Latest / Wired To Hunt Podcast / Ep. 503: From Whitetails to Tahr with Traditional Archer Bre Lewis

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Ep. 503: From Whitetails to Tahr with Traditional Archer Bre Lewis · Wired To Hunt Podcast

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, home of the
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: modern white tail hunter and now your host, Mark Kenyon.
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wire to Hunt podcast. I'm your guest
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: host Tony Peterson. Today I'm joined by Bree Lewis to
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: discuss Florida white tail hunting, traditional archery, and developing an
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: adventurous hunting mindset. All right, folks, welcome to the Wire
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: to Hunt podcast, which is brought to you by First Light.
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: You might notice that this is not the voice of
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: Mark Kenyon. He's off at a Miley Cyrus concert in
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: Memphis with Spencer new Hearth, where, at least according to
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: his latest text to me, Spencer paid up for the
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: meet and greet, So that's a nice little treat for
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: the boys. Today. My guest is Bree Lewis, who is
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: a big game hunting guide in New Zealand as well
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: as an outdoor writer. Bree grew up bow hunting Florida
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: white tails with her father, Tim, who is the author
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: of several great bow hunting books and a real student
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: of nature. While Breeze started off hunting with compounds, mostly
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: from stands and blinds, she quickly developed a love for
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: traditional archery and still hunting, which is a craft she
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: honed in the swamps of Florida but now uses in
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: New Zealand, which surprisingly has two huntable populations of white tails.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: There's a crazy story behind that, which Brie shares with me.
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: In addition to a lot of really interesting conversation. I
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: had an absolute blast talking to her, and I think
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: you're gonna love the show. But I gotta give you
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: a heads up that I actually recorded this with Bree
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: way back in July. Mark and I got our signals
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: crossed on this one, and we didn't really have a
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: place for the show then, but we do now. So
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: keep in mind if it seems like our seasonal timing
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: is off a little, it's because we had this conversation
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: it was in the middle of the summer. Other than that,
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: I think you're really gonna love this episode. Free Lewis.
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: I am so excited to talk to you today. Well,
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: I'm excited to talk to you too, Tony. You are
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: living a lifestyle that is pretty wild and we were
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: just we're just talking off air about how how I
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: show I show my little girls, my little nine year
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: old girls, your little social media post and stuff all
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: the time because I'm like, look at what this girl
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: is doing. And I really want to get into kind
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: of how your life has you know, hunting has been
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: such a central theme of it, and you've really taken
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: off with it, like you you You've said, I'm gonna
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: go do crazy wild things with hunting, and that's it's
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: so cool. I want to talk to you about that.
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: But let's talk about growing up in Florida as a
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: the daughter of a crazy traditional bowl hunter who I love. Uh,
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: what what was it like? Was it always hunting for
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: you even growing up as a little girl down there
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: in Florida. Yeah, my dad's just started taking me into
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: the woods, whether it was for hunting or catching snakes
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: or you know, looking at birds, just appreciating Florida nature
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: and being outdoors. And I started hunting pretty young. Um
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: my dad will remember the exact age. But I wanted
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: a gun, and he made me wait till I think
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: I was six, um, in order to start hunting. And
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: there's there's no I know, some of the states have
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: laws about the age that you can get in to
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: um firearms and hunting. But I shot my first pig
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: that year. Um, And yeah, what were you using for
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: a gun? It was it twenty two? Yeah? No, no,
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: I can't remember how big, but it was a bore. Yeah,
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: so it was. It was decent um. There's a bit
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: of a story. I don't know if this is okay
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: to say. Anyway, Yeah, it was a pretty independent sort
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: of experience actually, So that was cool. Are you gonna
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: just leave it hanging at that? Yeah? Yeah, you were
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: an independent six year old with twenty two and you
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: were hunting pigs and you've got one. I was with
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: my I was with my dad. There's just some piglets
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: that came by and I wanted one as a pet.
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: And anyway, yep, so you you were hunting pigs, trying
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: to kill a pig, but also maybe eyeball and some
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: little porkers running through there as potentially to grab and
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: take home to raise for my dad to grab for me. Yeah,
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: and did he grab one? Yes? I think so. So
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: all right, well, I can tell that I'm gonna have
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: to just pull this out of you. So what happens
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: to this pig that that Tim catches? Well, I think
• 4:46
  Speaker 1: I'm not really sure because he left me and I
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: asked if a boar came by, if I could chewed
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: it and Um, then I saw it and I think
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: he came running back. So, um, yeah, so you set
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: your dad off on a pet pig catching mission while
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: you're still hunting there? Uh, this is this? I love this.
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: How old are you by way twenty six? This might
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: be something we need to edit out. We're absolutely leaving
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: this end. So you you did something this this it's
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: a wild story, but it's going to you're You're gonna
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: tell us some other stuff here soon. I'm sure about
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: your being raised down there and the way you were
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: raised that has led to your life decisions. And that's
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: one of those things that I love hearing because you know,
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: as the father of twin nine year olds, I'm always
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: looking like, where are these moments where I can let
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: them have some independence and make some decisions with consequences,
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: because they're gonna hunt, like you know, whether they take
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: to it or not, they're gonna get their chances. And
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: you know, I think it's up to the parent to
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: decide is is six too young? Or is eight too young?
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: Or is nine too young? Where where's my kid at?
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: Obviously your dad trusted you there. Yeah, I think it
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: depends on out on the individual. Like I was probably mature,
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: and I think girls mature a bit understanding consequences, probably
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: a bit earlier than boys in some cases. But it's
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: all on the individual. And I had hunted with my dad.
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: That wasn't my first opportunity and at a pig. Um,
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: this is all like him telling me the story later.
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: I don't really remember things from back then, but there
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: were chances, I guess where there are pigs that I
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: could have shot, but there are cows behind them, and
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: I was so worried that I might accidentally wound a
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: cow that if it was in that direction, I wouldn't
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: choot the pig. So there are opportunities where he saw
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: me make decisions that were smart, and we talked about him,
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: so I think he felt pretty comfortable by that stage.
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: Was it was this kind of hunting scenario. This, This
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: wasn't probably out of a ground blind twenty years ago, then,
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: was it? I mean you're probably like, were you tucked
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: into the pal meadows or something? Do you know? I
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: can't honestly remember now, you don't remember if there was
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: a like a actual ground line there or not. I
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: don't know. We weren't in a blind. Yeah, um, yeah,
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: that's probably what it was when did when did he
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: get into shooting traditional bows before that? Um, I'll send
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: you a photo of it. I would probably have been
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: three or four, and I'm wearing a little tiara and
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: I have my first traditional bow, and I remember I
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: took it in to kindergarten to show and tell and
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: I broke it because I tried to string it myself
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: in front of the class. It's pretty heartbreaking, but yep.
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: So that was my first traditional bow and then I
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: just had heaps of other ones, and uh, I got
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: into shooting fish. So that was the first thing. I
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: grew up on a canal that you saw and mullet
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: would come by and I chewed him off the dock
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: with wood arrows so they'd float once the fish died up,
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: and then I'd go swim outing retrieve him. So yeah,
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: I love that, And this comes your Your dad is
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: is Tim Lewis, and he's he's a bow hunting writer,
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: he's a bow hunting author, he's a he's a hardcore
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: traditional bow hunter in a in a real student of nature.
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: He's such a cool guy. Uh he was he always
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: traditional archery? Did he did he ever hunt with compounds
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: that you remember? Yes, so my mom and I she
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: she bought it. I was pretty young. Um, we got
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: him a compound bow after he had an injury, and
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: he thought that that was the way to go, was
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: to try to shoot hunt with a compound bot. But
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: I don't even think he made it a whole season
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: with it, and he went back to traditional archery. So
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: he's into it and you just took to that. Have
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: you have you ever hunted with a compound or has
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: it always been traditional for you? Yeah? So I wasn't
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: strong enough to pull back a traditional boat. I started
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: bow hunting, I think when I was twelve, for dear,
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: and so he got me a compound bow and yep,
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: away from there, and I stuck with it all through.
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: I wanted to go to traditional bow, but I didn't
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: put the time into practicing, so I just you know,
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: season would come up and I'd want to go hunting,
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: and I just stuck with the compound as a bit
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: of a crutch. So I just started going into the
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: traditional bow. Now that I've been over in New Zealand
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: and games like readily available. There's no seasons or anything,
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: no tags, so it's a great opportunity. So you didn't
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: when you were growing up bow hunting those swamp white
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: tilS down there. You were always hunting with a compound.
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: Well no, okay, So when I was at school, um
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: at uf, I started getting into the mounted darchery, so
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: that motivated me to practice more with the traditional style
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: bow and that's when I started. So I did shoot
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: one white tail in Florida with a trad bow, which
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: was pretty cool. Nice when you when you start. So
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: you said you started when you were twelve white till
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: hunting down there. Yes, how long did it take you
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: to kill your first year? I was in eighth grade,
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: so it would have been probably two seasons without shooting anything.
