Latest / Virtuous Leaders with Dr. Johann D'Souza / Ep.75 – Eric Cook: Reclaiming Virtuous Education Against Modern Chaos | Classical Christian Schools | Parenting | Virtue Formation | Conservative Values

Transcript

Ep.75 – Eric Cook: Reclaiming Virtuous Education Against Modern Chaos | Classical Christian Schools | Parenting | Virtue Formation | Conservative Values · Virtuous Leaders with Dr. Johann D'Souza

• 0:00
  So we're working on a fundraising project of $60
• 0:02
  million so that we can invest in the growth of new classical
• 0:07
  Christian schools. So we'll take an established
• 0:10
  school who has proven model, who has a strong governance and they
• 0:14
  have strong leadership, and then help them build a team and start
• 0:18
  planting schools in their area. 681012 more.
• 0:27
  So you're the president of the Society for Classical Learning.
• 0:30
  What do you do as president? So my responsibility is to
• 0:35
  oversee the execution of the organization's mission.
• 0:39
  So that means that I'm ensuring that every everything internally
• 0:45
  is geared around fostering and flourishing by making classical
• 0:48
  Christian education thrive. So setting vision and trajectory
• 0:52
  for the organization, our strategic goals, leading our our
• 0:55
  team, making sure that all the resources are allocated in a way
• 0:59
  that is executing those TG priorities.
• 1:03
  A lot of what I'm doing right now is fundraising was a big
• 1:06
  responsibility to have and that a big portion of it is also
• 1:09
  leading up with our board. So those are the primary
• 1:13
  responsibilities that I'm responsible for.
• 1:17
  What would impact would you say that your society is having?
• 1:21
  Well, so you know, we have these three strategic modes of
• 1:25
  engagement and one of those, the first one is institution
• 1:28
  building. So what what we want to do is
• 1:30
  there's over 1000 classical Christian schools in the
• 1:32
  country. And what we want to do is ensure
• 1:35
  that each one of those schools is going to be healthy, thriving
• 1:40
  and enduring for generations. So we've created a framework for
• 1:46
  a thriving classical Christian School that's put together in
• 1:49
  our Accrelation standards and indicators.
• 1:52
  And then we provide a bunch of support resources that helps
• 1:56
  each one of these schools reach their own aspirations of vision
• 2:00
  to become a thriving classical Christian School.
• 2:03
  So that looks like leadership coaching and training, teacher
• 2:07
  training, resources for convening, you know, consulting,
• 2:12
  working with boards. We have these playbooks that go
• 2:15
  along with each standard that gives them best practices so
• 2:20
  that they have everything that they need to become the best
• 2:23
  version of themselves that they can.
• 2:25
  So that's Part 1. I think we're growing in our
• 2:28
  effectiveness and doing that. We we've had accreditation now
• 2:30
  this we're going into our second year and the feedback we've had
• 2:34
  on that is, is pretty remarkable.
• 2:35
  I think it is a true catalyst for schools becoming much better
• 2:41
  at what they do. The second category of of things
• 2:44
  that we're doing is what we call a growth engine.
• 2:47
  And what we want to do is greatly expand the reach and
• 2:51
  access of classical Christian education to more and more
• 2:54
  families across the country. So we're working on a
• 2:58
  fundraising project of $60 million so that we can invest in
• 3:03
  the growth of new classical Christian schools.
• 3:05
  So we'll take an established school who has proven model, who
• 3:11
  has a strong governance and they have strong leadership and then
• 3:15
  help them build a team and start planting schools in their area.
• 3:19
  681012 more. So that's a long term vision.
• 3:23
  It's about 200 schools, 100,000 students, and we're just getting
• 3:27
  underway with that project. And then the third category is
• 3:32
  around what we call culture maker.
• 3:34
  So what we believe is that what makes for a great classical
• 3:37
  Christian education and forming young people also are the seeds
• 3:41
  of cultural renewal in the things that make for him to
• 3:44
  flourishing. So we want to continue to
• 3:47
  advocate for those partnering with others, articulate those
• 3:49
  ideas and and hopefully not only just push for education reform,
• 3:54
  but for the ideas that make for a a flourishing civilization.
