Latest / The SEANC View / State Health Plan reaches deal, WakeMed merger vote Monday

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State Health Plan reaches deal, WakeMed merger vote Monday · The SEANC View

0:00
Hello, and welcome to another edition of the Scenic View podcast.
0:03
I'm your host, Jonathan Owens, alongside artists Watkins, Suzanne Beasley, and Samantha Klein.
0:09
Convention is over and we're still recovering. We have a few things to talk
0:13
about, so let's get to it.
0:25
So, like I said, we did survive another convention. Yeah, we did.
0:30
It was exciting. A lot of work and a lot of fun times with members from all over the state.
0:37
But we're here back in the office and we're ready to work.
0:41
We'll talk a little bit more about convention in a few minutes,
0:43
but let's get to the news portion of the episode first.
0:48
The biggest story that I've seen this week is the state health plan and Atrium,
0:55
reached a kind of agreement to allow some of Atrium's hospitals to be in the access tier.
1:02
It looks like mostly the rural hospitals. I think there was nine rural hospitals
1:07
and three children's hospitals.
1:10
That's welcome news for our members in those areas because I know that's caused
1:14
a lot of heartburn amongst when they first heard the plan about the tier system.
1:19
Yeah, because there's a lot of people who have atrium providers and their hospitals
1:24
were not going to, you know, be in the network. So, yeah, that was a hot topic.
1:30
When Thomas Friedman, the executive administrator of the health plan,
1:33
came to speak to our board, that was one of the first questions that came up.
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We had one of our board members lives in Haywood County, and they were worried about that.
1:41
So the list is Atrium Allegheny Health, Wilkes Medical Center,
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Atrium Health Anson, Cleveland, Kings Mountain, Lincoln, and Stanley,
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and Columbus Regional Healthcare System.
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Along with Brenner Children's Hospital and Jeff Gordon Children's Hospital and,
2:01
I think it's Levine Children's Hospital.
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And also Hugh Chatham Health.
2:06
So that's kind of a list all over the state. They have the Triangle area,
2:10
the Charlotte area, and the Sandhills area.
2:13
Which is where I live. It's better. Yeah. Any thoughts on it, Artis?
2:19
Good. No, I mean, it's the more people that can not have a disruption in their
2:26
services and pay, you know, the lowest price possible for their health care, that's the goal.
2:31
And that's what Treasurer Briner and Thomas Friedman and the rest of the staff
2:35
at the state health plan were going for is, look, they knew they had to hold
2:40
the line with some providers. and.
2:43
I know it scared a lot of people. And for a lot of people, it's still scary
2:47
because their hospitals are still not preferred or accessed here.
2:52
So, you know, it's not over by any means, but I think that was a huge step forward
2:56
for the treasurer and the state health plan staff.
2:59
So they have an— And congratulations, by the way, to them for getting that done.
3:03
So they have an updated map on their website, the plan does.
3:07
And yeah, it shows like Haywood County, which was the one we were asking or
3:12
we were the board member was asking about is now an access level.
3:16
So with the access that Atrium is now getting with the state health plan, what the,
3:22
state treasurer has shared is that they have reached an agreement that preserves
3:26
the access to primary care, emergency care, behavioral health office visits
3:30
and certain specialty services.
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So it's not all services that will be accessible at the access tier.
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Yeah, that makes sense. So because, you know, the argument is that some of the
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procedures cost so much that Atrium is just not competitive with the other.
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It'd be interesting to know, and we'll never know because we can't see the contracts,
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just what concessions the state health plan made and what Atrium moved off of.
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But I guess we'll just never know those things.
3:59
So we can't really pick a winner or a loser in that fight, I guess.
4:02
We can't because, I mean, the conversations with Atrium go back three years.
4:07
With the plan. You know, so this was not news to Atrium when it started.
4:11
So, yeah, I wonder where the giving was. Yeah.
4:15
So some hospitals, obviously, that are Atrium still will be non-preferred.
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Wake Forest Baptist is a large, like, regional hospital for folks in the western part of the state.
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And also there are others, but Wake Med is a big one. because there are a lot
4:33
of state employees in the Raleigh area and they'll still be non-preferred.
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And we've talked a lot about their pending merger with Atrium.
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And I guess that leads into an interview that we will post at the end of this
4:46
episode with Rob Stephens from the Patients Union.
4:50
It's a national organization. And this week, we partnered with them to request
4:56
a meeting with the Wake County Commissioners next week.
4:59
Wake County Commissioners may vote on this as soon as Monday, right, Artis?
5:03
Yeah, there's been no confirmation of that, but apparently the vote could happen
5:08
by Monday, the 21st of September.
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No telling, though. They could just do it anytime they meet.
5:15
And I guess they obviously meet every two weeks. I think that's the schedule for the Wake County.
5:20
Usually county commissioners do that. They can always call a meeting that's
5:23
not previously scheduled. So the idea is Wake Med and Atrium have had a whole
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lot of meetings with the commissioners, private meetings.
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And they've had hours and hours and hours, who knows how many hours,
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that they've been in the ear of the county commissioners. But the people have
5:40
had two minutes apiece twice. Yeah.
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And you can't have a thorough conversation with somebody.
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So what we're asking is, in fact, for them to sit down with us and with folks
5:52
from the patients union so we can really talk more facts about why exactly this
5:57
is a terrible idea for not only
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Wake County, but in the case of the state health plan, the whole state.
6:02
It seems like you're really seeing a lot more signs on the roads and things.
6:06
I did see one up here near our office. Wake Med is our hospital.
6:11
Seems like kind of a snowball. I think what happened was when the governor asked,
6:16
for questions to be answered by Wake Med about the deal, the deal that nobody can see, right?
6:21
The answer kind of concerned a lot of people because the governor shared them.
6:25
And one of those was the $2 billion that Atrium was supposedly giving for this takeover of Wake Med.
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Turns out it's not $2 billion being handed from Atrium to Wake Med or to Wake County.
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It's $2 billion investment, but it starts with the money Wake Med has.
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Wake Med has a billion in reserves right now.
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And then any loan capacity Wake Med has would have to be used up prior to Atrium putting in a dime.
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So technically, that was making it pretty clear. It's possible Atrium walks
6:57
in, takes over Wake Med, and doesn't put one dime in the game.
7:01
And I think that made the citizens that are affected and know their health care
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is likely to go up dramatically, as it did in Winston-Salem two years ago when
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Atrium took over Wake Forest Baptist.
7:13
It made those citizens think, why are we handing something for free that's going
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to put more costs on the citizens?
7:21
Why would our government do that? Yeah. And obviously, we'll go into more detail
7:25
with the Patients Union at the end of this episode.
7:28
And we have talked about this for several episodes now. But it's a big deal
7:31
for state employees, especially even the ones who don't live in Wake County because...
7:36
Everybody's premiums would go up. And premiums are absolutely killing these state employees.
7:40
And, you know, a lot of times people will say to us, but their premiums aren't
7:44
as high as some of them out in the private sector.
7:47
Well, they never had a premium for the longest time because the idea was the
7:51
benefits would be really good in state government since the pay can't compete
7:55
with the private sector.
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But, you know, premium started about, what, 14 years ago, I guess. It's been a while.
