Latest / Wicked and Grim: A True Crime Podcast / The Liquid Matthew Murder

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The Liquid Matthew Murder · Wicked and Grim: A True Crime Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Sometimes in the world of killers, the idea that they
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: can get away with their crimes gets the best of them.
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: Some can't help but return to the scene of the crime.
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: Others keep mementos from their victims stored in their homes,
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: and others taunt investigators by leaving cryptic clues or messages.
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: In the nineteen eighties, Florida would find itself home to
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: a crime that boasted such messages, and it would be
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: one that would go down in the history books as
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: one of the strangest unsolved murders in American history. This
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: is the case known as the Liquid Matthew Murders.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: My name's Ben, I'm Nicole, and you're listening to Wicked and.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: Grim, a true crime podcast.
• 0:51
  Speaker 3: Following mature audience listener discretion, Welcome back to Wicked and Graham, Yes, welcome.
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: What do you think of that intro? Captivating? It was
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: has your attention?
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: Our intro's always get my attention. But that just means
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: we're doing it right.
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: That's true. We're doing it right, doing it right, And
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry, that's really terrible about us.
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: Right before this, we were literally just singing, we are family,
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: if you were.
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: We were just making up our own renditions. So here
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: we are again. Yeah, you know, it's just never a
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: null moment in this tiny home. Yeah. So yeah, the
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: case today is an unsolved one, and I'm guaranteeing you
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: now it's going to piss Nicole off.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, apparently that's just what's going down today.
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: To piss you off. I'm slapping money on it right now.
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: I'm really looking forward to this. Yet, I felt like
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: I wanted to be pissed the fuck off today.
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: I wanted to piss you off today. That was my
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: goal with this one. Oh my gosh, this case seems
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: really interesting to me. There's certain things about it which
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: I can't say yet because we're going to get into it.
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: There's certain things about it that are frustrating, aggravating, entertaining,
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: and interesting all in the same boat.
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: And we're going down to Florida again.
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: We are going down to Florida again.
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: And also I guess just wait, the last one went
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: to Florida. I think that was our Patreon. Was it
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: a Florida man? That's Patreon?
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: Was it a Patreon one? I think?
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: So?
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: Okay, thanks, so well, we are going to be going
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: to Florida again. Here I'll touch on that here shortly,
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: but I do also want to give a quick shout
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: out to Patreon and our patron's over there. So we
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: always have patrons who sign up every week for Patreon
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: join us over there, and we have a bunch more
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: people who signed up this week. So this week we
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: have Alison Rabiro. She she told me I was gonna
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: pronounce her name wrong, so we'll see. So I'm gonna
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: try one more time just to make sure Alison or
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: Ra Biro whoa? I was like, should a roll v R?
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: And she's like the first one, So I think I
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: think I might have got it in one of those tries. Yeah,
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: I probably that sounds pretty good. Allison's probably laughing her
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: ass off right now. Sorry, Alison, appreciate you helping us
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: out and how to say your name. So Alison signed up.
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: We also have Rosie, Joseph Stayton, Megan Groves shout out
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: to Megan friend Local, and kimber.
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: Long right on this week it is I Like It.
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: And over on Hatreon. This week we also had everyone
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: do a little bit of a vote a vote I
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: want to tell us about that.
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: Well, just basically trying to let people choose our next case. Well,
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: it's not gonna be our next one, because the next
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: one we already have started our research process, but like
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: maybe one after that or one after that, I don't know,
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: but very soon.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: In the next few weeks.
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: And yeah, we got recommendations and then we kind of
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: picked the top recommendations and then we had a vote
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: on those.
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: And out of that vote, the top case was Maddie Clifton.
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: I was I wasn't going to actually say, but I thought,
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: maybe you're not screw it, let's say it. So Patreon
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: selected the case of Maddie Clifton going to be coming
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: up in the next few weeks. So if you like
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: that case, you know that case was.
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: I haven't looked recently at how the voting ended up being.
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: Was it closely? Maddie was a clear clear winner out
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: of the top three, So.
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: And I need to google that when I'm not even
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: sure what it is.
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: That's another one that I looked at either. Yeah, so
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: there's a lot of cases out there, and for us,
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: I mean, we're researching all the time, they kind of
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: blurred together sometimes so Starry, we do know this case,
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: it's just not possibly.
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: But then we also did realize that we're not quite
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: as as true crime fanatics as we thought we were.
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: Oh that's true one percent. Now you guys out there
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: are way more into this. I'm not into it, Like
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: we're just as into it. You're way more knowledgeable than Yeah.
