Latest / The Home of Fertility with Liz Walton & Helen Zee / Robin and Liz on Emotional Healing and Fertility Challenges

Transcript

Robin and Liz on Emotional Healing and Fertility Challenges · The Home of Fertility with Liz Walton & Helen Zee

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Welcome to Fertility, health and Coming Back to the Self, an opportunity to go deeper into your journey of life, and all this can encompass with your host, liz Walton.
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: This podcast follows the threads of life and the journey of fertility on every level emotional, physical, spiritual and the consciousness we consider our health and what that means in our lives today.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: And we bring all of this together with coming home to ourselves, the conscious and unconscious journey of life and how we traverse this in the best way possible.
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: I am so grateful and humbled.
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: You are here.
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: Welcome to my podcast, fertility Health and Coming Home to Self, and it's been really lovely.
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: I've had a bit of a hiatus with the podcast with the Fertility Summit, so it's really lovely to come back and record and chat and talk about, you know, healing health and everything that may be part of that.
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: As you know, we search on our journey to be fertile, be you know, with fertility and what is it?
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: Those things that get in the way physically, spiritually, emotionally.
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: So today I'm talking with my wonderful friend, robin, who happens to be in Wales, back in jolly old England.
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: Hello, robin, lovely to have you here today.
• 1:45
  Speaker 3: Thank you, liz, it's great to be here.
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: Ah, that's so good.
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: So I'm in an evening and Robin's about 10am during the day, so it's really lovely to chat again.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: We've done a podcast already where we discussed about health, and we have been texting over the months and Robin's been doing a lot of work on a subject that is quite big in the area of fertility, which is endometriosis, and so I thought this would be a really good conversation.
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: You know, just going deeper into seeing the meta perspective, um so, meta health, meta consciousness.
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: I'll get robin to explain it deeper again in a moment, but it's, you know, today is a conversation.
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: It's looking at endometriosis in just a different way and it's just about offering, um, yeah, another perspective, another way of being able to connect with our body, our emotions, and how this may be, um, how, how our body's talking to us.
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: I suppose Would that be the right way of saying it, robin?
• 3:06
  Speaker 3: I think metaconsciousness is kind of what it says on the tin meta, that overarching consciousness awareness.
• 3:12
  Speaker 3: So I think of it as an awareness of how our body is responding to its environment, whether that's external environment or internal environment, and how it then seeks to communicate that with us.
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: Our body is a biological system.
• 3:35
  Speaker 3: It's very wise, it's very intelligent, it doesn't make mistakes, it doesn't go wrong, it doesn't attack itself, but it does make adaptations when it feels under threat of some kind.
• 3:46
  Speaker 3: And that's very much a subjective perspective.
• 3:50
  Speaker 3: So the person right next to me might not feel under threat, but I might, and as soon as I do.
• 3:57
  Speaker 3: If I'm not able to respond to that, if I feel I have no coping strategy, then my body starts to go into some form of adaptation and that's done from a place of fear and lack.
• 4:11
  Speaker 3: So it's not something that serves who I was born to be, but it is there to help me get through that situation that feels so threatening situation that feels so threatening unfortunately, as human beings we quite often stick with that.
• 4:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we the design is that our body holds that for us until we're ready to process it.
• 4:34
  Speaker 3: Go into it, because it is wisdom, it's learning for us to help us to more fully step into who we actually are born to be, who we really are.
• 4:43
  Speaker 3: But if we don't have the space and time or the sense of safety to be able to do that, that's when that adaptation kind of gets stuck and we start to experience symptoms.
• 4:55
  Speaker 3: But the symptoms also are showing us what's going on, what is the belief I'm currently processing from or living from and living in that isn't serving me and how can I begin to turn that around so that I get back to balance, get back to well-being and step more fully into who I was born to be?
• 5:16
  Speaker 3: So it's all part of a very natural, very normal, very supportive process.
• 5:22
  Speaker 3: But when we don't understand that, when we're getting the message, your body's going wrong, it's making a mistake, we're pushing against that and we're not feeling able to dive in and explore it.
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: Oh, wow, okay, I feel this is going to be such a juicy subject as we, I suppose, peel back the layers.
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: So I think let's work on this um in each section.
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: So, um, you talked about what a meta perspective is just now, and if you want to say anything more, please do.
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: And then let's go into you know what is endometriosis and the symptom, and then we're going to look a bit about you know meta, you know the phases and whether we're in stress phase and the regeneration, so that we can sort of break this down on how we can more understand our body and how it's affecting us and how we're seeing it.
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: So, really, robin, kind of over to you.
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: So let's kind of start at the beginning with you know the meta perspective with endometriosis, and then let's go deeper with that, because I have a lot of clients and friends that suffer from endometriosis, and some of them very, very severely, and what I'm noticing now and now I can only talk more Australia wise as you can sort of be more of the UK is, you know, the Western woman is suffering more from endometriosis.
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: So the curiosity is it is it our outside world, is it our inside world?
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: Is it both?
