Latest / SpaceTomatoes / Deliciously Free Jon Francois Escapes Toxic Radio for Podcast Pivots, & Uber Shenanigans S3-EP7

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Deliciously Free Jon Francois Escapes Toxic Radio for Podcast Pivots, & Uber Shenanigans S3-EP7 · SpaceTomatoes

0:00
What is your favorite part about doing podcasts?
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Is it talking to the different people?
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Like, for me, that's probably what my favorite part is,
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because a lot of these people I would probably never run into in my life, ever.
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But I know for Havoc, his favorite part is the editing.
0:14
He loves it.
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I don't know why, but he just thinks it's great.
0:30
all right everybody welcome back to another episode of the space tomatoes podcast i'm one
0:45
of your hosts havoc i'm alex the other guy right here hello welcome back all those things today
0:52
we're joined by a special guest john francois host of the delicious culture with john francois
0:58
Welcome to the show.
0:59
Hey, Josh.
1:00
Thank you so much.
1:01
Yeah, I'm glad to be here.
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I was listening to one of your recent episodes with the lawyer.
1:07
That was a really fascinating listen.
1:08
So I'm so glad to be here.
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You guys do a great job.
1:11
Well, thank you.
1:11
Thank you.
1:12
Yeah, we've tuned into a few of your episodes as well.
1:16
So where did the idea for the-
1:18
I'm sorry about that, by the way.
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No, no.
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Wonderful, wonderful stuff.
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Where did the idea for the delicious culture come from?
1:25
So I've been podcasting for six years and I, when I started podcasting in 2020, it was merely an extension of what I was doing in commercial radio.
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I had been working in this sort of music-based, entertainment-based commercial radio format for eight years and was still doing that during the pandemic.
1:53
And I loved the creative freedom that podcasting gave that I could not get from FCC-regulated airwaves.
2:01
so um i decided to uh get into podcasting i think nine years too late because i
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listened to podcasts way back in 2011 and thought oh wow this is wonderful like you know i i remember
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listening to um and these are you know og guys uh mark maron adam carolla i think adam carolla
2:31
a podcast version of the NPR show, Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me.
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And I had an iPod to let you know how long ago this was.
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So I was just captivated by the fact that like,
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oh, these are shows that are made for the internet
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that you can just like listen to on your iPod.
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And I thought that it was like this big complicated thing to make these.
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So of course, for nearly a decade, I just never followed through on it
2:56
and was just doing more traditional media sort of things
3:01
like public access television, college radio.
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So in 2020, I finally decided to come around
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to try out the podcasting thing.
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And fortunately, I found this platform called Anchor,
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which is now called Spotify for Creators,
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where literally you just record something,
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upload the file, and then boom,
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they'll distribute it to all the major platforms
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where people listen to podcasts.
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obviously Spotify and Apple and Sirius XM and Amazon, et cetera. So just to start with,
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I mean, being in radio, I always loved the morning radio show format. I got into radio
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because of conversation and morning radio. That's the day part where conversation and personality
3:45
is the most key. So I did something called the anything show with Jean-Francois, which was just
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this goofy show influenced by morning radio where it's like, all right, we're going to just give you
3:56
like these quick headlines that really don't have any significance to your life or the world.
4:02
It could just be something goofy, like, you know, 57% of people say that dogs should have,
4:08
I don't know, t-shirts on their butt. Like, what do you think about that guest? It was just like
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really stupid shit like that. And then, you know, I play like viral video clips. And I have like 10
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minutes with a guest that I found through the Premiere Radio Networks syndicate. When I worked
4:30
in commercial radio, we would always get these emails from Premiere Networks where it's like,
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hey, do you want to have 10 minutes with this B or C level celebrity? Could be an author,
4:38
actor, musician, whatever. So I'd put that in. So yeah, it was pretty much a multi-format radio,
4:44
crazy variety show thing that I did in the beginning of my podcasting journey.
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So I did that for about three years.
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And then for the next two following that,
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I was noticing a rewatch podcast craze.
4:59
People watching old shows from their childhood
5:01
or cast members from these old shows,
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going back and recapping episodes
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and talking to people who worked on the show And I was really fascinated by that concept So I decided to just take a big swing and change the format to a 90s rewatch style podcast
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It was called The Delicious Recap.
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And I don't know if you guys are familiar
5:21
with the 90s sitcom Family Matters
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with Steve Urkel and all that nonsense.
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So me and-
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Did I do that?
5:27
Yeah, yeah, did I do that?
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Do you got cheese?
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Like it just all the catchphrases,
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all the catchphrases.
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so me and a co-host that I worked with at the time
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we decided to dive into that
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we recapped episodes from the first two seasons
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and talked to many guests, cast and crew
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that worked on the series
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and yeah, I definitely appreciate that two years that we had
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and we had some fans who liked what we were doing
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and you know, after two years
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I think me and that co-host found out that, oh God, this is a lot of work.
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Because it would literally like, you know, without the commercials, the Family Matters
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episodes are like, what, 22 minutes.
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So you would think that like, oh, okay, like watching the episode and having thoughts or
6:22
notes on it would be simple.
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But for someone like me who wants to like detail, break down every scene, every moment,
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every funny joke, you know, each, each time I had to prep for a recap, it was like three,
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four, five hours out of my day to, because I was always stopping.
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I was pausing the 22 minute episode, like every two seconds to like write down like,
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Oh, here's what I found fascinating.
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So at first that became fun, but after a while it was, uh, it was a grind and there's only
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so many guests, cast and crew that are interested in coming on this podcast.
