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Leading with a Positive Mindset with Mary Ann Boynton · Authentic Living

• 0:01
  Welcome to authentic living with Roxanne, a place where we have as conversations about
• 0:08
  things that really matter in our lives.
• 0:11
  And now here's your host, Roxanne Derhodge.
• 0:36
  Hi, everyone.
• 0:36
  It's Roxanne Derhodge of authentically being with Roxanne.
• 0:39
  Thanks for tuning in again this week.
• 0:41
  This, today I have a a special colleague, Marianne Beaton with me.
• 0:45
  Hi, Marianne.
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  How are you today?
• 0:47
  I'm great, Roxanne.
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  Thanks for having me here today.
• 0:50
  Thanks for taking the time.
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  I know what your busy schedule, you know, and, with you always not being home, it was that you
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  go to accommodate.
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  And, you know, in because I'm thinking of when I met Marianne would would have been, way back.
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  I was with Morneau Chappell at that time when Chappell and, she worked, or was affiliated at
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  that point with Greek West Life.
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  So Marianne said, works with work with mental health, psychological safety, and she works
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  predominantly the areas of resolving resolving conflict and building resilience.
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  And she also is the director of strategy and collaboration for workplace strategies for
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  mental health which provides free resources, through Canada Life.
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  And she's re written multiple books around the the area of, mental health and well-being in
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  the workplace.
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  So, Marianne, kind of, I I know we just started to talk.
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  And, Maryne, just talking about what's happening with, people having a lot of
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  cancellations with the coronavirus.
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  What are you finding with the fear that you're you're hearing around the elements of what's
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  happening out there in the workplace with, with the coronavirus.
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  Well, it's interesting because I look at, the fear around the coronavirus with the fear
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  around so many things in life, whether it's climate change or it's politics or it is,
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  injustice.
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  And all of these things are serious concerns, and yet the level of anxiety, can be
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  debilitating for some people And for other people, they can put it in perspective.
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  They can say, what can I do about this?
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  And if I can't do anything about it, which is usually, not the case.
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  It's usually some things you can do to protect yourself or to make a difference in the world.
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  But if there's nothing I can do about it, then I'm not gonna worry.
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  And if there is something, I will do it, but, well, I'm not doing that particular thing
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  washing my hands or making sure I stay out of crowded places then I'm going to say it is what
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  it is and live my life.
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  I think some people where the anxiety gets so great.
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  They actually put their life on hold and spend the time with repetitive negative thought of
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  fear that really take away from opportunities, for enjoying life.
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  Absolutely.
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  And fear is such a thing.
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  Right?
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  Like, you know, whether it's a there's a right sizing or a downsizing or an merger and
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  acquisition or issues at home, you know, we we're all always juggling things on an ongoing
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  basis, but to your point, when people start to catastrophize, And, you know, you hear about
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  the things the stories about Costco and people are like they're running out of toilet paper
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  and, you know, people are like having bunkers full food and all those things.
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  I I, to your point, you, yes, you have to get prepared, but to what detriments are you kind
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  of putting that pause button on on your life and what needs to get done until this happens.
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  And, of course, it's gonna unfold like it needs to.
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  Right.
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  And we know of people that almost their entire adult life has been spent in fear.
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  People in their 80s, in their 90s, that from the time they were very young and went through
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  the depression, went through the war.
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  They just believed that any minute now, the world was gonna collapse and their entire life
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  was spent in fear.
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  Whereas you can look at some of their peers who instead said, yeah, we went through some awful
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  things, so I'm going to embrace life.
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  I'm going to love people.
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  I'm going to enjoy while I can.
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  And I think Roxanne, that's the difference between being resilient and not being
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  resilient.
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  We are going to experience scary things.
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  We're gonna experience tragedy or loss or all sorts of frustrations and disappointments in
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  life.
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  But what we want to do is when we're not having to deal with that in the present moment, we
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  want to be able to lift our eyes up, lift our attitude up and enjoy what we can.
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  And it's so it's so interesting.
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  Right?