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And over that period of time, they keep going up and up and up simply because
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you can never give enough to the hospitals the way it's going.
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They always want so much more that you have to go to the people to get it.
8:17
So, yeah, it's a statewide issue. State employees, definitely,
8:20
when you tell them about it, get hopping mad. They don't want to see another
8:24
increase in their premiums.
8:25
Yeah. Another story I saw this week, and it's just a kind of a byproduct of
8:30
a bill that passed, or maybe it was in the budget. I'm not sure.
8:34
You no longer have to put the stickers on your license anymore,
8:37
your license plates for the registration. and you don't have to carry the paper registration.
8:44
Hmm. Yeah. It's funny, I just got my sticker in the mail.
8:47
It's kind of a source of pride for me because I've had the same license plate
8:50
forever and I just got this huge clump of stickers. Yeah, stack of stickers, yeah.
8:56
It's not a huge deal. It's not a big deal, but...
8:59
Like, how will they know if you are registered?
9:04
Well, from what I saw in the article, it says that they still use their systems
9:08
that are in their cars, their patrol vehicles, that they can match that there. When they pull you. Yes.
9:17
And they did say that they will no longer be sending the stickers,
9:20
but you will be able to download your paper registration via PDF if you would like to still keep it.
9:26
Because they do recommend that you still keep a copy in your car because just
9:30
because North Carolina won't ask you for your registration necessarily,
9:34
it doesn't mean that another state won't if you are out of town.
9:38
What if you're in another state and they see that your sticker is expired?
9:42
I guess they can look it up. Yeah.
9:44
Well, it's also, if you're in another state, they should know North Carolina's
9:47
laws as to, we don't need to have that sticker because not all states do yearly
9:52
registrations and inspections. Yeah. Lucky them.
9:56
I have a Tesla and like the inspection process is ridiculous.
9:59
It's like flash your lights. OK, you're good. Because there's nothing else to inspect.
10:04
So but we also get charged the electric vehicle fee, which is outrageous.
10:09
But that's another argument for another time.
10:13
But my idea is why?
10:15
I mean, I wish we could go to digital licenses because I don't always have my license.
10:20
I don't always carry my wallet, you know, because everything's on my phone now.
10:23
Can we go to an app or something? Like an Apple wallet. Yeah.
10:28
Digital copy that you keep there that scans and everything. Yeah.
10:33
I know that some places, like, when you're carded at a convenience store,
10:38
they will accept, like, a picture of your ID. Yeah. Who's been carded?
10:42
Good. My wife got carded the other day. She was so happy about it.
10:46
Yeah. Yeah, that would be great. I still get carded. Well, of course. Yeah.
10:52
That makes sense. But yeah, we're not. I mean, there are times when I don't
10:56
get carded. I'm like, really? Really?
10:59
I'll take it. And the worker's like, sure, lady. You look 40. Eeks.
11:08
At least I look mature. So I don't have any other news. Did y'all have anything
11:13
before we go to other topics? Anything happening? I saw that it's Pension Awareness Week. Oh.
11:19
Great. I'd never heard of that. Pension Fight Club. Yeah.
11:24
Yeah. We got to do something more with Pension Fight Club. Pension Fight Club,
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y'all, is a documentary that was made about, you know, kind of a national crisis
11:33
for public pensions where they're overpaying for pensions.
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The results they're getting with investments. And it affects all the retirees
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and actives who want to be retirees one day.
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So pull it up, Pension Fight Club. I found some fun facts around Pension Awareness Week. Do tell.
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About 86% of state and local governments still offer a pension for employees,
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but only 29% of American workers have access to a defined benefit pension.
12:03
And I think there's a direct correlation to the disappearing middle class.
12:08
Right. Well, 100%. Yeah. But that's why, you know, the whole deal was we'll
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pay you less in the public sector, but we're going to take care of your benefits.
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And that's why we get so ferocious about the retirement system and about the health plan.
12:22
Well, we have to. Yeah. I mean, pay is certainly not keeping up.
12:26
Yeah. And also, this is an interesting one. The median annual public pension is $24,930.
12:35
So obviously no one can live off that, but it's...
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It's to supplant. I mean, for some states, there's not Social Security with it.
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In North Carolina, there is. It's to supplant your Social Security.
12:45
And the idea is you might even have a part-time job because some people retire
12:51
fairly early from public service. So, but it's a guaranteed income anyway.
12:56
Whereas most workers get to the end of their, well, they have to work until
13:02
they're very old, most workers.
13:04
It's great. Yeah, it's crazy. One of my friends, he went into teaching right
13:07
after college and he, I was talking to him the other day. He's like,
13:11
yeah, I have six years left.
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And he's like, he's my age, you know. I'm like. That's one of the challenges
13:17
for pension systems. Yeah. Is funding that.
13:20
Yeah, because that's, he's going to be, what, 14 years before he can get Social Security. So, yeah.
13:26
That's a lot. You know, it takes a lot of money to keep them going,
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but that's why you have to have a good plan.
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Sounds like talking to Treasurer Briner and Sam Watts, who's the director of
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the retirement system. In North Carolina, I think they've got a very good plan.
13:40
I know when Treasurer Falwell was treasurer, he was very big on making sure
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the unfunded liability was addressed. Yeah, that was a hot.
13:46
So that this thing could last like it needs to last. Well, that's a good segue
13:51
into my last topic, which is the convention.
13:54
I think we had a great time at the convention, and Brad Briner came and spoke
13:59
as part of the dignitary session, and I thought his speech was really good.
14:03
And then Thomas Friedman afterward. All of them did so well. Yeah, yeah.
14:09
We posted that live on our Facebook page, and it got a lot of comments and likes.
14:13
I think it's cool that we have them all in one block because everybody can watch
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it and they'll. Yeah, not scattered all over. Yeah.
14:20
I think Commissioner Causey said they had a quorum, if they needed it, of the council estate.
14:26
Which is funny. They really did. They did. They had enough to take a vote if
14:29
they wanted. Oh, does that make our, would that be like a public records situation?
14:34
Are we subject to Public Records Act?
14:36
Well, you had it live streamed, so. Yeah, that's true. It was live streamed. As public as it can be.
14:42
I was kind of comparing in my head between, you know, when Dale Falwell used
14:46
to come, it was just a big party.
14:48
Everybody loved him, you know. And then the reaction to Briner,
14:52
maybe not that enthusiastic, but they still liked him a lot.
14:56
I think that's his message. Every time Briner speaks to a group of scenic people,
15:00
honestly, at the end of it, you can tell they very much like him.
15:04
He's just very, look, he's very businesslike. Yeah.
15:07
And he's not here for fun. That's what I was going to say. I think that I'm not here to play thing.
15:12
People like that. Yeah. You know, they... They... So...
15:16
I think he has a personality, too, though. He is. He's just not in those—I mean,
15:20
like, that's not a situation where he'd be making jokes and things. No.
15:24
Yeah. No, you don't want the guy coming up. I mean, Falwell,
15:27
by the time he was coming in and it was just a party, they knew him so well.
15:31
Yeah. They knew him from his tenure in the house before he ever became treasurer,
15:36
and then he was treasurer for eight years.
