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Heart, Hustle & Humor with Catherine Montiel · Laugh Love Law

• 0:07
  SPEAKER_03: Welcome back to Laugh Love Law.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_03: I'm Heather Kaplan and we're back with one of my favorite guests.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_03: I have known Catherine Montiel for almost 30 years.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_03: I think so.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_03: When I first met her, she was my boss.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_03: And over the years we've worked together, learned from each other, shared victories, survived difficult cases, celebrated milestones, and built a friendship that has lasted through many chapters of our lives.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_03: She's also one of the most accomplished attorneys I know.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_03: As the managing partner of Miller Montiel and Strano, she has spent more than three decades representing injured clients and has helped countless people rebuild their lives after some of the most difficult moments imaginable.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_03: Please welcome Katherine Montiel.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_05: Thank you.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_03: And wow, what an introduction.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, you feel very special, right?
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_05: I'm actually taken aback.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_05: Thank you very much.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think I would have imagined in 1997 that we would be sitting here talking as colleagues and friends.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't think so either.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_03: But no.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, because you did leave something out of your introduction.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_05: Okay, go ahead.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_05: You could have started by saying I was your not so nice boss when we first met.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_03: You know, if I'm looking at it with eyes of a 19-year-old or a 20-year-old, yes, you I don't think it wasn't you weren't not nice.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_03: You just weren't warm and fuzzy.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_03: And I feel like as you grew into your profession, as you grew into who you are, you became so warm and so friendly.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_03: And through the years you've been a mentor to me.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_03: And anytime I've needed something or you know, I had an experience with with law that was new to me, I I would go to you.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_03: And and and Steve and and Dave, your amazing partners.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_03: And I I think that the warm and fuzzy came with time.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_05: It did.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_05: I I started off very intense.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_05: You know, and we talked a bit a little bit about this in the past about how as a young lawyer, female lawyer, yeah coming out, it was just all intensity, climbing your way.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_05: And I wish I could tell my 30-year-old self to chill and enjoy it because it's the best thing I ever did.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_05: I love this job.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and I think that you know, starting out as a young lawyer, because when I met you, you were only practicing about six or seven years because I was a law student.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_03: So you were still proving yourself, you were still making a name for yourself, and I think it was fierce.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_03: The competition was fierce.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_03: And it's different now.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_05: It's so different now.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_05: I I was thinking about that before I came.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_05: I was like, even though it's only been 30 years, yeah, when we came out, there was no work life balance.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_05: It was all work, work, work.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_05: You know, the more you worked, if you went to work sick as a dog, you were honored for it.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_05: Now it's like, I'm so glad these changes have come, especially for our kids.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_03: There's more work life balance to be had.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_03: And there has to be because people you know, people were retiring at 70, 75, and then trying to do all the fun things that they should have done when they were 30 with their kids.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_03: Or when they were forty, you know, with their with their parents even.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_03: And now I feel like the work life balance is so much better.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_03: It's and it makes people happier.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_05: My staff now, if they have a kindergarten graduation, they're going to their kids' kindergarten graduation.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_05: That's right.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_05: And it makes for a happier working environment.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_03: It's true.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, you've built long-term relationships with clients and colleagues over the last 30 years, so much so that they keep coming back.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_03: They're friends, they're family.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_03: And it it's almost as if you have new cases from 2026 that somehow originated in the nineties.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_05: In the nineties, yes.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_03: How do you keep that kind of longevity?
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_05: So I think it starts with personal touch, just like being there for people.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_05: You know, when you have an accident or somebody has something happen to them, of course, financially they're ups they're upset and things get ruined, but it's more than that.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_05: It's about letting them feel confident again and getting back their autonomy.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_05: And those people, and and during a course of a case that could take a year to three years, you're talking to them basically every day or a couple of times a week.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_05: So after it's over, it would be odd just to end that relationship.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, we have a joint client that texts us every holiday Mother's Day, Christmas.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_05: And then those are the referrals, and then they send, unfortunately, if something happens to their friends and family, they send them to us too.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_05: So it's been, I have uh parents, grandparents, children, grandchildren over the years.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_05: And it is like a family.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_03: It is, and and they know that even if it's an area of law that you don't practice, they can call you and say, So I had a problem, can you just give me some guidance as to what to do?
