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Taxes, Value, and Volunteering · I Hate Talking

• 0:29
  I Hate Talking: Welcome to episode 58 of I Hate Talking.
• 0:33
  I Hate Talking: -- Hi -- everyone.
• 0:34
  I Hate Talking: So I don't think it will come to anyone's surprise that our word or phrase of this episode is tariff.
• 0:42
  I Hate Talking: Hm, no, it was a surprise to me, but then you said the word and I'm not surprised after all.
• 0:50
  I Hate Talking: Yes, so we're gonna take a little bit closer look at the word tariff since we did give a off the cuff definition in our last episode and I think we got it pretty much right.
• 1:02
  I Hate Talking: So basically, a tariff is a tax imposed by a government on goods.
• 1:09
  I Hate Talking: Usually, those are the goods that are imported from other countries where that is paid to the importer.
• 1:16
  I Hate Talking: So like we were talking about last time where the US government is imposing tariffs on foreign countries on the import of goods into the US that that tax is then effective for those goods coming in.
• 1:29
  I Hate Talking: And it is stated here that that is done with the express purpose to make foreign goods less competitive compared to domestic products.
• 1:41
  I Hate Talking: And then also tariffs can be a tax on exports, though this is less common where if you're actually sending something as an export from the source country, there would actually be a tax on that.
• 1:56
  I Hate Talking: And why would they do that?
• 1:57
  I Hate Talking: I suppose maybe they have a really special export that could only be sourced from that one single place or That is something that is specific to that country that they could actually generate some government revenue from that, regardless of particular demand because they have the only supply.
• 2:22
  I Hate Talking: OK, so instead of like a tax for their citizens, They would provide a tariff, so they still get that money.
• 2:30
  I Hate Talking: They, as in the government gets the money?
• 2:33
  I Hate Talking: Yes, they, the government is always the one getting the taxes, it seems.
• 2:37
  I Hate Talking: So the AI that I asked does cite several purposes here, and we touched on those last time as well, raising government revenue, so generating that income for the government.
• 2:52
  I Hate Talking: Protecting domestic industries from foreign competition and then basically just exerting political leverage in trade relations.
• 3:02
  I Hate Talking: Now there is a little bit more detail here in terms of two main types of tariff.
• 3:08
  I Hate Talking: There is a specific tariff and that's where it's a fixed fee per unit.
• 3:12
  I Hate Talking: So it could even be a unit in terms of the entire shipment.
• 3:16
  I Hate Talking: So it could be that there would be a tariff of $500 per container or something like that.
• 3:23
  I Hate Talking: Or there's the ad volorum tariff, which is basically just means a percentage, so the declared value of the goods and then a percentage applied to that, and that's what we were talking about, mostly for the ones that are in play currently where it is a advaorum tariff, where it is a certain percentage.
• 3:43
  I Hate Talking: OK.
• 3:44
  I Hate Talking: And then, like we talked about last time, this hopefully will encourage people to buy more domestic products since the imports are more expensive, but there's a lot of debate on that with economists and political pundits that whether that actually works or not.
• 4:04
  I Hate Talking: How true is it?
• 4:06
  I Hate Talking: I haven't researched it.
• 4:07
  I Hate Talking: I've just seen on like Instagram and such, so it's not super reliable, but people sharing like screenshots or photos of like, the US mail.
• 4:19
  I Hate Talking: They'll get like a bill, like uh you owe us $62 or something to get your package, and they'll like the product costs $10 and then now they're wanting to add $62 or whatnot to for us to receive the package.
• 4:34
  I Hate Talking: That may be something that's happening.
• 4:38
  I Hate Talking: I'm not, I haven't heard about that.
• 4:41
  I Hate Talking: I guess it could be happening where that would be a specific tariff that is just a base tariff that is applied to incoming shipments and it also may be something that they are experiencing that's new because of the de minimis rule that we were talking about last time where Previously, packages that were $800 or less were not subject to any tariffs, but that particular de minimis rule was suspended for China specifically, where regardless of the declared value of the goods, it will be subject to tariffs.