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So they knew him so well and they'd seen him so much that they were so aware of everything he did.
15:47
So I think with Briner, it's they're getting to know him.
15:50
You get to see their different personalities, too, like Jeff Jackson,
15:54
the attorney general. He signed up for Scenic right on the stage.
15:58
I got an awesome picture of that. OK, cool. Yeah, it was weird.
16:01
I just thought, you know, you see public officials speak a lot.
16:05
It's hard to make those little speeches interesting, but I thought they all did.
16:09
It's almost like they felt a
16:11
little more comfortable because they were talking to employees, you know?
16:15
Yeah. Whereas it's not just some random group that you don't really know.
16:18
And it was neat. They were all sitting together, and it didn't matter what their
16:20
party affiliation was. You know, you can tell they've got a camaraderie among
16:24
them because they all are in the same boat. Of course. They're trying to lead, you know, agencies.
16:30
Of course, Elaine Marshall was there. She's there every year.
16:33
I remember a few—well, it was probably 10 years now.
16:36
We didn't have this section of the— You know, so I remember she just came in
16:41
the hall and everybody was like, oh, we need to make a space for her to speak.
16:45
And she spoke from the floor. She just walked up to the mic and talked.
16:49
That's pretty cool. I don't think, this is like the third or fourth year we've
16:52
done this, and I enjoyed it. Yeah.
16:55
I learn something every time. Yeah.
16:58
They've got a lot going on in these agencies that we do know about,
17:01
but there's definitely stuff that it's a newsworthy period at the convention
17:06
when we hear from them. Yeah.
17:08
Any other highlights that stick out from the convention? I know there was a
17:10
lot of high and lows of the convention, but anything specific?
17:16
Well, save your favorite for the question of the week.
17:19
Yeah, for the question. The state health plan breakouts that we had Thursday,
17:23
it was for active employees and state health plan staff was on hand to answer
17:28
questions and explain just exactly what's happening on Friday.
17:31
It was for retirees, but in both of those groups, and I think we may even heard some of this,
17:37
I don't know if it was from the floor or just Facebook comments,
17:39
but a big issue was people being concerned about emergency care if their hospitals weren't included.
17:47
So it was good that the plan got to stress that, you know, if you have an emergency,
17:51
it was Thomas that was speaking on stage, go to the closest hospital.
17:55
You're going to be treated like it's access because you're in an emergency situation.
17:59
Yeah, I think that's obviously the first thing people think of when they hear
18:02
this plans, this tier structure.
18:05
And I mean, it's not for lack of trying, but I think that, you know,
18:09
it's hard to get that point across that this is not affecting if you have an
18:14
emergency. Yeah, go to your closest hospital. Yeah.
18:18
But I did a breakout for AI. I thought it was pretty. There was a lot of people
18:23
there. I know. There were way too many people.
18:26
Actually, I heard good feedback. Oh, good. I was terrified.
18:29
No, but the first day, you know, we ran over a little bit.
18:34
And so I had to cram it all into like 30 minutes instead of an hour.
18:38
So that one wasn't as good as the second one, I think. But we had a good time.
18:42
We had a lot of discussion. People are very interested in AI and what's going to happen.
18:47
Well, especially this week. Yeah. I mean, is the end of the world nigh or not,
18:51
John? You keep up with this stuff. I was listening to a podcast.
18:54
That's why I'm so interested in it. I have to have like two hours in the car
18:57
every day, and I listen to podcasts about how we're all going to die.
19:01
I know. I can't listen to two podcasts. But there was a good one today.
19:06
It was from the Bulwark, and it had part of, it had an expert talking about
19:10
these different things that are happening with hugging face and all that.
19:14
And I did bring that up in our discussion, but it's really complicated.
19:19
And, you know, I'm a little afraid. I am, but.
19:23
You definitely have to get somebody in here then for an A-B-C podcast.
19:26
Yeah, and we talked to Nate Denny, right, our director. Yeah,
19:29
so unfortunately, he wasn't able. He was planning to come and speak. Say who he is.
19:34
He is the secretary of the Department of Information Technology. Yeah, IT. IT.
19:41
Yeah, so I've been chasing him down for a few months now, and hopefully we can
19:45
get him on here to talk about.
19:46
And someone from maybe from OSHR as well.
19:50
It's going to be interesting, whatever is. People in my breakout,
19:55
you know, they're really interested in how this is going to affect their jobs
19:58
and if they're going to lose their jobs, you know.
20:01
I think it scares me because I am in a creative field and there are so many
20:05
companies that are already using it to replace people who work in creative fields.
20:10
Yeah, communications is really going to suffer.
20:14
And that's kind of the reason I started trying to learn as much as I could to
20:18
stay relevant, you know.
20:19
But, yeah, our members are concerned. I think that they should,
20:23
you know, let us know when something like there's an initiative coming up that
20:27
maybe we don't know about that could lead to job losses and things like that.
20:31
Yeah, please do because you guys are the front line out there.
20:34
So sometimes it's not like they're going to tell us, hey, we're we're cutting jobs, you know.
20:40
Oh, yeah. And by the way, we hadn't said in a while, if you have anything you
20:44
want to say to the podcast, we do have an email address. That's right.
20:47
Podcast at scenic.org.
20:50
We have a form on our website for scenic cares, too. If you have any information
20:54
about a job that may be in jeopardy or you see your agency putting more efforts
21:00
into AEI that could replace jobs, just let us. Contact us.
21:05
Contact us. I think that the, I'm sorry, y'all should have come to my breakout.
21:09
I covered it. I wish I could. I know. Yeah, we can get there.
21:13
Just one more thing. I think that the fear I have is that they won't just come
21:18
in and fire everyone and take it in.
21:20
But there will be a slow creep from human workers to a on some things that they
21:26
think could, you know, maybe do as good a job.
21:30
And you'll start seeing them just kind of leaving jobs vacant.
21:33
And then all of a sudden they'll just cut those jobs. And so if you see anything
21:38
like that, you need to let us know.
21:40
We are seeing exactly the jobs that are left vacant, and then they take the
21:44
jobs. Yep. That's familiar.
21:47
I think that's the biggest fear.
21:51
Well, that's not great. That's depressing. Yeah. But I asked, so—,
21:56
Well, anything else you want to talk about for a convention?
21:58
Anything? It happened, right?
22:00
I thought that was the most debate I've seen on the convention floor in years,
22:04
which is excellent. I do, too. Yeah, I think that's a good thing.
22:07
I thought that policy platform was really informative this year and dealt with real issues.
22:13
Policy platform committee killed it. Yeah. I didn't end up with as many bruises. Great.
22:19
You did get to climb a ladder. And we'll talk about that, too.
22:22
You guys don't know this because you're not all there to see it,
22:25
but Sammy is like all over this huge convention hall.
22:29
And if she sees there's a picture opportunity that she needs to catch,
22:33
she will run from one side to the other, hit her knees and slide across the floor.
22:38
I actually fell and hit my head on District 41's table at one point.
22:43
No pictures worth all that. Let's just go ahead and establish that.
22:46
Well, it was more just like I was like squatted in front of it and then I just
22:50
lost my balance slightly and went backwards. Ma'am.
