Latest / Wrongful Conviction / #333 Maggie Freleng with Ashley Jordan

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#333 Maggie Freleng with Ashley Jordan · Wrongful Conviction

0:01
Speaker 1: A note for listeners, this episode contains discussion of suicide.
0:05
Speaker 1: Please listen with caution and care. In May of two
0:14
Speaker 1: thousand and eight, Ashley and Albert Deblbot welcomed their first baby, girl,
0:19
Speaker 1: Mackenzie Leilani. The Deblebots were a successful military couple stationed
0:25
Speaker 1: in Fort Benning, Georgia, and the birth of their daughter
0:28
Speaker 1: filled them with more joy than they ever imagined. Once
0:34
Speaker 1: they brought baby Mackenzie home from the hospital, the new
0:37
Speaker 1: parents put her to bed and went to sleep. In
0:40
Speaker 1: the early morning hours, Ashley and Albert woke up to
0:43
Speaker 1: find Mackenzie in distress. Concerned, they took her back to
0:47
Speaker 1: the hospital.
0:49
Speaker 2: Maybe a couple hours later. The doctor comes in and
0:54
Speaker 2: tells that she passed, and my ex husban hit the floor.
0:58
Speaker 2: He started crying and screaming, rolling and I just kind
1:01
Speaker 2: of sat there looking at the wall. And then I
1:05
Speaker 2: looked at the doctor and said, go get my baby
1:07
Speaker 2: ready so we can take her home. I think I
1:11
Speaker 2: was just in denial and shop because you just didn't
1:13
Speaker 2: tell me that my daughter was dead. And then Columbus
1:16
Speaker 2: Police Department showed up, and that's when everything pretty much
1:21
Speaker 2: went to hell. My name is Ashley Jordan. I spent
1:28
Speaker 2: twelve years and two months in the Georgia Department of
1:31
Speaker 2: Corrections prison system, wrongfully convicted the requme that I did not.
1:35
Speaker 1: Commit from love of for good. This is wrongful conviction
1:42
Speaker 1: with Maggie Freeling today. Ashley Jordan actually Jordan, was born
2:00
Speaker 1: in Laurel, Mississippi, on May thirteenth, nineteen eighty four, to
2:04
Speaker 1: Brenda Dolores Jones and Thurman Jordan sr.
2:09
Speaker 3: Oh.
2:10
Speaker 2: As they're growing up, let me tell you about the
2:12
Speaker 2: little Poe. That's her nickname, Poe.
2:15
Speaker 1: That's Ashley's mom, Brenda.
2:18
Speaker 2: She was.
2:18
Speaker 3: She was a sweet little girl. Didn't never have to
2:20
Speaker 3: get no whoopings for nothing. She was shad and you
2:25
Speaker 3: know I didn't take.
2:26
Speaker 2: Much of her to feed it.
2:29
Speaker 1: Ashley grew up with three brothers in a military family.
2:32
Speaker 1: After just a few years in Mississippi, Ashley's dad moved
2:35
Speaker 1: their family to Detroit, Michigan. Ashley adored her dad.
2:40
Speaker 2: My dad was very hands on with us. He always
2:42
Speaker 2: made sure we showed love to each other as brothers
2:45
Speaker 2: and sisters. He helped pray with us at night.
2:49
Speaker 1: Ashley's family loved any excuse to get together.
2:54
Speaker 2: Our family is very big and They liked to cook
2:57
Speaker 2: out a lot, so there's a cook out for every
3:00
Speaker 2: We love to get together and eat, So that was
3:02
Speaker 2: one of the fondest memories I have from grown up
3:03
Speaker 2: is being able to get together with our family members
3:06
Speaker 2: and we eat and have a good time.
3:10
Speaker 1: But behind closed doors, family life wasn't as picture perfect
3:14
Speaker 1: as it seemed.
3:15
Speaker 2: My childhood life with my mom and dad married was
3:19
Speaker 2: very I like to call it chaotic. It was just
3:22
Speaker 2: a lot of it was always a lot of arguing
3:24
Speaker 2: going on. My mom was a heavy drinker and my
3:29
Speaker 2: dad wasn't, so a lot of times that was a
3:33
Speaker 2: problem because they bumped heads with a lot of things.
3:39
Speaker 1: Her parents' marriage eventually fell apart, so Ashley's mom packed
3:43
Speaker 1: up and moved with the kids back to their home state.
3:47
Speaker 2: So we moved back to Mississippi in nineteen ninety two.
3:51
Speaker 2: My mom got a job and pretty much just settled
3:54
Speaker 2: us there. I don't think we understood as kids that
3:58
Speaker 2: we were going to be living in in in Mississippi.
4:01
Speaker 2: I believed that we were just going to visit and
4:02
Speaker 2: we were going to make home to Detroit. But we
4:06
Speaker 2: started registering for school. It just kind of came out
4:09
Speaker 2: of nowhere where we had to start over again as kids.
4:14
Speaker 1: Brendo worked hard as a single parent to make ends meet.
4:18
Speaker 1: She and Ashley are close now, but at the time,
4:20
Speaker 1: Ashley wanted to get out of that situation.
4:24
Speaker 2: To be honest with you, I didn't want to save
4:25
Speaker 2: my mom anyway at that time because of her drinking.
4:29
Speaker 2: I just didn't like it. All my other friends, their
4:32
Speaker 2: moms didn't drink like that, So I saw a difference
4:34
Speaker 2: in that pattern. Like I said, she was a great
4:39
Speaker 2: mother when it came to taking care of us, It's
4:41
Speaker 2: just the drinking was very It put a strain on
4:44
Speaker 2: me and our relationship.
4:46
Speaker 1: Early on, Ashley opted to leave her mom's house and
4:50
Speaker 1: instead live with her grandparents. However, things weren't much better.
4:55
Speaker 1: Once she made the move. She started to notice similarities
4:58
Speaker 1: between her grandfather's behal behavior and her mother's.
