Latest / Beyond the Paycheck / Companies are getting priced out of benefits. Now what?

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Companies are getting priced out of benefits. Now what? · Beyond the Paycheck

• Beyond the Paycheck - Amber Little Recorded 2026-09-29 Kelsey Willock: Welcome, Amber Little, CHRO at Nation's Best. We're so excited to have you today. To kick us off, I'd love for you to share with our audience a little bit about yourself, your current role and background, and where you're calling in from today. Amber Little: Absolutely. Well, first of all, thank you for having me on. I'm really excited to be here. So I'm calling from Dallas. Right now, I'm the chief HR officer for Nation's Best. And so Nation's Best is a holding company. We have hardware stores, home centers, lumber yards. So it's a very different industry than I've ever worked in in my career. I've been here a little over five years, actually almost six now, next month. And we're a rapidly growing organization. So when I started here in 2020, we were on our 12th acquisition and around 100 employees. And today we have 60 stores and a little over 1,100 employees. So it's been a wild ride. But like I said, I haven't been in this industry forever. Before here, I've been in medical, medical devices, I've been in oil and gas, I've been in government. So I've kind of done a little bit of HR in all those different industries and held different types of HR roles in all those different industries. So my background is very diverse in terms of what I've done and the industries I've worked in. Kelsey Willock: Well, really excited to dig deeper, especially into the work that you're doing today and have done. But before we get there, I'd love to take a little step into the past and learn a little bit more about your first role ever, and if you recall what you spent your first paycheck on. Amber Little: So when I think about my first role, I actually go back to when I was 15. When I was 15 years old, I started my first job as a dietary aide in a nursing home. I was helping prepare meals, I was helping ensure they weren't getting sugar if they weren't supposed to have sugar, and then washing dishes and spending a lot of time with the residents as well. So that was really my first introduction to an actual job that held responsibility. I mean, you know, babysitting, things like that, it's a lot different. But that was really my first role plunging into that. My first job out of college was with a company called Skillsnet, and it was a consulting role with the government. And so I've done a lot of work like that since then, but I think that first job at 15 probably has taught me more than a lot of the other roles over the years, if I'm quite honest. Kelsey Willock: So I want to dig a little bit deeper into that. How do you think this early career and money story of yours has influenced how you think about showing up for your people and making decisions, whether it's regarding pay or supporting folks more broadly? Amber Little: Sure. So I think that role really taught me that every role has a story, right? Every role matters. My role mattered. If I didn't do my role, the dishes didn't get washed, right? If the chef didn't do their role, they didn't get fed. And the nurses mattered too, right? They needed that quality of care. So everyone there contributed to the residents' overall experience. And so I think what that really taught me was the value of someone's work is not really determined by their title. And I'm not a title person. My CEO calls me a hundred different HR titles, and it's not that big a deal to me. I'm HR. I'm just there to serve our folks. But I think that's what that really taught me, was titles aren't really important. So compensation obviously matters, but I think so does dignity, opportunity, respect. And I think really understanding that that paycheck means something to every single person. Kelsey Willock: So this is a really good segue into digging a little bit deeper into how we actually support folks. Right now there is this massive trend around supporting the whole person, for lack of a better word, beyond the paycheck. It's not just about how we pay folks, it's about how we support them in terms of their mental health, their physical health, their financial health, and more. So can you tell me a little bit about what you're particularly proud of, or some of the initiatives you might be working on that really support the whole person, and what you have found to be most meaningful? Amber Little: So I really think of benefits, or the whole human, as five different pillars. So, you know, the physical wellness of things like their health benefits, et cetera; mental and emotional well-being; financial well-being. I think growth and development is a part of that too. And then lastly, which I don't think a lot of organizations focus on, is connection and belonging. And so our benefit strategy is really focused around those five different strategies and ensuring that we are actually supporting the whole person. It's not just financial or just wellness in general, physical wellness. It's the whole thing, the whole human, so that they can thrive both personally and professionally. And so I think one of the things I'm most proud of when it comes to our benefits is that every year we hold a women's retreat, a women's leadership retreat. And that hits along a lot of these different pillars. So it's personal development, it's relationships and connections, it's mental well-being. They get to disconnect for a couple of days, and they get space away from those daily demands. And so I think that's especially meaningful because in the industry that I'm in, the lumber and building materials industry, women are underrepresented. And so this helps us provide leadership development and connection