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We had quite a few, but the well started to run dry.
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And Family Matters is nine seasons long.
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So I reached a point where I said to my co-host, like, I don't know.
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I don't know if this is like a good long-term sustainable idea.
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And so then we pivoted once again.
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And it was, I believe, in the late summer of 2025 that we started the Delicious Culture.
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Sure. And that originally became a sort of pop culture, current events, commentary podcast with my co-host, AJ Vander Tunt.
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And, you know, three or four months into that time, we or I decided that it would be best if we split our partnership after five years,
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because it was getting to a point where we weren't on the same page in terms of like the amount of focus that we're putting on the content.
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and posting on social media and stuff like that.
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So once he left, that put me in sort of this high-pressure situation
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of like, all right, how do I want to reformat this podcast?
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Like, how do I want to reignite it as me as a solo act?
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So then it just gradually became what it is now, which is, I mean,
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I've always loved talking and getting to know different sorts
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of interesting people like you you guys you're yourself i hope to have you on the podcast someday
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if you're interested um and yeah and now um you know especially i'm a solo act i don't i'm not
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one of those podcasters that like likes to talk by themselves for an hour like i always love to
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talk with people get to know people have conversations with others so now um it's just
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this sort of cavalcade of like oh like i'm having people that i'm meeting for the first time either
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through the PodMax service, which is how you guys and I hooked up. I'm having old friends from
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school or family members come on. And obviously we have that shared personal history and connection,
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so we can vibe off of that. Basically now the delicious culture is I get to know people's story
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and a common thread for all the guests is that I ask them what I like to call my three delicious
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questions, which is what's a delicious meal you've had lately? What's a delicious piece of pop culture
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that you're obsessed with right now?
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And what is a delicious thing that's happened in your life lately?
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So that's where I'm at right now, six years later,
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is just having fun conversing with people
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and just seeing how they answer these three questions
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because everybody, of course, has their own unique way
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of answering those questions.
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And it's been really fun.
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I mean, it's been really fun.
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I mean, you know, podcasting used to be like this thing
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that I had like a love-hate relationship with
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because, you know, for a good amount of time,
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I would say for the first four years of it, I was doing it while I was also doing radio.
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And between radio and podcasting, I was pumping out a lot of content.
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So I was easily getting burned out and would have some hiatuses from the podcast because
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the radio jobs I was doing, I mean, that was putting food on the table.
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That was paying my bills.
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And once I decided to leave the radio industry back in 2024 and gradually decided to put
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more focus into podcasting. Now all of my creative energy is put toward that. And now I'm excited.
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I excited about podcasting in a way that I never been excited before And I yeah that that pretty much about it I I I sorry if that a rambling story but No that good That good That in a nutshell my story yeah What is your favorite part about doing podcasts
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Is it talking to the different people?
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Like for me, that's probably what my favorite part is
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because a lot of these people I would probably never run into
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in my life ever.
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But I know for Havoc, his favorite part is the editing.
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He loves it.
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I don't know why, but he just thinks it's great.
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Lie.
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Yeah. So Roy Pacquette from the podcast donation who I mean, I was on his podcast recently and
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I essentially told him about the love hate relationship that I have with editing. So
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with podcasting, what I love about it is right now with this format, again, it's definitely
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like being able to talk to a different guests as much as I can every single week. I think that just
11:17
keeps it fresh and interesting is to talk to a different personality, see what dynamic I have
11:20
with them, see what I can get to know about them. And also it's just being involved in the creative
11:27
process. Like, I don't know if I would be one of those big name podcasters where I just come in,
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you know, press record, talk, and then have a team just produce and edit everything.
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I just, I love having creative control over the product as tiring as it can be because,
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you know, I Uber and Lyft drive to actually pay the bills. So between that and all the time I'm
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putting into podcasting, it can be a lot, but I don't know if I would change what I'm doing
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because to be able to have a conversation with somebody and both enjoy the present moment,
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you know, the jokes and the engaging stories they have to tell. And also, you know, in the back of
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my mind during that conversation, I could just be like, oh my God, like, I think I've already
12:07
have the title of the episode or, oh, I think this could make an interesting social media clip,
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what they're saying right now. And then afterwards being able to like actually dive into
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riverside which is the the the website that i use to record and edit my podcast and you know just
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kind of like play around with with the with the content and the clips and all that stuff um yeah
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i think yeah i i i think that's what it is i think it's just that balance of like you know my pure
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love of of socializing and getting to know different kinds of people and also creating
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an interesting product out of it that you could listen and watch at the end of the day
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do you think the ai tools make things easier these days yeah yeah i mean um i i and i have
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a conflicting relationship with it because like i know that specifically i mean my wife tony she
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was on the she was on my podcast not so that's another i saw her on an episode but how do you
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get your wife on there because i've tried mine forever and she's no no no so what is your secret
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to do it because i would say that's one of your biggest success stories so far in podcast it's
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getting my wife to do the podcast um we've both been trying for a big year now so yeah no no no
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for for the partners of us who do this yeah it's i mean it's it's not always easy and i get it like
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you know they may not be in the same field that we are they may be shy to get in front of a mic
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um so i totally get that uh i mean my wife tony i mean she god i mean she was she first came on
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during my anything show days back during the pandemic not too long after we met um and
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you know she has always supported me from day one i'd like pretty much started listening to
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the podcast from like the moment that we met and i told her that i had a podcast and she's a fan
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uh no not a fan no no no no um she's certainly enjoyed some episodes that she's listened to
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nowadays it's it's to a point where you know understandably like you know she's uh she's more
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leaned into her own interests and that's totally fine i mean that's that's how it usually is with
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like spouses and and partners and whatnot is that you know they you know if you first meet them or
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if you first tell them you have a podcast they'll dive in and listen and and see what it's about
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And they'll either love it and stick with it, or they may tune into a few episodes here and there that interest them.
