what the system will
30:58
have to adapt to, to be able to have accessible Affordable Care
31:03
is, is really one of the big challenges.
31:06
And so is the answer more government funding?
31:10
I think it's one of the answers, you know, I, I think that
31:13
there's a lot of different things that folks are looking
31:16
at. Clearly, you're looking at an
31:18
expanded footprint for public school.
31:22
One of the challenges with that is public school doesn't really
31:25
align with most people's work days, so you still have to have
31:28
some kind of childcare partnership around that.
31:32
So we are in a lot of conversations trying to figure
31:34
that out, more accessible paid family leave for those first few
31:40
months of an infant's life so that there's less pressure and
31:46
families could take those first few months to stay home and bond
31:50
with their infant. I think we we would be really
31:52
supportive of that. And then obviously continued
31:57
look at different public solutions.
32:00
And you know, it's interesting that child care is an area where
32:04
there's been quite a bit of bipartisan cooperation in
32:08
government. It is something that is
32:11
recognized across the aisle as an issue that we need to deal
32:15
with in our economy. How we get there is the trick,
32:21
and where the compromises will come and how we try to put a
32:28
different proposals together will be, you know, the work of
32:30
the next few years. You know, the other thing that I
32:34
hear from a lot of owners of childcare centers, you just
32:38
touched on transitional kindergarten.
32:41
So for those listening who aren't kind of familiar with the
32:44
industry, there's different ratios of adults to kids
32:49
required by the state. Obviously when they're younger,
32:53
they're infant ages, you need more adults to kids.
32:56
So that cost, that care cost more to deliver.
33:02
And as you get into the older groups and particularly that
33:04
four and five year old group, the ratios are more favorable.
33:09
And so this tends to be like you said, where the child care
33:12
centers can make their money. They're, you know, not breaking
33:16
even, maybe even taking a loss on those younger ages as a way
33:19
to, you know, be able to help families and keep them in the
33:22
system. And so now as transitional
33:25
kindergarten came in, they they can't get that full day care
33:29
that they're getting at, you know, a child care center that
33:32
that's the trade off. But for parents who can, you
33:35
know, make do with it, it it's free and it's hard to walk away
33:40
from free. And so I'm talking to a lot of
33:43
owners who are like, we don't know what we're going to do.
33:46
We don't know how we're going to keep the doors open.
33:50
Is there any relief insight for them?
33:53
Do you do you have any advice or suggestions?
33:55
You know, well, I'll speak to transitional kindergarten just a
33:59
bit, which is a California model that the state of California has
34:04
implemented that is all school based and it is, as you
34:09
mentioned, really focused on serving 4 year old children.
34:14
Other states have done this but done it differently.
34:17
If you look at states like New York, where they actually
34:23
started with a model similar to California but realized it was
34:27
impacting their supply of care for younger children.
34:31
So they began to build public private partnerships so that
34:35
families could have that transitional kindergarten
34:40
preschool experience in their child care program.
34:45
They would be able to have that full day, full year service and
34:50
it would be a partnership and funded in the same way as the
34:53
school based system. California's not gone that
34:56
route. California's gone an all public
34:58
route, New Jersey's another example where they have built
35:03
this public private partnership model that integrates the
35:06
existing child care system into the delivery as has Illinois.
35:12
We have, I have personally and you know, my organization has
35:17
been an advocate that we really need to think about that mixed
35:19
delivery model and including the existing child care providers in
35:26
the delivery of preschool services so that they can
35:29
sustain and so that we can sustain our infant toddler care
35:32
supply. But that's not been the
35:36
direction the state has gone thus far.
35:39
Do you see that changing at any point down the road, or do they
35:44
feel pretty locked into what they're doing?
35:46
You know, I, I think that there are differing opinions in the
35:51
state legislature and in the administration.
