Latest / True Crime and Wine Time / S5 E15 - How Did a Quiet Teen Become a Face-Eating Killer_ The Austin Harrouff Case

Transcript

S5 E15 - How Did a Quiet Teen Become a Face-Eating Killer_ The Austin Harrouff Case · True Crime and Wine Time

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hmm, we got so excited. Were you excited to be here?
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: Thank God it's Friday.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: M Yes, I mean I've never been happier.
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: Thank fucking god, it's Friday. I mean it has been
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: a week, lady and Gray. The babies are settling in.
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: They will show up in a little bit, monkey butt.
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: We'll bring them one at the time to say hello. Yeah.
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: It's very different than Jasper. Since I was Jasper's mama,
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: you know, he was only four or five days old
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: and had been bottle fed, so he was taken from
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: his mom at two days. These guys have been with
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: their mom almost three weeks. They'd be very attached to mama.
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: Where Jasper would cry for me if I wasn't around,
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: Willie and Roscoe cry when their other mom. And now
• 1:07
  Speaker 2: I have to teach them that I'm their mom while
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: also not freaking her out.
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: That's true. That's true, and.
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: Jasper doesn't know what they are. But there we go.
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: That's all I gotta say about that.
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: I was going to say, let maybe let's save that
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: for in just a few minutes, and then our listeners
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: will know what you're talking about because they may not
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: have watched Couch Court with Lama this morning to see
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: the sea beasts.
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: I just think that this is one continuous.
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: Stream today it feels like it, I mean since A
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: thirty this morning.
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: Well, I guess I should say hello everyone, welcome to
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: another episode of True Crime and Wine time. I am
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: your host Terry true.
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: Crime and I'm WAMA.
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: And guess what, Guys, we dive into the most draw
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: jaw dropping true crime stories while sipping, so some things
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: smooth to take the edge off. We both went for
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: the heavy stuff tonight. So guys, wor Glass, lock your
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: doors and let's uncork the truth behind some of the
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: darkest crimes. And let me say the darkest crimes are
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: picked by Lama, just so y'all are aware this is
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: another Lama night.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: That's true. That's true. It is so. Speaking of tonight,
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: we will be covering the bizarre case of Austin Harrok
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: and what made this quiet college kid turn into a
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: face eating killer. Mm hmmm, yeah, you heard that right.
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: But before we begin, if you're watching us on YouTube,
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: please hit the like button thumbs up, subscribe to our
• 2:48
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• 2:50
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• 2:57
  Speaker 1: us a rating or a review, whatever it is that
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: place as you have to do. It really helps get
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: our pod name out there, and it's free. It's free
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: to support us that way, and we really really appreciate it.
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: And if you're watching us over on the book face,
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: you can like it and give us the thumbs up
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: there just as well, because I know we do have
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: some book face.
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: We do because we stream on Facebook and YouTube simultaneously. Yes.
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: Now, also a very quick reminder, Lama and I will
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: be live in person July nineteenth and Marion, Ohio. You
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: can see all of this Bananaya in person and where
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: we will be covering two Ohio specific cases, the disappearance
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: of Andy Chapman and the unsolved murder of Joey LaBute.
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: Tickets are on sone now and you can follow the
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: link in the description of this video or in our
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: about section. It's also over on the book face. It's
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: everywhere spaces. So what are your tickets today? Guys? It
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: is a very small venue, Okay, it is going to
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: be up close and personal. Good news. If you can't
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: make it to Ohio, you can always become a member
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: of our YouTube channel where we will be streaming it
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: live exclusively to our members. Also, guys, because we're going
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: to be together that weekend along with the Miss and
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: her other half and Elbow Feet, there's going to be
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: some other members only livestream bananaies going on. Yes, you
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: can take that to the bank. Okay. Now, if you
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: would like us to come to a place closer to you,
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: please fill out our live event form or you can
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: email Terry, which would be me at Tcwtmedia dot com
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: and we will see what we can set up.
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: And you know, it could be anything. A winery, maybe
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: there's like a bar arcade, somebody suggests the dad to us,
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: sounds like, yeah, sounds awesome, let's go. Or maybe it's
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: a brewery. We're not big in the beer, but you
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: know what, we would show up just to meet our fans.
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: As long as they have alcohol, I think we can
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: make it work.
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: That's true.
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: They need to serve something besides beer because beer makes
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: me burble a whole lot and that would not look good.
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: Now, before we go into our drink, what we're drinking.
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: Did you want to show up?
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: Well, monkey Bet has not shown up with them yet.
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: I don't.
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: Okay, all right, well then we'll just changing with they're drinking.
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: Well that just a second, okay, all right, Oh she
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: is getting now, double H just to inform me she's
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: getting our So for those of you that do not
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: know me and double H, welcome to twins.
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: Mm hmmm.
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: They were born May twenty fifth, and today is the
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: first time that they are being seen on camera. I
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: hear one of them crying. So here comes a baby.
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: I don't know which one it is, So we have
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: Willie and Roscoe.
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: You guys, prepare yourself. And by the way, if you're
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: just listening to this pod, find our YouTube channel True
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: come of my time and you will see these absorable
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: twins with your own eyes. And I promise you you
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: will not be disappointed because they are so cute. And
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: you must be thinking if you're listening, wait a second,
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: it doesn't sound like a baby. And you know what,
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: you would be right. It's not an actual human baby,
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: but a baby. It is a baby.
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: Goat. This is Willie because he has the white spot
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: on his head.
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: That's right.
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: His brother Roscoe has blue eyes.
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: Oh. I love that he likes to be close down here.
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: He doesn't like to be held up.
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, look at you. They are. Oh, they've had
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: a rough day. It's a big day for them. It's
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: a big day. But you know you did a lovely
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: thing keeping their mom with them until they're wedb so they,
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: you know, can get accustomed to things on their own
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: terms in time, which I think is great.
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: Is his middle name Nelson. Guys, do not laugh at me.
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: I got to thinking, I really like I would have
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: named them Jackson and a Lassie. I don't know how
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: weird that makes me, but yeah, so this is Willie.
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: He's got the brown eyes and he is very feet.
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: Monkey butt, which is my granddaughter is going to sleep
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: out in the Goat House with them tonight, all on
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: a little The air mattress is really big and we
• 7:50
  Speaker 2: want them to have a room, so we live up
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: a full float and she's going to use that as
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: her most.
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: I mean, how could you be away from my goats?
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: I do this lucky, But I know she's not probably
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: watching this show in particular, but yes, I love that yet.
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: And they will start with their bottle feeding and supplements
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: tomorrow and then this week maybe not this weekend, maybe
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: next weekend. They will start their swimming lessons. Oh, these goats.
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: Adult goats do not like water. You have to teach
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: them when they're young to like water, or they don't
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: like water. And we did it with Jasper, and I'm
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: glad we did so. And if you like goats, when
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: the goat house is finished, there will be a goat camp,
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: so there will be.
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: Yay. I will be watching all of the goats always.
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: I had twins, how do I look? Three weeks?
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: Fantastic for new mom guys.
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: They were born the same day as our Annie's little one,
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: so I think they're truthless. Yeah.
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: Yes, our lovely bestie staff member Annie. She also had
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: a human baby, a human baby on the same day,
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: which we all realized today, which was hilarious on couch
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: court with Lamas. So that was great. Well, thank you.
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: They want to know if they wear floaties. No, they
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: do not. They can swim and they do let them
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: float on a big float So and then it looks
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: like Kapen asks what I like to adopt an old bee?
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: I already have one, so now I don't need it.
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: I'd adopt you, but I'm pretty sure my house is
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: in as amazing as Terry's. She has all the fun.
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: She has goats. I don't have goats.
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we had them in their onesies earlier and one
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: of them the diaper slid down. It was Roscoe, and
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: so we wet his onesie, so it had to go
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: into the wash. It is too freaking warm to put
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: their pajamas on them yet, oh so humid and hot.
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: It is just nasty. And they will get them before
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: they go to bed. And if you are over on
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: our discord, you will be able to see.
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: That's true. We do have a discord called the Court here,
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: and I encourage you all to join because if you
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: enjoy seeing us and talking to us or any people
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: in our life chats that's where we all hang out
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: when we're not live. Oh no, there's the other one
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: who's like, I don't want to be on camera too.
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: They are so stinking adorable, Susan says. My friend had goats.
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: I used to watch them pooping pellets on the ground.
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: They are so easy to clean up.
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: It will be interesting.
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: And some people sell the goat pellets because they are
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: great fertilizer for your yard. So you could go to
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: different farmers' markets and things and they will sell bags
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: of goat poop.
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: Good. More you know, the more you guys know, you
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: are also going to be educated in the same episode about.
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: And guess what. They will not try to eat your
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: face off. If you're lucky, they'll give you little licks
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: that they don't have top teeth.
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: So I wish you'd just lain the other day. That
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: was amazing. That's very interesting. I didn't know that.
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: So now there's a mama.
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: Okay, okay, we're we're busuled around you sure, all right, Well,
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: thank you for showing off your goats. Terry. Let's get
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: into what we're drinking, and then we're going to get
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: into the story. I promise we're going to get to
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: it very very quickly. So I did have a lovely
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: body body, a lovely bottle of how to Trot that
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: Terry had sent me a few weeks ago, but with
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: the week I've had, I opened out on a few
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: days ago, so that didn't work out. So tonight I
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: swish wine for a well deserved margarita made with Astril tequila.
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: That's right, we're not true griming whine and down, we're
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: true crowme in liquor time tonight, because if we've had
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: that kind of Weeked airry. So I'm drinking astral tequila,
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: which I very much enjoy, and tonight I've paired it
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: with Sorry, I gotta keep reaching down here because they
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: were heavy and they're on the floor up Town Cocktails
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: mango margarita, which is also thirteen point nine percent, So yes,
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: I am adding to tequila to n Yeah, well, elbow
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: I help. I will be picked these up for me,
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: because I was like, I need you to do this.
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: And he also got another mix which is Gloria Rocket
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: Pop Margarita Mix, which is also thirteen point nine percent,
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: but I opted out of that one because I didn't
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: know if it would give me blue raspberry mouth. And
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: after the members only disco teeth situation, I decided not today, Satan,
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: Not today, It's not happening. I got her up enough weeks.
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: So okay. I think the fact that you have three
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: bottles tells you what kind of week it's been for you.
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: Yes, it's been, but I'm so happy, you know, being
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: here with everybody makes me very happy. It does make
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: it better.
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: Well, I decided to not do wine either. I needed
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: something a little stronger than wine, So I'm having a
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: watermelon margarita on the rocks. But guys, it's made with
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: Tito's vodka, because so it's kind of a margarita, but
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: tequila makes my clothes fall off, and I didn't think
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: it was that kind of channel, so I should just
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: keep it in check.
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: Tonight, there's a yellow shots. It's bread party, right.
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: I love jello shots. I make them for all of
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: our poll parties.
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: You can tell we're not as young anymore as like
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: college age kids, because we're like, we're spending our money
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: on the goods, not the calm chaka that you if
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: you know, you know, if you know, you know, you know,
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: you know, Well that sounds delicious, al right, you guys.
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: With that, let's get into what you all are really
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: here for, and that is the literally insane tale of
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: Austin Haraf Yes that kid. Yeah, interesting photo.
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: Okay, it's a frat brother's photo that looks like all
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: of the frat boys photos that I know, except for
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: he doesn't have the little ruffles which they did back
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: in the day.
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: Okay, well, why don't you tell us a little bit
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: about his background?
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: So Austin Kelly harriff Off, you have a ha, I think,
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: and I just think we'll call him Austin. But he
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: was born December twenty first, nineteen ninety six in Jupiter, Florida,
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: to Wade and Mina. Now his father, Wade is an
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: area dentist. Because apparently we just can't get away from
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: the freaking dentist dentist necrophilia and people we'd eat people.
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: It just can't, So Austin, yeah, thank you, mamma. Austin's
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: parents divorced when he was thirteen, but both parents had
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: found new significant others within a year. Okay. Now his
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: primary homes with his mother and his younger sister, Hayley,
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: but they say he maintained a close relationship with his father. Now,
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: they say the split families appeared to get along without acrimony,
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: and guys, if they can do that, that is the
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: best for the children. Just to let you all know,
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: you should all take note of Demi Moore and Bruce
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: Willis and the way they handled their divorce and.
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: Stuff he found about your dramas about the kids. Get
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: over yourselves.
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: Now, Austin was an above average student. Now, he wasn't excellent,
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: but he did really excel in art. Okay, it was
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: the one class where he seemed to show a promise
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: and earn all A's moving him further to cultivate this talent.