• 3:58
  Let's see if I understand this correctly.
• 4:00
  Correct me if I'm wrong. So your organization is outside
• 4:04
  of the classical Christian schools, but you you help them
• 4:07
  externally to be able to carry out their own individual
• 4:10
  missions. That's correct.
• 4:12
  So we're a membership organization.
• 4:15
  We have you know, number of schools in our network who are
• 4:18
  paying dues and resources and membership fees to be part of
• 4:21
  this network. And then we're helping them
• 4:24
  support them in, in executing their mission, OK.
• 4:26
  So it's kind of like an external consultant that they pay for.
• 4:29
  Yes, yeah. OK, excellent.
• 4:32
  What? What was the genesis of this
• 4:33
  organization, Your organization? Yeah.
• 4:35
  So when with the classical Christian School started to grow
• 4:39
  in the 90s, there were a couple of different groups that emerged
• 4:44
  for this very purpose of helping them, you know, get supportive
• 4:47
  resources to do what they do better.
• 4:49
  So there was one in Idaho that emerged called the Association
• 4:52
  of Classical and Christian Schools.
• 4:54
  And there's one on the East Coast called the was that became
• 4:57
  SCL, what was originally called the East Coast Consortium of
• 5:00
  Classical Christian Schools, but not a great name.
• 5:03
  So we changed that to Society of Classical Learning.
• 5:06
  So what we did originally was bring people together, have a
• 5:09
  conference, help figure out how to do this model of education,
• 5:13
  which was largely new to many of us on the front end.
• 5:17
  And over time, it grew into a much larger organization and
• 5:22
  serving a broader set of needs within the movement.
• 5:26
  OK. What would you say are the most
• 5:28
  successful classical Christian schools right now?
• 5:32
  Well, I mean, I could name specific schools.
• 5:35
  I can tell you, I don't know if we do that necessarily, but the
• 5:38
  there are schools that I think are doing some core things
• 5:42
  really well that make them in this category where we deem
• 5:46
  thriving that that's the term that we've chosen to use that
• 5:50
  categorize them. One is they have absolute
• 5:52
  clarity in their mission. They know why they exist and
• 5:56
  they Orient all of the resources around doing that very clear
• 6:01
  mission to all of them have really great leadership from the
• 6:06
  very top, both at the board level and at the executive
• 6:08
  leadership level. So that's a really challenging
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  part of of the movement as a whole right now is finding
• 6:15
  really capable and qualified leaders for these key positions
• 6:18
  within schools. But it makes all the difference
• 6:21
  within an institution for them to be effective and stewarding
• 6:25
  the resources well and making sure that they're doing what
• 6:29
  they exist to do. I think, you know, then what
• 6:34
  trickles down from that from a leadership perspective is the
• 6:37
  kind of people they hire to be in the classroom every day.
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  Because at the end of the day in the school, the teacher is the
• 6:42
  most important, you know, personally, the school, they
• 6:46
  have to be able to embody the ideals that you're trying to
• 6:48
  teach. And that's going to be the place
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  where all of the, the things that are most important in the
• 6:54
  life of the school have. And if you have strong
• 6:56
  leadership, you'll find great teachers and you'll be able to
• 7:00
  recruit them effectively into your organization.
• 7:04
  I also think that, you know, because schools are communities,
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  the best of our schools within the movement are really dynamic
• 7:12
  in partnering with families and situating their school within
• 7:16
  the broader local community that they exist in.
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  So having clarity about roles, about what parents are are
• 7:23
  doing, inviting donors to be able to advance the mission of
• 7:26
  the school, seeing themselves as a participant in the flourishing
• 7:31
  of the communities that they're in.
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  The schools that are doing really well, I think have
• 7:36
  invested deeply in that part of their institution.
• 7:39
  So if an individual is looking to be an administrator or
• 7:43
  leadership take leadership position at A at a school, they
• 7:47
  would contact y'all and y'all can help facilitate matching
• 7:50
  them with a good school. Yeah.
• 7:52
  So we have on our site that as part of the membership, people
• 7:55
  can post jobs. And there's a lot of that sort
• 7:57
  of matchmaking that that happens on, on our site.
