Latest / Dear Nina: Conversations About Friendship / #191 - The Case for Work Friends and Where to Find Them When You Work Alone (Lindsay Pinchuk)

Transcript

#191 - The Case for Work Friends and Where to Find Them When You Work Alone (Lindsay Pinchuk) · Dear Nina: Conversations About Friendship

0:04
[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to Dear Nina Conversations About Friendship.
0:07
[SPEAKER_00]: I am your host Nina Badzon.
0:09
[SPEAKER_00]: I've been writing about friendship for over a decade and podcasting about it for over four years.
0:13
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm thrilled to tell you that the podcast is really grown in the past year especially.
0:18
[SPEAKER_00]: So there was a steady growth in year one, year two, year three, but year four has really exploded.
0:24
[SPEAKER_00]: One of the main reasons why.
0:25
[SPEAKER_00]: is due to the networking group created by today's guest Lindsay Pinchuk.
0:31
[SPEAKER_00]: Lindsay is a successful entrepreneur who started a networking forum called The Deer Found Her Forum.
0:38
[SPEAKER_00]: This is me telling you the way that I have met a lot of other women who have helped me learn a lot about events.
0:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Other things I needed to know to grow my podcast, my newsletter, and all the other ways I conduct the Deer Nina business.
0:53
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel funny calling it a business, but I have sponsors, other ways that I am monetizing Lindsay is the one who started that forum and she did it because she is so much experience of her own and she found wonderful parallels between friendship and networking and this episode is really about how you can make friends.
1:11
[SPEAKER_00]: within networking.
1:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Like we think of networking as just about growing your business, but it's not just that.
1:17
[SPEAKER_00]: The reason I've been able to grow within this network is because of the friendships I've made in it.
1:23
[SPEAKER_00]: If you are in a networking group or you want to be in a networking group, all of the skills that it takes to succeed in a networking group and get anything out of it are the same skills that it takes to make friends and keep friends.
1:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Basically, you also have to give.
1:37
[SPEAKER_00]: I really do try to give as much as I take and isn't that true in friendship too?
1:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Another reason I wanted to do this episode, I want you to think about if you are somebody who works on your own and you don't have colleagues, you're missing out on a place that you can make friends because work friends is a real thing.
1:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Work friends are something that we are missing if you don't go into an office.
2:00
[SPEAKER_00]: So even if you work completely on your own at home, there is a way that you could replicate the concept of colleagues even if you don't see them in person, but it's regular meetings, regular online spaces that you get together.
2:12
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't have to be in a network that's just in your city, but there could be zooms that are consistent.
2:16
[SPEAKER_00]: I want you to consider the idea that if you don't
2:20
[SPEAKER_00]: feel like your regular friends are that into talking about the work you do, which is a topic I covered in my newsletter.
2:28
[SPEAKER_00]: I will link that in my show notes.
2:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Or if you just feel like you are lonely in your work life and you want to have the opportunity to make some friends through your career then a community networking type of space.
2:43
[SPEAKER_00]: That's just a one-time event, but a regular networking
2:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Let me tell you a little bit about Lindsey Pinchick.
2:50
[SPEAKER_00]: Lindsey is an award-winning entrepreneur, consultant, and small business mentor, who's among the less than 1% of female founders that successfully lead her company through an acquisition.
3:00
[SPEAKER_00]: She built her first company, Bump Club and Beyond, from just $500 into a seven figure brand with partnerships that included Target, Nordstrom Huggies, Lindsey lives in Chicago, very close to where I grew up.
3:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Network, Lindsey, Tenshek, welcome to Dear Nina, finally.
3:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Nina, I am so happy to be here.
3:24
[SPEAKER_01]: I was talking about this on a call this morning.
3:27
[SPEAKER_01]: I am so excited, so thank you so much for having me.
3:30
[SPEAKER_00]: It's such a great topic because people often use the word work friend.
3:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, she's just my work friend, like they diminish it.
3:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Part of what we're going to talk about today is how a work friend, a work community can be actually a central part of your social life, too.
3:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Although it's not a media and it takes
3:47
[SPEAKER_00]: a finessing of the relationship over time, but you've seen a lot of things in your work history.
3:51
[SPEAKER_00]: So even though I gave a little bit of an intro about what you do, it took a long time for you to get to where you are now.
3:56
[SPEAKER_00]: So can you tell the listeners what you did for your work at the beginning and how it led to building this really incredible community?
4:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so I just want to say I have always been a connector.
4:07
[SPEAKER_01]: Community has always been very important to me.
4:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Even when I was in corporate America before I became an entrepreneur, I worked at the Hearst Corporation for 10 years before I started my own company.
4:16
[SPEAKER_01]: And I had very good work friends.
4:19
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, there are people that I text now and it's been 20 years.
4:22
[SPEAKER_01]: So I would say that I have always surrounded myself with connections and friendships, no matter where I am in my professional life.
4:30
[SPEAKER_01]: And actually my very first boss was on a deer found her form called today from high school.
