Latest / Making The Impact - A Dance Competition Podcast / Genre Spotlight - Contemporary Dance

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Genre Spotlight - Contemporary Dance · Making The Impact - A Dance Competition Podcast

0:07
SPEAKER_05: Have you ever wondered what goes on behind the table at a dance competition?
0:11
SPEAKER_05: Exactly what are the judges looking for anyway?
0:13
SPEAKER_05: This is Making the Impact, a dance competition podcast.
0:16
SPEAKER_05: Each week we'll cover a different topic related to the world of competitive dance from the perspective of the judges behind the table.
0:26
SPEAKER_05: Our season six genre spotlight series concludes this week with a look at contemporary dance.
0:31
SPEAKER_05: Peter ToDoo, a multi-hyphenite in the dance world, joins us to dive deep into a genre that can often be misunderstood, but is beloved among dancers.
0:42
SPEAKER_02: Hey Dance World, welcome to this week's episode of Making the Impact.
0:46
SPEAKER_02: I'm your host, Courtney Ortiz, and I'm here with my co-host Leslie Mueller.
0:50
SPEAKER_05: Courtney, can you believe we are almost at the end of season six?
0:53
SPEAKER_02: I really can't.
0:54
SPEAKER_02: It flies by every single year.
0:57
SPEAKER_02: I can't believe we have over 200 episodes, six seasons of Making the Impact.
1:02
SPEAKER_02: It's been a wild ride.
1:03
SPEAKER_02: It's been so fun and informative.
1:05
SPEAKER_02: And we're here for another episode this week.
1:08
SPEAKER_05: We are, and this one's an exciting one.
1:10
SPEAKER_05: I always love our uh genre spotlights, and this one in particular is a really exciting one because we're gonna do some learning ourselves.
1:18
SPEAKER_05: So before we get into that, we have some Making the Impact awards to talk about.
1:22
SPEAKER_02: Yes, we do.
1:23
SPEAKER_02: As we're nearing the end of our 2025 regional season, we have many Making the Impact Judges Choice Awards to share with you all.
1:33
SPEAKER_02: And this is an award that we give out at IDA affiliated competitions that is hand-selected by the IDA judges on the panel.
1:41
SPEAKER_02: And this goes to that one dance from the entire weekend event that the judges just cannot stop thinking about.
1:46
SPEAKER_02: And they want to recognize you with a beautiful plaque on site as well as a live shout-out here on the Making the Impact podcast.
1:54
SPEAKER_02: So let's hear from our first winner.
1:57
SPEAKER_05: From True Dance Challenges event in Allentown, Pennsylvania, congrats to Dance Fusion Performing Art Studio from Allentown, Pennsylvania, for their large group, Will You Still Love Me Tomorrow?
2:06
SPEAKER_02: From Decca Dance Competitions event in Lancaster, Pennsylvania.
2:09
SPEAKER_02: Congrats to Elite Dreams Dance Company from Reading, Pennsylvania for their duo trio for you.
2:16
SPEAKER_05: From Onstage America's event in Woodbridge, Virginia, congrats to All That and Jazz from Dumfries, Virginia, for their production, The Endless Loop.
2:24
SPEAKER_02: From Starbound's event in Sturbridge, Massachusetts.
2:28
SPEAKER_02: Congrats to Spotlight Dance Studio from Taunton, Massachusetts for their large group Skate.
2:33
SPEAKER_02: And from DECA Dance Competitions event in Bethesda, Maryland, congrats to TNT Dance Academy from Waldorf, Maryland, and dancer Zayze for their solo Blow the Whistle.
2:43
SPEAKER_02: Congrats to all of our recent Making the Impact Award winners.
2:47
SPEAKER_02: And stay tuned to hear our final winners in our last few episodes of season six.
2:52
SPEAKER_05: And like always, listeners, we have some amazing sponsors to tell you about, so here we go.
2:58
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3:13
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3:31
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3:38
SPEAKER_02: You'll also gain invaluable knowledge on injury prevention and recovery techniques from experts.
3:44
SPEAKER_02: Plus, the Dance Teacher Web event connects you with other fellow educators and industry celebrities from around the world throughout their networking gatherings and parties during the week.
3:53
SPEAKER_02: I'll even be attending and teaching this year at the Dance Teacher Web Conference and would love to see you there.
3:59
SPEAKER_02: With extended access to their event app, you'll have the luxury of revisiting sessions and notes long after the conference ends.
4:06
SPEAKER_02: Explore the Expo Hall for the latest trends in costumes and dancewear, and be sure to participate in the grand finale giveaway, where over$20,000 in prizes awaits.
4:16
SPEAKER_02: Use our exclusive podcast promo code Impact 50 in all caps for an extra$50 off registration.
4:25
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4:28
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4:33
SPEAKER_02: Get ready for an amazing journey in the world of dance education at the Dance Teacher Web Conference and Expo.
4:40
SPEAKER_02: All right, Dance World, we're back and we're here with our final genre spotlight episode of season six.
4:48
SPEAKER_02: It's been so fun learning about different genres of dance this season on making the impact.
4:54
SPEAKER_02: We kicked it off with a jazz dance and the style of faucet within the jazz dance world.
4:59
SPEAKER_02: Then we went over to rhythm tap earlier this season, as well as breakdancing for the hip-hop genre of dance.
5:06
SPEAKER_02: But now we're we're rounding it out with our final genre spotlight, and today we're talking all about contemporary dance.
5:12
SPEAKER_02: Now, this is a very broad genre of dance, and it is in the current, as in that's why it's contemporary.
5:20
SPEAKER_02: That's where the name comes from.
5:21
SPEAKER_02: But there's a lot to learn here, and it might not be what you think you see at competition, to be completely honest.
