Latest / Skin Anarchy / Indoctrinating The De-influencing of Beauty Products Featuring The Beauty Doctrine

Transcript

Indoctrinating The De-influencing of Beauty Products Featuring The Beauty Doctrine · Skin Anarchy

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Hey fam, so before the episode starts, I just wanted to make two little announcements.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_01: The first one is we have a brand new home.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_01: We are hosting our podcast on a new platform now because it's going to give us um that space to grow and expand and really spiral rings.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_01: Skincare anarchy has been growing exponentially in the last few months.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: And with all of the media coverage, with all the new interest that has been shown in our podcast, we have made the decision to now move on over from Spotify podcasters onto another platform.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_01: And the reason for that is because this will allow us to entertain more sponsorships, entertain more ad partners, and really kind of let our podcast, you know, do what it does, which is grow.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's been growing since day one.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, when I literally look at the graphics and characteries growth, it's a straight peak upwards.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_01: You know, there's no dip.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_01: And it's all because of you guys.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_01: So we wanted a platform that was going to be able to hold that.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_01: And here we are.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_01: So you guys might hear a few new sounds, like mid-roll ads, you know, rather than pre-roll, which you're used to.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so just stay tuned for little changes here and there, but nothing crazy.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_01: Also, I wanted to announce that next week we will be releasing all 10 winners for our science of skin awards.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_01: These awards are, in my opinion, and I think in the opinion of many, you know, compared to the response that we got last year, the most coveted science awards in the skincare industry.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_01: These awards are beyond just, you know, is a product feeling good on your skin or does it make you feel dewy?
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's about a brand.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_01: They are awarded, 10 brands are awarded the steel every year.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_01: And the reason for that is for you guys to be able to see the science of skin steel on their pages and know that there is something here for you.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_01: There's something here for everybody.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_01: That's what these awards represent.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: And they are backed by full-blown science from every angle.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_01: I'm talking clinical, you know, theoretical, everything.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_01: So you can rely on these suggestions.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_01: You can rely on the brands that we put out every year for these awards.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_01: And we've already actually seen two of the brands come out and announce their awards, and that was Novos, which is the leader in longevity science right now, and the second one was Editrix, which is the leader in microbiome topical products, because they have amazing technology that's been crafted over 20, it's been 20 years in the making.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm just, you know, I'm really excited about this because once you see year after year how we are awarding the right brands, you're gonna find yourself in a place that makes it a lot easier to be a consumer.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: It makes it a lot easier to pick products for what you need.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_01: Go and just find a brand at your favorite retailer and say, I know this brand.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's like all their products have been, you know, really thoughtful.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_01: So that's our goal with Lancy Skin, and I can't wait for you guys to see the winners next week.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_01: That's it for now, guys.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_01: Enjoy the episode, and I'll see you with next time.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: Hi guys, welcome back to Speaker Anarchy.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_01: This is Ekta, and I am so excited for our guests because I do not get to interview enough um entrepreneurs and leaders in the space of retail and really kind of curation, if you could say.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm very much excited to introduce you guys to the founder of the beauty doctrine, Nadia Benchakroon, and I'm so excited to introduce you guys.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to the show, Nadia.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_01: I'm such a huge fan of beauty doctrine, so I'm really excited to learn about it.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm a huge fan of yours as well.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_00: Super happy to be here and uh thanks for having me.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, it's it's it's a real honor and pleasure.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: Like I said, you know, I uh really don't get to learn much about retail and you know, just what it when it comes down to the curation of brands and putting them in one place for people, I think that's so important, especially right now in the industry.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, we recently had our top picks launched, so I can tell you for a fact, like it was a battle, you know, like getting through those.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_01: So I can't imagine how hard it must be for your end.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: But um, to get started, I would love for you to tell us about yourself, your journey in beauty and the whole industry and really what led to the creation of the beauty doctrine.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_00: Well, my journey is a long one and um it it has a couple different lanes.