Transcript

Sharri | 13 October · Sharri

0:07
Speaker 1: Thanks, Andrew.
0:07
Speaker 2: Good evening.
0:08
Speaker 1: Tonight, the Albanese government has refused to stop funding the
0:12
Speaker 1: Islamic centres allegedly linked to the FlyDubai co-pilot. Pauline Hanson
0:17
Speaker 1: and John O'Donoghue are demanding answers. Jealous liberals tear into
0:22
Speaker 1: Josh Frydenberg, but they'd be lucky to have him back
0:25
Speaker 1: in politics. Tonight, John Howard defends his record. And should
0:31
Speaker 1: tech giants block the live stream of a Texas execution?
0:36
Speaker 1: That debate coming up. But first, the Albanese government has
0:40
Speaker 1: refused to stop funding the Islamic centers attended by the
0:44
Speaker 1: Fly Dubai co-pilot who came within a whisker's breath of
0:48
Speaker 1: committing a major 9-11 style terror attack. The reality is
0:53
Speaker 1: that the Labor government has turned a blind eye to
0:57
Speaker 1: Islamic radicalisation and even now refuse to outright say they'll
1:03
Speaker 1: stop giving taxpayer funds towards organisations accused of radicalisation and extremism. Now,
1:11
Speaker 1: this is a deadly, serious issue. Shadow Home Affairs Minister
1:16
Speaker 1: John O'Donoghue grilled the government about it today.
1:21
Speaker 3: The Albanese government reportedly awarded almost $ 70, 000 in taxpayer-funded grants
1:25
Speaker 3: to the Multicultural Youth Centre in Melbourne, an organisation now
1:29
Speaker 3: under scrutiny following revelations about the accused fly Dubai terrorists'
1:34
Speaker 3: alleged connections to individuals who were affiliated with that centre.
1:39
Speaker 3: Has the government suspended or terminated these grants, and is
1:42
Speaker 3: it taking any steps to recover the funding already paid?
1:46
Speaker 1: And yet the answer from the Albanese government was far
1:50
Speaker 1: from adequate.
1:52
Speaker 4: In relation to grant funding, I think all political parties,
1:55
Speaker 4: including your party, make public election commitments to community groups,
2:02
Speaker 4: including multicultural community groups, and that is appropriate.
2:08
Speaker 1: One Nation leader Pauline Hanson has also asked for a
2:12
Speaker 1: commitment that the government stop supporting the organisation's link to
2:17
Speaker 1: the co-pilot Hamam al-Hammami. But again, absolutely nothing of substance
2:22
Speaker 1: from the Albanese government, no commitment that it wouldn't be
2:26
Speaker 1: sending our hard-earned money towards the centres being talked about
2:31
Speaker 1: in the world's media for being connected with an alleged terrorist.
2:36
Speaker 5: Did you.
2:37
Speaker 6: or your department seek or receive advice from ASIO or
2:42
Speaker 6: the Australian Federal Police before granting more than $ 68, 000 to
2:47
Speaker 6: the Islamic Multicultural Youth Centre.
2:50
Speaker 7: Minister Burke and his department have been looking into this
2:54
Speaker 7: and certainly from the government's perspective our position is that
2:58
Speaker 7: we expect that all organisations that receive government funding conduct
3:01
Speaker 7: themselves in lines with guidelines and funding agreements and in
3:05
Speaker 7: accordance with expectations of the Australian taxpayer. If any activities
3:09
Speaker 7: breach these, the funding will be reviewed.
3:13
Speaker 4: What waffle.
3:15
Speaker 1: Time and time again, we've seen Prime Minister Anthony Albanese uncomfortable,
3:20
Speaker 1: really uncomfortable, talking about the issue of radical Islamist extremism.
3:26
Speaker 1: And he often reverts to speaking about neo-Nazis instead. Here's
3:30
Speaker 1: just a few examples.
3:32
Speaker 8: But what we have here is neo-Nazis being given a
3:37
Speaker 8: platform for neo-Nazis to parade and to spread hatred, to
3:42
Speaker 8: spread anti-Semitism, to promote violence, to engage in training activities.
3:49
Speaker 8: This is un-Australian. We've outlawed the neo-Nazis who've gone through
3:56
Speaker 8: various name changes. but the policies remain the same. Another issue,
4:02
Speaker 8: the presence of neo-Nazis in Australia, I find just.
4:09
Speaker 9: Extraordinary in 2026.
4:12
Speaker 1: Now, of course, both are major issues, but why does
4:15
Speaker 1: he seem so uncomfortable even uttering the words radical Islamic extremism?
4:22
Speaker 1: And he struggled to do this even after the Bondi
4:24
Speaker 1: terror attack. as Josh Frydenberg pointed out at the time.
4:29
Speaker 10: Guns may have stolen the life of 15 innocent civilians,
4:36
Speaker 10: but it was radical Islamist ideology that pulled the trigger.
4:47
Speaker 10: And if you, Prime Minister, can't say those words, Islamist ideology...
4:54
Speaker 10: If you can't speak them, you can't solve them.
5:00
Speaker 1: Yep, you cannot solve a problem that you can't name.
5:04
Speaker 1: If you can't speak about an issue, you certainly can't
5:06
Speaker 1: come up with solutions to deal with it. It's an
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Speaker 1: international scandal that the fly-due-by pilot says he was radicalised
5:15
Speaker 1: here in Australia while studying at RMIT University. He came
5:21
Speaker 1: very close... to killing hundreds of people, innocent people, in
5:26
Speaker 1: a 9-11-style attack. His plan was reportedly to fly this
5:30
Speaker 1: Emirati plane into Israel's Ben Gurion International Airport. The UAE
5:36
Speaker 1: Attorney-General says Hammami attended a mosque and an Islamic institution
5:41
Speaker 1: called My Center in Melbourne. And according to the UAE
5:45
Speaker 1: government statement, the pilot claims that whilst in Australia, he
5:50
Speaker 1: adopted ideas advocating violence, terrorism and drew inspiration from the
5:55
Speaker 1: terror attack on the Twin Towers in 2001. Now, the
6:00
Speaker 1: leader of my centre is this preacher, Samir Mohtadi, also
6:05
Speaker 1: known as Abu Hamza. He's issued strong denials about his
6:10
Speaker 1: connection with this co-pilot. He says, I strongly reject recent
6:14
Speaker 1: media reports suggesting any connection between myself, the Multicultural Youth
6:19
Speaker 1: Centre and the co-pilot al-Hammami. And he's released a bizarre
6:24
Speaker 1: video statement saying he was going to fast from talking.
6:30
Speaker 11: You'll find those who are righteous, they've always been attacked, abused, accused, killed, imprisoned.
6:37
Speaker 12: And this is the way it is.
6:39
Speaker 1: The Age newspaper reports that almost $ 2 million, yes, $ 2
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Speaker 1: million in government funding has flowed to my centre since 2018.
6:49
Speaker 1: The paper reports that state and federal government documents show
6:53
Speaker 1: my centre received a $ 730, 000 grant from Victoria for community
6:59
Speaker 1: infrastructure and $ 1. 17 million from the federal government to subsidise
7:04
Speaker 1: childcare worker wages. So as they said, both state and
7:08
Speaker 1: federal funding. And Abu Hamza has been planning a $ 6. 9
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Speaker 1: million religious development in Melbourne. And this is all despite
7:18
Speaker 1: the fact he's accused of launching attacks on so-called Zionists.
7:24
Speaker 1: The Australian reports that last year, well, the Australian reported
7:28
Speaker 1: last year that he had called Zionists, and that is
7:33
Speaker 1: often understood to be Jews who support Israel, He called
7:36
Speaker 1: them scavengers and blood-sucking humans.
