Latest / New Worlder / Episode #118: Peter Tempelhoff

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Episode #118: Peter Tempelhoff · New Worlder

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is the new order podcast and i am one of your hosts nicolas
0:47
skill co-host juliana
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duke will be joining shortly i have been in the amazon for book
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research the past
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few months so this is the first new episode in a little while
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but they'll start
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coming steadily again i'm trying it a little different this
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time with the music in
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SPEAKER_03: the front now i think it just kind of picks up the pace right away
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SPEAKER_03: So today we are talking with Peter Tempelhoff.
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SPEAKER_03: He is a chef and restaurateur in Cape Town, South Africa.
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While Pete lived and worked in Europe and the US and worked
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with Marco Pierre White
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SPEAKER_03: and several other well-known chefs,
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he fell in love with Japanese cooking many years ago and it
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changed how he saw
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SPEAKER_03: South African ingredients,
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SPEAKER_03: which is an ongoing evolution.
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SPEAKER_03: His fine dining restaurant
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SPEAKER_03: Fein combines Japanese techniques with South African ingredients,
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SPEAKER_03: though he also has the more casual restaurants Sushiya and Ramen Head,
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SPEAKER_03: as well as a vineyard restaurant in Constantia named Beyond.
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Another restaurant at the historic Boshendal estate called Arum
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will open in November.
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SPEAKER_03: Last year,
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SPEAKER_03: on a bit of a whim,
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while I was waiting on paperwork for the book that I was just
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traveling for,
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SPEAKER_03: I went to South Africa.
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Pete told me about this paleobotanist named Jan de Vanck that
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was researching the
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cognitive development of homo sapiens in South Africa more than
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100,000 years ago.
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SPEAKER_03: The story was of particular interest to me,
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SPEAKER_03: and for Pete for that matter,
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SPEAKER_03: because the story had everything to do with what Homo sapiens ate.
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SPEAKER_03: Our species,
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SPEAKER_03: Homo sapiens,
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SPEAKER_03: were near extinction,
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but the particular biodiversity of the Western Cape allowed
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them to survive and
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SPEAKER_03: then thrive to become the dominant species on the planet.
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I found it to be incredibly hopeful and a powerful reason why
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we need to protect biodiversity.
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And ultimately,
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I wrote a 10,000 word three part story on the New World
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newsletter about it.
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SPEAKER_03: Please search for it and read it.
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This was my only time in South Africa,
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my only time south of Morocco on the African continent.
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SPEAKER_03: And it was nothing like I expected.
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SPEAKER_03: The sight of the straight up physical beauty of the Cape Town area,
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the extreme level of biodiversity and how it resulted in all
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sorts of ingredients
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SPEAKER_03: new to modern kitchens was quite the surprise to me.
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Many of them don't look,
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smell,
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or taste like anything I've ever tried before.
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Pete's restaurants are a good place to find them and he's been
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building different
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SPEAKER_03: gardens to support his needs
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and encouraging other farmers to grow them to take the pressure
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off of wild resources.
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I see South Africa as a place we'll talk much more about in
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terms of gastronomy and
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SPEAKER_03: restaurants in the years to come.
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SPEAKER_03: If you haven't subscribed to my newsletter,
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SPEAKER_03: just go to neworder.com or search for New Order on Substack.
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SPEAKER_03: It's free to subscribe.
4:09
SPEAKER_03: They'll paid subscribers to get access to all of the content.
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and back archives again that's newworlder.com also look for my
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books such as the
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latin american cookbook at small bookstores everywhere and
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check out the new world
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SPEAKER_03: Hey, Pete, how's it going?
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SPEAKER_00: Hey, Nick.
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, very good, thank you.
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SPEAKER_00: How are you doing there in New York?
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SPEAKER_03: I'm good.
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SPEAKER_03: Everything Lekka in South Africa?
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SPEAKER_00: I see you picked up one word from South Africa.
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SPEAKER_03: That's not food, but am I even using that right, Lekka?
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SPEAKER_00: Lekka is good.
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, Lekka means is everything great?
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SPEAKER_00: Lekka is just a really Lekka word.
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SPEAKER_00: It means nice, it means cool.
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SPEAKER_00: We use it for a lot.
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SPEAKER_03: But is it just like directly interchangeable with the word cool?
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SPEAKER_03: Yeah, pretty much.
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SPEAKER_03: Can you just say like, that's LECA or everything LECA or, okay.
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SPEAKER_03: I wasn't sure.
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SPEAKER_03: Yeah, okay.
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SPEAKER_01: Hi, Pete, how are you?
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SPEAKER_00: Are you LECA, Julia?
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SPEAKER_01: Yes.
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SPEAKER_03: All right.
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SPEAKER_03: So it's been a while since since I saw you.
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SPEAKER_03: It's I mean, not that long.
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SPEAKER_03: It's been a year,
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but it seems like it was a very recent because it took me a
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while to write about
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SPEAKER_03: it.
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SPEAKER_03: So it's been like in my mind for the past since I left the past year.
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It was such a just just out of this world trip for me going
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there to South Africa.
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SPEAKER_03: in going to places that you,
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SPEAKER_03: you took me with Jan and like seeing,
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SPEAKER_03: just thinking about this,
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SPEAKER_03: thinking about life on earth,
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SPEAKER_03: life of humans that goes back beyond,
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SPEAKER_03: you know,
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SPEAKER_03: just the last a hundred years,
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SPEAKER_03: you know,
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SPEAKER_03: like I think so much about just
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SPEAKER_03: How my life and my family's life and kind of my direct ancestors.
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But I never think of what humans were like 100,000 years ago
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and what they ate.
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SPEAKER_03: And just trying to grasp the vastness of that.
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It's unreal that our species,
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homo sapiens,
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go back that far and all the shit we've been doing
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SPEAKER_03: In all that time.
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SPEAKER_03: And it's so fascinating.
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SPEAKER_03: And it really shook my world, I think.
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Just how I think about life and the planet and just how old
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everything is.
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SPEAKER_00: Yes, it challenges you every step of the way.
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SPEAKER_00: Because you think about...
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just the process of evolution and because of the region it
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wasn't touched with the
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ice age or by an ice age how it's really evolved everything
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into little micro
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microcosms of it can change incredibly from 10 to 20 meters
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away and just that just
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the fact that it's taken that long to to evolve to where it is
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now is quite
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SPEAKER_00: incredible and
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To go back beyond the pyramids,
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10 times beyond the pyramids,
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is quite incredible.
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SPEAKER_00: Especially to go and to figure out what these guys were eating back then.
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SPEAKER_00: For me, that's the story for a chef.
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SPEAKER_03: What's especially fascinating is they weren't all that different from us.
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SPEAKER_03: I think at least I, in my mind, had the idea of
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SPEAKER_03: people more than 5,000 years ago or 10,000 years ago, I guess.
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SPEAKER_03: I don't know.
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SPEAKER_03: But tens of thousands of years ago, they were essentially
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SPEAKER_03: you know, so simple and so basic, but that's not the case.
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They were basically just like you and I,
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you know,
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they basically look the same.
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They were all just,
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you know,
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trying to survive and get food and however they could.
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And once you start peeling back the layers and understand how
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they started eating
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SPEAKER_03: certain things,
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SPEAKER_03: like,
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SPEAKER_03: and why they started eating them,
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SPEAKER_03: it's,
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SPEAKER_03: it's basically the same fucking shit we would have done,
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SPEAKER_03: you know,
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SPEAKER_03: in the same positions.
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SPEAKER_00: Hmm.
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I think the difference here is that there was such abundance of
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food that there was
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SPEAKER_00: more time to develop a flavor,
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SPEAKER_00: to bring something into another ingredient in
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SPEAKER_00: Because you want it to taste better.
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SPEAKER_00: And B, to develop these social groups and social pods.
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SPEAKER_00: Because you're not hunting just to survive.
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SPEAKER_00: You've got a plethora of food.
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SPEAKER_00: You've got food almost at will.
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SPEAKER_00: So it develops really strong societies and
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SPEAKER_00: I think it was quite advanced back then how,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: society at least,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: 50,000 years ago,
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SPEAKER_00: people think it's mid-stone age,
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SPEAKER_00: it's they're quite,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: caveman-like and,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: Flintstones,
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SPEAKER_00: but it wasn't actually.
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SPEAKER_00: I think they're way more advanced than we know, than we could imagine.
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SPEAKER_01: So, Pete, when did you start looking into these things and why and how?
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SPEAKER_01: What were your methods?
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
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SPEAKER_00: I mean,
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SPEAKER_00: as a chef,
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it just piqued my interest to think that we could be using
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ingredients that nobody
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else in the world can use one and that people have probably not
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put on menus before
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SPEAKER_00: and ingredients that,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: first man could have been eating and
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SPEAKER_00: probably more than likely we're eating.
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SPEAKER_00: Um,
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SPEAKER_00: and that's just,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: it really fascinated me that we can bring new,
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SPEAKER_00: new flavors onto our,
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SPEAKER_00: into our culinary arsenal.
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SPEAKER_00: And we can not just going to cook with,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: the Westernized ingredients like,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: carrots and vegetables and fruit,
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SPEAKER_00: we can actually be using our own South African indigenous ingredients.
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SPEAKER_00: Um, so it was about two and a half years, three years ago.
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We actually,
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um,
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we started really delving deep into it and young has given us
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SPEAKER_00: incredible amount of new ingredients.
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SPEAKER_03: Can you explain who Jan is for Jan?
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, sorry.
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SPEAKER_00: So Jan de Funk, that's a cool name, Jan de Funk.
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SPEAKER_00: He's a paleo scientist.
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SPEAKER_00: He's based out of the University of the Eastern Cape,
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SPEAKER_00: or the University of the Eastern Cape,
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SPEAKER_00: Nelson Mandela University.
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SPEAKER_00: That's where he was a professor.
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SPEAKER_00: And he studied the early diets of humans
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And there's strong research that says that the food that ate
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had a significant
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SPEAKER_00: impact on developing their cognitive abilities.