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: Love that now, guys. He began uploading videos to YouTube
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: on March eighth, twenty sixteen, under the name a Frost
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: or Austy Frost. I'm just looking around making sure it's
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: not on our channel, starting with the only short on
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: the channel, okay now. On May twenty eighth, twenty sixteen,
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: he uploaded his first audio track, a freestyle rap song
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: from his LP Make Trap Great Again.
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: Oh wow, okay, okay, make Trap Great Again? Okay, yeah, yeah,
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: I'm just everybody's so creative.
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: Everybody is so creative now now. However, on August eleventh,
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: twenty sixteen, he uploaded his last video, just days before
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: his arrest, Okay. Of the fifty three videos on his
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: YouTube account, a handful focused on fitness tips and is
• 17:37
  Speaker 2: distaste for steroids.
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: That's interesting.
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: Okay, that's a random thing. I mean, others feature rap
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: songs and cover songs like hound Dog and the Beatles.
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: Let it be.
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: Okay, that's interesting. Oh oh okay, yeah, those are some
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: choices made. Those are I mean here subscribers than we do,
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: so can you guys please subscribe? To subscribe to us
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: better than this aprol skuy, please and thank you.
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: I didn't see how many he had.
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: We're almost at two thousand subscribers. By the way, side notes,
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: we're almost a two thousand subscribers, so we should think
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: about a streamer when we hit that as we are
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: not that far away. You're like one hundred and something.
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: In kysh'all are wondering those are hit the art of
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: his album covers. Okay, so okay, we just got another
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: weather alert. So in other videos he used strange voices,
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: talking about strange topics and showed to erratic behavior. I
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: just got a great idea, see the Tito's just hit.
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: Oh okay, with my voice app, I bought where I
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: can change my voice. I could do some special videos
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: reading stuff and really weird voices. What do you think.
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: I mean? That's an idea. That's an idea, not a
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: good idea, but it's an idea.
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: We'll bring that to our meeting on Monday and see
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: see what it's a good idea.
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, Now, Austin attended Florida State University. I refused
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: to say go noles, so lose noles in Tallahassee, Florida,
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: that at the age of nineteen, something would happen that
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: would change his life forever. I'm sorry, if you're in Florida,
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: you got to be a Gator.
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: I don't. I don't sports ball, So I have no
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: dog in this fire book eye in this fight, I
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: guess since.
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: I so, let's hear about. How is it I've changed.
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: Let's let's hear about that. I hope you guys are ready, Okay,
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: brace yourselves. So on August fifteenth, twenty sixteen, Michelle Misgone
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: fifty three and her husband, landscaper John Stevens, fifty nine,
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: were in their garage. Look at them. What a lovely couple.
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: Oh gosh, this is gonna be so hard. This is
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: gonna be so hard. Oh my goodness. Okay, yeah, they
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: look like lovely, wonderful people that I would want to
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: hang out with. Okay. So they were in their garage
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: and it had been converted into a TV room with
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: a sofa and whatever other comforts they required for vedging out,
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: which again I approve of. I am like, let's get
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: all my snacks together, my my nest as I like
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: to call it, my friends. No, I call it my nest.
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: I get you, I get you, and you know that
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: they had it set up well because the neighbors liked
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: to come over and hang out. So the couple often
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: left the garage door open, like they did that night,
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: so friends could stop by. But that very garage transformed
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: into a neighborhood hangout for friends and family. It became
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: a place where they'd spend their last moments. And before
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: we discuss the vicious crimes that took their lives, let's
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: share a little bit about the couple, because I think
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: it's always important to know a little bit about these
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: victims who do get lost in stories. Was so kiled,
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. Okay. So the couple was loved by
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: their friends and family, as evidenced by more than the
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: five hundred people who attended their funeral, including John's children
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: and Michelle's father, who shared memories of the two and
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: highlighted their close relationship. And Michelle's father, Jeff Michone, a
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: former Miami mayor, said they were a dream couple and
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: truly two of God's best children. John Stephen's son, John
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: Stephen's the fourth and his daughter Ivy spoke lovingly about
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: their father and stepmother. He was an inspiring father and
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: an excited grandfather. Stephen said Steven's cry, thinking of how
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: his father had been robbed of the chance to meet
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: his new granddaughter. He would have met her in a
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: matter of weeks at her bapotism.
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: Oh that my heart strip it out of my chest
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: and that makes me very sad.
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: Oh this is tough, you guys, This is this is tough.
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: And I don't know if you're watching the chat, but
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: Kaptain is no longer coming to Ohio? Why do this to.
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: Place in Florida? What's hard to do with anything?
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: I exactly what's wrong that? I have a good friend,
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: old boss. It's a gator, so I have to support them.
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: So you can just stay home, Capin, just stay up.
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: No, I'm just kidding. You're so invited, please come anyway.
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: So quote, they couldn't wait to meet her. He couldn't
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: wait to take her on the water, Stevens cried. The
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: couple loved boating, fishing, and the water, which makes sense
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: why they live in Florida. Their friend, Devise Anderson described
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: Mission as a very special person.
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: What fish like, what fish is? This?
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: Is that real? That's a real fish? Swimming in the ocean.
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: I live in Ohio, so we don't have a fish
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: like that.
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: Okay, I have never seen a fish like that. I
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: need somebody to maybe miss a miss can like do that?
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: Google lends thaying I need to know what kind of
• 23:47
  Speaker 2: fish that is. Do you eat that fish?
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: I don't know, or do you put it back? It's
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: an interesting fish. But okay. Anyway, so they described Michelle
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: as a very special person and called Stevens one of
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: the sweetest, mild manner men you'd ever meet. She added
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: that the couple had an open door policy with regards
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: to the garage living room, and that they welcomed everybody
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: in the community and it was a place where people
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: could connect and relax after a day of work. Oh gosh. Now,
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: as an avid follower of true crime, I do not
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: recommend doing this regardless of where you live.
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: I know. I was like, it sounds so great, but
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: I'm going to just say, probably not a great.
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: It's not a great idea, which is sad, right, which
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: is sad because people won I feel like community is
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: missing in a lot of neighborhoods on my own included,
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: you know, and you should be able to open your
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: doors to those in your neighborhood, and you'll think about it.
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: But unfortunately that's not the reality of the world we
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: live in. Just I mean growing This is not victim blaming.
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: This is not no victim blaming.
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: It's the way the world's changed. Because growing up our
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: back door we had a back door from the garage
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: that would come in from the backyard. The back door
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: into the house. My parents had a key hanging right
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: next to the doorframe, so they unlock the door and
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: come in. Key was right there. That's how much we
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: trusted people.
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, like I grew up in this one time
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: we never locked our doors. But so ams the lobally
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: Amres's research. It is mahi mahi, which I know what
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: that is, but I didn't even know that's what it
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: looked like. That's a very colorful fish that tends to
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: have a bluish green or turquoise top that feeds in
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: the greenish sides with a yellowish belly. That's interesting, interesting, Okay.
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: The fish is covered with small bluish green dots and
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: the body is elongated with a blunt head. It has
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: a deep forked tail and the average size of these
• 25:57
  Speaker 1: fish is two to fifteen pounds. Look at.
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: Mahi mahi looked like that.
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: We either I've seen it on a menu. I had
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: no idea what it looks like. I seen it on
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: a minute. I feel like somebody once told me in
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: my life that it was tuna and I just went
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: with it. I was like, oh, yeah, okay, apparently not.
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: I don't.
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure that's not what a tuna looks like.
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: I've seen it tuna. Anyway, if you don't know what
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: we're talking about on the pod, please go over to
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: our YouTube channel and you'll be like, Okay, you guys,
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: you're right that fish. That fish is laird. Okay, but
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: let's get back. Let's get back to the story here.
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: So when they left the garage door open, they certainly
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: didn't expect the visitor that stopped by. We don't know
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: exactly what happened when he arrived, and we will hear
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: awesome story later, but we know that Michelle died first
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: from blant forces trauma, and she never made it out
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: of the garage. Now, John had tried to come to
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: the defense of his wife, also suffering from blood force trauma.
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: He was also stabbed eighteen times. That's a lot of
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: time to you, guys, it's a lot of times. Now,
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: law enforcement found him in his driveway near the garage,
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: with Austin Harriff on top of him. Witnesses said Austin
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: was growling like a dog and biting John Stevens exposed cheek. Yeah,
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: you guys heard it. This is where we're going. This
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: is where we're going, guys. Now, remember the neighbors looked
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: John Michelle. I mean, look at them, what a beautiful
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: Look at her blue Oh my god, look at her
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: blue eyes.
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: I know.
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: Look, Oh wow, how gorgeous.
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: And he looks great with them without a beard, because
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: normally I either like people with or without. He looks
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: good both ways.
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: Oh, they're such a beautiful couple.
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: Continuous too.
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: Oh this sort is up so much. Okay, all right, yes,
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: beautiful couple. So anyway, the neighbors love John and Michelle,
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: so when their neighbor Jeff Fisher, heard Michelle's screams, he
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: came running and Fisher witch witnessed the attack, saying I
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: saw him hitting her and her falling to the ground.
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: Continued to hit her on the way down, and Fisher
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: fought with Austin until he realized he was badly bleeding.
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: Austin told him, you don't want to be a part
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: of this. Fisher managed to run around the house to
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: the backyard just as law enforcement arrived. He was hospitalized
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: for his injuries, and he told police that Austin was
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: yelling up and that he just wasn't making any sense.
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, this is horrible.
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Now, Martin County Sheriff's Deputy Wayne Troken, Troken, you know,
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: said that when he pulled up to the foot of
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: the driveway, he found a oh my god, that is
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: just so hard to look at, a six to eight
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: foot wide trail of blood that ran up the driveway
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: to the garage. When he got past the vehicle in
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: front of the open garage, he saw a fellow deputy Grace,
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: who had her service weapon drawn on two men on
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: the ground. Troken told her not to fire her weapon,
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: as he was he was scared she would shoot the
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: victim fear. John Stevens was laying prone with Austin Harriff
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: on top of him in a grappling hold, with his
• 29:56
  Speaker 2: legs intertwined in one armor wrapped around the man, with
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: the other being used like a fush hook with his
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: finger in the victim's mouth, trying to pull his cheek apart.
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: Oh my god, I actually docuenty Sorry, I can't visualize
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: things in my head, so sometimes they have to do them.
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: That is horror, terrific. Now Austin was growling. Yeah, Austin
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: was growling like a dog and biting the man's cheek,
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: tearing it and chewing it.
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: That's horrible.
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: In case those of you don't know, your mouth is
• 30:42
  Speaker 2: a very strong muscle or gonna. I mean, you've got
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: a lot of strength in these teeth.
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: We every day we use it makes sense.
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: Now, he was nonverbal. The deputy made many attempts to
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: separate Austin from his victim him. He tasted him, he
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: kicked him many times, and he eventually sent a police
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: dog in.
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: Wow. Yeah, in case you get in the picture, he
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: has covered in blood. He's covered and sure every oh
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: my gosh, yeah, wow juju.
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: We understand. It is disturbing. It is not for everybody.
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: Come back. Yeah, it's okay, it's Lama's fault. Okay, she
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: picked the case.
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: It's okay to you are forgetting and I hope your
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: weekend gets better based yes.
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: You know, what tomorrow is going to be a great
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: day because it is Saturday, the fourteenth, So it's going
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: to be a fabulous day for everybody. I say yes,
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: I say so. Now, guys, Austin was mostly unfazed by
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: all of this. It wasn't until he was kicked in
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: the head hard enough to hit it on the driveway
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: that he moved his arm and was able to be coughed.
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: Now are use double cuffs due to both his size
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: and his behavior. That is just awful. Now, the deputy
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: reported Austin childed kill me. I'm meeting people, I'm killing people.
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: Kill me.
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: Okay, that's a statement.
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: That's a statement, and the deputy wrote it down on his.
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: Report, unlike some other long enforcement we know, in different.
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: Because if it's not said, you don't write it down,
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: but if somebody makes it up later, it's not written down. Okay.
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: Interesting now, Michelle mischkaums found lying in the.
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: Girls in just a second, I'm sorry, j Juji. You
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: can just pause the stream and talk just in chat
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: if you want, if you want to hang out with everyone.
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: If this is too much, seriously, just a pause button
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: on us and you can just interact with the chat.
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: The whole time, because I know you had a rough
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: day and we'd rather you be with us than having
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: nothing else to do. Okay, So I'm just giving you
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: that option. We're not offended at all, not at all
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: by anybody who can't handle things. But if you want
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: to hang out and chat, just go ahead and mute
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: us or push the pause button on us. Okay.
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: If I had one of the babies, I would hold
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: the baby up for you. But they went back outside.
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: Now they found bloody scissors in the driveway outside of
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: the garage and a knife in the driveway under Steven's arm.