22:55
No, don't put yourself in this position. We will be posting all those pictures
22:59
on our Flickr account. They're great pictures. So look forward to that. Yes.
23:04
So let's get to the question of the week. It is convention related.
23:08
What was your favorite part of convention? And I'll let Suzanne go first because she's very excited.
23:13
I am. Just jacks. Well, that goes without sin.
23:22
My favorite part of convention was at the very end, we have a floor call for,
23:27
you know, districts to make a charitable donation, like, to our scholarship fund.
23:33
So normally, Flint Benson is the voice.
23:37
I've seen it. He is our announcer, but he had to go to another event at the
23:42
convention, so I got to fill in.
23:44
You were the voice of God. That's what it says in the script.
23:46
Is that what it says? Yeah.
23:48
That is sacrilegious. Oh, my God. Anyway, I digress, but that was so much fun.
23:53
It was just fun to speak into that microphone and hear your voice be so big,
23:58
because I don't know that I have a really big voice. So it was just cool.
24:03
I think you did a great job, too. Thank you. And of course, I got pictures of that.
24:07
And the president's reception. That was a fiesta theme. There were some of the
24:13
most beautiful outfits and great dancers.
24:17
Lee Brady from the credit union. Oh, yeah. Yes. Yeah.
24:22
They were the sponsors of that event, and they all showed up,
24:26
and they were having fun. They were always fun. They were fun. Yeah.
24:30
What about you, Artis? What was your favorite part? Family Feud.
24:33
Oh, I heard it was cool. The Emerging Leaders Council did an event one night.
24:38
Family Feud and different districts of Scenic had teams, and we had a Scenic staff team.
24:44
I heard we weren't very good. Is that true? Well, we did our best.
24:48
I mean, you won out of you guys. We won our round, but it was on points.
24:53
So the team that won lobbered everyone by a mile. So we were really impressed by them.
24:59
Nice. But it was fun. It was fun.
25:02
Good, wholesome. That's awesome. There were so many people who had come out
25:06
to that event and were just enjoying themselves playing the games that were
25:09
at the different tables. And Dr. Van made the best host.
25:13
Oh, okay. From DAC. Yeah.
25:16
And ELC, that's our Emerging Leaders Council, so you hear us say ELC,
25:22
that's what we're referring to.
25:23
They did a great job planning that. That was a big, complicated—it's more complicated
25:28
than you think to throw a family feud. Yeah.
25:31
Yeah. And if you guys like doing volunteering stuff, you should definitely get
25:34
involved in ELC. They do a lot of volunteering throughout the state,
25:37
throughout the year. Yeah. Great idea.
25:39
But yeah, you know, I wonder how were they, when they said they were going to
25:42
do that event, I thought, how are they going to really do that?
25:45
But they had the buzzers.
25:47
They had, everybody had a proper mic. Dr. Vam was hysterical in his jacket,
25:52
but he also was very smooth.
25:55
Was he Steve Harvey-like? No, he was his own man for this.
25:59
He didn't do an impression of anybody. But he was, you know,
26:03
he's just kind of funny. He can just look at you and make you say something silly.
26:07
Yeah, they came here and practiced. They volunteered their time on their own
26:11
time, and they practiced that event like twice. Yeah.
26:15
Cool beans. What was your favorite part? Well, you know, we have that picture
26:19
in the scenic office that's from 1954. Yeah.
26:24
58, 54 from a convention passed, and artists wanted to replace that this year.
26:31
So we got a big 12-foot ladder. Now, look, you're taking credit from yourself.
26:37
I have said for years as we walked down the hall and passed that picture,
26:40
we've all said, gosh, I can't believe we've not taken one since then of everything.
26:45
Yeah. And you, the day convention was starting, suggested what?
26:50
Don't take credit from yourself. Yeah.
26:52
I was like, if we have a ladder, I'll get on a ladder and take a picture.
26:56
Yeah. So we got a big 12, 13-foot ladder on the stage, and I got to climb up
27:03
on stage and climb on the ladder and took a massive panoramic picture of everyone
27:09
at the convention. It was awesome.
27:11
That was cool. It was a cool time. Everybody was excited. It was nerve-wracking.
27:15
And she started, she did it, and she, like, didn't have her hand on the ladder,
27:19
and I was like, oh, no, she's going to die.
27:22
I was like, put your hand on the ladder We have a ladder that big at my parents'
27:26
house That I am forced to climb up every year For Christmas decorations Where
27:30
I then have to Crawl onto this platform that we have In our house.
27:36
She was up there with two I'm just standing there Watching her like,
27:40
I'm not sure what I'm going to do If you start coming down But
27:43
we had two staff members Brad Longhans and Scott Leonard Who are member relations
27:49
reps and they were on either side of this ladder.
27:53
And at one point, when I saw that she wasn't holding on, I said to Scott,
27:57
I'm nervous. And he said...
27:58
She may fall, but she ain't going to land. I'm going to make sure.
28:02
She ain't going to hit nothing. He had that. He had that. I felt safe with him.
28:06
Yeah. Yeah, truly. But, yeah, I was at first, the first time we discussed it,
28:12
we were thinking about getting one of those, you know, like scissor lift things.
28:15
We have them to do the lights around the stage.
28:19
But the AV team said that we couldn't get it on and off while people were in there, like, safely.
28:26
So then they were like, what about a ladder?
28:28
And so, Sammy and I were talking. I was like, how do you feel about ladders?
28:32
And she was like, I'm all for it. So, she did it here. And that ended up being
28:36
a really unifying moment. Yeah.
28:37
That was cool. For the convention. It was really cool. So, thank you for the suggestion.
28:41
I had no idea we would end up doing that. And the picture turned out awesome.
28:45
Yeah. We'll have to post that. Good job, Sammy. It's really narrow, though.
28:50
Yeah. I mean, obviously. Yeah. It's like a panorama, you know.
28:53
I don't know how. It's a picture like that of the General Assembly.
28:56
Yeah. I don't know how great it'll show up on your phone. Yeah,
28:59
but it can still be like, we could do a Facebook banner of that.
29:02
Yeah, that'd be cool. That's cool.
29:04
Well, my favorite, and I know you guys were all super jealous,
29:08
but I did win the Daryl Arnold Award this year. Champion.
29:12
Well deserved. And so did Felicia Edwards, who is in our finance team.
29:17
And I was very appreciative of it. And thank you to Wendell Powell for recognizing our efforts.
29:23
But honestly, I did tell, I wrote an email to the staff I was trying to explain,
29:28
and I don't know how great I did at it, but, like, we are really a team.
29:32
Like, everything that I do, it touches four or five people on staff,
29:36
you know, so we all work together on everything.
29:39
I thought your email was awesome. So I just don't like to take a lot of credit for it.
29:45
It's awful, isn't it? You go up to get an award, and you don't get to speak,
29:48
so you don't get to say, hey, listen, you know, it's uncomfortable a little bit.
29:53
Thank you for it, but it's uncomfortable because,
29:55
One person. Yeah. But the thing is, we all care about each other.
29:59
Yeah. This staff. I mean, even if we get on each other's nerves,
30:02
we still care about each other and we celebrate each other. Yeah.
30:06
President Powell let us all walk in together. That was cool. That's right.