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: We we do our research on these cases, and it's like,
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: crazy cool. We learnt a lot where you guys are like, yeah,
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: we knew all that already. So yeah, that's cool. Though,
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: that's good. There is actually also something crazy cool that
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: happened this week in the Great White Norse. The Great
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: White Norse, we had a a wild encounter on our
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: doorstep here. It was the.
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: Cutest, one of the cutest things I've ever witnessed in
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: my entire life.
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: It was pretty adorable. Yeah, so out our front door,
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: just across like the our walkway to our entrance whatever,
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: on the other side of our fence that we have
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: for our dog, we have our quad, our four wheeler
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: stored there for the winter, and our dogs just staring
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: at it. Yeah, she's a little hunter.
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: She she likes to to make animals feel uncomfortable.
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: And I was like, right away, I'm like, there's probably
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: a mouse starting to make a home something in that quad.
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: This is going to be fun, which isn't good. It
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: could cause some damage, Oh it can.
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: Especially with the chew and wires or something. Yeah, but
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: it was far worse than I'm out good because it
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: was a weasel yea, and the weasel could do it Ferret, well,
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: Ferret is a large weasel basically, yeah, but a little
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: white weasel. These weasels could do way more damage than
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: the mouse.
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: So yeah, what I don't know, just how you're describing
• 6:18
  Speaker 2: it is so funny. But anyway, I'm going to take
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: over because you're just sing.
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: Pausey Well, I was waiting for you to jump in.
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: I just feel like I'm just telling the whole story.
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: So rips after the squad just she'll sit there for
• 6:31
  Speaker 2: days just staring at the quad with the weasel in there, right,
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: And so we're like, hey, we're gonna go out there
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: and try to get this weasel out. But first it
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: just like at one moment popped Where did it pop
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: out from under the seat?
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: Kind of right, It was right of the steering column,
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: right where the steering goes down by the gas tank.
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: There's a little gap there, and it popped its head out.
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: There, just this tiny, little white weasel and it was
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: like and it was the cutest shit I've ever seen
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: in my life.
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it did it like four times, popped its head out, squeak,
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: gone yepped his head squeak, just like telling Ripley off,
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: being like fuck you, and then gone yeah, like it's hilarious.
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: I can't believe that it would stick up for itself
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: to like this. I mean, Rip's on a huge dog,
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: but still she would.
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: Have did to be fair though, to be fair, you're
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: all about it, to be fair, be fair. Weasels are mean,
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: they will fight your fucking well.
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: No, you kind of made me afraid of it. So
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: then when we're trying to get out of the quad,
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: I was like, shit, like.
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: Oh no, they will take off, but they will also
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: stand their ground. Yeah you know what I mean.
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: We kind of had it surrounded, so then I stepped
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: back and we did end up being able to get
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: out of the quad. But yeah, so Rip would have
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: killed that thing in a hearty Oh yeah.
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: She would have shredded it, but that weasel would have
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: fought back. It wouldn't have fought for long, but it
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: would have fought back. But that was an encounter and
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: a half.
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: That was Yeah, that was interesting little face with this
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: little yeah, so freaking adorable. My gosh, I kind of
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: wanted to keep it.
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: No, No, could you imagine having that in a tiny home?
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: Oh I don't think it would last in here. No
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: one of our key year rip would kill it, or.
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: Me or you just being annoyed. Unless you imagine just
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: going to bed at nights a little thing pops its
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: head out of the blankets. Gone, well, that's ourady counter.
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: We just want to share that story with you guys,
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: because I thought it was funny.
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it was really really cute.
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: Should we get to the podcast? We digress a little
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: bit here, I think, so let's let's go all right,
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: so as off. Apparently you are going to be pissed off.
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: As we mentioned though, we're going to Florida. We talked
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: about different stuff with Florida before. It's a state known
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: around the world for many different things and many different reasons.
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: As we have mentioned interesting headlines Florida Man for example,
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: right yep. Now, Florida also just so happens to be
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: home of this very strange case known as the liquid
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: Matthew murders. Okay, okay, any idea why it would be
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: called the liquid Matthew Murder.
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: I've already been kind of wondering. I don't know if
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: I'm going to go there, because like what happens if
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: I say something really fucked up?
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: Fair enough? I just realized I forgot that.
• 8:58
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, may look at all those SIPs he could
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: have already had.
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: I just got to catch up. I guess liquid what Sorry,
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: Matthew Liquid Matthew Murder. Okay, So this story takes us
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: back forty years into nineteen eighty three. Florida residents across
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: the state were beginning to wake up as the sun rose,
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: and they found themselves with a mystery almost directly lifted
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: from the pages of a Sherlock Holmes book, placed upon them.
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: Everyone you know, started their day the sun rising, getting
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: ready for work. But early in that morning, two joggers
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: out of highly in Miami were out for their morning jog,
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: probably living a much healthier lifestyle than I ever will.
