Latest / Mini Scroll / Skibidi Toilet: Exploring the Nuances of Gen Alpha's Favourite Meme w/ Aidan Walker

Transcript

Skibidi Toilet: Exploring the Nuances of Gen Alpha's Favourite Meme w/ Aidan Walker · Mini Scroll

• 0:00
  On December 4th, 2023, YouTube published its annual Year in
• 0:04
  Review blog post naming the trends that defined online
• 0:07
  culture over the last 12 months. Several trending topics listed
• 0:11
  were to be expected, like the Barbie movie Grimace, Shake and
• 0:15
  Mr. Beast, but the one that snagged the number one spot for
• 0:18
  YouTube's top trend of the year was relatively new and unheard
• 0:23
  of, at least for those under the age of 12.
• 0:26
  The top trend that defined online culture in 2023 was
• 0:30
  Skibbity Toilet and the users who watched it, or primarily Jen
• 0:35
  Alpha. Skibbity Toilet is a YouTube
• 0:37
  series created by animator Alexei Gerasimov.
• 0:40
  The first clip was published in February 2023, and by the time
• 0:44
  YouTube had dubbed Skibbity Toilet the top trend of the
• 0:47
  year, the series had reached over 65 billion views, often
• 0:52
  rivaling Mr. B for the platform's highest viewed
• 0:55
  videos. Skibbity Toilet, now in its 24th
• 0:59
  season, was an unprecedented success, receiving mainstream
• 1:03
  attention all around the world for its impact on online humor
• 1:06
  and Internet trends, proving that Gen.
• 1:09
  Alpha might be dethroning Gen. Z as the culture defining
• 1:14
  generation sooner than we think from Centennial world.
• 1:18
  I'm Lauren Meisner and this is infinite scroll, a podcast about
• 1:22
  Internet culture, the creator economy and how social media is
• 1:25
  shaping Gen. Zed.
• 1:27
  Welcome back to infinite scroll everyone.
• 1:29
  I am so excited to bring you this episode today.
• 1:33
  I feel this is a long time coming.
• 1:35
  Skibbity toilet has been part of the cultural zeitgeist for about
• 1:39
  a year now. I gained a lot of attention in
• 1:42
  July of last year and you know, we've never really covered it on
• 1:46
  the podcast before and I'm not really sure why.
• 1:49
  I, I honestly have no idea. I'm sure we've talked about it
• 1:53
  here and there, like touched on it, but we've never done a deep
• 1:55
  dive. So last week, friend of the pod,
• 1:58
  Crystal, one of my besties, media entrepreneur, she runs the
• 2:01
  feed. Go follow them.
• 2:02
  They're amazing. So she saw this TikTok, she sent
• 2:05
  it to me and she was like, Oh my God, this man is you.
• 2:09
  You need to interview this man. So today I'm interviewing a man
• 2:14
  named Aiden Walker. Aiden is an editor at know your
• 2:17
  meme and the TikTok she sent me was the beginning of a video
• 2:21
  series that he has started on the platform where he dives into
• 2:25
  Skibbity toilet and he's uncovering like the deeper
• 2:28
  meaning behind it and the true lore behind it.
• 2:31
  It's so interesting. So when I saw his video, I was
• 2:34
  like, you are so right. So I reached out to him and I
• 2:37
  reached out to him on LinkedIn, which was a bit unhinged.
• 2:39
  Like, I feel like I'm always on LinkedIn because I'm in my
• 2:42
  founder era, you know what I mean?
• 2:44
  But I didn't even consider that. Like most people who aren't
• 2:47
  gainfully employed and aren't like, I don't know, trying to
• 2:50
  make it in some type of way are not on LinkedIn all the time.
• 2:53
  But he did get back to me on LinkedIn and he was like, this
• 2:55
  is hilarious. I literally never checked
• 2:57
  LinkedIn. So I guess this was meant to be.
• 2:59
  So I'm bringing you an interview with him.
• 3:00
  I am so excited. We had such a good conversation.
• 3:03
  He is so knowledgeable. He's so smart.
• 3:05
  Like he really takes an academic lens, I feel, to Internet
• 3:07
  culture, which we do. I mean, I think we try to do
• 3:10
  here and I think we do it pretty well here at Centennial World.
• 3:13
  But he is like on another level. So I'm really excited for you
• 3:16
  guys to hear this conversation. But before we get into that, as
• 3:19
  always, Please remember to rate, review and subscribe.
• 3:22
  It means so much to me. It helps me grow.
• 3:24
  It helps me keep going. Please sign up to our
• 3:26
  newsletter, which is called Infinite Scroll.
• 3:28
  On Fridays, we round up the five biggest thing pieces on the
• 3:31
  Internet that you need to know and also join our Geneva group,
• 3:35
  which is also called Infinite Scroll.
• 3:36
  It's been a bit dead in there. So they changed the rules
• 3:39
  because Bumble acquired Geneva and then you had to be 18 plus
• 3:42
  to join and you had to I think reinstall the app or like re
• 3:45
  download it and enter your age. So it's been a bit dead in
• 3:47
  there. But I just did that process
• 3:49
  today and I saw that we had some messages that I hadn't even seen
• 3:52
  and I was like, Oh my God, I feel so bad.
