Latest / The Vault: The Epstein Files / Mother Jones Hits The BOP With A FOIA Lawsuit Due To The Ghislaine Maxwell Transfer

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Mother Jones Hits The BOP With A FOIA Lawsuit Due To The Ghislaine Maxwell Transfer · The Vault: The Epstein Files

0:00
Speaker 1: Over at Mother Jones, a journalist named Leland Nolley called
0:06
Speaker 1: every single person in Jeffrey Epstein's black book and then
0:12
Speaker 1: wrote a very detailed and very long article describing those
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Speaker 1: phone calls. So what we're going to do today is
0:22
Speaker 1: we're going to break this article down into two parts.
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Speaker 1: The first part is right here and right now. on
0:28
Speaker 1: the morning update, and then the second part will be
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Speaker 1: later on tonight on the Daily Drop. So, let's just
0:36
Speaker 1: jump right in considering how long this article is and
0:40
Speaker 1: how much we have to work through. This article, like
0:44
Speaker 1: I said, Mother Jones. Headline, I called everyone in Jeffrey
0:49
Speaker 1: Epstein's Little Black Book. What I learned about rich people, conspiracy, genius, Ghislaine,
0:56
Speaker 1: stand-up comedy... And evil from 2,000 phone calls. And the author, again,
1:04
Speaker 1: is Leland Nolley. And a tip of the cap to
1:07
Speaker 1: Leland for this article. This is an in-depth article. Very,
1:11
Speaker 1: very large article. And he obviously did a lot of work. 2,000
1:16
Speaker 1: phone calls. That's just... It's like a nightmare for me.
1:19
Speaker 1: I can't imagine sitting around making 2,000 phone calls. But
1:23
Speaker 1: I'll tell you, this is an interesting... subject and an
1:26
Speaker 1: interesting way to go about the investigation why not get
1:30
Speaker 1: right down to it and call some of the people
1:33
Speaker 1: in this book and that's exactly what this author did
1:36
Speaker 1: and a tip of the hat to you Leland good
1:39
Speaker 1: job buddy Jeffrey Epstein's little black book is one of
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Speaker 1: the most cursed documents ever compiled in this miserable dying
1:48
Speaker 1: country and Yeah, hey, he's not wrong about that, right?
1:51
Speaker 1: Pax Americana ended the day those planes hit the buildings.
1:57
Speaker 1: And it's just gotten worse progressively since then. And, I mean, honestly,
2:03
Speaker 1: it looks like a country that's in its dying throes
2:06
Speaker 1: right now, America. It's embarrassing. What's going on in the
2:10
Speaker 1: streets is embarrassing. The way people conduct themselves is embarrassing.
2:16
Speaker 1: It's just an absolute shitshow all the way around. and
2:19
Speaker 1: then you add on the little black book, and boy,
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Speaker 1: oh boy, that definitely is one of the worst of
2:25
Speaker 1: the worst documents ever compiled, right? Totaling 97 pages and
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Speaker 1: containing the names, numbers, and addresses of a considerable cross-section
2:35
Speaker 1: of the global elite, Epstein's personal contact book first turned
2:39
Speaker 1: up in a courtroom in 2009 after his former butler,
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Speaker 1: Alfredo Rodriguez... tried to sell it to lawyers representing Epstein's
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Speaker 1: survivors for $ 50, 000. Rodriguez described the book, apparently assembled by
2:56
Speaker 1: Epstein's employees as the Holy Grail. Yeah, look, but, you know, again,
3:00
Speaker 1: I've always wondered, was it really Epstein's book anyway? How
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Speaker 1: much of it was Ghislaine's? How much did Ghislaine have
3:08
Speaker 1: to do with the book? You know, she was in
3:10
Speaker 1: charge of a lot of the social... situations, right? Now,
3:14
Speaker 1: don't get me wrong, I'm sure Epstein was penning names
3:17
Speaker 1: in that book as well, but I bet you Ghislaine
3:19
Speaker 1: had just as much access to it, and, you know,
3:22
Speaker 1: she was in charge of the Rolodex, and let's remember, folks,
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Speaker 1: she had a leadership role. So, I'm guessing that we
3:29
Speaker 1: should be calling this the Maxwell-Epstein Black Book. Rodriguez described
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Speaker 1: the book, apparently assembled by Epstein's employees, as the Holy Grail.
3:41
Speaker 1: It is annotated with cryptic, Marginalia, stars next to certain entries,
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Speaker 1: arrows pointing towards others, and the names of at least
3:49
Speaker 1: 38 people are circled for reasons that aren't totally clear.
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Speaker 1: There are 1,571 names in all, with roughly 5,000 phone
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Speaker 1: numbers and thousands of emails and home addresses. There are celebrities,
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Speaker 1: princes and princesses, high-profile scientists, artists from all over the world,
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Speaker 1: all along, all alongside some of the world's most powerful
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Speaker 1: oligarchs and political leaders. People like Prince Andrew, Ehud Barak,
4:22
Speaker 1: and Donald Trump. And the fact that Epstein not only
4:28
Speaker 1: was palling around with these people at so-called events, like
4:32
Speaker 1: they said, right? Oh, we were just at parties together. Well,
4:34
Speaker 1: you were close enough that your names were in the book, right?
4:38
Speaker 1: So let's not act like, you know, the marathon defense
4:42
Speaker 1: is going to work here, folks. We have some questions and,
4:46
Speaker 1: you know, some answers are probably a good idea. And
4:51
Speaker 1: what the author of the article did here was really
4:54
Speaker 1: good work, right? He said, you know what? The hell
4:56
Speaker 1: with the nonsense. I'm going to go directly to these people.
4:59
Speaker 1: I'm going to make these phone calls and we'll see
5:00
Speaker 1: what's what. Rodriguez was Epstein's butler at his Palm Beach
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Speaker 1: mansion for many years. He was intimately familiar with his
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Speaker 1: boss's sexual proclivities. He claimed to have seen nude underage
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Speaker 1: girls at Epstein's pool, said that he would routinely wipe
5:17
Speaker 1: down and stow away sex toys in Epstein's room after massages,
5:22
Speaker 1: and alleged that he saw child pornography on Epstein's personal computer.
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Speaker 1: And he's not the only one who has said that, right?
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Speaker 1: We have heard that from multiple people about the child pornography.
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Speaker 1: and the lewd pictures of young children, and the artwork,
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Speaker 1: and just the whole entire weird-ass vibe that a normal
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Speaker 1: person would see, and feel, and be like, what in
5:45
Speaker 1: the is going on here? That's why when all of
5:49
Speaker 1: these people try and have these excuses of, I had
5:52
Speaker 1: no idea what was going on. I really had no idea.
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Speaker 1: You know, it wasn't that weird. I never saw any
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Speaker 1: underage girls All the other shit wasn't weird enough for you, bro,
6:01
Speaker 1: to make you question what in the F was going
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Speaker 1: on in this place? I mean, come on. In 2011,
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Speaker 1: Rodriguez was sentenced to 18 months in prison for having
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Speaker 1: tried to sell the book to an undercover agent after
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Speaker 1: failing to notify investigators about its existence. How about that, huh?
6:22
Speaker 1: Rodriguez got more time in prison, remember, than Jeffrey Epstein
6:25
Speaker 1: for trying to sell this book. It just shows you
6:28
Speaker 1: how skewed everything is when it comes to this Jeffrey
6:32
Speaker 1: Epstein case and the way prosecution has went about going
6:38
Speaker 1: after these people historically, right? We've seen some changes lately
6:42
Speaker 1: after people have just had enough and demanded justice. But previously,
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Speaker 1: it was an absolute shitshow. How does Rodriguez... Get 18
6:52
Speaker 1: more months. I mean, get 18 months when Epstein only
6:55
Speaker 1: gets 13. It just shows you the Department of Just
7:00
Speaker 1: Us and the failure of those who are part of
7:03
Speaker 1: the institution. It just shows you how much their failure
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Speaker 1: affects everything. Their inability to effectively manage the Justice Department
7:17
Speaker 1: has such long-ranging consequences. Rodriguez said in court that the
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Speaker 1: book was insurance against Epstein who wanted him to disappear.
7:28
Speaker 1: Rodriguez died of mesothelioma shortly after serving his sentence. The
7:35
Speaker 1: public first became aware of the book in 2015 when
7:38
Speaker 1: the now defunct website Gawker published a version of Rodriguez's
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Speaker 1: copy revealing for the first time just how ludicrously connected
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Speaker 1: Epstein was to the people who run the world. And
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Speaker 1: that's not even hyperbole. right, by the author. That's not
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Speaker 1: even hyperbole. These are the people who run the world.
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Speaker 1: We've been through them a million times here. All of
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Speaker 1: the bankers, all of the power players in politics, all
8:03
Speaker 1: of these people combined are the people that literally run
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Speaker 1: the world. They make the laws. They give out the loans.