30:10
Yeah. Yeah. We really messed that up. And no one noticed. That's one of the
30:13
things nobody really notices. But that whole thing was way too sped up.
30:17
Well, we'll talk about that later.
30:19
It was just so sped up. It really was like ridiculous. It did feel like it was
30:23
way sped up. I felt like we needed to move that.
30:25
So we did entrances this year for the executive committee and then the staff
30:30
and then Wendell Powell.
30:33
Wendell Powell's our president, and he had a great idea. It was going to be
30:36
really dramatic. Yeah, and I think we should have practiced it,
30:40
but yeah, it was just way too fast. I guess that's why they do wedding rehearsals.
30:43
Yeah, next year we'll have to do it.
30:47
I get it right. But everyone thought it was cool, and Wendell was happy,
30:49
so that's all that matters.
30:52
He had his moment. Yeah. And it was cool to let us walk in together like that, too. It was nice, yeah.
30:58
Set our tone as a staff, so. So one other thing we did at convention,
31:02
we always do our memorial, you know, to recognize the members who had passed in the year.
31:08
Before we got to Greensboro, this year we had two past presidents who passed,
31:14
Dwayne Smith and Paula Schubert.
31:17
And I thought it was a...
31:20
Fitting tribute that we, you know, put up their accolades and everything on
31:24
the, and Wendell said some nice things about both of them.
31:27
He did. They were great. Those two were one of a kind. Each of them was so one
31:32
of a kind. And they were so involved right up to the end, you know. Yeah.
31:36
And Dwayne's hair was awesome. It was impeccable. Right until the end.
31:40
Well, he came to a convention, you know, he passed in September of last year.
31:45
Yes. So he came to a convention right before he passed, you know.
31:48
And I didn't know that he was that, you know, so, but you are going to a memorial
31:53
for Paula today on, it's Thursday.
31:57
And she meant a lot to a lot of people at Scenic, so we just wanted to mention that.
32:02
Yeah, we will celebrate her today just the way she wanted.
32:05
One of the founders of Impact in 1989, she was president from 1999 to 2000,
32:11
Impact chair from 2005 to 2008, and she received the Member of the Year Distinguished
32:17
Service and President's Award.
32:19
But she did so much more than that. She was at every convention.
32:22
She was a staple. Everyone, you know, in the latter years, she was rolling around
32:26
on her scooter. And she even did the bylaws, the whole bylaws section about
32:31
two or three years ago from her scooter.
32:33
She was smart, so knowledgeable about everything, seeing it.
32:36
She was interesting. She was fun. Yeah.
32:38
She was perfect to have been a president of an organization because she just
32:43
is, when you elect somebody, you want to elect the best of you.
32:47
And Paula in any room just was the light in that room. She was a light.
32:51
She's very respected, too, amongst the membership. Always. Same with Dwayne.
32:57
So we will go to the interview now with the Patients Union, but everyone enjoy your week.
33:04
And please listen to the interview because it's a very important topic and the
33:08
vote could be Monday. So we need you to take action and first listen to the interview. Thank you.
33:20
Hello, everyone, and welcome to the interview portion of this week's Scenic View podcast.
33:25
I'm Jonathan Owens, along with Artis Watkins, and today we are joined by leaders
33:29
from the Patients Union,
33:32
an organization built and for patients working to reform health care in America,
33:37
who are fed up with seeing millions of people suffer, and so are we.
33:42
So earlier this week, we put out a joint invitation to the Wake County Board
33:46
of Commissioners asking for a meeting on the proposed QuakeMed atrium merger.
33:51
And today we have Jamila Headley, the Executive Director of the Patients Union,
33:56
and Reverend Rob Stephens, the Organizing Director for North Carolina,
34:00
with us to talk about the merger and where we go from here. Welcome to you both.
34:06
Thanks for having us. Good to be here. Good to be here.
34:10
So we recorded the first half of this podcast on Thursday, which was yesterday. Today is Friday.
34:15
But we waited a day for the interview, and I'm glad we did because news broke
34:19
overnight that the commissioners planned to vote on the merger on Monday.
34:24
First, I'd like to get your reaction to that news and the unlikelihood that
34:29
we'll get that meeting we requested and where things stand first.
34:35
Yeah, well, maybe Rob, I'll start, you know, this whole thing started back in
34:39
May when we had this decision to, you know, merge Wake Med with Atrium,
34:47
come on to a consent agenda.
34:48
And much like is happening today, we had documents dropped on a Friday,
34:54
for a vote that was Monday on a consequential decision that will affect generations
35:01
of Wake County residents and people across the state we now know,
35:05
to come with no meaningful engagement with constituents on the contents of that deal.
35:12
We've had many months of back and forth on this deal in the public.
35:16
We know that the commissioners have spent considerable time meeting with hospitals involved in this deal.
35:23
And we know that what is now on the table is different than what was there in
35:28
May. But once again, the public has no time to meaningfully engage with that.
35:32
So first, they have not fixed the process. The process has been rotten from
35:35
the beginning and it's still rotten today.
35:38
We know that commissioners met with Gene Woods, the CEO of Atrium.
35:42
We know that they have had several meetings with Donald Ginzik and the CEO of WICMED.
35:48
And what we ask simply is that they meet with patients and with state employees
35:54
who would be directly affected by the decision that they would make.
35:58
And the fact that they are going to proceed with this vote before that meeting
36:04
happens, before any meaningful exchange in this way that allows for two-way
36:08
exchange, not just us sharing our comments in public,
36:12
comments, is a flagrant disregard for the values of democracy,
36:18
and is incredibly disappointing.
36:21
Yeah, it's outrageous that after this deal was cooked in hiding for nearly three
36:28
years, which it did not have to be. This is Atrium's M.O..
36:32
That there's a public outcry for them to actually be transparent.
36:37
And not only do they refuse to show the deal to people, but they just turn around
36:42
and do the very same thing they did in May and rush this through because they
36:46
know that the longer it stays out here, the worse it smells.
36:50
And what we saw overnight, we're having a rapid response, we're going to respond
36:54
to it, is nothing that actually changes the fundamentals of the deal.
36:58
It's actually just what the deal that we thought it was in May and we knew it
37:02
was rotten in May before we found out that they were trying to slip it in,
37:06
that the $2 billion of investment wasn't actually going to come from Atrium.
37:10
Now they're saying it will, but it's very confused about how that will actually
37:13
work out. They've extended the timeline.
37:15
WakeMed had record profits last year, $177 million.
37:19
That times 15 is already $2.6 billion. And we know that Atrium is a private
37:24
equity actor with a nonprofit face.
37:27
They're going to come in, they're going to raise prices. No one even from Atrium
37:30
or WakeMed is disputing that.
37:32
Actually, Donald Genzik is saying he wants to raise the prices.
37:35
Yeah, publicly, didn't he? Yeah, over and over again.
37:39
And what we know they'll do is cut workers, cut staff, which happens at Atrium,
37:44
Wake Forest Baptist in Winston-Salem, is that they cut nursing in labor and
37:48
delivery so that now nurses are having to cover two patients.