• 3:53
  So go join our Geneva group. It's also called infinite
• 3:55
  scroll. And I'm going to read a couple
• 3:58
  comments that I got. One is actually from Geneva and
• 4:02
  then a couple are on the YouTube.
• 4:03
  So Ricky and Geneva said, hey guys, long time Lauren
• 4:07
  supporter, first time Geneva or I thought today's Reddit deep
• 4:10
  dive was very informative and well, well structured.
• 4:13
  Thank you so much Ricky. You are truly an OG like an like
• 4:16
  a longtime supporter. Legit when you say that you are
• 4:19
  so appreciate it. I actually got quite a bit of
• 4:22
  feedback on the Reddit episode, which I thought was interesting
• 4:24
  because I didn't think it was that different than anything
• 4:26
  else we've done. Like I thought it was very
• 4:28
  similar to the other tech deep dives that we've done.
• 4:31
  I don't know. I would be interested to hear
• 4:33
  what you guys like, liked particularly more about the
• 4:37
  Reddit deep dive than other episodes.
• 4:38
  But Ash, another longtime Lauren supporter for sure wrote love
• 4:44
  this episode on the Reddit episode.
• 4:45
  So excited to see you back with a deep dive and glad to know
• 4:47
  things are looking up. Thank you, Ash.
• 4:49
  They are things are definitely looking up.
• 4:51
  And then Klyla on YouTube said happy July.
• 4:54
  Lauren, I hope this month will be better than the last.
• 4:57
  Love the videos. Hoping July brings more Subs to
• 4:59
  this channel. Thank you, Klyla.
• 5:01
  Same subscribe to our YouTube. Please, guys, please.
• 5:04
  We are we're growing like we're still very small, but we are
• 5:07
  getting there. The YouTube is growing much
• 5:09
  faster than it's ever grown before and I definitely chalk it
• 5:13
  up to Danny's editing on the deep dives.
• 5:16
  Makes such a difference. And then EJJ 114 on YouTube
• 5:20
  said, first of all, Lauren, your skin is glowing in this episode.
• 5:22
  Oh my God, thank you. And Mini Scroll is my absolute
• 5:24
  favorite podcast to eat while I watch dinner.
• 5:27
  Wait to eat while I watch dinner.
• 5:30
  I'm dead to watch while I eat dinner.
• 5:33
  Oh my God, thank you. I love that.
• 5:35
  I'm so glad to hear that. It really just like keeps me
• 5:38
  going and it has quite a few likes.
• 5:40
  I love that you guys, you're keeping me going.
• 5:42
  I love it. All right, so I'm so excited to
• 5:48
  introduce you guys to Aiden Walker.
• 5:50
  Aiden is a writer and researcher who has worked for Know Your
• 5:53
  Meme, published academic articles on meme history, and
• 5:56
  posted yap sessions on TikTok about why memes are a relevant
• 6:00
  and resonant record of our times that we should all take very
• 6:03
  seriously. This is right up the infinite
• 6:06
  scroll alley. You guys can find his meme
• 6:08
  analysis on TikTok or at how to do things with memes, which is
• 6:11
  his sub stack. So I will put those links down
• 6:14
  below. I really hope you guys enjoy
• 6:16
  this. Let's chat while we dive into
• 6:18
  all things Skibbity toilet. Thank you so much for joining me
• 6:23
  today, Aiden. Happy to be here, exciting to be
• 6:25
  on. I'm so excited to talk with you
• 6:28
  about all things Skibbity toilet, essentially the biggest
• 6:32
  meme on the Internet for the last probably 12 months.
• 6:35
  So for anyone that doesn't know, I found Aiden on Tiktok.
• 6:40
  So I saw that. Just what was it last week?
• 6:42
  Maybe you started doing a Tiktok series breaking down the meaning
• 6:45
  behind Skibbity toilet. And and actually one of my
• 6:47
  colleagues, another friend here who runs an independent media
• 6:51
  company, she found your TikTok, sent it to me and she was like,
• 6:53
  you have to interview him. This is like so on brand.
• 6:57
  This is so perfect. And I was like, yes, you are
• 6:59
  absolutely right. So first, before we even get
• 7:01
  into anything, can you tell us how this series came to life?
• 7:04
  Yeah, so I'm only like 4 episodes deep.
• 7:07
  It really just began, but I was just sitting around one day and
• 7:11
  I was like, these scabidy memes are everywhere.
• 7:13
  It's sort of become this brain rot word that kind of stands for
• 7:16
  anything Gen. Alpha, anything like chronically
• 7:18
  online. And I was using it all the time.
• 7:20
  I was writing about it, thinking about it, making content that
• 7:23
  involved Skibbity. And I was like, I have no idea
• 7:25
  what the source material is. And then I was at a BBQ of like
• 7:28
  a family friend and I just happen to be talking to a nine
• 7:31
  year old like all of us do. And Skibbity toilet came up and
• 7:34
  I was like, I don't need to watch it, dude.
• 7:36
  Like what do you recommend? And he said watch the early
• 7:39
  seasons. After episode 70 it falls off.
• 7:42
  I was like 70 episodes. I was just surprised.
