Latest / Wicked and Grim: A True Crime Podcast / Halloween Week: The Lady of Raynham Hall

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Halloween Week: The Lady of Raynham Hall · Wicked and Grim: A True Crime Podcast

0:29
Speaker 1: Ah, day three. How delightful. You know, there is something
0:35
Speaker 1: rather peculiar about Halloween. As the days grow shorter and
0:41
Speaker 1: the nights become longer, the world begins to feel a
0:46
Speaker 1: little less familiar. The shadows seem to stretch just a
0:51
Speaker 1: little farther, and the wind whispers things we cannot quite understand.
0:58
Speaker 1: And sometimes, sometimes you get the feeling something's watching you
1:05
Speaker 1: from the darkness. But you know what I find the
1:09
Speaker 1: most fascinating about you mortals? Your peculiar fascination with fear.
1:15
Speaker 1: You spend your entire lives trying to avoid it. You
1:20
Speaker 1: lock your doors at night. You look both ways before
1:24
Speaker 1: crossing the street. And you do everything in your power
1:28
Speaker 1: to keep danger at a comfortable distance. And yet, you
1:34
Speaker 1: gather around campfires to tell stories of monsters. You watch
1:39
Speaker 1: films that make you hide behind your hands. And you
1:44
Speaker 1: listen to tales of murder. Madness. And things that go
1:51
Speaker 1: bump in the night. All for your own amusement. Oh,
1:58
Speaker 1: what wonderfully strange creatures you are. But perhaps that is
2:05
Speaker 1: the beauty of Halloween, my friends. For one glorious evening.
2:12
Speaker 1: You don't have to run from the things you're frightened of.
2:15
Speaker 2: Instead.
2:17
Speaker 1: you get to invite them in. Ladies, gentlemen, theys and thems,
2:24
Speaker 1: my name is Jacko, your ever so charming master of ceremonies,
2:30
Speaker 1: and I welcome you back to day three of Wicked
2:33
Speaker 1: and Grim's Halloween week. You've already enjoyed two deliciously dreadful tales,
2:41
Speaker 1: and I assure you, the wickedness is far from over.
2:47
Speaker 1: So settle in, dim those lights, and perhaps take one
2:53
Speaker 1: last look over your shoulder. You never know what might
2:57
Speaker 1: be lurking just out of sight. Now, my dear friends,
3:03
Speaker 1: it is my absolute pleasure to welcome you back to
3:07
Speaker 1: the two souls responsible for all this magnificent madness. Your
3:13
Speaker 1: hosts of Wicked and Grim, the Delightfully Wicked, Ben and Nicole.
3:22
Speaker 3: Day three.
3:23
Speaker 2: It's day three. Already day three. I can't believe we're
3:27
Speaker 2: already here.
3:27
Speaker 3: And if you'd like to live vicariously through us, it's snowing.
3:30
Speaker 2: It is.
3:31
Speaker 3: So it actually feels more like, dare I say.
3:34
Speaker 2: Don't, don't, don't say it. Don't say it.
3:36
Speaker 3: Rather than Halloween.
3:37
Speaker 2: No, it feels... Look outside. It's like the slightest drift of...
3:42
Speaker 2: It's like dandruff coming down. It's barely snow.
3:45
Speaker 3: That's a terrible way of describing that.
3:47
Speaker 2: That's exactly why I use that term because it's like
3:50
Speaker 2: creepy and gross outside, you know?
3:52
Speaker 1: Yeah.
3:52
Speaker 2: It's gloomy. It's not snow. It looks dreadful. So I
3:56
Speaker 2: think it's very Halloween.
3:57
Speaker 3: Okay. Well, Halloween in... A northern community.
4:02
Speaker 2: In our community, yes. That's absolutely for sure.
4:05
Speaker 3: Because I think other communities would be like, the what
4:08
Speaker 3: is happening?
4:09
Speaker 2: Yes. No, this time of year is not so much
4:12
Speaker 2: expected for many people. But even still for us, it's
4:14
Speaker 2: not going to stick around. Even if it accumulates on
4:17
Speaker 2: the ground, it'll be gone within a day.
4:20
Speaker 3: Oh, yeah.
4:20
Speaker 2: We'll have our Halloween.
4:22
Speaker 3: I'm sure we've talked about this many times. But yeah,
4:25
Speaker 3: being a kid growing up here wasn't always the best
4:27
Speaker 3: because you're like, this awesome princess or something, but then
4:30
Speaker 3: you put like your snowsuit underneath it or a winter jacket.
4:34
Speaker 1: Right.
4:34
Speaker 3: So it just kind of like, it was different. It's different.
4:38
Speaker 2: It wrecked the vibe.
4:39
Speaker 1: Yeah.
4:39
Speaker 2: Like I remember being a pirate one year and I'm like,
4:42
Speaker 2: pirates don't wear snowsuits. Like why is a pirate wearing
4:45
Speaker 2: a jacket over his cut up striped shirt and sword?
4:48
Speaker 3: So you don't freeze to death.
4:50
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah.
4:52
Speaker 3: It's kind of funny though. It's just, yeah, it's just funny. Wow.
4:55
Speaker 2: Anyways, I'm going to stop reminiscing about the time when
4:57
Speaker 2: I was a child and had to go knocking on
4:59
Speaker 2: doors for a candy. And now I'm going to think
5:01
Speaker 2: about the times being an adult and I can just
5:02
Speaker 2: go buy it myself.
5:04
Speaker 1: Yeah.
5:04
Speaker 2: Because it's much better that way.
5:05
Speaker 3: You just have a bowl full of sitting right beside you.
5:08
Speaker 1: Yeah.
5:08
Speaker 2: And if I run out, I can just go get
5:09
Speaker 2: more instead of having to go door to door.
5:12
Speaker 3: Oh, my gosh.
5:13
Speaker 2: We do want to say one thing today, though. Thank
5:15
Speaker 2: you for our Patreons who signed up this week. But
5:17
Speaker 2: with Halloween week being as hectic as it is, we're
5:20
Speaker 2: not going to do shout outs this week being today, Tuesday.
5:23
Speaker 2: So next Tuesday is when you're going to get your
5:26
Speaker 2: shout out. So just a heads up on that. We're
5:28
Speaker 2: going to keep rolling through and keep doing Halloween week
5:30
Speaker 2: for now.