• 5:20
  I Hate Talking: OK.
• 5:20
  I Hate Talking: Or it also might just be a scam and somebody's trying to collect some money from unsuspecting business people that think they have to pay this and They're just mailing their check to somebody somewhere and it's not actually going to the US government.
• 5:36
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, well, there you go, a new scam.
• 5:39
  I Hate Talking: I got my very first whole scam today.
• 5:42
  I Hate Talking: You get them a lot, right?
• 5:44
  I Hate Talking: You get the messages that you have unpaid tolls, unpaid tolls, yes.
• 5:48
  I Hate Talking: And I know a lot of people do, and I've never got one until today.
• 5:52
  I Hate Talking: I was almost excited, and then I was also super sad that the scammers have my number.
• 5:56
  I Hate Talking: Indeed.
• 5:58
  I Hate Talking: So the word tariff actually has some interesting etymology and it actually goes back quite a ways and it is something that comes from Latin and it would have been used also by the Greek speakers of the day back then where it is the word Tarif, T A R I F F E, which means a set price.
• 6:24
  I Hate Talking: And it was actually instituted I guess by those particular empires at the time for particular trade with the Turks.
• 6:35
  I Hate Talking: So it is also in Turkish a word called tarif, which is a list of prices, tables of rates of customs.
• 6:46
  I Hate Talking: And it also would have been in Arabic as well, basically to mean to know, to be able to recognize, to find out.
• 6:55
  I Hate Talking: So some of the things there in terms of the keeping of records and the monetary value with set prices.
• 7:04
  I Hate Talking: And then from the Latin came to be used in Italian and French.
• 7:10
  I Hate Talking: And then in English and didn't really change all that much throughout that time, it basically kept that same root word pretty explicitly as it went through all the different languages and arrived in our modern English term tariff.
• 7:27
  I Hate Talking: OK.
• 7:28
  I Hate Talking: So that is our word or phrase of the episode tariff, and I think like we said that we got that pretty spot on in our previous episodes.
• 7:38
  I Hate Talking: So it basically is a tax.
• 7:41
  I Hate Talking: It's just the type of tax and who institutes it and where the tax gets applied that sets tariff apart from just a standard tax.
• 7:50
  I Hate Talking: Will it go back?
• 7:52
  I Hate Talking: Will we lose this tariff one day and things will be cheaper again, or is that just TBD?
• 7:57
  I Hate Talking: I think it's already been suspended.
• 8:00
  I Hate Talking: Everywhere?
• 8:01
  I Hate Talking: I know some places, right?
• 8:03
  I Hate Talking: Like uh UK made a deal or something, and I thought I saw China have like a 90 day hold.
• 8:11
  I Hate Talking: Correct.
• 8:12
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, there were some trade deals made with the UK and then the status of the Chinese tariffs are still in effect, but with reduced rates and then there's also A 90 day pause on those very high tariffs that were instituted, I believe, on May 2nd, so they didn't last long before they came to the reduction from 150%, I guess at one point, it went down from 150 to 145% and now has dropped to quote unquote standard tariff of 30%.
• 8:52
  I Hate Talking: OK.
• 8:53
  I Hate Talking: Now, of course, after that 90 day pause, which there's really no guarantee that it would even go through the entire 90 days if something else happens or.
• 9:04
  I Hate Talking: The political powers that be would want to change something, but at the end of the 90 days, it could go back to that or maybe the 90 days would be extended, or there would be some sort of resolution that would allow it to be instated for a longer period of time, but it does seem that at least temporarily, It is greatly reduced from what it was.
• 9:30
  I Hate Talking: So, if I buy something tonight, I want something from overseas, I should buy it now.
• 9:35
  I Hate Talking: And not wait till the end of summer.
