Latest / Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families / #970 Talking About Tragedies

Transcript

#970 Talking About Tragedies · Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families

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  Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast. It's the podcast for the
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  Speaker 1: time poor parent who just wants answers.
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  Speaker 2: Now every Tuesday we answer your questions. You can sentence
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  Speaker 2: your questions via podcasts at Happy families dot com dot
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  Speaker 2: you or Betty Yet Jump onto Happy families dot com
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  Speaker 2: dot Au press the easy to use button where you
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  Speaker 2: simply push the button and start talking and we'll do
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  Speaker 2: our best to answer your questions. Today two questions, one
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  Speaker 2: extremely serious and then the other about the everyday challenges
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  Speaker 2: of parenting.
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  Speaker 1: By now, everyone in Australia knows about the tragedy that
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  Speaker 1: happened over the weekend at Bondi Junction. You've been doing
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  Speaker 1: a lot of media around this. Number one question on
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  Speaker 1: any parent's mind at this time or in time of
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  Speaker 1: tragedy is how do I talk to my kids? What
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  Speaker 1: do I say to help alleviate the anxiety and worry,
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  Speaker 1: grief if it is close to home, and deep sadness
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  Speaker 1: that comes at times like this. What do we say?
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  Speaker 2: So I'm going to go back a step, and what
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  Speaker 2: I want to really emphasize is that your children don't
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  Speaker 2: need to see it. The rolling coverage, even when I've
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  Speaker 2: been on the TV and I've just been watching what's
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  Speaker 2: happening in the studio. It is traumatizing, it is devastating.
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  Speaker 2: It's horrific to watch this playing out. It's one thing
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  Speaker 2: to hear about it. It's another thing entirely to watch it,
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  Speaker 2: and it is frightening. I'm going to say this really clearly,
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  Speaker 2: not just about the kids, but about you. If you
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  Speaker 2: listening to a Happy Families podcast right now, give yourself
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  Speaker 2: a week away from the news because it is horrible.
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  Speaker 2: It's absolutely horrible. Just don't check the news sites, stay away,
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  Speaker 2: give yourself a break. I'm sure that you've felt your
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  Speaker 2: anxiety increasing. I'm sure that it just feels absolutely terrifying.
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  Speaker 2: Take a break, be outside, breathe, touch the grass, put
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  Speaker 2: the phone away, do something other than watch the news,
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  Speaker 2: because it's terrible for you. And it's the same with
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  Speaker 2: the kids. They need to know that the world is
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  Speaker 2: say from predict believe when it's not, and the best
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  Speaker 2: thing that we can do for them is to keep
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  Speaker 2: it away from them as much as possible.
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  Speaker 1: So I guess the next step is what do we
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  Speaker 1: actually say to our kids if they find out Because
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  Speaker 1: the reality is, especially our kids in high school who
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  Speaker 1: have got their own phones, it's coming through their feeds
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  Speaker 1: seeing it, they're talking about it. How do we actually
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  Speaker 1: help alleviate the challenges that are associated with them being
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  Speaker 1: aware of stuff that has the capacity to create high
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  Speaker 1: levels of anxiety and stress.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, so I'm going to mention a handful of things.
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  Speaker 2: First off, assuming that they have reasonable distance from the tragedy,
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  Speaker 2: they're not personally affected. If your kids are seeing this,
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  Speaker 2: they're probably going to talk about it. So here's our
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  Speaker 2: job as parents. We need to Number one, acknowledge the
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  Speaker 2: awfulness of it, and that's not hard. Just see, this
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  Speaker 2: is terrible. This is just terrible. Number two, ask them
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  Speaker 2: how it's made them feel. Say what you see in
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  Speaker 2: terms of feelings. You seem really worried about this. This
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  Speaker 2: seems like it's really freaked you out. You seem pretty upset.
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  Speaker 2: It seems like you don't want to go out as
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  Speaker 2: a result of what you saw. If it's affecting them
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  Speaker 2: that way, But wherever they're at, just acknowledge what you're seeing.
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  Speaker 2: Next thing, ask them if they have any questions. You've
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  Speaker 2: obviously seen this, you've obviously heard about it. What questions
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  Speaker 2: do you have or what are the kids at school saying,
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  Speaker 2: or what has your conversation in your head been, what
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  Speaker 2: do you want to talk about it in relation to it.
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  Speaker 2: You're not trying to be their therapist. You're just asking
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  Speaker 2: them what questions they have.
