Latest / Find Your Edge: Training, Nutrition + Longevity for Endurance Athletes / Open Water Swimming for Beginners with Author Hilary Topper Ep 164

Transcript

Open Water Swimming for Beginners with Author Hilary Topper Ep 164 · Find Your Edge: Training, Nutrition + Longevity for Endurance Athletes

0:38
Coach Carlie: All right, welcome back to the Find Your Edge podcast.
0:40
Coach Carlie: I am your host, Coach Chris Newport, and I have a guest who is back again with another book.
0:46
Coach Carlie: Hillary Topper.
0:48
Coach Carlie: Welcome back to the show.
0:49
Coach Carlie: Another book about Traplon.
0:51
Coach Carlie: I love it.
0:52
Coach Carlie: How's it going?
0:54
SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
0:54
SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for having me, Chris.
0:56
SPEAKER_01: Oh, it's going good.
0:57
SPEAKER_01: It's it's a little bit, it's a little busy over here, but otherwise it's good.
1:02
Coach Carlie: I cannot imagine.
1:03
Coach Carlie: Okay, so this is your third book.
1:05
Coach Carlie: The first one was Couch to Triathlete, right?
1:08
SPEAKER_00: It was called, yeah, From Couch Potato to Endurance Athlete, a portrait of a non-athletic triathlete.
1:16
SPEAKER_00: That was um more of a memoir of a 10-year journey from me like not doing anything until I was like 53, and then getting into triathlons and all the adventures and everything in between with life and all that.
1:34
Coach Carlie: Yeah, it's so cool.
1:36
Coach Carlie: Okay, and then the second book, which I'll be sure to link to below, that was what we had our session on, so which was a great book.
1:44
Coach Carlie: So tell us about that, and then we're gonna get to Yeah.
1:46
SPEAKER_00: So that was called Unlocking the Triathlon, and that was the beginner's guide to competing in a triathlon.
1:53
SPEAKER_00: And it gives you like all the nuts and bolts you need, you know, besides having a coach, of course.
1:59
Coach Carlie: Right, you know, but getting but having that in your we all have to start somewhere, and we're all the natural start is not always gonna be, and probably most people will not always be with a coach.
2:10
SPEAKER_00: You know, it's interesting, Chris, because when I first started in triathlon, my my running buddy, you know, we had we had um run the Brooklyn half marathon, and she said, I don't want to do this anymore.
2:24
SPEAKER_00: And I said, Let's do a triathlon, not knowing that it was a swim bike run, not knowing that I had to learn how to swim, you know, all of that.
2:32
SPEAKER_00: So um, you know, at that time she was like, Oh, we have to get a coach.
2:38
SPEAKER_00: There's just there's no questions about it.
2:41
SPEAKER_00: And I thought that was like the norm to get a coach.
2:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but as I'm learning and as I'm seeing and as I'm volunteering at some of these races, I'm realizing a lot of people don't have coaches, they just wing it.
2:54
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know, they'll sign up for a 70.3 and that'll be their first triathlon, one and done, you know?
3:01
Coach Carlie: Or one and then they call us.
3:04
Coach Carlie: That's when they're like, okay, that was really hard.
3:06
Coach Carlie: I got my rear end kicked, and I don't want it to be that hard.
3:09
Coach Carlie: And because this is so challenging and rewarding, and that's when that's when they call us and like, please, can you help me not die again?
3:20
SPEAKER_01: And they look, some of them look really like they were gonna die after like a sprint triathlon.
3:25
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, oh my God.
3:26
Coach Carlie: My preferred mode of triathlon is off-road, and I've even run into experienced on-road triathlons at an off-road triathlon, and they're like, I've never mountain bike before.
3:35
Coach Carlie: I'm like, what?
3:39
Coach Carlie: So, you know, but we all that I I don't know.
3:42
Coach Carlie: I I think sometimes when you fumble through things, that's when you're like, oh, okay, maybe I need a little support.
3:49
Coach Carlie: But again, when I started in the sport, I was going, I was pulling all the books off the shelves, like diving into all the training plans and like what do I wear?
3:59
Coach Carlie: I mean, you know, so your book is so valuable for everybody.
4:05
SPEAKER_00: So many questions.
4:06
Coach Carlie: Yes, for sure.
4:07
SPEAKER_00: A hundred percent.
4:08
SPEAKER_00: And the thing of my uh about the book that really makes me very proud is that it talks to anybody, like anybody could pick it up and say, Oh, I could do a triathlon.
4:21
SPEAKER_00: Like it's not just for these, you know, buff athletes, you know, it could anybody could do it.
4:28
Coach Carlie: Totally.
4:28
Coach Carlie: I I a hundred percent agree.
4:31
Coach Carlie: And if you are listening to this and you are like, oh, I have a neighbor who I would love to do a triathlon with, but she poo-poos the bike, or he doesn't think that he can swim or whatever.
4:43
Coach Carlie: Like that this that book is a hundred percent for them.
4:47
Coach Carlie: Yeah, it is it is totally possible.
4:49
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely, absolutely.
4:51
Coach Carlie: I wish that was around when I was you know, I didn't want to just I wish I had my own book.
4:57
Coach Carlie: That would have been okay.
4:58
Coach Carlie: Yes, absolutely.
