Latest / SHeCOMMERCE / Ep 39: Erin Lovingfoss, Loving Your Pause: Menopause, Medicine & Making Yourself Heard

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Ep 39: Erin Lovingfoss, Loving Your Pause: Menopause, Medicine & Making Yourself Heard · SHeCOMMERCE

0:08
SPEAKER_02: Welcome back to She Commerce, where power women and real talk collide in the CBG world.
0:14
SPEAKER_02: I'm Christina.
0:15
SPEAKER_02: And I'm Jackie.
0:18
SPEAKER_02: And we have a great episode for you where we really are going to be supporting the She side of our business, SheCommerce.
0:33
SPEAKER_02: Jackie, I have a hypothetical.
0:35
SPEAKER_02: Imagine C side.
0:37
SPEAKER_02: You know what I'm saying?
0:41
SPEAKER_02: Imagine you're going through a major surgery, and only years after you discover that no one prepared you for what might happen next.
0:53
SPEAKER_02: And some of those things that happen next could be mood changes, anxiety, a host of other physical symptoms, um just an innate feeling that you're not yourself, but you don't know why.
1:08
SPEAKER_02: And then you finally ask for help and you're told it's just stress, or maybe it's depression, or just you need to live live with this.
1:17
SPEAKER_02: That's your new normal.
1:20
SPEAKER_00: Well, of course, but today, today we're calling bullshit on the silence surrounding perimenopause and menopause because women are still entering one of the most significant transitions of their lives without enough information, without enough support, and far too often without anyone actually listening properly.
1:45
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and this conversation matters for those of you at home, in the doctor's office, and in the workplace, because menopause is not just a personal issue, it affects how women feel, how they lead, how they perform at their jobs, and whether they feel supported enough to stay and thrive in their careers.
2:10
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
2:11
SPEAKER_00: I mean, today's guest knows that journey personally.
2:14
SPEAKER_00: After undergoing a hysterectomy in 2019, Erin Loving Foss began experiencing symptoms several years later that included mood swings, anxiety, depression, and the sense that there's something that's just not right.
2:30
SPEAKER_00: Because you know, right?
2:31
SPEAKER_00: You know how you would normally react to something.
2:35
SPEAKER_00: And her search for answers eventually led her to a practitioner who shock horror actually paid attention and listened, and to a treatment path that helped her begin to feel like herself again.
2:50
SPEAKER_02: Yes, but Erin didn't stop at finding answers just for herself.
2:55
SPEAKER_02: She went on to study menopause coaching and build a community of support, creating loving your paws, all while continuing a career built on over two decades in the beverage industry.
3:11
SPEAKER_00: And how incredible is that that someone who went through the trauma of not being able to figure out what was going on found it and didn't say, No, I found it.
3:22
SPEAKER_00: I'm okay.
3:23
SPEAKER_00: If I had to go through the pain, other people do.
3:26
SPEAKER_00: No, no, no.
3:27
SPEAKER_00: No.
3:27
SPEAKER_00: Erin didn't do that.
3:28
SPEAKER_00: She decided to talk about medical self-advocacy, paying it forward, talking about menopause at work, sexual wellness, everyday habits, and what it means to turn a personal health journey into a second calling, bringing it and paying it forward to the community of women out there.
3:48
SPEAKER_02: Yes, and that's what we call boss female leadership in action.
3:54
SPEAKER_02: Erin, welcome to SheCommerce.
3:57
SPEAKER_01: Thank you, ladies.
3:58
SPEAKER_01: I'm so excited to be here.
4:00
SPEAKER_01: That was an amazing intro.
4:02
SPEAKER_00: Of course.
4:03
SPEAKER_00: Glad you're here.
4:04
SPEAKER_00: So glad.
4:05
SPEAKER_02: It's amazing what you've done.
4:06
SPEAKER_02: Um so yeah, we're inviting you in.
4:10
SPEAKER_02: We want to have this chat.
4:11
SPEAKER_02: We also want to spill some tea, right, Jackie?
4:13
SPEAKER_00: Oh, yes.
4:14
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
4:16
SPEAKER_00: We are going to spill some.
4:18
SPEAKER_00: I'm really into my types of tea.
4:20
SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes.
4:22
SPEAKER_00: You're like, oh my God, here we go.
4:24
SPEAKER_00: Yes, what Nordic?
4:26
SPEAKER_02: Darjaling, something, something we have.
4:28
SPEAKER_00: You you have Darjeeling now.
4:30
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
4:31
SPEAKER_02: She asked me the other day what kind of tea is this?
4:33
SPEAKER_02: I'm like, I don't know, chamomile, like uh black tea, lifting, like what are we looking for here?
4:41
SPEAKER_00: Seriously.
4:42
SPEAKER_02: She's fancy.
4:44
SPEAKER_02: She's fancy.
4:45
SPEAKER_00: I am so fancy.
4:47
SPEAKER_00: But now I'm going to be talking about drones AI and the women behind the headlines.
4:52
SPEAKER_00: Okay, Christina, it's officially time to have a sip of Darjeeling, darling.
4:57
SPEAKER_00: And today's tea is incredibly future forward.
5:00
SPEAKER_00: We've got drones delivering your dinner and potentially one of the biggest IPOs in history.
5:08
SPEAKER_02: Seriously.
5:09
SPEAKER_02: So basically, the future of commerce is flying over our heads and being powered by robots.
5:16
SPEAKER_02: Totally normal.
5:18
SPEAKER_02: So maybe let's start with the DoorDash piece.
5:22
SPEAKER_02: So at the end of July, DoorDash announced that it received SAA Part 135, air carrier certification.
5:29
SPEAKER_02: Sounds very official, and launched DoorDash Air, its own in-house drone delivery program.
5:35
SPEAKER_00: That's just, I mean, that's but that's not just a cute innovation story, right?
5:40
SPEAKER_00: No.
5:40
SPEAKER_00: That certification is a huge milestone because DoorDash says it is only the eighth grown operator to receive that.
5:51
SPEAKER_00: And the company is building the program directly into its existing marketplace rather than treating drones like some separate science experiment.
6:00
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's really cool.
6:02
SPEAKER_02: And that's the interesting part from like a commerce perspective, because this is not about the technology or the medium.
6:12
SPEAKER_02: It's not about the drone alone.
6:13
SPEAKER_02: It's about the network, right?
6:14
SPEAKER_02: That they're building.
6:16
SPEAKER_02: And I think by doing that, they're essentially saying we have dashers, the humans that deliver.
6:23
SPEAKER_02: We have autonomous vehicles in some markets, we have robots, and now we have drones.
6:29
SPEAKER_02: And our platform is going to be the one deciding which of those fulfillment methods makes the most sense for each order and optimizing, obviously, to you know, uh incremental profit and speed, customer service, etc.
6:46
SPEAKER_02: So that changes the conversation from how fast can I deliver to what is the smartest uh way to fulfill this specific trip.
6:57
SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
6:58
SPEAKER_00: And there is a real operational reason behind this.
7:04
SPEAKER_00: So DoorDash has said that more than 20% of its orders in 2025 traveled between three and five miles.
7:11
SPEAKER_00: And those trips took almost 25% longer than shorter deliveries.
7:19
SPEAKER_00: Their argument is that drones could take some of those mid-range trips while dashers focus on shorter deliveries and the orders that autonomy can't easily handle.
7:31
SPEAKER_02: Interesting.
7:32
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and so brands, retailers that are listening, here's the so what.
7:37
SPEAKER_02: The consumer expectation around immediacy is not going anywhere.
7:43
SPEAKER_02: Like, spoiler alert, it's definitely not going backwards.
7:46
SPEAKER_02: So if drone delivery makes certain orders even faster or more economical, suddenly the use case gets even more interesting.
7:56
SPEAKER_02: Like, think about cold medicine, a missing ingredient when you're in the middle of cooking a meal, coffee, uh, maybe a heating pad for your cramps that suddenly come on, uh, a forgotten item before a kids' game.
8:11
SPEAKER_02: I think this changes what people consider worth ordering for delivery.
8:18
SPEAKER_01: We just found out where I live in the suburbs of Illinois that they're going to be delivering Amazon packages within 30 minutes.
8:25
SPEAKER_02: Ooh.
8:26
SPEAKER_01: Via drone.
8:27
SPEAKER_01: Via drone.
8:27
SPEAKER_00: Via drone.
8:28
SPEAKER_00: Oh soon.
8:30
SPEAKER_00: Now here's the thing though, Erin.
8:32
SPEAKER_00: This completely changes the definition of impulse buying, right?
8:36
SPEAKER_00: Because now your impulses are arriving from the sky.
8:43
SPEAKER_00: I feel like there's a shock and awe appeal to that.