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  Because we know with with neuroscience, like, I mean, all of us go into that fight flight or
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  freeze at any given point.
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  Right?
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  We get triggered.
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  You know, oftentimes when I will see clients, they'll say to me, help me learn how to get not
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  get triggered.
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  And I said, okay.
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  Well, short of you and I being kinda 6 feet under, we're always gonna get triggered.
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  It's kinda what we do with it and how long we kinda stay in that that fear based mode of
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  protect So there's nothing that's gonna, you know, obviously healthy preparation to your
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  point is very important.
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  But what what happens to a lot of people, and whether I've been a manager through my life,
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  and I know you've been in lots of management or director roles, and you see the differences in
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  personalities of how people kind of absorb fear, and they get almost catatonic to the
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  people that just kinda able to to take it in and just go with the flow.
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  And, of course, with a lot of stressors that we're seeing out there, it's it's it's
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  cumulative, and, we have so many things that kind of wear down at us on an ongoing So it
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  really becomes our, like, the, our individual responsibility, but also within companies for
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  companies to kind of think about what can they do around the issue of resilience.
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  Well, you know, Roxanne, I talk about the, common enemy mistake that's made in a lot of
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  organizations where in order to bond with their, directory reports, leaders may start
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  saying, yes, this thing, the coronavirus is really scary.
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  Yes.
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  Corporate head office is really bad.
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  Yes.
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  The economy is sinking.
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  And they believe that they're commiserating.
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  But what the research shows is that if the leader is expressing hopelessness.
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  If the leader is expressing victimization, then it actually depletes the energy and the
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  hopefulness of their direct reports and that we, as leaders, have a responsibility not to
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  whitewash, not to pretend that this new directive or policy that came down is the
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  greatest thing, but rather to say it is what it is, how can we make the best of it for us and
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  to really redirect the fear to positive action to minimize risk, to minimize the negative
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  impact.
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  And that's such a good important point because, obviously, I often, when I talk about authentic
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  leadership, I talk about the awareness and that leader knowing themselves.
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  Of course, they're human beings, but the more aware that they are, the more aware of how they
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  understand their coping mechanisms and their stressors and how they kind of process
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  information and how they relate to people, all those things become very, very vital so that
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  they could take the time for themselves.
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  So when they do go deliver a message arms, you know, things let's use the current example of
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  coronavirus.
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  They may have some things going through their head, but they have to put that face, front
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  facing positive spin on it as much as possible so that because people, we expect that from our
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  leaders.
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  Right.
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  But I think that what the leaders get mixed up with is the difference between being authentic
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  and putting that brave face on.
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  And We're not asking them to pretend like they it doesn't matter to them.
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  We're asking them to say, I can't control it, but let's talk about what we can do to manage
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  the risk for ourselves.
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  And not to pretend like it's ridiculous.
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  There's should be no reason for fear.
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  We're all fine because it's just not true.
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  Right?
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  There is there is some level of risk, but it's manageable, and there's ways to do that.
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  And I think, you know, through the years of management and stuff like that, would you say
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  that things have gotten better where managers are not, like, on the auto and where they
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  perceive that I have to be this well put together individual that always has it in
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  control.
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  And now that people are able to kinda Give us a bit more of a vein into to kind of them as a
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  person, but also delivering leadership.
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  Yeah.
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  So to, borrow from Renee Brown.
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  I think vulnerability is the new strength.
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  It is when a leader can say Yes.
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  I struggled when I started to do that too.
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  I had a challenge in interacting with this type of person in the workplace.
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  Here's how I dealt with it.
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  It's a lot better than saying.
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  You what's the matter?
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  Why aren't you getting this?
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  You know, you should have this by now.
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  Why do you have problems with these coworkers is be authentically vulnerable.
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  That doesn't mean weak.
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  It doesn't mean that your crying and whining.
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  It just means that you're honest about the fact that you're human too and that there's days,
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  for instance, when somebody comes and says, I need to talk to you.
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  This is going on, and you can say, You know what?
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  That sounds important to you.
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  I'm not in the right head space right now.
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  Can you give me a half an hour to get organized and then I'll talk to you?
