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Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan: Ghastly New Info On Idaho College Murders Leaked To Public · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Quanty times, but Joseph Scott more.
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: So. This past Saturday, I was mentioned in a post
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: on X and you know, I look down, my handle
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: is on there and everything and saying it's just gonna
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: be some comment about, you know, some case that's floating
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: around there. Well, yeah, it was about a case. And
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: not only was it about a case, it was about
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: a very specific case. Because this was on Saturday, and
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: on Friday night apparently Dateline did an episode on the
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: Idaho four and of course the accused is Brian Coberger. Boy,
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: do I have a tale to tell you, guys, because
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: apparently apparently I have been viewed by certain individuals that
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: I'm prepared to discuss right now. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: and this is body Backs. Dave kidnap me over with
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: a feather. I'm sitting there with my Queen of the
• 1:22
  Speaker 2: Homestead and we're having our morning coffee as we do
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: every day, my favorite time of day, by the way,
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: and I'm scrolling through the night's events, catching up on
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: X formerly known of course as Twitter, and lo and behold,
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: I've been tagged, and there before me, I see a
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: picture that is a screen grab off of Dateline and
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: it's my image. Apparently Ryan Coburger. According to them at Dateline,
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: they have information that states that he's watching or listening
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: to things on YouTube relative to true crime and specifically
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: these four homicides in which he is accused of perpetrating.
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: David got to tell you, brother, not too many things
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: send a chill up and spine. It got my attention
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: real quick when the Idaho case kicked off. When we
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: first had a national awareness of it, my wife and
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: I were just as shocked. It was on a Sunday
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: and it hit the news that afternoon. The next day
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: that Monday, I was on national television and it seemed like,
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: for oh my lord, it was like solid for like
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: three weeks. I just had phone calls coming in from
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: all of these different networks, podcast, YouTube channels, and all
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: this sort of thing. So the fact that I would
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: pop up on his radar, I guess because he's seeking
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: I think if you continue with this line of logic here,
• 3:13
  Speaker 2: that Dateline is putting forward. This isn't me putting this forward,
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: is date Line. I would think that he's seeking information
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: from individuals that may have practiced in the past, because
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: if you're you know, if you're in kind of the
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: atmosphere that I'm in right now. I don't work in
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: the field anymore. I'm a teacher and then I do commentary.
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: So I bring my knowledge from, you know, as a
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: practitioner and as an educator to most of the stuff
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: that I do, and I just talk about it. And look,
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: I'm not the only one. I'm sure that there were multiple,
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: multiple locations that he visited along the way and just
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: a glean information. And I find that's very interesting what
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: you mentioned, Dave. People throw around that term narcissism quite
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: a bit, and it seems like it's in every other
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: sentence now then everybody's making a diagnosis of narcissism. I
• 4:16
  Speaker 2: don't know if that's the same as being egocentric or
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: I guess there's shades of this involved in everything. But
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: I'm interested in what you have to say about. Was
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: he seeking information about the case potentially or was he
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: scratching that edge to see his name or see not
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: his name. We wouldn't have known it at that time,
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: but to see the shock that it elicits from the
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: general public. You know, every time there's some breathless reporter
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: that comes on the air, to talk about some little
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: new thing that has developed.
• 4:57
  Speaker 3: I wonder why John, Yeah, why he But not I
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: kind of I'm more like, I wonder why he's listening
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: or watching that particular show. But I really I think
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: it's feeding his ego, you know, getting his name mentioned.
• 5:10
  Speaker 3: But I think it's also you got to remember he's
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: also a student, so almost a professional student in his life.
• 5:20
  Speaker 3: You know, he didn't really go out of the educational atmosphere.
• 5:24
  Speaker 3: But I think based on what we know of him,
• 5:29
  Speaker 3: and it makes sense that he would be driven to
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: watch or listen to a professor give a breakdown as
• 5:38
  Speaker 3: opposed to a clinician. It just makes sense to me
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: that he would be that he. I don't want to
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: say that he's a you know, he's drawn to you,
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: but it makes sense to me that he would care
• 5:48
  Speaker 3: what your opinion was because as a student, he wants
• 5:52
  Speaker 3: to impress the professor, and as a suspected killer, you know,
• 5:57
  Speaker 3: he wants as much fame. He's not gonna get away
• 6:00
  Speaker 3: with it. At this point that they've pretty much made
• 6:02
  Speaker 3: sure that the judge has made sure that everything that
• 6:05
  Speaker 3: they didn't want in is coming in. And so at
• 6:08
  Speaker 3: this point I think they're trying to mitigate the death penalty.