• 9:37
  I Hate Talking: Oh yeah, and I think that's what probably a lot of companies are doing.
• 9:42
  I Hate Talking: So like we talked about last time, I think a lot of particular manufacturers were pausing, purchasing and shipments from China specifically.
• 9:51
  I Hate Talking: So I would imagine that they are now taking advantage of this 90 day window to Restock their supplies and take that very advantage of the thing that you stated that during this window, they're going to be able to get things at a quote unquote reduced rate because of the tariffs.
• 10:11
  I Hate Talking: -- Can -- you imagine the poor people that bought something that week, the tariffs were high, just to have them go back down?
• 10:19
  I Hate Talking: I'd be so mad.
• 10:20
  I Hate Talking: Indeed, I'm sure that happened to at least some people or some companies.
• 10:26
  I Hate Talking: Mhm.
• 10:26
  I Hate Talking: They can't get a refund?
• 10:28
  I Hate Talking: No, they can, I would imagine not be able to get a refund.
• 10:33
  I Hate Talking: And then I was also reading some information about tariffs historically within the United States specifically, and there's been a lot of usage of tariffs over the lifetime of the United States and in fact, There were a number of presidents early on that instituted tariffs and were in support of tariffs as a type of protectionism of the United States, where basically they call them at that time, quote unquote infant industries where basically in order to kickstart industry within the United States.
• 11:16
  I Hate Talking: They impose tariffs on foreign goods so that that exact thing, the manufacturer of domestic goods was more attractive to people in order to produce things and supply people with what they were demanding.
• 11:32
  I Hate Talking: And then I guess World War 2, that saw a reduction and I guess now we are coming back to perhaps some of that protectionism type intent that we talked about last time.
• 11:45
  I Hate Talking: As well.
• 11:47
  I Hate Talking: And then I believe there's even some things with the Civil War with certain things being tariffed between the North and the South that also played a part in some of the division in the country at that point in time as well.
• 12:02
  I Hate Talking: So interesting things to think about.
• 12:06
  I Hate Talking: There even is a lot of debate on whether the tariffs in the 1800s through the early 1900s were effective or not and whether they actually played a part in some of the industry being built in the US.
• 12:24
  I Hate Talking: So even for the things that we can look back at history, There is quite a dissent between various experts on whether it was effective and whether it was the best way to do things to achieve a certain outcome.
• 12:39
  I Hate Talking: Or whether it was even responsible for the outcome itself.
• 12:44
  I Hate Talking: So I think even now today, we can see the exact same thing where there may be people that are either in support of tariffs or not and Whether the intended effect will come to fruition or not.
• 12:59
  I Hate Talking: And if it does, whether tariffs actually played a particular significant role in achieving those things.
• 13:06
  I Hate Talking: OK.
• 13:07
  I Hate Talking: So that is our word or phrase, like we said, tariff and hopefully give some insight in terms of what's happening in our world today and that it's not really anything new.
• 13:20
  I Hate Talking: It's been around for hundreds and hundreds of years, even back to the Greek Empire.
• 13:25
  I Hate Talking: That's interesting.
• 13:27
  I Hate Talking: But there is one thing for certain.
• 13:29
  I Hate Talking: Is that tariffs are not voluntary.
• 13:32
  I Hate Talking: It is required.
• 13:33
  I Hate Talking: So, if tariffs were voluntary, do you think people would pay them or not?
• 13:39
  I Hate Talking: No, I don't think so.
• 13:41
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, I think you're probably right.
• 13:44
  I Hate Talking: There are people that maybe would have disposable income that believed so strongly that this was the right thing to do, that I could see maybe a very, very small percentage of people would maybe pay a voluntary tax, like a tariff or something like that.
• 14:02
  I Hate Talking: I think that's even been tested in some governments where like they have a base tax and then like if you have some extra money, you can Basically donate to the government for governmental programs and things of that nature.
• 14:17
  I Hate Talking: But yes, you're right.