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: And I never went to a gun, like even the
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: last week in a season, I stuck with my bow.
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: So I just loved it. Were you hunting, because I
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: don't know, your dad doesn't hunt over feeders, does he? No? Yeah,
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: so he's hunting natural brows and natural natural food, natural
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: movement down there. Yeah, and I'm assuming you were too, Yeah. Yeah,
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: so just falling in my dad's footsteps kind of. And um,
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: I really liked early season hunting because the deer feeding
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: on the acorns from the scrub oaks and they're out
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: in really good country for bush stocking um, which that's
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: my New Zealand term for still hunting. So yeah, yeah,
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: they go bush stocking here, but pretty much, um, just
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: walking through those scrub oak areas and it's really quiet
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: because we have that white sugar stand so it's quiet.
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: There's palm front clumps in these little scattered groups of
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: scrub oaks, um, and it's actually good chance to stalk
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: a deer, which is a really hard beat with a bow.
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: So is that how you killed your first one? No,
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: My first year was in the winter, and that was
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: from a stand in the swamp, so it was like
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: completely water under where I shot her. Um. Yeah. But
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: the other thing is we're hunting on private land. We
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: have fourteen members on the hunting club and most of
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: them are rifle hunters. So archer season was kind of
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: our free range. We could walk around and we didn't
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: worry about messing up other hunters versus during the rifle season,
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: we stuck to one area a bit more because we
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: didn't want to mess up other rifle hunters. Was that
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: part of the reason why you liked the early season
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: as well? Yeah, And and probably just for a young
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: person sometimes it's hard to sit still for a while. Like, um,
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: I used to only be able to hunt until nine
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: or something in the morning, because then I'd be ready
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: to go do something active. But of course as I
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: got older, I it was so exciting just being in
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: a spot where I felt like there was a potential.
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: I was quite happy to stay all day if I
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: felt like it was good. So when when did you
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: kill your your first one is still hunting down there.
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: I don't know, because after I killed my first year,
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: I had a bit of a good run um with does.
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: So our club had restrictions for bucks. They had to
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: be I think it was a hundred oh I'm thinking
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: of score, but it would have been I think fifteen
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: inch main beams and fifteen inch spread and a four
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: points on one side. Um. And then it changed and
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: they had to be also over four and a half
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: years old. So we had a lot of restrictions on
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: the type of bucks that we could take, and I
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: was always, I guess, wanting to air on the side
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: of caution. So there were some bucks that I took
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: photos of and showed my dad later and he was like, oh,
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: I would have shot that, And I was like, well,
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: what so this is this is a world that probably
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: a lot of people, a lot of the white sail
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: hunters listening to this, probably have never experienced a hunting club.
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: And you know that those kind of restrictions they're very
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: common in those kind of places or those kind of
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: leases and situations. And but but a lot of people
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: outside of the South don't deal with that. I mean
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: when you were you know, you grew up with that,
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: so you probably that was just what you dealt with.
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: But as like a young bull hunter out there who's like, man,
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: I really want to shoot something, it was probably pretty frustrating. Huh.
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: It wasn't frustrating because I I'm probably more trigger happy
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: now than I've ever been, just getting into the idea
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: that you can shoot a lot in game. Animals here
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: are considered pest, so um, it's actually encouraged in some ways.
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: But yeah, when I was young, because I always grew
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: up with those restrictions, I was never too worried or concerned.
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: I liked being out in the woods and hunting was
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: what motivated me to spend time out there. But um,
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: it was a great hunt. If I saw a raccoon
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: eating things in the tree next to me or you know,
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: it's all the other wildlife that I saw, and if
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: I saw a deer that was so exciting it didn't
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: matter if I shot them or not. But having the
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: camera and trying to get photos of them was pretty
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: rewarding too, because you feel like I was that close
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: and I did the movement to get my camera out,
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: I probably could have gotten a shot at that animal
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: if I had wanted to. So you kind of your
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: early years are kind of like mine, where you know,
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: we we were primarily sitting in tree stands for white
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: tails are sitting on the ground. But I was like
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: you a d h D to the max, Like I
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: don't want to sit here for hours and hours and
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: hours and so sneaking around and still hunting. You know,
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: when I when I was growing up, still hunting was
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: like a very talked about and you know it was
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: it was put into practice by a lot of people.
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: It's really not that popular now, at least for white tails.
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: It's not. Yeah. Um, well, like I said, my experience
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: hunting white tails has all been on private land on
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: that lease. But I enjoyed the still hunting aspects so
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: much that I started setting my stands for opportunities for
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: still hunting. So it's kind of similar actually, tell how
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: I hunt the mountain country here in New Zealand. So
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: I'd find an area with good sign around me, so
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: still a chance of being able to shoot something for
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: my from my stand, but also in areas where I
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: could see other you know, scrub boaks that were dropping,
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: in areas where I could plan a stock on something
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: that doesn't look like it's going to be feeding by me,
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: and just the terrain of that scrub country. So cool
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: because it's actually possible to do a stock you have
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: silent footing and lots of little clumps to go to.
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: And yeah, so that was cool. I mean the thing
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: that you know when you when you hunt in some
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: of the locations you hunt, or you know where you're
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: working down in New Zealand or you go out west
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: here in the States, you know it's spotting and stocking,
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: and you know it's it's very so common, right, and
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: you just realize like, yeah, you know, if I see
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: a meal there in the right situation, I can totally
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: creep in on it. But we don't because of where
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: white tails live and we don't see them better as
• 16:39
  Speaker 1: often as some of these other credits. It's kind of
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: like you forget how stalkable they can be, and if
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: you if you can move around and pay attention to
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: the wind and and stay quiet, they're totally stalkable. It's
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: just not it's so much harder to find the situation. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: And it's in the in the right situation and in
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: the right country because as it the time of the
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: year changes and they're more in the swamps and thicker areas.
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: It's pretty much I wouldn't say it possible, but I've
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: never shot one in that situation stocking. I've tried. I tried,
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: but I haven't been successful. So yeah, it's just not
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: it's a it's an opportunity thing that you know, there's
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: certain situations where you know, if you're hunting Western river
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: bottoms or something, it's it could come up, you know.
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: I mean, I've had it. I've I've I've killed a
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: few in my life. I killed one really good buck
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: one time, stocking him and that kind of what you're
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: talking about. I was sitting there in an early season
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: on a pond and he just walked the other side
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: and then went out to start feeding, and I was like,
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: I can just crawl through this cornfield and catch up
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: to him and did and it just worked. But it
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: was like kind of just fell into my lap, and
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: it was like, well, you have the you have the route,
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: you have everything working in your favor. You might as
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: well try it. But it's you know, it's so often
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: with white tails, especially now, where most people are going
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: to see that and they're not going to do anything,
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: or they're going to try to call it in and
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: you know, that might work, that might not. But there
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: are situation where you can just get down and go
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: to those suckers well, and there's a lot of situations
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: where you can't too. And I probably, well, there's a
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: lot more failing stories than successful stories, even in that scrub,
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: and I learned the hard way a bit about white
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: tail behavior. I can remember one story that's just really
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: really clear. It was a beautiful ten point buck and
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: he was gorgeous, and I think I had seen him
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: from a distance before and already knew that he could
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: be in that area. Um, and he came by me
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: and just kept on walking and never gave me a
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: shot at like thirty yards And I was hunting with
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: a compound bow at that time, so it was like
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: just doable range for me, but not he never gave
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: me an opportunity. Fed under an oak, and then he
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: was out of my range and he just wouldn't feed closer,
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: wouldn't feed closer, and he continued on and I was
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: so upset, and I decided I was going to get
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: down and try to intersect him on the other side
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: of that little scrub oak patch. And uh, of course,
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: right when I'm getting down, he comes back because they
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: feed around and comes and comes right back where I
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: could have saw him if I'd just stayed in my stand,
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: but instead I was moving and he saw me, and
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: who's gone? And that was it. So I was I
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: was really heartbroken over that, because you just you put
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: so much time into finding the spot, finding on the
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: spot with the animal, you get so obsessed with it,
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: and then you ruin it and you know, maybe blow
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: him out of that old buck like that. Yeah, it sucks.
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: He might not be coming back there, but that's a
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: I mean, what you bring up is a good point.
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: I actually wrote about that this morning for a piece
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: I've got for Meat Eater coming out later, where I
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: realized how often when you're sitting there. You know, you
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: see dear filter through and you're like, okay, they're gone there.
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: They headed off to the field, or they headed off wherever.