37:52
And when we're talking about Black maternal health crisis in Southeast Raleigh,
37:55
Like, how in the world can they justify going with a bad actor who is willing
37:59
to give their CEO $26 million a year while cutting nurses in their overtime pay?
38:05
And they're now saying to invest $15 million a year only if it's Atrium invested.
38:09
But that's probably less than half of what Gene Woods is actually making now,
38:13
because we don't know what he made last year because they refused to release
38:15
that, too. So, you know, that the CEO is getting more than Wake County for buying
38:19
a premier hospital is just absurd.
38:21
And didn't Atrium announce big raises for a lot of their people a few days ago?
38:25
21% raises just in one year for their C-suite.
38:29
But we don't know about Gene Woods yet. He's, you know, if it's like last year,
38:33
we'll find out four months from now that he also got even more. Yeah.
38:38
Well, you know, I didn't think I'd see the day where county government was going
38:43
to be the gift that keeps on giving for the legislature.
38:46
Because honestly, county governments had traditionally prided themselves on
38:51
making all things as transparent as possible. And they would,
38:55
behind closed doors, they would talk junk about the legislature and how it wasn't as open.
39:00
And I have to say, Wake County's outdone themselves in terms of secrecy,
39:04
in terms of not only lack of input from the public, but not even pretending to care.
39:11
Right. Right. And it is it is a darn shame. And we are nonpartisan,
39:16
but this is an all Democratic board and they are acting like the White House
39:22
in terms of secrecy and bullying and rushing this through.
39:25
And, you know, that's why we're coming together with Scenic and labor partners
39:30
and community partners, Men of Southeast Rally, NAACP, all out on Monday at
39:34
1230 for a mass rally to stop the takeover of WakeMed,
39:38
by the multi-billion dollar hospital chain atrium at Nash Square.
39:42
So we're- Yeah, tell us a little more about Monday, what people can do if they're
39:46
interested, you know, just in showing they don't want this, they don't like
39:51
it, and that this is a huge problem. What can they do on Monday?
39:54
Yes. So right now you can call your county commissioners. Everyone should call
39:57
the county commissioners. You should email your county commissioners.
40:00
We want you to get out and let them know that this is a rotten deal for Wake County.
40:05
And it's absurd that they're going to rush this through. There's no reason to
40:08
rush it through. They've said all along that there's no rush to this.
40:11
And now they're changing their tune saying that they need this to survive.
40:16
Those two things can't be true at the same time. It can't be true at the same
40:19
time that they have a billion dollars to invest in expanding hospitals without
40:24
Atrium, which they said in their
40:25
certificate of need, and that they think they need Atrium to survive.
40:28
So on Monday, we'll be at Nash Square right across the street from the county
40:32
courthouse at 1230 to rally and let people know that we don't want this deal.
40:36
A broad and wide coalition of folks and community members will be there.
40:41
But all over the weekend, please do call. You can find action alerts at CNIX
40:46
website, I know, but also Justice Center and Patients Union.
40:50
We just need everyone to let them know that this is a rotten deal that we don't want.
40:55
And they can even be in favor of trying to get a larger partner.
40:59
You might be in favor of Adrian, which I can't understand.
41:04
But you can still know that this is a rushed process that makes no sense,
41:07
that we're doing it on Monday.
41:09
I think an important thing to know for people who are wondering what you can
41:13
do is that you can do something. This is not done yet. The commissioners have not voted yet.
41:19
And they need to see that thousands of Wake County residents who will be affected
41:24
by this deal are willing to show up,
41:26
are willing to apply pressure, are willing to sit in that herring and bear witness
41:31
and to feel the right amount of pressure for the stakes involved in this deal.
41:36
So, you know, people coming out on Monday, we believe that this could change the course of the vote.
41:42
And so we're asking people to come out because we think it matters, right?
41:47
Like, it's not just a visual, we think it matters.
41:52
Yeah, and Jamila, y'all, bless her heart, she is good enough to do this podcast,
41:57
by having to step outside where she is.
41:59
So every now and then the audio is not perfect there, but we want her voice here.
42:04
And it's been such an important voice in this fight. So just wanted to explain what's going on there.
42:09
I did want to ask y'all about, I saw just a few minutes ago that the Justice
42:13
Center put out a press release about the fact that they're not getting responses
42:18
to their public records requests about the deal.
42:22
And Nathan Foster, who had been on this podcast, I guess last month,
42:26
gosh, it seems like this has gone on for longer than it has,
42:29
but he had this quote. We submitted a public records request for the deal between
42:33
Wakeman and Atrium on August 6th, more than a month ago.
42:37
We have received no response. Wake County should at least do the public the
42:41
courtesy of explaining why they won't show us the deal.
42:45
Well, I just have to say we got a response to our public records request on
42:49
Monday after 52 days of waiting and several follow up emails only because we got our lawyer,
42:56
to send a letter to the commission demanding a response to it.
43:00
And even then, that public records request was grossly insufficient.
43:04
It was rushed. It was clearly not fully fulfilling our request.
43:09
So we, too, have been in this battle to get transparency and to get what citizens
43:14
should be able to have to be entitled to as these deals unfold, which is access to
43:21
public records, to emails and
43:22
conversations that the county commissioners have been having about this.
43:26
Yeah, y'all really have been battling about this, which seems just so ridiculous.
43:33
We know a lot about the non-transparency of health records, right?
43:38
Artists from the state health plan. Yeah.
43:41
Yeah. The whole, you know, it's competitive trade secret information.
43:46
We can't give it to you because, for goodness sakes, corporations are going
43:51
to definitely have more rights than the public employees whose salaries are
43:55
posted on the open. Yeah, exactly. We can't accept that.
44:00
You know, the fact that it can't all be competitive. It can't be that we don't
44:04
get a single email from Gene Woods or Donald Genzig or email to them in this
44:08
public records request.
44:10
What's the point of the public records request if we don't get the people who
44:13
are actually negotiating the deal with the county are taken out of it?
44:17
There's none. We got 30 text messages.
44:20
There's no way there's only 30 text messages that people, that county commissioners
44:23
and staff and Wake Med have exchanged.
44:27
And we know for a fact that they have excluded text messages that have been
44:31
publicly discussed, you know, by county commissioners and requested us to ask for them in emails.
44:37
And so, yeah, there is a lot in there, but it is not transparent at all.
44:41
And I agree with Nathan completely that they cannot move forward with this,
44:44
with that type of lack of transparency.
44:48
So, Rob, you mentioned earlier that, you know, all of these commissioners are Democrats.
44:53
And it's funny how the R and the D disappear when billions of dollars are involved, right?
44:58
Right. And I think it just points out how this health care fight is not a partisan fight.
45:04
You know, can you speak a little bit about that? Like you face these things
45:08
and you too, Jamila, like all over the country, these types of things are happening, right?
45:14
Yeah. No one's happy about health care right now. And in some ways,
45:18
sometimes the Republicans are actually stronger on hospital consolidation of
45:21
Democrats, which is just makes no sense.
45:23
You know, that's and it is in the billions of dollars, you know.
45:27
And what we've seen is that one theory is that you can't privatize health care
45:32
as much as other institutions. And so everyone needs it.
45:36
But, yeah, people have come out. They are people, workers who are,
45:39
you know, from all sides of the political spectrum are angry at this.