5:00
Coach Carlie: Okay, and your third book, this is the most recent one.
5:03
Coach Carlie: It like literally just hit the books.
5:06
SPEAKER_01: Just hit the books in the stores.
5:09
SPEAKER_00: And it's um it's called Unlocking the Open Water Swim, and it's the beginner's guide to success in open water events.
5:20
SPEAKER_00: So this book is for triathletes, right, who maybe want to do um a 70.3 or a full Iron Man, but they feel like they're, you know, this is the weakest leg and they're not really sure how to do it.
5:37
SPEAKER_00: Or maybe it's a pool swimmer who says, you know, I'd like to go tap into the open water and do something a little bit, you know, outside my comfort zone.
5:49
SPEAKER_00: Or it's for a beginner triathlete who, you know, is doing a sprint triathlon.
5:55
SPEAKER_00: I do have training plans in here, and the training plans are more for, you know, the half R-man, R man, you know, 5K swim, 10k swim.
6:06
Coach Carlie: Ooh, okay, going big.
6:08
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, going big.
6:09
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
6:11
SPEAKER_00: You know, I mean, and the thing about the open water for me, uh, you know, I just started swimming at 53.
6:19
SPEAKER_00: So, you know, I I've only been swimming about 10, 11 years at this point.
6:25
SPEAKER_00: And there's something to me when I go into the open water, it's so special.
6:32
SPEAKER_00: Like I feel like there's this freedom that I don't get anywhere else.
6:37
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I get it a little bit on the bike, but this is much more like you could just go anywhere.
6:43
SPEAKER_00: There's no black lines, you could just do what you love to do and get out there and be in your happy place.
6:51
Coach Carlie: Yeah, totally.
6:52
SPEAKER_00: But that's not that's not the case for a lot of people.
6:55
Coach Carlie: No, I think that that is um, I mean, I'd have to look at some of the data, but I would argue that that's probably one of the number one reasons why people don't get into DRAFON.
7:05
SPEAKER_00: A hundred percent agree with you.
7:07
SPEAKER_00: A hundred percent agree that they're nervous, that they panic, that maybe they didn't have access to the water when they were growing up.
7:15
SPEAKER_00: Um, maybe something happened to them as a little child.
7:19
SPEAKER_00: You know, I have a story in the book about this woman, Melissa, who was actually in my swim group.
7:25
SPEAKER_00: She was in my course.
7:27
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
7:27
SPEAKER_00: And um sh I didn't know this at the time.
7:31
SPEAKER_00: She told me this later, like a couple of years later, yeah.
7:36
SPEAKER_00: That she, you know, was a swimmer as a child, but when she went with her husband on um uh vacation, they were he talked her into going diving, and she had a panic attack with the tube in her mouth, you know, when she went down, and she would never get she wouldn't go back in the water.
7:59
SPEAKER_00: And, you know, and then she, I mean, it wasn't really, you know, made me feel good.
8:04
SPEAKER_00: She she joined my group and we started out really, really slow, like behind the ropes, you know, just get used to the water.
8:13
SPEAKER_00: And every time that we met, we built up to the point where at the end of the session everybody swam a mile, and she was I can't even believe how kicked butt she was.
8:26
SPEAKER_00: I she was fantastic, she really was swimming fast, and you know, it you'd never know that she had this fear inside of her, you know.
8:37
Coach Carlie: Yeah, definitely.
8:39
Coach Carlie: I mean, and that that's why I do what I do, because you see grown adults who are literally terrified like a child, and that is a very vulnerable place to be.
8:53
Coach Carlie: I mean, I know you were saying get out of your comfort zone.
8:56
Coach Carlie: That's terrifying for a lot of people to to be like I literally feel like I might die.
9:04
Coach Carlie: Yeah, and I usually am joking with people like please don't say that, but that that's how they that's how they feel.
9:09
Coach Carlie: Like it's it can be incredibly intense and terrifying to go from that to holy smokes, I just did a triad on in the open water, it is next level mind-blowing, life transforming.
9:29
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
9:31
Coach Carlie: You have to do it, like you have to get Hillary's book, you have to find a group that you can train with, and get over it because you can, and it is it's so transformative.
9:43
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
9:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so you know, so in the book, right?
9:47
SPEAKER_00: I talk about you know, going from the pool to the open water, like what kind of drills you should do in the pool, you know, things like that.
9:56
SPEAKER_00: Like it I get very granular.
9:58
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I do talk also about some zones and stuff like that and kind of pick up speed, but then I also go into like adventure swimming versus competitive swimming, right?
10:10
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
10:10
SPEAKER_00: And I really enjoy the adventure swimming.
10:15
SPEAKER_00: Like I I just did uh last year, I swam around Mackinac Island in Michigan.
10:22
SPEAKER_00: It was an 8.2 mile swim, okay?
10:26
SPEAKER_00: And it's it's current, like you know, it's in a lake, but you know, you're getting the current because there's a lot of um the big great lakes, they're they're they're next to each other, you know.
10:37
SPEAKER_00: I think it's you know, so so you get that like turbulence going.
10:41
SPEAKER_00: And um that was an adventure swim, you know, it wasn't timed.