5:31
Speaker 3: We haven't forgotten. It's coming.
5:33
Speaker 2: It is coming. But I think we need to get
5:35
Speaker 2: into this story today because I have a very interesting
5:38
Speaker 2: tale for you. A ghost tale. One that involves a
5:42
Speaker 2: very famous photograph.
5:43
Speaker 3: Ooh, I'm intrigued.
5:45
Speaker 2: I figured since you're Miss Photographer and everything, that might
5:48
Speaker 2: pique your attention.
5:50
Speaker 3: Miss Photographer. You are.
5:51
Speaker 2: You're Miss Photographer.
5:52
Speaker 3: Okay.
5:53
Speaker 2: So the tale today is the tale of the Lady
5:57
Speaker 2: of Rainham Hall.
5:58
Speaker 3: Ooh, okay. Let's get into this.
6:01
Speaker 2: Let's do it. In the English countryside of Norfolk, roughly
6:05
Speaker 2: 100 miles northeast of London, stands Rainham Hall, a sprawling
6:10
Speaker 2: country estate that has been home to the influential Townsend
6:14
Speaker 2: family for more than four centuries. The property covers approximately 7,000
6:21
Speaker 2: acres of farmland, woodland, and countryside, with the River Wensum
6:26
Speaker 2: passing through portions of the estate. And for much of
6:29
Speaker 2: its history, Rainham Hall was associated with some of the
6:33
Speaker 2: wealthiest and most powerful political families in England. In fact,
6:39
Speaker 2: the estate's origin dates back to 1619, when Sir Roger Townshend,
6:44
Speaker 2: an English landowner and politician, began planning a grand residence
6:49
Speaker 2: for his family. Construction was restarted on a different site
6:54
Speaker 2: in 1622, and by the time Roger died in 1637,
6:57
Speaker 2: the main structure had been completed. The imposing red brick
7:02
Speaker 2: mansion was unusually modern for its time, incorporating architectural ideas
7:07
Speaker 2: influenced by European country houses rather than traditional English manor
7:12
Speaker 2: houses that had become very prominent before it. And over
7:17
Speaker 2: the following century, Rainham Hall continued to grow into something
7:22
Speaker 2: that was much more larger, both in size and importance.
7:26
Speaker 2: Its owners accumulated considerable political influence, while the building itself
7:31
Speaker 2: became known for its impressive interiors, valuable artworks, and elaborate furnishings.
7:37
Speaker 2: And among the family's associates with Rainham Hall were the Walpoles,
7:43
Speaker 2: another prominent Norfolk family whose political connections extended into the
7:47
Speaker 2: highest levels of British government. On her family estates at
7:52
Speaker 2: Hewton in Norfolk, Dorothy Walpole was born in 1686, one
7:58
Speaker 2: of the many children of Colonel Robert Walpole and his wife,
8:02
Speaker 2: Mary Burwell. Her father was a landowner and politician who
8:07
Speaker 2: represented Castle Rising in Parliament, while her older brother, Robert Walpole,
8:12
Speaker 2: would eventually become one of the most influential political figures
8:15
Speaker 2: in British history. Now, Dorothy grew up surrounded by considerable
8:20
Speaker 2: wealth and privilege here, receiving the kind of upbringing expected
8:24
Speaker 2: of a young woman from a very aristocratic family. Later
8:28
Speaker 2: descriptions portray her as beautiful, charming, sociable, and particularly fond
8:34
Speaker 2: of very fashionable clothing. She reportedly enjoyed expensive fabrics and
8:39
Speaker 2: and fine dresses alike, something that would eventually be reflected
8:42
Speaker 2: in the family's surviving financial records. As a young woman,
8:47
Speaker 2: Dorothy became acquainted with Charles Townshend, 2nd Viscount Townshend, a
8:52
Speaker 2: powerful political individual born in 1674. Charles had inherited his
8:59
Speaker 2: family's position and wealth at a very young age, and
9:02
Speaker 2: his political career eventually brought him into close contact with
9:06
Speaker 2: Dorothy's brother. Reportedly, Dorothy and Charles developed romantic feelings for
9:11
Speaker 2: one another, although Dorothy's father initially opposed their eventual marriage.
9:16
Speaker 2: And as Charles' guardian, he reportedly feared that allowing a
9:19
Speaker 2: relationship would appear improper given his responsibility for the young
9:24
Speaker 2: nobleman's affairs. So Charles instead married Lady Elizabeth Pelham, with
9:30
Speaker 2: whom he had several children. And Elizabeth died in 1711,
9:33
Speaker 2: leaving Charles a widower. Then, on July 6th, 1713, Charles
9:39
Speaker 2: married Dorothy, making her his second wife and the new
9:43
Speaker 2: Viscountess Townsend. Their marriage brought together two politically influential Norfolk families,
9:51
Speaker 2: but their personal relationship was reportedly far more complicated. Charles
9:56
Speaker 2: was known for his formidable temper and could be very
9:59
Speaker 2: difficultly to live with. He was also intensely proud of
10:03
Speaker 2: Rainham Hall, regarding the estate as a reflection of the
10:07
Speaker 2: family's standings. According to an observation attributed to Lord Hervey,
10:12
Speaker 2: Charles even resented the growing splendor of the Walpole's family
10:17
Speaker 2: neighboring estates at Hewton Hall, viewing its improvements as diminishing
10:21
Speaker 2: Rainham's importance. Dorothy, meanwhile, was said to enjoy an expensive lifestyle,
10:28
Speaker 2: but another issue reportedly complicated their marriage. You see, before
10:32
Speaker 2: marrying Charles, Dorothy was rumored to have been romantically involved
10:37
Speaker 2: with Lord Worlton, a politically connected aristocrat notorious for his
10:42
Speaker 2: relationships with women. Exactly what happened between Dorothy and him
10:46
Speaker 2: remains uncertain, but according to the legends, Charles eventually learned
10:51
Speaker 2: of that alleged relationship and became furious. So the story goes,
10:56
Speaker 2: Charles responded by restricting Dorothy's movements within Ringham Hall, eventually
11:01
Speaker 2: confining her to rooms and preventing her from even seeing
11:04
Speaker 2: her children. Their upbringing was reportedly then entrusted to their grandmother,
11:09
Speaker 2: leaving Dorothy separate from the family that she was said
11:12
Speaker 2: to have loved very deeply.