5:02
Speaker 2: My grandfather, her dad was a heavy drinker, heavy drinker,
5:06
Speaker 2: was putting it lightly. He was an alcoholic. So I've
5:09
Speaker 2: seen the pattern of where my mom where. That filtered
5:13
Speaker 2: on then to her. So in the house of my grandmother,
5:16
Speaker 2: we dealt with a lot of the same chaos.
5:24
Speaker 1: At the same time, she was facing these family troubles.
5:26
Speaker 1: Ashley was also maturing and learning to live her own life.
5:30
Speaker 1: Here's Brenda again.
5:32
Speaker 3: And she grew up and got older. She saw coming
5:35
Speaker 3: out of it and saw a door that she became
5:37
Speaker 3: a cheerleader school stuff like that, played basketball Northeast Jones Tigers.
5:44
Speaker 2: Yes, Lady Tigers.
5:46
Speaker 3: Mm hmm, Yeah, she was a basketball player.
5:49
Speaker 2: Cheer leader with those five sixty legs. Yes.
5:54
Speaker 1: Ashley also loved school. She was smart and ambitious. She
5:58
Speaker 1: even had a career picked out for herself, one that
6:01
Speaker 1: she admits was inspired by her own unique smile.
6:05
Speaker 2: You've seen and I have a gap between my teeth,
6:08
Speaker 2: and I've always been very fond of teeth. I like
6:10
Speaker 2: teeth and how they look, and I wanted to be
6:13
Speaker 2: an orthodonosis.
6:16
Speaker 1: But Ashley wound up on a different path. The turning
6:18
Speaker 1: point came one day when she was out shopping with
6:21
Speaker 1: a friend and.
6:22
Speaker 2: We were shopping at a place that was right next
6:25
Speaker 2: door to the recruiting office for the aug of the
6:28
Speaker 2: branches in the military, and it was a recruiter sign
6:31
Speaker 2: outside smoking a cigarette.
6:34
Speaker 1: Ashley was impressed by his uniform. She told him he
6:37
Speaker 1: looked spiffy.
6:39
Speaker 2: And he said, you want one? I said whatever, And
6:46
Speaker 2: before I knew it, I was sitting in his office
6:48
Speaker 2: looking at brochures. In my family, they always encourage you
6:54
Speaker 2: to go to college, go to college, and I thought,
6:56
Speaker 2: you know what, I've just been twelve years in school.
6:58
Speaker 2: I don't want to go to college. He's not right then,
7:00
Speaker 2: and I did.
7:02
Speaker 1: She did want to get a college education eventually, so
7:05
Speaker 1: Ashley was sold on the idea that the military would
7:08
Speaker 1: finance her ambition.
7:09
Speaker 2: And all I can think was pay for college, Pay
7:11
Speaker 2: for college. I didn't tell anybody I was joining got
7:14
Speaker 2: into my mom. I didn't tell anybody. I just kept
7:17
Speaker 2: it a secret.
7:20
Speaker 1: After high school graduation in two thousand and two, Ashley's
7:23
Speaker 1: friends started going off to college.
7:25
Speaker 2: And my mom came to me one day and she said, so,
7:29
Speaker 2: what do you got going on? And I said what
7:31
Speaker 2: do you mean? She said, are you going to school
7:33
Speaker 2: or are you going to start working or something? And
7:35
Speaker 2: I was like, well, I got something else playing. She
7:37
Speaker 2: said like what, Because you haven't said anything to me.
7:40
Speaker 2: I looked up.
7:41
Speaker 3: One day my baby came home.
7:43
Speaker 2: She came home from work, said she was in to
7:45
Speaker 2: join the Earth. I said, oh who.
7:48
Speaker 1: On the day she told Brenda the news Ashley brought
7:50
Speaker 1: an army recruiter to her mom's house to meet and
7:53
Speaker 1: talk about her plans.
7:54
Speaker 2: So he comes walking up the driveway and she looked
7:58
Speaker 2: at me and she just started She was so excited.
8:02
Speaker 2: I said, are you happy, and she said, yes, I'm happy.
8:05
Speaker 2: She said, this is a great career. My mom was
8:08
Speaker 2: the most supportive person I had in my army career.
8:15
Speaker 1: Ashley originally joined as part of the Army Reserve and
8:18
Speaker 1: wound up stationed in South Korea in two thousand and seven.
8:21
Speaker 1: She soon worked her way up to sergeant. Ashley loved
8:26
Speaker 1: the military, and after only three months in South Korea,
8:29
Speaker 1: she was about to find another love. Tell me how
8:34
Speaker 1: you meet Albert.
8:36
Speaker 2: By my first time. I was actually going into my
8:39
Speaker 2: barricks room for the first time, and he walked by
8:41
Speaker 2: and I complimented his calf muscles. He got some nice
8:46
Speaker 2: calf muscles. And he looked at me and was looking
8:48
Speaker 2: at me like, this girl is weird.
8:52
Speaker 1: Albert double Bud was a mail clerk in Ashley's unit.
8:55
Speaker 1: She would often see him around.
8:57
Speaker 2: He was lower ranking and I was high, and so
9:00
Speaker 2: he just kind of kept it professional, going back and
9:03
Speaker 2: forth and beyond every guy at that unit was trying
9:09
Speaker 2: to get my attention to talk to me, but he wasn't,
9:12
Speaker 2: and that kind of intrigued me. So I started to
9:16
Speaker 2: like him and I kind of went after him, and
9:22
Speaker 2: one day I stopped and talked to him, and we
9:24
Speaker 2: started watching DVDs together and we realized we had that
9:28
Speaker 2: we love the same kind of movies and the same
9:30
Speaker 2: kind of music, and that's kind of where the conversation started.
9:33
Speaker 2: And so I knew we were going on our first date.
9:39
Speaker 1: So besides his cabs, what else did you like about him?