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: And then you know, forty five minutes later you look
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: up and see movement and they never left they you know,
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: or they swung back around and they're just staging in
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: there and just milling around in the cover and they
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: didn't go anywhere. So that another I mean, there's an
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: asterix on our advice earlier just to get down and
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: run after him. Don't always do that, because sometimes they
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: didn't go away from you. Yeah, and that that situation
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: really taught me. Um, but there's a good chance that
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: they will come back and feedback by and things like that,
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: and um, most of the time when they feed by me,
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: I don't ever run after him. It's more these stands
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: that I've set up to actually cover other areas where
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: they're probably not going to come to my area after
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: that area, or maybe they're going to be feeding down
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: window me and then they're definitely not going to come
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: to that area. Sort of situation. We're all do that
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: a bit longer stock, But um, who knows what's going
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: to come by you if you stay there there might
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: be something else too, so well, I mean, right, if
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: you if you're in a situation where a good buck
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: feeds by you, not spooke, not worried, he's just doing
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: his thing and his you're in a good area. You
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: know you have good things going for you. I have
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: to ask you when you you know, when you're growing
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: up in your you're spotting, stocking through those palmados, sneaking
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: through there, it how much how much fun is it?
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: Because one of the reasons that you see that not
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: happen a lot in the white tail woods is because
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: the only thing we have to hunt is white tails.
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: But you've got such a bonus down there with pigs
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: when you're when you're doing that, are you like, I know,
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: when I'm around pigs, they're always on the menu, Like
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: I never if I see him, I'm like laser focused.
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: But when you're when you were down there growing up
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: having access to them, was it like you're sneaking along
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: and you hear pigs or you see them, are like,
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: are you immediately going after him? Or you're like, I'm
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: sticking to deer. I'm sticking to deer. Real, Yeah, I was.
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: I was always sticking to deer because we have the
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: opportunity to pig hunt all year around, but we only
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: had X amount of ones to because we are on
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: private land. Yeah, and the pigs aren't native, we could
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: hunt them anytime. So when I was deer hunting, I
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: was pretty hardcore about deer hunting. I was probably a
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: more obsessed with hunting back then than I am now,
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: even though that's what I do know for work and everything.
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: But no, it was a big deal to me. Um
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: and like even having pigs, under my stand, I would
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: hate it because they would scare away the deer, like
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: on the acorns and things. But I wasn't going to
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: waste time shooting them if I felt like it was
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: going to mess up my hunt. So yeah, they don't
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: play well together. Huh No, No, definitely not. Definitely not
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: on the like you know, any mass food product drawing
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: them in, they get a bit I guess territorially aggressive
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: over it, so they'll chase the deer off. When I hunted,
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: I hunted Florida one time for white tails and there
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: were pigs everywhere, and they were like, yeah, you can
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: shoot him, you know, but like we're we're here for
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: a deer hunt. So I shot one pig like the
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: first night or something like that. I couldn't. I couldn't
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: handle it. And then after that I just had to
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: watch these pigs. I was like, like it it kills
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: I don't get opportunities at pigs, you know, and it
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: just killed me. I'm like, I don't care about these
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: little swamp white tails, Like I'm sitting here just donating
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: like leaders of blood to these mosquitoes. Please just let
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: me shoot these pigs. But we couldn't. Yeah, well we could.
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: It was just round on. You just go to Florida
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: over the summer and yeah, go back to Coca Beach
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: and I'm sure my dad could help you with pigs.
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: Part of the reason I want to talk to you,
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: you know, the Southeast in general, is you know, there's
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: so many white tail hunters down there, and it's like
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: it's for some reason being in the hunting industry, it's
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: just like a hard region to represent, Like it's hard
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: to find a lot of voices that come out of there,
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: even though it's a super popular, you know, it's people
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: down there are passionate, and so that's that's part of
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: the reason I want to talk to you, because Like
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: when I think about going to Florida, I don't think
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: about hunting. I'm like, take me fishing. Well, that's it.
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: Like the truth is our white tail quality compared to
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: the rest of the States is just they're not as impressive.
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: So unless you're from Florida and you love hunting the
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: Florida swamps and the Florida bush, it's not something that
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: you is a destination at all. Like for turkeys, that's
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: the only and I guess gators now, um, but that's
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: the only reason why Florida would be a hunting destination.
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: But if you grow up there and you love hunting
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: the swamps and like, it's it's I think it's a
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: tough country to hunt. You have, like you're saying, the
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: mosquitoes and like uncomfortable heat a lot of the times,
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: even in winter, can get pretty miserably hot and things
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: like that, and just in the swamp and how thick
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: it is and all of that inhospitable environment. I mean,
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: it really is. And that's one thing that really opened
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: my eyes. So most of the hunting that we did
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: down and this was like this is three days of hunting,
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: so it's or five days of hunting or whatever. So
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: it was like there's a very small glimpse into your world.
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: So correct me if I'm wrong. But you know, we
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: did we did tree stand hunts on like natural movement,
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: and you know, like they had some feeders out there
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: in certain places, but it was mostly just like they
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: had little food plots and like you know, it's it's swamps,
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: so there's like a little high ground and they go
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: through here or whatever. But the one day they were
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: just like, you know, if you want to go sneak around,
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: try to find a pig or find it here, go ahead.
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: And you know, so I'm I dropped a pin on
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: camp and I'm out there and I'm like, you know,
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: when you're when you're in the mountains, they say you
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: get cliffed out right, Like you you get to a
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: spot You're like, I can't go anywhere. I'm gonna die
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: if I keep going. So you gotta back out, and
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: you can get into trouble because because of the you know,
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: the up and down terrain. I was sitting there and
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: I'm like I keep getting swamped out like everywhere I go.
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: I'm like I'm looking and I'm looking at water that
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: has alligators and it like I see them sometimes and
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: I'm like, now I don't know where to go, and
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: you can't get any elevation. It's so flat that it's
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: like it reminds me of being in the in the
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: big north Woods where you're just like, I don't really
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: have a good bearing and I can't get up and
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: see anything. It's it's a really challenging environment that you
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: probably wouldn't think until if somebody dropped you in there,
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: you'd be like, oh, yeah, this is tough. This is tough.
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: And and sometimes like especially on the edge of swamps
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: and things, you get bushed out to like it's just
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: actually too thick to really get through without making a
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: lot of noise and clearing a trail um and it
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: takes you way out of the way you'd like to
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: go with the wind or the area that you would
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: like to try to get to um because you have
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: to get around this really really thick briars and vines
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: and everything. So, yeah, it's tough. And what surprised me,
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: you know, because it's so wet or you know, when
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: we were there, you know, you'd get that crazy rain
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: for like an hour in the afternoon every day, and
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: you know where it would just downpour, and so you'd
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: be like, Okay, I should be able to sneak around
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: and be quiet. But then the the sun comes out,
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: it's a million degrees and then there's pomp like dried
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: palm fronds and stuff on the ground, and so you're like,
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: like you said, you're caught in the briers, and then
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: you're stepping on stuff that's way crunchier than you think
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: it should be. And I was just like, this is
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: this is legit difficult. So you know, you talk about
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: like the quality of deer down there, Yeah, they're little,
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: but if you could go down there and consistently sneak
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: around and kill them, you could go anywhere where the
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: deer were bigger and probably do really well. I think, Yeah,
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: that's that's what I think too, And like getting into
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: the guiding coming from Florida, I think learning to hunt
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: that bush and be aware of a lot of other
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: things besides just the game sign because you're aware of
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: all the other species that are going to give you
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: away and the terrain, it makes you a better hunter
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: anywhere that you go. And there's a lot of obstacles
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: to solve the problem of getting a white tail in
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: Florida and it kind of makes other obstacles not easier,
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: but it just helps you learn to figure them out.
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: I guess yep. Yeah, easy doesn't make you good, you know,
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: I mean, it just it does. It easy. It can
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: be fun, but challenging makes you good. And you know,
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: you know you mentioned you kind of alluded to this earlier.
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: And you know, I've bitched about hunting Florida a lot
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: because it was it was wild. But at the same time,
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: you know, You're sitting in a tree stand and we
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: were hunting the end of July, right at the opener
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: of the season wherever we were, like Central Florida or
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: wherever we were, and I grunted in a buck in
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: you know, August one or whenever. It was a little guy,
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: and I'm looking at like tree frogs and stuff from
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: my stand and little lizards, and I'm like, this is
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: not something I could have anywhere else. And so you know, everything,
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: you know, you think like, oh, the perfect white tail
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: hunt in Iowa November or seventh or whatever. Like there
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: there are times when it's just all around awesome and
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: very comfortable, But a lot of times the coolest white
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: tail hunting you're gonna have there's gonna be something that
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: kind of sucks about it, and you just you just
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: take that for what it is because of what you
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: get out of it as far as the overall experience. Yeah,
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: and that's the thing in Florida, like with your tree frogs,
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: and for me it was well, snakes, I like snakes
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: and frogs, but I also liked otters a lot and
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: raccoons and things as a young person. And I actually
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: used to pick my stands and my spots because my
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: dad would help me, like find sign and talk to
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: me about what was had good potential and things. But
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: when it came down to it, he would let me
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: pick my my own spots that I was going to
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: hunt and help me set up stands there. And yeah,
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: I used to pick them not on deer sign, but
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: on otter sign because I like to see the otters.