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Speaker 1: They decide who is going to qualify for a house
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Speaker 1: or for a car, right? They're the ones. that are
8:21
Speaker 1: in charge of all of that. These are the people
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Speaker 1: that are pulling all of the strings. These are the
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Speaker 1: people that are in charge. Gawker's file showed only names.
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Speaker 1: Attached phone numbers and emails were blacked out. Shortly before
8:37
Speaker 1: Epstein's mysterious death in August 2019 in his cell at
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Speaker 1: the Manhattan Correctional Facility, an unredacted version of the book
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Speaker 1: popped up on some dark corners of the internet. with
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Speaker 1: almost every phone number, email, and home address entirely visible.
8:54
Speaker 1: And I got my hands on a copy. So again,
8:58
Speaker 1: this is real investigative work, right? This is the sort
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Speaker 1: of work that investigators and journalists should be doing, especially
9:05
Speaker 1: in a case like this, and we have not seen
9:08
Speaker 1: enough of it. Like I've said from the beginning, I'm
9:12
Speaker 1: not a journalist like this gentleman here, right? I'm certainly not...
9:17
Speaker 1: working for one of these outlets or anything like that.
9:21
Speaker 1: But these guys who have these resources behind them, these
9:26
Speaker 1: actual journalists, they have completely abandoned this story for the
9:31
Speaker 1: most part. You've had very few real investigative journalists with
9:35
Speaker 1: resources digging in. And it's pretty disgusting, honestly, to see
9:44
Speaker 1: some of the garbage that they focus on and write
9:46
Speaker 1: about as opposed to some of the hard-hitting situations that
9:50
Speaker 1: really affect all of our lives, it's pretty pathetic to
9:55
Speaker 1: see what the 24 hour news cycle brings us on
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Speaker 1: a daily basis and then you have people like this
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Speaker 1: over here at Mother Jones who are doing great work
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Speaker 1: and you think he's going to be on any of
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Speaker 1: these shows you think Rachel Maddow is going to have
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Speaker 1: him on or Tucker Carlson or no I'm sure they
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Speaker 1: won't but they should Epstein's Little Black Book isn't little
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Speaker 1: at all it's gargantuan Its defining feature is its size
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Speaker 1: and thoroughness, and there are just as many boring numbers
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Speaker 1: as exciting ones. For every Jordanian princess, there are three
10:31
Speaker 1: reflexologists from Boca. The listings are at times preposterously detailed,
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Speaker 1: often containing additional names and numbers for people's emergency contacts,
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Speaker 1: their parents, their siblings, their friends, even their children. all
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Speaker 1: alongside hundreds of car phones, yacht phones, guest houses, and
10:51
Speaker 1: private office lines. Does that sound like somebody that you
10:54
Speaker 1: just ran into? If he has your yacht phone number,
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Speaker 1: your car phone number, your house phone number, you know,
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Speaker 1: I mean, really? That sounds like somebody who's just an acquaintance,
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Speaker 1: somebody you ran into at the bar? I mean, come on,
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Speaker 1: give me a break. This is obviously somebody that all
11:13
Speaker 1: of these people who had five, six, seven numbers in
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Speaker 1: this book, they all knew Jeffrey Epstein. And if they
11:19
Speaker 1: try and say any different, they're lying. Some individuals have
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Speaker 1: dozens of numbers and addresses listed, while others just list
11:29
Speaker 1: just a single number and a first name. Epstein collected people.
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Speaker 1: And if you ever had any interaction with him or
11:36
Speaker 1: Ghislaine Maxwell, his one-time girlfriend... and co-conspirator, you more than
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Speaker 1: likely ended up in this book. And then several years later, well,
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Speaker 1: you received a call from me. I made close to 2,000
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Speaker 1: phone calls total. I spoke to billionaires, CEOs, bankers, models, celebrities, scientists,
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Speaker 1: a Kennedy, and some of Epstein's closest friends and confidants.
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Speaker 1: That's pretty crazy, just cold calling all of these people.
12:09
Speaker 1: and having some of them talk to you is even
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Speaker 1: more batshit crazy. I think it's just a very creative
12:14
Speaker 1: way to go about it, and Leland should definitely get
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Speaker 1: some kudos here. It's a very creative way to go
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Speaker 1: about your investigation, sir. I sat on my couch and
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Speaker 1: phoned up royalty, spoke to ambassadors, irritated a senior advisor
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Speaker 1: at Blackstone, quality work, F. Blackstone, and the rest of
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Speaker 1: the party running around there, and left squeaky voicemails for
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Speaker 1: what must constitute a considerable percentage of the world oligarchy.
12:42
Speaker 1: At times, the book felt like a dark palantir giving
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Speaker 1: me glimpses of dreadful, haunted dimensions that my soft, gentle
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Speaker 1: animal being was never supposed to encounter. Yeah, look, man,
12:54
Speaker 1: when you start delving into the world of Jeffrey Epstein
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Speaker 1: and you start swimming around in the muck where he resided,
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Speaker 1: it is not a comfortable place to be. It's a
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Speaker 1: very dark and disgusting place filled with some really devious, dangerous, sick,
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Speaker 1: sick individuals. So I get it. I know what you're
13:17
Speaker 1: talking about. Seeing at close range the mundanity of Epstein
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Speaker 1: and his fellow elites, how simple and childish they could be,
13:31
Speaker 1: was a sickening experience of its own. The worst call
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Speaker 1: by far was with a woman who told me she'd
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Speaker 1: been groped by Epstein. An incident she said she didn't
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Speaker 1: report at the time out of fear of retribution from Epstein.
13:44
Speaker 1: I mean, how many times have we, you know, heard
13:48
Speaker 1: that story, right? How many times have we heard that
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Speaker 1: there would be retribution if you talked or if you
13:55
Speaker 1: snitched on Epstein or you told the authorities about what
13:59
Speaker 1: was going on? And when he was around so many
14:01
Speaker 1: powerful people, and he counted so many powerful people as
14:05
Speaker 1: his friends and his allies, well, it's one of those
14:09
Speaker 1: things where you believe him when he lays that threat, right?
14:14
Speaker 1: I have been aggressively counseled to remind the readers of
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Speaker 1: Mother Jones that an appearance in the address book is
14:19
Speaker 1: not evidence of any crime or of complicity in any
14:23
Speaker 1: crime or of knowledge of any crime. Yeah, well, that's
14:27
Speaker 1: for sure, right? No doubt about it. But still, the
14:29
Speaker 1: question remains, why are you in the book? Most of
14:33
Speaker 1: these people won't even answer that simple question, and that's
14:36
Speaker 1: why it has become an issue. If you're going to
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Speaker 1: avoid it, well, this is something that's in the public
14:42
Speaker 1: sphere now. People know about it. You can't just make
14:44
Speaker 1: pretend that you're not in this book. You can't make
14:47
Speaker 1: pretend that you didn't have a relationship with Jeffrey Epstein
14:51
Speaker 1: in some capacity. You have to explain. You're public figures.
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Speaker 1: That's part of the deal. They weren't all elites, thankfully.
15:01
Speaker 1: Sometimes I would have delightful conversations with normal people who
15:05
Speaker 1: had cleaned a car or given Epstein a facial and
15:08
Speaker 1: only shared my distaste for Epstein and his circle. Yeah, look, again,
15:13
Speaker 1: there are definitely going to be a lot of people
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Speaker 1: like that. When you're a rich billionaire or a hundred
15:19
Speaker 1: millionaire or whatever you want to call them, you're around
15:21
Speaker 1: a lot of people as far as employees, people that
15:24
Speaker 1: are going to work for you and people that might
15:27
Speaker 1: not have an intimate relationship with you, meaning people that
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Speaker 1: aren't at the mansions, people that aren't involved in procuring
15:35
Speaker 1: girls for you. You know, there's going to be plumbers, etc., etc., right?
15:42
Speaker 1: Sometimes I would call a number that had changed hands
15:44
Speaker 1: at some point since the book was compiled, and instead
15:47
Speaker 1: of reaching the governor or fashion designer I was looking for,
15:50
Speaker 1: I would end up with just a normal bloke on
15:53
Speaker 1: the line, some poor recipient of a torrent of wrong
15:56
Speaker 1: number phone calls of the worst variety imaginable. Their fate
16:00
Speaker 1: was a twisted inversion of my own. The oligarchy wouldn't
16:04
Speaker 1: stop calling them. That's crazy. I can't even imagine. Imagine
16:09
Speaker 1: having one of these phone numbers of one of these
16:13
Speaker 1: people who are in this book and, you know, they
16:15
Speaker 1: have a new number or whatever and you get the
16:18
Speaker 1: phone number in the rotation. How horrible would that be?
16:25
Speaker 1: Some highlights and lowlights from my tour of Jeffrey Epstein's
16:28
Speaker 1: Little Black Book. Remember, an appearance in the address book
16:32
Speaker 1: is not evidence of any crime or of complicity in
16:35
Speaker 1: any crime or of knowledge of any crime. Yeah, but
16:38
Speaker 1: there's still a lot of questions that need to be asked.
