Latest / The Curve / RTC129: The Curve's new chapter: welcoming Danielle Croome.

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RTC129: The Curve's new chapter: welcoming Danielle Croome. · The Curve

0:00
Welcome to Raising the Curth, a podcast designed to teach you everything you need to know
0:05
to be better with your money.
0:07
And the wise words of Amy Schumer were slipping carrots into the brownie recipe.
0:11
I don't really get the saying.
0:14
It's kind of like eating vegetables that actually taste good.
0:17
You know, I'm like, I'm still not ready to eat.
0:19
Are you on the script?
0:20
It's basically like saying, investing in finance can be boring, but it totally doesn't
0:26
need to be.
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OK, OK, so we're making it fun by putting the carrot.
0:31
OK, the vegetables are just good for you.
0:33
It's the brownie recipe.
0:34
OK, we got there, we got there.
0:36
OK, OK, well, you've really got a finance, right?
0:38
Yeah, one of us has to.
0:40
This is true.
0:41
OK, come and learn alongside me from Vick Harris, ex-fun manager,
0:45
where I'm going to ask all the questions that you wish you could.
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And I'm going to be eating all the brownie you wish you could.
0:50
No, that's so not the joke, Vick.
0:53
Oh, OK, just come and talk and learn and laugh with us.
0:56
Because together, we really can raise the curve.
1:00
We have some of the studio at home.
1:03
We need to give a lot of context as to why she's here.
1:06
She ended up being in studio with us.
1:09
And this is something we've kind of bred crumbed for a while, haven't we?
1:13
Like, the idea of what's going on behind the scenes at the curve,
1:17
with the business, we, I would have been maybe like three or four months ago.
1:22
And we were both just drowning in work.
1:25
Yeah.
1:26
And I remember we had to, like, I randomly just jumped on,
1:30
use my microphone.
1:31
I was like out in the country.
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We weren't even in London at the time.
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I think we'd just maybe moved.
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And we put out this like three minute episode just being like,
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we're raising money.
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We're not doing an episode this week.
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We'll be back, you know?
1:45
We're drowning in inviscimedings.
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Yeah.
1:49
And so basically, what's been happening for the last few months?
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Well, actually, we've been thinking about it for a while.
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It's just that we knew we had to pause all business activity
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to be able to focus on it.
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Because people were like, it's like a full-time job.
2:01
And we were like, yeah, well, even if it's not that hard.
2:03
And then we're like, oh, gosh, yeah.
2:05
Okay, everyone was right.
2:06
Yes, yes, yes.
2:07
So we basically decided at the start of this year,
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although we had thought about it for like, I don't know, maybe a year and a half,
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that we wanted to take external capital and investors to be involved in the curve.
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And what that effectively means is that they buy a part of the business
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and give you cash.
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And then you can go and spin that.
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How you wish.
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We put that club out.
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We were talking to investors at the time.
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We were reaching out to people.
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But then what happened when we put that episode out,
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which we did not expect, was like, business desk being like,
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oh, cool, you're raising capital.
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Like, can we ride an article?
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And people from the community were like, can we?
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And it was unexpected and totally not the point of putting that out.
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But in hindsight, quite genius.
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Because someone who came through and out emails
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was someone who's sitting right next to us.
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Danny, I don't even know where to start.
2:58
What did you think when you first heard that episode?
3:01
And was that the way that you heard that we were looking for investors?
3:04
I actually saw that you were looking for investors on LinkedIn.
3:07
We did do a LinkedIn post.
3:09
Yeah.
3:10
Then also saw or listened to the podcast.
3:13
And as soon as I heard that,
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something was just ticking over in my brain.
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And I actually was thinking about it for a couple of weeks before
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we got in touch.
3:24
Actually, the special guest is Miso.
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Yeah.
3:27
So just for context, no one can say this,
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but Miso is holding Danny's hand and looking her thumb right now.
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And as soon as Danny stops, she's like, excuse me.
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And tips are really part of the team.
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Yeah.
3:37
Yeah.
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So as soon as I saw that there was an opportunity,
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I thought about it.
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And it just kept coming back to the forefront of my mind again and again.
3:47
Miso again and again and again.
3:49
And it became something that just made sense.
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And I was in a point of my life,
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where I was looking for what my next move was going to be.
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And so in terms of investing,
4:00
I was searching for the next company that I wanted to sort of put money into and see grow.
4:05
I'm intrigued to know what made you think that the curve was a good business to understand.
4:10
I want to like really best self-guess.
4:12
I want 100% that and not Sophie.
4:14
I just want to tune out on Trumpets.
4:16
Why did you think we were so good?
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Honestly, the potential for the market of women wanting to learn is so vast to me,
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even with you guys being in business for three, four years that you have.
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There's so many people I have conversations with on a day-to-day basis that have no awareness
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of financial literacy, no access to that kind of information.
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They're kind of awkward when they have the conversations.
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They really want to know more.
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And they're looking for a community just like the curve.
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So it just was a no-brainer to me.
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Having lived in different countries throughout the world,
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I talked to different people from different countries all the time in my friendship groups
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and they were always mentioning.
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That's so cool.
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I'd love to be a part of something like that.
4:59
I think that's how I felt about the curve when we first talked about it.
5:02
Because I remember that mentioned it and it was almost just a slight light bulb moment.
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Sometimes when people bring out like a product and you're like,
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how has that never existed?
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And I had the same feeling.
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It was just it's hard to explain.
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It was like, oh my gosh.
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That's so a no-brainer and it's like, yeah.
5:21
Yeah, and I totally understand that.
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And I guess for people listening,
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so I guess just to sort of, I was about to say,
5:27
circle back, just to go back to the idea of investors.
5:30
So we have taken, how many total is it there?
5:34
We have 10 investors now.
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So we've officially closed the round,
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which is like investor chat that we sort of
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learned very much on the job, didn't we?
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It was like, the amount of lingo,
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it's like a very steep learning curve for us.
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Because we've obviously never done that before.
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But Danny, spoiler, one of the investors in the curve.
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And basically, what happened was,
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we spoke to Danny where we were like,
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oh my gosh, she was the managing partner of a really amazing digital agency in New Zealand.
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We met her before.
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Wow, what a compliment.
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And also so great because being a digital business and neither of us are like,
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and it's a digital setting where we're like,
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such an area we struggled with.
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And so I remember having the conversation with you and you were like,
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yeah, yeah, no, I'd be interested.
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We both had this light bulb moment that we were like,
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we were like, hold on a second.
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What are you doing for work?
6:22
I remember that call.
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It was a week really difficult.
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I did a little talk to that guy before.
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We went for an investor chat.
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And then your halfway through, we were both like,
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hold on.
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And I was like, looked at you like, go for it.
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Go for it.
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We didn't even talk about it.
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It just sort of happened.
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And I think, you know, I guess just anyone that's got like,
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five emails from us and one go, or like,
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seen some shitty ads.
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No, I was about to say, before Danny, like,
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I hate to think what some of our digital, you know,
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like, we don't know digital strategy.
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We're like, through a few dollars behind random ads.
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And we'd get messages from people being like,
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hey, just so you know, you've spanned me 25 times today.
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We're like, sorry.
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Or just so you know, this hasn't been updated.
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And still saying like, 2022 was something I was like, oh gosh.
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But also just, I guess firstly, apologies for any of that.
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But thank you for sticking with us and not like,
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being like, god, these girls are useless.
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But that was kind of, I guess, the main thing for us.
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We were like, how amazing to have someone
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that knows the space really well.
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Could we maybe just before we continue,
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that explain the key differences between,
7:25
because a lot of people refer to investing companies
7:28
as angel investing, which you may or may not have heard of.
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The idea of that is investing in private companies.
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So once you can't find on the stock exchange,
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and then what we talk about all the time on the curve
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is investing in the stock market, you know, public companies.
