Latest / Wired For More - ADHD & Self Mastery / You Want to Go Viral with Colin Stewart Perreault

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You Want to Go Viral with Colin Stewart Perreault · Wired For More - ADHD & Self Mastery

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Hey everyone, Ian May here with the Wired for More ADHD and Self Mastery podcast.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_01: I have my good buddy Colin Stewart Perot on the line.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_01: Him and I, as always, I seem to only live in LinkedIn, but we have found ourselves in similar circles just from the fact that one LinkedIn unisphere is so small, but also people who are posting and creating fun, engaging content, it's kind of a small circle, in all seriousness.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_01: There's only so few of us who are posting things that we are we are ourselves as content creators are excited to engage with.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: And Colin and I have had more than a few times where we've discussed getting people's attention.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_01: How do you be part of social media, but not be the consumer of it?
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: And I'll tell you, Colin, even just in our call that we just had pre-discussion, already dropped a painful amount of knowledge bombs about all the things that I'm not doing, all the things I should be doing, all the things to take me to the next level of becoming a true professional in visibility, content, brand, awareness.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_01: So, Colin, thank you for joining, brother.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_01: Would love for you just to for those of the people who don't know you, what are some things that are immediately apparent when you get to know Colin?
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: Immediately apparent.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_00: I'm chronically online.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I'll probably throw an anecdote out a little too often for most people.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: I love analogies.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, sometimes the analogies really hit with what someone's interested in, sometimes they don't apply so well, but I do them for me, and if they help you too, that's great.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_00: I teach, yeah.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like a Mr.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_00: Miyagi style teacher, you know, and it's kind of it might be frustrating for some people, but uh at the end we do get it done.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_01: So when you when you work with somebody to start analyzing how there's the infinite internet and all the different ways that they can engage and a thousand different platforms, and where where do you typically start when you're doing an audit of of a client for media?
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um in the professional space, there's one thing that I see every single time is that people want to speak to their ICP and they're ignoring their audience, and that's the biggest thing for me.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um, if you want to be famous, which is the most efficient business model, right?
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_00: And when people hear that, they get like this really like averse reaction, they're like, ew gross, I don't want to be famous, like I don't want to be Britney Spears.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_00: That was terrible.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, fame is relevant to size, right?
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_00: So your UPS guy, you might not even know him by name, but if he's like a friendly guy, he's like extroverted, he's cool, you know, comes up, maybe you give him some snacks sometimes, like he's famous on his block, right?
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: You can be famous in the smallest niche ever, and you'll never get recognized in public.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_00: So do you want to be famous?
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: And they're like, no.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, do you want to be famous at the convention that you go to?
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: Do you want to be famous at the board in the boardroom when you're sitting down?
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: Do you want to be famous when you hop on a when you hop on a Zoom call to consult a sales team that some of the people from other departments heard that you're going to be on that call, you're going to be teaching that day, and they just hop in and be like, yo, what's Ian talking about?
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_00: You know?
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: I follow him on Instagram.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: This guy is cool, right?
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_00: So fame has different levels.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um so if you want to be famous, which I think is a universally good thing, if you want to be successful, if you want to make money, if you want to have an endless stream of clients that are asking you to work with them, not the other way around, then you want to be whatever level of fame would serve you, right?
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: So if you do want to be famous and all you're doing is talking to and reaching out to the people that might be future buyers or near-term buyers, every conversation you're having is going to be a one by one-on-one, right?
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_00: It's not going to spread to something else.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: So if you want to scale big and if you want to not be the guy at the party that only talks to girls that he wants to sleep with, he doesn't make friends.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe just show up and treat people like people, speak to your audience.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: So that's the first thing I do is I show up and I'm like, all you're doing is selling, and you're just selling on a different channel.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: And it makes sense, it's okay, because you're like a lot of people aren't internet native.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: They might just be consumers, not creators.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_00: So when they show up as a forced creator, they didn't get the blueprint, they didn't get the boot camp.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: So that's the first thing I do is I switch to the client.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_01: That that resonated in that, though, it is this idea when people say, Hey, I don't want to be famous, but also you need to be known if if you're going to be a known quantity, right?
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like you talked about this of like whatever circle that you're swimming in, how do you become a known quantity?
