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Best of Ian Furness 10/26 · The Ian Furness Show

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Your home for the 12th man in the NFL proudly
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  Speaker 1: presents Hardcore Football with Hugh Millen.
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  Speaker 2: Brought to you by Hunt Services. Get on the horn
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  Speaker 2: and call Hunt.
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  Speaker 1: Now here's Hugh with Ian Furness on Sports Radio 93.3
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  Speaker 1: KJR FM.
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: All right, time to check in with our good friend,
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  Speaker 2: Hugh Breedlove-Millen. He is here, and it's a victory Monday, Hugh.
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  Speaker 2: A fun Monday to talk to you on Hardcore Football, huh?
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  Speaker 2: Let's go.
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  Speaker 3: I love it.
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  Speaker 2: Great to be with you. Great to have you here.
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: We're going to break it all down as only Hugh can.
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  Speaker 2: Hardcore Football every Monday at this time. Hugh, by the way,
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  Speaker 2: this number just jumps off the page at me, and
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  Speaker 2: I'll let you explain. You know that the two teams
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: combined to go 0-4 in the red zone yesterday? Wait
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  Speaker 2: for it.
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  Speaker 3: 0-4-3.
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  Speaker 2: One team was 0-3. The other team didn't get in
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  Speaker 2: the red zone. Can you believe that? That Kansas City
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  Speaker 2: never got into the red zone?
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  Speaker 3: And it's never happened with Mahomes. All these figures are
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  Speaker 3: coming out. The fewest first downs, fewest yards. And it's
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  Speaker 3: just another pelt on the cabin wall for Mike McDonald.
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  Speaker 3: Just taking, whether it's a Hall of Fame quarterback or
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  Speaker 3: whether it's a Hall of Fame coach, or a guy
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  Speaker 3: thought to be a mastermind offensively, and Mike McDonald just
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  Speaker 3: absolutely unraveling a guy. And it was fun to watch
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  Speaker 3: in every way. You know, Casey obviously came in with
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  Speaker 3: a certain potency with Mahomes and with K-9, and it
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  Speaker 3: just didn't matter. And Seattle did it in a variety
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  Speaker 3: of ways, and just watching that tape was some kind
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  Speaker 3: of treat this morning.
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  Speaker 2: We'll get through some specifics hardcore football-wise in a minute.
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  Speaker 2: Let's just get general thoughts when you watch the tape,
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  Speaker 2: what jumped out at you.
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  Speaker 3: Well, I think obviously the defense, I think the offense
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  Speaker 3: did a lot of good things. And so they played
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  Speaker 3: a complimentary brand that Mike McDonald can live with. And
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  Speaker 3: maybe there's more potency coming from them when we get
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  Speaker 3: Jadarian price back, but I think the defensive destruction, it
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  Speaker 3: started with what you did with canine. That was the
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  Speaker 3: national story. And to be able to put the kind
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  Speaker 3: of numbers up that they did with him and the
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  Speaker 3: averages and the, and the, and the long of seven
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  Speaker 3: yards and, uh, just stymieing the chiefs in that regard. Uh,
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  Speaker 3: it had to be a frustrating, uh, over there for
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  Speaker 3: Andy Reed and, and, uh, And for Pat Mahomes and
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  Speaker 3: obviously for K-9 to be handed the ball over and
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  Speaker 3: over again. And, you know, I watched all the tape
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  Speaker 3: and then I went back and I watched just the
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  Speaker 3: K-9 runs trying to give you, you know, something like,
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  Speaker 3: I'm going to go on with Ian and I'm going
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  Speaker 3: to say, well, it was because of this. Well, they
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  Speaker 3: tried left. They tried right. They tried outside. They tried inside.
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  Speaker 3: They tried zone blocking. They tried lead blocking. They tried
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  Speaker 3: gap scheme, power counter. It didn't matter. what they tried,
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  Speaker 3: Seattle just built a wall, and they're about dead even
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  Speaker 3: on the K-9 carries for whether they played a two-high
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  Speaker 3: structure or a single high. I thought during the game
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  Speaker 3: that maybe they played more two-high because that's just what
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  Speaker 3: they do, but when you actually tabulate it out on
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  Speaker 3: every K-9 run, they brought the safety down a number
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  Speaker 3: of times, and And on those situations and in those cases,
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  Speaker 3: the Chiefs weren't able to somehow induce that single high
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  Speaker 3: and get some matchups out on the perimeter. I mean,
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  Speaker 3: Josh Jobe had a couple of big-time stops. And oftentimes,
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  Speaker 3: you know, a corner, when you don't remember him in
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  Speaker 3: the game, that's a really good thing. Like, you don't
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  Speaker 3: hear his name. No news is good news. And so
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  Speaker 3: he did a lot of really good things. Pritchett did
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  Speaker 3: good things. And because you can't remember, like, huh, I
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  Speaker 3: don't remember those guys' names being called. Yeah, yeah, for
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  Speaker 3: good reason. You know, so I think that it was
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  Speaker 3: the idea that they're going to stop K-9 through a
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  Speaker 3: variety of ways. They're going to be able to decipher
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  Speaker 3: all the different schemes that the Chiefs were trying to
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  Speaker 3: get at them. They're going to build a wall. If
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  Speaker 3: they have to spill things to the outside, they had
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  Speaker 3: team speed on the perimeter to go get them. but
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  Speaker 3: they really bogged up the middle and there was just nothing.
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  Speaker 3: It was a box of coat hangers and the chiefs
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  Speaker 3: are really good on the interior of their offensive line.
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  Speaker 3: You know, their center and right guard are in, in
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  Speaker 3: the discussion for the best in the league at their positions. So,
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  Speaker 3: so the fact that Seattle just, you know, anchored down
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  Speaker 3: with those defensive tackles and, and what have you, and then,
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  Speaker 3: and then, you know, played it inside out from the
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  Speaker 3: running game perspective. It was just, you know, Just incredible
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  Speaker 3: fundamental football. And for me, Mike McDonald, he deserves all
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  Speaker 3: the accolades he can get. I absolutely love this guy
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  Speaker 3: as our coach. I wouldn't trade him for one coach
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  Speaker 3: on earth. He's so good. He has such a brilliant
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  Speaker 3: vision of how defensive football should look in this league.
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  Speaker 3: He knows exactly what's too much, what's not enough. He
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  Speaker 3: asks his guys to do things that they're capable of doing.
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  Speaker 3: It's not just, well, don't ask a guy to do
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  Speaker 3: something he can't do. He's, he is, as he alluded to,
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  Speaker 3: he is trying to push the envelope and ask guys
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  Speaker 3: to do things they can do. Like don't waste their talent.
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  Speaker 3: And anyways, obviously I can ramble on. I just, I
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  Speaker 3: have nothing but goosebumps and, and admiration for what they're doing.
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  Speaker 2: They have only allowed 300 yards of offense one game
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  Speaker 2: this season. That was against the Chargers of all teams,
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  Speaker 2: that goofy-ass fourth quarter.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, the favorite fourth quarter.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, which is weird. But I'm glad you brought up
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  Speaker 2: Mike McDonald the way you just did because this is
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  Speaker 2: something that I made a note of last night when
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  Speaker 2: I'm watching the game and I wanted to ask you today.
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  Speaker 2: In today's world of hyperbole and social media, but just
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  Speaker 2: with every game being broadcast and as much preparation as
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  Speaker 2: a broadcaster is going to put into a game, whether
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  Speaker 2: it be Chris Collinsworth or Ross Tucker or TJ Watt
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  Speaker 2: or Troy Eggman, whoever's doing the color, as much preparation
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  Speaker 2: as those guys put in, you're going to have a
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  Speaker 2: little bit of hyperbole at times. You're going to have
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: a little bit of, hey, this guy, this guy, and
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  Speaker 2: some generalizations. Brian Flores in Minnesota, what they're doing this
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  Speaker 2: year is remarkable.
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  Speaker 3: They're undefeated.
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  Speaker 2: I mean, they're just killing teams. They've allowed, I think
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  Speaker 2: it's less than 100 points this season in six games.
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  Speaker 2: It's fun. I mean, they're crushing it, and we hear
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  Speaker 2: about him. He blitzes all the time. Collinsworth, if he
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  Speaker 2: had a drink for a time, he said the name
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  Speaker 2: Steve Spagnuolo last night, you would be still drunk right now, Hugh.
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  Speaker 2: You'd be hammered. But they talk about these guys. My
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  Speaker 2: question to you, and what I jotted down last night is,
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  Speaker 2: What is it? You mentioned he puts guys in positions
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  Speaker 2: that they can do what they can do. But from
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  Speaker 2: a hardcore standpoint, what is it about Mike McDonald that
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  Speaker 2: separates him and allows him to basically, this is a
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  Speaker 2: Hugh Millen term, by the way, allows him to pants
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  Speaker 2: some of the best offensive minds in football?
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  Speaker 3: Well, yeah, first of all, Spagnola has four Super Bowl rings. And,
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  Speaker 3: you know, an architect of one of the greatest defensive
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  Speaker 3: performances in the history of football in that giant victory
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  Speaker 3: over the undefeated Patriots in the Super Bowl where he
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  Speaker 3: held that vaunted offense to 14 points. The Giants won
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  Speaker 3: that game 17 to 14. And I remember one year
• 8:02
  Speaker 3: just kind of crunching numbers on a spreadsheet and I
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  Speaker 3: was looking at, you know, about 12 different statistics. And
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  Speaker 3: all of a sudden I was looking at like 2022
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  Speaker 3: or 23 or whatever. But I had a spreadsheet that
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  Speaker 3: was all comprehensive and I would go, wait a minute.