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: Oh I'd like I'd like to see a deer too,
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: but I think i'd like to have a little bit
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: less chance of seeing a deer, but a better chance
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: of watching the otters and just you know the whole
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: experience being out there. So yeah, well that's the that
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: area that you grew up in. There's so much life
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: in there. I mean, it's when you're there, there's just
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: there's stuff moving constantly, like there's there's always something going on,
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: and that's you know that we don't talk about that
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: very much, but I'm glad you brought that up because
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: that that's sort of the secret sauce of enjoying hunting.
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: Like if you're seeing anything, then it's that then it's fun,
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: right like, and it doesn't have to be Boone and
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: Crockett Bucks. Like if if I challenge anybody to go
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: out sit and watch orders do their thing and not
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: be like, man, that was freaking cool. That was so cool. Yeah.
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: And the other thing is like I hear you talk
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: a bit about people looking at their phones and you know,
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: everything while they're hunting and not paying attention to their surroundings.
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: But if you're watching orders, then you're paying attention to
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: your surroundings and you'll be ready for when that buck
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: sets out, you know. Yeah. It's I'm to the point
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: now where I gotta shut that sucker down and just
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: put it away because you know, and it but it's
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: it's so worth it and it helps me when I
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: you know, like hunting with my little girls, it helps
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: me be aware of that pole to just be a
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: kid on your phone and you know, like it's yeah,
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: I mean, and it's an easy crotch, right, like we
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: we all do it, like I do it a lot.
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: But when I'm with my little girls, like there's something
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: to glass or something to watch for, something to explain,
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: it just helps me stay in the moment better. And
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: I didn't see that coming about taking little kids hunting,
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: and I just love it. That's so cool, that's so cool. Yeah.
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: So they're they're not uh bree level uh survivalists, and
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: they're not ready for the Florida snakes and stuff like that.
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: Not a survivalist, but they are. They would they would
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: explode down there in the summer and sitting on a
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: tree stand, but they would love they love the lizards
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: and stuff. Um, you were talking so speaking on that.
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: We were talking, you know, before we before we started
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: recording here, just just for like a frame of reference. Uh.
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: We went down to Florida in March, met up with
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: your dad, and by we, I mean my family met
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: up with your dad. He took myself, my little girls,
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: and my wife's uncle out fishing and we just had
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: a freaking blast. With him. It was so fun. And
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: you were talking about growing up with those opportunities and
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: so not only did you have a dad who took
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: you pig hunting and he took you deer hunting and
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: out to this hunting club, but you were saying that
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: when you were like ten, you had a boat that
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: he trusted you to take out. Yeah. Yeah, So in
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: Florida at that time, at ten, you could get your
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: boaters license or permit or whatever to drive a boat.
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: And I went ahead and I did that as soon
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: as I was ten, and I he felt like, because
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: I had the initiative to go ahead and do that,
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: that I should be allowed to take it out. So
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: that was really cool. Before that, I was taking out
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: canoes with my little friends and we would take turns
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: a lot of times. Yeah um, but we were shooting
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: shooting fish out of the canoes, taking turns, paddling for
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: each other. And then that kind of switched to the boat, um,
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: and going to islands and for shine and catching horseshoe
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: crabs and you know, their seats of opportunities I didn't have.
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: I ended up getting a crab trap, but I used
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: to just time meat to a string and put it
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: in and catch crabs with the net pulling that in.
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: And you know, were you catching crabs to eat or
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: were you just catch them to catch them? Yep, No,
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: I would catch them blue crabs to eat. I would
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: only take one claw off and then let them go.
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: So uh yeah, because I wanted to catch them again.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: Oh so you would take one cloth to eat that
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: and then you'd let the rest of them go. Let
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: the rest of them go, because I was kind of
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: keeping them catching them behind my house, so I wanted
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: to keep a population. I felt like that's what it
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: was a good thing to do. So yeah, you'd catch
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: the same ones again a and then heaps of fishing.
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: I liked both fishing a lot. But I would also
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: bike down to the beach and go tarpen, try to
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: get tarpen or snook in the morning before school. And yeah, yes,
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: so I was what we were chatting about. And I'm
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: curious your take on this that it's I love that
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: Tim gave you that responsibility and trusted you, because I
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: feel like if you were going to create a young
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: woman who loves the outdoors, who is going to just
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: all of a sudden to end up in freaking New
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: Zealand guiding hunters. That might be the blueprint for it. Yeah, definitely.
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: I mean I think it really helped my confidence that
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: I could just go out and do things by myself
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: because I was always allowed to and encouraged to. So um,
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: that really gave me the mindset where, oh, it's not
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: scary to get to a new place. And I'd never
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: hunted out of the state of Florida before I started guiding,
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: so and then I've been in New Zealand and guided
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: in Wyoming. Had never hunted ELP before, but it was
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: guiding there, so um, and had a bit of an
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: experience in Canada and I got my bees assorted. So
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: as soon as the borders open here, I can go
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: to BC and God, so that'll be good. That's incredible. Um.
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: I want to I want to ask you about the
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: New Zealand stuff, but I want to back up one second. UM.
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: I don't know if you ever pay attention to any
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: of these hunting forums or anything like that, but I
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: check into them sometimes and there's one called rock Slide
• 35:19
  Speaker 1: that's like a it's like a Western primarily a Western
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: hunting forum, and there was a thread recently on there
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: about somebody was bitching about like YouTube hunters or YouTube
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: stars or something, um giving away too many secrets and
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: explaining the like the draw process or the over the
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: counter units or how to make a drop camp happen
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: or whatever. Get like, like, please stop giving people easy information.
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: And you know, some people, you know, predictable predictably kind
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: of sided with them, and some people were like, you know,
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: not everybody grew up with a dad that taught him
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: how to do that, Like it's it's it's not a
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: bad thing that people have the right. They have good
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: information out there, and it just, you know, I kind
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: of feel like that, Like I feel very lucky how
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: I grew up, and you know I was my dad
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: took me hunting constantly and fishing constantly. Like I had
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: a very very good start to become what I am today.
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: And then I hear your story and I know your dad,
• 36:13
  Speaker 1: and I'm like, man, it's such an advantage to have
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: that growing up. It really really is, and it really
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: makes me upset. We get a lot of it in
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: New Zealand. UM very secretive and plicky in a way,
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: not welcoming to new hunters or people from different areas
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: hunting different areas, and I just think that that really
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: sucks because we're such a minority as it is, there's
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: no reason to um be more divided. And yeah, maybe
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: it's a shame when you want to go someplace and
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: there's a bunch of other people there and you've walked
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: seven hours. In New Zealand, I'm thinking you've walked seven
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: hours to get in and then someone's there. But when
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: it comes down to things, isn't it awesome that we
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: have the privilege to go hunting in it? Um, it's
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: great if more people could get into it, even though
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: it makes the woods a bit more crowded, because it's
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: going to ensure that. You know, I don't have kids,
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: and I'm not about to have kids, but one day
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: I'd like to have kids, and I want them to
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: have the opportunity. So if if we become such a
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: secretive minority, it's going to get taken away and or
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: at least made more difficult. So without question, and you know,
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: it's just the reality of what's going on right like
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: we have we have. If you look at the population
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: of humans, it's it's growing exponentially and there's more people
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: out there and they're taking up more space. And you know,
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: if you look at the average size of a like
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: the square footage of a house here in the US
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: now versus fifty years ago, it's like a thousand square
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: feed bigger or something like. I mean, we're taking up
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: more space, and so the people left who want to
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: go hunt have only so many options. And so yeah,
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: you're gonna bump into more people and that's sucks, but
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: we've got to keep people out there. Like I firmly
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: believe that we have to keep people out there, and like,
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: you can't get mad if you know, like I look
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: at how much information we have available for everything. You know,
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: like I can't. I can't do anything manly but hunting fish.
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: Like I'm if you asked me to work on a
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: car or something, I'd be like, I can't even I
• 38:18
  Speaker 1: don't know what that is. Like like I think I've
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: got a truck this two years old. I think I've
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: looked at the engine like twice, you know, like that's
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: not my jam, but there's so you know, I can
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: go on YouTube and find answers to questions like you know,
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: elect electrical work or stuff like that I can do myself.