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_01: And brand does that for you.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_01: So for me personally, I yes, I rely really heavily, a good amount of my business, on referrals.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_01: And so there's some amount of, hey, do you want to be known by the people who you who you best serve?
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_01: Well, absolutely.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_01: What do you want to be known for by those people?
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_01: I want to be known for vulnerability and authenticity and showing up meaningfully.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: I want to be known for the work that I have done personally in my own life.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: I want to be known for all the ways that I've shown up.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_01: But hey, that is going to require you to have to give and show part of yourself potentially in a very broad and open way.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_01: And I think just this idea of having this fear of rejection, because hey, if I'm famous and that means there's going to be as many, if not more, people who hate me and loathe me, then appreciate me.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_01: And I actually am not going to be able to do that.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: Apparently so, right?
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I think there's some beauty in that of how do you build resilience to people's criticism or when you share something of yourself, being totally open to the fact that people who are engaging, even in a cruel way, are still helping you, are actually still serving you very, very well, and just continue to give you more opportunity to be known.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I really like people showing up in polarizing ways online because it's also a beautiful version of audience segmentation.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_00: Have you ever had a call with somebody that could be a potential client and they just are so abrasive, their personality and your personality are just so abrasive on that call, that referral, that you're like, I hope that they don't want to say yes to this because I would love to pay my bills this month, or I'm in a privileged position where I can say no, I don't want this client.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_00: But I wish I would have known beforehand.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_00: If you would have shown up more authentically as yourself, they probably wouldn't have reached out because you have things that are about you that they already disagree with before they even know you.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: And those are the people in the comments, those are the people hating on you.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_00: They're just letting you know in their comments that I would never have been a buyer anyway.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: I would never have been a fan ever anyway, right?
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I tell people it's like, don't get upset of the opinions of people that are never going to give you money.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I think I think that is the part of, especially in the coaching space, when people first come to me when it comes to coaching, is that they will get obsessed with picking the perfect niche and the perfect audience.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_01: And initially, when you're first getting started, is actually you just have to go let people know that you are even capable of helping them.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_01: But with this mentality that if you're doing well, you're probably gonna strike out 70% of the time.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: I hope so with your ideal client, with the person that you can serve, and then even to generate that many conversations, you need to be turned down a hundred times more to convert 10% of those into the th you know, the 30% of that.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just it's so challenging to have somebody acknowledge I need to have people turn me down.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_01: In fact, I don't I pay myself by having more people turn me down, knowing that inevitably I'm getting the right person.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_00: There's an efficient way to get turned down without having it negatively affect you, and it's getting turned down before you even meet the people.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: So if you need to get turned down a hundred times before you find that one client, if you can create content that represents yourself, that shows your views, that shows things that would make people disqualify you, they're turning you down without you ever meeting, without you ever meeting them.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_00: And that's pretty damn cool too.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_01: I love that mentality, and I think that's the part of people are afraid of being divisive.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_01: And in and in fact, that might be the best thing for your business is to be divisive, is to be very clear of who is who I don't want to work with.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_01: And here are the things that I'm going to say to make sure that that person goes, not for me, screw this guy.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, exactly.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_00: They say in marketing advertising all the time, right?
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_00: If like if you try to sell to everybody, you sell to no one, but then we forget about that the second we go over to content.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_01: So and I I think that's the part where some of it is is the views game, right?
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_01: Like when we obsess about views, we're often obsessing about having the widest potential bucket to pull from.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_01: And in reality, it's like, yeah, there's some benefit of letting that be still representative of you, but also acknowledging that, like, hey, when your goal is just wide reach, you're not gonna be able to be as specific to the person who's gonna raise their hand to say, actually, that was for me.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: Like that post was for me, that comment was for me, that that individual thing that now is sparking that conversion conversation.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_01: Isn't gonna happen from the thing that has the broadest reach.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_01: The things that have done the best for my business were the posts that honestly had maybe 500 to a thousand impressions.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_01: It was very clear who the person who it was for, who was it it was speaking to.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_01: But that's only after the post-reach, right?
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, before, yeah, exactly.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_01: After having that broad reach, right?
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_01: So there's there's some beauty in kind of ebbing and flowing that.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: In terms of how you typically suggest somebody manages that the kind of ebbing and flowing in the hate spews for views into being able to then have like the hyper-specific conversation.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: What do you feel like is a good ratio for people to kind of ebb and flow into hyper reach versus hyper focus?