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And they reckon that it was because of the abundance of food
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here and because of
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the type of food that actually brought on this kind of taking
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from a Homo erectus
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SPEAKER_00: to Homo erectus.
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SPEAKER_00: But it's over millennia,
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SPEAKER_00: obviously,
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eating these rich foods and also having these social networks
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develop because of
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SPEAKER_00: the amount of food they could get here.
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Yeah,
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so he's a great guy and he's working out of a place called
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Still Buy.
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And he's done a lot of digs with professors around the world
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who've come down and
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studied these caves that they're bringing these fossils out of
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and all these
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incredible discoveries around Pinnacle Point where they reckon
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they found the first
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SPEAKER_00: evidence of man using fire to cook with ages ago.
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SPEAKER_00: I can't say how long, but it was over 200,000 years ago.
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so...
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but that was just interesting for me.
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SPEAKER_00: But how do you bring it to a fine dining scenario?
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's difficult.
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But it was just going to have to be done with research of these
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ingredients and
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working with these ingredients and just talking about these
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special ingredients
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SPEAKER_00: that we have here in the Cape.
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SPEAKER_00: We've got one of the richest plant kingdoms in the world.
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I think it's the smallest plant kingdom,
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but it's the most packed with diversity.
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We've got more diversity on Table Mountain alone plant species
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than in the whole
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SPEAKER_00: United Kingdom.
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SPEAKER_00: So, I mean, that just shows the extent of what we're working with here.
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SPEAKER_00: And that's just the tip of the iceberg.
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SPEAKER_00: You saw it firsthand, Nick, when you were with us.
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SPEAKER_00: It just goes on and on.
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SPEAKER_00: Every hill uncovers a different species.
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SPEAKER_00: Pollinator and, yeah.
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SPEAKER_03: For me, I think a lot about Grootwals.
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SPEAKER_03: Like that's,
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it's like a private reserve that has all this like very
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pristine Fanebos forest,
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SPEAKER_03: but it's just this like tangle of different species,
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SPEAKER_03: like what hundreds,
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SPEAKER_03: thousands of different plant species,
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SPEAKER_03: all kind of woven together.
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SPEAKER_03: And it's just like thick and it's crazy.
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It's like to see,
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it's just like unlike any other landscape I've ever witnessed
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before.
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SPEAKER_03: And yeah,
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all of these different things have weird and interesting
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flavors that for the most
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SPEAKER_03: part probably have never been really worked with outside of,
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SPEAKER_03: you know,
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SPEAKER_03: tens of thousands of years ago in very rustic conditions.
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SPEAKER_03: So to just think of the possibilities of those things,
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SPEAKER_03: just in terms of flavors and cooking and modern cooking,
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SPEAKER_03: it's just,
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SPEAKER_03: it's unreal.
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SPEAKER_03: Like it's crazy.
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SPEAKER_03: And like, there's so many things there that,
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SPEAKER_03: But this type of forest is also disappearing very quickly, right, Pete?
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we're not allowed to actually pick it.
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SPEAKER_00: We've had to actually bring it into a farming environment.
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We've done extensive clippings,
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and we found little areas where we can pick this stuff.
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SPEAKER_00: We're growing it at the farm now.
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SPEAKER_00: We've got an incredible edible indigenous garden now,
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and it's actually feeding all of our restaurants with as much
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of the stuff as we
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SPEAKER_00: want to use.
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SPEAKER_03: This is the format beyond?
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly.
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SPEAKER_00: Instead of putting pressure on the very scarce resources,
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SPEAKER_00: we decided to actually just bring them to our environment.
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SPEAKER_00: It's worked well.
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And can you name five or ten items for products for people to
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just have a sense of
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SPEAKER_01: what we are talking about,
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SPEAKER_01: how surreal it is?
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SPEAKER_03: Like what are the common ones from like Fainbos?
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SPEAKER_00: Well, there's a common one that's around the world now.
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SPEAKER_00: It's a tea.
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SPEAKER_00: It's a famous tea.
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SPEAKER_00: It's called rooibos.
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SPEAKER_00: You know, you've all drunk in rooibos or red tea somewhere.
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SPEAKER_00: It's really gone around the world.
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SPEAKER_00: That can only be grown in one small area in South Africa.
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SPEAKER_00: You can't grow it anywhere else in the world because of the very,
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SPEAKER_00: very unique soil type and the pollination of it.
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So this is just an example of how hard it is to reproduce some
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of the stuff in a...
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SPEAKER_00: out of South Africa and out of this small plant kingdom,
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because it's so developed for this specific area that rooibos
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doesn't grow anywhere
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SPEAKER_00: else.
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SPEAKER_00: You can't grow it.
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SPEAKER_00: The seeds are carried by ants in a very sandy acidic soil.
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SPEAKER_00: And the ants, they store the seeds of the rooibos.
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SPEAKER_00: And then through, I think, erosion and
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SPEAKER_00: I forget how the seeds get carried away,
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but they actually get carried away and they get pollinated a
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different way.
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SPEAKER_00: They don't just, the wind doesn't pollinate them.
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SPEAKER_00: You actually need an ant to do it.
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SPEAKER_00: So anyways, that's just one example.
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SPEAKER_00: We love using the tea, the Buchhus, B-U-C-H-U.
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SPEAKER_00: They have many different flavors.
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SPEAKER_00: It's a very aromatic herb.
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SPEAKER_00: Then we have a lot of succulents here.
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South Africa has got probably the most succulents in this area
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in the world.
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SPEAKER_00: There are thousands of them we can use.
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SPEAKER_00: We have two of them in particular that we love using.
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SPEAKER_00: One has the leaf of spinach.
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SPEAKER_00: It's called a prenia.
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SPEAKER_00: The leaf tastes like spinach and the stem is like an asparagus.
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SPEAKER_00: And it just, it's a creeper and it just grows wild.
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SPEAKER_00: And we love using that one.
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We,
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you know,
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we tempura it,
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we use it to make purees and flavorings and soups.
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SPEAKER_00: And, you know, we can chop it up into like a, you know, gremolata.
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SPEAKER_00: So we use that.
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SPEAKER_00: Probably that's the most one we like to use now.
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SPEAKER_00: Then there's a lot of fruits and berries, like num num is a big one.
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SPEAKER_00: It's a big purple, like a plum that grows wild here too.
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SPEAKER_00: And then there's roots.
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SPEAKER_00: We've got some of the, there's over 2005 on the USO.
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SPEAKER_00: So underground storage organism roots that we can dig up and you can get
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SPEAKER_00: carbohydrates from and water and
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SPEAKER_00: There's one in particular called pig root.
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SPEAKER_00: And if you roast it,
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SPEAKER_00: you peel it,
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SPEAKER_00: roast it,
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SPEAKER_00: and grate it,
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SPEAKER_00: it tastes or crush it,
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SPEAKER_00: just tastes like macadamia nuts.
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SPEAKER_00: It's quite incredible.
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SPEAKER_00: And it grows to about a meter long and that fat.
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SPEAKER_00: So, I mean, these things are, it's just the tip of the iceberg.
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SPEAKER_00: When the settlers came here 400 years ago,
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SPEAKER_00: they documented 700 ingredients that the natives,
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SPEAKER_00: the native indigenous people were using from the wild.
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SPEAKER_00: Now they've only got 300 that they're using.
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SPEAKER_00: So there's 400 that are just missing to history.
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SPEAKER_00: So, and that's just some of the stuff that they're using.
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SPEAKER_00: So, yeah.
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So we're trying to figure out what these other 400 are,
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at least a few of them.
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SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
17:31
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
17:31
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
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SPEAKER_03: And okay.
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SPEAKER_03: So the garden at beyond that makes things easier.
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SPEAKER_03: So when I was there, it was just kind of getting, getting together.
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So you're able to plant a lot of these things and have better
17:47
access to them.
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I know it's really helpful.
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We've developed the garden to about 20 different species now or
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25 different species.
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SPEAKER_00: And we first, when we started planting the garden, we were watering it.
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SPEAKER_00: We put some irrigation in from the dam and it just wasn't taking.
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SPEAKER_00: It was just sitting there going yellow and it wasn't growing.
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SPEAKER_00: As soon as we turned the water off, everything just shot.
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SPEAKER_00: Which makes us believe, yeah, which is, I mean, it's indigenous plants.
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SPEAKER_00: It's not used to a lot of water.
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SPEAKER_00: So it's used to this environment.
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SPEAKER_00: It's used to very poor soil.
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SPEAKER_00: And as soon as we turn the water off, it just shot.
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So,
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I mean,
18:25
it's really good for water conservation,
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water,
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you know,
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scarce areas like we have.
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SPEAKER_00: And, you know, you're eating your environment as well.
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SPEAKER_00: So it just makes a lot of sense for what we wanted to do at the time.
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SPEAKER_03: It's all right.
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SPEAKER_03: So the Fane Boss landscape, why is it so in danger?
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SPEAKER_03: Why was it not appreciated for so long?
18:48
SPEAKER_00: Well, urbanization is the biggest thing, probably.
18:52
You know,
18:53
people,
18:54
this is probably the fastest growing region in South Africa.
18:58
SPEAKER_00: You know,
18:59
SPEAKER_00: it's one of the,
19:00
this region or the province in particular in the city is
19:03
working probably the best
19:05
SPEAKER_00: in South Africa.
19:06
So people are tending to semi-grade down here from Johannesburg
19:10
and from Durban.
19:11
SPEAKER_00: So all the land is being sold off.
19:13
SPEAKER_00: That's one problem.
19:14
And the others is,
19:15
you know,
19:15
it's,
19:16
you know,
19:16
climate change is,
19:18
you know,
19:18
it's happening.
19:18
SPEAKER_00: It's getting warmer.
19:19
SPEAKER_00: It's,
19:20
SPEAKER_00: You know,
19:21
SPEAKER_00: some of the desert areas where some of the life is incredible,
19:25
SPEAKER_00: especially up towards Namibia and the Karoo,
19:30
SPEAKER_00: that's getting too hot.