4:36
[SPEAKER_01]: And my very first boss in the corporate world is someone who I still talk to and keep in touch with.
4:39
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think it's very important to kind of,
4:41
[SPEAKER_01]: say that and to set a precedent for where I'm going with this conversation because that's me, that's who I am.
4:47
[SPEAKER_01]: When I started my first company, it wasn't just a company.
4:51
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a community.
4:52
[SPEAKER_01]: I was pregnant and I had no other friends that were pregnant.
4:56
[SPEAKER_01]: We all have 9th graders, so I was just the first one and I started bump clubbing beyond which was my first company and it was a community for expectant parents and new parents and then eventually like parents of two and three.
5:06
[SPEAKER_01]: And so when I started that company, I was creating a community for me in terms of motherhood.
5:12
[SPEAKER_01]: And I definitely found that community through the company that I built.
5:16
[SPEAKER_01]: But the thing that you don't often hear me talk about is when I started that company, I had not one female founder friend.
5:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I didn't have a single friend who owned a business.
5:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And I sort of became an accidental entrepreneur.
5:29
[SPEAKER_01]: And to be very honest with you, I wasn't intending on leaving the hers corporation.
5:33
[SPEAKER_01]: I wasn't intending on starting my own company.
5:36
[SPEAKER_01]: This is before social media took off when I got back from maternity leave.
5:40
[SPEAKER_01]: I ended up quitting my job at the hers corporation to go all in on my first company bump club and beyond.
5:46
[SPEAKER_01]: So while I'm building community repairs and parents to be, I'm trying to navigate the waters and figure out how to own a business.
5:52
[SPEAKER_01]: And that is a whole different set of skills.
5:55
[SPEAKER_01]: And so what I realized early on was that I did need to surround myself with other women who were doing what I was doing.
6:02
[SPEAKER_01]: Because if not, then who am I going to ask is this okay or what do you think of this?
6:07
[SPEAKER_01]: And I didn't have anyone in the beginning.
6:09
[SPEAKER_01]: But what happened was it was very interesting in the parenting space, almost every company in the parenting space is owned by a mom.
6:16
[SPEAKER_01]: So as I started working with different brands, both locally and nationally, I started meeting a lot of really amazing female founders.
6:24
[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of who were our local partners here in Chicago, I really started building a network for myself of women business owners who not only were hosting events with me and working with me, but who understood what it was like to own a business.
6:38
[SPEAKER_01]: There are my closest friends today.
6:39
[SPEAKER_01]: There are still people that I talk to.
6:41
[SPEAKER_01]: They're not just people that I collaborated with or worked with.
6:44
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, over the course of time, and you said it in the beginning, you said it takes time, and it does, and it took me a lot of time.
6:51
[SPEAKER_01]: But I also knew that I needed to continue to cultivate this community for myself, and to really make sure I was surrounded by women business owners, to make myself a better business owner.
7:02
[SPEAKER_01]: I realized that I needed to have this kind of community surrounding myself.
7:06
[SPEAKER_01]: And so when I built bump club up to be, it was, we were reaching 3 million people a month.
7:12
[SPEAKER_01]: I bootstrapped the whole thing.
7:14
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a seven-figure business and I sold it.
7:16
[SPEAKER_01]: We were working with Target in the honest company in Nordstrom and all these big brands.
7:20
[SPEAKER_01]: When I sold it to the advantage marketing, who was my acquireer, I all of a sudden became a corporate employee again.
7:25
[SPEAKER_01]: I brought my whole team with me.
7:27
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a very different situation, and to be very honest with you, so my team are very good friends of mine.
7:32
[SPEAKER_01]: But I was also their boss, and it's a different relationship, but I also wasn't the owner anymore.
7:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Because I wasn't the owner anymore, even though I was the founder, I still had my founder community.
7:43
[SPEAKER_01]: But I was just in this very weird spot, and I felt like I wasn't supported, and I didn't have those female connections that I once had when I was independently run.
7:56
[SPEAKER_01]: some founders who had sold their businesses and gone through what I went through because I felt very lonely.
8:00
[SPEAKER_01]: And I felt like it was just a, it was a very depressing time of my life.
8:04
[SPEAKER_01]: When I realized that I needed to exit, you know, I had people in my network connect me to other women who had exited those types of conversations are so important for women to be having.
8:14
[SPEAKER_01]: When I left bump club, I was like, I have one goal and that is to help support other women business owners and to help them build their own communities and to make sure that they know that they're not doing this alone.
8:27
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I left and I started your founder very shortly after and what started as a podcast in like a social media account has really turned into this movement for women business owners over 40.
8:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Now this didn't happen overnight.
8:40
[SPEAKER_01]: This was something that I started the podcast and my listeners were like, well, we want to meet people in person.
8:45
[SPEAKER_01]: And then they were like, we want to work with you in a group setting.
8:48
[SPEAKER_01]: So we started creating cohorts for group mentorships, which lend itself to community.