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: So a huge impact on what really shapes up my view on um beauty and skincare specifically is my background, uh, coming from Morocco and growing up around women who had absolutely amazing skin, a really different approach to you know, the approach that I've seen here in the US being a beauty professional.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: So I've been um you know in the beauty industry now for 27 years.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_00: Uh started off at the counter.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I was a makeup artist.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_00: I was um I worked for a bunch of different brands from Baby Ron to Laura Mossier to Aviv to Dr.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: Pericona, you know, so went from makeup to skincare to fragrance to management.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_00: And then I uh transferred onto the brand side.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_00: So I got to work in corporate offices and really started seeing kind of what the process is of um launching a product.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and so working with the lab, working with the marketing department, and so on and so forth.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: And then I got into education and traveling.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_00: And so um one of my last roles in the corporate world was uh global head of global education and uh VP of sales.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_00: So it was basically two roles um in one.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then when the pandemic hit, uh I decided to take the plunge into entrepreneurship, uh, which I've been wanting to do for a very long time.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um and so with that, just you know, founded the beauty doctrine because I felt like there was something missing.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_00: As big as the beauty industry is and the choices are, um, there needs to be an advocate for consumers.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um, just having seen what the process is like in the kind of the creation of a product from the lab to the retail shelf.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and a lot of it is really focused on the product itself, on the trend, um, but not so much on the consumer themselves.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: And so I try to kind of leverage all of my experience, kind of interfacing with thousands of consumers over the years, uh to kind of bring that knowledge and really help them one-on-one.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: So the beauty doctrine is basically a platform where I curate the best of the best, um, kind of focused on health of the skin rather than um luxury or um, of course, the sensorial experience.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_00: So I try to find products that are, you know, of course, efficacious, but compatible with skin, which not a lot of brands look at right now.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_00: So I feel like the beauty industry is really divided.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so you have the the medical grade, you have the natural, you have the clean, and really not regulated.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm trying to be that voice for the consumer um and basically just present them with the products that are going to be, you know, working for their skin long term rather than just um kind of that immediate gratification that a lot of us are after these days.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_01: No, I I love that and I applaud you for it because we need more of that in this industry.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like you said, like, you know, I every day I come across brands and I realize that, you know, it's not that founders have um bad ideas.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_01: It's more of how many times has this idea been done before?
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_01: You know, like I I'm not gonna lie to you, Nadia.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_01: I had a very sad moment the other day because there are these tools I really enjoy that are made by one of my favorite estheticians, and she's got her own line and I love them, love them so much.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_01: But then I just saw them somewhere else in like a different color, and I was like, No, you know, and it just made me, I don't know.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_01: There's a part of me that just kind of like broke inside deep down, and I was like, oh no, stop copying each other, you know.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like we have this like, I think, you know, culture right now in the beauty industry of a lot of redundancies.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I love that you had brought up like all these different like categories, right?
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_01: Like clinical grade, medical grade, what's the difference?
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_01: Then there's clean beauty, green beauty, natural, natural beauty, organic beauty.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, oh my gosh, like stop it, you know.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_01: And um, I love that you are still focused on the science.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_01: That's what to me is literally the determining factor.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, at the end of the day.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I and I try my best to stick to this in my own life, like even outside of beauty, right?
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, what do you do when you go to a store, you buy something?
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_01: What are you really buying it for?
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_01: You know, whether that's food, whether that's beauty products, whatever.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't, yeah, we buy organic things, yeah, we buy things that are like, you know, no pesticides, but what are why do we do that?
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_01: Health, right?
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: So it all comes down to health.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_01: And so I really enjoy that you have kind of um, you know, embodied that in the DNA of your brand, you know, and what you guys stand for.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um now, my question, obviously, you know, um, my first big question is really how do you vet the brands that you represent?
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, what is that process like for you guys?
