Latest / The Ethnos360 Podcast / How Do I Resolve Conflict Biblically?
Transcript
- speaker-0: conflict comes up when we think, something must be wrong. This is terrible. Can you address the issue without making it personal? Can you talk about the conflict? Can you talk about how it impacts you? Can you talk about how you view things as right or wrong and keep the issue the issue and not make the person the issue? What would happen if we perceived conflict as an opportunity? The Bible and Missions Podcast, an Ethnos 360 podcast. speaker-1: Hey, I'm Alan McDohl, and I'm here with Andy Templeton, and we're gonna be discussing his conflict resolution class that he teaches here at Ethno 360 Bible Institute. And he's also gonna be sharing some of his missions background. speaker-0: The first time I was confronted with like eternal separation from God or like the importance of evangelism. One of my dad's roles was moving missionaries into the tribe after they learned Portuguese. So they'd learn Portuguese at the MK school, actually where where I grew up. And once they learned the language and what once they'd been assigned a tribe or once they'd picked a tribe to work in, then he would take you know, he had a truck and so we we would pack all their belongings and move to the tribe and He would take us along because it was usually during the summer break. But we were up in a tribe and when we were there somebody one of the tribal people died. I was probably a freshman in high school. And then all the ceremonies and all the despair and, you know, no hope and cutting themselves and all that to appease the spirits, you know, and to like guarantee the the person's soul going to the right place or whatever. That was the first time I was like, Wow. You know, I was just shaken out of my complacency a little bit. And realized, yeah, there's probably something bigger to live for than soccer, having a good time or going to college or whatever. And that's probably when I started seriously thinking about like what do I want to do with my life. So that was more of a that was probably more of thought provoking experience than than my salvation experience because I was just so young when when I came to know the speaker-1: As an MK, would you say your experience overall was positive or negative? Right. And what's one thing that your parents did good? What's one thing that you would do differently if you were them? speaker-0: So my experience was positive. When I I mentioned that my parents worked at the training center for Brazilian missionaries, in a place called Chiquina in Brazil. And I've been there. speaker-1: Have you? speaker-0: Okay. I was first grader. My mom homeschooled me. And they had decided that when I went into second grade, they would send me to the boarding school. So I was all excited about that. I was like making plans in my head. This mostly this is from my mom telling me the stories, right? 'Cause I was second grade. I don't remember all that. And then the field leadership asked my parents to move to the boarding school and work there. And my parents tell me I was so disappointed. Like that was the worst thing ever. And my parents were the dorm parents. But all that to say, my you know, I grew up there from second grade on and my experience was fantastic. But having said that, I get together with my siblings now and we'll sit around and chat when we're all together. And it's interesting how all of our experiences are a little bit different. And some of had really have really poor memories of growing up in on the field. It's interesting because most of the people that we grew up around and most of the adults that were in our lives were all the same. It's not like there was big changes in personnel or anything really. So a lot of it's personality, a lot of it's things you hold on to, you know, from your childhood. Sure. you probably can identify that there's things in your childhood that you remember well and some of are negative and some of them are positive. And I think some people just gravitate toward hanging on to certain things more than others. speaker-1: That's interesting. It makes me think of on a smaller scale how my sisters and I viewed homeschooling. Mm-hmm. We have different experiences 'cause we're different people. Right. Even though we did basically the same thing. Yeah. And it doesn't fit everybody. Right. speaker-0: No, I loved it. I mean, of course, this is a long time ago. This is the eighties. So no cell phones, no computers. But we had so much freedom. I mean, we'd take our bikes out and spend the weekend camping and fishing. And my dad had a motorcycle and I was riding the motorcycle at twelve and thirteen years old and it was fun. Let's see, your other question was do my parents do speaker-1: there one thing that you would do differently than your parents or speaker-0: So there's something that I've done different, and it has to do with culture within within American society and within the mission culture of new tribes. So when my parents went through, leadership was viewed as being appointed by God, not in a bad way. You didn't question leadership. okay. Really. And so if if your mission leaders ask you to do this, it's not that you didn't pray about it. It's not that you didn't talk about it as a couple. But what they asked you to do, it was almost unheard of to say no