Latest / Pit Talk / Antonelli reasserts control + McLaren's big upgrade: Hungarian GP Preview

Transcript

Antonelli reasserts control + McLaren's big upgrade: Hungarian GP Preview · Pit Talk

0:05
Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to PIP Talk, brought to you by Shaddons.
0:08
Speaker 1: On today's episode, Andrea Kimi Antonali leads the championship by
0:12
Speaker 1: forty five points ahead of the final round before the
0:15
Speaker 1: mid season break. After another disastrous weekend for teammates, George
0:19
Speaker 1: Russell and we look ahead to this weekend's Hungarian Grand
0:22
Speaker 1: Prix and what big upgrades for two key teams could
0:25
Speaker 1: mean for the rest of the season. My name's Michael Lamonado.
0:28
Speaker 1: It's great to have your company and the company of
0:30
Speaker 1: my co host. After seeing what spar Frank Maschaum looked
0:33
Speaker 1: like under the twenty six rules, he's feeling nostalgic for
0:35
Speaker 1: the twenty twenty one Belgian Grand Prix. It's Matt Clayton
0:39
Speaker 1: at Lisa.
0:39
Speaker 2: Twenty twenty one Belgian Grand Prix gave us a lot
0:42
Speaker 2: to write about with very laps to actually watch. That
0:44
Speaker 2: was the one of the worst lights to be a
0:46
Speaker 2: Formula one journalist based in this country. But i gotta
0:50
Speaker 2: say Belgium this weekend a bit of a struggle in
0:53
Speaker 2: the Murdor GP mid season break and I'm feeling a
0:55
Speaker 2: bit like a Formula one twenty twenty six enginey that
0:57
Speaker 2: I'm sort of mildly fit for purpose, mostly useless and
1:01
Speaker 2: running out of energy quite quickly and often criticized this week,
1:04
Speaker 2: so it's definitely been one of those weeks. But yeah,
1:06
Speaker 2: looking forward, Hungry is funny, isn't that Hungry's actually become
1:09
Speaker 2: a race that's one that you look forward to on
1:11
Speaker 2: the calendar where itever used to be that because this
1:13
Speaker 2: weekend we might actually see these cars somewhat unleashed by
1:17
Speaker 2: twenty twenty six standards.
1:18
Speaker 1: It's funny. It's not that long ago. I remember thinking Hungry.
1:21
Speaker 1: Hungry was all I think from memory, and this is
1:23
Speaker 1: me totally making up the reasoning. But it was one
1:25
Speaker 1: of those races back when we had a reasonable number
1:27
Speaker 1: of Grand Prix that Martin Brundle would normally choosese his
1:29
Speaker 1: rusted race off because it was inevitably quite an uneventful
1:32
Speaker 1: Grand Prix, is my assumption. But now it's actually, even
1:35
Speaker 1: notwithstanding these engines and why this might actually bring out
1:38
Speaker 1: the best of these cars, in recent years, it's become
1:40
Speaker 1: quite a good race in its own right. For whatever reason,
1:43
Speaker 1: the cars have fit the circuit. So there's a lot
1:45
Speaker 1: to look forward to this weekend. We will get to
1:48
Speaker 1: some of the specifics of this weekend in a moment,
1:51
Speaker 1: but let's cover off some of what we've missed in
1:53
Speaker 1: the interim days since you and I have been struggling
1:56
Speaker 1: with various illnesses. Yes, and I've had to record this
1:58
Speaker 1: podcast quite late. One of them is, of course, but
2:01
Speaker 1: the championship picture has either changed or reverted to what
2:04
Speaker 1: it was about three weeks ago, which is Antonelli has
2:06
Speaker 1: re established quite a handy lead at the top of
2:09
Speaker 1: the title table. He won in Belgium very much restored
2:13
Speaker 1: order after three races in which didn't score a lot
2:16
Speaker 1: of points, mostly not for his own fault, but nonetheless
2:18
Speaker 1: proved that it's nothing that rattled him. But there was
2:20
Speaker 1: George Russell, on the other hand, crashing out of the
2:22
Speaker 1: race with Lewis Hamilton's and it must be a nice
2:25
Speaker 1: change for Mercedes in a weird way, not a technical
2:27
Speaker 1: retirement per se, but a technical reason for it, because
2:30
Speaker 1: the story of that race very much was these engines
2:33
Speaker 1: a not being a very good match for this circuit,
2:35
Speaker 1: but also another level of understanding of the dissatisfaction the
2:40
Speaker 1: drivers and even increasingly some of the teams have with
2:43
Speaker 1: how these engines work. George Russell sums it up in
2:45
Speaker 1: a message that couldn't possibly re repeat it on a
2:47
Speaker 1: podcast like this, But this felt like a real nadea
2:50
Speaker 1: for the story of this year.
2:52
Speaker 2: Yeah, it did a little bit. I felt a little
2:54
Speaker 2: bit sorry for Sky on the weekend because they had
2:56
Speaker 2: one British driver crashing into another British driver. So do
2:58
Speaker 2: you lower the union jack to half mastered that immediately
3:01
Speaker 2: put it back up again. I'm not exactly sure how
3:03
Speaker 2: that works, but it was. It's interesting. The two tracks
3:06
Speaker 2: this year that have made me feel probably the saddest
3:09
Speaker 2: with these engines are Suzuka and Spa, and they're on
3:11
Speaker 2: most people's list of two of the best three or
3:14
Speaker 2: four tracks in Formula one. The tracks haven't changed very much.
3:17
Speaker 2: It's just the way we went into these two rounds
3:20
Speaker 2: with a bit of foreboding, our guess and probably knowing
3:24
Speaker 2: how things were going to play out. And it was
3:26
Speaker 2: very much in evidence at SPA because we know what
3:28
Speaker 2: a classic circuit that is and how fast and flowing
3:30
Speaker 2: it is. But there's not enough big breaking areas to
3:33
Speaker 2: really recharge the battery, and the racing was going to
3:35
Speaker 2: be compromised to a degree, and it was interesting in
3:39
Speaker 2: that you saw the way the teams kind of converged
3:42
Speaker 2: on the same solution to deploy the limited battery that
3:46
Speaker 2: they have and sector one and three go for your life.
3:48
Speaker 2: That's fine. Sector two and that double left hander at
3:51
Speaker 2: Puhon is one of those ones. It's almoly, the absolutely
3:53
Speaker 2: fantastic quarner. In qualifying, it just looked a bit sad. Really.
3:56
Speaker 2: It reminded me of the backshicaded Albert Park. But going
3:59
Speaker 2: back to what you were saying before, in terms of
4:00
Speaker 2: the championship picture, I think the latter option that you chose,
4:02
Speaker 2: this feels more like where we were three or four
4:06
Speaker 2: races ago in terms of the size of Kimmy Antonelli's margin.
4:09
Speaker 2: So it feels representative because regardless of what happened with
4:13
Speaker 2: Russell on the first lap at Belgium, it felt like
4:16
Speaker 2: an Antonelli weekend, the entire weekend from start to finish,
4:18
Speaker 2: and so it was a damage limitation exercise at best
4:21
Speaker 2: for Russell. So it feels like the championship picture is
4:24
Speaker 2: kind of where it should be. I guess the good
4:26
Speaker 2: news if you're Kimy Antonelli is that your three or
4:28
Speaker 2: four races down the road. Now, I mean we're basically
4:30
Speaker 2: at the halfway point of the season. Now, it is
4:32
Speaker 2: a pretty sizeable advantage, and you are starting to ask you,
4:38
Speaker 2: I know I'm doing this. I'm sure you're doing the
4:39
Speaker 2: same thing. You're starting to ask yourself the question, Well,
4:41
Speaker 2: if he doesn't win it, then who does. And it's very,
4:44
Speaker 2: very hard to come up with credible arguments for who
4:48
Speaker 2: might unseat him at this point because maybe some of
4:51
Speaker 2: the questions that we'd had about him from his rookie
4:53
Speaker 2: year that were probably justified just in terms of the
4:56
Speaker 2: inconsistency and Imberry went on that really terrible run of
4:59
Speaker 2: points scoring races in Europe in the tracks that he knew,
5:02
Speaker 2: and all of those things feel like three years ago.
5:04
Speaker 1: Now.
5:04
Speaker 2: It's amazing how far he's moved the game along. Now
5:07
Speaker 2: we forget how young he still is. But it looks
5:09
Speaker 2: right and it feels right, and irrespective of what happened
5:12
Speaker 2: to Russell in the first lap and how it happened,
5:13
Speaker 2: which I'm sure we're going to get into, this feels
5:16
Speaker 2: like an appropriate championship margin right now because he is
5:19
Speaker 2: just the best guy going at the moment, and as
5:21
Speaker 2: you said, reverse some of the lower points scoring rounds
5:24
Speaker 2: that maybe were not necessarily his fault, but this kind
5:26
Speaker 2: of feels just right now.