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  Speaker 3: In 2007, Tom Brady was number one in the NFL
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  Speaker 3: in every single one of these 12 most important categories.
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  Speaker 3: That was the only year it's ever been done. That
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  Speaker 3: was a freaky offensive team. and he held him to
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  Speaker 3: 14 points. So give Spaggs his credit. Oh, yeah. No, no.
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  Speaker 3: There can be two truths.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, but you can talk about a guy too much.
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  Speaker 2: Talk about him too much, and he's a hell of
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  Speaker 2: a coordinator. And Flores is the same way. I mean,
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  Speaker 2: neither one of those guys were good head coaches. They
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  Speaker 2: both are phenomenal defensive coordinators, and they have their calling cards.
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  Speaker 2: You mentioned the resume of Spagnuolo. My point is, in
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  Speaker 2: the resume of Flores, he's like the king of the blitz, right?
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  Speaker 2: He just comes at you. What is it about McDonald
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  Speaker 2: that just is different?
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  Speaker 3: First of all, For me, you look and you say
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  Speaker 3: McDonald's is primarily a too-high-structure guy that plays zone. They're
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  Speaker 3: at 91% zone. I have to update that. They're over 90% zone.
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  Speaker 3: They're at or near the top. They do it generally
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  Speaker 3: with too-high safety, so they've got to stop the run
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  Speaker 3: with a light box. So it's his vision of going, okay,
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  Speaker 3: I'm going to go a gap and a half. He
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  Speaker 3: could have said, hey, I like penetrators. Give me guys
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  Speaker 3: that can get up in the gap up the field.
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  Speaker 3: Or he could have said, just give me these slugs
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  Speaker 3: that are two gaps. Well, he likes guys that can
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  Speaker 3: start to penetrate into a single. Let's say Leonard Williams,
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  Speaker 3: he's a three tech. And he's on the outside shade
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  Speaker 3: of the guard. So he'll explode into that B gap.
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  Speaker 3: But he won't continue to to rush up. He'll hold it,
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  Speaker 3: hold his place and he'll present the color to the
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  Speaker 3: running back of, OK, that B gap is closed, but
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  Speaker 3: he's not penetrating. So now if if if he needs
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  Speaker 3: to at the end, Leonard Williams can shuck the guard
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  Speaker 3: and then fall back into the play and So it's
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  Speaker 3: everybody working as a unit to stop the run, to
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  Speaker 3: spill it to the outside. And then in coverage, when
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  Speaker 3: you play man-to-man and you can play great defense, like
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: the Bears in 85, they just loaded it up and
• 10:38
  Speaker 3: they came after you. Now, they had a great scheme,
• 10:40
  Speaker 3: so maybe this is a bad example, but they played
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  Speaker 3: a lot of man-to-man. I think they had 66 sacks.
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  Speaker 3: They just counted on getting you home. But if you
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  Speaker 3: can play man-to-man– Well, then, hey, good on you, man.
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  Speaker 3: Your cats are better than their cats. But when you
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  Speaker 3: play zone as frequently as the Seahawks do and the
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  Speaker 3: Ravens did when they were number one in the NFL
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  Speaker 3: his last year before being the Seahawks head coach, you
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: watch how they– hand receivers off. I mean, just thinking
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  Speaker 3: in zone basketball, you know, like, like zone, you know,
• 11:15
  Speaker 3: thankfully I don't know anything about soccer, but I'm sure that, that, um,
• 11:18
  Speaker 3: people on, on defense and soccer, there's a certain, you
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  Speaker 3: have to have an awareness that, um, uh, of, of
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  Speaker 3: where your help is your help to the inside, the
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  Speaker 3: help to the outside, the help in front of you,
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  Speaker 3: the help behind you. Like, like I'm going to go,
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  Speaker 3: I'm going to go four steps following this receiver and
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  Speaker 3: Not five and not three. Because that's when I need
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  Speaker 3: to release that receiver and then stay in my area
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  Speaker 3: and hunt. And then whether you're matching receivers or whether
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  Speaker 3: you match a receiver if he does a certain route
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  Speaker 3: or you sink and you zone up an area. So
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  Speaker 3: there is a comprehension to their zone defense that requires...
• 12:09
  Speaker 3: great teaching, great understanding, great team thought. But they got dudes.
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  Speaker 3: They play coverages, for example. They play primarily their number
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  Speaker 3: one coverage is a coverage called cover six. And what
• 12:26
  Speaker 3: cover six is you're going to roll the coverage to
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  Speaker 3: one side, put a corner down in the flat and
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  Speaker 3: a safety over the top, But then on the other side,
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  Speaker 3: the corner and the safety are going to be backed off,
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  Speaker 3: and they're going to have to read the coverages, whether
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  Speaker 3: or not the receivers are going vertical and who's going
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  Speaker 3: to the flat and what have you. And you look
• 12:48
  Speaker 3: at that coverage, you say, well, the strong flat is
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  Speaker 3: going to be vulnerable to the defense, accessible to the quarterback.
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  Speaker 3: But then they have Eamon Worre here. in that position
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  Speaker 3: and he covers so much freaking ground that he erases
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  Speaker 3: the weakness of the coverage. And then when they got
• 13:07
  Speaker 3: into a passing, passing situation, like last night, it's all
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: over the tape. They, they get into the quarters coverage
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  Speaker 3: where it's the, the, the both corners and safeties are off.
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  Speaker 3: It's a, it's a four deep structure with just three underneath. Well,
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: stop right there. You get, you, you can reason this through.
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  Speaker 3: You don't have to have ever, put shoulder pads on
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  Speaker 3: in your life. If you say, okay, we're going to
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  Speaker 3: rush four and we're going to play zone with seven guys,
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  Speaker 3: we're going to put four deep, but we're only going
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  Speaker 3: to have three underneath. As you start thinking, wait a minute,
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  Speaker 3: three guy zones underneath and the field is 53 yards wide.
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  Speaker 3: Hang on. How can you play an area with three guys? Well,
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  Speaker 3: you can't, you have to, you have to match the
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: inside receivers. So the defense sees five, eligible receivers and,
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: and they're either going to see a three by two
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  Speaker 3: or a two, a four by one. That's all the
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: defense can see.
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  Speaker 4: Right.
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  Speaker 3: Because there, there has to be an eligible receiver on
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: each side.
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  Speaker 1: Yep.
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  Speaker 3: And, and at some point the defense, you know, it's
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: got to declare there's no other, now it could be three,
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: it could be two by three, or it could be
• 14:16
  Speaker 3: three by two. It could be one by four or
• 14:18
  Speaker 3: four by one, but that that's how the defense is
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: ultimately going to see it. And so you got Ernest
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: Jones is like, Hey, you got three. Uh, not the, uh, not,
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  Speaker 3: not the three before the snap, the ball that, you know,
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  Speaker 3: the third guy to the strength, which is often the
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  Speaker 3: running back or the tight end and the spread sets
• 14:35
  Speaker 3: you got number three. And, um, and, and, and so
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: then anybody to the flat, those underneath guys, they don't
• 14:43
  Speaker 3: spot drop. Cause there's only three guys. They have to
• 14:47
  Speaker 3: play man concepts within a zone on the inside guys.
• 14:52
  Speaker 3: And then now if I'm Pat Mahomes, I'm looking at go, okay.
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: Ernest Jones. not the greatest athlete, but really heady, and
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: he just knows how to find his man. He can
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: do all kinds of window dressing. He knows how to
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: find number three, usually. Not to say he's never been beat,
• 15:13
  Speaker 3: but he's usually on point. And then when you've got
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: Eamon Worry on one side and you've got Witherspoon on
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: the other as your shallow outside defenders– Holy cow. I mean,
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: they are so quick spinning their hips. They, um, they're
• 15:30
  Speaker 3: uber competitive in the case of him and worry as
• 15:32
  Speaker 3: long as hell, uh, explosive as hell. So yeah, there's
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: a lot of grass to cover underneath near the line
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: of scrimmage, but, um, but they, they can just, uh,
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: you know, hit the turbo button button at will. And
• 15:49
  Speaker 3: so where you see other teams that have, uh, You know,
• 15:54
  Speaker 3: good athletes. I mean, they're all in the NFL. They're
• 15:56
  Speaker 3: good athletes. But you say there's nothing special. Then you
• 15:59
  Speaker 3: watch the Seahawks on tape and it's like everybody looks
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: like they're shot out of a rubber band. Like, you know,
• 16:07
  Speaker 3: it's like, boom, when they decide to go, they just go. Right.
• 16:11
  Speaker 3: and their tackling was extraordinary last night. Um, you know,
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: they had under 10% missed tackles. Uh, the, the, the
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: chiefs came into the game at about us, uh, number
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  Speaker 3: one in the NFL, by the way, and, and in
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: missed tackle at 6.8%, that was best in the league.
• 16:27
  Speaker 3: And they were up at around 12%, but Seattle was
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: under 10%. Um, so, so good night of tackling, excellent
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: night of tackling, but, but covering space and, um, and
• 16:40
  Speaker 3: playing selfless and playing, you know, fast, you know, you know, awareness,
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: you know, sniffing out screens and, and, um, you know,
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: they're just, they're, they're, they're very fundamental. My only beef
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: with them is that they lose contain and this coming
• 16:55
  Speaker 3: up against the bears is a bad week. So hopefully
• 16:58
  Speaker 3: they address that. But that's where, I don't know, am
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: I being too vague?
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: No, no.
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  Speaker 3: I don't want to just make these vague statements. I
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: want some specificity. But that's how they do it, in
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: my opinion.