• 7:45
  And so I was like, my reaction was that to out about it.
• 7:47
  So I figured if I made content about it, people would be into
• 7:50
  it. And it's been a wonderful
• 7:52
  journey that I've just begun getting into this Scibbity verse
• 7:54
  and all the lore. Yeah, absolutely.
• 7:56
  And have you seen a lot of interest in the series?
• 7:59
  Like have you found it's gained any traction?
• 8:02
  Yeah, it's done pretty good. I've gotten a lot of followers
• 8:06
  off of it. And I mean, I feel kind of weird
• 8:08
  about it because I'm committed now to 20 more Scibbity toilet
• 8:11
  videos because there's twenty more seasons of it.
• 8:14
  But the response has been enough and like people writing comments
• 8:17
  that are really thoughtful and interesting that I kind of feel
• 8:20
  like I should continue and it'll be fun for me to continue.
• 8:23
  But we'll see how I feel, you know, after 15 more videos.
• 8:26
  Yeah, absolutely. OK.
• 8:27
  So can you tell us a little bit about your background, your
• 8:30
  career, how you got into like being essentially a full time
• 8:34
  professional meme analyzer? Well, I've been an editor at
• 8:37
  Know Your Meme for three years. And before that I was working at
• 8:41
  a media lab that specialized in like early electronic
• 8:45
  literature, 1990s, early 2000s, hypertext and digital art, which
• 8:50
  are really these fun experimental things that people
• 8:52
  started. And kind of before meme culture
• 8:54
  happened and kind of even before a lot of vama and gaming
• 8:57
  happened to experiment with this technology and, and see what it
• 8:59
  could do. And so I got into that from like
• 9:01
  an academic sense. And then I was like, if I want
• 9:04
  to keep doing this work, I know your meme is a really publicly
• 9:06
  available and interesting place to do it that I was using all
• 9:09
  the time. And I thankfully, you know, was
• 9:12
  able to work there. And then after a certain point,
• 9:14
  I sort of felt that I wanted to go deeper then a Know Your meme
• 9:18
  entry lets you go because usually we're trying to hit an
• 9:21
  SEO kind of thing, trying to get there before someone else.
• 9:23
  And so we're rushing to gather all the examples and information
• 9:26
  we could. And so I did a master's program
• 9:29
  at Columbia and Ecole Normale Superior in Paris.
• 9:34
  And I focused on kind of social sciences, but also history and
• 9:38
  literature. And I really dug deep into
• 9:41
  distracted boyfriend, which it's kind of a, a flex, but I think
• 9:44
  I'm the world's leading expert on distracted boyfriend because
• 9:47
  nobody else has ever, you know, written 100 pages on it.
• 9:50
  So I'm a big fish in a small pond or maybe the only fish in a
• 9:54
  puddle. And after that, I just, you
• 9:55
  know, started yapping about Skibbity toilet on TikTok.
• 9:58
  And so my career hasn't been around very long, but I'm hoping
• 10:02
  that it continues. And I'm always glad to share
• 10:05
  this stuff with people because I I love it.
• 10:07
  Wait, what is distracted boyfriends?
• 10:10
  It's from August of 2017. And if you've seen it, it's that
• 10:13
  meme of the the guy in the blue shirt, the girl in the red
• 10:16
  dress. And the guy in the blue shirt is
• 10:18
  girlfriend. And they're walking down the
• 10:20
  street and he's, yeah, he's with the girlfriend.
• 10:22
  He's distracted by the girl in a red dress.
• 10:24
  So I kind of gathered up like 200 examples of it.
• 10:27
  And I analyzed, you know, what kind of labels are people
• 10:30
  putting over each character? What kind of situation is it
• 10:33
  talking about? And then I kind of analyzed sort
• 10:36
  of how it went viral across the different platforms, how it
• 10:39
  jumped around. And I interviewed some of the
• 10:41
  journalists that covered it and tried to get an account of that
• 10:44
  one viral moment. Oh my God, I'm obsessed with
• 10:47
  that. That is so cool.
• 10:48
  That's just such a cool example of how, I mean, I always say
• 10:51
  this on this podcast or when we're speaking to different
• 10:54
  brands and stuff like Internet culture just is culture now.
• 10:57
  Like you can't differentiate the two.
• 10:58
  And that's just such a strong example of that.
• 11:00
  Well, I consider myself like the number one primary source of
• 11:03
  Trisha Paytas news, so I understand where you're coming
• 11:06
  from. OK.
• 11:08
  I mean, that's breaking important news to many people.
• 11:11
  We got to know what she's up to. We got to know what
• 11:14
  reincarnation that's the. Totally.
• 11:17
  She's been like my guilty pleasure creator for so long and
• 11:21
  I'm so glad that she's come out the other side.
• 11:23
  Now she's less problematic and now people are getting on board.
• 11:26
  I love this renaissance for her. But anyways, so let's get right
• 11:32
  into Scibbity Toilet. Obviously, that's kind of the
• 11:35
  topic of today. So can you give us like just for
• 11:38
  anyone that does not know what Scibbity toilet is, my audience
• 11:41
  is primarily Gen. Z and young millennials.
