Latest / WoT Spoilers / Just Before Dawn, Entering Home, & Business in the City - New Spring ch11-13 - EP586

Transcript

Just Before Dawn, Entering Home, & Business in the City - New Spring ch11-13 - EP586 · WoT Spoilers

0:12
Speaker 1: This is the Wheel of Time Spoilers podcast.
0:22
Speaker 2: It's like having a product announcement and being like, oh, yeah,
0:24
Speaker 2: we have an idea for a product, you don't announce it.
0:26
Speaker 1: Then a lot of people are these days. It seems
0:29
Speaker 1: to be working great for grifters. Maybe we should try that,
0:31
Speaker 1: Maybe we should grift. Maybe we should not have morals
0:34
Speaker 1: and just start grifting.
0:35
Speaker 2: Do we need to announce podcasts, get funding for them,
0:37
Speaker 2: and then never make them.
0:39
Speaker 1: I mean, apparently that's the only way we're going to
0:41
Speaker 1: be able to save for retirement in this economy.
0:45
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm saving for retirement. I'm just not sure
0:46
Speaker 2: it's going to be worth anything by the time I retire.
0:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm stalking up on beans because they don't they
0:52
Speaker 1: don't have They're not quite so volatile in terms of
0:54
Speaker 1: their value to me. Just beans.
0:58
Speaker 2: They are consumable.
1:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, they have the same amount of calories in them
1:02
Speaker 1: this week as they did last week. You know, they're beans,
1:06
Speaker 1: not like dollars.
1:08
Speaker 2: Listen, we promised we're going to do a final podcast
1:12
Speaker 2: on the Wheel of Time. We definitely need are going
1:14
Speaker 2: to do a memory Light. We just need everyone to
1:16
Speaker 2: support us on Patreon for a couple of Decades first,
1:20
Speaker 2: and then we're going to go ahead and have that
1:22
Speaker 2: come out.
1:23
Speaker 1: I mean that would be one way to delay the
1:25
Speaker 1: inevitable anguish of actually finishing the project.
1:28
Speaker 2: Never finish it. Be like, oh, yeah, no, we're totally
1:31
Speaker 2: going to do a Memory of Light.
1:33
Speaker 1: Just have to do this other book series, this other book.
1:37
Speaker 2: We have to make a TV show really quick, a
1:40
Speaker 2: couple of short stories, raise money for charity.
1:44
Speaker 1: Screenplay trip to Antarctica for some unexplicable reason. Athlon By
1:50
Speaker 1: the time you actually posted that podcast, it will be
1:52
Speaker 1: more like a Forgetfulness of Light.
1:56
Speaker 2: Yeah. In a lot of ways we are. We're like, oh,
1:57
Speaker 2: we're gonna throw the prequel in the like. There is
2:00
Speaker 2: a little bit of that, like not wanting to finish
2:03
Speaker 2: it and doing this other prequel first, But the prequel
2:06
Speaker 2: had to get done.
2:06
Speaker 1: I think we're allowed one side step before it gets weird,
2:10
Speaker 1: And the.
2:10
Speaker 2: Prequel's part of the series. We've always intended to do
2:12
Speaker 2: it as part of the journey. It just was was
2:14
Speaker 2: a question of when.
2:15
Speaker 1: But also now we've gone from we're gonna do it
2:17
Speaker 1: in five episodes, so we have to do like three
2:19
Speaker 1: chapters per episode.
2:20
Speaker 2: Oh my god, what was I thinking?
2:24
Speaker 1: Thinking it. We were both we're both idiots.
2:26
Speaker 2: I'm reading through this going, oh, just not much is happening.
2:29
Speaker 2: It's just it's just backstort. There's so much going on
2:34
Speaker 2: in every Jordan sentence. I've been lulled into a false
2:39
Speaker 2: sense of compliancy by the sandersenness of these last two books.
2:44
Speaker 2: I mean it's just been could you stop cramming so
2:50
Speaker 2: much meaning in one sentence, Jordan? It's really frustrating, and
2:55
Speaker 2: when I'm trying to go through quickly. So yeah, we're
2:58
Speaker 2: down to three chapters per episode, and I think we're
3:02
Speaker 2: gonna try and stick with that.
3:03
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I there goes our plans thoroughly check.
3:11
Speaker 2: The best laid plans of Rats and Forsaken.
3:14
Speaker 3: There we go, there we go, and then and then
3:18
Speaker 3: something something dragon step forward.
3:21
Speaker 1: Profit that's all I'm under sad. So on that note,
3:25
Speaker 1: should we crack open the book and start with chapter eleven,
3:31
Speaker 1: just before dawn.
3:32
Speaker 2: Just before we start? Yeah, okay, yeah, just before dawn.
3:35
Speaker 1: And our symbol is the flame of Tarvallin, because this
3:39
Speaker 1: is the raising of the sisters to the Shawl, which
3:42
Speaker 1: is obviously going to be a flame thing.
3:44
Speaker 2: So it's a ceremony thing.
3:46
Speaker 1: By the light of a single lamp and the low
3:48
Speaker 1: fire on her narrow hearth, Moraine dressed herself carefully, making
3:52
Speaker 1: an effort to stifle her yawns. It needed effort. A
3:56
Speaker 1: night of contemplation meant a night of no sleep. Her
3:58
Speaker 1: eyes were grainy, her limbs leaden well. Sleep would have
4:02
Speaker 1: been beyond her in any case, simply because of what
4:05
Speaker 1: lay ahead this morning. Oh why had she not argued
4:08
Speaker 1: Swan out of that mad prank? It was a question
4:11
Speaker 1: she had asked herself often during the night, and as
4:13
Speaker 1: foolish this time as the first. She rarely won arguments
4:16
Speaker 1: with Swan. If only Swan were here with her now,
4:20
Speaker 1: contemplating the burdens and duties of an eye to die
4:22
Speaker 1: turned inevitably to the task Marine meant to take up,
4:25
Speaker 1: and the scale of that search had loomed larger and
4:28
Speaker 1: larger as the night went on, until it reared before
4:30
Speaker 1: her like unscalable dragon Mount itself. Company would have helped,
4:35
Speaker 1: but the ritual was explicit. Each must be alone when
4:38
Speaker 1: they came for her missteps now brought no penalties beyond
4:41
Speaker 1: embarrassment and likely a reputation as flighty dunces that they
4:44
Speaker 1: might never shake off. Of course, they might have already
4:47
Speaker 1: achieved that reputation, yet it had seemed best to be
4:50
Speaker 1: beyond reproach as far as they could cut it there.
4:53
Speaker 1: I just liked those first two paragraphs.
4:56
Speaker 2: Beyond reproach as far as they could They just did
4:58
Speaker 2: a major prank and got spanked for it.
5:02
Speaker 1: Yeah, aren't they like the only sisters in living memory
5:04
Speaker 1: who have been raised to the Shawl while still underpendan
5:07
Speaker 1: smarting from their last acceptance spanking? Pseudo accepted spanking at that.
5:13
Speaker 2: No, she doesn't think it explicitly here, but we do
5:15
Speaker 2: know that she was one hundred percent spanked right and punished.
5:20
Speaker 2: Do you remember how we know?
5:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, we get that information later in the book. I
5:24
Speaker 1: think someone says it. I think when kat Swain is
5:28
Speaker 1: interrogating their existence as freshly minted sisters.
5:31
Speaker 2: Got it.
5:31
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure that's where it is. But yeah, it's
5:34
Speaker 1: That's part of why they didn't get any rest was
5:36
Speaker 1: because they were getting spanked after sneaking around and putting
5:40
Speaker 1: mice in the light OF's bed Ohlida.
5:42
Speaker 2: Never again would Elida be able to make her quail.
5:47
Speaker 2: I mean not really.
5:49
Speaker 1: She makes Moraine quail a lot less than Swan in fairness.
5:52
Speaker 2: Exactly, Yeah, just because Moraine's not like there, right, except
5:57
Speaker 2: like by the time a lighta' is uh in right.
6:01
Speaker 2: I think Moraine's basically she's off doing her thing and
6:05
Speaker 2: then she ends up in an alternate to mention.
6:07
Speaker 1: Moraine learns about the deposition shortly before going through the
6:10
Speaker 1: red Stone doorway, so she thinks that Swan is dead
6:14
Speaker 1: surely before she goes into her pseudo.
6:16
Speaker 2: Death, which yeah, it would be nice, man.
6:19
Speaker 1: I do think she does kind of twitch a little
6:21
Speaker 1: bit when Rand mentions having a run in with the
6:24
Speaker 1: and dooran Queen's As said I advisor, I think that
6:27
Speaker 1: she does give a wee bit of a twitch at that,
6:31
Speaker 1: like back in the day, back in either world. I'm
6:36
Speaker 1: pretty sure that she's like, you ran into Alidah huh okay, yeah,
6:39
Speaker 1: we gotta go, Yeah, we gotta go now.
6:43
Speaker 2: That's almost more urgent than the Troliks and the murdraw
6:46
Speaker 2: finding him, right, like, knowing what we know about Alida.
6:49
Speaker 1: Yeah, and she's cool and chill about it, and we
6:51
Speaker 1: assume as first time readers that it's just Isidai in general.
6:55
Speaker 1: But when you read this, you're like, oh, her urgency
6:57
Speaker 1: to get out of Dodge when she learned that Rand
7:00
Speaker 1: caught Alida's attention, Like that was personal, that was personal, But.
7:04
Speaker 2: Everything's personal in these books. She keeps like everything from
7:07
Speaker 2: Tom to Alida to the Green Man, she's met them
7:12
Speaker 2: all before.
7:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, she probably has not met or heard of Tom
7:19
Speaker 1: at this point.
7:21
Speaker 2: Not at this point.
7:21
Speaker 1: No, at this point in her life, because.
7:25
Speaker 2: I would disagree with that. I would disagree with that
7:27
Speaker 2: because he's how long has he been. He was in
7:30
Speaker 2: the court for a while as an attendant, and we
7:34
Speaker 2: decided that that would overlap with her time before she
7:37
Speaker 2: went to the White Tower.
7:39
Speaker 1: He was the barred attached to the House of track
7:43
Speaker 1: Cand before it ascended to the throne. He was not
7:46
Speaker 1: with the throne before track Cand came to it. He
7:49
Speaker 1: helped her get the throne.
7:51
Speaker 2: No, but she's been she's had the throne now for
7:54
Speaker 2: a while.
7:54
Speaker 1: And yes, so we're Morgays has been queen for like
7:58
Speaker 1: two years at the point. So Tom's definitely super around
8:03
Speaker 1: and super known as a quantity. And Moraine's been in
8:07
Speaker 1: the tower for like seven years, so he's risen to
8:10
Speaker 1: his political prominence while she was cloistered away because trekand
8:15
Speaker 1: wouldn't have been relevant to a teenager in Kyrine back
8:19
Speaker 1: before she went to the Tower trekand was a relatively
8:23
Speaker 1: minor house at that point in the timeline. And his
8:27
Speaker 1: cousin has not been killed yet, right Owen has not
8:31
Speaker 1: manifested channeling yet or is just starting to manifest channeling.
8:36
Speaker 1: He hasn't been killed by the Reds yet. Tom hasn't
8:38
Speaker 1: had his falling out with Moraine yet or with more
8:41
Speaker 1: Gaze yet. Nephew, Sorry, I forget what I said, Thank you, chat.
8:47
Speaker 1: I appreciate that Tom's nephew has not manifested channeling and
8:52
Speaker 1: getting targeted by the Reds.
8:55
Speaker 2: So just Moraine went to the Tower in nine seventy two,
9:00
Speaker 2: more Gasee took over Kanlin in nine seventy six, four
9:04
Speaker 2: years later.
9:05
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I'm gonna assume that Moraine has no particular
9:09
Speaker 1: reason to know of Tom at this point and comes
9:11
Speaker 1: across him in the course of her gallivanting about as
9:16
Speaker 1: an eye to die and searching incognito for stuff. I
9:20
Speaker 1: don't see any reason for them to have known of
9:24
Speaker 1: each other before, especially with the age gap, like she
9:27
Speaker 1: would have just been too much of a kid back
9:30
Speaker 1: before you.
9:31
Speaker 2: Know, yeah, but I have a hard time believing she
9:33
Speaker 2: doesn't know anything about the politics of Camlin at this
9:37
Speaker 2: point and doesn't know about the Queen. She certainly knows
9:41
Speaker 2: about more Gaze right being the queen. Oh sure, yeah, yeah, yeah,
9:44
Speaker 2: and probably keeps track of most of the nobles. I'm
9:46
Speaker 2: not sure if she'd know of the Bard.
9:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, she might know that there is a Bard, but
9:50
Speaker 1: like not what his name is or what he looks like.
9:52
Speaker 1: And likewise he wouldn't have any reason to know of
9:55
Speaker 1: one of the Damna Dread sisters that's off in the
9:58
Speaker 1: White Tower just.
