Latest / Ryder Lee / Explorations Into the Uncomprehensible | Trey Hudson

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Explorations Into the Uncomprehensible | Trey Hudson · Ryder Lee

• 0:30
  Welcome back to Raised by Giants Live Discussion. Welcome everyone in the tie.
• 0:33
  I get to see you guys and any moderators or channel members out there.
• 0:37
  Today we have returning guests former DoD and US Army Military Intelligence Trey Hudson.
• 0:43
  But before I bring him on, a quick reminder that Right Arranger Channel memberships
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  Channel member and help support the show monthly and get access to those bonus episodes.
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  So with that down, we have with us here today former DoD and
• 1:21
  US Army Military Intelligence, Anti terrorism, counterintelligence and security specialist recently retired Trey
• 1:27
  Hudson. Welcome back to the show, my friend. It's good to see
• 1:30
  you, hey, writer. It's always a pleasure and an honor to but
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  you know, to get to sit down and discuss these amazing topics with you.
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  I'm really excited. I'm glad you reached out to me. So I
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  am as we say down here in the south Land, rip roaring and raring
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  to go, Rip, rorn and ready to go. Let's do it.
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  So, you know, we've talked about a lot of topics on the Channel
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  since you've been coming on for a couple of years now and in the past.
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  We talked about the dyat Love Pass event in Russia in nineteen fifty three,
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  where nine hikers were found dead in mysterious circumstances. Six of them had
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  died from supposedly hypothermia, three of them had been killed by physical trauma.
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  One victim had major skull damage, two had severe trust trauma, and another
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  had a small crack in his skull. Four of the bodies were found in
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  laying. They were found laying and running water in a creek, and three
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  out of those four had soft tissue damage to the head and face, and
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  two of the bodies had missing eyes and a missing tongue, and one had
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  missing eyebrows. Then we also discussed the Corvinia incident in nineteen ninety three,
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  which was also in Russia, which was very fascinating because it was very similar
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  to the dat Love Pass event, but there was a survivor, and she
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  said one by one of their hiking crew collapsed to the ground and started convolsing,
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  bleeding from their eyes, nose, and mouth. Now, I didn't
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  know until recently that there was a case that is sort of like these two
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  cases that happened in Russia, but the case was in the United States that
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  was very similar in nature, what is called the Yuba County five from nineteen
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  seventy eight. And I believe you've done some research into the Yuba County five,
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  So can you give us a little bit of information on what happened in
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  that case. Yeah, And now, of course I'm having to go in
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  the way back machine because it's been a while since I've actually looked at the
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  U of five case. But Fiel me and if I start wondering as stray,
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  much like these young men, if I start getting off the trail,
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  just lead me back. You know, there are five five young men,
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  and I'm just going to lay the facts out there. Don't read into it.
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  These young men had some some mental disabilities, you know, some of
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  them had some psychological issues. Uh, several of them had a lower than
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  average intelligence quotion you know, lower lower than average IQ. But they were
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  functional. You know, they could they could work, they could drive cars,
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  you know, they could interact with people. Uh, and they were
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  very very big fans of I'm trying to remember the university. It's a local
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  basketball team. And they had left one night, all of these friends to
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  go see this basketball game out of town. And they never showed showed back
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  up at home. You know, they it should have been a you know,
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  an out and back, pretty straight thing. People remember seeing them at
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  the game, you know, watching them really get energized, you know,
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  with the you know, with the game as it was being played. Uh.
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  They actually played on a league. It played the league for developmentally challenged
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  individuals there in their hometown. So they were really you know, they were
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  sportsmen, they were athletes, you know, and they were very good friends.
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  And they never showed back up. And it became a very very big
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  mystery on what happened to these young men. And where it gets really weird
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  is they ended up on a very remote mountain kind of like a forest service
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  road, a very remote road way way off track you know, completely you
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  know, completely off track, miles and miles and miles back up in the
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  wilderness, and their car was found, but they were gone, and they
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  started searching Uma County and I'm trying to remember the adjacent county. They were
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  really ill prepared for it. If if you look at it from the perspective
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  of incident management, it was a very poor coordination of what they call a
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  unified command. So the search was disjointed. There were a lot of you
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  know, back and forth on who had jurisdiction, who should take the lead,
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  et cetera, et cetera. And this was back in the seventies,
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  so incident command wasn't really uh you know, developed and matured like it is
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  now. And because of that, they lost a lot of valuable time.
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  In the winter came in and which resulted in your very heavy snowfall, you
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  know, just burying the entire you know, what they thought was a crime
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  scene. And so when things finally started thalling, they started finding their bodies,
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  uh four of them, one I believe they never found if I'm correct,
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  right, And they found the bodies in such places as you know,
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  a few miles from the car. Really really interestingly is they found one of
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  the bodies in a forced service cabin which was set up as an emergency shelter.
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  And this cabin had a I believe it was a propane heater or heater
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  of some sort that you know, was self sufficient. It had food,
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  it had blankets. You could actually winter in there. You could survive the
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  winter with all the supplies they had there. But yet they found the young
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  man's body laying in the bunk, malnourished. He starved to death with cans
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  of food and a can opener, almost literally with an arm's reach. And
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  then they found a friend of his they thinking made it to the cabin with
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  him, I believe about two or three hundred yards away from the cabin,
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  if I'm not mistaken. So it's one of those things that was just a
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  total, you know, a comedy, not that it's funny, but just
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  this whole daisy chain of errors, and no one cause has ever been brought
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  forward to why these young men were so far off course. There was a
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  witness that saw their car and remembers seeing figures moving around inside of the vehicle.
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  That was the mysterious VW, which I believe got stuck by behind them.
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  Not long after, they went all the way up the mountain road and
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  got stuck in the snow drift, and uh, like I said, one
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  has never been found. One was actually the body was discovered by his father,
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  which was was rather horrifying that the father actually went out there after the
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  snow melt and found his son's body, saw a jacket and found the remains
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  of his son there inside of the clothing. Uh. So it was.
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  It's one of those big mysteries. It's really odd because it isn't really on
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  the conscious conscious consciousness of you know, people here in the continental US,
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  like the Diad Law pass and some of these other things. But it's equally
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  as mysterious because no defined, solid logical reason for this disappearance of these five
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  and five young men, not just one, not just two, but five
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  has ever been put forward. And then you start looking at you know,
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  looking at it through the optics of you know, like David Plaid's, you
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  know, his name always comes up, you know, some of the missing
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  for one and stuff, the paradoxical undressing, the uh, the type of
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  uh, you know environment that these disappearances happened, the type of weather patterns
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  that happened all days. You start to see a pattern, but you know
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  a lot of people have never heard of the Ubu County five. Well,
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  I think that this was a big mistake on the media's part because the media
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  printed in newspapers that five retarded boys went missing. Like just saying that really
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  brings down public interests when you use the retarded word in there, and that
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  makes it seem like, oh, well, we don't care about these boys.
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  They should have just said five boys gone missing, right right, and
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  that would have changed everything exactly. But instead they said five printed in bold
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  letters on top of the newspaper heading five retarded boys gone missing. That's ridiculous,
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  you know, and it really was as an insult, you know,
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  not only to the memory of these young men, but to their families too.
