Latest / NO FILTER / Child told adults _Mama is going to kill me_ right before she fatally suffocated him(MP3_160K)

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Child told adults _Mama is going to kill me_ right before she fatally suffocated him(MP3_160K) · NO FILTER

0:00
Speaker 1: A word of warning. This podcast explores graphic and disturbing
0:03
Speaker 1: stories and includes some strong language. It therefore may not
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Speaker 1: be suitable for our young listeners or other folks who
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Speaker 1: may find it disturbing. Hello and welcome to True Crime News,
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Speaker 1: the podcast covering high profile and under the radar cases
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Speaker 1: from across the country. Every week. I'm your host Anna Garcia.
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Speaker 1: Our case this week a child killed at the hands
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Speaker 1: of his own mother despite his pleas for help. The
0:28
Speaker 1: child warned trusted adults about the horrific abuse that he
0:33
Speaker 1: suffered at the hands of his mother, but the Department
0:36
Speaker 1: of Child and Family Services continued to return the boy
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Speaker 1: back to his mother's home. After more than a dozen reports.
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Speaker 1: In the final two years of this little boy's life,
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Speaker 1: police would find the child unresponsive. His mother admitted to
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Speaker 1: suffocating him, taking his last breaths. How many opportunities were
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Speaker 1: there to stop this tragedy from happening. We're recording this
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Speaker 1: on Friday, November twenty first of twenty twenty five. Our
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Speaker 1: guest today is the one the Only Gizzila Kay, a
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Speaker 1: true crime YouTuber and the host of the very popular
1:13
Speaker 1: channel Grizzly True Crime. Welcome Gizila welcome back to the program.
1:19
Speaker 1: It's always such a pleasure to have you on. Thank you.
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Speaker 2: It's always such an honor to be here and to
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Speaker 2: discuss these interesting and heartbreaking cases with you.
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Speaker 1: This one's really hard. I got really upset as I
1:30
Speaker 1: was writing and preparing this podcast. I got very upset
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Speaker 1: about this. This little boy. I mean, I just don't
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Speaker 1: have the words. This little boy had confided in people
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Speaker 1: around him. He had told his foster parents he didn't
1:48
Speaker 1: want to go back to his mother. Every time he
1:52
Speaker 1: had to go back to his mother, he would get
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Speaker 1: physically ill, and he would scream and cry and beg
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Speaker 1: them not to let him go back there. But no
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Speaker 1: one other than the trusted adults listened to this child.
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Speaker 1: But the Department of Child and Family Services clearly did
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Speaker 1: not listen.
2:13
Speaker 2: Right they say, our hands are tired and there's not
2:16
Speaker 2: much we can do. I mean, isn't that what they're
2:18
Speaker 2: there for. This poor little boy was literally telling multiple
2:23
Speaker 2: people exactly what happened to him, being you know, I'm
2:26
Speaker 2: sure we're going to get into all of that suffocated
2:29
Speaker 2: and that his mom is doing all of this. And
2:31
Speaker 2: they all believed him, which was really great. You know,
2:33
Speaker 2: the silver lining of this terrible story. Everyone believed him
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Speaker 2: and they listened to him. But unfortunately, you know, dcfs
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Speaker 2: couldn't do much, the police couldn't do much, and these
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Speaker 2: other family members and the foster parents tried everything everything.
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Speaker 1: I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if at some point
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Speaker 1: they must have thought, we're just going to kidnap the child,
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Speaker 1: We're just going to keep him. But you know, then
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Speaker 1: they would have been charged. Not the mother. My god,
3:02
Speaker 1: you know, he told his grandmother, Mama is going to
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Speaker 1: kill me.
3:09
Speaker 2: That broke my heart reading that, like, Mama's going to
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Speaker 2: kill me, because this little boy is only seven years
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Speaker 2: old when he died, so already from age four and
3:18
Speaker 2: then five, he's saying, Mama's going to kill me, and
3:20
Speaker 2: this is what mama does to me. I mean, it
3:22
Speaker 2: must have broken the hearts of everyone he told it to.
3:25
Speaker 2: He sounded like such a sweet little boy, but imagine
3:28
Speaker 2: what he lived with.
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Speaker 1: This constant terror of either she would play these horrible games,
3:36
Speaker 1: of she would smother him with a pillow. He said
3:40
Speaker 1: that she would pull him under the bath water and
3:43
Speaker 1: hold him down there. So all the simple routines and
3:48
Speaker 1: rituals that a child goes through are now associated, you know,
3:55
Speaker 1: for him and his little brain in his little world
3:57
Speaker 1: with nothing short of terror. Yeah.
4:01
Speaker 2: I mean, she's supposed to be his kid giver, you know,
4:04
Speaker 2: like his mother. And his father's also in the house,
4:07
Speaker 2: which was also interesting because the whole time, I think,
4:09
Speaker 2: where's the dad, and he just seemed to not really
4:11
Speaker 2: have knowledge of what was going on. But this little
4:14
Speaker 2: boy said, I had to fix my own snacks, I
4:16
Speaker 2: had to fix my own lunch. And then his mother
4:20
Speaker 2: is just trying to suffocate him, choke him. And the
4:23
Speaker 2: scariest thing about the bathtub thing is that this little
4:25
Speaker 2: boy said that his mother would turn the lights off first,
4:28
Speaker 2: like he's alone, also that unsupervised in the bath so
4:31
Speaker 2: that's already like, oh my goodness, okay, and he's just
4:34
Speaker 2: playing with these toys, and then she would walk to
4:36
Speaker 2: the doorway, turn off the lights and try to choke him.
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Speaker 1: That is so frightening, so frightening, so frightening to make
4:44
Speaker 1: him physically ill at the thought of being with that woman.
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Speaker 1: That woman is a monster. She's nothing short of a monster.
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Speaker 1: And I am shocked that there has not been a
4:53
Speaker 1: greater deeper investigation into this case. In the state of Illinois.
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Speaker 1: This is out of Oregon, Illinois. The victim here is
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Speaker 1: seven year old Nathaniel Burton, who was suffocated to death
5:05
Speaker 1: by his mother. His mother, thirty eight year old Sarah Saffernik,
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Speaker 1: has been sentenced to thirty five years in prison after
5:12
Speaker 1: pleading guilty to the murder. That is not enough punishment.
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Speaker 2: Nope, when she could get out after seventeen and a
5:22
Speaker 2: half years. I was so shocked when I read that, like,
5:24
Speaker 2: oh my, on good behavior, so she could be between
5:28
Speaker 2: I was calculating sixty five and seventy three when she
5:31
Speaker 2: gets out. I don't think someone like this should ever
5:34
Speaker 2: get out. If you can harm children, let alone your
5:36
Speaker 2: own child, and repeatedly, and the thing she was looking
5:39
Speaker 2: up all of that. No, no, she should never get out.
5:42
Speaker 2: I can't believe she got thirty five years. And she
5:44
Speaker 2: first pleted guilty in March of twenty twenty four, then
5:47
Speaker 2: withdrew changed her mind two months later, now decided again
5:51
Speaker 2: in November. A caare cam I'm pleading guilty. That should
5:54
Speaker 2: not be rewarded.
5:57
Speaker 1: No, that's a good word for it. Rewarded. Yeah, she's
6:01
Speaker 1: being rewarded for this. It is shocking to me. Anything
6:06
Speaker 1: short of life in prison would be unacceptable. And I
6:11
Speaker 1: know many of you are probably thinking she doesn't even
6:13
Speaker 1: have a right to that. See, I don't want her
6:17
Speaker 1: to ever feel the sun on her face. She should
6:21
Speaker 1: not be allowed any joy. I'm sorry she should suffer.