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So I guess maybe just for people listening,
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can we just differentiate?
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Because there was 10 people who invested in the curve.
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But they're very different people
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and at a very different financial stage than what most people
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listening would be at.
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And I think it's important to like,
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differentiate because I didn't know what this was until recently.
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I guess we're investing in companies that are public.
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So that's companies that are on the stock exchange.
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It's what we talk about a lot.
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You know, companies like Visa, MasterCard, Uber,
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like all that, they're all public companies.
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So you can literally go onto a trading platform,
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type them in by the shares,
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and then you become a shareholder.
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Very easy.
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You can also sell your shares very easily.
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So if you're like, oops, I actually invested too much,
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or I've reached my goal now,
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and I want to sell my stock,
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you can do it literally with a push of a button.
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It's very what we call liquid.
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So there's lots of people buying and selling those shares,
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making it easy to transact.
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With investing in private companies,
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they're not part of an exchange.
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They're not listed in an exchange.
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They don't attend the market.
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You know when we talk about the farmer's market.
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They're not at the farmer's market.
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So they, it's a bit more difficult.
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Explain the farmer's market analogy for anyone.
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Yeah, that is so exciting.
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So a stock exchange is like a farmer's market.
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It's like a centralized place where everyone goes
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to buy and sell shares.
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So the companies go, they have stalls.
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Selling apples and oranges, for example,
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and that's like the companies.
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And then you have all the investors that go
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and they buy and sell the stock.
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There's the stock.
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Yeah, the reason that we use the,
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I guess the farmer's market analogy is the idea that
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there's lots of different types of companies
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with lots of different industries,
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selling different services, technology, blah, blah, blah.
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So if you were to go to a farmer's market,
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there's lots of different products.
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There's heaps of different firm vegetables.
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There's cheeses, there's bread.
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The idea of going...
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It's like an auction house as well, you know?
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Like you would go there, you've got all the art,
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cars, whatever you're buying,
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and you've got all the people there bidding.
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Like that's effectively what a stock exchange is.
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It's kind of like that.
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So with private companies,
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they don't belong to a stock exchange.
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They're not listed,
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they're not public,
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means that their financials aren't
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open to the public and all of that.
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So they're a bit more,
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it's a bit more tricky to invest in them.
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And do you think tricky is for many reasons
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the fact that,
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firstly, it's really hard to even find out
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about opportunities for private companies.
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Like I didn't even...
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I think up until recently,
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I wasn't really even aware of how those conversations happened.
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And now I think that we've gone through the process.
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I've heard lots of other people talking about companies.
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And I'm like, I know Danny,
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you were speaking about one not that long ago,
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but it was like within the lingerie space.
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And I was like, wow, that's awesome.
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And I looked it up and I was like,
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I didn't invest in that.
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I mean, obviously that was just at first glance.
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But it is definitely more of a not elitist,
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but it's not a publicized opportunity.
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And that's why when we had so many
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investments is because we have to go out,
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find those people, talk to them and sell our business.
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Whereas if we're on a stock exchange,
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you're just on there and people effectively come to you.
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Or, you know, there's not that actively going out
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and finding those investors from a company point of view.
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And there's not investors having to go and actively find
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those companies if you're public.
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So you kind of have to do a lot of the hustle.
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And what about the risk profile,
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which is like the idea of how risky is the investment,
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because the stock market, there's regulation,
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there's all sorts of like, I guess like,
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they're under the microscope from a legal perspective,
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differently with a private company.
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How would you compare how risky it would be?
11:16
That's one side of it, yes.
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There's rules and regulations that you have to buy by
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if you're on a public company on a stock exchange.
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There's two other things as well,
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which make investing privately more risky.
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And that is that usually it's smaller, younger companies.
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So they don't have that track record yet.
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You know, if you're investing in the likes of Amazon
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or Adobe, for example, those companies have been around
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for a very, very long time,
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they're now big enough to be on a stock exchange.
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Whereas companies like the curve,
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only been around a couple of years.
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We haven't got ahead that track record
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of revenue growth, profit growth,
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or you know, been through economic cycles, all of that.
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So there's that part of it.
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There's also the other part is the liquidity,
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which was kind of what I was talking about before,
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is that if shit hits the fan,
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it's very hard.
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You can't just press sell and sell your shares and get out.
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You have to go and actively find someone to buy your shares.
12:15
Do you know what?
12:15
So there's interesting that you use that as an example,
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because just yesterday, I can't remember
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what the company was.
12:23
Oh, it was my flatmates company.
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They're not public.
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So it's a private company.
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They've got like 350 employees.
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And the CEO and the founder left recently.
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They've now got a new founder.
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So in terms of raising when you're a private company,
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there's like pre-seed, seed series, A, B,
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like it's honestly, it's a whole other language.
12:44
But he was saying they're like, you know,
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they've raised maybe like 15 times blah, blah, blah.
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And I was saying to him, I was like, why?
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Because they were saying this is the first time they've raised
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where the company, it wasn't like a positive raise.
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They weren't raising at a time where the business had increased in value.
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And I was like putting my little hat on
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with all of Vic's knowledge.
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I'm like, well, did the CEO leave and sell all their shares?
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And he was like, no, because like, who would he sell them to?
13:13
You know, it's, and I just had that moment.
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I was like, oh, of course, because like if the curve starts doing shit
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and where the biggest shit hold is.
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You can't go and be like, hey, do you want to buy my shirt?
13:21
Hey, do you want to buy my shit company?
13:22
Yeah.
13:23
Oh my god, can we touch them wood?
13:24
Sorry, but then on the, on the, on the flip side of that,
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is that we're the largest shareholder.
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So if the curve does fantastically well,
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we benefit from that.
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And that's, that's the risk is that it could go either way.
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And that's the risk that Denny's taken.
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It's like, I'm going to invest in you guys
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because I think there's a killing in your amazing.
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It's so worth it.
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So worth it.
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It's worth an amount.
13:44
That's what you said.
13:45
Yeah, incredible market potential.
13:46
But sure, sure, sure, sure, it's a person else who based.
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That's feeling like she needs a better, I think,
13:52
affirmation.
13:53
Love your work, guys.
13:54
Yeah.
13:55
Thank you so much.
13:55
Thanks, thanks, thanks.
13:58
I lost my train a bit.
13:58
Yeah, well, I guess so it's like she's investing in it
14:00
because she thinks she's going to get,
14:01
her investment is going to grow and grow and grow.
14:03
But this is coming back to this liquidity thing,
14:05
is that like you kind of are forced to take a long-term view
14:09
if you're investing in private companies.
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Because Denny can't invest and then be like,
14:13
actually, I really want to buy a car.
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Can I get that money out again tomorrow?
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And it's like, no, no, no.
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Like, you have to now wait until we do another capital raise.
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Free career.
14:24
Oh, I'm just sorry.
14:25
I'm like, I know.
14:26
Do you diligence has been done?
14:27
Yeah, there you go.
14:29
But also, it's, yeah, worth knowing that if I wanted to
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in three or four years' time,
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even if that was an option,
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you'd have to approve the person that sold that before.
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They'll share it for me.
14:38
You can't sell to a computer, be like,
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I'll actually have got this person over here
14:43
that runs a financial female platform
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that wants to buy my shares.
14:48
Yes.
14:48
So that is the difference.
14:49
So there's kind of three types of investors
14:52
and invest in private companies.
14:53
It's angel investors.
14:55
So these are individuals with lots of money.
14:59
There is venture capital, which is VC funds.
15:01
They invest in early stage companies.
15:04
So companies that it might be an idea even.
15:07
They might not even have a product or any revenue.
15:09
And then there's, can I say something on that,
15:11
which I thought was so interesting.
15:12
Because, you know, like Vic always says,
15:14
invest in what you know, invest in what you like,
15:17
all of that stuff,
15:18
when we started going through this process
15:19
and we did talk to a few venture capital funds,
15:22
it's exactly the same.