• 11:44
  The Skibbity toilet kind of give us like the Cliff notes version.
• 11:47
  OK, so Skibbity toilet is a YouTube show.
• 11:51
  It is a machinima show, which means that it is made using like
• 11:55
  a video games visual engine and people animate using, you know,
• 11:59
  different little characters settings from that video game.
• 12:03
  So Skibbity Toilet is made in Source Filmmaker, which is a
• 12:07
  specific engine that like the Valve Video game Corporation
• 12:10
  that made Half Life and I'm not a gamer, but a few other games,
• 12:13
  they made this software specifically for people to make
• 12:16
  movies out of it. And this is like a pretty strong
• 12:19
  going tradition. It's been going since like
• 12:21
  probably like the 2000s. And Skibbity Toilet started in
• 12:25
  early 2023, mostly as YouTube shorts, and it's been going
• 12:30
  strong ever since and season 25 now.
• 12:32
  And it has 65 billion views total across all of the videos.
• 12:37
  It's beloved by a generation alpha.
• 12:39
  It's kind of like the iPad babies.
• 12:41
  What's on the iPad is Skibbity toilet a lot of the time.
• 12:44
  And the plot of it is you have the eponymous Skibbity toilets,
• 12:49
  which are animated toilets with a human head inside of the bowl
• 12:53
  that pops out and they sing this really annoying mash up song.
• 12:57
  And then you have these people that the Skibty toilets are
• 13:00
  fighting that are cyborgs, sort of the infantrymen of the
• 13:03
  cyborgs are these like guys in suits, but they have a CTTV
• 13:06
  camera for a head. And later in the series, they're
• 13:08
  joined by, you know, other guys who have ATV for a head or
• 13:12
  speakers for heads. And both the Skibty toilets and
• 13:15
  these like media people, some people call them that the
• 13:18
  cyborgs are constructing all these like different machines of
• 13:22
  war and they're really just locked in this arm race.
• 13:24
  And this, you know, cycle of a Hansa continues and continues
• 13:27
  and all there's all these awesome like cartoon Marvel
• 13:29
  movie type boss fights going on, which really attracts the kids.
• 13:33
  And for about the first like 20 seasons, it was like 20 second
• 13:37
  YouTube shorts was every episode.
• 13:39
  But now he's getting into like weird territory where he's doing
• 13:43
  like 10 minute long, really ambitious, like with a lot of
• 13:46
  plot kind of stuff. And so it's really, it's really
• 13:49
  altered as a series and it remains probably like the most
• 13:53
  popular children's YouTube thing in the world.
• 13:55
  Yeah, that is so wild. I'm going to ask you lots of
• 13:57
  questions about why you think that is in a minute.
• 13:59
  But obviously one of the main themes, as you mentioned, is
• 14:03
  war. So I wanted to share a couple
• 14:05
  fan theories that I found as to kind of why people believe
• 14:09
  there's something more to this in the Skibbity toilet universe.
• 14:12
  And then I would love to hear your theories as to kind of what
• 14:15
  you think is actually going on. SO1 fan theory speculates that
• 14:18
  the Skibbities are speaking in song and they're spreading like
• 14:21
  a virus via this sound or this song that they're singing.
• 14:24
  And then another theory that I found suggests that the war is a
• 14:28
  metaphorical battle between traditional media, as in like
• 14:31
  the film and television head like humanoids, and new media,
• 14:35
  which is like the Skibades, Internet culture, memes, that
• 14:38
  kind of vibe. What are your theories there?
• 14:40
  So my theory is like, I think that stuff is there the the guy
• 14:44
  who came up with kind of the allegory media theory, or I
• 14:47
  guess the most famous proponent is Matt Pat the the film
• 14:50
  Theorist YouTube. And I think that holds that you
• 14:53
  can scan across the series, series and like check all the
• 14:55
  boxes. But in a way, I think Skibdy
• 14:57
  Toilet is a bit too sprawling and there's too much going on,
• 15:00
  too much other stuff happening for that to like be the one
• 15:03
  explanation. And I think what that does get
• 15:06
  right, though, is that there's this ambiguity between like what
• 15:10
  side to pick. Because if the Skibities are
• 15:12
  trashing YouTube content and the camera heads are like
• 15:14
  traditional media, then in the show, the camera heads are kind
• 15:17
  of figured to be the good guys or at least the POV character.
• 15:21
  So it's kind of like, how could the good guys be traditional
• 15:24
  media? If I'm watching a, you know, a
• 15:26
  shitty YouTube show about toilets, it seems some divided
• 15:29
  loyalties there on which kind of media is better.
• 15:32
  And so my theory, I haven't totally formulated it trying to
• 15:36
  like do it live like across the different TikTok reviews.
• 15:39
  But my theory kind of is that there's no good guys.
• 15:42
  And there's something about them both being forms of cyborgs
• 15:46
  where they're both kind of these fake robotic non human things
• 15:50
  that it's about how violence just begets more violence and
• 15:53
  you get into this endless cycle of reprisals and building
• 15:56
  better, more, you know, sophisticated weaponry to
• 15:59
  compete with one another. And so I think maybe ultimately
• 16:01
  it's an anti war show, but it could be that this is just a
• 16:04
  children's cartoon that's like Rorschach.