5:28
SPEAKER_02: Yes, there's a lot of great things happening on stage at comp, but there's a lot of other great things that are happening in our professional dance world from dance companies around the globe that we are being very heavily influenced by and inspired by.
5:42
SPEAKER_02: And a lot of that comes from European dance companies, dance companies in New York City, all over the world.
5:49
SPEAKER_02: And we're gonna talk all about it today and dissect this beautiful genre of dance that so many dancers out there love to do.
5:56
SPEAKER_02: And we have a very special guest who is joining us today on the podcast as a brand new guest.
6:01
SPEAKER_02: And also I'm meeting them.
6:02
SPEAKER_02: We are both meeting them for the very first time.
6:04
SPEAKER_02: They came highly recommended by my dear friend and previous Making the Impact guest, Francisco Gella.
6:11
SPEAKER_02: And they are an educator, choreographer, performer.
6:16
SPEAKER_02: They've also taught on dance conventions at Steps on Broadway.
6:19
SPEAKER_02: You may have taken their class before.
6:22
SPEAKER_02: They have so much knowledge in this contemporary dance world.
6:25
SPEAKER_02: And a fun fact, they even grew up in the studio dance world.
6:29
SPEAKER_02: I am so excited to get to know and welcome Peter Chu to our podcast.
6:34
SPEAKER_02: Welcome, Peter.
6:35
SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much for having me.
6:36
SPEAKER_02: Yay! I'm so glad this worked out in your schedule because I know we're all super busy.
6:41
SPEAKER_02: So I thank you for squeezing us in and making time to be on the pod.
6:45
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
6:46
SPEAKER_00: It's a pleasure being here.
6:47
SPEAKER_02: Yay.
6:48
SPEAKER_02: Well, Peter, I know you've had an extensive career on all sides.
6:52
SPEAKER_02: So if you wouldn't mind just telling the world more about you, where you grew up, how your dance training started, how you got into the concert and company contemporary world, performance credits, choreography credits.
7:05
SPEAKER_02: Tell the world more about you.
7:06
SPEAKER_00: All right.
7:07
SPEAKER_00: Um, where to begin?
7:09
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
7:10
SPEAKER_00: Originally my family's from Bronx, New York, but I grew up in Cocoa Beach, Florida.
7:14
SPEAKER_00: And I my mother was a music teacher, so I started in the arts, um, did a lot of uh played a lot of instruments growing up.
7:21
SPEAKER_00: And I really wanted to be in gymnastics.
7:25
SPEAKER_00: And I started as an acrobat and then went to gymnastics, and then they mentioned that I needed to have more ballet training.
7:31
SPEAKER_00: And you know, my mother couldn't afford it.
7:34
SPEAKER_00: So we we there was a local dance studio that a friend brought me to, and she saw this talent, and she wound up scholarshipping uh both my sister and I.
7:43
SPEAKER_00: And I would not be here if it weren't for Liz Bealaca and the late Al Packard.
7:48
SPEAKER_00: And I I really that's why I I hold Dance Studio World close to my heart.
7:52
SPEAKER_00: Uh Juice Dance Studio is uh what where I went um in Merritt Allen, Florida, and she just uh instilled the passion of dance and movement and somatic practices at such a young age and education of dance.
8:06
SPEAKER_00: Uh we weren't a huge competition studio, we maybe perhaps just did two festivals a year, three that were called Florida Dance Masters.
8:14
SPEAKER_00: They grew up off of DMA.
8:16
SPEAKER_00: I grew up doing that.
8:17
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, we did like three festivals, competitions, and uh and then later I went to school for for dance, and I danced in a company called Abigeon Dance, uh Ballet Jazz de Montréal, Kid Pivot.
8:29
SPEAKER_00: I also danced with the Celine Dion show.
8:32
SPEAKER_00: I had the the honor from a dear, dear friend, Stacy Tuke.
8:36
SPEAKER_00: She was choreographing a music video and she made my dream come true that I got to to dance and perform on the the Jar of Hearts music video.
8:44
SPEAKER_05: Oh my god, iconic.
8:45
SPEAKER_05: I'm gonna have to.
8:46
SPEAKER_05: That's also like a dance competition song if there ever was one.
8:50
SPEAKER_05: Yes.
8:50
SPEAKER_02: And Stacy's been on our podcast as well.
8:52
SPEAKER_02: We love her.
8:53
SPEAKER_00: Stacy, she's such a dear friend, and she's actually an original member of my dance company called True This.
8:58
SPEAKER_00: So in 2008, I formed True This.
9:02
SPEAKER_00: And uh yeah, Stacy and her brother, and uh Jill Choo, a lot um, yeah, a lot of Cindy Salgado was an original member, and I formed True This, a nonprofit, and then now we are um no longer a nonprofit, but I still run it's a project-based dance company, and I choreograph under that company and I do projects under that company.
9:22
SPEAKER_00: And just so grateful to do what I love to do.
9:25
SPEAKER_02: And you've choreographed for many different dance companies around the world as well.
9:30
SPEAKER_00: Yes, I feel so lucky.
9:32
SPEAKER_00: I uh yeah, I've choreographed for like Hubbard Street Dance Company, I've uh Ballet Augsburg in Germany, just trying to think of other companies, Gibney Dance Company two times.
9:43
SPEAKER_00: Uh may I also call uh choreographed two shows for Suk de Soleil, one in Malta and one in Andorra.
9:49
SPEAKER_04: Cool.
9:50
SPEAKER_00: And that was such a tremendous ride.
9:52
SPEAKER_00: I loved it.
9:52
SPEAKER_00: It was such a challenge, but I learned so much.
9:55
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I've done some industrials and commercial work.
9:58
SPEAKER_00: Uh trying to think ballet companies like Cincinnati Ballet, Orlando Ballet, Kansas City Ballet.