6:26
Speaker 1: She should suffer for this. It's not like one day
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Speaker 1: she woke up and she was berserk, which I'm not
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Speaker 1: saying is okay because I'm not And I do want
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Speaker 1: to be sensitive to the fact that it appears that
6:40
Speaker 1: she was suffering from a very severe type of a
6:44
Speaker 1: mental illness and postpartum depression. But the fact that she
6:49
Speaker 1: didn't seek any help, the fact that you know, those
6:53
Speaker 1: around her saw it and were trying to get in
6:58
Speaker 1: the middle and save the child. And then there are
7:03
Speaker 1: the deliberate things that she did, because the foster parents
7:07
Speaker 1: and even her own relatives say that she saw Nathaniel
7:11
Speaker 1: as the money train, and that's why she thought for
7:15
Speaker 1: custody of this little boy, because he had been taken
7:17
Speaker 1: away from her at one point, and that's how he
7:20
Speaker 1: ended up in foster care with really loving, loving foster parents.
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Speaker 1: That to me, is deliberate. That's the evil part, that's
7:31
Speaker 1: the conscious part.
7:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, even if she had postpartum depression. I mean, how
7:35
Speaker 2: long can that go on for?
7:36
Speaker 1: I don't know.
7:37
Speaker 2: I'm just like, the little boy was seven years old
7:39
Speaker 2: and during that time, in the last two years of
7:41
Speaker 2: his life, the things that she was googling. I mean,
7:45
Speaker 2: she was literally googling that. She's obsessed with killing her child.
7:49
Speaker 2: But at the same time, Oh, these cases drive me nuts.
7:52
Speaker 2: When they fight for custody, they much they don't want
7:54
Speaker 2: anyone else to have them. Why financial benefit? We saw
7:58
Speaker 2: it like with Adam Montgomery, right with a Harmony Montgoment case.
8:01
Speaker 2: What like here as well, she's fighting for She's saying no,
8:04
Speaker 2: he's not going to see you to the foster parents.
8:06
Speaker 2: She's isolating him eventually, and then she kills him. But
8:09
Speaker 2: I mean, why just let him? Just let him go?
8:13
Speaker 2: Then obviously why his money?
8:14
Speaker 1: As we know, yeah, it's money, and that's why. You know,
8:18
Speaker 1: while I can understand and have compassion for anyone suffering
8:22
Speaker 1: from postpartum depression, and we have seen some of the
8:24
Speaker 1: most extreme murder cases happen in situations like that, and
8:29
Speaker 1: even with women who were receiving care and the family
8:33
Speaker 1: was as supportive as could be within the process, meaning
8:37
Speaker 1: trying to help, and the person was seeking help as
8:40
Speaker 1: well professional help. We've seen atrocious, atrocious murders, but there's
8:45
Speaker 1: an evil component to this one. There's something different about
8:49
Speaker 1: this case. It really is now. Sarah had two daughters
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Speaker 1: from a previous relationship before she gave birth to Nathaniel,
9:01
Speaker 1: and Nathaniel was born to Sarah and his father, Brian Burton,
9:05
Speaker 1: on September ninth of twenty thirteen, so he had a
9:09
Speaker 1: father figure in the picture. He has not been charged.
9:14
Speaker 1: I don't know how he could not have seen what
9:20
Speaker 1: was going on in the household. Is that possible? Did
9:23
Speaker 1: he try to interfere? I don't know. There are some
9:26
Speaker 1: things about this case. There isn't full justice here. There
9:30
Speaker 1: never can be because the little boy has lost his
9:32
Speaker 1: life and he was tortured. He was tortured, He had
9:34
Speaker 1: a horrible, horrible life. But there are so many others here.
9:38
Speaker 1: I really wish that the state would come out and
9:41
Speaker 1: do a truly and do a truly full deep investigation
9:46
Speaker 1: into who knew what when and holds people accountable absolutely.
9:54
Speaker 2: I mean, he had the foster parents, so I think
9:57
Speaker 2: you went to foster k already in twenty fourteen and
9:59
Speaker 2: you said he was born in twenty thirteen, so from
10:01
Speaker 2: when he's like one year old, he's going to Foster K.
10:04
Speaker 2: I also wonder how she treated her daughters, because she
10:06
Speaker 2: had the other these two other children, So I wonder
10:09
Speaker 2: what these stories are even they what did they know?
10:11
Speaker 2: So it was originally in Foster k in twenty fourteen,
10:15
Speaker 2: and so there's two there's a mom and a dad.
10:17
Speaker 2: They on the foster side, and there's grandparents, these aunts, uncles,
10:20
Speaker 2: half sisters. I meant a lot of them came forward
10:23
Speaker 2: and said they knew things. But man, this is such
10:26
Speaker 2: a failure of this little boy. He was failed in
10:29
Speaker 2: every single way.
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Speaker 1: Yes, these family members and the foster parents called not
10:34
Speaker 1: only the Department of Child and Family Services, they called
10:38
Speaker 1: the police. So people who are at first, you know,
10:42
Speaker 1: who have to report what's going on, they did, and
10:46
Speaker 1: the system that's there in place to save these children fail.
10:49
Speaker 1: Now you could say to some degree it did help,
10:52
Speaker 1: because clearly something happened since he was taken from his
10:58
Speaker 1: parents shortly after his and he was placed with the
11:01
Speaker 1: foster family, Rebecca and Daniel Ray. He was placed there
11:05
Speaker 1: in twenty fourteen. Now, Rebecca and Daniel Ray knew Sarah's
11:10
Speaker 1: family from church, and the Rays had always wanted to
11:13
Speaker 1: foster children because Rebecca was adopted herself, so she knew
11:16
Speaker 1: the value of all of this. Now. Rebecca and Daniel,
11:21
Speaker 1: the foster parents, were also Nathaniel's godparents, so they were
11:26
Speaker 1: so involved in his life, and they would continue to
11:29
Speaker 1: be present in his life to the point that he
11:32
Speaker 1: always referred to them as Mama and Papa, Mama and Papa.
11:38
Speaker 1: But of course Sarah didn't want him to stay with
11:42
Speaker 1: Mama and Papa. No, no, no no. She fought for custody.
11:47
Speaker 1: Eventually he was returned to his mother. I didn't even
11:50
Speaker 1: want to call her his mother. She's not a mother.
11:53
Speaker 1: She's an evil monster, evil monster. And at least in
11:58
Speaker 1: the beginning, he would be allowed to visit his grandparents
12:01
Speaker 1: and maybe stay over, and this was when he was
12:04
Speaker 1: about five years old. But the Rays said that they
12:07
Speaker 1: noticed Nathaniel started becoming very reluctant about going home. He
12:12
Speaker 1: would scream, he would refuse to get into the car.
12:15
Speaker 1: He would get physically ill, physically ill, and he would scream, Mama, Papa,
12:22
Speaker 1: help me, I don't want to go. Sure that is
12:27
Speaker 1: so said.
12:27
Speaker 2: He would also hide behind the leg sometimes apparently they
12:30
Speaker 2: really had to walk him to the car. At some point,
12:33
Speaker 2: his dad, like the biological dad, arrived with a police
12:35
Speaker 2: officer and said. The police officer said, there's nothing we
12:38
Speaker 2: can do. You have to he has to go home now.
12:42
Speaker 2: That must be so heartbreaking for the foster parents too,
12:45
Speaker 2: to see him in the state, to hear what his
12:47
Speaker 2: mother's doing to him, and sorry, we can't do anything.
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Speaker 1: It's got to go. I just what a broken broken
12:55
Speaker 1: system if we cannot protect one child? Yeah? Oh, who
12:59
Speaker 1: is telling the truth? And most of the time children are.
13:02
Speaker 1: Occasionally they lie, but I always say this, for the
13:04
Speaker 1: most part, for the most part, kids are telling the truth.