to that. And so you would go along. And so mission you wouldn't question leadership. And so there were things okay, and this happens everywhere, right? It's not just in missions or not within ethnos. It's anywhere that you grow up, there's gonna be times where leadership maybe makes a decision that's not great. And you can either go along with it or you can push back and you can question. And at that time, and even in American culture and in mission culture for sure, you didn't question leadership pretty much. and if you did, it would it might be viewed as a sign of rebellion or something like that. So they went along with a lot of things that probably weren't great. They weren't terrible, but they weren't great decisions. And by the time that we went to the field, culture had changed enough to where And maybe it swung too far the other way where everybody questions everything. Sure. But there was a lot more freedom to engage with leadership and to question and to ask for more clarity instead of just following. So I don't think that I don't think that culture necessarily resulted in anything terribly negative in my life. But that's something that even my parents will say, you know, it's too bad that we didn't. Either stand up or have the opportunity to stand up or question or those kind of things. So I think the the mission's in a lot better place in that aspect now for sure. speaker-1: That's an interesting segue to the class you teach speaker-0: that's right. speaker-1: resolution. What have been some of the cool testimonies that you've seen it change students' lives? speaker-0: In the class, we talked about communication as far as one of the processes of of resolving conflict. When we speak, our words should breathe grace into other people's lives. And that when we speak, we should exhibit a spirit of gentleness. And so there's some verses that we have the students memorize. Anyway, the student came in a couple days after we had talked about that and shared in class. He worked at a fast food restaurant. The line was really slow. There was an irate customer, a couple cars back in the drive-thru line, honking and yelling and you know, gesturing and all this stuff. That might have been you. speaker-1: I think that was me. speaker-0: and he said that when the well it wasn't you because it was a lady, but when the lady got up to the drive-thru window, he was just gentle and asked how her day was going and apologized for the wait. Was just really gracious with her. And he said she was kind of taken aback a little bit. And he went to get her drink order and brought that back to her and she started apologizing for her, you know, behavior. And and we had talked about that in the class just a day or two earlier about how conflict happens. I don't have control of the fact that it arose, but I do have a choice of how I respond to that. And my response is likely gonna either escalate it. Or help de escalate, right? Didn't speaker-1: Okay, yeah, that that's the interesting perspective I think that the the book has and that you teach that it's normal and you should anticipate it, especially on the mission field. I know some people think, if you're working with just believers like perfect Christians. Yeah, how could you have conflict? speaker-0: But usually conflict comes up when we think, something must be wrong. This is terrible. What did I do wrong? Or what did you do wrong? Or how can I avoid this? How can I get through this as quickly as possible? We live in a fallen world. And conflict is any time where two goals or desires can't be met simultaneously. Somebody's gotta give. Or somebody's in the way of my desire. So what do I do about that? And how do I How do I process it and how do I how do I deal with it? instead of viewing it negatively, what would happen if we perceived conflict as an opportunity instead of as a tragedy or as a as a bad thing that happened in my life? Some people are escapers, some people are attackers, and then some, even by default, our personality are tend to be peacemakers. So an escaper is gonna say it doesn't exist, the conflict is there is no conflict. Or I'm just gonna do whatever you want to appease you so that we it doesn't appear like there's conflict. An attacker is gonna say, I'm gonna win. And that's the way it is, and whatever it takes, right? And so in both cases we talk about in the class, neither one of those values the relationship as the priority. The escaper values comfort, their own comfort. Like I don't, I don't wanna get into this conflict, so I'll just Do whatever it takes to not ha experience it. so they're valuing their own comfort more than the relationship, because the relationship's not getting any better by escaping the conflict. And then the attacker doesn't value the relationship because they want to win at all costs, regardless of what it does to the relationship. And the peacemaker values the relationship more than winning or more than comfort, even though the conflict is uncomfortable, and even though they may not win, however you want to define that. conflict, their perspective is the relationship is the most important thing. speaker-1: I didn't realize there was a natural peacemaker. speaker-0: I th I think so. And I think I think you could say that some people are naturally peacemakers and it's not a fake thing. And it's not it's not just