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: Oh, oh goodness, this is how music good drink there
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: because oh my goodness wild Okay, So we're all wondering
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: how did Austin Harrow go from making Trapped great again
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: to attacking and killing a random couple, right, we're all
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: asking that right now, like WTF.
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: But what just happened? How did that happen?
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: So this is a little backstory here. So according to
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: his parents, by the way, on that evening in August
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: before his encounter with Michikhan and Stevens, Austin met his
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: father Wade for dinner at a local restaurant. So Austin
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: ordered a glass of tea and then went to the
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: bathroom and did not return. Austin's mother, Nina, called Wade
• 34:37
  Speaker 1: to let him know that Austin had walked to her
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: house from the restaurant, which was about two miles away,
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: so not really that big of a deal. Was still
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: a walk. I walked a mile, and I'm like, oh gross,
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: I'm good, no, thank you. Don't want to do that again,
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: you know, And he's a fitness buff, so it's probably
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: not weird for him to walk, not at all, not
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: at all for me. It's a treasury and you hear
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: about it for five days if I walk a mile, literally,
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: everyone will hear about it, maybe for a month.
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: Oh wow, Yeah, I don't like it.
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: I don't like it. So what was weird, though, was
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: that Austin had grabbed a bottle of cooking oil and
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: told her he was going to drink it, and so
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: his mom took it away from him, and she then
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: found him eating a bowl of cooking oil and cheese.
• 35:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah we're talking like Wesson oil, Crisco oil mixed with cheese,
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: and he was eating up.
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: I don't know if it was olive oil, vegetable oil.
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: I don't know him. Listen, I may partake in some
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: evening activities that might sometimes make me hungrier than normal,
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: And not once have I ever been like, yeah, I
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: want cooking oil and sheep. Now I've sat. I stood
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: literally in front of my refrigerator eating out of a
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: bag of cheese and putting it in my back. Who
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: has it right?
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: I have right here, and I keep stealing little parts
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: and putting it in my mouth.
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but this is cooking oil and cheese.
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: I mean, I just want to know what would happen
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: if drank Wesson oil. What m okay, I do not
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: want to know what it would do to your insides.
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: Let's just go back.
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: Now, you're gonna poop real quick. I don't think that's
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: necessarily But anyway, I don't know if it was that
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: or not. But that's weird. Okay, it's weird. We all
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: agree that oil in cheese is weird. Okay. So after that,
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: Austin had been taken to the hospital and placed in
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: ICU with an inframed esophagus and stomach, which caused a
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: way to think that Austin had been poisoned.
• 37:09
  Speaker 2: I apologize. I was laughing at the comment that it
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: was velveta.
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: I mean it kind of seems like it. Right. Oh,
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: look at that. Okay, I'm by the way, Kavin, I'm
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: glad you've got a lot out of the journal intries.
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: I love that anyway. So Wade said that after that,
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: Austin had been having symptoms for about two weeks and
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: he thought Austin would snap out of it. Okay, oh boy,
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: that's that's interesting. And Nina, his mother, later said that
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: Austin claimed to have superpowers. He had moved his bed
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: to the garage because he thought there were demons in
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: the house. Quote. He was talking about being a mortal,
• 37:59
  Speaker 1: running lights, being in front of cars, testing his powers,
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: saying he was half an animal. The family leader said,
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: but guess you're wondering. Austin's parents had set up an
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: appointment for him to be evaluated, but unfortunately the attack happened.
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: First, they were doing the right thing and trying to
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: get him help. They were okay, now, remember how we
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: said we would be hearing Austin's side of the story.
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: Well we know what he thinks happened. Okay, because he
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: sat down with Philip McGrath PhD, aka Doctor Phil.
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Okay, do not like doctor Bill.
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: In an online interview with Austin while he was still
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: in the hospital before being transferred to the jail, Wade
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: was in the hospital room off camp. Now, this interview
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: would be I mean, it would prove to be a
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: giant peta for Austin later on. If you don't know
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: what peta is, pain in the ass. Now, Austin ran
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: from the restaurant. Okay, everything around him was a blur.
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: He said. He was not thinking straight and felt panicky.
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: Now he says, as he ran, he saw a dark figure,
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: a demon like creature. Okay, Austin called this figure Daniel.
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: That is a random name, just a random name for
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: a demon, for a demon, okay, so called it while
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: I was talking to doctor Philp. I just did a burpie.
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: I am so sorry another one.
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: Welcome You've been sending so much time with me, and.
• 39:56
  Speaker 2: The fact that someone just did a screen shot. I'm
• 39:59
  Speaker 2: in a small So it is unclear why he chose
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: the name Daniel, But as he ran past the dark figure,
• 40:08
  Speaker 2: it spoke to him. Hey, Austin, Austin said, this terrified him. Yeah,
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: that would kind of freak me out.
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: Yeahschosis is real and it is.
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Now, he said, I got scared out of my mind.
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: He had thought, I need to find someone to help
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: me to figure out where I am. I don't even
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: remember what I said to myself. I just remember being
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: afraid and scared, he told doctor Phil. Now, he ran
• 40:46
  Speaker 2: from Daniel and came upon Michigan in her open garage.
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: He doesn't remember how he came face to face with
• 40:55
  Speaker 2: her in the couple'scriage. That he said, she's greamed and
• 41:01
  Speaker 2: then it's all a blurb. He said, I don't remember
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: what she said. I just remember being yelled at. Austin
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: said he grabbed a machete he found in their garage.
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: Oh boy.
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Now, when doctor Phil asked him why he killed them,
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: Austin said, I don't remember why. It's like it happened,
• 41:30
  Speaker 2: but I wasn't aware of it at the time. I
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: don't know. I don't know. If I knew, I would
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: tell you, he cried often in the video interview. Now, guys,
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: it should be noted that a machete isn't mentioned by
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: law enforcement or in any evidence photos. But guys, it
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: could be what his mind envisioned. Okay, true, A knife,
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: says and a screwdriver we're found at the scene. When
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: your mind is doing that kind of stuff, a pencil
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: can look like a machine.
• 42:07
  Speaker 1: Well, and I just also want to note in this
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: picture here they're showing a knife, scissors, and a wine
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: open or quirk screw shaping of our show. And I'm
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: also wondering if maybe the investigators called this a screwdriver
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: as opposed to a line opener. If you see the picture, uh,
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: the the blood material, blood ish looking material, it is
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: far up at cok. I don't I don't know. I
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: don't know how you would use that. And I'm to
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: be honest, I don't do need a description.
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: I do, I do, No, I don't need that. Yeah,
• 42:48
  Speaker 2: I can vinialize that if you go back early on
• 42:52
  Speaker 2: Winter Come and Wind time was just a pod when
• 42:55
  Speaker 2: it was just me and I had a guest on
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: we covered a case about a guy who took one
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: of those and used it on his partner in the
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: male membrane. They can do a lot of damage. So yeah,
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: but I found it interesting that they called it a screwdriver.
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: I mean, maybe there was a screwdriver too. We don't
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: By the way it was, there could have been one
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: we don't know. I was just wondering if if it
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: could be correlated. You know, maybe the person wasn't a
• 43:25
  Speaker 1: drinker at all. That investigator and was like.
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: Oh, just looked like a screwdriver.
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: Maybe there was also a screwdriver too.
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so I don't know. Now. Austin also said he
• 43:36
  Speaker 2: drank something in the garage after the attack. When doctor
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: Phil asked Austin what he drank, Austin refused to say,
• 43:46
  Speaker 2: but it severely burned his esophagus.
• 43:52
  Speaker 1: Now I would think has to be like some sort
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: of chemical, yeah, for sure, Like.
• 43:58
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, it could have been turpin time. I mean,
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: there were so many I won't even start thinking about
• 44:02
  Speaker 2: what now. Why wouldn't he say guys, because it was
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: probably told by his father or an attorney not to
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: at this time, I.
• 44:15
  Speaker 1: Think an any would be like, don't freaking go one,
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: doctor Phil.
• 44:19
  Speaker 2: I mean, because he still hadn't been charged with the
• 44:21
  Speaker 2: murder yet.
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: I don't think it was Anna Freeze An Sweet doesn't.
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: But okay, well that's that's a whole different topic that
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: we'll get into later. Okay, that's a story. But from
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: the gathering of researching this, I don't think it was
• 44:41
  Speaker 1: quite determined, and Anna freeze has been so used and
• 44:45
  Speaker 1: in murders that it like crystallizes in your organs.
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: And let me just think, when I say I drank it,
• 44:52
  Speaker 2: I stuck my finger in it and tasted it because
• 44:55
  Speaker 2: I wanted to see how sweet it was. It is sweet,
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: be sweet. It kind of reminded me of kros syrup.
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: The flavor, that intense sweetness.
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: I mean it could be. Let's put it this way,
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: it could have been in it. We don't know. I'll
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: be honest. It wasn't know at all what he drank.
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: It is not coming out way he drank. But the
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: doctors thought he drew none of that.
• 45:18
  Speaker 2: But they also have to remember that Austin just didn't
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: remember or he didn't want to admit to what it was. Okay,
• 45:28
  Speaker 2: But this comment also creates a timeline question that has
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: me a little confused, okay, because I want to know
• 45:36
  Speaker 2: when did he drink this exactly? Because I want to
• 45:39
  Speaker 2: know was it before the attacks? Did maybe Michelle find
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: him drinking it and it's what started the attack, or
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: was it after the attack?
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: Uh?
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: You know Michelle and Fisher, because when he was found,
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: he was still attacking Steven's.
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it could have been after. I think I had
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: to have either been. But I think the idea that
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: Michelle found him out there and spooped him and startled him, Yeah,
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: I think that's a really good Again, it's all speculation, folks,
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: we do not know, and you'll see why we don't
• 46:17
  Speaker 1: know later, But I think that's a fair, you know, hypothesis.
• 46:23
  Speaker 2: I mean, if y'all want me to try some paint center,
• 46:25
  Speaker 2: I'm willing to put my finger in it and taste
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: it after I've had something.
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: Terry. No, this is why you have me around and
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: be like, no, Terry does bad. I'll do no. Bye,
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: mom amos producer. You all can't see her, but she's
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: in the background running the show, and she's like, oh.
• 46:44
  Speaker 2: Captain drinking in the cap and drink paint center.
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: Okay, we're not, we're not. If you are listening, please
• 46:58
  Speaker 1: do not drink things that are not meant for human consumption.
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: Don't don't do that. Don't even put your finger in
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: it's Terry, No, don't do it.
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: What about a cute tip? No, nope, okay, okay, we'll
• 47:15
  Speaker 2: just keep going then, And Lady and Gray, I you
• 47:18
  Speaker 2: told me not to sample everything you just totally screwed
• 47:21
  Speaker 2: the pooch swaittie. No, boy, you just told me not to,
• 47:26
  Speaker 2: so I have to now.
• 47:30
  Speaker 1: All right, well, let's give back to this. Maybe our
• 47:35
  Speaker 1: producer amics, but I do not drink things that are
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: not made for human consumption. On the banner, yes, don't
• 47:42
  Speaker 1: do that. There's enough studies around. You don't need to
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: try it out. You're not gonna be the first person
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: it's like, oh, this is good. You know they already
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: tried it out before they send them to you, and
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: I won't try it. H mm hmm. Okay, So back
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: to the story, folks. You do not indoors streaking.
• 47:58
  Speaker 2: Any guys, y'all are saying drinking. I did not take
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: a drink. Tasting and drinking are two different things. Let's
• 48:07
  Speaker 2: be clear. I do not swallow anything. I just both
• 48:12
  Speaker 2: know in taste. Let's just move on.
• 48:18
  Speaker 1: Oh Terry, I love you so much. You're fantastic and wonderful.
• 48:21
  Speaker 1: Never change. I appreciate that about you. All right. So
• 48:26
  Speaker 1: back to the story. So Austin said he doesn't remember
• 48:30
  Speaker 1: attacking the neighbor at all, despite the fact that he
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: severely wounded Fisher, who was the neighbor, and he forgot
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: who was hospitalized with stab wounds after the attack. Now
• 48:43
  Speaker 1: the line of questioning then turned to drug use. Not
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: Austin denied ever having used flakka or basalts or knowing
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: people who did. Remember Austin's dad is in the room
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: with him. Maybe you don't know what flackau or bath
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: salts says. They are synthetic drugs that are around. I'm
• 49:04
  Speaker 1: not going to go to end to too much what
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: they are.
• 49:06
  Speaker 2: But okay, wait a minute, so bath salts, that's bath
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: salts like what I take a bath in.
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: No, No, they're not the same.