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: It's always the joggers or the dog walkers, man, I know, right,
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: being out those early risers, this just makes me out
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: want to be an early riser.
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So they were doing their thing. It was out
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: on December sixth of nineteen eighty three. Now while their
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: feet hit the pavement, which eat with each step, they
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: eventually led them to find a man laying face down
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: in an almost empty parking lot. Now, once in a while,
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: people have such a fun evening at the next morning,
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: they wake up in fairly peculiar places.
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: To be fair, right, I can't see that's ever happened
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: to me.
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: I've never woken up in a parking lot. Well, given
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: this is Florida, with such extravagant titles with the Florida
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: Man sort of thing, right, a parking lot doesn't seem
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: like it's too far fetched to be waking up after
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: a bender.
• 10:26
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: However, as a two joggers approached the motionless man laying
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: face down, it became increasingly clear that he wasn't just
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: passed out drunk. He was most undoubtedly dead deceased. Yes,
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: the two joggers called the discovery of the body into
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: the police and found themselves the center of a murder investigation. Dang.
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: When investigators arrived on the scene, it would be Sergeant
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: David Miller who would be piecing together what would become
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: one of the most confusing and yet striking simple investigations
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: in Florida's history. At the scene, barriers were immediately set
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: up to help contain and prevent crime scene contamination. Then
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: the investigation officially began. They searched for blood, footprints, clues,
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: all shapes and sizes, whether it was a murder weapon,
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: or anything that could lead them the right path. They
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: took crime scene photos and interviewed the two joggers who
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: found the man. It was immediately clear that the man
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: had been strangled to death oh jeez, and an estimated
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: time death was also able to be determined fairly quickly.
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: It was likely that he passed away and was killed
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: the evening before and laid there on the cold ground
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: to be discovered in the light of the new day
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: all night, hey yeap. Now, being that as death most
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: likely took place in the dark, investigators were not really
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: able to find anyone who was seeing any suspicious activity. Right,
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: it's dark. You can't see shit. Yep. There's not many
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: people around because they're all at home now sleeping, And
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: despite their searching, there wasn't much immediate apparent evidence as
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: far as things went either. Thankfully, though, due to the
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: victim's belongings, they did learn his name. His name was
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna butcher this. I'm sorry, but I'm gonna t
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: hi my best here. Francisco Patino Griterrez a sailor from Colombia. Now,
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: Francisco was on a cargo ship he had been working,
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: and they recently docked in Panama, and Francisco had found
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: himself at the wrong end of a pair of hands.
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: Clearly who had strangled him and left him there in
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: the parking lot. But the question is why what had happened?
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: We know he was strangled, we know he came in
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: from a boat, but how did he get there in between?
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: And who had a motive to kill him? Exactly?
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I was expecting his name to be like Matthew
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: or something. Just wait, now, this title makes zero sense
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: to me. So I'm I'm okay, I'm want to listen.
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: We're getting there, Okay, don't you worry. Okay. So these
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: were the sort of questions that Sergeant David Miller and
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: his team of investigators were trying to find out now.
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: Unfortunately for them, though, the investigation would come to a
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: screeching halt when a bright flash of light across the sky,
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: followed by a deep rumble of thunder echoing above, and
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: then all hell broke loose came upon them like a thunderstorm. Yeap,
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: oh shit, massive rains beyond suddenly pouring down and practically
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: flooded the crime scene, making it nearly impossible to physically
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: work on the scene any longer, and the investigators were
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: forced to go home for the rest.
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: Of the year. Oh, I've never really thought of something
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: like that happening.
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it could wash a whole shit ton away. Yeah.
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: I do remember watching CSI back in the day and
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: that happened in an episode. Actually, yeah, that rings the
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: bell too. Yeah, And I think that's why you'll see
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: a lot of modern day crime scene investigation photos. They
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: often have tents set up in areas where at all possible.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: But even still, it's not foolproof, right.
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, even if there was like a torrential downpour, it
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: would still be wrecking stuff.
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, imagine a crime happens in the middle of
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: a rain storm or it's just normally raining. It's going
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: to wash away blood immediately. That blood's not staying there
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: on the sidewalk, it's getting washed away.
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: You'd have nothing left. Yeah, wow, I mean that would
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: be some lock really on the killers side.
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: No kidding, So investigators return the next morning. There was
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: little hope of finding any evidence that it survived the
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: sudden storm, but they were hopeful. They went out there,
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: they crossed their fingers and they began searching. Now they
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: were going through the wet crime scene to see what
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: may have survived, hoping that something, anything, weathered the storm.
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: And it didn't actually take them too long to find something.
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: Oh the strangest of places.