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: Um, and then we have to look at well, what about other cultures as well, you know.
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: So, yes, robin, I will hand it over to you, because this is a very interesting subject and one that I'm going to be really um excited to share with the people that are having these problems.
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: And just, you know what?
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: What do they think about this perspective?
• 7:42
  Speaker 3: so just to start, maybe, with the symptoms, because perhaps there are people listening who aren't very familiar.
• 7:48
  Speaker 3: Probably most people have heard of endometriosis and certainly I'm sure your listeners are aware of what that is.
• 7:56
  Speaker 3: But just to go into the symptoms, in case there's anybody listening who's not so familiar, and basically I got this from the National Health Service UK website where they say that endometriosis is a condition where tissue similar to the lining of the womb grows in other places, such as the ovaries and the fallopian tubes, and it can affect women of any age.
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: So sometimes I think we think of this in a particular age bracket, but they're saying that actually is of any age, including teenagers, and that it's a long-term condition that can have a significant impact on your life.
• 8:35
  Speaker 3: And I think sometimes, unless you know somebody who has endometriosis or you have it yourself, many people don't really appreciate just how painful it can be, how much it can impact on your life.
• 8:46
  Speaker 3: But the nhs are saying that there are treatments that can help and that different women have different symptoms.
• 8:54
  Speaker 3: So some may be severely affected, others may be not badly affected at all.
• 8:59
  Speaker 3: But the common symptoms that people experience are pain, sort of in the lower tummy area or back pelvic pain, and it's usually worse during the woman's period and it can stop.
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: It can be so bad that it stops you doing your normal activities, the things that you would regularly do otherwise, and it can be also pain during or after sex, which can be really difficult, and it can be also pain during or after sex, which can be really difficult, and it can be when trying to use the toilet as well.
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: So really really can impact on normal life.
• 9:34
  Speaker 3: It can leave you feeling sick, constipated, with diarrhea, blood in your urine, blood in your feces.
• 9:41
  Speaker 3: It can make it difficult to get pregnant which is obviously why we're discussing it around fertility and some women also experience very heavy periods and depression.
• 9:52
  Speaker 3: So it's not just the physical symptoms, it's how you feel in yourself as well, and I know somebody who has very heavy bleeding and she talks about just how it leaves her feeling dirty, therefore isolated and alone, and she can't talk to people about it.
• 10:10
  Speaker 3: So there's all aspects yeah, a few clients.
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I have a few clients that, um, you know, they have to go and work from home.
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: The pain is just so much.
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: Um, I've also, when I've chatted to other few friends, a few clients, and they look back, you know when I think how long they've had it.
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: They've said, well, you know what, I probably had it from being a teenager, but I didn't know then.
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: So you know, it is very debilitating and um, yeah, which, of course, if you've got heavy bleeding, can leave you um with very low iron levels, can leave you anemic, therefore with low energy and low mood.
• 10:48
  Speaker 3: So, just for people's understanding, I think those aspects are very important to be aware of as well yeah if you know somebody with endometriosis to have that kind of empathy of what they are experiencing, what they're going through.
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I had um for the fertility summit.
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: I had a really lovely doctor called dr shumi shaha and she's in canberra here and I think she's um, she's quite um knowledgeable and she spoke about endometriosis and I know she does a lot of robotic if I get this right um robotic, um operations, um to support um people with endometriosis and supporting that with the different operations.
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: So she's she's very well versed.
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: So again, looking at it from a different point of view, it's a medical point of view.
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: A medical point of view.
• 11:46
  Speaker 3: And metaconsciousness is very much about being complementary.
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: It works alongside the medical perspective and as a practitioner I would be seeking to work with doctors or any other practitioners to best support the person, to best support the person, because that's always the ultimate aim, isn't it?
• 12:05
  Speaker 3: To best support the person who's going through whatever condition, whatever experience they have.
• 12:10
  Speaker 3: And to get to the meta.
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: You talked about the two phases earlier you mentioned those and in meta we look at the fact that when something happens I mentioned earlier something that leaves us feeling threatened and the body makes that adaptation.
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: So when that happens, the adaptation is basically because my body has gone into stress, it's trying to deal with something that it has found overwhelming, threatening, deeply challenging, and during that stress the body is making changes.
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: And during that stress the body is making changes and depending on where in the body and how, that relates to a certain area of the brain, because different tissues in the body relate to different areas of the brain, which is just embryology how the baby, the fetus develops in the womb.
• 13:00
  Speaker 3: Those changes might be cells increasing in number or cells decreasing in number.
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: And then when we shift out of stress, the body has to undo that.
• 13:14
  Speaker 3: It has to get back to balance.
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: So if it put on extra cells, we want to reduce those back to the normal level.
• 13:22
  Speaker 3: We're just trying to get back to that normal homeostatic level.
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: But if it lost cells in the stress, it'll be trying to put those back, regrow them in the regeneration.
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: So that's basically how our body responds.
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: And for endometriosis, the process starts in the ovaries and the ovaries relate to the part of brain known as the cerebral medulla.