• 14:18
  I Hate Talking: For the most part, taxes are involuntary and it is something that you are required to do.
• 14:25
  I Hate Talking: So, on the flip side, however, there are people that do things or give of their own funds voluntarily, and why would they do such a thing?
• 14:36
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, I guess when you word it like that.
• 14:39
  I Hate Talking: Some people, if you say tariffs, I feel like people would not want to pay it.
• 14:44
  I Hate Talking: But if it's a donation to the government or to a program, Yeah, there will be people that would be interested cause they'd care about that.
• 14:53
  I Hate Talking: Just like people donate to their local church or their local school, or, you know, the Ronald McDonald Center is a really great program that people donate to.
• 15:05
  I Hate Talking: So, funds, for sure, can be donated when somebody sees a value in something.
• 15:11
  I Hate Talking: And um I think time is a big thing that's also donated by volunteers if you care about something.
• 15:19
  I Hate Talking: Yep, that's true.
• 15:20
  I Hate Talking: So I guess those are the two big categories of things that you can donate.
• 15:26
  I Hate Talking: I guess you could also donate material goods, right, and that would sort of fall within the monetary category where perhaps you're donating just cash money, or you are donating some sort of used item or some other physical asset that you have and want to be used by.
• 15:48
  I Hate Talking: The particular entity that you are donating to.
• 15:52
  I Hate Talking: And then time, I think is a big one and I think Maybe a subcategory within the time is also skill.
• 16:02
  I Hate Talking: So maybe there's some things that don't require a whole bunch of skill but do require time to be spent on helping that particular entity achieve its goals or help people or do whatever they are doing, but in a lot of instances that there will also be the particular aspect of skill that if you have a certain skill set or talent.
• 16:25
  I Hate Talking: That, that could also be employed, so to speak by the particular program or entity of which you are donating your time and really they are leveraging that skill that you have in order to achieve their desired outcome.
• 16:41
  I Hate Talking: Mhm.
• 16:42
  I Hate Talking: I mean, I just feel like it's very community based in a lot of ways.
• 16:48
  I Hate Talking: Because you could live by yourself, in your house, and not interact with others, and just do your job, get your money, buy your groceries, and be done.
• 16:59
  I Hate Talking: Uh, even in a way of volunteering, even, you know, if you're paying a tip, that is voluntary, you value that person doing something, so you're gonna give them extra money that you do not have to give, or a lot of programs and activities.
• 17:19
  I Hate Talking: Do not have the funds to pay someone.
• 17:21
  I Hate Talking: So if somebody values that, they're gonna spend some time helping that organization or program or cause or anything like that.
• 17:32
  I Hate Talking: I think a lot of people at surface Value, don't want to volunteer though.
• 17:37
  I Hate Talking: I think they value their time so much that I think it's hard to picture doing something for free.
• 17:45
  I Hate Talking: Yes, I suppose that's true.
• 17:47
  I Hate Talking: And when you first started talking about this, you were using a lot of words like believe or belief and value.
• 17:55
  I Hate Talking: I think another word that you could throw in there would be importance that when somebody is genuinely volunteering, they are doing it because they believe in the organization of which they are donating their time and money.
• 18:10
  I Hate Talking: And that, as you said, they value something that that particular organization is doing or providing.
• 18:19
  I Hate Talking: And they see the importance of how they can contribute to that.
• 18:24
  I Hate Talking: But when you mentioned leaving a tip, there also may be some sort of cultural expectation for doing certain things where leaving a tip may not be culturally expected in certain cultures, but I think within the United States, it is culturally expected.
• 18:45
  I Hate Talking: So in some ways, That particular example may be done at least a little bit out of compliance to a social norm, and I wonder if volunteering in general is falling out of social norms.
• 19:02
  I Hate Talking: Like if you volunteer for an organization, you're outside social norms.
• 19:08
  I Hate Talking: That's what you mean?