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: Okay, what did they find?
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: Well, it was only meters away and I mean meters
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: away from where Francisco's body had been discovered where they
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: found the clue. This wasn't just any clue though. It
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: wasn't something that someone would unintentionally leave behind, not a
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: cigarette butt or a footprint or a hair. This was
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: intentionally left and it sparked Sergeant David Miller on a
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: search for clues and what would quickly turn into the
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: crime scene like in WHICHPT. Florida would never have seen before.
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: This is what he found. He found on taped to
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: the back of a no dumping sign was a note.
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, something that shouldn't have survived a rainstorm either. However,
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: whoever had left the note had sealed it in a
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: plastic bag, almost like they had seen the storm coming,
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: like the third for it beforehand.
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: They looked at the weather network before almost like that.
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he looks up. They find this note tagged to
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: the back of a sign weather Proof ready to go,
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: waiting for him.
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: Such bullshit though, like murderers and like killing someone, it's
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: not a game, like people when they leave shit like
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: that intentionally, like they're just making it a game, which
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: is kind of just makes you feel a little gross.
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I do want you to remember that, specifically what
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: you just said, okay.
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: Oh, like because it's going to be a grosser.
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: I just want you to remember that. Awesome okay. Now.
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: The note was only slightly damp and certainly in good
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: enough condition for the investigators to open up and read
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: the typed up message left on the crime scene photo
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: Urst crime scene note. Sorry, so what's it say? What
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: do we got here? Well to read what is said?
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: I want to bring in Jacko. Whoa.
• 16:50
  Speaker 4: Once you're back on the track, you'll travel in night.
• 16:54
  Speaker 4: So prepare your old self for a terrible fright now. Oh,
• 17:00
  Speaker 4: the motive is clear and the victim is too. You've
• 17:05
  Speaker 4: got all the answers just follow the.
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: Clues, so it's like a real life scavender hunt pretty much.
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: Yikes.
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: Usually scavender hunts are like fun. This is like not fun.
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, jaws were Jeff definitely dropped when they were
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: reading this note. They're just like what the fuck? Yeah?
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: And whoever left it literally seemed to be taunting investigators
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: with this like cryptic riddle. And now serial killers do,
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: like who do leave these clues? They do taunt or
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: tease authorities. That's kind of their what they're getting after,
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: Like it is a game, like it is a scavenger
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: hunt that lights them up. Yeah. The guys that do this,
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: they believe they are smarter than authorities, and so it's
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: their way of showing like you can't catch me. Mm hmm.
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: But was this a taunting message left behind by Francisco's
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: murderer or was it maybe just a hoax left behind
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: by someone during the rainstorm who caught wind of the
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: investigation and wanted to leave a fun riddle at the
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: investigator's expense. No, that's kind of the question they were
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: I think it was the murderer, You think so for sure? Well,
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: the investigators weren't one hundred percent. They weren't sure, but
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: they certainly were in a hurry to find out. M hmmm.
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: They didn't have much physical evidence from the night before,
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: but they did have something that would help them figure
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: out if this note was real, if it was posted
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: during the rainstorm in their absence or not. They had
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: crime scene photos, so they went back in the photos.
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: They took shit and looked at the photos.
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: That wasn't there. This person was probably just sitting there
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: fucking car watching.
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: I hate that the note was there. Oh okay, the
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: note was there in their crime shift here. I'm already
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: just like overreacting. Ben said, I'm going to be mad.
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: Is this apart where I'm meant? The note was legitimately
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: there at the time of the murder. Okay, So investigators
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: to find some answers. They needed to piece it together.
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: So thinking back, once you're back on track, you'll travel
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: in night. What could it mean? Now back on the boat, Well,
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: I'm not so sure. I don't. I can't get inside
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: Sergeant David Miller's head here, but in about an hour
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: or so he did figure it out. An impressive feet
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: for a note that's as cryptic as it is, potentially
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: left behind by a killer who clearly imagined themselves with
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: a fucking real life from Riddler from Batman. Yeah, but
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: he had a feeling that if he followed this clues,
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: he would find another piece of the puzzle, and his
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: gut proved be right when he found a second note
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: only a few minutes down the road from where the
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: first note had been found.
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: Okay, so I assumed it would be kind of further away,
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: but okay, Well.
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: He came across a speed limit sign and found another
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: plastic bag taped to the back of it. Oh and
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: I mean you can guess what was inside that plastic bag,
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: of course the note, right, Yeah, now back on track.
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: I'm assuming must have meant on the road. So I'm
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: thinking someone traveling a certain direction, a certain flow of
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: maybe a highway or something, right, okay, And that sign
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: would certainly be visible in the reflective night from vehicles
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: passing by in headlights. So that's kind of where I'm
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: thinking he got this from. But I'm not certain how
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: he deciphered to go this direction and find it on
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: the sign he figured it out. I don't know what
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: was going on in his head, but that's what happened.