10:03
SPEAKER_00: So I'm really fortunate to do what I love to do.
10:05
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
10:06
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
10:07
SPEAKER_05: And can you shout out your home studio one more time?
10:09
SPEAKER_00: Yes, Dusich Dance Studio in Merritt Island, Florida.
10:13
SPEAKER_00: But the director, my teachers and directors were Liz Bevelaca and the late Al Packard.
10:19
SPEAKER_05: Wonderful.
10:19
SPEAKER_05: I am I love that you brought them up because I we all believe over here that we have to honor the people who gave us what we have.
10:26
SPEAKER_05: So that's amazing.
10:27
SPEAKER_00: Lineage is so important.
10:29
SPEAKER_00: And honestly, I wouldn't I they paid for ballet shoes.
10:32
SPEAKER_00: Mr.
10:32
SPEAKER_00: Al would take me to uh junior mystery dance competition and uh Mr.
10:37
SPEAKER_00: Dance because we couldn't afford it.
10:38
SPEAKER_00: And he would put me up in a hotel.
10:41
SPEAKER_00: They just they're like our dance parents.
10:43
SPEAKER_00: When we say you have dance parents, they they they help cultivate who you are as a young human.
10:48
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
10:49
SPEAKER_02: And it's so special when people see something in you to be able to help support what you were meant to do.
10:57
SPEAKER_02: You know, you discovered dance because your gymnastics teacher told you to take more ballet.
11:02
SPEAKER_02: And dance is a privilege.
11:04
SPEAKER_02: It absolutely is a privilege.
11:06
SPEAKER_02: It's an it's not a cheap art form, an extracurricular activity to partake in, to get to the level that you need to be to be able to pursue this as a legitimate career.
11:17
SPEAKER_02: So to have people see the talent in you at a young age and want to support that and make that possible is just you you'll never forget those people.
11:27
SPEAKER_02: You know, they're they're always there with you through your whole journey.
11:30
SPEAKER_00: They they truly are.
11:31
SPEAKER_00: And and if if I can give one more shout out, of course, you know, just because I believe in community and I really would not be here.
11:38
SPEAKER_00: Mr.
11:39
SPEAKER_00: L and Mrs.
11:39
SPEAKER_00: Liz actually said, you know, we we recommend and I do recommend this, and I really respect them as uh directors.
11:46
SPEAKER_00: They knew that I didn't outgrow the studio.
11:49
SPEAKER_00: I just needed more training, you know, because I wanted to dance professionally.
11:53
SPEAKER_00: Or by the time I was in high school, the last two years, I did not want to dance.
11:56
SPEAKER_00: And I was going to go into sports medicine.
11:58
SPEAKER_00: I was also a cheerleader.
12:00
SPEAKER_00: And I won what was it called, COA, Cheerleaders of America Nationals, this individual champion.
12:05
SPEAKER_00: And you win money, and just like how dance team does too.
12:09
SPEAKER_00: And I won scholarships and I got into Ohio State and I was going to be a cheerleader and into sports medicine.
12:16
SPEAKER_00: But my last year in high school, I I didn't outgrow, I just needed more training.
12:20
SPEAKER_00: So there was a local studio, it was called Holly Rocks Dance Factory.
12:23
SPEAKER_00: And actually, my directors did recommend that they said it was okay to take extra jazz class because I needed more jazz in that training, and I didn't have.
12:33
SPEAKER_00: And Holly Haran is the one that took me to LA.
12:36
SPEAKER_00: And LA in that that summer, um, I was actually supposed to go to Ohio State um a month after, and I was taking Malaya's class, and she was just balling outside of Malaya's class and um was like, Why are you going not going to share this gift and take this away from the world?
12:53
SPEAKER_00: Yes, you want to be a doctor, yes, you want to do this, but why would you not not share this gift?
12:58
SPEAKER_00: And two weeks later, I called Pourk and asked if I could still be accepted.
13:03
SPEAKER_00: And I because I and I went to Point Park for the year, and then I got into Juilliard after that.
13:07
SPEAKER_05: Oh my god, wow.
13:09
SPEAKER_05: What a life!
13:10
SPEAKER_00: A quick shift.
13:12
SPEAKER_00: And that's also why I I like to shed light on it.
13:15
SPEAKER_00: It feels like decades ago, but I was a huge gymnast in a Tumblr and I was a cheerleader, and I I was not a great one, but I was I loved it.
13:23
SPEAKER_00: I loved dancing.
13:24
SPEAKER_00: Luckily, I got to win money to support my academic side, but I advocate for dance team and true leading team and all of that.
13:32
SPEAKER_00: Do I look down on one of the other?
13:34
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely not.
13:35
SPEAKER_00: All of us, all of us have a place, and a lot of people say, Oh, Peter would never agree to this.
13:40
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, no, no, actually.
13:42
SPEAKER_00: Actually, I agree.
13:43
SPEAKER_00: I used to choreograph for dance teams and true leading teams.
13:46
SPEAKER_00: And I I I support that side.
13:47
SPEAKER_00: It's all movement.
13:48
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
13:49
SPEAKER_00: I just wish that our society and our communities would stop negatively judging and let's be more curious and supportive, you know.
13:56
SPEAKER_00: And we all have an entry point into movement, different entry point.
14:00
SPEAKER_05: Oh, absolutely.
14:01
SPEAKER_05: And I'm I feel like some of the gymnastics and dance team, you know, like the power and explosiveness that comes from that kind of training, of course, that informs how you move in other genres.
14:11
SPEAKER_05: Like so it's it probably only did you good, you know?
14:14
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
14:14
SPEAKER_00: I I do a lot of partnering, tossing and flipping.
14:17
SPEAKER_00: I I have this physical dance side, um, flipping in the air.
14:22
SPEAKER_00: I love that.