• 49:15
  Speaker 2: No, so that is not the So this whole time
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: of researching this case, I literally thought the dude got
• 49:24
  Speaker 2: his mom's bath salt. So this is a true drug.
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: Yes, those are very different. It is not actual bath
• 49:31
  Speaker 1: salts that are that you use in your bath. No,
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: that's just the the street name, if you will. I
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: don't know what the technical scientific name is. To be honest,
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: I probably couldn't even pronounce it. But they are very
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: very different things, very different things. Okay, you cannot get
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: high on your mom's bath You.
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: Are so pretty. That just tells you. I didn't do
• 49:56
  Speaker 2: enough drugs.
• 49:57
  Speaker 1: No, Terry, Honestly, I've never I've never done and.
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: It looks like a bath salt bottel.
• 50:02
  Speaker 1: And Terry, I'm not going to give you a hard
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: time because a lot of people, a lot of people
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: think that, and that's I get it. I get why
• 50:10
  Speaker 1: that's your first go to because they don't believe the
• 50:13
  Speaker 1: media has really explained it a lot, and very well.
• 50:17
  Speaker 1: For a reason, I think it's to not draw people
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: to this. I do know people that have done them.
• 50:23
  Speaker 1: I'm not going to share those stories on air, but
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: let's just say they were kind of similar to some
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: of the things they've heard here. But we're not done. Yeah,
• 50:32
  Speaker 1: this episode is not sponsored by Doctor Teale sponsorus. They
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: can they can't use that's true, right, Yes, those are
• 50:41
  Speaker 1: two very different things, you guys. Okay, so we look
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: at it. We're learning all sorts of stuff. Now.
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: I'm really confused about some other stuff we're going to
• 50:49
  Speaker 2: get to.
• 50:51
  Speaker 1: Well, so that's okay.
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna have questions.
• 50:54
  Speaker 1: We're all learning together, and that's I'm not going to
• 50:56
  Speaker 1: say I'm an expert on any of this. I've never
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: done any of this stuff, so I don't know. Only
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: what I've heard and read good anyway. All right, So
• 51:04
  Speaker 1: remember Austin's dad's in the room and they're talking about drugs,
• 51:07
  Speaker 1: and he's like, no, I never do this stuff. Right.
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: So Austin been solved as he expressed guilt for his actions.
• 51:13
  Speaker 1: This is what the doctor Phil episode in Kafer and
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: we got distracted a few times. That's my mom, lalla there.
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: So Austin sobbed as he expressed guilt for his actions
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: and confusion as to why he did them. He sobbed
• 51:31
  Speaker 1: as he said, I'm sorry for their loss. Never wanted
• 51:34
  Speaker 1: this to happen. It's like a nightmare. And doctor Phil
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: said that he was actively working with Wade, his father,
• 51:43
  Speaker 1: to get Austin mental health care. He suggested that Austin
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: had been losing touch with reality and not only had
• 51:52
  Speaker 1: Austin been paranoid, he also seemed to think he had superpowers.
• 51:57
  Speaker 1: This is very strong signs of psycho Whether it's drug
• 52:01
  Speaker 1: and do psychosis, mental ill psychosis, doesn't matter. It's happened.
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: Helf medicating because of the tax could.
• 52:08
  Speaker 1: Be either way. It's happening. It doesn't matter if drugs
• 52:11
  Speaker 1: cause it or mental illness cause it. In my book,
• 52:14
  Speaker 1: it's literally the same experience, yes, And I don't know
• 52:17
  Speaker 1: if one is more scary of I'm thinking if it's mental,
• 52:21
  Speaker 1: that's probably more scarier than the drugs, right, because you're like,
• 52:24
  Speaker 1: I took the drugs, So this isn't normal. Where if
• 52:27
  Speaker 1: it's a mental illness, you don't even know that it's
• 52:31
  Speaker 1: not normal. I mean maybe a few people to a
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: few degree, but like, either way, that's not that's not normal.
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: So anyway, so he's being paranoid and he says seem
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: to think he had superpowers, and doctor Phil said, this
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: isn't something that just happened that night. This has been
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: going on for a period of time, and Austin replied,
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: I guess which I agree with people that are having
• 52:59
  Speaker 1: a cute psychotic episodes. This is not just that it
• 53:02
  Speaker 1: happened for an hour. It's done and over with no
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: no mental illnesses build over time almost always for most
• 53:11
  Speaker 1: of them. And he had been showing signs, according to
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: his parents, that something was very, very wrong. So Austin
• 53:21
  Speaker 1: then told doctor Phil that he would get treatment if
• 53:23
  Speaker 1: the court ordered it. Oh yeah, buddy, they're gonna order it. Okay,
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: you should already be doing this at this point. But okay,
• 53:32
  Speaker 1: I mean, even if it wasn't for his own mental illness,
• 53:35
  Speaker 1: the fact that two people just said because of you,
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: I think word's therapy. I hope. I think this is
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: up for debate. It's all I'm saying. Whether there was
• 53:44
  Speaker 1: an accident, a mess, whatever, right, this is not good
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: for you. So doctor Philden said, this doesn't mean we
• 53:52
  Speaker 1: are trivializing what happened to the people who got caught
• 53:55
  Speaker 1: up in this, But by the same token, we don't
• 53:59
  Speaker 1: want to throw your life away. Oh I'm trying to
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: use my doctor phil accent, which is not good and
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: probably insulting to you as a Texan. So I'm not
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: going to do that. Now.
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: Feel free to bash that man any way you would like.
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: And I find I'm not like him.
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: I have met him.
• 54:18
  Speaker 1: So what I find interesting about that is we're not
• 54:21
  Speaker 1: going to trivialize what happened to those people. This guy,
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: I have a funny story, but I got to save
• 54:26
  Speaker 1: that for when we're not on air. So what's interesting
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: is that the use of the phrase the people who
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: got caught up in this seems to be a little
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: trivializing about what happened to them, and the people who
• 54:42
  Speaker 1: were attacked. Two of them were murdered, and that is
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: not simply caught up in something. You know, they didn't ask.
• 54:52
  Speaker 1: They didn't even invite Austin to their house. They didn't
• 54:54
  Speaker 1: even know who this person was. In case you're wondering,
• 54:57
  Speaker 1: they had no idea who Austin Harrah even was. So
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: maybe that's not a good word choice. But would you
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: expect any less from doctor Phil? I would not. I
• 55:10
  Speaker 1: would not. No. No.
• 55:13
  Speaker 2: Now do you want to know some stuff about doctor.
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: Phil's a freakingly.
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: Did you know that his psychology license expired in two
• 55:23
  Speaker 2: thousand and six in Texas? I did never got a
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: license in California, where his show was produced. So please
• 55:34
  Speaker 2: tell me how he is involved. Why he is giving
• 55:39
  Speaker 2: advice as a therapist, as a medical professional for mental
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: health to somebody when he doesn't have a license. You
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: are a TV personality exactly?
• 55:52
  Speaker 1: You know? Hows is like that Doctor Oz? But we
• 55:54
  Speaker 1: won't get into that, but won't. That is one of
• 55:56
  Speaker 1: my biggest issues with doctor Phil is he knows, he
• 56:00
  Speaker 1: knows what he's doing is not okay ethically. He doesn't
• 56:04
  Speaker 1: have a medical license for a reason, you guys, It's
• 56:08
  Speaker 1: because what he's doing would most likely and I don't
• 56:11
  Speaker 1: know for this for sure, but some people in our
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: staff do this for a living, right, and I'm pretty
• 56:17
  Speaker 1: sure they'd be like, yeah, there's he's not a doctor.
• 56:23
  Speaker 2: The thing that bothers me about it he could harm.
• 56:27
  Speaker 1: This person exactly. It's irresponsible.
• 56:30
  Speaker 2: He could cause this person to do more damage to
• 56:35
  Speaker 2: others themselves. So it's just it's wrong. It would be
• 56:38
  Speaker 2: like me trying to practice being a psychologist. It would
• 56:43
  Speaker 2: be unethical, unresponsible, and I personally think it's criminal. But
• 56:48
  Speaker 2: that's just me.
• 56:49
  Speaker 1: I am right. There's also I have strong opinions about
• 56:52
  Speaker 1: Nancy Grace, but we won't get into her.
• 56:53
  Speaker 2: We all start with that.
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: Either, But I mean, yeah, anyway, anyway, you guys. So,
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: Austin was hospitalized for nearly seven weeks due to the
• 57:05
  Speaker 1: injuries in his esophagus van stomach before being transferred to jail.
• 57:11
  Speaker 1: I find it fascinating. I just really want to know
• 57:14
  Speaker 1: what he took yeah or drank. I really really do.
• 57:18
  Speaker 1: But I don't think we have been able to uncover
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: what that is. I'm sorry. I keep having I have
• 57:22
  Speaker 1: fan going. That's why I have Marilyn Monroe hair over here,
• 57:27
  Speaker 1: but I have this hair that, like, won't it just
• 57:30
  Speaker 1: keeps going in my eye. It's not great, So Terry,
• 57:35
  Speaker 1: can you late us in the next part way, I
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: remind myself just real quickly. Okay, you got.
• 57:41
  Speaker 2: So now, guys. By November eighth, twenty sixteen, I think
• 57:46
  Speaker 2: Austin was facing multiple charges of burglary, resisting an officer
• 57:52
  Speaker 2: without violence, the attempted first degree murder of Jeff Fisher,
• 57:58
  Speaker 2: and both first and second degree murder with a weapon
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: for Michelle Michon and John Stevens. Guys, don't even get
• 58:08
  Speaker 2: me started. You've got to remember two people died. Jeff
• 58:11
  Speaker 2: Fisher has to live with the fact he saw this
• 58:14
  Speaker 2: and experienced this. Okay now. A docket sounding on November
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: twenty third saw the release of thousands of investigative documents.
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: Among them were toxology results that showed that Austin did
• 58:30
  Speaker 2: not have any synthetic drugs in his systems that night,
• 58:35
  Speaker 2: although he did test positive for small traces of THHC
• 58:39
  Speaker 2: and marijuana and ethanol, which is alcohol. Now, Detectives theorized
• 58:45
  Speaker 2: that alcohol could have been consumed in the garage. Now,
• 58:50
  Speaker 2: Austin did have a documented history of some drug use. Okay.
• 58:55
  Speaker 2: He also had purchased mushrooms a few days prior to
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: the incident. However, the state sent evidence specimens to two
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: different drug testing facilities on three different occasions, only to
• 59:08
  Speaker 2: have negative results tendered each time. Okay, guys, when I
• 59:13
  Speaker 2: told you my research, I'm now confused because I really
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: thought that's why they didn't find drugs because it was
• 59:20
  Speaker 2: bath salts. And I was going to ask the question,
• 59:24
  Speaker 2: is it okay for me to soak in my bath salts?
• 59:29
  Speaker 2: Or am I going to have my body absorb it?
• 59:34
  Speaker 2: And now to find out it was drugs not bath salt,
• 59:37
  Speaker 2: It's okay now. Attorney Robert Watson filed a not guilty
• 59:43
  Speaker 2: plea for Austin's two first degree murder charges and attempted
• 59:48
  Speaker 2: murder charge. Now. Months later, the defense filed emotion to
• 59:53
  Speaker 2: restrict access to discovery material and to determine confidential alle
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 2: of court records. Okay. The defense argued that the material
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 2: in question calls considerable international, national, state, and local publicity
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 2: in this case which has been misleading and highly prejudicial
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 2: to the defendant, including but not limited to references of
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: the defendant as a cannibal and the frat boy, cannibal killer. Guys,
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 2: it's what I thought until researching this, so you tend
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 2: to believe those things. Now, The defense argued the public
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 2: access to this material would significantly affect and impair the
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: defendant's right to a fair trial. And yes, guys, this
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 2: discovery material is the doctor Phil interview. Surprise sign up,
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: it now becomes the giant pete. Okay, just yeah, it
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 2: just now. On February ninth, twenty seventeen, Scripts Media, which
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 2: is owner of WPTV, asked the court for access to
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 2: certain documents in interviews in Austin's case. They argued that
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 2: the defense had not met the legal requirements to keep
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 2: those materials private, which are meant to protect the defendant's
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 2: right but only in specific and serious situations. Okay. Also,
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 2: it's not doctor client privilege because doctor Phil is not
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 2: a licensed doctor. Shocking, I know.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 2: Now, for example, when a fair trial is truly at
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 2: risk and no other options except perhaps moving the trial
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 2: would work, okay now. Scripts pointed out that because Austin
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 2: wasn't under arrest during his interview, specifically with the Doctor Phil,
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 2: it couldn't be considered a formal confession and should be
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 2: made public, which, guys, is a very sound argument.
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 1: Shocked. What's my favorite?