7:40
Speaker 13: I've always believed that these Zionists are not normal.
7:45
Speaker 12: They're blood-sucking human beings.
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Speaker 5: They're scavengers.
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Speaker 12: They're not humans, I swear by Allah. 82%, not 20%
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Speaker 12: or 15%, 82% believe in ethnic cleansing. This is truly disgraceful.
8:03
Speaker 1: It's dangerous ideology and language. But, of course, it seems
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Speaker 1: it didn't affect federal or state governments millions in funding
8:13
Speaker 1: for his centre. And many Labor figures have visited the centre.
8:18
Speaker 1: There was more that he had to say as well.
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Speaker 13: Living in this country, we need to understand that the
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Speaker 13: war that exists here, which is much, much more dangerous,
8:28
Speaker 13: which is the war of no gods, They want to
8:32
Speaker 13: instil in our minds that God does not exist.
8:40
Speaker 1: Well, given the revelations, I asked Home Affairs Minister Tony
8:43
Speaker 1: Burke's office today if the government will stop funding the
8:46
Speaker 1: centres associated with the co-pilot. Well, he didn't respond to
8:51
Speaker 1: my question, even though these are Home Affairs grants, some
8:55
Speaker 1: of them, and he directed me to the office of
8:57
Speaker 1: Anne Alley, the Minister for Multicultural Affairs. She said the
9:01
Speaker 1: department conducts due diligence checks to assess compliance and eligibility
9:06
Speaker 1: requirements that identify information and may present a risk to
9:10
Speaker 1: the achievement of the grant objectives. I mean, this is
9:12
Speaker 1: as much waffle as we heard a bit earlier in
9:15
Speaker 1: the Senate today. She said any allegations of wrongdoing must
9:18
Speaker 1: be taken seriously and if these activities breach these, the
9:22
Speaker 1: funding will be reviewed. And she said the Joint Counterterror
9:26
Speaker 1: Team has announced it's investigating the links to Australia. etc. Now,
9:33
Speaker 1: the point is, we have already seen his public commentary,
9:38
Speaker 1: and yet the federal government funding continued to flow. These
9:43
Speaker 1: hate preachers who espouse extremist views have been able to
9:47
Speaker 1: get away scot-free. There have been too many wake-up calls
9:52
Speaker 1: to count. And it seems to me that this government
9:56
Speaker 1: doesn't take the issue of terrorism seriously. It's preferred to
10:00
Speaker 1: quietly ignore radical extremist ideology. And now the world's scrutiny
10:06
Speaker 1: is on Australia and how this beautiful country, once the
10:11
Speaker 1: lucky country, I say once, is where a pilot was radicalised,
10:17
Speaker 1: beginning his mission of murder. A mission that only failed
10:21
Speaker 1: thanks to the courage of Israeli passengers and an Indian pilot. Well,
10:31
Speaker 1: former Prime Minister John Howard launched a defence of Josh
10:35
Speaker 1: Frydenberg today as critics attacked him for the crime of
10:40
Speaker 1: writing and publicising a book. Jealous liberals have criticised Frydenberg
10:45
Speaker 1: for daring to get some publicity for his memoir, for
10:50
Speaker 1: not making a decision yet about whether he's going to
10:52
Speaker 1: make a political comeback and for suggesting tax reform. They've
10:57
Speaker 1: even attacked his record as Liberal Treasurer. And Liberal leader
11:03
Speaker 1: Angus Taylor is among those who joined the fray, inadvertently
11:07
Speaker 1: adding to the publicity for Josh. Taylor questioned how much
11:11
Speaker 1: money he'd spent on JobKeeper during the pandemic.
11:15
Speaker 2: But we made the mistake.
11:18
Speaker 12: Of spending too much during the pandemic, more than was
11:21
Speaker 12: needed to save jobs and the economy.
11:26
Speaker 1: Well, John Howard launched Josh Frydenberg's book today and he
11:30
Speaker 1: defended the spending of the Coalition during the pandemic. And
11:36
Speaker 1: Howard even revealed publicly today that he'd given advice to
11:40
Speaker 1: Frydenberg before he announced JobKeeper.
11:45
Speaker 5: And I remember you talking to me when you were
11:47
Speaker 5: walking around Parliament House, and you rang me and said, look,
11:52
Speaker 5: I've got to spend all this money. And I said,
11:54
Speaker 5: this is a time when you've got to forget philosophy.
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Speaker 5: Just do what you think is right for the country.
12:03
Speaker 1: Howard also praised Frydenberg as the standout performer of the
12:07
Speaker 1: Morrison government. and said that he shouldn't feel the pressure
12:10
Speaker 1: to declare publicly whether or not he's going to re-enter
12:14
Speaker 1: the political fray. Now, as a side note, Howard was
12:18
Speaker 1: fascinating today. In a long speech, he also said that
12:21
Speaker 1: he thinks Benjamin Netanyahu will win the Israeli election. He
12:25
Speaker 1: said he likes him, he likes survivors in politics. And
12:29
Speaker 1: he spoke strongly about anti-Semitism, saying that it shouldn't be
12:32
Speaker 1: a matter of political contention. Now, in his speech, Josh
12:37
Speaker 1: Frydenberg said... that two-thirds of Australians feel the country is
12:41
Speaker 1: heading in the wrong direction. And he said that's partly
12:45
Speaker 1: what his book is about.
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Speaker 14: Well, one of the reasons I've written this book is
12:50
Speaker 14: because there's a plea for us as a country to
12:53
Speaker 14: change course. I feel that the trend is not our friend,
12:56
Speaker 14: that our economy is weakening, that our society is fragmenting
13:00
Speaker 14: and that our neighbourhood is getting less secure.
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Speaker 1: Frydenberg also spoke beautifully about this great nation, Australia. His
13:10
Speaker 1: mother was stateless when she arrived here after escaping Nazi Europe.
13:14
Speaker 1: She was a refugee.
13:17
Speaker 15: If Australia had closed the doors to my mother, I
13:23
Speaker 15: wouldn't be here today. And my grandparents moved to a
13:29
Speaker 15: suburb called Kew, where my dad grew up, bang in
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Speaker 15: the seat of Kuyong. And they voted for our greatest
13:41
Speaker 15: Prime Minister, our longest-serving Prime Minister, Sir Robert Menzies. And
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Speaker 15: who would have thought? They definitely wouldn't have thought that
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Speaker 15: their grandson would get to sit in that chair as
13:58
Speaker 15: a local member winning four elections to rise to be
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Speaker 15: the Deputy Leader... of this great, proud party, and then
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Speaker 15: to serve the country in the role of treasurer during
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Speaker 15: the biggest economic shock our country has faced since the
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Speaker 15: Great Depression. For that, whatever happens in the future, for that,
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Speaker 15: I'm eternally grateful.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, and you can see the emotion as he spoke
14:30
Speaker 1: about how this nation had given him everything. But Frydenberg
14:36
Speaker 1: has given so much to Australia and to the Liberal Party,
14:41
Speaker 1: and he deserves more than white anting from rival colleagues.
14:45
Speaker 1: The Liberal Party needs talent desperately. They should be so
14:50
Speaker 1: lucky to see him return. OK, for more on this now,
14:58
Speaker 1: I'm joined by The Australian's editor-at-large, Paul Kelly, who Josh
15:01
Speaker 1: Frydenberg praised today as one of our greatest ever journalists.
15:06
Speaker 1: I think he's spot on there, Paul. Look, you and
15:09
Speaker 1: I both interviewed Frydenberg over the past few days, or
15:12
Speaker 1: at least it was broadcast over the past few days.
15:16
Speaker 1: What did you think of John Howard's comments about Frydenberg
15:20
Speaker 1: as a political leader, as a treasurer and as a
15:23
Speaker 1: human today?