14:22
SPEAKER_00: And that's definitely informed um the way I do partnering.
14:26
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
14:27
SPEAKER_02: And I love hearing about your your dance career and where it's taken you and hopefully inspiring others listening out there, that there's so many different avenues with contemporary too.
14:38
SPEAKER_02: Like you just said, like as a choreographer, as a known contemporary choreographer, that you choreograph for dance teams and you choreographed for Cirque du Soleil, and you got to perform in music videos, and you got to perform with dance companies and on stage in Vegas.
14:53
SPEAKER_02: Like the sky's the limit.
14:54
SPEAKER_02: And I think that a lot of people think, oh, there's only one path for contemporary dancers or contemporary choreographers.
15:00
SPEAKER_02: But I think that right here, right now, like you sharing your journey with us, it's it's proof that there's a lot more to it.
15:08
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
15:08
SPEAKER_00: You know, I grew up in a time where perhaps there was a a separation of concert dance and commercial dance.
15:15
SPEAKER_00: I hate even separating and talking about that there's a separation.
15:18
SPEAKER_00: For me, concert and commercial have everything to do with the process and the amount you're being paid.
15:24
SPEAKER_00: Sometimes commercial dance, you're paid more and it's a shorter process.
15:28
SPEAKER_00: So that's whenever I uh speak about both areas, I'm like, I'm talking more about finances and process and not talking about artistry because I really do feel a lot of people have a lot of intent and there's a lot of prep work for Broadway and and um music videos and television.
15:43
SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of it's just a different process.
15:46
SPEAKER_00: But but I sought out, I left ballet jazz because I wanted to be.
15:50
SPEAKER_00: I had a huge uh jazz and cultural jazz background from Ducage.
15:54
SPEAKER_00: We used to go to Florida dance festivals, so we took a lot of cultural jazz dance and Frank Hatchet.
16:00
SPEAKER_00: I he changed my life.
16:01
SPEAKER_00: He changed my life that summer I got to tour with him with Dance Alempus, and and wow, I fell in love with jazz dance because of him, not just because my teachers, but he just took it another place.
16:13
SPEAKER_00: And I wanted to actually uh seek out to become a commercial dancer.
16:18
SPEAKER_00: So I left concert dance and then went to LA for a year and then joined Celine, and then I went back and I joined, I went back to Crystal Pite's company called Kid Pivot.
16:28
SPEAKER_00: So and I I love that.
16:29
SPEAKER_00: That's something that was important to me.
16:30
SPEAKER_00: And a lot of people looked down on it, a little down upon it, but that was a pathway that was genuine, it was authentic.
16:36
SPEAKER_00: I don't have a hierarchy in dance and I just celebrate all facets of it.
16:41
SPEAKER_05: Well, and I think what's so interesting about that whole just every single thing you named, like all of those things are also contemporary in that they are current.
16:52
SPEAKER_05: You know, dance seems not ancient and old.
16:54
SPEAKER_05: It's like, you know, it that's current.
16:56
SPEAKER_05: That's something people currently do.
16:57
SPEAKER_05: And if we are really getting down into the nitty-gritty of what contemporary kind of is, if that's a big quote that I'm putting there.
17:06
SPEAKER_05: It's it's just what's current and now, and it's how you interpret all of that.
17:11
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
17:12
SPEAKER_00: What's great about contemporary dance is that it has like this um there's a historical side.
17:18
SPEAKER_00: You have modern dance, you have postmodern dance, and it's incredible what they what they all all stood for and did.
17:23
SPEAKER_00: And contemporary is current.
17:25
SPEAKER_00: It is something that it's also for me, I think of the word fusion.
17:28
SPEAKER_00: It's a way to celebrate your lineage, the way you fuse ideas.
17:33
SPEAKER_00: It focuses on it can focus on fluidity, it can focus on staccato movement, it can focus on um pulsing or popping.
17:41
SPEAKER_00: It also contemporary dance focuses on process sometimes, just like modern.
17:46
SPEAKER_00: It's a different process than maybe television or ballet, but it also focuses on you go to the other side of constructing and deconstructing.
17:54
SPEAKER_00: So that it has like that postmodern element of let's deconstruct this and go against what's happening.
18:01
SPEAKER_00: This is not about the emotions, this is more about the physicality and the way you're constructing, and it's not about a narrative.
18:07
SPEAKER_00: It's kind of celebrating, and it's that's why I love it.
18:10
SPEAKER_00: It's all encompassing.
18:12
SPEAKER_00: So I feel when I talk about contemporary, I like to ask people, what is your entry point into the process and what is your lineage?
18:20
SPEAKER_00: And then I for me, that's what makes it contemporary, and that's what makes it Courtney and Leslie and Peter.
18:26
SPEAKER_05: Wow.
18:26
SPEAKER_05: Well, so that's that we are like veering into the like so much.
18:31
SPEAKER_05: There's like 15 or 16 questions, listeners, that we tend to like try to work around.
18:35
SPEAKER_05: But sometimes you just have to go off to the side.
18:37
SPEAKER_05: So you just said you ask people what their entry point into movement is.
18:44
SPEAKER_05: So that means you should have had some movement experience before you do contemporary dance.
18:51
SPEAKER_00: You know, it I love all these questions, and this is sometimes it's so hard because I like to always preface I don't like to give a solid answer this way or that way, because I I view life as a circular entity and specifically social justice.
19:07
SPEAKER_00: I feel there's different entry points into that.
19:09
SPEAKER_00: You have the healers, you have the builders, you have the people that are on the front lines, people that are have this um that have to be uh more young energy, more of this uh this fierce energy.
19:20
SPEAKER_00: We all have different entry points.
19:22
SPEAKER_00: Some people are more silent and more um passive.
