Latest / Frightmares / Ep. 404 - Hokum (2026)

Transcript

Ep. 404 - Hokum (2026) · Frightmares

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: You are now listening to the Someone's Favorite Productions Podcast Network.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: Hello and welcome to Tumbleweeds and TV Cowboys. My name
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: is Hunter. In this podcast, I'll be joined by a
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: different guest each week to discuss a classic Western movie
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: or TV show. I've been a fan of classic Westerns
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: for as long as I can remember, and in recent years,
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: they've become very nostalgic for me. I love the aesthetic,
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: the tropes, and I love seeing different filmmakers' takes on them.
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: At their best, they're incredibly entertaining, rewatchable, and some of
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: my all-time favorite movies are westerns. We'll mostly focus on
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: western movies made in Hollywood, but we'll also be covering
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: spaghetti westerns, and one thing I'm very excited to get
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: into are western TV shows. I've got some amazing guests
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: coming on the show, film professors, historians, and podcasters, and
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: Tumbleweeds and TV Cowboys is part of the Someone's Favorite
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: Productions podcast network, and many guests on the show will
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: be from other shows on the network.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: Thanks for listening.
• 0:54
  Speaker 3: The following podcast will contain spoilers, tangents, hot takes and
• 0:59
  Speaker 3: excessive foul language. Viewer discretion is advised. Enjoy the show.
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to Fright Matters Podcast. I'm your host, Austin Proctor,
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: and joining me today for episode 404. Okay, wait, hold on.
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: Episode 404. Okay, episode 404. Okay, let me reboot here.
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: Hold on. Okay, let's try that again. Welcome back to
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: Fright Matters Podcast. I'm your host, Austin Proctor, and joining
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: me today for episode... You know what it is. It's
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: my good friend, Michael Viers. How we doing?
• 2:14
  Speaker 3: Better than you are, apparently.
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that error message kept popping up and it was
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: just fucking my day right up. My God. Anyways, today
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: on another installment of Warlocktober's Hex, we're discussing our modern pick, Hocum,
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: from 2026. A movie that shows us why you shouldn't
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: do mushrooms and go to one of the creepiest establishments
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: in Ireland. So let's see where this lands on the
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: Nightmare Index. All right, Michael, what you been watching? It's
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: been a little bit. I know you've got some fun
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: Hooptober plans. I know we're going to have a crossover
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: that we can talk about at the same time. But
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: what you been watching, bud?
• 3:02
  Speaker 3: Man, Hooptober, funny enough, I started off so fucking strong
• 3:05
  Speaker 3: for Hooptober, but we've had so many curveballs come our way.
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 3:10
  Speaker 3: We're not going to be able to finish Hooptober because
• 3:14
  Speaker 3: we lost essentially two weeks in October.
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: Two?
• 3:18
  Speaker 3: Well, Amanda was just in Florida for a week.
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 3:21
  Speaker 3: And then our trip is not this coming week, but
• 3:23
  Speaker 3: the week after.
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: Oh, yes, yes. Oh, yeah. Good Lord, yeah. Okay.
• 3:29
  Speaker 3: So, but we'll be close. I'm still going to count.
• 3:32
  Speaker 3: Like I'm, I'm going to, I'm going to try to
• 3:33
  Speaker 3: finish cause we won't be off by much. Um, but yeah, man, I've,
• 3:38
  Speaker 3: I've watched a lot. I don't even know where to begin. Uh,
• 3:40
  Speaker 3: so I'm going to just, I'm going to just jump
• 3:43
  Speaker 3: right into something I've watched recently. I just recently did the, um, I, I,
• 3:50
  Speaker 3: in essentially two days I watched, uh, all the new
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: halloween movies so i did halloween 1978 and halloween 2018
• 3:59
  Speaker 3: and then i did a double bill of halloween kills
• 4:01
  Speaker 3: and halloween ends and man it is a much better
• 4:06
  Speaker 3: experience watching them this close together because i don't think
• 4:09
  Speaker 3: i've watched them all in succession with each.
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: Other what's the uh what what's that fucking timeline is
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: that the like the does it have a name Well,
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: there's like the Thorne timeline. There's the Strode timeline. There's
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: a few different timelines. There's five timelines total in this
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: fucking franchise. It might just be the H40 timeline.
• 4:33
  Speaker 3: I think it is. Or just the David Gordon Green timeline.
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: Sure. Let's go with that because you have the 1978
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: that connects straight to the 2018 and then 21 and 22.
• 4:42
  Speaker 3: Because it's incredibly difficult to watch these films and not
• 4:47
  Speaker 3: just want to go, well, Laurie's Michael's sister. Because that's
• 4:51
  Speaker 3: the story that pretty much all of these movies go with. Right.
• 4:55
  Speaker 3: So it was kind of nice. I'm not going to lie.
• 4:58
  Speaker 3: I'm just going to say I got a little stoned
• 5:00
  Speaker 3: and I watched them that way. And so I was
• 5:03
  Speaker 3: just focusing on what was in front of me, which
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: was kind of nice. And I was like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah,
• 5:09
  Speaker 3: he's just some fucking dude. I literally forgot as I
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: was watching that they're supposed to, not the original film,
• 5:18
  Speaker 3: but Halloween 2, they established that they're related. And this
• 5:21
  Speaker 3: is the first time I was watching it where I
• 5:24
  Speaker 3: didn't have that in the back of my mind. And
• 5:26
  Speaker 3: I gotta say, the way that Danny McBride and David
• 5:29
  Speaker 3: Gordon Green tie back to not only the original film
• 5:33
  Speaker 3: in a really beautiful way, But the way they tie
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: back to their own timeline, like when going from Halloween
• 5:40
  Speaker 3: 2018 to Halloween kills, like seeing that they're pulling, they're
• 5:43
  Speaker 3: pulling in just background actors that they used in one
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: scene to have a bigger role in the next film.
• 5:49
  Speaker 3: Like after Michael escapes Lori's house in Halloween 2018. So
• 5:54
  Speaker 3: in Halloween kills when he kills all the firefighters and
• 5:57
  Speaker 3: he kills that first couple, I'm like, oh shit, that
• 5:59
  Speaker 3: woman was the caretaker at the cemetery.
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: I didn't put that together the first time I watched it.
• 6:07
  Speaker 3: So they work so well when you just watch them
• 6:10
  Speaker 3: really close to each other.
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: I'm a big defender of the DGG trilogy, as it were.
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: I can't deny the fact that I hated Kills when
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: I first saw it in theaters.
• 6:22
  Speaker 3: What did you hate about it?
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: I almost walked out of the theater, which is rare
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: for me. It was the whole Evil Dies Tonight thing.
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: I was so fucking sick of it. I was like,
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: oh my God, we get it.
• 6:31
  Speaker 3: It dies.
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: And plus Tommy was the big, I just, oh. But
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: that was also five years ago. But when I rewatched it,
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: and if you were actually, Jason and I are going
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: to be doing a bonus episode going through these movies.
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: And if you watch Halloween Kills, I think I told
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: you this, through a, I'm not going to get political,
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: but if you watch it through a political lens, it almost,
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: and I don't know if this is intentional or not,
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: It is definitely right on point with what was happening
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: in America at that time. And there are a lot
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: of themes that you can view from a political lens.
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: And I was like, intentional or not, I'm viewing it
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: that way. And it's honestly a fucking solid film.
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and also, I don't know, maybe it never bothered
• 7:15
  Speaker 3: me that much because people are fucking sheep. And let's
• 7:19
  Speaker 3: be real, people like to chant shit. Being a pro
• 7:22
  Speaker 3: wrestling fan for as long as I have been, people
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: will chant shit.
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: Fair enough.
• 7:26
  Speaker 3: Just people be chanting. People be chanting. And I know
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: a lot. I did a podcast shortly after Kills came
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: out with a friend of mine, and his whole thing
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: that drove him nuts was like, why would anyone think
• 7:41
  Speaker 3: that one inmate is Michael Myers? I was like, well,
• 7:43
  Speaker 3: let me paint you a picture. Jesus. I don't know
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: if you heard that. That was Frankie's head hitting the floor. Oh, Frankie.
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: Goodness.
• 7:50
  Speaker 3: Be careful. Be careful. Um, people were like, why would
• 7:54
  Speaker 3: anyone ever believe that? Well, let me paint you guys
• 7:56
  Speaker 3: a picture. One, no one has fucking, like, we know
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: what Michael looks like. We know his size. No one
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: else does. No one else has any idea to know
• 8:04
  Speaker 3: what this man looks like. If they've seen anything of him,
• 8:06
  Speaker 3: it's pictures. Tommy was a child last time he saw him.
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: Lori is not involved in this section. Bracket probably have
• 8:15
  Speaker 3: seen him, but Bracket's also not involved because things are
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: so crazy. It's just clearly mob mentality. Like, they don't
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: actually know what this man looks like. So everyone's like, well,
• 8:25
  Speaker 3: Mike was a big hulking person. They don't know that,
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: you fuckers.
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: Pay attention. That's what my argument was, too, is because
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: I was angry at that. That was another thing. I
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: was like, that's stupid. And then I was thinking about it.
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: And I was like, no, they're following someone, Tommy, who
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: had an experience with him ages ago. And he's saying
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: it's it. So we're all going after it. And Laurie
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: gets involved at the last second. Like, you fucking sheep.
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: This is not. That was one of the greatest lines.
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: You fucking sheep. This is not him. I know him.
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: So yeah, I've come around on kills a lot. Like,
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: that's honestly, it's a solid fucking movie.
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: And I've been a fucking Halloween ends truther since they
• 9:07
  Speaker 3: first came out. And I still love that film. I do, too.
• 9:11
  Speaker 3: I do, too.
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: And you know what? This has been speculated, and again,
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: intentional or not, he, David Gordon Green, managed to elicit
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: the same response from fans from the original trilogy. Everyone,
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: for the most part, you know, 2018 is well-regarded. Most
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: people like it. Halloween 2 was like, all right, well,
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: we didn't really need this. And then Halloween 3... And
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: ends is so divisive because they both don't involve Michael Myers. Well,
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: you have some Michael Myers and ends, but he and
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: even if you look at the text he used, he
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: uses the same.
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that was that was the first thing I noticed
• 9:52
  Speaker 3: when I watched Halloween ends. I'm like, oh, he's using
• 9:57
  Speaker 3: the same font and color. of the font that they
• 10:01
  Speaker 3: used in Halloween 3. It's like... Yep. So it already
• 10:05
  Speaker 3: told me, I'm like, oh, I'm going in... There's going
• 10:08
  Speaker 3: to be something different about this.