16:41
Speaker 1: Doug Band, longtime advisor to Bill Clinton. Called the number
16:46
Speaker 1: listed as his home number, which wound up being his
16:49
Speaker 1: childhood home. Spoke to his dad for five minutes. Seemed
16:52
Speaker 1: like a decent guy. Doug hasn't lived here for 30 years.
16:56
Speaker 1: All right, take care, man. So he called Doug Band,
17:00
Speaker 1: and it was the guy's home number, which was where
17:02
Speaker 1: the dude grew up. You imagine? Jeffrey Epstein has your
17:06
Speaker 1: parent's home number in his black book? What in the
17:10
Speaker 1: ever-living F? Why would he have that phone number? So
17:15
Speaker 1: many questions. Jimmy Cain, a former CEO of Bear Stearns.
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Speaker 1: Wife answered the phone. When asked about Epstein and Cain's relationship,
17:24
Speaker 1: she said, yes, they were friends, but we have no comment.
17:30
Speaker 1: Edward Razik, former chief marketing officer for L Brands. I
17:34
Speaker 1: can't talk about any of that. Our business has requested
17:37
Speaker 1: no interviews. And remember, Razik was also on the line
17:41
Speaker 1: by fostering a bad work environment for the girls at
17:45
Speaker 1: Victoria's Secret. Those were the allegations of sexual harassment, et cetera,
17:50
Speaker 1: et cetera. Rupert Murdoch, executive chairman of News Corp. His
17:56
Speaker 1: assistant gave me Hope Hicks' cell phone number after I
17:59
Speaker 1: asked for it. Hicks has not returned any of my calls. Well,
18:02
Speaker 1: that's a shock, huh? I'm really shocked that Hope Hicks
18:05
Speaker 1: hasn't returned any calls from you. I mean, geez, these people,
18:10
Speaker 1: all of these people are just unbelievable, folks. I honestly
18:13
Speaker 1: don't even know what to say about half of them.
18:17
Speaker 1: Princess Furial, Jordanian philanthropist. Called her home number. Dorman answered.
18:23
Speaker 1: I asked for a missed free-all, completely butchering the pronunciation.
18:28
Speaker 1: Dorman was confused, so I said princess, and he immediately
18:32
Speaker 1: told me where she was and who she was with.
18:36
Speaker 1: Peter Roth, chairman and CEO of Warner Brothers. No, that's
18:40
Speaker 1: not a shock, huh? I wonder how often Mr. Roth
18:43
Speaker 1: was hanging out with old Harvey Weinstein. Listed cell number
18:49
Speaker 1: went to his son's phone. Yeah, I don't really want
18:51
Speaker 1: to talk about any of this, his son said. I
18:53
Speaker 1: don't want to be anywhere near this whole Jeffrey Epstein thing.
18:57
Speaker 1: And that's what it's all about, right? They don't want
18:59
Speaker 1: to be near it. Even if they had a relationship
19:00
Speaker 1: with Epstein, they don't want to be near it, folks.
19:03
Speaker 1: They'd rather back away. They'd rather just, you know, like
19:06
Speaker 1: I always say, the marathon approach. And now, as it's
19:09
Speaker 1: becoming more serious, it's turning into a sprint. But these
19:14
Speaker 1: people who don't want to talk about it, come on now. Now,
19:17
Speaker 1: I understand here, this went to his kid's son, right?
19:21
Speaker 1: I mean, to his son's phone. So I don't expect
19:24
Speaker 1: his son to answer for his father. But some of
19:26
Speaker 1: these other people that, you know, don't want to talk
19:29
Speaker 1: about it and they want to just avoid it, that's
19:32
Speaker 1: not going to occur. The cat is now out of
19:34
Speaker 1: the bag. Jamie Grant, Global Chairman of Investment Banking J.P. Morgan.
19:41
Speaker 1: I wonder... How many times has Mr. Grant been involved
19:45
Speaker 1: with some of the stuff we talk about in the
19:47
Speaker 1: FinCEN files? I'm guessing a lot. As you all know,
19:51
Speaker 1: I think most of these bankers at this level, the
19:54
Speaker 1: Jamie Grant level bankers, are up to no good. So
19:57
Speaker 1: it would not shock me one bit if Mr. Grant
20:00
Speaker 1: wasn't involved in all of that sort of nonsense as well.
20:05
Speaker 1: Listed cell number also went to his son. who told
20:09
Speaker 1: me his dad didn't know Epstein or Ghislaine Maxwell. It's
20:12
Speaker 1: sort of like the New York City business world. I
20:15
Speaker 1: would say Jeffrey Epstein is like a couple people removed
20:18
Speaker 1: from my dad. Oh, so now we're doing the seven
20:21
Speaker 1: degrees of separation of Kevin Bacon, huh? Yeah, look, my
20:25
Speaker 1: dad's friend's friend's uncle's cousin knows Jeffrey Epstein. That's why
20:29
Speaker 1: my dad was in the book. Uh, what? Robert Meester,
20:35
Speaker 1: former chairman of Aon Insurance and the man who introduced
20:38
Speaker 1: Epstein to Leslie Wexner. He's a sicko. Bye-bye. So that's
20:42
Speaker 1: what Robert Meester said, huh? Oh, okay. That was very informative.
20:46
Speaker 1: Thanks a lot, sir. Kerry Kennedy, president of RFK Human Rights.
20:52
Speaker 1: Listed as an emergency contact for Robert F. Kennedy Jr.
20:56
Speaker 1: and Mary Kennedy and seemed very taken aback that I
20:59
Speaker 1: had forgotten Bobby was dead. I asked where he was. Yikes. Yikes, yikes, yikes.
21:05
Speaker 1: I then asked her about Mary Kennedy, who I learned
21:08
Speaker 1: is also dead. Big yikes all around on this one.
21:12
Speaker 1: She told me she used to sell photographs to Mother
21:14
Speaker 1: Jones in her younger days. Well, okay. That was informative.
21:20
Speaker 1: And I'm sure that he had a bunch of phone
21:22
Speaker 1: calls like that, right? Calling people and they're like, what
21:25
Speaker 1: is this even about? And then it probably veered off
21:28
Speaker 1: into other directions when he realized that it was either
21:31
Speaker 1: a number of somebody who was no longer related to
21:35
Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein, meaning nobody that has a relationship with him
21:38
Speaker 1: or whatever have you. It would veer off into a
21:42
Speaker 1: different direction. Meryl Tish, former chancellor of the New York
21:47
Speaker 1: State Board of Regents and heir to the Lowe's Corporation. Me, hey,
21:52
Speaker 1: I'm doing a story on Jeffrey Epstein. I was wondering
21:55
Speaker 1: if you ever met the guy or interacted with him. Tish.
21:59
Speaker 1: I don't know who you are. How did you get
22:01
Speaker 1: my number? Me. Well, I got it from Epstein's contact book. Tish.
22:07
Speaker 1: From who? Me. Jeffrey Epstein's contact book. Tish. No. This
22:13
Speaker 1: is ridiculous. Who are you? What's your name? Me. My
22:18
Speaker 1: name's Leland. I'm doing a story for a magazine. Tish. Oh. My. God.
22:24
Speaker 1: You have to be kidding me. No, I can't help
22:27
Speaker 1: you out. Thank God. I mean, really? Me? Me? Meryl
22:32
Speaker 1: and Jimmy were listed with an address and this number.
22:35
Speaker 1: You're Tish, right? With a C. There's a David Tish
22:38
Speaker 1: listed as well. Don't know if you're related? Tish. Huh. Goodbye. Oh, man.
22:45
Speaker 1: That's a good one there. That lady seemed to be
22:48
Speaker 1: mortified that she was... involved with Jeffrey Epstein or that
22:54
Speaker 1: her name was found in that black book. I wonder
22:58
Speaker 1: what her voice sounded like on the conversation, not just
23:00
Speaker 1: reading the words, but I wonder what she sounded like.
23:05
Speaker 1: Joel Pashkal, board member of the Palm Beach Police and
23:08
Speaker 1: Fire Foundation. You're really pathetic, you know that? Yeah, man,
23:13
Speaker 1: people keep calling me up, asking for Muffy, and I'm like,
23:16
Speaker 1: you know, I'm just always polite, man. That's Elijah Hutch.
23:20
Speaker 1: 22-year-old aspiring music producer who lives in Flatbush in Brooklyn.
23:26
Speaker 1: He has the old cell number for Muffy Potter, wife
23:30
Speaker 1: of world-famous plastic surgeon Cheryl Astin, and the fourth greatest
23:35
Speaker 1: socialite in history, according to Town & Country magazine. The
23:39
Speaker 1: fact that we have a list of the quote-unquote greatest
23:42
Speaker 1: socialites in history, what sort of Moronic nonsense is that.
