Latest / Foul Territory / Buck Showalter unfiltered: Nimmo-Semien swap q’s, Losing Edwin Díaz in ’23, Don Mattingly’s HOF case

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Buck Showalter unfiltered: Nimmo-Semien swap q’s, Losing Edwin Díaz in ’23, Don Mattingly’s HOF case · Foul Territory

• 0:09
  Speaker 1: He just barged right in with his buckmobile. Buck, great
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: to see you.
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: How you doing. We got to come up with something else.
• 0:15
  Speaker 3: Guys, No, that was I'm not a Florida State fan.
• 0:26
  Speaker 4: I hope it went.
• 0:26
  Speaker 5: I hope it's going miserably, just like that game last
• 0:29
  Speaker 5: Saturday where it went miserably.
• 0:30
  Speaker 4: For those lousy pieces of garbage. My wife went there.
• 0:33
  Speaker 4: By the way.
• 0:34
  Speaker 5: I love Johnny, but uh fuck, that's perfect because I
• 0:39
  Speaker 5: know when you were managing the Mets. That's how you
• 0:41
  Speaker 5: drove around Port Saint Lucy is in a convertible like
• 0:43
  Speaker 5: every other person your age, honking at everybody because they
• 0:48
  Speaker 5: think the light's green but it's really red. They need
• 0:50
  Speaker 5: their hair flowing. You know, that's exactly that's perfect for
• 0:53
  Speaker 5: you in Port See.
• 0:55
  Speaker 6: I'll tell you that for a guy that was there
• 0:57
  Speaker 6: when Saint Lucy first opened up. Let's put this way.
• 1:01
  Speaker 6: Not a lot's changed.
• 1:02
  Speaker 7: It's real estate. You know, real estate prices have changed. Buck.
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: You used to be able to get a place for
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: like fifty grand, and those places are now five hundred.
• 1:16
  Speaker 6: Yeah, Cesspides, I think bought a big bunch of land
• 1:19
  Speaker 6: down there. I think he may still live down there
• 1:21
  Speaker 6: where his mom does. I don't know, but uh, it
• 1:24
  Speaker 6: was interesting. I knew when I was with the Yankees
• 1:26
  Speaker 6: we had three games we had to win. We had
• 1:28
  Speaker 6: to beat the Red Sox, we had to go beat
• 1:31
  Speaker 6: the Mets in Saint Lucie, and then later on we
• 1:33
  Speaker 6: had to beat Tampa Bay. The old man, mister Steiner
• 1:36
  Speaker 6: was adamant about that. So the guys knew they had
• 1:38
  Speaker 6: to make those road trips. Nobody complained about it. Just
• 1:41
  Speaker 6: get on the bus and you better bring your a game.
• 1:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah, hold on, buck before you before you change the subject.
• 1:48
  Speaker 5: Were you with the Yankees when they're in Fort Lauderdale
• 1:50
  Speaker 5: or were you with the Yankees when they moved to
• 1:52
  Speaker 5: Tampa for Lauderdale.
• 1:54
  Speaker 6: Last thing we do the last thing we did there
• 1:56
  Speaker 6: stick and I helped design the Tampa Complex.
• 1:59
  Speaker 5: Okay, as I was going to say, you can't make
• 2:01
  Speaker 5: fun of Poort Saint Lucy if you were in that
• 2:03
  Speaker 5: ship hole that was Fort Lauderdale Spring Training Stadium, because
• 2:06
  Speaker 5: that place was god awful.
• 2:09
  Speaker 6: Well, that just all on the Ivy holder. We loved
• 2:11
  Speaker 6: it for a lot of reasons that weren't on the
• 2:12
  Speaker 6: field related.
• 2:13
  Speaker 5: AJ, But you like what you like watching the Jets
• 2:17
  Speaker 5: when They're like an airport and left field and the
• 2:19
  Speaker 5: Jets would take off. You're trying to warm up as
• 2:21
  Speaker 5: a visiting team and you got a seven forty seven
• 2:24
  Speaker 5: taken off in your ear.
• 2:26
  Speaker 6: Well, Aj, if you're in a proper level of concentration,
• 2:29
  Speaker 6: that shouldn't manner to you as a major league player.
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: But evidently you've had issues there. That's fine.
• 2:37
  Speaker 4: It's my life, Buck, all.
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: Right, we talked ball.
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: Let's let's talk ball for a sec here, Buck, we'll
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: get tomorrow.
• 2:44
  Speaker 7: I want to I want to start with the Mets.
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: I just want to get your take on where they're
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: at this offseason, what you would do if you were them,
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: And I do want to press you on the report
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: that came out that we kind of mostly said was hogwash,
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: but talked about how Lindor and Soto are very different
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: and so maybe they're not best friends, and that Lindor
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: and McNeil got into it again, like do we care
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: about this or do we more care about this team
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: getting some pitching so that they can make it through
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: a full season.
• 3:15
  Speaker 6: Pitching the last part. The best teams win. You know
• 3:18
  Speaker 6: that's true in every club that you just may not
• 3:21
  Speaker 6: hear about it. There's you know, I used to tell
• 3:24
  Speaker 6: them when the season though, okay, we pick your friends
• 3:26
  Speaker 6: for you go pick your own friends. And you know,
• 3:28
  Speaker 6: Jeff and Francisco are different. You know, Jeff's a long
• 3:33
  Speaker 6: Beach state dirt bag, loves you know everything about the game,
• 3:39
  Speaker 6: you know, thanks to the worlds against him sometime with
• 3:41
  Speaker 6: line drives at people. And Lindor is a very stylish,
• 3:46
  Speaker 6: worldly guy.
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: And they're they're not, but it works. You know.
• 3:51
  Speaker 6: I called them together the first day I got there,
• 3:53
  Speaker 6: and I'd heard a lot of stuff and we didn't
• 3:55
  Speaker 6: have a problem. Jeff, I think led the whole globe
• 3:57
  Speaker 6: in hitting that year. Nobody on the globe hit for
• 4:00
  Speaker 6: higher batan average, and Jeff McNeil and I think if
• 4:04
  Speaker 6: you actually knew everything that went on behind the scenes
• 4:10
  Speaker 6: with the relationships and you're drawing, you're thrown together in
• 4:12
  Speaker 6: a locker room for eight months, seven months. I mean, heck,
• 4:16
  Speaker 6: I've been married forty three years and there's not a
• 4:19
  Speaker 6: day goes by. I don't have to just shut up.
• 4:22
  Speaker 6: But it's okay, it's okay, I don't. That's not the
• 4:26
  Speaker 6: reason why they had a tough year. Their pitching wasn't
• 4:28
  Speaker 6: very good, and Soto if he wants to. I mean,
• 4:30
  Speaker 6: he's a splendid offensive, unbelievable offensive performer. And I would
• 4:35
  Speaker 6: say to him, they see you about six thirty quarter seven,
• 4:39
  Speaker 6: and God bless you. I like the end game here.
• 4:42
  Speaker 6: You can over manage those guys. But if they get
• 4:44
  Speaker 6: better pitching, all these stories will go away.