• 8:00
  You'll have people who are looking for jobs and people are
• 8:02
  looking for candidates. And so some of that happens, but
• 8:05
  we also have people who contact us and say, hey, look, I'm
• 8:08
  really interested in becoming a head of school.
• 8:11
  Do you know of other schools that are are looking and we help
• 8:14
  do a little bit of matchmaking there?
• 8:17
  OK. And then you you also accredit
• 8:19
  these schools so that they have a certain standard.
• 8:22
  Yes. So what we did was we spent
• 8:25
  about a year and a half looking at the existing accreditation
• 8:29
  models that are out there and then talking to head the school
• 8:33
  all across the country to say if if we were going to do
• 8:36
  accreditation the right way and and it wasn't going to be the
• 8:39
  root canal of all of education because nobody wants to do
• 8:42
  accreditation. I didn't even want to do
• 8:44
  accreditation. What would you do and how would
• 8:46
  you do it different? How would it best serve your
• 8:48
  school and actually help you become a better school, not just
• 8:52
  go through a mindless box checking, paper pushing,
• 8:55
  bureaucratic nightmare? So we took all of that
• 8:59
  collective feedback and use that to inform, I think a version and
• 9:03
  a program for accreditation that's unique.
• 9:05
  So we have 4 parts to it. One is it that it's principled.
• 9:08
  So no one wants someone from the outside to come in and prescribe
• 9:12
  everything that happens at your school.
• 9:14
  That's not what schools want, it's not what they need.
• 9:17
  So to give a principled approach, these are the things
• 9:21
  that work. These are the ideas, these are
• 9:23
  the core ideas of a classical Christian education.
• 9:27
  How do they sort of show up and apply in your own setting as a
• 9:31
  school? Those are the questions need to
• 9:32
  be asked. Second one is aspirational.
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  Most of the accreditation, you know, it's kind of this drive by
• 9:39
  thing. You're either compliant or
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  you're not. It doesn't create both a vision
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  for something you could be and a means by which you can move
• 9:48
  towards that vision. So we wanted to create something
• 9:51
  that you could look at the standards in the indicators and
• 9:54
  say, oh man, we really want to be that kind of school.
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  Not just are we checking all the boxes today.
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  The third thing is the T So this is path, principal,
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  aspirational, thorough. So we have a team of seasoned
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  people who come in and who have led schools and who have a deep
• 10:14
  understanding of how the school should be functioning.
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  And by doing it that way and, and having not just anybody
• 10:22
  who's willing to volunteer, which is what a lot of
• 10:23
  accreditation programs will utilize someone who's close and
• 10:28
  someone who's willing. But we want to set a high bar
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  for everybody who's coming in to assess from the accreditation
• 10:34
  assessment. And so that they are have really
• 10:37
  thoughtful, intentional, informed feedback for that
• 10:42
  school and their particular needs and the things that
• 10:44
  they're doing well and the things that they need to, to
• 10:47
  grow in. We don't put a lot of weight on
• 10:50
  our accreditation program on a lot of paper pushing.
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  So some, some accreditation programs do the opposite of what
• 10:58
  we do. So they'll ask you to do 100
• 11:00
  hours of data collection and uploading documents and all of
• 11:04
  that. We don't, we don't, we don't do
• 11:06
  it that way. The the what we call self study
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  part of accreditation is actually pretty brief.
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  Where we want to go deep is once we get on site and we're
• 11:15
  interacting with your team and we're understanding who you are
• 11:19
  and what some of the needs are and what we perceive needs to be
• 11:22
  pursued further. Not just everything you've ever
• 11:24
  done in the school in a big bank for resources that doesn't
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  really help and most of the team doesn't read anyway.
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  The last part of it is hospitable.
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  So most of the accreditation teams, you know, it's a painful
• 11:38
  process. People feel like they're having
• 11:39
  their papers rated and they're nervous about it.
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  What we wanted to do was create a program and this is what most
• 11:46
  of the heads told us is could we create a program that actually
• 11:49
  felt like we're serving the school will helping them fulfill
• 11:53
  their mission, helping them to grow and aspire to be something
• 11:57
  that they envision as a better future for themselves and do
• 12:01
  that with empathy, kindness, understanding with intent of
• 12:05
  serving the leaders of the school.