19:31
SPEAKER_00: And there's,
19:32
SPEAKER_00: you know,
19:32
SPEAKER_00: these beautiful succulents and this life there,
19:35
SPEAKER_00: which is in an arid climate,
19:37
SPEAKER_00: but it's still dense with a different species.
19:41
SPEAKER_00: It's dying out, you know.
19:42
SPEAKER_00: So,
19:42
SPEAKER_00: yeah,
19:43
SPEAKER_00: we've got the same problems as the rest of the world,
19:46
SPEAKER_00: you know,
19:46
SPEAKER_00: just overpopulation and climate.
19:50
and also people are you know people pick it because there's a
19:53
market for it you
19:54
know there's a market for wild rooibos and wild buchus and yeah
19:58
it's unfortunately
19:59
it's like the rhino you know it's it's very sought after around
20:03
the world have you
20:05
spoken to jan lately what's he up to yeah young is young's good
20:10
he's been trying to
20:11
SPEAKER_00: work out and
20:12
SPEAKER_00: He's a great guy.
20:14
SPEAKER_00: I remember when he found that footprint, that fossil footprint.
20:16
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it was crazy.
20:19
SPEAKER_03: Basically,
20:19
SPEAKER_03: we were just riding in this Jeep on this coast,
20:22
SPEAKER_03: and he makes it stop,
20:26
SPEAKER_03: and we get out,
20:28
and there's a footprint that's 100,000 years old that no one's
20:33
ever seen before,
20:33
SPEAKER_03: really.
20:34
SPEAKER_03: It's just kind of there in the
20:38
SPEAKER_03: in the sand and kind of etched in the rock.
20:40
SPEAKER_00: And it's just like... But I think it was just so surreal.
20:44
SPEAKER_00: It was so surreal.
20:45
SPEAKER_00: It was almost like it was set up, like we were meant to drive.
20:49
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, I agree.
20:51
SPEAKER_00: I agree.
20:52
SPEAKER_00: Actually,
20:52
SPEAKER_00: he went back there and he said he found,
20:54
SPEAKER_00: I think I told you,
20:55
SPEAKER_00: he found seven more footprints.
20:57
SPEAKER_00: No, you didn't tell me that.
21:00
SPEAKER_00: Until you find more than...
21:02
SPEAKER_00: You can't document it.
21:05
SPEAKER_00: Then you can't prove there's human footprints.
21:07
SPEAKER_00: But he found seven of them.
21:08
SPEAKER_00: So it's actually,
21:09
SPEAKER_00: he said,
21:09
it's one of the best finds that they found in the region in
21:12
terms of human
21:13
SPEAKER_00: footprints.
21:13
SPEAKER_00: He said they were about 75,000 years old.
21:16
SPEAKER_00: Wow.
21:18
SPEAKER_00: That was cool.
21:19
SPEAKER_03: That's crazy.
21:20
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, but it's like that whole trip.
21:22
SPEAKER_03: It was just like nonstop weird shit like that.
21:27
SPEAKER_03: Like astounding things all over the place.
21:31
SPEAKER_01: How does that affect, has affected the concept of the restaurants?
21:37
How you articulate all this with everything happening in your
21:42
restaurants?
21:43
Which kind of conversations this is opening with customers,
21:48
farmers,
21:49
the whole ecosystem?
21:51
surrounding your project yeah you know what we've we've had a
21:55
lot of conversations
21:56
with our farmers and they've all agreed to start growing some
22:00
of these ingredients
22:01
for us because i want the rest of this the restaurants in south
22:05
africa to also be
22:06
using this i don't want to be the only one using it i'm not the
22:09
only one but i
22:10
think the only one's using it in such abundance and these
22:13
things are part of our
22:14
SPEAKER_00: culture they're part of our you know our food history and i
22:20
mainstream that you'd find all the other vegetables that you
22:24
can get in the
22:25
northern hemisphere and fruit you find them on shelves we don't
22:28
find any of these
22:29
indigenous things so we've actually started the conversation
22:32
with our big our
22:33
leading supermarket chain brand and they have agreed to start
22:39
using some of these
22:40
products in their obviously cultivated ones in their salad
22:45
packs and in their
22:45
SPEAKER_00: especially the leaves and
22:47
you know the herb boxes and they yeah they because they're
22:50
they're really it's
22:52
passionate they're passionate about it as well not just you
22:55
know growing foreign
22:58
products but to also push our own stuff and also it's a story
23:01
that nobody else can
23:02
talk about you know we've got something very unique here and we
23:06
need to be proud
23:07
SPEAKER_00: about it and celebrate it so i think in that sense it's really opened up
23:11
SPEAKER_00: A lot of eyes and a lot of,
23:13
SPEAKER_00: you know,
23:13
SPEAKER_00: a lot of palettes,
23:14
SPEAKER_00: you know,
23:15
a lot of interested palettes come to the restaurant because I
23:17
want to try these new
23:17
SPEAKER_00: things and people love talking about,
23:19
SPEAKER_00: they love hearing about it.
23:21
We're pushing it a little bit more beyond because Fane's got
23:24
its own story and
23:25
SPEAKER_00: we've been on this trajectory for a number of years where Beyond is
23:31
It's finding its feet and I think it's really latched onto this
23:34
because of the
23:34
SPEAKER_00: garden that's right there.
23:35
We take guests to the garden and we have these ingredients more
23:38
interwoven into the menus.
23:40
SPEAKER_00: But Fein,
23:41
SPEAKER_00: we're focusing more on smaller ecosystems,
23:45
SPEAKER_00: I suppose,
23:46
SPEAKER_00: like we're really focusing on what's happening.
23:48
SPEAKER_00: And the land plants,
23:49
SPEAKER_00: the indigenous land plants,
23:50
SPEAKER_00: and then the coastal plants,
23:53
SPEAKER_00: the deep ocean,
23:54
because we've got a lot of different environments to talk about
23:57
in terms of food.
23:58
So Fane's more in that direction while we're still using some
24:01
of these ingredients on the menu.
24:03
SPEAKER_00: But it's just, I mean, the whole thing is just interwoven in what I do.
24:06
And I just love sharing it with our guests because it's
24:10
something that I know they
24:11
SPEAKER_00: haven't tried before.
24:13
SPEAKER_03: Like,
24:13
SPEAKER_03: I remember when I was there and we talked about this,
24:17
SPEAKER_03: it was after a few days,
24:18
SPEAKER_03: like in Cape town and I was like,
24:19
SPEAKER_03: can I get some like local food anywhere?
24:22
SPEAKER_03: Like aside of like your places where I was,
24:24
SPEAKER_03: I was tasting,
24:26
SPEAKER_03: you know,
24:27
SPEAKER_03: these,
24:27
SPEAKER_03: these ingredients and,
24:28
SPEAKER_03: you know,
24:28
SPEAKER_03: small amounts and like I'm tasting menus.
24:31
SPEAKER_03: All the kind of national cuisine was from somewhere else.
24:34
SPEAKER_03: It was Indian, it was British, it was, you know, European Mediterranean.
24:40
And every magazine feature you've read about South African food
24:43
in the last 20
24:45
SPEAKER_03: years has been about those things.
24:47
I can't think of a single of these like fane boss ingredients
24:52
or anything like that.
24:55
SPEAKER_03: all these like native things.
24:56
SPEAKER_03: And it's so ridiculously special.
25:00
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I know, but still it's just like the absurdity of that is crazy.
25:05
SPEAKER_03: When you think about the level of diversity there,
25:09
SPEAKER_03: like it's unreal,
25:11
SPEAKER_03: like that amount and it's just everywhere.
25:14
SPEAKER_03: And it's just been missing.
25:16
SPEAKER_03: It's crazy.
25:17
SPEAKER_00: It has been missing.
25:18
SPEAKER_00: But you know what?
25:19
SPEAKER_00: That is our culture here.
25:20
We were like the pit stop on the spice route for all the ships
25:24
coming from Portugal
25:25
SPEAKER_00: and Spain and England to India.
25:27
They could only come down this way because they couldn't go
25:30
through the Suez.
25:30
SPEAKER_00: It wasn't built yet.
25:32
SPEAKER_00: So they all came down.
25:33
SPEAKER_00: They stopped in Cape Town.
25:34
SPEAKER_00: They brought their culture with them.
25:35
SPEAKER_00: They brought something with them.
25:38
SPEAKER_00: And then coming back from India, they brought...
25:40
SPEAKER_00: Indians back.
25:41
SPEAKER_00: They brought indentured workers.
25:44
SPEAKER_00: They brought Malaysian people back with them.
25:47
SPEAKER_00: And it was like this incredible melting pot on the planet.
25:51
SPEAKER_00: It was probably the busiest port on the planet on this stage.
25:55
SPEAKER_01: So that's part of the reason why.
25:57
SPEAKER_00: So that is South Africa with the original melting pot of cuisine.
26:01
SPEAKER_00: But we're missing what really,
26:04
SPEAKER_00: like you're saying,
26:05
SPEAKER_00: what's really unique about South Africa is pre that.
26:08
SPEAKER_00: You go pre the settlers.
26:10
SPEAKER_00: And then that's when it really gets interesting.
26:12
SPEAKER_00: How do we work out what they were eating back then?
26:14
This is not like a cuisine like the Chinese cuisine or the
26:18
French cuisine that's
26:18
SPEAKER_00: got a proper cuisine.
26:21
SPEAKER_00: It's ingredients and it's history, you know?
26:25
SPEAKER_00: So I think finding out that and recreating that,
26:28
that's the challenge and that's the really special thing about
26:33
South Africa would
26:34
SPEAKER_03: be the food.
26:36
SPEAKER_03: But it's also difficult, right?
26:37
Because some of these ingredients,
26:39
some of these things that sustained us as early humans...
