Latest / Shit 90s Shows Taught Me | Felicity/ Buffy the Vampire Slayer/ Boy Meets World / Dawson's Creek/ 90s TV / Buffy the Vampire Slayer: Season 6 Episode 19 - Seeing Red

Transcript

Buffy the Vampire Slayer: Season 6 Episode 19 - Seeing Red · Shit 90s Shows Taught Me | Felicity/ Buffy the Vampire Slayer/ Boy Meets World / Dawson's Creek/ 90s TV

• 0:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes a world looks like you ain't ever seen it before Just be how never ended with those All you need is a door Searching for something to put a smile back on your face Just remembering unusual times I can come from an unusual place
• 0:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: I need a partner for a ride Cause everybody needs a ride Such a bird is to the side Just ask See the word and I'll be there Just ask
• 0:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know the greatest things in the life I'll come in a pair They say hindsight's 20, 20 That ain't far enough behind me So we can walk this sweetest honey I think hindsight's 19, 19 Isn't me to pretend I got a hand I can land Who's like you really need a friend Just ask
• 1:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Shit 90's show start me!
• 1:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: Shit 90's show start me was not filmed before live studio audience.
• 1:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: are you ready to play another day?
• 1:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: So are we?
• 1:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: Welcome back to shit 90 shows taught me.
• 1:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just dirling here with my co-hosts.
• 1:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: They're home free.
• 1:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: Sarah, how are you?
• 1:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: Jess, we are at the literal worst timeline.
• 1:43
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's like literally the darkest timeline.
• 1:45
  [SPEAKER_03]: The darkest timeline.
• 1:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know how I wound up here.
• 1:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: I thought I was doing pretty good in life.
• 1:49
  [SPEAKER_03]: I thought that was trucking along.
• 1:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: I got thrown into this cursed world where everything bad happens and I'm forced to watch the shitty shit that ever shitted out.
• 2:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's terrible, this is so bad.
• 2:05
  [SPEAKER_03]: I understand why it's called seeing red because not because anybody else is seeing red because all the entire audience is seeing red with anger and disgust at this episode.
• 2:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: really horrible.
• 2:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: There's so much to talk about.
• 2:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't even know how to wear to start off or like what to begin with.
• 2:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: But I guess like this is this is where friend of the podcast Hannah.
• 2:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: She had said like she had messaged just a while back like I'm afraid you're not going to like finish the season and I was like I was like maybe she's being hyperbolic you know like it can't get that bad.
• 2:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: But then this episode happened and it did get that bad.
• 2:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: And the thing is, is like the fact that there's even more than one thing that sent me off the edge is like kind of crazy.
• 2:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: You know what I mean?
• 2:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: The fact that like there's that we could theoretically, people could theoretically not know which plot line we're most upset with is like the is why this episode sucks so hard.
• 3:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like it just sucks.
• 3:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: all the way around.
• 3:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: The only thing that could have made it worse was something I was terrified of happening because we know sometimes you're a prophet.
• 3:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: I've said this to my husband.
• 3:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: I have said Sarah sometimes is a prophet and she just knows things and like not because you're spoiled just
• 3:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, sometimes it's because you're spoiled, but most of the time is because that is some sense of that.
• 3:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's my nobody believes me when I actually have visions because they're like, well, you're definitely spoiled.
• 3:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, but how did I dream that somebody had syphilis and then the next day they had syphilis?
• 3:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: Exactly.
• 3:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: But sometimes you know things.
• 3:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: And so the only thing that could have made this episode worse was the scene at which Zander and Buffy are like chilling outside on a bench.
• 3:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: I was like, are they about to kiss?
• 3:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, is this about to happen?
• 3:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: And it would have literally ripped my soul out of my body and stomped it on the ground.
• 3:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 3:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: But the vibes are surviving.
• 3:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: Bye.
• 3:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: vibe, whoa, vibes are so vibeing.
• 4:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: I can't even say this is so disgusting.
• 4:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: You have to hand deny, right?
• 4:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: That the vibes are something happening there.
• 4:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: But they, like, they were really friendship-y in that scene though.
• 4:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I'm thinking, like, hopefully there's nothing there and I'll have to worry about it.
• 4:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: But I'm getting ahead of myself.
• 4:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: What do we want to like start with?
• 4:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: Because there's the, like, willow terrorist stuff.
• 4:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: We also.
• 4:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: like I need to caveat or just a heads up for every one of the top of the episode as you watch these episodes twice as you watch first time for like enjoyment first gut reactions kind of vibes second time for note taking um I hated this episode so much I literally couldn't bear to watch it a second time um so I've only watched it once if that impedes my ability to remember things I apologize upfront but I hate this episode so
• 4:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, that's your gut reaction, right?
• 4:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like that's how you're, that's your truth.
• 4:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's how you feel.
• 4:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: So I think that the will start off with a softball.
• 4:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, softball and like just talk about, I mean, we should talk about like the loser trio, I guess, right?
• 5:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah.
• 5:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: Even though it leads into the willow entire stuff, it's just like whatever fuckery they're up to.
• 5:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: And this episode, what happened was that we heard in the last episode, they have something planned, especially Andrew and Warren.
• 5:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: They have their own plan that's separate from Jonathan.
• 5:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: And we see a come into fruition, where they want to rob a bank and puppy comes.
• 5:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: And, um, lo and behold, Warren is now like juiced his juice.
• 5:46
  [SPEAKER_02]: He has orbs.
• 5:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, they have created orbs by basically getting them from the some sort of demon, they get into his layer.
• 5:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: They really are like, we could sacrifice Jonathan, like he's going to be the one to be our
• 6:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: that get the Orbs and naturally, Warren being Warren, who is like, he has first-personitis, is like, I'm the main character, I'm going to hold the Orbs, gives him like super powers, super strength, sort of a thing, Buffy luckily, Buffy is told by Jonathan, because he like pretends to attack her and whispers in her ear like, get the Orbs.
• 6:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, the shocker to no one will be between the two of us of how can we get Jonathan to be likable again to not be as bad as Andrew and Warren.
• 6:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yes, you will save the day by sharing Warren's weak spot in this moment that she can smash the orbs so that she can defeat him because he's super strong like
• 6:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: Probably like as strong as glory, maybe stronger, I doubt it.
• 6:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: But she was a god, so I don't want to give him that much credit.
• 6:54
  [SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, but like she wasn't able to really be glory in, oh, but yeah, yeah, in the fighting, especially in the beginning.
• 7:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: So it was the same thing.
• 7:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like he was like super powered and smashing the orbs took it away and then he had like a jet pack.
• 7:12
  [SPEAKER_03]: And Andrew also had the jetpack.
• 7:13
  [SPEAKER_03]: So that was the, the thing that they could whispering about was that like, oh, like, Jonathan, I think that their plan was like, they would jetpack off Jonathan would take the fall for the three of them and then get sent to jail, worst comes to worse or.
• 7:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: killed, or whatever, get caught for wrapping the bank, but they would be able to escape this situation unscathed.
• 7:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: Warren did was able to fly off.
• 7:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: Somehow Andrew's jetpack was a lemon, a faulty jetpack, or did he crash into like the ceiling or something?
• 7:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: The other thing is
• 8:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I really, the way I view Warren is he is like, well, Andrew is easier to manipulate, so I'll keep him around as long as it's convenient for me, but I don't think he ever was as invested in Andrew as Andrew is in Warren.
• 8:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: And so when he sees his opportunity when Buffy like smashes the orbs and he basically doesn't have the super power anymore.
• 8:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: He's like, he sees his opportunity to get out of there with the jet packs.
• 8:24
  [SPEAKER_02]: He's not like, come on Andrew, let's go.
• 8:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: He's like, mm, I'm out skis.
• 8:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: And Jonathan and Andrew get arrested and take into jail, uh, Warren gets away.
• 8:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, not we see him very close by though, because he ends up as we, we were talking about the zanderbuffy scene.
• 8:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: He comes in with a fucking gun, which is like,
• 8:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: Again, is a bit shocking, like, I don't know, something about the show buffet, you get very used to like the violence obviously in the fighting, but a lot of it is so like hand-to-hand combat or like magical combat, that like you kind of forget guns are like a real thing in the show, just like they are in real life.