9:43
Speaker 2: We weren't dressed. I have this I love the way
9:46
Speaker 2: he dressed, and I realized that he was really nice,
9:49
Speaker 2: like beyond just being a soldier, he was a really
9:51
Speaker 2: nice guy.
9:52
Speaker 1: Theirs was a whirlwind romance, you know.
9:55
Speaker 2: It was kind of quick, but I don't have a
9:57
Speaker 2: time living on love. I'm gonna say that I'm the
9:59
Speaker 2: kind of person that it's there, is there, and I'm
10:01
Speaker 2: going to go for it. So we met, we started
10:03
Speaker 2: dating August two thousand and seven, We got engaged September
10:06
Speaker 2: two thousand and seven, and we got married over in
10:10
Speaker 2: nineteen two thousand and seven.
10:14
Speaker 1: And the couple had more good news while still in Korea.
10:17
Speaker 1: After their engagement, Ashley found out she was pregnant.
10:21
Speaker 2: I threw this pretticages in face. She looks, look look,
10:24
Speaker 2: and he looked at me. He's like, what does this mean?
10:27
Speaker 2: I said, it means we're pregnant. So we were super
10:31
Speaker 2: excited to be having a baby.
10:34
Speaker 1: She and Albert wanted to have their baby in the States,
10:37
Speaker 1: so Ashley was able to get an honorable discharge.
10:41
Speaker 2: I want to be a hands on mom. I don't
10:42
Speaker 2: want to be thinking that I'm going to be shipped here,
10:45
Speaker 2: shipped there, and my kids are being transferred from here
10:48
Speaker 2: to there. I just didn't want to deal with that.
10:50
Speaker 2: I'd rather be at home with my kids.
10:53
Speaker 1: Before coming to South Korea, Albert had served in Iraq.
10:56
Speaker 1: The newlyweds didn't want to worry about him being deployed again,
11:00
Speaker 1: so they found a military base where Albert could be
11:02
Speaker 1: on active duty without being marshaled out.
11:06
Speaker 2: So that's how we wind up in Georgia because that
11:08
Speaker 2: was the only due the station that was offering him
11:10
Speaker 2: a non deployable status where he wouldn't miss the baby's
11:13
Speaker 2: birth or I wouldn't be left alone.
11:20
Speaker 1: By March two thousand and eight, the young couple was
11:23
Speaker 1: back in the States getting ready for the birth of
11:25
Speaker 1: their baby a few months later. Albert was asleep and
11:29
Speaker 1: Ashley was beside him in bed, watching TV and eating.
11:33
Speaker 2: Let me tell you what I was eating. I had
11:34
Speaker 2: a tray full of food. I had chocolate chip cookies,
11:37
Speaker 2: two peanutreater and jelly salwiches, a glass of milk, a
11:39
Speaker 2: bowl of cereals, and grapes and strawberries. And I was
11:42
Speaker 2: sitting there in the bed eating, and I was watching
11:45
Speaker 2: George Lopez laughing, and I started having contractions, and it
11:49
Speaker 2: got so bad that at one point I slung my
11:54
Speaker 2: fists over on the bed because the contraction hit me
11:56
Speaker 2: so hard, and I hit him and he said, what's wrong.
11:59
Speaker 2: I think I'm having the baby.
12:03
Speaker 1: They headed to Martin Army Community Hospital, where on May
12:06
Speaker 1: twenty ninth, two thousand and eight, Ashley gave birth to
12:09
Speaker 1: a baby girl, Mackenzie Leilanie. Ashley had always loved the
12:14
Speaker 1: name Mackenzie, and Leilani was chosen by Albert, who is pollowin.
12:20
Speaker 2: I've had Mackenzie name picked out since the ninth grade.
12:22
Speaker 2: I was super excited to name my daughter McKenzie. So
12:25
Speaker 2: her middle name is Leilani and it means beautiful flower
12:28
Speaker 2: and allowing culture.
12:35
Speaker 1: After two and a half days in the hospital, Ashley
12:38
Speaker 1: and Albert were able to take Mackenzie home. As for
12:41
Speaker 1: many new parents, their first evening home was nerve wracking.
12:45
Speaker 2: I was afraid to go to sleep. My mind Frank
12:48
Speaker 2: kept thinking, if you go to sleep, something's gonna have
12:50
Speaker 2: She's gonna roll over, she's gonna smother. I don't know.
12:52
Speaker 2: I was just very cautious. I was scared. My mom,
12:55
Speaker 2: of course, you know, advice from older people was saying, Ashley,
12:57
Speaker 2: you can go to sleep.
12:59
Speaker 1: And Albert was already asleep preparing to go back to work.
13:02
Speaker 1: So Ashley relented and tried to get some sleep herself,
13:05
Speaker 1: with Mackenzie in the bacinet next to the bed. In
13:13
Speaker 1: the early morning hours of June first, Ashley and Albert
13:16
Speaker 1: were both sleeping fitfully.
13:19
Speaker 2: We were tussling in the bed and we both woke
13:21
Speaker 2: each other up, and we both were dreaming. And I
13:24
Speaker 2: looked at him, he looked at me. I said, I
13:26
Speaker 2: just had the craziest dream, and he said me too.
13:29
Speaker 1: And then they heard Mackenzie fussing in her baconet.
13:33
Speaker 2: I said, well, it's your turn to feeder. So he
13:36
Speaker 2: was getting the bottle ready and I was getting her
13:37
Speaker 2: out of the bassinette. I would tell him about my dream.
13:40
Speaker 2: I said, I was dreaming I was faring through elevator shaft.
13:43
Speaker 2: I said, but when I got to the bottom, I
13:44
Speaker 2: woke up. He said, Oh my god, I was dreaming
13:46
Speaker 2: if falling off a cliff. He said, but when I
13:48
Speaker 2: got to the bottom, I woke up. And I said,
13:50
Speaker 2: that's crazy. And we just started feeding her, and then
13:55
Speaker 2: I noticed the lump on her head and I said,
13:57
Speaker 2: what is that.