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But for the most part, they're doing their own thing.
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And that's totally fine.
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So as far as getting Tony on the podcast, you know, I convinced her pretty early on when we were, you know, back when we were just boyfriend and girlfriend.
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I knew that she was great at socializing and having a public speaking presentation because I've seen her in action with friends and relatives and such.
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Obviously, with her and I talking, I know she lights up a room.
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She has a great personality.
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She works as a veterinary technician and also as president of a dog rescue.
15:18
So there's also that part of it that means that she's just very well skilled at learning
15:24
how to communicate.
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And sure, like, you know, when she gets on the podcast, she will be much more quieter
15:32
and toned down than she is in real life But it is what it is I mean it still for me I think it still great to have out as a product because then I am naturally you know comfortable doing this
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podcast, being in control, being the host, I can joke around, goof around, be comfortable with her
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because she's my wife. And then, you know, she has like the, the, the, the response of someone
15:56
who's just like, Okay, Jonathan, you're just crazy. Like, I don't know, I just I just I think
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I think even if she's toned down, it's still a great dynamic to be like, Hey, I'm the crazy
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person. And she's the more like mature adult person trying to, you know, keep me in check
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and make sure that we're not talking about poop or whatever. Um, so, um, yeah, yeah. I mean,
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if that, yeah, if that makes sense, that's my answer is just like, you know, she,
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she knows how much this podcast means to me. She's already great as a communicator.
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And, um, even though, you know, there have been times where she's expressed like hesitation or a
16:31
come on, the more she's like, yeah, sure. I'll help you out. Like, you know, pretty much anytime
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I ask her, it's like, you know, yeah. If we have like a free Sunday, we're not doing anything then.
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And especially if we're like, you know, tuning into some big pop culture moment, like euphoria
16:44
on HBO and we want to talk about it, like, there you go. So that's the, that's really great. Cause
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every week I'm trying to pump out a new guest. So if every now and then I could have like
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reoccurring reliables, like my own wife, that's, that's, that's for all the better.
16:59
you hear that mrs lx
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yes come on the space tomatoes it's worth it come on i'm just giving her a hard time
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yeah she's gonna do whatever she's comfortable with no i think it's great to have her on though
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yeah yeah yeah every now and then obviously i don't want to ruin a good thing
17:18
right but uh yeah you know it's it's it's it's it's always fun to have her on
17:24
So one of the things you've described from your time in radio, at least I saw it in a couple of areas, is you described that as a toxic environment. Why is that? I always thought of radio as probably being like a super fun and, you know, interesting, chill, laid back, you know, maybe some pranks and jokes going on.
17:47
oh it can be oh it can be i and and i and i apologize i probably should have like
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put out a more nuanced opinion about radio um so yeah it definitely i've i definitely had a lot
18:00
of fun moments with with listeners with uh just having conversations by myself and communicating
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whoever the whoever wants to listen like i yeah definitely a lot of fun moments to be had over my
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eight years in radio. The toxicity that I'm talking about is, um, it's a very lowly paid
18:22
profession and it's that classic thing, like, you know, a fast food worker where it's like,
18:30
oh great. Overworked, underpaid. Like they want a lot out of you. Um, a lot of times you could be
18:38
doing like four or five jobs for the price of one. That's actually usually the case. Nevermind.
18:42
I got into radio for being on the air. I love being on the air. I love talking. And if that is the only goal, then sure, radio can work as a part-time profession. But I was at a point early in my radio career where I wanted to make it a living, where I wanted to make it full-time.
19:01
And when it becomes full time, that's where it can get tricky because then it's like, all right, not only am I on the air, but now I'm also the production director.
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I'm in charge of producing all the commercials.
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Maybe I'm in charge of setting up equipment or training new radio station employees that probably shouldn't be there because they have no business being on the air.
19:23
Like you, you quickly find out why radio can be a difficult thing to work in when you do it full time. So that's where I think it became a slippery slope. I think that if I stuck to it as just a part time thing where it's like, oh, I'm the weekend on air personality, I just come in and, and, and, and, you know, fuck around on the air for a few hours and then leave and go do my thing.
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maybe I'd still be working in radio, but like getting into it full time, um, really, uh, just
19:56
having headaches with the boss who again, doesn't want to pay you enough, but expects you to work
20:02
like every holiday except Christmas. Um, the, uh, the, the, the, the, the fellow coworker who's
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been there for many years and has a chip on his shoulder about, you know, Oh, like, why do you
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take, you know, why do you get to take this day off and that day off when I can't, when he really
20:20
can, he just doesn't have the guts to do that. Um, and, um, yeah. And, and, and having clients,
20:27
clients, clients who you record commercials for who, uh, are just very persnickety and rude and
20:35
how they communicate and you want to tell them off and you do, but then you get in trouble as if
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like you don't deserve to have respect and dignity and such.
20:47
So, um, and there's.