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: Right. So I know that part was intentional, but you
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: can't ever know how fans are going to react to things.
• 10:16
  Speaker 3: But.
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: he basically got the same reaction out of the fans
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: from his trilogy compared to the original trilogy. And I
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: think that's fine. I mean, that's brilliant. In my opinion,
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: I enjoy kills as well. Uh, it's our ends as well.
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: It's a half star lower than I have kills at,
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: but I, I enjoy it. I don't know. I don't
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: know what to tell people. People are very upset about things.
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: And it's just like, if you just watch the movie
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: and just have fun, it's not that big of a deal.
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: But that's just my opinion.
• 10:45
  Speaker 3: I'm going to go out and say it. Halloween Ends
• 10:48
  Speaker 3: might be in my top three or four of the franchise.
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: Let's see where it sits for me. Because it's pretty
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: high for me.
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: I haven't actually ranked them. People don't often agree with
• 11:00
  Speaker 3: me and my tastes in Halloween films. Because I also
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: love the director's cut of Rob Zombie's Halloween 2.
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: I do too. That one's brought me around so much
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: more to liking it. Which is funny, because the director's
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: cut of the first one, I hate, because they replaced
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: my favorite scene of Michael escaping with an assault on
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: a woman. And I'm like, what the fuck, dude?
• 11:21
  Speaker 3: Yet I can't find the theatrical cut anywhere.
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: I've got you.
• 11:25
  Speaker 3: I got you.
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: So, yeah, there is a Blu-ray out there, and I
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: think it's from Canada, because there's some French on there.
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: But there's a copy out there, and it's a Blu-ray
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: of the theatrical cut.
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: I need it.
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah. Um, Halloween kills is number six for me.
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: So almost in my top five.
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: Perfect.
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 11:51
  Speaker 3: So, you know, I watched a bunch of other stuff.
• 11:53
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to go through that unless you want
• 11:54
  Speaker 3: me to, I'm not going to go through my entire
• 11:56
  Speaker 3: Hooptober list thus far.
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: No, I like that conversation on a Halloween. Perfect timing.
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: Cause it's, we are in spooky season.
• 12:03
  Speaker 3: It works so well. I think people were way too
• 12:05
  Speaker 3: hard on the character of Corey. Uh, I like his
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: character a lot. I, uh, There's even moments in that
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: movie that, like, I've seen it before. And if you
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: can still make my jaw literally drop to the floor,
• 12:17
  Speaker 3: that's impressive.
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: You get to see what I like about Kill. And sorry.
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: Your dog's farting.
• 12:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, she's just over here passed out.
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: Just farting. Frankie. So what I love about ends is
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: you get to see the impact Michael had on a
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: town because it takes place a few years later. So
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: you get to see the impact he's had on an
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: entire town, which you really don't get to see that.
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: So I love that aspect of it because you're dealing
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: with the town. It's like, is he coming back? He
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: really fucked us up.
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: This is also the most fleshed out Haddonfield has ever felt.
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: 100%. 100%.
• 13:00
  Speaker 3: I also love, too, that Haddonfield in 2018 and Kills
• 13:05
  Speaker 3: feels one and the same. They feel reminiscent of each other,
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: and they feel reminiscent of the Haddonfield that we were
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: given in Halloween 1978. What I love about the Haddonfield
• 13:17
  Speaker 3: in Halloween Ends is we're seeing the parts of Haddonfield,
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: the more seedy parts of Haddonfield that we never saw before.
• 13:25
  Speaker 3: you know the under the overpasses if you look at
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: lori's house just look at lori's house which is a
• 13:29
  Speaker 3: beautiful nice little house look at all the houses around
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: her they're run down and and like shit it reminds
• 13:34
  Speaker 3: me of the house in barbarian it's like it's the
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: only good house on the block.
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah no i agree i agree uh i i
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: i'm a huge defender of uh dgg and his trilogy
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: so um And.
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: The movies are written by Kenny fucking Powers, so that's fun. Exactly.
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: I love Danny McBride.
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: My only complaint about those films is, because one thing
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: those movies do very well, and I love, is every
• 14:01
  Speaker 3: character almost has a moment. They have something that just
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: kind of separates them so they're not just a nameless character.
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: They have either a little moment, or like Halloween Kills,
• 14:12
  Speaker 3: you have that couple that dies early in the film,
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: and you have the dude and his fucking drone. It's
• 14:16
  Speaker 3: just a funny, silly little moment that gives him something
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: so he's not just a name on a page. Or
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: the kid that the girl was babysitting in 2018, he's
• 14:26
  Speaker 3: just a little shit. So many characters have their little moment.
• 14:32
  Speaker 3: The only character we don't get anything with is the
• 14:36
  Speaker 3: sheriff in the cowboy hat, the black sheriff in the
• 14:38
  Speaker 3: cowboy hat. We never really learn his fucking story.
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: I would love a little bit more of him. Cause
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: he was like one of my favorite.
• 14:46
  Speaker 3: I love that dude. And the one in kills when
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: he's sitting on the stairs, looking at his crushed cowboy hat,
• 14:52
  Speaker 3: like it's one of the most unintentionally funny shots, but
• 14:55
  Speaker 3: it's like, he's, he's, it's not, it's less the cowboy
• 14:57
  Speaker 3: hat and more just like, you know, I think it's
• 15:00
  Speaker 3: supposed to, to, to be a conduit for, you know, uh, of, um,
• 15:06
  Speaker 3: you know, his authority was essentially stepped on. No one
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: respected him or the police. And even though, like, normally
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: a police officer gets involved and people will stop in
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: these type of situations. And, you know, he still got
• 15:18
  Speaker 3: trampled with everyone else. So it's like, you know, it's thematic.
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: But I also just love him just staring at his
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: cup like that.
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: I recommend everyone revisit it because if especially if you
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: didn't like it, I always love watching movies that I
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: didn't like and giving them another chance. So I'm going
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: to advocate for that. Did you end up watching Jaws
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: the Revenge yet?
• 15:38
  Speaker 3: Not yet.
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: Oh my, okay, then I'll go on a quick little
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: thing for my Hooptober.
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: I've been pushing it off, man. I don't want to
• 15:45
  Speaker 3: watch it.
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: Okay, so I told this last episode, but I'll tell
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: you this. So I hadn't seen two or three. And yeah,
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: I could have just jumped to the fourth one. They're
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: not really related. They're very loosely related. But I was like,
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: I'm a completionist. Let me just watch these movies. Two
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: was fine. 3D was awful. Jaws the Revenge is one
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: of the biggest wastes. And I'm not trying to... make
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: you not want to watch this less. It's really the
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: story itself. And once you find out what the name means,
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: it's the biggest fucking eye roll in existence. So that's
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: my Hooptober. I also rewatched Jacob's, or not rewatched, watched
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: Jacob's Wife, a great vampire flick with Larry.
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I like Jacob's Wife.
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I said that last episode. Watched The
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: Monkey for Cursed.
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: Cursed object week or whatever it was and then for
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: my cmc challenge it was zombie week and i watched
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: the dead don't die a movie that like has terrible
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: ratings i fucking loved it i don't.
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: Know is that the the jim jarmusch film.
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah it's really good it's a situation where zombies are
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: are coming out of the ground and everyone is so
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: deadpan and unserious about it adam driver Bill Murray, Chloe's Avenia,
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: however you say her name, fucking Rosie Perez. Like the
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: cast is Steve Buscemi. I loved it. It's very untraditional
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: when it comes to the, how the zombies come about,
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: but it's fun. Like, cause zombies already are not a
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: real thing. So who fucking cares how they come about?
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: I don't really need an in-depth explanation. People accept virus, uh,
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: you know, airborne pathogens. Why aren't we accepting what happened
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: in this? Whatever. But I really enjoyed it. Gave it
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: a four out of five. And then I watched a
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: new movie for this year that came out for one
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: show time. It's called never after dark. And it is a,
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: it's the one I sent.
• 17:50
  Speaker 3: You a message about this.
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: Holy shit. I believe it to J horror. And it's just,
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: it's like a little bit of a slow burn. I was,
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: I was sitting there kind of like, okay, I like
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: what's happening, but where are we going with this? And
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: then from the second to third act, it is just
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: this escalation of absolute madness. Easily going to be in
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: my top five horror this year. Highly, highly recommend that
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: if you're into Japanese horror or just Asian horror, whatever.
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: It is so good. I think that's all I have
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: for now because I'm still trying to catch up on Hooptober.
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: But let's go to the body count. Run through this
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: quickly here so we can get to the movie at hand.
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: Hocum from this year, baby. Released on May 1st. Rated
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: R for some violent, disturbing content and language. No sex
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: and nudity. Moderate violence and gore. Moderate profanity. Moderate alcohol, drugs,
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: and smoking. Severe, frightening, and intense scenes. Runtime of an
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: hour and 47 minutes. Listed as a horror thriller. Directed
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: by Damian McCarthy. He also did Caveat and Oddity. Written
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: by the same man who wrote the same movies. Composed
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: by Joe Beshara, he has basically scored everything in the
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: Conjuring universe, including the Conjuring 1 through 3, Annabelle 1
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: and 3, Insidious 1 through 6. The man is clearly
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: getting fucking paid.
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: He also plays the Darth Maul demon in Insidious.
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's right! I remember reading that so long ago
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: and I totally forgot. Good for him. um cinematography by
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: colm hogan he did the cinematography for oddity edited by
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: brian david phillips oops brian phillip davids and um brian
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: phillip davis jesus he edited the devil's doorway super underrated
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: and oddity of course we have adam scott starring as
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: owen bauman I'm going to assume most people know him
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: from Parks and Rec as Ben Wyatt or Severance as
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: Mark Scout.
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: He's always going to be the dude from Piranha for me.
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: Okay, fair, fair. That's fair. Yeah, we talked about that
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: one last year.
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: Where's the mother? Yeah. One of my favorite beats of
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: the movie ever.
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: This is where it gets weird. Michael Patrick as Fergal,
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: who was also in A Dog's Purpose as Sam. Will
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: O'Connell as Albie slash Jack. So the guy who plays
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: Albie plays Jack the Rabbit. I haven't seen his other work.
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: We've got Brendan Conroy as Cobb. He was also in
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: The Green Knight as Tavern Gower. Peter Coonan, who I
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: thought I recognized as Mal, but I haven't seen anything else.
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: And then the same thing goes with Florence Ordesh as Fiona.