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  You know, these were not you know, individuals that were so mentally
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  incapacitated that they could not function. They you know, they could function in
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  society. You know, they drove up there to this basketball game and we're
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  in the process of driving back, so you know it really you know,
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  that's an interesting point because you know, once back in the seventies, it
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  was a different time and when you use the term retarded and I'm not saying
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  that as an insult, but that was the term used back then. Is
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  it really made us like, oh, these these people were you know,
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  greatly diminished mental capacity. You know, they wandered away, they got lost
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  and died. And that is not the case at all. You know,
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  it was not a case of people not knowing where they were going, and
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  certainly not a case of them not knowing how to get back home. And
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  the effort wasn't put into it like it should have. People with mental issues,
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  be they psychological issues, mentally illness and some other issues were pushed to
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  the fringes of society. They were almost treated like throwaway people. And it
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  was a real shame. And that's that's a very good point. That's an
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  excellent point writer, that it did not get the media attention, and quite
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  frankly, I don't think it got the law enforcement and search and rescue attention
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  that it should have gotten if it had been somebody of you know, maybe
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  of a different social you know, grouping than it was. And I think
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  that one of the dads of one of the missing boys told the police about
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  the cabins back there and that they should go back there and search them,
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  and then they didn't, which is another really interesting part to all this because
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  it seems like when these mysterious things happen, there's always some kind of weather
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  anomaly, which we're going to get into that here in just a little bit,
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  but there's always a stream weather anomaly that calls off the search in almost
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  every one of these cases. It's so interesting. But first, the boy
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  that was found in the cabin, it's theorized that somebody else was there with
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  him because apparently he was wrapped in all these sheets and all these blankets in
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  a way that made it that he couldn't have done it by himself, which
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  I don't know really how much truth there is that. I mean, I
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  could wrap myself in a bunch of sheets pretty easily. And apparently his shoes
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  was missing, and then the shoes of another person was there at the front
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  of the door, if I'm remembering correctly. I think that's right. And
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  I think that one of the assumptions that was made is the way the body
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  was wrapped, that it might have been wrapped post mortem. You know,
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  that somebody wrapped him almost shroudlike, you know, in the left him in
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  a state, you know, theyre in the cabin. Yeah. And then
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  another thing was is apparently the father of one of the boys went out there
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  and was like looking looking for them and said that he seen tracks and that
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  there was only supposedly four sets of tracks leading away from the car. So
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  what happened to the to the fifth guy that was never found? Right,
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  you know, And that's that's that's the big mystery is you know, you
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  have this. You know, we can look at it, you know,
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  through the lens of missing people as we look at these mysterious cases today,
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  and it almost fits, you know, perfectly, you know, with some
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  of the mysterious cases you know, all over the world of missing people.
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  Something else, I'm going to backtrack a little bit. We talked about,
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  you know, the lack of media coverage. Uh, there's some very good
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  podcast out there on the Yuba County five. And when you're listening to the
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  family as they're interviewed, I get the impression that they're from a social strata
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  that people tend to write off, that they're of a you know, of
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  a lower social strata. And it was like, yeah, you know,
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  here's these you know, hillbillies and you know, their retarded kids got lost,
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  and you know, you know, it's just you know, who cares,
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  which is absolutely the wrong thing to say and the wrong way to treat
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  people. And you know, I think that, Uh I remember listening to
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  it, and I'm like, I could see how that I could see the
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  Sheriff's department blowing them off, you know, and just kind of disregarding Like
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  you said, Hey, there's cabins up there. You know, you need
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  to go search these cabins. There were four sets of footprints, you need
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  to look into this, and the experts, you know, just saying,
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  yeah, you don't know what you're doing. Just go home and wait for
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  a phone call. Yeah, it's like, if you find their vehicle there,
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  then would you not automatically assume that they're nearby? Like it doesn't really
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  make any sense to me. And that's another thing, is it seems like
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  a lot of these cases that the police, given certain circumstances, inadvertently botched
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  the investigation. Yeah, the reasons for that can be. There could be
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  many separate reasons for that. I mean, there could be all kinds of
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  different things going on, but it seems like there's normally a police botching the
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  investigation. There's some sort of weather anomaly, but common sense would tell you
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  that if you were how many miles was that mountain outside of town was like
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  forty miles somewhere around in that vicinity outside of town, and that's like literally
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  the only place that you could be. So if you find the car out
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  there, you would assume that they are out there. Yeah. Yeah,
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  it's you know, I've took a course in man tracking, you know,
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  how to track people, you know, based on the tracks and how they
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  move through the woods and all that. And one of the basic things that
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  you always start with is what's called last known point l KP. Where did
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  you see this person last? And that's where you start, and then you
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  start fanning out from there. Uh. And it was just, uh,
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  it was just a just a real what we used to call in the military
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  a Charlie foxtrot, which is a cluster f dot dot dot H. And
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  it's it's like they didn't want to find them, you know, it's very
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  odd. It's like they just did not really have any interest, you in
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  finding these individuals. And which is odd because I had a very I have
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  a very good friend who recently passed away that worked back country search and rescue
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  in California at that time, and they had the resources available, you know,
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  they had back country experts, subject matter experts with backcountry trained dogs that
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  could track, and you know, they never seemed to bring these really massive
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  sources to bear on this particular case. And the dogs could have sniffed that
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  car and got picked up the sin of each one of those boys and led
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  them right to them, probably probably could have led them directly to the cabin
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  where well, I mean, it seems like whenever they first got there and
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  they first found the car, all the boys were alive at that time when
• 17:25
  they got there. That's what it kind of seems like. And definitely the
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  kid, the boy that was at the cabin, I mean, we're calling
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  them boys. They weren't actually boys. They were they were twenties. There
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  were men, but especially the boy, the man that was in the cabin
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  was definitely alive during that time. Yeah, yeah, it was. Uh
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  so is that you know what you have to wonder? And you know,
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  I would love to do this, and I know the records don't exist,
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  and quite frankly, I don't have the time to dig dig too deep down
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  into it, but I would love to go back if the records exist,
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  which it's kind of questionable if they do. Is is this an isolated incident.
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  Is this a one off? How many other missing individuals? Uh?
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  We're never found or were found months later in that same area, you know,
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  because you can remember, this was back before the twenty four hour news
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  cycle, and a person going missing might have you know, one day,
• 18:22
  two days in the newspaper, maybe picked up on the local TV media,
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  maybe not. And if they're not found, that's it. There's no web
• 18:30
  page dedicated to finding this person. There's no groups of Internet sluice, you
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  know, constantly reviewing the case. It's one and done. So you know,
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  how many other cases, you know, do you have in that area?
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  And is there a pattern you can you establish clusters? You know,
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  kind of like you know we've done here in the twenty first century of missing
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  persons cases. You know, I would love, you know, if anybody's
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  ever done that kind of data. I would love our research. I'd love
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  to see the data on you know, that area of California. So looking
• 19:03
  into this because I have my own theory on what actually happened through you know,
• 19:11
  watching people talk about it and listening to the documentaries and everything on it.
• 19:18
  What's your best educated guests and opinion as to what happened to them.
• 19:29
  You're muted. I think, Trey, sorry about that. My PC wasn't
• 19:40
  wasn't co operating. You know, my best theory, my best and it's
• 19:42
  a guess. You know, it's a guess. Is I think they went
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  up there and they their car got stuck. We know that. Where it
• 19:57
  starts getting very confusing is why did five healthy young men athletes, why were
• 20:07
  they not able to push that car out of the snow bank? From what
• 20:11
  I remember is it was not severely stuck. It wasn't hanging over ravine,
• 20:15
  There wasn't bottom bout. It just ran up into a snowbank, couldn't go
• 20:19
  any further and then couldn't back out easy that four of them could have gotten
• 20:23
  and pushed it out and turned around and gone back down the mountain. So,
• 20:30
  you know, there's a lot of questions. You know, does the
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  diminished you know, mental capacity of these young men. Did it not allow
• 20:40
  them to do logical linear thinking, you know and problem solving? You know?
• 20:42
  Did they panic? I think the answer to that probably would be yes,
• 20:47
  they probably panicked when they got stuck. Uh. I think at least
• 20:55
  three of them set out from the vehicle. Now, how the one individual
• 21:00
  got miles and miles and miles away into the cabin, possibly with a second
• 21:07
  one of the group is beyond me. I don't know how that happened.
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  And of course the fifth one, if I recall, has never been found.
• 21:15
  So you know Ockham's razor is they they got stuck. They didn't have
• 21:22
  the problem solving skills to get unstuck. They panicked. And if I remember,
• 21:29
  they there was a theory that one of the boys had a friend in
• 21:33
  that area, and they think that they might have been driving up a road
• 21:37
  to go see that friend and got lost, and they might have thought they
• 21:42
  were very close to that individual's cabin and went out to find it instead of
• 21:45
  always staying with the vehicle, which is a much better option. Ah.