26:43
they're they taste pretty fucking gross to our ballots now
26:45
right like they're very
26:47
bitter and like and just like yeah yeah you think about the
26:50
environment it gets
26:51
bashed by the wind you know it's real harsh environment here
26:55
matter by the wind and
26:56
sun and you know so it's got to grow up a protective layer and
26:59
that always tastes
27:00
bitter that's how it portrays yeah tell us about like like give
27:05
us an example of
27:06
SPEAKER_01: that
27:07
SPEAKER_03: I can give you an example.
27:09
SPEAKER_03: What was that berry that we ate?
27:11
SPEAKER_03: Do you remember?
27:12
SPEAKER_03: Pete and I drank a lot of wine at a barbecue one night,
27:16
SPEAKER_03: and the next morning,
27:18
SPEAKER_03: we were riding in this super hot,
27:21
SPEAKER_03: safari,
27:21
SPEAKER_03: bumpy vehicle,
27:22
SPEAKER_03: and then Jan got this little berry.
27:26
SPEAKER_03: It was a tortoise bird.
27:28
SPEAKER_03: It was like I immediately just threw up.
27:31
SPEAKER_03: I can't.
27:31
SPEAKER_02: They hung over, apparently.
27:39
I'm assuming there's something you can do with it,
27:41
but I didn't experience that.
27:43
SPEAKER_01: How do you treat something like that, Barry?
27:46
SPEAKER_01: How do you make it edible for someone?
27:51
SPEAKER_00: We've got to work out the extraction.
27:53
How we extract just the right amount of flavor from it without
27:57
putting all those
27:58
SPEAKER_00: bitter peptides and the bitter molecules out of it.
28:03
SPEAKER_00: That's always a gentle process.
28:06
SPEAKER_00: We've
28:07
SPEAKER_00: The more we work with them, the more we figure out.
28:09
SPEAKER_00: Some you can extract with alcohol.
28:11
SPEAKER_00: Some has to be steeping in water.
28:13
SPEAKER_00: Some is just oil.
28:16
SPEAKER_00: It's a learning curve.
28:17
SPEAKER_00: We've had some disasters a lot.
28:21
You've tasted some very unpalatable stuff,
28:23
but some of it's great surprises.
28:26
SPEAKER_00: Some of these roots, you can die from eating it.
28:33
SPEAKER_00: But if you,
28:34
SPEAKER_00: if you,
28:35
SPEAKER_00: if you leech out the toxins,
28:37
SPEAKER_00: it's actually quite good,
28:38
SPEAKER_00: you know,
28:38
SPEAKER_00: but to get there,
28:39
SPEAKER_00: it's,
28:39
SPEAKER_00: you know,
28:40
SPEAKER_00: it's,
28:40
SPEAKER_00: it's quite dangerous.
28:42
SPEAKER_00: Um, I don't know how people figure this out.
28:45
You know,
28:46
that if you,
28:48
you can eat it,
28:49
you know,
28:51
you burn it,
28:52
burn away the toxins.
28:54
yeah yeah well i mean i remember when i was there that's the
28:58
importance of fire was
29:00
a big part of this and you know fields were historically you
29:03
know pre-historically
29:04
i guess burned and they and they could just like pick them from
29:08
the ground and
29:09
that's it that's a secret like tannins and shit was was gone
29:14
yes that's right some
29:16
SPEAKER_00: of the irises the iris bulbs in particular
29:20
SPEAKER_00: Nick said that that lady who was working one of his peers,
29:23
SPEAKER_00: she discovered that you can actually eat this bulb,
29:25
SPEAKER_00: where previously it was bitter and toxic.
29:29
SPEAKER_00: But it took fire.
29:30
SPEAKER_00: And after the felt burnt,
29:33
SPEAKER_00: or the feinbos,
29:34
SPEAKER_00: they noticed that the primates,
29:37
SPEAKER_00: where they're actually eating these seeds from the ground,
29:40
SPEAKER_00: or these roots,
29:41
SPEAKER_00: and they figured that out,
29:42
SPEAKER_00: that you can just burn it away.
29:44
SPEAKER_00: So a lot of it is just watching what the animals do.
29:48
SPEAKER_00: which is incredible, which is just what we are, you know.
29:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
29:51
SPEAKER_01: have you found colleagues,
29:54
peers of you in other regions of the world doing something
29:59
similar or finding
30:00
SPEAKER_01: similar foods,
30:02
SPEAKER_01: or this feels very specific and unique?
30:07
SPEAKER_00: You told me Ralph Guzman's doing some stuff there.
30:11
Yeah,
30:11
like Chile is the place that reminded me the most of South
30:16
Africa,
30:16
just because...
30:18
SPEAKER_03: the coast of Chile at least.
30:20
SPEAKER_03: I mean,
30:20
SPEAKER_03: I was just on the kind of coast of South Africa too,
30:23
SPEAKER_03: but just with the rocks and the,
30:27
SPEAKER_03: you know,
30:28
SPEAKER_03: the mix with desert and the dryness and then the,
30:31
SPEAKER_03: you know,
30:32
SPEAKER_03: some of the types of plants,
30:33
but I think what was special in South Africa at least was just
30:40
the amount of these
30:42
SPEAKER_03: kinds of plants,
30:43
SPEAKER_03: you know,
30:43
SPEAKER_03: like in Chile,
30:45
SPEAKER_03: you know,
30:45
SPEAKER_03: there might be a handful scattered here and there,
30:47
SPEAKER_03: but
30:48
But from what I could see,
30:52
where we were,
30:53
hundreds and thousands of different plants.
30:55
SPEAKER_03: And you have no idea what the majority were.
30:58
SPEAKER_03: And most of them look unlike anything else.
31:02
So it's like there's not even things you can really compare
31:06
that to in a lot of the cases.
31:10
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
31:11
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, it's an exciting place to be cooking.
31:13
SPEAKER_00: It's an exciting place to be eating as well.
31:17
SPEAKER_00: With a lot of chefs now doing this as well,
31:21
SPEAKER_00: they're showing a lot of interest in it,
31:22
SPEAKER_00: which is fantastic.
31:23
SPEAKER_00: Sharing knowledge with them is awesome.
31:26
SPEAKER_00: It's what it's all about.
31:27
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, I think it's only a matter of time until people start
31:34
really using them properly and hopefully they get into the
31:39
mainstream market here,
31:41
SPEAKER_00: I'm hoping,
31:42
SPEAKER_00: and they get into the farmers' fields and stuff.
31:47
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think they will.
31:49
I think it just takes people like you to talk about them and
31:53
show what can be done
31:54
with them and things start to take off and it just makes so
31:58
much sense to plant
32:00
SPEAKER_03: these things again.
32:02
SPEAKER_03: And,
32:03
SPEAKER_03: you know,
32:03
SPEAKER_03: rather than trying to force,
32:05
SPEAKER_03: you know,
32:06
SPEAKER_03: potatoes or I don't know what the hell else is going on there,
32:08
SPEAKER_03: but just force whatever else into the soil there.
32:15
SPEAKER_03: But you're opening a new restaurant, right?
32:18
SPEAKER_03: What's the deal with that?
32:19
SPEAKER_00: Yes, we're opening very soon.
32:22
SPEAKER_00: We're opening around the 3rd of November.
32:25
SPEAKER_00: And it's our biggest project yet.
32:27
SPEAKER_00: It's a very, very historically significant wine estate.
32:33
SPEAKER_00: It's called Boshendal.
32:35
So it was actually the first wine estate to have a restaurant
32:38
in South Africa.
32:40
SPEAKER_00: And it's been around for 340 years making wine.
32:44
SPEAKER_00: It was the first farm to actually export fruit from South Africa as well.
32:50
SPEAKER_00: And the restaurant,
32:52
SPEAKER_00: I think it came about in 1972,
32:56
SPEAKER_00: 73,
32:56
SPEAKER_00: but the building itself was built in,
32:58
SPEAKER_00: I think it was built in 1820.
33:00
SPEAKER_00: So it's a protected building.
33:03
SPEAKER_00: And yeah,
33:03
SPEAKER_00: we're opening an extremely intense farm-to-table,
33:10
SPEAKER_00: I hate to say it,
33:11
SPEAKER_00: but farm-to-table restaurant.
33:13
It sounds a bit cliche,
33:16
but this one is like farm-to-table on drugs,
33:19
you know?
33:20
It's like really,
33:21
no,
33:22
I saw,
33:22
I saw,
33:23
I saw photos and it's like the farm is right there.
33:26
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
33:26
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
33:26
SPEAKER_00: they're really,
33:27
SPEAKER_00: it's yeah,
33:28
SPEAKER_00: it's probably the,
33:29
SPEAKER_00: it's the farm that's doing the most regenerative farming in the country.
33:34
Um,
33:35
they've got this massive vegetable and herb garden and fruit in
33:39
front of the restaurant.
33:40
It's probably takes up about four football fields in front of
33:44
the restaurant of just garden.
33:46
And then they've got fields of ancient grains,
33:48
which they started growing for us.
33:50
They've got 400 head of cattle,
33:52
which we have first pick on all the primals and everything
33:55
else.
33:56
SPEAKER_00: They have, I think, 700 Duroc swine or pigs on the farm.
34:02
SPEAKER_00: They've got sheep, an incredible breed of sheep.
34:05
SPEAKER_00: So it's really like a chef's dream to be moving into this place.
34:09
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, it's going to be about 100 seats.
34:11
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, a little bit daunting in terms of the numbers we can do.
34:15
SPEAKER_00: It's busy all year round, which is great.
34:18
And then we've decided to do a fantastic little cocktail bar
34:20
where we're going to
34:20
SPEAKER_00: be using all these farm ingredients in our pictures and cocktails.
34:27
SPEAKER_00: All sorts of bitters and syrups and free cocktails and veg cocktails.
34:33
SPEAKER_00: It's very exciting.
34:34
SPEAKER_00: There's a lot to do still.
34:38
SPEAKER_00: It's quite the project.
34:41
SPEAKER_00: We've got a good team around us.