• 6:11
  Speaker 3: You know, is there a way that we can avoid that?
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean Exhibit one A is autism, right, yeah,
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: because autism has nothing to do with him his appearance
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: in court.
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: You mentioned.
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: I love that word mitigate. By the way, they're trying
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: to mitigate the death penalty here, they're trying to say
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: that he's he's not eligible because he's diagnosed with autism,
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: which you know is.
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: You're mentally handicapped. Because of that, then how did you
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: get to be in to be in a college level
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: a program you know, that just doesn't hold wall. That
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: is just a bucket full of holes man?
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: Really?
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: And that based on listen listen.
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: People that would that would make a different argument will say, well,
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: you don't understand the spectrum is nuanced. I I mean,
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: how many times have we heard that? And look, that's
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: gonna be The people that say that are making the
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: same argument that the defense is making.
• 7:08
  Speaker 3: You and I have had this conversation about the on
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: the spectrum with regard to my grandson.
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: As soon as that started coming out on this, I went, really, you're.
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: Going to play this card.
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: Let's see how far they go, and having seen it
• 7:25
  Speaker 3: up close and personal, I wasn't shocked that they tried
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: to play it. I'm thankful that nobody bought it. Well,
• 7:35
  Speaker 3: I'm not shocked the game looking for you.
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: I want to interject one more thing and about this
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: as well. People throw around this term in cell. Oh yeah,
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: so you know they'll say, uh, you know, I'll just
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: see random comments that will pop up on social media
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: and they'll say classic insul And I'm thinking, Okay, how
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: did that? How'd you arrive at that? Dogno is because
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: I can tell you this. There is a manual that
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: mental health workers use. It's called the DSM, and it's
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: in multiple iterations, and I think they're in like the
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: third third. I'm sorry, excuse me, they're in the fifth
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: iteration of this now nowhere in that manual or you
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: can go in there and find the term in cell.
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: And the way this manual, the DSM works is that, yeah,
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: it helps you make diagnoses, but you know what else
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: they do. There's a code in there so that when
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: mental health people are making a diagnosis, they have to
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: enter that code onto their insurance forms in order to
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: get reimbursed. So if there was money to be made
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: with a diagnosis of being an in cell And I
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: don't even know what you would call it, in cell titis,
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: in cell itis. I have no idea that that implies
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: an infection. There's no such thing in the mental health
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: world as being an in cell. This is a uh,
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: a term that has been created to categorize a certain
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: group of men. And so they've used this term for him,
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: and you know, they just kind of throw these terms
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: around like that.
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: If you don't know what in cel means, it means
• 9:17
  Speaker 3: involuntarily sulibate.
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: It's for guys who have trouble with girls.
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: And and to be honest with you, they would have
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: a problem with most guys, you know, based on the
• 9:28
  Speaker 3: way they talk, act and think. They're not the type
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: of individual I know anybody would hang out with. And
• 9:36
  Speaker 3: so I think made up.
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: It's weird.
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: I mean, most of the time people are you know,
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: you come across somebody in there, you know, I don't know,
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: eccentric maybe.
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: But that's a great term.
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, eccentricity, you know, And uh, I have a
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: touch of that in me. I'm a college professor. I'm
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: it's actually mandated in my contract every year you must
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: be eccentric because you're a college professor. But you know,
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: back to this idea of him. Can I tell you
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: one other thing that happened to me on Saturday morning
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: as I sat there with my with my bride and
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: my cup of Joe's.
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: Weird to hear you call it a cup of Joe.
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: I know it is kind of weird, isn't it. I
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: sat there and as I'm sipping on my coffee and
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: I'm kind of absorbing this thing, the first thing that
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: jumped into my mind's eye was what did I say?