• 4:48
  Speaker 4: Wait wait, wait, you mean good players win games? Okay, buck, Well,
• 4:51
  Speaker 4: then I have the I have. Then I have another
• 4:54
  Speaker 4: brainbuster for you. Has there ever been a time when
• 4:56
  Speaker 4: you managed a really good team where there wasn't some
• 5:00
  Speaker 4: arguments in the clubhouse and don't remember any good, good
• 5:03
  Speaker 4: stories where it's like, wow, that was a big argument,
• 5:05
  Speaker 4: but it ended up being like it ended up being
• 5:09
  Speaker 4: the best thing for our team because we did X,
• 5:12
  Speaker 4: Y and Z to finish the season out.
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: Well.
• 5:14
  Speaker 6: You know, I kind of when I had the good
• 5:17
  Speaker 6: ship Lollipop, it never really ended well. I liked a
• 5:20
  Speaker 6: little bit of an edge with the players, I know.
• 5:24
  Speaker 6: I remember Laret's Jim Larris early on I got pinch
• 5:28
  Speaker 6: hit for and he slams his hell. You know, he's
• 5:30
  Speaker 6: trying to get your attention and Donnie. Donnie just said, hey,
• 5:35
  Speaker 6: can I take care of this? I go go right
• 5:36
  Speaker 6: ahead in the dugout, completely quiet, He goes, boys, I
• 5:41
  Speaker 6: just want you to know the king has left the
• 5:43
  Speaker 6: building because Jimmy had stormed up the runway and the
• 5:46
  Speaker 6: whole place cracked up and everything was great and we
• 5:48
  Speaker 6: went on our bu of business. He used to get
• 5:50
  Speaker 6: on Paul O'Neil all the time about getting kind of whiny,
• 5:54
  Speaker 6: like the whole world was against him with line drives
• 5:56
  Speaker 6: at people. But having guys like that, those aren't conferences.
• 6:00
  Speaker 6: It's just you know, if you take yourself too seriously
• 6:04
  Speaker 6: and you're getting you know, you think the whole world's
• 6:06
  Speaker 6: coming to an the end after one bad game or
• 6:08
  Speaker 6: at bat, you're not going to survive very long as
• 6:11
  Speaker 6: you guys well know better than anybody.
• 6:14
  Speaker 4: True.
• 6:14
  Speaker 5: True, And speaking of if you brought it up earlier too,
• 6:17
  Speaker 5: you said their pitching wasn't very good? You did, were
• 6:20
  Speaker 5: not there with David Stearns, correct, you were not in
• 6:22
  Speaker 5: New York, you guys.
• 6:23
  Speaker 6: I had a conversation where I said, thanks for the
• 6:27
  Speaker 6: good luck and hope things work out for you.
• 6:29
  Speaker 5: That was about it, okay, Because he seems to like
• 6:32
  Speaker 5: to to not go after the big starting pitcher, not
• 6:35
  Speaker 5: go after the big fish.
• 6:36
  Speaker 4: He always wants to try.
• 6:37
  Speaker 5: To maneuver and be Look, I don't I hate to
• 6:41
  Speaker 5: say this because I like David Stearns, but like he
• 6:43
  Speaker 5: wants to say, like, oh look I found this diamond
• 6:45
  Speaker 5: in the rough all the time. Why won't he just
• 6:48
  Speaker 5: go after and get the guy, the best guy that
• 6:50
  Speaker 5: fits his teams? It's oh, look, we can get this
• 6:53
  Speaker 5: guy for a little bit better deal and he's not
• 6:56
  Speaker 5: quite as good, even though he's really not as good. Right,
• 6:59
  Speaker 5: Why does David Serves do that and actually forget David Serns.
• 7:02
  Speaker 5: Why don't most gyms try to do that? Why don't
• 7:04
  Speaker 5: they just go out and get the.
• 7:05
  Speaker 7: Best players pitching? Though, we're talking about Buck for Stearns,
• 7:08
  Speaker 7: by the way, just to clarify so people don't say, oh,
• 7:10
  Speaker 7: they got to Toto.
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: We know that we're talking about starters Buck because last
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: year he did what he did the year before, and
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: he's fighting guys like mon Toss instead of going for
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: the big fish.
• 7:19
  Speaker 6: Yeah, you know, it's the ideal situation is you're kicking
• 7:22
  Speaker 6: out your own players.
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: But if you've got three so called.
• 7:27
  Speaker 6: Big time prospects, you're lucky if one of them hits
• 7:29
  Speaker 6: between the physicalness, being physically fit.
• 7:33
  Speaker 2: But you know, David's kind of had that.
• 7:36
  Speaker 6: If you look at his track record with Milwaukee, which
• 7:38
  Speaker 6: he didn't do a lot of player acquisition there other
• 7:40
  Speaker 6: than I think trade and Josh Hader. You know, there's
• 7:44
  Speaker 6: not really a big track record of how he looks
• 7:47
  Speaker 6: at things. But you know, you can always say no,
• 7:49
  Speaker 6: you can always find a doctor that's gonna poop Paul
• 7:52
  Speaker 6: his physical status. You know, putting your arm over your
• 7:55
  Speaker 6: head and jerk it down violently one hundred times every
• 7:58
  Speaker 6: fifth day is going to hurt your shoulder and your elbow.
• 8:01
  Speaker 6: It's gonna give at some point. So the problem aj
• 8:05
  Speaker 6: is that when you've acquired enough innings and track record
• 8:07
  Speaker 6: to be good and be and everybody's going, wow, what
• 8:11
  Speaker 6: a great free agent, well there's a lot of wear
• 8:12
  Speaker 6: and tear on that arm, and who's going to be
• 8:14
  Speaker 6: holding that that player when it pops. I mean, those
• 8:18
  Speaker 6: are the conversations that happened trying to project health. It's
• 8:21
  Speaker 6: such a hard task, and that's why it's so important
• 8:26
  Speaker 6: that you develop your own pictures. But you know, I
• 8:29
  Speaker 6: think I'm trying to figure what what trade? Do you
• 8:32
  Speaker 6: remember that David Stern's made other than the Josh Hater trade.
• 8:35
  Speaker 6: I'm trying to think. I'm sure there were some.
• 8:38
  Speaker 4: The Yelich, the Yelich he signed, he signed Lo Caine,
• 8:42
  Speaker 4: Christian Yelich after I mean, those two guys had got
• 8:44
  Speaker 4: in the same year, after Domingo Santana had like a
• 8:49
  Speaker 4: thirty homer year in Milwaukee. I mean, he's made a
• 8:52
  Speaker 4: couple moves. But I hear what you're saying. I hear
• 8:55
  Speaker 4: what you're saying. But don't you want don't you want
• 8:58
  Speaker 4: to go all in and say, you know, at the
• 9:00
  Speaker 4: end of the day, we got bit by the injury bug.
• 9:03
  Speaker 4: Isn't that better then? Isn't that better than I hope.