15:23
Like VC funds will invest in either deep tech
15:27
or, you know, they have their niches.
15:29
And it's exactly the same concept as being an everyday investor
15:33
except it's a company version where you have to fit
15:36
a certain niche otherwise they're like,
15:37
well, we don't know your business, so we're not going to bother.
15:40
Well, also for them, they have to focus on something.
15:41
There's so many startups and so many new companies.
15:45
It's like, okay, we're going to focus on consumer tech
15:47
and we're going to know that industry and what moves
15:49
in industry and what businesses are good and what ones are bad
15:52
and like so that we can pick the best ones.
15:53
Do you know what I mean?
15:54
If you spread yourself to a thin,
15:55
you don't end up knowing anything about anything.
15:57
And then private equity was the last one.
15:59
They invest more later stage.
16:01
So they usually invest just before a company goes public.
16:04
So they're kind of investing in established companies
16:07
but they're not public yet, if that makes sense.
16:10
And in terms of amounts,
16:11
those three types of investors would invest.
16:12
It's like, angel is usually smaller,
16:15
under 100K generally, right?
16:17
Nala under a million.
16:18
Oh, wow.
16:18
Yeah, or even like five million.
16:20
It depends on how wealthy the person is.
16:23
And then venture capital could be anything from
16:29
500,000 to 10 million.
16:31
And then private equity is that bigger,
16:33
much bigger than that.
16:34
But then there's private equity companies
16:35
and there's little amounts.
16:36
So it just totally depends.
16:37
A private equity is like,
16:38
I feel as though I've met so many guys
16:42
or friends whose boyfriends are in private equity.
16:45
You know, I never really understood what it was.
16:47
Like I'm in PE.
16:48
I'm like, well, you know that equity is like,
16:51
is capital, it's money, it's cash, it's shares.
16:53
Like that's what equity means.
16:54
So private equity is like,
16:56
it's like saying, you could just go back to the fair.
17:00
I invest in public equity.
17:03
Love that.
17:04
Yeah.
17:05
Yeah.
17:06
Feel like real big duck energy.
17:08
Yeah.
17:09
They're like, I'm in private equity and you're like,
17:10
oh, I invest in public equity.
17:11
Yeah.
17:12
So Danny, back to you.
17:13
Sorry, I feel like we've just hijacked.
17:14
It's not like, I guess in terms of like,
17:16
now just for context what she's doing.
17:18
So Danny has lived in like many places,
17:21
which we'll get to in a second,
17:22
but was living in New Zealand and has now relocated over here,
17:25
which we love.
17:26
So exciting.
17:27
Yeah.
17:27
And she's our commercial director,
17:30
which is just honestly, such a relief,
17:33
because I was just flailing around in the wind,
17:36
trying to do sponsor shifts.
17:38
And we had a strategy day last week.
17:40
And I was just, I came out of that and I was like,
17:43
gosh, if so, I'm tired of that.
17:44
We've got so many tangents.
17:45
Oh, yeah.
17:46
We, we definitely did during the day.
17:48
Danny's like, right, guys,
17:49
I'll get back to it.
17:50
Oh, I'd even remember that.
17:51
And by the end, we were just like,
17:54
yeah, we did get really two kids that are just over.
17:56
Yeah.
17:57
By about 3 PM, I was like, I've lost them.
17:59
I've lost them.
18:00
I'm wrapped up.
18:01
But like, so I guess anyone listening,
18:04
whether you work at a corporate,
18:05
like one of the things that we're going to be focusing on
18:07
in the next year or two,
18:08
is the curved classroom is something that we just
18:11
have realized there's so much opportunity
18:14
for massive companies that want to invest in there,
18:16
particularly their famous stuff.
18:17
But I guess honestly, it could be any gender
18:20
on upskilling when it comes to financial literacy.
18:23
So if you either like work in a big company
18:26
or you want to like actually get access to that,
18:29
let us know because we can put Danny in touch with
18:32
and we have you work.
18:33
But to have someone that actually knows what they're up to,
18:36
that's going to now be Danny.
18:37
So just in case anyone's lost thing.
18:40
And they're like, oh, stunning news.
18:42
I know it was brand.
18:43
They want to like re-reach out because they didn't like it.
18:45
Yeah, I'm dealing with stuff.
18:47
Yeah, you won't get an out of office saying,
18:49
I'll be back to you in two to four weeks.
18:50
Oh, no.
18:51
Corn little soft, she was trying so hard.
18:54
She was struggling a lot of balls.
18:55
It was a lot of amazing jobs.
18:57
We're so happy to have you.
18:58
It's honestly such a relief.
19:00
Yeah.
19:01
What other things do you have in your portfolio?
19:03
And how did you get yourself to a place
19:05
financially where you'd invested in other assets
19:08
before you went to like angel investing
19:10
or private company investing?
19:11
So in terms of what's in my portfolio,
19:13
I mainly invest in ETFs.
19:16
So I have got about 30% of my portfolios in the S&P 500.
19:21
Another 30% of my portfolio is in the,
19:24
the Nasdaq 100.
19:25
And that's the top 100 companies on the Nasdaq.
19:29
Because you can also invest in the broader aspect of the Nasdaq.
19:32
So you can just put it in to, I mean,
19:35
I think fidelity has got a really broad fund
19:37
that you can invest in.
19:38
But why would you?
19:39
So there's the New York Stock Exchange.
19:40
Yeah.
19:41
And there's the Nasdaq Stock Exchange
19:43
two major stock exchanges in the US.
19:45
The S&P 500 is a combination of companies.
19:49
From both.
19:49
From both.
19:50
The Nasdaq 100 is the top 100 companies,
19:53
purely on the Nasdaq.
19:54
Why would you bother investing in more than that?
19:57
Because it,
19:58
that is perhaps the risk.
20:00
So it's broader.
20:02
You're just putting into, I mean,
20:03
5,000, 10,000 companies instead of that top 100.
20:08
Also, because if you're investing in the S&P 500,
20:10
a lot of the stocks are in the S&P 500 as well.
20:14
From the Nasdaq humane.
20:16
Sorry, if you're missing in the Nasdaq.
20:17
Yeah.
20:18
Yeah, sorry.
20:18
Yeah.
20:18
So if you're missing in the Nasdaq 100,
20:20
a lot of those will be in the S&P 500.
20:21
Like, yeah.
20:22
And such.
20:23
So it's a good way if you want to double down.
20:25
I'm like, more growthy tech,
20:27
high returning companies,
20:29
that that's usually what the Nasdaq
20:31
Stock Exchange is about.
20:32
So yeah, you've gone right.
20:34
I'm going to invest broadly in the S&P 500,
20:36
the top 500 companies in the US.
20:37
You're like, but I want a bit more growth,
20:40
a bit more of the kind of high growth tech companies
20:43
that are in the S&P 500.
20:45
So I'm going to invest in the Nasdaq as well.
20:46
But I don't want to invest in the individually in terms of stocks.
20:48
Yeah.
20:49
Okay, cool.
20:49
And then I've got a couple of individual stocks
20:52
that I've held for a while.
20:53
Spotify is one of them.
20:54
Oh, love that.
20:55
Yes.
20:55
I also invest in AMD.
20:58
What is that?
20:58
See, making doctors, like chips and money.
21:01
Well, doing very well at the moment, guys.
21:02
He hasn't recently.
21:03
But it does.
21:03
He's over the long term.
21:04
And a couple of others as well.
21:05
I know.
21:06
I feel it as well.
21:06
Yeah, cool.
21:07
And then do you generally invest in lots of different
21:10
private companies,
21:11
or do you kind of do a larger amount on a fewer,
21:13
like what would be your...
21:15
Yeah, so I would generally only have
21:18
an investment in one private company at a time.