14:00
Speaker 1: Ashley called the hospital and spoke to a doctor about
14:02
Speaker 1: the lump of Mackenzie's forehead, but the doctor said she
14:06
Speaker 1: was fine.
14:08
Speaker 2: So then we tried to feed her and she was
14:11
Speaker 2: like she was gasping for air, like she just looked
14:14
Speaker 2: she just couldn't breathe. And I called him back and said,
14:16
Speaker 2: we're bringing her in. And by this time we're hysterical
14:20
Speaker 2: because she doesn't look good. She looks like she's turning colors.
14:24
Speaker 2: And we left everything at a disarray and we left
14:26
Speaker 2: in such of her. We left our cell phones at
14:28
Speaker 2: the house.
14:29
Speaker 1: Within minutes, Mackenzie had taken a turn for the.
14:33
Speaker 2: Worst, and we get to the hospital and before he
14:37
Speaker 2: get me even stopped the car, I was jumping out
14:38
Speaker 2: and I ran inside of the Mercy room and I
14:40
Speaker 2: threw her out at the nurse and I said, please
14:43
Speaker 2: help my baby. Something wrong.
15:01
Speaker 1: This episode is underwritten by AIG, a leading global insurance company.
15:06
Speaker 1: AIG is committed to corporate social responsibility and to making
15:10
Speaker 1: a positive difference in the lives of its employees and
15:13
Speaker 1: in the communities where they work and live. In light
15:16
Speaker 1: of the compelling need for pro bono legal assistance, and
15:19
Speaker 1: in recognition of AIG's commitment to criminal and social justice reform,
15:24
Speaker 1: the AIG pro Bono Program provides free legal services and
15:28
Speaker 1: other support to underrepresented communities and individuals. Ashley called her
15:38
Speaker 1: mom from the hospital to tell her what was happening.
15:41
Speaker 1: Brenda and her husband had already planned to come meet
15:43
Speaker 1: Mackenzie the following day, but now she was racing to
15:47
Speaker 1: get to the hospital.
15:50
Speaker 3: We's trying to get them, trying to get the fans
15:52
Speaker 3: Laku and she just as said, maybe I'm on the way.
15:58
Speaker 2: We're erratic, we're scared. We don't know what's going on.
16:02
Speaker 1: A couple of hours passed as the new parents waited
16:05
Speaker 1: anxiously for news of their baby. Finally, a doctor came
16:09
Speaker 1: to tell Ashley and Albert that Mackenzie had passed away.
16:13
Speaker 1: Albert collapsed on the floor.
16:16
Speaker 2: He started crying and screaming and rolling and I just
16:20
Speaker 2: kind of sat there looking at the wall. And then
16:24
Speaker 2: I looked at the doctor and said, go get my
16:26
Speaker 2: baby ready so we could take her home. I think
16:28
Speaker 2: I was just in denial and shot because you just
16:30
Speaker 2: didn't tell me that my daughter was dead, and I
16:34
Speaker 2: just didn't want to believe it.
16:37
Speaker 1: And then almost immediately after Albert and Ashley heard the
16:40
Speaker 1: news about their baby girl, personnel from the military showed.
16:44
Speaker 2: Up and I was a little weird about why they
16:47
Speaker 2: were there. And then Columbus Police Department showed up, and
16:52
Speaker 2: that's when everything pretty much went to hell, and in
16:57
Speaker 2: my mind framed, I was like, no, this is not
16:59
Speaker 2: this is not normal. Nobody calls the police when somebody
17:02
Speaker 2: passes away. This is not normal. She wasn't murdered. Why
17:05
Speaker 2: are they here? And when they separated us, and the
17:09
Speaker 2: kind of questions they were asking and the way the
17:11
Speaker 2: detective was looking at me, that's when I was I said,
17:14
Speaker 2: they think we've done this.
17:22
Speaker 1: Police took note that Albert was devastated, but that Ashley
17:27
Speaker 1: wasn't showing as much emotion.
17:29
Speaker 2: And at that time, I just lost a baby and
17:32
Speaker 2: I don't know how to grieve. At this point, it
17:35
Speaker 2: was just kind of unbelieved, like this was it was
17:39
Speaker 2: like a nightmare happening before my eyes.
17:43
Speaker 1: But at that point police took Ashley back to her
17:45
Speaker 1: and Albert's apartment to photograph and search their home. They
17:49
Speaker 1: began questioning her about what had happened that night.
17:54
Speaker 2: Where was I, like, what time I went to sleep?
17:57
Speaker 2: How long was Albert a sleep before I to sleep?
18:00
Speaker 2: When do we do that day? Who came to the house?
18:03
Speaker 2: Things like that, they were asking.
18:11
Speaker 1: Once the police were done at the apartment, Ashley and
18:14
Speaker 1: Albert were left to process all that had just happened.
18:20
Speaker 2: We couldn't even sleep in our room because her room
18:22
Speaker 2: was right next to ours with all her stuff, so
18:25
Speaker 2: we slept downstairs. We couldn't go up there.
18:32
Speaker 1: By this point, Ashley's mother had arrived.
18:36
Speaker 2: That was just that was two devils. That was just over.
18:38
Speaker 2: That was too much. Oh and I asked he was just.
18:41
Speaker 3: Crying and and aver he was just screaming that background.
18:46
Speaker 3: She was stronger than he were, you know, asked, was
18:48
Speaker 3: slow and he was just screaming and crying, and she said, mamma, go,
18:51
Speaker 3: let me go, try to take care of you know,
18:53
Speaker 3: look after him.
19:05
Speaker 1: The next morning, the police called and said the preliminary
19:08
Speaker 1: autopsy report was ready and that the couple should come
19:11
Speaker 1: to the station. Do you remember when you realized that
19:15
Speaker 1: they thought that you and Albert had done this?
19:19
Speaker 2: I realized that when they separated us, and then that's
19:22
Speaker 2: when interrogation started.