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: What did I say? Did I Did I say anything
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: that could have been taken by this individual and had
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: some kind of utility for them? And you can't think
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: that way. But that's not it's not outside. I mean,
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: we go to crime con and I actually have people
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: that will walk up to me. Happens almost every crime con.
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: They'll say, do you feel like that you're teaching killers
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: out there? Perspective killers? And no, I'm teaching forensics. I mean,
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: all are welcome at the table, I guess, but you know,
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: you can't tell who's out there in the audience when
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: you're making any kind of comment. You could say the
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: same thing. I guess about the people that are on Dateline.
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: I mean, they do this, They've done this for years.
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: You know, they have that sloted time and there are
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: people that can't go without watching Dateline. Hey, that's cool
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: if that's what you're what you're all about. But you
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: know they're disseminating information as well. But you know, I
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: had that, I've had that thought. You know, that's come
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: up in my mind, you know, over the years, you know,
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: thinking about you know, who's within the sound of my voice.
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: And I look, if you think that's bad, I think
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: now about my academic colleagues that are at the Sales University.
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: And now all of these years later, after this massacre
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: in Moscow, Idaho took place, I really wonder are they thinking,
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: are they thinking, what do we teach you? Well, brother Dave,
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: aside from my mug appearing on television and the shock
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: my own personal pearl clutching that took place over it,
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: they did. They did have information that they revealed and
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: a lot of stuff with stuff that we had not
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: heard before, you know, kind of this as it applies
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: to what was going on within the house. And you
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: know my question, I think one of my big questions
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: is how'd they come into this information Dateline, that is,
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: was there a source within some department up there, you know?
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: And I don't know. I'm not going to even state
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: any department. I'm just going to say that there are
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: multiple departments that are involved in the investigation of these
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: four homicides. If the folks at Dateline, the producers felt
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: this strongly that they would produce this thing. And I
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: bet you dollars to know, Netes Brother that this episode,
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: I bet they had some of the highest ratings they've
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: had in a while, just simply based on this, on
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: this particular episode, because there were a couple of really
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: big reveals in this day.
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: And they built it up right.
• 13:56
  Speaker 3: They did a good job promoting it, you know, And
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: there's a zeitgeist here with this particular killing, this murderer
• 14:03
  Speaker 3: of whatever.
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: To call a topic popular when you're dealing with the
• 14:09
  Speaker 3: deaths of four college students is mind numbing. It shows
• 14:12
  Speaker 3: you a lot about how we look at things. But
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: you know, every time now that we talk about the
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: Coburger story, the murders, I'm gonna be honest, Joe, I
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: have a twinge of hurt for you over what happened
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: in Orlando at crime Con when you were giving an
• 14:28
  Speaker 3: incredibly you did a loving tribute to the students, to
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: the victims. You talked with a lot of care about
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: what they went through and what happened, and you kind
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: of got at the very end, you know, I felt
• 14:46
  Speaker 3: like that you were not treated the way you should
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: have been treated.
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: By somebody, and that bothered me.
• 14:51
  Speaker 3: And so every time we cover this story, I think
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: about how, no matter hard you work to take care
• 14:56
  Speaker 3: of talking about the individuals, you and I are both victim,
• 15:00
  Speaker 3: the kids, and whenever we're not seen that way, it
• 15:02
  Speaker 3: bothers me.
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: And yeah it does. And listen, it's like I said before,
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: you know, not turning down any kind of offer that's made,
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: even in those circumstances, which, by the way, I think
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: I've made mentioned this before. But it was in a
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: room of thirty four hundred people. Yeah, I don't think
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: that I've ever spoken to a crowd that large before.