10:00
Speaker 2: Like No, absolutely Tom knows about all the nobility of Camelin,
10:04
Speaker 2: including the sisters.
10:05
Speaker 1: She's not of Camlin. She's Kyrie Kyrie. Sorry, and I'm
10:09
Speaker 1: just saying I don't think he would know her to
10:10
Speaker 1: look at her right and then in the kyrine in court,
10:14
Speaker 1: like he has no reason to care about that particular
10:17
Speaker 1: branch of the Damadred family beyond just like knowing she exists.
10:20
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, but I would say that if if someone
10:24
Speaker 2: said to Tom at this moment, are you aware of
10:27
Speaker 2: more Gayze trick hand of Kyrie Anne the isid Ie
10:31
Speaker 2: in training.
10:31
Speaker 1: Maureen Damadred of Kyrie. What did I say, more gaysee trickand.
10:37
Speaker 2: Names are hard. I'm looking at more gayst track cand
10:40
Speaker 2: on screen. That's yeah. Yeah, So no, I'm.
10:42
Speaker 1: Sure he would have known of her, but like, I
10:45
Speaker 1: don't think he would. I don't think they would know
10:47
Speaker 1: each other to see each other when and I of
10:48
Speaker 1: the world, right, they look at each other and like, oh,
10:50
Speaker 1: I know who that is. Like, I don't think that
10:52
Speaker 1: would happen now. I think that knowledge has to be
10:54
Speaker 1: accumulated between now and I of the world.
10:57
Speaker 2: Well, but see, they use the real names in either world,
11:00
Speaker 2: so they don't have to recognize each other by visually,
11:03
Speaker 2: they knew each other's names.
11:05
Speaker 1: Maybe it was brought to his attention when the White
11:07
Speaker 1: Tower was trying to position her to take the throne.
11:09
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna go ahead and head Cannon that this
11:12
Speaker 1: is around the time when he becomes aware of her
11:14
Speaker 1: as more than just like a spot on a family tree.
11:18
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, she's sort of, at least in this moment,
11:21
Speaker 2: in everybody's eyes, a player.
11:23
Speaker 1: And so he's going to hear about people being upset
11:25
Speaker 1: that they can't get her and manipulate her onto the throne.
11:27
Speaker 1: He's gonna hear about eyes to die scrambling to find
11:30
Speaker 1: someone who will do in the lack of her, Right,
11:35
Speaker 1: he's going to hear about that and be some amount
11:39
Speaker 1: more interested in who she is. All right, So she's
11:43
Speaker 1: kind of preparing to move out of the room, right,
11:46
Speaker 1: leaving her clothes behind to be recycled into the White
11:49
Speaker 1: Tower's endless store of clothes. Almost wonder if this is
11:52
Speaker 1: the dress that Agwayn ends up wearing twenty years.
11:54
Speaker 2: Later, right, because oh yeah, that's fine.
11:56
Speaker 1: The tiny little women. And she's like, hey, yeah, not
11:59
Speaker 1: many in my current class or getting where close to
12:00
Speaker 1: my size, so maybe someday someone will come along. And
12:03
Speaker 1: Agwain is described as being quite short.
12:05
Speaker 2: And I'm assuming that all this stuff goes into storage
12:08
Speaker 2: under a keeping, because it's like how it would rot
12:10
Speaker 2: if they didn't. But it's all magically stored, so it's
12:12
Speaker 2: fine to stay for centuries.
12:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, keepings aren't new weaves. Yeah, they've had keepings for
12:19
Speaker 1: a long time, so yeah, I would assume so that
12:22
Speaker 1: you have the storerooms where they put this stuff for
12:25
Speaker 1: you under a keeping.
12:26
Speaker 2: Just look at Alida, who does it to flowers right,
12:29
Speaker 2: to keep them right, right?
12:30
Speaker 1: Right?
12:31
Speaker 2: Yeah.
12:31
Speaker 1: I watched a video recently of a woman who is like,
12:34
Speaker 1: I want to grow a dress, so she starts with
12:37
Speaker 1: sewing flax into the ground.
12:39
Speaker 2: I saw, I've seen all those. Yeah.
12:40
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's this is a world where that's how you
12:43
Speaker 1: get clothes.
12:45
Speaker 2: Right.
12:45
Speaker 1: You don't just throw a garment away because it's a
12:49
Speaker 1: little damaged or a little stained, a little torn, a
12:51
Speaker 1: little bit worn out, like no, no, no, you repair
12:54
Speaker 1: that shit. You clean it very carefully, and you save
12:57
Speaker 1: it for the next person.
12:58
Speaker 2: And if you're pouring on the street, you have one
13:00
Speaker 2: set of clothing, maybe two.
13:02
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you'll put clothes in your will because they
13:05
Speaker 1: are expensive and sturdy. It's kind of a big deal.
13:10
Speaker 1: The whole dressmaker sequence in this. You always have to
13:14
Speaker 1: remember that every piece of fabric has to be manufactured
13:18
Speaker 1: by hand, every single step of the way. There is
13:21
Speaker 1: maybe they've got water looms, but they don't have power looms.
13:25
Speaker 1: They don't have spinning Jenny's, they don't have sewing machines.
13:28
Speaker 1: Like so many of the steps you need to make
13:30
Speaker 1: a dress are being done with human power. Maybe a
13:33
Speaker 1: bit of water wheels if someone's very clever.
13:36
Speaker 2: I mean, there's still at the point in civilization where
13:38
Speaker 2: you're trying to take care of your three main needs food, shelter, clothing,
13:44
Speaker 2: and most of the labor of everyone in this world
13:47
Speaker 2: is going towards one of those three things. Most people
13:49
Speaker 2: are farmers. The people who aren't farmers are working on
13:51
Speaker 2: making clothes. The people aren't working on making clothes are
13:55
Speaker 2: probably oh gear, building homes, you know, And they've got
13:58
Speaker 2: a little bit with the magic class that kind of
14:00
Speaker 2: exists above that, with the I said eye and a
14:02
Speaker 2: few other people. But yeah, most people's labor I mean
14:05
Speaker 2: that or war, I suppose well, And.
14:08
Speaker 1: Of course the emerging class that comes out of having
14:13
Speaker 1: those things actually working to at scale. Bureaucrats people that
14:17
Speaker 1: do the accounting, do the tax collection, and control the
14:21
Speaker 1: flow of resources. So that way, winter does not mean famine.
14:24
Speaker 2: But that's an extra shrinking percentage of the population. As
14:28
Speaker 2: governments and cities lose ground, right, more and more of
14:34
Speaker 2: the world is being just farmed by people who aren't
14:36
Speaker 2: part of any nation. They're just out in the wilderness
14:39
Speaker 2: trying to farm, right.
14:40
Speaker 1: Yeah, And also yeah, governments, right, that's the other small
14:44
Speaker 1: class of people that tries to exist and justify its existence.
14:48
Speaker 2: And yeah, Avalon says the educated class, and I'd say
14:51
Speaker 2: they basically don't exist, right, They're basically the nobles at
14:53
Speaker 2: this point.
14:54
Speaker 1: Right now, the educated class is a nice figment of
14:57
Speaker 1: a bygone era, right, that existed in the age of Leo,
15:00
Speaker 1: just because people had utopian technology and thus they had
15:02
Speaker 1: the leisure time to be at that scale of education.
15:07
Speaker 1: And Rand wants to bring that back by starting those schools.
15:09
Speaker 1: But it's not a class that exists currently, Like you said,
15:12
Speaker 1: it's education is limited to the wealthy class, which is yeah,
15:16
Speaker 1: the people that can justify being on top of a
15:18
Speaker 1: pyramid of people who are you know, eking value out
15:21
Speaker 1: of the dirt by making food or clothing.
15:24
Speaker 2: And there's always been that smaller elite class. But when
15:27
Speaker 2: you're talking about percentage of population, right, like, it's such
15:30
Speaker 2: a small percentage of the population. People who aren't farmers,
15:33
Speaker 2: seam sources, weavers, man weavers, builders, right like the people
15:39
Speaker 2: who are blacksmiths. Right, everybody goes to work every day
15:42
Speaker 2: to make the things you need to live.
15:44
Speaker 1: But isaid I are one and a half percent of
15:47
Speaker 1: the population, and so they have large wardrobes full of clothes,
15:52
Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera.
15:53
Speaker 2: I would say they're not even one half percent of
15:55
Speaker 2: the population.
15:56
Speaker 1: The channeling is one and a half percent of the population.
15:59
Speaker 1: So isaid I is what point one percent of the population.
16:04
Speaker 2: I mean we're talking a thousand is SIDI across the
16:08
Speaker 2: population of I mean there's got to be millions of
16:11
Speaker 2: people across rand Land.
16:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'd say probably less than ten million, but millions
16:17
Speaker 1: for sure.
16:18
Speaker 2: So let's see call it ten million. Sure, divide that
16:22
Speaker 2: by one thousand, right, I can do that in my head. No,
16:26
Speaker 2: I can't. Ten million. Divide that by one thousand. That's
16:33
Speaker 2: one in ten thousand. So that's point zero zero zero
16:39
Speaker 2: zero one percent of the population. Yeah, that's insignificant.
16:44
Speaker 1: A rounding error. Yeah, let's a small rounding error. That
16:48
Speaker 1: is just noise in your signal.
16:50
Speaker 2: I mean in the same way that we have like
16:52
Speaker 2: a thousand billionaires, right probably in the US, give or take.
16:55
Speaker 2: It's a similar level of power.
16:57
Speaker 1: And we have more than ten million people in the world. Yeah, right,
17:00
Speaker 1: more than ten million people in the US.
17:02
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, but on a scale of the US
17:04
Speaker 2: that that I think that's about a similar ratio the
17:06
Speaker 2: number of isid I to population. It's probably billionaires to
17:12
Speaker 2: our current population. Awkward, right, I mean, but do you
17:16
Speaker 2: give you the level of like how powerful aid I are.
17:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, for sure. So all that to say Moraine
17:22
Speaker 1: is not going to be allowed to waste that accept address.
17:25
Speaker 1: That's all that to say.
17:27
Speaker 2: There are nine hundred and sixty two billionaires in the
17:29
Speaker 2: US as of according to Google, which is almost exactly
17:32
Speaker 2: the number of Isidi in the town. Wow. Now we
17:35
Speaker 2: have a bigger population, but still, yeah.
17:37
Speaker 1: We have more than ten million people. I'm not good
17:39
Speaker 1: at knowing number of things, but I'm pretty sure that
17:41
Speaker 1: that's a thing that I'm confident about, speaking of numbers.
17:45
Speaker 1: Seven isid I arrive in the night early morning technically,
17:50
Speaker 1: and they collect her and Swan and take them down
17:54
Speaker 1: into the same chamber where they went through the test,
17:56
Speaker 1: but now it's a ritual instead of a test, and
17:59
Speaker 1: it's all very ceremonial and all seven odds are represented
18:02
Speaker 1: at all that good stuff, And.
18:03
Speaker 2: They do this step through the oval. It's the same
18:05
Speaker 2: oval they step through mat but now it's not magically enhanced,
18:07
Speaker 2: so it's just like stepping through the red twisted gateway
18:11
Speaker 2: the second time.
18:12
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a symbolic stepping through the arch like you
18:14
Speaker 1: stepped into the arch and went through the test, and now,
18:17
Speaker 1: but then you come back out that same side. Right
18:19
Speaker 1: now you get to symbolically show that you've gone through
18:23
Speaker 1: the test. But yeah, stepping through the arch.
18:25
Speaker 2: I honestly didn't have a whole lot to say about
18:28
Speaker 2: the ceremony. It's it's a raising ceremony, which is which
18:32
Speaker 2: is pretty cool. Glad to see it on screen. Glad
18:34
Speaker 2: we got the three oaths. It's kind of fun to
18:36
Speaker 2: see her and Moraine trading off who goes first in
18:39
Speaker 2: the various aspects of the ceremony that they can't do
18:42
Speaker 2: at the same time. I enjoyed that.
18:44
Speaker 1: Yeah, I really like how they worked out how they
18:46
Speaker 1: could make this ceremony as synchronous as possible, and they
18:51
Speaker 1: really do this as tightly together as they can. They're
18:54
Speaker 1: really good friends and they don't want to become ice
18:58
Speaker 1: to die with anything marking a different It's between them, right,
19:01
Speaker 1: That's why they want to do it so tightly, and
19:02
Speaker 1: Tamra rolls with it. Tom's like, okay, sure, I'll raise
19:06
Speaker 1: two of you at once, that's fine. But yeah, the
19:08
Speaker 1: ceremony is beautiful and formal, and we've seen it before.
19:13
Speaker 1: You know with other you know, when ninive gets raised.
19:17
Speaker 1: Although that one's weird, right, this is seeing how it's
19:19
Speaker 1: done normally, albeit two women at the same time, but
19:22
Speaker 1: this is the traditional form.