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: Well, It's lucky that they had someone that's good at
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: riddles on this case.
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: Right within an hour he had a figure.
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: Out, like that's really good.
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: That is really good. So he's he's doing awesome. Yeah,
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: shout out to him now. The message this time only
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: raised more questions rather than reassuring the investigators that they
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: were on the right track. Now this note again bringing
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: in Jacko. This note read this.
• 20:52
  Speaker 4: Yes, Matthew is dead, but his body not felt those
• 20:59
  Speaker 4: brains would Matt's because his body did melt for Billy
• 21:04
  Speaker 4: through Matt in some hot boiling oil to confuse the
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: police for the mystery they did toil.
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: Huh.
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm confused as shit now and you should be like,
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: he did they play two names in there, two names
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: Matthew and Billy.
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: Billy and Matthew. Matthew and Billy.
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: Yes, and that is not the name of the friggin
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: person that is dead.
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: Correct, So by Matthew could potentially be a whole other
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: victim that they've yet to find. And how does this
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: tie Francisco into it?
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: Huh that's terrifying almost, because then it's like, brig how
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: many victims do we have here?
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: What is this exactly? Huh.
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: And this guy's freaking crazy like psycho?
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: And what did you say earlier that I said, I
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: don't want you to forget what you said? Should I forgot?
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: I knew you forgot it? What the hell did I say?
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: You're basically saying that these guys playing a fucking sick.
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: Game and it's not Oh yeah, yeah, it makes you
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: feel feel sick or make you feel gross gross, made
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: you feel gross?
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: I did remember you had helped me, good job. I
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: should have a notebook that they're just right fentle me
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: to remember this.
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so this is sick, and it seems so bizarre,
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: as if someone was trying, honestly, in my opinion, too
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: hard to be clever with what they're writing, to the
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: point that it didn't make sense anymore if they took
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: the note at face value. Investigators were looking at another
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: victim and his remains may not be so easily found
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: because it sounds like Matthew could very well be in
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: well a liquid state, like because they boiled in oil.
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: Okay, And that is actually kind of where my head
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: went with that title, And.
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: I was like, I'm not going to say anything because
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: I don't want to sound like well, I mean, a
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: lot of us have seen Breaking Bad. We know that
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: people you know, certain assiles, certain compounds and bodies, and yeah,
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: so Bringing Bad's a good show. It is a good
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: show now this time, investigators, though regarding the clues, at
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: a loss. They weren't able to unravel these cryptic messages
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: in this riddle and what they were talking about. They
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: didn't have any answers. They couldn't come up with anything,
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: and the case was darker and stranger as the more
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: they thought about this. They potentially had a serial killer
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: out there.
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it seemed very random. Really, Oh yeah, it was
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: not what I was expecting. It doesn't make any sense.
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: It doesn't. So investigators worked trying to figure it out,
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: trying to make sense of it for days, and they
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: were unable to make any headway. They managed to figure out.
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: You know, the first one may said quick, but the
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: second one baffled.
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: Well, it's almost it's probably a fear too, that they're
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: just waiting for a Matthew to show up or something
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: deceased or missing or something right like, that's terrifying.
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: Well, and they're also going against a clock, because who
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: knows that if this individual is going to strike again,
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: and they're going to get another note with another body, right, Yeah,
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: who's to say we clearly have someone. As you said,
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: it's a sick game like this is just not a
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: good situation. Yeah. Well, it was almost a week later
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: that Sergeant David Miller made a call. He decided they
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: were going to release the second note to the public
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: and enlist their help in solving the cryptic crime. Okay,
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: so he sent it out to be published in the
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: local press. When they waited, they sat back and said,
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: let's hope someone might have the insight they need to
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: crack this code. Someone could know something. Yeah. Well, and
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: even still, you might have someone who might even be
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: able to look at it a different perspective and come
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: up with an idea. Yeah. Now, the Liquid Matthew case,
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: as it was printed in the press, came to be
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: an overnight sensation, with amateur detectives and sleuths all across
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: the nation putting their minds together to catch the mysterious
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: murderer and stop them before they could strike again. Yeah,
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: it didn't take long before investigators would receive a phone
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: call from someone who was able to help decipher them
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: note Okay, and the call didn't come from a would
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: be detective or a newspaper puzzle addict either, who was it?
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: The call came from the very person who left the note.
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, you're kidding. My head did not go there. No,
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: not at all. What the frig Because it's like this
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: person is probably thinking this is taking too long. I'm
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: just going to help them so they can buy the
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: next clue and we can move on.