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, yeah, it's it's a pretty lengthy process.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and just um one thing that I have that's kind of unique to the process is uh the fact that I'm extremely sensitive.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_00: I'm as sensitive as they come.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm the guinea pig really for these products.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_00: But I'll I'll um I'll kind of go through how we uh we curate these uh products.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_00: So, first of all, um the products have to kind of be free of all of the known toxins.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um so they're you know, I'm sure you're familiar with credo, for example.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: So it's like credo safe.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: So all of the, you know, they don't have any of the products or ingredients that are on the dirty list.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: That's number one.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but that's not enough.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um the reason being is that a lot of natural products now um, you know, tend to have a lot of essential oils, for example.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_00: So essential oils are not compatible with um, you know, human skin for long-term use.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: So it's something that we look at.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_00: So we start off with brands that are fairly, you know, uh very reputable, let's say.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um so we, you know, on uh the top retailer shelves.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: So we that's the first phase, right?
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: So we um narrow down that list, we start looking at inky lists, um uh, you know, kind of cross off any ingredients that tend to, you know, like I said, uh could have any potential for irritation.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_00: That's the first thing, really.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um fragrance is a huge one, so that's a huge no-no.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_00: We uh eliminate uh any product from our list that has any type of fragrance.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then we try to have uh products in different price categories because we really want to service the consumer and bring them uh products that they can afford to replenish.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: So we don't go for products that are like$250,$500, so on and so forth.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_00: So we want it to be attainable, but yet quality.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_00: And then the last phase really is for us to test the products on our skin.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I do a lot of that.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: My team does that.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_00: So I would just use a product, let's say, for a full week, two weeks to really get to see um, you know, what it does.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then of course it would make it to our assortment, you know, we would reach out to the brand at that point and and try to get that on the B doctrine.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_01: So it's really like a curationslash like like you know, obviously for the retail, but also in terms of efficacy of the products and you know, though that kind of stuff as well.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah, absolutely.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_00: Efficacy is you know paramount at the end of the day.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_00: We want a product that's gonna work.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but you know, what differentiates us from everybody else?
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: So let's say you have a medical brand, right?
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_00: So they're looking strictly at the science.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_00: The science is very important.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I come with the background of working for Dr.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: Perygon, for example.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: I worked for, you know, various, you know, big brands that strictly focus on the science, but I just feel like it's not enough.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: So one what I'm trying to do is really marry the different categories.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so science is you know a basic uh you know pillar at the new doctrine.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's gotta be there.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_00: The efficacy is gonna be there.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_00: But the issue is a lot of times when we're narrowly focused on efficacy, what we end up with is a lot of alpha hydroxy acid, for example, or a lot of retinoids.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, or you know, you'll have a super effective product that's not necessarily good for your skin type because you haven't evaluated, you don't really understand what your what how to kind of figure out what your skin type is.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_00: So it could be efficacious, but for somebody that is oily, or efficacious for somebody that's really dry.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um and so we combine all of those together.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_00: So it has to be effective, it has to be clean, it has to be compatible with your skin for the long term.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: So we do that work for you because I I feel like a lot of consumers, and I've interfaced with thousands and thousands of consumers over the years, and I've seen their pain trying to find that right product for their skin, and they're stuck in this loop, right?
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_00: So they go to the counter or to their dermatologist and they're like, okay, I have this issue.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_00: You know, what should I do?
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: They get the product prescribed, and then now, you know, it works maybe for a couple of weeks, and now their skin is reacting.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_00: And I've been there myself.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and so what I what we try to do with the redoctrine is deliver all of that.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_00: You're going to get that efficacious product, but you're going to be able to tolerate it in a month from now, two months from now, three months from now, because it doesn't have all of those irritants that are going to disturb, you know, the skin's delicate microbiome or, you know, and disrupt the lipid barrier and all those types of things.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_01: That's interesting because I, you know, I know there's a lot of um curation happening these days.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_01: You know, definitely people in the industry are realizing the value of it.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_01: And they're realizing that no, we have to really narrow down these products, you know, like it's it's getting to be too much.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_01: But, you know, so what is the okay, so let me ask you in terms of experience for the typical beauty doctrine consumer, like where does the experience begin?