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  Speaker 1: So when a child comes to you with a question
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  Speaker 1: that you don't have an answer to, especially at a
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  Speaker 1: time like this, and it's creating significant anxiety, what can
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  Speaker 1: we as parents do? What do we say in that moment?
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  Speaker 2: I just think you answer really briefly, and you answer honestly,
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  Speaker 2: You answer in an age appropriate way. Because they don't
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  Speaker 2: need everything. I talk about the fire hose all the time.
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  Speaker 2: Don't turn on the fire hose. When someone wants a drink.
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  Speaker 2: Just give them a glass of water, let them have
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  Speaker 2: a sip, and if they need to top up and
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  Speaker 2: give it to them because they ask for it. So
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  Speaker 2: they don't need to know and hear everything. And the
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  Speaker 2: reality is you probably don't know a whole lot, and
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  Speaker 2: so don't make up answers. Just say I don't know.
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  Speaker 2: Get comfortable saying I don't know. I think that's perfectly
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  Speaker 2: fine to do. And for me, one of the biggest
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  Speaker 2: things that we can do, one of the centrally important
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  Speaker 2: things that we can do is reassure the kids that
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  Speaker 2: this is unusual. This is staggeringly uncommon. I can think
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  Speaker 2: of two incidents that have been catastrophically tragic in Sydney
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  Speaker 2: let alone in Australia in the last dozen or so years.
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  Speaker 2: There was the Link Cafe siege, and there's what's happened
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  Speaker 2: at Bondi Westfield. There may have been other things that
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  Speaker 2: have happened. I mean, we can go back to nineteen
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  Speaker 2: ninety six and Port Arthur. I guess my point is
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  Speaker 2: there are so few of these kinds of things that
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  Speaker 2: happen in this country. It is a beautifully, wonderfully phenomenally
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  Speaker 2: safe country, and our kids need to know that they've
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  Speaker 2: been to the shops so many times nothing like that
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  Speaker 2: has ever happened to them. This is the only time
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  Speaker 2: that we've heard of it happening. Let's get back out there,
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  Speaker 2: let's get back on the horse. Avoidance reinforces anxiety, and
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  Speaker 2: so I would be really really keen to number one,
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  Speaker 2: help them to avoid the news completely, because then there
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  Speaker 2: won't be anxiety. But if they've seen it, get them
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  Speaker 2: back into life as soon as you can, jump on
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  Speaker 2: the bike, go for a ride, go to the park,
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  Speaker 2: Go to places where you know that you can feel
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  Speaker 2: safe and get back into life.
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  Speaker 1: Our second question comes from Kayleen. We love receiving your questions,
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  Speaker 1: and if you've got one for us.
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  Speaker 2: Go to Happy Families dot com dot you. We've got
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  Speaker 2: a button that you can push and then you talk
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  Speaker 2: about it button and people are starting to use it,
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  Speaker 2: but I want everyone to use that. It's so good.
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  Speaker 2: Push the button, start talking, tell us what's on your mind,
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  Speaker 2: and we will do our best to answer your questions.
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  Speaker 1: Kaylen sent us an email and she said.
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  Speaker 2: Mae, yeah, she didn't use the button.
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  Speaker 1: She said, my family isn't struggled town in a big way.
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  Speaker 1: I've heard you, and I'm working hard on connecting, getting
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  Speaker 1: curious and all that stuff. But what are we supposed
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  Speaker 1: to do when we are consistently met with I don't
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  Speaker 1: know nothing. I don't want to usually after being ignored
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  Speaker 1: when making polite, respectful requests and then being yelled at
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  Speaker 1: when you're holding the boundary or expectation. We simply can't
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  Speaker 1: let them play, definitely when it's bedtime. We can't let
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  Speaker 1: them never brush their teeth, hit one another, call each
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  Speaker 1: other names, or speak to one another like their dirt
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  Speaker 1: under one another's feet. How do we work with this?
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  Speaker 1: We're exhausted, and every day is about it.