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: I couldn't see the back of the room. You know,
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: first off, there's lights in your eyes. It was awesome,
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: but I could tell there were a lot of people,
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: and so I couldn't I couldn't see beyond it. But yeah,
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: and it was a learning experience and you never know,
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: you know, you never know what's going to bubble up
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: out of that. But when you think about what Dateline
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: has done in talking about this case, thirty four hundred people,
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: is nothing that happened that night or that afternoon, you know,
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: with me me, you think about the people that they reach,
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: and there's not going to be aybody standing up and
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: making some kind of comment in the crowd. This is
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: going to be about something else. You know, there might
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: be people at home screaming at the television screen for
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: all I know. I have no idea. But when you
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: get into like that kind of real granular detail about
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: what they are being told, and I have to think
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: that they're being told because they're not investigators. I think that,
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: you know, the most striking thing that came out of
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: this is that there was one part I believe where
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: they they allege that Xanna may have gone upstairs when
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: she heard a noise. Now I don't know how they
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: validate that. I don't know how they come up with that.
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: And then of course she is perhaps is kind of
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: implied that maybe she was chased back downstairs by Coburger.
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: He goes into the room attacks her. You know, she
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: had been up, she had received the order, that they
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: had done the food order. She was awake, And it
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: deviates from what we had heard about Ethan because now
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: they're saying that Ethan most likely was asleep in bed.
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: And we know what we have been what we have
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: heard previously about Xanna and her injuries where you've got
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: these sharp force injuries that literally go down to the
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: cartilage in her fingers where there's either blade grabbing going
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: on in a defensive posture or she's been stabbed in
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: the hand, and of course she's brutalized at that point.
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: And then you know, my lord, the information that Dayline
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: is saying, again not Morgan saying it. What they're talking
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: about relative to Ethan. You know, we've heard that Ethan.
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: I think there was one iteration where they said Ethan
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: was on the floor and uh, just adjacent to the
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: door and he'd had a really nasty injury to his neck.
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: That according to that doesn't square with what Dayline is saying,
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: because Dayline, and correct me if I'm wrong. Dave Dayline
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: said that Ethan's leg or legs were carved up with
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: sharp force injury and that he was in the bed,
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: so that it completely changes the dynamic of what we
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: had known about this case to begin with. Am I
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: am I right? Isn't that what I said?
• 18:43
  Speaker 3: And you know when I saw that, I thought, this
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: is new. This is not information that we have had
• 18:50
  Speaker 3: up to this point. As a matter of fact, a
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: lot of the stuff that we're being told now are
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: things we had didn't know or things that they don't
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: make sense to be honest with you. You know, we
• 19:02
  Speaker 3: were told at first that Dylan Mortenson, you know, the
• 19:05
  Speaker 3: the bushy the one who described the bushy eyebrows, that
• 19:08
  Speaker 3: Dylan you know, that she heard something and went back
• 19:11
  Speaker 3: and went to sleep and woke up around noon.
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: Now we find out that Dylan Mortenson was on the
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: phone all the time.
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: So there's a lot of things.
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: Actually, And I think that information actually came out prior
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: to the Dateline special.
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: It did, and that was like week week or week
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: before last.
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: Yes, I think it was a slow trickle of things
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: and that has that has gone gone on.
• 19:38
  Speaker 3: You know, Joe, I remember back to the Scott Peterson case,
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: and do you remember what happened between the first day
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: of the trial and the last day, other than all
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: the evidence, there was a really big reveal, a really
• 19:55
  Speaker 3: big change happened. And it's because that that whenever I
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: see a trickle of information coming out or something that
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: is really counter to what we believe up to this moment,
• 20:08
  Speaker 3: I realize that investigators don't have all the truth yet
• 20:13
  Speaker 3: they're still figuring it out. In the Peterson case, the
• 20:18
  Speaker 3: investigators the prosecutors open by saying they believe Lacy Peterson
• 20:24
  Speaker 3: was killed on December twenty third. Yeah, and by the
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: end of the trial it was proved that no, she
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: wasn't killed in she was killed on Christmas Eve.
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: That's a pretty big difference.
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And that's why when something like that can happen
• 20:44
  Speaker 3: in a major crime that had all the world's attention
• 20:48
  Speaker 3: and still does. Peterson still has huge ratings. The guy's
• 20:51
  Speaker 3: got the La Innocence Project. I mean, everybody's working on
• 20:55
  Speaker 3: this thing. And you know, I'll be honest with you, Joe,
• 20:58
  Speaker 3: if investigators had that part wrong, I got a feeling.
