Transcript

Sacha Ledan · Calm Under Fire

Col. John Boggs: Well, good day. Good morning. Good afternoon. Wherever everybody is. This is Colonel John Boggs of Fortitude Consulting. And ⁓ this podcast is Calm Under Fire, where we talk about leadership and leaders who have to lead ⁓ when the pressure's on. And today we have Sasha Ladon, who ⁓ Sasha works at the intersection. Now, he is very interesting fellow. He works at an intersection of global talent and American opportunity. a co-founder of Raiseable Funders Hub. ⁓ helps international entrepreneurs navigate fundraising, go to market strategy, and in networks that often determine who gets traction and who gets left behind, who gets overlooked. Previously, he worked at Stanford GSB. He built and led programs supporting hundreds of founders, partnering with top tier venture firms and helping companies scale with intention. So today we're talking about access, resilience, and what it really takes to build an unfamiliar territory. So Sasha, thank you very much for being here today. I greatly appreciate it. Sacha: Thank you for having me. Very excited to have this chat. Col. John Boggs: Thank you. Say, Sasha, do you mind if we just jump right into it? Perfect. Perfect. Sasha, you've chosen to focus on international founders building in the US. So what drew you to that work? Sacha: Please, let's do that. So I, you myself, I'm multicultural and multinational. So I was born in the US, but I grew up in France. ⁓ My mom's from Iran, my dad's from France. So I have kind of seen a lot of different cultures and people. ⁓ And I've spent about half my life in the US and half my life in France with some stints in the UK as well. So I've been kind of in between cultures, in between kind of local and international immigrant and ⁓ Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Sacha: citizens. So I kind of feel for these people, for the people that are in a similar way, and I kind of naturally associate with people that are ⁓ international or immigrants or expats. And so that always kind of had a specific draw to me. And working, I've been, you know, about eight years in the Bay working around the entrepreneurship ecosystem. Obviously, that attracts a lot of international people ⁓ from everywhere in the world. So I have Col. John Boggs: Yes. Sacha: kind of seeing these people struggle and there's specific issues that come with that. If you're not local, you're not plugged into the network, plugged into the ecosystem or even the culture and kind of some other factors that help you navigate a city or building a company in a specific country, ⁓ it has extra hurdles. So that's something that I felt passionate about. generally feel passionate about helping founders, but even more so when it's people that are coming from kind of everywhere in the world to do so here. Col. John Boggs: Yeah, yeah, I could imagine. what is the biggest challenge? Well, let me ask it this way. ⁓ The invisible challenge. Most immigrant founders, what is it? They don't talk about it, but they feel it every day. Do you get that? What is that? What's that invisible challenge? Sacha: Sure. I think there's not just one. There's probably many different ones that one or many can experience depending on their background or where coming from. I think the visible ones are things like visas and kind of legality of being here, building companies that are obviously more complicated as an immigrant. The invisible ones may be like lack of access, think is a big one, lack of connection to the Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Good. Sacha: to the ecosystem and the key players in it. I think there's some things that can be also like lack of cultural fit or know how, so you don't know exactly, you know, people's references or what they're joking about or their humor or things that are make it harder to connect because you just don't understand it. ⁓ Some things could be, you know, like your accent, maybe you feel self-conscious or maybe you feel people kind of Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Sacha: keep you a little further apart because you're having a hard time expressing yourself. Or even yourself, you feel like you're not fully yourself speaking in a second or third language that you're not fully a master of. You're not able to express yourself in the same way or be the same person fully almost. So I think those are some things that may be under the surface, but I think a lot of immigrants and international people wrestle with. Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Sacha: And it's just extra, right, difficulties, ⁓ extra layers to it that you're ready. It's hard enough to build a company, you know, and all these things kind of additionally come on top of it. ⁓ And, know, myself, I came to, I thought it was very American, you know, I grew up in France, but I was coming every summer to the U.S. and I spoke English with my mom. I had no problems with the language. Col. John Boggs: Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Sacha: But I moved here when I was 18 to go to college. And it was actually a huge culture shock still. And I was like, oh, wow, I don't know what these people are talking about or joking about or referencing. And it took a long time to adapt and to kind of fit in. So I can only imagine if you have no prior connection to the US and you come in your 20s or 30s and you're not fully in control or mastering the language and you don't know all the... Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Sacha: cultural references or the subtleties of how we interact. Like that's a big one to get over. Col. John Boggs: Wow, I could imagine. Tell me, how does that shape the leader of the, how does that shape their leadership? Because they're building an organization, you have to lead it. So how does, and it's almost as though they're fighting from behind. So how do they build their leadership to run a business like Sacha: Mm-hmm. Yeah, I mean, I think it's a hard path that it gives you a few extra maybe elements. It's hard to generalize. Obviously, everyone's going to be different, but I do think it helps you be on the one hand more empathetic maybe towards your employees or the people you're working with and the struggles they may be facing in and out of work. I think it also tends to make you more resilient overall ⁓ just because But the very nature of what you have to go through to just be here, ⁓ to go through all the visa processes, to be in competition with so many people from everywhere in the world that does want to come here, and overcoming all those hurdles kind of tends to make you just more resilient by the fact that you had to go through this experience, right? Again, it's generalizations, right? But many, many founders, local founders are very resilient, very empathetic. Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Sacha: I just think you may have maybe a disproportionate representation of those traits if you're international and having to go through all this and learning along the way. ⁓ Col. John Boggs: That's great. So they tend to hang in there. don't quit and go away. That's great. Sacha: Well, I'm sure many do, but the ones that remain are the ones that did hang in there, right? And that didn't make it through. So those are the ones you see or you meet that are still here. ⁓ Interpretership is a hard path and failure is just an integral part of it, ⁓ whether or not you're international. So for a lot of people, it's just not going to work out, at least not the first time. ⁓ Col. John Boggs: ⁓ Mm-hmm. Sacha: But I think if you've faced a lot of adversity in other parts of your life, it helps you kind of navigate that and maybe try again if you do fail the first time. Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Okay, so let's go here because they're trying, well, what you do is you find you're helping them fundraise, you're helping them get started. So ⁓ is there a thing where there's some misunderstandings about fundraising that, well, actually, I suspect many of us have misunderstandings about fundraising, but. Is there something that's particularly difficult when you're coming from overseas and you're trying to stand up a business here where you, mean, this place is crazy and you're trying to stand up a business. Is there something unusual about fundraising? Sacha: So I would say, of all, fundraising is a difficult exercise for everyone, right? I think it's very difficult and people often underestimate how hard and how long it is to do it. ⁓ I think there's another layer that comes when you're coming internationally that's kind of a... So something I've noticed, and this is pretty, I think ubiquitous, like compared to the US, ⁓ Most people are not as good at ⁓ kind of pitching and marketing and just kind of storytelling. I think like there's something in US culture that naturally kind of breathes it into people being good storytellers, being good, kind of selling yourself, selling your vision, things like that. So I do think there's a bit of a learning curve there for most people and specific cultures may have a bit more of a like humility, maybe. to it. So like I worked a lot with Ukrainians, particularly when I was at Stanford, we launched a program for Ukrainian founders called Stanfording Not Ukraine. And, you know, they would end the program by pitching to VCs and building a whole pitch and then getting feedback from real VCs. And one of the most recurrent feedback was you're not asking for enough money. You're not asking and you're not showing your vision is big enough. ⁓ Which is kind of funny, but it goes against their their culture where they kind of undersell, over deliver. That's like, no, you're here to like really show us the maximum, right? ⁓ So ask for more, say you're doing more. So I think that's a kind of maybe an invisible thing that people don't realize until, you know, the rubber hits the ground. And like, ⁓ wow, we're getting rejected actually, because we're not asking for enough. We're not like thinking big enough. We're not ambitious enough in a way. Yeah. Col. John Boggs: Wow. Wow, wow. That's interesting. I was actually told something like that in what I do early on in my career. Hey John, this is a great proposal, but you're not asking for enough. I was rocked. Sacha: It's counterintuitive, right? Yeah. But actually asking for... There you go. Asking for more often kind of signals that you're serious in some way, right? You're a big deal in a way that you're going to do big things. And particularly in the VC space, you don't want to miss the big thing, right? That's the whole game. And if you don't believe you're going to make... Col. John Boggs: It is. It was counterintuitive. It was counterintuitive, but I never had that problem again. Mm-hmm. That's right. Sacha: a multibillion dollar company no one else will. So it's got to start with you as the founder. And you got to share that vision clearly. Col. John Boggs: Wow, how does that land when you're building, when you're working with the companies? How does that land with them that, nope, you've got to think much bigger. How does that land? Sacha: I mean, I think it's a bit of a maybe a shock at first, you know, it's like, ⁓ we want to be realistic. We want to, you know, this is what we truly believe we can achieve. And sometimes they may feel like maybe it's a bit dishonest to go and say, ⁓ we're going to do all this extra things, right. Or all this extra levels. But the reality is, you know, you got to It's a fine line sometimes between selling a dream and the reality you could achieve and somewhere in between is where you'll probably