21:21
So when I was invested in the last company,
21:23
I had put a significant amount of money into that.
21:25
And as it's worked out with the curve as well,
21:28
a very kind of active investor in that sense.
21:31
It's quite a good way to do it, I think.
21:32
I think it's like, I'm not just going to invest.
21:34
And they go out my gate and kind of forget about it.
21:37
You're like, I'm going to invest,
21:38
enjoy the company so that I'm a master of my own destiny.
21:40
Well, it's lacking yourself, you know.
21:41
It's going, I believe in my abilities
21:44
to help create what I think can happen with this company.
21:48
So I'm going to double down on this.
21:50
With your last company that you invested in,
21:52
the private one,
21:53
what did you get a good return on that by the time you left?
21:57
Yes, I got over 100% return.
22:00
Wow, congratulations.
22:02
That's amazing.
22:03
Thank you very much.
22:04
Let's aim for 250.
22:05
Wow, oh my god, that's incredible DNA.
22:08
Yeah, that is amazing.
22:09
God, that's cool.
22:11
No pressure, that's...
22:12
But that's not...
22:12
I know.
22:13
I mean, that's not a sum of just my efforts.
22:16
You know what I mean?
22:16
I know, but you were an incredible team,
22:19
an incredible strategy that was, you know,
22:22
made by people within the business.
22:25
It is a sum of all parts, you know.
22:26
Oh, of course it is.
22:27
Not just me.
22:28
No, it's a curve, does what we know it can do.
22:30
I'm not at the end, I'm going to go,
22:32
nailed it.
22:33
No, but I think that you're right.
22:34
It's definitely a combination of efforts,
22:37
but I think to be able to spot a private company
22:39
that you believe in,
22:41
to then be able to know you can put your efforts
22:44
and skills towards that,
22:45
and be a part of that growth story.
22:47
Like, what a satisfying way to invest,
22:49
where it's not just sitting forget,
22:51
it's not just in the S&P 500,
22:52
like, you're doing that as well.
22:54
Yeah.
22:54
But I think there's something kind of, like,
22:56
it's a different type of gratification
22:58
when you see the return.
22:59
And I think we need to also understand
23:01
that there's that kind of time of the market as well.
23:04
Not timing the market,
23:05
but the moment that that investment was made
23:08
was just a really good time in market.
23:11
And it worked out for the best.
23:13
It's unrealistic to expect any of my future investments
23:17
to achieve that within that timeframe.
23:18
There's also the element of, like,
23:20
if this isn't doing well,
23:22
okay, what can I do to get in there and make it do well?
23:24
You can't do that with Apple.
23:26
You can't buy shares in Apple,
23:27
and then be like,
23:28
hang on, your share price is going down,
23:29
I need to get in there and help.
23:30
Yeah, you can't put your own effort
23:33
into change the direction of a lot of companies,
23:35
because they're too big,
23:36
or too much of a small sheholder,
23:38
whereas for you, it's like,
23:39
okay, if we're missing targets,
23:40
it's like, okay, I need to hustle,
23:42
and you can kind of have a bit more input
23:45
in the return of your investment.
23:46
Yeah.
23:47
And that really suits my personality as well,
23:50
because I do like to be super involved in stuff,
23:52
and you guys have noticed that I'm not exactly chill.
23:56
They love our signings, it's okay.
23:58
But regular signings, yeah.
24:00
Can relate, can relate.
24:02
Like, I don't think anyone would describe
24:03
any of us as chill.
24:05
No.
24:05
You actually pick in a personal sense,
24:08
come across as chill.
24:09
Yeah.
24:10
But there's no other chill.
24:12
But they don't work with me.
24:14
Yeah, I think if we were able to tap into your head,
24:16
we would see a really different thing going on
24:18
than what you present.
24:19
Yes. So, Danny is our first proper employee.
24:22
She's our commercial director,
24:23
for anyone who wants anything to do with, you know,
24:27
literally anything to do with the curve.
24:29
Yeah.
24:29
Actually, we're just taking a full one to make.
24:31
Just come to me.
24:32
Come to me.
24:33
I guess we're dead in mind,
24:34
because a lot of people will start to like speak to you,
24:36
and be talking to you.
24:37
And I think that's what's really nice
24:39
when we work with brands,
24:40
or people or companies, is that it is,
24:43
we're not dealing with another huge agency,
24:45
like it's us.
24:45
Yeah.
24:46
So, for the sake of them knowing who you are
24:48
and introducing your money story and how you grew up,
24:52
we wanted to have a conversation about,
24:54
yeah, like where you came from,
24:55
and actually,
24:56
we were just saying before you recorded,
24:58
these are conversations we haven't even had with you.
25:00
So, I'm excited to like get to know a bit more about that.
25:03
I'm excited.
25:04
And this is like a veting process
25:05
for any employees of the curve.
25:07
They have to come on the podcast and devolve there,
25:09
letting money...
25:10
I love this veting process.
25:11
After you've signed.
25:12
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
25:14
Did you not read the fine print?
25:15
Oh, it sucks.
25:16
Love it.
25:17
So, where did you grow up?
25:19
What was your like family dynamic when you were younger?
25:22
Like, where are you from?
25:23
Because even your accent is hard to decipher.
25:25
My accent is the airport accent, you know?
25:28
I have lived in too many countries
25:30
and picked up inflections in all of them.
25:32
So, I've got this strange soft English accent
25:35
that sounds like Australian,
25:37
but I am very much British.
25:38
And I was born in Bristol
25:40
and moved 14, 15 years ago to Australia for the first time.
25:44
So, yeah.
25:45
So, you've been in the Southern Hemisphere
25:46
for like probably the same amount of time you had
25:48
on the side of the world.
25:49
Yeah, yeah.
25:50
I'd say that's fair to say.
25:51
I think there's been a couple of moves back and forth
25:53
which I'm sure we'll go into,
25:55
but upbringing was all Bristol-based.
25:58
And, um...
25:59
Do you feel at home here?
26:01
When you landed, were you like,
26:02
ah, um...
26:04
This is going to sound a bit sad,
26:05
but I don't really ever feel home anywhere.
26:08
I think, oh, girl, this is going to sound very...
26:11
This is going to sound very woo,
26:12
but I just feel at home wherever I am.
26:15
No, it is like the most beautiful thing ever.
26:17
Because I think as long as I'm feeling good
26:19
and I have made the right decision or move
26:21
for whatever it is that I'm passionate about,
26:23
most of the moves I've done
26:24
have either been based on relationships or work.
26:27
And as long as I'm connected and committed
26:29
to what I'm doing, it feels like home
26:31
and it feels like the right thing.
26:32
It's how it should be.
26:33
And also, home within yourself,
26:34
it's not a destination.
26:36
It's how you feel.
26:37
It's the people that you're surrounded by.
26:39
Like, really?
26:39
And I do think I'm probably the best
26:42
personal place I've been in in my life
26:45
in terms of feeling good, feeling balanced,
26:50
empowered, confident,
26:52
and enjoying all the moves that I've made in my life.
26:55
I think I'm in a good spot.
26:56
So, yes, I do feel at home.
26:58
Thanks to the curve.
26:59
I know, I'm like, no,
27:01
I'm pretty sure this new office has to be like
27:02
a real holiday vibe.
27:03
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
27:04
We put a little beat in the car
27:05
and we're all having a lot to stay the night.
27:08
So, do you think, I mean,
27:11
because we had like a little team dinner
27:13
not that long ago.
27:14
And we started talking about your childhood
27:16
and how you grew up.
27:17
And I mean, I wondered if you would be open
27:20
to speaking about that at all
27:22
and you can choose to what extent.
27:23
And then I guess the second question to that would be,
27:26
do you think that your ability to create home
27:28
for yourself wherever you are?
27:30
Maybe stems from the way you grew up?
27:32
100% but I did not put that together
27:34
until that second.