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: Look I think he did it, but go ahead and
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: look at it again. But in this case, how do
• 21:08
  Speaker 3: you go from saying the reason we didn't get a
• 21:11
  Speaker 3: nine one one.
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: Call until noon. Is because the roommate was asleep.
• 21:14
  Speaker 3: After she sees a guy with bushy hair is bolting
• 21:16
  Speaker 3: out the door, she just goes and lays down and
• 21:19
  Speaker 3: crashes out. But then we find out she was on
• 21:21
  Speaker 3: the phone the whole time. It can't be both, It
• 21:23
  Speaker 3: has to be one of the other.
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, this is not one of these things where two
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: things can be right at the same time. You know.
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: I hear that phrase come up a lot now in
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: our conversations all around, And so what do you think, Yeah,
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: I don't. I don't think that. I don't. I guess
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: that if you're stating not you. But they, if they
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: are stating that they have information now that indicates that
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: there was phone activity. Remember we got those text you know,
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: talking about run run to me expletive, you know, all
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: these sorts of things. And there was even one one
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: bit that came out recently. And I don't know how
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: they concluded this that Dylan actually saw Xana's body and
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: maybe thought she was sleeping. But I got to tell you,
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: I don't know what the degree of lighting was in
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: that environment. And I know she's not a trained professional,
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: at least I don't think she is. She in my estimation,
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: the area around her would have been super saturated with blood.
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: So how can you merely, when you're looking over your
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: shoulder just say, yes, she was sleeping, And why would
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: she be sleeping on the floor. I mean, what are
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: you thinking she passed out? She passed out drunk, because
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: that doesn't seem like something she would have done necessarily.
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: She staid with her boyfriend. And look, I know that
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: there's we don't know yet alcohol had been imbibed. I
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: mean they had come from a fraternity party, you know,
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: and every one of my fraternity parties, I can tell
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: you they were not teetotalers there neither was I was
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: chief among sinners. And so I got to tell you,
• 23:09
  Speaker 2: I think about this, and I think about the information
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: that has been provided along the way at about the
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: circumstances that night, maybe even leading up to that day's events,
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: and what happened afterwards. I'm still I still think, Dave,
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: that at this point in time, I still have more
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: questions than I do answers. Let's see adage, Dave, A
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: picture's wors what one thousand words is that? What they
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: say is that I get confused sometimes.
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: Your paints a thousand words come.
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: On, this is David Gates.
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: And bread un I had record.
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, Telly was singing it too.
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: Uh picked your pains. That does.
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: Uh these images that have come out of Coburger, listen,
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: I gotta tell you. And I'm uh, I'm in no
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: way pro Coburger, but these are and I don't know
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: if these are going to be admitted into evidence because
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: on one level, you know, just when you see the
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: sinister nature of them, because they do, they do look sinister.
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: And remember we've been warned not to look at his eyes.
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: You know, we can't. Defenses sucked, you can't because of
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: his condition. You know, he's got that blank stare. You know,
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: he wears he's you know, he stares off in the distance.
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: You know. I've been locked up in a room with
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: a lot of people over the years, uh when I'm lecturing,
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: and they've got blank stares as well, you know. So
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: I don't know how much can be read into that.
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: And and but when they did release these, these these
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: images of him, you know, with the hoodie on and
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: he's got like a watchcaps knit cap to bogging thing
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: on under it, and you know he looks like you know,
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: he's very dark looking at it. You know, he's got
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: the thing kind of drawn down like a Holocaust cloak,
• 25:31
  Speaker 2: you know, like monks used to wear. Uh, it's got that,
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: it's got that weird, you know, kind of vibe to it.
• 25:37
  Speaker 2: Is that part of the evidence. Is this the trove
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: of evidence, some of the electronic evidence, it's going to
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: be presented in court? And if it is, how on
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: the whole dateline get their hands on it?
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: I don't know how they got it. I don't know.