5:28
Speaker 1: I think it's the the unshakableness of his position is
5:34
Speaker 1: what's impressing me most more than just the pace, because
5:36
Speaker 1: the pace is established now, you know, we're ten rounds
5:38
Speaker 1: into the season. It's been clear for a long time
5:39
Speaker 1: that he's had the pace. Even last year. Late last
5:42
Speaker 1: year he saw the flashes of what Mercedes understood was
5:44
Speaker 1: within him. But it's the fact, and this was this
5:47
Speaker 1: is a big thing that I wanted to watch going
5:48
Speaker 1: into the SPA weekend. He had these three kind of
5:51
Speaker 1: ordinary races. They weren't his fault. That doesn't mean they're
5:53
Speaker 1: not frustrating for a driver. Just look at what happened
5:55
Speaker 1: with George Russell. Maybe Russell was getting you know, it's
5:58
Speaker 1: a bit of a stretch to say it, but he
5:59
Speaker 1: had a bit of momentum at least on the scoreboard
6:01
Speaker 1: if you like, if not in actual pace terms. You know,
6:04
Speaker 1: for a nineteen year old, these might have been the
6:06
Speaker 1: conditions that triggered who knows what, you know, a little
6:09
Speaker 1: bit of a fumble, a little bit of extra pressure
6:11
Speaker 1: on yourself, that kind of thing. No sign of that
6:13
Speaker 1: at all. As you say, it was start to finish
6:14
Speaker 1: an anton early weekend pretty much that. Of course, you
6:16
Speaker 1: can add the astroisquaal. He still has such a healthy
6:18
Speaker 1: championship lead even before this that you didn't have to
6:20
Speaker 1: feel that pressure. But again, I come back to the point,
6:23
Speaker 1: he's nineteen years old. You know there's anything could back
6:25
Speaker 1: a nineteen year old feel pressure, could be anything, could
6:27
Speaker 1: still be anything. I guess that's the other element of
6:30
Speaker 1: this season. But it doesn't. It feels like there's no
6:34
Speaker 1: almost no real questions left to throw at him other
6:37
Speaker 1: than can him and his cart actually get to the
6:39
Speaker 1: finish well?
6:40
Speaker 2: And let's just ignore the date on the birth certificate here.
6:43
Speaker 2: Let's rewind twelve months where you had a similar driver,
6:46
Speaker 2: young in their career, who'd never really been at the
6:48
Speaker 2: sharp end before, with Oscar Piastre. And you know Piastre
6:51
Speaker 2: had the Baku weekend. That was the weekend you look
6:53
Speaker 2: back and go, oh, hang on, the wheels are a
6:55
Speaker 2: little wobbly here. Now you never say never wear these
6:57
Speaker 2: sorts of things. I can't see a Baku weekend inverted
7:00
Speaker 2: commers for Antonelli, just because of the way he's going
7:03
Speaker 2: about it. You could also argue that Mercedes has a
7:05
Speaker 2: greater advantage over everybody else in twenty twenty six than
7:08
Speaker 2: McLaren had in twenty five. But you know, you have
7:11
Speaker 2: to keep reminding yourself. He is nineteen years old. He
7:13
Speaker 2: has never been here before, so one of two things
7:16
Speaker 2: can be true, or maybe both of them can. He's
7:17
Speaker 2: either so inexperiences, so naive to the pressures of leading
7:21
Speaker 2: before with the World World Championship that it hasn't actually
7:23
Speaker 2: occurred to him, or maybe he is just this good.
7:26
Speaker 2: And I've been wanting to share this anecdote with you
7:28
Speaker 2: for a while, and I'm going to share it on
7:29
Speaker 2: the podcast just so I get a genuine reaction from you.
7:32
Speaker 2: I had a just off topic here. I had a
7:35
Speaker 2: lengthy chat with a long, long time Formula one journalist
7:38
Speaker 2: colleague of mine that I haven't seen for a while,
7:40
Speaker 2: a guy that was covering the sport in the nineteen
7:41
Speaker 2: sixties through to now, and I we're talking about the
7:44
Speaker 2: current season. He's a long out of the sport these days.
7:46
Speaker 2: And I said to him, who does Antonelli remind you of?
7:48
Speaker 2: And he said, I feel like I have to whisper
7:50
Speaker 2: this because this is literally sacrilege. But he's the best
7:53
Speaker 2: prospect at this age, this stage of his career that
7:55
Speaker 2: I've seen since dain Center. Right, very good, and I'm thinking, okay,
7:59
Speaker 2: now this is and this isn't a guy who's prone
8:01
Speaker 2: to hyperbole either, And you look at the way he's
8:05
Speaker 2: going about this now. I mean, obviously he said arguably
8:08
Speaker 2: greatest of all time. We know what he did with
8:10
Speaker 2: his career, But in terms of where Antonelli is and
8:12
Speaker 2: the way he's ticking off these challenges they come along,
8:15
Speaker 2: it certainly feels like you're on something resembling a trajectory
8:17
Speaker 2: to that, because he just seems pretty unshakable right now.
8:20
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's something similar to what we spoke about with
8:23
Speaker 1: Oscar last year as well, although you know, maybe this
8:25
Speaker 1: year makes that feel a little bit more flawed. But
8:28
Speaker 1: even if for whatever reason, the points and advantage doesn't
8:31
Speaker 1: have now it turns into a championship at what will
8:33
Speaker 1: be twenty years old by the end of the year, Yeah,
8:36
Speaker 1: he's going to have opportunities. He's had one of the
8:38
Speaker 1: top teams, Opportunities will come his way and he'll continue
8:40
Speaker 1: to get better. And that's the probably alarming thing. If
8:42
Speaker 1: it's someone like George Russell. I want to look at
8:45
Speaker 1: the equation for him now because for me this incident
8:48
Speaker 1: I think has been overtaken a little bit by the
8:51
Speaker 1: engine chat that's ensued from it, because obviously he made
8:54
Speaker 1: it a great deal about the lack of power he
8:56
Speaker 1: had out of the first corner, out of Orouze in particular,
8:58
Speaker 1: and you could see that on the coverage being swamped
9:00
Speaker 1: by or Lewis Hamilton particular, both Ferraris. But then for
9:04
Speaker 1: me it's the move as well, and I think this is,
9:07
Speaker 1: as I say, being lost a little bit round the
9:09
Speaker 1: outside in the lat Colm you only had the speed advantage.
9:12
Speaker 1: He was past Hamilton, that's clear, but everyone you can
9:16
Speaker 1: know it's easy to know that in that position drivers
9:19
Speaker 1: are going to wash out. That chicane is a hot
9:20
Speaker 1: spot for action on the first lap. He's not the
9:23
Speaker 1: first driver who have ended up in that gravel. For me,
9:26
Speaker 1: that said something about his position in I guess it's
9:30
Speaker 1: a little bit of a split yet in the championship.
9:32
Speaker 1: On the one hand, knowing that he was facing another
9:35
Speaker 1: points loss, even though twenty five points down before Belgium
9:37
Speaker 1: it wasn't too bad. But also that need to assert
9:42
Speaker 1: something in the season, whether it's because he's had engine
9:46
Speaker 1: problems in the past he feels needs to rejustify them,
9:49
Speaker 1: or simply just that he's being lost in that narrative. Yes,
9:52
Speaker 1: that for me felt even if the stewards decided it
9:55
Speaker 1: wasn't at all his fault, which don't think it was
9:56
Speaker 1: his fault, but I don't think it was Hamilton's either,
9:59
Speaker 1: felt for me like the bigger error if you like.
10:02
Speaker 2: And this is the interesting part of this equation, right,
10:04
Speaker 2: is that he is the experienced campaigner in a very
10:07
Speaker 2: very good car if you say Russell's on pole. He
10:11
Speaker 2: goes off, leads the start of the race after getting
10:13
Speaker 2: back past the Stappen, and it's Antonelli in that position,
10:16
Speaker 2: and Antonelli goes for something that's a little bit questionable
10:19
Speaker 2: in a corner that has been a hot spot in
10:20
Speaker 2: the past and ends up in the gravel and it's
10:22
Speaker 2: all gone wrong and hemorrhages a load of points. We
10:24
Speaker 2: all just shrug and go, well, he's a nineteen year old,
10:26
Speaker 2: he's a second year driver, right, It's a completely explainable mistake,
10:30
Speaker 2: and you know, you want to get inside Georg Russell's
10:33
Speaker 2: head here, but there was an element of jumping his
10:36
Speaker 2: shadows a little bit, or not necessarily playing the long
10:39
Speaker 2: game because there's still forty four laps to goo. You're
10:41
Speaker 2: in a clearly very very good car. You are probably
10:44
Speaker 2: know you win your championships on your worst days, right,
10:47
Speaker 2: And he took a disadvantageous situation that he could have
10:50
Speaker 2: probably finished on the podium at the end of the
10:51
Speaker 2: race and you mitigate the points gap and you live
10:53
Speaker 2: to fight another day. And it just felt a little
10:56
Speaker 2: bit ill judged and probably gives you an idea as
11:00
Speaker 2: to the pressure that's being felt there because of the
11:03
Speaker 2: momentum within the team and the momentum of the World Championship.