34:42
I've taken guys from all the restaurants and we've put a new
34:46
head chef in place who
34:47
SPEAKER_00: I've worked with before and he's coming from England.
34:50
He's worked in a couple of two and three star places and he's
34:52
come back home.
34:53
SPEAKER_00: So we've got a good new energy in the, in the restaurant.
34:56
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
34:57
SPEAKER_00: We must come back again.
34:58
SPEAKER_00: Have a look at it.
34:59
SPEAKER_00: It's going to be, it's going to be insane.
35:01
SPEAKER_03: So it's a fire restaurant.
35:03
SPEAKER_03: That's the idea?
35:03
SPEAKER_00: Well, yeah, it's a fire.
35:05
SPEAKER_00: We're really focusing on what's coming for the garden.
35:07
We've set this program in place where they're growing a minimum
35:11
of 30 or 40
35:11
SPEAKER_00: ingredients for us all year round.
35:13
SPEAKER_00: It's going to come for the garden.
35:15
We're going to be using probably 80% of the produce on the menu
35:19
will be coming for the garden.
35:20
We have to subsidize it with,
35:22
you know,
35:22
we have to buy in carrots and onions.
35:24
SPEAKER_00: We're not going to be doing those big crops.
35:26
everything else is from them they've even planted when i've
35:29
planted they've
35:29
inoculated two and a half tons of trees of of logs which are
35:36
going to be producing
35:37
mushrooms about seven different species of mushrooms over the
35:40
next two years and
35:42
it's probably going to yield about two tons over two years of
35:45
mushrooms so we've
35:46
SPEAKER_00: got oysters shiitakes and then some indigenous ones some local ones
35:52
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's very exciting.
35:53
SPEAKER_00: It's a project I've never thought I'd be embarking on two years ago.
35:59
SPEAKER_00: And now that I'm here,
36:01
it's just around the corner and I'm kind of shitting myself
36:03
because there's so much
36:05
SPEAKER_00: to do.
36:05
Um,
36:07
but I know how important this project is for the South African
36:12
culinary,
36:13
um,
36:13
landscape.
36:14
SPEAKER_00: It's super important because it's such a,
36:16
SPEAKER_01: I was going to say,
36:17
SPEAKER_01: I think it's,
36:18
SPEAKER_01: it's being almost more,
36:20
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
36:20
SPEAKER_01: apart from being a chef is being a food engineer,
36:24
SPEAKER_01: you know,
36:24
SPEAKER_01: in,
36:24
SPEAKER_01: um,
36:26
SPEAKER_01: you're engineering,
36:28
SPEAKER_01: obviously in an artisanal way and natural way,
36:31
SPEAKER_01: but this is beyond cooking,
36:34
SPEAKER_01: right?
36:34
SPEAKER_01: This is beyond transforming ingredients.
36:37
SPEAKER_01: It's a,
36:39
SPEAKER_01: Changing the ecosystem, right?
36:43
SPEAKER_00: You're right.
36:43
SPEAKER_00: I said I wish I was cooking more, but you're right.
36:46
SPEAKER_00: It's becoming more of an engineer and a manager.
36:50
SPEAKER_00: We're putting these beautiful spaces together.
36:54
SPEAKER_00: The only downside is taking me out of the kitchen more than I want to be.
36:57
SPEAKER_00: I've got such an incredible...
37:00
a network of people around me that I can actually leave a lot
37:03
to them and I can
37:05
SPEAKER_00: still cook a bit,
37:06
SPEAKER_00: which I'm very excited about.
37:07
Well,
37:08
as you're thinking about the legacy of all these people that
37:12
ate this food,
37:15
SPEAKER_01: maybe you can see yourself as,
37:17
SPEAKER_01: and your legacy,
37:19
SPEAKER_01: you know,
37:19
SPEAKER_01: beyond,
37:20
SPEAKER_01: but it seems to be bigger than cooking in present time.
37:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
37:26
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
37:26
SPEAKER_00: You need to more than,
37:28
SPEAKER_00: you need to do more than just cook these days to make a living,
37:30
SPEAKER_00: unfortunately.
37:31
SPEAKER_00: Hey, Nick.
37:33
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
37:38
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
37:38
SPEAKER_00: So listen,
37:39
SPEAKER_00: also,
37:39
SPEAKER_00: just to go back to that,
37:41
SPEAKER_00: with the extension of the farm,
37:42
SPEAKER_00: it goes quite far beyond the restaurant.
37:44
SPEAKER_00: You know, they've got their own, we're doing our own bakery.
37:47
SPEAKER_00: We've got our own charcuterie program going.
37:50
SPEAKER_00: We've got our own preservation system set up.
37:53
So all excess food from the garden will be going into
37:57
fermentation program.
37:59
SPEAKER_00: We've also got our own composting going already.
38:02
So we've got mounds of compost,
38:03
which are going up to 70 degrees Celsius inside.
38:06
So some of the cooking for the meal is actually going to be
38:09
done deep underground,
38:10
SPEAKER_00: where we don't need any electricity,
38:12
SPEAKER_00: any gas.
38:13
SPEAKER_00: We're going to be cooking in,
38:14
SPEAKER_00: I hate to say it,
38:15
SPEAKER_00: doesn't sound great,
38:16
SPEAKER_00: but we're cooking in compost.
38:18
SPEAKER_00: So I think that for me is really next level.
38:22
They did that at,
38:24
I don't know if they still do it,
38:25
but at Blue Hill,
38:27
they used to do that.
38:28
SPEAKER_03: They had like a little oven in the compost pile.
38:32
SPEAKER_03: But I don't think it was significant.
38:33
SPEAKER_03: I think it was just like, yeah.
38:36
SPEAKER_00: A lot of fun.
38:38
SPEAKER_01: What is the concept of the bakery?
38:41
SPEAKER_00: So we've got four fields doing ancient grains.
38:45
SPEAKER_00: We're doing our own wheats.
38:48
SPEAKER_00: And we've got sorghums.
38:50
SPEAKER_00: We've got rice.
38:51
SPEAKER_00: And so they are going to be milling.
38:54
SPEAKER_00: I think they're starting to mill after this season.
38:58
um so after the summer um they're busy growing them but the
39:02
bakery is doing right
39:03
now we're processing all of our sourdoughs and all of our
39:07
indigenous like our local
39:08
breads that are made from grape must so great after grape
39:13
season we keep the must
39:14
the yeast cells in the must or the grape leaves they're still
39:17
quite active after
39:18
you you rack the wine off and there's a traditional bread that
39:22
gets made out of
39:23
SPEAKER_00: that it's called a moss bollocky
39:26
SPEAKER_00: And that is significant to us.
39:28
SPEAKER_00: And it goes back hundreds of years.
39:31
SPEAKER_00: And that's one of the big products from the bakery.
39:34
And we do all of our croissants and all of our pastries and
39:37
everything for breakfast.
39:38
SPEAKER_00: And so it's all like, really, we don't need to go far.
39:41
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
39:41
you're cooking from a 10 kilometer radius only because our
39:44
cheese supplier is eight
39:45
SPEAKER_00: kilometers away.
39:47
SPEAKER_00: You know, we'd be cooking everything from the farm.
39:51
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so it's very exciting and I can't wait for it to open.
39:54
SPEAKER_00: I wish I had another month, but anyways, it's two weeks away.
39:58
SPEAKER_01: Do you have a name for it?
40:00
SPEAKER_00: Yes,
40:01
SPEAKER_00: it's actually going to be called Arum,
40:02
SPEAKER_00: A-R-U-M,
40:04
SPEAKER_00: like the Arum lily,
40:05
SPEAKER_00: you know,
40:06
SPEAKER_00: the white,
40:06
SPEAKER_00: the pig ear,
40:07
SPEAKER_00: the white lily,
40:08
SPEAKER_00: lily of the valley.
40:09
SPEAKER_00: And it's because in the valley that the restaurant is,
40:13
SPEAKER_00: it's every springtime,
40:14
SPEAKER_00: these Arum lilies,
40:15
SPEAKER_00: they're indigenous to this region.
40:17
SPEAKER_00: They just, they're everywhere you look, it's just white lilies.
40:21
SPEAKER_00: And I thought this white building,
40:22
SPEAKER_00: when I first moved into the region,
40:24
SPEAKER_00: into the valley to start cooking,
40:26
SPEAKER_00: that's one thing that was just etched in my mind is all these,
40:30
all these lilies that pop up in the springtime and made the
40:33
valley so beautiful.
40:35
SPEAKER_00: And I just started looking at this building.
40:36
It's such a significant,
40:38
beautiful building in the white cape Dutch style with the
40:41
gable.
40:42
SPEAKER_00: It just reminded me of this flower.
40:43
SPEAKER_00: It also happens to be one of my wife's favorite flowers.
40:46
SPEAKER_00: And she's from that area.
40:48
SPEAKER_00: She's from the next village over.
40:50
SPEAKER_00: So I thought, yeah, it just makes a lot of sense.
40:52
SPEAKER_00: And I like short names for restaurants like Fame.
40:54
f-y-n so aram is four letters we like it you know you can say
40:58
it in most languages
40:59
too some people say aram but it's not aram yeah it's aram yeah
41:06
okay so so there's
41:07
no japanese element to this right there's not really from what
41:12
i understand from
41:13
SPEAKER_03: what i'm looking at there's not really like
41:16
SPEAKER_03: a defined concept at all?
41:19
SPEAKER_03: Like, I mean, aside of, you know, the farm.
41:21
SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
41:22
SPEAKER_00: we're focusing on...
41:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
41:24
SPEAKER_00: we've divided...
41:25
SPEAKER_00: No,
41:25
SPEAKER_00: there's no Japanese as such,
41:27
SPEAKER_00: like we would define a fade where we're trying to blend...
41:29
SPEAKER_00: Well,
41:30
SPEAKER_00: we are blending Japanese and South African...
41:32
SPEAKER_00: Well, actually, we're not doing that, Nick.