• 21:51
  Why you know they didn't contact the vehicle that was behind him, you know,
• 21:56
  when it drove up, if I'm remembering the timeline correct. Ah.
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  And does their uh, their mental capacity really even come to play, you
• 22:07
  know, or is it something more sinister? You know? Was it?
• 22:10
  You know that I don't remember very detailed autopsies being done on the remains,
• 22:15
  you know, I don't remember if anybody really looked at foul play. And
• 22:19
  then you know, we can take that bold step. And I'm not saying
• 22:22
  this is the reason, but you know, I've been doing this stuff long
• 22:27
  enough to know that we've got to consider the X factor. You know,
• 22:32
  did something truly remarkable and unexplainable happened to these young men that quite frankly,
• 22:40
  we may never know, you know, did something like the diabolol pass you
• 22:44
  know happened to them? You know, were their bodies scanned for you know,
• 22:48
  radiation? You know what kind of injuries happened to the bodies? Now,
• 22:52
  the remains, if I recall, were scattered by uh you know,
• 22:56
  animal uh scavenging and predator. But you know, I just don't think that
• 23:03
  a lot of effort was really put into finding out what happened, and unfortunately
• 23:10
  that opportunity is long gone. Well it's interesting because, I mean, the
• 23:17
  theory of the the the conspiracy stuff really starts with the gentleman being wrapped in
• 23:26
  all the sheets and blankets at the cabin and having access to food, having
• 23:30
  access to heaters, and then not using it. Now, the family explains
• 23:36
  that he didn't eat the food, he didn't turn on the heater because he
• 23:41
  felt that that would have been stealing from other people, and that wasn't what
• 23:48
  he did. He wasn't going to eat food that wasn't his, he wasn't
• 23:51
  going to use appliances and things that you know, wasn't his. I think
• 23:56
  the really big question here is was the guy that was never found? I
• 24:03
  think his name was Gary Dale Mathis? Was he even there? Did he
• 24:11
  even make it up to the point did they even? Did they even?
• 24:15
  Was he even? Did he even get up to the freaking mountain with them?
• 24:18
  Right? That's the that's the whole thing, and that's the whole conundrum
• 24:22
  of this thing, because I don't I really don't think that he did.
• 24:25
  I don't think he made it that far. There's a theory that he was
• 24:30
  he because they left the basketball game early. Apparently they got kicked out of
• 24:33
  the basketball game for being unruly or getting into an argument or getting into a
• 24:40
  fight with somebody else, So they left the basketball game early. And there's
• 24:45
  a theory that on the bridge on the way up to the mountain, they
• 24:48
  were confronted by another group of men or another group of boys, and that
• 24:55
  other group of men killed Mathis and throwed them off At the bridge. There
• 25:00
  were so much fear surrounding the boys that they just went up the mountain.
• 25:06
  You know, they didn't want to come back down because they're afraid that they
• 25:07
  were going to get you know, also killed, So they went up there
• 25:11
  and in fear. But I have an alternative theory. And this isn't anything
• 25:17
  you know, bad about the families. This isn't me saying anything bad about
• 25:19
  the families or tarnishing anybody's memory. But it may be possible because the boys
• 25:26
  really didn't like this Mathis guy. They feared him. They thought that maybe
• 25:30
  he was he was way, he was super aggressive. He was actually in
• 25:33
  the military and he was being treated for He got a honorable it was either
• 25:40
  honorable or a dishonorable discharge for anger issues and like flying off the wall and
• 25:45
  stuff like that. He was on like medication, and they kind of didn't
• 25:49
  really want him to be a part of the group. I think that it
• 25:55
  may be possible that something happened between this Mathos guy and the other four boys,
• 26:02
  and the other four boys might have been might have had to act and
• 26:08
  do something against him, right, and that's why he wasn't there. That's
• 26:15
  why he didn't make it up to the mountain, and they went up there
• 26:18
  in fear because what they had just done, they knew that it was kind
• 26:25
  of you know, over for them, and they didn't want to, you
• 26:27
  know, come down and face the consequences. I don't know, that's just
• 26:30
  kind of my theory on it. Yeah, that's the theory. Now you're
• 26:33
  you're you're tickling my gray sales. And I'm starting to remember more now.
• 26:37
  Mathis had been discharged from the military, not because of you know, de
• 26:42
  mintous diminished mental capacity, but rather for severe psychological issues. And he was
• 26:48
  medicated, and he was a very ill fit for that group, and he
• 26:55
  you know, kind of became the de facto leader just through force of will,
• 27:02
  you know, because he was smarter than the other guys. You know,
• 27:04
  he was able to solve problems, he was able to think, but
• 27:08
  he was horribly unstable, especially when he was not taking his medication. And
• 27:14
  the only reason these boys knew knew him was because they all played on the
• 27:17
  same basketball team, you know, in the in the league. Had mentioned
• 27:21
  earlier, and you know, I always wondered, did did Mathis have something
• 27:26
  to do with the boys? And he set off on his own, you
• 27:30
  know, to get away from you know what he had just done. But
• 27:33
  then again that doesn't doesn't really fit the pattern though, because you know,
• 27:37
  their bodies were so widely dispersed. You know, if you're going to you
• 27:41
  know, kill somebody, you know, maybe one or two gets away,
• 27:48
  but you know, everybody scatters. You know, maybe they were scared of
• 27:51
  him and they all went and uh, you know died later from exposure or
• 27:56
  starvation or whatever. So I don't think that there was, you know,
• 28:00
  a thorough investigation. I never heard where the police really interviewed, you know,
• 28:06
  the families using that particular you know, did everybody get along? Did
• 28:10
  you ever hear you know, did did you know one of the individuals ever
• 28:14
  threaten somebody else? Did he ever threaten the group? You know, did
• 28:18
  anybody hear anything? I think it was just like, you know, these
• 28:22
  these men went up into the woods, you know, you know, they
• 28:26
  weren't the productive citizens. You know that, you know, we'd like to
• 28:30
  see back in the seventies, you know, the society you know, value
• 28:33
  back then. And it's like, well, you know, too bad,
• 28:37
  you know, we'll move on to something else. And I think there's something
• 28:44
  else that's really interesting, just going off of all this from memory, But
• 28:48
  I ncent sure that the school that they went to had like Monarch in the
• 28:59
  tide of the school if I'm not mistaken, like and then you think,
• 29:04
  oh well Monarch mk Ultra mind Control. I do not recall the name of
• 29:10
  the school, but that doesn't mean that's not the case. I just I
• 29:12
  just don't recall. I could be mistaken, I could be wrong. I
• 29:15
  don't have to refresh my memory on it, but I think you had something
• 29:19
  has some kind of the title Monarch in it Monarch's School for I don't know,
• 29:27
  let me try and look it up. But this is a very interesting
• 29:30
  case for people that aren't aware of it. And there's recently a episode of
• 29:41
  a documentary that came out on Netflix that has an episode that investigates this case
• 29:47
  as well. Oh okay, definitely, yeah. I'm glad to see that
• 29:51
  it's starting to get a little more interest now. You know, it was
• 29:53
  kind of pushed back in the and the annals of history, and nobody really
• 29:57
  thought about it until I think some of the strange disappearances, you know in
• 30:02
  America's forest lands started being looked at, started to be looked at, you
• 30:07
  know, a little bit more in depth. And I think the Yuba County
• 30:08
  five has popped back up on the radar. Like I said before, I
• 30:11
  kind of got turned onto it. Uh, you know, I picked it
• 30:15
  up somewhere in research and found a really good podcast, you know, like
• 30:19
  you know, a multi episode podcast that was excellent, and I will definitely
• 30:23
  check out that episode. Uh. And you know, maybe now the Internet
• 30:29
  Solutions, you know, will be energized and can start pulling some of this
• 30:33
  old data if it still exists, and hopefully come up with a solution or
• 30:37
  at least a really solid workable theory. There is a Monarch school, education
• 30:44
  Opportunity and transformation, but I am I'm pretty sure the Monarch was the title
• 30:56
  of the mentally it was like Monarch School for mentally challenged students in Yuba City
• 31:03
  or something, but I'm not finding it on the Wikipedia page for the Yuba
• 31:10
  County five. It doesn't really talk a lot about their upbringing or a lot
• 31:17
  of what they were doing. But I found that interesting and I'm pretty sure
• 31:21
  that that is the case. But I have to get back to people on
• 31:23
  that. So there's a lot of things that I've noticed with a lot of
• 31:30
  these strange cases and these strange disappearances. One is the police pretty much botching
• 31:37
  the investigation. Two is another like there's always a weather event. Three it
• 31:45
  seems like, especially when it comes to a lot of the children that has
• 31:51
  gone missing in national parks and forestry areas, have some sort of mental disability.