through their lens that a lot of organizations usually don't think to do. So I think that's one of the biggest things I'm proud of. We're in our fourth year. We actually just finished last week, our fourth session. We had about 60 women from our organization go out to Graham, Texas, to a ranch for leadership development and connection, and we tried to rope cattle and we did archery, a lot of things that pulled us out of our comfort zone a little bit, but things that I don't think women would traditionally stop and take the time to do. So that's one of the things I'm most proud of here at Nation's Best, being able to do that, and that my leadership continues to support that. Kelsey Willock: I love that, and I also just love the fact that it's not the standard answer. You can support the whole person by doing unique things. Roping cattle might not seem related to your day to day, but helping folks feel elevated, feel supported, feel they've got community around them can be so impactful in how they show up beyond it. Where do you think organizations are falling short right now in terms of supporting the whole person? Amber Little: Well, I don't think that organizations are really considering what the whole person is. I think they're really just continuing to add benefits and add benefits, but I think the harder part is connecting the dots between all of those things. So I think employees need to understand how the resources you're providing them are actually supporting their lives. If they don't know what the benefit is, if they don't know how to access it, if they don't know what the value is, then it's really worthless to them. Benefits obviously can't compensate for poor daily employee management or manager behavior or workload or flexibility or any of those things. But I do think that being able to connect the dots and ensuring that they know what they don't know is important. Kelsey Willock: How do you think about making the connection between supporting people and the quality of their output, and how do you measure it? How do you know something has actually worked, whether it's a retreat, a benefit in general, or a communication of a certain benefit? Amber Little: Yeah, so I don't believe that supporting people is separate from performance. It enables performance. I think people do better work when they have clarity, when they have the resources to do their job, when they have trust with their management, and then just support in general. And in retail, our employees are a major part of the customer experience. Our employees are the ones that are helping the customers, and the customers impact that bottom line. And so I don't think support necessarily eliminates accountability, but I think high expectations and more human-centered leadership definitely can coexist. So supporting people doesn't mean lowering the bar. We just have to give them what they need to reach it. Kelsey Willock: And how do you make the case for investment in these initiatives when maybe the spreadsheet might not so obviously support them? Amber Little: Well, I think that people initiatives in general always impact the bottom line at some point, right? I just think that it's important to separate the leading and lagging indicators. People investments a lot of times don't create immediate ROI, but you start with a business problem or what barrier you're trying to solve, and then I try to bring my C-suite into it early so that we can problem solve together. So I help them consider what the cost is, but also what is the risk of not doing something? Is it turnover? Is it retention? Is it recruiting costs? Lost knowledge, all those different things. And all of that impacts our customers, which then impacts our bottom line. So I really try to help connect that chain: our people experience is going to lead to engagement. That engagement is going to impact their performance or their retention. And that ultimately impacts customer experience, which then impacts financial performance. So again, not every people investment has that immediate return, but that doesn't mean that it doesn't have a financial impact. Kelsey Willock: Can you tell me a little bit about an experiment that you've run, perhaps in the benefits strategy, that didn't go the way you expected, and what you learned from it? Amber Little: Well, I would say we just implemented a new benefits plan last March. And I've really pushed back on implementing something that our employees were not comfortable with, because it's hard. They need education. And sometimes the more education they get, the better they get. But it's hard to provide education across 1,100 employees. But we went to a different benefits plan that did require a little bit more education. And to be honest, I think we're struggling with it. It was something that we implemented hoping that it would save both the employee and the company overall costs, but still provide a benefit that was valuable. But it's different. It's not the typical PPO healthcare plan that everybody's used to or has grown used to. We've gone to this kind of variable co-pay plan, which is a little bit different. It was different for me. It's the first time I've ever experienced it too. So I wouldn't say that it's failing necessarily, but it's definitely been challenging to implement something that's just different when employees are so comfortable with what they've always known. Kelsey Willock: Yeah, I imagine that's a challenge, especially in a world where healthcare costs are rising and companies are shifting toward how do we experiment to counteract some of these costs, which might include taking risks and trying new ways to deliver health care. But that doesn't always mean that the outcomes are going to be exactly what we expect. Amber Little: Right. Absolutely. Kelsey Willock: How are you staying current