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_03: And I know that you guys are always pushing people in the right direction.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_03: Always.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_03: I know there are times that you've helped people that didn't have any sort of a case that that you could get involved in just because.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_03: Just because.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_03: Just because.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_05: It's all you know, especially as you get older and you're more established in this business.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_05: It really is just about helping people.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_05: Right?
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_05: And if you're helping people, good things will come, success will come.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_05: But if you start with that foundation that people are suffering, you know, we have this business that unfortunately the people we meet are all suffering in some way or another, which is kind of hard.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_05: It is.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_05: But if you remember that and you just try to help them, they'll never forget you.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_03: They won't.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_03: And and you get somebody through a difficult time, then the stigma of that time is is lighter, is lighter because they know that you were there.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_03: You were a guiding light when things were really, really tough.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, you've said to me many times that when you evaluate a case to determine whether or not you'll take it on, it's gotta have a number of components.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_03: You want to tell us a little bit about how you look at a case?
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_05: So uh there are three parts to every case.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_05: There's liability, is somebody at fault for an accident?
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_05: There's injury, is somebody hurt from you know, not every accident result in an injury.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_05: And most importantly, and this is something we'll talk about with my insurance uh my insurance seminars that I've been doing, there has to be insurance coverage for the most part.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_05: So those are the three things.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_05: But as I'm getting older, I just take need two out of three.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_03: You need two out of three because you're gonna take the time and do the research and find the third.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, you don't always find the third.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_03: But if it's got those components, you want to at least investigate it to see if you can find the third.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_03: And as a young lawyer, if it didn't have all three.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_03: Probably not.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_03: You know, and I'm I'm finding the way I look at a case is different also the the more I practice, the the more cases I'm exposed to.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_03: You know, it used to be that if it happened at work and there was an injury, I would take the case.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_03: And I think in workers' comp it's sort of the opposite of what you do.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_03: Now, if it I need more.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_03: So I need to know that it happened at work, there was an injury, and the person's either in need of medical treatment or in need of monetary benefits while they're out.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_03: Because my thing is that I'll only take on a case if I could do something better or different than either the person on their own or the person with another attorney.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_03: If I can't make uh my client's life better and and handle their case in a more efficient way, then why do they want to hire me to pay me a fee when all I'm doing is taking away their own benefits?
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_03: So that's how I look at it.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_03: But I I it's interesting that your perspective just changes on how you look at a case.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_05: And and now after all this experience and doing this for so long, you probably have a better perspective on finding those elements than we did when we first started.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_03: Definitely, definitely.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_03: So I had you fill out a little questionnaire before the podcast and you wrote something that really stood out to me.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_03: When I asked you about accomplishments, you did not immediately talk about verdicts, settlements, awards, or money.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_03: You talked about helping people get their confidence back after tragedy.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_05: Well, yeah, that's a big thing.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_05: You know, when people come to us, especially the the ones who are more injured, it just breaks them.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_05: Like the change in their lifestyle.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_05: You I've had clients that have gone out in a car to go get their hair done and didn't wind up home for four months because they had a car accident and wound up in a rehabilitation without a toothbrush.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_05: Like people and those types of things, they need more than just sign this piece of paper, I'm gonna do this.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_05: They need someone to come in, reassure them, reassure their family members, and get them to the point where they can start to move forward and think this isn't the end of their life.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_05: And could you imagine that leaving your home, going to the supermarket, and you're not home again?
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_03: For months, and then you don't feel like a human being.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_03: You feel yeah.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_03: So when I met Kathy, I worked as, I guess, a paralegal or a you know, legal secretary, and I worked for Kathy and her two partners that remain, Steve Miller and David Strano, all exceptional attorneys, and I was in college, and I will say that I learned how to practice law by working for Miller Montiel and Strano way more than I learned about how to be a lawyer from going to law school.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_03: Because you guys not only taught me how to write a motion, how to do legal research, but you taught me how to do it with compassion and you taught me how to do it with respect for the clients, and that is something that I built my own practice on all these years later.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, it it it it made a difference and it still does.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and that's one of the things I've always respected is how much the three of you genuinely care about your clients.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, we've been together for 32 years.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_03: That I mean that is a relationship that long exceeds many.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_05: I was gonna say, I don't want to go through the names of all the famous law firms we know that have broken up since then, but we've outlasted them all.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_05: And if it wasn't for our ages, we would do another 50 years.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_05: We absolutely love what we do.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_05: We all have our own strengths, we all focus on different areas.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_05: I I, for one, love and handle all the cases that come in with the little children, obviously.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_05: Being a mom, that's my forte.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_05: My partners, uh, Mr.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_05: Miller was doing um uh medical mind practice for so long.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_05: David is a whiz at labor lawyer, like everybody has their we can all do everything, but if I have a question, I'm going to them on those issues.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_05: And it's really been a long I've been with them longer than I've been married.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_03: That is wild.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_03: That is genuinely wild.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_03: So if you were to go back to the beginning of your legal career, what would 2026 Kathy tell the Kathy of back then?