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: Don't know what else she's done. Estimated budget of NA
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: grossing $ 25 million. filmed in Skibbereen County, Cork, Ireland, and
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: Abu Dhabi, United Arab Emirates, for these desert scenes. You
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: can watch this on Hulu. Movies that came out around
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: the same time, I mean, we're literally living in this timeline,
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: but in case you live under a rock, you've got Backrooms, Michael,
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: The Drama, The Sheep Detectives, The Devil Wears Prada 2,
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: The Mandalorian and Grogu, Toy Story 5, Mortal Kombat 2,
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: Super Mario Galaxy, Lee Cronin's The Mummy, Thrash, Passenger, Teenage
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: Sex and Death, too long of a title. Deep Water,
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: Faces of Death, Pinocchio Unstrung, Her Private Hell, The Yeti,
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: and Corporate Retreat. IMDB summary, a horror writer visits an
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: Irish inn to scatter his parents' ashes, unaware that the
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: property is said to be haunted by a witch. Here
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: is your favorite sound, the autopsy.
• 21:27
  Speaker 3: Gross.
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: All right, Michael. Was this the.
• 21:31
  Speaker 3: First time watched for you? Oh, hell no, dude. This
• 21:33
  Speaker 3: is the third time I've seen this movie. Oh, same.
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: Third time for me this year as well. Perfect.
• 21:37
  Speaker 3: I saw it the first time at the Milwaukee Film Festival.
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's right. That's right.
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: All right.
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: Well, then tell me your overall thoughts for Hokem. What
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: do we have?
• 21:45
  Speaker 3: All right. So it is a movie that I originally
• 21:49
  Speaker 3: saw at the Milwaukee Film Festival. As I stated, it
• 21:51
  Speaker 3: was actually a film that the Shameless Picture Show, my podcast,
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: was the community partner for. So it was Shameless Picture
• 21:58
  Speaker 3: Show Presents.
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: That's right. That's right. I know you presented one. I
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: thought it was... thought it was something else like you.
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: Know it was goddamn hokum that's awesome um movie played
• 22:09
  Speaker 3: gangbusters in the theater which was just phenomenal like there
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: was a a moment like a jump scare when om
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: was in the room that made the woman behind me
• 22:20
  Speaker 3: jump and scare so much it scared me.
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: I think i have speculation on that and i will
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: confirm with you once we start.
• 22:28
  Speaker 3: Our review but i will say So I recently got
• 22:32
  Speaker 3: this in the mail from Alliance Entertainment, which I assume
• 22:34
  Speaker 3: you also got.
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: Yes. Shout out Alliance.
• 22:37
  Speaker 3: Yep. Shout out to them. And I rewatched it and
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: the scares don't work nearly as well. And it's not
• 22:43
  Speaker 3: because like, oh, I know they're coming. They just, for
• 22:46
  Speaker 3: some reason, without the tension of being in the room
• 22:49
  Speaker 3: with a bunch of other people, they don't, for me
• 22:52
  Speaker 3: at least, don't have nearly the effect they do. And
• 22:54
  Speaker 3: that's not to say they're not good scares. They're just,
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: because like, and it has nothing to do with having
• 22:58
  Speaker 3: seen it before because it's Like there are still times
• 23:01
  Speaker 3: where a scare can still work for me, but there
• 23:04
  Speaker 3: was something missing watching it at home, but I still
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: enjoyed it. And then I watched it a third time
• 23:09
  Speaker 3: with the commentary.
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: Excellent. Okay. Yeah. So for me, yes, I've also seen
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: it three times. I saw it by myself in theaters
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: because Gabby couldn't make it. And then I drug her
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: to the theater because I was like, you need to
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: see this.
• 23:21
  Speaker 3: You mean you brought her through the theater?
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: I was like, you are, yeah.
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: You didn't drug your wife to get her to go
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: to the movies.
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: Oh, sorry, dragged her. Oh, man, yeah. Sorry, not drugging her. No,
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: I took her. You know what? I took her.
• 23:37
  Speaker 3: It was a date. It was a nice time.
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: It was a date. No drugs involved. Um, so we
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: watched it, she loved it. And then I got the
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: Alliance copy and hadn't watched it until, uh, this that
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: we're doing now. I love this movie. I think Damian
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: McCarthy is one of the stronger voices and up and comer.
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: If you've seen caveat, it is a solid movie. I
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: really enjoy it. Oddity improves upon, um, his style, his, his, how,
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: you know, just how he makes a movie. And then Hocum,
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: I feel like he, he is, he is, fucking like
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: he is honed in with this movie. So I'm very
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: excited to see what else he does. But yeah, I
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: love this movie. Every time there's one scare that still
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: works for me every single time. Uh, there's a couple
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: other ones that still get me, but I love this movie.
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: I'm very excited to dive in here. I'm just trying
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: to figure out how to talk about this movie. Be like,
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: do we talk about the wraparound segment first? Do we
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: break down home as a character? Uh, I don't know.
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: I have a lot of notes here and we can
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: go in a lot of different ways, but I don't
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: know if we should kind of set up, you know,
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: with the, the whole opening scene because when I, let's, let's, okay.
• 24:50
  Speaker 3: You only, you can only begin once you begin. So
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: let's begin.
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: Let's begin. So I literally, when I walked into the theater,
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: it was just playing cause I was meeting Spencer there
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: and I was like, is this the right mood? Why
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: are we in the desert? I was so confused.
• 25:06
  Speaker 3: I do have a, I do have a story about that.
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: Sure.
• 25:08
  Speaker 3: Um, So I listened to the commentary and Damian McCarthy,
• 25:13
  Speaker 3: which this is a beautiful commentary. If you don't mind
• 25:16
  Speaker 3: me just, you know, going on a slight tangent for
• 25:18
  Speaker 3: a second, because sometimes you listen to a commentary and
• 25:21
  Speaker 3: especially a commentary where there's been some time. Um, the
• 25:25
  Speaker 3: filmmaker doesn't like, sometimes you get a commentary where, um,
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: they're just really digging into like the, you know, the
• 25:35
  Speaker 3: theory side of their own film. This one was interesting
• 25:38
  Speaker 3: because Damian McCarthy, it's really nuts and bolts commentary of like,
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: here's what I wrote. Here's why we couldn't do it.
• 25:44
  Speaker 3: Here's all the mistakes that we had throughout the film.
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: Here's why we had to change things. And it's a
• 25:50
  Speaker 3: very well-crafted film. And it just goes to show you
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: that shit happens. And sometimes you have to just fucking
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: go on the fly. And one of the big things
• 25:58
  Speaker 3: that changed from the beginning of the film or from
• 26:03
  Speaker 3: the original draft of the film is originally the scenes
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: with Adam Scott in this intro didn't exist. That was
• 26:08
  Speaker 3: a pickup shot they did months after finishing the film.
• 26:12
  Speaker 3: It just was the conquistador stuff. And then after that stuff,
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: it would hard cut to Ulm in Ireland. And it
• 26:20
  Speaker 3: was confusing the audience. Like, wait, was this the right movie?
• 26:24
  Speaker 3: What are we seeing? And he thought that, well, I
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: think we need something else to kind of hold the
• 26:32
  Speaker 3: audience's hand. Um, and his whole thing was like, well,
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: I'm going to like, I, he's like, I need to
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: figure out how, like what the best way to do
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: this is. And he remembers the circle in the sand.
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: So that's how he came up with the visual that
• 26:46
  Speaker 3: Om is drinking. And there's a, a ring on the
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: table and that's kind of his visual match cut. So
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: originally in this film that didn't exist. And for that
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: exact reason, because he didn't want people to be too lost.
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: I love that because that's one of my favorite because
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: like circles are a very big part of this movie.
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: And I like that when he picks up his, you know, he.
• 27:08
  Speaker 3: Happy accident.
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah. The shot is overhead and the conquistador with his
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: little traveler is a circle. And then it cuts to
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: Adam Scott with the water ring setting down his drink.
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: And I was like, ooh, yes, yes. That was very nice.
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: And it's so thematic, and then you assume that, well,
• 27:25
  Speaker 3: that query must have been in the script. Nope, wasn't
• 27:27
  Speaker 3: even planned.
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: Sometimes you get the best stuff from unplanned things that
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: you didn't have. So, all right, let's talk about the
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: Conquistador then because the unfinished, he's doing a trilogy and
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: it's unfinished, and it's one of the film's most revealing
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: elements because it gives us a parallel story that reflects
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: Ohm's internal state because at the beginning, Oma is struggling
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: to complete the final book. You know, the story follows
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: a conquistador, a child in the desert with characters, uh,
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: where they attempt to break a bottle becoming increasingly, uh,
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: making it, they can't break this bottle.
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: Uh, and, uh, it's a funny amusing, I have a
• 28:08
  Speaker 3: funny anecdote from the commentary about that too.
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: Oh Jesus.
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: Where they said that bottle is actually increasingly easy to break.
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: And the first time the actor threw it and it
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: hit the sand, it shattered. Okay.
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: Okay. So, yeah, that bottle, at least from what I'm,
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: you know, picking up here is, you know, Bramberson's an
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: obstacle that cannot be overcome through ordinary means. So he,
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: the conquistador, he needs something. And the solution he comes
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: up with is bashing over the, the, the bottle over
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: the kid's head to achieve his goal. But before we
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: see the conquistador do that, we cut. So we don't
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: know if that is what's going to happen because they
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: kind of, it's bookended with the Conquistador trilogy. He does
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: talk about it to the bartender at one point and like, oh,
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: that's a bleak ending. I'm not going to read that book.
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: Rightfully so, because that's crazy. So, you know, but I
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: think this represents Ohm's own physical predicament. Like he wants
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: relief from this guilt that he has, but he has
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: convinced himself that the only way to obtain this is
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: through suffering. Like the conquistador, he becomes trapped in a
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: destructive logic where the solution to this problem requires another
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: kind of harm. And it's a very interesting parallel between
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: the two that I don't think... I mean, the movies
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: obviously still would have worked, but the addition of the
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: Kikisador book ending the film and how he revises it
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: in the middle of the movie, or I guess towards
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: the end of the movie to have a more satisfying
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: ending shows not only growth of the story, but change
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: within Ohm after what he's experienced. And it really makes
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: me it spoke to me directly as a former, you know,
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: I say former alcoholic, but once an alcoholic, always an
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: alcoholic that people can get better. And that hit me
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: so hard at the end when he realized he could
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: make the story in a different way and process his
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: trauma at the same time. I was almost in tears
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: at that moment because I was like, Oh man, It's
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: so beautiful.