13:08
Speaker 1: And this one was. This one was so. In twenty eighteen,
13:11
Speaker 1: Nathaniel told the Rays that his mother had been abusive
13:15
Speaker 1: on multiple occasions. Oh my goodness. When she found out
13:24
Speaker 1: that Nathaniel had told the Raise what was really going on,
13:27
Speaker 1: she decides to punish the Raise and punish her child
13:30
Speaker 1: and not let them have contact with them, which is
13:33
Speaker 1: of course, you know, that is it's like a life preserver.
13:36
Speaker 1: It's a life saver to be able to see them.
13:39
Speaker 1: That's again we go back to the evil part. This
13:42
Speaker 1: is the evil. This is the evil. So the Rays
13:45
Speaker 1: believe that Sarah's motivation for gaining custody was financial. They
13:51
Speaker 1: said that she could quote game the system, according to
13:54
Speaker 1: the Rays, and get government services. Unbelievable. What a monster. Oh,
14:03
Speaker 1: I'm just so ill. I am physically ill. I am physically.
14:09
Speaker 2: Gaining the system. I imagine saying that, like, I can
14:12
Speaker 2: game this. She actually said that out loud, to the
14:13
Speaker 2: point where someone can actually quote her.
14:16
Speaker 1: Yeah. Wow, she didn't just think it. No, no, And
14:20
Speaker 1: then what she did with all her Google searches. Her
14:22
Speaker 1: Internet searches tell another story. Right. It's almost like speaking
14:26
Speaker 1: aloud in a different manner because you're you know, you're
14:30
Speaker 1: typing it in as part of a Google search. So
14:34
Speaker 1: police say that in twenty twenty, she began investigating these
14:37
Speaker 1: bizarre things on the Internet, including quote how to quickly
14:41
Speaker 1: kill someone and quote common cleaning products that will kill
14:45
Speaker 1: you instantly. She apparently had a fascination with killing Nathaniel,
14:51
Speaker 1: researching quote I have had thoughts about killing my kid
14:55
Speaker 1: and quote what is it called when a parent is
14:59
Speaker 1: obsessed with the thought of killing their child? It's called evil?
15:03
Speaker 1: Being a monster. And you're ill, very ill, and you
15:06
Speaker 1: need to get help. That's what it's called.
15:09
Speaker 2: Yeah, completely sadistic. One might throw out words like psychopathic. Right,
15:14
Speaker 2: So it's just like what she actually googled? What I mean,
15:17
Speaker 2: can you imagine typing that in? No, no we can't.
15:19
Speaker 2: It's a rhotoical question. But what, like, what is it
15:23
Speaker 2: called when you're obsessed with killing your own child? I mean,
15:26
Speaker 2: are you crazy lady? Yes, the answer is yes. But
15:28
Speaker 2: those Google searches including how to kill someone with a
15:31
Speaker 2: voodoo doll, how to kill someone with medication, and then
15:34
Speaker 2: there's that really wild other Google search, which is but
15:38
Speaker 2: breastfeeding a six year old. I was like, I don't
15:41
Speaker 2: know what's going on there, but this lady is not well.
15:44
Speaker 1: Yeah, that one was weird. Yeah, that one was very weird. Okay,
15:53
Speaker 1: So Nathaniel told his parental grandmother, Ronda Burton. Okay, so
15:58
Speaker 1: the father's mother, on several occasions that his mother had
16:02
Speaker 1: held a pillow over his head and prevented him from breathing.
16:06
Speaker 1: Sometimes she would smother the child on the couch and
16:08
Speaker 1: then jump on him. Nathaniel told grandma that his mother
16:12
Speaker 1: had held him underwater, as we've already expressed. So Ronda
16:16
Speaker 1: Grandma Ronda called these complaints in too DCSF, including telling
16:24
Speaker 1: them what name what Nathaniel predicted, and this is unbelievable.
16:28
Speaker 1: He said, quote, Mama is going to kill me.
16:34
Speaker 2: It's too much hearing a little you can actually almost
16:37
Speaker 2: hear that little boy's voice saying.
16:38
Speaker 1: Mama's going to kill me. Shame.
16:40
Speaker 2: He sounded so sweet the way that he described people
16:43
Speaker 2: as Mama and Papa and then you know, his biological
16:46
Speaker 2: parents and saying, Mama's going to kill me and she did.
16:50
Speaker 2: How helpless must he have felt to know that nothing
16:53
Speaker 2: he says, nothing he does, there is no help. She
16:55
Speaker 2: is literally going to kill him.
16:57
Speaker 1: And she did, Yeah, she did, she did. And also
17:02
Speaker 1: you know, the grandmother was able to cooborate that the
17:07
Speaker 1: reason for keeping Nathaniel was again financial, So it's not
17:10
Speaker 1: just coming from the foster parents in case someone would think, oh,
17:13
Speaker 1: they had, you know, some interest in this. No, their
17:16
Speaker 1: interest wasn't saving a child's life. That was their interest
17:19
Speaker 1: and loving him. So we want to make it clear
17:22
Speaker 1: it's not like it's just coming from one side of
17:25
Speaker 1: the family or one person. Multiple people could confirm this.
17:30
Speaker 1: And this is the part that I'm having problems with.
17:34
Speaker 1: You have a lot of people telling the exact same
17:36
Speaker 1: story to the authorities, and the authorities keep returning the child.
17:41
Speaker 1: What is the problem? Yeah, why do you keep returning in?
17:46
Speaker 2: I mean it is there's many cases we see like this,
17:48
Speaker 2: but that's very sad. I understand the sentiment of trying
17:52
Speaker 2: to reunite the child with a biological parental family, but
17:55
Speaker 2: in this case, in cases like this, no, like read
17:59
Speaker 2: the room not and in some of these in this case,
18:02
Speaker 2: in some of the instances, one of the DCFS workers said, sorry,
18:06
Speaker 2: I can't help you. This happened two weeks ago. Like
18:09
Speaker 2: when the person is giving the account of Nathaniel says
18:11
Speaker 2: this and this happened and he had a gash on
18:13
Speaker 2: his head and this and that. To say, well, we
18:15
Speaker 2: can't help you because that was two weeks ago, I
18:17
Speaker 2: mean what who cares if it was a year ago.
18:20
Speaker 2: If they have actors and they've got video and they've
18:22
Speaker 2: got recordings, and they've spoken to Nathaniel, I mean, the
18:25
Speaker 2: evidence was all there.
18:27
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is the part I don't get because child
18:29
Speaker 1: abuse is a crime to be investigated by police, and
18:35
Speaker 1: if you were abused two weeks ago, that would not
18:38
Speaker 1: prevent the authorities, meaning the police, from investigating. So I
18:41
Speaker 1: just don't understand this failure, and I just don't understand
18:45
Speaker 1: why more people are not outraged by this. I know
18:48
Speaker 1: the community really stood up for the little boy when
18:53
Speaker 1: he passed. The community, strangers paid for his funeral. The community,
18:58
Speaker 1: you know, screw for justice, as of course did all
19:02
Speaker 1: these adults in his life. I just don't understand how
19:06
Speaker 1: the system could fail so tremendously at a time when,
19:10
Speaker 1: for the most part, most states truly handle these situations
19:15
Speaker 1: far more seriously. So I'm just furious. I know I
19:18
Speaker 1: keep saying it, but something is so seriously wrong with
19:22
Speaker 1: this state. I'm sorry, but you really you failed a child,
19:26
Speaker 1: and it's irreparable. Whether it's an error, misjudgment, not understanding
19:33
Speaker 1: your role, or the laws, it cannot be an excuse
19:38
Speaker 1: when a child's life is lost. There's no such thing exactly.