land. But if you don't aim high, you're not going to get there no matter what. ⁓ So I think it's about building a bit your ambition. And sometimes it's just you're holding yourself back a bit, right? There's a fear element maybe as well of like, it's easier to say I'll do Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Sacha: you know, 1 million or 10 million revenue than than 100, right? Like, that seems more achievable seems a little less scary. But I think what's your something so special about particularly the Bay Area and the US in general, I think is there are many dreamers, there are many people that are so ambitious and smart and hardworking. And if you're here long enough, it kind of rubs off on you and you kind of feel like, okay, yeah, I can do it too. I want to do it too. I have that big vision. So I think that's that's kind of the ⁓ The cultural aspects, if you're in France, for example, where I grew up, it's a bit less, you go a little less ambitious, a little more balanced. So I think, yeah, it's maybe hard at first, but it's a learning curve like anything. And the more time you spend here, the more people you talk to and meet, the more likely you're going to understand how it works and the value of it as well. Col. John Boggs: Wow, it's idea and execution. Here we go. ⁓ It seems to be that disconnect. This is the idea, but you're asking me for a bigger idea. And now it's how am I going to execute that? ⁓ my. Sacha: Yeah. That's a huge question, right? And there's often a misconception that all the value of what you're doing is in the idea. You need to have this transformational idea of something that's never been done before. ⁓ And that's how entrepreneurship works. But the reality is actually not quite different. It's not quite that. mean, ideas do matter. But if you have a really good idea, the reality is there's probably other people that have that idea. And if not now, Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Sacha: By the moment you're actually doing it and out in the market, people going to copy it? Because it's good idea. So the idea is not that much of a differentiator. It's more about the execution. ⁓ It's about the execution and the people you surround yourself with in terms of employees, terms of clients, in terms of investors, in terms of the people that will help you get to that level of execution you need to be above the rest. Col. John Boggs: Right. It's a good idea. ⁓ Sacha: And we've seen it a lot. know, a lot of companies weren't the first to have that idea, but ended up winning. You know, a big example is like Google. You know, there's a lot of search engines. Google wasn't the first one. They just ended up being the one to do it the best and kind of win the game. Col. John Boggs: That's a very, very good analogy right there. ⁓ my goodness. So. ⁓ Tell me about the ⁓ do get with networking, with building ⁓ that group of who can help them? ⁓ How is that out? Sacha: Yeah, I think it's an essential part of it, right? I think it's so hard to do all of these things and end up on top and be a kind of era-defining company without a network, especially at the beginning. And so, intentionality and building that network is critical. It's critical. And how do you do it? mean, when you're coming out of here and you came from Europe or Asia or anywhere and you know no one and you're just... Brand new here, it's really hard, right? But especially in a place like the Bay Area, which is very centered around entrepreneurship, there are many events, there are many opportunities and communities and things you can join to build up that network. And I think it depends where you are in the stage of your journey as an entrepreneur, as a founder. For example, if you're just coming here and you're just exploring ideas and you don't really know what you want to do yet, maybe you do a lot of different events and you kind of see, you know, ⁓ maybe I'll go to an event with people doing things in sustainability and people doing things in biotech and people. So you kind of get a feel for different areas that feel for different people. And maybe you'll find a co-founder. Maybe you'll find an idea. Maybe you'll find both. If on the other hand, you're already doing a company, you're already Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Sacha: you know, going whether you raise money or not, but you're already really focused on this one thing, then you want to be more, you know, matchmaking between the event and what you're doing. So you're going to specific events for either that sector or maybe for investors investing in that sector, or maybe advisors, or you're going to be a little bit more ⁓ specific, right? And directed. But And there's many ways, right? Like if you have a VC that invests in you, they can connect you. If you go to accelerators like a Y Combinator or other startup accelerators, that will help you get into great communities. ⁓ Or if you're going to university, know, like Stanford or others, right? Like that's a great way to have a built-in community that you're just instantly part of. ⁓ So there's many ways to do it and there's no one right way. But I do think it's a big differentiator in your like chance of success down the road. Col. John Boggs: love that. There's no one right way. ⁓ It's execute. It's just get out there and go do it. I like that. Yeah. All right. Sacha: Mm-hmm. Yeah, start, start, learn, iterate, you know, like figure out what works or what doesn't and kind of keep doing that till you have a good enough critical mass and you have the right people around you because that changes everything. Col. John Boggs: changes everything. It brings a certain energy, doesn't it? Yeah. Sacha: Absolutely, absolutely. I think that's the power of a place like the Bay Area, like Silicon Valley, is that there's so