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: I'm like, this is kind of awesome like that that
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: we have the opportunity to get information this way, and
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: the same goes for hunting, Like, yeah, I know it
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: sucks that everybody's everybody's going to Colorado to hunt elk
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: or everybody wants to get that Iowa white tail tag
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: now and they can figure out very easily how to
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: go through the process of getting into the game and
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: playing the game. But at the same time, like man
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: if it keeps people around and gets that fire burning
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: and they want to be passionate and users who love
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: this stuff like I want to open the door. Well,
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: and the other cool thing is it's really an opportunity
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: to help educate people to become more considerate hunters, and
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: uh it's those platforms to share information and share good information.
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: Is also a platform to share, um, how we'd like
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: to see the future of hunting going and get build
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: people's mindsets to uh think more about conservation and management
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: of the areas and also consideration for other hunters. So yeah,
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: well that's you know, that's one of the big arguments,
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: right is you know you can you can give people
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: all the information to go on their first ALCN or
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: the first traveling white tail hunt. But you're not gonna
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: give them any you know, any of the ethics do
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: you think they should have or they're not going to
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: just know some of these unwritten rules that you and
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: I follow because we've were raised in this. And I
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: look at that and I go, Yeah, a lot of
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: people are out there and they do things that other
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: people think are stupid. Like that's that's where are like
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: the touch points between us and other hunters, like in
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: person or on platforms like this. I think that's where
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: this stuff matters, you know, because there are people that
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: just there's some people who are assholes, right, they're gonna
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: just do what they want. But a lot of people
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: just don't know, Like they don't know that you don't
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: park right in front of the trail ahead and walk
• 40:16
  Speaker 1: out like there, you know. I mean, if you want to,
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: if you want to see people do stupid stuff that
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: just aren't thinking about other people, go to any random
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: public boat access on July fourth weekend, you know what
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: I mean. Like you will see infuriating behavior. And some
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: of it is these people are clueless, and some of
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: it is they just don't know any better, Like maybe
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: they got their first boat and they've never done this before,
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: and so it's like kind of up to us to
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: just be like, we gotta little police our own a
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: little bit and just kind of usher them in the
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: right direction or what we hope is the right direction. Yea.
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: And maybe maybe I'm a little bit naive, but I
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: think most people just don't know. Like if they knew,
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: they would want to be a bit more considerate about things.
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: So at least that's what I choose to believe. So
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: I think you're right, and I really think, you know,
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: it's so easy. It's so easy to go into hunting,
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: you know, whether whether it's white tail or whatever, and
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: expect something bad to happen, you know, Like this is
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: what happens in public land a lot as people go
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: out and they're just thinking, well, you know, somebody's going
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: to ruin my hunt, or it's not gonna be any
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: good because there's been a bunch of idiots out here,
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: and so they don't hunt the way they should, and
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: it's sort of a self fulfilling prophecy. Or if you know,
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: you pull up there and there are two or three
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: other trucks in the parking area, it's you get into
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: a bad headspace and you're not gonna hunt the way
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: you need to. It doesn't do you any good, like
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: you know, and it those just this is so random.
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: But I've I've had a dog training buddy who I
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: had on my other podcast, and he was awesome, but
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: he was a hothead. He has a he has a
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: cabin and a lake up by where we're at. And
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: he passed away last year right before duck season. And
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: when I got the text, I texted, you know, the
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: person back and I was like, was it a Was
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: it a heart attack? And she said yeah, And I
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: was like yeah, because he was running so hot and
• 42:01
  Speaker 1: so angry over so much little stuff that you know,
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: and I'm not a doctor, right, there's probably a million
• 42:07
  Speaker 1: reasons why you had a heart attack. But when you
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: see that, it's like, it really wasn't worth it to
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: live that way. And he wasn't that old. And so
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: I see some of these people get so worked up
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: over this, and like, like you said, hunting is a
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: freaking gift, Like it's we could lose this ship at
• 42:21
  Speaker 1: any moment, and you know, the opportunity to live a
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: life like your living, and the opportunity to live a
• 42:27
  Speaker 1: life like I'm living or just have it be your escape.
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: That's there's only so many generations left and that's going
• 42:32
  Speaker 1: to be gone, Like we should really learn to appreciate
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: it exactly. No, I can't. Couldn't agree more with that.
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: And I see probably because I grew up more on
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: the private land side of things. I do, like most
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: of my hunting heres on public land. But I see
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: it a lot with fishing. So growing up in Florida
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: on fishing spots, you get people there up set coming
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: in and it's just really not worth it. Well, I know,
• 42:58
  Speaker 1: and it's it's weird, right because it's not like there
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: aren't lots of places to fish and you know, but
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: down there and people get very territorial and I get it,
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: but it's just it's the same thing again, like you know,
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: we we we were talking about before this podcast that
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: everybody has a freaking boat now and everybody has the
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: ability to go out and buy like a decent garment
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: unit or something they can find. I mean, you can
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: get a five dollar app on your phone and find
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: every every structure underneath the water on any lake you want.
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's the information is out there, so you
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: gotta go. Okay, Well, am I gonna mind to do
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: something different? Am I to get up earlier? Am I
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: gonna fish a little different strategy, a little tap like
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: change my tactics. What are you gonna do to just
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: make up for the fact that everybody has the same information.
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: There's more people out there? Yeah, yeah, instead of just
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: getting just redlining and it's screaming, shaking your fist at
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: the sky. Uh, what's what's what's it like down in
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: New Zealand right now? Or is what's what's the coronavirus
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: situation down there? Oh, we don't have COVID here, but
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: we also don't have very many vaccines, so just some
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: of the older folks are able to get vaccines now
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: I mean sorry, I mean like, what what's the tourist situation?
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: Can you get in or not? No? So the borders
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: were open with Australia, but I think they're closed now,
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: at least from Sydney they're closed. And yeah, um, so
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: we're just we just have Kiwi clients, which is really good.
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: I think. Uh, myself and my boss are the only
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: two hunting guides that I know of that are still
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: able to be full time, so that's pretty good. So
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: you just have you have local local hunters hunting what
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: tar and red stag or what are they hunting? We're
• 44:45
  Speaker 1: mainly doing tar, just because that seems to be a
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: bit more of the market. We have a really cool
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: opportunity that we lease a private station with lots of
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: public land tops and it's up in really cool country,
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: but having the farm access up the river bed makes
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: it more accessible. Um. So it actually comes out to
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: be about the same price as flying if you want
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: to do it with a group flying in and flying
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: food and beverages in for for the time to go
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: hunt other public land tops. In this way, you don't
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: have to pay the geography in and we have a
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: really awesome hut you know, no electricity, um, but really
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: really comfortable because it's insulated with a fire. So that
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: just makes all the difference for winter hunting because it's
• 45:31
  Speaker 1: it's winter now, so the ruts just about the batar
• 45:35
  Speaker 1: is just about over, but they're still kind of high
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: up this time of year, so it's pretty fun. Before
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: before everything got shut down, what was your client base like,
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: where where were they coming from? Mainly Americans and then
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: Germans would be the second biggest Europeans, but mainly Germans
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: all right. Were they mostly rifle hunters? Yes, yeah. So
• 46:11
  Speaker 1: my boss that I worked for for the chart doesn't
• 46:14
  Speaker 1: take those hunters. He doesn't like no no, And I
• 46:18
  Speaker 1: don't blame him, Um, I don't blame him at all,
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: especially for how he works, because um, I did have
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: a client last week that killed a tar with with
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: one shot with the three but that was this whole year,
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: three shots has been the fewest shots to finish guitar
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: um just because they're so tough. They've got this big
• 46:43
  Speaker 1: main do and I think that that really takes away
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: a lot of the speed before it even gets to
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: their their thick shield. It's almost like a pig um
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: their skin. And they're just such hardy animals, so um
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: and really really big open country. So I took my
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: bow up I had in between hunts. I went further
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: up the valley to some of the public land and
• 47:08
  Speaker 1: I was going to tried to shoot guitar and I
• 47:11
  Speaker 1: chickened out because of my clients the week before having
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: so much trouble with a gun and I was finishing
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: everything with the knife, and I just just like, I'm
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: not not comfortable to playing an arrow at this animal
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: um right now. So I'm gonna, well, but not not
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: even taking the bow out. Yeah, they do. They do
• 47:31
  Speaker 1: a lot with compound bows and and I think it's
• 47:35
  Speaker 1: definitely doable with a trad bow, and um, I think
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: my dad will give it a try. But I just
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: I guess I had a bad enough week guiding with
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: having trouble killing animals, but wasn't in the right frame
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: of mind to take my bow out for him. So well,
• 47:52
  Speaker 1: that's it's so interesting to hear you say that, because
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: there's whether we whether we want to or not, we
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: internalize things. And so when you're when you're exposed to
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: that and you're guiding rifle hunters and you see them
• 48:07
  Speaker 1: that a certain animals soak up a lot of firepower,
• 48:10
  Speaker 1: a lot of lead, it's in your heart you're like,
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: I think I can get one of these with the bow,
• 48:15
  Speaker 1: but you know, like what they're capable of, and so
• 48:18
  Speaker 1: you kind of internalize that and go, I don't know
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: if this is you know, like you call yourself off
• 48:23
  Speaker 1: of that. That's interesting. Yeah, And the other thing is
• 48:26
  Speaker 1: this time of year, over the winter. Um, I mentioned
• 48:29
  Speaker 1: that they're a bit higher, so a lot of times
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: the old bulls will live down in lower scrub and
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: it's really doable for our tree hunters, but this time
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: of year when they're running, they go up to much
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: steeper country where big family mobs of nanny slipt um,
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: and they're a bit more in the open, but still
• 48:50
  Speaker 1: it's steep enough you can. You know, bow hunting still doable.