• 9:08
  Speaker 6: I'm not saying I'm not saying he's scared, don't get
• 9:10
  Speaker 6: me wrong. But if you're scared, you need you need
• 9:13
  Speaker 6: to get a dog, because you got to take chances
• 9:16
  Speaker 6: along the way. That's why it's so intriguing about the
• 9:18
  Speaker 6: the Japanese and Korean pitchers, and and you know they're
• 9:22
  Speaker 6: not all obviously the same. You got to really look
• 9:25
  Speaker 6: and do your homework on it. But let me ask
• 9:28
  Speaker 6: you guys a question. If you could only sign one
• 9:29
  Speaker 6: player and you were the mess, would you signed Pee
• 9:32
  Speaker 6: Alonzo or Edwin Diaz or Kyle Swerber. No, no, your
• 9:39
  Speaker 6: own two guys. You can only sign one of the two.
• 9:42
  Speaker 6: The owner said, Hey, David, pick one of which one
• 9:44
  Speaker 6: you want.
• 9:45
  Speaker 5: I'm taking Diaz right now because he affects games more
• 9:50
  Speaker 5: not no.
• 9:50
  Speaker 4: I listen.
• 9:51
  Speaker 5: I love Pete Alonzo, but I'm taking Diaz because he
• 9:53
  Speaker 5: affects games. As you know, Buck a great closer. We
• 9:56
  Speaker 5: had Zach Britton on the other day and he was
• 9:57
  Speaker 5: complaining about that game. You didn't bring him in you
• 9:59
  Speaker 5: know how those games effected. Sorry too soon, but also
• 10:03
  Speaker 5: what I want to know.
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: He knows the whole story, there's more to it.
• 10:10
  Speaker 5: But I would rather have the great closer that can
• 10:13
  Speaker 5: close out because listen, you know there's no psychological advantage
• 10:16
  Speaker 5: more to the team looking down there and going, ah shit,
• 10:19
  Speaker 5: we gotta face Diaz in the ninth. We better get
• 10:21
  Speaker 5: them before the ninth, right, So but that's it to me,
• 10:26
  Speaker 5: it's easy. It's an easy one. I'll take Diaz.
• 10:28
  Speaker 6: I can negate Pete. You know, you can always negate Pete,
• 10:32
  Speaker 6: and I love Pete to death. I talked to him
• 10:35
  Speaker 6: a couple of times this season, but you know, try
• 10:39
  Speaker 6: and replace Edwin. You know you're you're going to end
• 10:42
  Speaker 6: up with someone that's unproven or someone that's done it
• 10:44
  Speaker 6: in the past, but you don't know which guy you're getting, Okay,
• 10:48
  Speaker 6: And you know, I I love taking a you know,
• 10:51
  Speaker 6: we did that with Britain. We did it with Jim Johnson.
• 10:53
  Speaker 6: I love taking a starter from a team that can't
• 10:57
  Speaker 6: afford these guys and make your own. You can make
• 10:59
  Speaker 6: your own. Just got to pick the right guy and
• 11:01
  Speaker 6: listen to people on the field.
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: But he.
• 11:04
  Speaker 6: Life without a closer when the guys are looking down going,
• 11:08
  Speaker 6: I don't know how much is enough. It's not fun.
• 11:11
  Speaker 6: It's not fun, especially in New York. And you know
• 11:14
  Speaker 6: you like to have both those guys on your team.
• 11:17
  Speaker 6: Edwin's gonna be really really hard to replace.
• 11:20
  Speaker 4: But you talk like you were a manager that had
• 11:23
  Speaker 4: to figure out how to replace Edwin Diaz, Like you
• 11:26
  Speaker 4: don't have any first hand knowledge of that. Do you
• 11:29
  Speaker 4: first an experience?
• 11:31
  Speaker 6: Oh, we had to replace Jim Johnson, had to figure
• 11:33
  Speaker 6: out Zach Britton. Don't get me started. We had I
• 11:36
  Speaker 6: would go back through my closer list and it seemed
• 11:38
  Speaker 6: like we always went to Plan B. We always ended
• 11:41
  Speaker 6: up with Plan b But it was funner in places
• 11:44
  Speaker 6: like Baltimore where you had to be a little innovative
• 11:47
  Speaker 6: and go get a starter. And you know, believe me,
• 11:50
  Speaker 6: Zach Fautus tooth and nail about going to the bullpen.
• 11:52
  Speaker 6: I think he kind of likes it now. He had
• 11:54
  Speaker 6: those little hands with that that he could get over
• 11:57
  Speaker 6: the top of that sinker. He's the only guy that
• 12:00
  Speaker 6: I've ever seen Big Poppy just completely two guys. They
• 12:03
  Speaker 6: had two left ers, Britain and Brian Mattis God wrest
• 12:06
  Speaker 6: his soul or teeth. Check out his numbers against those
• 12:10
  Speaker 6: two guys. Sometime he didn't even want to see him
• 12:14
  Speaker 6: come in the game.
• 12:15
  Speaker 4: Buck, I was talking about when you lost when you
• 12:17
  Speaker 4: lost Edwin Diaz in the WBC. Oh my god, your
• 12:21
  Speaker 4: first hand knowledge of that awful.
• 12:24
  Speaker 6: You know, there's a lot to that story about how
• 12:26
  Speaker 6: that all happened. I mean, we basically had him talked
• 12:28
  Speaker 6: out of it of going I'll never forget. I get
• 12:31
  Speaker 6: a call from Brandon Nemo about nine o'clock, and you know,
• 12:35
  Speaker 6: in spring train, I get up at four thirty five
• 12:37
  Speaker 6: o'clock and I love spring training. I love everything about it.
• 12:40
  Speaker 6: So I'm going night night, I'm ten toes up and
• 12:43
  Speaker 6: phone rings. I pick it up. It's them and I
• 12:45
  Speaker 6: go us up and them, and he goes, are you
• 12:47
  Speaker 6: watching this? I go, no, I'm going to bed, young man.
• 12:49
  Speaker 6: He goes, you might want to turn it on. And
• 12:51
  Speaker 6: our season was basically over. It was over when he
• 12:54
  Speaker 6: got hurt in the WBC. So I don't know whether
• 12:58
  Speaker 6: they should have it at some other time. You get hurt,
• 13:00
  Speaker 6: you know, stepping off a curb, but that one's stung
• 13:03
  Speaker 6: the next I wish.
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: I wish everybody could walk.
• 13:06
  Speaker 6: In the locker room the next day, and everyone in
• 13:08
  Speaker 6: that locker room knows that Edwin's not going to be there.
• 13:11
  Speaker 6: And basically we were in trouble in spring training, not
• 13:14
  Speaker 6: funait Buck.
• 13:16
  Speaker 5: Did you try and stop him from going because you
• 13:18
  Speaker 5: said there's more to the story, So you keep giving
• 13:20
  Speaker 5: us like more to the story, But then you're like,
• 13:22
  Speaker 5: I can't tell you, so tell us something, Buck, I
• 13:25
  Speaker 5: need something out of you.