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 2: Now? A few weeks later, on February twenty second, the
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 2: court agreed with scripts. Okay. The judge ruled that the
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 2: interview didn't count as a confession to murder or any
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 2: other charge, and it wasn't given to the police, so
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 2: it didn't need to be kept private. Hello, you recorded
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 2: it for public TV.
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 1: Yet you, guys, as we said in Karen Reid, do
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 1: not get interviews when you have charges against you. They
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 1: will and can be, all right, say, they can be
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 1: and will be used to get cheered in what it
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 1: says you guys.
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 2: Let's say it louder for those in the back are
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 2: not listening.
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 1: Do not give interviews when you have charged criminal charges
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 1: against you, especially when it's murdered. Y st'll do it, Oh.
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 2: Don't do it now. The defense argued they needed more time,
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 2: saying that once the interview was released, there would be
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 2: no way to undo the damage. Well, maybe he shouldn't
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 2: have talked to doctor Phil Okay, Now, they were given
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 2: a few days to follow an appeal. But by that time, guys,
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 2: it was too late because guess what, guys, The next day.
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 2: On February twenty eighth, the Sun Sentinel published the doctor
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 2: Phil interview, and other media outlets followed suit, and the
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 2: interview spread like wildfire, a bad case of herpes.
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, that sounds about right.
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so I mean, just don't do it now. After that,
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 2: the case continued to be delayed every two to three months,
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 2: year after year, until guys, five years and nine months
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 2: later was when a trial date was finally said in
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 2: November twenty twenty two. That is such a long time
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 2: a families while having to deal with that is insane.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 1: Now, Oh I remember when this was supposed to start, But.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 2: I now much of the delay came due to filings
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 2: for subpoenas for witnesses, psychiatric testing from both the state
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 2: and the defense, and of course, in case anybody has forgotten,
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 2: we had the COVID nineteen pandemic, we.
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 1: Had the roma did make things very difficult, very very
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 1: difficult for a lot of cases. But also this happened
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 1: a few years before then. But then when you're dealing
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 1: with somebody who has mental health issues, so it's five
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 1: years a long time, Yes, yes it is, but it's
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 1: also not as long when you put in especially the
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 1: mental health factor and then COVID on top that made
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 1: a big problem for a lot of people. But okay,
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 1: So by November twenty twenty two, the defense had announced
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 1: that they be arguing that Austin Harrip was legally insane
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 1: at the time of the crime and therefore not guilty
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 1: by reason of insandy. Now, before we go further in
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 1: the story, I would like to talk about the insantity defense,
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: as it's actually not something that you see that often,
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: and quite honestly, is often misunderstood. So let's talk about
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: this just real quick before to go into what else
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: has happened with him? All right, So Florida adheres to
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 1: then in rule, a legal standard that has been used
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 1: in the United States since the nineteenth century. Under the
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 1: Midnoton rule, a defendant may be found not guilty by
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 1: reason of insanity if at the time of the offense
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 1: they were suffering from a severe mental disease or defect
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 1: that prevented them from understanding the nature and quality of
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 1: their actions, or from knowing that their actions were wrong. Now, specifically,
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 1: and I'm I'm going to get too wordy about it,
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 1: just old with me for a second. So specifically, Florida
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 1: Statute seven to seventy five point zero to seven outlines
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: the criteria for an insanity defense. So, first, there's a
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 1: severe mental disease or defect. The defendant must have been
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 1: braying from a significant mental illness or impairment at the
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 1: time of the crime, and they must lack the lack
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: of understanding. The mental illness must have caused the defendant
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 1: to either not understand what they were doing or not
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 1: understand that what they were doing was wrong. Right, So, like,
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 1: if you're thinking this person is government and they're out
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 1: to kill you and you kill them, would you really
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 1: thought that was wrong? If you thought you were in
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 1: harm's way, even if that's not a reality, actually was right.
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 1: So that's kind of what's going on there. And usually
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 1: what's interesting about this defense is that usually the burden
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 1: of proof in a criminal case is on the state,
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 1: but when it comes to using the insanity plea, the
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 1: burden squarely falls on the defense. The defense has to
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 1: prove that their client was legally insane, which is different
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 1: than psychologically insane. These are two very different things that
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 1: I think people miss been tripped. So the defendant must
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 1: prove their insanity by clear and convincing evidence, a standard
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 1: that is more demanding than the preponderance of evidence standard
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 1: used in many civil cases, but which civil cases like
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 1: fifty one percent or higher. You think this person you
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 1: know is responsible for this, but it is less stringent
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 1: than the beyond a reasonable doubt the prosecution the state
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 1: is responsible for in a regular criminal trial. Now, the
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 1: insanity defense I know, I know, is one of the
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 1: most controversial aspects of criminal law, and its application of
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 1: Florida is no exception. So there are several challenges and
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 1: issues that arise when dealing with the insanity defense, and
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 1: I have seen many of these in previous trials that
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 1: they've watched in what people watching thought as well. So
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 1: one of them is the public perception and the misconceptions
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 1: of the insanity defense. So the insanity defense is often
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 1: misunderstood by the public, and many people believe that it
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 1: is a loophole that allows dangerous criminals to escape justice. Now,
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 1: in reality, however, the insanity defense is rarely used and
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 1: even more rarely successful. You have to be approved. You
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 1: can't just show up to court and be like, we're
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 1: doing insanity defense and that's what we're doing with that's
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 1: not how that happens. You have to say I want
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 1: to do that, and the court has to kind of
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 1: approve it. You can't just say that. And so the
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 1: perception that defendants can easily manipulate the system by claiming
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 1: insanity is not is not supported by statistical evidence. As
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 1: a matter of fact, the insanity defense is used in
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 1: less than one, that's right, one percent of all poor cases,
• 1:10:08
  Speaker 1: and when used has only a twenty six percent success rate.
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 1: So that's right, you guys. It is probably one of
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 1: the hardest defenses to put on ever for a defense attorney.
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 1: It is not easy. It is not granted right away.
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 1: You can't like when this is brought to the table.
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 1: It's for a good reason and they had to have
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 1: stuff to back it up in this case.
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 2: I don't have the statistics, but I believe while doing
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 2: Dearst Mothers, I had read something that most successful insanity
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 2: please have to do with women who killed their children
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 2: postpartus things like that. I don't there was a statistic
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 2: on one of them, and I just got goosebumps all again.
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 1: But yeah, the fact that no spoilers here, but yes,
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 1: you areked car Terry. The majority of successful cases are
• 1:11:03
  Speaker 1: in fact women over men. So then we go into
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 1: proving insanity. Meeting the burden of prefer insanity and actually
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 1: convincing a jury to go along with it is notoriously difficult, like,
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 1: oh boy, you are cleverness. Everyone skeptical of an instant
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 1: as I understand. I understand. I think we're getting a
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 1: little bit better as a society the more we know
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 1: about certain things, particularly postpartum psychosis. But I understand it's
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 1: hard for a lot of people to even wrap their
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 1: minds because you imagine trying to think. I mean, I
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 1: can speak from personal experience, but just imagine your brain
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 1: turns against you. How are you, as a person who's
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 1: never experienced to comprehend and such wildness.
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 2: So many people think you shouldn't talk about it, and
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 2: that it should be a dark, dirty scene grit, so
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 2: we don't talk. I think we're getting better about talking
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 2: about mental health and things like that, but you're right,
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 2: your brain turn turns against you. How do you explain
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 2: that somebody has never had a clue or known somebody.
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 1: I think it's interesting, and this is the point I
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 1: bring up some other times and some of my other shows,
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 1: is that I'm pretty sure everyone that is watching right now.
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 1: It asked if you got Alzheimer's or dementia, dementia, would
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 1: that be the worst thing that happened to you? And
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 1: I think all of us have that fear of getting
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 1: it right, like, oh my gosh, that would be I
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 1: can't imagine losing my mind and who I am and
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 1: forgetting everything. Well, guess what, guys, there are several mental
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 1: illnesses that have been exactly like that, and I do
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 1: think for some of them we should have some more
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 1: compassion like we do with people. It's Alzheimer's. It is
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 1: a brain disease. But I'm going to step off my stovebox.
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 2: I three with you one hundred percent.
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 1: But it's a hard thing for regular people to wrap
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 1: their head around.
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 2: It's terrifying, it is until to them, it's one of
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 2: those things until they know someone or have a loved
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 2: one or it happens to them, it's hard to put
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 2: yourself in those shoes. And so I also have some
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 2: compassion for them because they're like, I just can't imagine
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 2: that for sure, and I never had to be in that,
• 1:13:33
  Speaker 2: and I am so grateful that you never have. I'm
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 2: almost grateful that.
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 1: They for sure, so for example, Okay, the rule focuses
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 1: on cognitive awareness, the understanding from right from wrong, but
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 1: does not adequately consider other factors, such as the defend
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 1: its ability to control their actions due to compulishon or delusion. Right,
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 1: kind of tiptoe on the delusion a little bit earlier,
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 1: with like, if you think this is a government person
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 1: coming to kill you, that's delusion, you know, to you,
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 1: you may feel justified for killing that person because you
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 1: think they're ought to harm you and kill you. It's
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 1: a delusion though, right, So then there's also the post
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 1: trial consequences. So if a defendant is found not guilty
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 1: by reason of insanity, they are typically committed to a
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 1: state mental institution. However, there is often public concern about
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 1: how long such individuals remain in treatment and when they
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 1: may be released, and the decision to release a person
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 1: who has been committed after an insanity defense can be
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 1: contingents contentious, particularly if there is a concern about the
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 1: individual's potential danger to society. And I think that's where
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 1: a lot of us are like, Okay, where do we
• 1:14:58
  Speaker 1: go from here? And I know lots of cases and
• 1:15:01
  Speaker 1: I'm not going to bring them all up Andrea Yates
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 1: is wine. There's also a Canadian case of this guy,
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 1: I don't remember his name, but there's a lot and
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 1: that is something that we as a society, even legal,
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 1: there's a lot of things we need to work out here,
• 1:15:17
  Speaker 1: you know. But anyway, I wanted to share that all
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 1: with you. Now, with that, let's get back to the story.
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 2: Now. On November fifth, twenty twenty two, the prosecution filed
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 2: the last request to delay the trial, which, guys, is interesting,
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 2: but the judge denied it. See, the prosecution had recently
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 2: denied a different request. They wanted to replace their expert
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 2: witness after learning about the defenses insanity strategy.
• 1:15:54
  Speaker 1: That's not great.
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 2: But now the expert the prosecution planned to use claimed
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 2: to he was too ill to participate and said he
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 2: had to drop out of twenty five other cases. However, Guys,
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 2: during an in camera interview, which is a private interview
• 1:16:12
  Speaker 2: with a judge, he refused to share any details about
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 2: his illness. Despite saying he was too sick for some cases,
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 2: he admitted he was working on others.
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 1: Make that makes sense.
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 2: That's weird, right, bias maybe and only wants to work
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 2: on the cases that yeah.
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 1: He felt good about his opinion on I kind of
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 1: got that vibe. But we don't know. We don't know,
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 1: don't you know?
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 2: Now? The expert was a second opinion for the state
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 2: and was expected to testify that Austin did not have
• 1:16:46
  Speaker 2: a psychotic break but was likely on drugs or going
• 1:16:50
  Speaker 2: through withdrawals when the attacks happened. Okay, now, Because the
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 2: expert wouldn't give the judge enough information to prove he
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 2: truly couldn't testify, the court denied the state's request to
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 2: replace him.
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 1: I mean, interesting, if.
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 2: You're not going to give all the facts, what other
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 2: decision are you leaving?
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 1: The judge not an interesting I don't disagree with the
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 1: judge on that.
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 2: I don't either. So the judge also pointed out that
• 1:17:25
  Speaker 2: the state knew of the experts health issues since they
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 2: hired him in twenty nineteen. Ooh, yeah, this wasn't a
• 1:17:35
  Speaker 2: knew problem.
• 1:17:36
  Speaker 1: Boh ret Row.
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 2: We don't do math here, but I can do one, two, three,
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 2: okay now. On November twenty eighth, twenty twenty two, right
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 2: before the trial was to begin, a play deal, A
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 2: plea deal, my gosh, A plea deal was struck between
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 2: the two sides. And the judge accepted Austin's plea of
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 2: not guilty by reason of insanity for both the murders
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 2: of John Stevens and Michelle Mischkon and murder of Jeth
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 2: Fisher and Burglary.
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 1: Yes, I just real quickly, I didn't make a no here.