• 16:06
  You could read whatever you want into it and I'm trying to read
• 16:08
  it to have an anti war message. Or it could be that curtains are
• 16:11
  blue as people say. No, I agree with that.
• 16:14
  I think it's possible that it started out as just like brain
• 16:17
  rot and now as it's evolved, obviously the creator, Alexi, I
• 16:21
  don't know how to say his last name, so I don't want to butcher
• 16:23
  it, but his first name is Alexi. Has, you know, started to put
• 16:28
  more narrative and meaning behind.
• 16:30
  It is possible, but I agree it's very ambiguous on like who would
• 16:33
  be the good guys and who would be the bad guys.
• 16:35
  I think that's intentional, right?
• 16:37
  Like things like this are nuanced and I think that's
• 16:39
  possibly why younger, like children are so interested in
• 16:42
  it. It's not so black and white.
• 16:44
  There's a lot of questions. That's what I say.
• 16:46
  Speaking of Trisha Paytas that I always say about her, the best
• 16:48
  thing is that you have no idea of what she is putting out there
• 16:51
  is reality or not. And that's kind of how I feel
• 16:54
  about Skibbity Toilet. So what predictions do you have
• 16:58
  for the series? Where do you see this series
• 17:00
  going, or do you have any thoughts at all on that?
• 17:03
  I could see it just continuing indefinitely.
• 17:06
  Like there's, I think certain like mangas or web series that
• 17:09
  just never really have to end. Like, he could always, you know,
• 17:12
  animate more Scooby toilets, animate more camera heads.
• 17:15
  And like, I think his audience would be fine without the
• 17:18
  closure. But a part of me said he may be
• 17:21
  having some kind of end game in mind because the episodes have a
• 17:24
  lot more plot now. And I think it would have
• 17:26
  something to do with there's a lot of like hybridization we
• 17:29
  start to see because a lot of the times when like the camera
• 17:32
  heads will craft a new weapon, it'll be out of like salvage
• 17:35
  toilet parts. And so the two sides kind of
• 17:38
  start to look like each other. And they definitely behave like
• 17:41
  each other. And so I'd like to see like a
• 17:42
  Skibbity peace treaty being signed or them realizing they're
• 17:45
  not so different in the end. But I really, it could go
• 17:49
  anywhere. I wonder if he has like some
• 17:51
  notebook where he's written it. Out absolutely.
• 17:53
  I did read that he said in an interview he does have an ending
• 17:57
  in mind, but it's going to take a very long time to get there.
• 17:59
  So we'll see. OK, so I wanted to talk about
• 18:02
  the visuals of the show. I personally feel like I have
• 18:06
  developed trauma watching this because I find it so unsettling
• 18:12
  and like repulsive. Like the visual elements of like
• 18:16
  the toilets, like they he made them so dirty and I just there's
• 18:20
  something so disgusting about them.
• 18:22
  So based on your research, do you think that the animation
• 18:25
  style and visuals play a significant role in what the
• 18:29
  series is trying to convey or do you like kind of what we were
• 18:32
  saying before? Do we think it's really just
• 18:34
  started off as this project, this visual project, this brain
• 18:37
  rot project, and now it's evolved into something bigger?
• 18:40
  Well, it is very like striking visually and is kind of
• 18:44
  repulsive. I feel the same way.
• 18:46
  I'm I've kind of desensitized myself at this point.
• 18:49
  That was my first response as well.
• 18:51
  I think on one level, you know, kids love potty humor that's
• 18:54
  universal. So, you know, having a toilet.
• 18:56
  But the thing that really hooked me was the visual style.
• 18:59
  It's all POV and a few episodes in you realize that you are a
• 19:03
  camera and that's the perspective of the series.
• 19:06
  And you see your character's hands.
• 19:07
  Sometimes you see your character, you know, committing
• 19:10
  acts of violence. And it really looks like you
• 19:12
  literally are are doing that yourself.
• 19:14
  And so there is no like non diegetic camera in the series.
• 19:18
  Everything is this toilet head. And so it's following the, the
• 19:21
  gaze as you're looking around. And that is like a really
• 19:24
  limited palette in one way because you know, there's so
• 19:27
  many shots you can't do, you can't do dialogue, you can't
• 19:30
  really, you know, do any kind of wide shot.
• 19:32
  It's all from 1 standing camera head perspective, but in a way
• 19:36
  it's a little better than if it were just a movie person's
• 19:39
  perspective because the Skibbity toilet camera head can zoom,
• 19:42
  Which for me is one of the big things that makes it kind of
• 19:44
  repulsive is that you'll have him look to the left and then
• 19:47
  he'll zoom in and zoom out really quickly, which kind of
• 19:49
  helps with the retention editing of the series, I think.
• 19:52
  But ultimately what really interests me is because we're
• 19:55
  never like just watching something.
• 19:57
  We're always watching a character's watching.
• 20:00
  There's no moment in the series that isn't mediated or filtered
• 20:04
  through this POV cameraman. Is what they call him on the
• 20:06
  Skibbity Toilet fan wiki. I think it raises like these
• 20:10
  really interesting questions that were really juicy to me,
• 20:12
  just kind of like being into, you know, literature and, and
• 20:16
  film and stuff. Because I'd say the main thing
• 20:18
  that I think about with the Internet is we're always like
• 20:21
  watching other people's watching.