• 13:55
  Speaker 3: And what's going on there, behind the response the body is the adaptation the body is making.
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: Is that it's to do with a sense of profound loss, or it can also be fear or anticipation of a profound loss?
• 14:16
  Speaker 3: We don't necessarily need to have experienced that loss yet, but if we think that it's coming, if we have a sense of something really, really important to me is going to be snatched away, that can still leave us with sufficient sense of loss for our ovaries to be triggered into this adaptation.
• 14:39
  Speaker 3: And for meta, we look at what the themes might be.
• 14:46
  Speaker 3: What is that adaptation seeking to support us with what thought processes or emotions we might be experiencing at that time and with this process it's things like constant self-blame.
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: I'm not good enough, I didn't do what I was supposed to do, or grief, despair and again loss.
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: So that could be that we've had a breakup with somebody and again it's profound loss somebody who meant a lot to us, or it was a very emotional breakup, or it can be a death or a miscarriage or an argument that left us feeling that it might happen that I'm going to lose this relationship, relationship, this person, or a deep betrayal or unfaithfulness from that relationship, and the loss of a loved one can be a pet as well if your pet is because I know a lot of people and their pets could be there.
• 15:55
  Speaker 3: What they've seen, almost as a partner.
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: You know they come home to their dog, their cat and that's the person, four-legged person that they share their how their day has been yeah, that they talk to, yeah, yeah, that supports them in their how they see the world, isn't it yeah?
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: exactly yes, so that can be a profound loss as well.
• 16:21
  Speaker 3: It doesn't have to be a person or a child, it could be an animal.
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: It could also be that the person desperately wants to be pregnant and they've maybe been looking forward to having children of their own, starting a family, but perhaps they don't feel in a good position to do that right now.
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: So they've got that tension of I want, but it's not a good place, it's not a good time.
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: Maybe the current relationship isn't feeling like a safe relationship in which to bring a child, or the world.
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: You know, it might not be the relationship, it might be the situation.
• 17:03
  Speaker 3: So the world in which they're living, their little space in that world, doesn't feel safe yet.
• 17:09
  Speaker 3: I mean, you look at the wars that are going on today, but there are maybe women there who would have loved to start a family, but it just doesn't feel safe enough right now yeah, for sure so when we're talking about different cultures and different generations, this could come in in different ways for different women in different places at different times so much absolutely and emotions that would be relevant here are feelings of grief, despair and loss, as I've already mentioned, those profound you know.
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: You can just almost tune in and feel what that is like in the body when you experience something that deep and that profound.
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: That just leaves you feeling just that deep, deep grief, that sense of despair and that profound loss and again that can leave you feeling unsafe yes, and so I suppose I'm suddenly thinking of some of the words from some of my clients as well, probably myself, um, but I've never, as far as I'm aware, suffered from endometriosis, um, which I know from um some of my clients that, you know, some things had happened in the past and they were just, you know they.
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: They felt that they just weren't enough.
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: That deep, deep sense of I'm, I've got something wrong with me, and then that's already happened in the past, and then trying to get pregnant as adults, um, so that's something that's just come up for me and well, that ties in very much to the concept of it's not safe for me to bring a child into the world because if I'm not good enough, maybe I won't be a good mother and if I didn't experience good nurturing from my mother, then I might feel how on earth can I bring a child into the world?
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: I don't know how to mother a child yeah and that, might you know, we might think on our cognitive level.
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: Well, I'll look into it and I'll do differently from what I experienced, but if we have a belief that's running subconsciously, but.
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: I don't know how to do it, I'm not going to be able to do it, I'm not good enough.
• 19:35
  Speaker 3: Then that can be what's actually impacting on our body and how our body is responding, even though consciously we might be thinking but I'll do better, yeah I'll be better than my mom.
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll be okay, I'll get over it.
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, deep shame, I think um as well.
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: Deep shame.
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: That could also be part of it too.
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: Couldn't have that deep shame very much yes, interesting, like you said, those play so much into that whole.
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: I'm not worth it.
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: I'm not good enough.
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: Which is that whole thing of?
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: Is it safe for me to bring a baby into the world?
• 20:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah and there can be also thoughts around how can I go on?
• 20:22
  Speaker 3: Because that sense of it's not just our own survival, it's the survival of the species can come in as well.
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: So the survival of the family can be somehow I, we must survive, and ovaries relate to that whole, and ovaries relate to that whole reproduction.
• 20:57
  Speaker 3: So reproduction for myself as an individual, reproduction for ourselves as a couple, for our family, for our line, our family line, so there can be aspects of that in it as well, which again can relate very much to what you were saying about.
• 21:05
  Speaker 2: I'm not good enough and shame yeah, particularly if it is family shame as well, because that can come down yeah, yeah, okay, and so those can be some of the themes for us, can't it that we're thinking, feeling, believing.
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: It's part of our, you know part of how we feel, and then it might be very silent that we lock down deep inside, completely locked up, but they're happening, they're running, basically, aren't they?