11:05
Speaker 2: And how often in your career do you get a
11:08
Speaker 2: chance where your car is demonstrably the best in the
11:11
Speaker 2: field and you're one of two people who should win
11:13
Speaker 2: the World Championship. And it sort of goes back to
11:15
Speaker 2: the Piastre thing last year, doesn't it, Because it felt
11:17
Speaker 2: for the whole season that a McClaren was going to
11:19
Speaker 2: win the World Championship, and one of them eventually did.
11:21
Speaker 2: It took the long way around, but they got there.
11:23
Speaker 2: But that's also playing into it. But what's interesting for
11:26
Speaker 2: me is that the mistakes that Russell is making are
11:28
Speaker 2: the mistakes of a younger inexperienced there I say, teenage
11:31
Speaker 2: second year driver, not the other way around. You combine
11:35
Speaker 2: that with the points disadvantage that he's at, and one
11:38
Speaker 2: move doesn't define a season. But I think it really
11:40
Speaker 2: did give us a bit of insight into how this
11:43
Speaker 2: is playing out right now. And I guess the surprise
11:46
Speaker 2: on both counts is how each driver is handling that.
11:49
Speaker 2: And you know Lap one at SPA was a pretty
11:51
Speaker 2: classic example of that.
11:52
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, And just before we move on to
11:54
Speaker 1: briefly the engines and then to Hungry as well, I
11:56
Speaker 1: thought I've been thinking a little bit this week about
11:59
Speaker 1: the analogy it's been on before this season, and you've
12:01
Speaker 1: sort of mentioned it there that of course, when you've
12:03
Speaker 1: got one team at the front, it feels a bit
12:05
Speaker 1: like last year where for a lot of the year
12:06
Speaker 1: it seemed like it was definitely going to be McLaren
12:08
Speaker 1: driver of the staff and almost threatened that towards the end.
12:11
Speaker 1: This year that's clearly been the case as well, and
12:13
Speaker 1: you know, the younger drivers ahead fairly comfortably, and the
12:17
Speaker 1: other guy also happens to be British. I guess maybe
12:19
Speaker 1: that's part of it. He's trying to catch up what's
12:21
Speaker 1: going on there and the idea that Russell can replicate
12:25
Speaker 1: what Norris did, get a good run of form late
12:28
Speaker 1: overhaul Antonelli's it is now obviously and get the job done,
12:31
Speaker 1: and that could still happen. Obviously, it's half a season
12:33
Speaker 1: to go. But there are a couple of things that
12:35
Speaker 1: that make it different to me. One is that on
12:37
Speaker 1: pure form, Norris was never that far off ps I feel,
12:41
Speaker 1: and I've actually been interesting to go back and look
12:42
Speaker 1: at the numbers actually, but it never felt, you know,
12:45
Speaker 1: the margin between them was really more than I think
12:47
Speaker 1: off the top of my head fifteen points before that
12:49
Speaker 1: Dutch Grand Prix, it's always quite close. Norris was picking
12:52
Speaker 1: up more wins certainly than Russell was, even if some
12:54
Speaker 1: of them were somewhat controversial to say the least. There
12:58
Speaker 1: was that element of it. But the other element of
13:00
Speaker 1: it is that, and this is what maybe made the
13:03
Speaker 1: Norris recovery is that I think it definitely was a
13:06
Speaker 1: sense after the Dutch Grand Prix, when the margin blew out,
13:08
Speaker 1: that the pressure was off. He spoke about that, and
13:10
Speaker 1: I think that was genuine, because he definitely found form
13:12
Speaker 1: after that. Yes, the selection attracts and all that kind
13:14
Speaker 1: of stuff helped him, but there was definitely a degree
13:17
Speaker 1: of that if that was gonna happen for Russell, it
13:19
Speaker 1: should I think it should have happened already, shouldn't. He's
13:21
Speaker 1: had these big blows. I think he spoke about it
13:23
Speaker 1: as well after Monaco, saying, wow, I can't win the
13:26
Speaker 1: championship now, so the pressure's off. But I'm this Belgium
13:29
Speaker 1: incident suggests to me that he's not feeling that, and
13:32
Speaker 1: so the odds of replicating that form seem like a
13:35
Speaker 1: very long shot.
13:36
Speaker 2: And at the risk of sounding like George Russell's psychologist here,
13:39
Speaker 2: there's still at least eleven and perhaps thirteen rounds to
13:42
Speaker 2: go if I'm counting that correctly. No, actually twelve or
13:45
Speaker 2: fourteen if any. If we get to Saudi and Barra
13:47
Speaker 2: making the equation, there is still so much of this
13:50
Speaker 2: season still to go, and you are in the car
13:52
Speaker 2: that you want to be in, So it feels a
13:54
Speaker 2: little bit premature to do the whole of the ship
13:57
Speaker 2: is sinking, because you know these things come and go
14:00
Speaker 2: and and you know Anthonelli's not going to be lights
14:03
Speaker 2: out from here because this Formula one twenty twenty six,
14:05
Speaker 2: and there are going to be some stumbulls. So Russell's
14:08
Speaker 2: equation right now is to mitigate the points losses on
14:11
Speaker 2: the weekends where he's clearly running behind, which Belgium was,
14:14
Speaker 2: and if he'd taken the pot, if he finished third,
14:16
Speaker 2: it's only a ten point loss, that's fine, and then
14:18
Speaker 2: be ready to strike on the days where he where
14:21
Speaker 2: Anginelle falters and he will falter because it's just the
14:24
Speaker 2: nature of Formula one in twenty twenty six. I feel
14:26
Speaker 2: that the cars, more than the drivers, have far more
14:29
Speaker 2: saying how this championship is going. And you know, getting
14:31
Speaker 2: back to the engine question, it just feels a little
14:33
Speaker 2: premature to throw the baby and the bath water out
14:36
Speaker 2: at this point. So it's an interesting one. I just
14:40
Speaker 2: I can't stop thinking about the way each driver is
14:45
Speaker 2: handling their situations and then just transposing one driver for
14:48
Speaker 2: the other. It would make a lot more sense that way,
14:49
Speaker 2: wouldn't it.
14:50
Speaker 1: Yes, it is interesting the way this has developed in
14:54
Speaker 1: so many senses completely different to what we expect. It
14:57
Speaker 1: not only the championship lead element of it, but just
15:00
Speaker 1: the way they're playing those cards, and even the way
15:02
Speaker 1: that Mercedes has turned out, Let's be honest, the unreliability
15:04
Speaker 1: element not having the massive advantage, it looked like early
15:07
Speaker 1: everything feels different to expectation.
15:09
Speaker 2: Can I before you move on, and I know you
15:11
Speaker 2: want to, I want to pose this one to you
15:12
Speaker 2: completely unprompted. Here. We were talking about the Piastre Norris
15:16
Speaker 2: situation before, and it always felt maybe from an Australian lens,
15:21
Speaker 2: we're talking about the British lens. Before that Piastre was
15:23
Speaker 2: sort of fighting against the run of play within that team,
15:26
Speaker 2: and you know, are they prioritizing Norris and Papaya rules? God,
15:29
Speaker 2: I haven't said that for a while, all those sorts
15:31
Speaker 2: of things. Yeah, I know. But then you've got the
15:34
Speaker 2: situation where there's clearly, I mean Mercedes clearly see Antonelli
15:38
Speaker 2: as their north staff for the next however many years.
15:40
Speaker 2: So it kind of feels like the internal momentum or
15:44
Speaker 2: the just the way that team is not built around Antonelli,
15:48
Speaker 2: but it's much more in his favor than I ever
15:49
Speaker 2: felt McLaren was with Piastre, and so that adds a
15:52
Speaker 2: different dynamic to this championship fight where you've got the
15:54
Speaker 2: guy that maybe people weren't expecting to be in the
15:56
Speaker 2: lead in the lead. But in Antonelli's case, it feels
15:59
Speaker 2: like this groundswell of support within the team for him,
16:02
Speaker 2: and I wonder how much that plays out and how
16:04
Speaker 2: much that factor is into the way Russell's reacting right now,
16:07
Speaker 2: because it would be hard if you've been in the
16:09
Speaker 2: team for a while and it's been good, and then
16:11
Speaker 2: it hasn't been You're you're the store work, You've been
16:13
Speaker 2: there for a while, and then this kid comes in
16:15
Speaker 2: and you finally get the best car on the grid.
16:17
Speaker 2: It's like, all right, I've got this guy. I've had
16:19
Speaker 2: the experience, I've done the hard yards, he's a second
16:22
Speaker 2: year driver. I've got this. And then it doesn't happen
16:25
Speaker 2: like that. And then you see the way the team
16:26
Speaker 2: is rallying around this new superstar that's arrived in Formula one.
16:31
Speaker 2: You do have to wonder how much the psychology of
16:33
Speaker 2: that plays in. And it's sort of the reverse of
16:35
Speaker 2: what we saw last year, perhaps.
16:36
Speaker 1: I think so. I think as well though the difference
16:39
Speaker 1: I think we've spoken about this before between the two
16:42
Speaker 1: teammates relative this year. Last year, I think there is
16:45
Speaker 1: a genuine amount of mutual buying into the what we
16:49
Speaker 1: mon't call the McLaren way between drivers and the team.