• 9:05
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, because you see more ancient tools or weapons, you see
• 9:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: stakes but you're right like you don't see a gun like we I think that you I mean angel has guns right you see that more often than angel like but that's what makes it sure yeah like more like a guy show I don't know god more LA.
• 9:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's more dangerous than the most funny deal.
• 9:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think that everything is a lot more mystical in Buffy.
• 9:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: So to see a gun and he like comes out and shoots at Buffy.
• 9:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: and then I guess it also accidentally goes through the window and then it's Tara.
• 9:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: He like is not really aiming.
• 9:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: He's kind of just shooting half-hazardly and so it ultimately ends up getting buffy and Tara seemingly Tara directly in the heart.
• 10:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: She like collapses pretty much immediately.
• 10:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, the other interesting aspect of this is like I know there's been more than one gun on the show obviously, but the only other one that comes to mind is in like the school shooter episode, which is also a Jonathan episode.
• 10:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that's what I was thinking in that episode, if I remember correctly, didn't they push it off because it was all in line or something, right?
• 10:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: I was combine right.
• 10:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: So yeah, that is definitely that was something that struck out my mind as well.
• 10:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
• 10:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's we've been saying this for 90 episodes.
• 10:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: The loser trio really doesn't do anything for either of us.
• 10:45
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think that to go from glory to this, like the issue is that like you and like last season was a god.
• 10:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like you can't like go much higher.
• 10:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like the bar was set and like I do like the strategic or like the
• 11:02
  [SPEAKER_03]: the decision to go like switch to the opposite thing.
• 11:05
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like what's worse, just like a normal human.
• 11:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, I mean, we hate it.
• 11:11
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like it doesn't work for us.
• 11:13
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like it seems very
• 11:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know the whole thing just like seems like it was just written with a bunch of guys like it just feels like none like the dialogue with the guys and the joking around that like Andrew has because like Andrew has a crush on Warren, but it's also uses like.
• 11:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: a comedic relief, like, let's laugh at it.
• 11:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, we're having this crush on him.
• 11:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: Don't look at him.
• 11:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's good.
• 11:40
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, it doesn't think.
• 11:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: It just feels like a bunch of, like, guys, like, incense, you've got, I mean, we know this about the season, you know, just weed in, for all of his,
• 11:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: issues is not involved in this season, but he or less involved, but he made Buffy what it was.
• 11:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, so to not have him present, it causes a lot of issues.
• 12:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like there's, you know, a problematic season.
• 12:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: And it has nothing to do with the fact that Buffy is depressed.
• 12:12
  [SPEAKER_03]: In fact, like that's probably the strongest aspects of
• 12:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: coming back from the dead from heaven and losing her family, like that's like the least of it.
• 12:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't know, everything else really sucks.
• 12:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: Now with the Tara thing, what hurts the most here, is that these motherfuckers finally put
• 12:40
  [SPEAKER_03]: Tara in the opening credits just for that to be the episode where she seemingly killed like that is so cruel.
• 12:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: I When I saw Tara in the opening credits, I cannot tell you how excited I was see her.
• 12:54
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, oh my gosh Like did I miss this like has this been going on for a couple of episodes like this is incredible?
• 13:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think we were told that either last episode or episode before there was like a extended break like a two-month break or something.
• 13:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: So right
• 13:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: Did I miss it last episode and they came back?
• 13:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: No, they just put her in for them to kill her and that pisses me off.
• 13:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, um, I totally echo your sentiments here.
• 13:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, I think killing off Tara, while I think both of us had thought a character would get killed off the season.
• 13:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: And actually, I think both of us mentioned on Yatera as being like possible options.
• 13:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm not mad that it was Tara.
• 13:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm kind of pissed off that it was Warren who did it.
• 13:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's like it's it's shitty the way they do it because I have very much was skeptical of the the the willow terror relationship kind of just like rekindling immediately they're like very schmoopy this episode they're like back together they're fucking like dawn is like over the moon about this um they're very much back on the same page they're getting along great and
• 14:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: It sucks that like I feel like the character of Tara had a lot more potential that never really was explored because they were far too busy being like the Oh willow Tara break up stuff.
• 14:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, but they're back together.
• 14:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: It was like,
• 14:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: Very very frustrating that I think she's such a powerful witch and we really didn't get to see as much of her potential and then they just kill her off and to your point the way she gets killed off with a stray bullet from Jonathan is just like a gut punch like it just feels
• 14:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: on earned and obviously gun violence, like there are casualties and innocent casualties a lot of the time when it comes to that stuff, but it just felt sucky.
• 14:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: That like great, now Tara is gone.
• 14:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: We have this insell with a gun, like whether or not the insell's work for you as an enemy or the big bad is like, yeah, irrelevant to me because it's like,
• 14:59
  [SPEAKER_02]: It still sucks that that's the way she's killed.
• 15:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: Not in some big epic battle.
• 15:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: She's killed from a freaking stray bullet through the window.
• 15:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, and yeah, we haven't seen the rest of the season.
• 15:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: It seems very obvious by the way.
• 15:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: Willow reacts to her death that this is going to be like Willow breaking God.
• 15:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: Willow's going to do magic again.
• 15:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: She her eyes turn like bright red.
• 15:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like Willow is going to go back to doing magic.
• 15:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: But if they fucking try to feed me, the magic is drugs situation again.
• 15:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's like a
• 15:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: But it's fucking magic like we never treated magic like drugs until this season and it just like all of it sucks like the fact that Jonathan is there not to try not Jonathan.
• 15:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: Warren is the one who kills Tara the fact that it happens just like that and like then she's gone and not only that Sarah, but part of me was pissed too because while Buffy's not going to die from a bullet wound I didn't like that we undercut Tara dying by Buffy being like mortally and true as well because I
• 16:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: to be honest with you, of course, none of us would blink twice at Buffy getting shot because this is Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
• 16:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: She's not going to die on episode 19.
• 16:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's such like a waste of breath or thought to think to
• 16:25
  [SPEAKER_03]: to even worry about that.
• 16:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's the end of your fucking shot.
• 16:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, I'm just saying, no, no, it's just, but she pushes him out of the way.
• 16:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's just like very, very frustrating that, and I totally agree with you too, like putting her in the credits just to kill her off, felt like an extra punch to the gut that we didn't need.
• 16:43
  [SPEAKER_03]: Well, you know they're like, okay Amber Benson, like, we are going to kill you off, but don't you worry, we're finally going to give you the credit that you deserve.
• 16:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, like what you saw, dumb.
• 16:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: And here's the thing, like, are we being overly dramatic?
• 17:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, is there a chance that Willow doing magic again?
• 17:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, we, you know, the consequences of actions, right?
• 17:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, she brought Buffy back, Buffy was in heaven.
• 17:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, is there any chance Tara is coming back from this?
• 17:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, well, you know what, like, I didn't even think about that that Willow would want to try to bring her back.
• 17:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: Willow is not the type of girl to learn her lesson.
• 17:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's the thing.
• 17:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: I would not.
• 17:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, but, you know,
• 17:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: I would say that, yeah, it's a possibility, but also if this show wants to have any credibility with stakes ever, then they shouldn't bring her back because I totally agree with you.
• 17:45
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't take this show seriously when anybody dies or leaves because we can just like bring somebody back the only way that character will permanently leave is that if they find them disposable.
• 17:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: Ola, like Riley or Tara, or if the actor does not want to be on the show anymore, like jiles, like otherwise, there nobody's leaving the show.
• 18:12
  [SPEAKER_03]: The Scoobies are not leaving the show.
• 18:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: Tara was disposable, unfortunately, just like how sadly Ania is disposable.
• 18:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think my only gripe, I don't, I'm not even mad that Tara's, of course I'm mad that Tara's dead.
• 18:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: I love Tara.
• 18:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think that she's a great character.
• 18:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think that they, she, there's a lot of potential.
• 18:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm just mad that it didn't happen in like the epic fight last season with glory.
• 18:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like I heard out in a cooler way, like, don't just stray bullet her to the chest and also have Buffy get majorly injured, like the same time.
• 18:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: It just feels like a slap in the face.
• 18:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm with you.
• 18:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's the it's the way it happened that like really ticked me off.
• 18:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: Also, side don't I just realized we haven't recorded sense the news of the passing you mentioned Giles and it came to me.
• 19:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: Unfortunately, the passing of Anthony head who played Giles on the show.