• 21:35
  Speaker 3: which is why I think the work that you do is so amazing the journey work and all of that exploration that you do to support the clients and people who come to you, because it helps people to feel safe, to be able to explore this stuff, to recognize and acknowledge.
• 21:51
  Speaker 3: Actually, yes, I've been feeling this deep shame, I've been feeling this not good enough sense and then, once we acknowledge it, we can start to process it, we can start to address it yeah and start therefore to release it and to see.
• 22:09
  Speaker 3: Actually, maybe that's not my stuff, maybe it's stuff I've been carrying that I internalized, it was conditioned into me yeah but now I can let it go and I can recognize that that actually has been getting in the way.
• 22:23
  Speaker 3: It's maybe not my physical body at all.
• 22:28
  Speaker 3: It's this belief I've been holding that's just been trying to protect me and that we can celebrate that, be grateful for that and let it know that we're okay now.
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: We've got this, we that we're okay.
• 22:43
  Speaker 3: Now We've got this, we know we are safe.
• 22:45
  Speaker 3: Now we can move forward again.
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: Brilliant.
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: So then, what's next Once we start realizing the phases?
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, so then let's go back to the phases.
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: So then we have stress phase and healing phase, haven't we?
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: Yes?
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: so, as I was saying earlier, some cells will increase in the stress phase because they're trying to do more of something like more digestion, more protection.
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: But some cells decrease because they're trying to maybe feel less.
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: So our skin is one of those things that responds by reduction of cells in the stress phase, because the skin is trying to thin so that we are feeling less.
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: But in the cerebral medulla, which the ovaries are related to, again it's cell loss, but in the cerebral medulla it's so that we come back better when we start to heal.
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: The resolution is where we get the understanding of what the body was trying to do.
• 23:59
  Speaker 3: And here we're trying to reproduce, trying to have a child, trying to allow the family line to go on or our species to survive.
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: So the resolution is where we can achieve that, because I've learned what I needed to learn.
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: I've learned I am good enough.
• 24:22
  Speaker 3: I've learned I can let go of my shame and then I can come back even stronger, even better, even more empowered.
• 24:29
  Speaker 3: So cell loss in the ovary, to start with in the stress phase, and that means that the oestrogen levels go down, which can lead irregular periods, and then when we start, we have that shift.
• 24:48
  Speaker 3: We process the themes, the beliefs that we've been holding and we're able to start to let them go.
• 24:55
  Speaker 3: The lost cells need to be replaced.
• 24:58
  Speaker 3: We're always trying to come back to that homeostasis and balance.
• 25:01
  Speaker 3: If we've lost cells, we need to be replaced.
• 25:04
  Speaker 3: We're always trying to come back to that homeostasis and balance.
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: If we've lost cells, we need to replace them and actually bacteria come in to support us with this.
• 25:10
  Speaker 3: We are often led to believe that bacteria are attacking us.
• 25:15
  Speaker 3: They're bad for us, but they're in our environment all the time.
• 25:19
  Speaker 3: They're on our skin, they're inside of our body and they only become active when we go into regeneration phase to support us, to help us.
• 25:27
  Speaker 3: So, because of the presence of the bacteria, there may be pain, swelling, inflammation, but all of that is perfectly normal.
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: That is perfectly normal so long as if we have a very intense stress phase, we're going to have a pretty intense healing phase as well, so we might need to give the body some support.
• 25:51
  Speaker 3: Looking after our vitality, so making sure that we're eating well, resting, sleeping well, doing our best to reduce the stress in our lives all of those things can really support us to keep our vitality up, because the body is designed to go through this process and going through this process is what allows us to heal.
• 26:12
  Speaker 3: We need to allow ourselves the space and time to go through the whole of the process.
• 26:17
  Speaker 3: So these things, although they're uncomfortable I I mean, it's not very nice to have a fever or to be in pain or to experience swelling but they are a natural part of the process.
• 26:29
  Speaker 3: So, just supporting our bodies as best we can through that and that may.
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: Sometimes, if it is very intense, it's good to work with a practitioner because they'll help to support you through that and make sure that we don't go too far, too fast yeah and then, as that regeneration phase continues, as that healing continues, assist forms in the ovary where the cell loss happened, then there's a cyst that forms there and if we're also feeling any sense of isolation or abandonment, which unfortunately like we were talking about people feeling dirty and feeling ashamed and feeling that they're not good enough it can leave us, like you said, kind of closing things away, closing ourselves away, and we can feel that sense of isolation and abandonment.
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: But when we have that, it causes us to hold water.
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: So this cyst will hold more water, so it will be bigger and it can therefore be quite painful because, there's not a lot of space in there.
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: If there's this pressure inside, it's going to hurt and large cysts can, like we were talking about, cause considerable pain, particularly during menstruation and also heavy bleeding, and then within the cyst, there are cells, and those are ovarian cells, which are actually designed to replace the ones that were lost in the stress phase.
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: So again, it's all with a purpose, it's all going through a proper process that it's designed to do, and then, in the middle of the regeneration, we have what's called the healing peak.