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: Do you think so?
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: Huh?
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: You think that's what's going on? Yeah? Remember how I
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: said you were going to get pissed off?
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Did I just nail it?
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: No, you're far from it. Oh, and I'm going to
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: tell you why, and you're about to learn why. I'm
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: going to say you're going to get pissed off. CA
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: I'm ready. The man on the phone told law enforcement
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: that he had seen a copy of the riddle in
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: the public press and wanted to let them know that
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: he had written it along with the first note as well.
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: But that isn't all he had to say. In fact,
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: the man on the phone went as far as actually
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: giving investigators his full name and his home address. Weird,
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: but why would the person who wrote these notes simply
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: turn himself in as you just said it's weird.
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: Well, he's probably turning someone in. That's not him.
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: Oh he was. It was his real name, it was
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: his real address. The man was a leader of a
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: local church youth group, and according to him, the notes
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: had been part of an event that his local church
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: ran every Halloween. The notes reclues for a murder mystery
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: scavenger hunt, meant to send participants through the city to
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: try and solve it for fun, and was actually run
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: by four local churches, not one mysterious mastermind on a
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: murderous rampage.
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: Oh okay, so this note wasn't even like had anything
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: to do with this person in the parking lot. Then correct,
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: Well the fuck? Wow? Okay, well it's good that they
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: put that out there. Then that's so fucking weird, something
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: they would never have. Oh like what the wasted resources?
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry, but okay, you pissed off. Not as just
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: off as I thought I would be. But that's interesting,
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: like it's almost comical, but not.
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: Well, the man had claimed he had wrote the clues
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: then knew that the weather might turn worse for the
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: rain in the forecast on Halloween night. Yeah, so we
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: sealed them in plastic bags and tape them to the
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: back of the street sign so they could survive the weather. Now,
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: as it turns out, it's true another storm had struck
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: on Halloween night that year, and since it did occur,
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: the Scavender hunt had been called off early and the
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: participants went home, leaving the leftover notes behind, just.
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: Left them there. They should probably have gone and like
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: collected them.
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: No, they were just left behind, taped there and left
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: and they never went back to retrieve them.
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: And here now they are like clues to a murder.
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: It seemed. Wow. The notes had been on the back
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: of those signs for months, surviving wind rain in their
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: plastic bags, until the fateful December when a very real
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: murder and alive Francisco just so happened to be fallen
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: victim right beneath. Yeah.
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: Can you think that they would look pretty weather though?
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: Like you would think they wouldn't look like they were
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: just put there.
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: So, I don't know. I found that weird. Well, how
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: long does plastics deteriorate? In a month or two? Well,
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: they would be like dusty or dirty rain. It just rained.
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: I guess, huh, maybe I'll have to test this. You'll
• 28:38
  Speaker 2: come home tomorrow, plastic bags around it around the yard
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: testing well.
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: Any any sort of weathering that would have occurred. You
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: could have explained it with the rain. Oh, the note
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: is wet. Will it just rained? Yeah? The plastic bag
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: isn't hanging on very well anymore. Will it just rain?
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: The storm kind of washed some of the tape away.
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: I gotta use some good tape.
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: It's blowing in the wind. Who knows what could have
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: used good tape? Yeah, I mean this is a whole
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: fetch story as far as the police were concerned, though,
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: So to confirm, investigators called another church and other church
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: leaders in the area as well, and they were actually
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: able to confirm the identity of the caller and his
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: story as well. Huh So that's bizarre. Yeah, it turns
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: out that the notes had absolutely nothing to do with
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: Francisco's murder. Wow, nothing to do with actually anything really
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: at all, nothing real anyways, But what exactly did that
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: mean for Francisco's murder and investigation?
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: My gears are really turning here. That's wild.
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: Well, first, we do know there's no real serial killer
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: on the loose. There's no notes being left behind, right,
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: so it could be just like a one.
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: Off death, so Matthew is not in danger.
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: Here, Matthew is not in danger, which is good. So
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: at least no one was leaving behind riddles taunting investigators.
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: But the remaining questions were left why had a real
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: person been murdered and left in this parking lot? Well?
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: To explain why that had happened, the investigators actually didn't
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: have to look very far. Instead of chasing these mysterious
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: cryptic notes, investigators turned to the ship Francisco arrived on
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: the cargo ship. Yeah had Francisco as they cruised into
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: the country and docked in Panama, or so they initially thought.
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: The truth of the ship was that it had come
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: into American waters and port authorities stormed the ship before
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: we could ever get ashore. They had taken control of it,
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: and people who were on board the ship were led ashore. However,
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: the goods and everything were seas because authorities had good
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: reason to suspect it was part of a drug smuggling scheme.