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: I do know that I've made a number of calls
• 25:54
  Speaker 3: trying to find out it's some information to verify things,
• 25:57
  Speaker 3: and I'm I'm not finding it out, but you know,
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: you do have an investigation that if you remember early on,
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: remember they had the the person who was the not
• 26:11
  Speaker 3: the medical examiner, but they were like voted in on
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: the corner, like yeah, the corner. Yeah, how the corner
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: gave out information yes, early on that we would never
• 26:23
  Speaker 3: hear before, you know, from a No, I don't want
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: to say a legitimate source, but you know what I'm saying,
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: that was a very unusual way to get information.
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: The way it was.
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: Little God, it was when I when that dropped, when
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: that person dropped that information. First off, she actually stated
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: that they all appeared to have been asleep, you know,
• 26:47
  Speaker 2: and my you know, I thought at that time, now,
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: if we were to believe what's going on with this
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: new data that's coming out, it's confirmation to me, did
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: you even go to the scene and see the you know,
• 27:00
  Speaker 2: how long were you there with the bodies that you
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: would make these observations because I got to tell you,
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: I don't know what appears to have been asleep means
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: did Xana sleep on the floor?
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: Is that what you mean?
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: Because and again it's it's skewed. That's an area that
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: the corner never should open up about on any kind
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: of case. And Dave, I don't care how in what
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: far flung area of the country you're in. That's like
• 27:32
  Speaker 2: a minimal that's kind of a baseline of knowledge that
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: every corner has. We've had the national standards in place
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: now for medical legal death investigators since nineteen ninety eight.
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: That's like a one of the things that we kind
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: of pound into people's heads in that training that we
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: established all those years ago was that you worked together
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: as a team when you're talking about a homicide day,
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: particularly especially one that is unsolved. You're an elected official,
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: you're separate from the cops. You can say what you
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: want to say. But let me tell you this, I
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: don't see her getting Christmas cards in the future, you
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: know what I mean. She ain't gonna be invited to
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: the Christmas party all right in the wake of this,
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: because that is it's foreboden. You don't do this, You
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: don't step outside what I refer to as the investigative bubble,
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: because there's no telling who's listening. And unless they told
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: her just to say these things, and I can't imagine
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: anybody would would have done that, I don't understand why
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: she felt compelled to begin to talk about these things
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: that seem to be inaccurate exactly that that's the most
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: gentle way that I can put that.
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: I think you're being kind.
• 28:55
  Speaker 3: I think that there's a number of issues here that
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: this dayline's special. Again, I don't know where they got
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: their information, but they felt comfortable enough with it from
• 29:05
  Speaker 3: a legal standpoint to put it on national network television
• 29:08
  Speaker 3: and nobody has come out to scream about it. So
• 29:11
  Speaker 3: it kind of makes you believe that there is information
• 29:14
  Speaker 3: that is available somehow. But a couple of questions I
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: still have, Joe, is that again? I go back to
• 29:20
  Speaker 3: Dylan Mortenson, and I really I don't want to beat
• 29:25
  Speaker 3: this dead horse. They tore the building down, they tore
• 29:28
  Speaker 3: the house down, and we have no way of going
• 29:30
  Speaker 3: in there to verify anything, because I have real questions
• 29:35
  Speaker 3: about the people they call survivors. I have real questions,
• 29:39
  Speaker 3: mainly because I haven't heard what actually transpired. But now
• 29:44
  Speaker 3: we've been told about Dylan being on the phone the
• 29:47
  Speaker 3: whole time, texting back and forth and on Indeed or
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: Facebook or whatever, and you know that seems to be
• 29:53
  Speaker 3: a little odd thing to do for eight hours and
• 29:56
  Speaker 3: then get up and you have this carnage going on.
• 29:58
  Speaker 3: You don't call nine one one. But again, stepping over that,
• 30:05
  Speaker 3: the timetable puts Xanakernodle ordering food at four o'clock in
• 30:11
  Speaker 3: the morning, yes, and it being delivered at four oh
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: eight something like that. So the timetable we're looking at
• 30:21
  Speaker 3: begins there with Xena and ends before four thirty according
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: to what we've been told. Right, so you've got a
• 30:31
  Speaker 3: twenty minute window where one guy is going to come
• 30:34
  Speaker 3: into a house with six people and he is going
• 30:37
  Speaker 3: to be able to brutally kill very quickly enough that
• 30:45
  Speaker 3: it was quick enough that he didn't wake up Ethan,
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: because they say Ethan was asleep when he was attacked.