23:47
Speaker 1: They get a list. Socialites get a list of who
23:50
Speaker 1: the greatest socialites in history are. I have an idea.
23:53
Speaker 1: How about you're all idiots, okay? The whole lot of
23:57
Speaker 1: you are idiots. They'll text me about some dinner I
24:07
Speaker 1: went to, or how it was great seeing me with so-and-so,
24:10
Speaker 1: and I'm always just respectful, man, and just let them know,
24:13
Speaker 1: hey man, I think Muffy gave you the wrong number.
24:16
Speaker 1: Eli had no idea who Muffy was, or Epstein for
24:19
Speaker 1: that matter, and I almost didn't want to explain it
24:22
Speaker 1: to him, but I did. The child sex ring, the princes,
24:26
Speaker 1: the presidents, the suicide, the black book, everything. Out of
24:30
Speaker 1: all the people I spoke to, Eli had by far
24:33
Speaker 1: the most caught Cogent analysis of the situation. Damn, man,
24:39
Speaker 1: this is all sounding so strange. Find Eli Hutch on
24:43
Speaker 1: SoundCloud here. Let the haunting lyrics of Go Away give
24:46
Speaker 1: you strength as they did me. Awake at my desk
24:50
Speaker 1: at 4 a.m. so I could call every pedophile in London.
24:54
Speaker 1: You're gonna need more coffee, bro. Look, in fact, I
24:58
Speaker 1: should send you a six-pack of bangs because you're going
25:00
Speaker 1: to need those, I think. You're going to need the
25:02
Speaker 1: energy drinks. Step it up. You're going to need more.
25:05
Speaker 1: To call every pedophile in London is going to take
25:07
Speaker 1: you quite some time, my friend. What a world. Any
25:12
Speaker 1: phone can reach any other. It's almost unbelievable what a
25:15
Speaker 1: string of 7 to 12 numbers can get you. All
25:19
Speaker 1: I did for weeks... was sit on my couch, feel
25:22
Speaker 1: like dog shit, flip through this haunted book, and call
25:25
Speaker 1: people up one by one in between bouts of stress diarrhea.
25:29
Speaker 1: That's it. You just type the numbers in, and sometimes
25:32
Speaker 1: you get a ring. And sometimes, a person picks up. Remember,
25:37
Speaker 1: you know what I always say about being stuck in
25:39
Speaker 1: the house for six months, being locked down and shit?
25:43
Speaker 1: You really think that this guy would have went through
25:45
Speaker 1: this if he wasn't locked in his house? Probably not.
25:48
Speaker 1: So again, the quarantine has created some good content and
25:52
Speaker 1: it's really made people become pretty damn creative. The fuzz, maybe.
25:59
Speaker 1: I made the first call from a coffee shop in
26:01
Speaker 1: Los Angeles, Koreatown, the day after Epstein's suspicious suicide in
26:05
Speaker 1: his cell at Manhattan's Metropolitan Correctional Center while awaiting trial,
26:10
Speaker 1: a convenient turn of events for the rich and famous
26:12
Speaker 1: people who would now avoid exposure in court. Well, all right.
26:17
Speaker 1: Guess he started before the quarantine. So this guy actually
26:21
Speaker 1: has a lot of pizzazz, right? That's a lot of focus. 2,000
26:25
Speaker 1: phone calls, calling all of these people and asking them,
26:29
Speaker 1: probably going through the same questions with all of them,
26:32
Speaker 1: talk about repetitive. And you know what? It turned into
26:36
Speaker 1: a fantastic story and a lot of work, right? The
26:41
Speaker 1: day after Epstein committed suicide, he made the first phone call.
26:45
Speaker 1: So He's been working on this for a lot longer
26:47
Speaker 1: than the quarantine, so props. The death was a national scandal.
26:55
Speaker 1: Followers of the Epstein case, I'm including myself here, reacted
26:59
Speaker 1: to his death with a burst of paranoia and anger.
27:03
Speaker 1: Conspiracizing was rampant. I had come across a screenshot of
27:07
Speaker 1: an unredacted section of the Black Book and determined to
27:10
Speaker 1: track down its source. I decided to check the most
27:13
Speaker 1: awful place on the internet, A-chan, where I was quickly
27:17
Speaker 1: rewarded for my intuition, an unredacted PDF of the entire
27:21
Speaker 1: book had been posted just a few hours earlier. About
27:26
Speaker 1: 12 seconds later, I was dialing Melania Trump's personal cell
27:30
Speaker 1: phone voicemail. Then I sent a text to David Copperfield. David,
27:35
Speaker 1: we need to talk. It's about Jeffrey. I love it.
27:39
Speaker 1: I love it. I love it. Imagine sending that sort
27:42
Speaker 1: of text message to David Copperfield. Copperfield's reaction, he must
27:45
Speaker 1: have been like, who the who is this? What do
27:47
Speaker 1: you mean we need to talk about Jeffrey? Who in
27:50
Speaker 1: the hell is this? God, to be a roach in
27:54
Speaker 1: the rushes when these idiots got these these phone calls
27:57
Speaker 1: or these text messages, it must have been they must
28:00
Speaker 1: have been caught so off guard. I tried a couple
28:04
Speaker 1: more people, none of whom picked up, whereupon I was
28:07
Speaker 1: interrupted by a call from a restricted number. The guy
28:10
Speaker 1: on the line said he was with the FBI. He
28:13
Speaker 1: said there were reports of fraudulent phone calls being made
28:16
Speaker 1: on this line, which I immediately understood as bullshit. I
28:20
Speaker 1: wasn't committing any phone crime or trying to trick someone
28:23
Speaker 1: into doing so. I don't know about fraudulent, but I
28:27
Speaker 1: have a feeling I know what you're talking about. I
28:29
Speaker 1: said undoubtedly sounding cool, relaxed, and unbothered. He then said,
28:34
Speaker 1: I have a real call coming in, to what sounded
28:37
Speaker 1: like someone else in the room, his voice quiet in
28:39
Speaker 1: the way of someone who has just pulled the phone
28:41
Speaker 1: off of his face to look at it. He hung
28:44
Speaker 1: up and never called again. As far as I know,
28:48
Speaker 1: whether the guy was FBI or private security goon posing
28:52
Speaker 1: as a fed, the call was an important development. It
28:55
Speaker 1: told me that the book I was dealing with and
28:57
Speaker 1: the numbers it contained were genuine. Every cell phone number,
29:01
Speaker 1: every yacht line, every private office number, they were all real,
29:06
Speaker 1: and every one of them was about to get a
29:08
Speaker 1: call from me. The art collecting scientist, you're so full
29:13
Speaker 1: of shit. The next day I began calling en masse.
29:17
Speaker 1: By now, in an effort to spare my girlfriend any
29:20
Speaker 1: psychic harm, I was operating from the Los Angeles Central Library,
29:24
Speaker 1: first from a foyer, my voice bouncing off the high
29:27
Speaker 1: marble ceilings with embarrassing levels of clarity and volume, and
29:31
Speaker 1: then from a corner of the library's art gallery, deftly
29:34
Speaker 1: maneuvering around any guests when necessary. That day had been terrible,
29:39
Speaker 1: full of wrong and disconnected numbers, and I was close
29:42
Speaker 1: to quitting the entire project out of both fear and
29:45
Speaker 1: hopelessness when I placed what was maybe my 50th phone
29:49
Speaker 1: call to Stuart Pavar, who answered the phone and told
29:53
Speaker 1: me Jeffrey Epstein was my best pal for decades. So
29:57
Speaker 1: to go back to... what he was talking about here
30:00
Speaker 1: with the FBI supposedly calling him. I don't doubt it, right?
30:04
Speaker 1: We heard what happened with Tara Palmieri in the Broken
30:08
Speaker 1: podcast about how the FBI talked to, it slips my
30:15
Speaker 1: mind right now, one of the butlers or whoever the
30:19
Speaker 1: gentleman was that they talked to on Broken, Juan Alessi.
30:23
Speaker 1: So how the FBI had talked to him previously and
30:26
Speaker 1: now how the FBI or security goons called this guy
30:31
Speaker 1: and tried to tell him that he was making fraudulent
30:33
Speaker 1: phone calls. And that's just the way they conduct themselves, right?