10:46
SPEAKER_00: I mean, they did say you have up to a certain amount of time to finish it, but it was plenty of, I mean, I think it was like they gave they gave everybody eight hours.
10:57
SPEAKER_00: It was plenty of time to do 8.3 miles, you know, 8.2 miles.
11:01
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
11:02
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
11:03
SPEAKER_00: And um, you know, I mean, it was it was really well organized and amazing experience, you know, for somebody like me.
11:14
SPEAKER_00: I mean, when I was 53, I hired a coach and he said, You have to take a master.
11:22
SPEAKER_00: Well, first he tells me I should get in the pool and swim 1600 yards.
11:27
SPEAKER_00: 1600 yards.
11:29
SPEAKER_00: I was like, I don't even think I could swim 25 yards, you know.
11:33
Coach Carlie: And I couldn't skip me to the wall.
11:35
SPEAKER_00: I couldn't, really.
11:37
SPEAKER_00: So um, so then I um he said, Well, you have to join a master swim class.
11:43
SPEAKER_00: So I did, and I just couldn't get across the pool like I was throwing up.
11:48
SPEAKER_00: I the the the water was going up my sinuses.
11:52
SPEAKER_00: I mean, it was like I was a mess.
11:54
SPEAKER_00: And the lifeguard jumped in the water with me, and he says, Come on, let's blow bubbles, you know.
12:00
SPEAKER_00: So, so just you know, visualize like here is a person that like almost 10 years ago, I didn't even know how to swim.
12:08
SPEAKER_00: And last year I swam 8.2 miles, you know.
12:12
SPEAKER_00: I mean, so so what I'm trying to say is not that I'm so great, but that anybody could do this.
12:19
Coach Carlie: Yes, it's totally possible.
12:22
Coach Carlie: Wow, that is that's so awesome.
12:26
Coach Carlie: So, again, going from nothing to open water is totally possible.
12:32
SPEAKER_00: Totally doable, totally possible.
12:35
SPEAKER_00: You can't think, oh my god, there's like fish in the water or there's sharks in the water or whatever, trout or like, are there alligators?
12:45
Coach Carlie: I'm like, no.
12:47
Coach Carlie: In Florida, diff be a different conversation.
12:49
Coach Carlie: Like it depends on where you are.
12:51
Coach Carlie: It does, but not at least not here in north in the central North Carolina.
12:55
Coach Carlie: You are not gonna have alligators.
12:57
Coach Carlie: But people have legitimate fears, yeah, right?
13:01
Coach Carlie: Of are there are there fish in the water?
13:03
Coach Carlie: Absolutely.
13:04
Coach Carlie: Do they want to have anything to do with you?
13:06
Coach Carlie: No, unless you stand still, and then they're gonna be like, what are you?
13:09
Coach Carlie: And then they're gonna take a little nibble and be like, nah, I'm good.
13:13
SPEAKER_01: Or the little cramps, you know, the little cramps they nibble on your toes.
13:17
Coach Carlie: Yeah, yeah.
13:19
Coach Carlie: Um, but I mean that's a good segue.
13:21
Coach Carlie: Like, there are things in the water.
13:26
Coach Carlie: So uh do you have anything of uh whether in the book or just in general, of how to overcome that fear of the creepy crawlies?
13:37
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, so a lot of so I have like a you know, a couple actually a couple of chapters on this, like on the whole mental thing, you know.
13:46
SPEAKER_00: And you know, it it it gets to a point where you first need to visualize yourself swimming out, just not even like in your home here, lying in bed, just think about yourself, visualize yourself swimming, and then once you're in the water, just take it nice and slow and just look around and experience the beauty of nature because it's gorgeous, it really is gorgeous.
14:20
SPEAKER_00: I mean, we are so blessed to live on the east coast.
14:23
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I'm sure the west coast, they've got great beaches too, but on the east coast, we we just have so much water and it's so beautiful here.
14:33
SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, and and I have a whole like checklist of what to do and how to, you know, how to kind of overcome that.
14:42
SPEAKER_00: And, you know, people have told me that it's really helped them, so that makes me feel really good, you know, and then I also have other like inspiring stories like throughout the book.
14:55
SPEAKER_00: I did it very similar to the triathlon book, Unlocking the Triathlon.
15:00
SPEAKER_00: I had a ton of stories, either elite athletes or or age groupers doing their first triathlon.
15:09
SPEAKER_00: In this book, it's more about like there was this one guy who lives in Egypt and he was a runner, and you know, they the doctors told him to stop running because of his knees and all of this, and he's they said, you know, get in the pool, you'll love it.
15:25
SPEAKER_00: And he ends up getting in the pool, and somebody told him about an open water event, and you know, he didn't think he could do it, and then he did it, and you know, so it to me like these stories are so motivational.
15:37
SPEAKER_00: There's another woman in this book who did the 20 bridges around Manhattan.
15:42
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god, I think it's like 28.5 miles.
15:46
SPEAKER_00: That is nuts, yeah, you know, and she she just she had COVID.
15:52
SPEAKER_00: She like, I mean, like, what?
15:54
SPEAKER_00: You and she did it.
15:57
SPEAKER_00: Like she just, you know, to me, like seeing these people like who have the courage because that's that too is very scary.
16:08
SPEAKER_00: Swimming around Manhattan in that water, I don't know.