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_05: Um You might lose, you might have a failure, you might not get everything you want.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_05: Not everybody might not love me, right?
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_05: You know, back then it was just so many facets that you had to be perfect on every level.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_05: And that's really unattainable.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_05: I would tell myself to chill out, be yourself, maintain the confidence that you have, and uh just to enjoy the process more.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_05: It goes fast, it goes so fast, it really does.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_05: And those days of stress were wasted.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_03: So tell me about your I'm not gonna say new because you've been doing it for a while, but you're sort of spreading the word on insurance coverage.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_03: I am.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_03: So tell us about that, and also tell us why it's important to spread the word.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_03: Spread in the gospel while you're doing it.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_05: So, okay, uh as we said before with the three elements, right?
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_05: Liability, damages.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_05: People think that they have these accidents and they're injured, but the one big aspect that people aren't aware of is a lot of recovery is if you're going to be financially successful and recover money in a case, is the amount of insurance either you have or the other person has.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_05: And in going through my cases and people come in and they show me what they have, looking at the insurance policies, it seems to me that a lot of the insurance that's sold benefits the insurance company and not the consumer.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_05: So people don't have insurance they need, they have insurance that they don't need.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_05: I've had many clients paying for spousal insurance that aren't married.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, at least so how do you know what you need?
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_05: So I guess going through the years and learning about insurance policies, we've become somewhat of an expert on this.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_05: We don't sell insurance.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_05: But what I've been doing is going to senior centers, going to libraries, and also offering free insurance reviews at my office so that I can take, even if you don't have a case, you have nothing to do with me.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_05: I take your insurance policy, I go through every line with the people, ask them if they really need it or if they don't, and we get them better insurance that's going to be more useful to them and cost them as little money as possible to maintain that insurance.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_03: So if somebody didn't have a case but wanted like an insurance coverage review, they could call your office and make an appointment.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_05: Free insurance reviews any day, anytime, anywhere.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_05: So how do you have time for that?
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_05: Um so I don't have a lot of hobbies.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_05: Okay.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_05: I'm an empty nester.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_05: Um yes, and it's just so important.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_05: And so I meet people at local libraries.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_05: I do seminars at libraries, and then I'll have people come there.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_05: Not everyone wants to travel to my office or me to go to their house.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_05: We meet at libraries or senior centers or public places, and we go through their policies.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_05: I've had people just email me, you know, people who are technologically savvy email me their policies.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_05: You know, you have people who have three cars who are paying for rental insurance.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_05: They're never renting a car, no matter what happens.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_05: You have people who are retired, who are paying for excess loss wage coverage.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_05: Things that people just don't need, and the insurance companies don't want you to know this.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_03: So you can go through the policy and say, well, maybe you need more of this, less of this, and and maybe can actually save some money.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_05: A thousand percent.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_05: And then God forbid something happens where they're sued or they want to sue someone, they have the right insurance to do so.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_03: Now you touched on something before, and it makes me a little teary-eyed because when I met you, you didn't have any babies, and now your babies have flown the coop.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_03: My babies have flown the coop, yes.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_03: So, what is it about motherhood that gave you the new and improved Catherine Munn's heel?
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_03: Because I think that's what did it.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_03: I do.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_03: Like I think that was like your rebirth when it came to who you were.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_05: So I have a 27-year-old son and a 21-year-old daughter.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_05: And if you ever want to be humbled in life and know that it's okay to make mistakes and not be so intense, have children, right?
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_05: Because they're gonna put you in your place.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_05: But also, even with my son and my daughter, I I think that I'm so proud of who they've become.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_05: They saw somebody who worked hard, who couldn't be everywhere, who tried to be and do as much for them as I could.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_05: But if I had to go to work, they respected that.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_05: You know, when I first had my son, I would never leave the house on the weekends.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_05: That was his time.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_05: And he was good with that.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_05: He knew I had to go to work even as a child.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_05: But if I went out on Saturday night, he'd go nuts.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_05: So I think it was showing them hard work, independence, and they're both doing amazing, and I'm very, a very proud mom.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_03: You should be proud.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_03: I'm sure they're proud of you too.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_03: I hope.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_03: Do you think that you are a better mother because you were a working mother?