27:35
So, thank you for saving me thousands of dollars
27:37
in future therapy.
27:39
Yeah, well, I think anyone that knows me
27:41
knows that I'm a natural oversharer,
27:44
so no problem going into to childhood memories.
27:46
Great for a podcast.
27:47
So good for a podcast.
27:49
Family dynamic was quite strained and fractured
27:54
but in terms of money,
27:56
a really gloomy cloud on that subject for my whole childhood.
28:01
And I've spoken to my sister on this
28:02
and she has the similar experience
28:04
which is just validating to know
28:05
that it wasn't just me
28:06
and that she has the same memories
28:08
because you know how sometimes siblings
28:09
can just have a completely different memory
28:10
of your childhood.
28:11
Or experience.
28:12
Or experience.
28:13
Yeah.
28:13
And although we had individual experiences,
28:15
we definitely have common threads.
28:17
And shame around money is a really big one
28:20
from my childhood
28:21
and self-worth being tied into money.
28:25
So, to explain that a little bit more,
28:29
we never had any financial chats.
28:30
There was no pocket money situation.
28:32
It was very much,
28:34
we all started earning at a really young age,
28:38
younger than anyone I know.
28:39
As in, you got your first job?
28:41
Yeah, I mean,
28:43
some of them are related to family.
28:44
You know, some of them are,
28:45
you know, aunties paying you for Saturday,
28:46
jobs and stuff like that.
28:47
But most people would have done that
28:48
at age 13, 14, 15.
28:50
I had my first job at eight.
28:53
So, and that's what were you doing?
28:55
I was, my auntie had a Kabut stall.
28:59
So not just like those random Saturday ones
29:01
but a professional one where she would,
29:03
I think kind of illegally import pots and pans
29:05
and sell them out of literally the back of a van.
29:07
Oh my gosh, and you're a hello assistant?
29:09
We would wake up at three a.m.
29:10
on Saturday mornings
29:12
and drive to a Kabut in Tornton,
29:15
which is kind of near Bristol.
29:17
And we would be there from three a.m. to two p.m.
29:20
and I would get five pounds at the end of the day.
29:21
And my job was to build all of the displays and stuff.
29:25
So I would take the pots and pans out of the boxes
29:27
and display them and then put the price stickers and everything.
29:30
Oh my gosh.
29:30
It's pretty amazing at eight, honestly.
29:32
Like, I don't think I even knew how to like make my beer today.
29:35
That's incredible.
29:36
Yeah, I mean, we were all relatively independent
29:38
just because of the family dynamic kind of had to be.
29:42
But in terms of money education, there was none of it.
29:47
Do you remember what you did?
29:48
But those, like, if you were earning five pounds on a Saturday,
29:51
what did you, did you hide it in your room?
29:52
Like, where did it go?
29:53
So that's a lot of my sort of scarcity mindset,
29:56
which was my money mindset for a very, very long time.
29:59
I would even say up until last year,
30:01
I think I only really broke through this guest
30:03
in my set last year.
30:05
But up until then, yeah, at those times, I would come home
30:08
and I would hide it.
30:09
I did the same thing with everything, though.
30:11
Like, in terms of Easter eggs, I would get an Easter egg
30:16
and I would eat like a tiny piece of day for like three months.
30:19
So that long term investing thing
30:21
has always worked really well.
30:23
It wasn't, do you think, because you were playing opposites?
30:24
I would eat all the eggs.
30:25
I, she used to hide them, they would go off as, like,
30:28
to the point where it, like, that doesn't sound such a personality.
30:33
That is a, just like, I would put them in the fridge
30:36
and like, honestly, that'd be there for a year.
30:38
Do you think, did that come back to when you say,
30:41
like, the scarcity mindset and hiding things
30:43
and taking little bits at a time,
30:47
is that because there was your family
30:49
in a financial sense didn't have abundance in there for it?
30:52
It was like, you kind of had to like take bits
30:55
where you can, like, have you reflected on how that was
30:58
impacting you?
30:59
Yeah. Well, it's really interesting
31:01
because it's hard to know when you're a child
31:03
what's really going on behind the scenes
31:05
in terms of financial wealth and wellness within the family,
31:10
but we never wanted for anything material,
31:13
which is what's interesting because there would be an abundance of, you know,
31:16
croissants on a Saturday morning.
31:18
There was, you know, all of the top brand stuff in the fridge,
31:23
you know, my mum was wearing the designer clothes
31:27
and such like that.
31:28
So on the surface, there was no problem,
31:31
but there is a roof that's having carrier bags,
31:34
like plastic bags shoved into it when it leaks.
31:37
There is also a real big feeling
31:40
throughout my childhood of, don't ask for anything.
31:42
So necessity being a real problem for my parents,
31:46
and I recall, you know, asking for really basic needs
31:50
and then being met with anger, frustration,
31:52
and you were in inconvenience for needing something.
31:57
Particularly anything to do with money.
31:59
So I think from there, I learned that
32:05
I had to earn my own in order to not be a nuisance.
32:09
And it's why you felt like a burden.
32:11
Yes, definitely, definitely.
32:13
And in order to get where I needed to be,
32:16
no one was coming to, no one's coming, it's just you.
32:19
So, I mean, my earliest money memory is of me,
32:26
even though I was earning those five pounds and stuff like that.
32:28
I don't really consider that a money memory.
32:30
It's just sort of transactional to me.
32:32
But my first money memory is of my mum and dad had split up
32:36
at this point.
32:36
I think I was maybe, I think I was 11.
32:39
And she would ask me to get him to pay for things,
32:45
but he was incredibly, they would communicate only through me.
32:49
They wouldn't communicate with each other,
32:50
which, you know, anyone that's from a divorce zone,
32:52
which is so many people, they've probably gone through something similar,
32:55
but this was quite, quite nasty.
32:58
And she would set me almost goals, go and get this from your dad.
33:03
But then if you came home without that money, you had failed.
33:06
So I started to tie myself worth into achieving things like that.
33:12
But my father was incredibly tight with money.
33:15
You know, honestly, if you asked for a pound,
33:17
it would be explain why, like, no, I can't give that to you.
33:20
We don't have anything, but it's like you're driving a brand new car.
33:23
But it, nothing for the kids.
33:25
So the first money memory is my mum asking me to get my dad to pay for a school trip,
33:31
which was actually a mandatory school trip that had to be paid for,
33:35
which is a problem in itself, because it's just giving an opportunity for a child
33:40
that can't afford it to look humiliated and singled out.
33:44
But I went to my dad and asked him and he said, no, and my mum said she wouldn't pay for it.
33:49
So I was left in the situation of how am I going to achieve this.
33:53
So I got given two pounds a day, which was very fortunate.
33:56
And I'm really grateful that I was had two pounds a day for dinner money, for lunch money.
34:00
Wait, hold on. You had to pay for your own dinner and lunch.
34:03
I got given two pounds a day from my mum to pay for lunch at school.
34:07
That's kind of how it works in the UK.
34:09
It's changed a bit now.
34:09
There's paid school dinner systems, but I don't have children.
34:12
So I'm not like across the way it works these days.
34:15
But back then it was like five pounds or six pounds a week sort of thing.
34:18
So I would get given one pound fifty or two pounds a day to go and pay for my lunch at school.
34:23
And I ended up just not eating for like three weeks at school,
34:29
but like at any point in the day.
34:30
I'm saving up that money.
34:32
And then I went to my dad.
34:34
How old were you?
34:35
11.
34:37
Even just having the foresight of like, this is the only money I'm going to have,
34:44
and I need to ration this.
34:46
And the way to do that is to not eat is just like the fact that I'm more
34:52
seriously really hard right here.
34:53
And I'm almost more fucked off at the school for like making it a mandatory school trip,
34:59
making kids starve themselves so they can afford it.
35:01
It's just, yeah.