• 28:25
  Speaker 3: And the healing peak, quite often its purpose is to get rid of all that excess water that we've been holding.
• 28:30
  Speaker 3: And this is where the cyst will start to shrink and that water will come out, and that can cause a sense of that squeezing as the the water is pushed out of the cyst, the fluid is pushed out of the cyst and then, as we go on in that healing process, provided the original belief isn't reactivated.
• 28:56
  Speaker 3: So if we haven't fully processed that, there may still be a part of it active in our body which is then a potential for being reactivated.
• 29:04
  Speaker 3: But if that doesn't happen, if we just carry on with the healing process, the fluid will be gone.
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: It'll have been pushed out during healing peak and so the cyst shrinks and it hardens and it just becomes a part of the normal hormone producing function of the ovarian tissue.
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: And, interestingly, that whole process from start to finish if it just goes through very smoothly, straight line, start to finish takes nine months, same as a pregnancy.
• 29:36
  Speaker 3: Wow, oh, isn't the body just fascinating?
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: Fascinating, wow no way.
• 29:46
  Speaker 3: So it's not endometriosis as yet.
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, okay.
• 29:51
  Speaker 3: This is just the ovary going through its process.
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: Okay, endometriosis comes about if, as I was saying, if the original threat hasn't been fully processed, there's still part of that held in the body.
• 30:05
  Speaker 3: We're still operating from one of those beliefs that can be reactivated so we can be pushed back into stress and go through the process again.
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: And if we keep cycling through that process it becomes chronic.
• 30:20
  Speaker 3: Through that process it becomes chronic and the potential for that is that this cyst could get bigger and bigger and bigger and it could burst.
• 30:32
  Speaker 3: And it can be burst because it gets so big so it's too much pressure for it to hold and it bursts.
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: Or it can be that we have a blow to the abdomen so we might fall, or if one is in an abusive relationship, there may be physical violence there.
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: That could result in that kind of a blow, or it might even be that we go in for an exploratory aspiration or something.
• 31:03
  Speaker 3: So, there's a needle and it punctures it, or we go for surgery.
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: And it punctures that cyst and then those cells, the ovarian cells that were inside the cyst come out into the abdomen and they can attach to the other organs, which is then what develops into endometriosis, because they're doing what they're designed to do.
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: they're just not where they're designed to be wow gosh again that the process of healing is still the same.
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: It's still to go back and find those beliefs, find what the original issue was, the threat that we perceived, how it led to this feeling, the beliefs it caused us to create and to hold and to address those, because then we are free to move forward.
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: And that is our learning that actually I'm not weak, I am good enough, I can do.
• 32:11
  Speaker 3: I can get pregnant, I can bring a child into the world, I can grow that child, I can give birth to that child, I can raise that child.
• 32:18
  Speaker 3: It's safe.
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: I can do that I have the ability wow, because that's a lot.
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a lot to think about, isn't it?
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: Because really, we're looking at this on an emotional sense, which I love, um, but it is about offering a new perspective, isn't it so, um?
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: And then I know we discussed before we started recording, that then we can have endometriosis running and then, of course, we're trying to do ivf, so then we're bringing in more hormones into the body.
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: The body is suffering from I don't know if that's the right word suffering from.
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: The body has endometriosis, so those cells.
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: But we're pushing more conflict.
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: We're certainly yeah, we're trying to get the body to do something that perhaps currently it's telling us it doesn't feel ready for, it doesn't feel it's safe to bring a child into the world at this time, it doesn't feel good enough to be a mother at this time, or whatever belief that was created back when we felt that sense of threat or that challenge.
• 33:44
  Speaker 3: But then if we're trying to support the body by giving it these hormones to create the egg cell, to mature that egg cell, so that it can then become, it can go on and be fertilized and become a baby, I guess those two are kind of working against each other.
• 34:05
  Speaker 3: The body is saying no, I don't feel ready to have a baby right now, but the hormones are saying, yes, have a baby and the mind is probably having a baby yeah.
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: So it's like the beliefs are saying one thing, the mind is saying another thing and we're putting the body through an IVF cycle.
• 34:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and just on a purely mechanical level, or a purely physical, biological level, if you're putting hormones in and you've got all of these cells that are designed to do things with those hormones, but the cells are not where they're designed to be, they're going to be doing more of that.
• 34:45
  Speaker 3: So if they're already producing blood in the abdominal cavity, then potentially they're going to be doing more of that or growing or whatever they're doing as a response to these hormones that we're putting in.
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: But they're already causing issues because they aren't where they're supposed to be and they're going to be causing extra, extra issues because of the hormones that are impacting on them wow, that's quite interesting.
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: So I think, from what I hear here is um is really about trying to understand why we might be on this journey, why our body might be in a space of having endometriosis and you know what.
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: What are those feelings of?
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: Let's have that sense of profound loss.
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: What are the themes running?