41:36
We're taking Slava ingredients and we're looking at them
41:38
through like Japanese
41:39
SPEAKER_00: cooking techniques.
41:40
Like you would look at a French restaurant through French
41:43
cooking techniques using
41:43
SPEAKER_00: our ingredients.
41:45
SPEAKER_00: But Aaron,
41:45
we had to look at it differently because it's such a culturally
41:48
significant
41:48
SPEAKER_00: restaurant in the Cape.
41:51
SPEAKER_00: We had to look at more cake,
41:53
kind of go back in history and what style of food we were using
41:58
or was in the
42:00
SPEAKER_00: region when this restaurant or the farm developed in the beginning.
42:04
SPEAKER_00: And that was more Dutch, Dutch, French food.
42:09
SPEAKER_00: So you can say,
42:10
SPEAKER_00: okay,
42:10
SPEAKER_00: well,
42:10
let's use some of these culturally significant dishes and let's
42:14
recreate them.
42:15
SPEAKER_00: So we're going back in,
42:17
SPEAKER_00: I guess,
42:18
in Cape Dutch history and we're taking those flavors and we're
42:21
just looking through
42:22
SPEAKER_00: modern goggles,
42:23
SPEAKER_00: I guess.
42:24
SPEAKER_00: But the big focus is on the meat.
42:27
SPEAKER_00: We're dry aging all of our meat in the restaurant.
42:29
We're focusing on preservation of the garden ingredients and
42:33
also using fresh ingredients.
42:35
SPEAKER_00: So we've got a big pickle library with about 90 large,
42:40
SPEAKER_00: I think a three liter pickle jars in the restaurant,
42:43
SPEAKER_00: backlit.
42:44
SPEAKER_00: So you can all the time, you can see.
42:45
SPEAKER_00: Did you say pickle library?
42:49
SPEAKER_00: Pickle library.
42:50
SPEAKER_03: It's the first time I heard that.
42:54
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
42:56
SPEAKER_00: Is if they start exploding on us in the restaurant.
42:58
SPEAKER_00: That's the only downside.
43:00
SPEAKER_00: But besides that,
43:01
SPEAKER_00: I want the chefs to go out into the restaurant,
43:03
SPEAKER_00: be pulling the jars from the shelf.
43:05
SPEAKER_00: They'll be using one guest to be able to see what we're preserving,
43:09
SPEAKER_00: what we're fermenting,
43:11
SPEAKER_00: what's happening in the restaurant.
43:12
SPEAKER_00: Because it's not an open-plan kitchen.
43:16
So,
43:16
and then,
43:16
like I said,
43:17
all the meat will be dry aging in the restaurant.
43:19
So you got big dry age vitrines going in the restaurant because
43:22
the restaurant's so
43:23
SPEAKER_00: long,
43:24
SPEAKER_00: we had to divide it.
43:25
So we decided to put this wall of meat in the middle of the
43:29
restaurant to divide
43:31
SPEAKER_00: the bar and the restaurant up.
43:33
SPEAKER_00: So now it's a sexy space and yeah, we're so excited about going into it.
43:38
SPEAKER_00: And you'll see more, we'll be posting pretty soon of how it's looking.
43:42
SPEAKER_00: Is there game as well?
43:43
SPEAKER_00: We're focusing on the farm animals.
43:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we're focusing mainly on the farm animals.
43:50
SPEAKER_00: We're not even using a lot of seafood.
43:52
SPEAKER_00: There's some trout farms around the area,
43:54
SPEAKER_00: so we're using a lot of trout,
43:55
SPEAKER_00: a lot of vegetables,
43:57
SPEAKER_00: a lot of beef.
43:58
So it's kind of like a steakhouse on steroids that serves a lot
44:02
of vegetables.
44:03
SPEAKER_01: Where were you born?
44:04
I mean,
44:05
if you are not from Cape Town,
44:06
for people to know why did you end living there?
44:11
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, I've lived here longer than anywhere else.
44:13
SPEAKER_00: So I kind of feel at home now.
44:18
SPEAKER_00: But before, I was working in London.
44:21
SPEAKER_00: So I worked in London for seven years.
44:23
SPEAKER_00: I worked for a chef named Marco Pierwhite,
44:27
SPEAKER_00: as well as an Italian chef,
44:31
SPEAKER_00: a restaurant called La Conda at Giorgio.
44:37
SPEAKER_00: And then before that,
44:38
SPEAKER_00: I worked at a restaurant,
44:39
SPEAKER_00: another Michelin star restaurant called Hambleton Hall.
44:41
SPEAKER_00: So I did a little work in England.
44:44
SPEAKER_00: And before that, I was training in South Africa.
44:47
SPEAKER_00: And then,
44:48
SPEAKER_00: you know,
44:49
SPEAKER_00: when I was one,
44:51
SPEAKER_00: I moved from Boston,
44:52
SPEAKER_00: where I was born,
44:53
SPEAKER_00: and we moved to South Africa.
44:55
SPEAKER_00: And then we moved back to Canada, where I got this weird Irish accent.
45:00
and yeah then back to south africa so it made it even worse and
45:04
moved to england so
45:05
it really up the accent um and now you know i'm just loving it
45:10
and um can't wait to
45:12
see what's coming up in the future because you know we're
45:14
looking we're looking
45:15
SPEAKER_00: abroad as well and
45:17
SPEAKER_00: I can't say too much now,
45:18
but there's plans to get a nice footprint in either the States
45:24
or in England.
45:26
SPEAKER_03: You really can't place your accent, can you?
45:28
SPEAKER_03: It's pretty distinct.
45:30
SPEAKER_03: It's not South African.
45:31
SPEAKER_03: There's South African words in there, but it's not...
45:34
SPEAKER_01: But I see the Irish on it, too.
45:37
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but I'm not Irish.
45:38
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I know.
45:39
SPEAKER_00: It's weird.
45:39
SPEAKER_00: It sounds Irish.
45:40
SPEAKER_00: It does.
45:41
SPEAKER_00: Even people from Dublin, they're like, what part of Dublin are you from?
45:45
SPEAKER_00: Well, yeah, it's a long story.
45:47
SPEAKER_00: And especially when I drink, if I drink, it sounds very Irish.
45:49
SPEAKER_00: Toronto.
45:50
SPEAKER_00: Toronto, yeah.
45:53
SPEAKER_00: You see, my family's from Toronto.
45:55
SPEAKER_00: So I think my mom, she is from Toronto.
45:59
SPEAKER_00: I lived in Vancouver as well.
46:01
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, it didn't help.
46:02
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
46:07
SPEAKER_00: That's not where you're from.
46:09
SPEAKER_00: That's right, Julie.
46:11
SPEAKER_01: There you go.
46:14
SPEAKER_01: Where I was born?
46:16
SPEAKER_01: Oh, my accent.
46:17
SPEAKER_01: That's another.
46:21
SPEAKER_01: It's the same.
46:22
SPEAKER_01: It's all over the place, I think, by now.
46:24
SPEAKER_01: But
46:27
uh yeah i was born in colombia and i have lived in the states
46:32
for about 11 years
46:35
first on the east coast one year in chicago and now five in
46:39
california in los
46:40
angeles so yeah i don't know i feel that my accent it's all
46:48
yeah i love oh really
46:50
SPEAKER_01: i'm very
46:51
SPEAKER_00: I was living there in the early 90s.
46:53
SPEAKER_00: It was a different place back then.
46:56
SPEAKER_00: And I went to school in Arrowhead Springs for a little bit.
47:02
SPEAKER_00: But that was back in the 70s.
47:05
SPEAKER_00: California is really cool.
47:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's a special place.
47:10
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, for sure.
47:11
SPEAKER_01: I'm close to Ventura right now, today.
47:14
SPEAKER_00: Okay, cool.
47:15
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I like Ventura.
47:16
SPEAKER_03: So how many restaurants do you have now, Pete?
47:19
SPEAKER_00: I started late.
47:20
SPEAKER_03: Are you counting in your head?
47:21
SPEAKER_03: Like you don't know?
47:23
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
47:24
SPEAKER_00: Well, it's growing faster than I kind of imagined.
47:27
SPEAKER_00: I got my first restaurant when I was 48, which was Fane.
47:30
SPEAKER_00: And a lot of people are like planning their retirement already.
47:35
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, no, fuck that.
47:37
SPEAKER_00: I got my first restaurant at 48.
47:38
SPEAKER_00: My second one at 50.
47:40
SPEAKER_00: And then I've had, that was beyond, it was second.
47:44
SPEAKER_00: Then we decided, no, we need our footprints, kind of casual dining.
47:48
SPEAKER_00: And we all loved ramen.
47:50
SPEAKER_00: So we opened a restaurant called Ramen Head.
47:52
which we've opened two now in Cape Town,
47:55
which I think is one of the most incredible cuisines.
48:00
SPEAKER_00: It's just so simple, but so complex at the same time.
48:04
SPEAKER_00: And it's so amazing to make as well.
48:06
SPEAKER_00: And then we've opened a little sushi joint.
48:08
SPEAKER_00: I'm in collaboration with a chef friend who's called Shin Tagagi.
48:13
SPEAKER_00: So he's a two Michelin star chef from Kanazawa.
48:16
SPEAKER_00: And we opened a little sushi joint together in Cape Town.
48:19
SPEAKER_00: So that's like...
48:21
SPEAKER_00: yeah, the fourth one.
48:22
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, we're going to be doing this baby now.
48:24
SPEAKER_00: So we will be number six.
48:27
SPEAKER_03: Remind me when when did Japanese cooking enter your life?
48:32
SPEAKER_00: The day I stepped into a kitchen, actually.
48:35
SPEAKER_00: My first kitchen was in
48:38
SPEAKER_00: was in close to where Aram is actually, in a town called Parle.
48:43
SPEAKER_00: It was the top restaurant in South Africa.
48:45
SPEAKER_00: It was my first day of training.
48:48
SPEAKER_00: And it kind of,
48:51
I knew I wanted to be a cook after like the first three months
48:54
of this restaurant.