11:14
Speaker 3: What the heck? Because she wasn't allowed to have a
11:17
Speaker 3: relationship with... while he was married to someone else and
11:21
Speaker 3: having kids and stuff?
11:22
Speaker 2: Exactly. But the problem is, I don't know if she
11:27
Speaker 2: was seeing him only before their marriage or if their
11:31
Speaker 2: relationship continued on into the marriage that Dorothy had with Charles.
11:36
Speaker 3: Okay. Then that would be a problem. Yes.
11:38
Speaker 2: That would be a problem. But I mean, it's so
11:40
Speaker 2: muddled and a lot of this- It's very personal affair stuff,
11:45
Speaker 2: so it's not documented. So there's not a whole lot
11:47
Speaker 2: of actual history regarding it. So it's a lot of
11:50
Speaker 2: hearsay and legend and as the story goes sort of situation.
11:53
Speaker 1: Right.
11:54
Speaker 3: Okay.
11:54
Speaker 2: But allegedly, they had a relationship prior to, you know,
11:58
Speaker 2: Dorothy and Charles getting married. And then Charles found out
12:00
Speaker 2: about that once they were married and was furious. That's
12:04
Speaker 2: all I know.
12:05
Speaker 3: Okay. Interesting.
12:07
Speaker 2: Now, Dorothy's life ended relatively young. And in 1726, at
12:10
Speaker 2: approximately 39 years old, Dorothy died at Rainham Hall. The
12:16
Speaker 2: recorded cause of her death was smallpox, a highly contagious
12:19
Speaker 2: and frequently fatal disease that caused fever, severe illness, and
12:24
Speaker 2: distinctive blistering rashes. She was buried, and Charles continued his
12:29
Speaker 2: political career and his life at Rainham Hall. Then over
12:33
Speaker 2: the decades following her death, Rainham Hall remained in the
12:36
Speaker 2: possession of the Townshend family. Charles Townshend continued living at
12:40
Speaker 2: the estates until his own death in 1738. and ownership
12:44
Speaker 2: eventually passed through subsequent generations of the family. As the
12:48
Speaker 2: years went by, however, stories began circulating about strange encounters
12:53
Speaker 2: within the mansion, particularly involving a mysterious woman who supposedly
12:58
Speaker 2: wandered its corridors and bedrooms. One of the earliest stories
13:03
Speaker 2: involves a member of the British royal family. According to
13:08
Speaker 2: an account that later became part of Ringham Hall's Folklore, George,
13:12
Speaker 2: Prince Regent, the future King George IV, supposedly visited the
13:17
Speaker 2: estate sometime around 1815, and during his stay he was
13:21
Speaker 2: reportedly awakened in the middle of the night by the
13:25
Speaker 2: presence of a woman standing beside his bed. The woman
13:29
Speaker 2: was dressed in old-fashioned brown clothing, with disheveled hair and
13:33
Speaker 2: an unsettling appearance. Some versions described her leaning over the
13:37
Speaker 2: bed close enough even for George to see her face.
13:41
Speaker 2: And the encounter supposedly frightened him so badly that he
13:44
Speaker 2: immediately abandoned his visit, declaring that he would never return.
13:48
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I'm pretty sure that he probably also shit himself.
13:51
Speaker 2: There's a high possibility of that. Then at Christmas, the
13:55
Speaker 2: estate's owner, Lord Charles Townsend, hosted a gathering of family
13:59
Speaker 2: members and guests. And among those staying at the mansion
14:03
Speaker 2: were a military officer identified in various accounts as Major
14:06
Speaker 2: or Colonel Loftus and another visitor. named Hawkins. One evening
14:13
Speaker 2: after the festivities had concluded, Loftus and Hawkins were making
14:17
Speaker 2: their way towards their bedrooms when they encountered a woman
14:20
Speaker 2: in one of the upstairs passageways. The woman wore a
14:23
Speaker 2: brown silk dress, noticeably old-fashioned compared to the clothing that
14:27
Speaker 2: was fashionable during the 1830s. Initially, there was little reason
14:31
Speaker 2: to believe that she was anything other than another member
14:34
Speaker 2: of the household, perhaps someone returning to their room after
14:37
Speaker 2: the gathering. But when Loftus reportedly called out to her,
14:41
Speaker 2: the woman simply vanished. Both men claimed to have witnessed
14:44
Speaker 2: this unusual figure, and Loftus was sufficiently interested in the
14:48
Speaker 2: experience that he decided to investigate further. So he deliberately
14:52
Speaker 2: positioned himself along a corridor where anyone passing through would
14:56
Speaker 2: have difficulty escaping without being noticed. He wanted another opportunity
15:00
Speaker 2: to examine this mysterious woman and establish whether someone was
15:04
Speaker 2: playing a trick on the guests. The following night, Loftus
15:08
Speaker 2: reportedly encountered her again. This time he was close enough
15:12
Speaker 2: to make out considerably more detail. The woman appeared very
15:16
Speaker 2: attractive and was dressed in the same brown clothing, but
15:20
Speaker 2: there was something profoundly disturbing about her face. Her complexion
15:25
Speaker 2: seemed unusually pale, almost luminous, while the place where her
15:30
Speaker 2: eyes should have been only appeared as two dark, empty sockets.
15:36
Speaker 2: It seemed that rather than possessing ordinary eyes, the figure
15:39
Speaker 2: seemed to have nothing more than hollow darkness beneath her brow.
15:44
Speaker 2: Loftus reportedly watched the apparition before it disappeared once again.