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, is it on your website?
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_01: Is it like in a store?
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_01: Is it a consultation?
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how do we like if I if I approach you knowing that you're a retailer for products that have been proven to work, you know what I mean?
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: And they're really um a lot of things I can discover here.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_01: You know, there you your mission obviously like vibes with what I'm thinking, right, as a consumer.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_01: But then when it comes to navigating the space of beauty doctrine, how does that work?
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, great question.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so I actually do consultations one-on-one with my um clients.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, so it's more of like a boutique type environment.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I know probably like my top 50 clients.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: I know, you know, their full names, I know about their life.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, they they book consultations with me pretty much every couple months or so.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_00: We have like a VIP insider club where they can just join, and there's like a nominal, very small fee that they pay, you know, every month, and then they have access to me.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_00: So let's say they, you know, when you first want to come into the beauty doctrine, you can you can just book one consultation, right?
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: And then we get to chat and I look at your um, you know, what you're using, right?
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and a lot of times when I'm going through your skincare routine, I would find probably like five products that are doing the same thing.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I I try to kind of highlight and figure out what it is that you're doing wrong that's not kind of optimal, that's not serving you.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: And then I work with you, you know, kind of work through it with you.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so we um narrow it down to like the very basics and then start kind of uh watching the progress of your skin and how it's responding to a given routine.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_00: So whether it's optimizing your own routine or we start very slowly integrating other products into it.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um, the other way that you can experience a beauty doctrine is really just go on the website and um kind of just go through the the product selection.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_00: Every single thing on there has been vetted to be suitable for even the most sensitive skin types.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_00: So you can literally just pick, you know, any cleanser or any moisturizer, and nine times out of ten, it's going to be suitable for your skin because you know, we've narrowed it down to a very, very, very tight assorment.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_01: No, I love that.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that that's really, you know, for me as a consumer, I love like boutique, you know, just online retail that I can rely on because honestly, I sifting through some of these really large retail brands is it's daunting.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I want also like, um, for example, you know, right now, if you guys, for everyone listening, I want you to go to thebeautydoctrine.com and you'll see what I mean.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, you know, you'll see that everything is um, it's just a it's a tighter, you know, selection.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_01: And that's so important to me as a consumer because when I go onto websites, it's like, you know, every website has this algorithm in place that they're like, oh, here's some recommendations for you based on what you bought before.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like, I don't want what I bought before because it didn't work, which is why I'm back.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like, or a lot of times it's just like, I don't want to see, you know what I mean?
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_01: I just want a fresh start.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think that um the the whole process of discovering a brand is so different on a boutique site such as yours versus something that's like a huge retailer because Discovery, it's like, I feel like, you know, before maybe about two or three years ago, Discovery was more like, okay, go on to like, for example, Sephora.com.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, I like this brand.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_01: Let me just go under that brand and see every product ever made by that brand.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_01: But it's like I have done I did that so many times as a consumer, right?
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_01: Like I would go to uh brand XYZ, like, oh, I love their toners.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_01: Let me go back and like buy a couple of things, but then it didn't work out for me.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_01: So it wasn't that like it was the fault of the retailer, it was the fault of myself for not doing more homework because I was relying on the retailer to do that homework for me, right?
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_01: So, like that's where I think you guys really differentiate yourselves because you've done the homework that the bigger retailers can't do.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_01: They don't have the bandwidth, you know what I mean, to do that.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, I think that's my take home for this, is that, you know, for everyone listening, if you're, you know, if you're tired of the constant, especially with the holidays, like you just don't know which of the products from which lines work, that's where this really helps, you know.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I I'm I'm a fan of that.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_01: I I think that approach is actually more logical than just throwing all the SKUs of every brand up on a website and saying, figure it out.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_01: Good luck.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: You know, yeah, absolutely.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_00: And the industry is really trend driven, and that's not something that we focus on.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: I love trends when it comes to fashion.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, trends are amazing when it comes to color, but skincare, um, you know, we have to realize that skin is an organ, it's attached to us.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_00: It, you know, it needs to be nurtured and it's always gonna need the same old things, right?