16:51
Speaker 1: I think there is a genuine and they all believe
16:53
Speaker 1: in the culture that kind of stuff. But on top
16:55
Speaker 1: of that is the fact that while there is an
16:57
Speaker 1: experience gap between Piastre and Norris, it's not that massive,
17:00
Speaker 1: certainly nothing like the Russell Antonelli gap. So as much
17:03
Speaker 1: as there was a degree of going into last year
17:05
Speaker 1: expecting Norris was simply going to have the upper hand,
17:07
Speaker 1: Piastri probably did another year to get up to speed.
17:10
Speaker 1: Even when it was clear that wasn't the case, the
17:12
Speaker 1: team quickly accepted, Okay, well, this is what we wanted.
17:14
Speaker 1: We signed up for this in the near future. It's
17:16
Speaker 1: happened earlier than we expected. We also didn't expect to be
17:18
Speaker 1: contending for the title so early. It balanced itself out faster.
17:22
Speaker 1: This is harder, I think for Russell because as he
17:25
Speaker 1: contemplates the idea of being beaten and perhaps quite soundly
17:28
Speaker 1: by Antonelli, he contemplates being superseded completely as a representative
17:33
Speaker 1: of his generation of drivers. Almost yes, because that's it.
17:37
Speaker 1: After that, you know with Piastrian Norris, probably we'll talk
17:40
Speaker 1: about this in the moment. It's probably not going to
17:42
Speaker 1: be a championship year for any of them. Did I
17:44
Speaker 1: say this season? But you know, next year, let's say
17:47
Speaker 1: all things starting equal again, they've probably both got an
17:49
Speaker 1: equal chance of beating the other because we know they're
17:52
Speaker 1: roughly as good as one another. It depends on a
17:53
Speaker 1: little bit on this and that in the percentages. Right,
17:55
Speaker 1: even this year, they've been so closely matched at Antonelli
17:59
Speaker 1: and Russell's level with that experience gap, we know where
18:01
Speaker 1: Russell is, like, this is Russell's level. There's always a
18:03
Speaker 1: little bit more you can find, but this is it
18:06
Speaker 1: for Antonale to already be beating him so soundly in
18:08
Speaker 1: his second year and so young. I don't know where
18:11
Speaker 1: Russell goes from that, And I think if we're not
18:13
Speaker 1: talking about it by the end of the year, sure
18:15
Speaker 1: he will be next year. We know he's on a
18:16
Speaker 1: contract now at messages it seems like he's renewed for
18:18
Speaker 1: next year. It seems improbable that he would remain their
18:21
Speaker 1: long term with Antonelli there not because of the reasons
18:24
Speaker 1: that he's running for a fight or whatever, but there's
18:26
Speaker 1: just no space for a driver who relative to have
18:28
Speaker 1: today they coup we have saying this would be over
18:31
Speaker 1: the hill, well, which is absurd from this twenties right,
18:33
Speaker 1: But if you are being regularly beaten by a nine
18:36
Speaker 1: teen twenty year old, as he will be the end
18:37
Speaker 1: of the year, I just don't know where Russell goes
18:40
Speaker 1: from there, other than to accept his the number two
18:42
Speaker 1: at Mercedes. Now, this all supposes this season continues in
18:45
Speaker 1: exactly the way it's been so far, which it may not,
18:47
Speaker 1: much like last year did not. But I think the
18:50
Speaker 1: question is is more existential for Russell this year than
18:55
Speaker 1: it was for either McLaren driver last year because the
18:57
Speaker 1: stakes were much smaller in a weird way than they
19:00
Speaker 1: are this season.
19:01
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree. I mean I think the age gap
19:03
Speaker 2: and the experience gap is part of it. I wonder
19:05
Speaker 2: if this is just twenty twenty six's version of twenty
19:07
Speaker 2: eighteen Red Bull.
19:09
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's a that's a more interesting one. Yeah.
19:12
Speaker 2: Yeah, where Daniel Ricardo was clearly race when a very
19:14
Speaker 2: established in the team, and then Maximstappen comes in as
19:16
Speaker 2: like oh okay, and again you know, a big, big
19:19
Speaker 2: difference in age and experience and all of that, and
19:21
Speaker 2: we know how that turned out for both of them.
19:23
Speaker 2: So I do wonder if we're sort of reliving twenty
19:26
Speaker 2: sixteen to eighteen all over again ten years later. But
19:29
Speaker 2: I guess only titled.
19:29
Speaker 1: Tell yeah or just you know, we will move on.
19:31
Speaker 1: But the championship makes the difference here. But even think
19:34
Speaker 1: about Hamilton Alonso in two thousand and seven seven yeah,
19:37
Speaker 1: because the championships make it a be different for Alonso,
19:39
Speaker 1: but it's the same prospect, right, a very young driver
19:41
Speaker 1: and a much more established driver. When the young driver
19:44
Speaker 1: wins and Hamilton only just tied with Alonso, but it's
19:47
Speaker 1: clear the way the wind was blowing. Where do you
19:49
Speaker 1: go from that? Now there's a political background of that,
19:51
Speaker 1: but it's the same fundamental question, and I think that's
19:54
Speaker 1: the very interesting element of all of this. I want
19:56
Speaker 1: to talk only very briefly about engines because we have
19:58
Speaker 1: to move on, but I want to in a way
20:01
Speaker 1: that I feel like we'll we'll get a good answer
20:03
Speaker 1: from you, Matt. You obviously watched the Belgian Grand Prix
20:06
Speaker 1: weekend I did. How did you feel about it? Oh?
20:09
Speaker 2: My god? If I had like some brass instruments, I
20:12
Speaker 2: could play you like the sad trombone sound right now.
20:15
Speaker 2: The whole weekend, I just felt I felt just unsatisfied
20:19
Speaker 2: by the whole thing because I know what a great
20:22
Speaker 2: circuit that is. And the thing that is driving me
20:25
Speaker 2: a bit nuts at the moment about the coverage is
20:27
Speaker 2: that we don't know at the moment how many of
20:29
Speaker 2: these passes are just being done as drive bys by
20:32
Speaker 2: people with more full batteries than others, because all of
20:35
Speaker 2: the passes basically seem to happen at the same spot.
20:37
Speaker 2: They're all pretty much going into Laycolm at the end
20:39
Speaker 2: of Kemel Strait, depending on how slow a car was
20:42
Speaker 2: going in front of them, because they'd already chewed through
20:44
Speaker 2: all of their battery in the first sector. So I
20:46
Speaker 2: just felt I felt underwhelmed, and I felt not surprised
20:51
Speaker 2: in the slightest because I had kind of braced myself
20:53
Speaker 2: for that to be the case over the course of
20:55
Speaker 2: the weekend, and you went into it going, well, if
20:57
Speaker 2: it's anything other than this, I'm going to be pleasantly
20:59
Speaker 2: surprised and happy about it. And I was just a
21:01
Speaker 2: bit sad really, but not how you felt about it,
21:03
Speaker 2: but just felt underwhelming would be the word that I
21:05
Speaker 2: would use.
21:06
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was surprised. I felt this was much worse
21:08
Speaker 1: than Silverstone I thought to be the worst one. But actually,
21:11
Speaker 1: if you watched the pole lap of the British Grand Prix, okay,
21:15
Speaker 1: you can tell when the engine'es out out of power,
21:17
Speaker 1: but it actually didn't look I didn't think about it
21:19
Speaker 1: much of the time. It didn't look that bad this
21:22
Speaker 1: lap looked. I thought it was so demoralizing to watch
21:25
Speaker 1: the onboard through that middle sector you touched on it earlier,
21:28
Speaker 1: for the car to just be getting slower and slower
21:31
Speaker 1: to be producing as like a couple of drivers pointed out,
21:34
Speaker 1: when there's no electrical component, these cars have less power
21:37
Speaker 1: than a Formula two car, but with more downboards so
21:39
Speaker 1: are slower sort of by definition. I thought that was
21:42
Speaker 1: quite upsetting the racing. I think, though you're right, look
21:45
Speaker 1: in the race, everything kind of levels out a little
21:47
Speaker 1: bit because there's always management whatever. You can gloss over
21:50
Speaker 1: some of the weaknesses of the package. But I think
21:52
Speaker 1: if you had that battery information, I know there are
21:54
Speaker 1: some reasons why it's a bit hard to do because
21:56
Speaker 1: the battery changes so rapidly with these cars, but there's
21:58
Speaker 1: got to be a way to do it, because then
22:00
Speaker 1: at least you understand the tactics of it. I still
22:04
Speaker 1: come back to that idea. A lot of the passes
22:05
Speaker 1: were just done the same place they've always been done
22:07
Speaker 1: into La Colm, which is where Durs was allowing passes,
22:10
Speaker 1: but the dare and obvious because the wing would open whatever.
22:13
Speaker 1: At least this way you'd be able to get a
22:14
Speaker 1: sense of oh, well, you know, think about Hamilton Piastre
22:16
Speaker 1: that well, they passed away before there, but Hamilton was
22:19
Speaker 1: easily passed into a rouge. Just after passing Piastre into
22:21
Speaker 1: the sorts, you'd probably get a sense from the graphics going, oh,
22:24
Speaker 1: Hamilton used all these power to do that, and now
22:27
Speaker 1: Oscar's still got some left. I think that would improve
22:29
Speaker 1: the race spectacle a little bit, which I think you
22:31
Speaker 1: can get away with. But that qualifying was sad. There's
22:37
Speaker 1: no other I think. I was Oscar piastri A's results
22:38
Speaker 1: and it was just a bit sad.