15:49
Speaker 2: The encounter left such an impression on him that he
15:51
Speaker 2: allegedly produced a sketch of the woman, which he showed
15:55
Speaker 2: to the other guests and members of the household at
15:57
Speaker 2: breakfast the following morning. News of the sightings quickly spread
16:01
Speaker 2: amongst the servants of the home. And according to the
16:04
Speaker 2: family's later accounts, several staff members became so frightened by
16:07
Speaker 2: this possibility of a supernatural presence that they resigned their
16:12
Speaker 2: positions then and there. The reports also prompted other members
16:16
Speaker 2: of the Townshend family to discuss experiences they supposedly kept
16:20
Speaker 2: to themselves as well. Lord Charles Townshend reportedly admitted that
16:25
Speaker 2: he had encountered a similarly dressed woman several times in
16:28
Speaker 2: his own bedroom. He also claimed that children in the
16:31
Speaker 2: household were had occasionally mentioned seeing a strange lady in
16:34
Speaker 2: brown entering their rooms too. These stories suggested that the apparition,
16:40
Speaker 2: whatever it might have been, was not necessarily a new
16:44
Speaker 2: occurrence within the walls of this place. And as the
16:48
Speaker 2: reports accumulated, the household began referring to the mysterious figure
16:52
Speaker 2: as the Brown Lady, a name inspired by the distinctive
16:55
Speaker 2: brown dress described by witnesses. The incidents eventually became associated
17:01
Speaker 2: with with Dorothy Walpole, whose portrait reportedly hung inside the mansion,
17:06
Speaker 2: and guests who knew the portrait claimed the apparition resembled
17:10
Speaker 2: the woman depicted in it. But Lord Charles was apparently
17:15
Speaker 2: unwilling to accept that the family was being haunted. Instead,
17:18
Speaker 2: he suspected that someone might be deliberately frightening the household,
17:22
Speaker 2: perhaps as part of an elaborate practical joke directed against
17:25
Speaker 2: the Townshend family. Reportedly, he even arranged for detectives to
17:30
Speaker 2: stay at Rainham Hall, and investigate this mysterious appearances. The
17:35
Speaker 2: investigators reportedly remained on the property for several months, searching
17:39
Speaker 2: for evidence of an intruder, a disguised servant, or someone
17:42
Speaker 2: deliberately creating an illusion of a ghost. But despite their efforts,
17:48
Speaker 2: they supposedly uncovered nothing that identified a culprit or explained
17:53
Speaker 2: the sightings on hand. Then in 1836, a year after
17:58
Speaker 2: the frightening Christmas encounter at Rainham Hall, Another visitor arrived
18:02
Speaker 2: at the estate with the intention of getting to the
18:05
Speaker 2: bottom of the supernatural reputation. His name was Captain Frederick Marriott,
18:12
Speaker 2: a former Royal Navy officer, successful novelist, and friend of
18:16
Speaker 2: Charles Dickens. Marriott was familiar with the Townshend family and
18:22
Speaker 2: had heard the story surrounding the mysterious woman in brown,
18:24
Speaker 2: although he wasn't particularly convinced that the mansion itself was haunted.
18:29
Speaker 2: He suspected that local smugglers might be responsible for strange appearances,
18:33
Speaker 2: deliberately spreading ghost stories to discourage people from investigating their activities.
18:40
Speaker 2: He requested permission to sleep in the room most closely
18:43
Speaker 2: associated with the apparition, hoping to uncover a more reasonable explanation.
18:48
Speaker 2: Mariette settled into the room that contained a portrait of
18:52
Speaker 2: Dorothy Walpole, with a loaded revolver sitting beneath his pillow.
18:56
Speaker 2: He was prepared for the possibility of confronting whoever might
19:00
Speaker 2: be responsible. For the first two nights, nothing happened. But
19:05
Speaker 2: on the third evening, however, two young men from the
19:09
Speaker 2: Townshend family, described as nephews of the Baronet, knocked on
19:14
Speaker 2: Mariette's bedroom door. They had recently acquired a firearm from London,
19:19
Speaker 2: and they wanted the experienced naval officer's opinion of the piece.
19:24
Speaker 2: Mariette was already preparing for bed, wearing only his shirt
19:27
Speaker 2: and trousers, but agreed to accompany them to their room
19:31
Speaker 2: at the opposite end of the corridor. Before leaving, though,
19:34
Speaker 2: he collected his own revolver, joking that they might encounter
19:37
Speaker 2: the brown lady. After examining this new gun, the three
19:41
Speaker 2: men then began making their way back through the mansion.
19:45
Speaker 2: The household had already retired for the night. The lamps
19:48
Speaker 2: illuminating the long, upstairs corridor had already been extinguished. And
19:53
Speaker 2: as they approached the middle of the passageway, that's when
19:57
Speaker 2: they noticed a light approaching from the opposite end. The
20:01
Speaker 2: light appeared to be coming from a lamp that was
20:03
Speaker 2: being carried by someone walking towards them. The young townshend
20:07
Speaker 2: men assumed it was one of the women of the
20:10
Speaker 2: house visiting the children's nursery. Mariette was embarrassed about being
20:16
Speaker 2: seen in his currently dressed state, so he decided to
20:20
Speaker 2: step out of sight until she passed. The bedrooms lining
20:24
Speaker 2: the corridor had an unusual arrangement, with an outer door
20:28
Speaker 2: and an inner door separated by a small entrance space.
20:32
Speaker 2: So Mariette slipped behind one of those outer doors, followed
20:34
Speaker 2: by his two companions. and they watched the approaching woman
20:38
Speaker 2: through the narrow opening. As she drew closer, Mariette began
20:43
Speaker 2: distinguishing the details of her clothing. According to the account
20:47
Speaker 2: published by his daughter, Florence Mariette, in 1891, the woman
20:52
Speaker 2: appeared identical to the portrait of the brown lady hanging
20:56
Speaker 2: in his bedroom. Mariette kept his revolver ready, intending to
21:00
Speaker 2: confront the figure and demand an explanation for their presence.
21:04
Speaker 2: But before he could speak... the woman stopped directly outside
21:08
Speaker 2: the door where the three men were hiding. She raised
21:12
Speaker 2: the lit lamp towards her face, illuminating her features, and
21:16
Speaker 2: looked directly at Mariette. Then the apparition gave him a
21:21
Speaker 2: deeply unsettling grin, which was described as malicious and diabolical.
21:28
Speaker 2: Mariette immediately emerged from behind the door and discharged his
21:31
Speaker 2: revolver directly towards the woman's face, but she vanished. The
21:36
Speaker 2: bullet reportedly passed through the space where she had been standing,
21:39
Speaker 2: struck the outer door of the bedroom opposite, and lodged
21:42
Speaker 2: itself in the panel of its inner door. No wounded
21:46
Speaker 2: intruder was discovered, and there was apparently no physical trace
21:50
Speaker 2: of the woman herself. Florence maintained that all three men
21:55
Speaker 2: had watched the apparition approach, and according to her, Mariette
21:59
Speaker 2: never again attempted to interfere with the brown lady. Frederick
22:04
Speaker 2: Mariette died on In 1848. And his extraordinary experience remained
22:09
Speaker 2: largely preserved through his family's recollections until Florence published it
22:13
Speaker 2: in 1891, more than 50 years after the supposed encounter.