19:42
Speaker 2: And I'm so glad that we're talking about this case,
19:45
Speaker 2: and this is the case that you've chosen, because it's
19:47
Speaker 2: not covered that widely. This specific case like this is
19:51
Speaker 2: one people need to know about to know what can
19:54
Speaker 2: really go wrong that so many people can see something,
19:57
Speaker 2: say something, and unfortunately nothing's being done. So, Yeah, something
20:00
Speaker 2: needs to change there because I feel so sorry for
20:03
Speaker 2: this little boy. He had a terrible life with that mother.
20:06
Speaker 2: And she was also not I'm saying it respectfully petit.
20:11
Speaker 2: So when he said, he's just playing with these toy
20:13
Speaker 2: cars and the next minute she jumps on him with
20:15
Speaker 2: a pillow, smothers him and sits on him and he
20:18
Speaker 2: can't breathe, Wow, I mean she was really, she was
20:22
Speaker 2: really trying to end his life.
20:24
Speaker 1: Yes, she was obese. There is no way around her
20:26
Speaker 1: when you look at the photos. And that isn't being
20:29
Speaker 1: cruel or a judgment. It is just factual that if
20:33
Speaker 1: you have someone who weighs that much jumping on a
20:37
Speaker 1: five to seven year old, she could crush him, clearly,
20:41
Speaker 1: suffocate him, kill him, which she ultimately did. So that
20:46
Speaker 1: just paints a picture of what he was up against.
20:49
Speaker 1: Good luck trying to squeeze from under there, you can't.
20:54
Speaker 1: He just a shame.
20:55
Speaker 2: And when he says he fought back sometimes and kicked
20:57
Speaker 2: and screamed, and he's telling all these people, I try,
21:00
Speaker 2: I try it, but you know, mama wanted to kill me.
21:03
Speaker 1: So ooh shame.
21:04
Speaker 2: And apparently the dad was there one of these times
21:07
Speaker 2: when she had been sitting on him and.
21:09
Speaker 1: She was laughing.
21:10
Speaker 2: So that just tells you how sadistic she is and unwell,
21:12
Speaker 2: but also very sadistic. The dad, he told these paternal grandmother.
21:17
Speaker 2: I think it was that the dad had to pull
21:20
Speaker 2: his wife then, so the mother off of him. So
21:23
Speaker 2: he definitely saw something.
21:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't doubt that. Now, at some point Nathaniel
21:30
Speaker 1: was finally allowed to see the rays again. This would
21:32
Speaker 1: have now been twenty twenty, and that's when Nathaniel confessed
21:37
Speaker 1: again two more of the abuse, in this time that
21:40
Speaker 1: the suffocation that seems to be the theme here of
21:43
Speaker 1: suffocating him, and things got so bad for Nathaniel that
21:49
Speaker 1: Daniel Ray says, this is when Nathaniel said to him,
21:53
Speaker 1: this is the foster dad, quote, Papa, one of these days,
21:59
Speaker 1: Jesus is going to work it out, and I will
22:02
Speaker 1: be with you guys forever, because you're my real family.
22:09
Speaker 1: What a sweet child. A sweet child, yes, so sweet.
22:14
Speaker 2: And apparently the Fosterdaed also had said to him, I
22:17
Speaker 2: wish I could just take you to Mexico, name you
22:20
Speaker 2: Jose and no one will even know.
22:22
Speaker 1: But I can't do that.
22:23
Speaker 2: So the fosterdad is thinking. I was like, how could
22:25
Speaker 2: I now? That would be obviously a criminal, very illegal.
22:28
Speaker 2: Can't do Okay, what about what the mother did?
22:31
Speaker 1: Yeah? Exactly, That's what I was saying. It's like, I
22:34
Speaker 1: think I would have considered kidnapping the child just to
22:36
Speaker 1: save the child's life. But then who would end up
22:38
Speaker 1: in prison? Right? I would? Or the foster parents would
22:42
Speaker 1: for trying to save the child from a dangerous situation,
22:44
Speaker 1: because they'd be like, whoa, you know that's against the law.
22:47
Speaker 1: Oh really, well so is killing a child and abusing
22:49
Speaker 1: a child. Can we have a discussion about justice here?
22:53
Speaker 1: And that's what infuriates me about this case. It is
22:56
Speaker 1: about justice. This child didn't get justice while he was alive. Sorry,
23:00
Speaker 1: he didn't get justice after death, because that sentence is
23:04
Speaker 1: a joke. Give me a brink, give me a break. Well.
23:09
Speaker 1: The Department of Child and Family Services made nearly a
23:14
Speaker 1: dozen visits in the last two years of Nathaniel's life.
23:18
Speaker 1: A dozen visits? People, What did they not see that
23:23
Speaker 1: everyone else can see? I I just I can't aunt wait.
23:30
Speaker 1: Investigators even made their final visit to check on Nathaniel
23:34
Speaker 1: the same month that he died. This is not protective
23:39
Speaker 1: services This is blind services, right, all.
23:43
Speaker 2: Sense of security, So it's not really keeping the child safe.
23:48
Speaker 1: They're there, they're.
23:50
Speaker 2: For filling a task, but what's really happening. I mean,
23:52
Speaker 2: it's not as if it was invisible injuries either, meaning ooh,
23:56
Speaker 2: she smothered him sometimes and no one could tell no, No,
23:58
Speaker 2: he had a gash on his head, he had russ
24:00
Speaker 2: on his back. His grandmother saw that, his father saw that.
24:03
Speaker 2: So they were injuries. There was neglect, she wasn't apparently
24:06
Speaker 2: feeding improperly. So yet there's a lot to work with.
24:09
Speaker 1: There, There really is, There really is. On February seventeenth
24:15
Speaker 1: of twenty twenty one, police responded to Sarah's home for
24:19
Speaker 1: a report of a child not breathing. It was too late.
24:22
Speaker 1: He had been suffocated by his mother. As I said,
24:25
Speaker 1: the community was absolutely shocked, and they responded as quickly
24:28
Speaker 1: as they could, holding vigils, paying for his funeral and
24:35
Speaker 1: as they mourned for the loss of this child. What
24:39
Speaker 1: is Sarah doing? Police say. Sarah's coverner tracks, Oh, really,
24:44
Speaker 1: that would be the evil part of her, right, that
24:47
Speaker 1: knows what's going on. You can't tell me. She had
24:50
Speaker 1: no idea what was going on her actions clearly show this.
24:54
Speaker 1: On the day of Nathaniel's death. On the day of
24:58
Speaker 1: his death, she made the following Google search quote, how
25:02
Speaker 1: long does an investigation take after a child passes away? Really,
25:08
Speaker 1: that's your first thought. Your child is dead and that's
25:13
Speaker 1: all you care about. The other one was she checked
25:17
Speaker 1: on the Office of Juvenile Justice and Delinquency Prevention looking
25:22
Speaker 1: at the guides to how they investigate child abuse. Well,
25:28
Speaker 1: let me tell you something. They clearly didn't investigate child
25:31
Speaker 1: abuse for his seven years of life exactly.
25:36
Speaker 2: And she also researched how much Whilch cremation cost if
25:39
Speaker 2: I cremated my child, how much would that cost.
25:41
Speaker 1: On the day that he died.
25:43
Speaker 2: That's what she was looking up.
25:45
Speaker 1: And see, this is why I say she's sinister, she's evil.
25:48
Speaker 1: This is far more because postpartum depression is very serious
25:54
Speaker 1: and many women suffer, and we must have compassion for
25:59
Speaker 1: what women go through mothers go through. This woman evil evil,
26:06
Speaker 1: evil evil. So the autopsy revealed that Nathaniel died of suffocation.