35:02
I mean, they would have no idea what was going on behind the scenes,
35:04
but that's the point.
35:05
They should, like they're educators and they're seeing you every day.
35:09
I think there's so many problems.
35:10
Yeah, it's like it's also the parents.
35:13
There's like the family, the school that yeah.
35:15
Well, they would only accept checks, not coins, right?
35:18
So I went to my dad with this bag of coins,
35:21
and I said, you said no for this school trip,
35:23
and I know that you wouldn't give me the money,
35:25
but I have to go and Mum is disappointed in me,
35:27
because I don't have this money from you.
35:29
So I've saved this up from my dinner money.
35:31
And he took the bag of coins from me,
35:33
wrote me a check, and kept it.
35:36
And that's my first money from me.
35:37
Well, he kept, he didn't give you a check.
35:39
He gave me the check, but he took the coins.
35:41
He didn't do that thing that you're expecting from the parents to be like,
35:43
I can't believe this has happened.
35:45
Oh my goodness, let me write the check, keep that, you know.
35:47
He can't, yeah, it's not just, I'm sorry I made you starve yourself.
35:50
Yeah, I kept the money.
35:51
Yeah, yeah, he just wrote me a check, and I went on the trip.
35:54
So that was also me experiencing for the first time controlling money.
35:58
Okay, I was able to get the result I wanted by controlling
36:02
and restricting what I spent, and that went into the rest of my life.
36:08
It makes so much sense when you look at it in that way,
36:11
where it's like, okay, well, also I would say,
36:14
from a career perspective, knowing how successful you've been and how many things
36:18
that you've achieved, it's because you've probably had to apply
36:22
that same tenacity and drive to be like, well,
36:25
if I want this, I have to work for it, and so how am I going to make it happen?
36:28
Yeah, and the independence and that, like, there's no one else looking out for me
36:32
or providing for me.
36:33
If I want to achieve these things, I have to figure out how to do it myself.
36:36
I think figuring even that, realizing that at the age of a living, it's just like,
36:41
like I am home and I presented the check to my mom and she was like, you know,
36:44
good girl. So there's so many problems with this whole scenario, it's like,
36:49
you get praised for achieving that, which then feeds into every job and every relationship dynamic
36:55
that you have problems with in the future, but yeah, that's the money memory.
36:59
Was money ever spoken about with your siblings in terms of, like,
37:04
conversations about, okay, we're all in this together, how do we help each other out,
37:08
or like, to lean aside from the parents?
37:10
Yeah, just in terms of, amongst your siblings, that you're all probably living
37:14
under the same roof at some point in just, like, in terms of...
37:16
Yeah, no. It was never really spoken about. I wasn't really particularly close to my middle sister,
37:23
but my elder sister's eight years older than me. So she always kind of had a bit of a caregiving
37:27
role, but she left home very, very young as well. So by the time I was eight, she was gone,
37:33
and it was very young. It was very much a figure it out for yourself.
37:39
Okay, so you kind of, in a way, like, the person probably was looking out for you.
37:43
Oh, yeah, it was kind of gone. Yeah, yeah, definitely. And I mean, it's
37:49
from an outsider's perspective, that would be really complex, because we had a house that was
37:55
pay for by my mother, you know, all of these things, but I think in terms of well-being,
38:02
it was definitely my older sister sort of keeping an eye out for us.
38:06
Did she keep it out for you when she lived home, or, like, how did that work?
38:09
I remember my mum went on holiday at one point and left. I don't know what age I was,
38:15
so I don't want to say an age, but I think it was quite young, so I think it was maybe 9-10.
38:19
It couldn't have been older than that, because I wasn't in secondary school yet.
38:22
And my sister had already left home, and she came home to wash her hair, because she was going
38:26
for a job interview, like, 16 classic. And she went to use the water in her head, been shut off,
38:33
and she was like, why is there no water here? And I remember being like, I don't know,
38:39
she's like, where's mum? And I was like, I'm not sure, but she left like £50 on the tables,
38:42
and she'll be back in a couple of days. She'd gone on holiday. And unless she went on holiday,
38:46
with no running water in the house. Well, I suppose she hadn't paid the bill,
38:49
and it got cut off while she was away, but this is before mobile phones and stuff as well, right?
38:53
So that was not really any way to contact her. So I remember there being money on the table,
38:57
and a note next to it, and I'm sure that she'd said where she was going, but all I remember
39:01
thinking was, I'm very young to not have anyone here. And my middle sister was there. So she,
39:06
but her and I didn't have the greatest relationship. So it was sort of just, you know, from
39:11
yourself, my elder sister came home and, yeah, went to use the water washer hair, then, yeah,
39:18
and I believe she ended up calling the company and paying the bill to get the water turned back on
39:22
and such. And 16 didn't do that. So that's sort of the running theme was just sort of problem,
39:28
self. Yeah. There was a responsibility taken by the people around you. It was like if you want to
39:33
yeah, fix something you need to make it happen. Absolutely. You ended up leaving home also reasonably
39:38
young. Yeah. What was the deciding factor for you? You were like, okay, I think I'm going to be
39:42
better in my own space, in my own situation, taking care of myself. It's actually money driven.
39:48
There was a conversation between my mother and me, and she wanted me to do something
39:55
in school that was going to mean that my dad had to pay more maintenance, but it would mean me
40:02
doing a lot of extra schooling. And so in the UK, there's child support and it just depends on
40:08
sort of the certain levels of education and the age of the child, depending on for how long that
40:13
that person needs to contribute towards those maintenance payments. And it was coming up for
40:17
cut off. And she said, well, we need that money. So you need to do those extra things. And I said,
40:23
I'm not going to do basically work for that money to come from my father because I don't think
40:33
that's fair. And she, and were you just like, I could work and get their money myself and keep
40:38
it? Was that kind of the mindset? I mean, it was more, it was more so why would you, why are you
40:42
using me as a pawn? As a pawn? Yeah. Why are you using me as a way to achieve money rather than
40:49
going, how will we make this work without putting her in the middle of this, using me as, yeah,
40:56
and I remember saying, I'm not going to do that. And my mum said, okay, well, you know, you can
41:02
leave then. And so next day I left and I found a place to live on gumtree.com, which is like,
41:10
trade me. And how did you support yourself financially at their age? I just worked. Yeah,
41:15
and it paid for rent. And it just, it did sacrifice my education a little bit because, you know,
41:19
I had focuses that other people didn't at my age group. But, you know, it's all, it's all worked
41:25
at the end. I don't, I almost don't regret that because it gave me a work ethic that I've been
41:32
able to apply to so many aspects of my life. It doesn't necessarily mean it was healthy. But it
41:37
did give me a structure that has financially benefited me in the long run and has set me up for
41:43
understanding money, being able to sort of give insight and assistance to friends, which is
41:50
a big thing for me and money. A lot of my emergency fund is not for me. I have my own emergency
41:56
fund, but I have an emergency fund for people who need things. And I think that seems back to not
42:01
having, probably not having that when you were younger, not having anyone that you felt like
42:05
loves you enough to help financially. For sure. And also not wanting anyone else to give
42:09
me a situation like that. It's not having yet. It's that. It's how could you not help if you're
42:14
financially able to? I just am so perplexed by that. And that's a much bigger conversation. But
42:19
even people I've only known for a matter of weeks, if I can see that they're in need of something
42:24
like that, I just don't know how I would morally say no to someone if I knew that that was in my
42:29
bank. So, I mean, something that I've worked on for a long time was wanting to be there to support
42:38
my friends if they needed it. And obviously, I'm not going to give $5,000 to the first person I
42:43
meet who's like, oh, you know, but somebody that's in a real bind and oh, there's a week,
42:49
there's a month in between this. They just need that crossover period. They need the loan.