35:55
And typically what I see happen is we'll reach a pain point
36:01
where something's going to have to give and then we'll have a
36:04
different conversation. You know, and I, I know that
36:08
the, the transitional kindergarten piece, you've heard
36:11
from the child care provider side, it's not so smooth
36:15
necessarily on the public school side either, because the needs
36:19
of four year old children are quite different than the needs
36:22
of older elementary children. And it isn't a hand in glove
36:27
kind of fit for them. So I think you see varied levels
36:31
of integration of TK into their their public education system
36:38
depending on the district. So I would say we're very much
36:41
in flux at this time. I don't know where it's going to
36:45
land long term, but it's certainly is a place where
36:50
people need to be involved and really lift up what what they
36:53
believe is most beneficial, either that to their own family
36:57
or to their community. How would you characterize the
37:01
success or lack there of other programs where there's more of
37:05
that partnership model? They seem to be doing quite
37:09
well. I know there have been several
37:12
study trips done where folks have gone to look at what's
37:16
happening in New York and New Jersey and Illinois and they
37:21
seem to be on a a good path where there is the partnership,
37:26
you know, with any public system and any launching of new work it
37:31
there's a period of adjustment. I'm sure that there are bumps in
37:36
the road, but it does seem to be a good model to both offer a
37:43
universal preschool education to four year old children and
37:47
support the early childhood opportunities for birth through
37:52
three. Do you think we'll ever see a
37:55
federal child care solution, or do you think this stays with the
37:59
states? Well, a lot of the funding
38:02
starts at the federal level, and the way the federal government
38:07
has handled most of it has been through block grants, which
38:10
means they send a chunk of money to the state and then the state
38:15
has to follow certain amount of rules but are largely able to
38:18
implement their own local programs.
38:21
We got close in the 1970s before my time, but in the 1970s there
38:27
was a universal Child Care Act that was vetoed by President
38:32
Nixon. That was the closest I think we
38:35
have come. There have been proposals in the
38:38
Senate in the past few years. Senator Warren and Senator
38:43
Murray both have had different proposals which would have
38:46
dramatically expanded federal support for child care.
38:52
You know, we will see how those things play out.
38:55
But there certainly is discussion about the need for a
38:59
greater role at the federal level, particularly as states,
39:04
even states with a lot of resources like California, have
39:09
limits on what they can do. And so there will be a point
39:13
where California has exhausted its resources to be able to do
39:17
this without support from the federal government.
39:19
And so that that will be a tipping point for us.
39:24
What are some of the other services that CCRC provides,
39:27
Donna that we haven't touched on yet?
39:30
So we do a lot of different work to try to support families with
39:35
young kids. And we've been really building
39:38
out and expanding our home visiting services, which are
39:42
available to new parents. So when you bring a baby home
39:46
from the hospital, it's a scary time if you've never done that
39:49
before and you don't necessarily have the kind of extended family
39:53
you would have had. So we have home visitors that
39:56
can go out and support new parents and just learning
39:59
routines and basic development and you know, how how to move
40:05
into that space of being a parent.
40:07
It's it's a big transition. We've also expanded our
40:13
offerings around behavioral health.
40:16
Another thing that got a lot of attention during the pandemic
40:19
and since has been the tremendous stress on families
40:24
and on children. And so we have a variety of
40:28
different programs we've been doing to support families with
40:32
access to behavioral health and mental health consultation for
40:37
child care providers, which largely goes in and works with
40:41
the provider on how to manage different behaviors in children.
40:49
Children when they're stressed or have been through a traumatic
40:53
experience, don't tell you what happened or how they're feeling.
40:57
They show you and they show you through behavior.
41:00
So we offer supports to providers where we will have
41:03
someone go out and work with a provider to make sure that they
41:08
can think through transitions and how their program is
41:11
structured and what type of attention a child might need so
41:14
that they can really help the child be successful in their
41:16
program. What directions New directions
41:22
is CCRC maybe headed in? So I, I think I've said a couple
41:28
times that we really are interested in holistic services
41:31
for families. I think we've got a pretty
41:35
fragmented system of support. We are really eager to expand
41:42
our ability to make sure families get access to
41:45
healthcare. So as we're providing them
41:49
services and support for childcare, also making sure that
41:52
they have access to health insurance or to medical services
41:59
and support. One of the big issues with young
42:02
children is developmental screenings to make sure the
42:05
child is on track to develop at a typical pace.