19:25
SPEAKER_00: So, with that said, I try to preface my response.
19:28
SPEAKER_00: I think any kind of dance that you go into, training is important.
19:33
SPEAKER_00: And specifically in the dance studio world, what I love about the dance studio world, it celebrates uh versatility, diversity, a versatility of genre.
19:42
SPEAKER_00: Um, it celebrates all different facets of it.
19:44
SPEAKER_00: It's difficult going to a dance studio because sometimes you try to do everything and sometimes you can't really dive into it.
19:51
SPEAKER_00: But I also celebrate the places that that, because I right now I go to studios that have more isolated, smaller programs.
19:58
SPEAKER_00: They're not because sometimes people say, Oh, we don't want a conservatory program.
20:02
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, conservatory program is not a bad word.
20:05
SPEAKER_00: For me, it's just more of a smaller group and a little more uh a smaller focus, more not linear.
20:12
SPEAKER_00: It's not as broad.
20:13
SPEAKER_00: But in the dance studio worlds, you tend to have all facets.
20:16
SPEAKER_00: You have like ballet, you have jazz that comes from this lens, that lens, then you have jazz funk, then you have studio hop, then you have true like hip hop, and then you have studio hop.
20:27
SPEAKER_03: I love that.
20:27
SPEAKER_00: Just because I also want to be respectful.
20:29
SPEAKER_00: I I definitely am not in the hip-hop world, but I've done a a lot of it, and it's something that I love, but I don't call myself a hip-hop dancer, but I'm heavily informed because of my jazz funk background or the jazz dance background.
20:43
SPEAKER_00: Might probably more than anything.
20:44
SPEAKER_00: I was again, Frank hatchet, I'm dating myself.
20:46
SPEAKER_05: You're you're you're Vop.
20:48
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, Vop, exactly.
20:49
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
20:50
SPEAKER_00: And I also did Giordano growing up, and then uh we like a my teacher brought me to Florida Dance Festivals.
20:56
SPEAKER_00: We did Afro-Cuban, and it just influenced me.
20:58
SPEAKER_00: What I love about that, it celebrates movement, it celebrates community.
21:02
SPEAKER_00: And I do think you need training.
21:04
SPEAKER_00: I for me, this is what I try to remind people.
21:07
SPEAKER_00: I know I'm telling me if I'm going too far off, but training is important.
21:11
SPEAKER_00: I think I don't think ballet is the end all be all.
21:15
SPEAKER_00: Please hear me out.
21:16
SPEAKER_00: I I respect ballet, I respect modern.
21:19
SPEAKER_00: If I think you're only doing jazz five days a week from a dance studio perspective that celebrates versatility, I don't think that's healthy if you're only doing jazz five days a week.
21:28
SPEAKER_00: I like to celebrate that there's to jazz, to tap, to ballet.
21:33
SPEAKER_00: Do I wish if they want to go more into the professional contemporary world, there's some sides of the professional contemporary world that needs more modern and ballet focus.
21:42
SPEAKER_00: So if that's the case, I want you to be in ballet or modern four to three times, maybe five times a week.
21:49
SPEAKER_00: But I also celebrate ballet dancers that are only doing ballet need this wide range of jazz, modern, and contemporary.
21:57
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
21:57
SPEAKER_00: It is very, very useful.
21:59
SPEAKER_00: And then sometimes.
22:00
SPEAKER_00: People say, well, they get one ballet class a week.
22:02
SPEAKER_00: I also get that, but like one plus one is two, right?
22:05
SPEAKER_00: We we take mathematics, we do these additional and subtractions all the way to our senior year in high school, all the way to calculus.
22:12
SPEAKER_00: Like for me, training is training.
22:15
SPEAKER_00: I just because you go to a dance studio doesn't mean you're not you're getting this kind of training.
22:19
SPEAKER_00: Like ballet technique is ballet technique.
22:21
SPEAKER_00: There's many different approaches to it, but I think foundation is always important.
22:26
SPEAKER_00: Foundation of hip hop, foundation of tap, foundation of jazz.
22:30
SPEAKER_00: And sometimes I get what I hear like we just want them to have fun.
22:33
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
22:34
SPEAKER_00: But do you say that going into mathematics class?
22:36
SPEAKER_00: Do you say that going into martial arts?
22:39
SPEAKER_00: There's discipline in dance.
22:41
SPEAKER_00: There is fun and joy.
22:42
SPEAKER_00: And there's also fun and joy within the details.
22:44
SPEAKER_00: There's like we enjoy refining details.
22:47
SPEAKER_00: And that's why I love to support dance studios.
22:50
SPEAKER_00: But when I hear studios say, oh, we're going more this direction or that direction because of a trend, more contemporary, or now we're doing more conservatory, or we're going more dance team.
22:59
SPEAKER_00: I get scared.
23:00
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, please be true to your mission.
23:03
SPEAKER_00: Because even dance team coaches are not wanting them to just only do drill team clinics.
23:09
SPEAKER_00: They want them to, they are hiring these dancers because they're studio and ballet training.
23:14
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
23:15
SPEAKER_00: And I try to remind people stay true to your mission as a director.
23:19
SPEAKER_00: And please, it's so hard to try not to follow the trend.
23:23
SPEAKER_00: And then this, I might be veering off into another area, but and I because I love all the conventions and I've taught for a lot of them.
23:31
SPEAKER_00: And um, this last organization that I worked for, I love all of them.
23:34
SPEAKER_00: I celebrate what everyone's doing.
23:36
SPEAKER_00: I I personally feel we need to have celebrate shifts and change.
23:41
SPEAKER_00: So you're not doing one nationals every single year.
23:46
SPEAKER_00: I it's and I know, and I'm probably, and I really don't mean to speak poorly because I know it's um it's also a business.
23:52
SPEAKER_00: I get that.