15:24
Speaker 5: This was a very stirring and emotional book launch today.
15:28
Speaker 5: It was quite an event, not a normal book launch
15:31
Speaker 5: at all. We saw on display this bond, this special
15:35
Speaker 5: bond between John Howard and Josh Frydenberg. This bond is personal.
15:40
Speaker 5: It's political. As you've said, Howard repeated again that in
15:44
Speaker 5: his view, Josh Frydenberg was the outstanding performer in the
15:49
Speaker 5: Morrison government. Howard said three really important things. First of all,
15:54
Speaker 5: He praised Josh Frydenberg for the leadership he displayed in
15:59
Speaker 5: terms of the campaign against anti-Semitism. He said in terms
16:02
Speaker 5: of any decision about Kuyong, Frydenberg is not obliged to
16:07
Speaker 5: take that decision now. He's got his own discretion in
16:11
Speaker 5: terms of sorting that out. But most significantly, in terms
16:15
Speaker 5: of Frydenberg's economic management during COVID, Howard was full of praise,
16:21
Speaker 5: full of praise for what he did. full of praise
16:24
Speaker 5: for the fact that he treated, that Frydenberg treated it
16:27
Speaker 5: as an emergency situation, as a crisis situation in which
16:32
Speaker 5: you don't impose an ideological point of view. And, of course,
16:38
Speaker 5: I think the really interesting thing about this is Howard
16:42
Speaker 5: has repudiated Angus Taylor and he's repudiated Tim Wilson. He's
16:47
Speaker 5: repudiated the Liberal leader and he's repudiated the shadow treasurer,
16:52
Speaker 5: who have been talking in the last few days, criticising
16:56
Speaker 5: the Morrison government and Frydenberg by implication for spending too
17:01
Speaker 5: much at the time.
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Speaker 1: In many respects, Paul, it's these comments from the likes
17:07
Speaker 1: of Angus Taylor and Tim Wilson that has led to
17:10
Speaker 1: now this perception of a feud within the coalition. I mean,
17:13
Speaker 1: they didn't have to say that. They didn't have to
17:16
Speaker 1: make those comments about the record of their own government.
17:20
Speaker 5: All they had to do... and this was so simple,
17:23
Speaker 5: was to say they liked the book and if Frydenberg
17:27
Speaker 5: wanted to come back into politics, that'd be good. Full stop.
17:31
Speaker 5: This was so easy. They didn't have to say anything else,
17:33
Speaker 5: but the fact that they did, I think, indicated a
17:38
Speaker 5: degree of brittleness and a degree of sensitivity, which was unwise. Now,
17:45
Speaker 5: the point to make.
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Speaker 1: Or, as I put it, perhaps jealousy.
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Speaker 5: I don't think it's jealousy. I don't think it's jealousy.
17:51
Speaker 5: But the point I'd like to make, which is the
17:54
Speaker 5: point I made in my book on this period of government,
17:58
Speaker 5: the Australian performance, the Australian economic recovery during COVID was
18:04
Speaker 5: world leading. Our economic recovery was either the best or
18:08
Speaker 5: second best among industrial OECD nations. This was a stellar
18:14
Speaker 5: Australian performance. Wouldn't you think? that you'd have the leader
18:19
Speaker 5: of the Liberal Party and the shadow treasurer of the
18:22
Speaker 5: Liberal Party highlighting that rather than repeating the Labor Party
18:27
Speaker 5: mantra that they spent too much.
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Speaker 4: It's unbelievable.
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Speaker 1: It's truly unbelievable.
18:31
Speaker 5: Now, just on this point, yes, in this sort of crisis,
18:36
Speaker 5: you can never get the degree of fiscal stimulus right.
18:38
Speaker 5: We understand that. And we also understand that given... Given
18:43
Speaker 5: the advice the government had that unemployment might go to 15%,
18:48
Speaker 5: the health advice being that the lives of 150,000 Australians
18:54
Speaker 5: might be in jeopardy, the further economic advice that in
18:58
Speaker 5: a quarter GDP might fall upwards of 20%. It was
19:02
Speaker 5: clear the government had to act dramatically. They had to
19:06
Speaker 5: act very quickly. And in that sort of situation, the
19:09
Speaker 5: worst mistake is to underspend. To the extent you make
19:14
Speaker 5: a mistake, you've got to spend too much. They did
19:17
Speaker 5: spend too much. There's no question about that because you
19:20
Speaker 5: can never get the degree of stimulus right. But having
19:24
Speaker 5: spent too much, the point is they delivered for the
19:28
Speaker 5: Australian public, they delivered for the Australian economy and their
19:32
Speaker 5: performance was superior to virtually any other industrialised country. And
19:37
Speaker 5: yet we're finding senior Liberals are now lining up To
19:42
Speaker 5: criticise it. How weird is this?
19:44
Speaker 1: To distance themselves from their own record. Genuinely unbelievable. Especially
19:49
Speaker 1: because of... I mean, as some people say, Josh Frydenberg
19:51
Speaker 1: looks like a genius with how he handled the economy,
19:54
Speaker 1: you know, prior to COVID compared with the current government.
19:58
Speaker 5: Look, I might just say they did make one mistake
20:01
Speaker 5: and we should highlight this, but after the economy rebounded,
20:05
Speaker 5: they didn't sufficiently adjust economic policy. They kept too much
20:09
Speaker 5: of the stimulus in place when they should have wound
20:12
Speaker 5: back that stimulus after the economic rebound. So it's not
20:15
Speaker 5: as though they got everything right. They did spend too much,
20:18
Speaker 5: and when the economic rebound came, they did not sufficiently
20:22
Speaker 5: adjust policy.
20:23
Speaker 1: I want to talk about Frydenberg's political future. He hasn't
20:28
Speaker 1: made up his mind. He's been asked the question 1,001 times,
20:31
Speaker 1: including by me and you, as he said today. He's
20:35
Speaker 1: obviously clearly concerned considering it, but he needs to think
20:38
Speaker 1: about whether he can wing Koo Yong and also what
20:42
Speaker 1: the Liberal Party looks like. But my question to you, Paul,
20:45
Speaker 1: is given the Liberal Party is at this near historic
20:48
Speaker 1: low point, does it need a figure like Frydenberg to return?
20:53
Speaker 5: All I'd say about that is that if he did
20:56
Speaker 5: return to politics, that would obviously be a plus for
20:59
Speaker 5: the Liberal Party. I mean, we're talking about someone who
21:01
Speaker 5: was a former deputy leader and At one stage in
21:04
Speaker 5: late 2021 and early 2022, colleagues were urging him to
21:08
Speaker 5: challenge Scott Morrison for the prime ministership, which he wisely
21:11
Speaker 5: didn't do. So given the experience that he's had, given
21:16
Speaker 5: his capabilities as treasurer, given his ability as a communicator,
21:22
Speaker 5: I mean, what we saw at the book launch today
21:25
Speaker 5: was a high level of emotional and intellectual sophistication as
21:32
Speaker 5: a political communicator, and that is a very important quality.
21:36
Speaker 1: So you're saying the party needs him to return?
21:40
Speaker 5: All I'm saying is that it would be a plus
21:43
Speaker 5: for the party if he did return. Now, we all
21:46
Speaker 5: know Josh has not made up his mind. He won't
21:48
Speaker 5: make up his mind for quite some time. He doesn't
21:51
Speaker 5: have to make up his mind. It is a very,
21:54
Speaker 5: very important decision. I mean, clearly at the moment, at
21:57
Speaker 5: the moment, The answer is no. I mean, if the
22:00
Speaker 5: answer was yes, now he's jealous.
22:01
Speaker 6: He would say it, yeah.