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  To be vulnerable just means you're being more honest.
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  And I absolutely agree with you.
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  Based on
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  the sum of the sectors, based on the industry, would you say that in certain industries, and
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  you and I, I've worked in a lot of different industries also some environments, you know,
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  are more open and to that element of the leader can be a bit more authentic.
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  Some,
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  they talk about it, but I'm not sure that they deliver that.
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  Yeah.
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  And you know what?
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  I almost see it across every sector now that there are more enlightened leaders.
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  And we used to say Oh, well, you know, they're old school as if it was tied to an age.
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  And what I'm finding is that People are leading at every level in every sector.
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  It's just a matter of their personal evolution.
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  Their personal awareness, their ability to have emotional intelligence, and it doesn't matter
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  how old they are.
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  Doesn't matter how long they've been in the industry, and it doesn't matter what industry
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  they're in.
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  Of course, some of the more traditionally macho patriarchal, sectors, maybe a little slower to
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  evolve to something that is considered to be more feminine.
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  It doesn't mean it's more girly.
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  It just means that it's more emotionally aware.
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  But I see it everywhere.
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  That that we are making that change, that we are doing better when soldiers see their,
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  colleagues crash and burn.
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  They want to help.
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  They want to make it better.
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  And in order to do so, they have to tap into their own emotional impact from the work that
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  they're doing.
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  And that need to help others is often what's fueling their own self awareness and their own
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  evolution.
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  Absolutely.
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  I think, you know, in my work and dealing with different leaders in different sectors compared
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  to say 20 years ago when I started in the field of
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  VIP, it it definitely has shifted.
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  And now people are recognizing, I may not be, you know, what should I share first of all?
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  You know, so how authentic should I be?
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  That's the other thing.
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  A lot of leaders go, Well, I'm not really sure.
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  You want me to be this authentic person, and they'll say that they're they're afraid to get
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  so authentic that then there's no separation, not that there should be separation, but to
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  some degree, people have to take direction from you.
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  Yeah.
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  So I know
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  I talk about oversharing.
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  And when are we oversharing?
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  If you think being authentic is telling everybody everything about you, then you you're
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  off base.
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  Being authentic is don't tell a lie.
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  Don't view the truth in order to make yourself look better.
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  Yes.
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  You share because you think it's going to help the other person not because of how it will
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  reflect on you.
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  And there's there's a huge difference between the 2 approaches.
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  Absolutely.
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  And I think that's what happens.
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  Right?
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  Because people start to listen to things and they want to be you know, they go to courses
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  and they're thinking, how am I gonna do this?
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  And maybe they kind of do the pendulum swing so far that they're like, okay.
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  Now I need some coaching to be able to find the middle a little bit more.
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  Right.
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  So let's let's talk a little bit about some of the, you know, resilience, obviously, we all
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  wanna learn more about it.
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  We all wanna make our our our environments where it be that whole, we're at, you know, in
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  workplaces.
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  We all wanna be more resilient.
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  And to your point when we, just got out of it before we were talking is that In life, we're
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  gonna see things.
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  We're gonna deal with things on an ongoing basis.
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  What are some of the key resiliency factors that you know from being out in in kind of the
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  research world and working with Gather Life and just in, your work that are some of the things
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  that are important for people to think about implementing either at work or, I mean,
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  obviously, we bring ourselves to work so that they could be a bit more resilient out there in
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  the world.
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  Yes.
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  I I I think there's, definitely specific elements that are valuable to know.
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  One is self awareness.
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  If I believe that all of my emotions are caused by external factors, by you, by my work by the,
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  you know, the news station, then I feel out of control all the time.
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  When I understand that my emotions are based on my thoughts, my reactions, that I have a lot of
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  control over them I don't have control over what happens to me, but I absolutely have
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  control over the way I react to it.
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  So that's the first thing.
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  Become self aware.
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  And then you can drill down even further.
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  If I know that I do react to certain things in certain ways, start to name them.