• 35:51
  Speaker 3: and um really trying to heal that within the self, isn't it because then, um, we can support the body to come back to balance absolutely, and with the cerebral medulla tissues, as I was saying before, the learning comes and the strengthening and the more getting back to actually who we really are and the learning of what that is and the ability and the empowerment of that comes in the second phase.
• 36:25
  Speaker 3: So so that's our biological purpose, or the biological purpose of what our body is doing.
• 36:31
  Speaker 3: And for endometriosis, the biological purpose is, or for the ovary, for the issues within the ovary which then go on to relating to endometriosis, the biologic purpose there is to boost our oestrogen levels, because if we've experienced profound loss, perhaps of a child, perhaps a miscarriage, then our body is thinking I've lost that child, I've lost that extent.
• 36:58
  Speaker 3: You know the the line carrying on, passing on my genes.
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: And on a biological level the body goes I need to put in more effort to produce something that's going to carry on my genes because I've lost that opportunity.
• 37:13
  Speaker 3: I have to make sure the next time that doesn't happen and it does, my genes do carry on.
• 37:20
  Speaker 3: So the body is trying to produce more oestrogen so that it is more able to succeed in having a pregnancy next time.
• 37:34
  Speaker 3: The problem is, as I was saying before, when this is cycling.
• 37:38
  Speaker 3: So the body is effectively, I guess, doing what we were talking about with the ibf.
• 37:43
  Speaker 3: It's trying to do one thing while also trying to do another.
• 37:46
  Speaker 3: It's trying to have a baby while also trying to stay safe or not feeling ready.
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: So there are those, there's the interplay between those two, and so we are trying to heal, but then the issue gets reactivated and so we just keep cycling around and round and round and end up with severe symptoms which are simply trying to tell us.
• 38:13
  Speaker 3: This is what I'm struggling with right now.
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 38:16
  Speaker 3: This is where I need some support to help me to process this, so that I can release it and then my body can do what it's trying to do.
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: And then my body and my mind and my beliefs and everything will all be working together yeah, in alignment as, instead of in conflict, yeah, and so I'm just having a thought then this can be, you know, one of those issues where an individual can give up, you know, and kind of go sod it.
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: You know, I can't have a baby, let's let go.
• 39:00
  Speaker 2: And so, because of that decision, we're coming to, um, in a way, a regeneration phase, because we've gotten solid, so everything starts to change within the body.
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and this is why, sometime later, people can then find that they've got pregnant because they've released all of that the stress, the complications, the themes, that sense of profound loss because they've let it go doesn't matter anymore, which, you know, isn't always straight away, it can take time, um, because in a way, the whole body's come back to balance, isn't it?
• 39:53
  Speaker 3: absolutely, and infertility isn't always about endometriosis and we know that there are women who have been infertile, not been able to conceive, then they go and get a dog and.
• 40:06
  Speaker 3: And they just go I can't have a child, I'm going to have a dog.
• 40:08
  Speaker 3: And then they get pregnant or somebody I went to school with.
• 40:14
  Speaker 3: She was the ninth child in the family and they had been told you're not seemingly able to conceive, so you won't have a baby by yourself.
• 40:31
  Speaker 3: So they went out and they adopted and they adopted, and they adopted and they adopted and then they got pregnant.
• 40:34
  Speaker 3: Well, yes, because they had proved.
• 40:39
  Speaker 3: If your belief is, I'm not good enough, I can't be a good parent, not good mother, I don't know how to be a good mother because my mother wasn't good, or whatever the belief is yeah, and then you, you know you want to have a child, so you say, like you were saying, I'm going to do better, I'm going to make sure I am a good mother, and then you go out and you prove it because you adopt these children.
• 41:01
  Speaker 3: That's just one way somebody I know I went to school with that seemed to work for her family yeah so there are definitely those things of I give up, there's nothing more I can do.
• 41:14
  Speaker 3: I'm just gonna accept the fact that I'm not gonna have children, so I do other stuff.
• 41:20
  Speaker 3: I have get a dog, I adopt children, I go off and put my life into my career, and then I get pregnant and then, oh, now I have to adjust having adjusted to the sodded.
• 41:31
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to be a parent.
• 41:33
  Speaker 3: Then I have to oh gosh, I have to change my life again, because now I am yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: so that's very interesting.
• 41:42
  Speaker 2: And also then this goes back to you know, a lot of the work that we both do about accessing the inner trauma, the themes, the emotional pain, because by healing that and finding the answers, it can change so much in the body, be it for having a baby, be it for health, be it for whatever it might be for the individual.
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: But yeah, Absolutely.
• 42:26
  Speaker 3: And it's kind of like Gabor mate's book where he says, when the body says no, yeah, perhaps the body is saying no, not right now, I don't feel safe to get pregnant and, bessel van der kolk, the body keeps the score.
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, because if we're carrying these beliefs, the body really does respond to them yeah and I know people.
• 42:48
  Speaker 3: My mom actually used to be before she retired an aromatherapist and a reflexologist and she worked with a lot of women who subsequently got pregnant yeah because, again, it's that addressing of the stuff that our body is holding, and we can do that in so many ways and it doesn't have to be.