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  So those are those are the distinctives of the program.
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  And I think why it's been so effective this far.
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  I think the other part of it is that we spent 18 months getting
• 12:19
  input not just about how the program itself can be effective,
• 12:23
  but the actual content of the standards and indicators from
• 12:26
  scholars, heads of school, seasoned teachers for a very
• 12:32
  deep, vetted process to come up with the things that are
• 12:35
  embedded in our assessment tool themselves from educators who
• 12:39
  would be the recipients of this program.
• 12:41
  So that's probably more than you, more than you needed there.
• 12:44
  You know, we feel like we've created something distinct and
• 12:46
  really meaningful because of the way we went about creating.
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  Would you say that accreditation programs as they're currently
• 12:53
  done are basically a scam? Yes, yes, Well, think about
• 12:58
  this, OK, Cognia, which is the, you know, largest accreditor out
• 13:04
  there, all they accredited international, I think there's
• 13:06
  like 32,000 schools or something.
• 13:09
  It's like the Walmart of accreditation and and to be
• 13:12
  accredited within the many cases and our schools accredited by
• 13:15
  then for some years is a really low bar and you can't accredit
• 13:20
  32,000 schools or whatever it is and do that with the level of
• 13:24
  intentionality and engagement that I'm talking about.
• 13:26
  They're not visiting every school.
• 13:28
  Well, there's they're sending teams, but it's more of the
• 13:30
  drive by, you know, approach and they will push back against
• 13:35
  that. But I've, I've been through it
• 13:37
  couple times. I've experienced that and many
• 13:39
  of the educators you've been through accreditation, even if
• 13:42
  it's not them, that's what they feel and they don't, they don't
• 13:46
  feel like it's helping them, but it's something they feel like
• 13:48
  they have to do to satisfy this perception.
• 13:52
  And some you're a bureaucratic box checking from colleges,
• 13:56
  universities and and families. You know very little about it
• 14:00
  themselves. So the other thing I want to
• 14:03
  talk to you about is the Alliance for the Renewal of
• 14:06
  Citizenship. I believe it's called ARK.
• 14:09
  So the actually you're probably going to do a better job of
• 14:11
  explaining it. So can you explain a little bit
• 14:12
  to the audience? I think it's super interesting.
• 14:14
  I've been following her for a couple years.
• 14:15
  What what it is and the way your involvement with it has been.
• 14:18
  Yeah, so, so this is the Allies for Responsible Citizenship is
• 14:22
  Philippa Stroud and Jordan Peterson.
• 14:24
  So Philippa is a House of Lords member in the UK and she has an
• 14:29
  incredible reach in terms of her influence.
• 14:33
  She's very thoughtful, articulate the convictions about
• 14:37
  the renewal of Western civilization and aligned with
• 14:41
  Peterson in in basically working from two different perspectives.
• 14:46
  You know, she is has been involved in the House of Lords
• 14:48
  for a number of years in English politics and working hard for
• 14:53
  conservative principles within the country.
• 14:56
  And then met Jordan Peterson, who was on this tour doing all
• 15:00
  the speaking events and, and hearing over and over the same
• 15:04
  feedback concerns from all the leaders he was talking to in
• 15:07
  multiple countries all over Eastern Europe about, you know,
• 15:11
  the trajectory of their particular countries.
• 15:15
  And the loss of basic values and decency, the loss of basic
• 15:19
  freedoms, the loss of any moral framework from which people are
• 15:24
  are operating and just really having a sense of urgency and
• 15:28
  need to do something about that. So I think they both have enough
• 15:32
  of this where they got together and said, what if we brought
• 15:34
  together these people in one large setting, international,
• 15:38
  and had facilitated a conversation around these big
• 15:41
  ideas that range everything from the arts to the economy and
• 15:47
  around these core common themes that they would say we need a
• 15:51
  better story in Western civilization.
• 15:53
  And what are the things that brought us the level of of
• 15:57
  freedom, the prosperity that the West has enjoyed but is in
• 16:00
  threat of losing? How could we facilitate a
• 16:03
  conversation around those big ideas?
• 16:05
  And they had an incredible lineup of people.