19:24
Speaker 2: It kind of makes me go, how is the light
19:26
Speaker 2: of the only one that remembers these two were best friends?
19:28
Speaker 2: When this is how right? Right? Seriously is a light
19:34
Speaker 2: of the only one that's left alive?
19:36
Speaker 4: You know?
19:36
Speaker 2: Because none of these names pop up again, someone the
19:39
Speaker 2: know You're.
19:39
Speaker 1: Right, Varn's there and she's like, oh I remember, because
19:42
Speaker 1: I yeah. Yeah, it's the whole idea that is said,
19:46
Speaker 1: I have like a statute of limitations on remembering things.
19:49
Speaker 3: It's just hilarious, especially for how long they live, right, exactly,
19:54
Speaker 3: like for most of these teachers, I said, I with
19:56
Speaker 3: these two doing pranks together, twenty years is nothing.
20:00
Speaker 2: They would have remembered them being best buddies like it
20:02
Speaker 2: was yesterday.
20:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, And like a lot of eyes to Die are like,
20:06
Speaker 1: oh yeah, I remember that. Like there's this weird assumption
20:09
Speaker 1: at the beginning that no one remembers, and it turns
20:11
Speaker 1: out like a good third of the eyes to die
20:13
Speaker 1: that are ever relevant, like totally remember. It's lots of
20:16
Speaker 1: people remember, but Yeah, they experience the oaths, and we
20:20
Speaker 1: learned that it will take a year for the feeling
20:22
Speaker 1: to ease off. So remember, for the whole rest of
20:24
Speaker 1: the book, Swan and Morin are always some degree of
20:27
Speaker 1: uncomfortable from the tightness of the oaths.
20:29
Speaker 2: It is interesting how healing helps with that, because it's
20:32
Speaker 2: like you're being squished, but you can be healed from
20:35
Speaker 2: being squished.
20:36
Speaker 1: I'm guessing that the squishing feeling causes some inflammation that
20:40
Speaker 1: can be healed. I'm guessing it's like a secondary effect
20:43
Speaker 1: that can be eased.
20:44
Speaker 2: I'm sort of imagining like a little bit of post
20:46
Speaker 2: plastic surgery like swelling.
20:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was thinking post surgery swelling also. Yeah, but
20:51
Speaker 1: it's just like a very subtle thing, like all like
20:53
Speaker 1: in your dermis layer or something, and so yeah, a
20:56
Speaker 1: little wash of healing eases it. We get some commentary
21:00
Speaker 1: from Varren on the different ajas, and then yeah, we
21:06
Speaker 1: get to move into the blue aja specific welcoming right,
21:10
Speaker 1: like they pick the blue and so then all the
21:11
Speaker 1: other adjas leave and the Ombrelin leaves, and now only
21:16
Speaker 1: the keeper remains to witness because she is still technically
21:19
Speaker 1: kind of blue.
21:20
Speaker 2: The Keeper gets to stay blue. The keeper gets to
21:22
Speaker 2: keep their aja. Right, because they get to stay, they
21:25
Speaker 2: keep their stole.
21:25
Speaker 1: That's one color, right, I'm guessing because when the Omrelin dies,
21:29
Speaker 1: it's not like the keeper is executed, you know, she's
21:32
Speaker 1: not like forced to die along with the ombrelind. She
21:35
Speaker 1: gets to you know, go back to being a regular
21:37
Speaker 1: eye to die in her aja. She's not stripped out
21:40
Speaker 1: of it forever like in the ordinary course of things,
21:43
Speaker 1: not in the way that it happens in the books
21:44
Speaker 1: as we see it go down, because.
21:46
Speaker 2: They keep getting murdered at the same time.
21:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that's different. But yeah, now we get the
21:51
Speaker 1: blue specific stuff. So we get the you know, welcome home, sister,
21:55
Speaker 1: We've waited long for you, which I feel like kind
21:57
Speaker 1: of from is like how the wise Ones welcome back.
22:01
Speaker 1: The newly minted wise ones are like, when you come back,
22:05
Speaker 1: we will welcome you as a sister long departed.
22:08
Speaker 3: Right.
22:08
Speaker 1: It's very parallel in that way. And then we get
22:12
Speaker 1: you know, ceremony. Ceremony. You each owe me a pie
22:15
Speaker 1: made with your own hands. It is customary among us
22:17
Speaker 1: for the sixth Sisters, who gives you the welcome kiss.
22:20
Speaker 1: It slides from ceremonial to friendly and jovial and teasing
22:24
Speaker 1: just seamlessly, and I love it. There's a definitely a sisterhood,
22:29
Speaker 1: a family, A we aren't always going to stand on
22:32
Speaker 1: ceremony and eyes to die formalness. We actually have real
22:35
Speaker 1: human experiences behind the shawl, which.
22:37
Speaker 2: I feel like is not the case with all of
22:39
Speaker 2: the odd jaws.
22:40
Speaker 1: No, the blue and the green do seem like the
22:42
Speaker 1: much more and the brown, so that the much more
22:44
Speaker 1: cozy homie adjas feast. The red seems to be always
22:47
Speaker 1: so the red and the white are always white or yeah,
22:52
Speaker 1: the yellows probably pretty chill. Really is just the red
22:55
Speaker 1: and the white? Probably the gray? I bet the gray
22:58
Speaker 1: are very annoying.
22:59
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, the gray is government class all over again,
23:02
Speaker 2: you know, like debate.
23:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, like they never turn off. No, but the Funajas
23:08
Speaker 1: are cozy and homey, and yeah, the Blues have people
23:11
Speaker 1: like Anaya, right, who's just so much mother energy that. Yeah,
23:16
Speaker 1: the Blues are a family sorority rather than a really competitive,
23:20
Speaker 1: cutthroat beauty pageant sorority.
23:22
Speaker 2: And they're greeted by Leanne and Raffella because those are
23:27
Speaker 2: the most recently raised of the Blue so those are
23:29
Speaker 2: the youngest of the Blue, which is why they don't
23:30
Speaker 2: have the ice at I face yet there, so that
23:33
Speaker 2: they're within the last couple of years they've been raised.
23:36
Speaker 1: And then yeah, we get some fun teasing about other
23:39
Speaker 1: traditions that have been forgotten and teasing what is it,
23:43
Speaker 1: who is it that's really into it? Yeah, Raffella is
23:46
Speaker 1: really into bringing back old traditions, and so there's a
23:48
Speaker 1: lot of teasing about all the different traditions that have
23:52
Speaker 1: been let to go out of style and do we
23:53
Speaker 1: need to respect them? And the answer it's just fun,
23:57
Speaker 1: you know, like, oh, so you're going to walk their
23:58
Speaker 1: clad in the light and your shawl to show that
24:01
Speaker 1: that's all the protection you need. No, we're just going
24:03
Speaker 1: to clear the halls. And it's it's just fun getting
24:06
Speaker 1: this sense of, yeah, the stuff that you would never
24:08
Speaker 1: know about the Blue unless you were in a blues
24:10
Speaker 1: only room.
24:12
Speaker 2: It kind of reminds me of the people who who
24:14
Speaker 2: are trying to like bring back Bible stuff. And it's like, oh,
24:16
Speaker 2: do you also like going to stone people for wearing
24:18
Speaker 2: mixed fabrics because you were wearing like oh yes, right now,
24:22
Speaker 2: you know, like.
24:23
Speaker 1: The mixed fiber loophole is always like, so, yeah, at
24:25
Speaker 1: what point did it become oky to where mixed fibers?
24:27
Speaker 2: Huh huh, Because once you can justify that, you can
24:30
Speaker 2: justify everything else going on in that passage.
24:34
Speaker 1: And yeah, we get this emphasis on you know, just
24:37
Speaker 1: as much to learn once you gained the shawl as before,
24:40
Speaker 1: which is definitely what's sort of drilled home throughout all
24:43
Speaker 1: the chapters that we've chosen to do today, both inside
24:46
Speaker 1: the Tower and outside of the Tower. And yeah, the
24:50
Speaker 1: last line I have highlighted is she was not about
24:53
Speaker 1: to have the beginning of her search delayed by something
24:55
Speaker 1: as ridiculous as not wearing all blue on the first
24:57
Speaker 1: day of the month.
24:58
Speaker 2: Right on Wednesdays we wear pink. Let's stop trying to Yeah,
25:05
Speaker 2: I think it's Wednesdays. It's Thursdays. Oh my god, Wednesday's okay. Good.
25:09
Speaker 1: I've never seen that movie. I've just seen The Means
25:11
Speaker 1: enough times.
25:14
Speaker 2: But it's giving a little bit of mean girls here, right,
25:17
Speaker 2: Like that's the sorority you've joined, right, is this like
25:21
Speaker 2: you have to conform you're one of us. You do
25:23
Speaker 2: all the you know, you learn all the little animal
25:25
Speaker 2: summoning tricks, which will come in handy later with Land.
25:42
Speaker 1: So yeah, we then changed chapters over to chapter twelve
25:45
Speaker 1: entering Home, with the symbol being swans fish And it's
25:49
Speaker 1: just a continuation now that we've reached the Blue Aaja quarters. Right.
25:54
Speaker 1: This Initially what we were doing in the last chapter
25:56
Speaker 1: was the Blue ceremony in the testing chamber, and now
25:59
Speaker 1: we're moving to the Blue ceremony in the Blue AG's
26:03
Speaker 1: home itself.
26:05
Speaker 2: Yeah, they get to go to their rooms. I meet
26:08
Speaker 2: with the first selector.
26:09
Speaker 1: Lots of names, right, We've got Anaya, We've got kyn
26:13
Speaker 1: A important name to note, Cabriana Cabriana is here. Cabri
26:19
Speaker 1: Cabriana macandis the woman who is tortured to death by
26:23
Speaker 1: a semarag to make Heleima's cover story work.
26:27
Speaker 2: Yes, and also importantly so that she is friends with
26:33
Speaker 2: Kyne Karine killed by Arngar.
26:38
Speaker 1: Yeah, Kiren and Anaya they're called the three. And yeah,
26:42
Speaker 1: Kien and Anaya are murdered while Agwayne is in the
26:47
Speaker 1: camp as Omerlin, right, and Iya get smothered to death.
26:51
Speaker 1: Kyra and I forget how, but it's both Ringar again.
26:54
Speaker 1: Halema her Helena's cover story is facilitated by the first
26:58
Speaker 1: death of those three, and then she herself kills the
27:00
Speaker 1: other two. Right, the three of them are a particularly
27:03
Speaker 1: tight triad.
27:04
Speaker 2: So that's why they're killed, is because they are this
27:07
Speaker 2: tight triad and it would ruin her cover story.
27:09
Speaker 1: Interesting to note that those are the first three names
27:11
Speaker 1: we get as this chapter opens, is those three women
27:14
Speaker 1: in reverse order of when they are killed.
27:17
Speaker 2: And there's a lot of sort of questioning about like
27:19
Speaker 2: who's deferring to who and why, and she doesn't understand
27:22
Speaker 2: and we know it later they tell us it's all
27:24
Speaker 2: power levels.
27:25
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, that's kind of a lot of the point
27:26
Speaker 1: of this chapter as being that's one of the things
27:29
Speaker 1: you learned once you get the power, once you get
27:31
Speaker 1: the shawl, is that deference is predicated on power levels,
27:35
Speaker 1: which you're not supposed to think about until you get
27:37
Speaker 1: the shawl. There's this interesting line Edith is perhaps the
27:40
Speaker 1: most capable Blue in the last hundred years, but if
27:43
Speaker 1: she were a brown or white, they'd let her potter
27:45
Speaker 1: off wherever she wanted. And then a few lines later,
27:48
Speaker 1: in any case, you may rest assured that whatever talents
27:50
Speaker 1: you have, a use will be found for them. And
27:54
Speaker 1: that is one of the darker sides of the Blue
27:57
Speaker 1: is they are so dedicated to their causes that they
28:00
Speaker 1: don't care about what you want. If you've decided to
28:02
Speaker 1: sign up for causes, you will be told what your
28:05
Speaker 1: cause is. Kind of a darker side of the way
28:09
Speaker 1: that they organize and structure themselves.
28:11
Speaker 2: Yeah, sort of weird that the person of the higher
28:14
Speaker 2: rank can just tell you, oh, my cause is more
28:16
Speaker 2: important than your cause, so you're going.
28:18
Speaker 1: To support me, and the AJA can say it's more
28:21
Speaker 1: important for you to be in charge of running the
28:23
Speaker 1: AJA than living your own life. We're going to collectively
28:27
Speaker 1: make you be our leader, kind of like what they
28:29
Speaker 1: do to a queen, or.
28:31
Speaker 2: It's more important for you to go be a queen
28:33
Speaker 2: or exactly.