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: I often say that we think our problems are big, scary and painful, so we think the solutions are going to be big, scary and painful.
• 43:17
  Speaker 3: But you and I know, liz, that there are lots of ways we can work through something with somebody, support them in working through their issues, and it doesn't have to be big and scary and painful and we take it at the pace that's right for the person yeah and it doesn't have to be that talking so, working through all of that really difficult, challenging stuff that we may have held, like you said, closed away for a very long time and we don't want to
• 43:45
  Speaker 3: open that Pandora's box.
• 43:47
  Speaker 3: So there are other ways that we can address it.
• 43:50
  Speaker 3: That might be reflexology, and reflexology maybe just helps us to get safe enough that we then can start to address.
• 43:59
  Speaker 3: So there are lots of different ways and they don't have to be big and painful.
• 44:03
  Speaker 3: So just to encourage people, if they're listening and thinking, yeah, this is resonating for me, or yes, I have endometriosis and I want to do something about it.
• 44:12
  Speaker 3: If that's going to mean addressing my beliefs and my fears and I don't want to go there, that it doesn't have to be big, scary and painful.
• 44:23
  Speaker 2: No, and it doesn't always have to be going into the story.
• 44:25
  Speaker 2: Does it always have to be going into the story, does it?
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: Um, we both do EFT, which is tapping emotional freedom technique and, bizarrely enough, if that was actually on the news here in Australia the other day and I had some amazing lady, she was really good at being able to explain it and talk about it and, um, again, just a really amazing tool that doesn't have to be big, scary and painful, that can help break down that big pain into something that becomes really manageable and that gives us the insights that help us to understand more fully who we really are, who we were born to be, and to step into that and experience that liberation, that expansion, that empowerment.
• 45:20
  Speaker 3: which is why the body holds on to it in the first place.
• 45:22
  Speaker 3: It didn't hold on to it to beat us up with it.
• 45:26
  Speaker 3: It held on to it because it knows it as wisdom for us to support us in being our best self I like that it's holding on to because it knows it has wisdom there's a great quote from ah almas that talks about that that our pain is our pain, sent to us by the part of us that loves us the most, because it wants our best for us well, yeah, yeah, and I suppose this is why I can, I sort of say to a lot of my clients you know the fertility journey is such a journey that, um, it can change our lives.
• 46:06
  Speaker 2: You know, we get to, we get to change, heal our stuff now instead of later, later on.
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: You know it can be such a gift, you know and we get to.
• 46:18
  Speaker 3: That in itself is a gift.
• 46:19
  Speaker 3: It's not we have to, we should yeah or whatever it's we get to.
• 46:24
  Speaker 3: This is an an honour, an opportunity, a joy.
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely.
• 46:30
  Speaker 2: And so, finishing off, what would you?
• 46:36
  Speaker 2: How would be the best way to finish this off?
• 46:39
  Speaker 2: What would be your top tips about supporting the body and the self for you as we finish off?
• 47:00
  Speaker 3: Be gentle with ourselves.
• 47:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, recognize that our body is always doing the very best it can to support us where it feels we're at, and if it feels we're somewhere that is challenging, overwhelming or scary, it's going to respond from that place yeah so I think of it quite often, as this is my inner child.
• 47:19
  Speaker 3: Would I speak to my child the way I speak to myself?
• 47:21
  Speaker 3: So maybe what I need to do is sit down and dialogue with that child, help it to feel safe, help it to tell me where it doesn't feel safe and to show me how I can put things in place to help it feel safe.
• 47:38
  Speaker 3: And then we can have that dialogue and it can share with me what challenges does it feel it's facing right now and how can I help it feel better?
• 47:51
  Speaker 3: Help it to let go of those challenges.
• 47:53
  Speaker 3: Help it to see.
• 47:54
  Speaker 3: Actually you are so much more than that.
• 47:58
  Speaker 3: You're in a fear place right now, but that's okay and thank you very much because I know that from that fear place you're trying to keep me safe.
• 48:06
  Speaker 3: But as an adult, I get to share with you that we are safe, we are okay, we are good enough and when we understand that, me and my inner child, yeah we aren't afraid to step out, to move forward.
• 48:28
  Speaker 3: And there are, like I was saying, lots of different ways we can do that, but I think it starts with safety, it starts with being compassionate towards ourselves and it starts with listening really listening to our body, because it knows and it just wants to share with us.
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: I like that.
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: It starts with safety and compassion.
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, now, beautiful Robin, I just love everything that we've chatted about and it is, you know, in some ways different for people to hear, and I love the passion you have for healing, which is similar to mine.
• 49:03
  Speaker 2: You've also written a book just recently You've come out, because a lot of your things about walking on the wild side.
• 49:10
  Speaker 2: So tell us about your book and then how people can find you and, you know, want to work with you or chat with you.
• 49:17
  Speaker 2: Yes, tell us about your book and you then Thank you.
• 49:23
  Speaker 3: My book it comes from my story.