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  Speaker 2: Which is amazing. It's amazing. And that was a great explanation.
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: I'm going to save the next segment for the unicorn
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: that is Eamon Ward, if I can. You've watched a
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: lot of football. A lot of football.
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: I just want to.
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: I guess I just selfishly want to hear you wax
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: on about Eamon Warr in the next segment. I'll let
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: you do that in the next segment. And also how
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: they utilize him, because I think it's kind of an
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: amazing thing. He's a defensive football player. I don't know
• 17:37
  Speaker 2: if there's no position next to him. But just real fast,
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: can we throw a little bit of love to the
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: world of Tyrese Knight? He played 37 snaps, 70% of
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: the snaps last night, had eight tackles. And listen, tackles
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: aren't the be-all to end-all. I mean, I think Eamon
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: Warr is a good example of that. You don't have
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: to have a zillion tackles to be a good football player.
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: But Drake Thomas kind of beat him out last year.
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: And we remember Knight coming in, and he was a No.
• 18:03
  Speaker 3: 2 guy.
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: They had two linebackers that were punted to the opposite
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: end of the world by Mike McDonald after a few
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: weeks when he watched those guys play. And he went
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: with Knight, and they brought in Ernest Jones. And then
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: they brought in Drake Thomas, and he was already here,
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: I guess, as a practice squad guy. But Drake Thomas
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: ends up being a starter. Tyrese Knight has to come
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: in and replace him the last couple weeks. I felt
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: like we noticed a lot of Tyrese Knight last night.
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: I thought that was pretty cool.
• 18:25
  Speaker 3: It really was. And I would say if you ask
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: K-9 or the tape would show who had the most
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: physical sticks on him, I think Knight might have had
• 18:37
  Speaker 3: the top three, just forceful, just like, hey, you know,
• 18:42
  Speaker 3: like stop you in your tracks, just stick. Remember that term,
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: you know, uh, uh, that's, that, that's a term has
• 18:48
  Speaker 3: been around. I mean, he just stuck, uh, canine. So yes. Uh, and,
• 18:52
  Speaker 3: and it's a complicated defense.
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 18:54
  Speaker 3: He, he generally playing the weak side linebacker, but, but
• 18:58
  Speaker 3: if they motion, they're not going to flop, then he
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: has to become the strong side linebacker, uh, at least
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: strong to the formation and, and, and his, his, uh,
• 19:08
  Speaker 3: his responsibilities can change on the fly. And, uh, and
• 19:12
  Speaker 3: that happened a number of times. So I think that, yeah,
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: I think I, I don't, I don't, uh, I don't,
• 19:18
  Speaker 3: I don't feel like with Drake Thomas, uh, you're missing
• 19:21
  Speaker 3: a lot there. I mean, Drake Thomas is not the
• 19:24
  Speaker 3: athlete that Tyrese Knight is. And he, and he, and
• 19:27
  Speaker 3: he generally doesn't have the physicality, that kind of physicality,
• 19:31
  Speaker 3: that high end, uh, thud. But, um, and you know,
• 19:35
  Speaker 3: Drake Thomas is a starter cause he's just, you know, uh, uh, uh,
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: just a tick. faster on his diagnosis.
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Right.
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: And I mean, if Mike McDonald says that this guy's
• 19:46
  Speaker 3: the smartest football player I've ever had, well, you can just,
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: you know, Mike draw. you know that's why that's why
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: yes that gets my attention that's like e of hunting
• 19:55
  Speaker 3: yeah yeah he said what about who let me write
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: that down again yeah um you know so it's it's
• 20:00
  Speaker 3: no slight on on night that he lost his job
• 20:04
  Speaker 3: to Thomas, but he's a better specimen.
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah.
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 20:08
  Speaker 3: And now at this juncture in his game, I mean,
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: where'd he go to UT San Antonio or no, no.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: He was New Mexico, right?
• 20:13
  Speaker 3: UTEP. Oh, UTEP.
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: UTEP.
• 20:15
  Speaker 3: That's right.
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah. UTEP.
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 20:16
  Speaker 3: Cause I remember watching his game, uh, the full game
• 20:19
  Speaker 3: against Arizona Wildcats. That was Jed Fish's Wildcats probably. But,
• 20:23
  Speaker 3: but you know, that was an opportunity for UTEP to
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: play against a Pac-12 team at the time. And, and
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: I remember just saying, yeah, he's a, he's a heck
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: of a, athlete, but his eyes are so undisciplined. I mean,
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: he just, he bites at every eye candy out there. Right.
• 20:37
  Speaker 3: And so, so like there was a, there was a,
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: you know, the game didn't come easy to him mentally. Um,
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: there was some distractions there and, and now, you know,
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: having been taught by the best, uh, you know, he just, he,
• 20:52
  Speaker 3: he plays a smarter brand of football for sure.
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: Well, there's, I mean, it's just, and the reason I
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: ask is I'm thinking to myself, yeah, I mean, Drake
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: Thomas will tell you all those things. And, You know,
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: Ty Okada probably fits in that category too. I mean,
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: in an ideal world, maybe Bud Clark's your safety if
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: he wouldn't get hurt. But the ability, I think there's
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: a great term, diagnose what's happening is key. And now
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: all of a sudden, if Knight's able to do that,
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: along with his physical attributes, scary stuff. Hugh, when we
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: come back, we'll probably touch in on the offense if
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: we have time. But again, this is just selfish on
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: my part. I would like you to speak on Nicky Manwari.
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: I don't know if you have the ability to do
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: that at all and say anything nice about him, but
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: if you can....
• 21:27
  Speaker 3: I don't know, man. I'm going to have to scurry
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: during this commercial break. I don't know. I wouldn't have
• 21:35
  Speaker 3: thought of anything kind to say about him.
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: I'll tee it up with this. We've had some really
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: fun guys to watch over the years, and they're all different.
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: But whether it be Earl Thomas, hey, man, or Cam Chancellor,
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: you know, guys like that, Sherm. I mean, we've had
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: some really fun guys to watch over the years. I'm
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: not sure if this guy is at the top of
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: the list, and I'll ask you how they utilize them.
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: Hardcore Football continues with Hugh Millen next. Hardcore Football continues.
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: Hugh Miller back with us. Seahawks get a huge win
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: over Kansas City yesterday. The defense really incredible. They handed
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: Pat Mahomes really his worst outing in terms of statistics.
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: Being healthy for an entire game he's ever had in
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: the NFL. Hugh, in 2025 in the second round, 35th overall,
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: the Seahawks took a player by the name of Nicky
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: Manwari out of South Carolina with the 35th overall pick.
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: Second round, he comes in here. He gets banged up
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: in his first game, and then all of a sudden
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: we start seeing the fruits of the labor as this
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: guy starts cranking up to a different notch. When you
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: watch what he is, and you're doing the 33rd team,
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: you're on there with our guy Cosell, Paolo Zolo, and
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: you guys, that think tank that's the 33rd team. If
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: Bill Polly or somebody comes up and says, what is
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: Nicky Imanwari? How does this work? What is he?
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: Who is he?
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: Help me out here.
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I call him a Sino. He's a safety
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: in name only. Because last night, he didn't have a
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: single rep in the back end. For the season, he's
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: got 0.8% of his reps in the back end. So
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: he's going to be on or near the line of
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: scrimmage of box somewhere. Now, it might be in the middle.
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: It might be defensive end. That's not to say he
• 23:28
  Speaker 3: doesn't have versatility. but his versatility stops with the idea
• 23:33
  Speaker 3: that he's going to be a back-end defender. He wasn't
• 23:36
  Speaker 3: last year. He isn't this year. But I would say
• 23:41
  Speaker 3: he's a guy that the only– I mentioned this morning,
• 23:45
  Speaker 3: he's the only guy that got a perfect 10 on
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: his athletic grade from the combine, and he would have
• 23:54
  Speaker 3: got it for a safety, a corner, and in the
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: entire history, there's only one guy who would have beat
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: him if he was a wide receiver, and that's Calvin Johnson.
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: So he has a freaky athletic profile, and now he
• 24:10
  Speaker 3: brings it to the field, and just the idea that
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: he can do everything as a linebacker. He's a strong
• 24:18
  Speaker 3: outside linebacker. I would just say he's a nickel Sam.
• 24:22
  Speaker 3: They didn't play a down of base technically last night.
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: They played nickel and they played dime and so when
• 24:30
  Speaker 3: he plays he's like a sam linebacker and and and
• 24:34
  Speaker 3: if if you're looking at him you just say he's
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: a really athletic sam which is exactly what mike mcdonald
• 24:39
  Speaker 3: said about him prior to the 49 playoff game last
• 24:41
  Speaker 3: year he finally admitted that's who he is so that's
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: who he is and uh i know we'll go over
• 24:48
  Speaker 3: a few of these plays can.
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: You how does he cover xavier worthy step for step
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: and then rush and then and then play as a
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: dn the next play.
• 24:55
  Speaker 3: I cannot overstate or impress upon you or anybody just
• 25:04
  Speaker 3: how rare and freaky that is. Because normally you'd say, okay,
• 25:08
  Speaker 3: Xavier Worthy set the all-time combine record. I mean, this
• 25:12
  Speaker 3: guy has Olympic speed. He could be on the 4x100
• 25:16
  Speaker 3: grabbing a baton. He is that level of speed. And
• 25:21
  Speaker 3: so usually a defense is sitting there. Remember, I was
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: a professional scout team quarterback. When you're the backup, you
• 25:26
  Speaker 3: are going against the number one defense every day. That's
• 25:30
  Speaker 3: what you do to present the look of the opposing quarterback.