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_00: It needs to be a balance.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_00: I look at it like a funnel, like this.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_00: We've got you know the top funnel content, medium funnel content, bottom funnel content, and then the conversion content, bottom, which is your offer, right?
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_00: And you can look at like the awareness funnel, right?
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_00: You've got like um audience awareness, uh, problem awareness, solution awareness, and then offer awareness, right?
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_00: So you run it like that, and there's no perfect ratio.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_00: There's a perfect ratio for where you are, right?
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: So you look at your content stack and you're like, okay, my top of funnel content's ripping, but my conversion content is not ripping, right?
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: You probably need to add some more stuff in the middle.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_00: Like the I could see myself working with Ian content, right?
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_00: Case studies, social, social proof, free game, stuff like that before you stay, before you say, you know, I like the San Francisco 49ers, and they're like, boom, 100,000 comments, whatever.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: You're like, also sign up for my boot camp.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_00: And they're like, Who?
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_00: What?
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: I thought you were the football guy, right?
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: So you gotta lead people all the way down to it.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_00: I do uh like offer validation, like you can do little teases.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_00: If we're talking about just LinkedIn, right?
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_00: You can do little teases, you can do soft call to actions like sign up for my newsletter or comment something below, or send me a DM if this that's not direct offer sales things.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: And if your audience complies to that, then you've got the amount of poll that you can throw an offer down, right?
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_01: I I think that's something where people will, in our circles even obsess about, hey, does DM me this or comment Claude if you like all of that stuff that like somehow that affects reach or that if that affects like who who actually takes a look at those things?
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_01: How how much energy do you give to playing the algorithm game in those types of call to actions?
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_01: Do you completely ignore it?
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_01: You you go like fly by the seat of your pants?
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how much energy do you give to what is and doesn't work in in those settings?
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_00: The algorithm is always changing and it's changing for the better.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_00: People think the algorithm's changing for the worse, it's changing for the better.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_00: And usually when something changes for the better, there's some growing pains, right?
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_00: Like I forget the stats, but people say that like if you change something within your offer in a business, you're gonna experience an immediate X percent drop in revenue.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: And then it bounces back and goes back up, right?
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: So business owners will make changes and they'll see it go down, they'll change back, they'll see it change and goes down, change back, and they're slowly killing themselves, right?
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_00: But the algorithm's always changing, it's always improving for us.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: Like we used to have to use hashtags if we wanted to get our content to reach the right people.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_00: Now, if you post a video, the platform downloads the transcript of your video and finds long tail keywords in that and applies those to the audience that might be interested in it, right?
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_00: So we don't need keywords anymore.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_00: Stop using keywords unless you're using keywords for yourself, so you can help find your content.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like if you're doing a series or something, you can use a keyword because you can just click the keyword and see all your posts in one place, right?
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_00: But what doesn't change is human behavior and human psychology.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: So I really don't make anything for the algorithm.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't tell anyone to make anything for the algorithm.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_00: I tell them to make for people, because people are the constant.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_00: And if you learn the platform, if you master the LinkedIn algorithm, if you master the Instagram algorithm, you master the Facebook algorithm, right?
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_00: Let's say I master the LinkedIn algorithm, and then I hop over to Instagram because I'm like, I'm ready to expand my audience.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_00: I know nothing.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_00: Because I mastered this thing over here.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: So let's say LinkedIn dies tomorrow, and then uh Meta launches their version of LinkedIn, their professional platform with resumes and stuff like that and uh job and job seeking.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_00: I'm fucked.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: I'm starting, you know, I'm I'm I'm as good at it as my mom is, you know, so like that sucks.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_00: But if I learn people, if I learn human psychology, human behavior, and human attention, then I can go to any platform.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_00: And that's why I was able to just hop on Instagram or hop on LinkedIn 12 months ago and hit 10k just by fucking around because I didn't understand the platform.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_00: But I understood people.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: I I think that's that resonates even for me right now, just like in the current transition of I feel like I've got a good rhythm for my LinkedIn platform.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: I have a good bead on what my audience cares about, the types of people I engage with, the ways that I engage with them.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just like the not it's not just that the rules are different, it's that I I'm very used to the professional model of these particular personas.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like I'm going into a platform where those same people exist, like those same people didn't like stop showing up in that way.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_01: It's that I'm not speaking to them as the versions of them that are showing up on Instagram, I'm still trying to speak to them as if they're in the office in in that corporate setting, and now all of a sudden I'm trying to speak to them on their weekend retreat.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's it's being but it being able to understand the same the same human is in buff.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_01: So what is it about what I'm creating that speaks to the human and not to how they're showing up in that particular environment?