30:37
Speaker 1: They love to try and intimidate. They love to try
30:40
Speaker 1: and put fear into people. But you know what? Sometimes
30:45
Speaker 1: you just have to put that to the side when
30:48
Speaker 1: you're working on a story as a It's just, when
30:55
Speaker 1: you cover stories like this, there's bound to be some
30:58
Speaker 1: sketchy moments. Pavar, 90 years old, is an art collector, scientist,
31:05
Speaker 1: and a founder alongside Andy Warhol of the New York
31:10
Speaker 1: Academy of Art. How beautiful is that, huh? We all
31:12
Speaker 1: know about the New York Academy of Art and Eileen
31:15
Speaker 1: Guggenheim and all of the nonsensical BS that occurred there,
31:19
Speaker 1: don't we? He ended up speaking with me for over
31:23
Speaker 1: an hour about his very, very sick friend in a
31:25
Speaker 1: conversation we wound up publishing in its entirety. Stuart told
31:30
Speaker 1: me over and over again that Epstein suffered from satiricis,
31:35
Speaker 1: which he described as the male version of nymphomania, and
31:39
Speaker 1: that he used his money and power to make an
31:41
Speaker 1: industry out of having sex with underage girls. Sounds to
31:45
Speaker 1: me like Stuart Pivar is making this stuff up or
31:49
Speaker 1: going on, uh, you know, what, what he thinks maybe,
31:53
Speaker 1: because I don't think that, uh, Epstein was, you know,
31:58
Speaker 1: making an industry out of it. I think there was a, no,
32:03
Speaker 1: you know what? Maybe, maybe that is the right way
32:05
Speaker 1: to say it. Making an industry out of it. Yeah.
32:07
Speaker 1: All right. I think we could go with that. This
32:10
Speaker 1: apparently entailed Epstein having sex with three girls a day
32:13
Speaker 1: and hundreds and hundreds in total. He said he never
32:17
Speaker 1: knew Epstein was having sex with children until Maria Farmer,
32:20
Speaker 1: a student at the academy and an acquaintance of Pavar,
32:24
Speaker 1: had told him she had been assaulted and held hostage
32:26
Speaker 1: by Epstein. He also claimed that Epstein had never invited
32:30
Speaker 1: him to what he called the Isle of Babes, a
32:33
Speaker 1: reference to Epstein's private island where much of the child
32:36
Speaker 1: sex trafficking allegedly occurred. Yeah, it was an elite company, right?
32:43
Speaker 1: Only certain people... that Jeffrey Epstein was bringing to that island.
32:47
Speaker 1: Only some very select folks were invited to that island.
32:51
Speaker 1: People that Epstein knew... had the same proclivities as him
32:55
Speaker 1: would be my guess. Pavar said he was in mourning
33:00
Speaker 1: for Epstein... who had died just two days before we spoke.
33:04
Speaker 1: By turns morose, defeated, and indignant... veering between florid ruminations
33:09
Speaker 1: about teenage sexuality... and bitter denunciations of me and my
33:13
Speaker 1: life choices... He unloaded his thoughts and feelings about Maxwell
33:18
Speaker 1: and Leslie Wexner, Epstein's billionaire patron, as well as about
33:23
Speaker 1: nature of perversion, criminality, perhaps even life itself. On pathology,
33:30
Speaker 1: what's a pervert? There are all kinds of behavioristic aberrations,
33:34
Speaker 1: obviously including mass murderers. You don't call mass murderers perverts,
33:39
Speaker 1: do you? Uh, what? No, we call them mass murderers
33:42
Speaker 1: because they're killing people. Okay, perverts are people that do
33:46
Speaker 1: the things that your best friend Jeffrey Epstein did. Really?
33:50
Speaker 1: I was in mourning for Jeffrey Epstein? Sort of sick
33:55
Speaker 1: bastards in mourning for Jeffrey Epstein. On nature and civilization,
34:00
Speaker 1: and so all kinds of rules get made, and nature
34:03
Speaker 1: is not allowed to take its course on account of civilization.
34:07
Speaker 1: Jeffrey broke those rules big time, but what he was
34:09
Speaker 1: pursuing was kind of, I suppose, sexual urges which would
34:13
Speaker 1: Why am I telling you this stuff? Leave me alone.
34:17
Speaker 1: Go away. So this 90-year-old man goes on this rant, right?
34:21
Speaker 1: Starts prattling all this shit off to the author here.
34:26
Speaker 1: And then at the end, decides, why am I telling
34:29
Speaker 1: you all of this? Leave me alone. Go away. I
34:31
Speaker 1: wonder if he ended it by, get off of my lawn.
34:36
Speaker 1: On Epstein accuser Virginia Roberts and Epstein's child sex ring,
34:40
Speaker 1: Anyone who did one thing, let us say to some
34:42
Speaker 1: 16-year-old trollop who would come to his house time after
34:46
Speaker 1: time after time and then afterwards bitch about it, why,
34:50
Speaker 1: no one would pay attention. Except Jeffrey made an industry
34:53
Speaker 1: out of it. So this Stuart Pavard guy is obviously
34:57
Speaker 1: another sick bastard, right? Another one of these... you know,
35:01
Speaker 1: art world dealer sick dudes. We've talked about him previously
35:07
Speaker 1: when we were talking about the Academy. And just when
35:12
Speaker 1: you read the things that they would say about Jeffrey
35:14
Speaker 1: Epstein or how they supported Jeffrey Epstein or how they
35:18
Speaker 1: called one of these girls a trollop or you called
35:20
Speaker 1: Virginia a trollop. It's just, you know, the nature of
35:24
Speaker 1: these sick bastards, the nature of these fellow travelers. On
35:31
Speaker 1: nature and civilization continued, the business of sexual attraction, the
35:35
Speaker 1: attraction of males and females in its natural state, is
35:38
Speaker 1: not the same as what happens when civilization puts up
35:42
Speaker 1: all kinds of rules. Because sexual attraction starts at a very,
35:45
Speaker 1: very young age. When I was 14, I had to
35:48
Speaker 1: deal with a girl who was only 13. And somehow,
35:52
Speaker 1: I remember it was at summer camp. And I stopped
35:54
Speaker 1: having to do with her because of the tremendous age gap.
35:59
Speaker 1: On me and my life choices? You're so full of shit,
36:01
Speaker 1: it's terrible. You should not be writing about this. You're
36:04
Speaker 1: not qualified. This guy's obviously suffering from some form of
36:09
Speaker 1: dementia or something, Mr. Pavar. And sexual attraction starts at
36:15
Speaker 1: a very, very young age. So what does a 13-year-old
36:19
Speaker 1: being attracted to a 14-year-old have to do with Jeffrey
36:22
Speaker 1: Epstein raping little girls? on himself and his life choices.
36:30
Speaker 1: Why did I talk to you? I'm a dead fish,
36:32
Speaker 1: and you're going to ruin me. Luckily, I don't know
36:34
Speaker 1: anybody who reads The Mother Jones anymore. I can't believe
36:38
Speaker 1: it still existed. This guy's throwing all kinds of smoke
36:41
Speaker 1: at the author, huh? Firing. You gotta have some set
36:45
Speaker 1: of balls to call Jeffrey Epstein your best friend and
36:48
Speaker 1: then try to bring the smoke to this author. On
36:53
Speaker 1: my having asked him to speak into yapping pointlessly... You
37:00
Speaker 1: asked me to, so to speak, into yapping pointlessly because
37:02
Speaker 1: I have nothing else to do for the moment and
37:05
Speaker 1: I'm relying on you to understand what I say. If
37:08
Speaker 1: you misquote me or anything like that, I will sue
37:10
Speaker 1: your magazine until the end of the earth. Tell me
37:13
Speaker 1: your name again so I can start writing a complaint
37:15
Speaker 1: to sue you. Oh, yeah, he'll probably call Alan Dershowitz.
37:20
Speaker 1: Right away, he's calling Mr. Underpants himself. Uh, Alan, I
37:25
Speaker 1: gotta sue Mother Jones. Can you help me out? That's
37:30
Speaker 1: the sort of people we're dealing with here. This guy
37:33
Speaker 1: is calling Jeffrey Epstein his best friend is saying he's
37:35
Speaker 1: going to sue a journalist for calling him and asking
37:39
Speaker 1: about some context of their relationship. You don't have that
37:45
Speaker 1: ability anymore. Okay? That's done. Somewhere in all this, Pavar
37:53
Speaker 1: managed to tell me the entire backstory of his decades
37:56
Speaker 1: friendship with Epstein. Pavar had met Epstein through the New
38:00
Speaker 1: York Academy of Art, where Epstein was a board member.