• 30:24
  Speaker 3: Also without having to necessarily change the person he is.
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: It's not like an end of the Christmas Carol where
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: he's like, I'm going to dedicate my life to good.
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: I also love that in the ending scene with Albie.
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: I know we're skipping around a little bit.
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: It's fine. We're good.
• 30:45
  Speaker 3: He's still a little saucy. Towards Albie. Yeah, yeah.
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: He's still getting a little fast.
• 30:50
  Speaker 3: He's still who he is, but probably going to come
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: out of this as a more well-adjusted person. And I
• 30:58
  Speaker 3: think that was a note from Adam Scott. Because I
• 31:01
  Speaker 3: think he said in the original script, he was like
• 31:07
  Speaker 3: 180 change towards Albie. And he's like, I think we
• 31:10
  Speaker 3: still need a little bit. Just to show that the
• 31:13
  Speaker 3: person he was is still there, but he's trying. Right.
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: He's trying. Right, because when Albie approaches him with his
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: manuscript or whatever, he literally takes a spoon, gets that
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: spoon hot, hits his hand with it, and he's like,
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: you need tougher skin. And by the end, he's like,
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: all right, show it to me. So he's still the
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: same person in regards to the kind of snarky, sassy
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: nature that he has, but he is definitely more receptive
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: to other people because he has completely, I wouldn't say completely,
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: But he kind of just doesn't really associate with people.
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: He isolates. And that's the biggest problem with anyone going
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: through grief and trauma, alcoholism, what have you, is the isolation.
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: But when he opens himself up to Albie and still
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: gives him that sass, but he's like, you know, send
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: it my way. That's how natural growth works. Because you're right.
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: You're not going to come out of the other end
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: of the story and just be, bink, fixed. I've been
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: working on myself since I got sober for two years. Yes,
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: I'm still the same person, but how I handle things
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: is completely different than how I used to handle things.
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: So I think this movie has an incredibly strong and
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: powerful message that is on the ends of the film
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: and then just utter terror and horror throughout the middle.
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: It truly is a masterfully done movie. Yeah.
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: And I'm also a fan of... bookends like this i
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: i i like a movie that kind of plays around
• 32:44
  Speaker 3: with time and space a little bit and you know
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: so like when the conquistador stuff was on screen i'm
• 32:49
  Speaker 3: like oh this is kind of cool this is not
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: where i was expecting this to start and um it's
• 32:55
  Speaker 3: a nice little a nice little uh nice little moment.
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah and it's pretty safe to assume that the child
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: in the conquistador story is very significant because of Ohm's trauma.
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: Ohm's trauma originates from childhood, and as an adult, he
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: never fully separated the child who, spoiler alert, accidentally killed
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: his mom from the man he's become now. So he
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: continues to judge his younger self as though that child
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: should have possessed the understanding and emotional maturity of an adult,
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: which is impossible. So the child in the Conquistador story
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: can therefore be interpreted as as a reflection of Ohm's
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: younger self, vulnerable, caught in circumstances he cannot fully control,
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: and potentially sacrificed to satisfy another person's desperation. So I
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: love the parallels between what he's writing and what's going
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: on in the movie. And then, of course, like we've mentioned,
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: by the end, he changes the book. Instead of maintaining
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: the bleak logic, he chooses a more hopeful conclusion, in
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: which the child breaks the bottle on the conquistador... And
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: embraces him. And they embrace, and then the camera pulls
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: down to reveal a skull of something, like a steer
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: or something, which is like, we can go break it
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: on that because those skulls are tough as shit. So
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: I love that he was able to change that. He
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: forgave himself for what he did, put that into the story,
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: and gave the story hope that both of these people
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: in the Conquistador little trilogy thing could... Find a way
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: to break that bottle, get the map, and survive. It's
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: such a heartwarming moment in the story. Agreed.
• 34:40
  Speaker 3: Very well said.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So that's kind of the, like I said, that's
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: kind of the bookend here with that. And again, like
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: I said, when I first went in, I was a
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: little confused. I'm not going to lie. But then by
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: the time it came back around and you get the
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: intercutting in the beginning of.
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: Him writing and stuff like that. I was like, oh, okay,
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: he's a writer, got it. And it says he's a
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: writer in the description, but I didn't know he was
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: actively writing. I do wonder, though, because in the beginning
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: of that movie, he sees someone on the stairs and
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: he puts the light up there and they're gone. And then, boom,
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: they're behind him. Is that the mother?
• 35:22
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's the mother.
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: That is one of my complaints about that opening scene
• 35:29
  Speaker 3: is it's not terribly clear. You can make this, after
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: you've watched the movie, you can put it together, but
• 35:37
  Speaker 3: then also, to what end? Why is the mom haunting her? him. Right.
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: And I see, and it doesn't, it really didn't make
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: sense because the person on the stairs looks like a
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: very short individual. I mean, I don't know how the
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: tall the mom is, but I was like, okay, sure. Whatever.
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: Maybe that was just there to, I don't know. Maybe
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: the mom was there to try to guide him, but
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: I don't know why they made it a jump scare.
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: That's like really one of my only, it's such a
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: minor issue that it doesn't affect my rating, but.
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: No, no, but it is, it is kind of confusing.
• 36:07
  Speaker 3: I had a, it's a different movie, but I had,
• 36:10
  Speaker 3: A moment like that very recently with another movie that
• 36:14
  Speaker 3: I watched. Give me one second. I need to find
• 36:17
  Speaker 3: the title of it. It's a movie called Dragonfly that
• 36:23
  Speaker 3: has Kevin Costner in it. And it's a movie where
• 36:26
  Speaker 3: his wife dies. And he thinks his wife died. He
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: is not 100% sure. And he believes he's being haunted
• 36:35
  Speaker 3: by her. And the entire time I'm like, If your
• 36:39
  Speaker 3: wife's trying to communicate with you, why is she using
• 36:41
  Speaker 3: the fucking spookiest images ever? Like, is she trying to
• 36:44
  Speaker 3: scare you or trying to give you signs? And that's
• 36:46
  Speaker 3: kind of how this felt. I'm like, why is the
• 36:48
  Speaker 3: mom haunting him? I get it. He's haunted by what
• 36:51
  Speaker 3: he did. Right. But that's not how ghosts work.
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: That's not how ghosts work. So, fun fact, in case
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: you don't know, because I didn't know until I looked
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: it up afterwards. I was wondering... because he does say
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: hokum in the movie, but then that's kind of it.
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: Hokum is actually like nonsense or, you know, something that
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: people dismissed as being unbelievable. So that's kind of fun.
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: I like that the title kind of ties into what's
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: going on.
• 37:21
  Speaker 3: I just assumed everyone knew what that word, I use
• 37:22
  Speaker 3: it all the time.
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: Okay. Yeah. I wasn't sure. So yeah, it means nonsense.
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: And that's kind of a theme throughout this entire movie,
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: because there are points where you're like, am I seeing
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: what's really happening or, Or am I seeing the visions
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: of a man on mushrooms that he doesn't know he's
• 37:40
  Speaker 1: on mushrooms until Jerry tells him later?
• 37:42
  Speaker 3: That is something I wanted to talk about.
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: Perfect.
• 37:46
  Speaker 3: If you don't mind me transitioning into my thoughts on that.
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: Nope, that's perfect.
• 37:50
  Speaker 3: Because that is something that I was thinking about more
• 37:54
  Speaker 3: so on the second viewing than I did the first one,
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: especially with the way it ties into Jack, the Jackass,
• 38:00
  Speaker 3: the children's show character. Mm-hmm. Because my first thought, when
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: I first watched this, and you're just kind of experiencing
• 38:06
  Speaker 3: the film, I'm like, man, what a weird fucking kids
• 38:09
  Speaker 3: show character. Horrifying, yeah. But then I'm like, no, this
• 38:14
  Speaker 3: is not how the character looks. This is just how
• 38:16
  Speaker 3: he remembers it.
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: Ooh, that's true.
• 38:19
  Speaker 3: This is how he remembers it. And now that he's
• 38:23
  Speaker 3: especially on drugs, he has to kind of confront it.
• 38:26
  Speaker 3: And it's more so a... an amalgamation of all that
• 38:31
  Speaker 3: trauma that he has around killing his mother, and he's
• 38:35
  Speaker 3: on mushrooms. And actually, the commentary even kind of solidifies this. Like,
• 38:39
  Speaker 3: when he is seeing Jack the Jackass on television in
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: the room, and he's watching it, if you look at
• 38:47
  Speaker 3: his glasses, there's just static in his glasses. They said
• 38:51
  Speaker 3: they had a take. They did the visual effects where
• 38:54
  Speaker 3: you saw what he was watching on his glasses, but
• 38:57
  Speaker 3: they're like, if we show that, then it confirms that
• 39:01
  Speaker 3: this is all real.
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: I did read that, that there were, basically, anytime you
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: can see a reflection in his glasses, that's either what's
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: actually happening, so yeah, that was a pretty.
• 39:15
  Speaker 3: Here are just the imaginations of a man on mushrooms
• 39:18
  Speaker 3: who is processing, which then also leads to the whole
• 39:21
  Speaker 3: concept of wondering how much of what's happening is happening. Right.
• 39:27
  Speaker 3: Is the witch real? Is this something that he made up?
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: And yeah the the whole like the mushrooms being either
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: a hallucination or a doorway because you have the crazy
• 39:38
  Speaker 1: jerry out in the woods my favorite character.
• 39:40
  Speaker 3: The real jerry's the best the.
• 39:41
  Speaker 1: Real mvp of this movie he at one point is
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: talking about uh well i guess when they first meet
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: in the woods after ohm scatters the ashes and uh
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: jerry scares the shit out of him and he's like
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: oh you want to drink and he's like i think
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: i need something stronger than milk and he's like oh
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: here you go it's this and this and he's like
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: is it moonshine he's like no no it's this and
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: he drinks he's like yeah that's moonshine and then he
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: tells uh ohm that he's basically you know doing mushrooms
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: and uh goat's milk or whatever that's how he likes
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: it so he goes on to say that he had
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: a trip one time because his wife was terminally ill.
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: He took her life to put her out of her misery.
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: And when he was on a mushroom trip, he had
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: seen her and he, and she was like, we're going
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: to be together again. And, you know, of course, of course,
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: Ohm thinks it's hokum. It's nonsense. He's like, sure, whatever,
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: whatever you want to believe. And he's like, no, it
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: fucking happened. She said we were going to be together again.