• 20:23
  I think a lot of influencer content isn't necessarily
• 20:25
  filming something, but filming your way of watching it for and
• 20:29
  sharing that with an audience. And I think Skibbity Toilet is
• 20:32
  doing that same thing. You know, we're watching someone
• 20:35
  else's watching. And the interesting part is like
• 20:37
  kind of judging that person who we're watching through and kind
• 20:41
  of being like, are they right? Are they wrong?
• 20:43
  Are they understanding the situation?
• 20:45
  And there's something about that subjectivity that's really
• 20:48
  fascinating to me. No, yeah, you're convincing me
• 20:50
  that this should win an Academy Award or something.
• 20:53
  I'm like, you know what? Actually, maybe Skibbity Toilet
• 20:56
  is more than I thought. I mean, I guess that's the point
• 20:58
  of your series, right? Let's get on to why Gen.
• 21:01
  Alpha is obsessed with Skibbity Toilet.
• 21:04
  Why do you think that it is blown up online?
• 21:07
  Why do you think that Gen. Alpha's obsessed?
• 21:09
  I'd say like the three reasons for me would be first, like
• 21:12
  really high production value for what it is.
• 21:15
  It's very competently made. The fights are awesome to watch.
• 21:18
  The toilets are hilariously gross.
• 21:21
  You know, it has everything little kid would love and it
• 21:23
  feels a little like inappropriate or not safe for
• 21:25
  school or whatever, which they also love going towards that.
• 21:28
  The second reason for me would be kind of this theme of war
• 21:31
  that's happening. I think Skibbity Toilet really
• 21:34
  addresses like conflict in a way that a lot of children's media
• 21:37
  doesn't. And I mean, not to get too
• 21:39
  political, but kids are living in a world where there's a lot
• 21:42
  more conflict and they're definitely aware of it and
• 21:44
  thinking about it and worrying about it as much as the adults
• 21:47
  in their lives are. And so I think they're drawn to
• 21:49
  it for the same reason that, you know, you or I might be drawn to
• 21:52
  like some drama or something. I think it does tickle that
• 21:55
  nerve maybe in a weird way. And then the third reason for me
• 21:58
  is that camera head perspective and that kind of watching
• 22:01
  someone else is watching. I think it really often like
• 22:05
  interrogates what it's like to watch the world through a
• 22:07
  screen. And the review I'm really
• 22:09
  looking forward to doing is there's a moment where the
• 22:11
  camera head sends out like another camera head to record
• 22:14
  something. And then you see the camera head
• 22:16
  POV watching an iPad of the other camera heads filming.
• 22:20
  And there's just something going on there, you know, something
• 22:22
  about like watching, filming, posting that I think Skibbity
• 22:26
  Toilet is really rich in examining.
• 22:28
  And I think that's part of what draws kids to it is because, you
• 22:31
  know, they're iPad babies. And so the show's a little bit
• 22:33
  about like, what's it like to see the world through iPad?
• 22:36
  I think that's part of what hooked them.
• 22:38
  Yeah, absolutely. An interview for Forbes, Alexi
• 22:41
  said that who's the creator. He said that he believes Jen
• 22:45
  Alpha really likes his series because, quote, it doesn't feel
• 22:48
  generic or corporate, which is kind of to your first point of
• 22:52
  it's really well done, but it also explores these different
• 22:56
  topics that children's media typically won't touch.
• 22:59
  I also saw an opinion that he really seems to understand
• 23:02
  Internet culture really well, which I suppose is to your
• 23:05
  latter point. You know that it's a show about
• 23:09
  what it's like growing up with technology and you feel like, I
• 23:13
  mean, we feel like cyborgs ourselves half the time.
• 23:16
  I can't imagine what it would be like to be an iPad kid.
• 23:19
  So Skibbity Toilet has sparked a lot of concern to that point
• 23:22
  among older social media users who have struggled to grasp its
• 23:26
  premise. So much so that many were left
• 23:29
  concerned about hearing Skibdy Toilet syndrome, which
• 23:33
  essentially, journalists in Malaysia and Indonesia started
• 23:35
  writing about this syndrome, claiming that it caused viewers
• 23:38
  quote, to refuse to stop imitating the toilet songs and
• 23:41
  dances. And while the syndrome was a
• 23:43
  hoax, this led to many conversations around the show's
• 23:46
  addictive nature. Having watched You Know the
• 23:49
  series and deep within the lore, I'd be interested here if you
• 23:52
  think these concerns are valid. Or is there imagery in the
• 23:55
  series that is unsuitable for children in your opinion?
• 23:58
  So in terms of Scibbity, toilet syndrome, that I think is a
• 24:02
  little bit OK. The videos of it are hilarious.
• 24:04
  Little kids like in laundry baskets jumping out.
• 24:07
  But for me, I tie that back to the series and sort of this
• 24:11
  concern that I think we all have about kids and technology and
• 24:14
  ourselves with technology where it's like, how are they going to
• 24:17
  know what's real? And Scibbity toilet syndrome, if
• 24:20
  your child is infected, it's like a problem with them, you
• 24:22
  know, knowing where Scibbity toilet ends and life begins.