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_00: So you don't need the newest, trendiest ingredients.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_00: You need something that's going to preserve, you know, the balance in your skin that's going to give you the right hydration.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_00: So your basics, you know, your emollients, um, your occlusives, your peptides, your sunscreen, all those things are never gonna go away.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously, there'll be newer technologies that are going to be introduced into the market, you know, as as everybody, you know, as the science kind of progresses.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_00: But, you know, the skin basic needs are never going to change.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_00: And so we realize that at the Blue Doctrine, and we don't focus, uh, we hardly focus on on um trends.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so yeah, and and the other thing that we um, the other way that we connect with our consumers actually is through TikTok.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_00: So I kind of, you know, stumbled into the influencer marketing world um as I was connecting with, you know, kind of building my community.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: And so, you know, that's something that I would actually uh, you know, invite uh your listeners to check out because there's so much information that I share there um day in and day out, and very soon we're going to launch a YouTube channel as well.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so really we're we're very education driven uh versus just kind of putting all of these products on a website and asking people to go purchase.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I love I love that, and I love that you're you know really kind of committed to this.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we need more of that.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_01: I I am you know very similar to you then, you know, we're we're doing this very similar things, I think, in different ways.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, I I really believe in the idea that you know, if you find something that's good, spread it out there, you know, to the world.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's not about You know, keeping things coveted and like to yourself.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_01: I know that was kind of the culture for many, many years, right?
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like our mothers and grandmothers like had these well-kept secrets of like beauty products or things that really work for them.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, to find those little um, you know, just jewels and to find those amazing products.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_01: Like, for example, celebrities, that's a perfect example, you know.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um celebrities for the longest time were not telling us what lip plumper do you use, what um this do you use.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_01: You know, we all thought every time a celebrity looks different or their skin is flawless, it's because of plastic surgery.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_01: No, it was a lot of times it's because of a really great skincare line that, you know, we would never discover as consumers because it was it's either a just not accessible or you know what I mean, like it just wasn't out there.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that in the world of social media and the way that things have evolved, like this is really, really interesting, you know, what you guys are doing for sure.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_01: I I love that, you know, curation aspect a lot.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_01: No, okay, I'm I'm curious in terms of, you know, um, I know that you guys lean more towards things that really are universally um usable, right?
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_01: Like you want things that most people can just buy and be happy with.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um so when it comes to skin types, right, people really are um convinced.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_01: I I call it brainwashing because I don't really believe in the different.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_01: I think the skin types have to be um re-evaluated.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_01: I know that there's some work being done there, but um, you know, it's you can't just say I have oily skin, I have this, I have dry skin, because you can't make that claim until you have a balanced skin, right?
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_01: Like when your skin is balanced, right?
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_01: So so my thing is is that, you know, I think when you have um, you know, places that you like yours that you've created, it's easier for consumers to find products that just work to bring their skin back to balance, and then we can talk about what kind of skin type you are, you know.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_01: So when it comes to that, how do you approach that when your customers come to you and say, I have oily skin or I have dry skin, you know?
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_01: Well, how's that for you guys?
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we just we go back to education.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I truly believe that you create your skin type.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_00: And I'll elaborate.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so obviously, like for most of us, you know, our acid mantle, you know, starts kind of um breaking down as we age, right?
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: So we'll lose in more water.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_00: And so a lot of us get progressively dry as we age.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but when you're talking about like oily skin, combination skin, all of that, that's been a creation of the industry just to sell more product.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and so what we the way that we navigate that is to, like you said, uh teach our clients how to achieve balance.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so rather than just saying, you know, I have act, you know, acne-prone skin, what is it that um is causing you acne?
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_00: I just, in fact, recently have um have this client that uh she's about my age, she's in her mid-40s, and she said she's been breaking out her entire life.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: And so my first question, you know, to her when we started our confrontation is what do you think your skin type is?