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_03: A thousand percent.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_05: So I was lucky enough to have the ability and to go to work and not have to worry about my I have my husband was a retired police officer.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_05: He was the stay-at-home dad.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_05: Um I had my kids later in life, so by the time I had them, he was already retired.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_05: And he definitely had the better temperament for raising children and raising babies and playgrounds and letting them fall and get hurt.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_05: So, yeah, I'm a better mom to them because I was a working mom.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_05: I would have been way overbearing as a stay-at-home mom.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_03: I remember having my first daughter, and I I had a pretty long maternity leave with her.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_03: I think it was like four months, and I loved being home with her, but I was wearing pajamas all day, and I wasn't speaking to human beings other than my husband a couple of words a day, and I remember feeling sad about going back to work.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_03: I was gonna miss her, but feeling excited that I was going to feel like a human being again, and I remember feeling guilty about wanting to go back to work.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_03: And by the time second, third daughters were born, it was like, yeah, I'm a better mom because I get to play with you and love you and be the best mom I can be, but I also get to use my brain and talk to people and you know help contribute to our family income.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, for me it was it was a no-brainer.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_03: I I wanted to go to work.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, there are some people that are meant to be full-time moms, and there's some aren't.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_05: And I think you know, there's some shame in trying to recognize that.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, but whatever works best for everyone, I am definitely one of those be a full-time worker and part a full-time mom, yes.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_03: Um so I loved your answer on your questionnaire.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_03: You said people can struggle and still be successful.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_03: People can struggle with the balance and still be successful.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_03: And you're a perfect example of that because I don't think you realized you were struggling with it until you stopped struggling with it, right?
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_03: So you found the balance at some point.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_03: I found the balance.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_05: I found what made my brain work the best.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_05: Busy during the day, doing what I love, helping my clients, being a present mom when I got home at night, enjoying some downtime on the weekends.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_05: You know, this job doesn't allow for a lot of that.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_05: But yes, you have to recognize your strengths and weaknesses.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_05: It can't be what somebody else or society wants you to do.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_03: You said you don't have a lot of hobbies, but when you're not working or doing insurance seminars or reviews, what are you doing for fun?
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_05: So, um, what am I uh in the summer?
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_05: I am a pool and beach addict.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_05: So I just love to lay in the sun.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_05: I love to read for pleasure, right?
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_05: We don't get to do a lot of that during our work days.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_05: I'm reading law journals and books and cases, but I do love to read for pleasure.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_05: What's the last thing you read for pleasure?
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_05: I'm reading a book now called The Good Daughter, although I hate to say the word daughter because that Long Island accent is but I have Daughter.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_05: The Good Daughter, which actually is going to be a Netflix uh TV show soon.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_05: I didn't even realize that when I started reading it.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_05: I'll catch the Netflix version.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_05: I don't read for pleasure.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_05: It is a it's obviously it's based in law, but I am enjoying that.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_05: And you know, I'm a sports fan, so go Jets.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_05: I have bad teams that I like, but I am a sports fan.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_05: I know.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_05: Uh Pure Bar is one of my uh B-A-R-R-E, that is.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_05: So that's by ballet bar.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_05: That's my exercise.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_05: I like that.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_05: I like that.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_05: I don't do that, but I like that.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_05: That's like the newest thing.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_05: Well, you've been doing it a while.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, I've been doing this about five years, but it was yoga polite.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, so um that's probably about it.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_02: I don't have a lot of hobbies.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but you keep yourself pretty busy.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_02: I try.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_02: You want to play some laugh love law?
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_02: Of course.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, you want to grab the paddle.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_03: All right, let's play.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm gonna give you a topic.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_03: And if you absolutely love it, you're gonna hold up the love paddle.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_03: You can tell me a little story or not, up to you.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_03: If it's something that makes you chuckle, you can hold up the laugh panel, paddle, panel.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_03: I still haven't decided what they are.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_03: And then if you absolutely hate it, thumbs down.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not gonna hold up the law panel because that's the least fun of the three, right?
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_05: All right.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_05: The way we are with law, we probably would love the law one, but okay.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, true, but you know, we gotta make it fun.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_05: I'll accept it.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_03: All right.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_03: Are you ready?