28:34
Speaker 1: This is why Morain physically removes herself. She's like, I
28:37
Speaker 1: can't stand against the will of the Blue AJA. The
28:40
Speaker 1: will of the Blue AJA will move heaven and earth
28:42
Speaker 1: to make what it wants happen unless I'm physically unavailable.
28:45
Speaker 1: This is why Swan gets trapped so fast. And then
28:49
Speaker 1: Morain thinks, well, neither of them had any special abilities
28:51
Speaker 1: that I'm like, well, Swan has patterns seeking. We see
28:54
Speaker 1: that in like literally a page and you are a Demadred,
28:57
Speaker 1: so you know, epo baby ability is still an ability.
29:02
Speaker 2: Especially in a place where bloodline matters for a rule. Yep.
29:07
Speaker 1: So they get put in rooms that are next to
29:09
Speaker 1: each other, which is nice.
29:11
Speaker 2: And they're all frillly because Anya.
29:14
Speaker 1: Lace queen and some of the ruffles have ruffles, and
29:17
Speaker 1: Swan is into it. Moraine is horrified and can't make
29:21
Speaker 1: herself say that they're nice. She's able to make herself
29:23
Speaker 1: say that they are more than adequate. It's amazing. And
29:27
Speaker 1: she puts her Casierra back in for the first time
29:29
Speaker 1: in six years, so she immediately transforms into the lady
29:34
Speaker 1: Moraine Domitrade that we see and I have the world.
29:36
Speaker 1: The second she gets to her room, she dresses in
29:38
Speaker 1: all blue and puts her blue Casira in and bam there.
29:42
Speaker 1: She is a little bit young, little bit untested, but
29:45
Speaker 1: she's dressed.
29:45
Speaker 2: Well and it feels like she's going back to who
29:47
Speaker 2: she truly is. But it's like, man, how old was
29:49
Speaker 2: she when she went fourteen? Hard for her to have
29:53
Speaker 2: been the Lady Domindred before then, because she would have
29:57
Speaker 2: been you know, preteenly domindred.
30:00
Speaker 1: They I think were given adult responsibilities at an absurdly.
30:03
Speaker 2: Young age, especially in Kyrie Anne.
30:06
Speaker 1: Yeah, because she's she's like twenty twenty one at this
30:09
Speaker 1: point and they've been studying for seven years. So yeah,
30:12
Speaker 1: fourteen is when she would have enrolled, enlisted, which means yeah,
30:16
Speaker 1: she probably was thirteen when it first manifested in her
30:18
Speaker 1: ooh who She's asking a good question. What causes in
30:22
Speaker 1: general were the Blue pursuing and what causes were Marine
30:25
Speaker 1: and Swan thinking about pursuing before the Dragon Reborn came
30:29
Speaker 1: landing in their laps the way it did. What kind
30:31
Speaker 1: of causes were they imagining their lives would encompass because
30:35
Speaker 1: we never get a clue. They're just like, I'm going
30:37
Speaker 1: to do cool Blue Aja stuff and then they get
30:40
Speaker 1: given a mission. There's never any reflection on the specifics
30:43
Speaker 1: of what they were going to do before. It was
30:44
Speaker 1: just very like generic.
30:46
Speaker 2: But honestly, I think they just wanted to travel. Well,
30:49
Speaker 2: I think Suan just wanted to travel.
30:51
Speaker 1: Find something out there. Mm hmmm.
30:54
Speaker 2: The plot Aja.
30:55
Speaker 1: Plotaja not wrong, not wrong.
30:58
Speaker 2: Well, looking for something that will make a good story.
31:01
Speaker 1: Yeah, So yeah, they get scooted along to the horrible,
31:06
Speaker 1: distasteful discussion about power levels it's weird. The line that
31:11
Speaker 1: I think is most important is the Tower rooted something
31:15
Speaker 1: out of you then made you use that very thing
31:17
Speaker 1: to determine precedence. It's very weird logic. I don't understand
31:21
Speaker 1: why anyone thought that was a good idea. I want
31:23
Speaker 1: to blame the Black Aja and Ishamael just because it's
31:26
Speaker 1: so chaotic, But I don't know if that's too much
31:29
Speaker 1: of a stretch to support.
31:31
Speaker 2: Yeah, the whole right power makes right, might makes right
31:34
Speaker 2: that they've got going on in the White Tower, it
31:36
Speaker 2: doesn't make a lot of sense. And then in fact
31:38
Speaker 2: they don't talk about it, but they still obey it.
31:39
Speaker 1: It's like this weird The deep prohibition is what weirds
31:43
Speaker 1: me out. The prohibition against age, I kind of understand,
31:46
Speaker 1: because it's a way of avoiding talking about what the
31:49
Speaker 1: oath Rod is doing.
31:50
Speaker 2: And it doesn't matter to their power structure.
31:52
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, but I don't get the reluctance to talk
31:55
Speaker 1: about power levels that. I don't understand the origin of
31:59
Speaker 1: that deep emotional taboo.
32:03
Speaker 2: You know, it feels to me like he's trying to
32:05
Speaker 2: play off the taboo of talking about money and that
32:08
Speaker 2: you just don't talk about money and how much you make,
32:13
Speaker 2: and we all have unconscious biases right based on someone's clothes,
32:19
Speaker 2: someone's car, someone's home, someone's profession. We all kind of
32:23
Speaker 2: know how much money someone makes and will often adjust
32:26
Speaker 2: our social expectations based on that, but we never talk
32:32
Speaker 2: about it because it is very, very forbidden to talk
32:35
Speaker 2: about how much money you make. You still kind of
32:37
Speaker 2: treat someone differently depending on how much money to make
32:39
Speaker 2: based on all the unconscious cues you pick up based
32:42
Speaker 2: on their appearance.
32:44
Speaker 1: That is what it feels like. It does feel like
32:46
Speaker 1: that cringe. I was in the therapy program once where
32:49
Speaker 1: they were like, there are two rules. Do not talk
32:51
Speaker 1: about what you do for work and don't be making
32:54
Speaker 1: romantic contact with your fellow cohort people. Like those are
32:58
Speaker 1: the two rules, Like and you know, be a nice person,
33:01
Speaker 1: but like it was so much, so interesting how they
33:03
Speaker 1: were like, you will be affected in how you think
33:06
Speaker 1: about your cohort if you know what they do for
33:09
Speaker 1: a living and vice versa. So like just just don't
33:11
Speaker 1: just do not talk about what you do or don't
33:14
Speaker 1: do for a living. It is not relevant.
33:16
Speaker 2: And what's the first thing you do when you meet
33:18
Speaker 2: somebody in a social party? You ask well, what do
33:21
Speaker 2: you do for work?
33:22
Speaker 1: Exactly. They were like, we're breaking that taboo minute one,
33:25
Speaker 1: and we're holding to it with water tight adherents. It
33:28
Speaker 1: was a I had never thought about it how important
33:30
Speaker 1: it was to biases until they made like a ten
33:32
Speaker 1: minute level deal about it.
33:34
Speaker 2: Oh, hugely important, hugely important. Like I hate telling people
33:36
Speaker 2: what I do because I can see them immediately slot
33:39
Speaker 2: me in the social order once I tell them, you know,
33:42
Speaker 2: and often all lie, you know, all not sotily lie.
33:45
Speaker 2: But I'll be like, oh, yeah, you know, I used
33:46
Speaker 2: to work in restaurants, and I immediately go at the
33:48
Speaker 2: bottom of the social ladder. And then later later I'll
33:51
Speaker 2: say like, you know, but I've got an engineering degree
33:53
Speaker 2: and I work at a computer chip fab and I'm
33:55
Speaker 2: you know, And they go oh, and they're like, wait,
33:57
Speaker 2: why didn't you say that, and they get offended. They
33:59
Speaker 2: have this oh my god, I didn't realize you weren't
34:02
Speaker 2: at the bottom of the social order, and I.
34:05
Speaker 1: Need to treat you better because yeah, see, I was
34:07
Speaker 1: raised by artists, so just being weird and off to
34:13
Speaker 1: the side of those hierarchies is like kind of the
34:16
Speaker 1: entire identity.
34:18
Speaker 2: But see then there's another set of status achieved through
34:20
Speaker 2: we're rejecting those social norms and showing that you're not
34:24
Speaker 2: that of them. And there's a whole other hierarchy there,
34:28
Speaker 2: you know, like with the kN no.
34:29
Speaker 1: The weird CULTI hippie space that I grew up and
34:32
Speaker 1: didn't have any hierarchy in social sean who was being
34:37
Speaker 1: the most soy free and whatnot this week? That's not yeah, yeah, no,
34:43
Speaker 1: the definitely, yes, there are different social hierarchies, but yeah,
34:47
Speaker 1: the job one was one that was really deemphasized. It
34:50
Speaker 1: was not high on the hierarchy list in where I
34:53
Speaker 1: came from, so it was, Yeah, it sometimes trips me
34:57
Speaker 1: out how much that matters to other people.
35:01
Speaker 2: And of course they get the exceptions, right like if
35:03
Speaker 2: the authority of the tower puts them above you, then
35:06
Speaker 2: they're above you for that period of.
35:07
Speaker 1: Time, right right. Embassy structure matters. If the dragon reborn
35:11
Speaker 1: decides that you're in charge, that.
35:13
Speaker 2: Matters, right right. We go back to those moments and
35:17
Speaker 2: when yeah, there's some weirdness when they walk into the
35:21
Speaker 2: tower embassy and it's like he's like you you're in charge,
35:24
Speaker 2: and they're like, whoa, that's that's not what's supposed to happen.
35:27
Speaker 1: Now, that is what's supposed to happen. That's the thing
35:29
Speaker 1: is the leader of the embassy has been getting lower
35:32
Speaker 1: and lower status and lower and lower ranked, and then
35:35
Speaker 1: he comes in and says, no, no, no, she's the leader,
35:37
Speaker 1: and everyone right, right, we don't but.
35:40
Speaker 2: But we've been undercutting her so effectively.
35:42
Speaker 1: Dagon reboard said that the original leader needs to be
35:45
Speaker 1: the leader, so shut the back up, right, So yeah, anyway,
35:49
Speaker 1: power rankings are weird and we can move past that.
35:51
Speaker 1: And then the next thing that happens is Setalia's alarm
35:56
Speaker 1: shows up, and she is the current head of the
36:00
Speaker 1: Blue Aja Eyes and Ears and will presumably be handing
36:04
Speaker 1: that off to Swan as her protege over the course
36:07
Speaker 1: of the next couple of years.
36:09
Speaker 2: No information on what ends up happening to her. One
36:12
Speaker 2: would assume she is dead by the time the books
36:16
Speaker 2: roll around.
36:16
Speaker 1: But she has steel gray hair at this point, so
36:20
Speaker 1: this does imply that she's old enough to want to
36:23
Speaker 1: retire and go into the country or whatever it is
36:25
Speaker 1: I said I do at the end of their.
36:26
Speaker 2: Lives, right, die in office like all boomers.
36:31
Speaker 1: Right, She's not around at some point in the next
36:35
Speaker 1: twenty years, right right, delarm is almost the name of
36:39
Speaker 1: one of the soldiers in the Band of the Red Hand.
36:41
Speaker 1: I think it's Delarne in Matt's I think that's the
36:45
Speaker 1: guy that like falls in hinders tap and Mac goes
36:47
Speaker 1: back for it, and like that name sounds familiar. I'm
36:50
Speaker 1: pretty sure it's different, but I want to headcanon that
36:53
Speaker 1: you know their cousins or something.
36:56
Speaker 2: Sure, I'll give it to you only because I've got
36:59
Speaker 2: one of those coming up later that you're going to
37:00
Speaker 2: disagree with. So I'm going to give you this one.
37:02
Speaker 1: Giving me this one that's at all the friends.
37:04
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely support me.
37:06
Speaker 1: Later, so she calls Marine a pretty little porcelain doll
37:10
Speaker 1: and then hands who which she hates, and Swan agrees,
37:15
Speaker 1: except that she's actually a beautiful little porcelain doll' And.
37:18
Speaker 4: I'm like, dude, Swan's thoughts during this POV are dirty,
37:24
Speaker 4: Like there's some crush that's that's not just oh this
37:28
Speaker 4: is my friend, that's this is my crush who I love.
37:33
Speaker 1: One of the perspectives ends with a kiss. Okay, if
37:36
Speaker 1: that's not a cut to black, I don't know what is. Yeah,
37:40
Speaker 1: it's it's adorable Swan is fantastic, but yeah, she basically
37:43
Speaker 1: looks at this puzzle and immediately understands what it is.
37:47
Speaker 1: It's a cheat code to a card game. And that is,
37:52
Speaker 1: unfortunately the beginning of her just winning at an IQ
37:56
Speaker 1: test that came out of nowhere, and she gets all
37:59
Speaker 1: like mad at Setalia and tries to like prove her
38:02
Speaker 1: wrong by getting all the puzzles right, and like ends
38:04
Speaker 1: up being completely ensconced as an unwilling protege. By the
38:07
Speaker 1: end of the day.