many, there's this critical mass of people that are focused and concentrated around this entrepreneurship ecosystem. And they're all, you know, they're ambitious and smart and hardworking and they all want to do great things. And they're all here together talking to each other and mingling. And it really does create something ⁓ that's almost impossible to replicate. ⁓ And I think to this day, there's still no place like the Bay Area in terms of entrepreneurship. I think it's still the top ecosystem and it will be for a while. Col. John Boggs: Yeah. Yeah. you said the word ambitious. So tell me working with those ambitious founders. has that taught you anything about ambition yourself? I mean, what has that taught you about you working with them? Sacha: It certainly has helped me find ⁓ or maybe be in touch more with my own ambition, I think. ⁓ It's something that kind of that energy is infectious to a degree, right? ⁓ So it certainly has taught me to to accept it within myself, to to use it, ⁓ to develop it and to be more ambitious. You know, like the culture I come from in France is overall ⁓ I would say less ambitious than the US for sure. a bit more, there's a bit more of a balance or focus on balance between, you know, enjoying life and working and accomplishing things that kind of work life balance, which I think the French may be fairly famous for. So there was a bit less, maybe like a momentum, you know, in a way. But when you're here and you look around, you know, and I see my friends that I, the people I, you know, hang out with or people I see in work contexts. And they've built great companies and done amazing things and had it kind of these adventures and these successes. And it's inspiring. It's inspiring. And it wants me to it makes me want to accomplish some of these things as well and kind of see what what my potential to achieve may be. ⁓ And then eventually I'll go back to France and relax. But for now, I think this is There's no other place I'd rather be in the kind of middle of my career. Col. John Boggs: Okay, outstanding. Tell me, there something you see in the US, in the United States, in the ecosystem here? Is there something that you can see that could be done better, that we could be better at as far as helping founders, helping them grow? Sacha: Yeah, I think, well, still the US is number one and it is a fragmented space, right? There's no just one area. There's the Bay Area, there's New York, Boston, Austin, like there's many areas where there's kind of ecosystem that are very good for founders and developing your company. I think the US, obviously, has done a lot of things, right? They do a lot of things, right? I think the... some things that could be done better or that where we can improve is on the maybe more human side of things and less the business side. ⁓ And so, and I think there's been more, there's been more focus on that in recent years, there's been more focus on mental health and you know, not, not people burn out a lot, people get depressed a lot, people have a lot of issues with building companies. It's a very difficult, very lonely exercise at times. ⁓ and so I think a little bit more focus on, you as a person and not just you as a founder or you as an employee of a startup or, an investor. ⁓ I think that could be quite beneficial. ⁓ and, and, know, the counterpart to that ambition is what happens when, when you don't reach your ambitions or when you fail, ⁓ and what that does to you and your psyche. So. a little bit more acceptance on failure or stigmatizing it less to some degree, ⁓ I think would be quite beneficial as well. Col. John Boggs: Oh, I love that. I love that stigmatizing. That is so true because you need to fail forward. If you're not failing, you're not trying. mean, yeah, the whole thought of failure can really ruin a person here. Yeah, I'm gonna fail and I don't try. Yeah, Sacha: Yeah. and there's actually also interestingly enough, kind of the reverse example. ⁓ And is is what happens if you do succeed? What after what happens after success? Right. And I think of someone, Justin Khan, who who who co founded Twitter ⁓ and know, he's made hundreds of millions, if not billions. And he he was very open about his experience that after he did sell and ⁓ make money that he could ever dream of and kind of reach all the success that he could, that he always wanted to. ⁓ He felt super depressed and he didn't know what to do next and what to do with his life. It's like, ⁓ what, what now? So that's the kind of also the counterpart, right? Like success and failure and how we deal with both. I think it could be done better. I think we can generally be more open and more sharing about both with each other. Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yes, yes, I agree with that. That's very good. Very good. Is there an area that you see now in your experience with working with founders and just working in the US period, is there an area where you see, this is the growing area. There's not enough in this particular area. More founders should be looking here instead of over there. Is there anything like that that jumps out at you? Sacha: Yeah, I mean, certainly right now, obviously, AI is the huge, overwhelming trend, and everyone is hyper-focused on that and all the applications of it and how to create more agents and more things that are autonomously working on your behalf. ⁓ So that's obviously kind of overshadowing a lot of other things, right? I think there's a lot of other opportunities that maybe are less regarded right now because of AI. ⁓ which in part is justified, of course, I think it's a huge opportunity. But I think certain things, and maybe they're getting more attention now, but certainly things that are more in some ways like unsexy businesses, ⁓ more physical infrastructure businesses, more plumbing, electrician kind of businesses, things like that, which are going to be very important. And innovations in those fields are maybe not as happening, not as fast or Col. John Boggs: Mmm. Mm-hmm. Sacha: not as focused on. So I think those are big things. ⁓ I think there's a huge transformation in healthcare as well that's gonna happen and on ⁓ drug development and just longevity and lifespan in general. And AI will obviously accelerate and work with ⁓ that sector on some of those things. But yeah, I do think like there's a lot of opportunity for new founders or people thinking about building businesses in things that are not so hot right now or not on the top of the news or VCs list of all this AI stuff, but that are going to be vital and that are going to be super important and there is big opportunities there. Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Yeah. if someone feels called to build something, something meaningful here, and I'm coming from, I don't know, France and I want to build something meaningful here, what's the first thing they need to be doing to start it off right? Sacha: The first thing is to find, know, really focus on finding a problem, ⁓ a problem that's unsolved or where people are underserved in that market and finding who would pay for you to solve that problem. ⁓ That's really the main thing, right? So problem finding and it's probably the first solution later, right? Like if you're finding a problem, And no one wants to pay for it. You know, maybe you can build a nonprofit. That's a different model, right? If you're finding a problem and people will pay for it, but not enough, then maybe it's maybe you're build a small business. Maybe you build like a small medium business, doesn't have any external investors and it's just you own it and you service those, the market and solve that problem. But if you build, if you find a big problem, A lot of people would be willing to pay a lot for it. That's when you can kind of build in the venture backed startup ⁓ where you're going to need, you know, influx of capital to go big, to go fast, to do all these things. But it really all starts with the problem you're solving. And so it starts with talking to people and talking to to users or clients or whatever that may be in your context. But it starts with investigating that and figuring out, OK. Is this really a problem? Do people really will pay to solve this problem? And can we, can we solve it? Of course, then you need to solve it. Right. So yeah, but it starts with the problem and, and in the end, your solution to it may change, but the problem should remain the same, right. That you're trying to solve as you build your company. Col. John Boggs: Can't resolve it yet. Yeah. Yeah, I say the same thing to, well, something similar, always for people who do what I do and are looking to work with clients, speak to their problem. Nobody cares about what you do. This is the problem I'm resolving. Speaking those terms, you have their attention. Sasha, for international founders, for international founders who are listening, hopefully who are listening and are serious about building in the US, Sacha: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Col. John Boggs: and doing it the right way. What's the best way for them to connect with you to learn more about your work? Sacha: They can reach out on LinkedIn, certainly. They can look at my profile, me a LinkedIn message. ⁓ I think, you know, I'm always happy to talk to people, especially founders trying to come here, trying to figure things out. I mentor a lot of university students and young founders trying to kind of begin in that path. ⁓ Col. John Boggs: makes sense. Mm-hmm. Sacha: You could also go to raiseable.vc and send the message there, kind of look at what we're doing there with the SIL, who's the co-founder there. And if it's not me, think one thing I've seen a lot, and that's a big difference, I think, between the US and many other places, is that you can just reach out to people and many of them will actually take the time to to talk to you, to drink a coffee, to, you even if it's 15 minutes, 20 minutes, take a chance to send messages to people you want to meet. And that's something I was a bit worried about, you know, when I came here, it's like, that seems weird. ⁓ But the truth is like so many people have helped me without any, you know, I had nothing to give them really, ⁓ especially when I came here, I knew no one and very little, and they still took the time to explain things to me, like how the VC, investment ecosystem, how does that work, to build a company, all these things. I was very curious, very eager to learn, but had very little knowledge. And if you show you're passionate, if you show you're interested, if you show you're respectful, people will take the time. So I think take a chance to reach out to whoever you find interesting, whoever you want to learn from. Won't be 100 % response rate, but you'll have a good chance to speak to at least some of those people. Col. John Boggs: Mm-hmm. Sacha: And same goes for me. So please reach out. I may not always respond. Sometimes I'm busy, but I will try to respond to everyone. And I'm happy to meet as much as I can, as much as I have free time to meet and share what I know to help people. Col. John Boggs: Wow, that is absolutely superb advice. And let me reiterate, just reach out, reach out to people. You may be surprised at what you may connect with. And of course, Sasha has already made himself available. So folks, that's it for this session. I wanna thank you, Sasha, for joining us. I greatly appreciate it. That was absolutely wonderful. Thank you so much. Sacha: Mm-hmm. Col. John Boggs: And to everyone else, good luck out there and I'll see you on the next go. That's it out here. Sacha: Thank you, John.