22:40
Speaker 2: It's not even the race spectacle for mine. It's I
22:43
Speaker 2: would probably appreciate and I can't believe I'm saying that
22:46
Speaker 2: word appreciate this a little bit more if I felt
22:48
Speaker 2: that I had more information as to what it was
22:50
Speaker 2: I was watching. And even if the battery graphic was
22:53
Speaker 2: you have one third or less, two thirds or less
22:56
Speaker 2: or full battery, if you could see someone's battery and
22:58
Speaker 2: you go, well, this makes sense to me. Now while
23:00
Speaker 2: this guy's just seated a position with no real resistance
23:03
Speaker 2: going into la com because he has one third less
23:06
Speaker 2: battery than somebody else. It doesn't need to be to
23:08
Speaker 2: the absolute percentage. But give me something else so I
23:11
Speaker 2: can understand what it is that I'm watching, rather than
23:14
Speaker 2: leaving me wondering what is going on? And if your
23:17
Speaker 2: mind want you wanders with these things, you generally fear
23:19
Speaker 2: the worst, and so well, of course he's just been
23:21
Speaker 2: driven past. He's got no battery, because these engines are nonsense.
23:24
Speaker 2: And I think that's something that just the understanding and
23:27
Speaker 2: providing information to the viewing public that helps them to
23:32
Speaker 2: explain what it is that they're seeing and not just
23:34
Speaker 2: relying on them to accept it as being what it is.
23:36
Speaker 2: I think that's the hardest part for me right now.
23:39
Speaker 2: I prefer too much information than too little, But at
23:41
Speaker 2: least give me a chance to understand what it is
23:43
Speaker 2: that I'm watching, because right now we just do not know.
23:46
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it would be fascinating as well, considering
23:49
Speaker 1: maybe it is part of the reason there isn't any
23:50
Speaker 1: battery graphics. What we've learned about the engines, the way
23:53
Speaker 1: that the computer really does sit between the drivers for
23:57
Speaker 1: the Yes, our deployment seemingly at random, brought out by
24:00
Speaker 1: this track, because so much of this track has no
24:03
Speaker 1: energy left. So you notice there's a track like Buddapest
24:06
Speaker 1: this weekend. You're probably not going to be an issue,
24:08
Speaker 1: presumably hopefully, but you know if you did, if you
24:10
Speaker 1: were watching it on board and suddenly George Russell has
24:13
Speaker 1: a third less power on the back straight than Antonelli,
24:15
Speaker 1: but for no obvious reason. Maybe that raises more questions
24:18
Speaker 1: and answers. That's what the drivers have been talking a
24:20
Speaker 1: lot about this track as well. I think that's the
24:23
Speaker 1: that's almost the worst part of this for me. You know,
24:25
Speaker 1: there's one like the engines work the way they work,
24:28
Speaker 1: not everyone's comfortable with it. But before now anyway, it
24:31
Speaker 1: was that idea that it was pretty much the same
24:33
Speaker 1: for everyone. You just got to live with it, like
24:34
Speaker 1: these are the rules. They'll change eventually. This little like
24:38
Speaker 1: dark Art's the shadowy hand of the algorithm that's controlling
24:42
Speaker 1: the engine, I think really muddies the water a lot.
24:45
Speaker 1: I'm glad that that most drivers at least seem to think.
24:47
Speaker 1: It's not going to be the case at every track,
24:49
Speaker 1: but even for dampen at some tracks, I think is
24:52
Speaker 1: that's the concerning part for me more than just war.
24:54
Speaker 1: The engines aren't very nice, are they?
24:56
Speaker 2: No? I completely agree, and it's something. I mean, how
24:59
Speaker 2: you do with that e B graphic or the narrature
25:01
Speaker 2: of telling the story of the race. These things are
25:04
Speaker 2: way more complicated than they needed to be. We know that,
25:07
Speaker 2: we know the steps being made to try and fix them.
25:10
Speaker 2: But when you get a circuit like this, and there
25:12
Speaker 2: will be others through the course of the year, it
25:13
Speaker 2: is just a tough watch because I just don't feel
25:15
Speaker 2: you're getting all of the information to be able to
25:17
Speaker 2: watch the race properly.
25:18
Speaker 1: Let's move on now to Move of the Week, brought
25:21
Speaker 1: to you by Shannon's Look, there were plenty of moves
25:24
Speaker 1: up to you to decide what kind of moves they
25:26
Speaker 1: weren't now, but well, what's up to you really? What's
25:28
Speaker 1: your pick?
25:29
Speaker 2: I've got one that I'm not going to use in
25:31
Speaker 2: one that I am, and I'm going to say both
25:32
Speaker 2: of them just because I enjoyed Fernando a lot so
25:35
Speaker 2: doing some post race burnouts, because it was the one
25:37
Speaker 2: time I actually noticed him in the in the coverage
25:40
Speaker 2: after he crossed the finish line two laps down in
25:42
Speaker 2: the nineteenth and was it two laps and twenty seconds
25:45
Speaker 2: behind Kimiata and early Oh my god. We'll get into
25:47
Speaker 2: accident in a little bit. But move of the week
25:49
Speaker 2: for me, and this is something that you wrote on
25:52
Speaker 2: Fox Sports dot com dot you earlier in the week,
25:53
Speaker 2: is that it's only taken the main years, but I
25:56
Speaker 2: think Red Bull have a credible number two driver finally,
25:58
Speaker 2: and it's Isaac Hadjar. Not only did he have a
26:00
Speaker 2: fantastic race getting all the way back up into the
26:02
Speaker 2: top six from the back of the grid, but the
26:05
Speaker 2: execution of towing Max for Stappan in qualifying and getting
26:08
Speaker 2: Max onto the front row of the grid was probably
26:11
Speaker 2: the best thing a second Red Bull driver has done
26:14
Speaker 2: since the Minister of Defense Serg Perez and ad in
26:17
Speaker 2: twenty twenty one, and possibly going back further than that.
26:21
Speaker 2: But all jokes aside, I think Hadja, it's interesting, isn't it.
26:24
Speaker 2: In that Hadja did sort of come across as a
26:27
Speaker 2: bit of a rough diamond. I think in a bit
26:29
Speaker 2: of a oh God, we've just got to throw this
26:30
Speaker 2: guy in there because nothing else has worked for a while.
26:33
Speaker 2: And whether through luck or judgment or just the fact
26:36
Speaker 2: that he's actually really quite good, this feels like Red
26:38
Speaker 2: Bull have a one and three quarter car team for
26:41
Speaker 2: the first time in a very very long time. And
26:44
Speaker 2: I just thought the execution of the toe in qualifying
26:47
Speaker 2: and then what he did in the race and clearly
26:48
Speaker 2: was not the best car on the grid. I think,
26:51
Speaker 2: congratulations to the Red Bull. It took you eight years,
26:53
Speaker 2: but you got there. And move of the Week is
26:54
Speaker 2: putting guys like Kadjar in the Red Bull for twenty
26:56
Speaker 2: twenty six very good.
26:57
Speaker 1: Yes you're going read that the Fox Sports website. Some
26:59
Speaker 1: of the number that make him the best teammate the
27:02
Speaker 1: Staffen's had since Daniel Ricardo. I think that the numbers
27:05
Speaker 1: are compelling. He's had a great season and I think
27:07
Speaker 1: we should shouldn't forget that he's had some patchy races, obviously,
27:11
Speaker 1: but he's in his second season in Formula One and
27:14
Speaker 1: had a new team, so he's had one season at
27:15
Speaker 1: one team, and now he's halfway through a season with
27:17
Speaker 1: another team. That's probably to be expected, particularly when that
27:21
Speaker 1: team is meant to be fighting at the front. But
27:23
Speaker 1: he's actually being weighed down by quite a number of issues,
27:26
Speaker 1: including whether or not for Staffins has faith in the team.
27:28
Speaker 1: So I think in the context he's actually doing really
27:30
Speaker 1: quite well. And I second that, I think that is
27:33
Speaker 1: a great move. I'm going to go for a move
27:37
Speaker 1: on the track. I think I could be at least
27:39
Speaker 1: two weeks in a row that I've gone for that remarkable.
27:42
Speaker 1: I'm going for what I think was actually quite a
27:43
Speaker 1: good move. Franco Cola Pinto's double move on Gasly and
27:46
Speaker 1: Liam Lawson one of a few midfield moves that made
27:49
Speaker 1: it onto the television coverage anyway. Now there's clearly a
27:52
Speaker 1: little bit of energy management at play relative to Lawson.
27:55
Speaker 1: I think that's faed just didn't seem to have the
27:56
Speaker 1: speed on the run to Lecum, but not with Gasly.