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: She said, you know, I'm dry, acneic, and I've always broken out.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_00: And obviously, as you probably know, that's really not a skin type, dry and acnec.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: So acne comes from the inside, right?
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_00: And so further questioning her, we you know, I realized she probably consumes too much dairy.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_00: So I said, okay, why don't you just like cut off the dairy uh and let's let's chat in a couple weeks.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_00: She she called me probably, oh no, maybe seven to ten days.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_00: Who's gonna completely clear that?
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_00: So she's had this issue with acne her entire life and not knowing what the cause is.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: And that's kind of the issue with the skincare industry right now, is that you know, we put you in a certain category as an industry, and then we just start selling you, let's say, if you're acneic, here is everything that's going to dry out your skin.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_00: Here is a drying, you know, conservative peroxide, here's a drying toner with whatever other acid, and so on and so forth.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_00: And then so we create that skin type.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_00: So now that you're trying to dry out the acne, you're actually, you know, offsetting the balance of your skin.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_00: Now you're producing more oil.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_00: Now you're thinking that your skin is oily and you're trying to suppress it, you know, causing further imbalances.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_00: And so those are the types of things that I, you know, speak about all the time on my TikTok.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_00: You know, in my TikTok videos, and of course with my clients.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_00: And that that's the approach.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_00: The approach is education.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I I probably have about, I don't know, maybe 60, 70 blogs right now.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I write a lot of blogs.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_00: So even if the consumers don't get to speak to me in, you know, on video, they can go to beautydoctrin.com and check out a given blog about any skin condition, you know, anything they might be struggling with, whether it's rosacea, pigmentation, you know, um wrinkles and so on and so forth.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_00: So there's a lot of education there for them and to kind of help them through their skincare journeys.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_00: But in in all honesty, skincare is extremely simplistic.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_00: It's just made to be complex for the sake of selling more products.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_00: So we're bringing everything back to basics and really kind of helping consumers understand, you know, what those basics are and how to really care for their skin the right way for the for the long term, you know, how to maintain that healthy skin, you know, day in and day out.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_01: No, I really love that.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm I'm a huge believer in what you're saying.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_01: I I think that, you know, it's interesting that lady that came to you and said, you know, if I had uh I have dry acne skin, I know.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_01: And that's exactly, it's like you read my mind.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_01: That's exactly what I was thinking of.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, there's people out there that are like, well, I have dry skin.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, well, do you have acne?
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I have really bad acne, actually.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_01: That's my big my biggest problem.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, okay.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, it's it's it's a huge, huge um conversation that needs to be had, I think, um, more often, you know, in in that realm, whether that's dermatologists or anybody, you know, we need to be talking about that more because it, you know, it's very hard for us to do self-diagnosis.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's what a lot of people um these days rely on when it comes to skin health is self-diagnosis or uh diagnosis by their favorite, you know, person on social media or wherever they find their experts, you know, and so in that kind of culture, I think it's it's really important to have like, you know, somewhere that you can like go and feel like what I buy here is going to be something that if it doesn't work for me, it's probably the closest that could have come to it working, to finding a product that would have fit that category that I was looking for.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's that in itself is actually very like it's very important for the whole process of basically for me with the end goal, which is basically everyone having a skin routine that they like and they can stick to, right?
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's the goal is to have some have people stick to things and stick to a routine.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, I I've noticed that one of the biggest challenges for consumers is that you know, there's 15 brands that are like I said initially making the same thing.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_01: So they're like, Well, where do I go?
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_01: And then they realize, okay, well, you know, this product doesn't work for me.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's because you're trying a product by a brand that might not be creating it the right way for you, you know, whether that's hyaluronic acid, whether that's a night cream, whether it's a retinol.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's just it's not a matter of, you know, this product doesn't work for me or this ingredient doesn't work for me, right?
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_01: It's more of like, well, that's where brand discovery comes in.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_01: And I need to go to the right people to introduce me to the right brands.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think that's a huge uh service that you guys are doing for a lot of consumers because they don't know where to start.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you, thank you.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_00: And one thing that I found, uh, you know, just from uh interfacing with consumers over the years is they get to a point where their skin is sensitized, right?