26:15
Speaker 1: He also suffered a ruptured liver. That shows you he
26:22
Speaker 1: was beaten up. Manner of death of course homicide. The
26:25
Speaker 1: autopsy report and then Sarah's lengthy history. Oh now, all
26:32
Speaker 1: of the case history has some importance and some bearing
26:37
Speaker 1: on this investigation of a child. Obviously she was the
26:41
Speaker 1: prime suspect. Then on April twenty first of twenty twenty one, Sarah,
26:47
Speaker 1: Hold on a second, what took so long? I'm looking
26:50
Speaker 1: at my notes here. This little boy dies in February
26:54
Speaker 1: of twenty twenty one, and she is not charged until April. Really,
27:02
Speaker 1: come on, now, come on now, I believe in justice
27:07
Speaker 1: for all and due process. Really, so April twenty first
27:12
Speaker 1: of twenty twenty one, Sarah has charged with five counts
27:14
Speaker 1: of first degree murder and one count of aggravated battery
27:17
Speaker 1: to a child. She was denied bond. That's good. Don't
27:21
Speaker 1: want her out and about with children. And then she
27:23
Speaker 1: remained in custody, you know, since her arrests now, as
27:28
Speaker 1: you told us at the very beginning, she initially in
27:33
Speaker 1: twenty twenty four, I don't know what it takes so long?
27:35
Speaker 1: Here she pleads guilty to the murder, and she was
27:38
Speaker 1: at that time facing a sentence of between twenty and
27:41
Speaker 1: sixty years. But she, as you said, withdrew this plea.
27:49
Speaker 1: So then they were headed to trial. Okay, then her
27:52
Speaker 1: trial gets delayed for a million reasons, an all in
27:58
Speaker 1: defense of Sarah and Sarah's rights, because the last thing
28:04
Speaker 1: we would want is for Sarah to be denied any
28:09
Speaker 1: due process here or like hurt her feelings, right please?
28:13
Speaker 1: Oh I want to just vomit at this point. So
28:17
Speaker 1: here's what her defense team was trying to do. They
28:20
Speaker 1: were trying to exclude what we've just discussed. Yeah, they
28:26
Speaker 1: didn't want all those adults to be able to testify
28:32
Speaker 1: in front of the jury and recount what Nathaniel said
28:36
Speaker 1: to them. The defense said, oh, that's your say, so
28:40
Speaker 1: that's not admissible. Do you believe this? Do you believe
28:43
Speaker 1: this man? So it had to go to a higher court,
28:47
Speaker 1: and the appellate court ruled, of course it's admissible, especially hello,
28:54
Speaker 1: since much of what they are saying is fully documented
28:59
Speaker 1: in his record from Child and Family Services. I just
29:05
Speaker 1: it's gaming the system. It is gaming the fricking system
29:09
Speaker 1: is what this woman is doing, delaying and delaying justice
29:12
Speaker 1: that would be inadequate. And the other thing is then
29:18
Speaker 1: there were some videotapes. So the foster parents had made
29:25
Speaker 1: some videotapes and they asked Nathaniel in his words to
29:31
Speaker 1: describe what was going on in his life. They were
29:36
Speaker 1: very smart to do this in his own words. The
29:39
Speaker 1: child is speaking from beyond the grave about what was
29:42
Speaker 1: done to him. And then there was an argument about
29:44
Speaker 1: whether this could be admitted into court, and the appellate
29:48
Speaker 1: court ruled there were limitations on introducing this. Something else
29:54
Speaker 1: would have to be called in before they could be introduced.
29:58
Speaker 1: I don't understand why the appellate court ruled this way.
30:01
Speaker 1: Oh that's right, Sarah. Well, let's be fair to Sarah, right,
30:07
Speaker 1: because she's who we care about anyway. It just it
30:12
Speaker 1: didn't it didn't get that far. Obviously. These rulings came
30:16
Speaker 1: in in July of twenty twenty five. So she's facing
30:21
Speaker 1: another she's facing the possibility of a jury trial, and
30:24
Speaker 1: finally she makes the decision. She goes back to the
30:27
Speaker 1: playbook from you know previous and she decides on November
30:30
Speaker 1: twelfth of twenty twenty five, to plead guilty to first
30:33
Speaker 1: degree murder and this little boy's death. The judge sentence
30:38
Speaker 1: her to thirty five years. As we said, I just
30:41
Speaker 1: want to scream, thirty five.
30:44
Speaker 2: What the heck meant? She's thirty eight years old. Yeah,
30:46
Speaker 2: so thirty five years, I mean, she'll feel hopeful. She
30:49
Speaker 2: thinks she's going to game the system again.
30:51
Speaker 1: Oh she is, she is. She's going to be sitting
30:54
Speaker 1: there gaming the system, feeling the sunshine on her cheeks,
30:57
Speaker 1: enjoying a moment, having a sow to. I don't know something,
31:02
Speaker 1: whatever it is, whatever little joy, she's gonna have it,
31:05
Speaker 1: She's going to have it. And I'm just furious. And
31:07
Speaker 1: I'm just furious. And then here's how the state is
31:12
Speaker 1: kind of dealing with Nathaniel's murder and the deaths of
31:18
Speaker 1: other children. Okay, So in twenty twenty four, way too
31:23
Speaker 1: late for our Nathaniel. Three years after his murder, State
31:28
Speaker 1: of Illinois enacted seven new laws in defense of children's
31:33
Speaker 1: rights to give the Department of Child and Family Services
31:36
Speaker 1: more power to step in, by ya yai and help children.
31:41
Speaker 1: Maybe these new laws maybe would have helped. I am
31:48
Speaker 1: not relieved. I think it's good. Is the best I
31:51
Speaker 1: can say. It's good that they've made some changes to
31:55
Speaker 1: the laws. Let's protect the children, the most important thing
31:59
Speaker 1: that we do. WIFRTV reports that in twenty twenty one,
32:04
Speaker 1: that's the year Nathaniel was murdered, one hundred and twenty
32:08
Speaker 1: one children just like him who had contact with social
32:12
Speaker 1: workers died despite the Department of Child and Family Services investigating.
32:21
Speaker 2: Yeah, so let's hope the new laws include some new
32:23
Speaker 2: risk assessment, you know that they can actually like take
32:26
Speaker 2: a checklist like yes, yes, yes, okay, yeah, child needs
32:30
Speaker 2: to be removed or not returned to this home.
32:35
Speaker 1: Can you imagine one hundred and twenty one Nathaniels. That's
32:41
Speaker 1: a lot, that really is. That's just one state. So
32:47
Speaker 1: I hope that on the wings of angels that Nathaniel
32:54
Speaker 1: is in a better place.
32:58
Speaker 2: Shame, yes, I mean such a young life as well,
33:02
Speaker 2: seven years old, he experienced very little joy.
33:05
Speaker 1: Yeah. I have trouble doing these cases. Honestly, I sometimes
33:11
Speaker 1: don't want to do a podcast on these cases because
33:17
Speaker 1: I can't stand it. It just it breaks my heart.
33:21
Speaker 2: Yeah, it makes one feel hopeless, you know, like you
33:24
Speaker 2: almost you lose hoping things of like.
33:26
Speaker 1: How can this be?
33:28
Speaker 2: How can he have used his voice? He could have
33:30
Speaker 2: also been quiet, you know, his mother did the reaten him.
33:33
Speaker 2: He could have been terrified and not said anything.
33:34
Speaker 1: But he was so brave.
33:36
Speaker 2: So when you think of Nathaniel, how courageous he was,
33:38
Speaker 2: how he told people he trusted, how he had this premonition.
33:44
Speaker 2: You can almost say that Mama's gonna kill me. Shame
33:47
Speaker 2: my goodness. So yeah, it's really really heavy. So I
33:50
Speaker 2: hope anyone listening to this will look after their mental
33:52
Speaker 2: health as well, get some sunshine, some coffee, because it's very,
33:56
Speaker 2: very devastating to study these cases.