• 19:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: wild.
• 19:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like I was a gas like I feel like especially recently, oh my gosh, like we have lost so many people who we've podcasted about in Anthony Hedge, James Vanderbeek, a Katherine or Hera who I podcasted about on talking shit.
• 19:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like
• 19:24
  [SPEAKER_02]: so many and buffy the show has lost like so many people recently so like obviously our hearts go out to his family that's like really really sad he's not he was not an old guy like uh seven to two much years I mean like yeah
• 19:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: it's it's a lot and I felt bad because like daddy jiles that has he holds a special place in my heart you know um applications by pneumonia right pneumonia yeah which is really rough it's which is really scary so if you're over 50 or have a special medical in condition maybe consider the pneumonia vaccine
• 19:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and go to a doctor if you're not feeling well.
• 20:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: People, I go to everybody, not just, I mean, I'm sure that he likely went to doctors, but yeah, but anyway, um,
• 20:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it, uh, I don't want to see trials.
• 20:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, I'm wondering when we're going to see trials again.
• 20:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, yeah, the way in which we lost hair just really sucked, especially her and will we're just back together.
• 20:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like Dawn is so excited.
• 20:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like Dawn, I don't even want to think about Dawn's reaction.
• 20:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's like it's going to be awful.
• 20:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: That girl is haunted.
• 20:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: She's cursed.
• 20:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to be so depressed.
• 20:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: I know that, um,
• 20:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: I also think that with how happy Willow and Tara were all episode, like I should have seen it coming.
• 20:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: It felt a little, it felt like very many factured.
• 20:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, because obviously because it is because it's a minutes of show, but I felt very,
• 20:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: like we are so, so, so happy.
• 20:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: So, the only thing to do is to make them crash down.
• 21:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: They were very lovey, dubby or stupid.
• 21:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: They were very in love.
• 21:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: So, I'm not surprised.
• 21:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: But,
• 21:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
• 21:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: It felt, looking, especially watching it, I did watch it a second time.
• 21:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: It felt extra like glaring, like something bad is going to happen.
• 21:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, the only thing that caught me off guard was that this is episode 19 and a different show would save something like this until like the
• 21:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: penultimate or the final episode of the season.
• 21:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: But no, I mean, the show, the show does does not do that.
• 21:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: And we also know that Buffy does love to like, rev it up at the last four or five episodes.
• 21:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: So yeah, that's, that's a thing.
• 21:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's stinks because we really do love Tara.
• 21:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think that she's a very beloved character by
• 21:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: if that is the last time we're going to see her on our screen, if there's not going to be over a little, we're going to try to bring her back or something, then it's unfortunate.
• 22:06
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I think that especially this season, I think that Tara really came into her own.
• 22:13
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think that she, I remember last season, we talked a lot about how
• 22:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: She was like bulldoze a lot or like she didn't have much of a personality at least I know I said that But I feel like she this season really Reped it up and I I'm like more personality more like spunk I really I really liked what they were doing with her which makes even worse because you know like you said so much potential we could have had it
• 22:45
  [SPEAKER_03]: It could have had it all, but, you know, we only, we only can have a Scooby's proper.
• 22:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's unfortunate.
• 23:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: All right, let's shift our attention.
• 23:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: We could talk about Zander, but I do think the Zander content is honestly gonna lead to the spike content anyway, because so much of his story, this episode is like him working things out with Buffy.
• 23:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 23:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I think we might as well talk about the spike content.
• 23:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: We have a, we have a, we have an issue.
• 23:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: We have a problem here.
• 23:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: We have a big problem on big content warning at the top.
• 23:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: If you somehow haven't watched Buffy and are listening to this podcast, we're going to talk about rape and sexual assault, fun times.
• 23:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: So big trigger warning because that is a huge portion of the spike in Buffy storyline this episode.
• 23:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, this was really awful.
• 23:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um,
• 23:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: It was like, here's the thing.
• 23:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: I have been very pro-spoffy despite the fact that the show is like very much shoving it.
• 23:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, it's like, this is what you wanted.
• 23:59
  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, they're rubbing our faces in the fucking dirt essentially for anyone who ever was pro-spoffy.
• 24:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: They're like, this is why it wouldn't work.
• 24:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: Ugh, no, no.
• 24:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: And this was like the absolute worst possible thing they could do because
• 24:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: My biggest issue, Sarah, is it's fine.
• 24:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: If the show doesn't want to do spuffy, that's okay.
• 24:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: But then don't make me hate spike.
• 24:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, because how does a character come back from this?
• 24:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: They can't, in my opinion, like there's no redemption for spike after what he did.
• 24:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: And so it's unfathomable to me that you would character assassinate spike in such a fucking like immediate nose dive.
• 24:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: And then for all intents and purposes at least in our opinion fucking spin him off to angel like which is what seems like a tap where he's leaving town we know he's going to appear angel at some point is that where he's going now like this is bullshit like why why are they doing this you know.
• 25:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 25:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: So a surprising to me as well.
• 25:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think the issue here is I don't think that spike as originally written was ever supposed to be in this show for so long.
• 25:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: But it's an issue when you have somebody that's so charismatic as James Marsden.
• 25:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: Is that what his name is?
• 25:25
  [SPEAKER_03]: Marsden.
• 25:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think James Marsden is someone else.
• 25:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
• 25:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: James Marsden is like, no, Mars stars.
• 25:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: No, I know.
• 25:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: James.
• 25:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, it's like that.
• 25:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
• 25:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, Chris.
• 25:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: Whatever.
• 25:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: Mars stars.
• 25:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 25:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: For the fuck his name is.
• 25:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: He is.
• 25:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: very charismatic a spike, and he became a beloved character.
• 25:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: However, the point is, is that Angel is supposed to be a one-in-a-billing-in character of a good vampire.
• 25:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: There is nobody else like him.
• 25:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: So we try to put a band-aid on it.
• 26:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: We give him the chip, but he's still solace,
• 26:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: People, there's people that kept saying, like, reminding us, like, well, Spike is a monster.
• 26:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's so evil, but when we were watching these episodes up until like this episode, all of it was just like, well, he kind of just has, he doesn't seem like super evil.
• 26:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, we're not really taking him seriously.
• 26:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: He kind of just seems like he has a temper problem.
• 26:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, he needs to go to anger management.
• 26:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: I didn't see what some,
• 26:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: like listeners were saying to us but he was like he's a literal monster because that's not what they were portraying up until this point or if they were, he was so charismatic that we were able to sweep the shit under the rug that like we didn't once again take a very seriously I kind of just saw him as like
• 26:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: like an animal with their fangs taken out or their claws taken out.
• 27:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like I just didn't take him very seriously, but this obviously crosses the line.
• 27:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: This is not even the first rape or sexual assault storyline in this season.
• 27:13
  [SPEAKER_03]: We already did it with Warren.
• 27:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: Now like we already had this entire
• 27:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: killed his ex and, like, tried to rape her and, or, in trap her, basically roofy her with magic to, to have sex with her.
• 27:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 27:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: And we didn't even, it wasn't even as graphic as what we had seen in this episode of Spike literally pinning Buffy down.
• 27:49
  [SPEAKER_03]: and wanting to have his way with her and her screaming, like, stop, please stop.
• 27:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: It was surprising.
• 27:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I agree with you.
• 28:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: I just, I don't understand how he comes back from this.
• 28:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: The only thing is that spike is still such a beloved character in the fandom.
• 28:11
  [SPEAKER_03]: So the question is, does something happen?
• 28:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: and everybody magically forget about this, or does the entire fandom or majority of the fandom forgive spike for this moment and just focus on everything until now because he's so beloved, like it's not like
• 28:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: He somehow, he does redeem himself in the eyes of me.
• 28:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: But as far as there's still does, like fan things, he still has the hair of Spike.
• 28:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like he still does stuff as Spike.
• 28:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: So either the fandom has collectively agreed to ignore season six and possibly season seven and only focus on the Spike from seasons like two to five or whatever season he came in on.
• 28:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like,
• 28:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: or they find a way to redeem his character and it's just like, I'm sorry, maybe in the 90s, we could like look past certain things like a lot of shows, we talked about Dawson's Creek, we've talked about Felicity, like there are things where you like, well, this character is show on still on the show, so I guess we have to move on from what they did, but this was like, so
• 29:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: graphic and so disturbing to watch.