• 48:54
  Speaker 1: It's more challenging. But the worst part is re covery
• 49:00
  Speaker 1: such a real factor where you shoot an animal for
• 49:04
  Speaker 1: recovering it. And if you shoot them with a bow
• 49:07
  Speaker 1: and they go, you know, a hundred yards or two
• 49:10
  Speaker 1: hundred yards, well, are you gonna be able to get
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: to them? You have no idea where they're going to go.
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: So drop you're talking super high elevation, steep stuff, right,
• 49:19
  Speaker 1: really steep, really really steep, and you know ice this
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: time of year in snow, and yeah, there's just a
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: lot of places that you can't get to. So I
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: had a tar the other week that we shot and
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: it slid down and it hooked by its horns um
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: and we had to tie it up two shoulder cape
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: it and skin it, and then we untied it and
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: gave it one push and it just free fell. We
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: couldn't see it, and then we heard it hit something
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: and then free fall a bunch more and hit something.
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: So like that's the sort of country that we're in. Um,
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: And yeah, it makes you think before you bring a
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: bow out, that's for sure. And it's definitely doable other
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: times the year Um, after the rut by September especially,
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: old bulls are back down really low and thick, bushy
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: scrub and you just never really see them. But if
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: you you found a good area spent a lot of
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: time there, you probably get an opportunity. So does it
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: do you run into any any issues? And maybe issues
• 50:26
  Speaker 1: is the wrong word here, but you hunt with a
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: very interesting set up and you're guiding rifle hunters. Are
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: you ever just like, hey, come on, guys, why don't
• 50:35
  Speaker 1: you hunt with a real weapon or you just keep
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: your mouth shut and take your tips and just let
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: it go. Yeah, yeah, I definitely definitely keep my mouth shutting,
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: definitely take my tips. That sounds bad, But in your head,
• 50:47
  Speaker 1: are you like, come on, guys cuiping in such pansies
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: and hunt with a real weapon. No, Because it's such
• 50:52
  Speaker 1: a challenge in its own way, and everybody has their
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: different Um, what's a challenge for them and what they
• 50:59
  Speaker 1: enjoy doing. I um have been doing because I've been
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: guiding so many of these and it's a real social hunt.
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: These tops hunts I call like adventure hunting versus I
• 51:12
  Speaker 1: think the bush stocking and the still hunting with the
• 51:14
  Speaker 1: bow is a lot Well, obviously it's not something you
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: can do with two people, really, I don't think, And
• 51:21
  Speaker 1: it's yeah, you're very in the moment versus on these
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: big walks you're spending a lot of time just covering
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: ground where you're not really worried about your movement and
• 51:30
  Speaker 1: things and you can talk and um, it's more the
• 51:33
  Speaker 1: challenges of the train in the country. So if that's
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: what people are after, it's an awesome challenge in itself.
• 51:41
  Speaker 1: It's just a different sort of hunting. It's kind of like,
• 51:44
  Speaker 1: you know, I don't know if I said this on
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: the other podcast, because I tell quite a few people
• 51:48
  Speaker 1: this hunting is like saying that you play a sport
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: with a ball, you know, are you playing pool or
• 51:54
  Speaker 1: are you playing football? Like, yeah, it's it's pretty different,
• 51:59
  Speaker 1: so different ways to go about it. Let's let's talk
• 52:02
  Speaker 1: about your bow choice. Okay, well I have it here.
• 52:06
  Speaker 1: It's not strong, so it's um made with more like
• 52:13
  Speaker 1: it has fiberglass and modern day materials. But it's a
• 52:18
  Speaker 1: Turkish hornbow style, So which is West Asian recurve. It's
• 52:24
  Speaker 1: a West Asian recurve, a mounted Dartrey bow. So this
• 52:27
  Speaker 1: is new since the last one. This one's I think
• 52:30
  Speaker 1: sixty two pounds um, so it's a bit. I had
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: another one made that was another ten pounds stronger, just
• 52:38
  Speaker 1: for New Zealand game. And what you say, it's it's
• 52:43
  Speaker 1: a West West Asian or Western Asian. What did you say?
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: It was? Yep, a West Asian recurve kind of is
• 52:49
  Speaker 1: the model of it, good girl. And it's a mounted
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: bow and you keep saying that now our listeners don't
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: know what that means. Yes, okay, So I used to
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: do a sport called mounted archery. So it's where you're
• 53:01
  Speaker 1: running on a horse shooting targets um pretty close ten
• 53:05
  Speaker 1: fifteen yards away, and you hold a bunch of arrows
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: in your hand and you shoot quickly because you're moving
• 53:13
  Speaker 1: by a target. And I just love that that point
• 53:17
  Speaker 1: and shoot style, and it feels so natural and it's
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: something that you don't have to think about. You don't
• 53:22
  Speaker 1: have to think about the animals movement as much getting
• 53:25
  Speaker 1: a still shot with them, you don't have to think
• 53:26
  Speaker 1: about your movement. I think I mentioned on another podcast
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: with you, Um I shot a turkey that was I
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: was moving and it was moving, so um that was cool.
• 53:37
  Speaker 1: It's just your mind takes in all that and you
• 53:41
  Speaker 1: don't have to think about it when you shoot. This
• 53:44
  Speaker 1: is like like shotgunning for birds, right, there's a lot
• 53:48
  Speaker 1: of that. You just do it enough. It's true instinctive shooting.
• 53:52
  Speaker 1: And so this this mounted recurve that you're talking about,
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: what what does it measure? Tip to tip? First, I
• 54:00
  Speaker 1: know you're showing it to me, but the people can't,
• 54:02
  Speaker 1: you know. I'm just trying to trying to think. Would
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: that be like three three? It's pretty short, yeah, so
• 54:10
  Speaker 1: not it wouldn't be as long as it would be
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: about from my tip of my fingers to about my drawing,
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: I'd say really short. Similar and and designed. You know,
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: the history of those bows is shooting them from horseback.
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: And you know you said that you did this as
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: a you know, as a sport, but it's really really
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: a unique choice. There's probably what you and about seven
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: other people who hunt with these. Yeah, and it's it's
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: really got its challenges. I think the biggest one that
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: I'm finding is my distance. I'm just not comfortable taking
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: longer shots, and I think a lot of that is
• 54:51
  Speaker 1: also my um desire to really make an ethical shot.
• 54:59
  Speaker 1: And coupled with that, I'm shooting a really heavy broad
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: head with a stiff arrow, much stiffer than you would
• 55:06
  Speaker 1: for my poundage of a bow. Because of that heavy
• 55:09
  Speaker 1: broad head head, are you shooting it's two grain because
• 55:14
  Speaker 1: it's a hundred with a still insert so um and
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: so you have no problems with front of center. You
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: get you got a plenty of weight up there. Yep, yep,
• 55:26
  Speaker 1: exactly so, but it's just loses speed really quickly. So
• 55:32
  Speaker 1: and just because it's such a short bow and I'm
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: not shooting with a mechanical release. I use a thumb
• 55:40
  Speaker 1: instead of three fingers because it's only one point of contact,
• 55:43
  Speaker 1: but it's still uh little differences and it's a really
• 55:49
  Speaker 1: light bow. So that stability problem to like my problem
• 55:53
  Speaker 1: shooting because I record myself when I'm shooting and I
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: look at it, it's all from my left hand holding
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: the bow too tightly. Pretty much all my problems um
• 56:02
  Speaker 1: when I'm practicing at home come from that. And so
• 56:06
  Speaker 1: what I'm saying is that little differences have a lot
• 56:09
  Speaker 1: bigger impact because it's light and because it's short. So
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: you have issues because you you don't hold this. You know,
• 56:17
  Speaker 1: when we when we talk about compound shooting, we talk
• 56:19
  Speaker 1: about you know, grip what you're talking about and introducing
• 56:23
  Speaker 1: some torque in there, you know, by by gripping it
• 56:25
  Speaker 1: too tightly. But also you know, we've got bubble levels
• 56:29
  Speaker 1: and we've got multiple you know, anchor point We've got
• 56:32
  Speaker 1: we've got different points of reference to show us we're
• 56:35
  Speaker 1: holding this thing the same exact way every time. But
• 56:37
  Speaker 1: you're not doing that with these bows, right Like, there's no,
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: it's not consistent that way, right No. And I'm probably
• 56:44
  Speaker 1: getting a bit more consistent because i haven't been practicing
• 56:48
  Speaker 1: from a horse. I've been practicing a lot of stationary
• 56:51
  Speaker 1: stuff for hunting, and I've been practicing, um, actually holding
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: my draw, just getting prepared for different shot that I
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: might need to take a bit more. But it's still
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: it's still not stationary against myself. It's still a floating rest.