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  If I know that every time somebody criticizes me, that I get flooded with shame that results
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  in me being angry, then if I know that's going to be my reaction, I can stop and think, where
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  does that shame come from?
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  Where's that anger come from?
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  What do I think is unfair?
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  Because anger is a reaction to what is a perceived or actual injustice.
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  So when I'm angry, what do I think is not fair, and what can I do about that?
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  So that's that's the next step that I think is so important.
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  We need to know why we're reacting.
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  So you talked about triggers.
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  Why why do we have these involuntary reactions?
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  Then we talk about our reaction to stress in general.
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  And we have physiologic.
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  We have emotional and we have behavioral to stress.
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  But if we don't know what they are, especially the early warning signs, we continue usually
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  until we crash and burn.
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  We don't know what the source of our stress is because we've been stressed so long that we now
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  think it's just who we are, which is another phrase that always, amuses me.
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  That's who I am.
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  No.
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  It's not.
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  That's what you do.
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  It is not who you are.
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  Who you are is this perfect being, but what you do is stress or overreact or withdraw or
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  whatever.
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  It's what you do.
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  Another element that is important is to understand what stressors are in your life
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  right now.
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  And that may sound counterintuitive.
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  Let's sit down and think about all the things that stress us.
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  But if we're not aware of them, They have a tendency to build up.
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  Even things called micro stressors that there's so much they seem insignificant, but it bumped
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  my knee on a table every day because it's just in the way of me walking.
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  And I'm irritated by this every day.
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  My, coping skills are going to be depleted dealing with that pain, that physical pain and
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  that annoyance.
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  So eliminating these little things that we have control over make a lot of sense because then
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  when we're dealing with a stressor that we have less control of, like being a caregiver of a
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  family member who's dying.
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  We can't say, okay, don't die.
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  Or, you know, don't be sick, we have more energy to cope with that in a way that we won't
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  regret in the end, which is important, right, to behave in a way that is consistent with our
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  love for that person.
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  And it's not taken up being annoyed with bumping my knee.
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  Right.
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  Right.
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  Yeah.
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  What a
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  what a good way to look at it because you know, like, to your point, a lot of people say I'm
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  I'm stressed.
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  You know, it's it's a tough quarter.
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  I've been traveling a lot or, you know, my kids, you know, have been, going through a lot.
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  And we all have multiple balls to your point, but it it's a small microscopic things that
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  people could address that they can take a hold of.
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  But I think a lot of people don't, and it becomes that cumulative effect.
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  You know, it's kinda like you know, I'm I'm a little bit mildly irritated to explosive anger.
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  If you if you don't kind of address it along the way and kind of try to figure out what
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  what's putting me in that state before you know what you're kinda along the continuum.
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  And then maybe you have an interaction at work that ends up being a performance related
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  concern that goes to a manager or supervisor versus kind of trying to figure out some of the
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  things that you can do.
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  Yeah.
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  So in reference to, psychological safety, which is your your your space and, stress.
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  What are some of the things that, you know, people listening, you know, out there that they
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  if they are stressed and, you know, they're like I often say that when we're stressed, we
• 20:23
  might misperceive potential things and We might kind of, you know, I might perceive that if
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  you've raised your voice, Mary Anne, that you're screaming at me, but in fact, you're
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  maybe not doing that because we kinda look through a different lens.
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  So for the frontline employee that maybe is potentially going through some things and
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  thinking, you know, I think I'm being psychologically harassed.
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  You know, what what kind of guidance would you give them?
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  So in our plan for resilience, we have something called the 4 a's.
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  And they come from the University of Chicago, and we adapted them a bit for the workplace.
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  And it's that you look at a stressor and understand when we're stressed that our
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  executive functioning or decision making is compromised because we're stressed.
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  And when we look at a stressor through the 4 a's, what we're forcing ourselves to do is
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  consider the pros and cons.
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  So I haven't looked at it from the point of view of feeling harassed, but let's try it.
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  So one of the a's is avoid.
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  Now a lot of people will say, well, if you're avoiding a stressor, you're just in denial, but
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  I've got a colleague who is a recovering alcoholic who when they travel, they call the
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  hotel and say, empty the minibar.