• 29:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: It wasn't like a quick hit.
• 29:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: This was like we sat in that scene for a very long time.
• 29:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: And this is our main fucking character.
• 29:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like how do we just move on from this?
• 29:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: It doesn't make sense to me.
• 29:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: It is so
• 29:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: beyond the pale.
• 29:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I think I agree with you, too, of like, I, I'm not saying don't ever include sexual assault and television.
• 29:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: It is a real thing.
• 29:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: It is a real thing that happens a lot.
• 29:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: And a lot of, you know, it's a thing that should be talked about, obviously.
• 29:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: We just did a storyline with rape in this season.
• 30:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: We didn't need another.
• 30:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: We especially didn't need another with our fucking main character and one of her love interests like Dan and another main character like and a beloved main character.
• 30:11
  [SPEAKER_03]: This is not like a guest appearance type of thing.
• 30:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: He has been part of the main cast for multiple seasons.
• 30:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's been
• 30:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: a recurring character for multiple seasons.
• 30:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know, so like next episode is here and be taken out of the initial credits, or is he just going to come back into episodes?
• 30:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: Because I don't think that he's going to spin off proper.
• 30:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like I honestly don't think we know that there's one more season of angel than there is of
• 30:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: Buffy like right in terms of like how it lines up.
• 30:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think like he's not going to spin off until the series is completed.
• 30:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: So I think that we're still going to have another season of spike.
• 30:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and yeah, it's wild to me that the entire fandom just.
• 30:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: decided to just forgive spike and still haven't be so beloved.
• 31:02
  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, I mean, we heard like a little bit of background from some of our friends of like everybody hates this episode.
• 31:11
  [SPEAKER_03]: everybody feels uncomfortable about it.
• 31:12
  [SPEAKER_03]: Of course, it's kind of like when you get to this episode, you're like, you're on this episode.
• 31:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think I saw one of the YouTube comments being like, oh, next episode is going red.
• 31:25
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 31:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: So it's common knowledge that this is super problematic, even so that which is a crazy concept that you have to write this into your contracts that
• 31:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, he, like, was like, I will not be doing any sort of rape or social harassment and any of my parts going forward and forward contracts, which is like crazy that you have to like put that in.
• 31:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, yeah, but he thought I'm sure he felt just as betrayed, uh, as a lot of the fandom did in this shout out to Tom Palmer, who who gave us that factoid, um, I also like what he said, I'm going to quote Tom here.
• 32:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: I like what he said, and I do kind of feel the same way, um,
• 32:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: I do think the scene makes sense for the lore of the world-building spike as evil, he's a soulless monster, but by making him so charismatic that the audience was always going to root for him to some degree, it ends up being a pretty awful betrayal of audience expectations.
• 32:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: And that's how I feel, like, yes, he is evil, but then don't make us fall in love with him and like,
• 32:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: how much is it is the actor?
• 32:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: I kind of feel like it's the actor.
• 32:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't think it can be both.
• 32:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: I think the writing, you know, I think once they saw what James Marsters could offer to the role, I think they wrote with that in mind.
• 32:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's just like, it's really upsetting.
• 32:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: The whole thing again,
• 32:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: Spike, we've always talked about the way Spike is in relationships.
• 32:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's very unhealthy.
• 32:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's very toxic.
• 32:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like none of this is new.
• 32:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: But bringing it to this level is just a whole different ball game.
• 33:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like there is something so unforgivable about him saying, like, well, you loved me while I was inside of you.
• 33:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to make you feel that again.
• 33:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like,
• 33:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: Are you serious like how anyone is able to just move on from that?
• 33:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: Is there no checks and balances in this show?
• 33:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, who obviously like some dude like came up with this?
• 33:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, how did the rest of the cast be like, yeah?
• 33:22
  [SPEAKER_03]: Or is not even on the cast, but like the rest of the writers or leaders, yeah?
• 33:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, like this is like not going to pass the sniff test here.
• 33:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, why?
• 33:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't, I don't, how did this like get through?
• 33:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: How did the network push this through?
• 33:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 33:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: Shout-out to Stephen Denight, who apparently is the one who wrote this episode.
• 33:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: What else does Stephen need?
• 33:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: Now, so he wrote on Angel as well.
• 33:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: He wrote, I'm just looking to see, I think we've watched all of these.
• 33:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: The other episodes he wrote, he wrote season 5 episode 13 Blood Ties.
• 33:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, which is when, uh, it's Buffy's birthday and like Dawn finds out she's the key.
• 34:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, he wrote spiral, which is he wrote, so this is season five.
• 34:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: He wrote, uh, then he wrote all the way, which is season six episode, uh, six.
• 34:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: So yeah, he wrote, he wrote mostly for five and six.
• 34:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: This dude is mostly known for Spartacus.
• 34:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: What a fucking tool bag.
• 34:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: It doesn't, and I'm not trying to argue that a character like Spike wouldn't necessarily do something like this.
• 34:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's not my argument.
• 34:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: My argument is this feels like they're like, oh, you want spuffy so much.
• 34:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: We're going to make you wish you never fucking asked for it.
• 34:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: And it just feels like punishment, which is.
• 34:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: really fucking awful considering like how rabid the fandom is like that you really it really just feels like spitting in the face of your fans and I'm not trying to say do like ultra fan service but fans probably don't work out in the long run right like they don't make sense as a couple long term I'm not trying to argue that I'm just saying like the way they go about it feels like it just a fucking kick in the teeth and it just it didn't work for me
• 35:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: it was so awful and sad and the reason he does it right like Don shows up and it's basically like how dare you like you upset Buffy like you say you love her but you don't act like you love her claim like he then talks to claim later and plus I love claim I was so happy to see claim
• 35:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm just kidding, you're like, like, Klam is your like, stay space.
• 35:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: You're like, Klam is my same, same, same sweet and adorable.
• 35:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: He's my little golden retriever boy.
• 35:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: I love him.
• 35:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: And yeah, like Spike is like, the other thing, Spike, oh my God.
• 35:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: When he says, like, oh my god, what has she done to me?
• 35:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, yes, Buffy is the reason you almost raped her.
• 36:01
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like the way he said that, just like, hmm, don't put that shit on her.
• 36:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: She didn't nothing.
• 36:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: like she, you know, it's her, it's on her that like he fell in love with her.
• 36:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's her womanly wild.
• 36:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's like the exact same thing as like blaming a woman who gets assaulted for like the way she dresses.
• 36:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, oh, well, if you didn't dress so provocatively, it's like, um, yes, so men just have no control over themselves, apparently.
• 36:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: No self-control.
• 36:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: No.
• 36:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: I, I, I, I, I guess they, I suppose they don't in their minds,
• 36:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: If I think click if we were watching this show without any knowledge, ever of what people's opinions are or
• 36:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: If people are beloved or not, I think like you and I could just be like, well, fuck this guy.
• 36:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, can never think about him again, but like to know that this won't be the last time we'll see spike and there's going to once again, like some sort of like either redemption, story, or sweep under the rug.
• 37:01
  [SPEAKER_02]: I think like, yeah, well, he leaves town or any claim gives him an idea and he's basically like, oh, well, things change if you make them and it's like, well, what is he going off to do?
• 37:12
  [SPEAKER_03]: Uh-huh.
• 37:13
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
• 37:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: I have no clue.
• 37:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: I can't un sexually assault someone spike.
• 37:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, I'm sorry.
• 37:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: That is not how the world works unless you're just going to reverse time or how people willow and make her forget.
• 37:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, I would take that at this point.
• 37:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 37:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 37:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's, I'm very nervous to see how it would play out.
• 37:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: And it just adds to how the whole sentiment that this season just doesn't really work in any capacity.
• 37:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think that I think that they do not expect to get a season six.
• 37:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I think that it seems as though they were very much floundering on what they wanted or needed to do.
• 37:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think that there's some overarching ideas that really do work.
• 38:02
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think it was fascinating that Buffy, we all expected her to go to a held-in mention, and she wound up going to heaven.
• 38:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: Great stuff.
• 38:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: really, really interesting, really creative, a really interesting way for her to like deal with death and having like Willow bring her back.
• 38:22
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think like the Willow turning evil stuff, great stuff.