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_03: I'm ready.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_03: All right, let's pull up your topics.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_03: High school reunions.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_03: Did you go to yours?
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_05: I did.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_05: You did?
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_03: When did they do it?
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_05: 25?
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_05: So they did it at 25.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_05: I don't want to say how many it would be now.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_05: But yeah.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_05: And I think it was really nice to see how everyone was doing and what became.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_05: I went to an all-girls Catholic school.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, wow.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_05: So it's a different kind of high school reunion than most people were going to.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_05: But yeah, and being in that all girls Catholic school was like being at a pajama party 25 a day.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_05: You never cared how you looked, you never cared how you acted, and freeing, yeah, fun.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_05: You know, I I think not that my kids have gone to, well, I don't even think they have them anymore, these schools that are all boys and all girls.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_05: But the Catholic schools, I think they still do.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, but I loved that.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_05: So that's a love.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_03: All right, that's a love.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_03: Potluck dinners.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_03: That's because you don't eat anything.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_05: I need to know what's coming.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_05: I'm gonna be surprised.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_03: All right.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_03: And and besides, potlucks everybody cook something.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not a fan either.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_03: Uh family vacations.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_03: Where's the last time?
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_03: When's the last time the four of you have gone away?
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_05: Uh uh well, my daughter graduated college on May 8th.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_05: So you were born in the Mayor.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_05: Well in Miami for college graduation.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_05: Before the That I can't answer the question, but this is an easy one because we just went there from Miami.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_05: Okay.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_03: Vacationing with older kids is really fun.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_03: It uh we were just talking about that with uh Leslie and Ken Locke talking about how it's different to travel with your kids when they want to eat good food and do fun things.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_03: It's so different than going to like Disney.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, that was a good one.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_03: Which to me, Disney, I will say it on the record, I don't care.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_03: I love Minnie, I love Mickey.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_03: Going to Disney is not a vacation, it's a trip.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_05: It's a job.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_05: It's it is it's work.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_03: It's worse than work.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and you might as well just sign your paycheck over there because I don't know.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_03: I took uh when my kids turn 13, we they go on a trip, like a mommy and me trip, and Lily, who's 17 now, wanted to go to Disney.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_03: We were there for a weekend.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_03: One day at the park with the fast pass, it's like a thousand dollars for two tickets.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_05: Very expensive.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_05: Pick another place.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_05: I'd rather do that with my kids at a beachside restaurant eating and drinking.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_05: They're all eat lobster.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_03: I'd be no um dream dinner guests.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_03: Dream dinner guests?
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_03: Would I love that?
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_03: Like, would you love to have dinner with you know somebody that's on your dreamy list?
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, yeah.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, and who would that be?
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_05: Frank Grillo.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_03: Wow.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_03: Does anybody know who that is?
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I know who that is.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_03: All right, all right.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_03: Um leaving voicemails.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_05: You like voice.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, oh no, that's a law one.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_05: You know why?
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_05: Because nobody listens to them.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_05: Nobody listens.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_05: Nobody ever listens.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_05: Everyone's voicemail box is full.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, it's nobody ever listens to them.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_03: And I have the visual voicemail.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_03: Do you have that where it it it writes it out for you anyway?
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_03: So just send me a text message.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, no.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I'd I'd rather.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_03: And then canceling plans.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_05: Am I canceling them or somebody else is canceling them?
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_03: It doesn't matter.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, no, that I don't care for.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_03: No?
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_05: No.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_03: See, I don't mind.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_03: Like, you know that you have to go out on a Friday night, but you're exhausted, and then you get the call, oh, can we reschedule?
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_03: I'm I'm cool with that.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, you know me.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_05: I'm like a very structured human being.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_05: If my brain knows that I'm doing that on Friday and then you cancel it, it's gonna mess me up.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_03: Alright, no to solve.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_03: Don't cancel plans of cafe.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_03: Um, okay, so are we ready to do a little capsule confessions?
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_03: Sure.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_03: All right, so you can put the paddles down.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_03: Now, here's the trick with this machine it requires a jiggle.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_03: Then you put the quarter in, then you turn.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_03: All right.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_03: And that's the quarter?
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_03: Well, no, that's the fancy token that doesn't fit in the machine.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, okay.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_03: But they're there for show.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_03: But in that same container, there are quarters.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_03: So in here, uh, the other one.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_03: Yep.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_03: So open it up.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_03: Let's see if Kathy pays attention to the rules here.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_05: Jiggle, turn, jiggle.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_03: Well, jiggle, turn, catch the ball.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_03: We'll see how you do.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_03: Alright, so the rules are here.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_03: You can either answer the question, you can ask me the question, or you can save the question for the next guest.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_03: You ready?