20:50
certainly an old guard to radio management. There is certainly the, the priority of like,
20:56
all right, like how can we attract the most amount of listeners possible, make the most money,
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not spend as much money rather than more of a progressive minded, like, Hey, like here are some
21:08
ideas that we could do to continue to be relevant in the present going on into the future. So it's
21:15
a lot of that. It's a lot of that. It sounds like, I mean, honestly, it sounds
21:20
exactly the same as corporate America, right? Yeah. Honestly. I mean, just you, yeah. So it's
21:28
not so much what you're doing. It's the other stuff and the management of things that, that
21:33
typically is problematic for people. Yeah. And, and, and I know someone here in Vermont who,
21:39
worked in full time in radio for a while and then
21:42
sized it down to part time, mostly because he was just tired of all the bullshit you have to deal
21:50
with as a full time employee and really want to get back to the roots of why he enjoyed radio.
21:55
And if I had to do things differently, because like what I did was like when I decided to leave
21:59
radio in 2024, like I left like cold turkey. Like I didn't even like do a gradual thing of like,
22:06
all right, let me just go from full-time production director and on-air personality to just part-time
22:10
on-air. And then I'll see if that positively affects my relationship with radio.
22:16
Did you do the take this job and shove it deal live on air like some of them guys?
22:21
No, no, no, no, no. Oh, God, no, no, no. I definitely didn't Howard Stern it or anything
22:25
like that.
22:27
Dying on the bridge.
22:29
no no i you know yes i was i was bitter and frustrated at the end of my radio career but
22:37
i was fortunate enough with my last job where it wasn't as toxic as a job like i don't know
22:45
two jobs before that where i rage quit like where i literally like just couldn't stand it and just
22:51
decided that morning i'm leaving i'm sending an email and i'm not coming back um no no this last
22:58
job that I worked in before I left radio for good. I was bitter, but I had my head on my shoulders
23:04
enough to say, okay, I'm going to give a two week notice. I want to give this a full year
23:08
before I decide to quit. So it was all professional. It was all professional. I said my goodbye on air
23:15
very respectfully and just kind of left it at that. But certainly in the couple of years since
23:22
I've left radio, I've had like, you know, regrets and what ifs like, Oh God, what if I just stayed
23:28
on in a part-time on-air capacity? Maybe that would have been great. Maybe I could have like
23:32
integrated my podcast audience with the existing radio audience and things like that. But, um,
23:38
my wife is a really good person to talk to about these things because she really, um, puts me into
23:43
focus and sets me straight as to like why I left in the first place, which was just, um, yeah, I was
23:50
just tired of the toxic culture. I was tired of working for somebody else within a toxic culture.
23:55
And I've always been someone who's loved to own my own shit and create my own shit and set my own
24:00
terms. So that's what I've been doing for the past couple of years is, you know, when I Uber and
24:07
Lyft drive, that's me setting my own terms. I get to work whenever I want, take time off whenever I
24:11
want. And with this podcast, another, it's, it's, once again, it's, you guys know, it's like you,
24:16
get to do whatever you want, you know, whatever topic and go as long as you want and release
24:22
episodes whenever you want. Like, so being able to remember that, like, oh no, this is the dream
24:27
for me. Like I've always wanted independence. I've been afraid to fully commit to that for quite some
24:32
time because you know how it is. I mean, you know, you grow up and you look at radio and television,
24:37
blah, blah, blah. And you think like, oh, in order to do what I want to do, I need to have that
24:40
validation from like this corporate executive level. And what's great about this day and age,
24:46
where it's very DIY and everybody's making their own content,
24:48
releasing it on the internet,
24:49
is that you can take ownership of your success and your passion.
24:53
You don't have to wait for this grand established figure
24:58
to give you the opportunity.
25:00
So the last couple of years, I've just been leaning into that,
25:02
and that's where I am right now.
25:05
As far as the radio thing, did it make any difference to you
25:08
what market you were in?
25:10
Say whether you're a hard rock guy or a hip-hop guy,
25:12
and you only can land a job at a contemporary adult hit station
25:17
or something and you didn't like the music they played?
25:20
Well, format was definitely important.
25:22
I mean, I was the kind of energetic, goofy personality
25:26
that fit with top 40.
25:29
And then kind of next to that was hot adult contemporary,
25:33
which is basically a fancy way of saying it's a mixture
25:36
of top 40 of today, but also music that your parents
25:41
sometimes grandparents could vibe with from their day um so top 40 hot adult contemporary
25:48
i did do an adult album alternative music format in iowa for a while and i was kind of surprised
25:54
that they wanted me because like you know you listen to the personalities and it very like npr sleepy long form conversational style with the way they go in between songs but um i was lucky enough to you know have a boss who was like no like you know i
26:10
love what you're doing uh with you know the top 40 work that i was doing in connecticut at the time
26:15
and she you know thought that the radio station could use a bit of fun a bit of a bit more
26:20
personality and that's what i came in to do and you know i did cause some trouble every now and
26:26
then because uh that's just what happens when you know i come from my background and then i'm
26:32
infusing it into this more like mature background uh so i was very um conscious about what music
26:42
formats fit for me as a personality uh when you say market like the first thing i thought of was
26:48
like the the towns and the cities that i would go yeah i think i had the terms wrong there yeah
26:54
No, that's okay. It's okay. You're good. You're good. Yeah, certainly when I was in the thick of it with radio, I was definitely concerned about like, oh, I got to move up to this market, that market.
27:04
Once I found out that there's sort of a hierarchy of markets that, I don't know, if where I worked in Iowa, if that was actually certified, considered a radio market, it would be way on the 200 or 300 level of markets.
27:20
And then you work all the way up to New York City, which is the number one market.