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: So it's like, is, is, are the mushrooms hallucinations or
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: is it just, the doorway to seeing things that you
• 40:44
  Speaker 1: might not be able to see with your naked eye.
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: It's a very interesting point. You could go either way
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: with it. Um, and I really like that.
• 40:51
  Speaker 3: There is no right answer.
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: And that's my favorite part about it. I like when
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: a movie presents you something and gives you two options
• 40:58
  Speaker 1: and you can choose to believe whichever one you want.
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: I like to think it's a little column, a column B. Um,
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: like when, uh, the first moment outside of the little
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: scare that Ohm has with his mom, uh, when he's
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: writing is after he tries to take his life. And
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: what I find not funny about this, but he mentioned
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: that the person who killed his mom should have been hanged.
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: And then that's the way he tries to take himself out.
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: It's very poetic, uh, like, or unpoetic justice, I guess,
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: if you want it, if that's, that's even a thing. Um,
• 41:33
  Speaker 1: So that's the way he tries to take himself out.
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: But after he recovers in the hospital, you see a
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: hand touch his shoulder and it's clearly his mom's hand
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: because you see that same person with the yellow sleeves
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: embrace him once we find out that he accidentally killed
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: his mom. And I thought that that was the moment
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: after he had a brush with death that he became
• 41:57
  Speaker 1: susceptible to seeing certain spirits. And I think The mushrooms
• 42:03
  Speaker 1: amplified that to a whole new level because ultimately his
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: mom is there to kind of guide him through his grief.
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: He just kept apologizing like it was an accident. It
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: was an accident when he's down in the basement and
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: he's chained up. So it's a very interesting point. I
• 42:22
  Speaker 1: do like to think that after a brush with death,
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: you do have some, especially because I'm pretty sure he
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: was dead and then had to be resuscitated. You definitely
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: are going to have some connection with the other side
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: after that, if there is another side, if that's what
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: you believe in.
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: This is a perfect movie for, Amanda has a list
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: of movies that wouldn't exist if the characters went to therapy.
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's a great list. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's just,
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: it's like it happened to him so young, though. I mean, yes,
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: therapy would definitely help. Absolutely. I agree with that. But
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: when something like that happens so young and then your
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: father becomes an alcoholic and drinks himself to death and
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: now you have no parents, you have no guiding force,
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: you have no way to navigate the world, that is
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: a shitty situation. And the reveal that he was the
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: one responsible for killing his mom was one of the
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: most heartbreaking moments of horror this year for me. I
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: was like, oh, oh, that happened. And like the oranges
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: roll and the milk rolls out. And I was like,
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: oh no, it was him. And of course he's watching
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: the Jack show at that point. But yeah, the mushrooms
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: are an interesting aspect of that because he doesn't know
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: he was on mushrooms until I think after he, after
• 43:38
  Speaker 1: everything he's experienced, or I don't remember exactly when Jerry
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: says he put mushrooms in there because he finished all
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: the alcohol. So he was probably tripping for quite some time.
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: But it's an interesting element to bring in there because
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: it just kind of fucks with your mind.
• 43:54
  Speaker 3: Doesn't the mushrooms come when they're in the middle of
• 43:58
  Speaker 3: the night when they're planned to sneak into the hotel
• 44:03
  Speaker 3: at night and they're just kind of sitting under the
• 44:05
  Speaker 3: stars talking to each other? Isn't that when it came?
• 44:08
  Speaker 3: I don't remember.
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: Right before they break into the hotel after the last
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: person leaves, that's when Jerry is telling him about the trip.
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: I just don't remember the exact moment when he says
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: he spiked his drink. Because as we know, Jerry dies
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: towards the end of the movie. But yeah, there is
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: a moment where he basically tells him, like, yeah, I
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: spiked your.
• 44:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I remember that. Like you, I'm trying to remember
• 44:32
  Speaker 3: exactly when it came. I thought it was the nighttime scene,
• 44:36
  Speaker 3: but I could be wrong.
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So you have all of that going on. We
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: talked about, briefly touched on the suicide attempt, because I
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: think at this point... after scatter, I think Ohm was
• 44:48
  Speaker 1: trying to, you know, final gesture of scattering his parents' ashes. Um,
• 44:54
  Speaker 1: but it could also be interpreted as an attempt to
• 44:57
  Speaker 1: find closure when he's run out of other ways to
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: move forward. And I don't think that did it for him.
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: You know, the problem is he, he arrives at this
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: hotel without having the develop, develop the emotional tools to
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: achieve the closure. He can scatter the ashes and, But
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: he can't scatter the guilt that accompanies him. So, you know,
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: I guess I have a question here.
• 45:21
  Speaker 3: That was a nice line, Lawson. He can scatter the ashes,
• 45:23
  Speaker 3: but he can't scatter the guilt.
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: Thank you. So with movies like this, I try to
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: get really in-depth and come up with some good notes.
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: Hey, I haven't had to do much. You've got this covered.
• 45:37
  Speaker 1: So question. I've been doing questions to guests lately. So
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: do we think Ohm is genuinely seeking peace when he
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: visits the hotel or is he unconvincingly looking for an
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: ending that confirms his belief that he cannot be saved?
• 45:53
  Speaker 3: I think he's too jaded to actually believe that he, that's,
• 45:57
  Speaker 3: I think he, it's like his equivalent to, to go
• 46:01
  Speaker 3: in there, you know, is when, and let me stress
• 46:05
  Speaker 3: by saying I'm not a religious person, but when like,
• 46:08
  Speaker 3: Overly unreligious people are being like, well, good, it's real.
• 46:12
  Speaker 3: Have them make a sign right now. They're going into
• 46:15
  Speaker 3: the situation very jaded, not wanting to believe. But I
• 46:20
  Speaker 3: think there's a small part of him that hopes that
• 46:22
  Speaker 3: this will fix him, but I don't think he actually
• 46:25
  Speaker 3: believes that it will.
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: Right, and I think that's the key factor in getting
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: over something is you have to believe it will help.
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: And I don't think he does. He's too jaded for that.
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: He's too jaded, yeah. I do love, though, when he
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: scatters his mom's ashes. He does it so nicely. Takes
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: out his dad and is just like, yeet! Like, yep,
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: fuck you. And that happens much before we know anything
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: about it. So immediately from that, I was like, all right, well,
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: something happened with his dad. What the fuck?
• 46:57
  Speaker 3: Essentially hacky-sacked him away.
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: He really did. That would be funny. And, you know,
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: I'd say his alcoholism is more than just a character
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: detail about him. It kind of reinforces the idea that
• 47:09
  Speaker 1: he has no healthy way of processing his past. Well,
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: and then.
• 47:13
  Speaker 3: He's fallen into the same, you know, world that his
• 47:16
  Speaker 3: father was in. Right. He resents his father for being
• 47:19
  Speaker 3: this person. So what am I going to do? I'm
• 47:21
  Speaker 3: going to become my father. Yeah.
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: Like drinking offers temporary relief from memories and emotions that
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: we don't know how to confront. Trust me. I've been there.
• 47:30
  Speaker 1: but it comes at a cost. Okay. It compromises your
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: judgment for one. It encourages isolation and it makes everything
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: easier to avoid doing the difficult word of work of
• 47:41
  Speaker 1: actually getting past grief. I have been there. So I
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: related to that. I'm like, ah, man, you're yes. The
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: alcohol is a great temporary solution, but long-term it is
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: not going to work. And just like you said, he's
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: just echoing his father's drinking. Um, so really what good
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: are you doing there? Because you saw what it did
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: to your father. Why do you want to repeat the cycle?
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: But that's how it happens. Sometimes alcoholism can be quote
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: unquote hereditary in a way. And I think that's what
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: he's falling into. And the cycle is particularly tragic because
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: Ohm appears to have internalized the worst parts of his
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: family history. Uh, even when his father's no longer there
• 48:23
  Speaker 1: to hurt him, he is still punishing himself. So he
• 48:27
  Speaker 1: has been holding onto that since he was a child
• 48:29
  Speaker 1: and has found no relief in figuring out a way
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: to move past it. Therapy probably would have helped getting
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: it out all on the table. You know, they don't actually,
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: they don't go into him ever doing that. So it's
• 48:40
  Speaker 1: just kind of assumed that he didn't do that with
• 48:43
  Speaker 1: how he acts and how he behaves and stuff like that.
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: But I think Ohm is one of them, like such
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: a fascinating character, especially in a horror movie, because I'm
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: not saying there aren't, plenty of characters in horror movies
• 48:56
  Speaker 1: that have a lot of layers. But this one, the
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: story behind him and the grief he's going through, it's
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: grief horror told to a completely different lens. It's not
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: like the hereditary, like familial trauma. He's dealing with his
• 49:10
  Speaker 1: own shit internally, trying to figure it out and realizing
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: that he can and he tries to take his life.
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: And then from there, goes into the hotel and a few... dead.
• 49:20
  Speaker 1: He's trying to figure out what's going on with Fiona.
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: And I think that near death experience kind of especially
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: when he found out who found him, Fiona, he's like, oh, fuck. OK,
• 49:30
  Speaker 1: can I you know, I can I talk to her?
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: Can I see her? It's like, oh, well, she's gone.
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: She went missing. And he's like, well, what do you
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: mean she went missing? And that leads us to Mal,
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: which is a funny name because Mal in Spanish means bad.
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: So already right off the cuff, I knew Mal was
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: up to no fucking good here. Let me tell you.
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: And there's a whole subplot in this movie where Mal
• 49:55
  Speaker 1: has knocked up Fiona. She is pregnant. And I think
• 49:59
  Speaker 1: Mal is also married. And instead of just, you know,
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: getting an abortion or doing whatever the woman would like
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: to do with the baby, I'm just going to kill her.
• 50:10
  Speaker 3: What is it with men?
• 50:11
  Speaker 1: It's like every true crime is like, well, I got
• 50:14
  Speaker 1: another girlfriend and I just don't want to break up
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: with this one, so let me kill her instead. Men's
• 50:19
  Speaker 1: logic is so fucking flawed when it comes to shit
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: like this.
• 50:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we do kind of suck.
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: We are the worst. So you have that whole subplot
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: and that is kind of the... I wouldn't say inciting incident,
• 50:33
  Speaker 1: but it is the moment where Ohm is like, all right, well,
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: I got to find out what happened to her because
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: no one just disappears. And that's how we get into
• 50:42
  Speaker 1: the whole hotel. The hotel's closed down. Jerry and Ohm
• 50:46
  Speaker 1: go in there. Jerry talks about how he saw Fiona
• 50:51
  Speaker 1: pointing at the honeymoon suite because- he does the whole
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: like weird the weird yeah and there is a little
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: bit of comedy peppered in which i really enjoyed.