• 30:50
  Speaker 3: Although I'm still wondering, how does he get something carved
• 30:52
  Speaker 3: into his leg if he is the last victim and
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: he slept through the whole thing again, Yeah.
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: Just a whole lot response, Ale owned, you would think
• 31:00
  Speaker 2: that that would be something that would, you know, jolt
• 31:04
  Speaker 2: you away. Of course, we don't know about sequencing. Think.
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: Let's okay, let me let me throw.
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: This at you. I was just going to ask you
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: figured that one out.
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: Well, well, just let me throw this at you. Yeah,
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: if what date this is not Morgan saying this date line,
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: If what dateline is saying is accurate, okay, then what
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: are the what are the fatal wounds that Ethan would
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: have sustained. It's it's not going to be a carving
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: of the leg. Okay, that's not going to be fatal,
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: at least in the immediate You might exanguinate after a
• 31:36
  Speaker 2: period of time depended upon how deep, how deeply your
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: legs might have been cut. However, here's here's a here's
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: something I want to throw at you. What if he
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: was attacked in another area of his body and then
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: after the fact this is done to him. You know,
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: that goes into an area of mutilation. And again I
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: know I'm projecting here. He's a male, He's only male
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: in domsaw wow. And I think back to a comment
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: that was made in this program by this person that
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: knew him over at Washington State, and she had invited him,
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: allegedly to a pool party and his eyes, according to her,
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: had locked on to these two young women that were
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: clad and mkini's and was just focused on them. He
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: knows nobody. This is like, we feel sorry for this guy.
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: We want to invite him in kind of introduce him
• 32:39
  Speaker 2: to It's probably other graduate students thasga's, those sorts of
• 32:43
  Speaker 2: people that are working toward the same goals, or maybe
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: employees that work in the department, and he can't take
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: his eyes off of them. As a matter of fact,
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: he interjects himself into a conversation with one of these
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: young women allegedly that was there with her husband. Never
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: acknowledged the husband. The entire conversation is having a conversation
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: like her with her allegedly, Like it goes something like
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: you do you like rock climbing, do you like hiking?
• 33:14
  Speaker 2: You know, just completely inappropriate And I think about that,
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: and you're dismissing the male that's there, And if what
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: they're talking about really and I don't know if this
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: was their point with a dateline special that they maybe
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: perhaps are intimating that he did something to Ethan because
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: he's a male, he was there and there were these
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: other females. Maybe that's a long shot. I have no idea,
• 33:39
  Speaker 2: but I don't know. It's it's certainly something to think about.
• 33:44
  Speaker 3: I don't think he was just out tuling around looking
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: at stars at four o'clock in the morning and said, hey,
• 33:48
  Speaker 3: there's a nice house.
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: I think i'll go in and see. I can't kill anybody,
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: you know.
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: No, no, this is this is a location that whoever
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: did this, whoever did this, had some level of familiarity
• 34:00
  Speaker 2: with it. And you know, that's another interesting bit that
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: they dropped here, Dave, is fact that now and I
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: don't know, this might be bigger than anything else, that
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: now we've got new surveillance photos or surveillance video from
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: an adjacent house where you can and we've never seen
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: this before. That was one of the other big reveals
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: here where you can see what appears to be a
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: white Lantra that's that's making loops and passive. Do you
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: remember some of the other footage that we had initially
• 34:31
  Speaker 2: that we've talked about before, and it's real blurry. This
• 34:38
  Speaker 2: is not quite as blurry, and you can see the
• 34:42
  Speaker 2: car pass in multiple directions from that static camera that
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: was on an adjacent house. My wife and I were,
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: you know, kind of watching it the other other day,
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: just the video because I haven't seen the entire episode
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: of the dateline thing, and you know, we were saying, well,
• 35:04
  Speaker 2: if they have this camera, this videography, and here's where
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: I kind of will leave this. If they have this
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: videography and we've never seen it before, A big question
• 35:14
  Speaker 2: is what else do the police have that we haven't
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: seen yet. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this is bodybacks