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely, and you're totally right.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_00: Like your audience, your buyers, your ICP, and your audience, they're on LinkedIn, they're on Instagram, they're on TikTok, they're on Facebook, they're on Facebook Marketplace, they're on Craigslist, they're everywhere.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: Like your audience is everywhere.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_00: Just because someone is a B2B buyer doesn't mean that they're not into golf.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_00: Doesn't mean they're not into Formula One, doesn't mean they're not into making smoothies, right?
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_00: So you guys could have a lot of common interests.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: So they are on those other platforms.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: And something that I do highlight for specific platforms is the human behavior and how it changes on those platforms.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_00: You're like, I'm talking to them on their weekend, I'm talking to them on their retreat, right?
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's so it's super true.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_00: Like LinkedIn, people say that video doesn't work, right?
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: But then LinkedIn's saying video does work.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_00: That's a whole nother can of worms.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: I can go into how LinkedIn is trying to trying to like guide their user base so that they act in a certain way so that LinkedIn can generate more revenue.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_00: So they're really not giving us the advice to win, they're giving us the advice so that their metrics look better because they're a business too.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway, I can get into that.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: But people that watch LinkedIn, they're scrolling, the majority of them are at their computer, not at their phone, right?
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: And videos are more often than not on mute.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: So if you don't, if you have a video and you don't have big ass title text that's telling people why they should stop scrolling and why should they they should click that unmute button.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_00: So like people know them on LinkedIn.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_00: You want to just bait people to click the more, right?
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: So you really need to get like curiosity gap heavy, or you need to get value forward heavy, right?
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_00: Announcement heavy.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_00: I just quit my job more.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_00: I got in a car crash.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_00: We're having a more, right?
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_00: Like you just want to like bait them into clicking that more with the video, you want to bait them into clicking that unmute.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_01: Or a lot of people the visual hook over over the even the audio hook.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and you need subtitles for sure, unless it's an intentional, intentional reason you don't have them, but like you really need subtitles.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_00: I was um I do a lot of Instagram or LinkedIn commenting, and I was paying attention to myself last week, and I was like, I commented on six videos in a row without watching the video.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: I just had it on mute with like the first you know 10 seconds or whatever, and I formulated my opinion to comment in just that amount of time.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_00: I never listened to the damn thing.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_00: I had music playing.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_01: So I've got other stuff that I want to listen to.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but on Instagram, on Instagram and TikTok, um, it autoplays with audio, right?
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: And there's no other distractions.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_00: Like the video is is full screen on the on the phone, right?
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_00: So when they swipe, they can't just like it depends on the view, but like if they're scrolling the reels feed, they have to swipe to the next one.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: You can't just like scoot down and kind of like, I'm watching the video, but I'm gonna scoot down a little bit, I'm gonna tease and I'm gonna see if the other piece of content right below it is worth me jumping to, right?
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_00: Or maybe scroll back up or something like that.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_00: So you have more, you're more locked in on that one.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_00: But on the LinkedIn one, also sometimes on the LinkedIn formats, that text hook that you hit for the more, it gets embedded in the video over the video.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_00: So you can like barely see it.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_00: So all of a sudden it doesn't become a magnet, it becomes an afterthought.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_00: So what I do with every piece of content, like what I do with every piece of content for every platform is I do like the art of war thing, like know your enemy, right?
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_00: So I try to put myself in my audience's shoes, and then imagine how are they consuming content?
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_00: Let me make it to appeal to that person that I'm trying to reach.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're on Instagram or TikTok, probably couch content, right?
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like people are just like on the couch, right?