• 50:59
  Speaker 3: That i found that was inspired by uh uh damon
• 51:03
  Speaker 3: mccarthy had seen long legs uh okay and had seen
• 51:07
  Speaker 3: like when my when um uh nicholas cage is at
• 51:11
  Speaker 3: the hardware store and he's just has these weird like
• 51:14
  Speaker 3: jet like uh way he articulates his body He was like,
• 51:18
  Speaker 3: I just thought that was really weird and kind of
• 51:20
  Speaker 3: a fun choice. So that was my little inspiration from
• 51:23
  Speaker 3: Long Legs.
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 51:25
  Speaker 3: He also references Evil Dead 2 a lot in that commentary.
• 51:29
  Speaker 1: Really? As inspiration for?
• 51:33
  Speaker 3: Three films that inspired this movie were The French Connection 2,
• 51:39
  Speaker 3: like the second one.
• 51:40
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 51:41
  Speaker 3: Kind of just some of Olm's characteristics. Evil Dead 2.
• 51:46
  Speaker 3: A little bit of long legs. And he actually references
• 51:49
  Speaker 3: Ohm's last name, Bauman, came because he's a big fan
• 51:53
  Speaker 3: of Red Letter Media.
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 51:58
  Speaker 3: Which, by the way, from Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Oh, nice. Shout out.
• 52:01
  Speaker 3: Shout out. One of the guys who runs Red Letter
• 52:04
  Speaker 3: Media's name is Jay Bauman. And he goes, that sounds American.
• 52:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sure, why not?
• 52:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 52:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, why not? So, yeah, that honeymoon suite, locked up.
• 52:15
  Speaker 1: You know, they say there's a witch locked up in there. Yada, yada, yada.
• 52:21
  Speaker 3: I don't know.
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: I mean, do I think the witch is real? I
• 52:25
  Speaker 1: do think the witch is real because... This.
• 52:30
  Speaker 3: Is actually where some of my biggest annoyances come from
• 52:33
  Speaker 3: this film.
• 52:34
  Speaker 1: Oh, do tell. Do tell.
• 52:35
  Speaker 3: Not enough that it ruins the film for me.
• 52:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 52:38
  Speaker 3: But I want more fucking lore. Like, when we are
• 52:43
  Speaker 3: first introduced to this hotel... Ohm walks in and the guy,
• 52:47
  Speaker 3: old dude who fucking runs the hotel is there telling
• 52:50
  Speaker 3: this scary story about witches coming, like coming out from
• 52:53
  Speaker 3: a tree and, you know, snatching children and shit, you know,
• 52:58
  Speaker 3: trying to scare them. Then here, here I think, oh, well, cool.
• 53:01
  Speaker 3: That's probably going to be the story that we're going
• 53:02
  Speaker 3: to be following. Why are we like, why are we
• 53:07
  Speaker 3: establishing this story about these witches and this tree and
• 53:11
  Speaker 3: all this? if it's going to be witches coming from
• 53:12
  Speaker 3: a basement. I wish the folklore that they would have
• 53:17
  Speaker 3: been kind of talking about throughout this story would have
• 53:21
  Speaker 3: been more related to the supposed witch that's in this hotel.
• 53:25
  Speaker 1: Well, they do say that the witch is trapped. So
• 53:28
  Speaker 1: I'm wondering if at one point.
• 53:31
  Speaker 3: But why?
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they don't really give you the explanation as to
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: why or how.
• 53:36
  Speaker 3: I don't need explanations necessarily so much as I just
• 53:39
  Speaker 3: want if you're going to try to tell me a
• 53:42
  Speaker 3: story that's based on legends and folklore, and then the
• 53:46
  Speaker 3: story that we actually have the film about is different
• 53:49
  Speaker 3: than like what, like tie them in a little bit more.
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, because he almost assumes that the honeymoon suite
• 53:57
  Speaker 1: is where his parents probably stayed when they came there. Because, uh,
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: if we didn't mention his parents visited that hotel and
• 54:05
  Speaker 1: there's a picture of his mom next to this giant
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: tree and that's where he bears the ashes. So, I'm wondering,
• 54:12
  Speaker 1: you know, like, how did the witch get there? Like
• 54:15
  Speaker 1: I said, I don't need a whole bunch of backstory,
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: but they do.
• 54:18
  Speaker 3: I think a little bit more tying it to the hotel.
• 54:21
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 54:21
  Speaker 3: Could have been good, especially because they're all convinced that
• 54:24
  Speaker 3: there's a witch in this suite. And I'm just consistently like,
• 54:29
  Speaker 3: but why?
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: But why? And it could entirely be that there is
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: no witch. It's a cautionary tale. For kids, you know,
• 54:40
  Speaker 1: those are very common in every culture. And the drugs
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: might have played a heavy impact in believing. Because, I mean,
• 54:48
  Speaker 1: you know, if you believe that there's a witch down
• 54:51
  Speaker 1: there and you're on drugs and you're in that hotel.
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: You're not going to have a good trip. Now, typically
• 54:59
  Speaker 1: you do not see things that are there. I have
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: done my fair share of mushrooms. You're not going to.
• 55:04
  Speaker 3: Really?
• 55:05
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I've done mushrooms and I've dropped
• 55:08
  Speaker 1: acid a couple times. Wild experiences.
• 55:10
  Speaker 3: I'm getting all the Austin Proctor lore.
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: You don't think. I mean, unless you do a heavy dose,
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: you might see something. But in my experiences with like
• 55:22
  Speaker 1: the four or five times I've tripped out on psychedelics.
• 55:25
  Speaker 1: I've never seen something that was not present in my world.
• 55:29
  Speaker 1: Your world is just more kind of breathing and shifting
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: and flowing and things that you see. Like we were
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: watching an animated movie and the animation is just kind of,
• 55:42
  Speaker 1: it has texture to it. So, but again, the, there
• 55:46
  Speaker 1: is a lot of stuff about, about tripping where you
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: just see things that aren't there. And, and I guess
• 55:50
  Speaker 1: if you're put in a situation where you believe there's
• 55:52
  Speaker 1: a witch and You're going to a creepy fucking basement
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: and you're on however many fucking mushrooms you're on. It's
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: entirely possible. You could imagine in the dark that you're
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: seeing something. But he also has the marks on his
• 56:06
  Speaker 1: wrists from the chains that the witch put on him.
• 56:09
  Speaker 1: So it's like, you know, did he? I don't know.
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: It's something that.
• 56:14
  Speaker 3: I kind of choose to believe that the witch in
• 56:17
  Speaker 3: the basement is real. But Jack the Jackass is in
• 56:21
  Speaker 3: his brain. Okay.
• 56:24
  Speaker 1: So, okay, so you believe the witch is real, but
• 56:26
  Speaker 1: you're unhappy with the lore that was set up around
• 56:30
  Speaker 1: the witch. Yeah. Got it. Okay, got it.
• 56:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like, you know, this is essentially the Crazy
• 56:35
  Speaker 3: Ralph moment. Like, imagine if at the beginning of Friday
• 56:39
  Speaker 3: the 13th, Crazy Ralph was telling some unrelated story that's
• 56:43
  Speaker 3: not about Camp Blood. Yeah.
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, fair, you're right. And I do wonder about that,
• 56:49
  Speaker 1: and I wonder why he was telling that, because there's also.
• 56:51
  Speaker 3: Because it would have been just as easy for that
• 56:53
  Speaker 3: same old man to be telling, it's like, well, here's
• 56:56
  Speaker 3: the story about why our hotel is haunted.
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: Sounded like Dracula there.
• 57:02
  Speaker 3: I didn't know how to do an Irish accent. So
• 57:06
  Speaker 3: I just went Eastern European.
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: Apparently.
• 57:10
  Speaker 3: I could have just done Loomis.
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: He was doing a good job last night.
• 57:14
  Speaker 3: The witch was doing a good job last night.
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: There you go. Yeah. So, I mean, I do like
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: to believe that the witch is real in some aspect,
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: especially because, you know, he does find chalk at some point.
• 57:28
  Speaker 1: He draws a circle around the bed. I mean, we
• 57:30
  Speaker 1: literally see the witch circling the bed. She can't cross
• 57:33
  Speaker 1: over that threshold because they established it earlier in the film.
• 57:36
  Speaker 1: And even when he's down in the basement, he does
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: draw a circle around but I don't know if he
• 57:40
  Speaker 1: completes that circle because as soon as he like stops
• 57:43
  Speaker 1: for a second, the witch is right there in his face.
• 57:46
  Speaker 3: So good moment. Good moment.
• 57:48
  Speaker 1: I think the witch too, I have a speculation that
• 57:53
  Speaker 1: she takes people who are inherently bad or who haven't
• 57:59
  Speaker 1: taken accountability for what they've done. Mal has clearly done
• 58:04
  Speaker 1: something bad. He has killed his pregnant mistress, uh, and
• 58:08
  Speaker 1: tried to hide it up. He knows he's bad. I
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: don't think Ohm necessarily knows, thinks he's bad. He just
• 58:16
  Speaker 1: has a jaded worldview and kind of treats people weird
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: and he cannot confront and get over his grief. And
• 58:22
  Speaker 1: he also tried to kill himself as well. So I
• 58:26
  Speaker 1: think that's why he was hooked up at first, but
• 58:29
  Speaker 1: he was able to escape with the file, which comes
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: in handy three times. That file opens up the box
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: with the picture of his parents and, The gun that
• 58:37
  Speaker 1: he used to shoot his mom accidentally. It also helps
• 58:41
  Speaker 1: Fiona cut him down from being hung and it helps
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: him escape. So I thought that was a pretty interesting
• 58:48
  Speaker 1: piece of equipment that he had that helped him get
• 58:50
  Speaker 1: out of everything. But I think the witch is attracted
• 58:53
  Speaker 1: to kind of malevolent people and people who are. Mainly men, honestly,
• 59:00
  Speaker 1: because if you think about it, Fiona was down there
• 59:02
  Speaker 1: and she didn't, I think she just died of not exposure,
• 59:06
  Speaker 1: but starvation, dehydration, whatever. She didn't get. attacked by a witch,
• 59:11
  Speaker 1: but I don't think she was inherently bad either. So
• 59:14
  Speaker 1: there's a lot of ways you can read this and
• 59:16
  Speaker 1: a lot of ways you can take it. And I
• 59:18
  Speaker 1: think that's fun because they give you all of the information.