16:12
Coach Carlie: You know, it's we could argue that's not so beautiful.
16:16
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
16:17
SPEAKER_00: I mean, it looks pretty from well from afar, maybe not.
16:21
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, unless you go really close, right?
16:23
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
16:24
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
16:25
Coach Carlie: I mean, it's it's a real thing.
16:27
Coach Carlie: And um I d we do have folks at least locally who uh when they swim in open water, which I would I would much rather swim.
16:35
Coach Carlie: I it this finally didn't dawn on me until probably about a year ago that of all three disciplines, I swim the least, and it is probably the lowest on my list, even though when I'm in the water, certainly in a race, I'm like, oh, I love this.
16:51
Coach Carlie: This is so great.
16:52
Coach Carlie: And it finally dawned on me that I just don't like swimming inside in a pool.
16:57
Coach Carlie: It's inside.
16:58
Coach Carlie: The reason why I chose triathlon is because it's outside.
17:01
Coach Carlie: I love that.
17:02
Coach Carlie: So we have an outdoor pool.
17:04
Coach Carlie: When I swim in the outdoor pool, I'm like, oh I do like this.
17:08
Coach Carlie: Or swim in the open water, which is a little bit more logistically challenging because please, you guys don't swim by yourself.
17:15
Coach Carlie: Right.
17:16
Coach Carlie: You know, have a kayak or a paddle boarder, swim with friends, like you've got to have some sort of like backup plan.
17:23
Coach Carlie: But uh Toboe.
17:25
Coach Carlie: And it's an atoboy, yes, yes.
17:28
Coach Carlie: Uh, so that you're visible to boats, to all the things, depending on where you're swimming.
17:33
Coach Carlie: But swimming around Manhattan, that's next level.
17:36
SPEAKER_00: That's totally next level.
17:38
SPEAKER_00: Totally.
17:39
SPEAKER_00: I swim when I swim, and it's really funny because we swim at this place called Tobey Beach, uh, which is on the base side.
17:47
SPEAKER_00: So it's like very narrow inlet.
17:49
SPEAKER_00: You get like a bay on one side and the ocean on the other.
17:53
SPEAKER_00: So, and it feeds from the ocean.
17:56
SPEAKER_00: So you still have a lot of current there.
17:59
SPEAKER_00: It's not, but it's a little bit more protected.
18:02
SPEAKER_00: Anyway, so when I go and I swim, I swim with this huge duck.
18:07
SPEAKER_00: Okay, and I put all my stuff in there.
18:10
SPEAKER_00: Like I put my hydration in there.
18:12
SPEAKER_00: Uh snacks.
18:13
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
18:14
SPEAKER_00: Snacks.
18:15
SPEAKER_00: Somebody said to me, I should I should just swim around and ask people, like, put beers in there and say, Yay.
18:23
Coach Carlie: You can be like a roving, yeah, it's like a roving uh, you know, like drink business or something.
18:29
SPEAKER_01: Maybe I could make a little money on the side.
18:34
Coach Carlie: Oh my goodness, that's so good.
18:36
Coach Carlie: Yeah, so be visible, I think, is is certainly one of the tips.
18:40
SPEAKER_00: Do you have any other tips for folks who are you know, also know your limits.
18:45
SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, if you're tired or you feel like you just can't keep going, like don't push yourself, like get out of the water.
18:54
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
18:55
SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, besides the toe buoy, I also like to wear like a bright swim cap so that I'm visible.
19:04
SPEAKER_00: Like that, I think is really important.
19:06
SPEAKER_00: You know, I think that a lot of people like to go in the water, in the cold water, you know, like now it's cold.
19:15
SPEAKER_00: Now we're we're getting, you know, it's no longer in the 70s anymore and the water we're getting in the 50s, like mid-50s here, you know, and it it's just gonna get colder.
19:26
SPEAKER_00: And some people go year-round, but for those, you know, like they moved Jones Beach, which is our big race over here, to the end of October, which is really gonna be freezing.
19:42
SPEAKER_00: It's gonna be, I mean, it was cold.
19:45
SPEAKER_00: I went out today, it was 45 degrees, it was cold, it was cold.
19:50
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
19:51
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I was wearing a little down jacket and I was thinking, hmm, it's time for the winter coat, like literally.
19:56
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
19:57
SPEAKER_00: So it just happened so fast because like last week was like 85.
20:01
SPEAKER_00: It's just nuts.
20:03
Coach Carlie: I know this weather is so bananas, yeah.
20:07
SPEAKER_00: But though, but when you're swimming in the in the cold water, you know, like I was telling you earlier before the the interview that I was I volunteered this weekend at a triathlon.
20:18
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
20:19
SPEAKER_00: And the uh open water segment was at in a pond in Montauk, which is all the way on the end of Long Island, and it's it's chilly out there, very chilly.
20:32
SPEAKER_00: Like it was it was 50 degrees when we got there.
20:35
SPEAKER_00: It was cold.
20:36
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
20:37
Coach Carlie: And to clarify, in the air, not in the water.
20:40
SPEAKER_00: No, yeah, exactly.
20:41
SPEAKER_00: The the air is cold.