45:43
What we've seen is, you know, from the highest levels of government,
45:46
statewide officials and centers have come out against this.
45:50
And, you know, our question is for those who typically have a fairly consistent
45:54
line on supporting working people, supporting poor people to get the health care they need.
46:00
This is incongruent with that. And it's immoral.
46:04
Like you can't say that you're for working people. You can't say that you're
46:07
for health care, for folks, for child care, and then support a deal that is
46:12
blatantly going to increase our costs and take away the power of the people
46:15
to have oversight of this deal.
46:17
And so it does, Jonathan, absolutely cut across those, you know,
46:21
those kind of arbitrary lines of demarcation between different folks.
46:26
The level of pain here is so high on health care around the country.
46:30
It's so incredibly high.
46:33
I tear up just even thinking about it. Even during this hearing,
46:37
we heard stories over the last few months at public hearings on the WakeMed atrium merger.
46:43
We heard stories of people who were struggling to afford a $10 copay for a drug that they needed.
46:50
We heard stories about families making trade-offs on, you know,
46:54
paying for gas or paying for health care.
46:58
And we know that because of all these forces, because of increased consolidation,
47:03
among hospitals, among insurers, like the price is just going up for patients.
47:07
So when, Arda, when I saw you guys put out your analysis that the cost for employees
47:13
on the state health plan would go up by, what was it, $7 to $14 a month?
47:18
It was like $132 up to $132 a year.
47:22
Correct. People struggle to afford $10 co-pay for their medications.
47:27
That is so common among this country.
47:29
That is prohibitive cost increase for most American families.
47:34
And that is not, that's regardless of where people live, that's regardless of,
47:39
you know, partisan divide.
47:41
It is so deeply felt and it's so consequential in people's lives.
47:45
And we saw that in who came out, who's come out against this deal over the course.
47:50
It's been a strange set of bed fellows here coming out against this deal because.
47:57
This is so tangible in the lives of so many people.
48:01
And to watch an interview with Don Ginzik last week.
48:05
You know, shrugging his shoulders at the fact that costs would increase due
48:09
to this deal for patients. It is callous.
48:12
It is so callous in the face of such extreme pain.
48:17
Can I say that? Please, Rob. And that's why the Patients' Union,
48:22
you know, Victor Hugo had a quote that all the armies in the world can't stop
48:26
an idea whose time has come.
48:28
And the patients' union idea is that the largest group of folks in our healthcare
48:32
system that are the most impacted are the least organized.
48:36
And that it's all of us, that we're all patients. We're all going to be disabled one day.
48:42
We're all going to have to deal with this healthcare system.
48:44
And we have let the healthcare system become a corporatized system that's making
48:48
billions of dollars off our bodies and at the same time squeezing wages for workers.
48:53
And those two things are absolutely together. That's why we draw inspiration
48:58
from the labor movement, Artis and Jonathan, and that there's the system that
49:02
the means of how they're making is all this money.
49:05
There's no money in the health care system without our bodies and without the making of it.
49:09
And we deserve to be at the table, not just the CEOs, when these decisions are made.
49:15
Well, amen to all of that. I got to say, looking at the changes that were published
49:19
today as the kind of new and improved plan before the county commissioners on Monday,
49:27
one is, and I'd love to get y'all's take on these, more cash for the county,
49:30
$15 million each year for a decade for Wake County to expand initiatives for
49:36
affordability of care, expand mental health care.
49:39
First of all, I'm not sure how much you're dealing with $15 million a year to
49:41
make real inroads on such massive.
49:46
Systemic issues that we have as a state and country, but then more indigent
49:51
care. Now, this is the part I really wanted to ask y'all.
49:54
So, it says at least the second agreement would increase from 4.8% indigent care requirement to 8%.
50:04
But isn't WakeMed currently doing a lot more than 8%?
50:08
Absolutely, they are. MakeMed does three to four times as much indigent care than Atrium.
50:14
They are well over 12% right now.
50:17
And we know that those numbers can be made up. And so the 8% is,
50:20
I mean, they'll never go below that because they're going to be making so much money.
50:24
HM is the second worst in the state in indigent care, just slightly above Novant,
50:29
when you look at the real numbers.
50:30
And so there are examples in Indiana and other places where you get actually
50:33
hard, hard numbers, not those numbers that they're referencing.
50:37
They can use almost anything to make that up, to make it.
50:40
There's other standards that other groups, and that's why we need more time.
50:44
Is that there's examples of how you can get concrete ways to look at indigent
50:48
care that will actually mean that people are getting the services they want.
50:53
When you look at mergers in HCA and Novant, they can say that they're doing
50:57
indigent care because of, you know, math magic, because they're not using the
51:01
right standards for how we actually watch that.
51:05
But it is important to know that because of public outcry as well,
51:09
they felt pressured to change it at least on paper to 8%, still far below what
51:14
the standard of indigent care we county is experiencing from rake med right now.
51:19
And that is perhaps the most important point here, but a change,
51:24
right, from where we were four months ago. True. I mean, some progress.
51:28
And what about the board member selection and removal? Jamila,
51:31
what do you think of the new, you know, the newest version of that that's before
51:35
us? Has anything ultimately changed with that?
51:37
I think ultimately, no. I think ultimately there have been tweaks to,
51:43
you know, the process for the slate that, you know, a slate could be brought to
51:48
Wake County Commissioners and they can reject that slate and require them to provide other names.
51:54
But the bottom line is that Atrium is still the sole member,
51:58
functionally still holds power to make all the core decisions regarding capital expenditure.
52:06
Regarding budgets and regarding appointing of board members.
52:10
And that has not, what we can see from our analysis of what we have right now
52:15
is that that has not functionally changed, that we still have grave concerns
52:22
about what this means for local control here.
52:25
Well, that's this. OK, so this is not good.
52:29
Then definitely everybody need to come out if you're listening to this and you
52:32
live anywhere near Wake County.
52:33
You need to come on out to Nash Square on Monday with the Patients Union,
52:38
Justice Center, other groups and stand up for your rights to not get further
52:44
trampled on by the health care industry.
52:47
Are there things we should have asked y'all that we haven't yet before we wrap this thing up?
52:53
Did we talk about the $2 billion? Oh, we hadn't talked about that,
52:56
Israel. That's a biggie.
52:58
You know, we started off this, you know, when we saw the, heard news of this merger in early May.
53:04
The main talking point was that this was going to come with a $2 billion investment.
53:09
And maybe naively, many of us understood that to be real investment from Atrium,
53:15
but still had many other concerns about the deal.
53:17
So in August, due to questions from the governor, in response to questions from
53:22
the governor, the public found out that that $2 billion was not real money.
53:27
That first, what was going to comprise that $2 billion was first,
53:32
you know, revenue that generated by WakeMed.
53:35
WakeMed's excess revenue, debt financing, so debt that WakeMed would take on.
53:40
And then if there was any leftover of that $2 billion that hadn't been made
53:45
up by those first two sources, that H&M would kick in a little bit.
53:48
Now, we already know that WakeMed is at about $180 million in excess revenue.
53:52
So, like, do the math, by 10 years, that alone with no debt financing,
53:57
they're already almost there at the $2 billion.