22:02
Speaker 5: And so we'll have to see what happens with the
22:04
Speaker 5: Victorian election. We'll have to see what happens in the
22:07
Speaker 5: early part of next year. I mean, clearly he's not
22:10
Speaker 5: going to decide to come back unless the Liberal vote
22:14
Speaker 5: is at a sufficient level that he can build on. And,
22:17
Speaker 5: of course, if he does come back, it will only
22:19
Speaker 5: be in the seat of Kuyong. Yeah, indeed.
22:22
Speaker 1: He's indicated that much. Paul Kelly, thank you so much
22:25
Speaker 1: as always.
22:25
Speaker 5: Thank you, Shari.
22:28
Speaker 1: Let's turn to other headlines now and Pauline Hanson is
22:30
Speaker 1: trying to bolster One Nation's private sector credentials. She's told
22:34
Speaker 1: a leader summit that her party is a champion for
22:37
Speaker 1: small business. She also launched this attack on the Treasurer.
22:42
Speaker 6: We now have a Treasurer with no private sector experience
22:45
Speaker 6: and his Labor government believes it knows better than you how.
22:49
Speaker 4: To run your business.
22:50
Speaker 6: That's what a socialist government looks like. And this Labor
22:54
Speaker 6: government is now at war with the people who keep
22:57
Speaker 6: this country running.
22:59
Speaker 1: And joining me now is former State Labor Secretary Cameron
23:02
Speaker 1: Milner and former Speaker of the House, Bronwyn Bishop. Great
23:04
Speaker 1: to see you both. Bronwyn, starting with you, what did
23:08
Speaker 1: you think of Pauline's comments as small business is really
23:11
Speaker 1: becoming a big political issue at the moment?
23:14
Speaker 9: It always is a big political issue. And I thought
23:17
Speaker 9: her comments were correct. We have a government which has
23:20
Speaker 9: declared war on small businesses. And it's just failure after failure.
23:26
Speaker 9: I mean, it's as if there's no serious consideration of
23:30
Speaker 9: what the aftermath of any decision they make takes place.
23:35
Speaker 9: I mean, the head of Treasury is a ex-officer member
23:40
Speaker 9: of the RBA board. How come she didn't tip people
23:45
Speaker 9: off to what would happen with regard to getting rid
23:48
Speaker 9: of the surcharge for small businesses? for tax office ramifications,
23:52
Speaker 9: not accepting payment by credit card anymore. So when she
23:56
Speaker 9: goes in and starts to talk about the things where
23:59
Speaker 9: the government has, in fact, attacked small business, she's on
24:02
Speaker 9: the money. But so is the Liberal and National parties.
24:06
Speaker 9: They are also, which is why I keep talking about
24:09
Speaker 9: the need for them to find an accommodation.
24:11
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, to work together. Cameron, in your capacity as
24:15
Speaker 1: former Chief of Staff to Bill Shorten, you, of course,
24:18
Speaker 1: worked with a lot of the current Labor cabinet. I mean,
24:22
Speaker 1: what Pauline says is right in that they don't have
24:25
Speaker 1: business experience. Most of them do not have private sector experience.
24:29
Speaker 1: They've been in unions or politics their entire lives.
24:36
Speaker 12: Well, so was Bob Hawke and so was Paul Keating,
24:38
Speaker 12: but they were cut from a different cloth from the
24:39
Speaker 12: current kind of managerial left you have in the current
24:42
Speaker 12: Canberra group. I mean, the problem, to your point, Bronwyn,
24:45
Speaker 12: I think, is that they listen to the bureaucrats too much.
24:47
Speaker 12: We're dealing with, you know, politicians who lack real-world experience
24:51
Speaker 12: backed by public servants who have no world experience. I mean,
24:55
Speaker 12: the surcharge stuff was a farce. I mean, if it
24:57
Speaker 12: was going to be a cost, it was either going
24:58
Speaker 12: to be borne by the customer or by the business.
25:00
Speaker 5: I mean, for goodness sake. I mean, it's simple logic.
25:02
Speaker 12: So, no, we're unfortunately in a situation where we've got
25:06
Speaker 12: politicians with no world experience backed by bureaucrats with even less.
25:11
Speaker 1: We had this warning today from the International Monetary Fund
25:14
Speaker 1: over the government's spending, their level of spending. They've said
25:17
Speaker 1: in their annual report, I'll read you the exact quote,
25:19
Speaker 1: they've said a renewed focus on rebuilding fiscal space is
25:22
Speaker 1: urgent given elevated debt, higher borrowing costs, multiplying demands on
25:27
Speaker 1: public budgets and heightened uncertainty. Any new spending increases or
25:32
Speaker 1: tax cuts should be well funded. And, Bronwyn, the IMF
25:36
Speaker 1: has also forecast higher unemployment as well.
25:40
Speaker 9: Well, why wouldn't it? And what was the government's immediate response?
25:43
Speaker 9: To say it's going to pay another $ 640 million to
25:47
Speaker 9: top up the salaries of people who don't work for
25:50
Speaker 9: the government.
25:50
Speaker 1: Public servants?
25:51
Speaker 9: No, people who work in the healthcare industry.
25:53
Speaker 5: Oh, in the healthcare industry, yeah. Now, that means.
25:55
Speaker 1: I think pay rises to the public service, yeah.
25:57
Speaker 9: That's a stimulus payment. That indeed will add to inflation.
26:02
Speaker 9: Everything they do is counter..... is just the reverse of
26:06
Speaker 9: what they should be doing. I forget who said... a
26:09
Speaker 9: rather poignant statement that it's like the RBA has their
26:13
Speaker 9: foot on the brake and the Treasurer has his foot
26:17
Speaker 9: on the accelerator. It doesn't work. Accidents are the net result.
26:21
Speaker 9: Disasters are the net result. But if you look at
26:24
Speaker 9: the amount of extra money that has come the government's
26:29
Speaker 9: way out of sheer luck for increased receipts, largely by
26:36
Speaker 9: prices of commodities and so on, they've just splashed it
26:39
Speaker 9: up against the wall. There's been no attempt to put
26:42
Speaker 9: the budget into good repair. There's been no attempt to
26:45
Speaker 9: see productivity growth. It's just been spend, spend, spend.
26:53
Speaker 1: Cameron, we've had credit agencies, you know, the most esteemed
26:57
Speaker 1: ones come out publicly, the IMF now. This is also
27:01
Speaker 1: a political issue. I mean, everyday Australians are really crying out.
27:05
Speaker 1: They're struggling to just put food on the table. There's
27:09
Speaker 1: a lot of reports that, you know, parents are starting
27:11
Speaker 1: to skip meals so that their kids can have food,
27:15
Speaker 1: can't afford medical appointments and so on.
27:19
Speaker 12: Oh, and look, Labor's spending is out of control, absolutely
27:22
Speaker 12: out of control. I mean, if the New South Wales
27:24
Speaker 12: Labor Treasurer actually wants to make a point of difference
27:26
Speaker 12: with Chalmers by saying he's going to put a cap
27:28
Speaker 12: on spending, it just shows you how toxic Labor's spending
27:31
Speaker 12: problem is out there electorate. You know, and the Liberal
27:34
Speaker 12: Party should come up with the slogan, end the spend.
27:36
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's a good one.
27:37
Speaker 12: When they had to stop the boats, they had axe attacks,
27:39
Speaker 12: they should have end the spend. because voters have had
27:41
Speaker 12: enough of it. They've had enough of this. To your point, Bronwyn, absolutely.
27:45
Speaker 12: Rivers of cash flying to middle-class welfare in this country,
27:48
Speaker 12: which we can't afford. And the IMF has called it
27:50
Speaker 12: out and said, not only will we have higher inflation,
27:52
Speaker 12: we're going to have higher unemployment because we've got too
27:54
Speaker 12: much high spending.