• 24:25
  And you know, because they all have phones in their pockets,
• 24:27
  they're essentially the camera ads.
• 24:29
  And so it's kind of like where where is online life?
• 24:31
  Where is reality? And so I think that probably
• 24:33
  would be a threat with all kinds of online content.
• 24:36
  You know, we're all like terminally online.
• 24:38
  And so that could be a social problem.
• 24:40
  But I don't think it's like unique to to Scibbity toilet.
• 24:43
  And I think they could be cured of Scibbity toilet syndrome in
• 24:46
  terms of like the violence that the show might have.
• 24:48
  I don't think it's any worse than like your typical Marvel
• 24:51
  movie. There definitely is in a way
• 24:54
  more more complexity to the violence because we do have this
• 24:58
  like camera head POV, but we do see the camera heads through
• 25:01
  that POV, like doing horrible things to the Skibbity toilets,
• 25:04
  like things that would feel like excessive or not OK.
• 25:08
  And so in a way, I sort of prefer that kind of violence to
• 25:12
  the the more unambiguous violence that we have in a lot
• 25:15
  of kids media. Yeah, because I think it's a
• 25:16
  little more realistic and ultimately might do better to
• 25:19
  convince them that violence is not cool.
• 25:22
  That said, it wouldn't be right for every kid.
• 25:25
  Definitely. I'm sure it's inspired tons of
• 25:27
  nightmares and children. So I think you just have to know
• 25:30
  what the kids in your life are okay with.
• 25:33
  But like I was saying earlier about sort of why it's popular
• 25:36
  and and how it deals with war, I think to some extent it could be
• 25:39
  like therapeutic to watch media like that, you know, because
• 25:42
  kids might be in a place where they don't have the words to
• 25:45
  talk about this stuff they're seeing as well.
• 25:47
  Because, you know, the other videos on YouTube will be like
• 25:49
  literal war footage that children will watch.
• 25:52
  And so having Skibbity toilet there, this sort of safe
• 25:54
  fictional world where these themes are being discussed and
• 25:57
  also the online communities that spring up around it, I think
• 25:59
  might actually help kids. And so I think in general, like
• 26:03
  more thoughtful art for children is is not a bad thing, but it
• 26:07
  really depends on like what the kid you know is comfortable with
• 26:11
  and and OK with. Yeah, I I agree.
• 26:14
  I think there's a lot of unnecessary like moral panic
• 26:17
  around it. Children imitate all different
• 26:20
  like superheroes, bad guys all the time just because they're
• 26:24
  like imitating Skibbity toilet. I don't see how this is any
• 26:26
  different than them watching other types of media and
• 26:28
  imitating those characters. But on that note, there has has
• 26:32
  been concerned that the show is propaganda.
• 26:35
  So there have been a few claims that the series was Russian
• 26:37
  propaganda aimed at indoctrinating children.
• 26:40
  Interestingly, Russian police have also expressed concern
• 26:43
  after reports started surfacing that cops investigated, quote,
• 26:47
  UN quote, the series. What do you think of these
• 26:48
  claims? So I heard that there was like a
• 26:50
  Saint Petersburg court case against Skibbity toilet.
• 26:54
  Yeah. I think in general the politics
• 26:55
  of it are kind of hard to parse. Like I'm saying, I might just be
• 26:58
  reading it anti war because like I want to do this anti war.
• 27:02
  You know, the situation in the beginning is the Skibbity
• 27:04
  toilets are like oppressing the camera heads and then the camera
• 27:07
  heads rebel. And so the first phases of the
• 27:09
  war are like a camera head insurgency against the Skibbity
• 27:13
  toilets. And so it could be like maybe
• 27:15
  like anti imperialist. But kind of like, as I
• 27:18
  mentioned, we're in this ambiguity of, you know, who are
• 27:20
  the good guys because we see the camera heads doing tons of bad
• 27:23
  things. And I feel like the Russian
• 27:25
  state has like other propaganda programs running.
• 27:28
  I've had people on my comments also say like, oh, it's an
• 27:31
  American SIOP, it's a Chinese SIOP, It's a whatever.
• 27:34
  I think it's just a Georgian guy who's like way too into YouTube
• 27:37
  stuff is good at what he does. And then a bunch of kids who
• 27:40
  like explosions on on one level. But, you know, maybe episode,
• 27:44
  you know, 79 will, you know, suddenly be like extolling the
• 27:48
  virtues of, you know, Vladimir Putin.
• 27:50
  And I'll have to change my mind. No, I completely agree.
• 27:55
  OK, so the last thing that I just wanted to talk with you
• 27:58
  about is my team and I were trying to figure out.
• 28:00
  So I'm like a a young millennial and my team is all Gen.
• 28:04
  Zed. And to me, I'm like, this gives
• 28:06
  me Salad fingers. Like it reminds me so much of
• 28:09
  our obsession with Salad fingers as millennials.
• 28:11
  You know, watching it and feeling like it was so absurdist
• 28:15
  and kind of disgusting and you couldn't look away.