• 13:27
  Speaker 6: Well, we had talked to him about the merits of
• 13:29
  Speaker 6: going or not going, and you know the expression be
• 13:31
  Speaker 6: careful about telling truths that hurt innocent people. That's where
• 13:35
  Speaker 6: I stand on it.
• 13:37
  Speaker 5: Okay, that's fair, that's fair enough. So then what do
• 13:40
  Speaker 5: you think about you brought up Nemo. Neimo took shots
• 13:42
  Speaker 5: at the team too when he got traded. Is he
• 13:44
  Speaker 5: is he justified in saying what he said, because.
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: What do you constitute a shot?
• 13:50
  Speaker 5: Well, he said he used the run prevention, the run
• 13:54
  Speaker 5: prevention thing, you know, and it was like a It
• 13:58
  Speaker 5: was kind of like a backhanded compliment, right, And listen,
• 14:01
  Speaker 5: if I'm bringing Nim, I'm like, I'm going from New
• 14:02
  Speaker 5: York to Texas. I'm gonna save about twenty million in
• 14:05
  Speaker 5: taxes over the next few years of my contract.
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: I talk to him the other day. I remind him
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: of that.
• 14:10
  Speaker 6: I said, you know that housing is going to be
• 14:13
  Speaker 6: a lot different, price of gas is going to be
• 14:15
  Speaker 6: a whole lot different.
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: I can tell you that.
• 14:17
  Speaker 6: But you know, it's a good move for both of them.
• 14:20
  Speaker 6: I think they both need a little change of scenery.
• 14:22
  Speaker 6: I'm glad Nim approved it, and I think Simeon. I
• 14:25
  Speaker 6: think it's a move that will work out for both teams.
• 14:28
  Speaker 6: I hope so. But Nim's he's at an interesting stage
• 14:33
  Speaker 6: in his career. It's pretty much a wash with the money.
• 14:35
  Speaker 6: So you don't see those trades very often. But it
• 14:39
  Speaker 6: fit in need for both teams?
• 14:42
  Speaker 4: Who wins that craft? Who's on the surface right now?
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: For you? You're managing both teams, your Skip Schumacher, your
• 14:49
  Speaker 4: Carlos Mendoza. Who is more excited about that trade in
• 14:54
  Speaker 4: the moment? And I know you're a company guy, so
• 14:56
  Speaker 4: you're like, I'm the Mets manager. I'm gonna say why.
• 14:59
  Speaker 4: I love how Marcus Simmy And he's a leader, He's
• 15:01
  Speaker 4: a quiet leader. You know all this stuff. Who wins
• 15:05
  Speaker 4: this trade?
• 15:06
  Speaker 6: Does it make you, guys wonder at all that when
• 15:08
  Speaker 6: a team trades its captain. I think that went through
• 15:15
  Speaker 6: a little bit.
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: I'll leave that one alone.
• 15:17
  Speaker 4: Trades their captain.
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: So you're saying, Simeon over Seeger is the captain of
• 15:24
  Speaker 3: that team.
• 15:25
  Speaker 6: I think that's basically he was the captain there. Okay,
• 15:30
  Speaker 6: So it's kind of it makes me kind of if
• 15:32
  Speaker 6: I was putting the trade together, I would ask that GM,
• 15:36
  Speaker 6: why would you trade the captain of your team? Is
• 15:38
  Speaker 6: there something else going on here? I don't know, I
• 15:40
  Speaker 6: don't know. That's just my suspicions. You know, those calls
• 15:43
  Speaker 6: are made a lot, and I'm sure that sometimes there
• 15:46
  Speaker 6: is no reason. It's just change the scenery. They need
• 15:49
  Speaker 6: an outfielder, they need a second basement. I'm not sure
• 15:52
  Speaker 6: you know what the all the second base and what
• 15:54
  Speaker 6: what that does to Jeff McNeil. You know, I don't
• 15:56
  Speaker 6: know if they're trying to trade him or not. Jeff
• 15:59
  Speaker 6: can play a lot of places. He's a Swiss army knife.
• 16:03
  Speaker 6: He's a useful piece.
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: Hey, while we're on the transaction front, and I heard
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: you jumping in for a moment earlier before we interrupted
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: you back, But did you come across Cedric Mullins.
• 16:17
  Speaker 6: Oh yeah, Cedric, I'll tell you my Cedric story. So
• 16:20
  Speaker 6: we're in spring training. You now, you go on the
• 16:21
  Speaker 6: road and you take all the jicks. Those are the
• 16:24
  Speaker 6: justin case guys and the backups and or they play.
• 16:27
  Speaker 6: And I kept getting this not a very good grade
• 16:30
  Speaker 6: of player, and they were kind of, I don't know,
• 16:33
  Speaker 6: flat line, nothing exciting by him.
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: So I'd call the farm Dirrect.
• 16:36
  Speaker 6: I said, hey, can we get somebody's got some life
• 16:38
  Speaker 6: in their body that might you know, you know, wants
• 16:41
  Speaker 6: to be here and wants to play and wants to
• 16:44
  Speaker 6: He goes, yeah, yeah, he says, I'll send this guy
• 16:46
  Speaker 6: over names Cedric Mullins. Not many people think he's a
• 16:48
  Speaker 6: real prospect. He's a little diminutive guy. And so he
• 16:51
  Speaker 6: walks into Pirate City in Bradenton, and this guy has
• 16:55
  Speaker 6: a game.
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: And we're all looking around, going where's this guy? Ben?
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: We're going, Yeah, he was switched hitting back.
• 17:01
  Speaker 4: Then.
• 17:02
  Speaker 6: The thing that I like about Tampa they hardly ever
• 17:04
  Speaker 6: acquire a player that's not a plus defender, and Cedric
• 17:07
  Speaker 6: can play all three. He's he's going to be a
• 17:10
  Speaker 6: nice fit there for him. Turf will work good for him.
• 17:13
  Speaker 6: And h what a great kid too. He's thirty. I
• 17:16
  Speaker 6: think he's going to play a thirty one. He's got
• 17:18
  Speaker 6: some skills left, great body. I used to call him
• 17:21
  Speaker 6: the toy cannon. But I remember the first time I
• 17:23
  Speaker 6: saw him at Parts sitting and I looked around and said,
• 17:25
  Speaker 6: what are we missing here? Is this guy, you know,
• 17:28
  Speaker 6: done something to the owner or something along the way?
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: What are we missing?
• 17:34
  Speaker 5: Is he turned out to be He's had a heck
• 17:36
  Speaker 5: of a career and he just made seven million dollars.
• 17:38
  Speaker 5: So somebody got something wrong or something right, depending on
• 17:40
  Speaker 5: who you ask. Before we get into all the managers,
• 17:44
  Speaker 5: Tony Vaytela in San Francisco, Do Terra in Washington.
• 17:48
  Speaker 4: That's younger than your grandchildren. Buck?
• 17:50
  Speaker 5: At this point, how important is it for I don't know,
• 17:53
  Speaker 5: It's got to be close, right.
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: No, I got my oldest grandson is eight.
• 18:00
  Speaker 7: His children not grand children.