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_03: That was a good jiggle.
• 25:04
  unknown: Maybe not good enough.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, I think we're gonna have a turn there.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_05: Maybe I wasn't paying enough attention.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, oh, there you go.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think we've had a guest yet without a capsule confessions malfunction.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_03: Alright, the capsule just opened wide open for you there.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_03: What do you got?
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_05: Need the glasses for this one.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_05: Hold on.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_05: Not my best camera look.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_05: Okay.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_05: It's all good.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_05: What do you got?
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_05: Do I read the question out?
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_03: How else are we gonna know what it is?
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_05: What's your favorite thing about this stage of your life?
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_03: Ooh, that's a good question.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_05: I love that question.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_05: I'll I'll take it.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_05: Go ahead.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_05: Feeling confident in what you're doing.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_05: The anxiety, the nervousness, pretending you know what you're doing when you don't really know what you're doing and they want you to lie if you know what you're doing.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_05: I feel so confident in everything I'm doing now.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_05: I think that's this decade, the gift of this decade.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_05: You surpass the fake it till you make it.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: Now you know what you're doing.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_05: And I'm confident enough that if I don't know what I'm doing, I tell people and I refer them elsewhere.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_05: That's it.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_03: Know what you know and pass on what you don't.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_03: That's it.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_03: Alright, you want to do it again?
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_03: Sure.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_03: Do I have to put another quarter in?
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_03: Well, yeah.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_03: They're not free.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_03: Jiggle.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_05: Oh.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_03: She's a pro.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_05: That was not a mishap.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_02: No, she's a pro.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_02: What do you got?
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_02: Are you gonna need your glasses?
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_05: Oh unfortunately.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_05: That also comes with this decade.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_05: The needing of the glasses.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_05: I'll throw this to you.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_05: Alright, what is it?
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_05: What chapter of your life are you in now?
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_03: Ooh, that is a good question.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_03: Um I'm still in the reaching for my reaching for my dreams.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_03: Like I'm not there yet.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_03: I'm loving where I am.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_03: I feel great with my family, successful with my business, but I'm not there yet.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_03: I think there's more, and the more might extend beyond the law.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_03: So we'll see.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_03: Like doing a podcast.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, maybe.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you never know.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you're great at it.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, we'll see.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_03: And then you have to do one more because it's three.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_03: Oh.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so quarter, jiggle, turn.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_05: Is it three like in that live love?
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I feel like three is a good number, right?
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_03: Three quarters, three daughters.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_03: You know, three's good.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_05: It is.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it is.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know, Kathy.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_03: You have done the best with the uh with the catching the capsules.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_05: There you go.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_00: Alright, what do you got?
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_00: Glasses on first.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_00: That's so terrible.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_05: Okay.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_05: You have 30 seconds to teach us something random.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_05: Go.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_05: Good.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_05: Um, I can name the 50 states in 30 seconds.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_03: Can you do it in song?
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_03: I do in song.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_03: You ready?
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_03: One, two, three, let's go.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_01: Alabama, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Connecticut, Florida, Georgia, Hawaii, Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, South Dakota, Tennessee, Texas, Vermont, Virginia, Washington, West Virginia, West Wisconsin, Wyoming.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_05: You're the singer.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_03: That was awesome.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_03: And um on that note, you like that note?
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_03: Note, I got it.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, I have a really cute little hoodie for you.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I love swag.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_00: You can wear after bar class.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_00: Why thank you.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you gotta represent.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_03: I definitely will.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_03: And then your last chore, I need you to take out the fancy token, you know, one in that same quarter jug, yeah.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_03: I need you to give us a little signature and then drop it in the other jar because we'll keep a memory of our little time together here today.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_03: It was, and I mean, we could probably record our state song and you know, have another successful career.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_02: If editing can get my voice out of it, because I know you are the performer, but oh, come on, it was pretty good.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_03: I'm impressed.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_03: And Kathy, thank you so much for joining me today.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_03: And telling everybody about all the good stuff you're still doing more than 30 years into the practice of law.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you for being my friend and my mentor.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_03: And thank you all for listening until the next episode of Laugh Love.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_03: Laugh, love, law, yes, yes.