8:46
SPEAKER_00: It's feeding the addiction.
8:47
SPEAKER_00: It's feeding the addiction.
8:49
SPEAKER_00: It's super feeding my addiction.
8:51
SPEAKER_01: Imagine my neighborhood just alone is gonna have drones constantly over it.
8:55
SPEAKER_01: Imagining how many times Amazon packages get dropped off at their doors.
9:00
SPEAKER_01: But you're gonna get used to a constant buzz.
9:03
SPEAKER_02: I can imagine think about a kid's birthday partying and you having a drone drop in like the pinata or like candle.
9:13
SPEAKER_02: Like you, I mean, that's like rock star level.
9:17
SPEAKER_02: Uh I wonder if there's like a weight limit though.
9:20
SPEAKER_02: Like, what if it's carrying?
9:21
SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
9:22
SPEAKER_01: It did say there was a weight limit.
9:23
SPEAKER_01: I want to say it was um under 10 pounds.
9:27
SPEAKER_00: Oh man, if there was a weight limit that was just maybe 10 pounds over my weight, can you take me to the office?
9:36
SPEAKER_02: All right.
9:37
SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh.
9:38
SPEAKER_02: All right.
9:38
SPEAKER_02: Story is story number two.
9:40
SPEAKER_02: And this one is very she commerce.
9:43
SPEAKER_02: Uh, anthropic, the company behind Claude, maybe you've heard of it, is reportedly preparing for what be what could become the largest IPO ever.
9:53
SPEAKER_02: Erin, have you heard this yet?
9:56
SPEAKER_02: Um, I don't think I have.
9:58
SPEAKER_02: Okay, so um, before I tell you what the potential valuation is at, give me a guess what you think it's at.
10:07
SPEAKER_01: Oh gosh.
10:08
SPEAKER_01: I have no idea.
10:10
SPEAKER_01: Millions.
10:12
SPEAKER_01: Right?
10:13
SPEAKER_02: That's that's that's and that's a lot.
10:17
SPEAKER_02: Well, you gotta go, you gotta add some more zero.
10:20
SPEAKER_01: Oh, trillions.
10:21
SPEAKER_01: We're talking trillions here, huh?
10:22
SPEAKER_01: Two trillion.
10:24
SPEAKER_02: Trillion, two hundred and trillion, two trillion dollars.
10:28
SPEAKER_02: They didn't even say that.
10:29
SPEAKER_02: Who said it?
10:29
SPEAKER_02: Doesn't even sound like trillion dollars.
10:31
SPEAKER_02: Wow.
10:32
SPEAKER_02: All right, okay.
10:33
SPEAKER_00: Obviously, one million dollars was like a big deal.
10:40
SPEAKER_00: And one million, please.
10:42
SPEAKER_00: That's how much I pay for my Starbucks.
10:44
SPEAKER_00: We're talking trillions now.
10:46
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, wow and then the trillions.
10:49
SPEAKER_02: But okay, so we'll caveat saying this is still speculation, right?
10:53
SPEAKER_02: Around the eventual eventual public market valuation.
10:57
SPEAKER_02: It's not a guaranteed IPO price.
10:59
SPEAKER_02: We have to disclaimer, but that is that's the level that is being thrown out there right now.
11:08
SPEAKER_00: But also, uh, here's the thing, Aaron.
11:11
SPEAKER_00: Um Christina knows that I have I have a very special place in my heart for anthropic because because I am basically a dork at heart, and anthropic is is it's just so much more.
11:22
SPEAKER_00: And I I think maybe I have a crush on Claude.
11:25
SPEAKER_00: I'm not sure.
11:26
SPEAKER_00: I'm I'm I'm working through my emotions there.
11:28
SPEAKER_00: But uh the post that really, really caught our attention was um from Jenny Stokovic.
11:34
SPEAKER_00: Uh, because instead of only talking about the giant valuation, which is, you know, gigantic, she asked a really, really brilliant question here.
11:47
SPEAKER_00: And that is, who are the women helping build this company?
11:51
SPEAKER_00: And the coolest thing is, which is probably what may give me uh makes me have a girl crush on anthropic, there are a lot of them.
12:00
SPEAKER_00: Oh, that is so exciting.
12:02
SPEAKER_00: Christina, take it away.
12:04
SPEAKER_02: Name the names.
12:06
SPEAKER_02: So there's Daniela Amode, who co-founded Anthropic with her brother Dario, but I feel like Dario gets a lot of the press and the buzz, and she's kind of behind the scenes a bit.
12:19
SPEAKER_02: Um, then you look deeper and you see women that are holding leadership roles across product, governance, investing, communications on the tech side.
12:29
SPEAKER_02: We have Amanda Askel, who helped shape Claude's values and behavior.
12:33
SPEAKER_00: She's written the ethical white paper.
12:35
SPEAKER_00: Um, she is the author of that ethical white paper, which is just love that.
12:41
SPEAKER_02: You have Amy Borah, who leads product after a long career with both Meta and Fair.
12:48
SPEAKER_02: Diane Pen, who has helped ship Claude products, and Sasha D Margny, I might be messing that up, but she's built Anthropic's communications function as well.
13:01
SPEAKER_02: It's just a whole host of women driving that company forward.
13:06
SPEAKER_00: And if that's not a clear sign that more women need to embrace and invest in uh AI and practicing and using it in their everyday lives, then honey, you ain't been listening, right?
13:24
SPEAKER_00: Um and this is exactly why we talk so much about visibility.
13:27
SPEAKER_00: Because when a company becomes worth hundreds of billions, or potentially in this case, trillions, I don't even know how many zeros that is, to be fair.
13:36
SPEAKER_00: The headline usually becomes founder, CEO, valuation, IPO.
13:42
SPEAKER_03: Mm-hmm.
13:43
SPEAKER_02: But we know that companies are not built by one person.
13:48
SPEAKER_02: And women are often sitting in these incredibly consequential roles, shaping the product, the strategy, the governance, the capital, the culture, without becoming part of that very public narrative.
14:01
SPEAKER_02: And that's what we want to change.
14:03
SPEAKER_00: Which is the she commerce takeaway for me.
14:06
SPEAKER_00: And I love that Jenny brought this out and you know, she blasted it on LinkedIn.
14:11
SPEAKER_00: We need to stop waiting until women become CEOs before we decide their leadership story is so worth telling.
14:19
SPEAKER_02: Yes, because influence does not only live at the top of an org chart.
14:25
SPEAKER_02: And if AI is going to reshape commerce, work, media, our personalized, basically everything, we should absolutely know who is helping make the decisions behind it.
14:40
SPEAKER_00: So today's lapsong Sushan, commerce is moving faster.
14:46
SPEAKER_00: Delivery is moving into the sky.
14:48
SPEAKER_00: AI valuations are moving into numbers that I don't even know what they look like in terms of zeros.
14:57
SPEAKER_02: And we are going to keep asking the other question: where are the women shaping it all?
15:04
SPEAKER_02: T spill.
15:06
SPEAKER_02: Now, all right.
15:07
SPEAKER_02: So let's talk about the woman that's shaping the conversation and normalizing the conversation around perimenopause and menopause and get into today's conversation.
15:19
SPEAKER_02: All right.
15:20
SPEAKER_02: So, Erin, again, thank you so much for joining us and being willing to share your story and you know be vulnerable for our guests and our community.
15:30
SPEAKER_02: Um, let's start at the beginning of your story.
15:33
SPEAKER_02: If you, I know Jackie kind of touched on it in the opening, but if you could take us back to your hysterectomy in 2019 and yeah, walk us through like what were you told to expect and and what were you not told?
15:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I feel like I really wasn't told much.
15:48
SPEAKER_01: I had the hysterectomy, um, I was having so much pain, painful, you know, periods, all of that stuff where it really led to I was done having children, let's have this hysterectomy, um, and pretty much just sent home.
16:01
SPEAKER_01: I had two C-sections, so I was kind of like, oh, they're like, oh, it'll be a recovery, kind of like your C-sections, right?
16:06
SPEAKER_01: So I was like, okay, great.
16:08
SPEAKER_01: Um went home, dealt with that.
16:10
SPEAKER_01: They I did, they did leave one ovary, which I think is why I didn't go into full, you know, menopause then.
16:16
SPEAKER_01: And maybe that's why they felt they didn't need to say anything, or maybe just weren't trained to say anything.
16:21
SPEAKER_01: From what I'm reading a lot about, it's it's really just it's not necessarily the doctor's fault.
16:26
SPEAKER_01: They're not trained to teach us or educate us on these things yet.
16:30
SPEAKER_01: And that is changing, thank God.
16:32
SPEAKER_01: Um, but no, I was just kind of sent back home.