• 49:31
  Speaker 3: It comes from my story and it's how I got to the place where I was feeling very far from unwell, very far from well, very uh.
• 49:34
  Speaker 3: I had lots of niggling things that just were making my life a misery and I wasn't getting the support that I felt I wanted, because I wanted something that would leave me feeling empowered.
• 49:47
  Speaker 3: And what I was getting at the time felt left me feeling more dependent, so dependent on medication, dependent on a counsellor.
• 49:55
  Speaker 3: But I wanted something that was going to leave me feeling like I had the tools, because I didn't want to be taking pills forever or seeing a counsellor forever.
• 50:05
  Speaker 3: I wanted the tools that I could then go forward into whatever my future might hold and know that I could handle it.
• 50:13
  Speaker 3: I had whatever I needed.
• 50:14
  Speaker 3: So not finding that in any of the routes that I had, up to that point, found for myself.
• 50:23
  Speaker 3: I went off and read a lot of books and came across a lot of really amazing wisdom and put that together into my WILD approach, which is an acronym W-I-L-D and that's walking on the wild side.
• 50:37
  Speaker 3: That's where that title comes from and basically the book takes people through the acronym what it stands for, how it can support our wellbeing.
• 50:45
  Speaker 3: And it's not a set of steps, it's more that thing of perception how are we seeing, perceiving, interpreting the world in which we live and what is that creating in our inner environment and how can we make that the best it can be?
• 51:03
  Speaker 3: For me as an individual, it's very much an individual, unique to me thing and unique to everybody else, and in the book I have exercises and processes to support that.
• 51:17
  Speaker 3: So questions for people to ponder and consider and maybe journal on and tune into their body and listen and some things to help them with that as well.
• 51:27
  Speaker 3: How do you really get in and listen and some things to help them with that as well.
• 51:29
  Speaker 3: How do you really get in and listen and support yourself in doing that so it isn't big and scary and painful?
• 51:35
  Speaker 3: So, yeah, that's available on amazon.
• 51:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so hopefully, wherever you are, it's available.
• 51:42
  Speaker 3: I know it's on amazon australia, it's on amazon america and it's on Amazon UK for sure.
• 51:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah and uh, it's available through my website as well, which is equenergycom, e-q-u-e-n-e-r-g-ycom, and on there, if you go to the top, there's a contact me tab, so there's lots of ways to connect with me there wonderful.
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm excited I still got to get your book.
• 52:09
  Speaker 3: So I'm excited to get your book and actually it's in australia then yeah, a friend in perth apparently has been able to buy it on amazonau, so brilliant.
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: I can't wait.
• 52:21
  Speaker 2: So thank you so much for this wonderful deep dive talk into the body, looking at endometriosis in a whole different way, and the invitation, I think, to know that our body is trying really hard to look after us and, you know, from this fear, it is about keeping the body safe and there's a reason for it.
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: It's not, you know, it's not something that's striped.
• 52:56
  Speaker 2: There's a reason, there's been a reason why it's been there and there's an opportunity for healing for healing, definitely, and thank you so much, liz, for this opportunity to discuss this.
• 53:16
  Speaker 3: As you know, it's a passion of mine to look into the meta aspect of any condition and obviously that crossover between your fertility work and that has led us to endometriosis today.
• 53:26
  Speaker 3: But also just to say to anybody if you have any questions, please do feel free to get in touch with one or other of us.
• 53:33
  Speaker 3: I know there's.
• 53:33
  Speaker 3: You do so much work around this.
• 53:35
  Speaker 2: This is really your focus, it's more all the things that are in the way of fertility journey, and this is one of them.
• 53:45
  Speaker 2: So, yes and um, yeah, I'll reach out to some of our groups and, you know, you never know we might try and do a q?
• 53:52
  Speaker 2: A so that people can ask you know their questions, which could be really exciting.
• 53:57
  Speaker 2: So absolutely watch this space as I say that out loud now.
• 54:01
  Speaker 2: So that's good to the universe yeah, um thank you, robin, for taking this time.
• 54:07
  Speaker 2: Um, this is really special, really wonderful for all of you listeners.
• 54:11
  Speaker 2: I hope this has um created some an opportunity to look deeper within what's going on and um thank you all for your time and um robin, you have a beautiful rest of the day.
• 54:27
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much.
• 54:29
  Speaker 3: Thank you, Liz.
• 54:30
  Speaker 3: Have a lovely evening.
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: All right, and with that I will bid thee all goodbye with love and gratitude and chat soon.
• 54:48
  Speaker 1: Take care.
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to this episode of Fertility Health and Coming Back to Self.
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe to the podcast and consider leaving me a review, which will help me to reach others who may benefit from this information.
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: Help me to reach others who may benefit from this information.
• 55:09
  Speaker 1: Feel free to get in contact at lizwaltonorg or via social media at lizwalton underscore fertility coach and, if you feel called to, I would love you to share this podcast with anyone you think this could be a healing for, as an elixir for the soul.
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: I'll see you next time.