42:53
You know, I've created contracts with friends before where I've said no worries. I'll give you
42:56
this and obviously no interest, but it's going to get them that house. It's going to get them that
43:01
rental agreement, you know. And I just, I think that a big thing for me is yeah, just being able
43:06
to provide that help and having enough in the bank to do that. I guess just thinking back to like
43:11
when you started looking for your own home, I'm also, I mean, I guess for anyone living in New Zealand,
43:17
New Zealand, New Zealand or Australia, it's similar to like, I guess, the spare room in the UK,
43:24
or like, you know, trade me, rentals and New Zealand. What is gum true? Yeah, like gum true is kind of
43:31
I mean, I don't know anymore, but back back in the day, Facebook marketplace. Yeah, but I'm
43:35
just thinking like, you know, if I put a room up there, because generally people who were
43:40
flirting at a university, you were a lot younger. Did you have to say I'm 16? Did they ask you?
43:46
I paid 140 pounds a month. I remember that. And it was totally illegal because it was a room
43:53
that had been divided by one of those mini stud walls that are not approved in any regulation or
43:58
code. And it had a single bed in it. And that was pretty much what I could fit in. It was like a
44:04
single bed and a wardrobe, which I had nothing to put in. So you're like, cool. Thank you. Yeah,
44:11
wardrobe. But it was just the best. Like, probably perfect for you need it. It was amazing,
44:15
though. It's so interesting because when I, and this is coming from such a privileged place,
44:22
but when I heard you describe that, I just thought, God, I just want to cuddle with 16 year old Danny
44:26
and be like, come love with me, you know, but actually the fact that your experience and
44:30
that situation, the fact that you could pay for your own space and you were looking after yourself,
44:35
you felt so empowered by that. Yeah, I did. And that kind of created the rhythm of how I've
44:39
lived my life in that sense. And probably why I've ended up in relationships where I
44:45
always the breadwinner, I think there is an element that I, where I actually seek that out.
44:51
If I'm being completely honest, I think that I like having that security and control over
44:58
the situation. So next so much sense. Yeah, it does. I also think there's an element of, and I know
45:04
you were 16, but I think there's an element of anyone leaving home, even if it's in a privileged
45:11
situation or not to a privileged situation, I think is just you learned so much about being
45:16
independent, even just paying bills, earning your own money, like all that kind of stuff.
45:22
Like, I, I personally, yeah, that was a mind blow for me. Yeah. And I think just like
45:27
fending for yourself a bit more, I think it's, yeah, there's a lot of people that don't and
45:33
will particularly amongst our friends that haven't moved out of home or were moved out of home
45:37
very, very late. And you notice it, like immensely, just like the lack of awareness when it comes
45:43
to money, expenses, bills, paying rent, all of those things that are, that you have to get up
45:49
to speed with at some point in life. It's just like, you can sit there and be like, why won't I
45:52
talk taxes at school? But it's like, well, also, let's just take a step back. Yeah.
45:57
Everything costs money and you never had to consider that. Yeah. In a way, you got like the school
46:03
of life a lot earlier. Yeah. And it's probably, Eve, as, I mean, I don't know, I hope this isn't
46:09
sound like insensitive, but in a way has actually probably been the biggest blessing because you
46:13
learnt those things so much. Yeah. Like financially, if we look at the situation that you're now
46:17
in the situation, I'm in now, you're so much more financially secure and able to take care of yourself.
46:24
Like I still, if I was in a total bind, probably would call my dad or my mom and be like, yeah, help me.
46:30
Whereas that, that in itself is a privilege. I'm completely unaware of like having a safety net
46:36
should all go wrong. And yeah, I guess there's there's probably just just the awareness of
46:43
actually having to be an adult has maybe in a way been positive for you in a financial stability
46:51
standpoint because it has been you from the beginning, whereas even now at 32, I'm still in
46:57
my adult, probably not really. It's interesting, though, because as soon as I get anxious or stressed,
47:04
the very first thing I do is I restrict my money. It's the first thing I go back to is I open up
47:11
the spreadsheet and I look and I don't change anything because the spreadsheet's on lock.
47:16
It's been the same for years. I know exactly what's going on, I know exactly what's coming in,
47:20
I know what's going to my investments and know what's in all of the funds, but there's something
47:24
about I just need to make sure, I just need to make sure I have enough because what if something
47:27
goes wrong? Why do you think that is? Is that a control thing? Is that a, I think there's a few
47:34
things. I think it's wanting to feel safe and looking at that amount going like you're fine,
47:40
you're fine, you're fine, no one can take this from you, you're good, but also things have gone
47:45
quite wrong quite a lot of times in my life and that's not a well as me thing, but there's had
47:49
there's been moments where yeah, you've got, you know, there's a $10,000 visa bill to pay for and
47:54
I don't mean the credit card, I mean immigration, you know, that stuff is non-refundable and I've paid
48:01
approximately $50,000, Australian dollars, so 25,000 pounds in visas in the last 10 years.
48:09
I wonder if we can step into that because you just mentioned investments again and I think
48:14
my brain was kind of sitting in the personal finance paying for rent space, but actually
48:19
at what point in your life were you introduced to the idea of savings or investing to grow your money
48:25
because I feel like if it had been me, probably I don't think I would ever have been able to move past
48:33
the scarcity place, you know, it's kind of risky investing in anything and so I guess
48:40
how did you get introduced to that and how did you feel brave enough to step into it when
48:45
financial security and having that money to be able to use straight away? Yeah,
48:49
is a sense of safety. I think that scarcity and investing actually sat hand in hand
48:57
for a while for me. When I was building up my very first, I would call it the emergency fund,
49:02
the fuck you fund or whatever it is. It was control, but I was putting maybe, I think it was $80
49:09
a month at that point. I was $24, $80 a month into a high interest savings account and that to me
49:18
felt like investing, but saving at the same time. But how did you know to do that?
49:24
Did anyone ever say, don't just leave this in your everyday account? Because I think that's
49:29
what I mean, how did you have the foresight to know to even do that? Curiosity and just the need
49:34
to sort of go, how can I make this more? How can it not just be 80? How can it be 81? How can I
49:39
also feel safe enough to have that money in scarcity, but also make it grow simultaneously?
49:45
And I think that's a perfect thing for high yield savings accounts for people who want it there
49:49
in case they need it, but want to grow it, want to grow it. And they're not quite in the abundance
49:55
mindset, but they really want to be. It's so interesting though, because as I hear you talk,
50:01
like it's almost as though, and I don't know, maybe this is kind of talking out of line, but
50:06
you know, the patriarchy and the way that we've been taught to that, you know, whether it be
50:12
the safety of your parents or the safety net of getting married financially, like you really did
50:17
have to figure it out and stand on your own two feet. And I wonder if it comes from a place of
50:23
an assisted and maybe I've just a lot of us have never actually ever been in that. You found out
50:28
about high yield savings accounts because the responsibility was yours. But you listen differently
50:33
as well. When you don't have parents or guardians that are giving you instruction or advice,
50:38
your ears are just open in a different way. Every business I worked in, I'd be listening to
50:43
the CEOs. I was listening to bosses and they were primarily male. And then when I got my first sort
50:49
of female role model, which was one of my directors, my female directors, when I was working in Australia
50:56
at the age of sort of 26. And I would just listen to things that she said. And because it was sort of
51:01
in the property industry and building industry, I saw commission figures, I saw percentages,
51:08
I was exposed to different things and the curiosity and need for information from my childhood
51:13
got applied to those situations. And I would go, how are they doing it? You know, and then I would
51:17
research that just but yeah, it's because there was no one to call and ask. So you kind of take a
51:22
piece of information that you hear and you remember that. And in hindsight, you probably had a few
51:26
few more years on every run in terms of career and work and and and learning biosmosis. Yeah,
51:31
yeah. Definitely. Do you just mentioning hindsight, when you look back at
51:37
the way that you grow up with, you know, your parents sounding like they really just prioritise
51:42
the things they wanted to spend money on and were not selfless enough to recognise when they
51:47
needed to spend money on you and your sisters. I cure it. Do you, is there a part of you that is
51:53
a little bit niche or like if you or you know, I'm just curious to know if that's you know what's
51:59
interesting is that I can safely say that when I am their age, I will have more money than they've
52:08
ever had. And it's funny how their unwillingness to give and to share and to teach will end them
52:16
in a worse financial position than me who wants to give and wants to teach and wants to share.