8:53
[SPEAKER_01]: What year are we talking about?
8:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, 2022 is when I launched the podcast.
8:57
[SPEAKER_01]: 2020, three was when I started my very first cohort of marketing made simple for small business.
9:03
[SPEAKER_01]: That's my mentorship.
9:05
[SPEAKER_01]: That group said to me eight months in, we don't want to go anywhere when this is over at the year mark.
9:11
[SPEAKER_01]: What are you going to do about it?
9:12
[SPEAKER_01]: We need to have community.
9:14
[SPEAKER_01]: So I launched the Dear Founder Forum, which is my community for women business owners over 40.
9:19
[SPEAKER_01]: The best part
9:21
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I thought these women are showing up to learn from me, which they were.
9:25
[SPEAKER_01]: They are still, but I'm teaching them how to market their business and the skills they need and I'm mentoring them, but the most amazing thing that has happened and happened right from the get go with these women in the first cohort was they started forming their own friendships.
9:39
[SPEAKER_01]: And they started what's app groups and text chains off of our weekly calls and they started getting together in person.
9:46
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, you know, I started seeing them at my networking events and
9:49
[SPEAKER_00]: really what's everyone at this point the early years from Chicago.
9:53
[SPEAKER_00]: So they didn't get so they're getting it together in person traveling.
9:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, when people would travel to other markets, they would reach out and have coffee with one another.
10:01
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it was really amazing to watch.
10:04
[SPEAKER_01]: A year into this group mentorship, the first cohort graduated, we had launched the community for them to go into and other women started buying into this community too.
10:14
[SPEAKER_01]: I will tell you,
10:19
[SPEAKER_01]: came into one of our networking groups.
10:21
[SPEAKER_01]: And she said to me, I have to be honest with you, she said, I mean, I love seeing you and I love being here.
10:26
[SPEAKER_01]: She said, but the friendships that I have made from this community are amazing.
10:31
[SPEAKER_01]: And she's like, you know, I go out with this person for lunch and I'll go to another networking event with this person.
10:38
[SPEAKER_01]: And she said, I have made true friends.
10:40
[SPEAKER_01]: I looked at her and I said, well, that's funny, Rhana.
10:42
[SPEAKER_01]: I said, because the same goes for me, as much as I am here running this group and leading this group.
10:48
[SPEAKER_01]: At the end of the day, I need this group as much as you need me.
10:51
[SPEAKER_01]: And I created this group because I wanted to be able to give women business owners that same camaraderie that I'd
10:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Developed for myself, but it took five to ten years in order to do that.
11:02
[SPEAKER_00]: It's been amazing to watch, so I know that was like a very long answer It's a great for us to have this conversation because as I said in the intro I am in the forum.
11:10
[SPEAKER_00]: I am in this big group, and so I also get to see but I wasn't like the first one
11:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, come on.
11:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Actually, I think I was.
11:17
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you were in the founding group of the forum, not marketing made simple for Scott at us.
11:22
[SPEAKER_01]: So you were in the original group that came into the dear founder forum, which is the networking community.
11:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, okay.
11:28
[SPEAKER_00]: But the women in the marketing made simple also came into that.
11:30
[SPEAKER_00]: So some people already knew each other.
11:32
[SPEAKER_00]: So there is sometimes that intimidation factor of, okay, I'm just coming in by myself, no one's going to know me.
11:37
[SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't matter, there's something about the way you run it.
11:40
[SPEAKER_00]: It is easy to meet people, although just like everything I tell listeners in every episode in every topic, you are not going to meet people in a networking situation, whether it's online and or in person just sitting there.
11:52
[SPEAKER_00]: Just joining, just even showing up is not enough.
11:55
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a you have to talk and you have to listen.
11:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, and one of the things I say initially and all of my communication and actually I just did an orientation for new members of the forum which is posted for the people like you who didn't get an orientation in a year and a half ago the very first thing that I say is you will get out of this community what you put into this community and that's how friendship is.
12:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly, right.
12:17
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, there's this idea and I bet it happens, but you don't have to confirm.
12:21
[SPEAKER_00]: You can decide if you want to confirm, but I have to imagine that you do hear from people who've paid the money and then they say to you, I just don't feel like I'm getting as much out of it.
12:30
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't have a met anybody.
12:31
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not getting any resources and you could probably very fairly say, well, how often have you read through the materials that you Lindsay generously put up there about how to plan a event, how to collaborate with other people, all these tips that we are.
12:43
[SPEAKER_00]: paying to have access to how often have you had a zoom with somebody, how often have you come to an event, I do think there's a correlation between not doing those things and not feeling like you're meeting anybody.
12:53
[SPEAKER_01]: It's interesting that you say that I've had two people, two, that's it.
12:57
[SPEAKER_01]: And one of them was like, I don't know if I'm going to renew because I don't know that I'm getting anything out of this and I said to her flat out,
13:04
[SPEAKER_01]: are you coming to the monthly Q&A's to the office hours?
13:07
[SPEAKER_01]: And she said no.