38:03
Speaker 1: It was at an NYAA function where he met a
38:07
Speaker 1: young Maria Farmer, who along with her younger sister would
38:10
Speaker 1: become one of Epstein's earliest accusers. Farmer, a painter, was
38:15
Speaker 1: at the Wexner mansion at Epstein's invitation for what she
38:19
Speaker 1: believed was an art residency when she alleges Epstein and
38:23
Speaker 1: Maxwell sexually assaulted her and held her hostage for 12
38:26
Speaker 1: hours with the aid of Wexner's massive security team. After
38:31
Speaker 1: the ordeal, Farmer soon learned that her younger sister had
38:35
Speaker 1: also been assaulted by Epstein and Maxwell during a similar
38:39
Speaker 1: artist residency. Pavar told me he ran into Farmer at
38:42
Speaker 1: a flea market where she told him this bizarre story,
38:45
Speaker 1: and I realized, oh my God, something was happening after
38:48
Speaker 1: years and years, which he, Epstein, didn't tell me. So
38:52
Speaker 1: Maria not only told the FBI, she told Pavar here,
38:56
Speaker 1: and he just went on record saying that. So for
39:01
Speaker 1: all the detractors who like to run their fat, stupid,
39:04
Speaker 1: idiot mouths, well, there you go, another witness, huh? Another
39:08
Speaker 1: person to corroborate it. My hour-long conversation with Pavar was
39:14
Speaker 1: genuinely illuminating. Pavar spoke about Epstein in the exact way
39:19
Speaker 1: many of his friends and colleagues would speak about him
39:21
Speaker 1: to me in the coming weeks. Reverence mixed with an
39:25
Speaker 1: acknowledgement of Epstein's essential disingenuousness. much has been made in
39:31
Speaker 1: the press of Epstein's intelligence mostly due to his vast
39:35
Speaker 1: wealth the glowing adoration of his elite peers and the
39:39
Speaker 1: long roster of high profile scientists and thinkers with whom
39:44
Speaker 1: he surrounded himself Pavar was the first person to peel
39:47
Speaker 1: back the curtain of Epstein's reputation with intimate, first-hand knowledge
39:52
Speaker 1: of the man himself and to counter the prevailing media
39:56
Speaker 1: narrative at the time. Pavar had attended a few of
40:00
Speaker 1: the now widely publicized intellectual summits at Epstein's house in
40:04
Speaker 1: New York. And we've talked about all of those and
40:07
Speaker 1: the power brokers that they brought in. You know, the
40:10
Speaker 1: Edge Conference and John Brockman and... and all of the
40:14
Speaker 1: power players that were brought into Epstein's orbit for these
40:17
Speaker 1: sorts of conferences. Epstein hosted dinner parties for world-famous scientists
40:27
Speaker 1: and thinkers from around the globe. People like Steven Pinker,
40:31
Speaker 1: Stephen Jay Gould, Martin Nowak, Lawrence Krauss, and Marvin Minsky.
40:36
Speaker 1: Jeffrey didn't know anything about science, Pavar said. He would say, oh,
40:40
Speaker 1: what is gravity? Which, of course, is an unanswerable thing
40:44
Speaker 1: to present at a dinner to a bunch of scientists.
40:47
Speaker 1: And because he was Jeffrey, why, they would, and as
40:50
Speaker 1: the founder of the feast, they would listen to him
40:52
Speaker 1: and try to give answers. He was attempting, somehow, in
40:56
Speaker 1: his ignorant and scientifically naive state, to do something scientifically important.
41:01
Speaker 1: He had no compunctions about inviting people, and since he
41:04
Speaker 1: had money, they would listen. Yeah, I think it was
41:08
Speaker 1: more than just the money, though, too, right? He was
41:11
Speaker 1: also offering them other things, like the girls that he
41:15
Speaker 1: was sex trafficking. And we've talked at length about these
41:18
Speaker 1: nerdy-ass scientists. You know that they weren't running around with
41:23
Speaker 1: the hot girls when they were growing up or even
41:25
Speaker 1: when they were in college. Just take a look at
41:27
Speaker 1: people like Jeff Bezos, even. and Elon Musk before they
41:31
Speaker 1: got all their money and all the work done on themselves.
41:33
Speaker 1: You really think they were running around with, you know,
41:35
Speaker 1: hot girls? Hell no, and these scientists certainly aren't. So,
41:40
Speaker 1: when Jeffrey Epstein would have that island available, and he'd
41:43
Speaker 1: have all these traffic girls, that would just be the
41:45
Speaker 1: icing on top of the cake, right? Epstein used his
41:52
Speaker 1: money and influence to brand himself as an avant-garde intellect,
41:56
Speaker 1: a sparkling, auto... autocrat dedicated to the pursuit of knowledge
42:02
Speaker 1: on the far-out edge of human perception. In large part,
42:06
Speaker 1: it worked extraordinarily well. You could build mountains out of
42:10
Speaker 1: the bizarre, nebulous claims of esoteric knowledge ascribed to Epstein.
42:15
Speaker 1: He was good at puzzles and finding things out. He
42:18
Speaker 1: could look at an organization and see what was wrong,
42:21
Speaker 1: one friend told me. Wexner, when asked by Vanity Fair
42:25
Speaker 1: about his relationship with Epstein... said that he was good
42:27
Speaker 1: at seeing patterns in politics and financial markets. Epstein's mind
42:32
Speaker 1: goes through a cross-section of descriptions, Joe Pagano, a longtime
42:36
Speaker 1: friend of Epstein, had said. He can go from mathematics
42:39
Speaker 1: to psychology to biology. He takes the smallest amount of
42:43
Speaker 1: information and gets the correct answer in the shortest period
42:46
Speaker 1: of time. That's my definition of IQ. Epstein's attempts to
42:51
Speaker 1: portray himself as a galaxy brain genius was surely helped
42:54
Speaker 1: along by his vast fortune. As I would find, the
42:58
Speaker 1: myth of his genius and the fortune were mutually reinforcing notions.
43:04
Speaker 1: His brilliance went largely unquestioned. Because how else could he
43:08
Speaker 1: be so rich? His wealth wasn't so mysterious once he
43:11
Speaker 1: understood just how brilliant he was. Yeah, sorry, I never
43:16
Speaker 1: thought Jeffrey Epstein was brilliant from anything we've read. And
43:19
Speaker 1: from the stuff I've heard from people who knew him,
43:22
Speaker 1: it was all a facade, right? It was all fakery.
43:26
Speaker 1: He had some ability in the stock market maybe to
43:29
Speaker 1: move some numbers and shit. And he had a good
43:33
Speaker 1: feel for money laundering. But as far as legally, he
43:37
Speaker 1: was nothing to write home about. He was no Wall
43:39
Speaker 1: Street powerhouse. He was no big shot. He wasn't anything
43:44
Speaker 1: like that. But Pavard didn't buy it. At least not entirely.
43:51
Speaker 1: He still called his old friend a very, very brilliant
43:54
Speaker 1: guy and said Epstein had a very low, how should
43:57
Speaker 1: I say, charming way of expressing himself. But Pavar also
44:02
Speaker 1: acknowledged that Epstein was a bullshitter. He couldn't concentrate on
44:06
Speaker 1: a subject for more than two minutes before having to
44:08
Speaker 1: change the subject. because he didn't know what anyone was
44:11
Speaker 1: talking about and would blurt out the dumbest things, Pavar said.
44:15
Speaker 1: In particular, Epstein had an affinity for posing pseudo-deep questions like,
44:20
Speaker 1: what is up and what is down, at the scientific
44:24
Speaker 1: summits he hosted on his private island. Doesn't shock me
44:27
Speaker 1: one bit, honestly. A pseudo-intellectual like Jeffrey Epstein is definitely
44:33
Speaker 1: going to ask questions like that, right? Trying to act
44:36
Speaker 1: like he knows what he's talking about. or floss like
44:39
Speaker 1: he's some sort of, you know, intelligent guy. And these
44:43
Speaker 1: scientists were all probably rolling their eyes in the back,
44:46
Speaker 1: you know, in their heads, in their minds, I mean. Meanwhile,
44:51
Speaker 1: acting like they care what this guy had to say
44:53
Speaker 1: because A, the money, and B, all of the others
44:56
Speaker 1: that came with it. The act would wear thin eventually,
45:00
Speaker 1: Pavar recalled. While everybody was watching, we began to realize
45:04
Speaker 1: he didn't know what he was talking about. Then, after
45:07
Speaker 1: a couple of minutes, Jeffrey had no attention span whatsoever.
45:11
Speaker 1: He would interrupt the conversation and change it and say
45:14
Speaker 1: things like, what does that got to do with pussy? Yeah,
45:18
Speaker 1: that sounds about right. That most definitely sounds about right, folks.
45:23
Speaker 1: And we know that Stuart Pavard was a friend of
45:26
Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein's, and they probably were pretty close. It wouldn't
45:29
Speaker 1: shock me one bit, considering how close Epstein was to
45:32
Speaker 1: the Academy, sitting on the board, all the money he donated, etc., etc.
45:38
Speaker 1: So that is a tale that definitely rings true with me,
45:44
Speaker 1: the conversation Pavar had with the author here and what
45:48
Speaker 1: they talked about, because he most definitely had some intimate
45:51
Speaker 1: knowledge of Epstein, and him and Epstein most definitely were
45:56
Speaker 1: pretty good friends. Now, I'm not too sure that Pavar
46:00
Speaker 1: was involved in the actual you know, trafficking part of anything,
46:05
Speaker 1: but he certainly was rubbing elbows with Jeffrey Epstein more
46:09
Speaker 1: than just an acquaintance. And he, I don't care what
46:12
Speaker 1: he says. He most definitely saw some weird shit. And
46:16
Speaker 1: even if he didn't see anything weird, Maria told him
46:19
Speaker 1: what was going on and he still stayed friends with
46:22
Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein. So Stuart Pavar is another one that, you know,
46:28
Speaker 1: it's good that he's talking, right? And he's talking about,
46:30
Speaker 1: you know, his relationship with Epstein, et cetera, et cetera.