• 38:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think it's going to be really interesting to see how she maneuvers in the next couple of episodes
• 38:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: And yeah, I think like it could be interesting to see kind of like who is it from X-Men Jean Grey like when she gets like Uber or Phoenix.
• 38:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, like she's like the most dangerous X-Men new in the most expensive pens she can troll it.
• 38:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, right.
• 38:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: So like I think that and once again, like seeing like a woman be the
• 39:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: Actually, I mean, seeing women be able to like take that role is like really cool because like let's get like cool parts to women But also then and she's like well women can't control their emotions.
• 39:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: So yeah, yeah, you know, of course they're the ones that like so it's like a double-edged sword in a way Yeah, I'm all for giving Alice and Han again who's been Who's had like a very miles part for in terms of like
• 39:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: What is going on with your dog?
• 39:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: If you're watching us on YouTube, my dog is laying and keeps bumping my camera cord and so it's he's doing I mean, you see the camera move.
• 39:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's because my dog is laying on the core.
• 39:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's so funny because like my coworker has just like setting on his camera where if he moves it moves with him
• 39:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: It zooms in and it's so funny to watch because I'm just like he doesn't know how to turn it off and I don't know how to help him.
• 40:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's a mac thing, isn't it?
• 40:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: Probably.
• 40:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 40:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: So like it's just so funny to watch him and like it zooms in and zooms out.
• 40:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, he doesn't have a camera technician of a dog.
• 40:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, my dog Rupert shout out to Rupert who was spent time with you.
• 40:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: What a pal.
• 40:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: Such a pal.
• 40:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, yeah.
• 40:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 40:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't remember what I was saying, but I don't know.
• 40:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: Spike Spike gets on a motorcycle.
• 40:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: He leaves.
• 40:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: He says that when he returns, things will be different.
• 40:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: Who the fuck knows what that means?
• 40:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: Again, enough time will pass that.
• 40:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: I want to just forget you tried to rip off.
• 40:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
• 40:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 40:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's a problem.
• 40:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's, honestly, a problem.
• 40:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I, as a person that's like never been a spuffy fan.
• 40:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 40:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: I, I just because I felt like his vibes were off, but I don't want this, I like spike, like I think he made my number one character not too long ago.
• 40:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: I just like don't love this choice.
• 40:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: And yeah, it's like, um, when we watched Dawson's Creek, when Jen made all her dumb decisions, I was like, I'm not mad at Jen because I know it's the writer's fault.
• 41:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, I
• 41:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: I literally was thinking the exact same thing.
• 41:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: I was like, this is character assassination.
• 41:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: And we haven't, the likes of which we have not seen since we did like Felicity and Dawson's Creek.
• 41:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: And the fact that like, again, we will watch trash.
• 41:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's fine.
• 41:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: But like, to me, Buffy was not prestige TV because it's not like HBO, but like, it was above all that.
• 41:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: I saw the fans.
• 41:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and now it's like, this is bullshit.
• 41:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm upset.
• 41:40
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, yeah, I just don't think that season six should have been made is what I was talking about.
• 41:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we need to beat up.
• 41:46
  [SPEAKER_02]: We should have been done any years the thing.
• 41:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm gonna say something controversial and people are just gonna have to deal with it.
• 41:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: What is it worth it to have the musical?
• 41:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, what is it worth it?
• 41:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.
• 41:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: I, we proposed this question before and I said no.
• 42:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: I said to a lot of people, I think, that it probably was, but for me, I don't think it was worth it.
• 42:06
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't, I think the musical episode could have been like a movie.
• 42:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: or something.
• 42:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, a musical movie episode.
• 42:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: We didn't, we didn't need the season.
• 42:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: I didn't need this heartbreak.
• 42:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: I didn't need this, uh, adjada ag, what's it, adjada?
• 42:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I
• 42:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, just like I don't like it.
• 42:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't like it feeling like this.
• 42:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, an American, but honestly, Italian.
• 42:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's Giddish vibes though.
• 42:43
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's in Jews or not that, uh, that's too dissimilar.
• 42:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: So, but anyway, uh,
• 42:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: Then to round things out, we have the zander thing of like he he's still but her about buffy sleeping with spike.
• 42:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: He sees spikes duster his like jacket on the stairs and he finds buffy in the bathroom and he's like what happens?
• 43:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: He wants to go after a spike, but obviously they have to worry about the trio so he doesn't end up doing it.
• 43:11
  [SPEAKER_03]: I feel as though like this is the one time where zander would have been justified to try to murder spike.
• 43:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: this put like indefense of my best friend, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, I will go after Spike and try to stay Kim.
• 43:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: He would not survive it.
• 43:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: He would, I mean, he couldn't even handle fucking Warren, like now Spike would a thousand percent be him in a fistfight.
• 43:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: Well, we can't, though, is the thing to like the child.
• 43:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: I first otherwise Zander probably did.
• 43:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: I nearly forgot about the chip.
• 43:46
  [SPEAKER_02]: So they make up basically Zander ends up saying like he was hurt that she didn't trust him enough to tell him but he understands that like she probably thought he'd react badly which he did.
• 44:01
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's good so far.
• 44:02
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's right there.
• 44:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: We like to see that.
• 44:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: Also, tiny little thing we didn't mention at the very top of the episode.
• 44:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: Fuck and Tara, listen, I don't want to speak ill that did.
• 44:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: But really pop is spilling secrets.
• 44:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: She's like, one romp in the sack with Willow and all her fucking judgment is out the window.
• 44:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: No, no, no.
• 44:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: We both know that unless explicitly stated otherwise, we do not everything that is told to us.
• 44:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: is also told to our significant others.
• 44:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's fair, however, unless there is a, please don't tell anyone, blank this, or anybody that's including your husband, like yes, but when Buffy revealed this information to Tara, Tara and Willa, we're not together.
• 44:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: that is true but now they're together.
• 44:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I know, but I'm just saying I feel like that was in the protective bubble, the same to T of the bubble.
• 44:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's also like not, it'll get back to a little.
• 45:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's a little bit too like in the in the circle, you know what I mean?
• 45:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: Because their friends with they're all, they're all the same friends.
• 45:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: They're all in the same circle.
• 45:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: The thing is, I'm not upset with her.
• 45:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: Number one, because she's dead, but number two, because they under what it told her anyway.
• 45:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, like Tara, Willow is closer to Buffy than Tara is to Buffy.
• 45:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: So I would understand Willow feeling a little stung that Tara knew over her, but that's exactly why you tell Tara.
• 45:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: because she's not, she's not involved as involved and won't be as judgy as close to a third party person as you can possibly get while still knowing the members involved, which I think is important for the yeah for the context of it.
• 45:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: But if I found out that you told
• 45:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: somebody that like I felt like you were as close to as you and me were.
• 45:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, big secret like that.
• 46:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: I would definitely be hurt.
• 46:02
  [SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely.
• 46:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: I feel like, but why?
• 46:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like what did I do?
• 46:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like what?
• 46:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 46:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: And we are very good about, okay, if I am, I'm telling you this, and you can, like, again, unless expressly stated that you cannot tell your significant other, it's fair game.
• 46:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: What is said in the marriage bedroom is fine.
• 46:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: So Libra loves gossip.
• 46:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: Libra loves gossip, and both our husbands are Libra's.
• 46:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: So you would know.
• 46:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: Adam really sucks at gang his own details with gossip oh my god I think it's just a guy thing because my husband I will ask him I will tell him all the tea that's happening and like my extended family he has no fucking idea what's going on in his family and he'll try to tell me well no one tells me anything I was like no no no no you are not in the loop and that's your fault they don't ask questions you don't check in
• 46:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you don't have to question.
• 46:49
  [SPEAKER_03]: So she's like, he can tell me something and then I'd be like, but like, how does as little as like, but how does like your friend feel about this?
• 46:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: And he'd like, well, I don't know, like obviously he's like not happy about it.
• 47:02
  [SPEAKER_03]: And like,
• 47:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: but like what else?
• 47:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: What's the plan though?
• 47:06
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like my so like Adam Adams front.
• 47:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so like Adam's friend they're about to have their third baby.
• 47:12
  [SPEAKER_03]: They have they're giving they usually give birth at birth in center.
• 47:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: The birthing center closed out of nowhere.
• 47:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm like okay, is my birthing center not a hospital?
• 47:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's not a hospital.