23:52
SPEAKER_00: But as a director, I want to invite directors to start cross-training their programs.
24:00
SPEAKER_00: Maybe every other year do or every three years do a nationals, but then this year we focus on that.
24:04
SPEAKER_00: You can and then maybe only do this regionals, maybe don't do that every year, or only do two from that organization instead of only that organization.
24:13
SPEAKER_00: And then maybe supplement that with a studio workshop, with a ballet-focused workshop.
24:17
SPEAKER_00: It's really important.
24:18
SPEAKER_00: There's so much money that these parents and guardians are spending.
24:22
SPEAKER_00: We want to make sure that they're getting a really comprehensive education.
24:26
SPEAKER_00: Even if your focus is competition drill team, this, that's still gonna help them.
24:31
SPEAKER_00: If you take a modern dance workshop, it's not gonna hurt them.
24:34
SPEAKER_00: It's only gonna help their program and those dancers, I find.
24:37
SPEAKER_02: And prepare them for that BFA program that they might be going to and have that modern dance class not be the first time that they even dabble in that genre at the audition because we've never introduced it prior to.
24:52
SPEAKER_02: And I think that everything that you said is so valid and part of this conversation because contemporary dance, you said it at a few minutes ago, is a fusion.
25:02
SPEAKER_02: So all of the training and the versatility that you're gonna be getting from so many different genres of dance is going to help influence your movement vocabulary to be more versatile and more hireable in the contemporary world if you understand more vocabulary.
25:19
SPEAKER_02: And if you're just doing ballet and if you're only doing modern, like, yes, your technique's gonna be gorgeous, it's gonna be beautiful.
25:26
SPEAKER_02: But there's a lot of ballet companies that have jazz dance uh choreographers come in and set rep on the ballet company.
25:34
SPEAKER_02: Do you know how to isolate your hips properly?
25:36
SPEAKER_02: Like, do you, you know, do you have the background of enough jazz?
25:40
SPEAKER_02: It doesn't have to be crazy, but it needs to be enough where you can actually fulfill the expectation of the job, whatever in whatever side of the industry that you're going into.
25:49
SPEAKER_02: So even if you do want to be contemporary, like you said, there are some companies that are more heavily focused on the classical training, and it's just a preference at that point.
26:00
SPEAKER_02: But like you should be setting yourself up in your training to have the ability to go wherever.
26:05
SPEAKER_02: You know, you should be able to go here, here, here.
26:07
SPEAKER_02: I think that that's a perfect example like of your career, of why you were able to bounce around to so many different parts of the industry is it comes back down to how were you trained from the very beginning and where did you put the emphasis?
26:20
SPEAKER_02: And it sounds like you gained a lot of versatility and that helped your contemporary career.
26:25
SPEAKER_00: Well, you know, you know, yes, just to piggyback off what you said, it's also I went to a studio and that the mission for dance studios in my mind usually are to provide a comprehensive movement education.
26:38
SPEAKER_00: And then so you can choose to go to this way, that way, or that.
26:41
SPEAKER_00: But if you want ballet and modern, then you go to the ballet schools if you can afford.
26:45
SPEAKER_00: Then we also have to talk about socioeconomic, right?
26:47
SPEAKER_00: Like it really, really depends.
26:48
SPEAKER_00: So we we but the dance studio world, that's and I don't know if it's old school, but I feel it's a comprehensive dance education, not just saying we only want to focus on this or focus on that.
27:00
SPEAKER_00: It's but it's still you're having really great training in the contemporary world.
27:04
SPEAKER_00: You can also, that's why I like labels are difficult for me.
27:08
SPEAKER_00: But I you can also have contemporary ballet, contemporary tap, contemporary jazz.
27:12
SPEAKER_00: So for me, contemporary is like we talked about, just it's a fusion of ideas, know your lineage, know where you came from.
27:20
SPEAKER_00: Um, and that, and and yes, you have floor just like in modern.
27:23
SPEAKER_00: Modern dance also has a lot of floor technique and floor classes, not just contemporary.
27:28
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
27:29
SPEAKER_00: There is there are some dance historians out there that will talk about the modern dance and the postmodern and the people that uh celebrated postmodern, like Trisha Brown, Yvonne Rayner.
27:40
SPEAKER_00: But then contemporary dance formed in the later, later 20th century.
27:44
SPEAKER_00: But that's the best way I can describe it.
27:45
SPEAKER_00: It's a fusion.
27:46
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
27:47
SPEAKER_02: But you know what?
27:47
SPEAKER_02: I just want to mention that when you said that you're not a fan of labels, it took me, I don't know if you felt this, Leslie, it took me immediately back to our rhythm tap, quote unquote rhythm tap episode where Caleb Tysher was on as a guest and did not.
28:05
SPEAKER_05: Every single time Caleb said rhythm tap, they then said, if you want to call it that.
28:10
SPEAKER_05: Yes.
28:11
SPEAKER_05: Yes.
28:12
SPEAKER_05: So like Which I mean, it's fair.
28:14
SPEAKER_05: Like it is, we have to start thinking of there, there are so many lineages, and there is, you know, very few things in life came from one place.
28:23
SPEAKER_05: You know, there's just branches and roots coming from everywhere.
28:26
SPEAKER_05: I think with with that particular piece with contemporary dance at competition is sort of what what I want to jump into is we see so much on stage at competition that it's hard to even, you know, because we can't label it or have have a hard time labeling it, is it even anything?
28:45
SPEAKER_05: It's in the contemporary category, but I'm not seeing any, I'm not seeing your lineage.
28:51
SPEAKER_05: And it, you know, I say this a lot of time when I judge, I don't necessarily need to know what your story is, but you, I need to know that you know what your story is.
28:59
SPEAKER_05: And I think the same thing for lineage.