33:59
Speaker 1: Yeah, he believes so deeply in God. So that is
34:01
Speaker 1: why I said, I hope that on the wings of
34:04
Speaker 1: angels that he is in a place that he believed
34:07
Speaker 1: he would be safe. And that's all I can hope for,
34:10
Speaker 1: because I'm sorry, there's no justice for this monster. Well,
34:15
Speaker 1: it is time for our comments section. These are the
34:18
Speaker 1: crime cases that you all are talking about on social media.
34:21
Speaker 1: And here's our producer, Will Updike. Kay, Will, how are you, hey, Anna?
34:24
Speaker 3: How's it going good?
34:25
Speaker 1: Thank you, hey, Gubs to see you you too, Will all.
34:30
Speaker 3: Right, So this week, this case is very different. You know,
34:35
Speaker 3: this one is kind of a case of like going
34:36
Speaker 3: viral for the wrong reasons. I'm also calling it maybe
34:39
Speaker 3: the Din and Dasher wears pradac kind of a Devil
34:41
Speaker 3: Wears Prada reference here. But this case comes out of
34:44
Speaker 3: New York where several restaurant employees are saying that a
34:47
Speaker 3: glamorous looking woman is running a dining dash scheme in
34:51
Speaker 3: restaurants across the borough, the Brooklyn Borough. So she's been,
34:57
Speaker 3: according to sources, Instagram influencer has been showing up at
35:01
Speaker 3: these fine dining establishments, ordering lots of food and then
35:05
Speaker 3: skipping out on the bill. Now it's becoming like a
35:08
Speaker 3: more known thing because she will post this on Instagram.
35:12
Speaker 3: And she's been banned from at least seven restaurants so far,
35:15
Speaker 3: including the iconic Peter Luger Steakhouse in Williamsburg. And I'm sure,
35:20
Speaker 3: oh I have.
35:21
Speaker 1: I finally went, oh, okay, all right, it's very Yes,
35:26
Speaker 1: it's really an old old steakhouse.
35:27
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like an old timey like steakhouse that's like
35:30
Speaker 3: very popular, very very expensive, very kind of ritzy expensive.
35:34
Speaker 1: Like no, it's not fancy. It's not fancy.
35:37
Speaker 3: It's expensive though.
35:38
Speaker 1: It's expensive and not fancy, like it's all original wood
35:42
Speaker 1: from like you know, a million years ago, and everyone's
35:46
Speaker 1: very gruff. You know, the waiters are very cross.
35:48
Speaker 3: You're not getting like a foam or anything crazy. You're
35:51
Speaker 3: getting like a thick that's costing one hundred dollars.
35:54
Speaker 1: But it's very expensive.
35:55
Speaker 3: She's even done like return visits to some of these restaurants,
35:58
Speaker 3: hitting the Brooklyn restro Francy at least twice. Now. Police
36:02
Speaker 3: have been involved in this. They've arrested pay multiple times,
36:05
Speaker 3: and she's been released. I don't know, Actually, I should
36:08
Speaker 3: have looked into this a little bit more. I think
36:10
Speaker 3: they might have a similar note cash bond situation to California,
36:14
Speaker 3: where under certain amounts you might be released fairly quickly,
36:17
Speaker 3: depending on the charge. But this has been going on
36:20
Speaker 3: for about two months now. This allegedly started back in
36:22
Speaker 3: October at that Peter Luger Steakhouse, where she allegedly ordered
36:26
Speaker 3: one hundred and fifty dollars worth of steak size and
36:28
Speaker 3: dessert all for herself large meal there, and on her
36:33
Speaker 3: food blog she posted pictures of the meal and gave
36:36
Speaker 3: the steakhouse a glowing review. And it's like, Okay, well,
36:39
Speaker 3: this all seems pretty good so far, but the waiters
36:42
Speaker 3: are noticing that it's a little odd. She's been there
36:44
Speaker 3: for hours now, like she's just kind of she's kind
36:47
Speaker 3: of there, and she's eventually given the bill and she
36:51
Speaker 3: tells these waiters that she can't pay, so they're like, oh, no, okay, Like,
36:57
Speaker 3: and if you've ever been in this situation, I you know,
36:59
Speaker 3: I I spend a lot of time in the service industry.
37:02
Speaker 3: Like it's a very awkward situation because it's like you've
37:05
Speaker 3: eaten the meal. I don't really know what you want
37:08
Speaker 3: me to do at this point, Like, you know, like
37:11
Speaker 3: I can't pay for your meal for you. I don't
37:13
Speaker 3: have any power in this scenario. But she apparently tries
37:16
Speaker 3: to barter with these restaurant workers, offering various items from
37:20
Speaker 3: a Prada bag, like a nice bag, including a set
37:24
Speaker 3: of kitchen shears. You know, well, it clearly doesn't fly
37:28
Speaker 3: with the restaurant. They call the cops. No pay was
37:31
Speaker 3: taken away, but she actually allegedly returned to this Peter
37:34
Speaker 3: Luger location the next day, but employees recognize her and
37:39
Speaker 3: they promptly showed her the door. One thing I do
37:41
Speaker 3: want to say is if you are doing it up
37:43
Speaker 3: to any funny business. In restaurants, people talk and they
37:47
Speaker 3: are gonna know you like they like they are, like,
37:49
Speaker 3: your picture is gonna be shown to every server. Everybody
37:53
Speaker 3: is gonna be talking about it at at family meal
37:55
Speaker 3: and any little break around the that you get before
38:00
Speaker 3: someone yells at you. If you got time to lean,
38:02
Speaker 3: you got time to clean. But like I said it
38:06
Speaker 3: all Pay has been arrested six times for the same
38:09
Speaker 3: charge theft of services, which is interesting. I wasn't actually
38:13
Speaker 3: familiar with what kind of like charges they could press
38:15
Speaker 3: you with an alleged dining dash. I wasn't sure what
38:18
Speaker 3: that would be, but theftist services is interesting. But on
38:22
Speaker 3: her Instagram page, Pay continues to post photos and videos
38:25
Speaker 3: of the meals that she's allegedly now getting for free.
38:29
Speaker 3: And she has kind of an m O, which makes
38:31
Speaker 3: this whole thing kind of like stranger. She's you know,
38:35
Speaker 3: I'm just gonna say objectively, she's a very gorgeous woman.
38:38
Speaker 3: She shows up dressed to the nines, and she orders
38:40
Speaker 3: all this food like I said, and doesn't pay. And
38:43
Speaker 3: when restaurants have forced her to produce credit cards, like
38:45
Speaker 3: I said, wealthy looking women. She's wearing designer clothing, like
38:50
Speaker 3: very nice stuff. All these cards have been declined. Like
38:55
Speaker 3: I said, It's kind of like people are calling her
38:57
Speaker 3: like the ANNADELVI of restaurants in Oh My, oh My.
39:02
Speaker 3: It's like a similar kind of thing. Right where you're
39:04
Speaker 3: like projecting this wealth or something and you're going to
39:07
Speaker 3: these nice restaurants and then you know you're not paying.
39:11
Speaker 1: I have a question, Well, so in this whole world
39:14
Speaker 1: of influencers, right, there is a value to an influencer
39:21
Speaker 1: posting a good review about the restaurant. There's a value there.
39:25
Speaker 1: And we know that influencers either get paid or get
39:29
Speaker 1: some kind of product for their good reviews or their
39:34
Speaker 1: honest reviews. So I'm trying to figure out here, then,
39:38
Speaker 1: did did they get something for her showing up to
39:42
Speaker 1: that meal? Or do influencers have to pay for their meals?