22:19
Speaker 3: You know, this, though terrifying, like Dorothy isn't doing anything wrong.
22:25
Speaker 2: No, she's not.
22:26
Speaker 3: Like, I mean, her presence is maybe not exactly welcomed
22:28
Speaker 3: and it's frightening, but like him, for example, firing a gun.
22:34
Speaker 3: In a house is a hell of a lot more
22:36
Speaker 3: dangerous than anything this lady is doing.
22:40
Speaker 2: Oh, for sure. But you have to think on the
22:41
Speaker 2: situation for Frederick Marriott. He believed that there was no ghost.
22:47
Speaker 2: He believed that it was smugglers and a cover-up story.
22:51
Speaker 2: So he's thinking this is an intruder in the home.
22:55
Speaker 2: This is someone who's not supposed to be here. This
22:57
Speaker 2: is a robber. This is a burglar. This is a
23:00
Speaker 2: person with malicious intent.
23:01
Speaker 3: Someone traumatizing the family, I think you said, or something. Yeah.
23:05
Speaker 2: So he's like, okay, if I shoot this person, I
23:07
Speaker 2: can stop them. I can end this. Yeah. But in
23:10
Speaker 2: pulling the trigger, there was no one there.
23:13
Speaker 3: Nothing happened.
23:15
Speaker 2: And then that's the realization of, oh shit, this isn't
23:18
Speaker 2: what I thought it was.
23:20
Speaker 3: Because he didn't really believe.
23:21
Speaker 2: Exactly.
23:22
Speaker 3: And now he believes.
23:24
Speaker 2: Exactly.
23:24
Speaker 3: Okay.
23:25
Speaker 2: So it's a weird situation. But you are definitely right.
23:29
Speaker 2: There is no ill intent from this brown lady.
23:34
Speaker 3: No.
23:35
Speaker 2: As far as we can find, other than- Startling as heck.
23:39
Speaker 2: Startling as heck because, I mean, having an appearance being
23:42
Speaker 2: of absolute beauty and then just no eyes with just
23:45
Speaker 2: blackness and a malicious grin, that would scare the shit
23:50
Speaker 2: out of me too.
23:51
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, especially the one where they were in bed.
23:55
Speaker 3: And she's like leaning over the bed. That one would
23:58
Speaker 3: get me pretty good.
23:59
Speaker 2: Yeah. I think each and every one of these situations
24:01
Speaker 2: would get me pretty good.
24:02
Speaker 3: But she also, like, I'm just saying she's not, you know, being.
24:07
Speaker 2: There's no harm.
24:07
Speaker 1: Yeah.
24:08
Speaker 3: She's not harming anyone, I suppose.
24:10
Speaker 2: Maybe she's actually just smiling friendly, but because she has
24:13
Speaker 2: no eyes, it just looks bad.
24:15
Speaker 3: It comes across a little bit like a resting or
24:19
Speaker 3: not even resting bitch face.
24:20
Speaker 2: Resting ghost face.
24:21
Speaker 3: Yeah.
24:22
Speaker 2: Jesus. Yeah. Anyways, meanwhile, the Townshend family's circumstances had actually
24:29
Speaker 2: changed considerably by this time. By the late 19th century,
24:33
Speaker 2: Rainham Hall was experiencing serious financial difficulties. An agricultural depression
24:38
Speaker 2: had reduced the income generated by the family's land, while
24:41
Speaker 2: expensive lifestyles and substantial costs of maintaining the estate placed
24:45
Speaker 2: additional pressures on the owners. In 1899, John Townshend, 6
24:51
Speaker 2: Marquet Townshend, inherited a heavily debted estate. Valued pieces from
24:59
Speaker 2: the family's art collection were sold, and portions of the
25:01
Speaker 2: property were rented out as the family struggled financially. In
25:05
Speaker 2: August of 1905, John married Gwelaide Southersts, the daughter of
25:10
Speaker 2: a successful lawyer. Gwelaide took a considerable interest in the
25:14
Speaker 2: family's history and the preservation of Rainham Hall, although the
25:18
Speaker 2: financial problems surrounding the property remained substantial. Following John's death
25:22
Speaker 2: in 1921, Gwiledes, now Dowager Marioness Townshend, became increasingly involved
25:29
Speaker 2: in restoring the ancestral home. Her interest extended beyond its
25:35
Speaker 2: architecture and furnishings to many unusual stories associated with the building, too.
25:40
Speaker 2: Then in 1926, another encounter was reported. According to Gwiledes,
25:47
Speaker 2: her son George Townshend and a friend were inside Rainham
25:50
Speaker 2: Hall when they encountered an unfamiliar woman on the main staircase.
25:56
Speaker 2: The figure reportedly resembled the woman depicted in Dorothy Walpole's portrait,
26:01
Speaker 2: but there was something particularly disturbing about her appearance. Although
26:05
Speaker 2: she had the recognizable form of a woman, her body
26:07
Speaker 2: appeared transparent enough that the two witnesses could see the
26:11
Speaker 2: staircase right through her. George and his companion were frightened
26:15
Speaker 2: by this encounter, and the appearance was subsequently identified with
26:19
Speaker 2: the brown lady, who had supposedly been wandering the mansion
26:22
Speaker 2: now for generations. By 1936, Rainham Hall had been associated
26:28
Speaker 2: with ghostly encounters for more than a century, and Gulady's
26:32
Speaker 2: townshend had developed a particular fascination with the estate's supernatural reputation.
26:37
Speaker 2: That year, she published a book titled True Ghost Stories,
26:42
Speaker 2: a collection of 32 accounts involving supposedly haunted properties all
26:47
Speaker 2: throughout Britain. The opening chapter was dedicated to Rainham Hall
26:52
Speaker 2: and the mysterious woman who had allegedly appeared for generations
26:57
Speaker 2: of visitors. Her book detailed the experiences of earlier encounters
27:01
Speaker 2: with Rainham Hall's supernatural history and was becoming increasingly more well-known.