• 16:07
  There were 4100 people there. This is in February, 92
• 16:11
  countries and some really great conversations happening.
• 16:15
  And not only that, they're not just wanting to get people
• 16:19
  together for a couple of days and talk.
• 16:21
  They're actually have another part of their work, which is
• 16:24
  what they're calling for them to take these pockets of people who
• 16:29
  are interested in actually doing something about these ideas and
• 16:33
  having them meet once a quarter in the small, what they call
• 16:36
  supper clubs and the getting to know each other, working
• 16:39
  collaboratively to solve real problems that are related to the
• 16:44
  big things that they care about and and want to see real
• 16:47
  solutions for. Yeah.
• 16:50
  And so how does one get involved in that?
• 16:53
  Well, at the, at the broadest level you can essentially
• 16:56
  anybody can attend, you know, the ARC conference, it's I think
• 17:00
  the next one is in June of 26. The forum dinners are by invite.
• 17:07
  And so it's not, you know, a secret club or anything, but I
• 17:11
  think they want people who are like minded.
• 17:13
  So if you've attended them like like I have, you can invite
• 17:16
  other people in to participate. And then the format is they put
• 17:21
  everybody at these tables, you have a dinner and you have a
• 17:23
  speaker maybe 1520 minutes around some big idea and then
• 17:28
  facilitating Q&A. And, and then a lot of it is
• 17:32
  organic. I think it's intended to say,
• 17:34
  let's get people who care about the same things in the same
• 17:37
  room, who can network and connect and then find ways to
• 17:40
  work together to do good things. So that's been, it's been very
• 17:44
  effective. It's very inspiring too.
• 17:46
  So we had David and Philippa come speak at our conference,
• 17:50
  the Society of Classical Learning conference in summer of
• 17:53
  24, and did a remarkable job casting vision for the renewal
• 17:58
  of culture and that aligns well with what we're trying to do
• 18:02
  with the Society for Classical Learning.
• 18:05
  You said that it's a very inspiring.
• 18:07
  What would you say it was the most inspiring experience or the
• 18:10
  most impactful thing for for you that you got out of this?
• 18:15
  Well, I think so. A couple of things.
• 18:17
  One is that, you know, the vision that they've cast of it
• 18:23
  is possible to see things that we are concerned about in
• 18:27
  culture and to be able to actually do something about it.
• 18:31
  And what David Stroud has articulated is historically,
• 18:36
  here's how culture has been renewed.
• 18:37
  He lays out these five categories, and he tells
• 18:40
  inspiring stories of other people who have had these kind
• 18:44
  of concerns, had generative ideas, and made some significant
• 18:49
  progress in advancing ideas they care about and in getting
• 18:53
  significant support behind those ideas by working in ecosystems
• 18:58
  and dense networks of leaders to advance the thing that they care
• 19:02
  about. So he's kind of setting up a
• 19:04
  framework for if we really want cultural renewal.
• 19:07
  Here's how it works. Here are the components that are
• 19:10
  necessary and that's something we can do now.
• 19:13
  So it's hopeful. You know, they've really avoided
• 19:16
  a lot of the cynical jaded culture war terminology.
• 19:20
  And I think, yes, there's areas to be concerned about.
• 19:23
  Yes, there's some real bad things happening, but can we
• 19:27
  cast a vision for real positive change that that is actualized
• 19:32
  and executed and we actually solve problems and not just
• 19:36
  whale and moan complaint, but we're real aimed at at, at
• 19:43
  meaningful change around the things we care about.
• 19:45
  It sounds a little trite, but it's real.
• 19:47
  It's real. They they live that.
• 19:50
  God wouldn't expect anything less from a member of the House
• 19:52
  of Lords. Yeah, but the wailing and
• 19:55
  moaning is kind of fun. Yeah, feels good.
• 19:59
  Just then really move the needle.
• 20:02
  So it seems to me that the biggest challenge that young
• 20:05
  people face, maybe everyone in modern society, is digital
• 20:10
  destruction. And how do you address that
• 20:13
  problem with all these schools you're working with?