29:01
SPEAKER_05: Like I don't know that I need to be able to name off every style of dance you've ever you've ever studied, but I need to see through your movement that you have studied.
29:09
SPEAKER_05: And I think a lot of times people get thrown into the can into the contemporary category, almost sort of how people sometimes throw people into the musical theater category.
29:17
SPEAKER_05: In the open category.
29:18
SPEAKER_05: Or the open category, because they're like, well, this will be fine.
29:21
SPEAKER_05: They'll they can hang in here and it's like can you?
29:25
SPEAKER_02: Are they?
29:26
SPEAKER_02: I don't think so.
29:27
SPEAKER_02: Especially as a training dancer, I think that's where it comes back around.
29:31
SPEAKER_02: And I'm curious because as a judge, I need to know that you understand the movement vocabulary that you're doing.
29:38
SPEAKER_02: And just because we're in the fusion, just because we're in the current, doesn't mean that you can get away with things that you might not have gotten away with if you put this in a harder, quote unquote, harder division that has a little bit more codified technique attached to it.
29:53
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
29:53
SPEAKER_00: And I I this is why I give so much respect to all of you who adjudicate and judge.
29:58
SPEAKER_00: I haven't done it in years, since like 2016 or so in Canada.
30:02
SPEAKER_00: It's very difficult to be an adjudicator and a judge.
30:05
SPEAKER_00: And it takes a huge skill set and a gift to have I there's so much I want to talk about.
30:11
SPEAKER_00: And for me, I know there's a bigger picture, but what what I'm going to say now is sometimes I wish that the directors, and I get it, business is very difficult.
30:19
SPEAKER_00: But if we're running, I look at dance studio world very similar to um education as public schools.
30:26
SPEAKER_00: It is you're trying to lay a foundation of everything there.
30:31
SPEAKER_00: And you you sometimes you start, if you know that if I'm going for a competition that's trying to win the diversity award and I'm doing every genre, then I need to bring in all these different choreographers.
30:42
SPEAKER_00: Then I need to have a conversation, it's very similar to a director of a professional dance company.
30:47
SPEAKER_00: You're looking at what you're curating for that season.
30:51
SPEAKER_00: And sometimes I wish that directors would kind of invite themselves to start going outside the box.
30:58
SPEAKER_00: We need it in this jazz vernacular.
31:01
SPEAKER_00: Okay, now that we know it's going to be this big, what do our students this year need to work on?
31:06
SPEAKER_00: I sometimes wish we would curate it that way, but I also know it's a finance thing.
31:10
SPEAKER_00: I get that, because not every studio can afford.
31:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
31:12
SPEAKER_00: I also feel I'm also one of the choreographers' dance studios, but I feel that we have too many choreographers coming in.
31:18
SPEAKER_00: I think we need to rely also on in-house choreographers and rely on all these great educators that have degrees.
31:25
SPEAKER_00: Let them choreograph.
31:27
SPEAKER_00: Why do we need to bring, and I'm one of them.
31:29
SPEAKER_00: Right.
31:29
SPEAKER_00: But why do we need to bring in so many well-known choreographers?
31:33
SPEAKER_00: These students are getting choreographers, well-known choreographers at age seven.
31:37
SPEAKER_00: By the time they're 19, they've had everyone.
31:39
SPEAKER_04: Right.
31:39
SPEAKER_00: I feel like there's something that they should work towards.
31:42
SPEAKER_00: And maybe we can find more balance in the studio world, including what I do for education programs.
31:47
SPEAKER_00: I'm trying to find that's why I'm very selective of what studios I go to.
31:50
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
31:51
SPEAKER_00: And if they don't align with my vision, it's nothing wrong.
31:54
SPEAKER_00: I'm not mad at them.
31:55
SPEAKER_00: It's just I I it's I let's agree that we don't align.
31:59
SPEAKER_00: That's okay.
32:00
SPEAKER_00: But sometimes I get strong feedback and I'm like, well, we don't need to hate on each other.
32:05
SPEAKER_00: We need to respect.
32:06
SPEAKER_00: There's a level of respect.
32:07
SPEAKER_00: Let's just be curious and be like, okay, you're you wanting to go this direction.
32:10
SPEAKER_00: Let's go go for that.
32:12
SPEAKER_00: But how can I support you and our community?
32:15
SPEAKER_00: You want to go more funk and hip hop.
32:17
SPEAKER_00: Okay, let's try this and not only focus on the the roster that people are utilizing, let's find other amazing people and give them an opportunity.
32:25
SPEAKER_00: So I'm it's something that I don't know where we are coming from, but I it's something I want to talk about is how do we build more curiosity as artistic directors and dance studio programs?
32:37
SPEAKER_05: Oh, that's such a great question.
32:39
SPEAKER_00: And also difficult.
32:40
SPEAKER_05: Peter, you I feel like you would have been a great guest on like four other podcasts.
32:45
SPEAKER_05: But based on what you just said, I'm like, oh, he would have been great on that episode.
32:48
SPEAKER_05: Oh, he would have been good on that episode.
32:50
SPEAKER_05: So many episodes, yeah.
32:51
SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
32:52
SPEAKER_05: I think the one of the barriers to being more curious and being more supportive of the community is the scarcity mindset of we all recognize that this is a privilege.
33:04
SPEAKER_05: And where are the where are the people with privilege going to give their money?
33:08
SPEAKER_05: Then I'm the privileged one who gets to accept their money and their time and their talent.
33:13
SPEAKER_05: And, you know, not everybody has the means.
33:15
SPEAKER_05: And so I think that's unfortunately part of it for even with bringing in guest choreographers, which we've had that exact conversation on this podcast a couple of times, is is this worth it?
33:26
SPEAKER_05: Is your studio ready?
33:27
SPEAKER_05: Is it even, is it better?