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: Well, they do it while they're driving, there's a lot of different things, walking the dog.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_00: You have to kind of figure out what your audience is and what they're going to be doing.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: And then on LinkedIn, they're either at their desk or they're on the toilet.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: So you have to pick which one.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_01: And you really can't, I mean, you can optimize for both if their job's really shit, but like when I think that's that's actually an important factor of being able to acknowledge, hey, do I want somebody to to stop on this when they're sitting in the toilet?
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: Which is gonna affect the aspect ratio of my video, how I'm hooking them, what is what is the goal of the video hook, versus of like, hey, is this something I actually want somebody to engage with when they're sitting at their computer?
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_01: Well, what I built and how I create it is actually gonna change.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_01: And my hook might be different.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_01: Like one hook might be, hey, here's what standing on stage in my underwear taught me about engaging boardrooms.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like, okay, that's a obvious that's a definitely a toilet scrolling video, versus being able to to speak a little bit more to hey, here are the the biggest struggles that I had in my corporate role that are keeping you from landing your next gig, whatever.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like the two two completely different posts, right, and two different formats.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_01: But being able to acknowledge of who's that person I'm trying to engage with meaningfully.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: Where are they?
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: Who how are they showing up?
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_01: What are they looking for?
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's I think it's interesting though, putting putting that hat on, putting that lens on.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_01: And I think one of the things to your point that you've really engaged with is you're not using views to assess any of those details.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like you're genuinely thinking about who the person is on the other side.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_01: Because we can kind of get lost, the numbers get lost on us.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like, hey, I had a post that had 10,000 views.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, well, you just filled a high school football stadium.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_01: That's not a small amount of visibility and awareness.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's huge.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_01: How how have we trivialized that?
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: This one actually went viral.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_01: There's a hundred thousand views on this inside of six hours.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, that's that's Michigan Stadium.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like you just a third or five.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_01: It's like a little college football stadium.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: It's it is wild though that how how much we've trivialized that viewership.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_01: And even what does a room of 500 people even look like?
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_01: And why is that?
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_01: Even worth celebrating, which is like your worst post.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_00: We are doing that to all things.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, think about you're frozen.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_01: Why am I frozen?
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_01: I got you frozen.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_01: Go ahead and keep keep going though, because it it's recording on both sides.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, okay.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we we um we do that to all things.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_00: Like, think about a trillionaire, right?
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_00: Or like a billionaire.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_00: Like, people don't even understand.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_00: We can't comprehend when we're looking at like a five trillion dollar market valuation for a new car, new company on this IPO.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_00: We can't even like understand what five trillion dollars is, right?
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_00: But we're throwing these numbers around.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_00: If we're in the business world or like especially if we're in the stock market or something like that, like if we do trading, we're throwing these massive numbers all around all the time, and it's numbing us to those numbers.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_00: And the same thing's happening with social media.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_00: Someone's like, like, I'm a small creator, I only have 10,000 followers, and I'm like, wait, what?
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_00: You're a small creator with 10,000 followers?
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_00: That's huge, massive.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that putting into perspective, like you said, trying to put like a metric on it, meaning like this is you know, 9,000 school buses worth of people, it's a big deal.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_00: Like we were just talking earlier about um 500 views, right?
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: If you're able to take 500 views across all the social media platforms once per day, people think of a 500 view post as a flop, right?
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_00: But if you get 500 views cross posted across all the platforms, fancy 65 days a year, you're gonna crack a million impressions with a million times that people see your face.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_00: And if you want to talk about pairs.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: Social strength, which is how you get trust, which is how you get sales.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: If you're shit posting over on threads and you've got your Ian face right there, and then someone's hopping on LinkedIn and they see your offer because you just showed up in the network for whatever reason, they don't even know this guy, they're like, I know this guy, I'm gonna click it.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: Because I know it at all.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_00: Like brand awareness drives decision.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: If there's no other metrics or no other information for someone to make a decision on something, just by seeing something before, they're gonna pick it, right?
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_00: If I'm buying floor cleaner for my house, because my cleaner is like, oh, we're out of, we're out of floor clean and go to the store and get some floor cleaner, I was like, okay, and I show up and I don't know anything about floor cleaners, right?
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna pick something that has a cool label, I'm gonna pick something based on the price.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_00: Or if I've seen a floor cleaner before at my sister's house, just like once, I was like, I recognize that label, I'm just gonna buy it.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: I know nothing about the brand.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_00: But if I have no other information, if I just seen that before, so if I'm just scrolling and I've seen Ian's profile picture before, I'm just gonna like click it because it's beating out everything else.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, I don't know.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_00: Who's this guy?