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: Oh okay, and while aboard they found eleven pounds or
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: five kilograms of cocaine on the ship. Woh yeah wow.
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: No one on the crew had been arrested yet, like
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: I said, a lot of them were led ashore, and
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: authorities were actually in the process of figuring out which
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: crewmates were involved in the drug smuggling scheme, the whole crime.
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: A lot of them might not even have known exactly
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: that was what they're caring so they're trying to figure
• 31:07
  Speaker 2: out who's who, who's involved.
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and in the midst of all this, Francisco got murdered. Huh.
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: So this could have looked like another coincidence at first,
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: but Francisco was still on their list of suspects as
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: far as the drug ring went when he was found
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: dead in that parking lot. Okay, and after the mysterious
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: no part but that aside, his involvement in the drug
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: smuggling scheme was confirmed. Hmm. So the leading theory was
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: that when the missing shipment of cocaine did not arrive,
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: Francisco was in hot waters with some local drug cartel
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: oh my gosh, and ultimately it cost him his life.
• 31:53
  Speaker 2: You know. That honestly kind of makes sense too, because
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: lots of times people that are like that, they kind
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: of kill someone I just leave them there like it's
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: just like whatever. They're not even like trying to hide
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: their crime whatsoever. Yeah, but then this note situation just
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: like threw it for a fucking look them on a
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: wild goose chase, so just shit right, Like, yeah, it
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: just delayed the process. It's pretty good that they were
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: still able to like go about finding this out.
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but and what are the odds of actually having
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: these fucking scavenger hunt notes taped right there by a body? Yeah,
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: and then having a an investigator actually solved the first
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: one too, because he didn't have the steps leading up
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: to it. Oh my gosh.
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: It's just lucky. And it could have cost them them
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: solving this altogether. Really, Oh, it could have because it
• 32:43
  Speaker 2: took so much time, yeah, away from them searching other
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: paths and other like things that might have happened.
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, one hundred percent. It detracted from him for sure.
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: And then also on top of it, I mean, the
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: crime scene was basically washed away giant storm. But yeah,
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: the goose chase, the false leads, who knows how long
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: it could have delayed and potentially disrupted this entire case.
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but I'm assuming these people probably still got away
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: with this.
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: Well. Francisco's case was closed on December nineteenth, nineteen eighty three,
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: only thirteen days after his body was found. But it
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: has forever been tied with the now legendary and infamous,
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: infamous Liquid Matthew murderer case. And though his case was
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: closed or is closed, yes, his killer got away with murder. Wow. Wow,
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: so it is a closed case, but it is technically
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: to this day unsolved.
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: That's like the biggest piss off, right there. Yep, that
• 33:45
  Speaker 2: they just like got away with this.
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: Yep. And okay, sorry, was the notes called? Okay?
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: I just needed to clarify this name situation. Here was
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: the case or the person in those letters was called Matthew,
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: and like he was to be like liquid, So that's
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: why it's like liquid Matthew.
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: Correct. Okay. Wow, it's a bizarre case. Yeah, this is
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: so bizarre. Okay. I can hear the gears turning.
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: They're really turning, because I don't think at any moment
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: and time in this case I could have predicted shit
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: of what was going to happen. I know, there's nothing
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: I could have predicted.
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: In all honesty. If you remove the scavenger hunt notes
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: from this case, the case is ten seconds long.
• 34:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and it's it's probably a lot like other cases. Yeah,
• 34:38
  Speaker 2: they get away with the shit because drugs are involved
• 34:41
  Speaker 2: and it's scary people.
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: And yeah, so essentially this individual got away with murder
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: potentially because of the wild goose chase the washed away evidence,
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: but also potentially because they know they're just not going
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: to catch this guy. Who the fuck is it.
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: I think they would have gotten away with it regardless.
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: I think so too. Yeah, huh, so that is well
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: now known as a liquid Matthew murder case.
• 35:07
  Speaker 2: I shouldn't Okay, I'm not laughing in regards to this
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: at all, but I'm just like thinking that the church
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: probably did not continue playing that game in future. That
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: is my That's how I'm ending my thoughts of this case.
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: I'm assuming that the church did not get charged with
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: any sort of obstruction of justice or anything. Oh I
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: don't think so. I mean, maybe they got charged with
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: fucking littering, who knows. I doubt it. But even still,
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: it's like that could have gone so sour. Yeah, it
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: could have gone because they're lucky they figured this out
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: and have a case still solved within thirteen days.
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: Well, yeah, they're lucky that the guy decided to put
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: it out to the media, because they just kept like
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: trying to solve this.
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: Gosh, it could have been like a fucking Zodiac killer situation.