28:00
Speaker 1: I don't think there was any difference in power with Ghastly,
28:03
Speaker 1: but there was a difference with aggression. I think in
28:05
Speaker 1: Colo Pinto Si we had it pushed Gazly a little
28:08
Speaker 1: bit wide into the entry of that corner, claimed that
28:11
Speaker 1: corner he had the speed he was entitled to do it.
28:12
Speaker 1: I don't think there's anything over the top about it,
28:16
Speaker 1: but I think that was It's sort of funny with
28:18
Speaker 1: Colo Pinto. This year started fairly well all things, at
28:21
Speaker 1: least when the car got its upgrade, seemed to be thereabouts,
28:24
Speaker 1: but then faded a bit in a way that I
28:26
Speaker 1: think we shouldn't underestimate whether or not that seat is
28:29
Speaker 1: it threat. I think Gazzli really stepped it up in
28:31
Speaker 1: the last month or so really put him in the shadows.
28:34
Speaker 1: So a result like this probably needed for him as
28:37
Speaker 1: we reach presumably the crunch time in driver market discussions,
28:41
Speaker 1: just to show that actually he's still there when things
28:43
Speaker 1: are working out for our pain and as results scored points. No.
28:46
Speaker 2: I did enjoy the move. It was on my long
28:49
Speaker 2: short list and then immediately excluded because of lack of
28:51
Speaker 2: battery graphics as per five minutes ago of this podcast.
28:54
Speaker 2: But I did enjoy it as a piece of Oh,
28:56
Speaker 2: look at that. That looked like a good move, and
28:58
Speaker 2: then I just thought, yeah, but I wish I'm stood
29:00
Speaker 2: it a little bit more. So. I enjoyed the move.
29:03
Speaker 2: I didn't like the lack of information about it, therefore
29:05
Speaker 2: crossed off my list, but I'm glad that it made yours.
29:07
Speaker 1: Yes, very good and talking about a midfield team LPN
29:11
Speaker 1: and Racing Bulls remarkable times. But you know what we're
29:13
Speaker 1: going to talk about a team doesn't even qualify in
29:15
Speaker 1: the midfield and only at the back, in fact, at
29:17
Speaker 1: the very back of the field. It's Aston Martin. Oh,
29:20
Speaker 1: this weekend for Aston Martin, we are going to be
29:23
Speaker 1: talking about McLaren's upgrade package in a moment. Let's start
29:25
Speaker 1: with the Aston Martin upgrade package because it's going to
29:27
Speaker 1: be the first one the team's got. Hasn't upgraded its
29:30
Speaker 1: car at all all season. It's been dreadful all season
29:33
Speaker 1: as a results. Fernando Lns, as you said, so frustrated
29:36
Speaker 1: after the Belgian Grand Prix, was just doing burnouts for
29:38
Speaker 1: fun in his car. So the last time that car
29:40
Speaker 1: is presumably going to be seen, which can only be
29:43
Speaker 1: a good thing for everyone at Aston Martin. But this
29:46
Speaker 1: is the moment, isn't it Whether we find out this
29:48
Speaker 1: big spending Aston Martin arrangement of Adrian Newe In Fernando
29:52
Speaker 1: Alonso and all the stroll money and all the other
29:54
Speaker 1: people they've hired can actually deliver a competitive car.
29:58
Speaker 2: I guess if you're going to to see your glasses
30:01
Speaker 2: being somewhat half full, it can't get any worse than this.
30:05
Speaker 2: I mean, god imatinely if it did, could get worse
30:07
Speaker 2: than this. But it's incredible to think. I look at
30:09
Speaker 2: Aston Martin this season, in and of themselves, but also
30:13
Speaker 2: the fact that we've got a brand new startup on
30:15
Speaker 2: the grid this year as well, and they're trailing Cadillac
30:18
Speaker 2: for the most part, puts it into a different a
30:21
Speaker 2: different tier of total grimness. And I think we could
30:23
Speaker 2: have ever ever considered. So they've been talking about this
30:26
Speaker 2: Hungry upgrade for quite some time, and my understanding of this,
30:29
Speaker 2: and correct me if I'm wrong here, is that it
30:31
Speaker 2: is a chassy upgrade as opposed to an engine upgrade,
30:34
Speaker 2: because that's coming at the following round. Now, what will
30:37
Speaker 2: be interesting about that is if the there is some
30:40
Speaker 2: sign of improvement this weekend and then perhaps not for
30:42
Speaker 2: the next one, then the fingers of blame will be
30:45
Speaker 2: pointed in certain directions, won't they. But it just it's
30:49
Speaker 2: been so so underwhelming, and they've put so much on
30:53
Speaker 2: this Hungry upgrade, and we've been talking about it for
30:56
Speaker 2: how long now? I mean, we're about to head into
30:57
Speaker 2: round twelve. I've been talking about it for so long.
31:00
Speaker 2: It better deliver because I just I don't know how
31:04
Speaker 2: to really rate what Aston Martin are doing right now,
31:07
Speaker 2: because I keep coming back to the fact that this
31:09
Speaker 2: is a team that is not short on resource, and
31:11
Speaker 2: it employs Fernando also, one of the best drivers of
31:14
Speaker 2: the modern era, and it has Adrian Newey at the helm,
31:16
Speaker 2: although interestingly and every Aston Martin press release it's always
31:19
Speaker 2: Mike Crack delivering the sad quotes and Adrian new He
31:22
Speaker 2: is nowhere to be seen. But that's another story. But
31:25
Speaker 2: it's really interesting to me that if they didn't have
31:27
Speaker 2: those figureheads in position, you know, in those key positions
31:31
Speaker 2: at the team, whether we'd be looking at them differently.
31:33
Speaker 2: But the Cadillac thing, for me, Cadillac are doing a
31:36
Speaker 2: perfectly credible job as a first year Formula One team
31:39
Speaker 2: starting from absolutely nothing, and you don't expect them to
31:41
Speaker 2: be any good, but they are slightly improving, and that's
31:43
Speaker 2: completely fine. The fact that Aston Martin is even in
31:47
Speaker 2: the same post code of that discussion is insane to me,
31:52
Speaker 2: and so it's not so much is being put on
31:53
Speaker 2: this hungry upgrade. We've been hearing about it for months.
31:56
Speaker 2: It would want to deliver because if it does not,
31:59
Speaker 2: then there's a couple of inflection points here. I mean
32:01
Speaker 2: the obvious one is Alonso, why would you stick around
32:04
Speaker 2: for this? And would he be shopping himself elsewhere? Would
32:07
Speaker 2: someone else want to pick him up? Because I think
32:09
Speaker 2: we saw a couple of years ago that there's still
32:10
Speaker 2: plenty of plenty of fight in the old dog. Not
32:13
Speaker 2: to call Fernando an old dog, but he's still plenty
32:15
Speaker 2: plenty good He's still plenty plenty good enough if you
32:17
Speaker 2: give him the right car. But you know I joke
32:19
Speaker 2: before about him doing burnouts after being two laps down
32:21
Speaker 2: at the end of SPA. This is not where we
32:23
Speaker 2: need to be seeing Fernando Alonso. And it's just something
32:25
Speaker 2: about that name and the resource and where we've seen
32:28
Speaker 2: Aston Martin in the past. It's scarcely believable what's going
32:31
Speaker 2: on at the moment there.
32:32
Speaker 1: It is obviously the worst case scenario because it couldn't
32:35
Speaker 1: get any worse than this. As you said, it's a
32:37
Speaker 1: two part upgrade package. As far as the team is
32:39
Speaker 1: selling it, so two aerodynamic upgrades across this weekend and
32:43
Speaker 1: then the Dutch Grand Prix after the break. I think
32:45
Speaker 1: this weekend's package includes the new chassis as well, which
32:48
Speaker 1: I think does make it a BESPEC car as much
32:51
Speaker 1: as the team does. I want to say it, even
32:52
Speaker 1: if the chassis changes apparently just making it lighter. But
32:55
Speaker 1: then that engine upgrade comes with that second half of
32:57
Speaker 1: the package at the Dutch Grand Prix, so that's when
32:59
Speaker 1: you'll see the full power of it. We should still
33:01
Speaker 1: expect to see a judging by how much the team's
33:04
Speaker 1: saved up for this upgrade package, a big step forward
33:06
Speaker 1: this weekend. There are a lot of rumors around how
33:09
Speaker 1: much time it's going to be worth. Obviously no one
33:11
Speaker 1: wants to say any certain targets, but the rumors have
33:15
Speaker 1: ranged from two to two and a half seconds from
33:17
Speaker 1: the total package not this weekend, which is remarkable. On
33:20
Speaker 1: the one hand, I can't think of another time, even
33:23
Speaker 1: thinking back to McLaren's remarkable jumps up the grid over
33:25
Speaker 1: the last couple of years, any team's found that much
33:28
Speaker 1: time in one upgrade package. Now there is the caveat
33:30
Speaker 1: that they are saving all the upgrades they would have
33:32
Speaker 1: done essentially over the course of the first half of
33:34
Speaker 1: the season till now. That makes a difference. But just
33:37
Speaker 1: to put into context what two and a half seconds
33:40
Speaker 1: would mean still, which is the simultaneously grim and interesting
33:46
Speaker 1: part of this. For the last three races, on average,
33:50
Speaker 1: McClaren Aston Martin has been one and a half seconds
33:53
Speaker 1: off the back of the pack, so one and a
33:54
Speaker 1: half seconds down to Cadillac. That's correcting for track length
33:58
Speaker 1: as well, because obviously we just came from Spa gaps
34:00
Speaker 1: are much bigger, so two second game and that would
34:03
Speaker 1: be huge again would be enough only to get it
34:06
Speaker 1: ahead of Cadillac, no one else. If it's two and
34:09
Speaker 1: a half seconds in total, it would get to roughly
34:12
Speaker 1: on par with Williams and just behind Heart so be
34:16
Speaker 1: Englam would make it the ninth fastest team in Formula One.