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: I've seen this guy before, I've recognized him, right?
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and even to your point of like, if I if you you brought up like your sister and you saw it at her house, it's like if you associate your sister with cleanliness and she keeps a tidy house, and every time I walk into her house, I it always smells fresh, like it always smells clean, like it's not reeking of mildew.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_01: If you if you walked into your sister's house, saw the cleaner that she uses, and then you smell mildew and molds, and you walk in, you're like, maybe that cleaner doesn't work.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_01: But you talked about that parasocial association, which man, that was a mouthful.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um good thing I don't have a lisp, that would have been hard.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_00: Uh parasful.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_00: Paraphoeful.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you just you just named what uh you just named what an influencer is, right?
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_00: I just named why brand partnerships are important.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I I think that's the part where people look down on that because it's like, oh, you're just trying to sell me something.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's like Yes.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_01: I'm trying to serve you in a way because I these things are meaningful.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_01: It is important that you have a clean house.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like these things are important.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_01: We should agree that these things are important.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_01: Do you want to make sure that you're using something that actually serves the purpose in which it was made?
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_01: How can we increase the likelihood that happens?
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: We are a tribal people, and so we make tribal decisions.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_01: The argument is how conscious are you of that tribal decision and are you willing to buy into that tribalism or not?
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_01: Some people aren't.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_01: And honestly, they live sad, miserable lives being sad and alone and kind of desperate for connection and belonging, but also just being able to acknowledge the fact of like I'm willing to make a purchase based on these relatively unimportant biases that I have.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm okay with that.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_01: I genuinely am okay with that.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_01: And a lot of people I think who are coming to terms with how they're engaging with social media, the fact they are being sold things constantly.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, hey, if this thing genuinely does serve me, then actually I want that app to be sold.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_01: And in fact, I want to engage with social media in a way to tell it the ways I want to be sold to, how I want to be sold to, what products I care being sold to the most.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I actually want to feed it that information.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's actually something that I think more social media organizations care about, of me being able to say, you could pretty much tell me if there is a new flavor of pre-workout from these brands, I'm gonna click on it.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_00: Can I just like me spend some damn money?
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's why I say that the platforms are platforms are just getting better, right?
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: And um what is it, Gary V, he's always talking about it's not social media, right?
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_00: It's attention media.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_00: We're in the attention economy, and that's super true.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_00: Because everyone's page is just turning into a channel, because that's what serves the platform, right?
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_00: That's what drives conversions.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_00: So we're not really using platforms as like vlogs anymore.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: We're not using platforms as just like little diaries and fun stuff and pictures of our cats.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone is either selling or consuming, or they're not getting views.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, it's true.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_00: You can you can try to hide from the platforms, you can try to hide from being sold to, or if you're like Ian, you can be like manga pre-workout, manga pre-workout, mango pre-workout, manga pre-workout, and then you're like, all right, cool, this is great.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_01: Honey, I was thinking about rainbow sherbet pre-workout.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_00: What do you think?
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_00: And then that just pings to someone that pings to like bum or something, and they get that thing, they're like, Oh, a lot of people are mentioning rainbow sherbet pre-workout lately.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_01: We should develop that flavor, we should make that and I think that's the part where we can actually celebrate that.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like, let's learn how to celebrate that.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_01: Can we just influence what we want to be sold to, how we want to be sold to, and engage in that in a meaningful way?
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_01: So it's interesting now.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_01: Where where brain rot is going now is actually super interesting, and I know this isn't necessarily your expertise, but there's an is an interesting phenomenon that people who are self-aware of the trash that's on social media are essentially using brain rot or like particular videos that literally have no meaning, no purpose, no nothing.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_01: And like there's I can't remember the name of the video, but it's essentially like a head, a talking head that's singing out of a toilet bowl.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_01: Complete trash content.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's interesting is that people are participating and watching that because it's like there's no message, there's no meaning to this, there's no, there's no rhyme or rule around why this media, I'm consuming it.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like it's like weird anti-establishment.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's just an interesting phenomenon on that.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's people's self-awareness that they're constantly being sold to and petitioned to.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_01: And so they're choosing to not participate in it by allowing their brains to rot even further rather than engaging with.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_00: You familiar with all those guys, yeah.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's good stuff.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I mean, I have 36 hours of screen time a day.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I consume everything, and one of my superpowers is going to those fringes that have no revenue attached to them, that's just pure attention, and stealing techniques and stealing trends from those and bringing them over to something that has a revenue funnel attached to it.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: So I consume a lot of content that people would say, What the fuck are you watching this for?