27:24
um i think once i left iowa that's when it sort of became a mission of like oh god i have to like
27:31
you know keep going up markets and and eventually get to the top that that was the goal for quite
27:38
some time um and then you know i i i i the the farthest i got was a medium-sized market i think
27:47
Albany, New York was like number 68. And it was during that time that I worked there that I
27:55
realized that like, oh, like, you know, whether I work in a medium sized market or a smaller market,
28:01
like in Iowa or Vermont, it feels the same. You know, you're doing the same kind of work. You're
28:07
on the air talking to an audience in a quiet studio. You're posting on social media. You're
28:13
you're doing a live broadcast at community events, like no matter if it's a small medium or maybe
28:19
major market, it all feels the same. And then my value sort of shifted from like, Oh, I got to have
28:24
like the biggest market job to, well, if it all feels the same, okay, how about I have a job in
28:32
radio and also keep my personal life in check. So when I moved to Albany, that was a period of time
28:39
where I was already a couple years into my relationship with my wife. We were talking about,
28:45
you know, wanting to get married, wanting to have a house and stuff like that. And she's been here
28:48
in Vermont. So, you know, I had my few years in Vermont and then I, you know, took a brief detour
28:52
in Albany. And I thought that, you know, me and my wife would try to make a long-term thing work
28:57
where I would work and live in Albany and then commute up to Vermont on the weekends to see her.
29:02
And then like seven or eight months into my Albany, New York tenure, I just realized like,
29:06
oh no, like no, this radio, this medium market, like, you know, big promotional radio job,
29:12
it's not worth jeopardizing this growing relationship that I have with, you know,
29:19
my then girlfriend, then turned fiance and now wife. So after seven or eight months of Albany,
29:24
New York, I just decided that, you know, trying to move up markets like that just no longer became
29:29
a priority for me anymore. In terms of radio, it was just doing it and also having a great
29:36
life outside of it where I could have friends, I could have my wife, I could have the quality of
29:41
life that I have here in Vermont that you don't really get in Albany, New York. So markets, yeah,
29:47
markets just suddenly didn't become important to me. And then that gave way to, you know,
29:53
after eight years, radio no longer becoming the important thing that it used to be. So yeah,
29:59
it's just funny. It's just funny. I mean, values change, your goals change over the course of time.
30:04
And you can either beat yourself in the head for that because you think like, oh, no, this is how my path should be.
30:08
Or you could just accept that, you know, we're all changing, evolving human beings.
30:13
And, you know, it's not weird.
30:16
How would a real radio guy?
30:17
How do you feel about guys like Howard Stern or like where I'm from Tampa?
30:21
They bubble the love sponge when, you know, love them or hate them.
30:24
Those guys, they get a lot of drama and they get, you know, the money to go along with it.
30:28
But I'm sure a lot of that bleeds into their personal life.
30:31
But I mean, how do you feel about guys like that?
30:33
Do you think they've kind of sold themselves out to get where they are?
30:36
So Bubba the Love Sponge, first of all, that's a fantastic name.
30:39
And I've heard Howard mention Bubba the Love Sponge quite a bit on his show.
30:42
So is he kind of like a shock jock sort of thing like Howard?
30:46
That's exactly what he is.
30:47
He's pretty much just like Howard.
30:49
I think they were both on that SiriusXM for a while.
30:51
He was on Howard's channel.
30:53
But he started in Tampa.
30:55
Most of his career was in Tampa.
30:57
But, you know, they used to have the strippers in the studio.
31:01
and you know, he gave away like boob, boob jobs for contests and you know, like the kind
31:06
of stuff.
31:07
Yeah.
31:08
Um uh so I mean look I mean there a lot of Howard Stern audience that thinks that he sold out
31:21
He's not as funny or as groundbreaking as he once was.
31:24
My opinion of that is that it is unrealistic to expect the Howard Stern of now.
31:30
I mean, he's like, what, 70 right now?
31:32
I mean, if you could imagine a 70-year-old guy still doing what he was doing in his, like, 30s, 40s, 20s
31:39
with the strippers and the, you know, and the really, really risque humor that he did, like
31:44
that would be sad. So what I see it as like, oh, this man has evolved. Like he just has transitioned
31:52
from his wilder younger days to now, you know, he's been in therapy, he's worked through some
31:58
shit and now he's just more mellow and is just more interested in, you know, could be long form
32:04
interview conversations. I mean, certainly like the first like 20 or 30 minutes of his show. I
32:08
I mean, you listen now, even now on Sirius X,
32:10
and you could still find the naughty Howard Stern of older days.
32:15
But, yeah, no, I just think he's grown up.
32:18
He's just mellowed out, and that's great
32:20
because I think that contributes to his longevity in the game.
32:25
Do you think you could see yourself doing any of that stuff?
32:28
No, no, no.
32:30
I don't think I ever thought I would be like that.
32:33
No, no, not.
32:35
So here's the funny thing.
32:36
I mean, when I was doing radio, like my energy gave off shock jock.
32:42
Like I was, you know, very obsessed with like coming up with crafty, witty, fun punch lines for every radio break.
32:50
And the way I presented myself.
32:52
Yeah.
32:52
I mean, program directors thought that I was trying to like shock and really get people's attention.
32:58
And it was just I don't know.
33:00
It was a mixture of like, oh, no, this is what I feel.
33:04
But also I want to put on a really entertaining show.