20:43
SPEAKER_00: So, so um, I had, you know, so I was volunteering, I was walking around transition, and people were asking me, like one guy came up to me and he's just wearing like a little, you know, first of all, the tri-kit that he was wearing was too big for him, which I'm thinking to myself, like, oh yeah, yeah, you know, no, it should be skin tight, right?
21:04
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but um, he says, you know, I don't have a wetsuit and I've haven't done open water swimming yet at this point.
21:13
SPEAKER_00: Uh and I said, Well, what did you sign up for?
21:16
SPEAKER_00: He said, Well, the sprint, he said, Do you think I should drop down to like a uh duathlon?
21:23
SPEAKER_00: And you know, I'm a little bit more conservative, right?
21:26
SPEAKER_00: So I told him, I said, you know what?
21:28
SPEAKER_00: I really think you should drop down to it because if you've never been in the open water and you don't have a wetsuit and the water is cold, it was like, you know, low 60s.
21:39
Coach Carlie: That's very cold.
21:40
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
21:41
Coach Carlie: For never been on being in the open water and no wet suit.
21:44
SPEAKER_00: And and, you know, you could get that the a lot of a lot of these swimmers on these R Man events and stuff like that.
21:53
SPEAKER_00: Even we just had somebody who passed away during an Olympic event here on Long Island, and they had SIPE, which is swimming-induced pulmonary edema.
22:04
SPEAKER_00: And that comes from the cold.
22:06
SPEAKER_00: So the thing to do is to, you know, wet your face, wet your neck, make sure that you're acclimated to the water before you actually go in the water, you know, and I think that's, you know, a huge tip.
22:20
SPEAKER_00: If at any point you're in the water and you're swimming and you're choking, or you're like you feel like very phemmy, or you're like spitting up like a pink froth kind of thing, stop immediately.
22:35
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
22:35
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
22:36
SPEAKER_00: Cause that I I Just feel like people don't really know and they go and you're trained as lifeguards to look for that.
22:45
Coach Carlie: If somebody ends up on your board or on your kayak doing that, that is an immediate you're out.
22:51
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
22:51
Coach Carlie: That's not the ambulance.
22:55
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
22:55
Coach Carlie: And that's not to scare people, but like sport is inherently has a uh inherent danger to it.
23:03
Coach Carlie: And it doesn't matter whether you're doing triathlon or football or running or skateboarding or anything.
23:10
Coach Carlie: Anything like it's just that's but the joy it brings you and the positive health effects that it can bring you far outweigh the dangerous pieces like that, but it's still necessary to be aware of it, right?
23:24
SPEAKER_00: 100% agree.
23:25
SPEAKER_00: 100% agree.
23:26
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I I just feel like, you know, what happens as athletes, we tend to push ourselves through the pain.
23:35
SPEAKER_00: You know, we we get some type of a pain when we're, you know, when we're biking, we feel it in our quads or our hamstrings or wherever, and we push through it.
23:48
SPEAKER_00: And that's what we tend to do.
23:51
SPEAKER_00: And you know, in this particular case, like pe don't push through something like this, you know.
23:57
SPEAKER_00: I mean, sometimes it depends on what it is, but if it's something serious and it's a little, it's completely outside of what you're ex you've ever experienced.
24:10
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
24:11
SPEAKER_00: Caution there.
24:13
Coach Carlie: I mean, it's it's uh it's hard to balance that sort of like um the David Goggins' messages.
24:23
Coach Carlie: Um, and you know, I have nothing against him, but I it you have to balance what is it worth for you.
24:29
Coach Carlie: Right.
24:30
Coach Carlie: And um we all have a very unique journey and a unique path that we are here for, and sometimes DNF is part of that path and part of those lessons that we need to absorb and learn.
24:47
Coach Carlie: But that does not make you any less of a human being or any less of an athlete.
24:51
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely, right?
24:53
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I mean, I have a you know, I work with this guy who he's terrific.
25:00
SPEAKER_00: I mean, he keeps signing up for Iron Man, Eagle Man, and he keeps DNFing it, but he's gotten to the point where he goes through the swim, goes through the bike.
25:12
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, you know what?
25:13
SPEAKER_00: Just be proud of yourself.
25:15
SPEAKER_00: You got through two legs of this race.
25:17
SPEAKER_00: Be proud of yourself.
25:18
SPEAKER_00: Like that's it's a big deal.
25:22
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, it's look, we're all we're all in this together.
25:28
Coach Carlie: Yes, you know it's the it's the courage to show up, the courage to to sign up and to do the work.
25:36
Coach Carlie: And if that means you get across the finish line, great.
25:38
Coach Carlie: If that means you don't, great.
25:40
SPEAKER_00: And it's okay.
25:41
Coach Carlie: Yeah, it totally is.
25:43
SPEAKER_00: I I remember thinking like, oh, a DNF is like the worst thing that can ever happen.
25:48
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
25:49
SPEAKER_00: You know, and then I realized I actually DNF'd one of my races, and it was like, okay, I didn't die, I'm okay.
25:57
Coach Carlie: Yeah, yeah, totally.
26:00
Coach Carlie: Um, let's talk about a little bit of a channel change of gear, because I know we've mentioned it a little bit, and you know, our little ducky behind you or your both.
26:09
Coach Carlie: Oh my duck.
26:10
Coach Carlie: Wetsuits.