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like absorbing game.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and I think that's a one of the things that you do really well, Colin, in your ability to actually perform analysis.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_01: You are not actively shutting off when you're consuming quote brain rot.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_01: You're actually doing the opposite of turning on.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_01: What are people doing here?
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_01: So there's an existential crisis happening, uh, and maybe there's some therapy to go along with that.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_01: But being able to choose, hey, I want to engage with this meaningfully, and so therefore, I am actually going to analyze this, assess it, discuss it, not immediately belittle the the art form that it is in attention, and then how can I attach something that is true, true service, true utility, true benefit to somebody in my sphere of influence?
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it it's interesting for me being in the ADHD space or the attention space or the in uh the performance space because there is some amount of like being anti-social media, being anti-doom scrolling, because of the fact that like it limits performance and it limits intensity.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_01: But also, how do you create bandwidth for when you're doing research?
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_01: And how can you make sure that you are signaling to your brain, hey, I'm in research phase right now.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm gonna make sure I'm gonna go to these particular channels of Brain Rot, even.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna watch these five videos, I'm gonna take these notes.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_01: And so now all of a sudden it's like I'm actively empowering my brain, my nervous system to engage it rather than just being this idle consumer.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_01: Because you're not idle at all.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_01: And you just said it.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_01: My brain's constantly going, I can't turn this off.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's something that somebody listening should should lean into of like, how can I turn on being being a student of this game?
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_00: That's a dangerous thing that you said is uh setting time to intentionally, intentionally brain rot or intentionally social media with the with the idea that you're doing it productively, because some people can justify destructive actions by saying by by justifying that they're productive, right?
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_00: And that's the that's the biggest argument of LinkedIn is people say this isn't Facebook when someone posts a selfie, right?
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_00: And they're like, I don't use social media that's beneath me, right?
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_00: But you've got these guys, Kyle, that are in their desk.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_00: And if you actually look at their screen time, like they might be spending four or five hours a day at their job doom scrolling LinkedIn, but they can justify it because they're like, this is a business platform, it's professional.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_00: I'm learning things, I saved some PDFs, right?
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_00: And like, you're just you're no different than your kids on TikTok.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_00: You just won't admit it because you feel like you're better than them because you're on a professional platform.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_00: Just go look at the guy singing in the toilet, right?
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_00: So that one stuff.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_00: I think the easiest way to combat being a consumer of social media is to become a creator.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_00: And to become a creator, not just make stuff, but to shift your mindset into that of being a creator.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_00: And the best way to do that is to understand how things happen.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_00: So I used to work in uh video production, right?
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I worked on sets a lot.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_00: So now when I look at an ad, a commercial, when I look at a movie, I'm kind of broken in that I'm not watching the screen, I'm watching behind the screen and where the lights are, how they got this shot, where the camera is, do they do the audio afterwards, all of these things?
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_00: So I can figure, I'm like I'm dissecting it all, right?
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_00: And because of that, I'm not justifying watching all of the Batman movies in a row because I feel like Christopher Nolan's a great director, and I can be like, I'm not watching trash, I'm not watching Fast and Furious, I'm watching Christopher Nolan, right?
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_00: I'm actually figuring things out.
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I might use some of the shots in short form videos later because I picked those up.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: So if you understand the back end of something and how it works, and the best way to learn that is by doing, then when you're consuming all of the content, you will be able to turn your brain on, or in my case, not be able to turn it off, to try to figure out why did this stop my scroll?
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_00: Why did this become viral?
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_00: Why did it draw me to go comment something?
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_00: Not being like, oh, I got this idea of commenting something.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_00: And like, why did they make why did they make me want to comment?
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_01: Right?
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_01: Oof.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_01: So when you talk about justification though, usually you're justifying it to yourself, by yourself, in the solitude of your own mind.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I think you know, you ask about how do you combat that?