• 18:02
  Speaker 5: But I forgot how Buck. I forgot how old Buck is?
• 18:04
  Speaker 5: His hair got me off. And then him driving around
• 18:07
  Speaker 5: this talk in the horn here I got confused. So Buck,
• 18:11
  Speaker 5: what I want to know is these managers? How important
• 18:14
  Speaker 5: is the bench coach and the pitching coach? And I
• 18:17
  Speaker 5: don't want to say hitting coach because hitting coach is
• 18:19
  Speaker 5: kind of on his own island, But the manager and
• 18:21
  Speaker 5: the pitching coach and the bench coach are kind of
• 18:23
  Speaker 5: like the trifecta and then in the dugout right, So
• 18:27
  Speaker 5: how important of a hire is it for a manager
• 18:30
  Speaker 5: to hire the right bench coach and have the right
• 18:32
  Speaker 5: pitching coach with him?
• 18:33
  Speaker 6: I think I think kind of manters aj who the
• 18:35
  Speaker 6: manager is, Like you think Bruce Bochi is a big deal.
• 18:38
  Speaker 6: Who the bench coach is? You think, uh, you know,
• 18:41
  Speaker 6: Tito Francona's a big deal. Who the bench coaches depends
• 18:43
  Speaker 6: on what that job description is.
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 18:45
  Speaker 6: I was lucky to have John Russell and Baltimore as
• 18:48
  Speaker 6: good as it. Guess he had managed before, but he
• 18:51
  Speaker 6: you know, he was solid. You know, it depends on
• 18:53
  Speaker 6: how you choose to use them. But you're right. The
• 18:55
  Speaker 6: h the hitting coach now, I mean, heck, they barely
• 18:58
  Speaker 6: hit outside anymore after four o'clock. But if you look
• 19:03
  Speaker 6: at the Angels, that are really interesting to me. They've
• 19:06
  Speaker 6: hired Mike Maddock since their pitching coach. They hired Brady
• 19:09
  Speaker 6: Anderson as a hitting coach, and they hired John Gibbons
• 19:12
  Speaker 6: as a bench coach. And Kurt Suzuki, quite frankly, has
• 19:15
  Speaker 6: played a lot of baseball. The only thing not on
• 19:17
  Speaker 6: his resume is having managed a lot, and you know
• 19:20
  Speaker 6: that's not you know, I'm sure John can help him
• 19:23
  Speaker 6: wrong and if you're open to those things, you know,
• 19:26
  Speaker 6: I'm not sure about Tony's staff. Somebody said they hired
• 19:28
  Speaker 6: wash today Ron Washington. Have you guys heard that? In
• 19:32
  Speaker 6: San Francisco? They'd be a good hire. But you know
• 19:37
  Speaker 6: those guys, you know, it's gonna be interesting to see
• 19:41
  Speaker 6: how that dynamic works out, especially with San Francisco. You know,
• 19:45
  Speaker 6: that's a different gig than the one he came from. Completely,
• 19:49
  Speaker 6: but Tony's a smart guy, and I don't think he'll
• 19:53
  Speaker 6: let his ego get in the way of reaching out
• 19:55
  Speaker 6: for help when he needs it.
• 19:58
  Speaker 4: Did you ever think you would see today when you
• 20:00
  Speaker 4: would see a college head coach jumped straight to the
• 20:04
  Speaker 4: big leagues, not to pro ball, straight to the big leagues?
• 20:08
  Speaker 4: Think about the time. I mean, I want you to
• 20:10
  Speaker 4: go back through your time of like working for George
• 20:15
  Speaker 4: coming into Baltimore when they needed to like rebuild it
• 20:18
  Speaker 4: to what you what you guys build it up to. Like,
• 20:21
  Speaker 4: did you ever think you would see this?
• 20:25
  Speaker 6: You know, I'm one of those that doesn't confuse change
• 20:27
  Speaker 6: with a lack of respect for tradition. You know, they think,
• 20:31
  Speaker 6: you know, I remember I first started managing Yankees. I
• 20:33
  Speaker 6: was thirty five, thirty six, and you know, I immediately
• 20:36
  Speaker 6: surrounded myself with Cleete Barrier and Frank Howard and Willie
• 20:39
  Speaker 6: Randolph and you know, and I had Don Mattingly on
• 20:42
  Speaker 6: the team, who you know, was a real strong ally
• 20:46
  Speaker 6: for me in the clubhouse, and you know, and we
• 20:49
  Speaker 6: started winning more. That really helps. Okay, your words are
• 20:52
  Speaker 6: gonna get hollow if you don't if it doesn't start
• 20:54
  Speaker 6: showing up on the scoreboard and standings and doesn't help
• 20:57
  Speaker 6: their career. But I'm not one of those those that
• 21:00
  Speaker 6: fights the convinctionality. I mean, it come in all shapes
• 21:03
  Speaker 6: and sizes, and I want to say baseball is baseball,
• 21:08
  Speaker 6: but the college game is different. You know, you play
• 21:10
  Speaker 6: your weekend series Friday, Saturday, Sunday. The bullpen management's different,
• 21:15
  Speaker 6: the rotation management's different, the way you acquire players is different.
• 21:20
  Speaker 6: You're playing almost two hundred games counting spring train as
• 21:23
  Speaker 6: opposed to fifty or sixty in college. But it's nothing
• 21:27
  Speaker 6: that you can't make adjustment to. I'm pulling for them.
• 21:30
  Speaker 6: You know, life's too short. Everybody looks at this convention,
• 21:33
  Speaker 6: this is the way it happened, this is the way
• 21:35
  Speaker 6: it's supposed to happen. Well, let's just see how it
• 21:37
  Speaker 6: works out. Maybe, you know, maybe changes the way we
• 21:42
  Speaker 6: look at them. The experience factor is something that's going
• 21:45
  Speaker 6: to have to move. And I think the biggest thing
• 21:47
  Speaker 6: that people miss is that gms that are hiring these
• 21:51
  Speaker 6: guys are completely different than the gms I came up with.
• 21:54
  Speaker 6: Doesn't mean it's good or bad, it's just they're looking
• 21:57
  Speaker 6: for a different type of guy that's not gonna rock
• 22:01
  Speaker 6: the boat. But basically be a liaison down in the clubhouse.
• 22:05
  Speaker 6: You know, the collaboration of picking players doesn't really happen anymore.
• 22:11
  Speaker 4: All right, Well, let's go to Washington. Let's go to
• 22:15
  Speaker 4: but Terra. You said you were thirty six when you
• 22:18
  Speaker 4: became the Yankees.
• 22:19
  Speaker 6: Thirty five or thirty it was the off season. I
• 22:22
  Speaker 6: think I was thirty five in the off season.
• 22:25
  Speaker 4: What is a young manager like Buttera going to face
• 22:29
  Speaker 4: not even talking about any kind of chops like he
• 22:31
  Speaker 4: hasn't he has a young GM. It's it's a lot
• 22:34
  Speaker 4: of think think alike. But what's he going to face there?