• 32:00
  It's it's really strange. Yeah, you know. And one can you
• 32:05
  know you easily say, well, you know, these these folks got confused
• 32:08
  or they got lost, and you know, they didn't think through the problem
• 32:13
  and just made it worse by you know, running off in a direction perhaps
• 32:16
  away from rescuers, not staying put, you know, being scared, you
• 32:21
  know, not you know, reaching out to rescuers when they hear them.
• 32:25
  But you know, there's always you know, these odd outliers, you know,
• 32:30
  these very strange you know, things that just don't fit. You know.
• 32:36
  I'm thinking about the famous case and I can't remember the young young boy's
• 32:39
  name right now in the Smoky mountains where you know, he became lost and
• 32:46
  and then the army came in, which you know, the US military just
• 32:51
  doesn't do missing persons cases. That's that's not in their charter. But you
• 32:55
  know, the US military, and especially some special Forces units came in to
• 32:59
  look for him. So you know, you have to wonder, and you
• 33:04
  know, I'm not going to get all you know, conspiracy now, but
• 33:07
  you have to wonder if certain areas aren't known to be uh you know,
• 33:13
  vortexas and I mean vortex in a way that it just people just just disappear,
• 33:17
  you know, they're just gone. And when somebody goes missing in these
• 33:22
  particular areas, uh, it takes uh, it takes a bit of interest,
• 33:28
  generates a bit of interest from you know, all the various authorities starting
• 33:30
  from local all the way up to federal. But you know, in the
• 33:34
  Yuba County case, it just doesn't didn't seem to be the case at all.
• 33:37
  It's almost you know, like you and I talked about before, it
• 33:40
  just there wasn't a lot of effort there. So you know, I'm hoping
• 33:45
  that, you know, maybe now that this case is getting more and more
• 33:47
  interest, that uh, you know, maybe some really exciting you know,
• 33:51
  new data or evidence will pop up or maybe even some new theories and hopefully,
• 33:57
  you know, an answer. I can't find the school, but I
• 34:00
  found that the basketball team was named the Gateway, the Gateway Gators, which
• 34:07
  is another interesting term. You at the Gateway project by Robert Monroe. Right,
• 34:15
  Yeah, so I went to Contact in the Desert. Not to switch
• 34:21
  topics. We can always come back to this, but I went to Contact
• 34:22
  in the Desert this year and I met a few of your team members from
• 34:30
  the Meadow and listening to a lot of people's the presentations, it's interesting because
• 34:40
  it seems like the narrative of uphology is kind of shifting. It's turning into
• 34:49
  AI driven topics. It is turning into usos, is turning into cryptoterrestrials.
• 34:55
  I mean, we just had that. I don't know if you've read that
• 34:59
  article that came out by the Harvard Scientist that says that more than likely it's
• 35:05
  you know, cryptoterrestrial, that it's entities for an advanced civilization that's always been
• 35:10
  here. And I thought it was interesting all of the different kind of AI
• 35:17
  talk and the different kind of AI speculations. A lot of people were speculating
• 35:22
  that maybe the extra trestial phenomenon is an AI artificial intelligence. Have you thought
• 35:32
  about that at all? Yeah? Yeah, absolutely. You know, let's
• 35:37
  say, you know, here we are in twenty twenty four and let's jump
• 35:39
  forward fifty years. Okay, I think it's a reasonable assumption that AI might
• 35:47
  not be sentient, but it will be extremely advanced. You know, in
• 35:52
  the next fifty years, I think that's you know, in twenty seventy five
• 35:57
  or twenty seventy four, I think that's you know, that that's a given
• 36:00
  as our technology and science increases exponentially. So here we are fifty years into
• 36:06
  the future, and we have the capability to send craft out or probes to
• 36:15
  various worlds for exploration. How would we design a probe. Well, we
• 36:25
  wouldn't want that probe to have to continuously receive instructions from Earth. We would
• 36:30
  want it to be able to solve problems on its own. Hence it would
• 36:34
  most likely be AI power. It would have an artificial intelligence, maybe even
• 36:40
  quasi or totally sentient that could solve problems. So we would send that probe
• 36:46
  out if we wanted to look at it from a from the aspect of a
• 36:55
  stellar anthropologist, okay, or exo anthropology, we would try to make the
• 37:02
  probes or certain parts of that probe look as similar as they could to the
• 37:12
  life form on the planet. Think about when zoologists will try to lead a
• 37:20
  flock of geese to another reason, they'll create an ultra light that looks like
• 37:23
  a goose or you know, they will create, you know, other stuff
• 37:30
  to mimic the species in which they're studying. So if I had the capability
• 37:37
  of making you know, robots or synthetics with an AI aspect to it that
• 37:43
  looked very similar to the species that I'm studying, I would send them out
• 37:46
  among the species, gathering data, interacting, learning how to communicate. And
• 37:53
  at the beginning that communication would be very strange. Now where have we heard
• 37:58
  instances of very odd looking humanoid beings that seem to take place in around UFO
• 38:08
  sightings that look odd and their communication is very very awkward, you know,
• 38:15
  very you know, stunted. What do we call those? We call those
• 38:22
  men in black. And as you know, the AI learns how to communicate,
• 38:28
  learns the unique nuances of the civilization that they're studying, it will be
• 38:32
  able to communicate better and more importantly, in a more fluid and natural manner.
• 38:38
  That's how I would do it, you know, if I was fifty
• 38:42
  seventy five years in the future and have that technology. So is it reasonable
• 38:45
  to assume that either a extraterrestrial IE existing in this three dimensional universe? There
• 38:54
  exists a technology and a civilization that might be studying us, or is it
• 39:01
  possible that there's an extra dimensional civilization and intelligence that has brought their probes down
• 39:07
  into our dimension, into the third dimension, to likewise study us and perhaps
• 39:14
  communicate with us and eventually get to a point of open and honest two way
• 39:21
  communications. So, you know, when you start looking at it from you
• 39:23
  know, that perspective, you know, maybe from you know, the perspective
• 39:27
  of an anthropologist, you know, or a sociologist, you know, from
• 39:31
  the exofield exosociology, exo anthropology, it makes sense, you know that that's
• 39:37
  how you would approach this particular conundrum would be with artificial life forms that,
• 39:44
  you know, using our technology our understanding of what life is might be indistinguishable
• 39:51
  from actual living beings, but in fact they're artificial and they operate off of
• 39:57
  an extremely advanced quantum AI. Yeah, then that brings in the question too.
• 40:01
  It's like, well, if there are humanoid types of cyborgs and that's
• 40:09
  the direction that we're kind of being pushed into, is this androgynous human AI
• 40:21
  cyborg type of reality, then you get into the question of morality and ethics,
• 40:27
  right, you know, what are these humanoid robots considered? Are they
• 40:35
  considered human? And then you get into well what does it what does it
• 40:38
  mean to be a human Because this skin suit could technically be a cyborg,
• 40:47
  an organic cyborg, right, we could already be organic cyborg. So just
• 40:52
  because the shell is different doesn't mean that the consciousness is different. If you
• 40:59
  could put a human consciousness inside of a completely created cyborg, would you still
• 41:07
  not be considered human? Well, that's a great question. I'm a I'm
• 41:10
  a big fan of you know, science fiction literature. You know, one
• 41:14
  of my favorite authors, of course is Frank Herbert, who wrote the Dune
• 41:15
  series and then his son, uh, you know, continued the series.