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  Speaker 2: Lately, Kaylen added some contexts well, Kylie, she said that
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  Speaker 2: they've got three kids at home, six, eight, and fourteen,
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  Speaker 2: and there's a lot of neurodivergence in the family. Really
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  Speaker 2: wanting everyone to feel happier and respected and considered. But
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  Speaker 2: you can hear how challenging this is. So I'm hearing
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  Speaker 2: Kayleen's plea, and there are a couple of things that
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  Speaker 2: stand out to me. First off, timing is everything. When
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  Speaker 2: we try to talk to our children and they're emotional,
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  Speaker 2: we tend to get responses like I don't know and nothing,
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  Speaker 2: and I don't want to Our timing matters enormously. Now,
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  Speaker 2: I know that's not the crux of what Kaylin's asking,
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  Speaker 2: but I wanted to highlight that because if the kids
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  Speaker 2: are a bit emotional, if they're really engaged in what
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  Speaker 2: they're doing, we're not going to be able to have
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  Speaker 2: productive and effective conversations with them. We're going to get
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  Speaker 2: reactions that are uncomfortable and difficult and annoying and frustrating
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  Speaker 2: and often inflammatory. High emotions, low intelligence. Sometimes you do
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  Speaker 2: just have to deal with it in the moment. But
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  Speaker 2: what I would encourage, where possible is deal with challenges
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  Speaker 2: at appropriate times, at good times, at times where everybody's
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  Speaker 2: in the mood for having a conversation and is available
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  Speaker 2: to talk, rather than in the moment.
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  Speaker 1: When I'm reading this, I may have this wrong, but
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  Speaker 1: I kind of feel like there is this tendency to
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  Speaker 1: want to be this gentle, loving parent and not raise
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  Speaker 1: our voices, and we feel like the only way we
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  Speaker 1: can do that when our kids push back is to
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  Speaker 1: acquiesce and let them keep going. But what happens when
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  Speaker 1: in moment we're stuck with a kid who keeps hurting
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  Speaker 1: their sibling and we're trying our best to be respectful
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  Speaker 1: and be kind and help. How do we actually deal
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  Speaker 1: with things in the moment? Because you're saying timing matters
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  Speaker 1: and we can't always have these beautiful, thought provoking conversations
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  Speaker 1: with the kids. Tell me about your feelings, So what
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  Speaker 1: happens in the moment.
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  Speaker 2: In the moment, I think we need to remember that
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  Speaker 2: sometimes there's just no such thing as perfect. I mean,
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  Speaker 2: every now and again, I'll tell a story where I've
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  Speaker 2: nailed it, or you've nailed or another parent has just
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  Speaker 2: gotten this so right. But most of the time perfect
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  Speaker 2: doesn't exist, and the more we push for perfect, the
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  Speaker 2: more frustrated we will be at ourselves and also at
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  Speaker 2: our children for ruining our otherwise perfect and well planned lives.
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  Speaker 2: We sometimes just have to do what we have to
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  Speaker 2: do to get kids out of trouble or to There
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  Speaker 2: are times where I had to pick up a child
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  Speaker 2: and literally put them over my shoulder and carry them
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  Speaker 2: out of the shops, or carry them out of the park,
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  Speaker 2: or carry them out of wherever it is that cousin's
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  Speaker 2: house because they were refusing to leave. And I want
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  Speaker 2: to be kind, I want to be really gentle, I
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  Speaker 2: want to be compassionate with my children, but sometimes they
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  Speaker 2: just have to get in the car, or sometimes they
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  Speaker 2: do just have to go to bed. It doesn't ever
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  Speaker 2: feel good to be overly controlling and forceful, but sometimes
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  Speaker 2: we need to do that. We want to do it
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  Speaker 2: as gently as we can, We want to do it
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  Speaker 2: as softly and considerately and compassionate as we can, but
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  Speaker 2: sometimes we just need a result, and in that case
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  Speaker 2: we have to take it. The thing is, though those
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  Speaker 2: instances are rare, they are vanishingly small if we can
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  Speaker 2: set things up ahead of time and be proactive, And
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  Speaker 2: that's probably where I'd like to focus. You and I
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  Speaker 2: have spoken many many times about how rather than addressing
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  Speaker 2: things in the moment, we'll address things on the weekend.
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  Speaker 2: We sit down and have our family meeting on a Sunday,
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  Speaker 2: and we say to the kids, what's gone well this week,
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  Speaker 2: let's celebrate us successes. What hasn't gone well? Oh yeah,
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  Speaker 2: there's been a lot of this happening, or there's been
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  Speaker 2: a lot of that happening. And it's a non targeted
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  Speaker 2: way to address the challenges in the family and then
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  Speaker 2: make plans. All right, what's one thing we're going to
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  Speaker 2: work on this week so that we can make our
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  Speaker 2: family feel better, get everyone aligned, everyone on the same page,
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  Speaker 2: and put together a plan. Yeah, we're going to work
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  Speaker 2: on being kind of okay, what are two or three
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  Speaker 2: strategies that we can implement to get this right?