appeasing and it's not just avoiding conflict. They actually they have a sensitive spirit maybe. could speaker-1: Middle sibling. speaker-0: be, could be. And they actually care about like the value of the relationship in that. It's not it's not a selfish thing necessarily. Probably the minority of us. Personally I I would tend to probably be the more of an escaper. and peacemaker. I don't wanna, you know, sound too proud. But I think I am a peacemaker to speaker-1: Where was that in Footsal? speaker-0: I think I'm a peacemaker to the most part. People are a lot of work and they take a lot of time and so it's easy for me to just say, conflict. Well, what's that gonna take to resolve this? It's gonna take time, it's gonna take interacting with people and talking about their feelings and as an introvert, I'm just like, I could just not be bothered by all that. But then it goes back to that, well, but they're created in God's image and they have an eternal soul. So I guess it's worth it, even though I might not be super excited about it. speaker-1: And some people I think with that perspective think they're better than the aggressive when it all costs people. speaker-0: Yeah. But you can be the quiet, sneaky type that instigates all kinds of conflict and just be in and then you sit back and just watch everything blow up and then you're like, I didn't I didn't give angry. But yeah, I mean I think there can be that tendency to think that the hot head is is worse. But if you think about it from a relational standpoint, maybe the person with a bad temper more obviously destroys a relationship. You have a tree, you can cut it down, that would be like an attacker. he destroyed the tree. Yeah. But an escaper, you could just neglect it and not water it and not feed it. It's still gonna die. It's just not as obvious, you know. So the same thing with the relationship. Like, do I value the relationship? And if I if I do, I will I'll invest in it. speaker-1: I found that I'm like strict with my kids. Yeah. And then maybe I don't call out my boss. Especially in past work environments. I just, you know, didn't confront at all 'cause I was just speaker-0: I think to some extent we all do that. I think most people interact with conflict in multiple ways depending on who they're in conflict with. I think that's probably accurate to say. Our middle son is our most stubborn, strong, strong willed. speaker-1: That's our oldest. speaker-0: And they're the ones that change the world. They're the ones that they're the ones that do things, but they're pretty frustrating to the parent. Yeah. So he's in middle school and his teachers are all telling us. He's such a good kid, he's so helpful in the classroom, he's so wow, you know. And we asked him, we said, Why aren't why aren't you like this at home? So his answer was, Well, you have to love me. That was his response. Hmm. And so I think that's true, like in the family setting, we're we're the closest to these people. But there's this idea that, well, you have to love me, 'cause you're my family, so I can just be however I want to be. And so maybe we are more antagonistic and maybe we stir up more conflict and maybe we are more of an attacker in the family because there's less to lose in it. I mean, there's more to lose really, but it we tell ourselves that there's less to lose because these people they're always gonna be in my life. They have to be. But like my job, I might lose my job if I'm if I question my boss, or I might lose somebody's respect, a friend's respect, or I might lose a dating relationship if I bring up conflict and address it, you know. So like, I don't want to lose that. So I just I become more complacent. speaker-1: You've been in Brazil, Thailand, and here in the US. What stands out as different in how people in general address conflict and how can that be challenging if you're not aware that there's gonna be huge cultural differences? Yeah. speaker-0: Brazil and Thailand are a lot more relational. They would value the relationship over time, say America. Not that Americans aren't relational, but we value we're a time culture. We're a cold culture. So we value getting things done. I would say, as a general rule, obviously America, there's people from all over the place here, right? But generally in America, it's very important to be right. And if I believe I'm right, I can pretty much approach conflict any way that I want. And I don't have to worry about your feelings or about the relationship too much because I'm right. And so I I should just stand up and you know, we value our rights in America. In Latin and and Asian culture, it's like you better value the relationship. Doesn't matter if you're right or not. I mean it does a little bit, but the relationship is the main thing. I mean, and I only lived in Thailand for four years, so that's That's my perspective. People who have lived there longer would probably have a different perspective and probably more accurate perspective. But in Thailand, you would resolve conflict alm like if you and I are both Thai people, and this probably applies to other Asian cultures. If you and I are having a conflict, we probably wouldn't resolve it face to face. Like I would tell a friend and they would tell a friend, and eventually it would come around to you. And we would. We would become aware that there's conflict