• 59:22
  Speaker 1: It's not like it's completely ambiguous and you got to
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: figure it out. Now, here's all the information we're presenting you. Which,
• 59:28
  Speaker 1: which version do you like best? It's like a pick
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: your own or choose your own adventure. I'm fucking here
• 59:33
  Speaker 1: for that.
• 59:34
  Speaker 3: And this, that like, when we're talking about, you know,
• 59:37
  Speaker 3: when I was talking about earlier, when I feel like
• 59:38
  Speaker 3: I wanted more of the lore, once again, I don't
• 59:41
  Speaker 3: need everything explained like this type of ambiguity. I love,
• 59:45
  Speaker 3: I love, I just, I just want to be told
• 59:48
  Speaker 3: a story.
• 59:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I guess, I guess the lore matching up to
• 59:52
  Speaker 1: what was actually happening in the.
• 59:56
  Speaker 3: I know that. That was my thing. So it's like,
• 59:58
  Speaker 3: you know, what is this basement? Why does this basement exist?
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 3: Why is it so fucking inherently creepy? Why is there
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 3: a witch supposedly down here? Because I get why the
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 3: honeymoon suite is haunted because she can get up to it.
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 3: But why is she down here? Yeah, what's she doing?
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 3: Is she connected to the, is this somehow connected to
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 3: the tree? Like, that's what, that's just my thing. It's like.
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 3: It's almost there. Cause they keep, they talk about in
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 3: the tree in, in the, the Lord dump at the
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 3: beginning that she's crawling out of a tree.
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 1: Do we think that's the same fucking tree that Ohm's
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 1: mom was standing next to?
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 3: That's what I want to know. But the tree and like,
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 3: I feel like we're almost there of connecting everything and
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 3: we're not quite, it doesn't quite connect. You know what
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 3: I mean? Like I feel like there could have been
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 3: a really beautiful way to connect these things. And we
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 3: didn't ever quite get there.
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 1: I need to get Damien McCarthy on this fucking show.
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 1: I really do. And I just need to pick his brain.
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 3: Have me come on with you just so I can
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 3: be like, Damien, let's talk about it.
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 1: Let's talk about this.
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 3: And I even did some extra research. I was like, well,
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 3: what's the name of the hotel? And I was trying
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 3: to see if it's like another name for a tree
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 3: or something. It's not. But I was like, I was
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 3: trying everything I could to connect it to that story.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 3: And like I said, I love the Irish folklore side
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 3: of it. I just wished... Either the folklore matched the
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 3: story that's in the film or the story in the
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 3: film matched the folklore. And I feel like, especially because
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 3: they established a tree in there, I feel like we
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 3: are almost there.
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we're almost there. I'm going to do some more.
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 3: Digging after this. Needs another draft. We're almost there.
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 1: We're so close. So we've talked about basically everything that
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 1: I have here. The chains, the witch.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 3: Since we were talking about the basement, there wasn't originally
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 3: a different ending written. Really?
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 1: How was that going?
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 3: So originally, the movie ended with... He explains in the commentary,
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 3: and I don't remember all the details, so anyone listening,
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 3: I apologize, but go listen to the commentary. He explains
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 3: that Somehow, the story had changed a little bit. Ohm
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 3: actually had his laptop with him. Maybe because when the
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 3: fire started, he wanted to bring it with him just
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 3: so he didn't lose everything, like his writing and such.
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 3: But when he got trapped in the basement, and the
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 3: original final shot of the film was going to be
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 3: when Mal is being dragged away, Ohm is stuck there,
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 3: and he's not able to escape. And then he opens
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 3: up his laptop and finishes the story there.
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 1: Oh, interesting.
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 3: You know, I was almost like in a complete moment
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 3: of desperation. I got nothing else. And that's kind of
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 3: like his moment to repent is by showing his new worldview.
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 1: Was the mom involved in that ending where she is
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 1: there next?
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 3: I don't think he specifies.
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 3: But hey, go listen to the commentaries.
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 1: Oh, I'm definitely going to now. I do love a
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: good commentary because, again, that was one of the.
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 3: This commentary does something really annoying, though.
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 1: Oh, God, what?
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 3: So, I'm wondering if there might have been some editing
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 3: done with AI in it. Oh. You know, normally when
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 3: you listen to a commentary, the entire soundtrack is brought down.
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 3: This is, you know, every time Damien McCarthy's talking, it
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 3: sounds like how you are used to a commentary track talking,
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 3: but anytime he's not talking, the audio from the movie
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 3: comes back up again. Hmm. So there's times where if like,
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 3: if there's spaces in between, like slightly longer spaces in
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 3: between what he's saying, the music is going.
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah. That's weird. Usually it's at a, usually it's
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 1: at a pretty.
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah. It's, it's really weird. It's like almost every time
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 3: he's done talking, the audio for the movie comes back
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 3: up for just however long there is a gap. And
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 3: I'm like, that's a weird choice.
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 1: That is a weird choice. Okay. So whether his mother
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 1: was there or not, that's fine. But I do like
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 1: the version we got because he was a- It's a
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 1: little more hopeful. It's a little more hopeful. It's a
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 1: little more impactful that he is able to finally move
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 1: on from his grief in a sense and then kind
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 1: of start over. He finishes the Conquistador trilogy and now
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 1: he's beginning a new chapter of his life with ideally
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 1: a new perspective on life because he even gives the
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 1: liquor back So that's progress. You know, he like Albie
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 1: hands him that bottle of liquor and he's like, you
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 1: know what? He's like, you have it. And I was like,
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 1: look at this. This is a positive message about alcoholism,
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 1: about moving on from grief, accepting things you've done and
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 1: getting past it. I was like, this is a fucking great,
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 1: great progress.
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 3: I also love Albie's dedication. He's not going to take
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 3: fucking no for an answer.
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 1: I love him so much. He's such a, he's like,
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 1: I love his energy. He's so great. I wish I
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 1: could read that manuscript. Um, but yeah, so, uh, man,
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 1: I mean, I have a lot of more notes, but
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 1: I mean, we've really, I'm gone like looking through them
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 1: and I'm like, yeah, we, we pretty much touched them.
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 1: I guess the last thing I'll say is, uh, I
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 1: did like the shining vibes I got from the ending
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 1: of the movie, even though in the, you know, the
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 1: steven or um the kubrick version it does not burn
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 1: down in the book the you know the hotel does
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 1: burn down and i'm like oh this is totally shining
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 1: vibes right now yeah so that was.
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 3: An alcoholic writer in a hotel.
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah exactly fuck yeah so uh any final thoughts for
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 1: you or anything you wanted to touch on before we
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 1: wrap up.
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 3: Here Still really enjoy this film. Like I said, and
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 3: part of the feeling like the scares didn't work as
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 3: well for me could have just been me. I might
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 3: just not have been as engaged in the film as
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 3: I was the first time. That's fair. That's not to
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 3: say that the movie doesn't work. Sometimes you're more engaged
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 3: than other times. I still think it's a very strong film,
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 3: and it is a highlight of the year. And my
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 3: hot take is I feel like this movie should have
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 3: done better much better, and I think it should have
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 3: been more on par with something like Obsession.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 1: I do too, honestly. I really feel that. I mean,
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 1: $ 25 million is still good. I'm assuming the budget.
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 3: Especially on a $ 5 million budget.
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's still pretty great, but I do feel like
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 1: it was deserving of at least $ 100 million because it
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 1: is really good, and it's very unique and original, and
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 1: Damian McCarthy has a very strong voice writing, directing, all
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 1: of that stuff. I did want to circle back, though.
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 1: The scare that happened when that lady behind you scared you,
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 1: was it the scene where Adam, sorry, Adam, where Om
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 1: walks out from behind something and his mother is directly
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 1: next to him? Was that it?
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 3: Oh, you mean like the Exorcist 3 kind of moment?
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 3: Almost? I think it was actually the moment where Jack
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 3: the Jackass turned out to be in the room with him.
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 1: Oh, okay, that's fair. Yeah, that one fucking... It's like
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 1: a non-jump scare because she's just following behind him, and
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 1: I can never remember exactly where it is, but he
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 1: walks out of those double doors, and at just full stride,
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 1: his mother's behind him, and I'm always like, ooh! It's
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 1: just like that icky feeling. You're like, ugh!
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 3: There's also a moment that he talks about in the
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 3: commentary that I really appreciated. So apparently, Damien McCarthy... Before
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 3: he was a filmmaker, he was an electrician.
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 1: Okay. Interesting change of pace there.
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 3: Yeah, he was an electrician. And there's that scene where
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 3: Ohm is trying to get out of the room by
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 3: unscrewing that thing.
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 3: And there's a different type of screw. And he's like,
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 3: that was a little piece of autobiographical moment where he's like,
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 3: that would happen so many times in my shifts where
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 3: I have to remove something and someone used different types
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 3: of screws and it would just fucking ruin your day.
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 1: It would just piss me the fuck off. That's great.
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 3: He's like, you never have the exact tools that you
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 3: need because they are always using different screws.
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's hilarious. Is it just him on the commentary?
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just him.
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 1: Ooh, I like that. I like that. So sometimes I
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 1: do like an ensemble, but I do like just hearing
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 1: from the director a lot of the times. So yeah,
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 1: I think that's all I've got on Hokem. If you
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 1: haven't seen it, well, it's been spoiled for you now,
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 1: but that's okay. I have heard from Corey that people,
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 1: there's a few people he knows that don't watch horror movies,
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 1: but love having them explained to them. So, you know,
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 1: I'm here to provide a service, I suppose. Uh, let's
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 1: go on to the final.
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 3: That was me as a child. Fun fact. Really? I
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 3: was petrified of horror movies, but I was fascinated by them. So, like,
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 3: if my brother was watching, like, a Nightmare on Elm
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 3: Street movie or something, I was like, tell me everything
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 3: about it. Tell me, you know, Freddy Krueger's lore. I
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 3: just want to know all about it, but I couldn't
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 3: handle watching it on my own.
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 1: I love it. Okay, yeah.
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 3: I feel that.
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 1: I feel, okay, yeah. So then, with all that being said,
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 1: let's go to the final cut. Taglines, there's two. Check in,
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 1: and we've been expecting you. Not great, not bad. Trivia,
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 1: Adam Scott spent nearly three weeks filming alone in a
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 1: single room, a process he described as emotionally demanding but
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 1: important for conveying the character's isolation. The film's rabid people
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 1: continue a reoccurring motif in Damian McCarthy's work, inspired in
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 1: part by his childhood fear of Watership Down, 1978. That's fair.