• 19:10
  I Hate Talking: Essentially, I would phrase it a little bit differently where volunteering perhaps used to be the social norm and it is no longer the social norm.
• 19:21
  I Hate Talking: So it's not necessarily that you are outside of the social norm, but I guess for all intents and purposes you are, but it's more that the social norm has changed that volunteering is not necessarily important.
• 19:35
  I Hate Talking: So it's not that you would be seen as like an outcast or an outsider, it's just Not something a normal person would do.
• 19:41
  I Hate Talking: Do you ever look at people that are volunteering in some way?
• 19:46
  I Hate Talking: And either look down on them or hold them to a higher esteem.
• 19:51
  I Hate Talking: Which would you tend to do?
• 19:53
  I Hate Talking: I think in general, I would hold them to a higher esteem.
• 19:59
  I Hate Talking: If that is something that they can do in addition to their regular means of income and the regular job.
• 20:10
  I Hate Talking: So I guess as long as they are doing things to fulfill their normal roles and responsibilities and have that extra ability and time to be able to do that, I would hold that in higher esteem.
• 20:24
  I Hate Talking: I guess there's maybe a little bit of the lower view if it's.
• 20:31
  I Hate Talking: At the cost of something that I would say would be more important.
• 20:37
  I Hate Talking: For example, a theoretical person was volunteering so much that they got fired from their job and then therefore didn't earn a paycheck and then could not feed their family and spiraled downwards, but all the time, yet they were still volunteering at various nonprofits and organizations that That probably is not a picture of success for volunteering, right?
• 21:03
  I Hate Talking: And I feel like I have a lot of mixed emotions.
• 21:06
  I Hate Talking: I mean, we personally volunteer a lot for stuff, different groups we're in, we do love it, but if I don't volunteer for something, I either feel guilt about it, if other people are like, oh, I know this is important.
• 21:21
  I Hate Talking: And I should be doing more to help.
• 21:24
  I Hate Talking: Or on the flip side, if I don't see value in something, and people are spending a lot of time volunteering for it, it's frustrating to me cause I'm like, there's way more important stuff, in my opinion, or just like pay somebody such and such and get it done right and get it done better and faster than all this hassle.
• 21:45
  I Hate Talking: Yes, I suppose so.
• 21:47
  I Hate Talking: And I guess everything comes down to a cost-benefit analysis at some point in time, where is it better to get a volunteer that may not be able to do something perfectly versus spend some of your resources to hire a professional to do it in a certain way.
• 22:03
  I Hate Talking: And also your comment about volunteering.
• 22:07
  I Hate Talking: If you volunteer for everything, then other people can't volunteer for anything.
• 22:12
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, I think that's something you and I both have a hard time with is not volunteering sometimes and giving other people an opportunity to help.
• 22:24
  I Hate Talking: Yes, I suppose so.
• 22:27
  I Hate Talking: I think my particular instance is.
• 22:30
  I Hate Talking: I will Do one of two things.
• 22:35
  I Hate Talking: One, if there is nobody stepping up and it sort of seems like maybe I'm the last resort is that I will fulfill that particular role.
• 22:48
  I Hate Talking: Assuming other things are in play, like I already discussed that it's not gonna overburden you that other priorities are going to go by the wayside to the detriment of certain responsibilities that I have.
• 23:01
  I Hate Talking: And then also, secondly, is if there is somebody volunteering and they're doing.
• 23:06
  I Hate Talking: Just to put it bluntly, a bad job that I may feel the need to step in and make things better from that perspective as well.
• 23:18
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, OK, so what do we do with that?
• 23:21
  I Hate Talking: Because if their hearts in the right spot, but they're doing a bad job, I guess where's the line?
• 23:28
  I Hate Talking: Because for me, I can see if it starts to get detrimental.
• 23:31
  I Hate Talking: Then we have to step in and be like, hey, you know, and redirect somehow or whatnot.