through our friend group, and we may resolve it. Our friends would play a part in resolving that conflict. If it's a big one, if it's a small one, we might resolve it, you know, face to face. But you and I would do everything possible to not embarrass each other, to not shame each other, to not make the relationship uncomfortable. And there would probably be a bigger tendency of of avoiding or hiding the conflict. Even if internally I was pretty upset about it. Because not only are you and I involved, like your whole family's involved, my whole family's involved, our neighborhoods involved. And Brazil is somewhere in between. It's a Western culture, but the Latin culture is also very relational. It's not so much honor shame like Asia was. but you would still definitely value the relationship. I could probably address a conflict face to face with a Brazilian friend. But I would do it in such I wouldn't start with the problem. I would start with the relationship. And I would like talk about how you're such a a good friend of mine and how we have this history of being good friends. And I would bring up the conflict almost in an apologetic way, like, and this this may have happened and or this thing, you know, I sense this thing between us and but maybe it's not a big deal 'cause I I would in everything that I said I would put like the relationship first and value the relationship. speaker-1: And maybe in the US somebody might view that as insincere. Right. If you're speaker-0: You're being fake. speaker-1: what I really mean to say is this, they're like, Okay, why don't you just get straight to the point? Yeah. speaker-0: In America we would say, I'm sorry, but I just have to tell the truth. Like I'm sorry this destroys you, but I'm just gonna say it 'cause it's truth. speaker-1: I hate to say this, but speaker-0: So we talk about here at the at the school, you have all these students have roommates. People go to bed at different times. People listen to different kinds of music. People listen to music at different volumes. People play different kinds of video games with different levels of violence and language and all that. So all this is happening in a very small space in their dorm room, right? Can you address the issue without making it personal? Can you talk about the conflict? Can you talk about how it impacts you? Can you talk about how you view things as right or wrong and keep the issue the issue and not make the person the issue. Like the person isn't your enemy. And the person isn't the conflict. There's this thing, there's this issue that is the center of the conflict. And can I view you as a partner in resolving the conflict, or do I have to view you as the problem? Enemy. speaker-1: As the speaker-0: As the enemy. Right. So how I perceive conflict is going to impact how I Try to navigate conflict and that's gonna have consequences. speaker-1: You have an example from your life where a conflict unexpectedly turned into an opportunity for spiritual maturity? speaker-0: We had our kids in Tennessee. We took them to Brazil, brought back to the States, took to Thailand, brought back to the States. At different times in their life, they would have said that they've been dragged around the world. Now they look back on it as a mostly positive experience, right? But all of those moves created conflict. The second time we went to Brazil, we were there five years, kids had a, you know, pets, they had friends, and then we're like, Yeah, we're not coming back. We're leaving and we left the we left the dog and when we drove away to go to the airport, the dog got loose from the new owners and followed our car running behind it. I mean this is conflict. Our kids are saying things like, Well, you don't care about my friends, you don't care about my dog. Why does God have us move around the world? What do you do with that as a parent? You can be and we probably did all of the all of these things bad and Good. Well, you just need to obey because you're my kid. God's leading us in a certain direction and I'm the leader of the family and you just need to come along. The opp the other side of that would be to s just let your kids make the decision because you want to be their friend. Well, that's not all three of them maybe have different ideas, you know. Or the idea that they have isn't the best long term idea, even though it would make them happy at the time. And then maybe my wife and I weren't always on the same page. You know, my wife's family all lives here in Wisconsin. So going to Brazil was difficult the first time. Coming back was nice. Family again, leaving for Thailand for another four years, that's difficult. So what do I do with that conflict? It's like there there are these emotions for my kids, myself, my wife. You can ignore if you want, but that's not only gonna do you so much good. you can win the argument by attacking or by being a dominant type person. And that may cause outward conformity, but there's still gonna be issues, right, in their heart. So then you have to process through and it's never going to be resolved a hundred percent to everybody's satisfaction equally. So we had a lot of difficult conversations in Yeah, everybody wasn't always on board. And the answers aren't weren't always satisfactory, but that's that's how it is in life, right? Even as adults, there's a