27:06
Speaker 2: But an incident later that year would bring the haunting
27:10
Speaker 2: to an international level. On September 19, 1936, two photographers
27:17
Speaker 2: working for the British magazine Country Life arrived at Rainham Hall,
27:22
Speaker 2: to photograph the estate for an upcoming feature. The photographer
27:27
Speaker 2: was Captain Hubert C. Prevond, an experienced London-based professional, accompanied
27:32
Speaker 2: by his assistant, Indri Sheera. Their assignment involved documenting the
27:38
Speaker 2: mansion's architecture and interiors, including the elaborate rooms and architecture
27:43
Speaker 2: features that made the building an important example of an
27:46
Speaker 2: English country house. Among the areas selected for photography was
27:51
Speaker 2: the mansion's grand staircase. The men were working with a
27:55
Speaker 2: large camera that required Prevand to position his head beneath
28:00
Speaker 2: a dark focusing cloth while preparing the exposure. Shira assisted
28:05
Speaker 2: with the lighting, holding a device commonly called the flashlight pistol,
28:10
Speaker 2: which triggered off the flash. The photographers had already taken
28:13
Speaker 2: one photograph of the staircase and were preparing themselves for another.
28:18
Speaker 2: Prevand was concentrating on the camera with his head buried
28:21
Speaker 2: underneath his focusing cloth, while Shira stood nearby, looking towards
28:26
Speaker 2: the staircase, the direction where they were taking the photo.
28:30
Speaker 2: According to Shira's subsequent statement, that's when something suddenly caught
28:34
Speaker 2: his attention. He described seeing a faint, mist-like shape appearing
28:40
Speaker 2: on the staircase, and as he watched, the shape seemed
28:43
Speaker 2: to develop into the outline of a woman, partially transparent
28:49
Speaker 2: and covered in flowing material, and this figure appeared to
28:53
Speaker 2: be moving slowly down the staircase, right towards them. Shira
28:58
Speaker 2: became excited and shouted for Pravan to take the photograph now,
29:01
Speaker 2: take it immediately. So Pravan removed the lens cap and
29:05
Speaker 2: Shira activated the flash. The exposure was completed within seconds.
29:11
Speaker 2: Pravan had not personally witnessed the apparition. As his attention
29:15
Speaker 2: was directed towards the camera, his head was buried underneath
29:17
Speaker 2: that cloth, but after completing the exposure... He reportedly turned
29:21
Speaker 2: to his assistant and asked, what's going on? And Shira
29:25
Speaker 2: explained what had just happened. When the photo's negative was
29:30
Speaker 2: subsequently developed, an unusual image appeared on the staircase. There
29:36
Speaker 2: in the center of the photograph was a pale, translucent image.
29:40
Speaker 2: figure resembling a woman descending the steps. Her upper body
29:44
Speaker 2: appeared partially concealed beneath a veil or maybe a hood,
29:49
Speaker 2: while flowing material surrounded the lower body. Portions of the
29:54
Speaker 2: staircase remained visible throughout the figure, creating the appearance of
29:58
Speaker 2: someone who is simultaneously present and transparent. On December 26, 1936,
30:07
Speaker 2: Country Life published the photograph alongside an account of the
30:11
Speaker 2: photographer's experience. Readers were presented with an image that appeared
30:15
Speaker 2: to capture something extraordinary inside a house already famous for
30:20
Speaker 2: its supernatural history. The photo quickly attracted attention, and on
30:25
Speaker 2: January 4, 1937, the American magazine Life produced the image,
30:30
Speaker 2: bringing the story to a much wider audience. Among those
30:35
Speaker 2: interested in examining the photograph was Harry Price, a prominent
30:39
Speaker 2: British paranormal investigator known for studying hauntings, mediums, and alleged
30:44
Speaker 2: supernatural phenomena. Price had considerable experience investigating photographic depictions of
30:51
Speaker 2: ghosts and was particularly interested in determining whether supposed paranormal
30:56
Speaker 2: things had been manipulated. After the photograph became public, Price
31:01
Speaker 2: interviewed both Pravand and Shira about the circumstances surrounding its
31:05
Speaker 2: creation or capture. According to Price, their explanations were very
31:11
Speaker 2: straightforward and very consistent. Shira maintained that he had witnessed
31:16
Speaker 2: the apparition descending the staircase, while Pravand confirmed that he
31:19
Speaker 2: had been operating the camera when Shira called out. Price
31:23
Speaker 2: also examined the photographic negative, looking for indications that the
31:26
Speaker 2: mysterious figure had been added through manipulation. But he reportedly
31:32
Speaker 2: found no obvious evidence that the negative had been altered.
31:36
Speaker 2: Price acknowledged that a deliberate deception involving cooperation between the
31:40
Speaker 2: two photographers was possible, but he found their testimony convincing
31:45
Speaker 2: and stated that he had no grounds to accuse them
31:47
Speaker 2: of dishonesty. However, not everyone examining the photograph reached that
31:52
Speaker 2: same conclusion. During 1937, researchers associated with the Society for
31:58
Speaker 2: Physical Research, an organization devoted to studying unusual experiences for
32:02
Speaker 2: alleged paranormal phenomena, conducted a separate investigation into the image.
32:08
Speaker 2: Their examination considered conventional photographic explanations, including the possibility that
32:13
Speaker 2: light had accidentally entered the camera or that movement during
32:17
Speaker 2: an exposure lasting approximately six seconds had produced the unusual effect.