38:09
Speaker 2: Welcome to the Gifted and Talented Program. You will be
38:11
Speaker 2: taken out of class and put in a special room
38:13
Speaker 2: where you wait. No, I don't want to go too bad.
38:16
Speaker 2: You have passed the Gifted and Talented Program. Mm.
38:20
Speaker 1: And then Morain gets, you know, three steps farther along
38:24
Speaker 1: in her day before getting yoinked. This is her getting
38:28
Speaker 1: yorkes to Tom for Tombra to tell her you'd sit
38:30
Speaker 1: your ass down and don't run away because we have
38:32
Speaker 1: plots for.
38:33
Speaker 2: You, at which point she goes running away.
38:36
Speaker 1: Yeah. Like because at this point, well, in the section
38:38
Speaker 1: that we're going to read later, she talks to her banker,
38:41
Speaker 1: and her banker says, oh, there was a situation that
38:44
Speaker 1: I sent you a letter about and she goes, uh,
38:46
Speaker 1: the tower's screening my mail and I didn't hear about that. Yeah,
38:49
Speaker 1: that letter has probably already been screened at this point.
38:53
Speaker 2: Sure, absolutely, it happened like nine days ago or eight
38:56
Speaker 2: days ago, right.
38:57
Speaker 1: Yeah, so tom ras summoning her and telling her to
38:59
Speaker 1: be in charge of distributing the bounty and to sit
39:01
Speaker 1: your ass down. Tomr's already totally scheming. This is part
39:04
Speaker 1: of I think why she doesn't mind that Swan and
39:06
Speaker 1: Moraine have wanted to stay around, because she knows that
39:09
Speaker 1: this plot to put Moreinn on the sun throne is
39:12
Speaker 1: going and she's fully endorsed.
39:15
Speaker 2: It wouldn't that put her out of the tower to
39:18
Speaker 2: go hand out the bounty like I or is she
39:21
Speaker 2: like staying like in the tower and people are coming
39:23
Speaker 2: to her and she's just sitting in a booth handing
39:26
Speaker 2: out money to people who's straw. I don't understand the
39:28
Speaker 2: handing out of the bounty and have like, oh, she'd
39:30
Speaker 2: only take a few days when getting the names took weeks.
39:33
Speaker 1: Where does it say only a few days handing out?
39:35
Speaker 2: Sorry, not days? Look, now, handing out the bounty can't
39:38
Speaker 2: last more than a few months, sorry, not days still.
39:42
Speaker 1: And I don't think she's in charge of physically handing
39:43
Speaker 1: it out. She's in charge of distributing it. I think
39:45
Speaker 1: that means she's orchestrating the people that are handing it out,
39:49
Speaker 1: like this many sacks of gold into this cart to
39:52
Speaker 1: go to this area with this list under this person's supervision.
39:55
Speaker 1: I think that's more what Moraine is being put in
39:58
Speaker 1: charge of, not physically handing the sacks over to people.
40:01
Speaker 2: That is weird. I was thinking that she would be
40:03
Speaker 2: out of the tower handing out and I'm like, is
40:05
Speaker 2: that not getting her out of the tower to kind
40:07
Speaker 2: of start the search and check on people? Like, if
40:09
Speaker 2: she's handing out gold to the people in the list,
40:11
Speaker 2: is that not encouraging her to go look for the
40:14
Speaker 2: dragon reborn?
40:15
Speaker 3: Yeah?
40:15
Speaker 1: I don't think so.
40:16
Speaker 2: But if she's not, No, if she's just stuck in
40:18
Speaker 2: the tower organizing and doing paperwork, that's different.
40:22
Speaker 1: That's what I think is happening.
40:23
Speaker 2: Okay.
40:24
Speaker 1: Oh, and Anaya provides healing, which is helpful.
40:29
Speaker 2: And she holds onto the shawl because all new sisters
40:32
Speaker 2: raise the shawl find excuses to wear it all the time.
40:35
Speaker 1: Okay, so then we actually switched to Swan's POV where
40:39
Speaker 1: she's in Cetalia's room being told you have a job.
40:43
Speaker 1: Now she's been vall and told to be Cetalia's protege, because.
40:47
Speaker 2: That's what Setelia is looking for, someone to take over
40:50
Speaker 2: the eyes and ears. Yeah, that's what the puzzle thing
40:53
Speaker 2: is for, right, not for like anything else.
40:55
Speaker 1: It's yes, she needs an assistant. That was an interview.
40:58
Speaker 2: She needs a spymaster.
41:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, the whole puzzle thing was just an interview process, and.
41:03
Speaker 2: That's where we get the thoughts about it. She was
41:05
Speaker 2: not a pretty porcelain little doll. She was a beautiful
41:08
Speaker 2: little porcelain doll.
41:09
Speaker 1: That Moriene always made her smile.
41:11
Speaker 2: No matter how often she was knocked down, she climbed
41:14
Speaker 2: back up on her feet straight away. Moraine did not
41:16
Speaker 2: know the meaning of give up. Her voice usually reminded
41:19
Speaker 2: Suan of silver bells, but Moraine hated hearing that.
41:23
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, Swan is so in love with mourn. So yeah,
41:28
Speaker 1: they discussed their days. Moraine comes out as the potential
41:33
Speaker 1: heir to the sun throne to Swan, she's been hiding.
41:36
Speaker 2: That from her, and someone's like, well, of course you're
41:38
Speaker 2: a queen like obviously you know, yeah.
41:41
Speaker 1: You totally. She's like, well you're my queen, obvious, so yeah.
41:47
Speaker 1: Moraine basically says, I'd rather be forgotten than remembered, like
41:50
Speaker 1: one of my own ancestors whose name is still used
41:52
Speaker 1: to frighten children. Because but like the Tower says, she
41:55
Speaker 1: was a successful ruler because it was peaceful. And I
41:57
Speaker 1: think that's an interesting lens inside what the Tower thinks.
42:02
Speaker 1: Law and order means.
42:03
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean order by the sword, right, yeah, order
42:08
Speaker 2: by death. That's fine.
42:09
Speaker 1: The absence of violence is the presence of justice. It's not.
42:14
Speaker 1: It's not great.
42:15
Speaker 2: That was her great grandmother, yes, oh yeah, and this
42:19
Speaker 2: is the only information we have about her.
42:21
Speaker 1: And then the POV ends with Morena offering healing and
42:25
Speaker 1: Swan kissing her, and then the camera cuts to black,
42:28
Speaker 1: and I'm like, there is no heterosexual explanation for that.
42:33
Speaker 1: There simply is not, And I'm happy about that.
42:36
Speaker 2: Think about how beautiful she is now in their own
42:38
Speaker 2: private quarterers, no consequences whatsoever. Heal each other by putting
42:44
Speaker 2: hands on and then.
42:46
Speaker 1: Then rearrange the lace on that.
42:48
Speaker 2: Bed, rip it off more but more likely, and so.
42:56
Speaker 1: Then we can switch povs to land little dash of
43:01
Speaker 1: land here.
43:02
Speaker 2: It just basically him saying, yes, the war is over right.
43:07
Speaker 2: It took a little while for them to realize the Iel.
43:09
Speaker 2: We're just going to retreat. There's no more battles to
43:11
Speaker 2: be had, Pedro. Nile is not doing the dumb thing
43:14
Speaker 2: and doing suicidal attacks on retreating Iel. Like he's smart
43:21
Speaker 2: enough not to do that, because he's not a complete moron.
43:23
Speaker 1: Yeah, we get a look at kin Slayer's dagger a
43:26
Speaker 1: little fun. Hey, we know that location from book two.
43:29
Speaker 1: That's important. And yeah, just an emphasis that Nile is
43:32
Speaker 1: a great captain. He is a respected great captain at
43:35
Speaker 1: this point in time. This is kind of like the
43:37
Speaker 1: peak of Nile's career, right, He's writing on the momentum
43:40
Speaker 1: from this period among others. When we see him in
43:43
Speaker 1: twenty years, you know.
43:44
Speaker 2: Right, one would assume he had he had some success
43:47
Speaker 2: against the Iel, unlike most of the other captains.
43:50
Speaker 1: Right, right, this is a lot of where he has.
43:53
Speaker 1: He's in the act of having all that momentum that
43:55
Speaker 1: he is literally going to be still writing on twenty
43:57
Speaker 1: years from now before he gets you know a sae fascinated.
44:00
Speaker 2: Don't most of the Greek captains get their acclaim from
44:04
Speaker 2: the Iel War.
44:05
Speaker 1: I actually don't know. I just kind of thought they
44:07
Speaker 1: were great captains for reasons. I didn't think that the
44:09
Speaker 1: Aeo War figured specifically into it. But wouldn't surprise me.
44:12
Speaker 1: They're all because.
44:13
Speaker 2: They're all kind of of that age, right, Well, they're.
44:15
Speaker 1: All different ages, but they all have a Yeal War experience.
44:19
Speaker 2: Right.
44:20
Speaker 1: Nile significantly older than all of them, right, Gareth Brandon
44:22
Speaker 1: Nile are not the same age, but they both are
44:25
Speaker 1: great captains, and they both fought in the Aeo War.
44:27
Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess of an age should be old enough
44:29
Speaker 2: to have fought yeah war.
44:31
Speaker 1: You know, Nile's already pretty much like the old guy
44:34
Speaker 1: on the block at this point.
44:36
Speaker 2: Yeah, fighting the blight, I guess that that does count.
44:38
Speaker 2: But for me, it's like you can't really be a
44:40
Speaker 2: captain in a general fighting the blight.
44:43
Speaker 1: Yeah, being a general is sort of a human war, right.
44:47
Speaker 2: I think I think of fighting the blight as being
44:49
Speaker 2: more of like an extermination job, you know, like against
44:53
Speaker 2: or you know, clean up crew, almost because you don't
44:58
Speaker 2: you don't have the big battles, you don't have the
45:00
Speaker 2: pitch battles, right, you have raids, you have fhades trying
45:03
Speaker 2: to sneak into your barracks, you have villages disappearing. You
45:07
Speaker 2: rarely have big battles.
45:09
Speaker 1: Right right, But this is just emphasized that Niall is
45:12
Speaker 1: actually a good captain in terms of the tactical task
45:15
Speaker 1: and this is why he's a great captain. And Land
45:19
Speaker 1: and bukamare kind of talking about after, you know, what
45:22
Speaker 1: were we doing once this campaign is formally over, and
45:25
Speaker 1: Land says the act of writing to the blight will
45:27
Speaker 1: be enough of a vacation, and Bukama's like bullshit, which, like,
45:33
Speaker 1: I agree with Boukama. That is a bullshit argument from Land.
45:36
Speaker 1: Oh I'll rest while I'm writing across the continent.
45:38
Speaker 2: That's not rest, dude, That's such a typical Land thing
45:42
Speaker 2: to do.
45:43
Speaker 1: He so has nothing to live for right now. He's like,
45:46
Speaker 1: I can't wait to get back to my suicidal death
45:48
Speaker 1: wish blight campaign. But Boukama kind of wants to relax.
45:53
Speaker 1: He wants to chill, he wants to see the Southlands
45:55
Speaker 1: and have wine and pretty girls.
45:58
Speaker 2: He's classic, I'm too old for the shit. I'm five
46:00
Speaker 2: days away from retirement. I just want to relax. Let's
46:03
Speaker 2: not get involved in anything. And then this rookie cop
46:07
Speaker 2: goes and hooks up with some is sid eye and
46:09
Speaker 2: gets him killed by the Black Aja. It's like, God,
46:12
Speaker 2: damn it, Bukama just wanted to relax a little bit,
46:15
Speaker 2: and you Land cannot You're on a suicidal mission and
46:19
Speaker 2: you're taking them down with you. Just go have a
46:21
Speaker 2: few drinks.
46:23
Speaker 1: I know, right, nodding to all of that.
46:26
Speaker 2: Now, I'm glad he does get involved, right, or else
46:28
Speaker 2: we wouldn't have the classic Land. But like die from
46:30
Speaker 2: Bukama's perspective, Oh my god, come on, Land, come on.
46:34
Speaker 1: For real, for real. And so yeah, they leave from
46:38
Speaker 1: this campaign and they specifically say we're going to detour
46:41
Speaker 1: around Tarvalin. We want nothing to do with any Isidye whatsoever.
46:45
Speaker 1: And you only find Isidye at Tarvalin. They never wander
46:48
Speaker 1: along on the road. The cognito will be fine.
46:51
Speaker 2: The number of times, I don't know why he thinks
46:53
Speaker 2: I don't want to get involved with Isidai this many
46:56
Speaker 2: times other than the fact for ironic storytelling, because you know,
47:01
Speaker 2: because he's not been involved with I said I at all.