on new innovation, on what's actually working in HR in general? Are there specific conferences that you attend, peer networks, even startup communities that you've been a part of that you think our community should know about? Amber Little: Well, I do spend a lot of time with different HR networks across Dallas, just in general. So SHRM is a big one that I try to stay in contact with. But I also join round tables that are specific to my industry. And I think that's helpful because what works in my industry may not work in another industry. Our people are different. Everybody's different. So I try to be in round tables that are not only HR specific but also industry specific. And so I just try to have those conversations. I go to conferences and I talk to other HR professionals, and even others that are just in operations, because they can provide some really good understanding of what's working for them and not working for them. So I try to use all those outside ideas as input, not necessarily proof that it's something that we need to implement, but I think it definitely opens up a conversation of, is this something we should talk about? And I've learned a lot from the different round tables because, again, same industry, but still very different organizations when you really deep dive into them. And so what's working for them might work for us. And sometimes we've implemented some of those things. And then some of those things I look at, I'm like, there's no way that would work for us. So I think that's the biggest thing, being able to just stay connected. I also, over my last 25 years of experience, have tried to keep in contact with a lot of the people that I've worked with, especially the people that I've reported to: the CHROs, the directors, all of those different individuals who have gone on to work in different industries in different roles. And I try to keep up with them as well. So although there's a lot of HR people in the world, we are still a very close-knit community, because I can call someone and say, hey, how's this working for you? And they usually will have some really great feedback. Kelsey Willock: Yeah, I think that you're completely right that industry matters so much. Even if someone's in the same role, industry to industry, how certain initiatives impact different types of people can vary greatly. One thing I'm really interested in, and we scratched the surface of it when we were talking about well-being and the five pillars, is financial health. How important is financial health for employees to you, to the company, and why? Amber Little: I think it's extremely important, particularly with a large hourly retail population. Financial stress doesn't just disappear when somebody clocks in. It affects focus, it affects their attendance, their engagement, and ultimately retention. So there are obviously economic realities. I would love to be able to pay everybody $100 an hour to cashier in our stores, but that's just not realistic. So I think within those realities, we try to focus on fair and competitive compensation. Again, those usable benefits that we talked about, so they know what they are, they know how to use them, they know where to find them, they know what benefits they bring and the value that they bring. And then I also try to really push schedule flexibility where operations allows it. Obviously, I can't let everybody work from home in a retail environment, but I want my managers or store managers to lead with compassion and empathy if somebody has a sick kid or they need to go to a parent-teacher conference or whatever it is. I think that goes a long way in eliminating some of that stress for them. I also think career pathing and advancement and just the quality of our management also affects that overall. So within the economic realities of the business, I think we try to create the best possible experience for our people, understanding that it's not always pay that they're looking for. It's obviously important. They really do like it when they get a raise, right? But it's not just that. It's the connection, and it's how they feel when they come into the store. Do they feel supported? Do they feel valued? Are they getting opportunities to do what they do best? And so yeah, I think it's extremely important because it just affects so many different outcomes. Kelsey Willock: And as you mentioned, it's not just one thing. For example, it's not just retirement, it's not just pay. It's so many other facets, and financial health can include the time it takes to get to work, the cost of going into an office, paying for gas, et cetera. So it certainly appears that the company thinks about it from multiple different aspects, not just the tunnel vision of only retirement. It's much more, beyond just the 401(k). Amber Little: Well, and we have employees anywhere from 18 to 80, right? And so they're all in different seasons. And so what success looks like to them, what financial well-being looks like for them, it's different. They definitely define it differently. I noticed with the employees coming in very early in their careers, they're not really thinking about retirement yet. They're wanting flexibility, they're wanting career advancement. But when you're 80, you're looking at retirement. So every season sees something a little bit differently, and we have to work to ensure that we're supporting all of them in all of their seasons. Kelsey Willock: What is a compensation and benefits trend that you see coming that most HR leaders are not ready for? Heavy question. Amber Little: Well, I've been thinking about this a lot, because I've listened to other podcasts you've done. I've listened to what they're saying. I heard a podcast that you guys did and he had a very similar answer, and I would agree, that I think the biggest thing that's going