• 25:35
  Speaker 3: And so I'm hearing defensive coaches, and they talk about
• 25:38
  Speaker 3: the matchups. I'm right there in the middle of it.
• 25:41
  Speaker 3: And if you go against a guy with that kind
• 25:44
  Speaker 3: of heat, you're sitting there going, do we have anybody
• 25:48
  Speaker 3: on our roster at 180 pounds, at any weight, that
• 25:52
  Speaker 3: can run with this guy? And now you're, you're telling
• 25:55
  Speaker 3: me that a guy North of 220 pounds is going
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: to be the guy that, that they're going to put
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: in man to man. Now that play that you described,
• 26:08
  Speaker 3: one of the things about that, that you're probably not
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: going to hear talk, spoke about other in other places
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: is what happened before the snap on that ball that,
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: Chiefs were in the right hash.
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 26:23
  Speaker 3: So Eamon Worry lines up as the nickel Sam. Uh,
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: they're in the nickel night to the boundary and, uh,
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: and Eamon Worry to the field. Okay. But the chiefs
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: motion worthy over from the right side, from the short
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: side to the wide side. And as you watch Seattle,
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: Eamon Worry, he's just over there. He's like, Oh, okay. Um,
• 26:46
  Speaker 3: you're going to put worthy in my spot. Um, I
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: got him. It's like they didn't know that he was
• 26:52
  Speaker 3: going to go. Seattle did not know he was going
• 26:54
  Speaker 3: to go in motion. They just had him in worry,
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: and then they just reacted to it. Now, whether or
• 26:59
  Speaker 3: not they're going to play the same coverage, Seattle does
• 27:02
  Speaker 3: a lot of checking, and they may have had a
• 27:06
  Speaker 3: two-by-two on that particular call, and then when it became
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: a three-by-one, it changed to a different call. So there
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: may be some audibilizing, but the point is this. Eamon Worry,
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: when Worthy shifted over into his shift would be the
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: proper term, not motion, because he shifted over and he
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: got set and he was the middle guy of trips.
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: And he established his alignment. I'm talking about Worthy now.
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: He established it in a minus two or a minus
• 27:40
  Speaker 3: three split. What does that mean? From the top of
• 27:42
  Speaker 3: the numbers, he was about two to three yards inside. Okay.
• 27:48
  Speaker 3: closer to the ball.
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 27:50
  Speaker 3: Well, the top of the numbers is 14 yards from
• 27:53
  Speaker 3: the sideline. That means that he was at least 16
• 27:56
  Speaker 3: yards from the sideline. He's running a go route. The
• 27:59
  Speaker 3: whole reason why the NFL has gone to this, uh,
• 28:04
  Speaker 3: this type of, of scheme, uh, on, on, on the, the,
• 28:09
  Speaker 3: the concept is why stick. And it's, you've got, uh,
• 28:12
  Speaker 3: Travis Kelsey is he's the innermost of three closest to
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: the ball. He's a tight end. He's running a, five,
• 28:17
  Speaker 3: six yard out route. That's a stick route. And then,
• 28:21
  Speaker 3: and then you got to have somebody going deep and
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: then somebody in the flat to make a kind of
• 28:24
  Speaker 3: a triangle spacing and zone.
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 28:27
  Speaker 3: Got me. Yep. And, and with the middle guy running
• 28:30
  Speaker 3: the vertical, that is a green light check for a quarterback.
• 28:35
  Speaker 3: Like if you like the matchup, go and get it
• 28:38
  Speaker 3: because it's easier from the slot receiver. I just said,
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: he's what? Two yards inside the numbers.
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: Um, Then if he was wider, it's harder to hit
• 28:48
  Speaker 3: against air. It's harder to hit in the game. So
• 28:52
  Speaker 3: the point was, this is the most favorable opportunity that
• 28:56
  Speaker 3: a quarterback can have. He's got an Olympic sprinter. going
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: against a 220-pound linebacker, the ball's on the right hash,
• 29:04
  Speaker 3: that we have a minus split of at least two yards,
• 29:11
  Speaker 3: and you're just going, wow.
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: Mahomes is like green light, here we go. Hey, Butker,
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: get your helmet on. You're in on the next play.
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: It's going to be a PAT, right?
• 29:24
  Speaker 3: And yet, Eamon Worry, without a safety help behind him,
• 29:28
  Speaker 3: because that's the important thing. It's one thing to say
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: that Eamon Worry had man-to-man on Xavier Worthy. That doesn't
• 29:37
  Speaker 3: impress me if it's cover two-man.
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 29:40
  Speaker 3: Because there'd be a safety on each half of the
• 29:43
  Speaker 3: field over the top to help on all verticals. No,
• 29:46
  Speaker 3: this was cover one. Actually, they did what I call
• 29:51
  Speaker 3: cover seven, where the safety love came down and bracketed
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: with Ernest Jones on Kelsey running the stick route. So,
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: so they were bracketing in and out on, on Kelsey.
• 30:01
  Speaker 3: Everybody else is man to man. There's no safety over
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: the top.
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: None.
• 30:05
  Speaker 3: So that is even worry is on a complete Island.
• 30:09
  Speaker 3: And just the idea that, that, that there is any
• 30:13
  Speaker 3: human being on any continent that can at 220 pounds
• 30:18
  Speaker 3: that can run with Xavier worthy. It would be, is
• 30:22
  Speaker 3: just a staggering proposition. I mean, they'd laugh you out
• 30:25
  Speaker 3: of a coaching convention if he said that there's such
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: a human being. And yet he does exist on this continent,
• 30:32
  Speaker 3: on this team. And, and he ran hip for hip
• 30:37
  Speaker 3: for him. And, uh, and it's just, I don't know.
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: I don't know. I can't, uh, you know, for those
• 30:43
  Speaker 3: who haven't played football and love football, I hope I'm
• 30:46
  Speaker 3: making the imprint on you.
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: Just how freaky rare that is. I, I, I'm going
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: to tell you too, just like, you know, we're out
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: of practice every Wednesday for, you know, the, 15 minutes
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: or so we're allowed out there. And last week, I
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: think I took a picture and put it on Instagram.
• 31:00
  Speaker 2: I'm sitting there with him or like sitting there watching
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: him and worrying, right? And I look over. Like he's
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: listed at 6'3, 220. I think he's a little heavier
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: than that. And when I say heavy, that usually is
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: a negative connotation. Like, you know, like, oh, he's– no, no. No,
• 31:17
  Speaker 2: just the way he's put together. Like he looks– Couldn't
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: agree more.
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: Could not agree more. I'm glad you said that. Yeah.
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: He's the most impressive athlete I've seen in a long time,
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: you out there. You know what?
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: I'm going to just say it real simple because we
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: know the glutes are the strongest muscle in the physique.
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: I think his ass has gotten bigger. I agree with you.
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: I think that he was 220. I think now he's 225. Yeah.
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: And he just looks unbelievable.
• 31:45
  Speaker 3: I was a teammates with Ron Brown. When I got
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: drafted in the NFL, Ron Brown was an Olympic. He
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: was on the four by 100 Olympic team. And, and,
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: you know, he, he had that kind of juice. So
• 31:58
  Speaker 3: when I say that, Xavier Worthy is an Olympic sprinter.
• 32:02
  Speaker 3: I'm not kind of just saying that for a fact.
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: If you're the fastest receiver in the history of the NFL,
• 32:11
  Speaker 3: or excuse me, fastest player in the history of the
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: NFL combine, you are an Olympic-level sprinter. If he had
• 32:19
  Speaker 3: chosen in eighth grade to drop football and dedicate himself
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: to be an Olympic sprinter, there's a damn good chance
• 32:28
  Speaker 3: he's one of America's top four or five sprinters. Like
• 32:31
  Speaker 3: he's that fast. Yep. And, and so, so anyway, I
• 32:36
  Speaker 3: want to make that distinction. I was being literal when
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: I said.
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: No, I know, I know. I just, it's, I just
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: think if you're, if you're any kind of football fan,
• 32:43
  Speaker 2: just watching three for Seattle is just a treat. Unless you're,
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: unless you're a fan of the team that he's playing against,
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: that's probably not fun. But, but, but that guy is good.
• 32:52
  Speaker 3: A couple of things. I know, I know we're chewing
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: up the segment, but you know, he, you know, he,
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: he was blitzing off the edge. Uh, on the interception
• 33:00
  Speaker 3: and he just, you know, he turned the hoop, you know,
• 33:03
  Speaker 3: he ran the hoop like a defensive end and sprinted
• 33:06
  Speaker 3: and caused the interception. There are a number of times, Ian,
• 33:11
  Speaker 3: where he's the flat defender and Mahomes is looking over
• 33:16
  Speaker 3: there and he wants no part of it. You just
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: see he looks and then he sees three and then
• 33:21
  Speaker 3: he comes off. In fact, remember the Derek Hall hit?
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 33:25
  Speaker 3: Oh, yeah.
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: Nobody can remember. Nobody can forget that one.
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah. The fumble, right? If you look, he looks
• 33:33
  Speaker 3: over to the right. They're trying to get the running
• 33:35
  Speaker 3: back in the flat. And Eamon Worry went over the
• 33:39
  Speaker 3: top of the slant. He had to navigate that. And
• 33:44
  Speaker 3: there he was in a position to accelerate on the back.
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: And Mahomes was like, no, thank you. No, thank you.
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: And so that caused him... to then turn and sprint.
• 33:55
  Speaker 3: So there's just all over my sheet. There was a
• 34:02
  Speaker 3: dagger concept where you take the slot, you run him
• 34:05
  Speaker 3: through the safety, and then the widest receiver worthy, he's
• 34:09
  Speaker 3: going to run a deep in at about 18, 19 yards.