• 23:38
  I Hate Talking: Where's the line between just not done the way we think it should be done versus a detriment to the organization?
• 23:46
  I Hate Talking: Well, there's even another point in there is.
• 23:50
  I Hate Talking: What one thinks is the right way versus The actual right way.
• 23:57
  I Hate Talking: So, I will take the opinion 99% of the time that there is a best way to do something.
• 24:04
  I Hate Talking: And I will also be open to the fact that there may be instances where I do not know the best way.
• 24:10
  I Hate Talking: So there could be the possibility that somebody that at the outset, perhaps looks like they're not doing it the best way, but maybe they are, and once you learn how they're doing it, you'll see that it is actually a better way than you had originally thought.
• 24:25
  I Hate Talking: But then to your point on whether it is a line that needs to be addressed or not comes down to again that cost-benefit analysis, is it better to either spend resources or your own time or is it something that can be quote unquote good enough that this person is doing it in a certain way and you just live with that.
• 24:49
  I Hate Talking: Mhm.
• 24:50
  I Hate Talking: And I wonder if it's a cultural thing or what.
• 24:55
  I Hate Talking: I'm just curious about how other cultures do it, because here we have like a lot of nonprofits, we have a lot of not for profits, and then we have for-profits.
• 25:06
  I Hate Talking: And I wonder if there's a value placed on all those three different categories if people see value in their time and money spent there.
• 25:16
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, I suppose so.
• 25:18
  I Hate Talking: The problem is not completely non-existent even in for-profit businesses because there could be people that are doing a bad job or things that aren't standard.
• 25:31
  I Hate Talking: Now you have I guess a little bit more leverage there because there's the possibility that if they don't correct their behavior that they will no longer be employed there.
• 25:40
  I Hate Talking: So, I guess in some ways, a volunteer organization doesn't have quite that same leverage where they can actually have something to use as a particular incentive to have people do things a certain way, other than just asking them and I guess.
• 26:04
  I Hate Talking: At the worst case, asking them to step away from that particular role, if it is causing a detriment to either the job that they're performing or the organization in general.
• 26:14
  I Hate Talking: Right?
• 26:15
  I Hate Talking: It reminds me of, like, value for our kids and how we want them to work hard with their hands and help people.
• 26:24
  I Hate Talking: It made me think about it when you talk about the salaries and paying someone, because I go back and forth on, like, paying our children for things, because I want them to learn how to use their money wisely, but also, I don't want them to just do a job because it's money.
• 26:42
  I Hate Talking: I want them to do a job because they value, like for us, or at our church or anything like that, I want them to say, there's a job that needs to get done.
• 26:51
  I Hate Talking: I'm gonna do it because I'm part of this family.
• 26:53
  I Hate Talking: Not because I'm gonna get a couple dollars.
• 26:56
  I Hate Talking: And there we have once again revisited the concept of value.
• 27:02
  I Hate Talking: So perhaps that's our big takeaway for this episode is that.
• 27:07
  I Hate Talking: People are going to be motivated by whatever they perceive is valuable, whether that be money or helping other people or creating a stable community and family and perhaps you can achieve all those things through hard work and volunteerism.
• 27:28
  I Hate Talking: And don't forget to pay your taxes.
• 27:31
  I Hate Talking: That's what I was thinking.
• 27:33
  I Hate Talking: I was like, well, if you volunteer for everything, you won't have money for your tariffs.
• 27:37
  I Hate Talking: Precisely.
• 27:38
  I Hate Talking: Well, very good.
• 27:40
  I Hate Talking: Hopefully some insights that you can take and consider and perhaps you've come to some insights that you think others would enjoy, and if so, you can always share this episode and this podcast.
• 27:52
  I Hate Talking: It's voluntary.
• 27:54
  I Hate Talking: It is voluntary at this point.
• 27:56
  I Hate Talking: So, from your friends at I hate talking, until next time, remember, it is only through talking that we begin the journey to understanding.