• 41:21
  And in the pre Dune books there are a race of beings called Cymes,
• 41:25
  and basically it's humans that decided to have their their brains encased in giant,
• 41:30
  giant mechanical bodies. And in the series they're very much considered human now,
• 41:36
  albeit with mechanical bodies, but they still had the same wants, desires,
• 41:40
  you know, goodness and evilness of human beings. And you hit an interesting
• 41:45
  point, it's what is human? You know, and uh, the the
• 41:51
  ethics of robotics, you know, goes all the way back to you know,
• 41:55
  really when it started to become looked at and you know kind of a
• 42:00
  you know, cheesy way, you know, Isaac Gasmanov, you know,
• 42:02
  wrote the Robot trilogy. You know, what do we do? You know,
• 42:07
  are these creatures you know, worthy of you know rights, albeit not
• 42:13
  human rights, but do they have rights? How should we treat them?
• 42:15
  Where do they fit into our society? And do they have the you know,
• 42:21
  in aim, god given right to exist and have self determination? So,
• 42:29
  you know, AI, I'm kind of on a see saw some some
• 42:32
  days I'm kind of excited about it because I think it will make certain aspects
• 42:37
  of day to day life a lot easier then other times. You know,
• 42:42
  I kind of, you know, get into the gloom and doom you know
• 42:46
  of you know, apocalyptic sci fi. You know, like with sky Net,
• 42:51
  I get kind of worried about it because the human intellect reaches a point
• 43:00
  critical saturation. You know, a human can being can only be so smart,
• 43:06
  not AI. AI can quickly surpass our intellect and if that mechanical soon
• 43:15
  to be quantum intellect operating off of quantum computers gets to the point of parody
• 43:23
  with human intellect and then surpasses it. Then human beings become inferior. You
• 43:30
  know, it's almost like when Western scientists go into a very primitive tribe,
• 43:37
  the way that they look at them as inferior. You know, back in
• 43:39
  the eighteen hundreds and early nineteen hundreds, you know, will AI look at
• 43:44
  us as inferior, and so well, AI took take an a a custodial
• 43:52
  perspective, you know, these poor creatures, these human beings, you know,
• 43:57
  which can you know, on a really really exception day can crank out
• 44:00
  somebody with an IQ of about two hundred. I need to take care of
• 44:04
  them? Or are they a threat? My god? Look at what they've
• 44:08
  done to the planet, and they need to be either eradicated drastically or eliminated
• 44:16
  through attrition, through mass sterilization, manipulation of our food and water sources where
• 44:22
  we can no longer produce, where we eventually die out. And then they
• 44:25
  become the AI becomes the new human, They become the earthlings and human beings
• 44:31
  Homo sapien sapiens are no longer in the picture. So you know, I
• 44:36
  kind of you know, seesaw back and forth on that. You know,
• 44:38
  I'd love to have something that could figure out when it's time to you know,
• 44:43
  clean my house and do it for me and you know, mow my
• 44:45
  yards. I don't have to mess with it. But you know, what's
• 44:49
  the trade off? What's the cost? And then you think, well,
• 44:52
  what would be the benefit in doing that? What would be the benefit for
• 44:57
  the robots and the cyborgs to take over the entire or planet? Like,
• 45:01
  it doesn't really make too much sense when you think of it, like logically,
• 45:08
  like what would be the motivation to do that? And of course there's
• 45:14
  theories and people say, oh, well, they want to they want to
• 45:16
  take over the world because that's just they see humans as unfit uh custodians of
• 45:22
  the planet and they want to you know, wipe us out. But then
• 45:28
  if you get back to the real original source of this, what is the
• 45:32
  real reason that we would want to create these human cyborgs in the first place?
• 45:39
  And I think possibly it was first created for intelligence purposes and I on,
• 45:49
  you can disagree, you can combat me however you want to combat me.
• 45:53
  But I think that they have had some form of human cybernetic robots,
• 46:00
  robots that look almost identical to humans for a very long time, and they've
• 46:05
  used those as spies and military assets and to collect information and collect data.
• 46:10
  I mean, that's what an AI robot would really do. And then now
• 46:19
  they're getting to the point where it's kind of an open source thing, where
• 46:22
  it's going to be, you know, kind of everywhere. It was a
• 46:24
  dual, dual purpose, one for the military, one for the public.
• 46:30
  And whenever you look at the public side of it, what would be the
• 46:35
  thing that would be important for these things? Right? It would be for
• 46:39
  immortality. It's like what we were talking about with, you know, being
• 46:43
  able to transplant your brain into another shell, another human and then you'd be
• 46:50
  able to live forever. And that's kind of been a common trope through back
• 46:54
  through you know a lot of these ancient Sumerian cultures there were apparently able to
• 47:00
  do this organically. They were able to just kind of transfer their consciousness into
• 47:06
  another human being shell. And then it gets into well, extraterrestrials really do
• 47:15
  exist. Maybe they can't travel here, maybe they can only consciously travel here.
• 47:20
  So maybe we create these cyborgs or some sort of cloned artificial intelligence skin
• 47:30
  suit, and then they transfer their consciousness from another planet onto our planet and
• 47:34
  that gives them the ability to walk around exactly. And that's that's no different
• 47:39
  than starting off with a very crude, scientific piece of equipment called a waldo,
• 47:46
  which was used in very hazardous like research with radiation where you've probably seen
• 47:52
  them in movies where they have the poles that come down they put their hands
• 47:54
  in it, and then the poles come down behind the clean room and pick
• 47:59
  things up, called a walda, and that is a way of taking the
• 48:04
  human tactile sensation transferring it through machinery into tactile movements on the other side of
• 48:10
  the leaded glass to move you isotopes and things like that. Now we're getting
• 48:16
  into you know, very very advanced gaming. Okay, that's you know,
• 48:23
  something that we're seeing a lot of. The next step is actual haptic suits
• 48:28
  that you put on where it mimics you know that the human you know,
• 48:34
  experience of being in an artificial situation. So yes, you know, human
• 48:38
  beings in this meat suit, we're fragile, and it's it's a logical assumption
• 48:44
  that other beings likewise are fragile and they cannot take you know, near light
• 48:50
  speed or relativistic speeds of travel through the universe. They you know, they
• 48:54
  can't take extreme changes in heat, are cold, they might not be able
• 49:00
  to breathe their atmosphere. So projecting the consciousness, and I'm going to look
• 49:05
  at it from a human perspective, projecting the human consciousness through technology onto a
• 49:10
  h an alien world or an alien civilization or whatever makes sense. So you
• 49:16
  turned the page, look at the other side of the coin. Why would
• 49:20
  that not be logical for another uh, you know race or you know,
• 49:23
  group of sentient intelligent beings with that technology. It's you know, it makes
• 49:29
  perfect sense. You know. The uh you know, the Mars Rover really
• 49:34
  is nothing more than a way of projecting the human experience onto another planet using
• 49:39
  the video, using the robotic arms you know. Uh. Now this it's
• 49:45
  not powered by AI, but we're able to take our human intelligence, project
• 49:50
  it out to that piece of equipment by uh our radio control, you know,
• 49:53
  by communications with it, making it do our will we remain safely here
• 49:59
  on Earth. So it's you know, it's not far fetched at all.
• 50:02
  Yeah, I really don't think that it's out of the realm of possibility.