46:34
Speaker 1: But he's not going to be able to pull the
46:37
Speaker 1: wool over anyone's eyes and act like he didn't see
46:41
Speaker 1: anything weird at Epstein's house. If you're over there and
46:44
Speaker 1: you're at his conferences and stuff, you saw a few
46:46
Speaker 1: weird things. Now, do you want to acknowledge that or not? Well,
46:51
Speaker 1: that's a different question. And that's probably where we are
46:55
Speaker 1: with Mr. Pavar, right? He is just... He, you know,
47:02
Speaker 1: in his mind, he has, it's normalized. That's the normal
47:05
Speaker 1: behavior for these people. So when Jeffrey Epstein has all
47:08
Speaker 1: this weird ass art and painting and shit on his walls,
47:11
Speaker 1: maybe this guy says to himself, yeah, yeah, you know, typical,
47:14
Speaker 1: just the way we roll in polite society. So that's
47:20
Speaker 1: going to end part one of this very lengthy article
47:26
Speaker 1: and part two. What's up everyone. And welcome to another episode.
47:30
Speaker 1: of the Epstein Chronicles. The fact that we're still fighting
47:33
Speaker 1: tooth and nail for transparency when it comes to Jeffrey
47:36
Speaker 1: Epstein and Glenn Maxwell is absolutely wild, especially considering that
47:42
Speaker 1: the deadline has long come and gone. You'd think that
47:45
Speaker 1: they'd be more concerned about upholding their end of the
47:48
Speaker 1: bargain as far as the DOJ and the BOP's concerned,
47:52
Speaker 1: but I guess not. And now Mother Jones is sued,
47:56
Speaker 1: the BOP, for records about Ghislaine Maxwell and the transfer.
48:01
Speaker 1: And I say good, because that's one part of this
48:04
Speaker 1: story that people are not talking about nowhere near enough.
48:09
Speaker 1: There is no reason, no justification whatsoever, for Ghislaine Maxwell
48:14
Speaker 1: being moved to Camp Fed. And I don't want to
48:17
Speaker 1: hear anything about, oh, well, her wife was in danger. Yeah,
48:20
Speaker 1: guess what? So are a lot of other inmates inside
48:24
Speaker 1: of the system. Are they getting moved? Yeah, maybe move
48:27
Speaker 1: right back to the main line. So why is Ghislaine
48:30
Speaker 1: Maxwell getting all of these extra benefits and these extra
48:33
Speaker 1: rewards that she nowhere near deserves? I mean, this lady
48:38
Speaker 1: should be under the prison, not getting moved to a
48:41
Speaker 1: place like Camp Ryan. So today we have an article
48:44
Speaker 1: from Mother Jones and the headline, Mother Jones sues the
48:48
Speaker 1: Bureau of Prisons for Ghislaine Maxwell records. The author of
48:52
Speaker 1: this article is David Korn. One of the oddest occurrences
48:57
Speaker 1: in the Trump administration's handling of the Jeffrey Epstein imbroglio
49:01
Speaker 1: was the trip that Todd Blanche, the Deputy Attorney General,
49:04
Speaker 1: took in July to Tallahassee, Florida to meet with Ghislaine Maxwell,
49:09
Speaker 1: who's serving a 20-year sentence for procuring underage girls, some
49:13
Speaker 1: as young as 14, for Epstein to sexually abuse. There
49:17
Speaker 1: is no good reason for it. I said so then,
49:20
Speaker 1: and I'll say so now. I wish somebody could provide
49:23
Speaker 1: a logical reason for Todd Blanche having that conversation with
49:27
Speaker 1: Glenn Maxwell. And if you compare the way Todd Blanche
49:31
Speaker 1: went about that investigation, if that's what you want to
49:33
Speaker 1: call it, or that conversation with Maxwell, to the way
49:38
Speaker 1: that the OIG inspectors were talking to Acosta, it's night
49:42
Speaker 1: and day. So if anyone out there thinks that Todd
49:47
Speaker 1: Blanche didn't white glove the interview with Maxwell, they're crazy.
49:51
Speaker 1: He most certainly did. So the question is, why? What
49:56
Speaker 1: did the administration gain? I mean, they certainly didn't get
49:59
Speaker 1: any kind of actionable intelligence, right? Nothing even close. So
50:04
Speaker 1: it looks like they moved her for other reasons. And
50:07
Speaker 1: what those other reasons are, are up for debate. Now,
50:11
Speaker 1: my opinion, they wanted her quiet, right? They wanted to
50:15
Speaker 1: give her the best sort of circumstance they possibly could
50:18
Speaker 1: to keep her quiet. And the best way to do
50:21
Speaker 1: that is move her to this facility. Now, it's going
50:24
Speaker 1: to cause a bit of a stir like we see here,
50:27
Speaker 1: but nowhere near as much as if you would give
50:29
Speaker 1: her a pardon, right? So they split the baby. What
50:33
Speaker 1: can we get away with? What can we do to
50:35
Speaker 1: give Maxwell some beneficial movement without having the whole entire
50:40
Speaker 1: world come down on top of us? I mean, nothing
50:42
Speaker 1: else makes sense, right? You don't just move somebody like
50:44
Speaker 1: Elaine Maxwell, who is a child abuser, from the facility
50:48
Speaker 1: they're in to a new facility without any reason why.
50:51
Speaker 1: Prior to being nominated by Trump to the number two
50:54
Speaker 1: position in the Justice Department, Blanche, was Trump's criminal attorney.
50:59
Speaker 1: In the porn star Hush Money forged business records case
51:02
Speaker 1: in New York in which Trump was convicted of 34
51:05
Speaker 1: felony counts. Bro has no shame. Let me go ahead
51:09
Speaker 1: and appoint my personal attorney who is not qualified for
51:12
Speaker 1: the job by the way to the number two position
51:15
Speaker 1: at the DOJ. Nobody else has a problem with that?
51:20
Speaker 1: And what about the precedent it sets? Now all these
51:23
Speaker 1: people in MAGA I'm sure they're excited right now but
51:26
Speaker 1: what happens when the other team wins? Are you still
51:30
Speaker 1: going to be that excited when, insert president here, I
51:33
Speaker 1: don't know, Gavin Newsom has his personal attorney as the
51:37
Speaker 1: second man or woman at the DOJ? Is that going
51:39
Speaker 1: to provide you comfort? Is that going to be cool
51:41
Speaker 1: with you? You know it's not going to be. And
51:44
Speaker 1: all the people right now that are cheering it are
51:46
Speaker 1: going to be complaining about it when it happens to them.
51:49
Speaker 1: See me? I stay consistent. I don't want either side
51:52
Speaker 1: doing this shit. I want the best person qualified for
51:55
Speaker 1: the job to get the job, like in any other industry.
51:59
Speaker 1: Not your friend, not your cousin, not your buddy. I mean,
52:02
Speaker 1: it's bad enough we have nepotism everywhere else. Do we
52:05
Speaker 1: really need it at the D-O-fucking-J? Blanche never provided compelling
52:10
Speaker 1: explanation for his unprecedented act. Why was Trump's former personal
52:15
Speaker 1: lawyer and a top Justice Department official meeting with a
52:18
Speaker 1: sex offender whom the U.S. government had previously assailed for
52:21
Speaker 1: her willingness to lie brazenly under oath about her conduct?
52:25
Speaker 1: And if you go back to the beginning, that's what
52:27
Speaker 1: I said from the jump. This lady's already perjured herself
52:30
Speaker 1: under oath. But sure, Todd Blanche, the great investigator, is
52:34
Speaker 1: going to get to the bottom of it. Legal observers
52:37
Speaker 1: have scratched their heads over this. And months later, Blanche
52:40
Speaker 1: said the point of the interview was allow her to speak,
52:42
Speaker 1: which nobody had done before. That didn't make much sense.
52:47
Speaker 1: How often does the Deputy Attorney General fly 900 miles
52:50
Speaker 1: to afford a convicted sex offender a chance to chat?
52:54
Speaker 1: It was as if Blanche was trying to create fodder
52:57
Speaker 1: for conspiracy theorists. Or he was trying to protect the
53:00
Speaker 1: secrets that she knows. I mean, come on. What are
53:04
Speaker 1: we doing here? And what's really, really funny is that
53:07
Speaker 1: anyone would believe Glenn Maxwell at all. Can you imagine
53:10
Speaker 1: putting her in front of a jury? Can you imagine
53:13
Speaker 1: how she'd be savaged during cross-examination? There is zero that
53:17
Speaker 1: this lady can offer. that's actionable, that will move an
53:20
Speaker 1: investigation forward. So none of this shit makes sense. There
53:24
Speaker 1: was no reason to move her, no reason to even
53:26
Speaker 1: talk to her, but yet here they are. And the
53:28
Speaker 1: fact that he said that she had no chance to
53:30
Speaker 1: explain herself? She most certainly did. She chose not to.