27:56
Speaker 1: Cameron, that is not the first time you've come up
27:58
Speaker 1: with an excellent slogan for the Liberal Party. I think
28:00
Speaker 1: they need to pay you to get some, because they
28:04
Speaker 1: don't have any of these lines. And the spend, it's
28:07
Speaker 1: a good one. Just on another topic now, the Parliamentary
28:11
Speaker 1: Friends of Palestine is hosting an event for politicians at
28:14
Speaker 1: Parliament House tomorrow. But look who their speaker is. It's
28:18
Speaker 1: this controversial anti-Israel United Nations lawyer, Chris Sidoti. He's doing
28:24
Speaker 1: a briefing at an event called Children in Gaza, Evidence
28:27
Speaker 1: Impact on Australia's Role. Of course, no mention of Israeli children,
28:31
Speaker 1: God forbid, or Australian Jewish children, God forbid. He's also
28:36
Speaker 1: known for comparing the Holocaust to the war in Gaza.
28:39
Speaker 2: Have a look.
28:40
Speaker 11: It's as though we are not learning from history. but
28:44
Speaker 11: yet again walking sleepingly into a situation of the most
28:50
Speaker 11: extreme violence, the most serious violation of fundamental human rights
28:55
Speaker 11: and indeed of humanity itself.
28:58
Speaker 1: And Bronwyn, Sophie Scomps, the Teal, is involved in this
29:03
Speaker 1: event along with Labor MP Susan Templeton. Should he be
29:06
Speaker 1: given a platform at Parliament House?
29:10
Speaker 9: No, Shari, I represented the seat of Mackellar for 22 years.
29:14
Speaker 9: And I just lament the state of the representation now.
29:20
Speaker 9: I hope we find a very good Liberal candidate who
29:23
Speaker 9: can take the seat back because, no, Mr Sidoti, in
29:27
Speaker 9: my view, should not get such a platform. I just
29:33
Speaker 9: feel that history is being so distorted. The real.
29:42
Speaker 9: Violence is being perpetrated by a coming together of the
29:46
Speaker 9: far left, the Marxists, together with extreme Islam, both thinking
29:52
Speaker 9: they'll win at the end of the day and can
29:55
Speaker 9: be the people who are ruling the world. And it's
29:58
Speaker 9: just so dangerous. And to use the Parliament House to
30:02
Speaker 9: do it, it just makes my heart bleed.
30:06
Speaker 1: I mean, it's actually something Paul Kelly wrote in his
30:08
Speaker 1: column last week, Cameron, that I thought was really smart.
30:11
Speaker 1: He said what the activists have done is they've normalised
30:16
Speaker 1: this concept that there was a genocide in Gaza. Of
30:18
Speaker 1: course there was no genocide, absolutely none, no evidence, no
30:23
Speaker 1: suggestion that there was one. But because they've normalised this concept...
30:27
Speaker 1: it turns anti-Semitism or targeting of Zionists into some supposed
30:33
Speaker 1: moral cause.
30:36
Speaker 12: It is, but let's call Chris Sidoti for what he is.
30:38
Speaker 12: He has been chasing a headline, has been chasing a headline.
30:41
Speaker 12: I mean, this bloke just says shocking, awful things about people,
30:44
Speaker 12: about Israel, about Jewish people. And for goodness sake, to
30:48
Speaker 12: your point, turn the blind eye to the two decades
30:50
Speaker 12: of child abuse that Amnesty International and others have all
30:54
Speaker 12: documented that the Hamas administration perpetrated on the children of Gaza.
30:58
Speaker 12: He forgets that, blanks the history before October 6th.
31:01
Speaker 5: How convenient.
31:02
Speaker 12: But to your point, yes, there is an awful, nasty
31:05
Speaker 12: streak in the left and, you know, amongst some of
31:07
Speaker 12: the bleeding hearts in this country, which is that it's
31:10
Speaker 12: OK to be anti-Israel, anti-Zionist and anti-Jewish because supposedly there
31:16
Speaker 12: was this awful crime committed in Gaza. For goodness sake,
31:18
Speaker 12: Hamas was causing crimes there for 20 years and they
31:21
Speaker 12: said nothing.
31:24
Speaker 5: Well said.
31:24
Speaker 1: Cameron Milner, Bronwyn Bishop, great to have you on again.
31:28
Speaker 1: All right, still to come, why is the Royal Commission
31:30
Speaker 1: keeping adhering into intelligence failures a secret? Plus, Ray Hadley
31:35
Speaker 1: will rip into bail laws after another senseless killing. He's
31:39
Speaker 1: right here after the break. The Albanese government is in
31:46
Speaker 1: pieces trying to decide whether to try block the US
31:49
Speaker 1: live streamed execution of Nidal Malik Hassan, who faced the
31:53
Speaker 1: firing squad on the 3rd of December. Hassan was found
31:56
Speaker 1: guilty of killing 13 people at a military base in
32:00
Speaker 1: Texas in 2009. Joining me now, radio legend Ray Hadley. Ray,
32:05
Speaker 1: now the eSafety Commissioner has weighed into this, saying that
32:09
Speaker 1: it can't block it from Australian viewers, but it does
32:13
Speaker 1: seem to be able to censor everything else.
32:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, look, I have no problems with the execution of
32:18
Speaker 2: this murderous lowlife.
32:21
Speaker 5: I wouldn't watch it.
32:22
Speaker 2: I have no desire to see someone killed in the
32:25
Speaker 2: manner that he's going to be killed in front of.
32:26
Speaker 5: A firing squad.
32:28
Speaker 2: But surely to goodness, if we don't want people to
32:32
Speaker 2: I guess, you know, you'd hate to think kids would
32:35
Speaker 2: see it at some stage and things like that. I mean,
32:37
Speaker 2: there's got to be some way to filter it. There
32:40
Speaker 2: has to be some way, surely.
32:42
Speaker 1: I also don't have a problem like you with the
32:45
Speaker 1: death penalty for terrorists, for really awful people. I just
32:48
Speaker 1: don't have a problem with it. But do I want
32:51
Speaker 1: to watch it? Probably not. I mean, we see enough
32:55
Speaker 1: death in our roles as journalists. I probably wouldn't want
33:00
Speaker 1: to watch it. And you'd be worried about kids seeing it.
33:02
Speaker 1: I don't know why they have to live stream it.
33:05
Speaker 5: Yeah.
33:06
Speaker 2: I was reading today it could be well against the
33:08
Speaker 2: American Constitution. They're in a bit of a battle against
33:10
Speaker 2: that as well. But look, 13 people died at his
33:14
Speaker 2: hand way back in 2009.
33:17
Speaker 5: He doesn't deserve to live.
33:18
Speaker 2: I agree.
33:19
Speaker 5: I agree.
33:19
Speaker 1: I have that same view about many other people that
33:22
Speaker 1: I will not say on air right now. All right,
33:24
Speaker 1: let's turn to bail laws. There's this shocking story, Ray,
33:27
Speaker 1: of a 13-year-old. He was out on bail when he
33:30
Speaker 1: allegedly killed a father. He's now back behind bars. But,
33:36
Speaker 1: I mean, why was he out on bail in the
33:37
Speaker 1: first place?
33:38
Speaker 2: Well, you see, it's very complicated because he actually got
33:40
Speaker 2: police bail. The police gave him bail. Then he went
33:43
Speaker 2: before the Children's Court and they continued the bail. Now,
33:47
Speaker 2: I'm not going to be criticising policemen for giving bail.
33:49
Speaker 2: There was a bail officer who made that decision. He'd
33:51
Speaker 2: been previously allegedly found with a knife. and allegedly has
33:56
Speaker 2: killed this man with a knife at Mount Druitt. So
34:00
Speaker 2: the Premier's all the time telling about the review of
34:03
Speaker 2: bail laws in relation to young offenders. I have a
34:06
Speaker 2: feeling that if the bail officer gave him bail, he
34:09
Speaker 2: would have been compelled to do so because of his age.