• 22:38
  Speaker 4: And how is that inexperience in the big leagues alone?
• 22:43
  Speaker 4: And his age being younger than you were when you
• 22:46
  Speaker 4: first started managing the Yankees.
• 22:49
  Speaker 6: Not as much as you may think, Not as much
• 22:51
  Speaker 6: as you may think. You know, I didn't play in
• 22:52
  Speaker 6: the big league. I played in Triple A, and you know,
• 22:55
  Speaker 6: and a lot of time in Double A. And so
• 22:57
  Speaker 6: I had to, you know, keep your nose down, and
• 23:00
  Speaker 6: I had to out figure out what I could do
• 23:03
  Speaker 6: that other I could out work, I could out relationship,
• 23:06
  Speaker 6: I could out you know, know the game within the game,
• 23:09
  Speaker 6: know our players, know the background. You know whatever, and
• 23:13
  Speaker 6: there are ways to make up. I don't think it's
• 23:15
  Speaker 6: as big as it used to be where people. I
• 23:18
  Speaker 6: think because the people that cover the game day, the
• 23:21
  Speaker 6: day to day guys are kind of like that, some
• 23:25
  Speaker 6: of the people that are being hired, and I think
• 23:28
  Speaker 6: down deep, it shows that they like something new and unconventional.
• 23:32
  Speaker 6: It makes easier to write. You know, people ask me
• 23:34
  Speaker 6: what's changed the most. What's changed the most is the
• 23:37
  Speaker 6: people that cover the game, the more modern people they
• 23:41
  Speaker 6: I was always surprised after games guys about what they
• 23:44
  Speaker 6: didn't ask me, not what they asked me. I would
• 23:46
  Speaker 6: go because you know, they have different requirements. Now they're
• 23:49
  Speaker 6: up in the press box, you know, tweeting and typing
• 23:52
  Speaker 6: and the game and different thoughts, and they're not really
• 23:54
  Speaker 6: watching the game. So they missed something that happened in
• 23:57
  Speaker 6: the third ending that really decided the game. And I
• 23:59
  Speaker 6: can't times I left, I go wow to the PR director,
• 24:02
  Speaker 6: I can't believe they didn't ask that. So the way
• 24:04
  Speaker 6: the game's covered I think gives these guys a better chance.
• 24:09
  Speaker 4: That's fair, that's fair.
• 24:11
  Speaker 5: You did say something though, that I found interesting when
• 24:13
  Speaker 5: you said the back and forth between the GM and
• 24:16
  Speaker 5: the manager and picking players has changed. We'll explain that
• 24:19
  Speaker 5: because I always said, listen, when I first came up,
• 24:22
  Speaker 5: and that was nineteen ninety eight, Tom Kelly was our manager.
• 24:24
  Speaker 4: Terry Ryan was our GM.
• 24:26
  Speaker 5: Terry Ryan didn't really have a lot. It was it
• 24:30
  Speaker 5: was Tom Kelly liked you. Tom Kelly didn't like If
• 24:32
  Speaker 5: he didn't like you, you were out. Like there was
• 24:35
  Speaker 5: no Terry Ryan going to him and saying, I don't
• 24:37
  Speaker 5: care what you say, Tom like.
• 24:38
  Speaker 4: I like this kid.
• 24:38
  Speaker 5: He's got a chance to be a really good player. No, no, no,
• 24:41
  Speaker 5: TK was out on you.
• 24:43
  Speaker 4: You were out.
• 24:43
  Speaker 5: Nowadays that it seems like it's almost the other way.
• 24:47
  Speaker 5: The GM's going say, hey, Buck, here's your players. Make
• 24:50
  Speaker 5: him work right, And it used to be the other way.
• 24:52
  Speaker 5: So explain how that has changed and why it's changed.
• 24:55
  Speaker 6: Well, you know, along that subject, and when I see
• 24:58
  Speaker 6: guys giving up coaches, Hey, the manager is coming back,
• 25:01
  Speaker 6: but four or five coaches aren't coming back. That's why
• 25:04
  Speaker 6: I left the Yankees years ago, because I knew the
• 25:07
  Speaker 6: respect I would have in the clubhouse is gone. All
• 25:09
  Speaker 6: the things I asked them to believe in. So it
• 25:11
  Speaker 6: still drives me crazy when I see a manager go, Okay,
• 25:14
  Speaker 6: take my pitching coach, take my hitting coach, take my
• 25:16
  Speaker 6: third base coach. But as long as I'm still here,
• 25:19
  Speaker 6: I don't know how. I don't know how you get
• 25:21
  Speaker 6: through that. So when you start giving people up your
• 25:26
  Speaker 6: credibility in the clubhouse, hey guys, I'm going to be
• 25:29
  Speaker 6: there for you wit a minute. You weren't there for
• 25:31
  Speaker 6: that pitching coach that you said was the greatest thing ever.
• 25:35
  Speaker 6: So I think the collaboration. When the players know that
• 25:40
  Speaker 6: the manager and the coaches have no input on player evaluation,
• 25:47
  Speaker 6: it makes for a different mindset in a clubhouse. And
• 25:50
  Speaker 6: I think that's what a lot of front officers don't realize.
• 25:53
  Speaker 6: When the players know that that Tom Kelly has no
• 25:56
  Speaker 6: input at all on their future, there's a different dynamic
• 26:00
  Speaker 6: making your clubhouse.
• 26:01
  Speaker 5: Yeah, Tom Kelly, when he finally did get LEGO, the
• 26:04
  Speaker 5: Twins came to him and said, hey, do you want
• 26:06
  Speaker 5: to get rid of your pitching coach His name was
• 26:08
  Speaker 5: Dick Sutch And He's like, no.
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: It's either both of us or none of us.
• 26:13
  Speaker 5: And they said well, and then so Tom Kelly obviously resigned, retired,
• 26:17
  Speaker 5: whatever you want to call it. He still work for
• 26:18
  Speaker 5: the organization, but he would go down with it.
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: I had Brian Butterfield, Mark Connor. I can go right
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: down the list.
• 26:26
  Speaker 6: Willie rant them people they wanted and I said no,
• 26:29
  Speaker 6: and mister Steinbrenner. Next thing I know, I was head
• 26:32
  Speaker 6: of Dara's own.
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: Hey, you know, all.
• 26:38
  Speaker 6: These things you preach to the players, then all of
• 26:40
  Speaker 6: a sudden, when you give up people, your words are hollow.
• 26:44
  Speaker 6: You can't go in the clubhouse and think you're going
• 26:46
  Speaker 6: to get that same respect.
• 26:50
  Speaker 7: It's good stuff, Hey, Buck, I want to finish with this.
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: So Sunday night they do the voting in the announcement
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: for who makes the Hall of Fame from the Contemporary Committee.
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: I don't know if he saw I'm nervous. I'm nervous, nervous.
• 27:04
  Speaker 7: Are you okay? Talk to me. You're on the you're
• 27:07
  Speaker 7: on the chair, talk to me. What are you nervous about?