32:22
Speaker 2: Rather than concluding that the photo demonstrated the existence of
32:25
Speaker 2: a ghost, the investigators considered that an ordinary explanation was
32:29
Speaker 2: instead highly likely. The findings of that investigation, however, well,
32:34
Speaker 2: they were not widely published at the time. As a result,
32:37
Speaker 2: the photo continued circulating with Harry Price's more favorable assessment,
32:42
Speaker 2: receiving considerable more attention. And for many people encountering the image,
32:46
Speaker 2: the pale woman descending Rainham Hall staircase remained one of
32:49
Speaker 2: the most extraordinary photos ever associated with a reported haunting. Now,
32:56
Speaker 2: in the years following the publication of the Brown Lady's photograph,
32:59
Speaker 2: the image became one of the most widely recognized examples
33:02
Speaker 2: of supposed paranormal evidence. For believers, it appeared to provide
33:07
Speaker 2: photo confirmation of the encounters reported at Rainham Hall for
33:11
Speaker 2: more than a century. But for others, the photo raised
33:14
Speaker 2: questions about how the mysterious figure had appeared on the negative,
33:18
Speaker 2: particularly the when there were several ways to produce a
33:21
Speaker 2: similar effect without anything supernatural taking place at all. One
33:26
Speaker 2: explanation involved double exposure, a photographic technique in which two
33:31
Speaker 2: separate images are recorded onto the same photographic surface. If
33:35
Speaker 2: a person were photographed against one background and the same
33:38
Speaker 2: negative or plate were exposed again on, say, this staircase,
33:43
Speaker 2: the resulting photograph could show a translucent figure seemingly occupying
33:47
Speaker 2: both of these scenes. Other critics suggest that the figure
33:51
Speaker 2: might have been created during a single lengthy exposure. If
33:55
Speaker 2: someone stood in the staircase for part of the exposure,
33:58
Speaker 2: then moved away while the camera was still recording the scene,
34:03
Speaker 2: then it could, you know, have both their body and
34:06
Speaker 2: the staircase behind them, making them appear partially transparent. There
34:11
Speaker 2: were also suggestions that grease or another substance had been
34:14
Speaker 2: applied to the camera lens, creating a blurred, human-like shaped pattern.
34:18
Speaker 2: patch of light. Alternatively, an accidental light leak might have
34:23
Speaker 2: produced an unusual shape that viewers subsequently interpreted as a woman, maybe.
34:30
Speaker 2: Among the photo's critics was Joe Nickel, an American skeptical
34:34
Speaker 2: investigator who argued that the image showed evidence consistent with
34:37
Speaker 2: double exposure. Writers John Fairley and Simon Welfare also identified
34:43
Speaker 2: irregularities in the photograph. They pointed to faint lines appearing
34:47
Speaker 2: above the individual stair treads, suggesting that the staircase itself
34:51
Speaker 2: had been recorded more than once, meaning a double exposure.
34:55
Speaker 2: They also noted that a patch of reflected light near
34:58
Speaker 2: the upper portion of the right-hand banister appeared twice. Now,
35:02
Speaker 2: if those observations were correct, the photo contained indications of
35:06
Speaker 2: overlapping images rather than simply an unexplained figure. Another interpretation
35:12
Speaker 2: focused on the appearance of the woman herself. Some critics
35:16
Speaker 2: noticed that the figure resembles traditional statues of the Virgin Mary,
35:21
Speaker 2: particularly those depicting her wearing a long veil and flowing
35:24
Speaker 2: robes with her hands held together in prayer. They suggested
35:28
Speaker 2: that a photograph of such a statue could have been
35:31
Speaker 2: superimposed over the empty staircase. Then a pale triangle shape
35:36
Speaker 2: near the lower portion of the apparition was compared with
35:39
Speaker 2: a draped cloth commonly depicted in these statues. while a
35:44
Speaker 2: rectangular shape beneath the figure was interpreted by some as
35:47
Speaker 2: a possible pedestal even. However, no particular statue was conclusively
35:52
Speaker 2: identified as the source of the image. Now, the possibility
35:57
Speaker 2: of deliberately manufacturing a ghost photo was also explored by
36:02
Speaker 2: magician John Booth. Working with fellow magician Ron Wilson, Booth
36:07
Speaker 2: created a comparable effect at Hollywood's infamous Magic Castle. Wilson
36:14
Speaker 2: covered himself in a sheet and posed on the building's staircase,
36:17
Speaker 2: while photographic techniques were used to produce a translucent ghost-like figure.
36:22
Speaker 2: The resulting image demonstrated that a photo resembling the Brown
36:25
Speaker 2: Lady could be created without supernatural involvement, although it didn't
36:30
Speaker 2: establish which method, if any, had been used at Rainham Hall.
36:36
Speaker 2: In the decades following the publication of the photo, reports
36:39
Speaker 2: of the Brown Lady became considerably less frequent. although the
36:43
Speaker 2: Townshend family continued to have occasional experiences that they attributed
36:46
Speaker 2: to that apparition. During the 1960s, George John Patrick Dominic Townshend,
36:53
Speaker 2: 7th Marquis Townshend, reportedly encountered a mysterious figure himself. Unfortunately,
36:59
Speaker 2: very little information about this particular sighting is known. Interestingly,
37:04
Speaker 2: stories also began circulating that the Brown Lady was actually
37:07
Speaker 2: no longer confined to Rainham Hall. Some accounts placed her
37:11
Speaker 2: at Hewton Hall. the nearby country estate associated with Dorothy
37:15
Speaker 2: Walpole's family, while others suggested that she's also made appearances
37:20
Speaker 2: at Sandringham House, another historical Norfolk residence. These later descriptions
37:26
Speaker 2: sometimes portrayed the apparition as a younger, less frightening woman,
37:30
Speaker 2: quite different from the hollowed-eye figure reportedly from other stories
37:34
Speaker 2: centuries earlier. Although the Brown Lady remained Rainham Hall's most
37:38
Speaker 2: famous supernatural resident, though, I should say she certainly wasn't
37:42
Speaker 2: the only ghost associated with the property. Over the years,
37:47
Speaker 2: stories emerged about two mysterious children, an unidentified caretaker accompanied
37:52
Speaker 2: by a cocker spaniel, and even James Scott, Duke of Monmouth,
37:57
Speaker 2: the illegitimate son of King Charles II, who was executed
38:00
Speaker 2: for treason on July 15th, 1685. But in a more
38:05
Speaker 2: modern sense, in 2006, another development brought renewed attention to
38:10
Speaker 2: to the famous photo of the Brown Lady. Paranormal researcher
38:15
Speaker 2: Alan Murdy discovered material preserved in the manuscripts department of
38:19
Speaker 2: Cambridge University Library concerning the Society for Physical Research Investigation
38:24
Speaker 2: for the photo in 1937. The previously unpublished findings offered
38:29
Speaker 2: a different assessment from Harry Price's favorable comments. The investigators
38:34
Speaker 2: had examined the photo and found possibilities of ordinary photographic defects.