• 47:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, got it.
• 47:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I wish like well, where are they going to go?
• 47:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like
• 47:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: But like I asked like all these questions about like of course like I if my friend out of nowhere lost her doctor and the place that she was going to give birth in I would be like what's the plan here like tell me like this is horrible and he like knows nothing and I'm like what's what you mean?
• 47:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: She asked no follow-up questions.
• 47:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: They don't want I'm like yeah, you should they're just like that sucks man
• 47:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: And that's it.
• 47:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 48:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, let's go back to our, like, our video game or followers.
• 48:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: It was so bad that, like, um, because we're, my in-laws are visiting this weekend.
• 48:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I was like, okay, I want to prep some, like, stuff for, like, lunches, you know, food to have around the house.
• 48:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I asked him questions.
• 48:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: And it was like, the answer to get me is not giving me the most confidence that, like, he knows.
• 48:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: So all I ended up doing I was like instead of being like, hey, text your parents and ask that I was like, I'm just I have their numbers.
• 48:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: We've been married for almost six years.
• 48:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like I can text them and I just took the initiative in Texas.
• 48:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, she should.
• 48:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that's what I do.
• 48:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like I, I've given them.
• 48:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, I don't know.
• 48:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: Because it's like, if I have to ask him to do it, it's like, okay, then he's gonna have, it's like gonna be a whole thing.
• 48:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm like, I'm just gonna text them because I'll get the straight-up answers I need and then I'll be all square away.
• 48:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I speak to my in-laws more than he speaks to his parents.
• 48:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: That is not true for me, but I'm like, okay, because I, you know, like, I get no information, but also his family don't, they don't like to plan either.
• 49:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: So I came and get into that right now because my brain will explode.
• 49:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, that is, that is what happened on Buffy.
• 49:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: We're not done and I just like don't know where to go from here.
• 49:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: And also, like does it is even fun for you guys to hear us complain about it?
• 49:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: I feel like this one that'll be cathartic because I think based on the feedback we've gotten, nobody likes this episode.
• 49:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I don't think people would be upset to hear us complaining about this episode.
• 49:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I just feel like in general with the season.
• 49:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: I feel like we've been so negative and it's uncomfortable for me because like I would rather have fun.
• 49:45
  [SPEAKER_03]: So I mean, we're committed, but like seasons never committed.
• 49:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: We're committed.
• 49:51
  [UNKNOWN]: We're committed.
• 49:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: Seven has to like pick up a little.
• 49:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like thinking better, I swear.
• 49:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, or else, I don't know, I don't know, because it's not the rest you just want here from us ever again.
• 50:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, yeah, we did get them also.
• 50:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: We did get an email from Sherry that I wanted to read.
• 50:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I think, first of all, Sherry, I so appreciate you because she sent this like a couple weeks ago.
• 50:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: She put in this subject line, spoiler alerts below, please read after watching season six episode 19.
• 50:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: In that subject on girlie pop, thank you so much for being so conscientious.
• 50:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: We love that.
• 50:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, Sherry says, hi ladies, love the podcast.
• 50:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: Buffy is an all my all-time favorite show.
• 50:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: I watch from the very start.
• 50:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: Can you remember recording it on my VCR when I had to work and having people make fun of me for being obsessed with this weird show that was a reboot of that campy movie.
• 50:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, it's only a minor exaggeration that from the day my son was born, I waited until he was old enough to watch it with me.
• 50:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, thank you.
• 50:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: When he was around 12, we watched it and he loved it and it made me so happy.
• 50:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: Then we watched this episode and it destroyed him.
• 51:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: He refused to finish watching.
• 51:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: I was so bummed out.
• 51:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, I did convince him a year or so later to watch the whole series and he was happy.
• 51:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: He did, but he never got over it.
• 51:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: He's now 20, happily enjoying rewatching with his boyfriend.
• 51:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: who's never seen it before.
• 51:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: All that's so cute.
• 51:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I look forward to the text with his reactions.
• 51:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: They're currently in season five and he is loving glory.
• 51:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: Perfect.
• 51:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: He wasn't as confused about dawn as YouTube were.
• 51:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: Aloha.
• 51:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, he's just smarter than us.
• 51:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, I really enjoy your take down Malo and Zander during the original run.
• 51:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: I never realized how toxic they are, but watching it week to week again with you really highlights it.
• 51:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's unbelievable that.
• 51:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, it was still so mean and bitchy to Ania all this time later.
• 51:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: What's her problem?
• 51:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, I just listened to your coverage of normal again in L.O.
• 51:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, when you said you were so bummed, we didn't get dark willow.
• 51:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: And, oh yes, stick it out to finish.
• 51:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: Angel, there are a few infuriating storylines.
• 51:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks, Josh.
• 51:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: But season five gives an amazing character.
• 51:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for making E-Laf every week, Sherry.
• 52:01
  [SPEAKER_02]: So we're not alone.
• 52:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: People don't like this episode.
• 52:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: And, yeah, I'm so happy to hear that your son eventually did finish the series and enjoyed it.
• 52:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: And it's now rewatching it with his boyfriend.
• 52:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's really cool.
• 52:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: Well, that gives us hope.
• 52:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: I feel like you answered my question.
• 52:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: besides artists you're like obligated to because we are milled.
• 52:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: We've never bailed out on a show before.
• 52:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: Even Felicity, we finished Felicity.
• 52:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, it was incredible.
• 52:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: We're not leaving, but I want to.
• 52:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: I was proposing other things that we can do and live up this.
• 52:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and I'm not going to lie.
• 52:43
  [SPEAKER_03]: Those other projects seem better, like a better option for you and me, Jess.
• 52:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: But yeah,
• 52:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, let's talk about did you watch Angel Angel the price is not you know what I was going to But then I read in the synopsis that there's a bug game And I have a strict no bug rule.
• 53:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm so happy that you protected yourself because I would have told you after I finished it I didn't think about messaging you, but I would have said to you don't watch this episode.
• 53:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you don't need to
• 53:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: You don't need to.
• 53:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: Basically what happens is there's this nasty, sluggy sort of thing.
• 53:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't do slugs.
• 53:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's infecting people and it basically makes them really, really thirsty and like a dehydrates them and then it makes them talk in like the, like, plural person.
• 53:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: So it's like, we need this, we need that.
• 53:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it's creepy.
• 53:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: High of my end episode.
• 53:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: You kind of like, pluralous.
• 53:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 53:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, so, um, either way, uh, basically, it ends up infecting Fred, um, and gone is like freaking out and no one is willing to talk to Wesley and the funny part is in the beginning of the episode, Fred is trying to talk to gone and like about, well, why don't we like think about talking to Wesley and gone was very much like absolutely not, like we are not talking him.
• 53:59
  [SPEAKER_02]: He ends up going to Wesley who like,
• 54:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: He looks kind of like people did during COVID, where it's like they stopped shaving and like rather hit me out.
• 54:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: I did see this because I was looking for one thing in particular, which you'll get into.
• 54:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: So I was like skipping around the episode a little bit.
• 54:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I did see a shot of Wesley and he did look like a bag man.
• 54:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: He, it's cool.
• 54:22
  [SPEAKER_03]: have glasses on too.
• 54:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, he looked undone, which is yeah.
• 54:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: So he's in a rough spot because he has no friends, right?
• 54:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
• 54:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
• 54:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: And so, but gun ends up going to him for help because no one can figure out what is happening with Fred.
• 54:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: They don't know what to do and Fred was trying to research and figure it out when she gets infected.
• 54:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: She's like the replacement Wesley.
• 54:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: She's like the
• 54:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, and so income's gone and puts a vodka basically on her, which like dehydrates them the monster and saves her life, I guess.
• 55:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, only other thing of note, this episode is like, there's a lot of Cordelia and grew talking about how close her and angel are and how she'll like always be there for him.
• 55:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: There's a moment when,
• 55:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like Angel is staying back to fight something and grew is gonna take Fred and like I don't know bring her to the hospital or something and Cordelia's supposed to go with grew, but she stays to help Angel, they're just definitely setting up the Cordelia Angel relationship.
• 55:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 55:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 55:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: So that's that.
• 55:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: The other big thing of note is basically they talk about like, oh, the destroyer.
• 55:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: That is like this like, oh, the slug was running from the destroyer is like this thing.