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  I want no alcohol.
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  In my room.
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  And it's like we talked about with the micro stressors.
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  Why should that person have to deal with that stressor when they can avoid it altogether.
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  So in this situation where you feel like you're being harassed or bullied, The first question
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  is, could you avoid them?
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  And what are the pros and the cons of doing that?
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  And and to really look at both sides so they you don't make a decision that is difficult.
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  The next a is accept.
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  Can you accept that this person is going through their own stuff, that it maybe isn't
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  even about you and that you can put them in perspective.
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  It's their issues.
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  It's their challenges.
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  And you're not going to bother with them.
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  You're not gonna react them.
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  So that's another a.
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  The next one is to adapt.
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  Can you change the way you interact with them?
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  Could you sit down with them and say, you know what?
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  Roxanne, you're a good person.
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  I've worked with you for years, and I've seen who you are And lately, it seems like we've
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  been having a more difficult relationship.
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  I would like that to change Can we talk about how we could do that?
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  And you can take control of trying to adapt that relationship.
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  The next one is alter, and that is, can you change the situation altogether?
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  Can you alter the external environment?
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  Could you move your office?
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  Could you get a different job?
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  And all of this isn't to say any one of those is the right answers.
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  But what it does is it takes you out of your emotional approach to the stressor, puts you
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  into a much more objective approach as you look at the pros and cons.
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  And when you go through this exercise, sorry, and that resource, by the way, is free online.
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  But when
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  you go through this exercise, you may, come up with a different idea altogether than what you
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  do in the exercise, but it's because you've shifted from an emotional reaction to it, to a
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  more rational reaction.
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  Executive functioning because, like, you know, I often say once our logical prefrontal cortex
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  goes off, then we kinda have a bit of a street party in our brain with all the things kind of
• 24:11
  pinging off each other.
• 24:12
  And, So that's that's an amazing resource.
• 24:15
  I will I will put the link to, you know, the Canada Life resources in our show notes.
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  Because that's a nice approach.
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  So avoid.
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  Accept.
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  Alter.
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  Or adapt.
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  Awesome.
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  So I think that's something that people can apply today.
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  Whether it's at whether it's at home or whether it's at work, that's something that's really if
• 24:40
  you could kinda go through that logical exercise, that would be able to you know,
• 24:44
  unless you kind of go through and then you realize it's an ongoing issue.
• 24:48
  At which point, I would say you have to kind of decide if it's at work, how are you gonna
• 24:52
  address it?
• 24:52
  Like, you know, what next steps you could take to maybe go to, maybe your supervisor, have a
• 24:59
  conversation with somebody in HR, those types of things.
• 25:01
  And, obviously, there's policies and procedures accordingly free to be psychologically safe at
• 25:06
  work.
• 25:07
  Right.
• 25:07
  And all of those hopefully will come up through this exercise that those are options.
• 25:12
  Right?
• 25:12
  Do you file a complaint?
• 25:13
  Or how do you go about managing this for yourself?
• 25:17
  There's another resource I just wanna mention.
• 25:20
  For those who are listening who are in that place right now, and it's called protecting
• 25:25
  yourself against bullying.
• 25:27
  And it was written, along with people who were also dealing with depression.
• 25:32
  And that that bullying just was a straw that's breaking the camel's back.
• 25:38
  It's that thing that's just too much And it's about how to protect yourself until it's
• 25:43
  resolved.
• 25:45
  Right?
• 25:45
  Because in the moment, you still have to take care of yourself.
• 25:49
  And, the 4 a's are great to think about what you could do about it, but what are you doing
• 25:56
  right now to protect yourself?
• 25:59
  Absolutely.
• 25:59
  Because you have to continue to be able to function and do your job, you know, run things
• 26:04
  outside of work and those types of things So being able to protect yourself, to be able to
• 26:09
  continue to function.
• 26:10
  And if it's a bigger issue, obviously, having the steps to go out and take that next step.
• 26:15
  Now, Mary Anne, in reference to leaders, right, which, you know, we have obviously the the
• 26:20
  employee and then we have leaders.