13:08
[SPEAKER_01]: And I said, well, that's for starters.
13:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Of course, you're not getting anything out of it.
13:13
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what you're paying for.
13:14
[SPEAKER_01]: You're paying to have mentorship in this group.
13:16
[SPEAKER_01]: So like you should be coming to the meetings or watching them if you can't come or
13:20
[SPEAKER_01]: submitting a question to me if you can't be on, so I can answer them.
13:23
[SPEAKER_01]: And I said, how often do you go into circle and choose legal not often?
13:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And I said, well, you're an adult.
13:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm an adult.
13:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not going to hold your hand and walk you through this.
13:30
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's very clear where you can find the group.
13:34
[SPEAKER_01]: You're in the group, I see you're in the group.
13:35
[SPEAKER_01]: You need to go into the group and participate.
13:37
[SPEAKER_01]: I also had someone recently say to me, well, like, I really don't like circle circles not my friend.
13:41
[SPEAKER_01]: That's where the group takes place.
13:43
[SPEAKER_01]: And I said, I know you're afraid of circle because you've never used circle.
13:47
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's why you're saying it's not your friend.
13:48
[SPEAKER_01]: If you want to get something out of this, you have to go in and you have to just try.
13:53
[SPEAKER_01]: And you have to spend 15 to 20 minutes a week.
13:56
[SPEAKER_01]: That's it.
13:57
[SPEAKER_01]: Just poking around and getting used to the platform, just like any platform that we use in business.
14:03
[SPEAKER_01]: It takes a little bit of time.
14:04
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you'll start getting something out of this group.
14:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my god, there's so many friendship parallels.
14:09
[SPEAKER_00]: Even though yes, we are talking about friendships being built out of something like networking, but just like in any good friendship.
14:16
[SPEAKER_00]: For example, on the circle platform that Lindsay's talking about, it's not like Facebook, but it is like Facebook that you can post things and you can ask questions and answer questions.
14:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Lindsay herself as the leader can have files there that everyone can have access to.
14:28
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's organized in a way, and it's off a social media, and so like she's saying, yes, if you're not going to learn the new platform, you're not going to get anything out of it, and all of us at 40 and above, that's what the group has aimed for, because sometimes ball get having to learn something new, but that is the only way.
14:43
[SPEAKER_00]: The circle is a great example.
14:45
[SPEAKER_00]: So that was a long queue up to say, you can't just go into a networking situation or a friendship situation and say, what am I getting out of it?
14:52
[SPEAKER_00]: You also have to get something.
14:53
[SPEAKER_00]: So first,
14:54
[SPEAKER_00]: I really try because I do ask questions sometimes or about my own stuff for the podcast.
14:58
[SPEAKER_00]: I try to make a point to get in their answer other people's questions.
15:02
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a gift take and I think the more you also answer other people's questions and people can see what it is you do and how you think that also lends itself to people coming to you for other things which lends itself to further relationships and connections.
15:17
[SPEAKER_01]: this is the conversation we had this morning on the forum open house was I said most business growth doesn't start from posting on social media or sending a newsletter it starts from a conversation and so you have to have those conversations in order to get to the point where you're partnering with people or hosting an event with people or asking people for a favor.
15:38
[SPEAKER_00]: have to get to know them.
15:39
[SPEAKER_00]: That's right.
15:40
[SPEAKER_00]: And a big part of networking that I think is unique in the community you have built is you do have people in there that are doing the same kind of business and you also have business owners who businesses have nothing to do with each other and yet you can all find a way to help each other.
15:54
[SPEAKER_00]: I find that interesting so you could have someone who owns a jewelry company and someone like me who's a podcaster but we're supporting each other and in some ways maybe you would think it's easier to support each other because we're not
16:05
[SPEAKER_00]: But we also don't maybe have as much in common in our businesses, so it has a challenge and it has a benefit.
16:10
[SPEAKER_00]: I want us to talk about the challenge of when people are in the same business.
16:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I love that you're asking me this.
16:17
[SPEAKER_01]: This is one of my favorite things to talk about.
16:19
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to use some names too.
16:20
[SPEAKER_01]: When I first started my mentorship, so before the forum even came to be, Shane Shaps from Big Voice Social and Lucy Metzker from El Studio Media joined my initial mentorship group.
16:31
[SPEAKER_01]: And essentially, they both do very similar things.
16:34
[SPEAKER_01]: They are social media managers and strategists for small business owners.
16:37
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I definitely think they're clientele is a little bit different.
16:40
[SPEAKER_01]: And their method is a little bit different.
16:42
[SPEAKER_01]: But that's essentially what they both do.
16:43
[SPEAKER_01]: And I know that initially they were hesitant to share,
16:48
[SPEAKER_01]: talk about their business.
16:49
[SPEAKER_01]: One day I said, you need to embrace the competition.
16:54
[SPEAKER_01]: You need to be friends with the people who are doing what you're doing.
16:57
[SPEAKER_01]: Number one, there's enough business to go around for everybody.
17:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's be honest.
17:02
[SPEAKER_01]: You're one person.
17:03
[SPEAKER_01]: You're not going to take on everyone's social strategy.
17:05
[SPEAKER_01]: too, you need to be able to bounce ideas off people and there's no better way to do it than to talk to someone who's doing what you do every single day.
17:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Three, it's just really good moral support.
17:17
[SPEAKER_01]: What ended up happening was the two of them started doing content together.
17:21
[SPEAKER_01]: They started going online and doing Instagram lives.
17:24
[SPEAKER_01]: I refer both of them all the time and there have been a couple of times that I've referred them together to pitch a project because I have thought that they
17:35
[SPEAKER_01]: their friends.
17:36
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a great success story.
17:38
[SPEAKER_01]: So funny, I'm not going to use names on these people because I haven't talked publicly about this and I don't know them as well but there are two new members who also do something very similar.
17:48
[SPEAKER_01]: She messaged me on an Instagram and she's same thing, you know, this is this person does exactly what I do and blah, blah, ones in one part of the country and ones in the other part of the country and there are service-based business and it is very specific but I said, look, there's enough business to go around.
18:00
[SPEAKER_01]: You are one person.
18:02
[SPEAKER_01]: You're not going to get out of plane every time someone in that area needs your service And it's a in person thing that has to happen.
18:08
[SPEAKER_01]: I was like you need to forget this She said, you know, I follow her.
18:12
[SPEAKER_01]: She doesn't follow me.
18:12
[SPEAKER_01]: I said, we need to stop this right now You know, I said, this is not how I run my operation.
18:18
[SPEAKER_01]: I said if you really have an issue with it, then Let me know.
18:22
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm happy to give you your money back
18:23
[SPEAKER_01]: And she said, OK, she didn't want her money back.
18:25
[SPEAKER_01]: She wanted to be in it.
18:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And I said, if you're hesitant about sharing certain things because you don't want her to see it, you probably shouldn't be sharing those things in an open forum anyway.
18:35
[SPEAKER_01]: If there's something that's that private about your business, that should be for a DM or a one on one with me, or just another capacity.
18:43
[SPEAKER_01]: And I said, but this isn't how I operate it.
18:45
[SPEAKER_01]: There are a lot of people in this group who do the same thing as one another.
18:48
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's really important to lean into that.
18:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I learned that myself at bum club and beyond.
18:54
[SPEAKER_01]: There was another company, big city moms.
18:56
[SPEAKER_01]: They were in New York.
18:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I was in Chicago.
18:58
[SPEAKER_01]: We worked with all the same brands.
18:59
[SPEAKER_01]: We were competing for dollars at our events.
19:02
[SPEAKER_01]: But we really didn't do events in the same places.
19:05
[SPEAKER_01]: And for a few years, we would be at these trade shows.
19:07
[SPEAKER_01]: We would be giving each other dirty looks.
19:09
[SPEAKER_01]: We would be, you know, we hated each other.
19:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Actually, up a baby one time invited us all for drinks.
19:14
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a total bust.
19:15
[SPEAKER_01]: We didn't want to be there with each other.
19:17
[SPEAKER_01]: We were
19:17
[SPEAKER_01]: competitors.
19:18
[SPEAKER_01]: It was two sisters who owned it.
19:20
[SPEAKER_01]: And one day one of them called me up and said, I know you're going to be in New York for an event in Brooklyn.
19:26
[SPEAKER_01]: We would love to take you to lunch.
19:27
[SPEAKER_01]: So we went to lunch.
19:29
[SPEAKER_01]: We didn't come away from the lunch being like, okay, we're going to work together.
19:32
[SPEAKER_01]: But we came away from the lunch.
19:35
[SPEAKER_01]: One, with this mutual respect for one another, there was no one in the world doing what I was doing above the club and beyond, besides these two sisters.
19:43
[SPEAKER_01]: So to have the two of them understand what I do and deal with on a regular basis was invaluable to me.
19:48
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think the same for them.
19:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And two, we walked away with this mutual respect for one another and moving forward, we would meet in like December, January, and go over all of the dates for our events so that we would not host big events in the same cities at the same times.
20:04
[SPEAKER_01]: Amazing.
20:04
[SPEAKER_01]: It worked, and we ended up doing content together, encouraging moms to vote during the election cycle, and during different health crises, and you know, I mean, and you know what, now we both sold our businesses, they're still my friends.
20:18
[SPEAKER_01]: I learned it the hard way.
20:19
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it really took a long time for me to get to that place with them.
20:22
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I impart that wisdom on the women inside the group, lean into the people who are doing the same thing as you.
20:27
[SPEAKER_01]: You want them in your corner.
20:29
[SPEAKER_01]: one of the things that I think is the biggest value to leaning into your competition is sometimes you need to have someone to refer people to.
20:38
[SPEAKER_01]: You can't take all the business or you might have a project that you don't want.
20:43
[SPEAKER_00]: That is so true and I had to make a decision on my own.