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 1: But for those of them watching, you know, Karen read
• 1:18:21
  Speaker 1: and whatnot. The fact that the prosecution was willing to
• 1:18:25
  Speaker 1: do a plea deal for insanity, as the defense is
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 1: literally telling you. All you need to know it is
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 1: believe me, they want the first agree mur the second
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 1: to it. They want. The fact that they immediately was like, okay,
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 1: here's a plea deal, will sign. That is telling you,
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 1: honestly and truthfully that whatever was happening with Austin Harrowin
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 1: was enough that they knew that they would tremendously lose
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 1: a case. Because again, remember we talked about how hard
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 1: it is to defend that sort of thing.
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 2: There's enough, sure.
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 1: Exactly, there was enough there that the prosecution was scared
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 1: they were going to lose their case. That is saying
• 1:19:07
  Speaker 1: a lot.
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 2: It is a lot. It is now as a result
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 2: of this plea Austin, Kelly Harrof Way remained in the
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 2: Martin County jail until he was taken to a secure
• 1:19:21
  Speaker 2: mental health facility monitored by the Florida Department of Children
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 2: and Families, and that he would not be allowed to
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 2: leave the facility without a court order. Okay, Now, Sidney Mishkin,
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 2: sister to Michelle, read her impact statement in court. She
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 2: read numerous bizarre conversations Austin had left via text messages
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 2: leading up to the killings. And this is all quotes Scott.
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 2: Your dad asked you on the afternoon before you killed
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 2: my sister, did you throw the drugs out? Did you
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 2: throw the drugs out? You didn't answer yes. Do you
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 2: know what you said to him? Learn? I mean, what
• 1:20:11
  Speaker 2: does that mean? Are you ever going to tell us
• 1:20:15
  Speaker 2: what that means? But here we are opening the prison
• 1:20:21
  Speaker 2: doors for a double murderer. For words come to mind,
• 1:20:25
  Speaker 2: white rich boy justice. Yeah. So, Jody Bruce's sister to Michelle,
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 2: brought up extensive text messages that Austin allegedly sent to
• 1:20:41
  Speaker 2: his friends before the crimes that documented his extreme drug
• 1:20:45
  Speaker 2: use leading up to the attacks. She was outraged by
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 2: the judge's ruling. I don't really know how you could
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 2: brutally murder two people attempt to kill another and not
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 2: even have a trial. This was news to me. So
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 2: as you can probably guess from that, the family was
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 2: not happy that there was a plea deal and that
• 1:21:15
  Speaker 2: they didn't get to go to trial. And I have
• 1:21:18
  Speaker 2: to say I would probably feel the same way. And
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 2: I think when you're caught up in all of those
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 2: emotions and grief and everything you've gone through and all
• 1:21:26
  Speaker 2: this time, I could see you feeling like you didn't
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 2: get your day in court and your chance to say
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 2: so for sure, totally understand all of that.
• 1:21:40
  Speaker 1: I can't imagine as a family member, and I certainly
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 1: am not judging them at all. I understand running justice
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 1: and closure and this is hard, very hard to wrap
• 1:21:53
  Speaker 1: your mind again, And I get it, I do. I
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 1: get their frustrations, the feeling like justice isn't being Doneal
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 1: talk about that a little bit later, But my sympathies
• 1:22:04
  Speaker 1: for sure go out to the families of both Michelle
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 1: and John. So with that, defense attorney Nelly L. King
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 1: said after the hearing that although the result of the
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 1: case fails to bring comfort to the families of the victim,
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 1: this finding brings this matter to its right and lawful end.
• 1:22:29
  Speaker 2: All right.
• 1:22:29
  Speaker 1: Two experts, one for the defense and one for the state,
• 1:22:35
  Speaker 1: determined Austin was experiencing a psychotic break at the time
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 1: of the homicide and lack the intent necessary to be
• 1:22:45
  Speaker 1: criminally responsible for his conduct. And I know somebody you're like, oh,
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 1: you could be vaking it. Let's saying hear heard voices
• 1:22:51
  Speaker 1: and all that. But the interesting thing is is that
• 1:22:55
  Speaker 1: when people fake it, they actually get the process wrong.
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 2: He chewts somebody's face off. Guys, let's just think about that.
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 2: That's yeah, yeah, So.
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 1: Here we go. So Austin will remain in a mental
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 1: health facility until medical professionals determine he is not a
• 1:23:23
  Speaker 1: risk to return to society. But but he can only
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 1: be released with a court order. That's right, the doctors
• 1:23:32
  Speaker 1: and a judge. It will be talked about. You can't
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 1: just walk out on your own. It's a whole to do.
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 1: It's a whole thing. The family has to notify everything happens. Okay,
• 1:23:44
  Speaker 1: this is not oh you're good, here you go, you're discharged.
• 1:23:47
  Speaker 1: That's not happened.
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 2: I've heard it. Sometimes that's more in depth than a trial. Absolutely,
• 1:23:55
  Speaker 2: they get into all.
• 1:23:56
  Speaker 1: Of it absolutely, that's a freak lately. So let's say
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 1: where Worrie so he'll be asked to do that her
• 1:24:07
  Speaker 1: the plea agreement. Now, Craig Trosino, sorry if I didn't
• 1:24:11
  Speaker 1: know you justiced their critic. I apologize. A University of
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 1: Miami law professors said that finding Haraf not guilty by
• 1:24:19
  Speaker 1: reason of insanity would effectively be a life sentence because
• 1:24:23
  Speaker 1: it's highly unlikely that they would risk releasing a killer
• 1:24:28
  Speaker 1: as notorious as parent, which wasn't the same thing said
• 1:24:35
  Speaker 1: about John Hinckley Junior. Notwithstanding that President Reagan survived, that's
• 1:24:39
  Speaker 1: who tried to assess me him And well, we don't
• 1:24:42
  Speaker 1: know this for a fact. But Andrea Yates, who is
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 1: somebody I feel very passionate about with her case, I
• 1:24:50
  Speaker 1: feel very passionately about it, Terry notes, because she had
• 1:24:53
  Speaker 1: her and I was like, let me tell you who
• 1:24:56
  Speaker 1: everything I knew about Andrew Yeates. She has never tried
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 1: to get out, but she has been eligible, and I'll
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 1: be honest, how she tried to get out. I do
• 1:25:05
  Speaker 1: think she would be approved, I really really do. But
• 1:25:09
  Speaker 1: she wants to stay where she feels safe and isn't
• 1:25:11
  Speaker 1: harmed because of what happened. You don't know who. Andrea says,
• 1:25:15
  Speaker 1: she drowned her five children in a bathtub. And it
• 1:25:17
  Speaker 1: is not whatever you think you know about that case.
• 1:25:20
  Speaker 1: It is not like that, okay.
• 1:25:24
  Speaker 2: And he tells me that the mental help she's getting
• 1:25:28
  Speaker 2: is working. Yeah, because she's taking accountability. And she is saying,
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 2: I do not know without the structure, Yes, in this
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 2: place that I'm in that I wouldn't hurt someone else.
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 2: That tells me it's working.
• 1:25:43
  Speaker 1: And it's hard. It's hard to say, you know what,
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 1: this is a child killer and I have empathy with
• 1:25:47
  Speaker 1: them and all of that. It's very hard to get
• 1:25:53
  Speaker 1: your mind across that threshold. Right.
• 1:25:56
  Speaker 2: Anyway, her husband, Rusty, should have been charged with something,
• 1:26:00
  Speaker 2: but we won't get into that.
• 1:26:01
  Speaker 1: I'm a great girl. By the way, if you guys
• 1:26:02
  Speaker 1: want to hear about more, Andrew Yates Terry did a
• 1:26:04
  Speaker 1: show called Dearest Mothers and that's a doocy. So if
• 1:26:08
  Speaker 1: you need someone to watch this weekend, go check it
• 1:26:11
  Speaker 1: out on our Challenge your Crime and Wine time now.
• 1:26:15
  Speaker 1: So Judge Sherwood Bauer in court defended the defense team, prosecutors,
• 1:26:20
  Speaker 1: and the expert witnesses from criticism voice in court, he said,
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 1: what did I do here? I pressed the button and
• 1:26:28
  Speaker 1: everything is oh, we're fine, We're fine. Sorry, guys. So
• 1:26:32
  Speaker 1: he said, it's a sad case. It's an awful case,
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 1: he said, adding that no one is losing sight of
• 1:26:41
  Speaker 1: the death and injuries in this case. And then Prosecutor
• 1:26:46
  Speaker 1: Brandon White is sympathetic to the families. If we need
• 1:26:50
  Speaker 1: to be the punching bag, that's fine, he said. The
• 1:26:54
  Speaker 1: prosecutors did everything possible to prove the case, but the
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 1: facts were not there. Quote. What they are really angry
• 1:27:08
  Speaker 1: about is the law. In quote. He said. He wasn't
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 1: happy with the result either, but he said the prosecutor's
• 1:27:17
  Speaker 1: office does not create the facts and we don't create
• 1:27:22
  Speaker 1: the law, which was also true. It's also true. But
• 1:27:24
  Speaker 1: remember they got all starts of it, and they got
• 1:27:26
  Speaker 1: digital levens, they got all this stuff.
• 1:27:29
  Speaker 2: But wait a minute, just keep that in mind. Could
• 1:27:32
  Speaker 2: someone please call the Commonwealth and tell them that they're
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 2: not supposed to create facts and ignore the law. Could
• 1:27:40
  Speaker 2: please somebody call them and tell them for me?
• 1:27:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I know this is our case. For a lot
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 1: of people, it is. But I do respect the prosecution
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 1: for making the statement they did it is rare.
• 1:27:51
  Speaker 2: He didn't get a guilty verdict, but it is in
• 1:27:56
  Speaker 2: a sense still a life sentence. He's not on the
• 1:27:59
  Speaker 2: shop read he's not going to hurt someone else.
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 1: Yes. Now, White wants to try to find something positive
• 1:28:10
  Speaker 1: out of something so horrific. He planned to look at
• 1:28:14
  Speaker 1: two specific falls in Florida in light of the verdict. First,
• 1:28:19
  Speaker 1: he planned to research a few states that allow a
• 1:28:21
  Speaker 1: guilty but insane conviction. Now in Florida, White said, only
• 1:28:27
  Speaker 1: a not guilty by reason of insanity conviction is handed down.
• 1:28:32
  Speaker 1: He said, this is an effect gets the defendant off completely,
• 1:28:36
  Speaker 1: which I would argue once again, you're spending time. People
• 1:28:41
  Speaker 1: have to approve your mental well being, the drudge has
• 1:28:44
  Speaker 1: to or the courts have to prove it. I don't
• 1:28:47
  Speaker 1: actually see that, Like, you could be sentenced to five
• 1:28:50
  Speaker 1: years and it could take you fifteen because mental illness
• 1:28:54
  Speaker 1: is no joke. It's not steady all the time. You
• 1:28:57
  Speaker 1: could be serving any even more time. Yep, in that
• 1:29:01
  Speaker 1: sort of place. But I understand, I understand understand. Quote,
• 1:29:06
  Speaker 1: anytime we have a not guilty by reason of insanity,
• 1:29:10
  Speaker 1: basically we are surrendering the outcome to a bunch of
• 1:29:14
  Speaker 1: paid experts, and psychology is not a hard science. I
• 1:29:20
  Speaker 1: would say you could probably find a psychologist to say
• 1:29:23
  Speaker 1: whatever you want them to say in the quote. And
• 1:29:27
  Speaker 1: I do kind of agree with the prosecution a little
• 1:29:30
  Speaker 1: bit here. I do. I do. But let's not pretend
• 1:29:34
  Speaker 1: that this is some sort of defense that happens all
• 1:29:36
  Speaker 1: of the time that we know. We know for a
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 1: fact that is not true. But I have seen some
• 1:29:44
  Speaker 1: psychology experts on Inlinel what get out here, like doctor Phil,
• 1:29:51
  Speaker 1: like doctor freakin' Phil, who we should just call Phil
• 1:29:55
  Speaker 1: because he's not a freaking doctor. I mean maybe it's
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 1: his doctorate.
• 1:29:59
  Speaker 2: As a coach, so he has a pactric that.
• 1:30:01
  Speaker 1: He is not medical doctor.
• 1:30:03
  Speaker 2: He is not licensed to practice psychology.