19:23
Speaker 1: Ashley was interrogated by Detective Andrew Tyner.
19:27
Speaker 2: I will never forgive him because he caught me a monster,
19:31
Speaker 2: and he said the preliminary optoxic results said that she
19:35
Speaker 2: died from blunt force trauma to they head and she
19:38
Speaker 2: had multiple score fractures, and that we did it.
19:43
Speaker 1: Ashley and Albert were adamant they had nothing to do
19:47
Speaker 1: with Mackenzie's death and had no idea what happened to her.
19:51
Speaker 1: Yet they were held and interrogated four hours.
19:55
Speaker 2: Now, mind you, on postpartum, I just had a baby
20:01
Speaker 2: and my breast are filling it with milk, and they
20:04
Speaker 2: just sat there and interrogating me for hours and wouldn't
20:08
Speaker 2: give me any feminine hygiene products. And I was bleeding
20:11
Speaker 2: from having the baby, and they just sat there and
20:16
Speaker 2: kept interrogating me, and so I didn't understand what was happening.
20:24
Speaker 2: So I just assumed that I would go home, like
20:26
Speaker 2: I just thought that we would go home. I didn't
20:28
Speaker 2: think it would be what happened for sure, though. We
20:33
Speaker 2: didn't go home.
20:34
Speaker 1: And eventually the detectives tried to turn Ashley and Albert
20:39
Speaker 1: against each other.
20:40
Speaker 2: If one of y'all just say y'all did it, because
20:43
Speaker 2: both of y'all gonna go to jail, and both y'all
20:44
Speaker 2: gonna go to prison. But if one of y'all just
20:46
Speaker 2: say y'all did it, then one of y'all can go
20:48
Speaker 2: home and help fight for the other one. That's what
20:50
Speaker 2: they told us. But they made sure nothing was recording
20:53
Speaker 2: when they did that. And he was about to say
20:57
Speaker 2: he did it just so I can go home and
21:00
Speaker 2: won't go to jail, and I looked at him and
21:03
Speaker 2: I grabbed his hand and I said, no, you're not.
21:05
Speaker 2: You will not lie for these people. He said, I
21:09
Speaker 2: don't want you to go to Joel. I said, I
21:10
Speaker 2: don't care. We're gonna go together then, and that's just
21:12
Speaker 2: what it's going to be. I said, because we didn't
21:13
Speaker 2: do anything wrong.
21:22
Speaker 1: Ashley and Albert were arrested that same day. Did you
21:26
Speaker 1: think it was possible that they could have done this
21:28
Speaker 1: at all? Did you think that was possible?
21:31
Speaker 2: Oh?
21:32
Speaker 3: No, baby, I never even think twice, not even for
21:35
Speaker 3: a split second, that they done something to that baby.
21:38
Speaker 3: Oh they were They owned a child, and they had
21:40
Speaker 3: everything going for them.
21:42
Speaker 2: Are you serious?
21:43
Speaker 3: They had everything going for them.
21:47
Speaker 1: Ashley was charged with malice murder, felony murder, and cruelty
21:51
Speaker 1: to children in the first degree.
21:55
Speaker 2: And it was the most humiliating experience is being booked
22:01
Speaker 2: into the county jail. They strip you of everything that
22:06
Speaker 2: was ever yours. I'm bleeding from having a baby. They
22:12
Speaker 2: don't provide you with any type of extra clothing. They
22:15
Speaker 2: just give you. They give you their uniform and I said, well,
22:18
Speaker 2: I don't have any underwear and I'm bleeding. But it
22:21
Speaker 2: was like aus so we don't provide that. And they
22:25
Speaker 2: set me in a cell and a cold sale for
22:29
Speaker 2: hours on concrete, and then I got took a mug
22:32
Speaker 2: shot and they put me in a suicide sale and
22:37
Speaker 2: I remember bleeding all over my pants. I just felt disgusted.
22:43
Speaker 2: I just remember crying and crying in that cell, thinking
22:46
Speaker 2: this can't be happening to us, like we didn't do
22:49
Speaker 2: nothing wrong.
22:52
Speaker 1: Alone in the cell, Ashley's mind was racing.
22:57
Speaker 2: I started thinking about him, I started thinking about our daughter.
23:01
Speaker 2: I started thinking about our life and how they were
23:06
Speaker 2: portraying us to be. I wouldn't have been on top
23:10
Speaker 2: of the world, had a new marriage. I was mad
23:12
Speaker 2: a baby, and then I woke up in the whole
23:14
Speaker 2: rebel was on top of me and I didn't know
23:16
Speaker 2: how to breathe. And at that moment is when I
23:18
Speaker 2: contemplated killing myself. I kept looking around thinking like what
23:23
Speaker 2: can I do? How can I do it?
23:36
Speaker 1: Over a year later, on October twenty sixth, two thousand,
23:39
Speaker 1: the trial started. The prosecutor was Sadana Daily. Ashley and
23:44
Speaker 1: Albert each had a separate defense team.
23:47
Speaker 4: One of the things that the state really wanted to
23:51
Speaker 4: present was to depict Ashley as a cold hearted, really
23:58
Speaker 4: this angry black woman, because that's the kind of woman
24:03
Speaker 4: that would harm her own child.
24:07
Speaker 1: This is Jiminyue Rodgers. She's a criminal defense attorney and
24:10
Speaker 1: a doctoral student in criminal justice and criminology and has
24:14
Speaker 1: represented Ashley.
24:16
Speaker 4: And so what the jury heard was the state saying
24:20
Speaker 4: that Ashley was this cold hearted woman who was controlling,
24:25
Speaker 4: controlling of Albert, and that she didn't show any appropriate
24:33
Speaker 4: sadness when her baby died, and that whatever was going on,
24:39
Speaker 4: they were trying to hide things. And then they presented
24:42
Speaker 4: doctor Darisol to say that there is no way, there's
24:46
Speaker 4: no other way other than intentionally an intentional blunt force trauma,
24:52
Speaker 4: that the injuries to Mackenzie would have occurred.