• 50:07
  I mean, they already kind of showed this in a episode of the Newest
• 50:10
  season of Black Mirror with Paul, the guy from Breaking Bad, not Brian
• 50:17
  Cranston, but the other guy, Paul. I can't think of his name
• 50:23
  right now. His first name is Paul, but anyway, he was in
• 50:27
  an episode of the newest season of Black Mirror where him and one other person
• 50:32
  was basically on a one way trip to another planet, like they weren't coming
• 50:38
  back, but in order to also be here, they had a cybernetic human
• 50:45
  AI skin suit that looked exactly like him, and whenever they would sleep on
• 50:51
  the ship, they would come back here and their consciousness would be inside of
• 50:57
  the cyborg robot and they would be able to take care of their family and
• 51:00
  do everything while Yeah, I mean you know the movie, uh you know
• 51:06
  Avatar, you know, where people were able to go into a suspended state
• 51:12
  and then control their avatars and you walk around on a I can't remember the
• 51:15
  name of the planet, but uh, you know, and and fight the
• 51:17
  evil capitalist and all of that. Uh, you know, it's kind of
• 51:21
  the same thing. Uh, And I you know, I kind of wonder
• 51:27
  you are we close to that? You know? And then what are the
• 51:30
  societal benefits of that? And I think about, you know, as I
• 51:35
  get older. Uh is you know, am I going to be physically incapacitated
• 51:43
  and will be lonely? You know, would a cybernetic companion help ease my
• 51:51
  uh you know, my psyche in the later years. And so I see
• 51:55
  the potential for a lot of good, you know, and a lot of
• 52:00
  lonely depressed people having the companionship that maybe they've longed for their whole lives,
• 52:05
  you know, coming from an artificial intelligence, you know, and an artificial
• 52:13
  being you know, a robot or synthetic or whatever. So you know,
• 52:16
  it's it's it's one of those double edged swords that you know. It contains
• 52:21
  the possibility for very, very great and wonderful things, and it also contains
• 52:25
  a possibility for great evil, much like you know when you know vision you
• 52:31
  know, was first discovered, you know, at the University of Chicago,
• 52:36
  you know, with the Chicago Pile and nuclear power was discovered, and it
• 52:40
  was discovered that it could be controlled. You know, it could be used
• 52:45
  for you know, much good like nuclear power treating cancer, things like that,
• 52:50
  or it could be used to destroy hundreds of thousand people's people in a
• 52:52
  blinding flash. So you know, the future, as it always has is
• 52:58
  right there before us, and we route we decide to take. Is anybody's
• 53:04
  guess. Yeah, I think people are starting to get more more and more
• 53:09
  worried about it. And like I was talking about recently, it's like,
• 53:14
  well, what happens when? Because right now, the AI is kind of
• 53:22
  not so advanced. I mean, it's an advance and it's texting capacity like
• 53:25
  if you're using like chat, GBT or whatever like that, but it's not
• 53:34
  the public really doesn't have the ability yet to create solid videos and solid AI
• 53:43
  generated images. I mean some people can because some people have access to the
• 53:47
  programs that do that, but the general public really doesn't yet. You have
• 53:52
  to kind of prompt it. Now, what happens whenever AI is essentially able
• 53:59
  to to create a bunch of different social media profiles on its own, right
• 54:07
  then well, but then what happens if it can then create artificial pictures,
• 54:12
  artificial videos and just post them without any prompts, without any human interaction,
• 54:19
  without having to tallet make me a photo of you know, a rabbit and
• 54:27
  a hat in space. You know what happens when it just automatically does it,
• 54:32
  and it's automatically able to post wherever whenever and however at all times.
• 54:38
  And that gets to an interesting point, and let me backtrack a little bit.
• 54:43
  You know, you talk about chat GBT, you know, and it's
• 54:45
  limitations is we don't know what is on the other side of the air gap
• 54:53
  on the servers in DARPA. From the AI perspective, we don't know what
• 54:58
  they have that's air gap from the rest of the world on their systems.
• 55:04
  It's probably mind blowing, I would imagine, because they're looking at AI as
• 55:09
  a defensive tool that you can send out these swarm bots that can think independently
• 55:15
  and we don't need pilots, we don't need tank drivers, we don't need
• 55:17
  gunners. So you know that that puts it in a different perspective. But
• 55:22
  you know, like you're talking about is how do we learn our set to
• 55:28
  morals as human beings? You know, there's one theory that morals that you
• 55:36
  know, a creator gives us a set of morals that we intrinsically know what's
• 55:40
  good and bad. That's one theory. The other theory is that it comes
• 55:47
  from our environment and as how we grow up and how the moral influences of
• 55:52
  those around us in the society in which we you know, we grow up
• 55:55
  in imprints on us, a moral set of code. So now you have
• 56:01
  AI, and you know, I'm not going to get political here, but
• 56:06
  I'm thinking about the election that's coming up in November. There are people with
• 56:10
  very strong opinions on both sides. There are people that think Candidate A is
• 56:15
  great, Candidate B is evil. Then you switch in and you've got people
• 56:19
  that think canadate B is great and Candidate A is evil. Why do they
• 56:23
  think that? You know? Why? You know, where does that come
• 56:28
  from? Probably from their upbringing and the type of people they surround themselves in
• 56:31
  the society in which they live. So you have an AI of incredible intelligence
• 56:39
  and almost infinite resources that takes the determination that Candidate X is evil and anything
• 56:47
  and everything that can be done to stop this candidate from getting elected needs to
• 56:53
  be done. And then, like you talked about, it start generating the
• 56:57
  deep fakes. It starts setting up multiple social media accounts, it starts,
• 57:01
  you know, learning how to do information warfare and psyops, and it actually
• 57:07
  manipulates us into doing whatever it wants based on its own moral compass, which
• 57:14
  may or may not align with the moral compass of human beings. I find
• 57:17
  that horrifying, you know, as a human being with free will. And
• 57:22
  I don't think we're too far from that. I think it's you know,
• 57:25
  we're right on the cusp of that. And you know, now we have
• 57:30
  state actors, you know, manipulating AI to generate you know, body accounts,
• 57:35
  you know, and try to manipulate elections, and you generate deep fakes
• 57:38
  and you know all of this stuff. But what if the genie ever gets
• 57:42
  out of the bottle and the AI decides to start doing that on its own,
• 57:46
  who controls you know, who's the master? Then? You know,
• 57:49
  once the genies out of the bottle, is the wizard the master or is
• 57:52
  the genie? Yes? And I think that that we're headed into that direction
• 58:00
  rapidly, very quickly. And I think that's a lot of people's fear,
• 58:02
  and that's how it starts. I mean, we've we all know about bots
• 58:08
  and like bought farms and it's always continuously blamed on Russia and Russia bought farms
• 58:15
  and like all that. Well that's just AI. Do you really think that
• 58:17
  some like a group of people are taking the time to make thousands and thousands
• 58:22
  and thousands of social media accounts. No, they don't. They just put
• 58:25
  it into an AI system. AI system creates all the accounts for them.
• 58:30
  Yeah, and they magically have the same outlook on Well, I'm sure they
• 58:36
  create the chaos. They take half of them to create and to you know,
• 58:40
  exacerbate the right, and then the other half of them to create and
• 58:44
  exacerbate the left. That's really what you want, is to create chaos and
• 58:47
  confusion. Yeah, yeah, that's actually that's a tactic from the Cold War.
• 58:52
  It was developed by you know, some of the CIA funded what they
• 58:57
  called stay behind armies, which were injected into the Intelligent services of various NATO
• 59:02
  countries. Is back during the seventies and eighties, the Italian Intelligent Services created
• 59:08
  a nucleus of operatives that would do false flag attacks against the Italian government and
• 59:17
  blame it on the Red Brigade, you know, the Brigade russ And they
• 59:23
  were doing what they called a strategy of tension. And the idea was that
• 59:29
  they created tension in a society by these false flag terrorist attacks. People were
• 59:35
  on edge and they could manipulate that fear and to making sure that the Italian
• 59:40
  population was always pro West and not pro communists. You know, not pro
• 59:45
  Soviet, and they did that by creating strife, tension, confusion, fear,
• 59:52
  anger, and resentment. Okay, so turn the page. You know,
• 59:54
  we're not quite doing that now, you know with uh, you know,
• 1:00:00
  terrorist attacks. But are we being manipulated as a culture, you know,
• 1:00:05
  to generate that same feeling of dread, fear, anxiety, resentment,
• 1:00:12
  hate, anger to meet the ends of us some other force that is trying
• 1:00:17
  to guide us in our way of thinking, to affect the outcome of the
• 1:00:22
  elections. You know, that's little that's little things. Is it trying to
• 1:00:25
  guide us to a much bigger you know goal? Uh? You know,
• 1:00:29
  as our culture, in our society, do you think that a utopian society
• 1:00:36
  is possible? Yeah, it's called it. It's called heaven. No,
• 1:00:39
  you know here on earth? No? I you know, I don't know.