47:04
Speaker 2: They haven't been involved in his life. The idea that
47:06
Speaker 2: he would encounter one seems almost foreign for him to
47:10
Speaker 2: be like, all I want to do is go fight
47:11
Speaker 2: the light and avoid I said I. It's like, so
47:15
Speaker 2: you want to get involved with I said, I Like yeah, yeah,
47:20
Speaker 2: totally totally.
47:21
Speaker 1: Sure would be bad if an iside showed up and
47:24
Speaker 1: gave me a reason to live. Sure would hated if
47:27
Speaker 1: that happened.
47:29
Speaker 2: It's like Jordan likes to prove his character is wrong,
47:31
Speaker 2: but sometimes he makes them assert things that they have
47:33
Speaker 2: no reason to assert, so he can prove them wrong.
47:38
Speaker 2: So I just feel like if there had been maybe
47:40
Speaker 2: if he'd been thinking about like earlier like that, I said, I,
47:43
Speaker 2: who fought in the battle, But then they wouldn't have
47:45
Speaker 2: fought against the Aeel. So I don't there's no connection there.
47:49
Speaker 1: I think he just is generally distrustful of powerful women,
47:52
Speaker 1: and everyone is distrustful of IS said I. So was
47:55
Speaker 1: just a normal default setting.
47:57
Speaker 2: I mean, I guess other than the fact that maybe
47:59
Speaker 2: they were their pass was going to take them by Tarvollan,
48:02
Speaker 2: and he's thinking about avoiding Tarvoalan and avoiding Iidaie in general. Right,
48:05
Speaker 2: So it's like, well, we're taking the longer path to
48:07
Speaker 2: avoid the iid eye yeah, well there.
48:09
Speaker 1: Were isid I with the armies that he's interacted with
48:12
Speaker 1: over the course of the Aeo War. He has seen
48:14
Speaker 1: them at a distance and seen how they you know,
48:16
Speaker 1: hover around rulers and stuff. But yeah, anyhow, Chapter thirteen,
48:35
Speaker 1: Business in the City. Our symbol is the snake in
48:39
Speaker 1: the wheel, and we opened with Swan and Moraine having
48:43
Speaker 1: a very nice dinner in the Sister's lounge. Basically instead
48:48
Speaker 1: of like a dining hall with benches, it's like more
48:50
Speaker 1: of a little restauranty thing where there's separate tables and
48:52
Speaker 1: there's actually a couple of different choices for food, and
48:55
Speaker 1: it's just this sense of like, oh, yeah, I said,
48:57
Speaker 1: I have nice things behind stores.
49:00
Speaker 2: They got money, they do. Yeah, People like, where are
49:02
Speaker 2: the money coming from. These are the billionaires, These are
49:04
Speaker 2: the bankers, These are the They have holdings in estates
49:08
Speaker 2: and interests that builds over centuries, if not, you know,
49:12
Speaker 2: tens of centuries.
49:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, these are cardinals living at the Vatican. They have
49:17
Speaker 1: nice things. So, yeah, they have some good food. And
49:19
Speaker 1: then they got back to the Blue Quarters and we
49:21
Speaker 1: talk about money. They get one thousand crowns of gold
49:26
Speaker 1: per year as an annual stipend and they can get
49:28
Speaker 1: more if they want it, and it's a reasonable request.
49:32
Speaker 1: And Swan doesn't know what the hell to do with
49:34
Speaker 1: that much money, whereas Morena's like, oh, I need some dresses,
49:37
Speaker 1: and yeah, showing their classes, showing their relative classes is
49:41
Speaker 1: very apparent here in the way that they look at
49:43
Speaker 1: the money. Moren says, oh, good, now I have a
49:45
Speaker 1: dress budget, and Swan goes, I.
49:49
Speaker 2: Ah, you know, I have more money than I've ever
49:51
Speaker 2: seen in my life, by multiple orders of magnitude, and
49:54
Speaker 2: I'm going to store it away safely because if everything
49:57
Speaker 2: else falls apart, I at least have that to fall
49:59
Speaker 2: back on.
50:00
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, Swan has never gome at I mean, obviously
50:04
Speaker 1: is said I live well, but she has clearly not
50:06
Speaker 1: mentally processed that that's going to include.
50:08
Speaker 2: Her one day, right, because she's been living like a
50:11
Speaker 2: novice or an accepted, which is not living well.
50:14
Speaker 4: Yeah.
50:14
Speaker 1: No, it is spartan. It is bare bones, it is
50:17
Speaker 1: bare minimum. It's not going to fluff you up. They
50:20
Speaker 1: don't fluff you up until you're in ie to die.
50:22
Speaker 1: But Swan will keep her money with the Tower Bank,
50:25
Speaker 1: whereas Moraine is working with a bank that has branches
50:28
Speaker 1: all over the place and has a good place in Tarvalan,
50:32
Speaker 1: but is not the Tower Bank. And then she learns
50:34
Speaker 1: that the Tower is messing with her stuff, so she's like, yeah,
50:37
Speaker 1: I'm not going to use the Tower Bank so that
50:39
Speaker 1: they can see all my transactions. That's noe, not going
50:42
Speaker 1: to happen.
50:42
Speaker 2: I think that this is like a branch of the kyrieane.
50:44
Speaker 1: And Bank exactly exactly.
50:47
Speaker 2: Right, just extending out into Darvallin. Yeah.
50:49
Speaker 1: She's like, no, this is the bank I've always used
50:51
Speaker 1: since forever. This is the bank my family uses. They
50:54
Speaker 1: know me. There's a like, why would I trust the
50:56
Speaker 1: tower when I have already a trustworthy banking service.
50:59
Speaker 2: And every bank has a branch in New York City,
51:01
Speaker 2: I mean Tarvallin.
51:02
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, naturally it's the financial district.
51:05
Speaker 2: It's the center of commerce of the world. Yeah, it's
51:06
Speaker 2: the financial district.
51:07
Speaker 1: So yeah, we then we learned about the letter, and yes,
51:12
Speaker 1: the banker says, nine days ago a man came to
51:14
Speaker 1: me a Kyrie In and he spoke with cultured accents.
51:18
Speaker 1: He had presented an order purportedly signed and stealed by
51:21
Speaker 1: the Amberland Seat, directing me to lay open your finances.
51:25
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's not going to happen.
51:27
Speaker 1: And I'm kind of curious who was doing this and
51:32
Speaker 1: why because clearly it's not from the Amberlin right, because
51:35
Speaker 1: the banker says that this failed because I recognized Tom
51:37
Speaker 1: Rospenya's signature and it was this was a forgery. So
51:40
Speaker 1: who was interested in this information and sent this guy?
51:44
Speaker 1: Do you think was that like the Red Aja or
51:47
Speaker 1: was it like a Kyrie in In.
51:49
Speaker 2: I think it's Kyrie in In, right, So nine days
51:51
Speaker 2: ago puts it less than a week after the death
51:53
Speaker 2: of layman Ah. So I think basically someone said just
51:59
Speaker 2: had her on the radar as a potential to inherit
52:02
Speaker 2: the throne and was going trying to sabotage her by
52:05
Speaker 2: getting access to her finances.
52:07
Speaker 1: Okay, right, Like, so as soon as Lamon dies immediately
52:10
Speaker 1: people are sniffing around her from exactly Okay, that makes sense.
52:13
Speaker 2: Whether whether it's opposition, you know, research, whether it's trying
52:17
Speaker 2: to undercut her finances, I don't. I don't really know. Later,
52:21
Speaker 2: there's there's a moment where she thinks that like basically
52:25
Speaker 2: she's under attack and she thinks, oh, it must be
52:26
Speaker 2: this guy ordering it. But it's not, it's totally the
52:29
Speaker 2: black aud Jab.
52:30
Speaker 1: Right, So the name Rescorthonis doesn't mean anything.
52:36
Speaker 2: No, it doesn't mean anything.
52:37
Speaker 1: It's just some guy.
52:38
Speaker 4: Right.
52:38
Speaker 2: So when when Canadrin the black uh, the dark friend
52:45
Speaker 2: who is with lanb.
52:47
Speaker 1: Oh yeah yeah.
52:48
Speaker 2: Yeah, he tells Maureen he was hired to assassinate her,
52:51
Speaker 2: she thinks it's this guy. Not it's got to be
52:55
Speaker 2: you know, the black a Jab.
52:57
Speaker 1: I think later, Miriam, and this presumably isn't the black
52:59
Speaker 1: ou Ja. So this is good old fashioned Kyrine is schaming.
53:02
Speaker 2: I think it's just Kyrine in politics, is my assumption.
53:04
Speaker 2: That's all that's going on here. So in the same
53:07
Speaker 2: way that Matt thinks he's being robbed all the time
53:10
Speaker 2: and it's always dark friends, this is Moraine thinking, oh,
53:13
Speaker 2: you know, it's politics. I'm being targeted by politics, And
53:18
Speaker 2: it turns out later it's not that it's actually dark
53:21
Speaker 2: friends trying to kill.
53:22
Speaker 1: Her, except this guy. It is politics.
53:24
Speaker 2: She was right this time, Yeah, this guy's right, right, right, right,
53:27
Speaker 2: this guy is politics. But like later on, she attributes
53:30
Speaker 2: the assassination attempt to politics and thinks it's this guy
53:35
Speaker 2: when I really think, no, it's just the black Auja
53:37
Speaker 2: trying to take her out.
53:38
Speaker 1: So the banker had sent a letter to her, and
53:40
Speaker 1: the Tower kept the letter from her, and she sees
53:43
Speaker 1: that as evidence that the Tower is seriously invested in
53:46
Speaker 1: making moves to put her on the throne. Not that
53:48
Speaker 1: they sent that guy. Obviously, Tomra could have you know,
53:52
Speaker 1: done her own signature if they wanted it to be
53:54
Speaker 1: that guy, right, right, But the fact that they held
53:57
Speaker 1: that information back from her does say that they are
53:58
Speaker 1: also interested and manipulating Kyrian in politics confirms her worst fears.
54:04
Speaker 2: So they take that guy right into custody because he
54:08
Speaker 2: faked the signature. Faked, Yeah, and they bribe a boy,
54:14
Speaker 2: a young.
54:14
Speaker 1: Man, yeah, one of the bank employees.
54:17
Speaker 2: One of the bank employees, right, and that boy gets
54:20
Speaker 2: shipped down river for basically doing a betrayal. Yeah, here's
54:24
Speaker 2: my theory. He do be Bail Domon as a young
54:28
Speaker 2: boy who started off. They don't say where he's from.
54:34
Speaker 2: They don't say he's from you know, this is an
54:36
Speaker 2: international place. He could be from Ilion, and you know,
54:39
Speaker 2: he gets shipped out to run ice peppers. Now, come on,
54:42
Speaker 2: come on, Bail Domont and ice Peppers go hand in hand.
54:46
Speaker 2: That's how we first meet him. He's the right age.
54:49
Speaker 2: He'd be a young lad here, he'd be a you know,
54:51
Speaker 2: middle aged man running his own ship in twenty years.
54:54
Speaker 1: He has a strong illi on or accent, though, you know,
55:00
Speaker 1: which implies he grew up in Ilion.
55:03
Speaker 2: You think bail Doman was in a pretty youth. I mean,
55:06
Speaker 2: I know it doesn't work. It doesn't work. I don't care,
55:08
Speaker 2: but I wanted to work.
55:10
Speaker 4: I know.
55:10
Speaker 2: I know he's because he's right.
55:12
Speaker 1: About the timelines though, the timeline.
55:15
Speaker 2: Ice peppers being shipped off to see like he is.
55:19
Speaker 1: A young man getting started in his shipping career. He
55:23
Speaker 1: probably has started, you know, wiping the decks on a
55:26
Speaker 1: pirate boat or something. Ice peppers are shipped a lot
55:29
Speaker 1: of places. They're a very popular trade good. There's an
55:32
Speaker 1: annual run of many merchants moving ice peppers. He probably,
55:36
Speaker 1: I mean, everyone's got their own taste. He might have
55:39
Speaker 1: been a pretty young man. I don't think so, though.
55:43
Speaker 1: I think that young people working entry level jobs in
55:46
Speaker 1: Tarvalan are probably natives of Tarvalin.
55:49
Speaker 2: They're probably Andoran. So well, that's the good question. Tarvalin
55:53
Speaker 2: is of no nation, right, It does not exist inside
55:55
Speaker 2: of and or Tarvallin. Is Tarvallin like the Vatican? Are
56:00
Speaker 2: you a Tarvolliner, Yeah, Tarvalinite Valinite, Like they never really
56:03
Speaker 2: talk about what what where are these people who live there?
56:07
Speaker 2: What nation are they from?
56:09
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're just from Tarvallin. I know that there's some
56:14
Speaker 1: character that describes themselves as having been coming from like
56:18
Speaker 1: is it one of the ship captains, like one of
56:20
Speaker 1: the weird ship captains we see briefly and like fires
56:22
Speaker 1: a Heaven from Tarvollin.
