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Australia’s New Hate Laws Just Hit Their First Target — And It Wasn’t a Neo‑Nazi · The Slippery Slope

• 0:01
  With. The red light.
• 0:05
  On I'm just waiting for the. Change.
• 0:10
  On February 18, ACT Policing raided a music venue in
• 0:15
  Canberra, evacuated patrons and declared the place a crime
• 0:19
  scene. It was because of so called art
• 0:23
  hanging on the wall. This is exactly what many have
• 0:28
  warned would happen when the government rushed through the
• 0:32
  new hate speech laws. Legal experts warned it.
• 0:36
  Civil libertarians warned it, and I wanted to, because after
• 0:40
  more than a decade in policing, I know how vague powers get used
• 0:45
  in the real world. They don't stay confined to
• 0:48
  extremists. They expand.
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  They get weaponized, and eventually they land on ordinary
• 0:55
  people who simply hold the wrong political view.
• 1:03
  So the hypothetical became reality.
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  You might think, well, if someone displayed a hate symbol,
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  surely they intended to spread hate.
• 1:14
  But that is the trap. Under these laws, you don't need
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  intent. As I said, you only need to be
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  reckless about whether a symbol was displayed, and that
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  threshold is dangerously, dangerously low.
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  So the posters in question were anti fascist satire mocking
• 1:34
  world leaders as dictators, not promoting them.
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  But the police didn't care about context, They saw a symbol tick
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  the box and shut a business down.
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  That's what happens when legislation is drafted broadly
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  and enforced mechanically. So just to be absolutely clear,
• 1:55
  I do not like the posters, nor do I agree with the messaging in
• 2:00
  the posters. But the government says this is
• 2:05
  about safety. But when police are shutting
• 2:08
  down gigs to assess the artistic merit of a poster, you have to
• 2:13
  ask whether the government has handed itself a weapon it
• 2:16
  doesn't know how to control. So here's the incident.
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  We have a Canberra venue called Descent Cafe and Bar.
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  It was forced to close and cancel a gig after police seized
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  5 posters following a complaint about possible hate imagery.
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  Police attended. They've asked the owner to
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  remove the posters and when he declined, which he is legally
• 2:45
  entitled to do, they escalated. A crime scene was declared, the
• 2:50
  venue was shut down, the posters were seized.
• 2:55
  ACT Policing later said 5 posters were subsequently seized
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  and will be considered under recently enacted Commonwealth
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  legislation regarding hate symbols.
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  They also confirmed they are seeking legal advice on whether
• 3:14
  the posters are even illegal. Did you hear that?
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  So as someone who spent more than a decade in policing, let
• 3:23
  me translate that little statement for you.
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  What they're saying is they weren't sure it was a crime, but
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  they acted as if it was. That statement alone should
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  terrify you. It terrifies me.
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  The political reaction has been fierce.
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  The Greens and several independents have condemned the
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  action as wrongly or sorry, worryingly Orwellian and a
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  direct threat to free speech. They're now questioning whether
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  the legislation was rushed and whether it's even workable.
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  And honestly, they are right to ask.
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  But they probably should have thought about this beforehand
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  and questioned a lot more So what the posters actually were.
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  The posters depicted figures like Donald Trump, Benjamin
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  Netanyahu, Vladimir Putin, Elon Musk in photoshopped Nazi style
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  uniforms. The artists who called the Grow
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  Up art collective said it was anti fascist satire.
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  The venue owner said the same. So again, I do not like the
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  posters nor do I agree with the message.
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  However, we need free speech and this kind of political
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  commentary has existed for decade whether I agree with it
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  or not. But under these laws, context
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  doesn't matter, intent doesn't matter, matter.
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  Satire doesn't matter. The symbol is the offence, and
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  that's the problem. So this is really a legal trap.
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  Let's talk about the hidden mechanics of this law, because
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  this is where the danger really lies.
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  A defence is not a shield that stops police from entering your
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  building. A defence is something you argue
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  months later in court after you've been charged, your
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  property has been seized, your business has been disrupted and
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  you've spent thousands on legal fees.
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  To rely on the artistic purpose defence, the display must be
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  genuine and reasonable. And who decides what's genuine?
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  Art? Art was always in the eye of the
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  beholder. So first the police officer
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  standing in your venue, later a court.
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  So you have to ask yourself, is it reasonable to display a
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  swastika in a cafe window where a Jewish passerby might see it
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  and feel threatened? Even if the intent is satire,
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  that is exactly the question the prosecution will ask.
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  And here's the irony, the artists used fascist imagery to
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  criticise fascism. But the law doesn't care about
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  ideology, it bans the symbol not the meaning.
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  So an anti fascist mocking a leader they believe is a
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  dictator is treated the same as a neo Nazi promoting promoting
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  hate. So this law captures the
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  satirist and the extremist alike and forces the satirist to hire
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  a lawyer to explain the difference.
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  So here's the policing reality. When police say they are seeking
• 7:02
  legal advice, that is code 4. We don't actually know if this
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  is legal, but by that point the venue is closed, the posters are
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  gone, the gig is cancelled, the damage is done.
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  Police operate on a risk averse model.
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  If they leave the posters up and it turns out to be a hate crime,
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  then they've failed. If they seize them and it turns
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  out to be art, they can return them later.
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  So from a policing standpoint, seizure is the safest option.
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  But from a civil liberties standpoint, that safe option is
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  catastrophic. It means freedom of speech
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  becomes secondary to administrative caution.
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  Legal bodies warned this would happen.
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  They warned police would struggle to distinguish between
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  hate speech and commentary about hate speech.
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  Not because police are stupid, but because police enforce the
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  law, they don't interpret it, and when the law is vague, they
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  take the safest path, as they always do.
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  So the bigger picture, the bigger picture in all this is
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  that this law was born out of a real tragedy and a real rise in
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  anti semitism, but it is now being applied in a way that
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  targets political dissent and political communication.
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  So the shutdown of the Descent Cafe, I mean, the name says it
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  all, proves that the safeguards in this legislation are not
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  enough to prevent overreach. We've created a system where the
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  symbol carries more legal weight than the intent or the ideology
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  behind it. Police are still seeking legal
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  advice, but the fact they needed advice after shutting down a
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  business tells you everything you need to know about how
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  confusing and poorly communicated these powers are.
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  And if you think this won't affect you, think again.
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  Next time. It might not be a Cafe in
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  Canberra. It might be a history teacher, a
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  comedian, a Bible teaching pastor or you sharing a meme in
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  a group chat. All it takes is 1 complaint.
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  That's all it takes. The government says this is
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  about making Australia safer, but we have to ask ourselves,
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  where do we draw the line between safety and just being
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  silenced? And is this just about
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  manipulation and control? As always, this is just my
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  opinion. I'm Jay Fallon.
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  Thank you for listening to The Slippery Slope.
• 10:24
  They just. Feel the desire they will take
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  me higher. I'm on fire because nothing's
• 10:29
  going to bring me down. Nothing's going to be done,
• 10:30
  nothing's going to stop me now. No one deals to be done as I'm
• 10:34
  not going to stand on me going and nothing 's going to and
• 10:56
  nothing's going to hold me down. Got my eye on the eyes, got my
• 11:10
  sign. It seems nothing's going.
• 11:16
  Nothing's. Going to stop me now.
• 11:20
  Nothing's going to stop me now.