53:34
Speaker 1: Did she take the stand? Oh, that's right, she didn't.
53:37
Speaker 1: And you know why she didn't take the stand? Because
53:40
Speaker 1: she knew that if she got up there, she would
53:42
Speaker 1: get absolutely cooked. So she didn't take the stand. so
53:47
Speaker 1: what does that even mean she didn't have a chance
53:48
Speaker 1: to explain herself? And what made all of this even
53:52
Speaker 1: stranger is that after their conversation, Maxwell was transferred to
53:56
Speaker 1: a minimum security, women-only, federal prison camp in Bryan, Texas,
54:01
Speaker 1: that houses mainly non-violent offenders and white-collar crooks. This facility,
54:07
Speaker 1: home to disgraced Theranos founder Elizabeth Holmes and And Real
54:10
Speaker 1: Housewives of Salt Lake City star and fraudster Jen Shaw
54:14
Speaker 1: is a much cushier facility than the co-ed Tallahassee prison. Well,
54:18
Speaker 1: that's all that really matters, right? That Ghislaine's comfortable. Gotta
54:22
Speaker 1: make sure the Lady Ghislaine is hooked up. Now, if
54:26
Speaker 1: you have a relative that's in one of these jails
54:28
Speaker 1: or prisons, go ahead and try and petition to get
54:30
Speaker 1: them moved to a camp and see how that works
54:33
Speaker 1: out for you. When the transfer was first reported in August,
54:36
Speaker 1: the Bureau of Prisons refused to explain the reason for
54:39
Speaker 1: the move. which Epstein abuse survivors protested. So, I filed
54:44
Speaker 1: a Freedom of Information Act request with the BOP asking
54:47
Speaker 1: for information related to this relocation, specifically, all records mentioning
54:53
Speaker 1: or referencing Maxwell's transfer to Federal Prison Camp Bryan. This
54:57
Speaker 1: includes emails, memoranda, transfer orders, phone messages, texts, electronic chats,
55:03
Speaker 1: and any other communication, whether internal to BOP or between
55:07
Speaker 1: BOP personnel, and any other governmental or non-governmental personnel. Guess what?
55:13
Speaker 1: The BOP did not jump to and provide the information.
55:18
Speaker 1: After a months-long delay, the agency noted it would take
55:21
Speaker 1: up to nine months to fulfill this request. Now, why
55:24
Speaker 1: would that be the case? That is so illogical that
55:27
Speaker 1: it's not even funny. And we should be raising hell
55:31
Speaker 1: about this. You want to talk about the cover-up in
55:35
Speaker 1: real time? This is it. There is no explanation for
55:39
Speaker 1: why Ghislaine Maxwell was moved and none coming. Imagine a
55:43
Speaker 1: world where we have to sue to get that information,
55:46
Speaker 1: especially from the most transparent administration in the history of
55:49
Speaker 1: the country. I would think that they'd be showing up
55:53
Speaker 1: with bundles of information for people, right? Considering the way
55:56
Speaker 1: these idiots talk, we're suing. That is, the Reporters Committee
56:00
Speaker 1: for Freedom of the Press, a non-profit that provides pro
56:03
Speaker 1: bono legal assistance to journalists, today filed a lawsuit in
56:07
Speaker 1: a federal district court in Washington, D.C. on behalf of
56:11
Speaker 1: the Center for Investigative Reporting, which publishes Mother Jones, to
56:15
Speaker 1: compel the BOP to provide the relevant records. The filing
56:19
Speaker 1: notes that the BOP violated the Freedom of Information Act
56:23
Speaker 1: by initially failing to respond in a timely manner. Well,
56:27
Speaker 1: they don't care. Really, that's what it comes down to.
56:31
Speaker 1: These jackbooted thugs that are running the DOJ, they don't
56:34
Speaker 1: give one single fuck what the law says. They're going
56:37
Speaker 1: to do whatever they want. They're above the law. They
56:39
Speaker 1: are the law. And you and me, well, we're just
56:43
Speaker 1: plebs for them to do with as they will. We're
56:48
Speaker 1: not the only ones. After this information, in August, Senator
56:51
Speaker 1: Sheldon Whitehouse sent a letter to William Marshall III, the
56:55
Speaker 1: BOP director, requesting similar material. Against the backdrop of the
56:59
Speaker 1: political scandal arising from President Trump's relationship with Jeffrey Epstein
57:04
Speaker 1: and Ghislaine Maxwell, by the way, Ms. Maxwell's abrupt transfer
57:08
Speaker 1: raises questions about whether she was given special treatment in
57:12
Speaker 1: exchange for political favors, he wrote. White House asked for
57:16
Speaker 1: a response within three weeks. He received no reply, and
57:20
Speaker 1: along with Senator Richard Blumenthal and Adam Schiff, filed a
57:24
Speaker 1: FOIA request. In November, a whistleblower notified Democrats on the
57:29
Speaker 1: House Judiciary Committee that at Camp Brian, Maxwell was receiving
57:33
Speaker 1: preferential treatment that included customized meals brought to her cell,
57:37
Speaker 1: private meetings with visitors who were permitted to bring computers,
57:42
Speaker 1: email service through the warden's office, after-hours use of the
57:45
Speaker 1: prison gym, and access to a puppy that was being
57:48
Speaker 1: trained as a service dog. That poor dog. Imagine being
57:52
Speaker 1: some poor dog and ending up in the cell with
57:55
Speaker 1: Elaine Maxwell And this disgusting, vile woman petting you and
57:59
Speaker 1: touching you? That month, Representative Jamie Raskin, the senior Democrat
58:04
Speaker 1: on the committee, wrote Trump requesting that Blanche appear before
58:08
Speaker 1: the committee to answer questions about Maxwell's treatment. That has
58:12
Speaker 1: not happened. It's not going to happen. They do not
58:15
Speaker 1: respect you. They don't care about the law. And they're
58:17
Speaker 1: going to do whatever they want to do. And nobody's
58:20
Speaker 1: going to do a thing to stop them. Oh sure,
58:23
Speaker 1: people will post on Twitter, people will act crazy and,
58:25
Speaker 1: you know, talk shit, but at the end of the day,
58:28
Speaker 1: nobody's going to stop them. They're going to do whatever
58:30
Speaker 1: it is they want to do. And you know why?
58:33
Speaker 1: Because the precedent has been set. You give these two
58:35
Speaker 1: nods an inch, they're taking a mile. Given the intense
58:39
Speaker 1: public interest in the Epstein case, and the scrutiny it deserves,
58:42
Speaker 1: there ought to be no need to go to court
58:45
Speaker 1: to obtain this information about Maxwell. But with Trump's Justice
58:49
Speaker 1: Department brazenly violating the Epstein Files Transparency Act, which mandated
58:54
Speaker 1: a release of the federal government's Epstein records by December 19th,
58:59
Speaker 1: by which time only 1% of the cash had been
59:02
Speaker 1: made public, it's no shocker that the Bureau of Prisons
59:05
Speaker 1: has not been more forthcoming regarding Maxwell's prison upgrade. It's
59:10
Speaker 1: so ridiculous, and I know I keep saying that, but man,
59:13
Speaker 1: I can't even believe how brazen they are with the cover-up.
59:16
Speaker 1: And the truth is, they're relying on you being too
59:18
Speaker 1: distracted with other disasters. That's what they're relying on. Our
59:23
Speaker 1: in-house counsel, Victoria Berensky, says, at a time when public
59:27
Speaker 1: trust in institutions is fragile... FOIA remains essential. Our lawsuit
59:32
Speaker 1: seeks to enforce the public's right to know and to
59:34
Speaker 1: ensure that the government lives up to its obligation of transparency.
59:39
Speaker 1: And Gunita Singh, a staff attorney for RCFP notes, we're
59:43
Speaker 1: proud to represent CIR and look forward to enforcing FOIA's
59:47
Speaker 1: transparency mandate with respect to the actions of law enforcement
59:51
Speaker 1: in this matter. When we might get anything out of
59:54
Speaker 1: the BOP, no idea, but we'll keep you posted and
59:57
Speaker 1: you can keep track of the case at this page.
1:00:00
Speaker 1: And considering how reticent the government's been to give up information,
1:00:04
Speaker 1: I expect to see plenty more FOIAs in the near future.
1:00:08
Speaker 1: And like usual, we're going to continue following along and
1:00:11
Speaker 1: we'll see where it all ends up. All of the
1:00:14
Speaker 1: information that goes with this episode can be found in
1:00:17
Speaker 1: the description box.