• 55:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: And it's after Angel is like the biggest thing.
• 55:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: And they're like, okay, who the fuck is this?
• 55:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: All of a sudden, a portal opens up.
• 55:59
  [SPEAKER_02]: Fucking Pete for Madman pops out as a man trialed.
• 56:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, um.
• 56:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: He'd have had butterfucker below.
• 56:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: Peter, he does look like Peter Pan.
• 56:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: Peter Pan looking mug of motherfucker pops out and just goes, hi, dad.
• 56:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 56:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
• 56:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I would assume he's like 16-ish.
• 56:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: He kind of gives the vibe of like coming a age sort of or yeah, a pre-pubescent boy.
• 56:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: Sure.
• 56:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: Played by Pete from Madman who is Vincent,
• 56:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: Carthesia, Carthesia, I don't know.
• 56:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: Here is one person that I hate.
• 56:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm madmen, probably more than no other.
• 56:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: And that is Pete Campbell for madmen.
• 56:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: I hate, oh, see this is so fascinating.
• 56:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: So have you, because I'm only in season five of madmen.
• 56:46
  [SPEAKER_02]: I've not fully madmened yet.
• 56:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 56:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: Have you seen all of madmen?
• 56:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 56:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: This is so fascinating to me, because I know there are Pete apologists.
• 56:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: um, who like love him.
• 56:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: I never liked him ever.
• 57:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: He's so brewed to his wife who is my dearest Alice in Bree.
• 57:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 57:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: And he literally, so in slight spoilers from I'm in of people care.
• 57:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: In the season five premiere that I just watched.
• 57:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: So she's had a baby that she's like was infernal for like a very long time.
• 57:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: Churdy.
• 57:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: She, yeah, churdy.
• 57:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: She gets the baby Tammy and they drop him they're in the burbs now.
• 57:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: He's named his Tammy.
• 57:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 57:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, when he's going to say me her name is Trudy, they drop him off at the train station because again they live in the Burbs now because she wants moved in Burbs and he's like, there was a time when she wouldn't leave the house in a robe and I'm like
• 57:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: I could have murdered this man immediately.
• 57:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: You never talked that way about Alison Bray.
• 57:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: She's more beautiful and you could ever be.
• 57:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: And they were like, is Pete going bald in this episode?
• 57:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I was like, fuck yeah, bald him up, please.
• 57:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 57:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: Pete is terrible.
• 57:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: I hate Pete so bad.
• 57:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: He is rude.
• 57:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: All of them end suck on the shot.
• 57:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's simply every man.
• 58:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, yeah, every man does suck.
• 58:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, Don, he sucks.
• 58:05
  [SPEAKER_03]: He sucks.
• 58:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: There's a scene in, I think it's season two.
• 58:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: It might be season one.
• 58:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: I can't remember him and his wife, Betty, go to, like, I think it's Central Park.
• 58:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: They have this whole picnic on a blanket.
• 58:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: They get up.
• 58:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: They just do like a wish with the blanket.
• 58:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: Leave all the garbage and just leave.
• 58:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I was,
• 58:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: It was the most agass I've ever been at.
• 58:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to make it to that.
• 58:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: You're littering in New York City.
• 58:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: How dare you?
• 58:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, city.
• 58:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: I couldn't believe it.
• 58:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, my gosh.
• 58:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: There is one man on this show that doesn't suck.
• 58:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: They all do bad things all the time.
• 58:46
  [SPEAKER_02]: There's not a single man that is like good.
• 58:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
• 58:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: No, all of them.
• 58:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: Even the children.
• 58:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's your Bobby, you have obviously Bobby.
• 58:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: A little bit, Bobby's just a nothing burger, but mostly I was thinking of Glenn.
• 59:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh Glenn, who's a fucking creepo depo?
• 59:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 59:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, all the men suck on Mad Ben.
• 59:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm very interested to see a young Pete Campbell playing Angels' son who, I mean, we should have known he was gonna come back.
• 59:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: They're like, we're not gonna deal with the baby for too long.
• 59:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: He's gonna come back as like a young adult.
• 59:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: actually think goodness.
• 59:22
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think that this is the best case scenario.
• 59:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'd like to like because the whole thing I'm like, what are we going to do with a baby?
• 59:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like it's ridiculous.
• 59:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think that this is actually kind of like a smart way to that.
• 59:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I will watch the next episode because who interested in what they're going to do.
• 59:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: Also, why is he dressed up like Peter Pan?
• 59:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: He looks like a
• 59:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: He also gave me the vibe of George of the jungle or whatever.
• 59:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 59:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 59:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 59:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: He is like a lost boy.
• 59:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.
• 59:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, he's obviously been through some shit.
• 59:59
  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, like they all thought he was dead.
• 1:00:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: Because he got brought through the portal by what's his face.
• 1:00:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: And like, who the hell knows what he's been dealing with all these years?
• 1:00:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: There's no way that he's like, I thought he was dead.
• 1:00:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: I just, you just know the show set it, the show set it.
• 1:00:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, the characters thought that he was dead.
• 1:00:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, the characters were all saying to Angel.
• 1:00:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, he's dead.
• 1:00:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: So we have to like move on.
• 1:00:22
  [SPEAKER_03]: Bubba, Bubba, how can you even think that the character?
• 1:00:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't think that like if I saw Ash go through a portal, I don't think that my first thought would be like, oh, Ash is dead.
• 1:00:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'd be like, I'm not getting him out of the portal.
• 1:00:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: I can't talk about this.
• 1:00:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: Ash ever went into a portal.
• 1:00:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, yeah, she don't go through the portal.
• 1:00:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never, it's never,
• 1:00:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think maybe you would be dead.
• 1:00:59
  [SPEAKER_02]: This is so funny.
• 1:01:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: I can't wait to see what happens with Connor, who maybe I'll have a different name, except as so.
• 1:01:05
  [SPEAKER_03]: Because, yeah, like to be honest with you, Connor as a name sucks.
• 1:01:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: So it does, and it doesn't fit his vibe anymore.
• 1:01:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: Because he's a lost boy now, so he needs, he needs, like, a wilderness name.
• 1:01:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: I know two people in my age group that named their children Connor.
• 1:01:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's kind of crazy because I don't know that that was a popular name, apparently it is.
• 1:01:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: Is it a biblical name?
• 1:01:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: Connor.
• 1:01:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: Don't know.
• 1:01:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, interesting.
• 1:01:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: I always check.
• 1:01:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not going to lie.
• 1:01:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'll check names.
• 1:01:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: If they're two, if they're two biblical.
• 1:01:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know much about Connor.
• 1:01:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm just always shot when people name their kick Connor in like the stain age.
• 1:01:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: No, there's a lot of other names you could choose people.
• 1:01:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: Let me out.
• 1:01:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: C-O-N-N-O-R, right?
• 1:01:49
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 1:01:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: Well, one of the people named it with one N, which is just C-O-N-R, but whatever.
• 1:01:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's a bad joke.
• 1:01:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's a joke.
• 1:01:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: Now that I'm judging, but I definitely am.
• 1:02:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: Conner, according to the Social Security website in 2025, is the 166th most popular name.
• 1:02:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's pretty popular.
• 1:02:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: Really popular.
• 1:02:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I want to know what Connor name, meaning.
• 1:02:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: I love looking this dumb shit up.
• 1:02:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: I can't even help myself.
• 1:02:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: Meaning is lover of hounds.
• 1:02:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, okay.
• 1:02:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: Sure.
• 1:02:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's Irish.
• 1:02:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we knew that because angels Irish.
• 1:02:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, right.
• 1:02:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: Connor can be traced back to the old Irish name.
• 1:02:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
• 1:02:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, that's hilarious, um, beautiful stuff.
• 1:02:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 1:02:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, hopefully he comes back with like a name like River Forest or Elm.
• 1:02:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.
• 1:02:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: I know somebody named Forest.
• 1:02:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 1:02:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 1:02:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: Good guy.
• 1:02:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: I got him forest, but I feel like you'd get a lot of run forest run jokes.
• 1:03:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I don't know if he's ever gone that.
• 1:03:06
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm sure he has.
• 1:03:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: I never asked him that.
• 1:03:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: I never thought about that.
• 1:03:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think of a forest, but yeah.
• 1:03:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, you're just better than the rest of us.
• 1:03:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: not.