26:11
Coach Carlie: Yes.
26:12
Coach Carlie: Like there are, I feel like this is a this is an intense topic because it's not like, well, let me have to target and grab me a like there's there's can seem like there's a lot to it.
26:25
Coach Carlie: So tell us what you have about wetsuits.
26:28
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I have a whole section about wetsuits in the book.
26:31
SPEAKER_00: You know, there are different types of wetsuits.
26:34
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I probably have more than many, which is what I've done.
26:40
Coach Carlie: This is like this is like bikes in the you know, in the exactly, or sneakers, you know, you like have a million pairs of sneakers.
26:47
Coach Carlie: True.
26:47
Coach Carlie: I mean, like for me, I am in love with my shorty.
26:50
Coach Carlie: My shorty is my favorite wetsuit, but I also live in the south.
26:53
Coach Carlie: Hillary, I would probably not ever wear it if I lived where you lived.
26:57
Coach Carlie: Yeah, no, I actually sleeveless is great, a long sleeve is great, I have sleeves, I have gloves, I have a cap, I don't have booties, but anyway, tell us about that.
27:07
SPEAKER_00: You need the booties, you need the booties when it's cold.
27:10
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
27:11
SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, or when it's rocky, you know.
27:14
SPEAKER_00: I oh yeah, yeah.
27:15
SPEAKER_00: I I I wear them when it's rocky.
27:17
SPEAKER_00: I talk about all the different types, the shorty.
27:20
SPEAKER_00: I love the shorty too.
27:21
SPEAKER_00: That's no sleeve and short shorts.
27:24
SPEAKER_00: Some people even wear lava pants, you know, or lava shorts too, you know, when they swim, which I, you know, I I I'm not I don't feel comfortable with that.
27:34
SPEAKER_00: It's just to me, it's a little too low down.
27:37
SPEAKER_00: You know, they make them they make them kind of like low.
27:41
SPEAKER_00: Um and I'd prefer something that's just, you know, my whole suit.
27:46
SPEAKER_00: Your whole torso.
27:47
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
27:47
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly.
27:48
Coach Carlie: But I would, I would I feel like that's more popular with men.
27:51
Coach Carlie: I have zero data on that, other than what I've seen and what I've experienced.
27:55
Coach Carlie: Men tend to uh yeah, as there's men who are getting into this sport oftentimes later in life, um, God love you, but uh sometimes you're a little more dense.
28:07
Coach Carlie: Yeah, and you you sink a little bit more.
28:09
Coach Carlie: Oh, yeah.
28:09
Coach Carlie: You just need a little bit of a little bit of a lift in your hips.
28:12
Coach Carlie: So lava shorts to explain real quickly what lava shorts is, because I feel like I'm talking to my son right now.
28:18
Coach Carlie: Like the literal word of this does not sound anything like what it is.
28:25
Coach Carlie: So explain that.
28:27
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, you know, you can you you there's a lot of different terminology, right, for it, like this, the lava shorts, there's a sim uh shorts there.
28:35
SPEAKER_00: Basically, what they are is they're made out of wetsuit material, and they are shorts that you wear that keep you buoyant.
28:44
SPEAKER_00: And you're right.
28:46
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I I know a lot of I train with a lot of guys, and they tend to sink in the pool, but in the open water, they wear their wetsuit, they're flying.
28:58
SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's it's insane.
29:00
Coach Carlie: It's magical.
29:00
Coach Carlie: Yeah, yeah.
29:01
Coach Carlie: Wetsuits are so great.
29:03
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
29:03
SPEAKER_00: I mean, for me, I don't know.
29:05
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't really do that much.
29:07
SPEAKER_00: I don't know because I'm pretty like level when I when it comes to the pool.
29:12
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
29:12
Coach Carlie: So, but for you gotta do some pillary, we gotta do some like time trials.
29:16
Coach Carlie: You're gonna have to test it out.
29:17
Coach Carlie: Although it's probably hard with like more current and things like that, is to try is it a one-to-one comparison?
29:25
SPEAKER_00: The problem, right, is that you know, what you said is that there is current.
29:30
SPEAKER_00: And, you know, I often and I actually have a chapter in the book about why is it that you swim faster in the pool than you do in the open water?
29:39
SPEAKER_00: You know, now some people do swim faster in the open water, but most I've not met many of them.
29:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
29:46
SPEAKER_00: Most do not.
29:48
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
29:48
SPEAKER_00: And and and that bothered me for a really long time because I would be like, you know, in the pool, I'd be like averaging like 150 or something like that.
29:57
SPEAKER_00: I mean, not a fast swimmer, but whatever.
30:00
SPEAKER_00: And a 150 to 100.
30:02
SPEAKER_00: And then in the open water, it would be like 215 or 230 to 100.
30:07
SPEAKER_00: And it's like, what?
30:08
SPEAKER_00: You know, like you start like thinking, like, what's going on here?
30:12
SPEAKER_00: Why is this happening?
30:13
SPEAKER_00: But it's it really has to do with the current, it has to do with uh the water temperature, it has to do with the stroke, you know, when to shorten your stroke, when to elongate your stroke.
30:26
SPEAKER_00: You know, there's so many different elements that are involved here.
30:32
Coach Carlie: Yeah, cool.