• 57:07
  Speaker 1: So but I am trying to be more consistent with
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: that floating rest and Um, the biggest thing that I
• 57:14
  Speaker 1: do that helps me is to do that little bit
• 57:17
  Speaker 1: of a what we talked about with the male arrow,
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: the positive pull through and push through, and that little
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: bit of movement for me at the shot helps to
• 57:28
  Speaker 1: keep my release more consistent and crisper. So those are
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: some of the things I've been working with. So you
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: you said, you know, compounds way too easy. Rifle is
• 57:42
  Speaker 1: obviously way too easy. Traditional normal, traditional archie way too easy.
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: You're going to shoot a bowl that is designed to
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: be shot off horseback, but you're gonna shoot it in
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: all of your different sneaking around, hunting down in New
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: Zealand everywhere else. What's what's your range with that sucker? Yeah?
• 57:59
  Speaker 1: Right now, I'm me myself to ten yards, okay, yeah,
• 58:03
  Speaker 1: and that's so I might be pushed out to fifteen
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: yards and I have shot things at fifteen yards and
• 58:10
  Speaker 1: even over twenty yards with the old bow. But um,
• 58:14
  Speaker 1: it's just what I've decided to tell myself now, Um,
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: is I'd like to try to get ten yards from
• 58:22
  Speaker 1: the animal and your what did you call it? Bush creeping?
• 58:26
  Speaker 1: What was the word you said? I'm still hunting pretty much,
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: so you're bush stocking a variety. You know. That's the
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: cool thing about New Zealand is a variety animals to
• 58:37
  Speaker 1: hunt down there, and you're trying to get within ten
• 58:40
  Speaker 1: yards of them to shoot them with this bow. Yeah,
• 58:43
  Speaker 1: that's just they're big animals and it's a little bow,
• 58:47
  Speaker 1: and I want to make sure I take the best
• 58:51
  Speaker 1: shot that I can. Yeah, so yeah, yeah, it's it's
• 58:56
  Speaker 1: it's really cool. I mean and want to ask you.
• 59:00
  Speaker 1: I know this, this has come up a lot in
• 59:02
  Speaker 1: other places, and I know Rogan's pushing this book, but
• 59:04
  Speaker 1: I just finished this, this book, Empire of the Summer Moon,
• 59:07
  Speaker 1: about the Comanches, and you know there their whole thing,
• 59:13
  Speaker 1: you know, when they really took off was they figured
• 59:15
  Speaker 1: out how to shoot from a horseback, and they figured
• 59:17
  Speaker 1: out how to shoot rapid fire, and it shoots from
• 59:20
  Speaker 1: a position where they were shooting under the horse's neck
• 59:22
  Speaker 1: at full speed with a with a fistful of arrows,
• 59:25
  Speaker 1: you know, kind of like Semiato style. And I don't
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: know this, I should have looked this up beforehand, but
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: I have to assume their bows were probably they probably
• 59:34
  Speaker 1: were built similarly to what you're shooting. Do you do
• 59:36
  Speaker 1: you know, I do not know, I believe that they're
• 59:40
  Speaker 1: a bit longer. Um, just I think that in North
• 59:46
  Speaker 1: America we shot longer bows versus this Asian style is
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: a bit a bit shorter, and that would help with
• 59:53
  Speaker 1: distance and um stability and everything as well for them.
• 59:57
  Speaker 1: So I'd have to look up what they were shooting
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: to know for sure. I even know the Japanese mounted
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 1: archer shoot really really long both. So, um, there's there's
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 1: quite a few different designs that were made to be
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: shot off horses. But why did this, Why did your
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: just the design of the bows you shoot, why did
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 1: they get so short? Then? Um, I'm not sure why.
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 1: To be honest, I think that just they're a lot
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 1: easier to handle on a horse. So the Mongolians and um,
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 1: everything did everything from horseback, so they probably wanted something
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 1: that was just easy on the horse. Huh. It's it's
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 1: interesting anybody who's listening to this, who's like, I have
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: no idea what the hell they're talking about. You're just
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 1: gonna look them up, Just just just go to YouTube
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 1: look them up, because it's it's it doesn't look like
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 1: the kind of thing that you could possibly shoot well,
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 1: and yet people do. Yeah, yeah, people shoot them amazingly well,
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 1: and when I was shooting a lot practicing. My dad
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 1: and I play archery golf when I'm home. So what
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 1: we do is we tie a bottle cap hanging from
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 1: like a bush, so it's like a bottle cap by
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 1: a piece of floss in the wind. It's kind of
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: a hard target to shoot, and you know, you can
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 1: get consistently where you're hitting something like that with these bows, um,
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 1: which is pretty cool. How often do you target practice?
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 1: I mean, how often do you shoot when when I
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: am really seriously hunting with it, I probably am shooting
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 1: and try to shoot like three times a day. Like
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: when I was in school, I shooted in the morning
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 1: before classes, you know, after class again before bed, at
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 1: least three like sessions of shooting. And right now it's
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 1: I'm pretty bad about it because I've been well, I
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 1: just got back yesterday from a hunt, so I've been
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 1: in the bush, um, working and guiding. And it's not
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 1: something like even if I did have a second where
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: I wasn't doing a chore, doing a job or trying
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: to headskin things or get things ready. Um, I kind
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 1: of have to be social, Like I can't just go
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 1: off by myself and practice shooting. So um, I haven't
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 1: been practicing as much lately. Yeah, well, I mean you
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 1: gotta work, Yeah, I gotta work. I mean, yeah, we're
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 1: opposite seasons to y'all. So this is our busy season
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 1: was from March until and it's still going given a
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 1: bit of the law. But so, how how come you
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 1: haven't hunted the white tails down there in New Zealand yet? Yeah?
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 1: Good question and just laziness on my part. So the
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 1: hunting the white tails isn't the really big draw to
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 1: me because there's so many cool species here that I
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 1: haven't shot or hunted and that I would love to
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: hunt with a bow. Um, and probably it's much more
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 1: accessible areas for where I live because there's only two
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 1: populations of white tail in New Zealand and the one
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 1: that I would really like to hunt on Stewart Island.
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: Uh requires a boat to get there and you have
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 1: to book the blocks about a year ahead of time.
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 1: So it's a bit of planning and a lot of
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 1: my work is pretty last minute right now with KIWI,
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 1: so I have to keep a pretty open schedule. But
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 1: I do I need to go down there and do it,
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 1: because not not for shooting the white Tail, but the experience.
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 1: Like I'm one of those people I'm kind of bad
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 1: at just going in sight seeing. I'm not a hiker.
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 1: I love hiking with a weapon or even a camera
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 1: in my hand, but I like having the purpose. So
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 1: white Tail would give me the purpose to get down
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 1: into a really really spectacular part of New Zealand and
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 1: a place that I'd like to see and spend time in. Um,
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 1: whether or not I shoot anything. But so you haven't
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 1: been down there where? Nope? No, how did How did
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 1: the white Tails get there? So Theodore Roosevelt? Yeah, Um,
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 1: Theodore Roosevelt actually gifted them to New Zealand, So that's
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 1: pretty cool. In the early nineteen o four or five,
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 1: and he gave twenty two that were trapped in snow
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 1: in Missouri, I think, um put him on a boat
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 1: and eighteen of them made it, which is pretty cool
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 1: because that's before the Panama Canal, so they had to
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 1: go along. Um. Yeah, they took a real ride and
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 1: they came into the South part of New Zealand and
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 1: nine of them, um so two bucks and the rest
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 1: seven does two bucks on Stewart Island and two bucks
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 1: and seven does on um Lake what what something anyway,
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 1: where the other herd is up up towards actually where
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 1: I live, um, but that herds a little bit less
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 1: accessible because a lot of it's on private land and
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 1: the public land is super super bluffy, and while there
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 1: are white tails still there, it's um not as ideal
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 1: as the private land around it for them to live.
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: So there's more that are on those private blocks. So
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 1: those all, all of the white tails down there in
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 1: New Zealand are descendants from that the gift from Teddy. Yeah. Yeah,
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 1: And I haven't hunted them, but I've heard from people
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 1: that you can really see like similar traits on the
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 1: left side. They don't have p fort I can't remember,
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 1: but you can see some like huge similarities in the
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: racks because they all came from those nine deer that
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: were in that area, and the populations have taken off.