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 3: That movie's fucked.
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah. To capture detailed close-up shots of the clock's miniature heads,
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 1: the producers created oversized versions.
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 3: Sorry.
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 1: The production created oversized versions of the props. Makes sense.
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 1: And the hotel bell seen at the beginning of the
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 1: film is the same prop used in Damian McCarthy's Oddity.
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 1: And I was like, ah, I knew it. And even
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 1: in Oddity, he has the bunny from Caveat in one
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 1: of the scenes. And I was like, this is the
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 1: little shit that I like. This is great because it's
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 1: a goof that had 25 likes, 46 dislikes, so these
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 1: are always fun. After the hotel burns down at the
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 1: end of the movie, Albie returns the old photo of
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 1: Ohm's mother to him, claiming the fireman found it in
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 1: the wreckage. However, there is no logical way the fireman
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 1: could have recovered a loose, unlabeled photo from a blazing
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 1: inferno and somehow known to belong to Ohm, let alone
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 1: why Albie would recognize the woman in the photo to
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 1: return it to him. Just fucking shut up.
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 3: Just shut it. I had the same thought.
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: All right, fine. You shut it too then. Rated 6.6
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 1: out of 10 on IMDb. That equivalates to a 3.30
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 1: on the Nightmare Index scale. An aggregate score of 3.27
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 1: on the Letterboxd. 90% on the Tomatometer. 82% audience score.
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 1: I don't really like Rotten Tomatoes, but there's getting a
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 1: lot more love there. Michael, what did you rate this?
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 3: I think I gave it a four back when I
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 3: was still rating things.
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 1: Oh, back when you were still, yes. Because that's right, yeah.
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 1: I honestly admire the fact that you're not rating things anymore.
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 1: I love that. So Michael has given it a four.
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 1: This is a five from me to this day. That
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 1: gives us a nightmare index of a 3.89. Going to
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 1: be really high up on the list. I will have
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 1: to get with the corrections department and get back to
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 1: you next week because I didn't include my list on
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 1: the write-up sheet here. So, you know, I'll have to
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 1: get with them. Similar movies according to IMDb. We have Oddity, Backrooms,
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 1: Evil Dead Burn, Lee Cronin's The Mummy, and Caveat. Two
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 1: of Damien McCarthy's films and then other shit that released
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 1: this year. Similar movies according to Letterboxd. We have Undertone, Backrooms...
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 1: Insidious Out of the Further Obsession, and then The Haunting
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 1: of Hill House.
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 3: Very few of these feel right.
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because a lot of the times with brand new movies,
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 1: they'll just give you films that have come out around
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 1: the same time. It's really weird. It's very strange. So
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 1: let's do some funny reviews and get out of here.
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 1: I have entirely too many, but we might have some crossovers,
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 1: and that is totally fine.
• 1:12:23
  Speaker 3: I've got seven.
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I've got eight, because I feel like we're going
• 1:12:27
  Speaker 1: to have some crossovers. So why don't you go first?
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 3: All right, so this first one, no rating, but a
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 3: little heart from Bob Rose. It takes a hell of
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 3: a lot to get someone to agree to read your script.
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 1: Apparently burning spoon on the thumb. Yeah. So I love
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 1: this because it reminds me of a meme. Three stars
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 1: from Mac. This is proof that there's only one thing
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 1: scarier than a witch, a man. Yeah.
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 3: This one is just the beginning of a review. I'm
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 3: not going to read the whole review, but this is
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 3: from Casey with a little heart. Casey gave it three
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 3: and a half. This is Adam Scott's point-and-click adventure protagonist dialogue.
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 1: Four stars from Modino. Hoke him? I hope she does.
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 1: Jesus Christ.
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 3: This one's four stars by Carrie with a little heart.
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 3: It says, smoke him if you got him. This was great.
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 3: And Smokum is spelt like Hokum, but with smoke. Nice.
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 3: And Gottem is also spelt like Hokum. So Smokum, if
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 3: you got him. This was great. The director is good
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 3: at actually making me jump at jump scares.
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 1: I included this one because I'm confused. I don't remember
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 1: this part of the movie, so maybe you will. Two
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 1: stars from Thermac. Don't tease a dick ripping scene if
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 1: you're not going to have a dick ripping. I don't
• 1:13:50
  Speaker 1: remember the movie ever mentioning dick ripping.
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 3: Only thing I can think of is maybe when Mal
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 3: was caught at the end.
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 1: Oh, okay.
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 3: I don't know. Maybe. I didn't feel like there was
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 3: a teased dick ripping. This was from Explosive Zombie. Four
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 3: and a half stars in the heart. It just says,
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 3: bunch of hooey.
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 1: But he gave it four and a half.
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 3: Well, because Hocum and hooey.
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 1: There it is. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This one is upsetting.
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 1: Five stars from Blue Ghost. So scared that I absorbed
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 1: my menstrual disc. They might need to go to the hospital.
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 1: That sounds dangerous.
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 3: Painful.
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 1: Painful.
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 3: This is four stars and a heart from Elric Kane
• 1:14:35
  Speaker 3: of Pure Cinema Podcast. It delivers serious ghost story for
• 1:14:40
  Speaker 3: Christmas vibes. Wonderful stuff.
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 1: Oh, nice. Okay. Here's a.
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 3: Which I think we should go back to ghost stories
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 3: for Christmas.
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 1: Ooh, I like that idea.
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 3: I have a whole book of Christmas ghost stories.
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 1: Do you really? Mm-hmm. Okay, I like that.
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 3: You gotta go to the bookstore around Christmas, dude. You
• 1:14:58
  Speaker 3: find some weird shit.
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 3: I also have the novelization for Silent Night, Deadly Night. Ooh, okay.
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 1: Well, that's gonna be my new thing this month. Here's
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 1: a meme that everyone got tired of really quick. Two
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 1: and a half stars from Angus Trussick. Hocum tua and
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 1: spit on that thing.
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 3: Okay, that's pretty funny. All right, this is three stars
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 3: from Justin Laliberte. Nice. England, our sheep are detectives. They're cute. Ireland,
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 3: our goats are high on mushrooms and ruining cars. They
• 1:15:28
  Speaker 3: must be destroyed.
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 1: Damn it, I forgot to mention the goats. The fucking goats.
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 1: Fucking Jerry's like, they eat the mushrooms and then they
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 1: go on top of the cars because they can see
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 1: their reflections and it's like, It's otherworldly, and he's doing
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 1: all these hand motions. The goats, the fucking goats.
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 3: Man, Jerry's the best character.
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 1: The best. Justice for Jerry.
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 3: I also have to say, real quick, I just want
• 1:15:51
  Speaker 3: to mention how when Adam Scott's playing a fun character,
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 3: I love him. When he's not playing a fun character,
• 1:15:57
  Speaker 3: he's got the most punchable face in the world.
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 1: Exactly. And it's so funny, too, because he was playing
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 1: such a dick in this movie, but I was like,
• 1:16:05
  Speaker 1: he kind of got that charm going on.
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 3: You can make this work.
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 1: Four stars from Skrunkly. God forbid a woman has hobbies.
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 3: All right. My last one is from Buddy O. Four
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 3: stars and a heart. Not sure if scary big-eyed bunny
• 1:16:23
  Speaker 3: or Olivia Wilde, which is just so mean. So mean. Well, perfect.
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 1: We didn't have any crossovers. That's crazy.
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 3: That's actually impressive. That's impressive. It's not a seven and
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 3: eight review.
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 1: It's like, shit. Four stars from Lee Hone Film. The
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 1: level of cunt that Adam Scott is serving in this
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 1: movie should be studied. I agree. All right, Michael. Where
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 1: can everybody find the sultry sound of your voice on
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 1: your podcast?
• 1:16:50
  Speaker 3: All right. You can find me at the Shameless Picture Show.
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 3: I'm on all forms of social media. It's either Michael
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 3: underscore Byers or Shameless Picture Show. You can find me
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 3: at Letterboxd at Byers102008. Come find me on Instagram. I
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 3: talk about aspect ratios more than probably anyone else. Well,
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 3: I can't say that, but I feel like out of
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 3: everyone doing physical media reviews, I talk about aspect ratios
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 3: more than anyone else.
• 1:17:10
  Speaker 1: I'll endorse that statement, so.
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 3: And I've been a little slow at some of my
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 3: videos just because I've had a lot going on, but hey,
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 3: I still put shit up.
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I just recorded three today because I'm like, I'm
• 1:17:22
  Speaker 1: so deep in Hooptober shit, but I'm like, I gotta
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 1: actually put out videos. So let's see where my notes are.
• 1:17:30
  Speaker 1: There we go. If you enjoy the show, please rate
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 1: and review on your favorite podcast app of choice. Follow
• 1:17:35
  Speaker 1: us on Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and YouTube at Frightmares Podcast.
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 1: Our email is stayspookyatoutlook.com. You can check me out on
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 1: Letterboxd at Dr. Proctor, all one word. If you'd like
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 1: to expand your movie podcast listening, be sure to check out,
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 1: of course, the Shameless Picture Show, the Dead Eye Millennial
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 1: Film Club, and One Week Rental as well. We have
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 1: a vast library over at Someone's Favorite Productions. There's a
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 1: podcast for you. Next week, Derek and I will be
• 1:18:01
  Speaker 1: doing Superstition from 1982 as our international pick, and it
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 1: is streaming nowhere, so good luck, Godspeed, and have fun
• 1:18:09
  Speaker 1: finding it. I don't know why I pick movies that
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 1: aren't streaming, but here we are. You know what?
• 1:18:14
  Speaker 3: People can go to their fucking local library. Oh, yes!
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 1: I have to advocate for that. Go to your local
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 1: library and see if it's there.
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 3: Streaming's all well and good, but go to the local
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 3: library and check out some movies.
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, do that. Okay, there we go.
• 1:18:28
  Speaker 3: Everyone who's like, I miss the days of Blockbuster. You
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 3: have a fucking Blockbuster and it's called your local fucking library.
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 1: It just might smell a little mustier and you have
• 1:18:36
  Speaker 1: to be quiet, but that's okay. That's okay. You still
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 1: go there. All right, good plug for the local libraries there.
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 1: So that's going to do it for this one, guys.
• 1:18:46
  Speaker 1: And until next week, stay tuned and stay spooky. Thank
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 1: you for listening.
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 3: To hear more shows from the Someone's Favorite Productions podcast network,
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 3: please select the link in the description