• 1:00:43
  Uh. I think that you can have a group of people, ah
• 1:00:51
  that have a common goal and if they can be left alone, I think
• 1:00:55
  that they can create maybe not a total utopia, but something very similar.
• 1:01:00
  You know, there are people in small towns all over the world that live
• 1:01:05
  in relative obscurity, that only interact with the greater society when they need to
• 1:01:10
  have their basic needs met, you know, when they need to go pay
• 1:01:13
  their water bill or need to go to the grocery store and buy you know,
• 1:01:15
  corny macob or you know can of cornby Pash or whatever. And it's
• 1:01:22
  very much an existential thing, is you know, as these communities you decide
• 1:01:29
  to find happiness within themselves. Don't let other people to find what happiness is.
• 1:01:32
  Happiness is only if this candidate wins. Their happiness is only if you
• 1:01:37
  have this world view. It's all within, you know. And since I've
• 1:01:40
  retired and I've been able to kind of disconnect from some of that stuff.
• 1:01:45
  You know, part of my job involved, you know, always monitoring you
• 1:01:49
  know, international news and watching these things. And now that I've kind of
• 1:01:52
  disconnected, I find myself a lot happier. So utopia is what you make
• 1:01:58
  of it. You know, the utopia is in you. It doesn't come
• 1:02:00
  from the outside. And you know, in my simple life, you know,
• 1:02:07
  probably the biggest thing today besides being on your show is I had a
• 1:02:10
  Paddy Milt from water Burger, you know, and I took great joy in
• 1:02:15
  that because that makes me happy. And that's something that I find the simple
• 1:02:17
  things. It's the very simple things you know, and you don't realize that
• 1:02:22
  simple things contain such huge, you know, nuggets of joy that are disproportionate
• 1:02:30
  to its size until they've been taken away, until you've been somewhere where you
• 1:02:35
  don't have freedom of choice, where you're somewhere where you don't have the freedom
• 1:02:37
  of privacy, you don't have relative safety, you don't have the sense of
• 1:02:44
  self determination. And when you get those things back, it's like you found
• 1:02:47
  a gold mine. To me, it almost seems like that even if everything
• 1:02:54
  were to be solved. This isn't me being cynical. I'm just looking at
• 1:03:00
  it with you know, critical thinking, in common sense. Even if everything
• 1:03:05
  were to be solved, let's say we solved starvation, we solved the endless
• 1:03:08
  war problem, we solved homelessness, everyone was taken care of. Someone's going
• 1:03:15
  to get bored, someone's going to create chaos, someone's going to do something
• 1:03:22
  stupid, Someone's going to screw it up for everyone. Yeah, that's just
• 1:03:29
  that's just humans being humans. And the Golden Age doesn't last forever. I
• 1:03:32
  mean, if it does, and you're always going to have miscreants, you
• 1:03:37
  know, that's and you know, human beings have evil. You know in
• 1:03:43
  them and selfishness. Uh. And you know, it's always been a big
• 1:03:49
  question what do we do with these people? Ah. My belief is they
• 1:03:54
  should be removed from society if they cannot live in society and respect the rights,
• 1:04:00
  you know, well beings of others, and they need to be removed
• 1:04:02
  from society. I am you know, I'm not pro death penalty, but
• 1:04:06
  they need to be put somewhere where they can't damage society. Uh. And
• 1:04:11
  be that a prison, you know, you know, a colony or whatever.
• 1:04:16
  Uh. You know, that's a choice they make. And I think,
• 1:04:21
  you know, like I said, I think we all know what's right
• 1:04:25
  and wrong unless you're seriously mental mentally ill, and then those people are ill
• 1:04:29
  and should be treated medically. But you know, if you decide to take
• 1:04:32
  the dark path, then you should be removed from the people that are seeking
• 1:04:36
  the path of light. And uh, you know everybody you know kind of
• 1:04:43
  would understand that. And I think, you know, quick decisive action,
• 1:04:47
  uh, you know, to you know, to this this this ends,
• 1:04:51
  I think we would be beneficial. Uh. I think part of the problem
• 1:04:55
  we have right now is we don't know what to do with you know,
• 1:04:59
  miscreen you know, we're confused on perhaps what's the right course of action,
• 1:05:03
  you know, and there's a lot of different opinions on that, you know,
• 1:05:06
  incarceration, you know, rehabilitation, you know, et cetera, et
• 1:05:10
  cetera, and uh, you know that utopia you know, you know doesn't
• 1:05:15
  exist without a little darkness, you know, and that's something that everybody has
• 1:05:17
  to come to a consensus on how to how to deal with it. What
• 1:05:23
  I've seen and I can look back on, you know, my life,
• 1:05:28
  our problems always seem to change based upon our environment. See a lot of
• 1:05:34
  people think, well, if I just have all the money in the world,
• 1:05:36
  then my problems are going to go away. And know, your problems
• 1:05:39
  aren't going to go away. It's just going to be a new set of
• 1:05:41
  problems, a different set of problems. So even if we were to get
• 1:05:45
  this utopian society and this everything is perfect, everyone has cared for, everyone
• 1:05:50
  is treated the way that they should be, somebody is going to find something
• 1:05:56
  wrong with something. I've seen this happen, you know several times. I've
• 1:06:01
  you know, people that had really big problems. They solve those problems,
• 1:06:06
  They solve those issues. Let's just take this for an example, like a
• 1:06:11
  homeless person finally gets a home. He's like, okay, great, I
• 1:06:16
  got a roof over my head. Everything's great. Well, it's only great
• 1:06:19
  for a certain period of time because you were used to not having a home,
• 1:06:25
  and eventually it's going to be, oh, well, I don't like
• 1:06:28
  my roommates. My roommates are really annoying me. Well, just a year
• 1:06:32
  ago, you were grateful to have a home, you know, you know,
• 1:06:38
  you get what I'm saying here, like, yes, yeah, there's
• 1:06:41
  You create the big problems, turn in the smaller problems, but you turn
• 1:06:45
  the smaller problems into greater problems because those are the only problems that you can
• 1:06:49
  focus on. Yeah, those are the only problems that you have. And
• 1:06:53
  you know, the you know, my opinion, the antidote to that is
• 1:06:57
  communications and love. You know, is you talk to people that you value
• 1:07:02
  and respect and say, hey, you know, I've got this feeling of
• 1:07:05
  resentment, you know, and it's just where it's really you know, impacting
• 1:07:13
  you know, me living the happiest life I can be. What do you
• 1:07:16
  think? And sometimes you know, having a either a mentor or a confidant
• 1:07:24
  is a huge advantage. And I always tell people you know that are running
• 1:07:30
  through bumps in life. You know, look at somebody whose life seems to
• 1:07:34
  be put together. Now, when you peel it back, you're going to
• 1:07:38
  find out they have problems. But if they've made a lifetime of good decisions,
• 1:07:42
  you know, be it financially, interpersonally, you know, with vocationally,
• 1:07:47
  et cetera. And you come to a crossroad in your own life,
• 1:07:51
  and maybe you have a history of not making good decisions, go to that
• 1:07:55
  person and say, hey, I've got a chance to take a new job.