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: And when you watch him, man, he can haul ass.
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: When he has free access and you don't jam him, whoa,
• 34:20
  Speaker 3: that dude is, he is a freaking jet worthy. And
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: he just screams up, rounds into the middle of the defense,
• 34:29
  Speaker 3: but there's Eamon Worry just backing up. He's the underneath defender.
• 34:34
  Speaker 3: He's backing up into that area. And again, Mahomes doesn't
• 34:38
  Speaker 3: want that smoke. And you see it all over the field.
• 34:41
  Speaker 3: So a lot of Mahomes, when you look at that
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: very pedestrian performance, the number of plays, I've got, I've got,
• 34:48
  Speaker 3: I've got yellow highlight all over my page. One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight.
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: Eight different plays where I've got Mahomes deterred by Eamon Worry.
• 35:02
  Speaker 3: So it's not just the plays that you see him make.
• 35:05
  Speaker 3: I mean, he ran down K-9 on a wide run
• 35:10
  Speaker 3: to Kansas City's left. Eamon Worry was blitzing off the right.
• 35:15
  Speaker 3: the right side and sifted his way through the defenders.
• 35:20
  Speaker 3: And it was, I don't know, man. It was like, like, like,
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: I don't know, a horse rate, a horse, just like,
• 35:27
  Speaker 3: like down the backstretch, just running by all the other horses.
• 35:30
  Speaker 3: He just, he just, I don't know. I run out
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: of analogies, but, but he chased him down and from
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: the opposite side, it was a four yard gain Ian
• 35:39
  Speaker 3: four yard game. And he made the tackle. And by
• 35:41
  Speaker 3: the way, made up, You know, a pretty good, reasonably
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: violent hit, given that the angles that were involved, because
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: you're out by the sideline, you know, you're going to
• 35:53
  Speaker 3: have more forceful hits in the hash marks, you know.
• 35:55
  Speaker 3: Out by the sideline, it's hard to really thump somebody,
• 35:57
  Speaker 3: but he put a pretty good hit on K-9, and
• 36:00
  Speaker 3: he came from the opposite side, and he was able
• 36:03
  Speaker 3: to do it for a four-yard loss. Here you go, K-9,
• 36:08
  Speaker 3: four yards and a headache for your troubles.
• 36:09
  Speaker 2: How about instead of Sino, safety in name only, it's
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: Secretariat instead. We'll take a quick break, come back, we'll
• 36:16
  Speaker 2: wrap it up, but look ahead. Schedule coming up is interesting.
• 36:19
  Speaker 2: We've got Chicago, Arizona, and Vegas before the bye, and
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: we'll talk about that next. Just on the show today.
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: We'll get to more text later, by the way. 49451,
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: Tacoma Dodge text line. Talkbacks as well. The feeling in
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: one week's time is so different when you and I
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: talked last Monday. It was after the Thursday night game.
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: But the losses to San Francisco and Denver, two over
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: a span of five days. You're starting to see the
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: division become out of reach. Wild card there. And you've
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: got Kansas City at 5-0 rolling in. And then after that,
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: you've got Chicago on the horizon, Hugh. And they've got
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: it humming now with Ben Johnson and Caleb Williams healthy.
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: Tough little stretch for Seattle.
• 37:02
  Speaker 3: Well, I think it is, but I like Seattle's chance
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: in Chicago against Chicago. And then you get Arizona and Vegas.
• 37:11
  Speaker 3: I think you're fine there. And then you got the
• 37:13
  Speaker 3: huge game November 29th against the 49ers. Seattle coming off
• 37:17
  Speaker 3: a bye. That's important. The week before, the 49ers will
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: be playing the Vikings. And then three games against the
• 37:23
  Speaker 3: NFC East, Cowboys, Giants, Eagles. And then you finish with
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: two games against the Rams tonight. a game at Carolina. Now,
• 37:32
  Speaker 3: here's an interesting thing. I still have my sights on
• 37:36
  Speaker 3: winning the NFC West. Here's how it's got to happen.
• 37:40
  Speaker 3: With San Francisco one loss and Seattle three, obviously, we're
• 37:47
  Speaker 3: going to ink right now. Let's say that the 49ers
• 37:49
  Speaker 3: and the Seahawks played this morning in Santa Clara and
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: Seattle just won. Now we're within one. We just have
• 37:58
  Speaker 3: to have the 49ers lose one more game than Seattle
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: the remainder of the way. Now, here's an interesting part
• 38:06
  Speaker 3: about scheduling that I bet most of your listeners will
• 38:11
  Speaker 3: be interested, but probably couldn't in any specificity explain what
• 38:15
  Speaker 3: I'm about to explain. If you take a 17-game schedule,
• 38:20
  Speaker 3: So you obviously play six division games. Got me? Yeah.
• 38:23
  Speaker 3: And then this year, all of the NFC West plays
• 38:26
  Speaker 3: all of the AFC West and all of the NFC East.
• 38:29
  Speaker 3: Got me? Correct. And that's going to come down to
• 38:33
  Speaker 3: common opponents, which is the second tiebreaker after division wins.
• 38:38
  Speaker 3: But the three remaining games goes like this. They play
• 38:42
  Speaker 3: the AFC East, and it's how you placed the year before.
• 38:46
  Speaker 3: Seahawks were first. So the Seahawks played the Patriots already.
• 38:51
  Speaker 3: The Rams were second last year. The Bills were second
• 38:54
  Speaker 3: last year. So the Rams had to play the Bills,
• 38:56
  Speaker 3: and they already lost that game. 49ers got a break.
• 38:58
  Speaker 3: They were third last year in the NFC West, so
• 39:01
  Speaker 3: they got to play the Dolphins. They already beat them. Now,
• 39:03
  Speaker 3: this Monday is one of the NFC North games. seattle's
• 39:08
  Speaker 3: number one play the bears who were number one the
• 39:11
  Speaker 3: rams have to play the packers and the 49ers have
• 39:14
  Speaker 3: to play the vikings who were number three last year
• 39:17
  Speaker 3: so there's a possible loss there nfc south uh seahawks
• 39:21
  Speaker 3: were first the panthers were first i like i i'm
• 39:24
  Speaker 3: not scared of the panthers even going there no no no.
• 39:27
  Speaker 3: The Rams have to play the Buccaneers, who were second,
• 39:30
  Speaker 3: and the 49ers just played the Falcons, who were third,
• 39:34
  Speaker 3: and they lost. Now, unfortunately, those games have lesser importance.
• 39:39
  Speaker 3: So here's the number one tiebreaker. If we can get
• 39:44
  Speaker 3: the 49ers to lose to the Rams, that's doable, right?
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 39:48
  Speaker 3: And Seattle controlled on destiny. And then you say, well, um,
• 39:52
  Speaker 3: how do you tie, uh, that would involve the, uh, uh, a,
• 39:58
  Speaker 3: a tie for Seattle losing only one game. And then
• 40:02
  Speaker 3: the 49ers having lost to Seattle and the Rams, and
• 40:06
  Speaker 3: then Seattle's the NFC West champ. You know, there, there
• 40:10
  Speaker 3: may be other losses, but you know, among both teams,
• 40:13
  Speaker 3: but that's not terribly far fetched. Now you say, well,
• 40:16
  Speaker 3: wait a minute, uh, Does Seattle have to beat the
• 40:18
  Speaker 3: Rams both games and at San Francisco and the Cardinals? Well,
• 40:24
  Speaker 3: I'm just telling you, the number one tiebreaker within the
• 40:28
  Speaker 3: division is division wins, and the second tiebreaker is common opponents.
• 40:32
  Speaker 3: And the common opponents, the 49ers just lost to the Falcons,
• 40:37
  Speaker 3: who are not a common opponent. So Seattle has two
• 40:40
  Speaker 3: losses in common opponents against Denver and against the Commanders.
• 40:45
  Speaker 3: The 49ers have none. So there'd have to be a
• 40:49
  Speaker 3: lot of makeup to win on the common opponents. So
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: you go back to the first tiebreaker, which is the division,
• 40:58
  Speaker 3: best record in the division. And if Seattle can, you know,
• 41:03
  Speaker 3: Seattle obviously has one loss right now, but we just
• 41:05
  Speaker 3: beat the 49ers this morning.
• 41:07
  Speaker 4: Right?
• 41:08
  Speaker 3: Did you get that news?
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I loved it. That was a pretty good win.
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: Back-to-back games. Yeah, that was a nice weekend.
• 41:13
  Speaker 3: Exactly. Yeah, they were kind of tired, but they got
• 41:17
  Speaker 3: up and they did it. So now the 49ers have
• 41:21
  Speaker 3: another loss. They have a loss in the division, and
• 41:25
  Speaker 3: it's head-to-head. So Seattle is tied with the 49ers, one
• 41:30
  Speaker 3: win each. And then, okay, what's the next– Because that's
• 41:34
  Speaker 3: obviously the first tiebreaker, head-to-head. But then the next one
• 41:39
  Speaker 3: is division. So let's beat the 49ers. Let's have the
• 41:42
  Speaker 3: Rams beat the 49ers. And that's how you become the
• 41:46
  Speaker 3: NFC West champs. It's not terribly far-fetched. And, by the way,
• 41:50
  Speaker 3: without Mike Evans.
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: They're a different team. They're a different team without him.