• 27:09
  Speaker 2: For Donnie? Is that the guy? I think this is
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: Donnie's best shot. I do.
• 27:14
  Speaker 6: And there's got to be a wing for Hall of
• 27:16
  Speaker 6: Fame people. You know, it was so important for people,
• 27:20
  Speaker 6: his teammates. He made his teammates so much better. And
• 27:24
  Speaker 6: I don't know, you know, if his back had been. Okay,
• 27:26
  Speaker 6: you can say about a lot of people. He and
• 27:28
  Speaker 6: Del Murphy have my attention in this group. I mean,
• 27:30
  Speaker 6: what do you guys think?
• 27:32
  Speaker 4: I agree, I listen, I agree.
• 27:34
  Speaker 5: I mean and and by the way, I'm going to
• 27:36
  Speaker 5: say this too, Del Murphy is my favorite player growing up.
• 27:40
  Speaker 5: Maddingly is one of the favorite, my favorite people I've
• 27:42
  Speaker 5: ever met in baseball.
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: Why but why why?
• 27:46
  Speaker 5: Because they're just awesome people to talk to, and they're
• 27:49
  Speaker 5: they literally would give you your their shirt off your back,
• 27:52
  Speaker 5: and they're just they were not unbelievable players first of all,
• 27:55
  Speaker 5: but then when you talk to him, you're just like
• 27:57
  Speaker 5: this guy, I mean, Del Murphy. Listen as a Braves
• 27:59
  Speaker 5: fan growing up, Dale Murphy two MVPs back to back
• 28:02
  Speaker 5: MVPs took the worst teams I've ever seen and carried
• 28:05
  Speaker 5: him for years, actually got into the playoffs, which is unbelievable.
• 28:08
  Speaker 5: I mean, I don't know how, you know, four hundred
• 28:09
  Speaker 5: plus home I just don't understand how you he's not
• 28:13
  Speaker 5: in But and Maddingly, everything he went through in New York,
• 28:16
  Speaker 5: all the stuff with George and all whatever you want
• 28:18
  Speaker 5: to say, in the years he put together, he.
• 28:21
  Speaker 4: Should be in the Hall of fame.
• 28:22
  Speaker 5: But the problem I have but is also as someone
• 28:25
  Speaker 5: that played against Barry and Clemens and those guys, I
• 28:28
  Speaker 5: think they should be in too. I'm sorry I draw
• 28:31
  Speaker 5: the line of steroid use at two thousand and five.
• 28:37
  Speaker 5: If you got caught after two thousand and five, when
• 28:39
  Speaker 5: they told you he's stupid, you can't, you can't do this,
• 28:43
  Speaker 5: then you're out. I don't care who you are. Alex
• 28:45
  Speaker 5: Rodriguez out, Manny Ramirez out. All these got RAFFI pal Merrow,
• 28:49
  Speaker 5: I don't know. If you were there, then out right.
• 28:51
  Speaker 5: You got caught after they said don't do this. If
• 28:54
  Speaker 5: there's allegations of you before that, fine, you're you're fine
• 28:58
  Speaker 5: because that wasn't against the rules of baseball. It was
• 29:01
  Speaker 5: against the law, but it wasn't against the rules of baseball.
• 29:04
  Speaker 5: And trust me, we all know buck people have done
• 29:06
  Speaker 5: other things that are against the law, but not against.
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: I like that. I like that. That's a great point,
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: so to me.
• 29:13
  Speaker 5: I mean, I think that that Mattingly and Murphy should
• 29:16
  Speaker 5: have been in a long time ago. But then I
• 29:17
  Speaker 5: think Clemens and Bonds and that crew should also be in.
• 29:20
  Speaker 5: So I think there's a lot of guys on this ballot.
• 29:22
  Speaker 4: That's why this ballot to.
• 29:23
  Speaker 5: Me, when I look at it, I'm like, Damn, I
• 29:25
  Speaker 5: can make a case for all ten of these people to.
• 29:27
  Speaker 6: Get in exactly, exactly exactly. You know, I always described
• 29:32
  Speaker 6: Donnie and I think you could say Murphy too. I
• 29:35
  Speaker 6: think they were very stylish players, and they go what
• 29:38
  Speaker 6: I go, Yeah, their substance was their style. You know,
• 29:42
  Speaker 6: Donnie hit a home run and it's like he had
• 29:44
  Speaker 6: done it before and by the grace of God, he
• 29:46
  Speaker 6: might again. To you know, my top three moments in
• 29:49
  Speaker 6: my whole career was when Donnie got announced in ninety
• 29:52
  Speaker 6: five playoffs. But the home run he hit off Andy
• 29:55
  Speaker 6: Bennis when it left the infield, I went, oh my god.
• 29:58
  Speaker 6: People think I got out of the dug out to
• 30:00
  Speaker 6: greet him. I got out so the I thought the
• 30:03
  Speaker 6: roof was coming down. Those old cinder blocks were shaking.
• 30:06
  Speaker 6: I'd never heard of place that loud in my life,
• 30:08
  Speaker 6: and I'm going, oh my god. We had to stopped
• 30:10
  Speaker 6: the game. Lupenella pulled his team off the field. A
• 30:13
  Speaker 6: lot of people forget that, but Donnie having those moments
• 30:16
  Speaker 6: and his substance was in style. I said that about
• 30:20
  Speaker 6: Jeter two one time. And that's what you know, they
• 30:23
  Speaker 6: didn't have any of this. Look at me, everybody, let
• 30:26
  Speaker 6: me do something that draws your attention to me. You
• 30:28
  Speaker 6: know what drew your attention is just how good he was.
• 30:31
  Speaker 6: I was telling my grandson about it the other day,
• 30:34
  Speaker 6: after he scored and went through all these gyrations. I said, congratulations,
• 30:39
  Speaker 6: the first one you've ever scored, and he goes, well,
• 30:41
  Speaker 6: that's not the first one. I said, it sure looked
• 30:43
  Speaker 6: like it.
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: Last one real quick. But did you talk to Donnie?
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: Did you talk to him leading up to this?
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: And is he nervous too? Is he one of those
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: guys where he's like, no, Donnie, No?
• 30:57
  Speaker 6: You know, I think Donnie's son is like ten or
• 30:59
  Speaker 6: eleven out. He's got four boys, I think, but he, uh,
• 31:04
  Speaker 6: Donny's maybe he's just not letting on. I don't know
• 31:10
  Speaker 6: because I played with him. Remember the first time I
• 31:12
  Speaker 6: saw him, this long, skinny neck guy that hit six
• 31:14
  Speaker 6: or seven home runs, And you know, I was a
• 31:17
  Speaker 6: jerk to him. He was playing my position. After watching
• 31:19
  Speaker 6: him play for a month, I went, Okay, you better
• 31:21
  Speaker 6: find another line of workers. You're not gonna you know,
• 31:24
  Speaker 6: he's ahead of you, and you ain't catching up with him.
• 31:26
  Speaker 6: He could filey a ball as good as anybody aja
• 31:29
  Speaker 6: needed a hit. He could he could duck fart a
• 31:32
  Speaker 6: ball to left anytime he wanted to.