52:22
So I think that's a lesson that can be applied in terms of mindset and positivity, but I think that
52:29
that that you know eight-year-old Danielle was kind of proud but also a bit sad, you know,
52:35
at the way that the journey had to happen, but we're feeling pretty good about where we ended up.
52:39
One of the things that you mentioned just then about like if things were reversed and if you had
52:44
a relationship with your parents still and you know from a financial perspective, you actually
52:47
could have helped them a lot more than what they would have given you had they probably parented.
52:52
Sorry if that was brutal. And I think that circular like almost community mindset has been massively
53:01
lost on a lot of us in the Western world and you know as my parents start to get older and the
53:07
reality of them not earning money forever and you know it is kind of this like Benjamin button
53:15
cyclical thing where you do spend a lot of money on your kids when they're young but you do hope
53:19
that that's something that in your older years if you needed to there's the ability to like kind of
53:24
work together and then you can rely on your kids because you've put a lot of time and effort
53:30
for them to be successful financially and yeah yeah I feel like it's just sad that you're naturally
53:36
such a giving person who would have totally done that for your parents had they supported you.
53:42
Yeah I mean as you guys know I was married as well um just like to fit lots of things into short
53:50
space. That's why I'm like another episode another episode. I was saying we're done with the other
53:54
night. I was like you're like an onion. Yeah it's like you're working out with your own like I peel
53:57
back a layer and they're like oh I've actually been married. Oh I've actually got five children.
54:01
Yeah she doesn't yeah but just even that relationship was really interesting to watch the dynamic
54:06
of those parents and that person and what they knew about money and and what they didn't um and
54:13
that person was older than me and had a really strong relationship with both their parents and still
54:17
had absolutely no idea so when we were you know trying to pay for that wedding and building those
54:23
costs up it was me teaching them about how how we are going to budget you know what we're going to
54:27
spend money on what's worth it what's not doing market research getting an ABN like an Australian
54:31
business number so that I could go into flower markets and buy them wholesale and create the
54:36
bouquets myself which you wouldn't be able to do is sort of a pedestrian you'd you needed a business
54:41
number so it's like well let's just get one you know and and just being able to have those
54:45
conversations whereas the the other person would just turn to their parents and go where should we
54:49
get this. It's almost like a reflection I mean I would never wish that childhood in terms of
54:58
feelings alone and having to really like fend for yourself on somebody but I think hearing the
55:04
way that you use that in a really positive light to learn and be curious and take responsibility
55:10
for yourself is very unique and I think it's just the thing that like you're really lucky that
55:15
that's how it affected you because I think there's a lot of people who would be in situations that
55:20
are unsupportive in childhood and that's not how things end up and it's just how can you sort of
55:25
take them bits that have helped motivate you to take responsibility financially while do you
55:31
know what I mean like what's a good balance between the two because being coddled like I was did
55:35
not work. I don't know the answer to that but I do know that in order to step out of a scarcity
55:40
mindset and into abundance which like I said only happened I would I mean honestly last year's
55:47
being generous I think it was January this year think I needed to zoom out from my life a bit
55:53
because when you're in it and you're constantly like I need more that's not enough I need more
55:57
you know the safety net needs to be bigger you get really desensitized and it becomes really negative
56:05
whereas I was able to stop everything and just zoom out and take some time off I didn't work
56:11
for a couple of months just because I needed to reset which is a absolute privilege but a privilege
56:15
I created for myself a hundred so I don't like saying the word luck there's nothing to do with luck
56:20
in this this was how am I going to apply everything I'm learning to give myself a moment of
56:25
respite and you know regrouping and I desperately needed it and it's helped a lot but zooming out
56:34
on that sort of January February march was I was able to go this is enough and applying everything
56:40
I know about investing why am I still so panicked I know that this is going to grow you've already
56:45
got enough in there for it to grow I could not contribute anymore for the rest of my life and it
56:49
will be okay but you get caught up in this cycle of like I have to put in more I have to put in
56:54
more and whilst continuous investing is important not hampering your lifestyle and hampering your
57:00
enjoyment of life is so important as well and I had really gone way too far the other way I was
57:05
putting in 80% of my paycheck into my investments every month 80% whoa now of course I'm only able
57:12
to do that because I was earning a good salary but even when I was on lower salaries it was the very
57:17
first thing it was like bills rent and that's not so amazing that you did that like but now you're
57:24
in such an incredible financial position yes that probably wasn't the healthiest at the time but
57:31
now you're in such an incredible financial position that you can invest in lots of different things
57:36
do you know anything I think there's like every action has a reaction and I think it's definitely
57:42
I think that I remember a game-changing phrase that I read I think it was just on the internet
57:48
maybe seven or eight years ago and it was like no one saves their way to wealth and I remember hearing
57:53
that and going what do you mean and I just I can do it that's where yeah yeah yeah I want a bet
58:00
and that's where the curiosity comes in yeah because then you go what does that even mean and when
58:04
you even just type that into Google you're going to loads of investments that's going to pop up and
58:08
then you research that further so I think people are just applying curiosity to finances the very
58:12
first step you don't have to make any moves just read just see are there things you've been money
58:19
on now that you're younger self would just be like what the oh my goodness yeah I've noticed
58:25
myself to like it's so much more recently maybe there's abundance minds that needs to chill
58:28
because you should be mad at me just writing apps these lots of packages that have arrived isn't
58:35
yeah what did someone get me something no you remember I got a special delivery last week
58:40
me oh my god no the like world is not all about you so it's my birthday so he he saw I was just
58:48
you know I thought maybe it's like the other day I was like hey baby you're gonna work on your
58:51
birthday or you're gonna take the day off she's like why are you gonna organize a lunch for me I'd
58:54
love that obviously I was like I'm just kind of scheduling some meetings but okay now I'm
58:58
actually all going to lunch so I came all the way from New Zealand we're having a birthday lunch
59:07
yeah there definitely are things that my younger self would panic about but also would be super
59:14
stoked that I'm finally able to do that Danny L2 years ago is stoked that I'm going get the
59:20
bag babe Jesus you know like give yourself a break and that's I mean not to rehash what we've
59:25
already talked about but we're talking like for a decade instead of getting a taxi that was
59:32
seven pounds I'm gonna walk eight miles you know just such an incredible thing to finally go
59:39
oh my god get the taxi yeah and not be filled with guilt but even even the childhood and the lessons
59:45
and the scarcity and the abundance all comes into one in when I'm purchasing something so the other
59:49
day I bought those loafers that you guys saw I went into Selfridges who will now never sponsor this
59:55
book us I went into Selfridges tried them on it was like yep cool a couple hundred pounds sweet
1:00:01
walked out of selfridges I'm not even out the building yet and I've bought them online for 200
1:00:06
pounds less oh my god amazing because why would I pay for that you know you don't have to sacrifice
1:00:11
a lot of things just do a little bit of research and make your money go further you don't have to
1:00:15
then be without something you can find something that fits within your budget it's the exact same thing
1:00:19
and still have that dopamine here and the thing that you actually needed I feel like we could talk
1:00:24
to you for hours now and I'm just aware of the fact that you're actually not going anywhere and we
1:00:28
can get you back in for another podcast so maybe we just actually just hit pause and say thank you
1:00:34
for sharing and I will all go to the office together now yeah yeah okay bye thank you so much
1:00:42
for listening to raising the curve these conversations are designed to teach you everything that you
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