16:35
SPEAKER_01: And then a couple years later, like I said, I started having symptoms.
16:39
SPEAKER_01: Um, I've always been extremely like go-getter, always the planner, always, you know, on top of it at work and never struggled with depression or anxiety.
16:49
SPEAKER_01: Um, and I just did not feel like myself.
16:52
SPEAKER_01: I didn't understand what was happening.
16:54
SPEAKER_01: Um, I was kind of like pulling myself back socially and even at work, um, just like lost a lot of confidence that I, you know, had, um, just not feeling like myself, which when I talk to a lot of women, that's their number one complaint of starting this process is I just don't feel like myself.
17:13
SPEAKER_01: So went to the doctor, kind of explained that, had heart amputations.
17:17
SPEAKER_01: Um, they wanted to give me a um depression anxiety meds.
17:21
SPEAKER_01: I was like, I've never struggled with either of those.
17:23
SPEAKER_01: I'm not really comfortable.
17:24
SPEAKER_01: Go, I didn't want to go on meds.
17:26
SPEAKER_01: I think that they serve their purpose, and that's fine for people that need it.
17:30
SPEAKER_01: I just felt like I wasn't one of those people.
17:32
SPEAKER_01: So I kind of pushed through, um, kept going.
17:35
SPEAKER_01: Um, but then, like, like I said, the heart palputations, um, I started having even some like acid reflux where things were cut like coming up, and I didn't understand why that was happening, ended up in the emergency room because it kept going for like hours.
17:50
SPEAKER_01: My dad had to like pick me up and bring me to the emergency room.
17:53
SPEAKER_01: That was never relayed as a type a part of perimenopause either until I figured that out later.
17:59
SPEAKER_01: Um, just so many random things.
18:01
SPEAKER_01: The insomnia was the worst um because then you can't you have that so much brain fog the next day.
18:06
SPEAKER_01: You feel like you can't focus.
18:08
SPEAKER_01: Um, had another doctor's appointment.
18:10
SPEAKER_01: Um, she pretty much said, it's menopause.
18:13
SPEAKER_01: It happens to all women, like live with it.
18:15
SPEAKER_01: Like this, that I can't help you.
18:17
SPEAKER_01: This is, but this is probably what it is, right?
18:20
SPEAKER_01: So I was like, oh gosh, well, um, never went back to her.
18:25
SPEAKER_01: Uh found found a new doctor.
18:28
SPEAKER_01: Um and actually, this was not even a doctor.
18:30
SPEAKER_01: This was a nurse practitioner that I made an appointment with.
18:33
SPEAKER_01: Um, went into her office, um, started talking to her about my symptoms.
18:38
SPEAKER_01: First thing she did was did not cut me off.
18:41
SPEAKER_01: She listened to me, right?
18:42
SPEAKER_01: She really listened.
18:43
SPEAKER_01: Then she asked me follow-up questions on my symptoms.
18:46
SPEAKER_01: She's like, oh, well, you're talking a lot about a lot of stuff that's like in your happening in your brain with the insomnia and the mood and the cognitive issues.
18:54
SPEAKER_01: Um, are you having, you know, you know, kind of we talked about sexual wellness.
18:59
SPEAKER_01: We talked about um moving into like the heart palputations.
19:03
SPEAKER_01: She started asking more questions.
19:05
SPEAKER_01: We probably talked for 40 minutes, which is unheard of nowadays, I feel like, in a doctor's office.
19:10
SPEAKER_01: And yes, it was an NP, but she was the first one that even said anything about hormone replacement therapy.
19:17
SPEAKER_01: And I feel like the last year it's really taken off with the conversations.
19:21
SPEAKER_01: And I guess also it's in my feed now, right?
19:23
SPEAKER_01: Because I started a business around it.
19:26
SPEAKER_01: But a lot of people I talk to still are not as aware of perimenopause and menopause as I feel like everyone is now.
19:32
SPEAKER_01: Um, and I didn't know anything about hormone replacement therapy or HRT at all.
19:37
SPEAKER_01: Um, and she just she didn't push anything on me.
19:40
SPEAKER_01: She explained what it would be, said, why don't we start with like 0.5, you know, estradiol.
19:45
SPEAKER_01: Um, she told me that there was a patch version.
19:47
SPEAKER_01: She told me there was an oral um version.
19:50
SPEAKER_01: Um, we decided on the oral just because I have a hot tub of sauna, a pool, and she we didn't want to do the patch.
19:56
SPEAKER_01: So I felt like that.
19:57
SPEAKER_01: And I also didn't have any issues with my kidneys and livers.
20:01
SPEAKER_01: I was a candidate for the oral, where a lot of people are.
20:04
SPEAKER_01: So um I honestly, it could have been placebo effect, but I swear I felt better in 24 hours.
20:11
SPEAKER_01: And then, like as the three weeks, four weeks went on, I just couldn't believe how much more like myself I was feeling.
20:18
SPEAKER_01: Um, I will say after about three months, I felt like it was starting to come back.
20:21
SPEAKER_01: So I went back to her and she upped it um for me.
20:24
SPEAKER_01: And I have been on that now.
20:27
SPEAKER_01: It'll be two years in May.
20:29
SPEAKER_01: Um, we've I've tried some other stuff for some other things too, and I just it ebbs and flows, but that's kind of where it started, you know, feeling dismissed, feeling unheard, and then found somebody that listened and then really was like, wow, this is life-changing to how I felt.
20:44
SPEAKER_01: So I want to learn more about this.
20:46
SPEAKER_01: And that's when I decided to take the course courses last fall and got certified as a menopausal coach specialist um the end of last year.
20:55
SPEAKER_01: And then I was like, I need to do more with this information.
20:59
SPEAKER_01: I need to teach women, I want to educate women.
21:02
SPEAKER_01: And I started my little LLC and it's been it's been pretty amazing.
21:06
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I have a full-time, full-time job, so I haven't been able to do as much as I'd like, but just talking to people, booking, you know, wellness events and education, and I learned how to build a website and I did it all on my own.
21:18
SPEAKER_01: And I'm really pretty proud of myself.
21:19
SPEAKER_01: I'm not a tech person.
21:21
SPEAKER_01: So to learn like how to do all of that was very like it helped build a lot of that confidence back that I was missing.
21:28
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
21:29
SPEAKER_02: We're gonna get into all that, Erin.
21:31
SPEAKER_02: Um, I mean, just what a what a journey to get there.
21:34
SPEAKER_02: Too too long of a journey, honestly, in our opinion.
21:37
SPEAKER_02: And I I'll say myself, and maybe this is my own ignorance, but like I knew of menopause that doesn't don't really know all the ins and outs.
21:44
SPEAKER_02: My mom never like sat me down and had to talk.
21:48
SPEAKER_02: And I I have never heard about perimenopause until like the last two years, with all these people starting to talk about the hormone replacement.
21:56
SPEAKER_02: I'm like, wait, what do you mean?
21:57
SPEAKER_02: Like there's a there's a precursor to this?
22:00
SPEAKER_02: What what's that?
22:01
SPEAKER_02: Um, so yeah, I mean, I think you're right on to something that this is a conversation that a lot of people don't have and don't have information on.
22:12
SPEAKER_02: So you going through something like that for all those years and not knowing what's happening, you know, has to be like maddening and uh, you know, such a distraction for the other things that you have in your life.
22:25
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
22:25
SPEAKER_01: And most women, when we go through this, we are in our you know, peak career stage.
22:31
SPEAKER_01: We are taking care of kids, we're taking care of maybe, maybe even elderly parents, right?
22:35
SPEAKER_01: So we have a lot going on, and we are that's kind of where they're said, you know, it's just stress, it's just stress.
22:41
SPEAKER_01: You have a lot going on.
22:42
SPEAKER_01: But there's also a lot that can help you in this time if you know what you what to identify.
22:47
SPEAKER_00: Of course.
22:48
SPEAKER_00: And and you know, and and and the uh now when I think back to my much younger days and you know, the older women who were in my, I guess, in my in my universe at that time in at work, and you have and you know, I bought into and I feel, you know, I'm I'm gonna out myself as being a horrible person.
23:08
SPEAKER_00: I feel really awful that at that point myself and some of my younger colleagues were like, oh my god, there's such a grumpy old woman.
23:16
SPEAKER_00: Well, hell yeah.
23:18
SPEAKER_00: Going through all of this, all of this, and and and of course, we we didn't know.
23:23
SPEAKER_00: I didn't even know uh what what menopause was.
23:26
SPEAKER_00: I just thought, okay, that's it, your period stops, right?
23:28
SPEAKER_00: That's it.
23:30
SPEAKER_00: Because my mom didn't tell me about it, my grandmother didn't tell me about it.