• 41:54
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, hell, they play the Vikings. They play that
• 41:56
  Speaker 3: game at home. But that defense is a problem. And
• 42:01
  Speaker 3: so I don't think I don't think the 49ers is
• 42:04
  Speaker 3: going to win out. I don't actually I probably don't
• 42:06
  Speaker 3: think the Seahawks are going to win out, but you're
• 42:09
  Speaker 3: getting closer to controlling your destiny with just one more
• 42:13
  Speaker 3: slip by the 49ers. And there's always that. that game
• 42:16
  Speaker 3: that the Rams can beat the 49ers.
• 42:18
  Speaker 2: I'm in. I'm buying in. I'm in all chips in
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: after that, Hugh. I'm 100% in. Let's go get it, right?
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: Hugh will be back later.
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: What did Cal Raleigh say? Let's go get the effing thing? Yeah, exactly.
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: That was a year ago, unfortunately. But now he's got surgery. Well, Hugh,
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: more at 4 today, right, with Softie?
• 42:35
  Speaker 3: I believe so, yes.
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: All right, more at 4 with Hugh later on.
• 42:37
  Speaker 3: Thanks, buddy.
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: Great job. That's Hugh Millen. Mike Sando takes a tour
• 42:40
  Speaker 2: of the NFL with us. Coming up next.
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: It's time for our Monday visit with Mike Sando of
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: The Athletic, brought to you by Hunt Services. For HVAC, plumbing, sewer,
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: and electrical needs, get on the horn and call Hunt's
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: or visit HuntServices.com. Now with Mike Sando, here's Ian Furness.
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: Mike Sando joining us here from The Athletic. The Pick
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: 6 column is up, ready to rock and roll, and
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: here we go. It's time to talk to all things
• 43:19
  Speaker 2: NFL and take a tour of the league.
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: Hi, Mike.
• 43:21
  Speaker 3: How are you?
• 43:22
  Speaker 4: Good, how are you?
• 43:22
  Speaker 2: I'm good. I'm very good. Let's just start with impressions
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: from what you saw on Sunday Night Football last night
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: with the Seattle Seahawks and the Kansas City Chiefs.
• 43:31
  Speaker 4: I mean, just such great domination by Seattle. I'll tell you,
• 43:34
  Speaker 4: the way it's been going with the turnovers lately, Darnold
• 43:37
  Speaker 4: was just threading the ball in there, and I was like, oh,
• 43:40
  Speaker 4: that was close. You're almost like a little bit, you know,
• 43:45
  Speaker 4: you're feeling that one of these might go the other way,
• 43:47
  Speaker 4: but it really didn't, except for that one time right
• 43:48
  Speaker 4: before the half. So to me, the takeaway is, This
• 43:52
  Speaker 4: is a really tough team to beat when they don't
• 43:56
  Speaker 4: beat themselves. We've kind of known that, but this is
• 43:58
  Speaker 4: a dominant team. Really, the only way they've lost is
• 44:01
  Speaker 4: when they give the other team credit for making plays.
• 44:04
  Speaker 4: But when they are risking the football with silly stuff
• 44:07
  Speaker 4: like what happened against the 49ers, that's the only way
• 44:10
  Speaker 4: that it can kind of go the other way, it
• 44:12
  Speaker 4: feels like.
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: You wrote a little bit about Brian Fleury today. What
• 44:16
  Speaker 2: did we learn from him this weekend? Yeah.
• 44:18
  Speaker 4: Well, I thought it was obviously a much better performance.
• 44:22
  Speaker 4: And last week, I think a lot of us were
• 44:25
  Speaker 4: looking for a little more urgency or even accountability with
• 44:27
  Speaker 4: the things he was saying. He kind of sounded like
• 44:29
  Speaker 4: he was happy with the way things were going.
• 44:32
  Speaker 3: But hey, you know what?
• 44:33
  Speaker 4: Maybe he was right because it looked pretty good. I
• 44:35
  Speaker 4: think it'll be interesting to give a little bit of
• 44:37
  Speaker 4: a closer look and see what changed. I think there
• 44:40
  Speaker 4: were probably a couple of things maybe different in the
• 44:42
  Speaker 4: run game. But all in all, you've got to feel
• 44:46
  Speaker 4: like Darnold seemed to have answers quicker. He seemed to
• 44:50
  Speaker 4: play faster in the game. Just my impression watching it. So, hey,
• 44:56
  Speaker 4: you got to tip your cap there. I think he
• 44:58
  Speaker 4: was under some pressure and had a great game.
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: The Seahawks defense we know is elite. How surprised were
• 45:05
  Speaker 2: you to see the Chiefs scoring just three points, never
• 45:10
  Speaker 2: getting in the red zone, 213 total yards? I mean,
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: all these things that Mahomes had never– scene happened to
• 45:17
  Speaker 2: him before. And oh, by the way, remember the story
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: last week? I think we all do. We all live
• 45:20
  Speaker 2: in the area. The whole story was Ken Walker. Hell,
• 45:22
  Speaker 2: they did a whole pregame fake movie bit trailer with
• 45:26
  Speaker 2: Ken Walker returning here to Seattle, and he had 36 yards.
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: How surprising was that to see Andy Reid's offense?
• 45:35
  Speaker 4: I thought there was a good chance he wouldn't get 100,
• 45:37
  Speaker 4: because Seattle's just really good defensively, but I thought he
• 45:40
  Speaker 4: would get closer to 100 than 50, right? I thought
• 45:43
  Speaker 4: he'd have a decent game, and and that it would
• 45:45
  Speaker 4: be a closer game for sure. I thought it could
• 45:48
  Speaker 4: be a little nerve-wracking game late, so it wasn't any
• 45:51
  Speaker 4: of those things, and you can certainly in retrospect say, hey,
• 45:53
  Speaker 4: they're missing both their tackles in Kansas City, and they
• 45:56
  Speaker 4: were missing receivers. Okay, but they had that back, and
• 45:59
  Speaker 4: they still had Kelsey, and they still had Mahomes, so
• 46:02
  Speaker 4: it wasn't like Seattle could take really anything for granted lately,
• 46:05
  Speaker 4: so I think it was probably a you know, a
• 46:09
  Speaker 4: very affirming game, one they really had to have, one
• 46:13
  Speaker 4: they needed more than Kansas City needed, and they got it.
• 46:15
  Speaker 4: So it really puts them, I think, back on track.
• 46:18
  Speaker 4: And that was nice for them too, the 49ers lost.
• 46:20
  Speaker 3: Very nice.
• 46:22
  Speaker 2: Explain this to me. You wrote about this. How was
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: this Seattle's defense's fourth best outing this year by EPA? Like,
• 46:29
  Speaker 2: that's crazy. That's nuts.
• 46:32
  Speaker 3: It is. But we can kind of see that.
• 46:34
  Speaker 4: So in their games that they lost, the defense was amazing.
• 46:40
  Speaker 4: And they had three or four turnovers in every one
• 46:42
  Speaker 4: of those games and still lost by, I think, a
• 46:44
  Speaker 4: total of eight points in the three games. The average
• 46:47
  Speaker 4: team would lose by 27 points in those games. And
• 46:51
  Speaker 4: so the difference between losing by 27 across the three
• 46:54
  Speaker 4: losses and losing by eight is your defense. It's a
• 46:57
  Speaker 4: dominant defense. I mean, they're holding... The Sean Payton Broncos,
• 47:01
  Speaker 4: I think it was under three yards of play.
• 47:03
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 47:04
  Speaker 4: They shut down the 49ers. I mean, yes, there's a
• 47:08
  Speaker 4: couple drives late that the 49ers got some stuff going,
• 47:11
  Speaker 4: but they've played great the whole year, I think is
• 47:13
  Speaker 4: the point. You can argue, okay, maybe this is more
• 47:15
  Speaker 4: impressive or that was more impressive, but this was not
• 47:17
  Speaker 4: a new performance by this defense. It's just... When they've
• 47:21
  Speaker 4: been even average on offense, we see 31-7 against Arizona.
• 47:25
  Speaker 4: We see 20-3 in this game, which should have been more.
• 47:27
  Speaker 4: They had the interception in the end zone, should have
• 47:29
  Speaker 4: at least got three, probably seven. So that's what it is.
• 47:34
  Speaker 4: The defense, to me, has been there the whole time.
• 47:37
  Speaker 2: You mentioned the 49ers, Mike. At some point, injuries do
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: catch up. The Mike Evans injury, is that one that's
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: going to be hard to overcome?
• 47:45
  Speaker 3: Well, yeah.
• 47:46
  Speaker 4: I think they're not even close to the same without him.
• 47:48
  Speaker 4: And now Christian McCaffrey... was having some trouble getting going
• 47:50
  Speaker 4: in the game too. He hurt his thigh. I'm not
• 47:53
  Speaker 4: sure the severity is of that, but to me, that's
• 47:56
  Speaker 4: just a matter of, that's going to happen throughout the season,
• 47:59
  Speaker 4: especially to older veteran players. It's why Mike Evans was available.
• 48:02
  Speaker 4: So they've got to figure out a way to, you know,
• 48:06
  Speaker 4: get him right. And then probably maybe they pitch count
• 48:10
  Speaker 4: him a little bit throughout the season to have him
• 48:11
  Speaker 4: ready for the playoffs. Cause they're going to make the
• 48:13
  Speaker 4: playoffs and they're going to be a good team right
• 48:14
  Speaker 4: in the end. They may even win the division. We'll see,
• 48:17
  Speaker 4: but they have to have him. to go anywhere once
• 48:21
  Speaker 4: they get to the postseason.