24:56
Speaker 1: Doctor Laura Darisaw was a medical examiner for the Georgia
24:59
Speaker 1: Bureau of Investigation and the state's primary witness. She performed
25:04
Speaker 1: the autopsy on Mackenzie the day after she died. Doctor
25:07
Speaker 1: Darisaw said she found extensive fractures on Mackenzie's head and
25:12
Speaker 1: bleeding in the brain.
25:14
Speaker 4: And once she saw blood, she deemed this to be
25:18
Speaker 4: a homicide and reached out called out to law enforcement
25:22
Speaker 4: and communicated that unless the parents had some other explanation
25:26
Speaker 4: for this, then it had to be blunt force trauma,
25:32
Speaker 4: either by a series of blows to Mackenzie's head or
25:36
Speaker 4: a crushing type of injury.
25:40
Speaker 1: Doctor Darisol concluded that the injuries happened near the time
25:43
Speaker 1: of Mackenzie's death by no more than four hours, and
25:46
Speaker 1: the injuries were so traumatic that if they had happened
25:50
Speaker 1: during birth, the hospital would have noticed. The prosecution concluded that,
25:54
Speaker 1: without any other explanation, this was a homicide by the
25:59
Speaker 1: only two people who were with Mackenzie that night. The
26:05
Speaker 1: state also presented a jailhouse informant, Melvin Tarver, who had
26:09
Speaker 1: been in jail at the same time as Albert.
26:12
Speaker 4: He testified that on the morning that trial was about
26:16
Speaker 4: to start, Albert told him that his wife had harmed
26:21
Speaker 4: the baby.
26:22
Speaker 1: Tarvor's story was that Albert told him he had gone
26:24
Speaker 1: out to get drugs that night, and when he returned,
26:27
Speaker 1: the baby wasn't moving. According to Albert.
26:30
Speaker 4: He asked Ashley, you know what you did. What did
26:34
Speaker 4: you do and asked, she says nothing. I just spanked
26:37
Speaker 4: her and put her to bed.
26:39
Speaker 1: Tell me about the jailhouse snitch. Can you tell me
26:42
Speaker 1: what you thought when you saw them on the stand.
26:45
Speaker 2: I was livid. I was ready to jump over that
26:48
Speaker 2: table and fight, and I'm not a light in person.
26:52
Speaker 2: But when he came to the door, I looked at Albert,
26:54
Speaker 2: I said, do you know him? He said, no, I
26:56
Speaker 2: don't know him at all, And I know he was
26:58
Speaker 2: in line because I'm so I'm the person that can
27:01
Speaker 2: walk into a room full of strangers and make friends.
27:04
Speaker 2: He's gonna walk into the room and sit by himself.
27:06
Speaker 2: He's not talking to anybody because he's quiet. He's very humble,
27:12
Speaker 2: very to himself. So no, so I didn't believe it.
27:18
Speaker 2: But I was so mad because I was look like,
27:20
Speaker 2: what is who is this guy? But what made me
27:23
Speaker 2: mad was that the fact that the judge even allowed
27:25
Speaker 2: it to happen.
27:29
Speaker 1: Jiminique says that off the bat, Ashley and Albert were
27:33
Speaker 1: at a disadvantage.
27:35
Speaker 4: There was a systemic breakdown in a fundamentally fair trial
27:41
Speaker 4: for Albert in Ashley. They sat in jail for quite
27:45
Speaker 4: some time without proper representation, and that sets the stage
27:50
Speaker 4: for what happened with their attorneys once they got in court.
27:54
Speaker 1: Ashley hired private attorneys Sandy Callahan, and Albert was appointed
27:58
Speaker 1: Bill Mason.
28:00
Speaker 4: And both of these were highly respected attorneys. They had
28:05
Speaker 4: two very different perspectives of going into the trial. Albert's
28:10
Speaker 4: attorney's strategy was to not challenge the medical evidence to
28:16
Speaker 4: be presented by doctor Dearisol and the prosecutor On the
28:20
Speaker 4: other hand, Ashley's attorney wanted and intended to challenge that
28:24
Speaker 4: medical evidence.
28:26
Speaker 1: In order to challenge the prosecution's medical evidence, Callahan brought
28:30
Speaker 1: in John Plunkett, a forensic expert, to talk about shaking
28:34
Speaker 1: baby syndrome or SBS. The science behind this diagnosis was
28:38
Speaker 1: starting to be questioned at the time. Experts had found
28:41
Speaker 1: other causes or conditions that could mimic symptoms of SBS. Today,
28:46
Speaker 1: SBS is acknowledged to be junk science. But there was
28:50
Speaker 1: a problem with Plunkett refuting doctor Dearisol. The judge Douglas
28:55
Speaker 1: Pullan did not require the prosecution to turn over the
28:58
Speaker 1: medical evidence they were going to use at trial.
29:02
Speaker 4: And there was no way that the a defendant can
29:05
Speaker 4: prepare a defense a medical defense without the evidence that
29:08
Speaker 4: the prosecutor has, And because of the collaborative efforts of
29:15
Speaker 4: the judge and the prosecutor in the case, the defense
29:20
Speaker 4: was never able to get this information. So at that
29:24
Speaker 4: point Ashley's attorney asked for a continuance. Albert's attorney opposed it,
29:29
Speaker 4: and the judge, Judge Douglas Pullan, denied it, and so
29:33
Speaker 4: that was the context in which the trial began.
29:37
Speaker 1: So Ultimately, Ashley was unable to have a medical defense.
29:41
Speaker 1: In fact, Callahan didn't put on much of a defense
29:44
Speaker 1: for Ashley at all. During closing arguments, prosecutor Daily pointed
29:49
Speaker 1: out that the defense did not present any evidence contradicting
29:53
Speaker 1: doctor Dearisol.