23:33
SPEAKER_00: No older woman in my circle mentioned anything about that.
23:39
SPEAKER_00: And um, and and now when I think about it, I'm like, oh, I need to go, I need to contact the people who I thought were grumpy, and it and I need to apologize.
23:49
SPEAKER_00: Because Lord knows it's changed for me.
23:51
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, I'm like like you said.
23:56
unknown: Ow.
23:58
SPEAKER_00: But I am the grumpy one.
23:59
SPEAKER_00: No, no, come on No, but I um I went I and again I I still say I think I went through menopause last year.
24:08
SPEAKER_00: No, I definitely I went through menopause last year, and then it left me with a little um with a little sort of like uh going away present of anxiety.
24:15
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like uh slight anxiety.
24:17
SPEAKER_00: So I'm really lucky, but I'm sitting there going, what is this?
24:21
SPEAKER_00: I've never had this.
24:23
SPEAKER_00: I'm not anxious, I thrive on crazy.
24:29
SPEAKER_00: Yep.
24:29
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, Christina, not one word, okay?
24:31
SPEAKER_00: Not one word.
24:32
SPEAKER_02: No, what does that say about me and like you doing this with me?
24:36
SPEAKER_02: Well, this is why.
24:37
SPEAKER_02: I thrive on crazy.
24:43
SPEAKER_01: No, and that's the thing.
24:44
SPEAKER_01: At least knowing what's happening uh can make you not feel crazy, right?
24:49
SPEAKER_01: Um, because I think that's how some women do feel, and just knowing that there's a word for it and talking about it and talking about it with your friends, your family, your community.
24:58
SPEAKER_01: I mean, just feeling less alone is a huge, right?
25:03
SPEAKER_00: So, so, so much.
25:04
SPEAKER_00: And like hot flashes you hear about, but no one tell tells you that you can also have cold flashes because I was freezing all of last year.
25:11
SPEAKER_00: I was freezing.
25:12
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, what the hell's going on?
25:15
SPEAKER_00: It's like 40 degrees outside.
25:17
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, chills.
25:18
SPEAKER_00: And this summer, um the weather here has been crazy, crazy hot.
25:22
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, wait, am I having a hot flash or is it hot?
25:25
SPEAKER_00: And then I have to wait for people around me saying, oh my god, it's really hot.
25:28
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, okay, no, it's it's fine, it's fine.
25:31
SPEAKER_00: It actually is crazy.
25:32
SPEAKER_00: But let's go back to you, Erin.
25:34
SPEAKER_00: You know, that three or four years later, um, you know, after the hysterectomy, you began experiencing the mood swings and anxiety and everything we talked about earlier.
25:44
SPEAKER_00: Let's talk about what this period, how did this period feel for you?
25:51
SPEAKER_00: What did it feel like?
25:53
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, before I knew what was happening or after I knew what was happening.
25:57
SPEAKER_00: Before, before.
25:58
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so before I was just very, very, very confused.
26:01
SPEAKER_01: Um, I did feel like I was kind of losing my mind because I always, you know, have my to-do list, have my checklist, and I've always felt great and I've always, you know, moved along.
26:13
SPEAKER_01: I've never been depressed, always the positive attitude.
26:15
SPEAKER_01: So it was just very I felt very sad.
26:19
SPEAKER_01: I felt confused.
26:21
SPEAKER_01: I felt um dismissed.
26:23
SPEAKER_01: I didn't even know how to like explain it to my friends and family, like how I was feeling, because I was never that depressive person.
26:29
SPEAKER_01: Um, I did start to pull back a little bit socially too, which is very not like me.
26:34
SPEAKER_01: Um, but and then yeah, with confidence.
26:36
SPEAKER_01: It just I it it it definitely made me not like want to go for that next role.
26:43
SPEAKER_01: Um, and things like that, and just kind of like sit back and just sit in it, which at the time I feel like if I knew what it was and someone gave me even a word for it and I could have placed it, I don't think I would have had all of that like fear and anxiety around it.
27:00
SPEAKER_00: So, I mean, this this took a knock to your confidence and it affected your relationships.
27:06
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god, I can't even imagine.
27:09
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
27:10
SPEAKER_02: So, and and you're trying to get answers.
27:12
SPEAKER_02: You go to all these healthcare professionals that are told to trust and tell them what's going on, and they keep dismissing you or misdiagnosing or diagnosing too quickly.
27:24
SPEAKER_02: Was there a moment when you realized, hey, I know this is not just stress, or this is not just depression all of a sudden, that there's something else happening here?
27:34
SPEAKER_02: Like that voice and like what was that moment?
27:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I know I definitely knew and I tried to find somebody who um I heard about the perimenopause and um menopause.
27:45
SPEAKER_01: So I searched for a physician or a practice that had specialty in it.
27:50
SPEAKER_01: Um, so the nurse that I did find had like a menopause certification that I found online.
27:56
SPEAKER_01: Um, but I think the final straw with me was sleeping.
27:59
SPEAKER_01: I mean, the insomnia was excruciating.
28:03
SPEAKER_01: I think that was probably one of my worst, worst symptoms.
28:06
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
28:06
SPEAKER_01: Um, and then that just affects everything else, right?
28:09
SPEAKER_01: Because if you are not sleeping, you obviously don't have the energy to give it all at your job.
28:13
SPEAKER_01: You don't have the energy to, you know, do all your strength training and eat the all the protein and do all the things you're supposed to be doing.
28:20
SPEAKER_01: So it literally just kind of derails everything.
28:23
SPEAKER_01: Um and sleep is literally probably your most important medicine to set you up for all the other habits that support you during this time.
28:31
SPEAKER_01: So um that was pretty brutal.
28:35
SPEAKER_00: I imagine that one of the hardest parts was was knowing that something felt lot wrong, but not being able to pinpoint, right?
28:43
SPEAKER_00: That was that would have been the worst thing.
28:45
SPEAKER_00: Did you did you begin questioning yourself?
28:49
SPEAKER_00: Because you weren't answers.
28:51
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
28:52
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
28:53
SPEAKER_01: I I don't think I ever doubted myself so much in my life.
28:56
SPEAKER_01: Um, I I don't know.
29:00
SPEAKER_01: I just that's kind of what I want women to take out of this is like to know that you are allowed to ask questions, to know that you're allowed to get a second opinion, a third opinion opinion.
29:10
SPEAKER_01: Um, and to find out like what what matters most to you during this time.
29:15
SPEAKER_01: Because I think that really helped me reshape like my values and the and what I wanted out of this time in my life, right?
29:21
SPEAKER_01: I could I could have sat there and not done much about it and been depressed and like took that whole turn, but I really want women to look at this time as like, hey, I just lived these 40 so years, whenever this happens to you.
29:34
SPEAKER_01: It can happen as early as 35, by the way.
29:36
SPEAKER_01: Um and how do you want to live the next 40, 50 years of your life, especially the last 10 of your life, right?
29:43
SPEAKER_01: We outlive men.
29:45
SPEAKER_01: So if you have a male partner, you know, you're most likely gonna live 10 years longer than him.
29:50
SPEAKER_01: Um, how do you want to live that on your own?
29:52
SPEAKER_01: Do you want to live that in a nursing home?
29:54
SPEAKER_01: So we have to decide what our values are, what wellness and our health means to us, because it's gonna be different for everybody, right?
30:01
SPEAKER_01: Like some people, you know, want to be very strong, some people maybe want to be thin, some people just want to have a great life, but a lot of balance.
30:09
SPEAKER_01: So depending on what that is, finding out what that is for you and planning your goals and how to like build your toolbox is kind of what I like to call it, what your toolbox should be for your, you know, daily, weekly activities and and move forward uh with that and just set the mindset of this this is how I'm gonna do it.
30:29
SPEAKER_01: And that's pretty much what I've had to do.
30:31
SPEAKER_01: And every day is different, you know, in the these stages.
30:35
SPEAKER_01: Some days you do wake up after that insomnia, even if you're on HRT, it still happens.
30:39
SPEAKER_01: Um, and you know, you planned for this crazy day and you wanted to to get all this stuff in, and you might have to change that, and then that's okay.
30:46
SPEAKER_01: Also knowing that that is okay.
30:48
SPEAKER_01: Consistency over perfection at this point in our lives is the most important thing.
30:52
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
30:54
SPEAKER_00: So, you know, all the um all the trips, uh all the tips and tricks that you're talking about right now, um, and how you want to share that with the community, you know.
31:05
SPEAKER_00: Um the sisterhood, if you will.
31:09
SPEAKER_00: Um, is that is that similar to um how the nurse practitioner who actually paid attention to you and actually listened, is that how she was, you know, uh in terms of different to everybody else that you'd spoken to?