56:24
Speaker 2: He like hates the isid eye.
56:26
Speaker 1: It's the one that Mack runs away with. It is
56:28
Speaker 1: the one that Matt jumps on after the Lucky Knight.
56:30
Speaker 1: I believe that guy is a native Tarvolliner and is
56:35
Speaker 1: Matt comments, you know, internally, and how it's kind of
56:38
Speaker 1: weird that he doesn't like isidike, given that he's like
56:41
Speaker 1: from there. I don't recall there being a name for
56:45
Speaker 1: what a Tarvallnor is, But Tarvallaner sounds right, Tarvalonite does
56:50
Speaker 1: not sound right. Tarvala Nur sounds right.
56:52
Speaker 2: Whereas the White Cloak refers to them isid I cock.
56:57
Speaker 1: Wow, it came from ah, came from the manosphere language.
57:06
Speaker 2: Unfortunately, well, the like looks are a good analogy for that,
57:11
Speaker 2: so they are they are anyway, But yeah, I wanted
57:15
Speaker 2: that to meet somebody, you know, like I wanted that
57:18
Speaker 2: to the backstory of one of our characters and bailed
57:20
Speaker 2: them on game Game to mind.
57:22
Speaker 1: I admire your enthusiasm and commitment to the bit, but
57:25
Speaker 1: I don't think it works. But I do like your enthusiasm.
57:30
Speaker 2: Tarvalonian, Eh, that sounds very Hooviyan to me.
57:34
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, So next thing we've got is kind
57:38
Speaker 1: of the last major arc of the chapter, and this
57:41
Speaker 1: actually overlaps with what I was recording with my mom
57:43
Speaker 1: just a couple of hours ago. Seemstressing. Mm Moraine asks
57:48
Speaker 1: around for a seamstress because she needs to get a wardrobe,
57:51
Speaker 1: and she takes Swann to go do this dress shopping
57:54
Speaker 1: thing which involves tailoring.
57:57
Speaker 2: She needs to fake a wardrobe.
58:00
Speaker 1: Well, she does genuinely get a bunch of clothes that
58:02
Speaker 1: she takes with her, but yes, she orders far more
58:05
Speaker 1: clothes in an effort to show that she's planning on
58:07
Speaker 1: sticking around.
58:08
Speaker 2: Right, which is a lie.
58:10
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's omitting some of the truth. And we got
58:15
Speaker 1: this whole thing about the steamstress and the relationship with
58:20
Speaker 1: your tailor and the fitting process and how you do
58:23
Speaker 1: and don't negotiate about what aspects of design and price
58:27
Speaker 1: and adornment. And the reason that I was bringing this
58:34
Speaker 1: up to my mom earlier was because we were talking
58:36
Speaker 1: about sewing, as we always do, but we were specifically
58:40
Speaker 1: talking about sewing machines in warfare, because the first war
58:45
Speaker 1: in which sewing machines made a material difference in the
58:49
Speaker 1: outcome of the war was the Civil War. The North
58:52
Speaker 1: had sewing machines at that point, and it made a
58:55
Speaker 1: really big difference that they had much better clothes and
58:58
Speaker 1: tents and whatnot than the Southern army, right, And so
59:03
Speaker 1: then we were talking on and on and on about
59:05
Speaker 1: that and thinking about just how hard it is to
59:07
Speaker 1: make clothes. And it got me to thinking about how
59:10
Speaker 1: in wheel of time these dresses they're all not just
59:14
Speaker 1: hand sewn, they're also hand woven, right.
59:17
Speaker 2: And think about where the silk is coming from and
59:19
Speaker 2: how it's getting there.
59:21
Speaker 1: Oh, the silk had to come from Shara.
59:23
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's getting shipped.
59:25
Speaker 1: Over from freaking Shara. And it's just all of this
59:28
Speaker 1: is so much work, No wonder the relationship with the
59:31
Speaker 1: steamstress is so much. It's so complicated because making clothes
59:36
Speaker 1: is so difficult, right, the hours it takes to stitch
59:40
Speaker 1: a garment together, right, And Marine's like, yeah, I want
59:42
Speaker 1: twenty dresses. I want them to start getting delivered next week.
59:47
Speaker 1: Just the labor involved is so much more than we
59:52
Speaker 1: can even comprehend.
59:54
Speaker 2: You know, and the social status that goes along with that, right,
59:56
Speaker 2: the skill and the ability, and like you have to
59:59
Speaker 2: bow to her as though she is as superior to
1:00:01
Speaker 2: you as an I sid die. Like that's the level
1:00:04
Speaker 2: of skill, skilled labor that is going on here, right,
1:00:07
Speaker 2: And like.
1:00:07
Speaker 1: Swan thinks it's fine to have four dresses, right because
1:00:10
Speaker 1: from where she's coming from, that's you know, month's worth
1:00:14
Speaker 1: of money to a regular labor to make one garment.
1:00:18
Speaker 4: Right.
1:00:18
Speaker 1: There's a reason why people used to will their garments
1:00:21
Speaker 1: onto their descendants, because garments are that expensive, that hard
1:00:25
Speaker 1: to come by, that hard to get a good jacket
1:00:28
Speaker 1: or whatever. It's very, very expensive in a world where
1:00:31
Speaker 1: everything is done with human power. And Moraine just waltzs
1:00:35
Speaker 1: on in there and it's like, yeah, I'm going to
1:00:36
Speaker 1: order twenty dresses. That's a normal thing to do. Only
1:00:38
Speaker 1: the richest of the rich kind of people can think like.
1:00:41
Speaker 2: That, and then I really like what her sort of
1:00:44
Speaker 2: summary of what everybody does. When Moraine's like, do we
1:00:47
Speaker 2: have to treat when sorry? When someone's like, do we
1:00:49
Speaker 2: have to treat everybody like this? And Moraine's like, no,
1:00:52
Speaker 2: the shoemaker will make what we want, and we will
1:00:54
Speaker 2: bargain the price with him, but not too hard. We
1:00:57
Speaker 2: want his best work. The same with the glove maker,
1:00:59
Speaker 2: the stocking maker, shift maker, and all the rest. Just
1:01:02
Speaker 2: be glad. Neither of us needs a hairdresser. The best
1:01:04
Speaker 2: hairdressers are true tyrants. Nearly as bad as perfumers. Is
1:01:09
Speaker 2: that level of like, okay, so you've got dressmaker, then perfumer,
1:01:13
Speaker 2: then hairdresser, than all the other people who do.
1:01:16
Speaker 1: Work, and like, don't forget the perfumer, right, Yeah, that's
1:01:22
Speaker 1: wealthy lady stuff. That is wealthy lady stuff. Swan's like, no,
1:01:28
Speaker 1: I don't need all of that, but everything else is.
1:01:30
Speaker 2: Much more basic. Right, everybody needs shoes, everybody needs shifts,
1:01:34
Speaker 2: everybody you know.
1:01:35
Speaker 1: And a lot of that stuff is way easier to
1:01:36
Speaker 1: make in more standardized sizes and adjust easily to fit
1:01:40
Speaker 1: a person. You know. You can make the three sizes
1:01:42
Speaker 1: of stockings. That's going to be most people.
1:01:45
Speaker 2: Whereas what determines your social status is what you're wearing,
1:01:50
Speaker 2: what your hair looks like, and what you smell like.
1:01:53
Speaker 2: Those are the things people perceive when you walk into
1:01:56
Speaker 2: a room. So the dressmaker, the hairdresser, and the perfumer
1:01:59
Speaker 2: are the tyrants who determine what you're going to look
1:02:02
Speaker 2: like and what's fashionable because they're determining fashion for the
1:02:05
Speaker 2: entire court, right, and you're paying that person. You're paying
1:02:08
Speaker 2: the person to be up on the fashion and up
1:02:11
Speaker 2: on the latest trends, and that's why they dictate to
1:02:14
Speaker 2: you what you're gonna wear, not the other way around.
1:02:17
Speaker 1: And also notice how you have to go to a
1:02:18
Speaker 1: different merchant for every article of clothing. There is no
1:02:22
Speaker 1: department store where you can just go and get stuff
1:02:25
Speaker 1: from the sock aisle, right. You have to go to
1:02:27
Speaker 1: a person who just does hosiery, and their entire business
1:02:30
Speaker 1: is based around figuring out those materials and putting that
1:02:33
Speaker 1: stuff together. You have to go everywhere. You can't just
1:02:36
Speaker 1: go to one spot. You can't just get things all
1:02:38
Speaker 1: in a one and done situation. It's a whole journey
1:02:42
Speaker 1: and then all the embroiders. So I have been absolutely
1:02:44
Speaker 1: addicted to cross stitch. Lately, I've been doing a cross
1:02:48
Speaker 1: stitch paint by numbers kind of thing where I'm just
1:02:50
Speaker 1: following a pattern and I'm completely addicted to it.
1:02:53
Speaker 2: My mom did a lot of those growing up while
1:02:55
Speaker 2: I was growing up.
1:02:55
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's freaking fantastic. I'm having so much. It's analog
1:02:59
Speaker 1: can't crush. I'm successfully kicking the candy crush habit by
1:03:02
Speaker 1: playing with different Bradley colored squares. So when you know
1:03:05
Speaker 1: Marine's talking about all this embroidery that they're doing on this,
1:03:08
Speaker 1: I'm just like, man again, that's all hand done that.
1:03:11
Speaker 1: There's no sewing machine that does that. That's all hand embroidery. No.
1:03:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, my neurodivergency isn't inherited. But all of my stockings
1:03:19
Speaker 2: were hand cross stitched growing up by my mother.
1:03:22
Speaker 1: Maybe your socks were cross stitched.
1:03:24
Speaker 2: Christmas stockings, the ones that you hang by the fire west, Oh,
1:03:28
Speaker 2: those she would stitch a whole Christmas cross stitch, a
1:03:32
Speaker 2: whole Christmas scene on the front of it, and it
1:03:34
Speaker 2: would be this elaborate. You know, people skiing, you know,
1:03:37
Speaker 2: you've seen those like puzzles that people put together that
1:03:39
Speaker 2: like they're complicated. She crossed ditch that whole thing on
1:03:42
Speaker 2: and we all had stockings. All four of us had
1:03:46
Speaker 2: one of those cross stitch stockings, and each one took
1:03:48
Speaker 2: her years to make.
1:03:50
Speaker 1: I believe it. Yeah, I'm I'm working on a really
1:03:52
Speaker 1: big one right now, and it's very time consuming.
1:03:55
Speaker 2: It's not a fast process. And so you know, in conclusion,
1:03:59
Speaker 2: autism isn't inherited.
1:04:01
Speaker 1: Quilting and needlecraft are not a thing a neurotypical person
1:04:06
Speaker 1: is going to invent. It's just not just not. Yeah,
1:04:11
Speaker 1: and my mom got made this kid at a second
1:04:14
Speaker 1: hand store because I was complaining about how much candy
1:04:16
Speaker 1: crushes absorbed in my brain, and she's like, we'll try this.
1:04:18
Speaker 1: And a year and a half later, I finally worked
1:04:20
Speaker 1: up the balls to start working on it. And now
1:04:22
Speaker 1: I'm completely addicted and hurting my back in an effort
1:04:24
Speaker 1: to just keep doing more tiny little squares.
1:04:27
Speaker 2: I actually did some of it back in a couple
1:04:29
Speaker 2: of little ones, just because my mom was doing it,
1:04:31
Speaker 2: so I wanted to do it. It was fun, it
1:04:32
Speaker 2: was fun. I enjoyed it. But I was a kid,
1:04:34
Speaker 2: so crosstaching wasn't going to hold my attention for long.
1:04:36
Speaker 1: I did it when I was a kid too. In
1:04:38
Speaker 1: that was one of the many many handcrafts that that
1:04:40
Speaker 1: Valdorf had me do. Yeah, it's a really fun activity.
1:04:45
Speaker 1: But yeah, the concept of yeah, I would like these
1:04:48
Speaker 1: dresses with all this embroidery, and I want some of
1:04:50
Speaker 1: them to be delivered next week. And that's a lot
1:04:52
Speaker 1: of people that have to work on that. That's a
1:04:53
Speaker 1: lot of hours to get not just a dressed hand stitch,
1:04:56
Speaker 1: but also to have like a beautiful like scroll work
1:04:59
Speaker 1: flowers hurling around the bottos or whatever.
1:05:02
Speaker 2: It's a lot of talent, spending a lot of sleepless
1:05:04
Speaker 2: nights and avoiding a lot of other projects.
1:05:07
Speaker 1: And getting so much fuel for arthritis.
1:05:09
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then like the most important thing, she does
1:05:14
Speaker 2: a Columbo right on her way out. She does it,
1:05:16
Speaker 2: by the way, I want five more writing dresses, which
1:05:18
Speaker 2: is the whole reason she came in the first place,
1:05:20
Speaker 2: was to cover up the need for the writing dresses
1:05:23
Speaker 2: because she wants to escape.