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: Years the road. We're still trying to decipher this shit. Yeah,
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: and here it's just some scavenger hunt put on by
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: someone in a youth group. Yeah.
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: So it honestly seems like the stars kind of just
• 36:02
  Speaker 2: like aligned so much in this case for me, like that,
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: it just things happened for reasons, and it's lucky they happened.
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, and it's it baffles me that it was
• 36:13
  Speaker 1: solved within thirteen days. Yeah, And I also want to
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: draw attention to how fucking ridiculous those clues were. This
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: is for a youth group. What kind of kids are
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: going to be able to solve this shit?
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: Well? Or should they even be thinking about like a
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: body being boiled?
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: That too, But it took a professional detective one hour
• 36:33
  Speaker 1: to cipher one clue.
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: Well yeah, but like we said, said, he doesn't have
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: the backstory or there was probably or he was kind
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: of solving them not in an order, and so makes
• 36:44
  Speaker 2: sense still yeah, but I like, I just think that
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: if he didn't put it out with the media, they
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: would have probably spent months months on this.
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: I have a feeling it would have been years. Yeah,
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: I have a feeling that if it wasn't put out
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: to media, it would have been one of those things
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: that's going to be sitting on a police officer's desk
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: where the couple guys are working on it, working on it,
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: that going around talking to people. Public doesn't really know
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: about these notes, trying to keep them quiet. Sure, maybe
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: it's getting leaked a little bit here and there, but
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: general public doesn't see him for the most part. Right,
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: general public hasn't read freaking Zodiac killer's notes, right, or
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: seen them or whatever, not that you can read them,
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Yeah, so it would have
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: been probably years, and by the time it even is
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: to the point where these individuals could have read it,
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: they probably fucking don't remember anyways. Yeah.
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: Wow, just the amount of money that could have cost
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: is unbelievable. But then also someone did did die here,
• 37:43
  Speaker 2: and that's oh, that is terrible.
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: So sad.
• 37:46
  Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, his I don't even think. Yeah, his
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: death wouldn't have probably even made the news other than
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: all this crazy shit that happened here, right, I'm sure
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: his death would have Still, it would have been not
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: in like the sense where it's like on a true
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: crime podcasts and stuff what I sort of mean, but yeah,
• 38:02
  Speaker 2: fair enough, super.
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: Sad, Yeah it is. But I mean, honestly, you find
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: yourself in a bad situation with drugs like that, that's
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: it seems like that's kind of the world. I mean,
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: I don't I don't think anyone deserves to be murdered.
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: Don't get me wrong here. No, however, he's kind of
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: putting himself in that kind of situation. You know, it's unfortunately,
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: it's kind of part of the business. You know.
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that is just scared. I would just be so
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: scared shitless. Oh yeah, don't do breaking bad shit.
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: Don't do drugs kids.
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah right, that's that's how we're going to end this.
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: Yeap. So thank you for listening. Hopefully enjoyed that episode.
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: Hopefully it didn't piss you off too much. It didn't
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: pissed the hole off as much as I thought.
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it didn't actually super piss me off. There was
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: parts of it, but it's just like, like, I think
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: the fuck that should be the saying of this podcast.
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: I thought you were going to be all like, are
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: you fucking kidding me? We just went through all that
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: for nothing, Like I thought that was going to be
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: your attitude.
• 39:00
  Speaker 2: Well, if it was years or months, I think my
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: attitude would be like that more so. But it was
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: quite quick, right, Well, I meant.
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: You having to sit here listen to me talk about it.
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: Oh no, I enjoy listening to you talk.
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: I thought you would have gotten ramped up and everything
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: and been like, fuck, now we just start over. And
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: by the way, I did tell you remember that thing
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: you said, and I said, remember that you said, this
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: isn't some sort of sick game. Yeah, oh, it was
• 39:27
  Speaker 1: a game. It was a scavenger hunt. You even said
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: scavenger hunt in fact. Oh shit, So I did predict
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: something then, unknowingly that was exactly what it is. And
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: it was really hard for me to bite my tongue
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: and keep that quiet. Wow, I'm good. Well, well you
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: said it wasn't, so it was the exact opposite of
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: what you were saying. No, I think I did good.
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: I did well here, you did good. Hopefully you guys
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: did too. If you want to check anything else for
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: our social media website whatever, it's all in the description
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: of this podcast. You can even go down there and
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: find Patreon, and there you can sign up for some
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: behind the scenes content. Get on our discord server you
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: name it, exclusive episode at the end of the month
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: for all access patron tire.
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: There you go.
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Or if you just want to chill out here
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: and listen to this episode next episode, that is cool too.
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: We appreciate you.
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: Justine, I appreciate you all. So until next week, stay wicked.