31:24
SPEAKER_00: Are you are you kind of mirroring um some of her behaviors?
31:29
SPEAKER_01: So I feel we didn't talk too too much about lifestyle changes, honestly, when I was with her.
31:35
SPEAKER_01: A lot of that I've learned from following like um different doctors and some other people, and just from my menopausal certification, because a lot of it was around personal training and how to work that into your daily life in your 40s or you know, 40 and over.
31:51
SPEAKER_01: Um, but she was very instrumental in when she listened and asked questions, that felt like it gave me the permission to do that as well.
32:00
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
32:02
SPEAKER_02: And, you know, well, for people who might be thinking about HRT or hormone replacement therapy, can you share a bit um about what changed?
32:13
SPEAKER_02: Like, is it, you know, a miracle job where you took it and immediately felt something different, or did it take time?
32:19
SPEAKER_02: And what were those first, you know, uh feelings coming off that?
32:24
SPEAKER_01: So what I'd like to say is my experience is not going to be everybody's.
32:28
SPEAKER_01: Everybody is different and everybody is different, right?
32:31
SPEAKER_01: So I don't I don't even necessarily want to talk talk ness about mine.
32:37
SPEAKER_01: What I will say about what I will say about it is it ebbs and flows, right?
32:41
SPEAKER_01: So when I started on the estradiol, I did feel great.
32:45
SPEAKER_01: I had to up it twice, um, and I'm still on it and I feel great.
32:49
SPEAKER_01: But then you get you maybe get a whole nother set of symptoms.
32:53
SPEAKER_01: So that's the other thing, right?
32:54
SPEAKER_01: So you can start to feel in control, but then all of a sudden your estrogen and your testosterone and your progesterone can go wacky on another end, and maybe you need progesterone.
33:05
SPEAKER_01: Um, I did try progesterone, it did not work for me.
33:08
SPEAKER_01: I knew in three weeks immediately that it was not working.
33:11
SPEAKER_01: Um, so they took me off of it right away.
33:13
SPEAKER_01: Uh and I've tried testosterone.
33:16
SPEAKER_01: Again, tried it for six months, felt no different.
33:18
SPEAKER_01: They had to up the dose.
33:19
SPEAKER_01: I'm still in the middle of that, so I'll I'll keep you posted.
33:22
SPEAKER_01: Um, but it's it's I feel like you have to be willing to test it and you have to be willing to listen to your body, um, journal about, journal about how you're feeling, what you're feeling, and everybody is different.
33:34
SPEAKER_01: Everybody's gonna need a different cocktail, uh, maybe assortment of it.
33:39
SPEAKER_01: Some people don't need any of it, right?
33:40
SPEAKER_01: Some people don't have any symptoms at all, which is they praise them, right?
33:44
SPEAKER_01: I that's amazing.
33:45
SPEAKER_01: I have a I have one client that's like, I want to talk to you about stuff just in case stuff starts to happen, but luckily I haven't had anything yet.
33:51
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, yes, that's great that you're trying to learn and like be proactive on it.
33:55
SPEAKER_01: But I don't want to say that everyone's experience is gonna be like mine or anything like that, because that's just not the case.
34:01
SPEAKER_01: Um, it's a very individual experience for every woman.
34:04
SPEAKER_02: And it also feels a bit of a moving target because, like you said, your your body doesn't stay the same forever.
34:10
SPEAKER_02: So, what works today, you know, you have to stay on top of it and work with your your healthcare professional to monitor those things and continue to evolve if necessary.
34:20
SPEAKER_01: 100%.
34:20
SPEAKER_01: And just keep listening because again, if you're on one thing, it's not gonna fix everything, right?
34:24
SPEAKER_01: There's no one pill you can take or one exercise you can do that's gonna make you feel better.
34:29
SPEAKER_01: Um it's gonna vary.
34:31
SPEAKER_01: You know, I wish it was that I wish it was that easy.
34:34
SPEAKER_01: Unfortunately, it's not.
34:36
SPEAKER_00: And you know, the the the challenge here is that um menopause goes on for a while.
34:42
SPEAKER_00: It's not a one and done.
34:45
SPEAKER_00: So you may not need HRT now, but you may potentially need it in in a year or two years or even five or ten years, right?
34:54
SPEAKER_00: And it's and the thing is HRT is is can be really polarizing.
34:59
SPEAKER_00: So, I mean, how do you talk about your experience while how do you talk about it in terms of no, do you talk about it in terms of your experience, um, you know, while still making it clear that decisions are very much up to the individual?
35:17
SPEAKER_00: Or, you know, how how do you do that?
35:20
SPEAKER_01: I honestly try not to talk about HRT in general with my clients or with people at wellness groups.
35:26
SPEAKER_01: I'm happy to share my story about it, but what I like to tell you is there are lifestyle changes that can support you, right?
35:34
SPEAKER_01: So eating the right amount of protein, the right amount of fiber, making sure you're strength training three times a week, uh, making sure you're moving, right?
35:42
SPEAKER_01: Moving with intention.
35:44
SPEAKER_01: So you might not be doing the cardio and the you know HIIT classes like you were in your 20s and 30s and counting your calories anymore.
35:52
SPEAKER_01: And now you really actually want to be putting more fuel into your body to support your bones, right?
35:58
SPEAKER_01: We don't want, we don't want those calories.
36:00
SPEAKER_01: We you should not be counting calories in your 40s.
36:02
SPEAKER_01: Um we want to be strong.
36:04
SPEAKER_01: We want to build those muscles.
36:06
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
36:08
SPEAKER_02: I tend gelato every night and can.
36:11
SPEAKER_00: That's what I heard.
36:12
SPEAKER_00: I heard Aaron said we need to eat more pasta and pizza.
36:15
SPEAKER_02: This is what I took away from this conversation.
36:20
SPEAKER_01: It's all about what makes you happy, right?
36:22
SPEAKER_01: I said you got to set out your goals.
36:23
SPEAKER_01: And if eating pizza and pasta is in your goal, give yourself that pizza or pasta once or twice a week.
36:27
SPEAKER_01: There's other things that will make up for that.
36:30
SPEAKER_00: So, Aaron, what do you what do you wish women understood, you know, about asking the questions?
36:34
SPEAKER_00: You know, like just just knowing what to ask, we're discussing benefits and and making informed decisions.
36:40
SPEAKER_00: You know, what do you wish women knew to know to ask with the open provider?
36:48
SPEAKER_01: So if I was to go into a doctor and knowing what I know now, what I would do is I would write down every single symptom that I have and I'd put them in probably order, at least the first five, in order of what's affecting my life the most, right?
37:00
SPEAKER_01: So the first year was insomnia, and then it was like the acid reflux, whatever, whatever it is for you at that moment, so that your doctor, because unfortunately, they're probably not gonna have 40 minutes to with you, right?
37:12
SPEAKER_01: They're gonna probably have 15.
37:14
SPEAKER_01: Um, and if you can fix, if you can have a conversation with them about the top three to five symptoms that are affecting you, they can put it in a bucket.
37:22
SPEAKER_01: Like, is this her brain?
37:23
SPEAKER_01: Is this her um her heart?
37:25
SPEAKER_01: Is this her gut?
37:26
SPEAKER_01: You know, and and classify that, and then they can kind of choose what can help that.
37:30
SPEAKER_01: Is it gonna be a diet?
37:31
SPEAKER_01: Is it gonna be exercise?
37:32
SPEAKER_01: Is it gonna be HRT, depending on what they um, you know, current medications or their, you know, medical history are.
37:40
SPEAKER_01: Um, I would also say um on my website, I do have a symptom that you could like fill out.
37:46
SPEAKER_01: So there's like 22 questions.
37:47
SPEAKER_01: It probably takes like five or 10 minutes, depending on how much you want to think about it.
37:51
SPEAKER_01: And at the end, it kind of tells you what percentage, you know, what bucket of percentage you're in the most.
37:56
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
37:57
SPEAKER_01: Um and you could start there.
38:00
SPEAKER_01: I do follow Dr.
38:01
SPEAKER_01: Mary Claire Haver.
38:02
SPEAKER_01: Amazing.
38:03
SPEAKER_01: I would say to go on Dr.
38:05
SPEAKER_01: Mary Claire Haver um website, she has a free uh lab checklist because when you walk into a doctor and say, like, oh, I want to, you know, labs, they're gonna give you the general labs that they normally would.
38:18
SPEAKER_01: And those do not tell you anything about perimenopause or menopause, right?
38:22
SPEAKER_01: So you really do need specific labs.
38:25
SPEAKER_01: Um, there's a great checklist in there that you can literally print off and bring to your doctor and ask for those labs.