20:47
[SPEAKER_00]: We talked about it on your podcast.
20:48
[SPEAKER_00]: This podcast thing I'm running has turned into a business.
20:51
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not a brick and
20:52
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not a bit business by any stretch, but it is taking up a lot of time space.
20:58
[SPEAKER_00]: People contacting me for all kinds of things all the time.
21:01
[SPEAKER_00]: It could be a quote for an article.
21:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Recently, I answered both in the scam and in real simple, like advice questions.
21:08
[SPEAKER_00]: And those were great ones, but I can't always do everything.
21:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I've done the scam a number of times.
21:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes I can't do it when they ask.
21:14
[SPEAKER_00]: It's nice to have other friendship advice people that I'm friends with, that I become friends with, that I can send it to.
21:20
[SPEAKER_00]: However, I had to make, I'm heavy myself on the back here, I had to make a choice to become friends with people who are doing pretty much exactly what I'm doing.
21:28
[SPEAKER_00]: They have podcasts, they have newsletters, they have social media accounts that are all about friendship.
21:33
[SPEAKER_00]: And there's a very big difference between the ones who are warm to that and the ones who aren't.
21:38
[SPEAKER_00]: I decided right away when I did the podcast.
21:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Even though I've been writing about friendship longer than a lot of them, my platform wasn't as big.
21:45
[SPEAKER_00]: And so sometimes people weren't as interested in me.
21:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe kind of like the person you were saying called you, maybe they didn't follow me back, even though I found out them.
21:52
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe they were kind of like, who's this Nina Badson?
21:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Basically, two ways to go when you are people in your same kind of business.
21:57
[SPEAKER_00]: You could be warm to the connection and be humble about it, or you can sort of constantly be in competition.
22:03
[SPEAKER_00]: And I just think that takes a lot of energy to be in competition.
22:06
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's interesting that you say that because there are not that many female founder podcasts.
22:12
[SPEAKER_01]: There are a few, the women are, there are a lot younger.
22:15
[SPEAKER_01]: They want nothing to do with me.
22:17
[SPEAKER_01]: And like, it's fine.
22:18
[SPEAKER_01]: We're very different.
22:19
[SPEAKER_01]: We reached different people and we're just different.
22:21
[SPEAKER_01]: It's funny because outside of their podcast platforms, they haven't built and sold businesses.
22:26
[SPEAKER_01]: So you would think that they would want to lean into that, but they don't.
22:28
[SPEAKER_01]: There was one woman who has a business, who has a company and also has a female founded podcast.
22:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And I reached out to her and I said, do you want to do a pot swap?
22:35
[SPEAKER_01]: never heard back from her, but she's younger.
22:38
[SPEAKER_01]: I point that out because as you know, a lot of the women in the forum, most of them are over 40, and I think that's really just been who is magnetized towards me and my personality and my way of doing business, but also to that mindset, right?
22:52
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't care about that stuff.
22:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't care about follower count or like I just don't care.
22:57
[SPEAKER_01]: That BS is like, you know, I don't stand for it.
23:00
[SPEAKER_01]: The networking community that I have created is really
23:03
[SPEAKER_01]: No gatekeeping, it's sharing resources and like having conversations and working with your competition and like all of those things lend itself to conversation, which lend itself to relationships, which ultimately have created friendships and that is why this community is so strong because people really know each other
23:22
[SPEAKER_00]: It's exactly right.
23:23
[SPEAKER_00]: All those things that makes the atmosphere welcoming for friendship.
23:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, I want to tell you something that I didn't get a chance to prepare you for.
23:30
[SPEAKER_00]: That I want us to also point out why being part of a network is a very powerful thing.
23:35
[SPEAKER_00]: You can ask friends in your network and community to do things for you that you would really not ask a regular friend to.
23:42
[SPEAKER_00]: You can ask a regular friend once in a while, but it can get annoying.
23:45
[SPEAKER_00]: One of the most popular things I see in social media because to remind everyone social media feeds you, stuff that knows you're interested in, especially TikTok.
23:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Practically, every post out there where people are on their complaining that their friends don't like their social media posts.
23:59
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a big thing.
24:00
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm not going to say I've never felt that way before in my life.
24:03
[SPEAKER_00]: I have grown from that because I study friendships so much and I really understand the difference between your work stuff and your personal stuff.
24:12
[SPEAKER_00]: So if I were to post a picture of my kids, it would get gazillion, you know, hearts us up.
24:16
[SPEAKER_00]: If I'm like, this is the next episode, it can be crickets.
24:19
[SPEAKER_00]: And that can feel hurtful, right?
24:21
[SPEAKER_00]: It can feel hurtful in a networking group.
24:24
[SPEAKER_00]: You can expect that people will like your stuff.
24:27
[SPEAKER_00]: If that's something that we all kind of need to grow our presence there, that's just one piece of the business.
24:33
[SPEAKER_00]: I got a question in my sub-stack.