• 48:23
  Speaker 2: You wrote a little bit about me because they got
• 48:24
  Speaker 2: beat by Atlanta. Atlanta now 3-4. They're a different team
• 48:27
  Speaker 2: with Michael Penix. There's no doubt about that. And the
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: defense stepped up. Carolina is 3-3, just gets absolutely annihilated yesterday,
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: gets boat raced. Is the NFC South, is that a
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: two-team race? Or is there a chance that Tampa can
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: crawl back in it? New Orleans doesn't show the same record,
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: doesn't show the same signs of life, but it feels
• 48:47
  Speaker 2: like the NFC South, in kind of a perverse way,
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: is wide open. Now, we'll get to the NFC North
• 48:52
  Speaker 2: and East, and we can talk about they're kind of
• 48:53
  Speaker 2: the same way, with the exception of maybe Washington, all
• 48:55
  Speaker 2: those other teams are involved. But the NFC South is
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: intriguing in terms of Maybe a three-team race? Yeah.
• 49:01
  Speaker 4: I think you pick a team and I'll take the field.
• 49:04
  Speaker 4: I mean, look, the Saints haven't been able to run
• 49:06
  Speaker 4: the ball and stop the run. They don't look ready,
• 49:07
  Speaker 4: but they have the same record as Tampa Bay.
• 49:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 49:09
  Speaker 4: They've been close in a lot of these games, so
• 49:11
  Speaker 4: they just look like they haven't been trending in the
• 49:13
  Speaker 4: right direction, and their style of play is concerning, asking
• 49:17
  Speaker 4: too much of the quarterback. But some of these other teams...– now,
• 49:20
  Speaker 4: I don't know what Carolina really has to hang their
• 49:22
  Speaker 4: hat on either.
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: No.
• 49:23
  Speaker 4: Other than I guess the quarterback, Bryce Young, has played better.
• 49:26
  Speaker 4: They have a good receiver. But their offensive line is hurting.
• 49:28
  Speaker 4: Their defense is hurting. Just from an injury standpoint, I
• 49:31
  Speaker 4: don't know what their staying power is going to be,
• 49:33
  Speaker 4: and they've been inconsistent. They've given up 59 and 43 points.
• 49:37
  Speaker 4: in two of their games. And to me, that screams
• 49:39
  Speaker 4: volatility and you can't trust them. And remember they won
• 49:41
  Speaker 4: the division last year at eight and nine. So I really,
• 49:44
  Speaker 4: I wouldn't mind being Atlanta probably right now of all
• 49:47
  Speaker 4: those teams that, you know, you're still going to be
• 49:51
  Speaker 4: in a situation where Michael Penix has to last through
• 49:53
  Speaker 4: the year. He's, if he starts next week at six
• 49:56
  Speaker 4: in a row, it matches a career best for him
• 49:59
  Speaker 4: in a season. So that's a big concern, but you feel,
• 50:03
  Speaker 4: I feel like kind of both sides of the ball
• 50:05
  Speaker 4: have been, pretty good at various points, unlike the other
• 50:08
  Speaker 4: teams where it's kind of been one or the other.
• 50:11
  Speaker 2: The NFC East will feature two teams tonight in the
• 50:15
  Speaker 2: Eagles and the Dallas Cowboys. Both are two and four,
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: and both are probably saying, how in the hell are
• 50:21
  Speaker 2: we looking up to the New York Giants right now?
• 50:23
  Speaker 2: And that's what they're doing. Washington, sorry, Dan Quinn, you
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: can probably kind of look ahead. And I guess for him,
• 50:28
  Speaker 2: hopefully he looks ahead for next year. But Boy, it
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: almost feels like tonight, Philadelphia and Dallas, it's close to
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: an elimination game and we're not even to November yet.
• 50:37
  Speaker 4: I mean, it does, but it's another where they're all
• 50:40
  Speaker 4: bunched up and there's no one's going to really run
• 50:42
  Speaker 4: away from them. You know, that's why when people ask, hey,
• 50:45
  Speaker 4: are the Eagles going to make a bunch of trades
• 50:46
  Speaker 4: at the deadline and get rid of players? I mean, maybe,
• 50:48
  Speaker 4: but like, I think they can win the division.
• 50:52
  Speaker 3: Don't you think if you're.
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: Even without Jalen Hurts, even without Jalen Hurts?
• 50:57
  Speaker 3: I think so.
• 50:59
  Speaker 4: We'll see what type of ball they play, but probably not.
• 51:03
  Speaker 4: I think they need to see, do they get rolled
• 51:06
  Speaker 4: in this game tonight? What if they win, or what
• 51:10
  Speaker 4: if it's close? Jalen Hurts, obviously, your starting quarterback matters,
• 51:15
  Speaker 4: but I don't know that he's been great either, so
• 51:20
  Speaker 4: I guess.
• 51:22
  Speaker 4: I guess I need a couple more weeks to feel
• 51:25
  Speaker 4: like which teams are going to bow out. It's just
• 51:28
  Speaker 4: too close, and you don't think the Giants are that great.
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: Well, Dallas is struggling defense. If they can't stop Philadelphia
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: without their starting quarterback and probably their best wide receiver,
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: then their Christian Parker experiment is really going to go downhill,
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: I think, at that point.
• 51:41
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and they don't get a bye until week 14 either.
• 51:44
  Speaker 4: The 49ers get a bye right now. You've got to
• 51:47
  Speaker 4: rest up in it. I think Seattle had the mini-bye
• 51:49
  Speaker 4: off the last game, and they had some things to
• 51:51
  Speaker 4: figure out offensively, right?
• 51:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 51:53
  Speaker 4: It feels like Dallas or some of these teams could
• 51:56
  Speaker 4: use the break right now to figure it out. They've
• 51:58
  Speaker 4: lost three out of four. They're only two and five
• 52:00
  Speaker 4: on the season. And the schedule does open up for them.
• 52:03
  Speaker 4: They're going to have Arizona, Indy, and Tennessee for Dallas,
• 52:08
  Speaker 4: at least, over the next month or so. So they
• 52:12
  Speaker 4: may still pull their.
• 52:12
  Speaker 3: Way out of it.
• 52:14
  Speaker 4: I guess if you could beat any one team in
• 52:16
  Speaker 4: that division, it would you know, to try to make it,
• 52:18
  Speaker 4: would it be them? Would it be Dallas? I mean, maybe,
• 52:21
  Speaker 4: but it's kind of another situation where you take one
• 52:23
  Speaker 4: and I'll take the field.
• 52:24
  Speaker 3: It's crazy.
• 52:25
  Speaker 2: Mike Sando joining us, the athletic. Did you have Minnesota
• 52:28
  Speaker 2: as the last unbeaten team at the start of the year?
• 52:31
  Speaker 3: Really did not at all.
• 52:32
  Speaker 4: You know, did not at all there. Man, their defense
• 52:35
  Speaker 4: is good though.
• 52:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 52:37
  Speaker 4: You know, they're going to, Minnesota is going to play
• 52:39
  Speaker 4: a tougher schedule coming up. So that's going to even out.
• 52:42
  Speaker 4: As I wrote today, you know, they, They're going to
• 52:45
  Speaker 4: have to be better than they are in offense. I
• 52:46
  Speaker 4: think right now they're 29th. They're going to have to
• 52:49
  Speaker 4: get into the low 20s on offense to be a
• 52:52
  Speaker 4: team that can really realistically do something in the playoffs.
• 52:55
  Speaker 4: Maybe that happens, but I think there's going to be
• 52:57
  Speaker 4: inconsistency with that quarterback. Fascinating situation there with Nolan Teasley,
• 53:03
  Speaker 4: former CX front office guy, as the GM. It's his team,
• 53:07
  Speaker 4: but it's not really his team he put together. Yet
• 53:10
  Speaker 4: here they are 6-0, trade deadline, need help on offense.
• 53:13
  Speaker 4: But you're really trying to build this thing right for
• 53:15
  Speaker 4: the long term. How do you handle that? I think
• 53:17
  Speaker 4: it's fascinating.
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: Well, that's why I want to bring it up because
• 53:19
  Speaker 2: for those who don't know, Nolan Teasley was a longtime
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: Schneider lieutenant, so to speak, here in Seattle. And we
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: were one of the many guys that John's had in
• 53:27
  Speaker 2: that front office who were just like, it's not a
• 53:29
  Speaker 2: matter of if, it's a matter of when he's going
• 53:31
  Speaker 2: to get that job in that seat that he had
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: been working towards along the way. And when you kind
• 53:36
  Speaker 2: of alluded to that, what's the trade deadline going to
• 53:39
  Speaker 2: look like or how aggressive may they be? Well, Schneider's
• 53:42
  Speaker 2: pretty aggressive if he thinks he needs something or is
• 53:44
  Speaker 2: going to go get something. We've seen that with the
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: Ernest Jones, Leonard Williams, Rashid Shaheed just in the last
• 53:49
  Speaker 2: few years. I mean, he'll go at it. I'm curious
• 53:52
  Speaker 2: to see if Teasley has that same philosophy as his
• 53:55
  Speaker 2: mentor did. Yeah.
• 53:56
  Speaker 4: Do they need a back now after Aaron Jones got hurt?
• 53:59
  Speaker 4: I don't know how bad that is. I haven't seen
• 54:01
  Speaker 4: that yet today. But the hardest part is they could
• 54:04
  Speaker 4: probably really use a quarterback, and that's a hard thing
• 54:06
  Speaker 4: to trade for. Are you going to really bring back
• 54:09
  Speaker 4: Kirk Cousins at age 38, you know, people are going
• 54:12
  Speaker 4: to hope they'll swing a deal for Justin Herbert, but
• 54:14
  Speaker 4: I don't think that's realistic. So, you know, Kyler Murray
• 54:16
  Speaker 4: may be as good as what you're going to get.