42:12
So making sure they get connected to developmental
42:14
screening services. And we've been leaning more and
42:17
more into, you know, basic needs for families, diapers and food
42:24
and clothing and just trying to, as much as possible, meet a
42:29
family where they are when they come to our organization and
42:33
wrap the services that we can to really help them succeed.
42:39
So give us more specifically the geography that you in particular
42:42
serve. Sure.
42:44
So we serve the northern part of Los Angeles County, which is the
42:49
San Fernando Valley, Santa Clarita Valley, Antelope Valley,
42:53
Burbank and Glendale. And then we also serve San
42:56
Bernardino County, which is a pretty large largest geographic
43:00
county in the country. Our service area is about 22,000
43:04
square miles. So we have a pretty large
43:07
territory that we cover and we partner then with our colleagues
43:12
around the state and have sister agencies throughout California
43:15
and across the country. So somebody who's listening,
43:18
that's in one of those coverage geographies that Donna just
43:21
mentioned, you can find out more about their services and how to
43:24
contact them at ccrcca.org. We'll have that in the show
43:30
notes, but I want to make sure that you have it ccrcca.org.
43:35
Donna, shifting gears a little bit, would love to hear about a
43:38
particular challenge that you personally have overcome,
43:43
whether it's on the professional side or something more on the
43:46
personal side and and some lessons that you learned coming
43:48
through that. So, you know, I, I think I, when
43:54
we started talking about how I got to the job that I'm in now,
43:58
you know, careers are journeys and we hit different milestones
44:03
and pitfalls along the way. I think probably a big challenge
44:09
that I faced was during the Great Recession, the
44:13
organization that I was working for went through a lot of very
44:17
difficult challenges and changes and I was pretty tired.
44:23
I was doing public affairs at that point, dealing with a lot
44:27
of the reductions in services, dealing with media, dealing with
44:33
local government and a lot of contract reductions.
44:36
And I kind of reached a burnout point where I just didn't, I, I
44:42
lost my way in the reason I was doing this work and I stepped
44:46
away and went to do work with a, a friend who was doing
44:52
environmental policy. So I, I stepped away completely
44:57
kind of for a year, but I, I kept some of my fingers in the
45:02
early childhood space and it was not for me.
45:07
It just was not a good fit. And I ended up ending that
45:13
position and was sort of between jobs, had a young kid of my own
45:20
and really struggled to decide, you know, well, you know, do I
45:27
try something totally new or do I need to go back to where,
45:31
where my core is and where my values are?
45:34
And fortunately, I, I had a long standing relationship with the
45:39
CEO at CCRC, who, you know, we had stayed in, in communication
45:46
when I had made that transition. And I ended up with an
45:49
opportunity to go back and it's where I belong.
45:55
This is the stuff I care about, you know, and I think it took
45:58
about, you know, six weeks into being back to go.
46:02
Oh, right. Why did you leave?
46:03
What, what were you thinking? Because this, you know, and I, I
46:08
think I, you know, as I mentioned, I have a degree in
46:10
child development and I, I really thought I was advocating
46:15
for kids, but it was really during that time that I realized
46:18
I was advocating for the parents because I was 1 and I was in it.
46:23
And I knew how hard it was and how hard it is to put all the
46:26
pieces together when you're trying to raise a family.
46:29
And we don't make it so easy in the United States to be a
46:34
family. We, we don't put all the
46:39
resources and supports in place. You know, we're very, very
46:43
driven with economics and with, you know, success in that way.
46:48
And it's very hard to be a, to be a parent.