38:40
Speaker 2: particularly light entering the camera, movements or lengthy exposure, that
38:44
Speaker 2: sort of thing, things we've already discussed. The discovery showed
38:48
Speaker 2: that serious doubts, though, about the photo had existed almost
38:51
Speaker 2: from the very beginning, even though the skeptical investigators had
38:54
Speaker 2: received far less publication attention than Price's statements. But today,
38:59
Speaker 2: Rainham Hall remains standing in the English countryside, more than
39:03
Speaker 2: 400 years after its construction. The famous photograph continues to
39:08
Speaker 2: be debated to this day, And despite decades of investigation,
39:12
Speaker 2: no definitive explanation for the mystery and the figure standing
39:16
Speaker 2: there in that staircase has ever been established. Whether the
39:19
Speaker 2: brown lady was nothing more than a trick of the
39:21
Speaker 2: camera or something much more difficult to explain, well, that
39:26
Speaker 2: mystery remains. But if the stories are true, perhaps Dorothy
39:31
Speaker 2: Walpole never really left Rainham Hall. And somewhere within its
39:35
Speaker 2: century-old walls, the woman in brown may still be wandering
39:40
Speaker 2: the corridors that she once called home. And that's the
39:45
Speaker 2: story of the Lady of Rainham Hall.
39:49
Speaker 4: Hmm.
39:49
Speaker 3: That's quite a story.
39:51
Speaker 2: Is it ever.
39:52
Speaker 3: What a piss off though. These two literally take the
39:55
Speaker 3: photo of their freaking life and everyone is just trying
39:59
Speaker 3: to explain it away for eternity really.
40:02
Speaker 2: Essentially and honestly that's still something that goes on today
40:05
Speaker 2: is you know oh it's photoshopped oh it's fake and
40:08
Speaker 2: even now in the new age oh it's AI.
40:10
Speaker 1: Yeah.
40:11
Speaker 3: You know. I mean, some of the reasonings that you
40:15
Speaker 3: were given make sense, but I don't know. I really
40:17
Speaker 3: want to believe that it's real.
40:19
Speaker 2: It's an eerie photo.
40:20
Speaker 1: It is.
40:22
Speaker 3: It really is. I mean, they were probably like rushing
40:26
Speaker 3: to take it.
40:27
Speaker 1: Yeah.
40:28
Speaker 3: So maybe something happened or could have even been like
40:31
Speaker 3: in the developing process, really. But I don't know. I
40:35
Speaker 3: want to believe it's real because there's also so many
40:38
Speaker 3: other stories to go along with it, right?
40:40
Speaker 2: There is.
40:41
Speaker 3: So it kind of.
40:43
Speaker 2: Well, and it's not something that just showed up on
40:45
Speaker 2: the camera. Supposedly, Shira saw it and told them to
40:49
Speaker 2: take the photo so they could capture what's going on.
40:52
Speaker 3: I don't know. Yeah, that photo was wild. It's kind
40:56
Speaker 3: of cool. It is.
40:58
Speaker 2: We should get it framed in our house.
40:59
Speaker 3: Kate, that's so funny. I was literally just thinking that.
41:02
Speaker 1: Really?
41:02
Speaker 3: That is so cool to have, if you had something
41:04
Speaker 3: like that framed in your house. Like, oh my gosh.
41:08
Speaker 2: Well, I hope you guys enjoyed this spooky tale today.
41:11
Speaker 2: It's an infamous photograph. If you haven't seen it before,
41:15
Speaker 2: look up the Lady of Rainham Hall, the brown lady.
41:19
Speaker 2: You will find this photo. It is, it's haunting. It's
41:25
Speaker 2: not scary. It's not eerie. It's just haunting. There's something
41:31
Speaker 2: about it. I can't put words onto it.
41:33
Speaker 4: Yeah.
41:33
Speaker 3: It's hard to even explain it. It's, it like sucks
41:36
Speaker 3: you in though. Like into a different world almost.
41:40
Speaker 1: Yeah.
41:40
Speaker 3: Like a moment.
41:41
Speaker 2: It really does.
41:42
Speaker 3: Yeah. I mean, we can put it on our socials too.
41:45
Speaker 2: We definitely will. So you can take a look over
41:47
Speaker 2: there as well. If you haven't got the ability to
41:49
Speaker 2: look it up or you're curious, you can go over,
41:51
Speaker 2: check out our Instagram and Facebook. We'll be putting it
41:53
Speaker 2: up there soon and you can take a look and
41:55
Speaker 2: let us know what you think. Is it real or
41:58
Speaker 2: is it not? I mean, regardless if the image was fake,
42:02
Speaker 2: the stories of the lady in brown sure are They're
42:05
Speaker 2: sure in depth.
42:07
Speaker 1: I know.
42:07
Speaker 2: And they predate this photo by generations already.
42:12
Speaker 3: And you almost kind of just hope that she's like
42:17
Speaker 3: still living the afterlife that she wants. That she's not stuck,
42:20
Speaker 3: you know?
42:20
Speaker 2: I hope so.
42:21
Speaker 3: But I'm kind of like, frick, that sounds fun. Just
42:23
Speaker 3: wandering around this mansion and scaring the shit out of people. Like,
42:27
Speaker 3: I don't know. Kind of into it. Is that weird?
42:30
Speaker 2: I guess we know what Nicole's going to do in
42:32
Speaker 2: her afterlife.
42:33
Speaker 3: Yeah.
42:35
Speaker 2: Anyways, thank you guys for being here. We appreciate you.
42:37
Speaker 2: Day three of Halloween week is done and we'll see
42:41
Speaker 2: you in day four. But before we do, Nicole's got
42:44
Speaker 2: something she needs to give you.
42:46
Speaker 3: Holy shit.
42:47
Speaker 1: I do.
42:47
Speaker 3: I would have forgotten. I'm like so into this case. Okay.
42:53
Speaker 3: So today's number that you need to keep track of
42:57
Speaker 3: is seven.
42:58
Speaker 2: Number seven.
42:59
Speaker 3: Number seven.
43:01
Speaker 2: And until next episode.
43:03
Speaker 3: I think Jacko needs to take us away. Jacko?
43:05
Speaker 2: Where is he? Jacko!
43:08
Speaker 1: Stay wicked.