• 26:22
  What are some of the things that leaders could have, you know, in their in our work
• 26:26
  environments, you know, I know when I was in corporate, stressors were there, and I know
• 26:31
  it's just quantified as as we've gone.
• 26:33
  And we've really had to to your point, really step back and recognize, how we need to take
• 26:39
  care of ourselves because the stressors and the rapidity of our economic you know, an economic
• 26:44
  world and with the digital economy.
• 26:47
  All those things aren't going away.
• 26:49
  They're happening and the impact of AI.
• 26:51
  All those things are gonna coming at us.
• 26:54
  And with leadership, you know, what kind of things are you seeing out there with leaders?
• 26:59
  What are some of the pressures that they're talking about in this acknowledged economy,
• 27:04
  that they're having to adapt or pivot to.
• 27:07
  Yeah.
• 27:07
  I think there's several things that happen.
• 27:09
  One of them is that people often get promoted to a leadership position, a manager, a
• 27:17
  supervisor, because they were really good at doing the job.
• 27:21
  So what that means is first of all, they don't understand, the struggle to learn something new
• 27:29
  to, uh-uh, you know, create good habits at work because they never had to do it.
• 27:34
  And secondly is that they're not trained in many cases well enough to manage the emotional
• 27:42
  reactions of other people.
• 27:44
  And so for some, leaders, whether they're union reps or they're, on the management side, they
• 27:51
  go to help someone and they get attacked or, told that they're part of the problem, and they
• 28:00
  become traumatized, not in the big post traumatic stress disorder, but that now they
• 28:07
  are dealing with anxiety about saying or doing the wrong thing.
• 28:13
  And it's tough place to be.
• 28:15
  I don't envy people in management positions.
• 28:19
  I know it seems like, oh, they got promoted.
• 28:21
  It must be great.
• 28:23
  It's a whole different level of responsibility.
• 28:26
  It's a whole different level of self doubt.
• 28:30
  And while they really want to do the right thing, their fear and their frustration can be
• 28:39
  that the people that are leading them are just giving it to them in a very concrete way.
• 28:46
  This is what you have to do, get it done.
• 28:49
  There's no room for but this is how I feel about it, or can we talk about it?
• 28:55
  And if you are not emotionally intelligent enough for yourself.
• 29:02
  You turn around from a fear base and try to direct your employees.
• 29:08
  What I try to say to leaders is because you're given something, it doesn't mean that you
• 29:17
  shouldn't know how to question the way that it's gonna be applied.
• 29:22
  And that's not to say This is ridiculous.
• 29:24
  I can't do it.
• 29:25
  But to go away and say, let me think about, how I'm gonna get that done.
• 29:30
  Is it okay if I come back to you and we can review it?
• 29:33
  And you simply look at how many people do you have?
• 29:37
  What are they asking?
• 29:38
  How many hours will it take?
• 29:39
  And you go back to your boss, the senior leader and say, okay.
• 29:45
  What you're asking me to do takes, you know, a 100 hours what we're already doing takes 500
• 29:51
  hours.
• 29:52
  That's 600 hours.
• 29:53
  I have this many people that leaves us with about a 150 hours unaccounted for.
• 29:59
  How would you like me to prioritize?
• 30:01
  Just Right.
• 30:02
  Very concrete, very straightforward.
• 30:06
  The thing is that many leaders think if they do this, they will either be accused of being
• 30:13
  insubordinate or not a team player or ineffective, my experience has been that's
• 30:20
  never true.
• 30:21
  If you can actually show the numbers and be in that very straightforward approach, most
• 30:29
  leaders are appreciative and we'll say, okay, this will go.
• 30:33
  We'll let that go for now.
• 30:34
  We'll just focus on this, or let's see.
• 30:37
  We'll get you some more help.
• 30:38
  It's because then it's a business decision.
• 30:41
  It's a numbers game.
• 30:43
  It's not emotional.
• 30:44
  How could you give me this much?
• 30:46
  You don't care.
• 30:48
  Absolutely.