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_00: And so because of you, the overuse of all these actives that are being pushed onto consumers all the time.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_00: It's all about no glowing skin, right?
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_00: So let's give you that instant gratification.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_00: Let's, you know, here's the newest peel, here's the newest mask, here's, you know, and so people are really kind of doing their own concoctions and then going after that, like instant gratification.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_00: So what ends up happening is that they're now their skin is sensitized and now it's reactive.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_00: And so they don't realize that it's the skin, not the product.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, so they show up, I don't uh, you know, I've seen this hundreds of times.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_00: They'll buy a new moisturizer, let's say, and you know, they'll use it for a day or two and they're like, oh, it burns.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's not suitable for my skin, and they go return it and get another moisturizer, but they don't necessarily realize that it's maybe the skin that has micro-tears because they've been, you know, using a physical scrub, or again, they've been using like a mix of ingredients that they're not supposed to be using.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_00: And so until you kind of scale back a little bit and just start nurturing the skin, let it heal a bit, then you can reintroduce, you know, the product and you will have a completely different experience with it.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and so that's kind of kind of the mindset that we don't quite have, you know, because and I think too, because of all the marketing, you know, uh messages that we keep getting is you know, in um in way of here's this one product and it's gonna fix it all for you, right?
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's the magic product.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: And so consumers are after that, you know, they they want, they they hear the uh marketing message and they go pick up the product and they put it on, and then they're disappointed.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_00: And and the cycle continues.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_00: And so that's something that we really are passionate about, kind of just basically, you know, stopping that cycle a little bit, halting it, and uh pausing it for a little bit.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, I mean that's that's that's really I I love that.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: I love that you brought that up, and I think that that's very, very true and um actually really important because to address because you know, you don't know what product is going to cause sensitization for you.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_01: I've seen people who get sensitized from a cleansing oil, you know what I mean?
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like I've seen people who literally have done the bare minimum, and it's just because they used a product that had one ingredient, you know what I mean, that just did not sit well.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_01: And it wasn't because they're a dry skin type or an oily skin type or whatever.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: No, it was because their skin at that time was not ready.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_01: And it doesn't have to be an active, it can be anything because the way it is is like people don't understand the science, and that's why I always harp on science, honestly.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, Nadia, because I think like when you start to see your skin as like this like landscape, like think of like virtual reality.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_01: I was telling people this because I'm like, you guys have really got to start putting that like ultra, you know, high definition, super strength microscope on your own skin and have that mental image of it, you know, as like this landscape, like as if you're walking through like a field, right?
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you're gonna see little things popping up, you know, you'll see like dandelions, right, in a field.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_01: Well, imagine your skin.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_01: It has these little things that pop up and what they're they're called antigens.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_01: So what happens is when your skin is injured or it's um hurting in some way, it's not balanced, these antigens will come out through a leaky skin barrier and they will sit on top of your skin.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_01: So you can have reactions to things that might not even be active.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_01: Like, for example, you don't have to have an AHA to react with that antigen or react with that one specific molecule.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_01: It could be something that you would consider soothing normally.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_01: But it's because your skin is aggravated, it's because you um tampered that skin barrier.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_01: That's why you're getting to that place of just feeling like you can't find your products because everything makes you react.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_01: That's called rebalancing your skin.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_01: And that's where I really find what you're doing here, Nadia, to be so beneficial because it's like, once again, instead of going on to xyz.com and finding all the SKUs of a line, no, go to a boutique place that has tested the products, talk to Nadia and be like, Nadia, my skin is like freaking out.