46:51
And I, I think that that was a real moment of clarity for me
46:54
where I really realized that the skills and talent I had were
46:59
best used to try to lift that issue and to try to really make,
47:05
make the system work better and make things better so people
47:08
could really achieve the, the families that they wanted to
47:13
have. Donna, say more about what
47:16
caused you to burn out and to leave the space for a little
47:20
while. You know, it's very hard to have
47:23
things that you really care about dismantled.
47:26
And I had to lay off employees. You know, those are very
47:32
difficult decisions, particularly with people you
47:36
have a relationship with over years.
47:39
And then, you know, a lot of the services that we had been
47:42
providing, we had to end. And there were a lot of families
47:45
who were in a very difficult circumstance without the support
47:50
that we had been offering. And you, you feel like you
47:53
failed, that you couldn't fight to keep it together and
47:58
couldn't, couldn't make it work. And so I, I do believe that, you
48:07
know, in hindsight, I don't know that there's anything that could
48:09
have been done differently. But at the time you just don't
48:12
feel like you can fix it. And that's a, you know, for, for
48:17
an, a student, that's a hard thing to, that's a hard thing to
48:22
accept. I, I usually feel like I've got
48:25
my hands on the reins pretty solidly.
48:27
But when you know, when, when things got tough, it was, it was
48:30
really difficult. And I, I think it's hard to live
48:35
your life and not run into those patches.
48:39
And you learn a lot about yourself and you learn about
48:42
what matters to you, what you are willing to do and not do.
48:48
And I think that's part of becoming wise, older and wiser.
48:55
You know, you, you fall down and you get yourself back up and you
48:59
start again. But you know, it's always easier
49:02
looking back than when you're in the thick of it, isn't it?
49:06
And what did you learn that matters to you, Donna?
49:10
I, I think that, as I said, it just really underscored to me
49:15
that I really feel strongly that I want to use my skills and
49:20
abilities to make other people's lives better.
49:23
And that at the end of the day, that's where I want to invest my
49:27
time to make sure that children have the best opportunity to
49:31
succeed, that their parents are able to give them what they want
49:37
to and, and we build strong communities.
49:41
I, I think that that's the most meaningful type of work in my
49:45
life. So that's that's why I do it.
49:50
I'd be curious. I'm going to explain something
49:53
I've gone through, something I've seen a lot of other either
49:57
business owners, business leaders go through and that's
50:01
when you're in that transitionary state between
50:03
things. It's really sticky.
50:08
It's really murky, it's really uncomfortable.
50:12
Like I'll speak for me personally, my identity is
50:16
largely attached, right or wrong to the work that I do.
50:19
And so if I'm leaving one opportunity and I'm trying to
50:24
figure out what the next one is, I feel untethered.
50:28
I feel like a part of me is unknown or missing or, you know,
50:33
waiting to be defined. I, I see you nodding your head.
50:36
Does this describe your experience as well?
50:39
I think so. I, you know, I think knowing
50:42
what I know about human development and child
50:45
development transitions are the hardest things.
50:48
And I had a colleague who used to talk about an example of a
50:52
trapeze, that when you're swinging out on the trapeze and
50:57
you need to reach to get to the next one, you have to be brave
51:00
enough to let go of the last one, and that letting go of the
51:05
old. It's.
51:07
That's a good way to put it. It's.
51:09
Scary, you know, at least you knew you had something there,
51:12
but it's going away and you've got to move on to the next
51:17
thing. But it's that in between where
51:20
you do, you feel untethered, you feel nervous and unsure of
51:25
yourself. And you're better for it once
51:30
you get through that phase. And the more times you do it,
51:35
the more you realize, I've been through this before.
51:38
I could do this again. I've been through this before.
51:40
But you know, it's it is an uncomfortable feeling.
51:47
Yeah, what's I'm kind of curious you guys, your staff's pretty
51:52
big size 1000. What'd you say?
51:54
Thousand, 1300. Yeah, 1300.
51:56
Yeah, tight labor market for most folks that I talked to.