48:55
And the chef there,
48:57
he had done a lot of training in Singapore and he worked in
48:59
Tokyo.
49:00
And he was a German guy and he had a lot of these ingredients
49:02
in his pantry.
49:04
SPEAKER_00: And, you know, the menu in this restaurant was changing every single day.
49:08
SPEAKER_00: We had to come with a new a la carte menu,
49:10
SPEAKER_00: which was like three starters,
49:13
SPEAKER_00: three starters,
49:14
SPEAKER_00: four main courses,
49:15
SPEAKER_00: three desserts every single day.
49:18
so it really challenged us young chefs and i mean we had to
49:22
keep coming with new
49:23
things and he had a lot of these ingredients in the pantry and
49:26
i didn't know how to
49:26
use them i just thought no they're so full of amami i love them
49:29
and the balance
49:30
wasn't always right but it wasn't that was in 1996 97 and then
49:35
i went to to england
49:37
SPEAKER_00: in 1998 and i started working at market pure white's kitchens and
49:44
SPEAKER_00: Locatelli's kitchen, and I didn't really use a lot of it again.
49:48
SPEAKER_00: And it wasn't until I came back.
49:51
I've always loved eating,
49:52
like,
49:52
Japanese food,
49:53
but I never really understood it.
49:55
SPEAKER_00: And then it wasn't until 2008 until my first trip to Japan happened.
49:59
SPEAKER_00: And I worked in a kitchen called Hotel de Makuni.
50:03
And he was probably the most famous chef in Japan never to get
50:06
a Michelin star.
50:07
SPEAKER_00: He had a Relais Gaumont status,
50:09
SPEAKER_00: which was about equivalent to two Michelin stars,
50:11
SPEAKER_00: according to the Relais Chateau.
50:13
and he was everybody knew him he was always on tv couldn't
50:17
speak a word of english
50:17
spent two weeks in his kitchen is the most is the most silent
50:22
two weeks of my life
50:24
i couldn't understand a word they were saying in the kitchen
50:27
but it was just kind
50:28
of getting by through you know a lot of hand signs and showing
50:33
showing and telling
50:33
SPEAKER_00: drawing and
50:34
But it was the most eye-opening experience of my life because
50:37
of their respect for
50:38
their ingredients and just their meticulous work ethic and
50:42
their respect for each
50:43
SPEAKER_00: other.
50:44
SPEAKER_00: He was a hard ass, but these guys respected him.
50:47
Do you find that when you started cooking Japanese food or
50:52
being interested in
50:53
SPEAKER_03: Japanese food,
50:55
SPEAKER_03: did it change the way you thought about South African ingredients?
51:01
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, totally.
51:03
do you think that's kind of the thing that set you on the path
51:06
to where you are now
51:07
yeah yeah because i knew i talked about this earlier i knew
51:10
that to extract the
51:11
flavor from our local ingredients you couldn't use french you
51:15
couldn't use butter
51:16
you couldn't use heavy techniques which is what i've grown up
51:20
with you know i've
51:21
SPEAKER_00: been trained french french style and
51:23
SPEAKER_00: you know,
51:23
SPEAKER_00: worked in a lot of pitchens,
51:25
SPEAKER_00: you know,
51:25
SPEAKER_00: where this is,
51:26
SPEAKER_00: this is what,
51:27
SPEAKER_00: this is all I knew.
51:28
But if you try and add a lot of these ingredients to a heavy
51:32
cream sauce or to a
51:33
SPEAKER_00: beaux blanc or to,
51:34
SPEAKER_00: you know,
51:35
SPEAKER_00: you try to cook it,
51:37
SPEAKER_00: whereas applying it to a dashi is a lot easier.
51:40
SPEAKER_00: You got different results.
51:41
SPEAKER_00: So it was,
51:43
when I started working with dashis and misos and like
51:47
interesting soya sauces,
51:50
SPEAKER_00: then I started really,
51:52
SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
51:53
it actually opened my eyes to our ingredients and to how we can
51:56
apply flavor and
51:58
SPEAKER_00: how we can apply the extraction of flavor from them.
52:00
SPEAKER_00: Because it has to be a lot lighter.
52:02
SPEAKER_00: It has to be a lot...
52:04
SPEAKER_00: easier on the palate.
52:07
SPEAKER_00: That's where it started.
52:09
SPEAKER_00: It was 2008 and I said, fuck, I love this.
52:13
SPEAKER_00: I love Japanese food.
52:14
SPEAKER_00: I have to bring some of this into my cuisine more.
52:18
I started working with it over the next 10 years and it wasn't
52:21
until 2018,
52:21
10 years after
52:24
SPEAKER_00: that are really, this is probably five or six trips to Japan.
52:26
SPEAKER_00: And I said, no, this is the, this is now's the time I'm 48.
52:30
SPEAKER_00: Jeez, I've got to do this.
52:30
SPEAKER_00: And there's a gap in the market.
52:32
SPEAKER_00: Nobody's really doing this using Japanese in a fine dining environment.
52:37
SPEAKER_00: And I need to be able to meld this into South African food.
52:41
And I need to have a combination that doesn't make it a
52:43
Japanese restaurant.
52:44
It makes this an African restaurant where we're looking at it
52:47
for the Japanese lens on it.
52:49
SPEAKER_00: And it just worked.
52:51
SPEAKER_00: It worked from the beginning.
52:52
I think people love that the Japanese cuisine or the Japanese
52:56
style is so like
52:57
SPEAKER_00: symmetrical and clean and lean.
52:58
And then you got this really rugged African kind of vibe going
53:03
on at the back and
53:03
these flavors and ingredients coming through that it just
53:06
piqued the interest of so
53:07
SPEAKER_00: many people.
53:09
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, so it was just the right time and it was the right food.
53:12
And now we've kind of developed it over seven years to say,
53:16
listen,
53:16
we're less Japanese.
53:17
SPEAKER_00: We're more South African.
53:20
For people to experience Spain and South Africa,
53:25
people want to taste the region.
53:27
So we had to make it less Japanese and more South African now
53:30
without losing this,
53:32
SPEAKER_00: how we started with this Japanese concept in the background.
53:37
SPEAKER_00: So now it's been a bit of a
53:39
SPEAKER_00: you know,
53:40
SPEAKER_00: kind of a repositioning of the restaurant to make it,
53:42
SPEAKER_00: you know,
53:43
SPEAKER_00: feel more naturally South African,
53:45
SPEAKER_00: more naturally African and less Japanese,
53:48
SPEAKER_00: you know,
53:49
SPEAKER_00: so.
53:51
SPEAKER_03: I mean,
53:51
I think it makes a lot of sense because it's not really that
53:55
you can cook a lot of
53:56
SPEAKER_03: these things in some sort of,
53:59
native way you know like it just wouldn't make sense on a lot
54:03
of levels just from a
54:05
modern flavor standpoint i think yeah but but to me it still
54:11
feels like i didn't
54:13
really it feels south african to me at least you know the what
54:18
i had like it feels
54:20
very distinct and south african in that way yeah of course
54:24
there's you know
54:25
SPEAKER_03: japanese elements but
54:28
SPEAKER_03: But yeah, it's cool.
54:31
It's weird just how that bit of information that entered your
54:34
life from somewhere
54:37
SPEAKER_03: far away could make you look at
54:41
SPEAKER_03: you know, your home so differently.
54:43
SPEAKER_00: Definitely.
54:43
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I know.
54:44
SPEAKER_00: It's true.
54:45
SPEAKER_00: I think a perfect example of how we kind of blend the two,
54:49
SPEAKER_00: you've sat in the restaurant,
54:50
SPEAKER_00: you've looked at the ceiling feature.
54:52
SPEAKER_00: I told the designer,
54:54
SPEAKER_00: Tristan Duplessis,
54:55
SPEAKER_00: who's not quite famous around the world,
54:57
SPEAKER_00: just like one of the top restaurant designers.
54:59
SPEAKER_00: I said, Tristan, this is my project.
55:02
I want,
55:03
must feel African,
55:04
but I must feel slightly Japanese at the same time.
55:07
SPEAKER_00: So he came back and he proposed this roof feature.
55:10
SPEAKER_00: And I said, what the fuck is that?
55:11
SPEAKER_00: People are going to be looking up.
55:12
SPEAKER_00: They're not going to be looking at the food.
55:13
SPEAKER_00: I don't want that.
55:16
SPEAKER_00: And he said, listen, trust me on this.
55:18
SPEAKER_00: And I said, listen, I'm paying you enough money.
55:19
SPEAKER_00: I've got to trust you.
55:20
SPEAKER_00: So I trust you on this one.
55:23
And sure enough,
55:24
when he designed it,
55:25
and he said,
55:26
just before he installed it,
55:27
he said,
55:27
Pete,
55:29
I'm going to design a restaurant where people who walk in are
55:32
going to take their
55:32
SPEAKER_00: phones out and take a picture of your restaurant.
55:34
SPEAKER_00: Like, nah, yeah, good luck.
55:35
SPEAKER_00: Good luck with that, mate.
55:37
And sure enough,
55:37
to this day,
55:38
everybody takes their camera out,
55:39
takes a picture of that.
55:41
SPEAKER_00: And then,
55:42
SPEAKER_00: you know,
55:42
the hard part or the hard job is to actually get them to take a
55:45
picture of the food
55:46
SPEAKER_00: next.
55:46
SPEAKER_00: You know, that was our challenge.
55:49
SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
55:49
SPEAKER_00: so,
55:49
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
55:50
SPEAKER_00: the reason I brought that up was because he said,
55:52
SPEAKER_00: listen,
55:52
SPEAKER_00: this bead symbolizes Africa through the beads,
55:55
SPEAKER_00: the trading of the beads,
55:57
SPEAKER_00: and it also symbolizes the abacus,
55:59
SPEAKER_00: the Japanese Sorbonne.
56:02
SPEAKER_03: Did you ever start using the misos from that guy, James?
56:07
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, James, James Caper.