39:45
Speaker 1: Don't they get a bunch of free stuff? I don't know.
39:48
Speaker 3: I think it depends on the level of influence, and
39:50
Speaker 3: generally that's something that's worked out with the restaurant beforehand. Yeah,
39:54
Speaker 3: you know, Okay, unless you're like a really big influencer,
39:58
Speaker 3: you know, like I don't, I'm sure of Haley Bieber
40:00
Speaker 3: shows up at a restaurant, they're gonna be like, we
40:02
Speaker 3: got the check, Well.
40:03
Speaker 1: We got this little pick we can't not anymore care of.
40:08
Speaker 3: But we're talking like tens of thousands of followers here,
40:11
Speaker 3: not huh. Oh Okay, So it's also kind of like, yeah,
40:17
Speaker 3: and like I said, it doesn't seem to be slowing
40:19
Speaker 3: down at all. She's still posting these things on Instagram.
40:22
Speaker 3: And the complicated part is like these restaurants aren't really
40:26
Speaker 3: even sure what they're supposed to do other than you know,
40:29
Speaker 3: obviously catching it beforehand, not allowing the restaurant without payment.
40:34
Speaker 3: But like, you know, these credit cards, like I said,
40:37
Speaker 3: have been declined. When they force her to produce those,
40:39
Speaker 3: they you know, they call the cops. The cops did
40:41
Speaker 3: arrive that this Peter Luger thing. I don't know what
40:43
Speaker 3: the situation has been, but I can't imagine the cops
40:45
Speaker 3: are exactly like turning on the sirens and rushing over
40:48
Speaker 3: there for like one hundred and fifty dollars like burned check.
40:52
Speaker 1: Yeah, this isn't the biggest problem that the NYPD has
40:55
Speaker 1: to deal with right now.
40:56
Speaker 3: Right, Like that's the thing, right is that? Like and again,
41:00
Speaker 3: I know that we're talking about this obviously we talked
41:01
Speaker 3: about the case, though it is far more horrowing and
41:04
Speaker 3: important for exactly, but what do you do in a
41:08
Speaker 3: situation like this, like this is bad?
41:12
Speaker 2: Imagine if other people hear of this and start getting
41:14
Speaker 2: ideas to get free meals.
41:15
Speaker 1: This is bad.
41:16
Speaker 3: That's a good that's a good one to do that. Yeah,
41:20
Speaker 3: that's a good point too. We don't want this to
41:21
Speaker 3: become like some sort of terrible trend. But according to
41:25
Speaker 3: court records, she's being represented by a public defender and
41:28
Speaker 3: she's scheduled to appear in court in December. So I
41:30
Speaker 3: don't know if we'll get any sort of like resolution
41:34
Speaker 3: on this or anything. But yeah, it's just a mess.
41:39
Speaker 3: It's just I don't know what you do.
41:43
Speaker 2: I think influencers should call her out, you know, like
41:47
Speaker 2: her own community, So influencers say that's not how we
41:50
Speaker 2: do it, Like, what are you doing? And they should
41:52
Speaker 2: troller a little bit, shade a little bit, name and
41:54
Speaker 2: shame a little bit. That could stop that behavior, you know,
41:56
Speaker 2: because that happens in the true crime community, you know
41:59
Speaker 2: what I mean. If somebody misses up in the true
42:01
Speaker 2: crime community, everybody's going to know about it what they did.
42:04
Speaker 2: So I think in this scenario, influences should get together
42:08
Speaker 2: and say, no, look what she did.
42:10
Speaker 3: Yeah. No, that's a great point too. And I guess,
42:13
Speaker 3: like I wonder what the motive is behind all this
42:17
Speaker 3: because I don't think her plan is to become famous
42:19
Speaker 3: as a dine and dasher. It just doesn't really feel
42:21
Speaker 3: like there's a whole lot of opportunities to expand that
42:25
Speaker 3: type of brand into anything.
42:27
Speaker 1: So you know what I think there is actually because
42:30
Speaker 1: it really just well, just like you mentioned and a
42:34
Speaker 1: del delv you know, this is a woman who finally
42:40
Speaker 1: who you know, conned people up so much money. She
42:42
Speaker 1: finally she's put in prison, and yet behind prison she's
42:46
Speaker 1: doing these drawings and having auctions. Now then once she
42:50
Speaker 1: was released, there are all these pictures of her with
42:53
Speaker 1: her ankle monitor on, and she has monetized, she has
42:58
Speaker 1: monetized everything, and she's become a household name if you will,
43:02
Speaker 1: you know, documentary about her, movie about her. Do you
43:04
Speaker 1: see what I'm saying? This one? You know, this this
43:08
Speaker 1: dining and dash woman, she might be thinking the same thing. Notoriety,
43:15
Speaker 1: not typical celebrity.
43:17
Speaker 3: I mean, I guess that is something we encounter in
43:19
Speaker 3: the crime world, right, It is like people are just interested.
43:23
Speaker 2: Yeah, she's not gonna get it though, she's gonna get
43:25
Speaker 2: in the worst way. When other because she she's also
43:28
Speaker 2: on Instagram, It's not like she's on TikTok or YouTube.
43:29
Speaker 2: By the signs of it, it's a little bit, sorry
43:32
Speaker 2: to say, outdated the way that she's doing it.
43:35
Speaker 3: Like, what are you doing?
43:37
Speaker 1: Shade? I'm gonna throw the shade.
43:41
Speaker 2: Also, consent is a thing because there are so many influencers.
43:45
Speaker 2: If I go way back when I was an airline
43:47
Speaker 2: pilot at South African Airways and in my free time,
43:49
Speaker 2: I was a travel writer, and what I did was
43:52
Speaker 2: I would approach hotels and ask them to host me
43:54
Speaker 2: in exchange one article, photos, and then I would market
43:57
Speaker 2: this all special rates to the pilots. That took a
43:59
Speaker 2: lot of consent, a lot of emails, a lot of negotiation,
44:02
Speaker 2: a lot of You can't just rock up and be like,
44:04
Speaker 2: oh well, I'm just not going to pay so yeah,
44:07
Speaker 2: what she's doing there, Like she's just entitles. I just
44:10
Speaker 2: feel like she's almost trolling restaurants.
44:13
Speaker 3: And it's almost and doesn't care. Yeah yeah, because I
44:19
Speaker 3: mean if it's not a heck yeah, if everything that's
44:23
Speaker 3: like alleged is true, it does feel very blatant. But
44:26
Speaker 3: people had a lot to say about this one. Uh,
44:30
Speaker 3: you know a lot of people commented on you know,
44:32
Speaker 3: she's a gorgeous woman normal fans said, what did she dine?
44:35
Speaker 3: And dash ice cubes, I do want to know one thing?
44:38
Speaker 3: Uh one at one of these restaurants, but she was
44:41
Speaker 3: caught and the waiter actually like filmed her on a
44:42
Speaker 3: security on their phone. Sheer, all this food doesn't touch
44:48
Speaker 3: the food there for hours, So that one is even
44:51
Speaker 3: like you're not even getting free meal out of this,
44:53
Speaker 3: You're just is it just for the love of the game.
44:56
Speaker 3: I don't understand it. I don't I do not understand it.
45:00
Speaker 1: Game.
45:03
Speaker 3: Rohan k said, when your hustle is just stealing. But
45:07
Speaker 3: in HD, which is kind of funny. I I follow
45:10
Speaker 3: some of these these accounts that are like financial influences
45:14
Speaker 3: or whatever, and they recommend something that's like essentially fraud,
45:18
Speaker 3: and I think people are getting really confused about what
45:21
Speaker 3: some of those lines are. Sometimes if it's a hack,
45:24
Speaker 3: it's a maybe you should check with a lawyer on that.