• 31:35
  Speaker 4: As a proud duck farter buck. I love that skill. Long.
• 31:40
  Speaker 5: That's a long lost art, the old duck fart to
• 31:42
  Speaker 5: the left field over the shortstop, said the magic wand Buck.
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: You know, Eric, you never had one of those two, right, But.
• 31:51
  Speaker 4: What's what sucks about a duck fart? Hit?
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: Nothing?
• 31:55
  Speaker 4: Absolutely nothing?
• 31:57
  Speaker 6: You ever ever hit one that you're trying to pull
• 32:00
  Speaker 6: and it goes this way, and you you try not
• 32:03
  Speaker 6: to act like it was a complete luck. So instead
• 32:06
  Speaker 6: of you try not to look for the ball because
• 32:08
  Speaker 6: you're looking to left and it's over here to right.
• 32:11
  Speaker 6: That's quite a skill to make everybody think that you
• 32:14
  Speaker 6: meant to do that.
• 32:18
  Speaker 4: It's hard to get.
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: Oh god, I they used to call it the show
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: Walter corner. I could.
• 32:28
  Speaker 6: I could right over the third baseman's head for a
• 32:31
  Speaker 6: two bagger boys, and I was a left handed hitter.
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: I missed those two. They don't pay for those anymore.
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: But that's another story. We can get into that next time.
• 32:42
  Speaker 6: By the way, the next time you guys are talking
• 32:44
  Speaker 6: about defense, they still haven't figured out how to if
• 32:47
  Speaker 6: you want to, if you want to create a niche
• 32:49
  Speaker 6: in baseball, if you got together a bunch of people
• 32:53
  Speaker 6: evaluating defense is still you can't do it analytically.
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: You got an eyeball them and you got to talk
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: to people.
• 33:01
  Speaker 6: And I look at some people that are in finalists
• 33:04
  Speaker 6: for Gold Glove, and I go, are you kidding me?
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: Who is making this list out?
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: That's different? Here's my thing real quick. I'm going to
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: come back at you for this book number one. I
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: think the metrics are better than what they used to be, right,
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: just going off like fielding percentage or something like that. Right,
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: So they're better.
• 33:22
  Speaker 7: I agree with you. There's a long way to go.
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: And sometimes you look at a metric for someone who
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: you're like, what. But here's the other part. The awards
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: are screwed. They are so screwed up right now, and
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: they're not a lot of it's not necessarily based on metrics.
• 33:33
  Speaker 7: Some of it's like one of them has like fan voting.
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: It's it's a ridiculous situation that needs to be fixed.
• 33:40
  Speaker 7: Yeah, fan vote?
• 33:43
  Speaker 4: How was cal Ray not like he was?
• 33:46
  Speaker 5: He won the platinum glove and he was better he
• 33:48
  Speaker 5: had but he had zero pass ball zero and thirty games.
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: That's almost how about that. I know that one.
• 34:00
  Speaker 5: Throwing split after split after split, and he had That's
• 34:03
  Speaker 5: why he got danged.
• 34:05
  Speaker 4: That's why he got dinged because he went down and
• 34:09
  Speaker 4: his blocking and his his blocking went down. He saw
• 34:14
  Speaker 4: the most balls in the dirt over I think it
• 34:17
  Speaker 4: was eighty eight miles an hour of any catcher. So
• 34:20
  Speaker 4: all his numbers went down. That's why.
• 34:24
  Speaker 6: And I'll take him. I'll take him. All those numbers
• 34:28
  Speaker 6: going down, I'll take him. I'll signed me up. Okay,
• 34:31
  Speaker 6: and number two Like like you guys, I think you said,
• 34:34
  Speaker 6: uh Scott, that that arm strength Cedric Mullens has an
• 34:39
  Speaker 6: average arm. No he doesn't. No, he doesn't trust me.
• 34:42
  Speaker 6: He doesn't have an average arm. I'm not gonna say
• 34:46
  Speaker 6: it's an above average arm, below average arm under just
• 34:48
  Speaker 6: telling you it's the average in the major leagues. But
• 34:51
  Speaker 6: like arm strength, do not tell me about arm strength
• 34:54
  Speaker 6: just because what velocity they're throwing the baseball at. You know,
• 34:58
  Speaker 6: it's so much more than that. So to properly evaluate defense,
• 35:02
  Speaker 6: you've really got to have some people with trained eyes
• 35:06
  Speaker 6: and boots on the ground that know what they're looking at,
• 35:08
  Speaker 6: and how does it actually play in a game? You know,
• 35:12
  Speaker 6: how do they evaluate who can turn the double play
• 35:14
  Speaker 6: the best? Not by the number of double plays they turn.
• 35:18
  Speaker 6: You know, maybe they're playing with a team that doesn't
• 35:19
  Speaker 6: throw any ground balls. You know, how do you how
• 35:22
  Speaker 6: do you decide what a great tag or somebody?
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: If J. J.
• 35:24
  Speaker 6: Hardy was the greatest tagger I ever saw, but they
• 35:26
  Speaker 6: never gave him any points for that? How about fly
• 35:30
  Speaker 6: balls in the range? On fly balls for infielders or catchers.
• 35:34
  Speaker 6: There's so many variables to this to defense that they
• 35:37
  Speaker 6: miss out on. Okay, I'm done, thanks for letting me go, but.
• 35:41
  Speaker 7: Your spot on on that, we have a long ways
• 35:44
  Speaker 7: to go.
• 35:45
  Speaker 5: Here's the thing, Buck, Cedric Mullins might not have the
• 35:47
  Speaker 5: greatest arm in the world, but you know what he
• 35:49
  Speaker 5: does better than most outfielders. As soon as the ball's hit,
• 35:51
  Speaker 5: he comes and gets it right. So what as a
• 35:54
  Speaker 5: third base coach? What shuts you down first? How fast
• 35:57
  Speaker 5: the guy's coming in to get it.
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a great point.
• 36:01
  Speaker 6: I coached third base and the rule of thumb was
• 36:04
  Speaker 6: if the if the runner is in front of the bag.
• 36:06
  Speaker 6: When the player corrals the ball, secures the ball, you
• 36:09
  Speaker 6: stop him. If he's past it, you send him. And
• 36:11
  Speaker 6: if he's on the bag, you got to make a decision.
• 36:14
  Speaker 6: If it's Simon Tank. But the I use to tell
• 36:16
  Speaker 6: the guys, if you guys will come get the ball.
• 36:18
  Speaker 6: You can have a thirty arm, you can have a
• 36:20
  Speaker 6: blowy average arm, but if you come get the ball,
• 36:22
  Speaker 6: you will shut some of these guys down that should
• 36:25
  Speaker 6: be sent. That's a great point.
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: Aj I love it well, Buck, this was a pleasure
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: as always. Good luck to your buddy Donnie Umbroton for
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: him two on Sunday, and we'll talk to you soon.
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: Okay, all right, thanks you guys, thanks for having me.
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: Take care. Thank you got the basketball.