component of faith to living. So that whole that that wasn't really just one example, but that was our whole time of moving, leaving things behind, leaving pets behind, selling everything, moving to a different country. I think we did a fairly good job of, you know, involving our kids in all of that. Explaining as best we could why we're moving again. A lot of conversations and a lot of asking the Lord, Am I doing this right? Or am I ruining my family by moving them around? And I should ask you questions. What's your automatic response to conflict? Are you a peace are you a peacemaker, escaper, attacker? speaker-1: think the more comfortable I get in a relationship, the more attacker I become. And if there's conflict, I wanna resolve it right away. speaker-0: What's the motivation for wanting to resolve it right away? speaker-1: I'm starting to realize that yes, you shouldn't let your the sun go down in your anger and you should resolve conflict as quickly as possible, but maybe maybe not like right that second. Yeah. That's what I've learned with with my wife and speaker-0: So does she need more time to process usually? speaker-1: Yeah, she usually needs more time to process. And I didn't understand that. Yeah. But I start to started to understand that once I got into situations where I was like, Wow, I'm not ready to talk about this right now. This very second. Yeah. I'm still angry and speaker-0: And that's not gonna be helpful to talk about right now 'cause I'm I'm angry. That's what's gonna come out. Pick the right time. That's another thing. Like sometimes I'm so motivated to resolve the conflict. I'm not even thinking about the other person. And like what time of day do they process information? But I mean, this is good for marriage, right? So I don't know. Your wife probably has a certain time of day that you would not want to try to resolve conflict with her. Because she's busy with the kids or she takes more time in the morning to wake up or what you know, whatever. But if I'm just focused on the conflict and just focused on myself, I'm not even gonna be thinking about that. And then I'm gonna bring up this resolution to the conflict. The other person's not ready to hear it. It's not the right time. speaker-1: Yeah, I found certain times like you mentioned dealing with the kids right after dinner and we're putting the kids to bed and giving them baths and crazy that's just not a a good time to like talk about any deep conversation. 'Cause we'll just be interrupted by the kids. 'Cause our kids are very young right now. Yeah. But also I've learned some things about myself where That period of time when I'm waking up is the hardest time for me to control my emotions. Based on that knowledge, recently I've been setting and and by recently I mean like two days ago. I've been like, I need I really need to wake up before the kids, no matter how tired I am so I can you know, unload the dishwasher, right, get coffee going. speaker-0: It's interesting with kids because it's a you know, it's a natural thing. People have been having kids forever. So there's this part that's like, it'll just be intuitive or I'll I'll figure it out. But on the other hand, like I wouldn't wake up at the last minute for my job. I would wake up ahead of time and, you know, get dressed and prepare myself. And if I'm speaking, if I'm speaking in a church, I wouldn't just like roll out of bed and go talk. speaker-1: That's a good point. speaker-0: All these things in life for soccer, I don't just wake up from a nap and go to play. I'm like, you know, especially like in high school, you're psyching yourself up. You're it's like this whole process leading up to and then with kids, like you were saying, like how many times do they wake me up? And then of course I'm frustrated. Like that's I'm I'm irritable from the get go, you know. But then my kids are way more important than a soccer game or a job or any of these things. So why wouldn't I? And it sounds like you're doing it. Like I'm I'm just recently well, I'm intentionally thinking about this is how I am when I am, you know, without sleep or or just waking up. And my kids are important, therefore, this is what I need to do so that I'm in the best frame of mind because I'm investing in. My family. So, what I tend to think about a lot is approach conflict with the right perspective. It's not the end of the world. It's not something to get through, it's something to grow through. I mean, it's cheesy, but it's it's a good perspective. Because conflict comes up multiple times a day. Many times I'll probably just start interacting with that conflict without thinking. It's just kind of automatic. Subconsciously. I'm frustrated or I'm maybe I'm in even handling it well, but I'm not thinking about it. And so maybe what what would happen if I stop? That's the first thing. And then, okay, how am I gonna approach this conflict well? speaker-1: That's a great thought to end on. Well, thanks for coming on the podcast. speaker-0: Till next time. speaker-1: Until next time, talking about your other class that you teach. speaker-0: Right. speaker-1: Thanks for listening to the Bible and missions podcast. Be sure to check out Ken Sandy's book, The Peacemaker, which is the main textbook for the conflict resolution class, or apply to take the class here in person at Ethno 260 Bible Institute.