52:03
I don't know if that's the case for the kinds of positions that
52:05
you're hiring. What are some things that you
52:08
guys have tried and found success with in terms of
52:11
recruiting good folks and once you find them, holding on to
52:15
them? You know, I obviously is a tight
52:18
labor market and we as a non profit organization can't be
52:24
necessarily as competitive in salary as other entities can be.
52:31
What I do find is we are so fortunate that there are many
52:38
people who feel very committed to the work that we do and to
52:41
the mission of our organization. We do our best to be as
52:46
competitive as we can be with salary.
52:48
We do do our best to try to offer competitive benefits,
52:54
flexible workplace and you know, are constantly striving to do
52:59
better. But at the end of the day, I
53:03
think that most of our employees who are with us for long periods
53:07
of time are really committed to the work and are able to earn a
53:13
good living at the same time that they're able to, as I
53:17
mentioned, give back and try to do for others.
53:21
And I, I think that that's a unique opportunity.
53:24
Probably the area where we are stretched most thin in labor is
53:29
in the actual teacher workforce because of the things I
53:34
mentioned earlier. There just are not as many
53:37
people going into the profession and getting an education in
53:42
early learning and child development.
53:46
So we have been doing a lot of work around apprenticeships,
53:50
trying to find people who wouldn't necessarily have gone
53:55
straight to a four year university, wouldn't necessarily
53:59
have thought this at the beginning of their professional
54:03
lives, but start to, you know, identify that they're interested
54:07
in working with kids. Maybe they've had their own
54:09
children and now they're like, oh, well, maybe this would be
54:12
something I'd be interested in. And then giving them a, a more
54:17
attainable pathway through an apprenticeship model where they
54:20
can work and get the training at the same time.
54:23
I, I would get, I would guess we're going to be doing more of
54:27
that, you know, and the areas where we need the most work
54:33
workers is really that, that classroom teacher side home
54:37
visitors, case managers who work with our families, those entry
54:41
level positions and trying to, you know, craft those jobs to be
54:46
as appealing as possible. And then also getting out there
54:49
and really trying to recruit at the community colleges and even
54:54
in high school career technical education to identify folks who
55:00
maybe didn't realize this was a career they could do and try to
55:05
connect them in as as quickly as we can.
55:09
What's something you wish you could teach a younger version of
55:11
yourself, Donna? It's really obvious to you now,
55:13
but man, it would have been good to know back then.
55:19
Oh, you know, I've never been patient.
55:25
I'm still waiting to learn that one too.
55:29
But I think if I could in hindsight, if I'd known when I
55:37
was young, that things do take time, changing things takes
55:42
time, and you have to keep going back to things that are
55:47
important to try to move them forward.
55:49
And it's not going to happen all at once.
55:51
It's just not realistic to think you're going to get everything
55:54
right the first time and that you've got to be willing to
55:57
adapt and change and that it takes time.
56:00
Yeah. Any specific mentors or books
56:05
that have helped shape your career or you?
56:08
Personally, no. I, I have been so fortunate to
56:11
have a lot of wonderful mentors in the, in the field that I'm
56:16
in, you know, women who, who set up a lot of these organizations
56:22
that I had the chance to work with when I was in my 20s.
56:27
You know, who I saw as our founding mothers in many ways.
56:31
And I, I will say it's a little daunting to now realize I'm one
56:36
of them, not one of the youngsters coming up, but you
56:40
know, they, they really blaze trails that were not there
56:43
before. And I, I learned a lot from
56:47
them. I have a colleague who was a
56:50
member of the state legislature in California and have worked
56:54
closely with her for about 15 years.
56:56
And then some of my Graduate School professors, just
56:59
wonderful mentors at USC and even at Cal State Northridge in
57:03
the child development program there.
57:06
They, you know, they, they still keep roping me back in to mentor
57:10
the next generation, you know? Everybody takes a turn, Donna.
57:14
Everybody takes a. Turn That's right.
57:16
You know what? I I actually really like that
57:18
part of where I am in my life right now.
57:20
I really like mentoring young people.