29:55
Speaker 4: Neither the defense attorney nor the judge stopped the prosecutor
30:01
Speaker 4: when she shifted the burden too. The debl bot saying
30:04
Speaker 4: they had the responsibility to present some evidence that this
30:08
Speaker 4: was not homicide, and they would have, but they don't
30:13
Speaker 4: have any evidence. And then they ended by arguing and
30:17
Speaker 4: closing that the state didn't even have to prove, really
30:22
Speaker 4: what we consider proof beyond a reasonable doubt.
30:25
Speaker 1: At the end of any trial, if there's a doubt,
30:28
Speaker 1: the jury must acquit. The prosecution's burden was to prove
30:32
Speaker 1: beyond any doubt that Albert and Ashley were guilty, but
30:35
Speaker 1: in her closing argument, Daily shifted the meaning of reasonable doubt.
30:41
Speaker 4: She goes on and says, this means we don't have
30:43
Speaker 4: to prove that ninety percent. You don't have to be
30:46
Speaker 4: ninety percent sure, you don't have to be eighty percent sure,
30:51
Speaker 4: you don't have to be fifty one percent sure. It
30:56
Speaker 4: does not mean to a mathematical certainty. The fifty one
31:00
Speaker 4: percent sure is so offensive because it simply means that
31:05
Speaker 4: this prosecution doesn't have to present and doesn't have to
31:09
Speaker 4: meet any Burton.
31:11
Speaker 1: Either. Ashley nor Albert's attorneys objected to that misrepresentation of
31:16
Speaker 1: reasonable doubt, and Daley went on to make other misstatements
31:20
Speaker 1: and inaccuracies that the defense failed to object to as well.
31:26
Speaker 1: After a short four day trial, on October twenty ninth,
31:29
Speaker 1: two thousand and nine, Ashley and Albert were convicted of
31:33
Speaker 1: all three charges and sentenced to life in prison. When
31:54
Speaker 1: Ashley got to prison, she had no hope left.
31:58
Speaker 2: I will try to commit suicide. And I tried to
32:00
Speaker 2: take all my pills, and I had f my medicine,
32:04
Speaker 2: and I tried to do it again, but a friend
32:05
Speaker 2: walked in and stopped me.
32:09
Speaker 1: Ashley knew she needed to create a routine if she
32:12
Speaker 1: wanted to survive, so she got a job and started
32:15
Speaker 1: making friends and taking courses and classes.
32:19
Speaker 2: One thing I learned while I was there was to
32:21
Speaker 2: stack your paper. If people say stack your paper your money,
32:23
Speaker 2: I said, no, stack your resume.
32:30
Speaker 1: In two thousand and nine, Ashley's team moved for a
32:33
Speaker 1: new trial, arguing ineffective assistance of counsel based largely on
32:38
Speaker 1: a failure to present medical evidence, rebutting the state's case.
32:44
Speaker 1: A few years later, in twenty fourteen, Jimmynique came on
32:47
Speaker 1: Ashley's case.
32:49
Speaker 4: They were only arrested because there was a lack of
32:54
Speaker 4: the ability for them, as parents to explain what happened
32:58
Speaker 4: to their child. They were then denied the opportunity to
33:02
Speaker 4: have a full medical analysis of their case to get
33:06
Speaker 4: a fair day in.
33:07
Speaker 1: Court in twenty fifteen. That day finally came, Judge Arthur
33:13
Speaker 1: Smith the Third heard medical testimonies from defense experts who
33:17
Speaker 1: concluded that Mackenzie's injuries likely happened before birth. After years
33:25
Speaker 1: of appeals being denied, finally on February twenty eighth, twenty twenty,
33:30
Speaker 1: the Georgia Supreme Court vacated their convictions based on any
33:34
Speaker 1: effective assistance of counsel at trial. Tell me about when
33:38
Speaker 1: you found out Ashley and Albert were going to get out.
33:40
Speaker 3: Oh, I found that before CD and it's why just
33:45
Speaker 3: called me and told me, told me.
33:48
Speaker 2: I dropped the phone.
33:49
Speaker 1: Brenda couldn't wait to tell her daughter the good news.
33:53
Speaker 3: She called me and I said, well, Ashley, I said, y'all,
33:56
Speaker 3: convision has been overturned.
33:58
Speaker 2: Sweetie, I heard, don't was She's screamed.
34:02
Speaker 3: She just just bust out his though A you for Rea.
34:06
Speaker 2: She's the right, ast, greatest, saying thank you. She kept
34:08
Speaker 2: saying thank you, thank you, the thanks.
34:12
Speaker 1: After their release, the current district Attorney Mark Jones apologized
34:16
Speaker 1: publicly to the devile bots on behalf of the court.
34:19
Speaker 1: In his apology, Jones said, there is now quote mounting
34:23
Speaker 1: medical evidence that says the child was born this way.
34:30
Speaker 1: Ashley was finally free, but although she and Albert stayed
34:34
Speaker 1: in touch during their imprisonment and were able to see
34:36
Speaker 1: each other occasionally, the trauma they had endured was too
34:40
Speaker 1: much for their marriage. While they were still incarcerated, Albert
34:43
Speaker 1: asked for a divorce.
34:46
Speaker 2: He was so busy fighting for his life. How do
34:48
Speaker 2: you fight for your marriage to stay when you're trying
34:50
Speaker 2: to fight for your life? He said, he didn't even
34:53
Speaker 2: know me no more as a woner. He didn't even
34:55
Speaker 2: remember me as that person.
34:58
Speaker 1: What did that feel like when he when he said that,
35:02
Speaker 1: I was devastated.
35:03
Speaker 2: I felt less than I felt ugly because of course
35:08
Speaker 2: I can't dress up and look nice like I would
35:11
Speaker 2: if we were home. So where time he saw me,
35:14
Speaker 2: I had on a jail uniform that was dirty and dingy.