38:32
SPEAKER_01: Now, I will say some insurances don't always cover that.
38:34
SPEAKER_01: So you may want to talk with your doctor again about those symptoms and say, hey, here's the list of labs that I was recommended to get, which ones align with my top five symptoms, and then let me call my insurance company to make sure it's actually covered, or maybe you don't care and you're still willing to do that, right?
38:50
SPEAKER_01: So, like for me, I heard about dexascans and bone loss.
38:54
SPEAKER_01: So I was like, Oh, I want to get a dexasan.
38:56
SPEAKER_01: I got one.
38:57
SPEAKER_01: I paid out of my pocket for it because it wasn't covered.
39:00
SPEAKER_01: Um and they're actually not much.
39:02
SPEAKER_01: I think they're like 50 bucks.
39:04
SPEAKER_01: So really it's not a bad deal to know your baseline.
39:06
SPEAKER_01: Um, well, I didn't get to find out my baseline until I was in my mid-40s, but I found out my baseline and then I also found out that I have osteopenia.
39:14
SPEAKER_01: So I already have bone loss because I was not given the option to potentially go on HRT early enough to prevent that bone loss.
39:24
SPEAKER_01: So that's something that I'm a little mad about, right?
39:26
SPEAKER_01: Like if I would have been told what exactly was going to happen to my body when it did, I could have taken more prevent preventable measures.
39:32
SPEAKER_01: So now I'm trying to get bone back, right?
39:35
SPEAKER_01: So now I'm trying to jump 20, 50 times a day.
39:38
SPEAKER_01: I'm trying to, you know, get some more like calcium into my diet, more calcium via food and supplement.
39:44
SPEAKER_01: So trying to get that back because my my strength is a little bit gone from that as well.
39:49
SPEAKER_01: So again, just writing down those symptoms, looking at those lab lists, uh that's where to start for sure.
39:55
SPEAKER_01: And those are incredible.
39:57
SPEAKER_01: Sorry, I kind of went off on a tangent.
39:59
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, those are all incredible tips for our viewers and uh listeners.
40:03
SPEAKER_02: And I think, you know, us, yeah, for sure.
40:05
SPEAKER_02: And we'll definitely cross-link those those resources.
40:09
SPEAKER_02: So thank you for that.
40:11
SPEAKER_02: What if what if you do all that?
40:13
SPEAKER_02: You're prepared, you make your list, you have your, you prioritize them, you know, you you are succinct in telling the doctor all these things, uh, and they still dismiss it and just say, oh, that's just stress, or you you might be depressed.
40:29
SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, what would you tell a woman who feels that way?
40:33
SPEAKER_02: And when is it time to request a referral or another opinion?
40:37
SPEAKER_01: I I feel like if you feel dismissed after coming that prepared for your appointment, you're at the wrong doctor.
40:44
SPEAKER_01: Um, I would walk out and just be like, okay, great.
40:46
SPEAKER_01: I'm I'm gonna get a second opinion.
40:47
SPEAKER_01: Nice, nice to meet you.
40:49
SPEAKER_01: I'm leaving now.
40:50
SPEAKER_01: Um, I could also say to be proactive before going to that doctor, you could go on the menopause menopause society um dot com website, and there's a whole list.
40:58
SPEAKER_01: So you can actually find a menopause specialist in your area.
41:03
SPEAKER_02: Okay, great.
41:04
SPEAKER_01: Um, I believe that link is also on Dr.
41:06
SPEAKER_01: Mary Claire Haver's website.
41:08
SPEAKER_01: Um, but trying to find a certified person prior is is it's definitely going to be helpful.
41:16
SPEAKER_01: 100%.
41:19
SPEAKER_02: Helpful.
41:19
SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much.
41:20
SPEAKER_02: Should we talk about menopause in the workplace, Jackie?
41:26
SPEAKER_00: God, yes, let's let's do that.
41:28
SPEAKER_00: Let's talk about menopause in the workplace.
41:31
SPEAKER_00: Oh, gracious.
41:32
SPEAKER_00: Um how do you do that?
41:36
SPEAKER_00: You know, how do you I guess I guess my question here is how do you how do you bring that up to the to your to your boss who may not be female?
41:46
SPEAKER_00: Or maybe a female who's younger and and again, just like us, didn't know, doesn't know about menopause yet because it's not in her radar.
41:57
SPEAKER_00: It's definitely not on the man's radar.
41:59
SPEAKER_00: So, you know, even now talking about period, and you you see men sort of like, oh gosh, the P word.
42:07
SPEAKER_00: Um how?
42:08
SPEAKER_00: How did you bring that up?
42:10
SPEAKER_01: So I will say I didn't discuss it too much with my employer at the time I was going through it because it's a I'm in a male-dominant industry.
42:19
SPEAKER_01: Um, I will say I gosh, I had moments.
42:24
SPEAKER_01: I'm not a crier, first of all, at all.
42:25
SPEAKER_01: I'm not I'm like the opposite of an emotional, like wear it on my shoulder type person.
42:30
SPEAKER_01: I this was another thing I went through for about a year.
42:33
SPEAKER_01: I cried at everything.
42:34
SPEAKER_01: Like I was just at like a work event and I got I was so overwhelmed by some stuff that was happening at work and personally and stuff that I was just like bawling, where my boss was nice about it, kind of like text me on the side, like, are you okay type situation, which is great, but I didn't necessarily want to talk to um him about it.
42:51
SPEAKER_01: What I will say is you don't have to say that you're in perimenopause, you're in menopause.
42:57
SPEAKER_01: You could say you're going through a health concern, you know, something health-wise, that you need, you know, assistance with, right?
43:05
SPEAKER_01: You don't have to say anything.
43:07
SPEAKER_01: Um, I don't think there's anything wrong with saying anything.
43:09
SPEAKER_01: Now that I've started this business, especially, I'm talking about peri-menopause all the time where every I'm making people uncomfortable.
43:15
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I've even had a woman in my company pull me to the side and be like, Why are you talking about that?
43:18
SPEAKER_01: People are just gonna think you're old.
43:20
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, everyone needs to be talking about this.
43:22
SPEAKER_02: But you know, like that's a great, that's a good point though, because women already in the workplace don't want to be seen as old, and we do a lot of things to, you know, yeah.
43:32
SPEAKER_01: But I was like, this is gonna happen.
43:33
SPEAKER_01: This happens to their moms, this is happening to their sisters, this is happening to their wives, this is happening to their friends.
43:38
SPEAKER_01: Like it we get pregnant too.
43:41
SPEAKER_01: Guess what?
43:41
SPEAKER_01: We talk about that, like so what, right?
43:44
SPEAKER_01: We we can't stop talking about things that happen to women after they give birth to babies, right?
43:49
SPEAKER_01: Like we are not just put on dessert to bear children.
43:52
SPEAKER_01: So we are allowed to talk about what comes after that, and I just feel like we don't have to apologize for that anymore.
43:57
SPEAKER_01: Um, and I think we're allowed to ask for.
44:00
SPEAKER_01: You know, reasonable accommodation.
44:03
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, if you're in a meeting and you want to turn the air down, like I do this constantly.
44:08
SPEAKER_01: As soon as I get into a meeting room, I get there 15 minutes early and I call IT if it's too warm.
44:12
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, nope, I will not be able to sit in this meeting for the next three hours without this temperature being controlled, right?
44:20
SPEAKER_01: Um, and I figured out other ways.
44:21
SPEAKER_01: Like before I present, somebody told me one time, like, have an ice cold water bottle.
44:26
SPEAKER_01: Maybe it's even iced and just like put it on your wrist and that'll help.
44:29
SPEAKER_01: And I was like, ooh, that was one of the best advices I've ever been given for when I go to give a presentation, um, just to cool your temperature before you even walk out there.
44:38
SPEAKER_01: But asking for reasonable stuff.
44:40
SPEAKER_01: So if you're not sleeping well the night before, if you do report to the office, maybe, ooh, you could work from home that day.
44:45
SPEAKER_01: Sorry, my ear can fell out.
44:47
SPEAKER_01: Um or, you know, maybe you could start a little bit later that day if you didn't sleep well.
44:53
SPEAKER_01: Or, you know, maybe you could call in virtually.
44:55
SPEAKER_01: Just there's little, there is little things you can ask for.
44:58
SPEAKER_01: Um, I will say, I want to make sure I get it right.
45:01
SPEAKER_01: So our governor of Illinois actually just passed a menopause law.
45:05
SPEAKER_01: Um, it's going under the Equity and Care Act to improve awareness, understanding, and equity of menopause in the workplace.