57:23
I like to see them succeed. And really I'm really enjoying
57:29
that part of at this phase of my career.
57:32
It's, it's really something to, you know, I have young staff who
57:36
started with me right out of college that are now in
57:40
committee assignments at the state legislature doing amazing
57:44
work, you know, leading organizations and really taking
57:49
off in their own right. And that's pretty cool.
57:53
What's a fun or interesting thing that most people might not
57:57
know about you? You've done something crazy.
58:02
You have an interesting hobby. You know, I, I grew up, my dad
58:08
was in the entertainment industry and I grew up around
58:13
that. He was an Emmy Award winner.
58:16
So I grew up in Los Angeles around television stations and
58:22
television production and a lot of celebrities, which was just
58:27
sort of a strange surreal to me was normal.
58:31
But I think to other people, they would be surprised.
58:34
But I it's in a lot of ways helped me in my life because I'm
58:39
not easily phased by. You don't get starstruck or
58:46
rattled. Or starstruck.
58:48
I, you know, I don't, there are very few times I, I can think of
58:51
that I've been like, oh, that's really an important person
58:54
because I, I was around it enough to know that they were
58:57
just people like everybody else. So, so that's probably, you
59:00
know, something people don't know about my background.
59:03
I was probably one of the few elementary school kids who sat
59:06
in remote trucks for sporting events because my dad would take
59:11
me along and I would sit and watch them produce sporting
59:14
events. So.
59:15
Was there ever any thought for you to get involved in that
59:19
space? I started off as a radio,
59:21
television and film major. OK.
59:24
I did and I. You decided that you found out
59:27
that wasn't for you. I I knew what it would take to
59:31
be successful in that world and it just wasn't a good fit for me
59:35
at that time. Ironically, I now talk to the
59:38
media on the regular. I understand press, we put press
59:42
conferences on. I still deal with parts of that.
59:47
So I, you know, my, my deep down skills come up every so often.
59:52
But yeah, I I did entertain it very early on, but not since.
59:58
Donna, I've just got one more question for you.
1:00:00
But before I ask it, I want to do 2 things.
1:00:02
Hit the share, like or subscribe button on your favorite podcast
1:00:05
app. Then I also want to let people
1:00:07
know the best way to get in touch with you.
1:00:08
What would that be? I think if they go to our.
1:00:12
Website, they can find my contact information there.
1:00:15
So it's ccrcca.org and they can find me there.
1:00:23
Yep. Well, be sure to put that in the
1:00:24
show notes for. Everybody.
1:00:26
And last question I have for you, Donna, how do you see this
1:00:29
whole space evolving in the next couple of years, things that we
1:00:33
haven't talked about already? What do you think maybe some of
1:00:35
the big changes are that are coming?
1:00:39
Yeah, there's a lot of uncertainty.
1:00:41
At this moment, we are a week and a half out from a national
1:00:46
election. New presidential administration,
1:00:50
new Congress, new a lot of new elected officials in the space
1:00:55
who I think will have their own opinions about what they think
1:01:03
should happen in the space. If anything, I don't think the
1:01:07
need for childcare is going to go away.
1:01:13
I think that it is just a reality of our world and our
1:01:16
economy. And I think that as we're
1:01:20
grappling with a as a nation, we're grappling with a declining
1:01:24
birth rate. And that has lots of long term
1:01:28
implications for our country. And one of the things we need to
1:01:32
consider is what are we doing to make it possible for folks who
1:01:38
want to have a family to be able to do that?
1:01:41
And many of the projects and programs we work on are related
1:01:45
to that. And it'll be interesting to see
1:01:49
how that plays out. Well, Donna, I.
1:01:52
Want to be the first to thank you for sharing both your time
1:01:55
and your story with us today. I'm grateful for it and I really
1:01:59
appreciate the opportunity. And thank you so much for the
1:02:01
invitation, folks. That's a wrap on another episode
1:02:04
of the. Inspired Stories podcast.
1:02:06
Thanks for learning with us today.