33:06
I care about the audience like actually being entertained so you know yeah I mean that you know
33:12
when I would list Howard Stern as an influence like I think you know there were some program
33:18
directors that thought like oh okay that's that can that's that's fine that you like Howard Stern
33:24
but maybe don't lean into that so much because that's not really what our identity is um I mean
33:30
what I think about Howard is I, I respect him. Like I really do. I don't listen to the show
33:36
nowadays regularly, like I used to, but I just respect his place in the game because I think
33:41
Howard arguably is responsible for the podcasting boom that we have today. Because if you think about
33:48
it, like, you know, between podcasting and Tik TOK and whatever, like the key thing to all of
33:53
the content that's being created on the internet today, it's authenticity. And I feel like Howard
33:58
was like really the first big person to just say fuck it i'm going to come on the air and just be
34:05
my full honest self yes you know well a lot of the time he come off as an immature teenage boy
34:11
with his jokes and whatnot and sure there's a lot of politically incorrect thing that that stuff that
34:17
he used to do back in the day yeah absolutely but i think what i always respect is that he just
34:21
decided to do away with this sort of polished professional way that radio used to be done and
34:27
just say, no, I'm just going to have fun, be honest, be myself, be vulnerable. Um, so yeah,
34:34
that I, I, I, for, for that, I will always respect him and occasionally check in on what he's doing
34:40
nowadays. Um, and, uh, yeah, I think I can hold two thoughts at the same time. I think I can,
34:46
I can have that respect and also say, all right, I'm not going to be a regular listener like I used
34:52
too because howard is a he's a complicated personality i mean he uh not only can he be a
34:57
little bit too immature for my taste and certainly you know sometimes a little bit mean to his uh to
35:04
his uh callers who call in uh but also uh he's a man who can be very bitter like he can let that
35:12
bitterness out i remember there's a period of time where he was just complaining about his uh
35:17
his contract, his relationship with Sirius XM and just thinking like, wow,
35:22
damn, you are at like the, the,
35:25
the high mountain pantheon of radio personalities. I mean, the,
35:29
the money you make, the stature you have, like you are up there and to,
35:33
and the fact that you're still unhappy and complaining as if you're any other
35:37
small market radio person like myself.
35:40
Yeah. Let me go home to my house in the Hamptons and cry about my,
35:43
my contract.
35:44
Yeah. It's that disconnect, right? It's that disconnect.
35:46
But like, it's just, I mean, yes, you know, he's Howard Stern.
35:51
He's going to be honest about what he's feeling.
35:52
That's what has made him successful.
35:54
But yeah, when he would complain about stuff like that, which was certainly not relatable
36:00
to the average listener, you know, that kind of stuff can turn me off.
36:04
So it's to a point with Howard where I check in every now and then.
36:08
I personally think that it wouldn't be a bad thing to gradually make your way out of the
36:14
radio game and lean into other parts of your life.
36:16
He seems to be hanging on.
36:18
He seems to have his identity so tied to radio
36:21
that he I guess wants to do it forever And that his right He been in the enough But yeah I think I think I just have this sort of balanced view of like wow like you know
36:34
you're, you are, you are a God to anybody, not only in the radio world,
36:39
but also in the authenticity content world. And also maybe leave.
36:45
so pivoting just a little bit you see you you do uber and lyft drive driving there uber and lyft
36:55
driving now um i guess right off the bat what's your worst drive and what's your best drive what
37:05
you gotta have some really interesting stories i imagine well well the best drive is always uh
37:12
people who are down to have a conversation and like so much like time just quickly passes by
37:21
like because you enjoy the conversation so much they're very kind they ask questions of you you
37:27
ask questions of them like so i think blanket statement the best drive is is those type of
37:31
people i love that uh makes my job a lot easier because you know otherwise it is a lot of monotone
37:37
like all right pick this person up and then most likely they're going to want to keep to themselves
37:41
and listen to something on their headphones. And then I'm just listening to my own thing. So it's
37:46
like this silent ride for however long. So when you have occasionally those people that are like,
37:52
hey, how you doing? And on top of that, they tip, they can tip well, because they appreciate the
37:57
conversation that you gave them. That's always great. The worst people I, you know, probably
38:03
the worst experience I had was this guy that I picked up from this pizza place and he was just
38:14
in this weird situation with his girl on speakerphone. He's talking loudly to his girl on
38:20
speakerphone and it seemed like some shit was happening between them and he was very sorry
38:25
and she was accepting it. But like, it was like, they were very, they were being very
38:32
unnecessarily dramatic about it um yeah no it was just just kind of a cringe situation huh
38:39
yeah very much i mean it's one thing to take that like on like you know to your ear but like to do
38:45
it loudly on speakerphone as if i don't exist it was just really odd like you know oh baby i'm so
38:51
sorry and and then she on the other line like oh no baby that's okay and you know i know you're
38:56
gonna be in the military soon and fight for our country like they were just talking like they were
39:01
in a movie like they were in this big dramatic movie where they fought like hell throughout it
39:06
all and then made up in the end and i'd be thinking like is somebody recording me like is this really
39:13
happening right and and of course when you know i uh drop him off they hug like crazy just in front
39:22
of my car like they're reuniting after five years apart because of some big fight of course this
39:29
woman like looks fucking homeless and sketchy and has no teeth it's like yeah it just has all the
39:35
inklings of like oh this is a couple that is just off their rocker and has no semblance of how to be
39:41
a mature common sense human being like they're drama llamas you can tell they probably do that
39:48
all the time yeah yeah and on top of that like you smell funny and i mean i thought i thought for
39:57
sure you were going to say drugs was your worst one. Drunks and like either puking in the back or
40:01
like crapping their pants in the back. No, no, no. Thank God. Thank God. And this is why it's great
40:06
to avoid the nighttime drives. I do daytime hours because one, I just need that for a better sleep
40:15
schedule, better sanity. And also my wife, she has a regular daytime job and I want to be able to see
40:21
her. And there was a time where I was working nights doing DoorDash deliveries and I barely
40:26
ever see her. I was not sleeping well because I was getting home at like two, three in the morning.