45:26
Speaker 3: Maybe you should make sure that that yeah, it's actually
45:29
Speaker 3: good to go. MJ had some interesting ideas for punishment
45:33
Speaker 3: here for a thing that the restaurants could do, they said,
45:35
Speaker 3: put turbo lax in her meals, which sometimes she's not
45:39
Speaker 3: eating them. But if yeah, I mean I guess if
45:41
Speaker 3: you did get sick. But then I feel like you're
45:43
Speaker 3: opening yourself up to a whole other issue as the restaurant,
45:45
Speaker 3: because then could she sue you. I you know, I
45:48
Speaker 3: wouldn't want to get I wouldn't want to get my
45:50
Speaker 3: hands messy with that whole kind of thing. HASSANJ had
45:54
Speaker 3: another different idea for justice. He said, feeder to the homeless,
45:57
Speaker 3: which the loss of of of of food, like a
46:02
Speaker 3: waste of any sort of food.
46:03
Speaker 1: It's all waste. Yeah, it is waste. It's a waste
46:06
Speaker 1: of food.
46:07
Speaker 3: Waste for me, like it paranois me so much like
46:10
Speaker 3: if I leave, if I have a couple of bikes
46:13
Speaker 3: of something left at a restaurant, I'm getting a box
46:15
Speaker 3: and I'm definitely eating it later. Like I just like
46:18
Speaker 3: it disturbs me on the level that I should probably
46:21
Speaker 3: unpack somewhere else. But it's one of those things like
46:25
Speaker 3: thinking about a whole meal at a nice restaurant. Just
46:27
Speaker 3: going untouched for the content really bugs me. It really
46:31
Speaker 3: really bugs me. Obviously, not condoning any sort of.
46:35
Speaker 2: For the views and for the ego. Okay, yeah, giving ratings,
46:39
Speaker 2: she's doing them a favor.
46:40
Speaker 3: I remember exactly, but don'll do it for this story
46:45
Speaker 3: in it. Do you have any additional comments from our
46:48
Speaker 3: viewers and listeners that you'd like to share?
46:50
Speaker 1: Yes, I do. I should have had them all set
46:52
Speaker 1: up because I was just reading the other day. Okay,
46:57
Speaker 1: So here this is on a last week's case which
47:02
Speaker 1: was crazy. Basically, we have a woman who ends up
47:05
Speaker 1: being convicted she had of killing her baby daddy even
47:10
Speaker 1: though she had married that man's son. Okay, it's like incestuous.
47:14
Speaker 3: It's crazy.
47:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's all like it's cuckoo. There's like you can't
47:19
Speaker 1: unpack this. So uh, trainy two writes, killing the dad
47:25
Speaker 1: because you want custody of the kids doesn't seem like
47:29
Speaker 1: a well thought out plan, but that was the theory
47:32
Speaker 1: that she thought if she could just get rid of him,
47:34
Speaker 1: then she could get the kids because she lost custody.
47:37
Speaker 1: What sense does this make? You know? It just of
47:39
Speaker 1: course it doesn't make any sense. And then Michael hannah
47:44
Speaker 1: Ford writes, this headline alone made me scream what like
47:50
Speaker 1: four times? And I responded, I'm still screaming, what man
47:54
Speaker 1: did you write a headline on that? One? Will? Will
47:57
Speaker 1: is responsible for the headlines everyone, Okay, okay, and then
48:02
Speaker 1: Penny Pole dash c one K writes, great show today,
48:07
Speaker 1: loved your guests and always love you. Anna. We thank
48:10
Speaker 1: you so much. We actually had a new guest on
48:13
Speaker 1: last week and Elenni, who is a therapist in New
48:19
Speaker 1: York and she had actually worked at Rikers Island as
48:25
Speaker 1: a supervisor mental health there, so she had an incredible
48:29
Speaker 1: history and she said she very much enjoyed being on
48:31
Speaker 1: the program and we'll be back. So we thank you
48:33
Speaker 1: for your comments. I try and read them and sometimes
48:37
Speaker 1: I just thoroughly enjoy you know what you have to say,
48:41
Speaker 1: and sometimes we just all commiserate together. So thank you
48:44
Speaker 1: so much for leaving your comments.
48:46
Speaker 3: Yes, it's a great community. You could leave those comments
48:48
Speaker 3: on any YouTube video. You can comment on these parts
48:52
Speaker 3: if you want to be a part of the comment
48:53
Speaker 3: section in our community, or post tab on YouTube, depending
48:57
Speaker 3: on what format you're looking at, it's called different things.
48:59
Speaker 3: You can also read to us across all social media
49:01
Speaker 3: at my True Crime News. That is going to do
49:03
Speaker 3: it for this week's comments section until next week. Don't
49:06
Speaker 3: do crime.
49:07
Speaker 1: Don't do crime. Absolutely, it's not good, not good. Okay,
49:10
Speaker 1: So Gizzilow, where can people find you? Follow you.
49:14
Speaker 2: They can find me on YouTube. My channel is Grizzly
49:17
Speaker 2: True Crime double z like the Bear, I'm on the
49:19
Speaker 2: almost every day, whether it's a video, a YouTube short,
49:22
Speaker 2: or a live stream or a community post. That's mostly
49:24
Speaker 2: where they can find me on my website Grizzlytruecrime dot com.
49:28
Speaker 1: I love it, and I just I'm so fascinated by
49:30
Speaker 1: your history. I mean, a former professional airline pilot who
49:35
Speaker 1: now does true crime. You are fascinating. Oh, thank you
49:39
Speaker 1: so much. And the fact that you're joining us from
49:43
Speaker 1: Switzerland is just so I don't know, feel so lux.
49:47
Speaker 2: Nice okay, exotic Switzerland snowing in the evening here when
49:51
Speaker 2: we're recording this.
49:52
Speaker 1: Oh is it snowing?
49:53
Speaker 2: Oh?
49:53
Speaker 1: Hi nice? I bet? I bet? Christmas is going to
49:56
Speaker 1: be really pretty in Switzerland.
49:58
Speaker 2: Yes, you should visit Switzerland one day. It is so
50:00
Speaker 2: beautiful in winter. It's really like how the pictures actually
50:03
Speaker 2: don't do a justice. It is so beautiful in winter,
50:05
Speaker 2: and everyone comes skiing here and there's the hot tubs,
50:07
Speaker 2: you know, overlooking all the mountains.
50:09
Speaker 1: Very nice, wow, wow, how lovely. Well, thank you again
50:14
Speaker 1: for joining us. We also want to wish our friend
50:18
Speaker 1: Mike King a speedy recovery. We're thinking of him. He
50:22
Speaker 1: was supposed to be on with us today and you,
50:24
Speaker 1: my friend, jumped right in at the last second. And
50:27
Speaker 1: I want you to know that we are very appreciative
50:30
Speaker 1: of your kindness and your generosity of time.
50:33
Speaker 2: Yes, thank you so much for inviting me. I will
50:35
Speaker 2: always I'll be there if you need me to be there.
50:37
Speaker 2: I'm always wanted to be here.
50:39
Speaker 1: Thank you, Thank you. All Right, so you can find
50:41
Speaker 1: me at Ana G News Anna with one end. It's
50:43
Speaker 1: so funny. Someone actually wrote on YouTube, Hey it's Anna
50:47
Speaker 1: with one end. It made me laugh. It just was hilarious.
50:51
Speaker 1: I thought it was very sweet. You can subscribe to
50:54
Speaker 1: our YouTube channel, where we have a very vibrant and
50:57
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51:06
Speaker 1: at Truecrimenews dot com. So until next time, this is
51:09
Speaker 1: True Crime News the podcast. I'm your host, Ana Garcia.
51:12
Speaker 1: Crime never stops at neither do we