1:05:24
Speaker 1: Well, those dresses, she says, she wants them made last,
1:05:28
Speaker 1: so they're not the ones for escaping.
1:05:30
Speaker 2: I thought they would be.
1:05:32
Speaker 1: Yes, Right before she leaves, she no, the thing is
1:05:34
Speaker 1: that she picks she wants dresses that are in her
1:05:38
Speaker 1: house colors, but not enough of them. So it's still
1:05:42
Speaker 1: a part of her telling the Tower like, yeah, I'm
1:05:45
Speaker 1: down to be a member of House Domadrid. Sure, totally
1:05:49
Speaker 1: totally there for that.
1:05:50
Speaker 2: Maybe this is why I thought her traveling dresses had
1:05:53
Speaker 2: the stripes of Kyrie in and House on them. Yeah,
1:05:55
Speaker 2: I mean this is twenty years before she goes writing.
1:05:58
Speaker 2: I'm assuming she's still not using the same dresses that
1:06:00
Speaker 2: she has made now in twenty years when she meets.
1:06:02
Speaker 1: Rand No, no, I think she's going to have to
1:06:04
Speaker 1: get some replacement dresses for sure. But yeah, she offers
1:06:08
Speaker 1: a gratuity for speedy completion, and she also accepts that
1:06:12
Speaker 1: the first dress she's going to get are going to
1:06:14
Speaker 1: be super pale because Swan offends the seamstress so much
1:06:17
Speaker 1: that the seamstress decides she's going to dress Moraine and
1:06:20
Speaker 1: very pale colors. And we do see that Moreene always
1:06:22
Speaker 1: dresses in dark colors the future, once she has proper
1:06:26
Speaker 1: control over her boardrobe. She doesn't with sky blue. She's like, no, no, no,
1:06:32
Speaker 1: we're going for sapphire blue, thank you, And yeah, that
1:06:35
Speaker 1: is what preparations she can do to get ready to
1:06:39
Speaker 1: try to get out of the tower when the opportunity
1:06:41
Speaker 1: presents itself, but she's not actually fully ready to go.
1:06:44
Speaker 1: And with that, that's the end of the chapter. That's
1:06:47
Speaker 1: all I have. Marketing.
1:06:48
Speaker 2: Yeah, we actually that was a I don't want to say,
1:06:51
Speaker 2: less meaty, but maybe less tangenty than some of the past.
1:06:55
Speaker 1: This dressmaking chapter is really I love seeing them get raised.
1:06:59
Speaker 1: I love the dress making thing, but yeah, there is
1:07:02
Speaker 1: maybe less super heavy plot stuff to talk about.
1:07:04
Speaker 2: We had some good tangents, good tangents, yeah, but it
1:07:07
Speaker 2: was it was definitely a oh yeah, the ceremony that
1:07:10
Speaker 2: we've seen before and dressmakers that we've kind of talked
1:07:13
Speaker 2: about before and stuff like that.
1:07:14
Speaker 1: But this is like an infamous dress making seem.
1:07:16
Speaker 2: Yes, well, isn't there one with Ninive and uh Elaine
1:07:21
Speaker 2: as well? That's very similar to.
1:07:23
Speaker 1: They go into a dressmaker's shop and then get a
1:07:27
Speaker 1: dosed on fork rout right.
1:07:28
Speaker 2: But I feel like some of the thoughts are very similar.
1:07:31
Speaker 1: Kind of but Moraine has a much more city girl
1:07:35
Speaker 1: approach to a seamstress.
1:07:37
Speaker 2: Than Elaine Ninive does.
1:07:40
Speaker 1: No, Ninive's the one that handles that whole discussion, and
1:07:42
Speaker 1: it's all just the code words for the yellow AJA
1:07:48
Speaker 1: message getting passed along like they really just passed through
1:07:51
Speaker 1: the door. They don't really do a lot of the
1:07:53
Speaker 1: seamstress song and dance, and Ninia wouldn't even know how
1:07:56
Speaker 1: to do any of it anyway, because she's a country girl.
1:07:59
Speaker 2: God. I just remember the being more like another scene
1:08:01
Speaker 2: where they could get dresses.
1:08:04
Speaker 1: No, there's scenes where people get dressed, but the tailoring
1:08:09
Speaker 1: part is different.
1:08:10
Speaker 2: And then I can think of the one with two
1:08:12
Speaker 2: on and Matt oh, yeah.
1:08:14
Speaker 1: That comes up in the next book. Yeah, and Memory
1:08:17
Speaker 1: of Fly that that is a scene. I guess one
1:08:19
Speaker 1: other thing's worth talking about here is the cost of
1:08:21
Speaker 1: this one gold crown for a woolen dress and ten
1:08:24
Speaker 1: for one made of silk. That implies that a gold
1:08:27
Speaker 1: crown is worth quite a bit if one can be
1:08:31
Speaker 1: worth a dress.
1:08:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they get a thousand a year, They.
1:08:35
Speaker 1: Get a thousand a year. Yeah. Do we know approximately
1:08:38
Speaker 1: how much a gold piece is? Is there some kind
1:08:41
Speaker 1: of rule of thumb for translating that?
1:08:44
Speaker 2: It's the value depends on plot, I think is basically
1:08:48
Speaker 2: what it boils down to.
1:08:49
Speaker 1: Sure, Okay, well, how much would a handmade dress, tailored
1:08:54
Speaker 1: wool dress cost Now if I were to buy one,
1:08:58
Speaker 1: if I were to make one and I was a
1:09:00
Speaker 1: good seamstress and not learning everything over and over again,
1:09:05
Speaker 1: I don't know hundreds of.
1:09:06
Speaker 2: Dollars right, And this is also like, yeah, I feel
1:09:09
Speaker 2: like this is also before money becomes very weird in
1:09:12
Speaker 2: later books with like and there's weights based on the nation,
1:09:16
Speaker 2: so every nation has a slightly different value depending on
1:09:20
Speaker 2: you know, Tarvallon marks are different than Carina Mars.
1:09:24
Speaker 1: Tarvon has the best money, yes, which makes sense since
1:09:27
Speaker 1: they're the nation makers, which would make fun asume that
1:09:31
Speaker 1: they've got a mint as well in Tarvallon. I mean,
1:09:34
Speaker 1: every nation's got to have one, but Tarvalon's got to
1:09:36
Speaker 1: have a mint with like some gold standards.
1:09:39
Speaker 2: So just a gold crown is ten gold marks, a
1:09:42
Speaker 2: gold mark is ten silver crowns, a silver crown is
1:09:45
Speaker 2: ten silver marks, a silver mark is ten silver pennies,
1:09:48
Speaker 2: a silver penny is ten copper pennies.
1:09:51
Speaker 1: So and we see like copper pennies in like small
1:09:55
Speaker 1: quantity being used to pay for a meal or a
1:09:58
Speaker 1: mug of ale or something like that.
1:10:00
Speaker 2: I kind of think of one hundred silver pennies. You know,
1:10:02
Speaker 2: back in the day when like a penny was worth something, right,
1:10:07
Speaker 2: that's kind of a silver penny is kind of what
1:10:08
Speaker 2: a penny used to be worth, and a copper penny
1:10:11
Speaker 2: was like because we used to have like tenths of
1:10:12
Speaker 2: pennies that people used to and that's what our copper
1:10:15
Speaker 2: pennies are in this world, which means silver mark is
1:10:18
Speaker 2: the equivalent to kind of like a dollar, an old
1:10:21
Speaker 2: school dollar. A silver crown would be like ten dollars.
1:10:26
Speaker 2: A gold mark is one hundred dollars, and a gold
1:10:30
Speaker 2: crown is like one thousand dollars.
1:10:32
Speaker 1: Oh, a mark and a crown are very different.
1:10:35
Speaker 2: Mark a crown is ten marks.
1:10:37
Speaker 1: Wow.
1:10:38
Speaker 2: And that's consistent throughout both silver and gold and copper.
1:10:42
Speaker 1: One thousand dollars for a wool dress or ten thousand
1:10:45
Speaker 1: dollars or a silk dress. I guess they must have
1:10:49
Speaker 1: very good pay for their employees all the way through
1:10:52
Speaker 1: that entire supply chain. It must not be a lot
1:10:54
Speaker 1: of a human labor exploitation all the way down to
1:10:57
Speaker 1: the harvesting of the fibers.
1:10:58
Speaker 2: And that makes the stipend a million dollars a year
1:11:02
Speaker 2: in like nineteen twenties dollars.
1:11:05
Speaker 1: Wow. Wow, Wow, You've become a Robber Barren level of
1:11:10
Speaker 1: wealthy for the low low price of becoming an isidaie
1:11:13
Speaker 1: hm damn. And that's after they've invested, however, many years
1:11:17
Speaker 1: into feeding and housing you. They have a lot of money.
1:11:22
Speaker 1: Tarvala has a lot of money.
1:11:24
Speaker 2: You are essentially, yeah, you essentially become a millionaire instantly
1:11:28
Speaker 2: when you become an isidi. All isidi are millionaires.
1:11:31
Speaker 1: Every year they get their millionaire status refreshed. So if
1:11:34
Speaker 1: they don't spend all that, they are a multimillionaire before
1:11:37
Speaker 1: they've even gotten the isidie ageless look set in properly
1:11:42
Speaker 1: geez wow.
1:11:44
Speaker 2: And that's assuming they don't have any way of making
1:11:46
Speaker 2: their own money or any of their own power or
1:11:49
Speaker 2: using their own power to you know, or like Moraine
1:11:51
Speaker 2: who has her own states.
1:11:53
Speaker 1: Right right business ventures they could choose to get.
1:11:56
Speaker 2: Involved in, like invest that money and stuff, because you
1:11:59
Speaker 2: have three hundred years let it grow, right, you know.
1:12:01
Speaker 2: So yeah, money's not really an issue for the isidye
1:12:04
Speaker 2: oh wow. So again, that's that's just so sort of
1:12:07
Speaker 2: going off the idea that like a silver penny is
1:12:10
Speaker 2: the equivalent of a penny that a couple of those
1:12:12
Speaker 2: will buy you.
1:12:12
Speaker 1: A meal, right, yeah, like nineteen twenties.
1:12:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, nineteen twenties, like pennies.
1:12:17
Speaker 1: One hundred years ago. Yeah, wow, trippy.
1:12:21
Speaker 2: And now what money's worth maybe one hundred times that, Yeah,
1:12:24
Speaker 2: with inflation, so you know when we're talking, Yeah, they
1:12:27
Speaker 2: were millionaires, they're like one hundred million. They're getting like
1:12:30
Speaker 2: one hundred million bucks in modern money handed.
1:12:33
Speaker 1: To them as an annual salary.
1:12:35
Speaker 2: As an annual salary.
1:12:37
Speaker 1: These are some absurdly wealthy people in a world where
1:12:40
Speaker 1: you know, a lot of villages have very little hard
1:12:42
Speaker 1: currency circulating in them.
1:12:44
Speaker 2: I would guess that there's a little bit of a
1:12:46
Speaker 2: falloff in terms of money, right, Like I don't think
1:12:50
Speaker 2: I think we're getting a little outside of ourselves in
1:12:52
Speaker 2: terms of how much money they're getting because just because
1:12:54
Speaker 2: I think nice things cost so much more that the
1:12:57
Speaker 2: buying power goes down.
1:12:58
Speaker 1: Sure. Sure, but there's a reason why they're always dressed
1:13:02
Speaker 1: in nice clothes and have nice lamps, and have nice horses,
1:13:05
Speaker 1: and the warders have nice gear, and like it behooves
1:13:10
Speaker 1: the eyes to dye as an institution to always look tiptop.
1:13:13
Speaker 1: And yeah, with that, I think we're done.
1:13:16
Speaker 2: I think we're done. Yeah, No, having fun with the
1:13:19
Speaker 2: phone with these books a lot. Really love the Robert
1:13:21
Speaker 2: Jordan stuff. Looking forward to the next couple of chapters
1:13:24
Speaker 2: for sure. Yeah.
1:13:25
Speaker 1: Well, I think we'll probably just be doing another three
1:13:27
Speaker 1: chapters next episode, so stay tuned for that. And in
1:13:30
Speaker 1: the meantime we can take a break and then go
1:13:33
Speaker 1: do Dungeon Caroler, Carl Dungeon, Andrew Ki's cookbook.
1:13:36
Speaker 2: It sounds good to me.
1:14:16
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to the Wheel of Time Spoilers podcast.
1:14:19
Speaker 1: Please rate and review us on your podcast app, and
1:14:22
Speaker 1: consider supporting us on Patreon for ad free episodes. Watts
1:14:26
Speaker 1: Spoilers is a production of Fox and Raven Media. For
1:14:29
Speaker 1: more podcasts from Fox and Raven Media, visit our website
1:14:33
Speaker 1: at Foxendravenmedia dot com.