34:13
Speaker 5: He was 13.
34:13
Speaker 1: Well, he is 13.
34:16
Speaker 5: Yeah.
34:16
Speaker 2: So at the end of the day, he got bail
34:21
Speaker 2: from police, which often happens. He then appeals before a
34:24
Speaker 2: children's court. The bail is continued. Why wouldn't it be?
34:27
Speaker 2: Because police gave him bail. And if the police officer
34:30
Speaker 2: in charge of this was compelled to give him bail, well,
34:33
Speaker 2: it's something Chris Minns and his Attorney-General need to look
34:35
Speaker 2: at because obviously it resulted allegedly in the murder of
34:39
Speaker 2: an innocent man.
34:41
Speaker 1: A father, exactly. Kelly Sloan's now talking about having adult
34:46
Speaker 1: time for child crime, similar to the laws they've announced
34:50
Speaker 1: in Queensland today.
34:53
Speaker 2: Yeah, she has, but it doesn't, you know, jail time's
34:56
Speaker 2: got to be found guilty of the crime. This is
34:58
Speaker 2: about bail. And we had this allegedly fixed by the
35:02
Speaker 2: Attorney General. But if there are police officers compelled to
35:05
Speaker 2: give a 13-year-old allegedly over a knife crime bail, well,
35:09
Speaker 2: they need to review that as well.
35:12
Speaker 1: Chris Bowen, your favourite, Ray?
35:15
Speaker 2: Look.
35:15
Speaker 1: I don't want to get your blood pressure.
35:17
Speaker 5: No, no, no.
35:17
Speaker 1: But now the Daily Telegraph's revealed that he went to
35:20
Speaker 1: Saudi Arabia just days before his pre-cop snooze fest. We
35:25
Speaker 1: can call it a snooze fest. He fell asleep in Fiji.
35:29
Speaker 5: But this is what's interesting.
35:30
Speaker 1: The accommodation was reportedly paid for by the kingdom so
35:34
Speaker 1: he could attend an energy meeting.
35:36
Speaker 2: So maybe... Look, the kingdom of Saudi Arabia.
35:40
Speaker 2: They earn the bulk of their income through the sale
35:44
Speaker 2: of oil and petroleum, the finished product. So I just
35:48
Speaker 2: wonder how this bloke, as our energy minister, who's decrying
35:53
Speaker 2: fossil fuels all the time, can lie in the king-size
35:56
Speaker 2: bed given to him by the king of Saudi Arabia
36:00
Speaker 2: or one of his cousins and then think, no one's
36:03
Speaker 2: going to think much about it, then come back and
36:05
Speaker 2: spend $ 20 million to $ 25 million in Fiji, where, by
36:10
Speaker 2: the way, the Prime Minister insulted the Fijians by not.
36:13
Speaker 5: Wearing that headdress. The two balloons.
36:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, he probably thought he looked stupid enough in
36:16
Speaker 2: the shirt, you know, but that's nothing to do with...
36:19
Speaker 2: Fijian shirts, you know. It's more to do with him.
36:22
Speaker 2: But it was a really vain thing to do. I
36:24
Speaker 2: just imagine if he went to a smoking ceremony in
36:26
Speaker 2: Australia and an Indigenous person offered him some form of
36:31
Speaker 2: recognition of what.
36:32
Speaker 5: They were doing, he'd accept it.
36:33
Speaker 2: But he'd look really, really awkward with it by pushing.
36:36
Speaker 5: the headpiece away.
36:37
Speaker 1: Especially because there was the video footage of someone coming
36:40
Speaker 1: and trying to give it to him and then they
36:42
Speaker 1: obviously thought he didn't have one and they came back again.
36:45
Speaker 2: Well, he probably thought Warren Brown was going to come
36:47
Speaker 2: up with a cartoon in the Daily Telegraph of him
36:49
Speaker 2: looking rather stupid in the headdress and the floral shirt.
36:51
Speaker 2: But that doesn't mean he should insult our Fijian cousins
36:54
Speaker 2: who are wonderful, wonderful people.
36:56
Speaker 1: He doesn't need Warren Brown. Brown to make him look
36:58
Speaker 1: stupid given their current policies.
37:00
Speaker 5: Warren does a pretty good job. He does.
37:02
Speaker 9: He does.
37:03
Speaker 1: I'm interested in your take on Josh. There's been this
37:05
Speaker 1: debate raging. You heard me with Paul Kelly a bit earlier.
37:09
Speaker 5: Yeah.
37:10
Speaker 2: I was absolutely honoured to meet Paul. All the years
37:13
Speaker 2: I've been reading his stuff and had never met him.
37:16
Speaker 2: He gave me a bit of a tip about rugby
37:17
Speaker 2: league calling because he went to his first match of
37:19
Speaker 2: the day in 1959, St George and North, he told me,
37:23
Speaker 2: long before I started calling in 87. But, look, last
37:26
Speaker 2: week you and I sat here, Angus Taylor was on set,
37:29
Speaker 2: and we were singing his praises about finally enunciating something
37:33
Speaker 2: that the punters would agree with, immigration.
37:36
Speaker 10: Yes.
37:36
Speaker 2: So a week later he's decided to tear apart a
37:41
Speaker 2: person who's much loved within the Liberal Party and much
37:44
Speaker 2: loved as a prominent Jewish Australian. And as Paul Kelly
37:48
Speaker 2: documented here, he's got it all wrong. He's got it
37:52
Speaker 2: all wrong, as has the shadow treasurer. I mean, so
37:55
Speaker 2: he's gone from last week, you know, I guess roll
37:59
Speaker 2: gold chocolates to boil lollies this week. I mean, he
38:02
Speaker 2: just doesn't seem to get it right consistently. And he's
38:06
Speaker 2: probably worried that if Josh does decide sometime in the
38:08
Speaker 2: future to take up Kooyong and win it, that he'd
38:11
Speaker 2: be an automatic challenger for his leadership.
38:14
Speaker 5: I mean, it's a long way off, Nadia.
38:15
Speaker 1: I mean, Angus Taylor's got to worry about Andrew Hastie first,
38:18
Speaker 1: doesn't he?
38:19
Speaker 2: Well, I can't believe that we've got a Liberal leader.
38:24
Speaker 5: Mm.
38:25
Speaker 2: Agreeing with the Labor criticism of the spending of a
38:28
Speaker 2: former Liberal government. It just doesn't make any sense.
38:31
Speaker 1: Completely agree with you. It's unbelievable. They should be defending
38:35
Speaker 1: their economic record. This is the Coalition's strongest point of
38:39
Speaker 1: their economic credentials and they do have a lot.
38:42
Speaker 4: To be proud of.
38:43
Speaker 2: Look, I'm sure everyone has seen the footage of the
38:45
Speaker 2: man bun bloke today in Parliament, storming Parliament.
38:49
Speaker 5: Yeah, I saw that.
38:49
Speaker 1: New South Wales Parliament.
38:50
Speaker 2: Yeah, New South Wales Parliament. Just a couple of things.
38:53
Speaker 2: That bloke I think the man bun may have been
38:55
Speaker 2: a bit tight. He's screaming and yelling that he wants.
38:58
Speaker 1: He said man bun, like a hairstyle.
38:59
Speaker 5: The thing at the back of.
39:00
Speaker 2: His head, the man bun. You see a lot of
39:02
Speaker 2: rugby league players with man buns these days. I'm not
39:05
Speaker 2: a fan of the man bun, incidentally, and I'm not
39:07
Speaker 2: going to start. Anyway, that's another story for another day.