30:33
Coach Carlie: So it sounds like in the book you have led people who want to get into Trafalon, certainly some more long course kind of things, but also some open water long course.
30:46
Coach Carlie: And then getting into all the gear aspects and um exactly stroke, all kinds of all kinds of fun stuff, and also like how to find events.
30:56
SPEAKER_00: I was thinking, oh, I really love swimming and I want to get into more swimming events.
31:01
SPEAKER_00: How do you how do you go about finding them?
31:04
SPEAKER_00: You know, so I have a whole chapter on that, like where to look, where to, you know, and that's and that's great.
31:11
SPEAKER_00: I've done um swim to the moon a couple of times.
31:13
SPEAKER_00: That's Eva Solomon.
31:15
SPEAKER_00: She's with Epic Races in Middle East.
31:18
Coach Carlie: Oh, yeah, cool.
31:19
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and that's a beautiful, beautiful swim.
31:23
SPEAKER_00: It's a lake swim, but it's got like connecting, it's it's got like little like tunnels and connectors to different lakes, you know.
31:32
Coach Carlie: So cool.
31:33
SPEAKER_00: It's so beautiful, and that's like I've done that twice, and I absolutely love those swims.
31:41
Coach Carlie: So cool.
31:41
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
31:42
Coach Carlie: So there's basically if you can get into open water swimming, you not only can unlock Triathon, but now you've got a whole nother world to explore.
31:53
Coach Carlie: And we didn't even talk about swim run, you know, right?
31:57
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
31:57
Coach Carlie: Which is one of my favorites.
31:59
Coach Carlie: But aqua bike, which or aquabike, yeah, yes.
32:02
SPEAKER_01: A lot of people do.
32:04
Coach Carlie: Mm-hmm.
32:04
Coach Carlie: Yeah, who are like, no, screw running.
32:06
Coach Carlie: I don't want to ever do that.
32:08
Coach Carlie: Um, so yeah, I it's it's a whole new world, and uh, which reminds me I crewed someone who did the alligator eight-mile swim down in uh like the keys area.
32:24
Coach Carlie: Yeah, that was that was no joke for me on the kayak or the swimmer.
32:30
Coach Carlie: Well, were you on the kayak or board?
32:32
Coach Carlie: I was on the kayak.
32:33
Coach Carlie: It was like a beautiful day to start with, and then you get out there and then things start to pick up.
32:39
Coach Carlie: And then uh he was my swimmer was having kind of a rough time and then ended up having to get picked up.
32:44
Coach Carlie: And in the meantime, you know, like dealing with the boats, and I did not take any tramine that morning.
32:50
Coach Carlie: And so anyway, um, some fish got my breakfast.
32:54
Coach Carlie: Uh, but it's fine.
32:55
Coach Carlie: We all made it.
32:56
Coach Carlie: See, we uh we all survived.
32:59
Coach Carlie: So uh, you know, the life of a support crew, but yeah, man, that was that was no joke.
33:06
SPEAKER_00: I mean, oh there are a lot of those swims out there.
33:10
SPEAKER_00: Like somebody sent me, uh one of my swimmers sent me a swim from St.
33:16
SPEAKER_00: Lucia to St.
33:17
SPEAKER_00: Kitts.
33:18
Coach Carlie: Oh, um, sign me up, please.
33:21
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god, can you imagine that?
33:23
SPEAKER_00: It's like probably so gorgeous, you know.
33:26
SPEAKER_00: You could see right through, you could see the turtles.
33:29
SPEAKER_00: I actually I raced once in um in St.
33:33
SPEAKER_00: John and the water that was in.
33:37
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I saw turtles floating by, you know, it's just like, oh my god, this is insane how gorgeous this is.
33:44
Coach Carlie: Yeah.
33:45
Coach Carlie: Oh, okay.
33:47
Coach Carlie: So swim cations, I think, or is that what we're officially gonna call them?
33:52
Coach Carlie: I like it.
33:52
Coach Carlie: Yeah, swim cation.
33:53
Coach Carlie: Like, and here's the beauty of it, especially coming from Traffon, where I literally have to consult my checklist every single time.
34:02
Coach Carlie: I raced this past weekend and I had my son read my checklist off to me as I was like packing my bag.
34:08
Coach Carlie: And you know, I've been doing this for over 25 years, and I still have to go with the you know, it's like swimming.
34:14
Coach Carlie: You're like, goggles, check wetsuit, check.
34:18
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I actually have like a whole list in the book of uh race day essentials, and then like also I have you know, if you're kayaking for somebody, yes, what to bring with you.
34:33
Coach Carlie: I could have used that, Hillary.
34:35
Coach Carlie: Come on, yeah.
34:37
Coach Carlie: It's a whole because you have to you have to hang out for, you know, it's not a short while to do it's a it's 10 miles.
34:47
SPEAKER_00: It's you're hanging out for a while, yeah, yeah, a long while.
34:52
Coach Carlie: Yeah, definitely yeah, um, okay, Hillary, anything else we missed about this amazing new book that you have coming out?
35:03
SPEAKER_00: Um, just where to order it.
35:05
SPEAKER_00: You know, you could get it on Amazon, Barnes and Noble.
35:10
SPEAKER_00: You can go into your independent bookstore and ask for it.