• 20:16
  Well, you know, what's pretty remarkable is is you know, when
• 20:19
  the anxious generation came out, Jonathan Hyde was advocating
• 20:22
  for, you know, phone free schools and our schools are
• 20:26
  never went down that road. They never allowed them in the
• 20:29
  first place. And they've been very protective
• 20:32
  and I think cautious about overly saturating kids with
• 20:38
  digital anything and giving them real lived, you know,
• 20:43
  experiences that are humane and not detached and overly
• 20:49
  mediated. And that's been really rich
• 20:52
  because I think we've been able to say she's right and we've
• 20:56
  been saying that in here, to reiterate are the reasons why we
• 20:59
  care about this. And so I think that's really
• 21:02
  encouraging. And I think a lot of our
• 21:03
  families, you know, who are, are concerned about this issue have
• 21:09
  learned from our schools about what are the principles or
• 21:13
  reasons why we'd even not give them unfettered access all the
• 21:17
  time to social media or just to even having the device, you
• 21:21
  know, accessible to their kids or teenagers 24/7 and what it's
• 21:26
  doing to them. But also with a positive aim
• 21:28
  towards if we're going to form wise and virtuous human beings,
• 21:33
  then that's not going to happen in mediated terms.
• 21:36
  We're going to have to be intentional about what we do
• 21:39
  with our kids and not allowing this constant stream of things
• 21:46
  coming to them that we have no real understanding of what it is
• 21:49
  or what the content of it is or how it's shaping them.
• 21:52
  But be proactive in the kind of ways in which we're forming them
• 21:55
  and be vigilant in that, in that work.
• 21:58
  And I think that's one things, the beautiful things that that's
• 22:00
  happened in our movement is a a real positive vision for why do
• 22:05
  we educate? What is the purpose of education
• 22:08
  and how have the content and the methodologies and the cultures
• 22:11
  in our schools moving towards creating and forming lives of
• 22:16
  virtues as human beings? And it's going to mean some
• 22:19
  temperance, some moderation on things that are helpful tools,
• 22:23
  but if we're not careful, can rewire and reshape us in
• 22:26
  something we would be terrified to see the outcome of.
• 22:30
  Well said. Good for you, Eric.
• 22:33
  You're doing. You're doing the right thing.
• 22:36
  It really makes my heart glad to hear that.
• 22:37
  Well, good, good. I I think there's a lot of
• 22:39
  resonance with that. I think that's the the
• 22:41
  trajectory of it. Even outside of our more
• 22:43
  conservative circles. I think Pierce intuitively think
• 22:46
  this is, this is not a good idea.
• 22:48
  It kind of like people have given the parallel with the
• 22:50
  cigarette. You know, we'll look back and
• 22:52
  go, can't believe we did that. Yeah, yeah.
• 22:56
  If there is a civilization that that's capable of looking back,
• 23:00
  yeah, I. Think they will?
• 23:01
  Yeah. So any last words for us, Eric?
• 23:05
  Well, I'm full for the opportunity to do this.
• 23:07
  I, I, I think that, you know, one of one of the things that,
• 23:10
  yeah, I'm very passionate about is recovering good and true and
• 23:15
  beautiful things, giving those to our, our, our children in
• 23:20
  ways that we, we've lost. And so if anything, this renewal
• 23:26
  of classical Christian educations is recovering things
• 23:31
  that have been lost. And it's a beautiful thing to
• 23:33
  watch if you walk in our schools and you see what's happening in
• 23:37
  the lives of these young people. Their ability to articulate
• 23:40
  ideas, their understanding of the things that have shaped
• 23:45
  Western civilization, human civilization.
• 23:48
  Their ability to articulate the big ideas and essential
• 23:51
  questions of what it means to be human.
• 23:53
  The access to the great resources of what made human
• 23:56
  beings wise and flourishing in the past and to be able to apply
• 24:00
  those to real issues today of technology and AI and sexuality
• 24:04
  and all the other things that they encounter.
• 24:07
  We, we just desperately need this, you know, to happen.
• 24:10
  And we've just lost sight of that entirely.
• 24:12
  So it's an honor to be able to work in a industry that is
• 24:16
  committed to doing that and see the the grapefruit of it.
• 24:20
  Beautiful. Thank you.
• 24:22
  Yeah. Thank you.