• 54:18
  Speaker 4: And then that, you know, that puts its own sort
• 54:20
  Speaker 4: of ceiling on things as it is. What more are
• 54:23
  Speaker 4: you going to add offensively? That's going to make a
• 54:26
  Speaker 4: huge difference. So, you know, maybe they, maybe they add,
• 54:30
  Speaker 4: but I don't know they're going to give up a
• 54:31
  Speaker 4: ton of big assets.
• 54:33
  Speaker 2: Mike, I saw a name that you printed this morning
• 54:36
  Speaker 2: and I was like, I had to take a double take. Eric,
• 54:38
  Speaker 2: is it Zaire?
• 54:39
  Speaker 3: Eric Zier. Zier.
• 54:41
  Speaker 2: Come on now, Eric Zier. Well, 1995, that was the year.
• 54:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you were so young then.
• 54:46
  Speaker 2: I think I was chilling in Tri-Cities working for the Americans,
• 54:50
  Speaker 2: if I'm not mistaken. Tell people who Eric, how do
• 54:54
  Speaker 2: you say it again?
• 54:55
  Speaker 3: Zier. Zier.
• 54:56
  Speaker 2: Tell people.
• 54:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I remember him actually, yeah.
• 54:58
  Speaker 2: Who is he and why is he relevant?
• 55:00
  Speaker 4: So in week eight, we're going to have the Steelers
• 55:03
  Speaker 4: and the Browns playing for sole possession of first place
• 55:06
  Speaker 4: in the division. For the first time, I think it's
• 55:09
  Speaker 4: the first time that the Browns have been in first
• 55:13
  Speaker 4: place in a division at Halloween since 1995 when Bill
• 55:18
  Speaker 4: Belichick was a coach. And with Vinny Testaverde benched, Eric
• 55:23
  Speaker 4: Zier was the starting quarterback in the middle of the season.
• 55:27
  Speaker 4: So that's a long time when even, you know, look,
• 55:30
  Speaker 4: you've been following sports closely, following the NFL closely, and
• 55:33
  Speaker 4: you're like, who was that again?
• 55:35
  Speaker 2: You know, a quarterback.
• 55:36
  Speaker 4: We can name almost all the certain quarterbacks, but that's
• 55:37
  Speaker 4: how long ago it was and how obscure it is.
• 55:39
  Speaker 2: I was going to guess, if you would have said, hey,
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: when Cleveland was last in first place and doing well,
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: who was the quarterback? I would have said probably Derrick Anderson.
• 55:47
  Speaker 2: I thought they had like a little one-year run with DA,
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: the former Beaver star, and then it kind of went south. Honestly,
• 55:54
  Speaker 2: I think it's just a great story. We talked about,
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: I don't even know why it came up. We were
• 55:59
  Speaker 2: talking about Cleveland, Ashley on the show, was it two
• 56:01
  Speaker 2: weeks ago? I think we were talking about different places
• 56:05
  Speaker 2: to go and I've Oh, yeah, because you brought up
• 56:08
  Speaker 2: the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and something else. Yeah,
• 56:10
  Speaker 2: and it came up. Mike, I love the fan base there.
• 56:13
  Speaker 2: When I covered it there, it was borderline insane, borderline
• 56:17
  Speaker 2: terrifying at times as well. The fans are right up
• 56:19
  Speaker 2: against the press box. I ended up buying the mustard,
• 56:22
  Speaker 2: the stadium mustard, Ash. I got two of those things
• 56:24
  Speaker 2: from the stadium. Yeah, great stuff. But I think it's
• 56:26
  Speaker 2: a great story. Good for Cleveland, Mike. I think, honestly,
• 56:29
  Speaker 2: good for the NFL for a fan base and a franchise.
• 56:32
  Speaker 2: I know they left for a while, but a franchise
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: like that to be sitting at 5-2 right now.
• 56:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and all of them with, like, fourth-quarter comeback wins.
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: Yep, exactly, exactly, yeah.
• 56:40
  Speaker 4: A little cardiac kids type of a season, so beats
• 56:44
  Speaker 4: the alternative. They've certainly lived on the other side of that.
• 56:46
  Speaker 4: They're 4-0 in games decided by three or fewer points,
• 56:48
  Speaker 4: which is, like, impossible to do, but they've had it coming.
• 56:53
  Speaker 2: It's a little bit of a fantasy football thing because
• 56:56
  Speaker 2: people are concerned about such things, but I'll bring it
• 56:58
  Speaker 2: up anyway to wrap things up. What's the story out
• 57:00
  Speaker 2: of Baltimore with Lamar Jackson and the ankle injury? He's
• 57:04
  Speaker 2: good to go. He's not good to go. He doesn't
• 57:05
  Speaker 2: want to go out there in a league that celebrates,
• 57:08
  Speaker 2: celebrates playing through pain. And he decided it'd be better
• 57:11
  Speaker 2: if he sat out.
• 57:12
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 57:12
  Speaker 4: Yeah. It is a confusing one. I feel like they
• 57:15
  Speaker 4: haven't had clear, concise communication of his injuries going all
• 57:20
  Speaker 4: the way back to when Harbaugh was there too. So
• 57:22
  Speaker 4: now you go, okay, maybe the training staff is the,
• 57:25
  Speaker 4: is the common denominator, but Lamar Jackson is. And, He
• 57:28
  Speaker 4: seems like one of those guys who is obviously different
• 57:33
  Speaker 4: in terms of what he can do physically. I mean,
• 57:35
  Speaker 4: what he can do with his legs and run. And
• 57:39
  Speaker 4: he seems like kind of, to use a car analogy,
• 57:43
  Speaker 4: the Ferrari that's really tuned up. It's like he doesn't
• 57:48
  Speaker 4: want to drive on a dirt road. He wants to
• 57:52
  Speaker 4: feel like he's himself. And so that's why I think
• 57:57
  Speaker 4: it's looked like. Maybe he's going to play and he's practicing,
• 58:00
  Speaker 4: but then he's not going to go. So one of
• 58:03
  Speaker 4: the things I looked at in the column was like,
• 58:05
  Speaker 4: does he have a point? I mean, are they actually,
• 58:07
  Speaker 4: when he plays hurt, is he so bad that they're
• 58:09
  Speaker 4: better off with their backup? And I think last year, statistically,
• 58:13
  Speaker 4: they were better with the backup compared to when Lamar
• 58:15
  Speaker 4: was on the injury report. But I think longer term,
• 58:18
  Speaker 4: they've been better with Lamar. And I think as a
• 58:21
  Speaker 4: team that could use some leadership right now, I think
• 58:26
  Speaker 4: even they have said that coming out of that game yesterday.
• 58:29
  Speaker 4: And I think the coach said that, man, getting him
• 58:32
  Speaker 4: back would be a huge boost for a team that
• 58:35
  Speaker 4: just keeps losing these second-half leads.
• 58:37
  Speaker 2: It's crazy what's going on there. Great stuff, as always.
• 58:40
  Speaker 2: Mike Sandel's Pick 6 column is up in The Athletic.
• 58:42
  Speaker 2: Click on the NFL tab. My algorithm just goes to
• 58:45
  Speaker 2: the front page on Monday mornings, which tells you that
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: we're checking it out. But in the meantime, thanks for
• 58:49
  Speaker 2: joining us. On with Chuck and Anders and company later
• 58:52
  Speaker 2: this week. So we'll look forward to that. In the meantime,
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: have a great rest of your week, Mike.
• 58:55
  Speaker 3: Thank you. Thank you.
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: That is Mike Sando from The Athletic, theathletic.com. Love his
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: stuff every week. His column is fantastic. Great tour around
• 59:02
  Speaker 2: the NFL with a lot of insight from executives and
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: coaches throughout the National Football League. Yeah, Philadelphia tonight and Dallas. Two,
• 59:09
  Speaker 2: two and four teams. Someone's going to be two and five.
• 59:12
  Speaker 3: Mike's right.
• 59:13
  Speaker 2: Because of the Giants leading the division, it won't be
• 59:15
  Speaker 2: necessarily an elimination game for the NFC East. And you
• 59:18
  Speaker 2: keep an eye on the NFC East because if you're
• 59:21
  Speaker 2: the Seahawks... that may be someplace you have to travel
• 59:23
  Speaker 2: if you go to a wild card game.
• 59:25
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 59:25
  Speaker 2: So that's, it's interesting. None of those teams look fantastic.
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: Although the giants, all of a sudden, do they have
• 59:30
  Speaker 2: a quarterback in JJ McCarthy? Didn't get a chance to
• 59:32
  Speaker 2: get into that with him, with Mike, but damn JJ
• 59:34
  Speaker 2: McCarthy looked good yesterday of all things.
• 59:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 59:36
  Speaker 2: Which was surprising. I think, I don't think it's yeah.
• 59:38
  Speaker 3: An elimination game, but it is a train wreck and
• 59:40
  Speaker 3: I kind of enjoy watching it.
• 59:42
  Speaker 2: There's a part of me that wants to see Dallas
• 59:44
  Speaker 2: lose just because the Jerry Jones factor and his post
• 59:46
  Speaker 2: games are phenomenal. Um, But then Sirianni and Philadelphia losing
• 59:50
  Speaker 2: at home to Dallas. Yeah, they're just going to lose
• 59:52
  Speaker 2: their minds. So one way or the other, someone's going
• 59:54
  Speaker 2: to lose their mind tonight. And I'm here for that.
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: That makes for fun on Monday Night Football. We'll have
• 59:57
  Speaker 2: that for you here on KJR. 5.15 kickoff right after
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 2: Softie Fane and the Jackson Felts experience. We'll take a break,
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 2: come back. More text, talk backs as well next.