• 1:30:08
  Speaker 1: No. Now, White also wanted to see the state expand
• 1:30:12
  Speaker 1: upon its definition of voluntary intoxication, which I have an
• 1:30:18
  Speaker 1: opinion about this in just a second. This only takes
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 1: into account the actions someone takes while actively intoxicated, not
• 1:30:26
  Speaker 1: the actions they might take while experiencing psychologic psychological impacts
• 1:30:32
  Speaker 1: from withdraw or long term drug abuse. Now, Austin had
• 1:30:38
  Speaker 1: a known and documented drug habit, but toxicology tests the
• 1:30:44
  Speaker 1: ones that they use did not pick up any synthetic
• 1:30:48
  Speaker 1: drugs in the system, time of the crime, and just
• 1:30:51
  Speaker 1: real quick, this is where I think a lot of
• 1:30:55
  Speaker 1: the conversation needs to happen and listen. In my years
• 1:30:59
  Speaker 1: of looking into true which has been a long many
• 1:31:02
  Speaker 1: of decades, the worst crimes, some of the worst I've
• 1:31:07
  Speaker 1: ever read, was from people on meth amphetam. The most horrific,
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 1: disturbing cases I've ever heard of comes from people being
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 1: under the influence of drugs. And I don't know if
• 1:31:22
  Speaker 1: now is the time to have that conversation, but I
• 1:31:25
  Speaker 1: certainly think that's something that we really need to consider.
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 1: But also remember drug addiction is a mental illness as well,
• 1:31:33
  Speaker 1: substance abuse, alcohol abuse is as well. But I think
• 1:31:36
  Speaker 1: we really need to look more into this as a society,
• 1:31:41
  Speaker 1: a grade overall. Now, our researchers searched for the charges
• 1:31:48
  Speaker 1: to Florida and Santad laws since this case, and the
• 1:31:51
  Speaker 1: only thing that they could find was an update to
• 1:31:55
  Speaker 1: the Baker Standard. Many of you have heard the Baker Act, right,
• 1:31:58
  Speaker 1: which gives law enforcement more discretion to ask for one Oh,
• 1:32:03
  Speaker 1: they had lost there, right, that's about being committed involuntarily
• 1:32:08
  Speaker 1: for mental health. Truth, that's the bag direct. Some of
• 1:32:11
  Speaker 1: you that way trials with us are very familiar with
• 1:32:13
  Speaker 1: with that. With so, that is where we leave at
• 1:32:17
  Speaker 1: this story. And with that, let's get into our closing thoughts.
• 1:32:23
  Speaker 1: What do you guys think about that? By the way,
• 1:32:27
  Speaker 1: just before I go into closing thoughts, I just want
• 1:32:29
  Speaker 1: everyone to know that I am very much an advocate
• 1:32:32
  Speaker 1: of mental health. I have my own struggles and it
• 1:32:35
  Speaker 1: means a lot to me, a lot to me to
• 1:32:39
  Speaker 1: break the stigma, to bring awareness to these sorts of things.
• 1:32:45
  Speaker 1: I want you to know that the reason I chose
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 1: this case is because of the mental health aspect to it.
• 1:32:53
  Speaker 1: It really really was. It was not the cannibalism, meaning
• 1:32:56
  Speaker 1: the cheek. It wasn't that gets the headlines right.
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 2: It's about why did that happen?
• 1:33:03
  Speaker 1: Why did that happen?
• 1:33:04
  Speaker 2: What was that factor that did it? It's not like
• 1:33:08
  Speaker 2: he was just a bad kid. He didn't wake up
• 1:33:10
  Speaker 2: one day and just decide to do this. Whether it
• 1:33:13
  Speaker 2: was drugs, mental illness, I mean, he was suffering through something.
• 1:33:18
  Speaker 1: Whatever his reality was clearly was an actual reality, right
• 1:33:24
  Speaker 1: you know, whether it's drugging news for mental illness, either way,
• 1:33:27
  Speaker 1: it's very scary for him and for anyone in his past.
• 1:33:30
  Speaker 1: Believe you me, I am not hies high. I am
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 1: not condoning what Austin Harrow did. That is not my stance.
• 1:33:40
  Speaker 1: What happened was horrific to Michelle and John John Okay,
• 1:33:46
  Speaker 1: but cases like these need to make us think a
• 1:33:50
  Speaker 1: little bit, they do more because this isn't the first time.
• 1:33:54
  Speaker 1: It won't be the last time. If this happens to
• 1:33:58
  Speaker 1: people anyway, that's a very fast So I just want
• 1:34:00
  Speaker 1: to preface. I just want to preface tonight. I know
• 1:34:02
  Speaker 1: we had fun that I just I did at the
• 1:34:05
  Speaker 1: end because I didn't want to do spoilers of why
• 1:34:07
  Speaker 1: I chose this case specifically. Oh Dave, He says he
• 1:34:13
  Speaker 1: has a million things to do, but I just came
• 1:34:14
  Speaker 1: across this, have a wonderful week and nice people. Thank you, Dave.
• 1:34:18
  Speaker 1: Dave is one of our couch growth Mama watchers. But
• 1:34:20
  Speaker 1: we will get into that. Let's do our closing thoughts
• 1:34:23
  Speaker 1: for a quick second.
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 2: I just want I'll say that Sami Sunshine is right.
• 1:34:28
  Speaker 2: A lot of mental disorders and males show up early
• 1:34:32
  Speaker 2: mid twenties to early thirties. I mean it truly is.
• 1:34:38
  Speaker 2: I have known some that they are perfectly fine, and
• 1:34:41
  Speaker 2: just one day something changes.
• 1:34:44
  Speaker 1: It's scary. It is so scary.
• 1:34:47
  Speaker 2: You don't know. It's like a little fun bomb inside
• 1:34:50
  Speaker 2: of you that you don't I knows. It's kind of
• 1:34:52
  Speaker 2: like a nidney stone, but kidney stones so much easier.
• 1:34:55
  Speaker 2: But yeah, you just don't know when it's going to drop.
• 1:34:58
  Speaker 1: Right, let's do all right? So tonight we remember John
• 1:35:04
  Speaker 1: Stevens and Michelle ms Gohm, not as victims of a sensious,
• 1:35:11
  Speaker 1: sensational case, but as people who loved and were loved.
• 1:35:17
  Speaker 1: Look at them. What a beautiful, beautiful couple they really are.
• 1:35:22
  Speaker 1: Their lives very much mattered. And let's not forget Jeff Fisher, Okay,
• 1:35:29
  Speaker 1: who thought, who almost lost his life trying to help
• 1:35:34
  Speaker 1: his neighbors. Okay, I can't imagine the trauma he goes
• 1:35:40
  Speaker 1: through every single day, to have been stabbed so many times,
• 1:35:44
  Speaker 1: to have tried to help Survivors' Guild, all that stuff
• 1:35:48
  Speaker 1: that can happen. Nothing was Jeff's fault. He did his best.
• 1:35:52
  Speaker 1: And while justice may look different through the lens of insanity,
• 1:35:56
  Speaker 1: and I understand for some people it's it's a no,
• 1:35:59
  Speaker 1: it's a hard note them. But let us never lose
• 1:36:02
  Speaker 1: sight of the lives that are lost. I know I haven't.
• 1:36:10
  Speaker 1: Let's not lose sight of the people's lives that were lost,
• 1:36:13
  Speaker 1: the people grieving, and the questions we must keep asking
• 1:36:17
  Speaker 1: about mental health, about warning signs, and about how we
• 1:36:21
  Speaker 1: care for one another in a world where tragedy, unfortunately
• 1:36:27
  Speaker 1: can arrive in the most unexpected ways. Michelle and John,
• 1:36:36
  Speaker 1: I know if you guys are in love in a
• 1:36:38
  Speaker 1: much better place than the place where you've lived.
• 1:36:43
  Speaker 2: Yes. Now, this case, to me sadly reminds us that
• 1:36:49
  Speaker 2: sometimes a horrse that we think of it not just
• 1:36:51
  Speaker 2: from monsters, you know, it could be from someone we
• 1:36:56
  Speaker 2: least expected. Who thinks a young man, excuse me, boy
• 1:37:01
  Speaker 2: of this age would have this kind of mental breakdown
• 1:37:05
  Speaker 2: or situation happen. No one is thinking of that, and
• 1:37:08
  Speaker 2: you don't expect someone to just unravel and attack like
• 1:37:12
  Speaker 2: Austin did. Two innocent lives, John and Michelle were brutally
• 1:37:17
  Speaker 2: stolen in an act that I still have trouble wrapping
• 1:37:21
  Speaker 2: my head around. Okay, their families are never going to
• 1:37:24
  Speaker 2: be the same, guys. We also have to think of
• 1:37:26
  Speaker 2: Jeff Fisher. He will never be the same, Okay, and
• 1:37:31
  Speaker 2: we also have to remember the court world, Austin not
• 1:37:33
  Speaker 2: guilty by reason of insanity. They're honestly, I don't think
• 1:37:38
  Speaker 2: would be any verdict that could have made sense of
• 1:37:41
  Speaker 2: this tragedy that true, and it needs to make us
• 1:37:47
  Speaker 2: question more about mental health, drug induce mental health, psychosis,
• 1:37:53
  Speaker 2: all of these things, and what would and should justice
• 1:37:57
  Speaker 2: look like for these individuals. Shouldn't just luck away, lock
• 1:38:00
  Speaker 2: them up, throw away the key. We need to help
• 1:38:02
  Speaker 2: them too. I agreed we need to help them, but
• 1:38:06
  Speaker 2: most importantly, guys, we need to figure out how to
• 1:38:08
  Speaker 2: keep this from happening again. The drugs are out there.
• 1:38:13
  Speaker 2: We need to figure out what to do now. I
• 1:38:16
  Speaker 2: personally hope that Austin is getting the help he desperately needs,
• 1:38:20
  Speaker 2: and that all of the families are getting the help
• 1:38:23
  Speaker 2: they need, because if you think about Austin's parents here,
• 1:38:26
  Speaker 2: they had made an appointment to try to get him
• 1:38:28
  Speaker 2: help and it wasn't soon enough, and the guilt they
• 1:38:32
  Speaker 2: probably feel, but I want them to know you've got
• 1:38:36
  Speaker 2: an appointment, you were trying. You aren't putting your hand
• 1:38:40
  Speaker 2: in the sand, ignoring your son and just saying, oh,
• 1:38:42
  Speaker 2: he'll grow out of it. You know, you were trying.
• 1:38:46
  Speaker 1: You know something was bad enough, because I don't think
• 1:38:49
  Speaker 1: that's an easy spot for a needs parent to be in.
• 1:38:53
  Speaker 2: Because what if you're wrong, then your kid's going to
• 1:38:55
  Speaker 2: be mad at you because you did this. Trust me,
• 1:38:57
  Speaker 2: I know I've lived it. I've done it with my
• 1:39:00
  Speaker 2: older one, So yeah, but I agreed. Now, before we go,
• 1:39:06
  Speaker 2: if you like what you heard tonight, please be sure
• 1:39:09
  Speaker 2: to follow all of our socials and subscribe to our
• 1:39:12
  Speaker 2: YouTube channel. It's free, okay. Or if you're listening to
• 1:39:16
  Speaker 2: our pod, please download the pod, give us a rating,
• 1:39:21
  Speaker 2: a review. It helps people find us, and all of
• 1:39:25
  Speaker 2: that helps all of these different algorithm gods that are
• 1:39:29
  Speaker 2: out there that we know. I do not math. I
• 1:39:33
  Speaker 2: do not understand algorithm gods. I just know they're out there,
• 1:39:37
  Speaker 2: and you doing those things make him work. That's true,
• 1:39:43
  Speaker 2: makes him work. Now, next week, guys on True Crime
• 1:39:47
  Speaker 2: and Mind Time, we are going to have a special
• 1:39:49
  Speaker 2: guest on the show. We have someone who is going
• 1:39:52
  Speaker 2: to talk in depth with us about the Mikayla Tyler
• 1:39:57
  Speaker 2: murder from Swingey Technas. It's a big deal, and we
• 1:40:02
  Speaker 2: have someone close to the family who's going to talk
• 1:40:05
  Speaker 2: with us about what happened, how law enforcement has failed them,
• 1:40:12
  Speaker 2: and how justice right now may not happen for them.
• 1:40:17
  Speaker 1: Oh, it's going to be a very interesting and I
• 1:40:20
  Speaker 1: look forward to it.
• 1:40:22
  Speaker 2: There's not going to be all of the graphics stuff
• 1:40:25
  Speaker 2: and things like that that we've showed tonight it, but
• 1:40:27
  Speaker 2: it's gonna I'm gonna say, don't bring snacks, bring tissues,
• 1:40:33
  Speaker 2: just because we're going to feel how it has personally
• 1:40:36
  Speaker 2: impacted these individuals.
• 1:40:40
  Speaker 1: Right, And we love telling interviewing families and telling their
• 1:40:44
  Speaker 1: stories of victims, whether it's here of victims who we
• 1:40:49
  Speaker 1: know have passed from tragic circumstances, or if it's victims
• 1:40:54
  Speaker 1: that are missing. You know, Terry does a great job
• 1:40:59
  Speaker 1: with that. Now, if you need more of Terry and
• 1:41:03
  Speaker 1: I because we're fabulous, and who doesn't want to spend
• 1:41:06
  Speaker 1: them all the time. I still wonder why every day
• 1:41:10
  Speaker 1: why I have an audience?