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_01: Me personally, is I hold myself accountable to other people.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, what have you learned?
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, what it in the time that you've spent in the last hour on LinkedIn, what have you learned?
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_01: What have you gained?
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_01: What are you working on?
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_01: Who are you reaching out to?
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_01: What type of messaging are you doing?
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's a tough question to ask a lot of people on LinkedIn.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's it's it's miserable, right?
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: And and that's the funny thing, because to your point, especially when amongst coaches and influencers, they're like, well, I'm growing my business.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_01: Growing my business.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_01: What does that mean?
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_01: That's super nebulous.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_01: That's a really ambiguous phrase to use.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_01: And versus I have marching orders.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_01: Every time I get on LinkedIn, I know exactly what I'm doing.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_01: I have a whole process.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_01: There's a standard operating procedure for what I'm doing, how I'm doing it.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_01: And as soon as I notice I do this, even a few times, like I have triggers in my own mind of like, nope, not scrolling.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_01: Not working on my business.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, we're not working on our business.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_00: You need to show up with intention.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_00: You show up with intention, you have good results, right?
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like the people that go to the gym and they're just like, la la la, they're at the gym.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, you're you're doing the right thing.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_00: You're at step one, that's good.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_00: But like, if you show up with a plan, you don't deviate from that plan, the results you're gonna get are going to be exponential, like they're gonna be insane.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and that's that's a part of increase the likelihood of success.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_01: And if you go to the gym every day, you are gonna increase the likelihood that you get healthier, but it's still just a percentage likelihood, which means that you still have a percentage chance of not getting healthier.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_01: And which one is outweighing the other?
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_01: And then and to that same extent of like, are you just on LinkedIn?
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_01: Then yeah, no, you're not gonna be successful by just existing there.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_01: Commenting with your friends, or are you are you showing up and I I like what you said about becoming a creator of what are you building?
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_01: What are you creating?
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_01: And honestly, feeling that discomfort of you actually can't appreciate uh what Christopher Nolan does as much as the person who's tried or tried to write a script or tried to film something, or to get of of a video composition done.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_01: You're just not gonna appreciate it the same way until you participate in the art, in the craft.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_01: And so for every keyboard warrior who clackity clack clack, this is in Facebook, it's like what have you created recently?
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: What have you put out there that is actually meaningful?
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_01: And not just say this isn't this is in Facebook, but this also isn't Twitter either.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_01: So your your little 30-second rant about LinkedIn not being Facebook is like this feels that feels like Twitter.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_01: So this isn't Twitter either.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's really easy to not, it's really easy to not try, right?
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's a part of when people when people throw lob insults at you and mock and belittle, like that's actually a good moment to to celebrate of you are putting yourself out there.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_01: And the man in the arena is always is always more worthwhile because of the fact, and also the one that's more insulted, right?
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_01: Like you're they're lobbing flowers at the same moment that others are lobbing tomatoes and and moldy fruit.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_01: Being able to celebrate all of it because you're in the arena, and that by itself is is worthy of success or worthy of celebration.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_01: It's you.
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_01: As a commitment to staying on track on time, we are reaching the top of our time right now.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_01: Would love for you just to share what are you working on for somebody who's listening who wants to engage with you, where can they find you besides everywhere?
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I'm currently trying to grow my LinkedIn channel, so I'm funneling all attention to there because it was a new platform for me and it's pretty fun.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_00: It's a really cool community of people there, and I'm having a really good time trying to optimize and master the what I like to call the easiest social media platform to grow on the internet.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_00: It's pretty fun.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_00: I'm building a system for people to grow on LinkedIn from what I've learned over the past year.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't want to release anything yet, and I'm going to be offering that as a honestly pretty free service through LinkedIn itself because I think that a rising tide lifts all ships.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_00: And all platforms are getting tougher every day.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_00: Used to be able to just show up and see something happen, like the gym, but more people are showing up and the competition levels are getting higher.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_00: And what used to work last week might not work tomorrow.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_00: So I just want to see everyone grow and not get left behind.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_01: Love that, brother.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I appreciate you.
• 36:28
  SPEAKER_01: Appreciate the time.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_01: Looking forward to engaging with all of your content all the more, brother.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_01: Have a good rest of your day.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_01: You too.