35:13
SPEAKER_00: You know, it is available through Ingram.
35:16
SPEAKER_00: Um, that's like the service I think they all use.
35:20
SPEAKER_00: And uh I'm gonna be doing a little book tour, not as big as the last one, but I'll be doing a couple of stops on Long Island and then going out to Colorado for a week.
35:31
Coach Carlie: So cool.
35:31
Coach Carlie: Okay, so a little behind the scenes here.
35:34
Coach Carlie: What is so what was that like?
35:36
Coach Carlie: You went to you went to Colorado and you went to Austin, and what is it like doing a book tour?
35:42
Coach Carlie: I mean, we gotta hear uh like the the real deal.
35:45
SPEAKER_00: Like it was so tiring.
35:47
SPEAKER_00: I mean, it was great meeting people, like I met so many people that I that I am friendly with on social media, you know.
35:54
SPEAKER_00: You get we all like become part of this community, and I love that about triathlon, you know, it's like we're all like the same kind of people, yeah.
36:04
SPEAKER_00: And um, so I um I it was just really tiring and it was a lot of work and trying to get people, and you know, there were times when I had, you know, like I don't know, 30 people, and then there were times when absolutely nobody showed up.
36:21
Coach Carlie: Oh man, I mean it's you know, it's a it's a it's a niche subject.
36:28
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
36:28
Coach Carlie: Um, but I feel like we are losing touch with each other, and this is an opportunity to actually connect and ask real questions and and uh do real human contact things.
36:49
Coach Carlie: That might have sounded weird.
36:50
Coach Carlie: Don't take it.
36:51
SPEAKER_00: But it is, it's true, it's so true with social media, you know, we we l lose sight of those connections, you know.
37:00
SPEAKER_00: We we get so we think like you know, that this online world is a real world, but it's really not a real world.
37:09
SPEAKER_00: But the nice thing about it is that when you do meet people in the real world, like and I met so many people that I'm so friendly with on on social that I just it was fantastic for me.
37:23
SPEAKER_00: I love that.
37:24
Coach Carlie: Good, okay, very cool.
37:26
Coach Carlie: All right, so this is gonna be a mini book tour, right?
37:29
Coach Carlie: Mini book tour, yeah.
37:30
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I might be doing a couple of other things, you know.
37:33
SPEAKER_00: I'm I'm kind of like scouting the waters, but yeah, it's gonna be a little mini tour.
37:38
SPEAKER_00: I was, you know, thinking of targeting uh different race companies and stuff like that, like for first drivers, you know, that type of thing.
37:46
Coach Carlie: That yeah, Hillary, you are always welcome at our Humans to Steal uh trath on every August, where it is hotter than blazes, but um we do a reverse trathon, which is even more intimidating.
38:00
Coach Carlie: Wow, yes, so run, bike, swim.
38:03
Coach Carlie: And the reason part of the reason why I did that is because aqua bikers have they get the total shaft.
38:09
Coach Carlie: They swim and then they bike and then they end up in transition, which is so anticlimate.
38:13
Coach Carlie: Like everybody deserves a finish line, but it is hard to swim last.
38:19
Coach Carlie: And I know I've got so many people who are like, there's a reason why the swim is first.
38:22
Coach Carlie: I'm like, no, there's not.
38:23
Coach Carlie: Yeah, like look into the history of the sport, like nope, that's not.
38:28
Coach Carlie: Yeah, um, and in fact, from a race logistic perspective, um, you're going to have the most issues at the very first part of the race.
38:38
Coach Carlie: When most people are like, like you had described, I've never done open water before.
38:43
Coach Carlie: And I am around all these other people, and it's cold or it's hot or whatever the situation might be, and they panic.
38:50
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
38:50
Coach Carlie: Right.
38:51
Coach Carlie: So um anyway, all that to say, you're welcome to offer if you want to hang out in August in North Carolina, which is dream.
39:02
Coach Carlie: So cool.
39:03
Coach Carlie: All right, Hillary.
39:04
Coach Carlie: So we can order the book um from our favorite retailer, right?
39:08
Coach Carlie: Love it.
39:09
Coach Carlie: Unlocking the open water swim.
39:11
Coach Carlie: So good, so excited for you.
39:14
Coach Carlie: Thank you for um supporting the sport in this way and supporting our community in this way because I think that just like your message is is that everybody can do this, no matter what your age, your gender, your uh ability.
39:34
Coach Carlie: Like it's totally possible.
39:36
Coach Carlie: So anything anything else you want to leave us with, Hilary.
39:40
SPEAKER_00: I just appreciate you and I appreciate your audience for listening in.
39:44
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, I'm always available.
39:47
SPEAKER_00: If anybody has any questions, you can find me on Instagram.
39:50
Coach Carlie: Cool.
39:51
Coach Carlie: All right, so and I'll be sure to link to that uh in the show notes too.
39:55
SPEAKER_00: Terrific.
39:55
SPEAKER_00: Cool.
39:55
SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
39:56
Coach Carlie: Hilary Tapper, so excited that you came back on.
39:59
Coach Carlie: I truly appreciate you.
40:00
Coach Carlie: Thanks for writing the book and good luck with the book tour.
40:03
SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
40:03
SPEAKER_00: Thank you very much.