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 1: They're huge, especially done in Stewart Island. The hunting pressure
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 1: from recreational hunters doesn't really seem to be enough to
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: keep the population in check because there's no native predators
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 1: there anything. So they do quite a bit with professional
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: callers and it's not the target of the Tenadie drops,
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 1: but they do do aerial Tenadie, which is a poison
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 1: drops for possums and predators Pastewart Islands and island. It's
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 1: pretty pristine. They have an awesome Kiwi bird population so
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 1: that you can even see kiwi's out in the day,
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 1: which is a big thing for New Zealand. They're really
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 1: threatened so to protect it, let's let's pretend like you're
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 1: talking to some idiot from Minnesota who has no idea
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 1: what you're talking about. So you have an island down
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 1: there has a population of white tails on it, but
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 1: also has invasive possums, right, and they're dropping poison on
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 1: the possums and that's killing some of the deer. Yep,
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 1: so the deer will eat the Tenadie as well. So
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 1: it's some thing that they're not really worried about because
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 1: they're they're paying people to call them to shoot them
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 1: as well, um to keep the population in check because
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 1: it's a pretty pristine environment. It's really uh. For as
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 1: big as the island is, it's fairly untouched by humans
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 1: and they've got some really awesome plant species and bird
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 1: species that don't exist in any place else. So they do.
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 1: Actually the white tail population in New Zealand is probably
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 1: studied more than any of the other Dear, I don't
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 1: want to say that for sure, but it's really well
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 1: studied because they want to determine their effect on the
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 1: native vegetation as as their browsing and things. So they
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 1: have a number that they've determined as like acceptable to
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 1: be there, and they use other means, um, commercial shooting,
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 1: professional shooting to help keep that number where they want it.
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 1: Just without predators. It's completely different, dear, Dear, pest here.
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 1: So there's like, if you look up online, you can
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 1: read a lot about how to effectively hunt, because it's
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 1: all how to effectively manage pest species. But it will
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 1: tell you tapes of information about what they're eating and
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 1: where they are, what times of year and on that
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 1: island down there there's public land there. Yeah, so it's
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 1: all public land. Um, it's just you have to book
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 1: your block and it's like booked out a year ahead
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 1: of time. It's a pretty popular thing for kiwi's to
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 1: go down and do a kiwi not the birds, the
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: people than New Zealanders. So um, they love it. It's
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 1: really like Sportsman's well in New Zealand. All New Zealand's
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 1: kind of like a sportsman's paradise. But the diving is
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 1: just exceptional, the fishing is just exceptional, and then you
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 1: have the opportunity to hunt a species that you can't
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 1: hunt other places in New Zealand. So it's a pretty
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 1: big draw. And has anybody ever go in bow hunt him?
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 1: Or is it mostly rifle? No? No, quite a quite
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 1: a few. The compound bow um is becoming a much
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 1: bigger thing here in New Zealand than it was, and
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 1: it's it's ideal country for bow hunting anyway, because it's
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 1: a lot of bush. Most of the deer shot within
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 1: like a hundreds of the coast, so a lot of
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 1: deer shot. Probably most of the deer would actually be
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 1: shot on the beach because they come out and they
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 1: eat the seaweed on the shore. The white tail do there.
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, how big did they get down there?
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 1: Do you know? Um? They're pretty small, I think similar
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 1: size to Florida, So like maybe a hundred and twenty
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 1: for a buck and eighty pounds for dough sort of yeah,
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 1: pretty little, Yeah, pretty small, And same thing with the racks,
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 1: like anything that scored over a hundred would just be
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 1: a golly wamper a monster? Is that a New Zealand word. No.
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 1: We had one client like three years ago where I
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 1: work that he's from the States and he called things
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 1: golly woffers, and my boss and I just keep on
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 1: using it as a joke. So it's become one of
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 1: those things that you use enough as a joke and
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 1: now you actually say it. So I love that. So
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 1: when are you going to get down there and hunt
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 1: those deer on the island? And good question, Well, um,
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 1: depends how long the border stay close, because I would
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 1: like to. I would have liked to have gone to
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 1: Canada for this season, but a bit of a tricky
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 1: situation travel wise. I won't have very much work at
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 1: all over the spring in the summer, so that might
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 1: be a good opportunity, even though things will be cast then.
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 1: But just to do some hunting for a dough with
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 1: my bow myself, that would be pretty cool. And having
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: no seasons here makes it so accessible. Um. I have
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 1: enough friends that maybe somebody will have a block booked
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 1: and I could go on a trip with someone. If not,
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 1: I'll have to plan a bit in advance to get
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 1: a block. So the hunting down there there's public land,
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 1: but you've got to reserve your spot. And is it
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 1: you know, it's it's big country. Is there are you
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 1: doing like kind of a uh, you know, backcountry bavy
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 1: type hunting camping out there? How how are you like logistically,
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 1: how do you go about it? Okay, So there's a
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 1: bunch of different ways, and I have hunted a bunch
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 1: of different ways. So for the Stewart Island, for the
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 1: white Tail, you book your block and they have huts.
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 1: They have a hut there. Um, you can bring a
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 1: tent as well because I'm not sure how many bunks
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 1: are in the hut. And normally you would come in
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 1: with your friends. It's like a fairly big party. And
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 1: then you all go to different sections so you're not
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 1: hunting over each other. Um, and you know the end reaches.
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 1: But even on your phone you can get maps so
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 1: you can know the boundaries of where you're hunting without
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 1: intruding on other parties and things. So that's really important
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 1: to make sure that you know where you can hunt
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 1: and where where you're intruding on somebody else. Um. But
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 1: like I said, the coastline is where a lot of
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 1: it's happening there. But it's really comfortable because the weather
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 1: gets pretty bad. You're off an island, off the south
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 1: tip of the South Island, so you're getting it's not Arctic,
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 1: but you're getting towards there, so it can be pretty
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 1: bad weather sometimes. Um, and the white tail don't like
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 1: the wind and the nasty weather at Allso, um, when
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 1: do they run down there? Do you know? Yeah? I
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 1: do know. So they'll start the end of April, but
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 1: through May all the way to the end of May. June. Yeah,
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 1: it's a different time of year anyway. Anyway, you can
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 1: get the government down there to open up those borders.
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 1: We can come down and yeah, crazy next year, they
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 1: need to pass out the vaccines before. I think they're
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 1: gonna let the borders open just but we'll see, we'll see.
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 1: We're hoping. I mean, our industry might work really relies
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 1: heavily on the borders opening, so it would be great
• 1:13:09
  Speaker 1: if they could. But yeah, this is a this is
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 1: a bad situation for a lot of outfitters. I mean,
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 1: you know, the big question here is is Canada gonna open?
• 1:13:17
  Speaker 1: Canada gonna open, you know, and they rely so heavily
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 1: on American sportsmen there, and you know, in some places
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 1: from Europe too. And you know when you when you
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 1: get your business shut down for two full seasons, it's
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 1: like that's tough to weather. Yeah. Yeah. I was talking
• 1:13:33
  Speaker 1: to who I was going to be working for in
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 1: Canada about potentially coming over, and he had some Canadian clients,
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 1: but um, yeah, it's almost not worth running the camp
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 1: for what he can charge the Canadians versus the international
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 1: is a lot better. It's it's a rough deal. Uh breathe.
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 1: This has been so much fun. Um, where what's the
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 1: outfitter you work for? In case people who are listening
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 1: this can never actually get down there and go hunting,
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 1: you ever let us in? So I work for two
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 1: places where you can bow hunt. That's where I actually
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 1: live and I'm right now where I rent a house,
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 1: and that's Glendan Hunting and Fishing UM in New Zealand.
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 1: And then where I've been doing the tars for Southern
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 1: Mountain Adventures. And he doesn't like bow hunters, but if
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 1: you want to go for an epic mountain experience, he's great.
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 1: So beautiful country. Yeah awesome. Well, thank you so much
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 1: for coming on. I really appreciate it. Sweet Thanks Tony.
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 1: Great talk catching up. That's it for this week, folks.
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 1: Make sure to tune in every week for more white
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 1: tail goodness. I'm your guest host, Tony Peterson and this
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 1: has been the Wire to Hunt podcast, which is brought
• 1:14:43
  Speaker 1: to you by First Light. If you still have a
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 1: white tail itch that needs some scratching, head on over
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 1: to our wire to Hunt YouTube channel to check out
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 1: our how to videos, or go to meat Eater's YouTube
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 1: channel to watch our one Week in November series. And
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 1: if that's not enough, go to the meat eater dot com.
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 1: I'm slash wired and you can see a bunch of
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 1: articles from Mark myself and a whole bunch of our
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 1: valued contributors writing on all kinds of different topics related
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 1: to white tails. M