53:59
What we read through that was effectively H&M was getting this hospital for free. Handed to them.
54:08
They're added to that. They have pointed to, you know, in the new agreement,
54:11
there is a change of language and there's a change of one word.
54:15
Instead of saying Atrium intends to make $2 billion in expenditure over 10 years,
54:19
there's actually two words, it says Atrium shall make an investment of $2 billion
54:25
in expenditure over 15 years.
54:28
They've swapped the word intends to with shall.
54:31
Still no specification of where that money shall come from, whether it shall
54:36
come from the revenue generated by WakeMed or debt financing,
54:41
or if that will truly be additional funding from HVM.
54:44
And now we have an extended timeline, not just over 10 years,
54:48
but over 15 years. Again, I'm incredibly concerned about this.
54:51
And there is no point in the process between now and Monday where the public
54:56
can get these questions answered by commissioners before a vote is taken.
55:00
And that, to me, is absolutely not what democracy looks like.
55:03
Jamila, you might want to say that just one more time around the shall,
55:06
because the shall is very important.
55:10
What I just looked at is that it's shall make or cause to be made.
55:15
So that the or is what is... Shall make or cause to be made.
55:18
Oh my God. Yeah, so the shall is important because shall is the big deal.
55:23
That means something. But the fact that they're still leaving out,
55:27
and we certainly, artists and others will be doing this, having attorneys look
55:31
at this and get it out to the public and analysis of this.
55:35
But they're going to be making so much money off of WakeMed with their increased
55:40
prices, with their cutting of costs.
55:43
I wonder what our county commissioners think of the fact that Atrium,
55:47
despite having much more massive coffers than Wake Med, doesn't fund their retirement
55:52
system for their employees to the level Wake Med currently does.
55:56
And that should make, if I was an employee at Wake Med, I'd be worried about that.
56:01
Well, Artis, I hadn't heard that.
56:04
That's important information. I'd be worried about that, too.
56:07
So Anne Kemski put that on her LinkedIn a while back, and I thought that was fascinating.
56:14
With $10 billion in reserves to not fully fund your employee's retirement system
56:20
is a huge deal, in my opinion.
56:22
And WakeMed apparently funds theirs much more appropriately.
56:26
We do know that they have been intimidating their staff to not come out against
56:30
us. We have had dozens of staff members and family members of staff members
56:35
of WakeMed who have come to us and said, We don't believe in this deal,
56:38
but we know that we'll get fired if we stand up and say something.
56:41
On Monday, we will actually hear some of those stories of people who have sent
56:45
in their anonymous stories of their fear of this deal, who are working at WakeMed,
56:51
but are scared to come out because of the backlash.
56:54
And Atrium and WakeMed, Atrium in particular, their fear is warranted.
56:59
Yes, I do want to go back to one thing where we were talking about the premium
57:04
increases for state employees. from this.
57:08
So I posted last night this story about the commissioners voting on our Facebook
57:12
page and it's shocking how many people are asking why.
57:17
Like this is the first time they've ever heard of these artists.
57:20
So I don't know if we've like failed in telling them but we've told them many
57:25
many times but how is that just not connecting with people and you know people across the state,
57:32
are kind of thinking well this is Wake Med.
57:34
I don't go to Wake Med. Why am I affected by this.
57:40
I mean, I think there's a couple, wait, you know, Atrium is the largest health
57:43
system in North Carolina, right? Like, you know, they have an outsized impact on this market.
57:49
And I think the other thing is that healthcare is complex. Big hospitals,
57:53
mega hospital chains, and big insurance are in cahoots in raising prices on
57:58
patients. And they're all guilty. That's the truth.
58:01
But the hospitals are not, the hospitals are part of the problem, right?
58:05
Like, we've heard Don Kinzig, one of the things that I wanted to say before
58:09
we went was like, In the interview that he had with WRAL last week,
58:14
he said, our operating costs are going to go down because we're going to have economies of scale.
58:17
We're going to be able to negotiate lower prices on commodities and other things.
58:22
So, like, he's admitted his costs are going to go down, but then still said
58:27
in the next breath that prices are going to go up.
58:30
Now, make that make sense, right? Your costs are going down,
58:34
but your prices are going up. That just sounds like greed. Yeah. Right?
58:38
And as a result, it affects prices for all workers given their outsized role
58:44
on the market. But Artis, I'm curious to hear your thoughts.
58:46
I just had to get that note in about pricing.
58:50
When people are desperate, they start scrambling.
58:53
Then they'll say things that absolutely make no sense because they're just throwing
58:57
everything against the wall. But actually, going back, I did want to say one
59:01
more thing about the pension of Atrium and WakeMed because I did find that now.
59:07
Because if anybody who works at Wake Med's listening, I do think this is pertinent.
59:11
According to Fitch Bond Rating Agency, Atrium's pension was 66% funded in 2024,
59:17
and it looks about to be 70% funded from 2025 despite big stock market gains.
59:23
Wake Med's was 130% funded in the most recent Wake Med annual financial report.
59:29
So that alone, to me, if I was a health care worker, would cause tremendous concern.
59:37
Yeah we definitely get get that out to folks absolutely,
59:41
i think the topic of health care is so overwhelming to people because it's like
59:45
rob said it's ruining people's lives and it's the most basic need other than food,
59:51
yeah your health care is your most basic need for you and your family to survive
59:56
so of all the things to put perverse profit margin in charge of it's just gross.
1:00:04
It's absolutely gross that we're living in this timeline, but people kind of
1:00:08
don't want to hear it because it's really alarming and anxiety producing.
1:00:13
So let's review one time before we go, just what people can do.
1:00:17
You mentioned, Rob, that you're having an event on Monday, right?
1:00:22
They have decided to take this vote on Monday without the public having any
1:00:27
real substantive input or ability to respond or understand the new parts of this deal.
1:00:33
What we do understand is that it's still a rotten deal that's going to take
1:00:36
money and be extracted for people of Wake County. It's going to raise prices.
1:00:39
They aren't even countering that.
1:00:41
And so all weekend, we need folks to be calling their county commissioners,
1:00:45
emailing their county commissioners, telling them to stop this deal.
1:00:48
And you can find action alerts from the Patients Union, from Scenic,
1:00:52
from Justice Center to take those actions.
1:00:55
Then on Monday, we need large crowd to come out and we need folks to come because
1:00:59
their voices will make a difference.
1:01:01
And you can come to 1230 to Nash Square right across the street from the courthouse,
1:01:05
for a rally and then people to sign up to speak to oppose this at the county
1:01:09
commissioner meeting at 2 p.m.
1:01:11
So even, and I'll tell you, we all know that this is going to be a while,
1:01:14
so if you get off work at 5, I would guess that we'll still be there.
1:01:17
So come on down, even if you can't get there right at 2, to speak out against
1:01:23
this takeover of our hospital.
1:01:26
Great. Jamila, do you have anything to add? No, that's all. Thank you so much. I'm sorry about that.
1:01:33
Lots to say. It's an important one. Twice as long as I told you. Sorry about that.
1:01:38
All good. Thank you to both of you for joining us. And yeah,
1:01:41
please take action on Monday. It's very important. Thank you. Bye. Bye-bye.