to happen is that companies are going to get priced out on benefits, right? They're becoming so expensive. And they're not able to take on as much of those premiums as they used to be able to for employees. And now the employees are paying more, the company's paying more, which means the employees are making less money overall. And so I honestly think we're going to start seeing shifts of employers providing more stipends instead of benefits. Go find your own benefits, or helping them find benefits outside of their organization, because I just think what is happening now with the increases is just unsustainable for any organization. So I think that's what's coming. And I think we're going to have to figure out how we deal with it. Because every year you're getting 15 to 50% increases. And it's unrealistic for organizations to be able to continue to do that. But you also don't want to send all those cost increases to the employee. So what are we going to do in the future when that just continues to happen? Kelsey Willock: Don't mean to put you on the spot, but I'm curious about any of the thoughts that you might be willing to share around what you think might happen. It's such a fascinating topic. And I would say, Amber, this is probably the most frequent answer I'm seeing right now. So it's becoming impossible to ignore that we're at this almost breaking point, right? It's getting unsustainably expensive. So what does that mean for the healthcare system and the dynamic it has with the workforce? Amber Little: You know, I think every organization's going to start taking more risk in terms of what they're providing to their people. I know that that's certainly the things that we're thinking about. Like, what puzzle pieces can we move around where we're still giving employees benefits, but we're not getting a 75% increase in cost that we then have to pass along a portion of to the employee. So I do think that's kind of where we're headed. I'm concerned. I don't have an answer of how to fix it, but I do think that risk is going to show up, and then that is going to impact the value that employees are getting out of their benefits. And the value that they're getting out of it is then going to affect their engagement. The whole cycle just continues. So I think we're going to maybe see companies, like in our industry, band together under maybe an umbrella company, and then they're able to provide benefits a little bit cheaper because they have more people. So we've talked about doing that, like with a co-op, for example, because our company belongs to a co-op. So I think we're going to start seeing more of that, because it's just becoming unsustainable. Kelsey Willock: Really interesting idea. It's kind of the next age of a PEO almost. So definitely a space I continue to want to poke on and see what innovative solutions come up. I really like that idea of the co-op opportunity. And Amber, my last question for you: is there anything that's particularly lighting you up, or any last words that you'd like to leave with our community? Amber Little: Well, I love that we talked today about the whole human. And I think that your podcast and the request for me to be on it is very timely, because I am super focused on Whole Human Leadership. And so not just at work, but in our lives, with our spouses and our friends and our kids. And so I actually have been journaling a lot about that and posting a lot on social media about it, just how I'm handling that through my experiences. And I actually wrote a 52-week reflection journal. It's geared towards women because that's the experience that I've had, but men can enjoy it as well. It really helps you every week to just think about something a little bit differently, whether it's boundaries, saying no, or being more present. And so I actually used this as a workshop in our women's retreat last week. And I think it added a lot of value, because it just helps people think about where they are, what matters to them right now, what they value right now, and are they really living their life based off what they say matters? So I'm really excited about that. I've been working through that, and I've had a lot of women come up and tell me how it's impacting their lives, which I love. So I think that's what I'm really excited about right now, and I'm doing a lot of work around that in our organization. And you can see it in the way that we do benefits, the way that we support our women, for example, with the women's retreat. So the concept of this whole human is very near and dear to my heart at this point. Kelsey Willock: And as you can probably imagine and tell from the conversations I've been having, I love elevating folks like yourself that are investing in the human being right now, in such an interesting time that our world is in, in the next age of AI. Innovation and technology is so important and I continue to love it. But also, reminding ourselves of the humans involved, it's a wonderful thing to hear from folks like yourself how we're doing that, whether it's through journaling exercises, retreats, bringing people together. We're human at the end of the day. Amber Little: We're human. We're human before we're anything else, right? We're human before we're an HR leader or a mom or a spouse or a friend. So I think focusing on who we are as a human ultimately leads to better outcomes as a leader, both at home and at work. Kelsey Willock: Well, we will certainly link the opportunity to read and participate in Amber's journaling book. So if anyone is interested, please do click on the link, take a look at it, and do the exercises yourself. It's been an absolute pleasure to have you on the show today, Amber. Thank you so much for your time, your candor, and everything. Amber Little: Thank you so much for having me. It's been a great conversation.