Latest / No Mess, No Magic / The 7 Unpublished Novels That Led to Her Debut
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- riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Hello and welcome to the No mess No magic podcast with Monica Hay. Today I am here with Rebecca Taylor-Mkay, the author of The Honeymoon Suite. Welcome, Rebecca. I'm very excited to have you. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Thanks, I'm really excited to be here. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yes. Is this your first podcast or have you been on other podcast episodes before? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: done a couple, I'm slowly getting used to the idea, riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: A couple. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: yeah yeah, of talking to people about myself and my book. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yes. Was it weird at first when you started doing it? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Definitely, yeah. think I'm always, one of those people that's like, no, I don't like the way that I sound. So when the first one came out and people were like, how did it go? was like, I don't know, I've not listened to it, but I have listened to it now. I'm getting used to the idea that that is what I sound like. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Fair. Fair. I love it. Rebecca Taylor-McKay lives in West Yorkshire with her husband and two teenage children. Her debut novel, The Honeymoon Suite, came out this year and was longlisted for the Women's Prize Discoveries and shortlisted for the Northern Writers Sid Chaplin Award. I love this. I really like your story that you sent me about writing and becoming an author. My first question is going to be. The this this book is your eighth full-length novel and you specifically riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: it is. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: said that your debut was not an overnight success and you spent a decade honing your writing craft before a book deal. What happened throughout all riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: those years and how did you keep going throughout all of that? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah, it's a long time, isn't it? I don't know if it felt like, maybe at points it felt like a long time, but I think it's looking back on it that I think, wow, that was a whole decade that I was writing for. So I decided, I'd always written, growing up I'd always kind of written stories and made up these really elaborate role play games that I forced my younger sister to take part in, bust her about. So I'd always kind of been a writer, but I think like a lot of people life just kind of gets in the way and you somehow end up doing things that are completely unrelated and then maybe you've got like a career and a family and obligations and things. And then it wasn't really until I was in my late... 20s that I got diagnosed with quite a serious chronic health condition that I started to think, wow, I really, if there are things that I want to do, I should really be doing them and not putting them off for this imaginary day when everything's going to be perfectly aligned and I'll have all this imaginary sort of time and space and energy to dedicate to it. So that was 2013. And I would say it's probably the following riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: year, 2014, when I really thought I'm going to give this a good go. I'm going to try and actually finish a novel. I'd had lots of ideas for stories before I'd started stories and abandoned them but I was like come on let's actually finish something. So started a started riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: a novel in 2014, managed to I think finished it in 2016 and then pretty much I think I've averaged one a year since. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: But for a long time I was just figuring out what kind of writer I wanted to be. What stories did I want to tell? Trying to find my voice. Abandoning lots and lots of manuscripts along the way. Finishing riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: some of them. Changing them halfway through. But yeah, was writing pretty seriously with the aim of publication and taking it quite kind of seriously from 2014 onwards. But it wasn't until late 2024 that I actually got my book deal. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. And throughout riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: and riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: that process of those ten years, were you in your mind, were you intentionally saying, I'm going to write and practice writing? Or were you actively sending things out, you know, giving it to your friends to read or beta readers or critique partners, things like that? Or were had you like decided that you were going to take your time? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: I think a little bit of a mixture of both. think I did send a few things, entered a few competitions, swapped manuscripts with other people and read theirs and they read mine and got feedback. But I think also I was waiting to have something that I felt like I wanted to be my debut, that I wanted to go to Agents with and go, this is the best that I can do. And I think riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: certainly with the first, I don't know, probably two, three, maybe even four, I never got that feeling of, yeah, this is what I want to go out into the world with. So I finished them and then kind of went, okay, what's next? I didn't have riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yes. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: a set idea of... I know some people come to writing and they think, you know, I definitely want to write certain types of stories or I definitely want to traditionally publish or I definitely want to self-publish and they have quite a fixed kind of idea of the path that they want to take and where they want to end up and all I really knew was that I wanted to write fiction, that I would probably be better at novels than short stories because I'm quite long-winded. So that's kind of all I knew. I didn't really think, I'm definitely going to be commercial or literary. or I definitely want to riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: write in this genre. And I've done a lot of research into self-publishing, a lot of research into traditional publishing, and I was kind of, all I really knew was that I wanted to write and that I wanted an audience for whatever I was writing. But for the rest of it, I was kind of like, let's just see what happens, see where it goes. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. And as you were writing, how did you know if something didn't feel like it was what you wanted for it to be your debut? Like what what was that? Did you feel sad about it? Were you like accepting of it? What did that feel like? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: I for some of them I finished and I thought I'm really glad that's finished. I think I've done the best that I could do with that story, with the skills that I've got at the moment. But let's see what we can do now with something different. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: And I kept kind of wanting to push myself and figure out where I wanted to be as a writer riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: and what could I do next. See where I can get away with, what I could pull off next. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: It sounds like you're very patient. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: I don't know if I am, that's quite funny. In real life, like in other areas of my life, I think I'm quite an impatient person, but I must have, don't, but I think I'm also definitely a perfectionist and I think there was something to be said for it. I kept writing these books and going, not that one. And riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: yeah, waiting for something to feel like, yeah, okay, I could show this to other people. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: How many different genres did you write throughout that time? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: And... I wrote a young adult novel which started as a young adult fantasy novel which is what I was reading a lot of at the time and I think I'm one of those writers who if I read something I definitely get influenced by whatever genre I'm reading a lot of at the minute and because I'd just been diagnosed with this illness and I was spending a lot of time in and out of hospital and having tests and riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: investigations and life felt like really full-on and I had two very young children I was just looking for escape so I was reading like any young adult fantasy novels that I could get my hands on and there were a lot around obviously like 2013, 2014. I really had like my pick of the bunch so I was reading loads of young adult fantasy and I thought maybe that's what I'm gonna write and I wrote one and I was so bad at the fantasy aspect of it that I ended up having to make it young adult contemporary because I just couldn't I couldn't write the fantasy stuff whenever something fantastical was supposed to happen I was like I don't know what to do. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: So funny. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Maybe do a contemporary novel. I tried to write an adult fantasy novel after that. I think I've written a few romance novels, trying different sub-genres of romance. Then I went back to young adult, I think, and then wrote something very gothic, very overwrought. Yeah, I kind of dabbled in quite a few genres. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. That's so cool because a lot of writers I talk to, that's not how they approach it. They tend to decide what they love and they hone that genre. And I think it's really cool when authors decide to write in multiple genres because sometimes you don't know what genre you're gonna fall in love with. Like you might think you will never like it and then you'll write it and you'll think, This is amazing. This is what I want to do. So I love that. The and you naturally just did that. You naturally just tested without that's riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: so cool. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah, I was thinking I was just having a lovely time and actually when I started writing romance I thought I'd found my thing and I was like, I'm gonna be a romance author That's what I'm gonna be. I really love writing about love and people falling in love And then it was really funny that actually the novel that got me my age in and got me my book deal was the first time I had ever tried to write Historical and the first time I'd ever tried to write a thriller and then that was the honeymoon suite and that's what got picked up and it was like I was like, thought I was going to be a romance up there and it's riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: like never mind that you're doing this now. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: That is so funny. And how many books did you end up querying throughout your writing career so far? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: not very many. I queried a Christmas rom-com that I had written and that would have been probably towards the end of 2023 I think when I finally felt like I had got something that I was like I'm really happy with what I've managed to do with this and I just tentatively started. I think I sent it into a pitch contest and I started to query some agents like a really small number. I was doing the thing where you people advised to send it out in batches in case there's like any riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm-hmm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: wrong with your kind of query package and I did that and then I didn't really get any kind of, you know, nobody wanted to see the full or wanted to pick it up. And then I went back to the Honeymoon Suite, which was already like a work in progress that I had been really struggling to get over the line. And I entered that into a competition and that's riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: how I met my agent. So I got picked up through that with my agent. So it's quite funny. I was almost like in the middle of querying this Christmas rom-com and then just got distracted and went and picked up an agent in something completely different. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: You went and did a side quest. I love that. I love that. And were there moments throughout these years where you didn't think that publication would ever happen? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah, I think so. think to begin with I was probably quite naively positive and decided that because I had decided that this was what I was going to do that I was like just determined that I was somehow going to make it happen no matter what and I was probably quite right we can do this come on if we just put enough into it we'll eventually get somewhere and that worked for quite a while for quite a few years I think but then towards the end the final I would say probably the final year, year and a half before I got my agent, I had started to think, no, what if it doesn't riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: happen actually, because it's coming up to a decade now. And I think, riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: you know, it's coming up to a decade and also all that I'd really achieved in terms of external validation was that I had been long listed once and short listed once and then nothing had come of either of those. So it's sort of, I thought, Is that going to be it? Is that as far as I'm going to get? And I definitely had a bit of a wobble 2023. Because I think, like I say, it was coming up to 10 riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: years. And I remember saying to my husband, if nothing happens in this next year, I think I probably have to accept that this is just going to be like a fun hobby. And I will do it when riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: I have time, in the evenings and the weekends, but that I need to stop putting so much time and effort and energy into it because I'm not really getting that back or not getting anything back. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: And he was obviously very supportive, encouraging and saying, you know, I think you're nearly there, just keep going. And within six months of kind of saying that to him, I had my agent and then a few months after that, riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: my goodness. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: my book deal. So I think that was my like 11th hour wobble of going, no, it riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: doesn't happen. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: I love that. I love having a supportive partner. I think it makes a huge difference. And riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: It's F. does, because at that point I was doing freelance two or three days a week and then trying to save riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: these sort of couple of days a week to focus on my own writing and obviously that comes with sacrifices, know, like financial stability and saying no to paid work, thinking if I take on this extra paid work then I won't have time to finish the book and riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: for a partner then that's difficult for them to kind of go, no, I believe in you, I believe that this is going to come to something, while at the same time thinking, can we pay the bills? So I think it's incredible of him to go, you're nearly there, don't give up, because I think I was pretty close to throwing the towel in at that point. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. Yeah. And I'm also curious, how did your relationship with those earlier manuscripts manuscripts change? What how do you see them now that you're here? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: I think for some of them I feel like they were just... I think I love baking. I don't love it as much as writing and I'm not particularly like I'm alright at it but I'm not going to be like winning Great British Bake Off or anything like that. I definitely can't bake under pressure like I take hours and hours riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: to make something that's only supposed to take like 45 minutes but I always think of those kind of early early manuscripts as being like it's a cake and I had a really nice time making it but I would never ask someone to like pay for a slice. In fact I would only probably offer it to like really close friends and family because I'm not you know convinced that it's that I followed the recipe. So I think it's a bit like that with the early ones. There are some later ones that I have a real soft spot for. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: And for some of them I feel like you deserve to be in a drawer and I think, you know, it's fine that you're in the drawer. And for others I think, it would be nice one day maybe if they find their way out of the drawer. I've not given riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Hmm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: up on a couple of them. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. I think a lot of writers see their work as precious and it's hard to picture working on something for so long and then putting it in drawer. But it sounds like you've really embraced that feeling. You're like, Yeah, this was practice. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah, I had a great time writing some of them and I think I like to preserve the memory of how nice it was to write them without spoiling it by going back and looking at them and thinking, no, what was that? What was I thinking? riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: That's so funny. I'm curious. You also mentioned that you have you came from nursing rather than a formal writing background. I'm I'm curious. so many writers have so many different opinions about how to learn the craft. And in my opinion, you you could just write and practice and read a lot and you'll learn the craft of writing. how did you learn your craft throughout the 10 years? What did you do to improve your craft and everything like that? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah, think to begin with, felt like I was maybe at a disadvantage because I hadn't come from a formal kind of writing background and I didn't have any qualifications in it. And in fact, I hadn't even studied it since school because I didn't even take kind of English through to my A levels or to university. So I thought, am I even really allowed to do this? Do I not need to go back and get like a certificate to show that I can actually do it? But then I kind of had always been a huge reader. I'd always been a massive bookworm. And I'd like I said, always made up these stories. So I think like you say you do absorb some of the rules and some of what it means to what a good story can be and I think you riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm-hmm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: would naturally pick that up. But I definitely... kind of threw myself into learning as much as I could once I'd started and I really got the bug and I thought, right, okay, how do you actually write a whole novel and keep it going for the whole way through? But I think this, we kind of, it's... difficult time to be a writer but also an amazing time to be a writer because like there's everything that you could possibly need to know is is out there you know it's available riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: in so many different forms and I just read so many incredible like articles online and blogs from authors who were already doing it and and kind of riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: offering up that expertise of like learn from my mistakes here are some things that you could avoid doing or try to do and obviously all the like craft books that just get recommended over and over but for a good reason. you know, Mark's riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm-hmm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Bird by Bird and Stephen King's On Writing and I got a lot of books like that for Christmas and birthday presents after I had told people what I was trying to do. yeah, just reading anything that I could really to try and improve. And writing and like just writing and writing and writing. Like, I don't know how. not just the the kind of seven that I managed to finish before I wrote the Honeymoon Suite but like all the ones that I abandoned along the way riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm-hmm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: all kind of don't feel like they were a waste because they were me drawing riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: stuff so riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah, you were practicing your craft. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: yes riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. And how so you said that you're a perfectionist. I'm just so curious how you decide how you decided in the beginnings with your with your let's say your third or fourth manuscript or something and how you decided, okay, I'm gonna put that away and I'm not gonna try to publish it. How did you decide it was time to go on to the next thing? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: think sometimes it was just that I had this really shiny idea that I thought, that's the one. And then I would just throw myself into writing that instead and kind of lose interest in going back and trying to fix what I'd already written. But I think for some of them, just knew it was like I'd satisfied that itch, but that didn't mean it would be. necessarily publishable or that I'd want anyone else to read it. I'm trying to think of like specific ones now and like why did you why did you kind of give up on that? I think for some I was just riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah, why don't you put it down? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah, why did I put it down? I think for some I was trying genres and realizing, I don't think that's where I belong. Like with the fantasy thing, riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: I loved the idea of writing fantasy and I loved reading it. But then when it came to it, I just couldn't quite pull it off. Yeah. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah, yeah, I love that. You were working, raising children and dealing with a chronic illness all those years. What did writing actually look like look like inside that reality? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: I think for me it's been about accepting that what other people are able to do is great for them but not always what you can replicate. I know lots of people do recommend writing every day and I think if you can that's great and it's a great way to stay really engaged with your manuscript if you're opening it up and looking at it every day. But for some people it's just not going to be possible and it definitely wasn't for me for quite a few years. So I think it's just about committing to the idea of if you have had to put it down. of going back to it and not beating yourself up about it because I think then you almost end up wasting even more time and energy by going, no, I haven't opened it for X days, weeks, months, and I'm riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm-hmm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: a terrible person, a terrible writer, I'm not really a writer, or, you know, and thinking, okay, no, life just happens and everybody's got different stuff going on, so just get back to it when you can and don't be so hard on yourself because I always think, I riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: wouldn't, I would never say that to one of my writing friends if they had been really struggling with something that was going on in their lives and they were like, do you know what? Actually, I haven't opened my manuscript for six months. I wouldn't be like, call yourself a writer. Like, I wouldn't say that to them. So then I think, riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Right. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: why am I doing that to myself? And also thinking that writing every day doesn't have to mean literally. adding fresh words to a manuscript every day. I think you can find ways to touch base with a writing project without having to be sat at a desk with a laptop open. There were times where I would be on school runs, thinking about... my project I hadn't had time to write anything that day but I would think, where was I up to, what was that scene? Or listening to playlists in the car that could kind of keep it ticking away in the back of my mind. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: And just finding little ways back in when the idea of actually sitting down and writing 500 words or something was just not gonna happen. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. I mean you seem pretty prolific with writing eight books in the last ten years. Seems like a lot of books for ten years. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: It does. think I've had massive gaps where I haven't really been writing anything. Like for me, I know a lot of people really wrote a lot in the pandemic. was that maybe they riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm-hmm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: were furloughed. They suddenly had all this time. And I think for me, the opposite was true because I'd already been writing and suddenly now I was like homeschooling and I wasn't sure if I was meant to be kind of staying at home because of my chronic illness and nobody really knew what was going on and it was quite stressful. I don't think I got any writing really done in 2020, but then I've had years where I've come back to projects that I'd started and stalled on and suddenly got this flurry and been able to finish them. I had this year that I called my finishing year where it seemed like I was just wrapping up all these projects that had been ticking away and they'd all been abandoned. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: I love this. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: One had been abandoned at 38,000 words and one had been abandoned a little bit nearer to the end and one had barely got the ground and it was like I just got this like spurt of like I'm just gonna finish them just like riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: That is so funny. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: and like wrapped them all up and I don't know where that came from but yeah I've kind of dropped them come back to them yeah riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Okay. So you don't necessarily s pick up a manuscript and then, you know, you you write it and finish it and then you're like, Okay, done. Like you've you've had points where you've dropped something off and you've like, Okay, I'll come back to that and then a few years later you did come back and you finished it. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah. I think that's my natural way riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: That's so cool. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: of writing. I think looking back, that's how I would write if I was left to my own devices. And actually, since getting my book deal, this is the first time I've tried to write in a very normal way. Because you have to, because I was under contract. So riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Right. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: the book that's coming out next year, I genuinely had to have the idea for it, start writing it, finish writing it, and send it to an editor. And I was like, well, this is very strange. Like, I don't get to abandon it. halfway through, like, I have to just keep going. So that was a real challenge, riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: That's so funny. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: because, you know, I even said to my husband, this is the point where if I wasn't under contract, I would just put this away and leave it alone because it's driving me mad. And he was like, yeah, but you can't do that because they were waiting for it. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: I'm curious how do you deal with those moments when you're s you're having to write something and you're stuck and but you're under contract? Like what does that feel like and how do you manage it? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: to have a big sulk about it. And just go, I can't believe that they expect me to just be able to write this book that I've told them that I would write that they've paid for. Like how unreasonable, you know, of them. And have a big sulk about it and feel really stuck. Write myself into like several corners thinking that, maybe if I do this, it would fix it. But actually I've just made it worse. Waste like. I don't know, three, four, five, six weeks writing weird stuff that's never gonna end up in the final thing. And then suddenly go, yeah, okay, I remember now, this is what we're meant to be doing and then get back on track. So it's definitely been a learning experience having to see it all the way through riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: That's so funny. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: from start to finish. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: I love that you say that you have weeks where you just write things that will never end up in the manuscript and then you come back to it and you're like, yeah, okay and like you kind of find your way back into it after doing that. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah, it's really inefficient and I was thinking this the other day when I looked at my outtakes document and it's nearly as long as the actual manuscript and it's all stuff that I've taken out and gone, I don't know what that is or that doesn't belong there or it doesn't make sense anymore. And I think it's up to about 70,000 words, you know, and I was like, this riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: is really inefficient. There must be a better way to write a book that doesn't involve doing this, but I just haven't, if there is, then I haven't figured out what it is. Yeah, it seems to be the only way that I can do it is to write all this random nonsense and then just take it out bit by bit. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: I think that's very common. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. I know it's annoying because we're like, well, I want to just be efficient, but I I do think that if it's working and it clearly is because you have all these books that you've written and of course you s you know, they all look different, but it's it c it clearly like does get you to the end at some point. Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah, it's just annoying. Like, it's just, I just look at it I'm like, what? That's hours and hours that you just spent running around with that. yeah. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: I love it. And so you had come from a nursing background. When did you riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: very much. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: leave nursing out of curiosity? Or are you still a nurse? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: No, I'm not. mean, I suppose I am. I don't think you're ever not a nurse. It's maybe one of those professions where you still feel like you are one, even though you're not actively doing it anymore. But I'm not on the nursing register anymore. So I'm a trained nurse, but I'm not a registered nurse anymore. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: So I stepped back from nursing in 2013 after being diagnosed with my chronic illness. It was all a bit uncertain when I first got diagnosed as to what it was kind of going to be like, you know, the condition. that I have can affect people differently and there's different versions of it like riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm-hmm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: relapsing remitting or you know there's a version where you kind of get progressively worse and no one riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm-hmm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: could really say to begin with what that was going to look like for me and I had two very very young children who were three and one at the time. So the idea of juggling that and also going back to a career that demands so much of you mentally and physically, riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: it just wasn't going to happen. And I sort riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: of thought, I'll take a step back and maybe at some point I'll go back to it. And then I tried to go back to it twice. And each time thought, no, the timing's not quite right. And then the second time thought, maybe it's not the timing, Rebecca. Maybe it's that you have just changed. You're not the person that you were back then, and maybe that's fine. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: You can stop trying to go back to something that you did a long time ago. So, yeah. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. This might be a personal question. So if you don't want to answer it, I can have my husband take this out because he's the one who edits the podcast. But I'm curious, when you were diagnosed, was there a feeling that you were gonna run out of time that you wouldn't be able to write books because you'd you'd pass away? Like did you ever have that feeling when you got diagnosed? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: I'm really fortunate that my health condition is one that I'm going to have to live with forever and I can't get rid of but isn't necessarily going to shorten my life. It's going to make my life more difficult but hopefully not going to kind of cut my years down. But I think what it really made me think was, I mean I was a nurse so I already knew that these things can happen and that your life can suddenly riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: take a turn. And I'd looked after enough people to realise that nobody ever thinks that whatever it is is going to happen to them or their family. But somehow you compartmentalise that and you go to work and you think, OK, I go to work and I look after poorly people, but I am not a poorly person myself. And then when you get a diagnosis that's kind of here to stay, you have to start thinking about yourself differently and what comes next differently. and my condition meant that... I was paralysed, so was 28. I'd done like a 10K run or something for charity in the May, and by the August, I couldn't walk, I couldn't dress myself, riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm-hmm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: I could barely feed myself, I couldn't get off the toilet by myself, so it was properly basic kind of levels of things that I couldn't do. And I couldn't write, couldn't, when I had to sign something when I was in hospital, and I couldn't sign my own signature, was just like, I've got a shaky blur. And it really made me think, not necessarily that I would run out of time, but I just thought, I don't know what the rest of my life's gonna look like and how dependent riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: I might be on other people. I just, when I then, when they found out what it was and they said here is a treat, well several treatments that we can try and figure out what the right one is for you, I thought I've really got to do the things that I feel that I need to do, that I want to do with my life because I just don't know what's coming next. I mean nobody ever does but it riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: really, really made it home I suppose. Yeah. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. It sounded like there was a level of maybe not the urgency, but you you kinda came to peace with this is what I actually have to do with my life. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah, and I'd been putting it off thinking, imagining that I had all this time, all these years, when the kids were older, when work was less stressful, riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm-hmm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: all these things that you sort of tell yourself, when this, when that, then that would be better, that would be easier. And then I just thought, well, I think all I've got for sure is now. So I probably have to just start with now and like see what we can do riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: with that. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. And I'm curious when you when you look back at your last ten years and maybe Rebecca ten years ago, who didn't know what was gonna happen, what would you tell her? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: I think probably what I'd tell anybody who sort of says... what would your advice be to writers? And I think it's always to keep going because I think if you are a writer you can do lots and lots of things to distract yourself from that fact and to sort of pretend that you're not. But if you are then it's always going to be in you trying to get out in various ways and I think before I really made a go of trying to write fiction when I look back now and I say to myself, I wasn't really writing back then but then I think yeah but you had like a mummy blog when your kids were little like you were writing it didn't feel like the riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Mm-hmm. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: writing to you but you were always trying to express yourself trying to trying to get something out there so I think my advice is always just keep going just keep literally just keep writing because I think that's the only like antidote that we've got as writers is to just keep just keep doing it and and and eventually, riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Severe. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: yeah, it'll get some work. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. Yeah, and I'm very curious, how can people find your work? Tell us where we can find the honeymoon suite and everything else. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Well, I've got a website, which is just my name, RebeccaTaylorMcKay.com, and I am on Instagram, again, just as my name. And I'm branching out into TikTok because I went to a Society of Authors training workshop last week. An author who has been doing really well on TikTok was sharing some wisdom with us, and I was there with my little notepad. I'm tips down, I'm trying to, much to my teenage children's amusement, I am trying to post TikToks. One of them, my eldest son liked my first little TikTok that I put up this morning while he was on the bus to college and I was like, thanks for liking it. And he was like, that's all right, I'm helping you build your platform. But yeah, they find it quite funny that I just obviously don't have a clue what I'm doing. and they know everything, you know, they're like, yeah, that's how you do this. So yeah, I'm trying to... riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: That is so funny. Are you on TikTok a lot? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: No, I'm not because it's so addictive and I feel like I've got these books that I'm supposed to be writing. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: I know. I know. It's very tricky. I'm not on there anymore either. I was on there for a few years. And then I think I left in like twenty twenty three or four because I was like, This is too addicting. but then you don't know what is happening on there, you don't know the trends, so it's harder to like post and actually do stuff on there if you don't know what's happening. But riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yeah, you can't really dip it in and out, can you? You can't be like, I'll just pop on with a TikTok and then go away riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: No riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: because you kind of have to figure out. Yeah, it's definitely right. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: It's yeah, it's very tricky. That's funny though. So you're on TikTok, you have your website. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: Yes. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: yeah. And can you tell us about your book? What is your like I guess pitch to your elevator pitch? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: for the honeymoon suite. That's so funny because riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: Yeah. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: you always feel like people are asking you about the one that's out and your head is in the one that you write about riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: I know. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: next year and you're like, which one? Which book? So the honeymoon suite is a psychological thriller. It's set on the Amalfi Coast in the early 1960s and it follows a very wealthy, glamorous young couple, Clara and Spencer, who are on their honeymoon. But all is not as it seems. and quite early on in the honeymoon Clara receives an anonymous note under the door of the honeymoon suite saying that her husband is lying to her so we then follow Clara as she tries to figure out if that's true and if so what is he lying about so yes riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: This sounds like it could also be such a good like Netflix series or something. my god. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: I'm really helping. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: I know, right? man. Okay, I love this. I love this. And I love that you didn't start writing the thrillers ri originally, like you've been trying all these different genres and you ended up in this d did you know it would be a thriller when you started writing it? riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: thought it'd be a thriller, but I will say that it's quite, because it's historical and because I guess it's like psychological thriller, it's quite a slow burn thriller because we're really along for the ride as Clara tries to, she's having this glorious honeymoon that turns a bit sinister and she's trying to figure out what's going on. So I think it's maybe not like a car chases and gun fights kind of thriller. It's more of a like, who is lying and what are they lying about vibe. But yeah, riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: I love that stuff. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: yeah. riverside monica hay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0064: I love it. Well, thank you, Rebecca. This has been a lovely conversation. Thank you for joining us. riverside rebecca taylor mckay raw video cfr monica hay's studio 0063: thank you so much for having me. It's been great.