• 1:03:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, um, next week we're going to, we're, we're getting there.
• 1:03:24
  [SPEAKER_02]: We're anti-pinal to my episode, um, season six episode, 20 villains.
• 1:03:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, and then, which probably has to be about the loser tree, or I guess, Warren, or season, or Spinek, or, I mean, Willow, who knows, maybe they're all, oh, Willow's breaking bad, baby.
• 1:03:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, and then Angel is a new
• 1:03:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: Mm-hmm.
• 1:03:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: It is a, yeah, a new world.
• 1:03:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: So whole new world.
• 1:03:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: His name is Aladdin.
• 1:03:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, lovely name.
• 1:03:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: A whole new world.
• 1:03:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: So we'll see.
• 1:03:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's next week.
• 1:03:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: I did join by our friend Hannah.
• 1:03:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, thank you.
• 1:04:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: I did get six feet under unplex.
• 1:04:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: So I've started.
• 1:04:05
  [SPEAKER_03]: How many episodes are you in?
• 1:04:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: And like at least like 15 episodes then how are you feeling?
• 1:04:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: I like it.
• 1:04:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: I like it a lot.
• 1:04:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's okay.
• 1:04:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: And old show is very crusty.
• 1:04:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it's very old and crusty.
• 1:04:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 1:04:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: Because it was early, early, oddly, 90s.
• 1:04:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's around this time.
• 1:04:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: Well, 2001.
• 1:04:22
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think it wasn't one.
• 1:04:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: It started.
• 1:04:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 1:04:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
• 1:04:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: So I'm very crusty.
• 1:04:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 1:04:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: We were talking about the care quality, not the quality.
• 1:04:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: Obviously.
• 1:04:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 1:04:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, it's just different.
• 1:04:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: A different time.
• 1:04:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 1:04:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 1:04:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: which we put up with crust on here all the time.
• 1:04:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: So it's fine.
• 1:04:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'm enjoying it.
• 1:04:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: Look good.
• 1:04:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm glad I started the show summer house because I have no taste and I needed something in talking about summer.
• 1:04:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: Because there was some sort of drama, I literally don't even know about and I'm like, well, now I need the lore and I'm having
• 1:04:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, my my good friend Julie and told me about this literally yesterday about the big controversy and then she said that had to watch it and they said, well, how many seasons are there in this bed said 10 I guess I to be fair, I've already watched one full season and it wasn't that many episodes.
• 1:05:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think, but it's like, yeah, I'm going back to like 2017 and they keep yelling send it and I'm like, what do you remember, stend it.
• 1:05:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: I honestly, I don't know what I'm going to do, I don't know what I'm going to do, I don't know what I'm going to do, I don't know what I'm going to do, I don't know what I'm going to do, I don't know what I'm going to do, I don't know what I'm going to do, I don't know what I'm going to do, I don't know what I'm going to do, I don't know what I'm going to do, I don't know what I
• 1:05:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: don't.
• 1:05:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: But in like every five seconds, they're like, send it.
• 1:05:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: It'll just stop.
• 1:05:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: That year's FOMO.
• 1:05:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god.
• 1:05:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 1:05:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 1:05:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: I remember every person did.
• 1:05:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: But it's very dramatic and stupid.
• 1:05:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: And all these people, like, I want to say, I think every single one of them is a bit of an alcoholic.
• 1:05:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like,
• 1:05:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, most of these reality stars are, I just feel bad for them in their livers, you know?
• 1:05:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, but anyway, one guy even got an IV because he was like so hung over.
• 1:05:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, that's like rich people shit.
• 1:05:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: Very popular, yeah.
• 1:05:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, anyway, that's everything.
• 1:05:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, and we'll be back next week with some more buffie.
• 1:05:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: Hopefully a better episode.
• 1:05:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: Hopefully we don't have to be Debbie Downers again.
• 1:06:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: But if a show wasn't so stupid, we wouldn't have to be.
• 1:06:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 1:06:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: So it's true.
• 1:06:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's how I feel.
• 1:06:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, true.
• 1:06:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: Anything else Sarah before I get us on out of here?
• 1:06:11
  [SPEAKER_03]: I watch for Toy Story Movies.
• 1:06:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: Almost in a day.
• 1:06:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: This is in preparation for Toy Story 5.
• 1:06:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: I think so.
• 1:06:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: Are you okay?
• 1:06:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: Because I feel like that's a bit of an emotional whirlwind.
• 1:06:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: Did you cry when Jesse song came on in this for second one?
• 1:06:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, obviously you have to do it.
• 1:06:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: It is.
• 1:06:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: And then also... Oh, she loved me.
• 1:06:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: There was like three times that I cried.
• 1:06:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: That was one of the times the second time was seeing the dog buster in the third movie and he was like, oh, when he's old.
• 1:06:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: just in the movie before he was a puppy.
• 1:06:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that was really sad and I don't even like dogs anymore.
• 1:06:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: And then the last one was like when Andy gave up his toys at the end.
• 1:07:01
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:07:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: Movie is trash.
• 1:07:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: You didn't cry at the fire conveyor belt thing?
• 1:07:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: No, okay, I'm just curious.
• 1:07:11
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't like the fourth movie.
• 1:07:12
  [SPEAKER_03]: The fourth movie was sped.
• 1:07:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: Honestly, code that was telling you the distinction between third and fourth.
• 1:07:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
• 1:07:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: Well, the third one is a good movie and you're right.
• 1:07:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: That was when the conveyor belt was a thing.
• 1:07:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: The fourth movie was the antique shop.
• 1:07:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: What the creepy ventriloquist thing?
• 1:07:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 1:07:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I hated that.
• 1:07:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: The reason why people don't like the fourth movie was because instead of going with
• 1:07:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: Bonnie hang out with both people with a pretty decide to stay with both people and stay lost toy instead of staying with his friends and that's why people hate movie four right yeah well movie five's coming out soon so yeah i've been trying to find spoilers of it just so i can know what happened um wrong with you
• 1:07:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: long with you.
• 1:07:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
• 1:07:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: I just want to know what happened.
• 1:08:02
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
• 1:08:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: So I think you're a Jesse fan.
• 1:08:05
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's a big Jesse.
• 1:08:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: I loved Jesse as a kid.
• 1:08:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: Obviously, we have the same name and because she was very like tomboyish, like very into like boy boy cool things.
• 1:08:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, rooting to love turf.
• 1:08:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: So very excited.
• 1:08:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I'll probably, if it's at the drive-in, we might see it.
• 1:08:24
  [SPEAKER_02]: But were you team buzzer team Woody?
• 1:08:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, and let's separate from Tom Hanks and Tim Allen.
• 1:08:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's obviously you can't.
• 1:08:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: When I was a kid, I was team Woody as an adult though.
• 1:08:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm like, Woody's being a little pissed pants.
• 1:08:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm, I'm team body through and through.
• 1:08:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't care.
• 1:08:46
  [SPEAKER_02]: This is like, your core math use, yeah, just like, through and through, you can't help it.
• 1:08:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, I'm very annoyed.
• 1:08:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: But is it because of the Tom Hinks thing because you do love Tom Hinks?
• 1:08:54
  [SPEAKER_03]: I do love that.
• 1:08:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's why I just think I think it just once again goes down to are you an only, an older child or a younger child?
• 1:09:02
  [SPEAKER_03]: Because if you're a, what are your like, an older child and the younger child comes in and ruins your life?
• 1:09:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I think like, I can be.
• 1:09:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: I just think he's such a big baby sometimes and I'm like, get over it.
• 1:09:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: What are you're being a child?
• 1:09:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like stop.
• 1:09:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's justified in everything and he's extremely loyal.
• 1:09:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, except it's not with Bonnie because Bonnie loves him in the closet.
• 1:09:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like a loser.
• 1:09:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: And stole his share of star.
• 1:09:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: So funny.
• 1:09:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's just.
• 1:09:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I love it.
• 1:09:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's um, I toy story really hard.
• 1:09:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
• 1:09:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, that's great.
• 1:09:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's really funny.
• 1:09:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, I enjoyed that.
• 1:09:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, all right.
• 1:09:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, we'll get out of your hair, everyone.
• 1:09:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: And we'll be back next week with more Buffy season six episode 20 villains.
• 1:09:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: Until then, everyone here and if the lesson.