39:10
Speaker 2: So this bloke's in there screaming at Chris Minns, and
39:13
Speaker 2: I think the AG got it right.
39:15
Speaker 5: The Attorney-General called him a rat bag.
39:17
Speaker 2: But the simple fact of the matter is this bloke
39:20
Speaker 2: needs to understand this, as he's been congratulated by fellow protesters...
39:24
Speaker 2: If coal stops tomorrow, 60% to 80% of New South
39:27
Speaker 2: Wales and Queensland will be in blackout because that's how
39:32
Speaker 2: much coal puts into the grid. The biggest exporter in
39:37
Speaker 2: New South Wales and Queensland is coal. His electric bike
39:41
Speaker 2: or his electric scooter, or if he's well enough, his
39:44
Speaker 2: electric car, won't work if the power's not there because
39:47
Speaker 2: the lights won't be on The fridge won't work. And
39:51
Speaker 2: unless he's living in a tent or a cave, he
39:53
Speaker 2: won't have power.
39:54
Speaker 5: Yeah.
39:54
Speaker 2: And so what I just don't understand, it's all well
39:57
Speaker 2: and good to have some.
39:58
Speaker 5: Sort of ideology. But it's the practicality of it.
40:02
Speaker 2: Coal is the biggest export earner in New South Wales
40:06
Speaker 2: and Queensland. We send a stack of it to Japan
40:10
Speaker 2: who use a third of it to power big cities
40:13
Speaker 2: in Japan. And yet here we are, you know, this
40:16
Speaker 2: ratbag as he's... You need.
40:17
Speaker 1: To give him a lesson, Ray. We need to get
40:19
Speaker 1: him watching our news channel. So good to see you.
40:22
Speaker 2: Well, it's got to understand that if we take coal
40:24
Speaker 2: out of the grid tomorrow, you and I will be
40:26
Speaker 2: in the dark. These lights won't work. That won't work.
40:28
Speaker 5: The TV, none of it will work.
40:30
Speaker 4: Absolutely, absolutely.
40:31
Speaker 1: We'll see you next Monday.
40:32
Speaker 5: I hope so.
40:33
Speaker 1: Or Tuesday.
40:34
Speaker 9: Monday.
40:35
Speaker 7: Monday next week.
40:36
Speaker 1: All right, coming up, the blast by the Houthis at
40:39
Speaker 1: Saudi Arabia's Riyadh Airport. Where is the war heading? We'll
40:43
Speaker 1: speak with Peter Jennings after the break. Well, there are
40:50
Speaker 1: reports that the United States and Saudi Arabia are preparing
40:53
Speaker 1: to jointly strike the Houthis in Yemen after a strike
40:57
Speaker 1: on Riyadh Airport, killing 13 and injuring hundreds. President Trump
41:01
Speaker 1: was asked about this. Here's what he said.
41:04
Speaker 7: Well, they're able to defend.
41:05
Speaker 2: Look, the Saudis are good fighters, but I think the
41:08
Speaker 2: attack was a terrible thing.
41:10
Speaker 1: And joining me now, News 24 defence analyst Peter Jennings. Peter,
41:14
Speaker 1: good to see you. This strike shows how the conflict
41:17
Speaker 1: has spread throughout the Middle East. What do you expect
41:20
Speaker 1: the US and Saudi Arabia to do?
41:24
Speaker 16: Shari, I think after the midterms, we're going to see
41:27
Speaker 16: definitely a Saudi and probably a US-Saudi set of strikes
41:31
Speaker 16: on the Houthis. What comes out of this, despite the
41:34
Speaker 16: President's comments, is this was a total failure of Saudi
41:37
Speaker 16: air defence. They weren't able to shoot any of these
41:40
Speaker 16: drones and missiles down. And the Houthis are showing themselves
41:43
Speaker 16: to be a very competent military force, trained and backed
41:46
Speaker 16: by Iranian Revolutionary Guard advisers. So the war is going to,
41:52
Speaker 16: I think, after November 3 midterms, it's going to broaden
41:55
Speaker 16: and there'll be a southern front, which is going to
41:57
Speaker 16: be the Saudis going after the Houthis on the Red Sea.
42:03
Speaker 1: Just in another story, Ilhan Omar's house has been raided
42:06
Speaker 1: by Homeland Security. Peter, this pre-dawn raid is said to
42:09
Speaker 1: be about alleged immigration fraud. What do we know?
42:16
Speaker 16: Well, the immigration fraud appears to relate to Ilhan Omar's
42:21
Speaker 16: arrival into the United States as a child. It's been
42:25
Speaker 16: described by the FBI as being a long-running case. But
42:30
Speaker 16: what I think is curious about it, Shari, is that
42:32
Speaker 16: it's happening only 23 days before the midterm elections when
42:37
Speaker 16: Ilhan Omar is going to be a candidate. And it
42:42
Speaker 16: goes to accusations that are now coming from the Democrat
42:45
Speaker 16: side about politicisation of the FBI, as though that didn't
42:48
Speaker 16: happen in their own time in government. And I just
42:52
Speaker 16: wonder what it's going to do to Ilhan Omar's majority,
42:56
Speaker 16: if indeed she's re-elected in the Congress in three weeks' time.
42:59
Speaker 1: Yeah, it would be good to see the facts of
43:02
Speaker 1: the case. Turning to domestic issues, the Royal Commission will
43:05
Speaker 1: hold an 11th hour closed hearing around the security environment
43:10
Speaker 1: in the lead up to the Bondi massacre. Now, I mean,
43:13
Speaker 1: I've got chapters in the book on this, Peter, but
43:15
Speaker 1: why is this confidential? Does it require this level of secrecy?
43:21
Speaker 16: Well, it does go to intelligence and policing, and I
43:24
Speaker 16: have no doubt that some of that is secret. But
43:27
Speaker 16: as a person that worked in that national security world, Shari,
43:31
Speaker 16: I think the The level of required secrecy is being
43:34
Speaker 16: seriously overplayed here. I just wonder if the Royal Commission
43:38
Speaker 16: staff who are not from that world might be a
43:41
Speaker 16: little lacking an understanding of how much needs to be
43:45
Speaker 16: done in public. Let's remember that a key function of
43:48
Speaker 16: this Royal Commission is to expose to the public light
43:51
Speaker 16: what happened, what mistakes were made, if mistakes were made,
43:56
Speaker 16: how this situation came about.
43:58
Speaker 5: And the more of it that.
43:59
Speaker 16: Can be conducted in the open, the better. The other thing,
44:04
Speaker 16: just very briefly, is to say I think it shows
44:06
Speaker 16: that the Royal Commission needs more time. So it's up
44:09
Speaker 16: against a deadline which is going to see its final
44:12
Speaker 16: report brought out just in the last few days before Christmas.
44:16
Speaker 16: Why on earth they couldn't have asked for six more
44:18
Speaker 16: months to do this more carefully and more thoroughly and
44:20
Speaker 16: more openly, I think, is something which is very disappointing.
44:24
Speaker 1: Yeah, I completely agree. I mean, they needed more time
44:27
Speaker 1: from the start. Just final, very quick comment, Peter. It
44:30
Speaker 1: does show that this entire... It indicates that the entire
44:34
Speaker 1: Royal Commission process has been haphazard, a bit.
44:38
Speaker 5: Of a mess.
44:40
Speaker 16: Too quick. It's just gone too quickly. Most Royal Commissions
44:43
Speaker 16: take at least two and a half years. I just
44:47
Speaker 16: think that that was a mistake from the start and
44:50
Speaker 16: they're struggling to recover from it now when they clearly
44:52
Speaker 16: still want to gather further evidence.