• 30:49
  And then you're not so taking it from a pragmatic, perspective and kind of saying,
• 30:54
  okay.
• 30:55
  Well, I'm overwhelmed.
• 30:56
  I'm a set.
• 30:56
  My employees are upset at b.
• 30:58
  We're not we have this much more being pushed down from upper management and the frontline
• 31:03
  are freaking out and the, you know, the The middle manager oftentimes gets sandwiched into
• 31:07
  that pressure cooker, I call it.
• 31:09
  And that was something that I dealt with all the time when I was in my executive role was
• 31:13
  that managers always felt like they hadn't they felt like they were a no man's land oftentimes,
• 31:18
  and they wanted to find some safety.
• 31:20
  So this pragmatic kind of steps makes a lot of sense because you know, when we we come from an
• 31:27
  emotional part of our brain where we're we're being reactive, then we kind of get gray in the
• 31:32
  way we communicates.
• 31:33
  And then, of course, if you're going to senior leadership, you need to be more, like you said,
• 31:38
  you have to come from a business perspective to say, This is what I'm seeing.
• 31:43
  This is how we this is what I see will happen.
• 31:45
  If we kind of proceed in this end, we're gonna burn out people.
• 31:49
  We're gonna lose our good staff.
• 31:50
  Those of things based on the numbers and those.
• 31:53
  So I think definitely from a business model to look at the business case that you could
• 31:58
  present, versus kind of like you said, being reactive and I'm I'm so upset and people are
• 32:02
  screaming at me.
• 32:03
  And then there's, you know, it becomes harder to come to a pragmatic solution from that
• 32:08
  space.
• 32:09
  Mhmm.
• 32:10
  So, Marianne, this this is always a pleasure.
• 32:12
  I'm sure you and I could keep keep going on and on and on with a lot of things, you know, based
• 32:16
  on, or or backgrounds and things like that.
• 32:19
  So with, with yourself, if people are wanting to get ahold of you, I will do put all the
• 32:26
  links to the free resources through Canada Life.
• 32:29
  What where can people get a hold of you if they're interested in, having you speak or do
• 32:33
  some work with you?
• 32:36
  So my, they can get in touch with me through the workplace strategies for mental health
• 32:41
  website through the contact us.
• 32:43
  Or atmarian@marianbeaten.com.
• 32:47
  Okay.
• 32:47
  Perfect.
• 32:48
  So I will put that in the show notes.
• 32:50
  So, again, what did I learn?
• 32:51
  I think I I like the concept of the 4 a's.
• 32:54
  Right?
• 32:55
  That really is it's quick, and I'm sure people listening and were thinking the same thing.
• 32:59
  So again, in my day, I'm thinking, you know, whether it's, you know, having to deal with,
• 33:04
  one of my customers, and I, you know, we all get into that you know, issue sometimes of
• 33:08
  something coming up to maybe sit back, try to reflect on it, think about how could I react a
• 33:15
  little bit differently and then approach it after.
• 33:17
  So I love that tip.
• 33:18
  So thanks for you so much, and I will put the link for that for anybody wanting to, you know,
• 33:24
  kind of apply it and learn a little bit more about some of the other things that, Marianne's
• 33:28
  provided.
• 33:28
  So for everyone, thanks so much again for tuning in.
• 33:31
  It's Roxanne Derhodge.
• 33:32
  You know, I work in the arena of mental health and wellness.
• 33:34
  And if you're needing any, information on leadership, please go to roxanneverhodge.com.
• 33:40
  So, Marianne, thanks so much again, and take care.
• 33:43
  And thank you for being a role model for what resilience looks like.
• 33:47
  Well, thanks so much, Marianne.
• 33:49
  Bye.
• 33:50
  Thanks for tuning in to authentic living with Roxanne, creating the space for positive,
• 33:56
  healthy change.
• 33:57
  Roxanne is a keynote speaker, psychotherapist, and coach to work with Roxanne, visit
• 34:03
  rocksandirhaj.com/blueprint.
• 34:07
  We'll see next time on authentic living with Roxanne.