• 1:41:11
  Speaker 2: What here we are?
• 1:41:12
  Speaker 1: Like?
• 1:41:12
  Speaker 2: Here we are? Somebody wants listen to us? Because normally
• 1:41:16
  Speaker 2: I just talk to myself and nobody talks back to me.
• 1:41:19
  Speaker 2: And that's why I have some.
• 1:41:20
  Speaker 1: Many yeah right now. Every Monday and Wednesday, Terry hosts
• 1:41:25
  Speaker 1: her show mid Day Missing, where she covers missing person
• 1:41:28
  Speaker 1: cases that don't seem to get a lot of attention.
• 1:41:32
  Speaker 1: You know, maybe they're not the perfect victim for whatever reason,
• 1:41:35
  Speaker 1: maybe they're not the right color. Whatever. You can also
• 1:41:38
  Speaker 1: find these on anywhere you'll listen to podcasts, because both
• 1:41:42
  Speaker 1: our True Crime and Wind tim and Midday Missing are
• 1:41:44
  Speaker 1: in podcast forms, specifically Midday Missing, because that really is
• 1:41:49
  Speaker 1: I think the heart of our channel. We very much
• 1:41:54
  Speaker 1: care about missing people and their families, So please give
• 1:41:59
  Speaker 1: that a listening. You never know, one little thing, one
• 1:42:01
  Speaker 1: little thing could help solve the whole thing. You never know.
• 1:42:05
  Speaker 1: You never know. Then I have my show Couch Court
• 1:42:09
  Speaker 1: with Lama, where we just kind of wrapped up the
• 1:42:12
  Speaker 1: Karen retrial. We are on Verdict Watch right now.
• 1:42:15
  Speaker 2: You ever wrapped up, We're still do that.
• 1:42:17
  Speaker 1: It was closing and right now we're on Verdict Watch,
• 1:42:20
  Speaker 1: which will continue in the next week. But while we're
• 1:42:24
  Speaker 1: waiting for the jury to come back from the verdict,
• 1:42:26
  Speaker 1: we are going to be watching the Lori Valo Devo
• 1:42:29
  Speaker 1: trial that she just recently had with the attempted well.
• 1:42:32
  Speaker 1: I think she starts with conspiracy of murder against Brandon Boudreau,
• 1:42:38
  Speaker 1: her nephew. It just wrapped up this week, but since
• 1:42:42
  Speaker 1: we're visiting with Karen Reid, we're going to go ahead
• 1:42:44
  Speaker 1: and watch it and we get a zoom zoom through
• 1:42:46
  Speaker 1: all the brakes. So join us right here on True
• 1:42:49
  Speaker 1: Crime and Winetime Channel at eight thirty am Eastern Monday
• 1:42:54
  Speaker 1: through Friday on Mosdays day suit week. I think there's
• 1:42:56
  Speaker 1: one day where I had to change the time, but
• 1:42:57
  Speaker 1: it's still a thirty in the morning where there I
• 1:43:00
  Speaker 1: have so many great friends. I saw you Cash Potatoes
• 1:43:03
  Speaker 1: who stucked in tonight. I love yo, So what we'll
• 1:43:07
  Speaker 1: be doing that next week. I'm also doing Couch Court
• 1:43:09
  Speaker 1: Wilma after Dark, which is about the Sean Diddy Cones trial,
• 1:43:16
  Speaker 1: his federal sex trafficking reco case. So on. The stuff
• 1:43:19
  Speaker 1: has that has come on has been absolutely shocking to hear.
• 1:43:23
  Speaker 1: And I've been trying to record last four days off
• 1:43:26
  Speaker 1: freaking day, so many things have happened, but I did
• 1:43:30
  Speaker 1: manage to record at least twenty minutes from Tuesday and
• 1:43:35
  Speaker 1: afterwards because we had this show to do, so I
• 1:43:37
  Speaker 1: had to put a pause in it and I looked
• 1:43:39
  Speaker 1: at Amos and I was like, I can't believe I
• 1:43:41
  Speaker 1: just said say the things.
• 1:43:42
  Speaker 2: I said the things that you have said. I mean,
• 1:43:49
  Speaker 2: the fact that you're having to say them is horrifying
• 1:43:53
  Speaker 2: to me.
• 1:43:54
  Speaker 1: There's a lot of especially nightmares.
• 1:43:56
  Speaker 2: It's wed a nightmare made.
• 1:43:59
  Speaker 1: Oh my god, I laugh so hard. I can't. I
• 1:44:01
  Speaker 1: don't want to give spoilers. I don't give spoilers. Everyone
• 1:44:03
  Speaker 1: knows that I thought those will be released this weekend
• 1:44:06
  Speaker 1: at some point. We many of us, have had a
• 1:44:09
  Speaker 1: very busy personal week and that has caused some of
• 1:44:14
  Speaker 1: the episociated behind. But I promise we're catching up all
• 1:44:17
  Speaker 1: this weekend and we will be caught up come next week.
• 1:44:20
  Speaker 1: But oh, you guys, just prepare yourself for this didy silf.
• 1:44:23
  Speaker 1: It's a wild going anywhere yet, that's true. I'll get
• 1:44:27
  Speaker 1: to you in just the second on that one. And
• 1:44:31
  Speaker 1: if you haven't watched any of the Ditty stuff, you
• 1:44:33
  Speaker 1: can find my coverage on our US versus Sean Ditty
• 1:44:36
  Speaker 1: Coom playlist, so be sure to check that out and
• 1:44:40
  Speaker 1: real quick. If you have a member on our YouTube channel,
• 1:44:43
  Speaker 1: Terry and I are doing a members only a live
• 1:44:45
  Speaker 1: shows every Wednesday night for the rest of this month
• 1:44:48
  Speaker 1: in June at seven pm Eastern and they are a
• 1:44:51
  Speaker 1: lot of fun. We have been telling people wait too
• 1:44:52
  Speaker 1: much about ourselves. I think you can become a member
• 1:44:58
  Speaker 1: by clicking the join button, selecting which ch your best
• 1:45:00
  Speaker 1: suits you by the little you know dots there. It
• 1:45:03
  Speaker 1: is through memberships that we heap the lights on and
• 1:45:06
  Speaker 1: the crime stories flowing. Now I start a comment earlier
• 1:45:10
  Speaker 1: before we sign off. I specifically start a comment from
• 1:45:13
  Speaker 1: Juju being jujub Bean. Are you still here? Are you
• 1:45:17
  Speaker 1: still here, Juju Bean? If not, that's fine, I'll tell
• 1:45:20
  Speaker 1: you Monday that I responded to this comment that you
• 1:45:22
  Speaker 1: post said a while ago at the beginning of the show,
• 1:45:25
  Speaker 1: you said, oh, that's in my way thinking about Crystal
• 1:45:29
  Speaker 1: Rogers Ballard from Kentucky. Now, I can't say for sure,
• 1:45:34
  Speaker 1: but literally before I got on this show tonight, the
• 1:45:39
  Speaker 1: lovely amos said, what are you going to do after Diddy?
• 1:45:43
  Speaker 1: And will you do Crystal Rogers because it's not going
• 1:45:47
  Speaker 1: to be testified, uh televised. So I said, we will
• 1:45:52
  Speaker 1: talk about it this weekend and we will figure out
• 1:45:54
  Speaker 1: how we can do that. Because I'm very familiar with
• 1:45:56
  Speaker 1: the Crystal Rogers case. It is a big deal. It's
• 1:46:00
  Speaker 1: not being televised, and I may likely in some ways
• 1:46:04
  Speaker 1: shap reform I don't know how we're gonna do yet,
• 1:46:06
  Speaker 1: but I will cover that because Crystal Rogers deserves answers.
• 1:46:12
  Speaker 1: M So thank you for asking my question. Jujubi. With that, Terry,
• 1:46:19
  Speaker 1: how about we sign off and do these lovely people
• 1:46:22
  Speaker 1: start to their weekend? Oop?
• 1:46:23
  Speaker 2: Sorry? Absolutely, Now for all of you that are fathers,
• 1:46:27
  Speaker 2: I was reminded today at his Father's Day on Sunday,
• 1:46:30
  Speaker 2: and so happy Father's Day. Just so everybody knows, if
• 1:46:37
  Speaker 2: you're a father, it does mean something. Okay. There's a
• 1:46:41
  Speaker 2: lot of people who don't have, you know, fathers in
• 1:46:44
  Speaker 2: their lives for one reason or another. So if you
• 1:46:48
  Speaker 2: get to call yourself a father and you have that,
• 1:46:50
  Speaker 2: I want you to know you are loved and we
• 1:46:54
  Speaker 2: appreciate you. Okay. Now I want to say thank you
• 1:46:58
  Speaker 2: for joining us and for being patient with this as
• 1:47:03
  Speaker 2: all of the crazy technology stuff crash yesterday and let
• 1:47:06
  Speaker 2: us push it to tonight. I do appreciate that it.
• 1:47:10
  Speaker 1: Shows up, yes and best fans in the land.
• 1:47:15
  Speaker 2: Absolutely, y'all are just amazing. Okay. But I also want
• 1:47:20
  Speaker 2: y'all to remember to take care of yourself. Okay, be
• 1:47:23
  Speaker 2: sure to take care of yourself. These cases can be hard.
• 1:47:27
  Speaker 2: We know, Lama and I've loved the true crime world
• 1:47:30
  Speaker 2: for many, many years. We know there can be times
• 1:47:33
  Speaker 2: that you have to say this one's not for me
• 1:47:35
  Speaker 2: and you have to walk away. So I always want
• 1:47:38
  Speaker 2: to remind you, please take care of yourself. Just pop in,
• 1:47:41
  Speaker 2: say hi, and then leave. It's okay. We appreciate it.
• 1:47:45
  Speaker 2: And guys, if you see something, say something, remembering by
• 1:47:49
  Speaker 2: not saying something, you are protecting the purpse. Okay, just
• 1:47:57
  Speaker 2: think about that. By not speaking up, you're protecting them. Okay.
• 1:48:02
  Speaker 2: So and until next time, and especially over this weekend,
• 1:48:06
  Speaker 2: enjoy your mind time, guys.
• 1:48:08
  Speaker 1: Or margarite a time, because that's what's happening for.
• 1:48:10
  Speaker 2: Us or margarite us. I'm not having anything else tonight
• 1:48:13
  Speaker 2: because I'm like Earl.
• 1:48:16
  Speaker 1: I want to thank you everyone for listening and supporting us.
• 1:48:21
  Speaker 1: I know I've just stepped in this ghosts and I
• 1:48:23
  Speaker 1: appreciate your guys's acceptance of me. I'm so happy to
• 1:48:27
  Speaker 1: be here to cover these cases and bring them attention,
• 1:48:31
  Speaker 1: and I just want to appreciate and say I'm sorry.
• 1:48:33
  Speaker 1: I say I appreciate all of the sport and becoming
• 1:48:37
  Speaker 1: the new co host for sure Criment mind Time now
• 1:48:40
  Speaker 1: until next time, as always say take care of your mind,
• 1:48:44
  Speaker 1: take care of each other, and never stop asking the
• 1:48:48
  Speaker 1: hard questions. Actually, I just realized it's the first time
• 1:48:51
  Speaker 1: I've ever said that. I know, but I'm gonna be
• 1:48:53
  Speaker 1: saying always. That's my new that's my new thing. I
• 1:48:57
  Speaker 1: thought about it really hard, and I was like, know,
• 1:49:00
  Speaker 1: I need to say that, And actually I think I'm
• 1:49:02
  Speaker 1: going to say that for the show, every show, because
• 1:49:05
  Speaker 1: it's important, right, It's important of your mind. Because this
• 1:49:08
  Speaker 1: is important. You guys have learned anything from this case,
• 1:49:12
  Speaker 1: it's that your mind is.
• 1:49:13
  Speaker 2: So it's okay to admit something's not for you.
• 1:49:17
  Speaker 1: Exactly and take care of each other.
• 1:49:20
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:49:21
  Speaker 1: Sometimes I feel like we lose wait for new sight
• 1:49:24
  Speaker 1: of that in today's world that makes it difficult. And
• 1:49:28
  Speaker 1: never stop asking the hard questions. People don't like people
• 1:49:32
  Speaker 1: to ask questions, but I am a question asker. That's right,
• 1:49:36
  Speaker 1: and you should ask questions always. Now, until next week,
• 1:49:39
  Speaker 1: you guys, go forth and be amazing. All right, thank
• 1:49:45
  Speaker 1: you guys so much. You have a wonderful nights. Y