44:55
Speaker 1: All right, Peter Jennings, thank you so much. Still to come,
44:58
Speaker 1: why an Australian tech entrepreneur wants a video taken down
45:01
Speaker 1: after an attempt to go public with his company failed.
45:05
Speaker 2: That's next.
45:09
Speaker 1: Well, Oliver Curtis's AI company, Firmus, failed to float on
45:12
Speaker 1: the ASX after it was speculated he overvalued the demand
45:16
Speaker 1: for his shares, valuing the company at $ 44 billion. And
45:19
Speaker 1: when questioned by journalist Liam Mendes on this, he was agitated.
45:24
Speaker 5: And you didn't mislead investors? Mislead investors?
45:27
Speaker 2: No.
45:27
Speaker 5: Oh, that's it. That's a disgraceful comment. No, no, I'm
45:31
Speaker 5: just saying, I'm just putting it to you. You didn't
45:33
Speaker 5: mislead them? That's a disgraceful comment. I just want, I just... No, no.
45:36
Speaker 11: You know, if you're going to try and stoke a
45:38
Speaker 11: little reaction, just be careful.
45:43
Speaker 2: What you say.
45:46
Speaker 1: And there's a suggestion he didn't want that video to
45:48
Speaker 1: run with lawyers becoming involved. Well, joining me now to
45:51
Speaker 1: discuss is a leading private market investor in global technologies,
45:54
Speaker 1: BFA Global Investors, Chief Executive Jonathan Bells. Jonathan, great to
45:58
Speaker 1: see you.
45:59
Speaker 17: Pleasure to be here.
46:00
Speaker 1: You're usually based in Singapore. Now, this would have been
46:03
Speaker 1: the biggest IPO in Australian history.
46:06
Speaker 4: What went wrong?
46:07
Speaker 5: Yeah.
46:07
Speaker 17: Well, I think we have to differentiate a couple of
46:10
Speaker 17: things here. Like, on one hand... the supply and demand
46:13
Speaker 17: when it comes to data centres is incredibly strong. We're
46:15
Speaker 17: at the start of an incredible tech transformation. But the
46:20
Speaker 17: other hand is when you're going into public markets, the
46:22
Speaker 17: scrutiny that's required to ultimately get public is very different.
46:27
Speaker 17: You're looked at it from a valuation perspective, from other
46:30
Speaker 17: elements such as, you know, the quality of the contracts,
46:33
Speaker 17: et cetera. So it doesn't mean just because you have
46:35
Speaker 17: a very strong model that everything stacks up when you
46:38
Speaker 17: actually go to be a public company.
46:40
Speaker 1: Now, one of the firm's investors, James Packer, believes that
46:44
Speaker 1: Australia is trying to tear down risk takers. Is he
46:47
Speaker 1: right to say this, in your opinion?
46:50
Speaker 17: Yeah, I can totally understand the frustration from James and
46:53
Speaker 17: many others when you really want Australia to succeed and
46:56
Speaker 17: be a global player, especially we're in this moment of
46:58
Speaker 17: incredible change and AI really is something very different. But
47:01
Speaker 17: I do think we have to separate a couple of
47:03
Speaker 17: things here. It doesn't just mean that any company should
47:07
Speaker 17: be able to go public. And you really do have
47:11
Speaker 17: to separate what it takes to become a national leader.
47:16
Speaker 17: And scrutiny is a good thing, right? If we really
47:18
Speaker 17: want to have trust in our companies, we can't just
47:20
Speaker 17: rely on everything going public and valuations being whatever certain
47:24
Speaker 17: people demand. So I think trust is absolutely critical.
47:29
Speaker 1: Speaking of massive AI IPOs, Anthropic is looking to go public,
47:33
Speaker 1: a valuation of $ 2 trillion. What are you hearing about this?
47:37
Speaker 17: Yeah, so obviously this is the topic of the town
47:41
Speaker 17: at the moment because so much of this AI trade
47:43
Speaker 17: now relies on Anthropic. It's incredibly ironic that we live
47:47
Speaker 17: in this world of capitalism and thousands of companies and
47:50
Speaker 17: it really comes down to one company and what they're
47:52
Speaker 17: going to ultimately achieve. What I am hearing, though, is
47:55
Speaker 17: this is going to surprise people on the upside, how
47:57
Speaker 17: fast this company has grown, despite the pressures from open
48:01
Speaker 17: source and China and other, you know, different models coming
48:04
Speaker 17: into play. What we're hearing is that the run rate
48:06
Speaker 17: and growth and the adoption is just continuing to grow very,
48:09
Speaker 17: very fast. And even though they, you know, are doing
48:12
Speaker 17: interesting things with alignment and, you know, the probably believers
48:16
Speaker 17: all dying and all these kind of outlandish comments, I
48:18
Speaker 17: think we're going to see from the numbers that these
48:20
Speaker 17: business models really do stack up.
48:23
Speaker 1: The IMF has warned that these kind of sky-high valuations
48:26
Speaker 1: of AI companies could put global financial stability at risk
48:31
Speaker 1: if there's a crash. Do you think there is a
48:34
Speaker 1: risk of a crash with companies like Anthropic?
48:38
Speaker 17: Yeah, certainly, as I said, you know, when you have
48:40
Speaker 17: so much of market sentiment relying on one company or
48:43
Speaker 17: a couple of companies, you're at risk on one hand.
48:47
Speaker 17: On the other hand, though, I look at this trade
48:49
Speaker 17: and I see the spending that's going into AI is
48:52
Speaker 17: coming from really, really profitable and cash producing companies like
48:56
Speaker 17: Google and Amazon and Facebook. who were previously putting that
48:59
Speaker 17: money in social media and maybe less great technologies. So
49:04
Speaker 17: I think from a sentiment and how important the trade
49:08
Speaker 17: is right now, I think, yes, definitely. But I think
49:11
Speaker 17: it's a bit different from, say, 2007, where the entire
49:14
Speaker 17: banking system was caught up in this, where it was
49:17
Speaker 17: mums and dads' loans and you know, structures on structures
49:20
Speaker 17: which threatened the entire financial system. So I think from
49:23
Speaker 17: an equity perspective and perception of growth and maybe the
49:26
Speaker 17: US economy, dangerous, but from an entire financial system point
49:30
Speaker 17: of view, maybe not quite there yet.
49:33
Speaker 1: Your background is China. You work there. You understand the
49:36
Speaker 1: business environment there. You speak Mandarin.
49:38
Speaker 5: I mean, part of this.
49:39
Speaker 1: US urgency on AI is in response to China. I mean,
49:44
Speaker 1: is this a winner-takes-all scenario?
49:46
Speaker 17: Yeah, I think the conventional wisdom is, you know, this
49:50
Speaker 17: technology is only going to end up in a US
49:54
Speaker 17: or China construct. I actually have a very different view.
49:56
Speaker 17: I think it's a lot more nuanced, which is I
49:58
Speaker 17: think technology here is going to be ubiquitous. We're all
50:01
Speaker 17: going to have it. We're all going to be living
50:03
Speaker 17: in it like air. The difference, though, I think, when
50:05
Speaker 17: you think about winners and losers, is more about how
50:08
Speaker 17: quickly this technology can get diffused. Now, with these big
50:11
Speaker 17: companies IPOing and all the pressures on jobs, et cetera,
50:14
Speaker 17: the fundamental question now is how quickly this can diffuse
50:18
Speaker 17: and how quickly it can make returns for everyone.
50:20
Speaker 1: Jonathan, great to have you on the show.
50:22
Speaker 5: Pleasure. Thank you for that.
50:23
Speaker 1: Thanks, everyone, for your company tonight. I'll see you tomorrow
50:26
Speaker 1: at 8 o'clock. And here's, I think, Kayla Bond with
50:29
Speaker 1: Paul Murray.