24:35
[SPEAKER_00]: My sub-stack that Dior Nina, dot sub-stack, dot com once a month, I do an anonymous, I get a lot of anonymous questions.
24:41
[SPEAKER_00]: I only answer it once a month.
24:42
[SPEAKER_00]: The one I got, I titled them, it's not like the person titles it.
24:45
[SPEAKER_00]: I titled their question, do you make yourself smaller around certain friends?
24:50
[SPEAKER_00]: And her question was along the lines of, I have these friends and whenever I bring up work, they change the subject, they clearly aren't that interested.
24:56
[SPEAKER_00]: I just don't feel like I can be my full self.
24:59
[SPEAKER_00]: And part of my answer, I said, you should never feel like you can't be yourself around friends.
25:03
[SPEAKER_00]: And yes, you should be able to talk about work, but my answers are usually not what people expect.
25:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Your friends in that sign up to be your colleagues to be your follower, to be your fan, to be your constant, like, or, and comment, or maybe what you need.
25:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Isn't that working group?
25:21
[SPEAKER_00]: That was part of my answer.
25:22
[SPEAKER_00]: Like maybe you don't need your friends to do that, only she would really know that.
25:26
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's like something's missing in her life.
25:27
[SPEAKER_00]: She doesn't have a place to really talk about work.
25:30
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to talk about work with my friends to be very honest.
25:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And usually unless they ask me what's going on, I don't really bring it up.
25:37
[SPEAKER_01]: I do have very supportive friends who do follow me and ask me and they'll see something that I post on social media and they'll want to know more.
25:44
[SPEAKER_01]: And I feel very lucky.
25:45
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I would say to the first part of that,
25:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Question, maybe find some new friends because you want to feel subverted by your friends.
25:50
[SPEAKER_01]: You should be able to be yourself.
25:51
[SPEAKER_01]: At least feel proud of the things that you do and I do share.
25:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I share with my friends when I'm proud of something that happens at work.
25:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I always do because I know they want to know certain friends, you know, my closest friends.
26:01
[SPEAKER_01]: But to your point, I don't share the nitty gritties of the nuances of the day or like if I have a customer service issue or whatever it might be.
26:08
[SPEAKER_01]: with anyone that wouldn't understand it.
26:11
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't share that with my friend who works in corporate real estate.
26:14
[SPEAKER_01]: She wouldn't know, nor does she care.
26:16
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, and I understand that.
26:17
[SPEAKER_01]: So yes, to your point, I do think you need to surround yourself with a group of women, especially if you're a female entrepreneur who can understand that.
26:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And you would probably feel a void that's filled.
26:30
[SPEAKER_01]: You would probably feel that void to be very honest with you.
26:33
[SPEAKER_01]: This person probably doesn't even realize that that kind of relationship exists.
26:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, and that's what I'm hoping this episode will introduce people to the idea of who aren't part of a network for your network is for somebody owns a business, but there's other kinds of networks out there that you could find, and I would go as far as to say if it doesn't, then maybe to create it.
26:52
[SPEAKER_00]: And it could just be a Facebook group, even.
26:54
[SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't have to be the whole thing where people are paying and everything.
26:57
[SPEAKER_00]: You need places where that part of our lives are, it's a box we can check.
27:03
[SPEAKER_00]: We can ask somebody that sort of nitty-gritty thing like, I have this post up, can you comment on it?
27:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Which I think you have to be careful about that with your friends.
27:12
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why you just agree with all those social media posts.
27:14
[SPEAKER_00]: Basically, they say, in these posts, your friends aren't like in your posts or haters.
27:18
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, mmm.
27:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Everyone uses social media differently.
27:21
[SPEAKER_01]: You know I don't agree with that and I think that's a ridiculous stipulation to put on your friend.
27:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And I actually have a friend who has a now X friend who really used to come down hard on her.
27:32
[SPEAKER_01]: You don't like my social posts for my business, my friend was like
27:36
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not like on social media all the time, and I buy things from your business all the time, that's how I support your business, and so I think that that's like a ridiculous stipulation.
27:44
[SPEAKER_01]: I also think that when you have a business you are usually on social media more than the average person.
27:50
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
27:50
[SPEAKER_01]: And you see things more than the average person.
27:53
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't always assume that my friends have seen what I've posted.
27:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I realize I am online more than they are.
28:00
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel that way too.
28:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
28:01
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm definitely an online person.
28:03
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll get in the comments of these young people's posts, and I'm like, listen, this is a cautionary tale.
28:09
[SPEAKER_00]: You're going to ruin your friendships.
28:11
[SPEAKER_00]: This is not a good expectation, and then they're like, you're old.
28:13
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't know what you're talking about.
28:14
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, okay.
28:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Good luck.
28:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Call me in 10 years.
28:16
[SPEAKER_00]: See if these people are your friends.
28:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Because like I said, you're regular friends to not sign up to be your forever customer fan followers.
28:23
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just not a good idea.
28:24
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's okay to keep it separate.