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  Speaker 1: Well, I just want to add some clarity because you've
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  Speaker 1: acknowledged that we don't deal with things in the moment. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: And the reality is that all of those situations need
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  Speaker 1: to be dealt with in the moment, but the conversations
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  Speaker 1: where learning takes place. Don't happen in those moments.
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  Speaker 2: What a great way to say it. Yeah, yeah, don't
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  Speaker 2: get rational in the moment, just deal with things.
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  Speaker 1: So one of the things that I absolutely love about
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  Speaker 1: our family meetings is it's actually, in some ways, the
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  Speaker 1: kids are running the conversation. It's not you and I
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  Speaker 1: sitting up the front of the room and saying, Okay,
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  Speaker 1: here's what I've seen kids, this is what we're upset
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  Speaker 1: about this week. This is what hasn't gone well. You
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  Speaker 1: didn't do that. There is none of that. We sit
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  Speaker 1: down and we actually ask the kids. We're the last
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  Speaker 1: ones to speak in that conversation. We ask the kids
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  Speaker 1: what they have seen has gone really well. We celebrate
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  Speaker 1: the successes, and we're able to do that together. Then
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  Speaker 1: when we ask them what didn't go well, it's them
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  Speaker 1: who leads the conversation. They are the ones who recognize
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  Speaker 1: and know that things don't feel great when we're at
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  Speaker 1: each other, and there is an absolute acknowledgment that they
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  Speaker 1: take part in that process to.
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  Speaker 2: The extent that we can as well. We do have
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  Speaker 2: treats during this conversation. Like this family meeting is meant
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  Speaker 2: to be an easy, fun conversation about helping our family
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  Speaker 2: to function better, and so we do everything we can
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  Speaker 2: in that meeting to help the kids want to be
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  Speaker 2: there and enjoy the opportunity that they have a voice
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  Speaker 2: in the way the family operates.
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  Speaker 1: And then when it comes to that third question, what
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  Speaker 1: are we going to focus on this week, it's the kids.
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  Speaker 1: They look at the list, they see what's gone wrong
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  Speaker 1: during the week or what has hasn't gone well, and
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  Speaker 1: they're the ones who want to rectify it. We haven't
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  Speaker 1: been really kind to each other this week, and our
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  Speaker 1: home hasn't felt great. I think that that is where
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  Speaker 1: the power comes from having those meetings.
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  Speaker 2: So Kaylin, what I would say is when the kids
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  Speaker 2: are ignoring you, or when the kids say I don't know,
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  Speaker 2: or when the kids say nothing. As a parent, it's
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  Speaker 2: your job to hold lines, hold boundaries, be considerate, consider timing,
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  Speaker 2: considering your children's emotional state. Look at whether they've got
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  Speaker 2: food in their berey, how tired they are, all those
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  Speaker 2: sorts of things, and respond accordingly. But results are necessary.
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  Speaker 2: When it's bedtime, it's bedtime, so work out what needs
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  Speaker 2: to happen. Or if the kids are calling each other names,
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  Speaker 2: intervene but do it as gently as you can and
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  Speaker 2: then kick it down the road. And on Sunday you
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  Speaker 2: have that family meeting. What went well, what didn't? What
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  Speaker 2: can we work on? And bit by bit things improve
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  Speaker 2: and then you backslide, and then they improve, and then
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  Speaker 2: you backslide and then they improve. That's family life.
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  Speaker 1: And that's again where the power comes in those regular
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  Speaker 1: family meetings because there's accountability. Everyone's held to a level
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  Speaker 1: of accountability.
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  Speaker 2: So, Kaylene, we really hope that that helps to answer
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  Speaker 2: those questions that you have. Good luck. Look, parenting life,
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  Speaker 2: family life, it is messy, It really is challenging. But
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  Speaker 2: but but hopefully those principles will be useful for you.
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  Speaker 2: If you have questions for us, please jump onto Happy
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: families dot com dot you use the button talk to us,
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: let us know what's on your mind. The more prepared
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: you are with your question, the easier it will be
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: for us to put you on the podcast and answer
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: your questions to make your family function better. Tomorrow a
• 13:36
  Speaker 2: really important conversation about pregnancy and infant loss. And then
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: on Thursday this week in parenting our favorite podcast ever.
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  Speaker 2: The Happy Families podcast is produced by Justin Rawan from
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  Speaker 2: your family happier, please visit happyfamilies dot com dot au
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