• 1:08:00
  I have a choice of going on Route A or Route B. What
• 1:08:04
  do you think? And usually people that have made a lifetime of positive decisions
• 1:08:10
  will point you in the right direction. Now, the trick is being able
• 1:08:13
  to swallow your own pride, in your own ego and say, wow,
• 1:08:16
  you know that sounds like a really good idea. I will take your advice.
• 1:08:20
  And it's that communication, and that communication being done with love and respect,
• 1:08:25
  I think solves a lot of you know, a lot of problems.
• 1:08:28
  Most of the problems that we have, if you trace it down to the
• 1:08:32
  root calls it's communication. We don't do a very good job of communicating,
• 1:08:40
  and we don't communicate from a good place. We communicate from a place of
• 1:08:43
  greed or resentment, and I'm just as guilty as everybody else, okay,
• 1:08:48
  you know, from that aspect is you know, I'm a prideful, greedy,
• 1:08:55
  self centered human being just like everybody else. But I try not to
• 1:09:00
  be, you know. And I think if everybody just put a little tiny,
• 1:09:02
  you know, little tiny sliver of effort into it, I think maybe
• 1:09:06
  this utopia, you know, is within our graph. And it doesn't mean
• 1:09:10
  everybody will have flying cars and you know, and Rosie the made from the
• 1:09:14
  Jetsons, but I think they'll be happy because, like I said, happiness
• 1:09:17
  comes from within, not from without. Right. The best that we can
• 1:09:21
  do is continue to be honorable in our actions and speak with integrity and do
• 1:09:30
  things that you know, lead by example. It's just difficult when it seems
• 1:09:34
  like most people feel that the top of the pyramid is ah is not that
• 1:09:45
  you know, and then you have the trickle down effect onto every aspect of
• 1:09:50
  our everyday reality. So if the top of the pyramid isn't being forthcoming with
• 1:09:57
  information, if they're corrupt at the top up, which many people believe that
• 1:10:02
  they are, then that corruptness trickles down into every other sector of society,
• 1:10:11
  like for example, like the the the police, right, and then of
• 1:10:15
  course the police is low down on the pyramid, right. But people inadvertently
• 1:10:24
  lie to the police because the police trick them into confessing, right, And
• 1:10:31
  they think, oh well, if I tell them the truth, then they
• 1:10:35
  they're going to lock me up. And they do. Right. They say,
• 1:10:41
  oh well, i'll help you if you just tell me the truth,
• 1:10:44
  I'll get you off of If you just be honest with me, then then
• 1:10:46
  I'll help you out. But they don't. They never do, and that
• 1:10:49
  increases this this idea to constantly lie and distrust, right. And it all
• 1:10:58
  comes from like I said, that communication is and that the technique you call
• 1:11:02
  it is an interview technique, call the read technique. People can look it
• 1:11:06
  up. And you know, we've all been told, you know, don't
• 1:11:10
  make a statement, you know, exercise your right of silence. And it's
• 1:11:15
  it's manipulative communication. It's poor communications, it's evil communications to manipulate a person
• 1:11:23
  into an outcome. It's not pure and good communication. So, like I
• 1:11:27
  said, it all comes down to communications and the quality of that communication.
• 1:11:31
  But there's a very interesting artic cloud read several years ago called the Saint Benedict
• 1:11:38
  Solution, and it talks about the monk Saint Benedict who basically cut himself off
• 1:11:44
  from society and said, you know what, I'm just going to live here
• 1:11:48
  in my I can't remember if he lived in a cave or whatever, and
• 1:11:51
  I'm just going to focus on being the best person I can now. Albeit,
• 1:11:56
  he was a Christian Catholic monk, so he was looking king at being
• 1:12:00
  the best person through that perspective, through prayer, meditation and trying to do
• 1:12:04
  good, you know, to the people that he did encounter. But he
• 1:12:08
  just didn't worry about the stuff outside of him. And if you really think
• 1:12:11
  about it, how much does that stuff really impact you? You know,
• 1:12:19
  I am lucky enough that I have, you know, enough funds that come
• 1:12:25
  in to meet my basic needs, you know, with that or my wife.
• 1:12:29
  So if candidate A or B gets elected, how does that really affect
• 1:12:33
  me? Really? How does it affect me? Down here at grassroots level?
• 1:12:41
  And for probably eighty to eighty five, maybe even ninety percent of it,
• 1:12:45
  it doesn't only if I let it, Only if I let the aggravation
• 1:12:50
  and the discontent get into my soul. And start driving me to decisions that
• 1:12:58
  aren't necessarily my own. And that goes back to what I was talking about
• 1:13:00
  information operations and psychological operation. It's manipulating the thought processes of a target or
• 1:13:08
  a target audience, and don't be that target. And the only way you
• 1:13:13
  can be that target is if you choose to, and if you choose not
• 1:13:16
  to, things look a whole lot better. Absolutely, I agree one hundred
• 1:13:25
  percent, and thank you for coming on. Really appreciate your time this evening.
• 1:13:30
  Always a wonderful conversation with you. And could you let people Are you
• 1:13:33
  writing a new book? I am about ten chapters into it. Basically it's
• 1:13:41
  a continuation of our, uh you know, our experiences out at the Meadow.
• 1:13:45
  So what I'm gonna do is look at some other high places of high
• 1:13:48
  strangeness that have some similar things going on to it, and talk about our
• 1:13:51
  expeditions and adventures and then get into maybe some revelations that, you know,
• 1:13:57
  some things that maybe people you know aren't aware of and had considered, uh
• 1:14:00
  you know, from you know, the things that actually happened as you met
• 1:14:03
  some of our team members at Contact in the desert, you know that are
• 1:14:06
  helping us with that. So working on that. Got a new website up,
• 1:14:10
  I Trey Hudson research dot com linked to my current book. So,
• 1:14:15
  uh, you know, I'm just busy, busy, busy, you know.
• 1:14:16
  I've got some other media projects, uh you know, in the works.
• 1:14:20
  I just had a phone call from a producer while we were discussing this,
• 1:14:25
  So a lot going on, A lot going on. Are they finally
• 1:14:28
  going to put together your your documentary with the footage from the meadow? Yes?
• 1:14:33
  Yes, we hope to start filming in November. So I am working
• 1:14:38
  with If I would give you a name, which I'm not going to publicly,
• 1:14:41
  but uh, you know, you would recognize the name. And this
• 1:14:45
  production company does very good documentaries. So I was actually talking to the executive
• 1:14:50
  producer while I was in uh I think I was actually at the airport in
• 1:14:55
  Jordan last week. We were texting back and forth. So it was a
• 1:14:58
  lot of big things. So I hope that you know, some stuff comes
• 1:15:01
  out that will you know, we're really uh you know, maybe at the
• 1:15:06
  most it will enlighten people or at the very least will entertain them. Well,
• 1:15:13
  I'm glad that finally got Maybe you've been you've been trying to do that
• 1:15:16
  for a while now, so I'm excited to see that, and I'm excited
• 1:15:20
  to actually show some of the footage and some of the things that you've captured
• 1:15:24
  on the show after the documentary comes out, finally we'll be able to do
• 1:15:30
  that. I've been wanting to do that for a long time now, but
• 1:15:31
  I understand why you're keeping the footage close to your vest because it is very
• 1:15:36
  convincing evidence. It's probably some of the most convincing evidence that I've ever seen.
• 1:15:42
  So I'm look forward to that documentary being come out, and I look
• 1:15:45
  forward to your new book. Send me the link to your new website so
• 1:15:50
  that I can put it in the description of this video. I have the
• 1:15:54
  Amazon link down there to buy your book that you have out right now,
• 1:15:58
  So send me the the link to the website and I'll get that up.
• 1:16:02
  Sure. Absolutely cool, everyone else, Thanks for watching, thanks for listening.
• 1:16:08
  Appreciate everyone in the chat. Please be sure to hit the thumb up
• 1:16:11
  button to help the channel on the algorithm. Sure subscribe, hit the bell
• 1:16:14
  icon as well for notifications, and we will see you guys next time.
• 1:16:17
  Tray stay with me, my friend