• 28:17
  But it also had a deeper meaning, right?
• 28:18
  It was like a there was a bigger picture there that was being
• 28:21
  painted and we were trying to talk about or figure out for
• 28:23
  Gen. Z what was that equivalent.
• 28:25
  Do you have any ideas about that?
• 28:28
  Well, I'm I'm Gen. Z definitely, and I'm showing my
• 28:32
  age here and a lack of Internet knowledge.
• 28:34
  But but what is Salad Fingers, Warren?
• 28:37
  No, what? I'm actually going to fall off
• 28:40
  my chair. I don't know the lore, I'm
• 28:43
  sorry. It happens.
• 28:45
  I I trumpet myself as an expert and then Salad Fingers reference
• 28:49
  just goes over my head. OK, OK, This.
• 28:51
  You have to, as soon as you get off this, you have to watch
• 28:54
  Salad Fingers. It's a YouTube series.
• 28:55
  It was from 16 years ago and it's like a post apocalyptic
• 28:59
  series, but it was like a cartoon animation.
• 29:02
  And it's about essentially Salad Fingers is like the main guy and
• 29:06
  he's all messed up from like nuclear war.
• 29:09
  Oh my my God, you have to watch it.
• 29:10
  It is so interesting. OK, so the reason why I brought
• 29:14
  that up though is because we were thinking some of the
• 29:17
  examples we came up with. But I don't think that they have
• 29:20
  the same like gravity that solid fingers or that Skibbity toilet
• 29:24
  have. But we thought of Charlie the
• 29:26
  Unicorn, Fred the Annoying orange.
• 29:29
  I like trains, but those just feel like brain rot, you know?
• 29:32
  Yeah, they don't have that, like, epic scale of Skibbity
• 29:35
  Toilet. It's Charlie the Unicorn videos,
• 29:38
  llamas with hats, amazing content, right?
• 29:40
  And they do have that, like, dark theme thing.
• 29:43
  You know, Charlie gets his kidneys stolen.
• 29:45
  It's like pretty dark stuff. But for me, Skibbity Toilet
• 29:49
  might be unique. Like, I was thinking through
• 29:51
  this question. What would the Gen.
• 29:52
  Z equivalent be? Like?
• 29:53
  We had our own Internet. We have our own Internet
• 29:55
  culture. Not past tense.
• 29:56
  We're still here. And Gen.
• 29:57
  Alpha hasn't won yet. But there's nothing, there's
• 30:01
  nothing like like as involved as Skibbity Toilet.
• 30:05
  And maybe you could say, you know, overall, like the the
• 30:09
  traditions of like late 2010's memes like object labeling or
• 30:14
  maybe like the whole corpus of, you know, woe Jacks or something
• 30:17
  could kind of be the closest thing like these big lore
• 30:20
  systems that are running. Because in a way, Skibbity
• 30:22
  Toilet isn't just one meme. It's like a series of related
• 30:26
  memes and different, you know, it's a fandom as well.
• 30:28
  So it's kind of this weird hybrid thing I almost thought of
• 30:32
  like Homestuck or, you know, like Never Ending Story in a
• 30:36
  way. I think kind of like Tumblr
• 30:38
  fandom culture would be the closest in a weird way.
• 30:41
  Cousin to Scibbity Toilet. Oh my God, that's.
• 30:43
  Such an interesting. Answer Yeah, no, I agree.
• 30:46
  There's no equivalent. There's no true equivalent.
• 30:48
  And we were saying like, well, my one of my editors, she's Gen.
• 30:52
  Z, she's so Gen. Z.
• 30:53
  And she was like, maybe that's why we're all so unserious.
• 30:56
  Like we didn't have any brain rot content that also doubled as
• 31:00
  like deeper meaning. Anyways, thank you so much Aiden
• 31:04
  for chatting with me. You have to go watch salad
• 31:07
  fingers. You are going to be obsessed.
• 31:08
  Please watch salad fingers. That should be your next TikTok
• 31:11
  series once you're done. Scooby toilet.
• 31:14
  Well, we'll talk in two months once Scooby Toilet is done.
• 31:16
  All 20 videos. Literally thank you so much for
• 31:20
  joining me, this was so amazing. Where can people find you?
• 31:23
  Where can they find your work? So the Scooby toilet series is
• 31:26
  on TikTok. My handle is at Aiden with 2A S
• 31:30
  etcetera, Aiden etcetera. And then my sub stack how to do
• 31:33
  things with memes. I post sort of longer takes on
• 31:36
  that and that's my presence for now.
• 31:38
  They're going to do in a a YouTube for longer form
• 31:41
  analysis, but that's still in the works.
• 31:44
  All right, I hope you guys enjoyed that interview.
• 31:46
  Thank you so much again to Aiden for joining me and sharing all
• 31:50
  of his wild knowledge with us. That was just quite the journey.
• 31:54
  Infinite Scroll is a podcast written, produced and presented
• 31:57
  by me, Lauren Meisner for Centennial World.
• 32:00
  Additional research and reports is by Annabelle and David.
• 32:03
  Editing is by Danny Fennick. Thank you guys so much for
• 32:06
  listening. I love you guys and I will talk
• 32:08
  to you next week. Bye.