40:30
And usually if I get home from work after midnight, I know I'm not going to sleep well.
40:35
So to be able to have a schedule that's more better for sleep routine and also a better work
40:43
life balance with my wife, it's like the greatest thing ever. So because I work during the daytime,
40:47
I'm more likely getting people that need to go to work, go to class, get a ride to the airport,
40:52
like just very simple, quiet rides. You know, occasionally if I'm not making enough money in
40:57
the day, then I'll work into the night and then I'll, you know, pick up the group of four that,
41:01
you know, want to get wild with their Halloween costumes or go out to the bar or restaurant,
41:05
whatever, like occasionally I can do that. But I think that if I like did that on the regular basis,
41:09
then yeah, I would, I would be, it would be a lot because I've certainly picked up some sketchy
41:15
characters late into the night. I mean, I picked up somebody who was friendly, but you know, he had
41:21
a case of beer and he was talking like someone who was clearly a depressed
41:25
alcoholic and it just made me really uncomfortable.
41:28
And you know, you, you, you get some interesting creatures in the night.
41:31
So, uh,
41:33
you ever tell anybody like, just get out, get out of my car.
41:36
I don't want you here.
41:37
Uh, you know what I, I said, I said,
41:39
very politely to this very sketchy, homeless seeming character. I mean, the guy must have been
41:47
like 70 pounds, sweating and weird facial hair outlook. And I mean, he just came into my car
41:56
all messy with like his 10,000 coins and a banana and a water bottle and other. And then,
42:05
You know, he needed me to drop him off to like this, this dispensary.
42:09
And he spent like, God knows, like 20, 30 minutes longer than he should have there.
42:13
So I was wondering like, oh, should I leave?
42:17
Yeah.
42:17
And then he smelled bad.
42:19
So yeah, when you have that kind of person that just doesn't seem quite all together,
42:27
that's when, you know, at the end of the ride, you're like, okay, cool.
42:31
Like, you know, get your stuff and leave.
42:35
because you're just kind of annoying me right now with not respecting my time,
42:40
with dropping your quarters and your banana all over the place,
42:44
and things like that.
42:46
Awesome.
42:48
All right.
42:49
Well, just trying to be cognizant of time.
42:54
One question we like to ask all of our guests is,
42:57
throughout our lives there's invariably someone or an individual
43:02
that comes across that has a massive impact on our life, highly influential.
43:07
This could be a sixth grade science teacher, you know, historical figure and author could
43:12
be mom.
43:13
But we like to give our guests an opportunity to shout out someone that made that impact
43:17
in their lives.
43:20
Yeah, so for me, it would be Jitu Huntley.
43:24
When I was, God, 16, 17 years old, this must have been like the summer before my senior
43:31
year of high school and I was living in West Hartford, Connecticut. And I was, you know,
43:37
trying to, you know, figure out what to do with my summer, how to, you know, follow through on
43:40
a passion rather than just like be bored. And I noticed, oh, public access television station,
43:48
West Hartford community television. I've always had an interest in show business of all aspects,
43:53
but definitely like, you know, I just remember watching TV a lot as a kid and being like,
43:58
oh my God, this looks all awesome. I wonder how it all works. So I think it was like, I was in
44:06
my high school library and I saw the website and I saw the place where you can reach out to
44:13
the program coordinator, Jitu Huntley. And I inquired, I was like, hey, what opportunities
44:21
can I have Do you have any volunteer Do you have any employment opportunities How can I get involved because I interested in this And he invited me to stop by for a visit for a tour of the studio And yeah he showed me around the studio I got to ask him questions
44:38
pick his brain about like, okay, this is how the cameras work. This is, you know, this is how the
44:43
control board works when you're producing a show. He was mentioning all the volunteer opportunities
44:47
that can come about from producing your own show to working the camera on other people's shows,
44:53
to learning how to edit. And so I started doing that that summer. And I started volunteering on
45:04
other people's shows by, you know, again, being a camera operator and such. And I think fast forward
45:10
to maybe the summer following my freshman year of college, something like that is when I had the
45:14
confidence to produce my own content. And it started off very silly. I mean, I was interviewing
45:21
blankets like just any like any inanimate object i can think of like i was interviewing them because
45:28
i was too shy to interview actual people so you know blankets a a glass of water or whatever and
45:34
i would provide the voiceover i would like pre-record voiceovers so those inanimate objects
45:38
could talk and i would kind of like splice together in the editing bay like me talking to this
45:44
inanimate object that was voiced by me um so i used to where can we find this i want to watch it
45:50
It sounds interesting.
45:50
Oh, I was actually talking to my wife about this the other day.
45:52
I mean, if you really go into the deep recesses of YouTube,
45:56
going back to like the early 2010s,
46:01
I know that I called my show A Moment with John Francois,
46:05
but that's what I definitely called it
46:07
when I got the confidence to interview people.
46:11
So I don't know if it was called that
46:13
when I was interviewing Inanimate Objects,
46:14
but if you search in like John Francois,
46:17
West Hartford Community Television,
46:19
um that there's many things that i used to do from those days that are still up there uh smashing
46:27
bags of ice with a hammer for no reason with my friend james i i you know uh i i i was doing um
46:37
god what was i yeah i don't know i was just doing crazy letterman-esque like you know how like
46:42
letterman in the 80s and and such used to like throw stuff off the roof of buildings and and
46:48
And, you know, yeah, I was influenced by that.