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_01: Give me the most calming thing you have, like literally.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: So that's where, that's where I think that, you know, um there's so much value in creating this space, you know, that you have.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I really, really love what you guys are doing because, you know, I like I said, there just cannot be enough curation for in this industry.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_01: There just can't be enough.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's so saturated.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_00: And you're so, so right uh, with the point that um, you know, it's not just the alpha hydroxy.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and this is what I try to highlight with the natural and clean beauty movement, that is not enough either.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_00: You can put an oil on your skin and you get a massive reaction because a lot of people, a lot of brands now, uh cleaner brands, are substituting, you know, uh fragrance with essential oils.
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_00: And that's worse than alpha hydroxy acids.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_00: And then with the pandemic, when you know everybody is trying to focus a lot more on wellness and and doing their DIY masks.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_00: I cringe every time I hear the word DIY.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my god, please don't tell me about DIY masks.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_00: You see all those lemons, oh my goodness, and the bacon soda and the vinegar and all these things going on the skin, and people not realizing that we don't have a digestive system on the skin.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_00: Your body can can put this lemon.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_00: It's amazing for you.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_00: But please don't put lemon on your skin.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_01: Or even also, you have no way of figuring out how much of what you're putting on.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_01: Like I'm just not even we're not going down that road.
• 35:52
  SPEAKER_01: No, yeah, we're gonna be on here for a while.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_01: No, but I hear you though.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_01: I hear you, and I'm with you.
• 35:59
  SPEAKER_01: I am with you there.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_01: I have seen the DIY masks, and let me tell you, as somebody who my favorite skincare, I've said this so many times, my favorite skincare category is masks.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, it is.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_01: I love them.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_01: I love all masks except DIY masks.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_01: I've never done a DIY mask, like since I was like 15, I haven't done one, and I will never do one because it's so risky, but that's a whole different topic, like I said.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_01: But in general, you know, you're right.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_01: You're so right.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like, you know, you you made a really great example, Nadia, because you uh talking about oils, essential oils, yeah.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like people, oils are not all made the same.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_01: Like the process of distilling an oil, the process of purifying it, extracting it, that is all stuff that goes into what we consider to be, whether it's clean beauty, organic beauty, blah, blah, blah.
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, these are all things that matter when you define what kind of brand you are.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_01: So like it's very important for us to have, like, until the FDA wants to take charge.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_01: I'm honestly a huge believer that we need like micro like policing of this industry and the products by people who understand it, like yourself, you know, even myself, anyone out there who likes to curate products, you know, because that's how we are going to figure out what's working, what's not.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_01: And so it without me beating a dead horse, you know, I just want to say like I really think that this is the time in the industry.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_01: Overall, I think this is the time to shop in a more curated way.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_01: And shop in a more like, you know, um, what's the what's that word?
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, you know, you're you're you mean to do something when you, you know, go out and mean to do something like intentional.
• 37:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_01: Shop with intention.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, exactly.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_01: Shop with intention, shop with knowledge and wisdom and uh understanding.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_01: And and to do that, you've got, you know, the beauty doctrine and these amazing like outlets to help you along that journey.
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm a huge fan of that idea.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_01: I think what you guys are doing are is beautiful.
• 38:06
  SPEAKER_01: I love the website.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_01: I love the options you guys have.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it's it's really, really something for everybody.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_01: So everyone listening, if you have not already, I want you to go to thebeautydoctrine.com and check out the whole, you know, selection that they offer and you know, buy a couple of products, do a consultation, you know, have fun, explore.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_01: So uh, Nadia, thank you so much.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_01: This was so lovely chatting with you and learning from you.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much for having me.
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_00: This was lovely.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, likewise.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_01: And for everyone listening, I uh really, really need you guys' help.
• 38:39
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• 38:47
  SPEAKER_01: That helps us a lot.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_01: It's really, really helpful.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_01: The it's so ignorant.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_01: I always tell people, you know, the podcast world is like the magazine world, except a lot more complicated when it comes to, you know, getting the word out.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_01: So it's um, I would really appreciate it if everybody went on there and left us some ratings.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, I'll be back next time with another episode.
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much.
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 39:11
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• 39:14
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• 39:19
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• 39:36
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• 40:02
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• 40:07
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• 40:13
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• 40:18
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.