28:26
[SPEAKER_00]: The final thing, and then we'll wrap it up.
28:29
[SPEAKER_00]: In a networking situation, you probably haven't had to deal with this in the forum, hopefully, yeah, because it's still only been year-ish, old, a little over a year.
28:37
[SPEAKER_00]: What happens if two people sign up who, so we talked about people signing up for, and this is just for your network, but anyone's in a networking group?
28:45
[SPEAKER_00]: We talked about people signing up who are in the same business and aren't so sure about that.
28:48
[SPEAKER_00]: What about people who know each other in real life?
28:51
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you have to have people who don't want to sign up?
28:52
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's say because like, oh, they know so and so and they're already not friends.
28:55
[SPEAKER_01]: You know what?
28:56
[SPEAKER_01]: I haven't.
28:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I've had people who I've had so many people sign up because someone's referred them.
29:01
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's the best way that I have marketed my business.
29:04
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's, you know, the deer found reforms I think speaks for itself and the women inside want to encourage other women.
29:11
[SPEAKER_01]: They know to join and they do so graciously.
29:13
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the most amazing community.
29:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I've never had someone come to me and say, oh, I'm uncomfortable that someone's in this that I know or whatever it might be.
29:21
[SPEAKER_01]: But truthfully, I think that if someone's uncomfortable and it's up to them to leave or to ask for a refund or whatever it might be.
29:27
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm the facilitator.
29:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not the manager of people's friendships at offline.
29:31
[SPEAKER_01]: And so, unfortunately, if you can't handle that, then maybe this isn't the right community for you.
29:36
[SPEAKER_01]: But I also would say, maybe if you have someone that you don't like in the community, maybe it's a good opportunity to try to mend that fence.
29:44
[SPEAKER_01]: in a different space.
29:45
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a different space and like the work that you might have in common, even again, if you're not in the same business, but you both have to hire people, you both are trying to figure out insurance or whatever it is you're both doing in your business, that can be the commonality.
29:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes the not personal nature of work is what makes networking kind of a nice part of life that could turn social, but it doesn't have to.
30:05
[SPEAKER_00]: It could stay as a work kind of a relationship, too.
30:08
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I would absolutely say that you don't have to take every relationship in your professional life into a friendship.
30:15
[SPEAKER_01]: And if you have a former friendship, you can still be friends with people and be cordial to people that are in your professional space.
30:23
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that we're a cordial.
30:24
[SPEAKER_00]: We do not use it enough.
30:26
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like friendly.
30:26
[SPEAKER_00]: It's another way of saying that.
30:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Not everybody has to be friends.
30:29
[SPEAKER_00]: And there is a place for being friendly, respectful, helpful, part of networking is being helpful, giving and taking.
30:35
[SPEAKER_00]: What is the final thing you would love our listeners to know about creating some sort of network community?
30:40
[SPEAKER_01]: I would just say, don't discount it and don't count it out.
30:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Your community for yourself, your own community, is really and truly what's going to fuel the growth in your business if it is a business type of relationship.
30:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that people are so surprised by what they get out of the deer founder for.
30:58
[SPEAKER_01]: I know I've been surprised by what I've gotten out of the deer founder for them.
31:01
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I thought this was going to be way more business oriented.
31:05
[SPEAKER_01]: and there definitely is some gray space now because I have formed friendships with a lot of these women and I look forward to meeting them.
31:11
[SPEAKER_01]: But I would say it's funny that you're asking me this too.
31:14
[SPEAKER_01]: So Pam Sunshine who you had on the podcast said to me recently because she's like an
31:20
[SPEAKER_01]: In adjacent to the dear found her forum, she's a big part of our world and she said to me Lindsay, I didn't even realize what I was missing.
31:26
[SPEAKER_01]: She said I didn't realize that this whole community existed, I would have a place among other women business owners that are so amazing.
31:33
[SPEAKER_01]: I would just tell anyone who is a business owner, you have to find time and space for these kinds of relationships because they will fill you up and they will ultimately propel your business forward.
31:48
[SPEAKER_00]: The whole journey in a world has gotten a lot bigger with advice that gotten from you, support from other people in the forum, and so I'm really grateful.
31:55
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so glad you created it, and I'm glad that I somehow we kind of discussed it on your podcast, decided to sign up even though I didn't feel like I was big enough.
32:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I have really enjoyed watching you grow over this last year and expand your space.
32:09
[SPEAKER_01]: And also, I really enjoyed getting to know you and becoming friends with you.
32:12
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we couldn't even stop talking before we hit record today.
32:15
[SPEAKER_01]: We had to force ourselves to hit that record button.
32:19
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't wait to see where this continues to go.
32:21
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I think you are doing a really great job.
32:24
[SPEAKER_01]: I love that you've embraced everything that the forum has had to offer to really propel you in that right direction.
32:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
32:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Lindsay, as I tell listeners at the end of every episode, they should come back next week when our friendships are going well.
32:36
[SPEAKER_00]: We are having an all around.
32:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Bye.