34:19
Speaker 1: This is a team. We shouldn't forget that. The start
34:21
Speaker 1: of the year and I'm sure Adrian knew saying this
34:23
Speaker 1: genuinely because whatever other reason could there be to say it,
34:26
Speaker 1: you believed it was the fourth or fifth quickest car
34:29
Speaker 1: in the sport except for the Honda engine. It's every
34:32
Speaker 1: every weekend, it feels like they've realized how wrong and
34:35
Speaker 1: how much more wrong that is. So the step even
34:38
Speaker 1: if they the summary is that even if they make
34:40
Speaker 1: such a big step, the path forward to where they
34:43
Speaker 1: expected to be this year, never mind where they hoped
34:45
Speaker 1: to be in the coming years, is so long.
34:49
Speaker 2: It's it's so long, and it's so off the rails.
34:50
Speaker 2: I'm just looking at the qualifying results here from SPA.
34:53
Speaker 2: So Alonso was the best qualified Aston Martin who was
34:56
Speaker 2: two point zero three seconds behind Serge Apes one lap
35:00
Speaker 2: of spar in a Cadillac. Which is it just it
35:03
Speaker 2: looks like a typo. You literally want to refresh your
35:05
Speaker 2: screen and say, is this actually real? It is insane
35:09
Speaker 2: how far off the pace they are so in terms
35:11
Speaker 2: of the misjudgment where they thought they were at the
35:13
Speaker 2: start of the season, and what the ripple effect of
35:15
Speaker 2: that is going forward? You know, yes, okay, great, they
35:19
Speaker 2: might pick up your second and half two and a
35:20
Speaker 2: half seconds, so that's fantastic. It will make them only
35:22
Speaker 2: mildly bad as opposed to just completely not Formula one standard.
35:26
Speaker 2: And I know we were talking about this off air before.
35:29
Speaker 2: There is a story going around where it someone has
35:33
Speaker 2: decided to rate how grim the Aston Bart It is
35:36
Speaker 2: relative to some of the other grims, the grim cars
35:38
Speaker 2: that we've seen in Formula one over the modern era.
35:41
Speaker 2: It is not flattering, No, it's not.
35:43
Speaker 1: It is an analysis done by the rates and this
35:45
Speaker 1: was a great bit of data crunching from the last
35:49
Speaker 1: ten or twenty years of Formula One. They've described it
35:52
Speaker 1: as the worst car. It is the worst car in
35:54
Speaker 1: Formula one this year, there's no doubt about. That's worse
35:56
Speaker 1: than the Cadillac, which it really that's no right to be,
35:58
Speaker 1: but go the only cars worse in the last I
36:02
Speaker 1: guess this is dating back to twenty eleven anyway, I
36:05
Speaker 1: think looking at this graph, the only cars worse are
36:09
Speaker 1: those of the Case Room, HRT and Manor ILK, those
36:13
Speaker 1: teams that were allowed into the sport under budget capitals
36:16
Speaker 1: that never came into existence in nine I think wasn't right,
36:20
Speaker 1: and some of them obviously struggled for a few years later,
36:22
Speaker 1: like the most recent was Matter in twenty fifteen. They
36:25
Speaker 1: are the only cars in the last I'm going to
36:27
Speaker 1: say twenty years looking at this data that have been slower,
36:30
Speaker 1: that is further off the front of the pack than
36:33
Speaker 1: Aston Martin has been. That includes Oh, you know what,
36:35
Speaker 1: I've just looked at this graph. There are some Manor
36:37
Speaker 1: cars that were ahead of this astonat in twenty sixteen
36:41
Speaker 1: and twenty thirteen. Remarkable, but that also includes the twenty
36:44
Speaker 1: nineteen Williams, which famously turned up to testing illegal and
36:48
Speaker 1: way overweight and cause the latest desire, the last disaster
36:53
Speaker 1: for the Williams team. This Aston Martin Carr is worse
36:56
Speaker 1: than all of those, and again that's partly because they've
37:00
Speaker 1: chosen not to bring any upgrades for these first ten races.
37:03
Speaker 1: But it's also and while they've slipped back a lot
37:05
Speaker 1: obviously over the course of the yet it's not as
37:06
Speaker 1: if they've slipped back multiple multiple seconds. This is still
37:10
Speaker 1: the ballpark of where they started. A team with this
37:12
Speaker 1: kind of resource and this kind of star power in
37:15
Speaker 1: its lineup, both on and off track, really shouldn't be here.
37:19
Speaker 2: Well, and you mentioned you were talking about teams before
37:21
Speaker 2: Manner and Caterum and Hrt. This is Aston Martin. Yeah,
37:26
Speaker 2: they were on podiums for fun not that long ago,
37:30
Speaker 2: when Fernando had that amazing start to the season a
37:32
Speaker 2: couple of years back. It's incredible to think how much
37:35
Speaker 2: this thing is unraveled over the last little while, and
37:38
Speaker 2: as I said at the start of this, I just
37:39
Speaker 2: think we look at this through a completely different lens
37:42
Speaker 2: because of the names that they have in their organizational hierarchy.
37:46
Speaker 2: We expect more. The sport should consider itself wanting to
37:51
Speaker 2: expect more as well. But just the complete lack of
37:54
Speaker 2: direction of this thing. There is so much riding on
37:56
Speaker 2: what happens this weekend and then following on in Zanfort
38:00
Speaker 2: that doesn't go as it's planned to go. Where are we?
38:03
Speaker 2: I mean, it's a podcast for about eight weeks time,
38:06
Speaker 2: but it is an absolute mess right now. And seeing
38:10
Speaker 2: you know, obviously Spa was the track where it brought
38:13
Speaker 2: out the absolute worst of the twenty twenty six cars.
38:15
Speaker 2: I think of all the tracks we've seen this season,
38:17
Speaker 2: but even I wasn't expecting them to be quite that bad.
38:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think the questions. I mean, if we get
38:21
Speaker 1: to the end of this weekend and they're saying we'll
38:23
Speaker 1: just wait for the Dutch car, oh God, and I'm
38:25
Speaker 1: not sure that's good enough. You know, I know the
38:26
Speaker 1: engine is going to be part of the equation all
38:28
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff, but it needs to be a
38:30
Speaker 1: visible and obvious step forward this weekend, because that's I forget.
38:34
Speaker 1: This is a team that in recent years it's the
38:35
Speaker 1: biggest problem, one of the biggest reasons that Adrian knew
38:37
Speaker 1: his arrival was heralded to so important. So it just
38:39
Speaker 1: hasn't been able to develop cars. Even when it's rolled
38:42
Speaker 1: out a faster the start of the year, it's inevitably
38:45
Speaker 1: gone backwards. So there's a lot to prove just from that,
38:48
Speaker 1: like organizational standpoint, Can this team actually start developing a
38:51
Speaker 1: car because if it can't, they've taken a hell of
38:54
Speaker 1: a bad gamble on saving up all of its development
38:56
Speaker 1: resource essentially online upgrade, when it was never going to
38:59
Speaker 1: do it anyway. So really big weekend for a team
39:01
Speaker 1: that's way at the back, but shouldn't be. Also a
39:04
Speaker 1: big weekend I think for McLaren. Look realistically, well, I'm
39:08
Speaker 1: in two minds about this. On paper, you'd say there's
39:10
Speaker 1: not really much chance of McLaren defending its Constructors championship
39:13
Speaker 1: this season's too far back. On the other hand, it
39:17
Speaker 1: did quite a significant and not dissimilar jump in terms
39:21
Speaker 1: of what's required this year in twenty twenty four when
39:24
Speaker 1: it overhauled Red Bull Racing. It was more than one
39:25
Speaker 1: hundred points behind Red Bull Racing at twenty twenty four recovered.
39:29
Speaker 1: It ended up being a round about one hundred and
39:30
Speaker 1: ninety two point turnaround because they finished so far ahead
39:33
Speaker 1: of Red Ball. That's part because so Gio Peiz was
39:35
Speaker 1: scoring approximately zero three points a weekend something like that.
39:40
Speaker 1: But it's going to require a really big step this
39:42
Speaker 1: weekend for McClaren to try and repeat that. It's probably
39:44
Speaker 1: going to require a bigger step than twenty four because
39:46
Speaker 1: there's much less time remaining. There were eighteen races to
39:49
Speaker 1: go and twenty four when it turnaround started there, well
39:52
Speaker 1: after this weekend there'll be only eleven. But it's all
39:55
Speaker 1: hinging on this weekend because McLaren has talked about Andrea
39:57
Speaker 1: Stella has suggested that his hope is that the car
40:00
Speaker 1: I'll be competitive enough to do it and it'll only
40:01
Speaker 1: be about time remaining as to whether or not they
40:03
Speaker 1: can win the title.