45:14
SPEAKER_01: So in 2020, yes, in 2027, under the Illinois Human Rights Act, menopause-related conditions are required to have reasonable workplace accommodations for heck flashes, brain fog, sleepless nights, etc., even including joint and muscle symptoms.
45:32
SPEAKER_01: Um, and part of that will be public education.
45:34
SPEAKER_01: And then in 2028, health care insurance plans need to cover medically necessary evaluation, including hormonal and non-hormonal treatment.
45:44
SPEAKER_01: So this just passed last week, which is why I'm reading this.
45:48
SPEAKER_01: Yes, I know.
45:50
SPEAKER_02: All the other states follow suit.
45:51
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
45:52
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
45:53
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
45:53
SPEAKER_01: So I'll give a shout out to our governor on that.
45:57
SPEAKER_00: That's incredible.
45:58
SPEAKER_00: Really great.
45:58
SPEAKER_00: So this is basically encouraging um workplaces to actually start making adjustments that could make an immediate difference.
46:08
SPEAKER_00: And here's the thing: um, it's not a case of you're not asking for special dispensation.
46:14
SPEAKER_00: No, you're just asking for support.
46:18
SPEAKER_00: You still want to work, you still have ambition, you still want to do stuff, but your body, this is your body, your your hormones, your you you just need that additional support.
46:29
SPEAKER_00: Support.
46:30
unknown: Yeah.
46:30
SPEAKER_00: So that so that you can continue bringing your absolute best self, which is a rock star, to work.
46:37
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
46:37
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
46:38
SPEAKER_01: 100%.
46:39
SPEAKER_01: And the women that do not get that support are often likely to walk away from those careers, which is sad because it's peak careers and they're losing talent.
46:47
SPEAKER_01: They're losing great talent.
46:48
SPEAKER_01: And there's not, it's not like we're asking for the world, just a few accommodations and some understanding and compassion.
46:54
unknown: Yeah.
46:54
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think the simplest things that the the simplest thing that a company could do, that an organization could do, is just, if nothing else, just create a culture where women don't feel embarrassed to speak.
47:07
SPEAKER_02: Normalize it.
47:08
SPEAKER_02: Normalize it.
47:09
SPEAKER_02: They companies say they want, you know, women and men to bring their whole selves to work.
47:15
SPEAKER_02: You know, and that means you have to accept the parts that are inconvenient or maybe a little make you a little uncomfortable.
47:23
SPEAKER_02: Um, and I think your at your advocacy for that will definitely go a long way.
47:30
SPEAKER_02: And, you know, Chicago, it's not Chicago, but Illinois leading the charge there.
47:34
SPEAKER_02: So we need more states to follow.
47:37
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm hoping that they will.
47:39
SPEAKER_02: And and also the work you're doing.
47:42
SPEAKER_02: So let's talk a little bit about loving your paws.
47:44
SPEAKER_02: Um, you said you took a menopause coaching course, which who knew that was a thing, um, for your own education, just because you wanted to learn more.
47:55
SPEAKER_02: So when did that switch from learning for your own benefit to now becoming a calling to help other women?
48:06
SPEAKER_01: Once I took the course and just started talking to women about it and being more open and not embarrassed, I guess, to talk about it.
48:13
SPEAKER_01: Um the most common thing I heard from women was, why did I not know this?
48:20
SPEAKER_01: Why is no one talking about this?
48:23
SPEAKER_01: I haven't felt like myself in so long, and I just thought I was crazy or I thought I was alone.
48:28
SPEAKER_01: So again, it's that why is no one talking about this?
48:31
SPEAKER_01: So as many people that start talking about it or have these workshops or listen to this podcast and other podcasts like it, um, it's it's starting a movement, honestly.
48:41
SPEAKER_01: Um, and I do think that it will start to change in the workplace, and you'll see these other states and countries start to support it, which is what we need.
48:49
SPEAKER_01: Um, and some of the podcasts that I listen to, I've learned that only 8% of the medical industry has had any menopausal education at all.
48:59
SPEAKER_01: 8%.
49:00
SPEAKER_01: And that 8%, we're talking OB gynees at less than 8%, 30 minutes, 30 minutes of menopause awareness of anything.
49:09
SPEAKER_01: And even those doctors that are speaking to it now and have these podcasts are saying that they were treating women incorrectly for years.
49:17
SPEAKER_01: They were being even gaslit themselves.
49:20
SPEAKER_01: So, and like starting to realize it and just sharing it is it it's gonna it's gonna make waves.
49:27
SPEAKER_01: I that's all I can say.
49:28
SPEAKER_01: Things are gonna start changing and they're gonna start changing very quickly as long as people see keep continuing having these conversations.
49:36
SPEAKER_00: Oh, I mean, it needs to, right?
49:38
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it needs to.
49:39
SPEAKER_00: I mean uh when your Obi Gynee doesn't know uh anything about menopause, you right?
49:46
SPEAKER_00: What ch what what chance do you have?
49:48
SPEAKER_00: But let's let's also look at um you know the experience you had uh doing personal training with with uh with a group of women.
49:56
SPEAKER_00: How did that shape the kind of support you wanted loving your paws to provide?
50:04
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so the women that I currently um you know support or work out with, um, we're all pretty much in the age range of perimenopause, menopause.
50:12
SPEAKER_01: So even the things that I learned, I was like, oh, we really need to be focusing a little bit more on a little less cardio and more strength, right?
50:21
SPEAKER_01: And we want to be lifting a little bit heavier sometimes.
50:23
SPEAKER_01: So I'm challenging them to lift heavier.
50:25
SPEAKER_01: I'm challenging them to jump and get off the ground.
50:28
SPEAKER_01: I'm challenging them to get down on their knees and stand up.
50:31
SPEAKER_01: Like, do you want to be playing with your grandchildren in, you know, 15, 20 years?
50:35
SPEAKER_01: You need to be able to get up and get down, right?
50:37
SPEAKER_01: So balancing, so pelvic floor, like all of these things, right?
50:41
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I had two C-sections.
50:43
SPEAKER_01: No one ever told me to go to pelvic floor therapy.
50:45
SPEAKER_01: I started that probably six years after my last one was born.
50:49
SPEAKER_01: Um, again, that's something that I feel like we should all go to after we have babies, right?
50:55
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
50:56
SPEAKER_00: I had twins uh and C-section.
50:59
SPEAKER_00: This is the first time I'm hearing about pelvic floor therapy.
51:04
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
51:05
SPEAKER_00: And that's also awful.
51:07
SPEAKER_01: That's insane.
51:09
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
51:09
SPEAKER_01: I had like that abstinence or whatever where they were separated.
51:13
SPEAKER_01: So I had to go and try to get that fixed because I just continued to look pregnant.
51:17
SPEAKER_01: Um, but it's yeah, again, pelvic floor therapy should be an absolute must-have after you have a child, right?
51:26
SPEAKER_01: Um, just like, you know, when we hit 35, we should all be talking about peri-menopause, menopause, and like what to look for just so that you don't feel so alone or confused when it starts happening.
51:37
SPEAKER_01: Should all be part of that education system.
51:39
SPEAKER_01: And I do believe that um Dr.
51:41
SPEAKER_01: Mary Claire Heaver and a lot of the physicians that she's been working with um are starting, are starting that movement um and should help.
51:49
SPEAKER_01: But I mean, yeah, this is biology.
51:52
SPEAKER_01: This is not a problem.
51:53
SPEAKER_01: So we shouldn't be embarrassed to talk about it and ask for help.
51:57
SPEAKER_02: I I do want to jump us to one part of it that maybe does get left out and people do feel embarrassed about, which is the sexual wellness part.
52:06
SPEAKER_02: And, you know, having why do you think that's left out?
52:10
SPEAKER_02: I mean, this beyond the obvious.
52:12
SPEAKER_02: And, you know, what are some of those maybe changes and how can women feel more comfortable talking about those as well?
52:20
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
52:21
SPEAKER_01: Um, I think they're not talked about because doctors are not trained to ask us about our sexual health um after we've had kids again.
52:27
SPEAKER_01: Um, and frankly, I feel like they feel sexuality is less important as we age, which is absolutely not true.
52:34
SPEAKER_01: Um so again, we need to advocate for ourselves because if there was a man that was saying, Oh my God, when I have sex, it hurts and it burns, I'm sure we'd have a pill for that, right?
52:45
SPEAKER_01: Within a second.
52:46
SPEAKER_01: Um, so the fact that if a woman is in pain, first of all, having sex, right?
52:51
SPEAKER_01: Um, you should there are options.
52:54
SPEAKER_01: You shouldn't have to like suffer through that.
52:56
SPEAKER_01: You should find a medical professional to help you take care of that, right?
52:59
SPEAKER_02: Um enjoying part of a relationship.
53:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
53:03
SPEAKER_01: 100%.
53:04
SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, loss of orgasm, loss of desire, all of those things come in perimenopause and menopause.
53:10
SPEAKER_01: And again, they are treatable.
53:12
SPEAKER_01: So just knowing what to ask for.
53:14
SPEAKER_01: And I would say this is like a sensitive topic.
53:16
SPEAKER_01: I think I went to my doctor three times before I actually wrote it down and just kind of handed the note almost.
53:23
SPEAKER_01: Cause I was like, every time I'd leave and I'd be like, oh, I didn't bring it up again because I don't think it's maybe as important.
53:28
SPEAKER_01: And then I was like, you know what?
53:29
SPEAKER_01: I just am gonna write it down.
53:30
SPEAKER_01: And if I feel weird about talking, and usually I don't feel weird, but I would just focus on other stuff and I'd be like, oh, I'll get to it next time.
53:36
SPEAKER_01: And I was like, no, pass her the note.
53:39
SPEAKER_01: Tell her what's wrong.
53:40
SPEAKER_01: Maybe somebody can help you, right?
53:42
SPEAKER_01: So I just think writing it down sometimes if you're not comfortable saying it, but knowing that, you know, pain, loss of desire, uh, loss of orgasm, all of those things are normal and treatable.
53:55
SPEAKER_00: So what would you say, Aaron, in terms of the kind of language that can help make the conversation a little less intimidating?
54:04
SPEAKER_00: Because let's face it, you know, it in society, like all across the world, apart from maybe Scandinavia, you know, women don't talk about um sexual health.
54:14
SPEAKER_00: They don't talk about menopause, they barely talk about periods.
54:18
SPEAKER_00: They and the only thing that they talk about, um, and they feel they can talk about is what to expect when you're expecting.
54:24
SPEAKER_00: Right.
54:25
SPEAKER_00: Right?
54:25
SPEAKER_00: So so when you're not even gonna tell you that whole story.
54:30
SPEAKER_00: Oh, hell yeah.
54:31
SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
54:32
SPEAKER_00: Um so what language can can can help make that conversation less intimidating?
54:40
SPEAKER_01: That's a good question.
54:42
SPEAKER_01: Um again, for me, it was writing it down.
54:46
SPEAKER_01: Um, even though I felt like I had the words, um, I still just sometimes was like not confident to say it at the end of the appointment.
54:54
SPEAKER_01: So I I guess narrowing it down too, like if it's painful, you know, again, finding exactly what part of that sexual wellness that is bothering you, whether it's the libido, whether it's the painful, you know, if it's painful, um, narrowing that down.
55:09
SPEAKER_01: And then yeah, it I mean, it is tricky.
55:13
SPEAKER_01: It's hard.
55:14
SPEAKER_01: I would say writing it down.
55:15
SPEAKER_01: That's that's my easiest bet.
55:16
SPEAKER_01: I don't know if there's a language or a certain word that I can come up with.
55:20
SPEAKER_01: How about you?
55:21
SPEAKER_00: Code word is no, that's that's a different that's a different episode.
55:28
SPEAKER_02: I was gonna say pineapple, and I was like, that's very that's not the code word.
55:32
SPEAKER_02: That's a safe conversation.
55:37
SPEAKER_00: We're not talking code words, you're not talking safe words, Christina.
55:41
SPEAKER_00: Okay, you entered the wrong chat.
55:43
SPEAKER_02: Sorry.
55:44
SPEAKER_02: Um well before we exit this chat, what Aaron, would you say to uh a woman listening who feels, you know, some of the things you felt exhausted, dismissed, or even afraid that she's losing herself.
55:57
SPEAKER_02: What do you want her to hear?
56:00
SPEAKER_02: Besides the whole episode.
56:01
SPEAKER_02: Listen to the whole episode, but what do you want her to take on?
56:05
SPEAKER_01: I want her, and I know this is cliche, so it's like two things, right?
56:09
SPEAKER_01: I don't feel alone, like feel less alone by listening to this, knowing that this is not just happening to you, right?
56:15
SPEAKER_01: And then know that this is your time to thrive.
56:19
SPEAKER_01: You get to choose how you want to live the next 40, 50 years of your life, and you get to build that toolbox, however that looks for you, right?
56:26
SPEAKER_01: So you can look at your values, look at how you want to live your life, and choose those tools out of that toolbox to make yourself live the best life and support you during this time.
56:37
SPEAKER_01: I think that's the most important thing.
56:39
SPEAKER_01: I love that.
56:40
SPEAKER_00: I love that.
56:42
SPEAKER_00: So, Aaron, as we begin to wrap up, what is the biggest menopause myth that you want to call total BS on?
56:52
SPEAKER_01: That it starts in your 50s and that it starts with a miss period, which you mentioned earlier.
56:57
SPEAKER_01: Those are the two biggest myths.
57:00
SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
57:01
SPEAKER_00: All right.
57:02
SPEAKER_00: So now we're gonna close with a quick lightning round.
57:05
SPEAKER_00: Don't overthink it.
57:06
SPEAKER_00: Just give us the first answer that comes to mind.
57:09
SPEAKER_00: Christina, take it away.
57:10
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, all right, Aaron, finish this sentence.
57:13
SPEAKER_02: My body is not betraying me.
57:16
SPEAKER_01: It is asking for a new way to thrive.
57:20
SPEAKER_00: Oh, damn, that's on a t-shirt.
57:23
SPEAKER_00: Oh, I know.
57:26
SPEAKER_00: What are you loving about your paws?
57:30
SPEAKER_01: Honestly, it's the clarity for me because I think I was living in this like dazed, confused state for so long that it's clarity.
57:38
SPEAKER_01: It's knowing my body, it's knowing what I'm willing to put up with and what I'm not willing to put up with anymore.
57:44
SPEAKER_01: So that's so true.
57:45
SPEAKER_01: That's me.
57:46
SPEAKER_02: What's your favorite go-to hype song?
57:50
SPEAKER_01: In this time of my life, in this era, right now, it's definitely I'm just a girl, by no doubt.
57:56
SPEAKER_01: That's an oldie button.
57:58
SPEAKER_01: It is such an oldie but listen to it after this podcast, and you will be like, Yes, we are women and we are we deserve more.
58:05
SPEAKER_02: Oh, that's a good one.
58:06
SPEAKER_02: And it's not on our playlist yet, so we're adding that.
58:10
SPEAKER_00: One word is to describe this chapter in your life.
58:16
SPEAKER_01: Unstoppable.
58:18
SPEAKER_01: Unstoppable.
58:19
SPEAKER_00: No, stop.
58:21
SPEAKER_00: No.
58:22
SPEAKER_00: You stop saying that.
58:26
SPEAKER_02: Um one thing women should stop apologizing for.
58:32
SPEAKER_01: Everything.
58:33
SPEAKER_01: We say I'm sorry way too often.
58:36
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
58:36
SPEAKER_01: Way too often.
58:37
SPEAKER_01: I do, I I'm guilty of it as well.
58:39
SPEAKER_01: I'm guilty of it as well.
58:40
SPEAKER_01: And sometimes I'll even catch myself and be like, wait, I'm not sorry.
58:43
SPEAKER_01: Like it depends on the cer situation.
58:45
SPEAKER_01: It depends on the situation, but really everything.
58:49
SPEAKER_01: Um, in my opinion.
58:52
SPEAKER_00: Wonderful.
58:53
SPEAKER_00: All right, Erin.
58:55
SPEAKER_00: We're drawing to a close.
58:56
SPEAKER_00: And with as with every episode of SheCommerce, we are building this beautiful growing community of a sisterhood of female leaders and advocates.
59:09
SPEAKER_02: So will you take the pledge with us to pay it forward, amplify women's voices, and help shape a future where no woman has to navigate this transition in life uninformed or alone?
59:22
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
59:24
SPEAKER_00: Recognizing.
59:25
SPEAKER_00: Erin, thank you so much for sharing your story so openly and for turning what you went through into education, support, and community for other women.
59:36
SPEAKER_00: It's it is just such a beautiful thing that you're doing.
59:40
SPEAKER_00: It really is.
59:41
SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
59:42
SPEAKER_02: Yes, I appreciate that.
59:43
SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much for having me.
59:44
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and this is exactly why that these conversations matter.
59:48
SPEAKER_02: You know, women do not need to be told to quietly just push through.
59:54
SPEAKER_02: They need information, they need options, and most importantly, and as you pointed out, they need to be heard.
1:00:01
SPEAKER_02: Because menopause may be called a pause, but we all know that women are nowhere near finished.
1:00:10
SPEAKER_00: And all that's left for me to say is gold brands, fierce women, won Sisterhood.