46:50
So I did a lot of crazy stuff in my public access show, kind of like that.
46:55
And yeah, I would do man on the street interviews, asking the dumbest fucking questions, AC or box fan.
47:01
What would you prefer, an air conditioning or a box fan in 90 degree weather?
47:05
Like it was just like it was dumb shit.
47:08
But, you know, whatever.
47:09
I mean, at the end of the day, thanks to Jitu, I was encouraged to like really let my creativity fly.
47:17
And yeah this was during my college years and immediately after my college years where I thought I was going to be a professional actor but then that didn work out for me
47:27
But then this broadcasting thing that I got into was something that vibed with me.
47:34
So it was a really formative time in my life.
47:36
And Jitu could have easily said like, oh, you can't do this, you can't do that. Because literally every other show on that station was your typical public access show. It was like some middle-aged woman sitting down and just being like, all right, here we're going to talk about how the chakra can help your life.
47:55
or I don't know, they could be, you know, talking to a wine expert or whatever.
48:02
I mean, it was very muted shows like that.
48:07
And then me just coming in being like, oh my God, I'm going to go upstairs in the town hall where this station is
48:14
and go through the dark halls and give you a tour of the dark halls of town hall at night when nobody is working.
48:21
Like it was just stupid shit like that.
48:23
um so and that's all thanks to jitu jitu was just very uh instrumental in um that sort of early
48:31
mid-20s part of my life where i was trying to figure out who i was trying to explore my
48:37
creativity um and eventually i moved to iowa for my first full-time job in radio after working
48:43
part-time in radio for quite a bit in connecticut and from there i just i felt like i took off i was
48:48
like all right like let me just like really lean into this zany creative thing that i'm doing
48:53
first with public access then with radio now with podcasting um yeah i owe a big thing of gratitude
48:59
to you too and uh you know we we occasionally keep in touch she'll occasionally send me videos
49:04
on social media of steve urkel stuff because he knows that i used to do a family matters recap
49:09
podcast but um yeah and he doesn't work there anymore i think he works i think he still works
49:14
for espn um which i heard i feel like they're leaving bristol connecticut and they're now
49:20
headquartered somewhere else now. But yeah, no, I just have a great amount of affection for Jitu
49:26
Huntley because he, as a fellow man of color who was also in the TV production space, he saw a lot
49:36
of me in him. And as an older sort of role model figure, decided to just give me a shot and just
49:44
let me fly and find myself. And I feel like I wouldn't be who I am today if I didn't have that
49:50
chance to just really create and fail and learn. I mean, yeah, not only did I learn who I was as a
49:57
personality, but literally all the production, editing skills, like stuff that I'd know how to
50:03
do with the podcast like it goes right back to those public access days you know So I yeah I owe it a lot I owe a lot of gratitude to you too I think he was he was really instrumental in my growth Awesome All right Well where can people
50:19
find you? What do you got going on? What are you working on? What's coming next?
50:23
Sure. So right now I'm, I'm doing my podcast, the delicious culture with John Francois for any of
50:30
your listeners and you guys included, if anybody wants to come on and share their fascinating story,
50:36
because I think everybody is fascinating and has a great story to tell.
50:39
And also, if anybody wants to share what delicious meal,
50:42
pop culture obsession, and life event they really want to share,
50:45
please reach out, thedeliciousculture at gmail.com,
50:50
thedeliciousculture at gmail.com.
50:52
And you can also follow me on Instagram and TikTok,
50:55
at thedeliciousculture.
50:56
Send me a DM, and I'd love to respond and follow up with you
50:59
and get you on the podcast.
51:02
The Delicious Culture with Jon Francois is available
51:03
pretty much wherever you get your podcasts.
51:05
You can listen to us on Apple, SiriusXM, Amazon.
51:10
Yeah, and Spotify, you can listen and watch us.
51:13
You can watch us on YouTube.
51:16
Yeah, we're pretty much anywhere that people consume podcasts.
51:19
The Delicious Culture with Jean Francois.
51:21
Just search that.
51:23
J-O-N, last name, F-R-A-N-C-O-I-S.
51:26
That's how you spell my name.
51:29
And besides that, you know, I occasionally act.
51:33
uh you know i like to act in theater sometimes tv and film stuff so if you live in vermont like i do
51:39
maybe you'll catch me acting in another um local theater production and uh if you live in vermont
51:49
specifically burlington uh then maybe you'll end up having me pick you up as an uber and lyft driver
51:55
because that's what I do for 40 plus hours a week.
52:01
So yeah, that's about it.
52:03
Thank you guys so much for having me.
52:04
I really appreciate it.
52:05
Thank you for coming on.
52:07
Absolutely.
52:07
Thank you for giving us some of your time.
52:09
And thank you for giving us some of your time.
52:13
You know where you can find us?
52:14
We're everywhere.
52:16
Just, you know, do the thing.
52:19
Find us.
52:19
Give us a like.
52:20
If you don't like us, give us a thumbs down.
52:22
Leave us a comment.
52:23
Oh, no, don't do that.
52:24
Tell us.
52:25
He'll respond.
52:26
He'll respond in kind.
52:30
And remember, wherever you are, whenever you're watching this, have an amazing day.
52:38
Thanks, John.
52:39
See you, everybody.
52:40
Thank you.
52:55
We'll be right back.