56:09
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, geez, we've used a lot of his misos.
56:13
SPEAKER_00: You know,
56:13
SPEAKER_00: they were,
56:14
SPEAKER_00: they're very rough in that they're a little bit,
56:17
SPEAKER_00: a little bit more salt than we want.
56:19
So you've actually had to kind of read them a little bit,
56:21
but they're fantastic.
56:22
SPEAKER_00: And his story is incredible.
56:25
SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
56:25
we've gone to visit James a couple times since then and tasted
56:29
through another
56:30
SPEAKER_00: batch of his misos.
56:31
SPEAKER_00: He's got this incredible cabbage miso.
56:34
SPEAKER_00: And, yeah, no, we love supporting him, you know.
56:36
SPEAKER_00: But we can only use so much.
56:38
SPEAKER_00: We actually bought two 20-kilo tubs, and it's lasted like a year.
56:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, a lot of miso.
56:48
Just to explain to everyone,
56:49
there's a guy in kind of a remote beach area.
56:53
SPEAKER_03: In Cape Town?
56:54
SPEAKER_03: What do you call it?
56:55
SPEAKER_03: Remote Beach Town?
56:56
SPEAKER_03: Scarborough.
56:58
SPEAKER_03: So it's a pretty isolated beach area, a small community.
57:03
SPEAKER_03: And he had like teenage cancer.
57:07
SPEAKER_03: Was that right?
57:08
He was quite young and he just cured himself through food and
57:12
lashed himself onto miso making.
57:14
SPEAKER_03: And he's making misos in this kind of African style roundhouse.
57:21
Yeah,
57:21
well,
57:21
no,
57:22
he built those,
57:24
what they call rondovils,
57:25
so the round African huts.
57:28
SPEAKER_00: He got them built by a local sand builder,
57:31
SPEAKER_00: not sand,
57:32
but a local sand person who made the bricks out of clay and
57:37
then built these houses
57:38
SPEAKER_00: out of those bricks.
57:39
SPEAKER_00: So he literally made it from the earth, these houses.
57:42
SPEAKER_00: And because the walls are so thick,
57:44
SPEAKER_00: he could actually,
57:46
SPEAKER_00: they're perfect insulation and perfect temperature for the mesos.
57:49
And he'll make a fire at the bottom of one if it's too cool and
57:53
it'll like heat the
57:53
SPEAKER_00: whole house up.
57:55
SPEAKER_00: But he's devoted his life to misos,
57:57
SPEAKER_00: to kefirs,
58:00
SPEAKER_00: to every kind of fermentation you can think of to heal himself.
58:04
SPEAKER_00: He doesn't do any sugar.
58:05
SPEAKER_00: Everything is just made by his own hands.
58:09
SPEAKER_00: And now he just spreads the love.
58:11
He just helps people and he gives people advice and he sells
58:15
his product to whoever
58:17
SPEAKER_00: wants to heal themselves.
58:19
SPEAKER_00: It's quite incredible.
58:20
SPEAKER_03: No,
58:20
SPEAKER_03: it was like completely unexpected in this,
58:23
SPEAKER_03: in this little town that,
58:24
SPEAKER_03: uh,
58:26
SPEAKER_00: but just saw how he's living.
58:27
SPEAKER_00: He's like living in a mud hut in this town with all these nice houses.
58:32
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, it's like, yeah, a little surf town.
58:35
It's just like the incredible miso is like totally distinct,
58:38
but it's,
58:39
I don't know.
58:40
There was,
58:41
there's just so many cool people like doing interesting things
58:44
there and,
58:46
SPEAKER_03: You know, just Abalobi.
58:48
Like I've told so many people about Abalobi since I was there
58:52
and just like people
58:53
SPEAKER_03: in the Amazon,
58:54
SPEAKER_03: like working at least,
58:55
SPEAKER_03: you know,
58:56
SPEAKER_03: trying to manage resources while doing sustainable development.
59:03
Just the Abalobi fish app could really be applied to so many
59:09
different things.
59:11
and it's it's really yeah you know i think what's incredible
59:15
about that is because
59:16
of how these small fishing villages on the coast of you know
59:20
with the western cape
59:21
and south africa are dying away because of you know these
59:25
obviously the fishing
59:26
stocks are going the fish stocks are dying also you know the
59:29
big ships are coming
59:30
SPEAKER_00: in from abroad and they're
59:33
SPEAKER_00: landing all these fish and taking them offshore.
59:35
SPEAKER_00: And their towns are dying because of it,
59:37
SPEAKER_00: and their social ills that come with it,
59:40
SPEAKER_00: like drugs and unemployment.
59:43
So what these guys are doing,
59:44
they're putting the power back into the small fishermen's
59:47
hands.
59:47
SPEAKER_00: So they've given these fishermen a phone,
59:50
SPEAKER_00: and when they land,
59:52
SPEAKER_00: when they pull the fish in from the water,
59:54
SPEAKER_00: they can log where the fish has been caught.
59:57
SPEAKER_00: And through a GPS, Abilobi can track the
1:00:01
whether it's true or not,
1:00:02
whether they landed them in the spot where they caught them.
1:00:06
SPEAKER_00: And so you can actually buy the fish.
1:00:09
SPEAKER_00: You can see the name of the fisherman who bought it,
1:00:10
SPEAKER_00: the name of the boat,
1:00:11
SPEAKER_00: where it was called,
1:00:12
SPEAKER_00: when it was caught.
1:00:13
And what is great about abilobi is they actually give them ice
1:00:17
because in the past,
1:00:18
SPEAKER_00: they just used to chuck these fish in the hold,
1:00:20
SPEAKER_00: fish for the whole day.
1:00:22
SPEAKER_00: These fish would be on top of each other, sweating in the hot sun.
1:00:26
SPEAKER_00: They come back to shore and they've got like a day's shelf life.
1:00:29
SPEAKER_00: Now they're extending that shelf life.
1:00:31
SPEAKER_03: Now they're getting much more value.
1:00:34
SPEAKER_00: It's incredible.
1:00:36
SPEAKER_00: They were actually up for the Earthshot Prize a couple months ago.
1:00:41
SPEAKER_00: They're one of the finalists,
1:00:42
which is Prince William's big award for the best humanitarian
1:00:52
or the best business
1:00:53
SPEAKER_00: promoting.
1:00:55
SPEAKER_03: What's especially fascinating to me is that
1:00:59
SPEAKER_03: it's not just,
1:01:00
SPEAKER_03: you know,
1:01:01
SPEAKER_03: for these communities,
1:01:02
SPEAKER_03: but actually this data wouldn't,
1:01:06
SPEAKER_03: no one would be able to collect this data in quite an efficient way,
1:01:11
SPEAKER_03: you know,
1:01:11
SPEAKER_03: as,
1:01:12
SPEAKER_03: as well as these fishermen can.
1:01:14
SPEAKER_03: So like this,
1:01:15
this data is like essential for preserving all of these species
1:01:19
and they're getting
1:01:20
SPEAKER_03: it.
1:01:20
SPEAKER_03: They're,
1:01:21
SPEAKER_03: you know,
1:01:21
SPEAKER_03: they're the ones that kind of own this information and it's,
1:01:26
SPEAKER_03: I mean,
1:01:26
SPEAKER_03: that's,
1:01:26
SPEAKER_03: that's powerful.
1:01:28
SPEAKER_03: I think it can be applied in a lot of different things.
1:01:32
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
1:01:35
SPEAKER_00: That's one of my favorite people, man.
1:01:38
SPEAKER_00: We love him.
1:01:39
SPEAKER_03: We've talked a while.
1:01:40
SPEAKER_03: I could talk with you all day about all this.
1:01:44
SPEAKER_03: My week in South Africa a year ago.
1:01:47
SPEAKER_00: I don't know how you trapped all that information in your head, man.
1:01:51
SPEAKER_00: I don't know how you did it.
1:01:52
SPEAKER_00: No one that took you so long to write those
1:01:55
SPEAKER_03: No, but it's a lot to process just because there's vastness to it.
1:01:59
SPEAKER_03: And you did a good job of it.
1:02:02
SPEAKER_03: Good talking to you.
1:02:03
SPEAKER_03: Nice one, Nick.
1:02:04
SPEAKER_03: Hope everything's lekker.
1:02:05
SPEAKER_03: Likewise.
1:02:05
SPEAKER_03: With the new place.
1:02:07
SPEAKER_00: I appreciate it, Nick.
1:02:09
SPEAKER_00: And you have a lekker evening, eh?
1:02:11
SPEAKER_00: Or a lekker day.
1:02:13
SPEAKER_03: Thanks, everyone, for listening.
1:02:15
SPEAKER_03: That was Peter Templehoff from Cape Town, South Africa.
1:02:19
SPEAKER_03: That's our first guest from the African continent, I think.
1:02:25
SPEAKER_03: Pretty sure.
1:02:25
SPEAKER_03: So good.
1:02:28
SPEAKER_03: I'm glad that happened.
1:02:30
SPEAKER_03: Check out his restaurants,
1:02:31
SPEAKER_03: Fane,
1:02:32
SPEAKER_03: Beyond,
1:02:34
SPEAKER_03: Arum,
1:02:36
SPEAKER_03: Ramen Head,
1:02:37
SPEAKER_03: Sushiya,
1:02:39
SPEAKER_03: in Cape Town,
1:02:41
SPEAKER_03: around Cape Town.
1:02:42
SPEAKER_03: They're pretty great places.
1:02:43
And check out the three-part story I wrote about my trip there
1:02:47
on the New World Newsletter.
1:02:49
SPEAKER_03: Subscribe if you haven't paid subscribers.
1:02:54
SPEAKER_03: do get extra access to all the content and are much appreciated.
1:03:00
SPEAKER_03: So thank you everyone for the support.
1:03:02
SPEAKER_03: Please like and share us.
1:03:04
SPEAKER_03: And thanks to my friend Pat Buzzard for providing the music for the show.
1:03:08
SPEAKER_03: See you everyone soon.