35:18
Speaker 2: My hair wasn't comb like I like it in, and
35:21
Speaker 2: it just looks awful. So I felt like maybe he
35:24
Speaker 2: thought I was ugly now, and maybe he could remember
35:26
Speaker 2: what I looked like before this, because all he see
35:28
Speaker 2: is this. So a lot of people ran through my mind.
35:34
Speaker 4: They never got to grieve for their child and then
35:37
Speaker 4: were left to sit in prison for years, the prime
35:43
Speaker 4: years of their lives while they waited hoping to get justice.
35:48
Speaker 4: The devil Bots can never go back. They can never
35:51
Speaker 4: go back and recover the years that they lost.
36:06
Speaker 1: But Ashley is trying. She moved into her own place,
36:09
Speaker 1: started working, is in school for health administration and management,
36:13
Speaker 1: and has made friends with her neighbor, Miss Jackie.
36:18
Speaker 2: We kind of bonded because she lost a child too.
36:21
Speaker 2: She lost a son, and we bonded off dealing with
36:24
Speaker 2: that as a whole as mother's.
36:27
Speaker 1: Like the rest of her large family, Ashley loves to
36:29
Speaker 1: cook and share meals. One day, Ashley was bringing over
36:33
Speaker 1: food to Miss Jackie, so.
36:35
Speaker 2: I would just cook all this food like I had
36:37
Speaker 2: a big family living here with me, and I would
36:39
Speaker 2: take her food too.
36:40
Speaker 1: And that day Miss Jackie was with her daughter, Freda,
36:44
Speaker 1: a sergeant in the military. When she met Freda, Ashley
36:48
Speaker 1: felt herself opening up to love again.
36:51
Speaker 2: I enjoyed being a wife. I enjoyed being a mom.
36:54
Speaker 2: I enjoyed that life and I wanted it back. But
36:58
Speaker 2: I just didn't know how I wanted it back because
37:00
Speaker 2: I was so afraid of people. I was afraid to
37:02
Speaker 2: trust people. I was afraid to be around people. And
37:06
Speaker 2: I looked up Freedo one day and I was like,
37:08
Speaker 2: this is happening. We started talking, I guess talking in March,
37:15
Speaker 2: and I asked her to marry me October first.
37:20
Speaker 1: Now Ashley is making a family with Freda and Frida's son.
37:24
Speaker 2: Everything is still so new to me and I'm learning,
37:26
Speaker 2: but I'm so glad that I have a partner that's
37:29
Speaker 2: willing to be patient with me and kind with me
37:31
Speaker 2: and loving with me and let me be a mother.
37:35
Speaker 2: An addition to mother to her.
37:36
Speaker 1: Son, Ashley is also focused on advocating for reform within
37:43
Speaker 1: the prison system.
37:45
Speaker 2: I'm using what happened to me as a beacon for
37:47
Speaker 2: goodness and for positiveness, because even though I was innocent.
37:51
Speaker 2: A lot of my friends are guilty and they have
37:53
Speaker 2: to do their time, but they still deserve to be
37:55
Speaker 2: treated with humane conditions and respecting dignity. And that's not
37:58
Speaker 2: what's happening in the prison. But I would have never
38:01
Speaker 2: known that unless this happened to me.
38:09
Speaker 1: Ashley applied for compensation for her wrongful conviction from the
38:12
Speaker 1: State of Georgia. In Georgia, a specific bill has to
38:15
Speaker 1: be passed for each individual, and Ashley's bill for compensation
38:20
Speaker 1: was denied in twenty twenty one. I asked Ashley if
38:26
Speaker 1: she has anything she'd like to say to listeners, and
38:29
Speaker 1: she does.
38:31
Speaker 2: If anybody's listening, miss, you're registered to vote. And I
38:33
Speaker 2: say this because there's over one hundred and ninety thousand
38:36
Speaker 2: people on Paroland to say to Georgia and they're not
38:38
Speaker 2: allowed to vote. There's over nineteen thousand people that are
38:41
Speaker 2: on probation in Georgia and they're not allowed to vote.
38:43
Speaker 2: They get out of prison after they're saved their time successfully,
38:47
Speaker 2: they pay taxes in the state that they're not allowed
38:49
Speaker 2: to even vote for the leadership over them in that
38:51
Speaker 2: actual state. So if you don't vote for anybody else,
38:54
Speaker 2: vote for those who can't vote for themselves, and that's
38:56
Speaker 2: all I gotta say.
39:01
Speaker 1: To help support the cause of ex offender voting rights,
39:04
Speaker 1: go to Women on the RISEGA dot org or the
39:07
Speaker 1: Southern Center for Human Rights at SCCHR dot org. You'll
39:12
Speaker 1: find all those links in our bio. Next time, on
39:20
Speaker 1: Wrongful Conviction with Maggie Freeling Charles Jackson.
39:24
Speaker 2: They put their guns on me.
39:26
Speaker 3: They asked me for my driver's license, saw my name is,
39:29
Speaker 3: I guess just him and locked me up.
39:31
Speaker 2: So I didn't had none to wordy about because I
39:33
Speaker 2: didn't do anything.
39:34
Speaker 3: Three four days later, you know I was tried with murder.
39:41
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to Wrongful Conviction with Maggie Freeling. Please
39:44
Speaker 1: support your local innocence organizations and go to the links
39:47
Speaker 1: in our bio to see how you can help. I'd
39:50
Speaker 1: like to thank our executive producers Jason Flamm and Kevin Wurdis,
39:53
Speaker 1: as well as our senior producer Annie Chelsea, producer Lyla Robinson,
39:57
Speaker 1: and story editor Sonya Paul. The show is edited and
40:01
Speaker 1: mixed by Annie Chelsea, with additional production by Jeff Cliburn
40:05
Speaker 1: and Connor Hall. The music in this production is by
40:08
Speaker 1: three time Oscar nominated composer Jay Ralph. Be sure to
40:11
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40:19
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40:22
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40:25
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