40:05
Speaker 2: That sounds a little optimistic. I think you go back
40:07
Speaker 2: to the previous example you were talking about. There there
40:09
Speaker 2: was really only one opponent, and that opponent had one driver,
40:13
Speaker 2: and there was more time, so you add all of
40:16
Speaker 2: those things into the mix. I just think that the
40:17
Speaker 2: depth of competition at the front that McClaren would have
40:20
Speaker 2: to overhaul to find themselves. I mean, this is the
40:22
Speaker 2: raining constructors champion that hasn't won a race yet this year,
40:25
Speaker 2: and quite frankly, hasn't really looked like winning one either.
40:28
Speaker 2: I mean, maybe that becomes the benchmark to hit for
40:33
Speaker 2: the rest of the year and they can win a
40:34
Speaker 2: couple of races and move themselves up the Constructors Championship.
40:38
Speaker 2: But I think expecting some sort of a repeat from
40:41
Speaker 2: a couple of years back seems pretty fanciful to me.
40:44
Speaker 2: I think both things can be true. I think they
40:45
Speaker 2: will be better. The upgrade will definitely bear some fruit.
40:49
Speaker 2: Expecting it to suddenly vault them into Oh look this
40:51
Speaker 2: pstre nor a scrapping for wins every weekend, that's really
40:54
Speaker 2: hard to see right now because I just think the
40:56
Speaker 2: depth of what they're fighting against is tougher, and they're
40:59
Speaker 2: coming from further back. And look, I mean most of
41:02
Speaker 2: the other opposition right now have two very competent or
41:04
Speaker 2: semi competent drivers, so there's not enough. There's not that
41:07
Speaker 2: low haging fruit to pick off that was Sergei Eperez
41:09
Speaker 2: back in that day. So it feels like, you know,
41:14
Speaker 2: Andrea Stella can be correct in some respects, but maybe
41:17
Speaker 2: the scope of the optimism maybe is a little bit off.
41:19
Speaker 1: I think the time would get them even if they
41:21
Speaker 1: turned up with a car that was on par with Mercedes.
41:23
Speaker 2: Absolutely, yeah, yeah.
41:25
Speaker 1: Just not enough time to close a gap like that
41:27
Speaker 1: when you do have two Mercedes drivers that are capable
41:29
Speaker 1: of winning races, even if for Russels, and you've done
41:30
Speaker 1: it a couple of times this year, and Red Bull
41:33
Speaker 1: Racing in twenty four was also clearly on the precipice
41:35
Speaker 1: of a collapse that's ensued. That has happened, Yes, whereas
41:38
Speaker 1: you don't get the sense that's the way Mercedes is
41:41
Speaker 1: right now. You know, we could be proven wrong. We've
41:43
Speaker 1: probably didn't quite see it coming in two twenty four either.
41:46
Speaker 1: The only extra a little bit of optimism for McLaren.
41:49
Speaker 1: I suppose that every team that's brought a big upgrade
41:51
Speaker 1: package this year has ended up competing for wins at
41:53
Speaker 1: least that weekend he go back to Miami for McLaren.
41:56
Speaker 1: That was the last time they brought an upgrade Rari
41:58
Speaker 1: one in Barcelona, Red Will probably we should have won
42:00
Speaker 1: in Austria so depending on how powerful this upgrade is.
42:03
Speaker 1: And this is also a two part thing. We're bringing
42:05
Speaker 1: more at the Dutch Grand Prix after the break. You know,
42:07
Speaker 1: wins could be on the table, but I think, as
42:09
Speaker 1: you say, to see them, they would have to dominate
42:12
Speaker 1: the rest of the season really to claim it.
42:14
Speaker 2: Yeah, a big.
42:15
Speaker 1: Stretch, but there's other thing. There's a lot we haven't
42:18
Speaker 1: learned about twenty twenty six yet, so something interesting to
42:20
Speaker 1: watch anyway, But I think it's a bit of a
42:22
Speaker 1: stretch and to go to that idea that they have
42:24
Speaker 1: to beat multiple teams, Let's finish with Ferrari because this
42:27
Speaker 1: could be a big weekend for Ferrari. I think it's
42:29
Speaker 1: worth saying, despite the fact that Belgium gave some mixed messages,
42:34
Speaker 1: I guess on where Ferrari is, especially because expectations have
42:37
Speaker 1: been raised by both Barcelona the victory there and then
42:39
Speaker 1: also the unexpected victory in Silverston. These were expected to
42:43
Speaker 1: be Ferrari's Among Ferrari's two worst tracks, they walked away
42:46
Speaker 1: with the most points of any team at both of them. Now,
42:49
Speaker 1: obviously luck played a role there, there's no one suggesting
42:51
Speaker 1: that that's because it's pure pace but nonetheless, to go
42:55
Speaker 1: back to something you said earlier, winning your championship on
42:56
Speaker 1: your worst days is a real thing. This would be
42:59
Speaker 1: a t that'sh's Ferrari much better. I think this is
43:02
Speaker 1: now when we discover where that level is.
43:04
Speaker 2: Yeah, agreed. I mean it's interesting, isn't it, Like you
43:07
Speaker 2: sort of brace yourself for Ferrari. We both Silvestone and
43:09
Speaker 2: Spa thinking if they can get out of this and
43:11
Speaker 2: be reasonably credible, and that's almost a bit of a victory,
43:14
Speaker 2: and they more than that, as you said, and they're
43:16
Speaker 2: very good at both tracks, and Hungary is one of
43:18
Speaker 2: those ones that we have been talking about for a
43:21
Speaker 2: while with Ferrari, and they have certainly in marked. I'm
43:23
Speaker 2: actually really looking to it, forward to it from that
43:25
Speaker 2: perspective because I am pretty confident Ferrari going to be
43:30
Speaker 2: pretty good this weekend. I'm not I wouldn't say I'm
43:32
Speaker 2: not sure about Mercedes, but I'm really curious to see
43:35
Speaker 2: what the advantage is and the extent of the advantage
43:38
Speaker 2: if Ferrari is really on its game, and that's operationally
43:41
Speaker 2: and also with their two drivers. We know how good
43:43
Speaker 2: Hamilton is a Buddhapest in particular, so to my mind,
43:46
Speaker 2: this shapes is one of the more intriguing fights because
43:49
Speaker 2: it feels like the protagonists at the front both will
43:53
Speaker 2: come at the fight from the right angle, If that
43:54
Speaker 2: makes sense, I think both of them. How much of
43:57
Speaker 2: an advantage does Mercedes have? Can Russell pick himself up
43:59
Speaker 2: half for a weekend of disappointment? Anginoali's on this great
44:02
Speaker 2: run right now, But Ferrari feel like they feel reliable
44:05
Speaker 2: this week I a coup believe I'm saying it's just
44:07
Speaker 2: be touching something you wouldn't hear. But I feel like
44:09
Speaker 2: I know what I'm going to get from Ferrari this
44:11
Speaker 2: weekend based on the fact that you know, yes, they've
44:13
Speaker 2: done pretty well at tracks they didn't expect to be good,
44:15
Speaker 2: and generally they have to live it at tracks where
44:17
Speaker 2: they expect to go well. This strikes me as one
44:20
Speaker 2: of those the layout, I mean, you couldn't really have
44:23
Speaker 2: two tracks at the opposite ends of extremes, could you.
44:26
Speaker 2: The Hungara Ring and Spa Franko Champo is so different
44:29
Speaker 2: in the way that they are driven, and I think
44:31
Speaker 2: that really lends itself towards Ferrari. If that means we
44:33
Speaker 2: get a closer fight at the front then I'm absolutely
44:35
Speaker 2: all for it. But it would be great to see
44:37
Speaker 2: Ferrari beat Mercedes on one of their stronger tracks in
44:40
Speaker 2: a straight fight, because that really leaves us at an
44:42
Speaker 2: interesting sort of inflection point at the mid season break.
44:45
Speaker 1: Doesn't it a lot to think about, not only for
44:47
Speaker 1: us but also for the teams as they take that
44:50
Speaker 1: mandatory break. We will find out this weekend, but that's
44:52
Speaker 1: all the time we have for pit Talk this week.
44:54
Speaker 1: You can subscribe to Pittalk wherever you get your favorite podcasts,
44:57
Speaker 1: and you can leave us a rating and a review
44:59
Speaker 1: as well. Yes, it is this weekend the Formula one
45:01
Speaker 1: Hungarian Grand Prix, with lights out at eleven pm Australian
45:05
Speaker 1: Eastern Standard time. You can keep up to date with
45:07
Speaker 1: all the latest F one, Supercars and motorgp news at
45:09
Speaker 1: Foxsports dot com dot Au. From Matt Quick than me
45:12
Speaker 1: Michael Lomonato. Thanks very much for your company. We'll catch
45:14
Speaker 1: you next week.