33:28
SPEAKER_05: Is it worse?
33:29
SPEAKER_05: Is it more beneficial?
33:30
SPEAKER_05: Um, and that's also a scarcity thing of like, well, if my kid doesn't get the guest choreographer, then I'm gonna take her to this studio where they will bring the guest choreographer because somehow that's better.
33:39
SPEAKER_05: But really, is it just more money?
33:41
SPEAKER_00: And you know, this goes back to and um again, it's about the directors, it's not always easy.
33:46
SPEAKER_00: And I don't run a studio.
33:47
SPEAKER_00: I'm an artistic director, but so I can only speak from the lens of being a guide.
33:51
SPEAKER_00: Um, I don't like to say uh a direct a guide or a leader.
33:55
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
33:56
SPEAKER_00: But we have to set that tone.
33:57
SPEAKER_00: It's not always easy because you know your demographic better than I ever would, and everyone is different.
34:02
SPEAKER_00: We can have some equations just a set of rubrics, but then branch off from there.
34:07
SPEAKER_00: But I do wish that the parents would build more of a dialogue with those directors and it has more of respect.
34:16
SPEAKER_00: Just like parents um hiring choreographers.
34:19
SPEAKER_00: I always tell those parents that reach out to me, you gotta have your artistic director reach out to me.
34:24
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
34:25
SPEAKER_00: It's out of respect.
34:26
SPEAKER_00: I'm so sorry.
34:27
SPEAKER_00: I I, you know, there's maybe one time that I did because I knew they went independent and they needed a mentor, and I spoke to their past director and I said I can do this.
34:35
SPEAKER_00: But I really believe in respecting the student that they came from to build that relationship.
34:40
SPEAKER_00: And the directors also need to set set up boundaries.
34:43
SPEAKER_00: But there was something I wanted to mention, piggybacking off of what you said.
34:48
SPEAKER_00: I also let's trust these artistic directors that let's not only go into maybe the trendy ones that sometimes might be jazz or contemporary.
34:57
SPEAKER_00: They students need to earn their way up.
35:00
SPEAKER_00: And these artistic directors and teachers do know we we went to school for a reason.
35:04
SPEAKER_00: We've been working in this field.
35:05
SPEAKER_00: I don't go into a surgery and say, nope, do this.
35:08
SPEAKER_00: So I ask guardians and parents to please.
35:11
SPEAKER_00: That's why I personally, when I'm guiding, I don't like to see the the guardians or the parents because I when I see parents doing this or tapping on a window, I'm like, you know, I don't go into your business and tell you what to do or what they need to do.
35:22
SPEAKER_00: And I do not tell, I politely ask them not to correct their dancers or their kids while they're being teached taught.
35:29
SPEAKER_00: And I see this sometimes.
35:30
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, we don't do that.
35:31
SPEAKER_00: There's a there's a culture that we need to build out of respect to the art.
35:36
SPEAKER_00: It's not about me.
35:38
SPEAKER_00: It's not about you.
35:39
SPEAKER_00: For me, it's about the art at the center of the room.
35:42
SPEAKER_00: We're focusing on process and education.
35:45
SPEAKER_00: That's what we need to remember while we're all here.
35:48
SPEAKER_00: So, so to go back to this idea of contemporary, that might be trendy or or whatnot, but I I love contemporary dance.
35:56
SPEAKER_00: I don't know where it's going.
35:58
SPEAKER_00: What I and I don't want to try to predict the future of where the dance studio world is going, where the company world is, I'm nervous.
36:06
SPEAKER_00: Because it's because I'm kind of going off in a tangent.
36:08
SPEAKER_00: I'm nervous because from the professional standpoint and from being in the field, we have lack of funding.
36:12
SPEAKER_00: And I try to share this with our demographic because it is important.
36:17
SPEAKER_00: If we as a studio do don't start, I know it's very difficult, and and dance studio owners, I'm trying to remind them I it is a very difficult.
36:24
SPEAKER_00: I run a business.
36:26
SPEAKER_00: Running a business is not easy.
36:27
SPEAKER_00: It's like a restaurant.
36:28
SPEAKER_00: It's like you eat, sleep, and breathe at 24-7.
36:35
SPEAKER_02: Attention, all dancers.
36:37
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36:43
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36:47
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36:52
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36:59
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37:05
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37:09
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37:15
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37:19
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37:36
SPEAKER_00: We, if we don't start supporting our local dance companies, our local shows, the local art, if it doesn't start there supporting locally, we are not going to thrive specifically.
37:46
SPEAKER_00: I can only speak about dance, contemporary dance.
37:48
SPEAKER_00: And again, I hate the label, but I'm talking about the nonprofit dance world that is the lowest paid.
37:54
SPEAKER_00: And if we don't start supporting the local modern dance company here, and what I hear studios like, they're just bad.
38:00
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, oh, before we start negatively judging, I don't feel like that's my place here on earth.
38:06
SPEAKER_00: I don't want to judge because you don't know what they're going.
38:08
SPEAKER_00: And also sometimes post-modern might not align with you, or this kind of performance art, experiential art, immersive art might not align with you, but it is really done well.
38:20
SPEAKER_00: And also we have to understand maybe they don't have the funding to pay their dancers five times a week.
38:25
SPEAKER_01: Right.
38:26
SPEAKER_00: That's something I really want to talk about and be transparent about.
38:28
SPEAKER_00: Right now, we can't compete with the European and Canadian and Asian dance companies.
38:33
SPEAKER_00: I love what's happening in Asia contemporary-wise.
38:35
SPEAKER_00: I think it's again, for lack of a better word, I say contemporary, but they're having a lot of funding in some of the Asian countries and European and Canadian companies.
38:43
SPEAKER_00: We have lost so much funding.
38:45
SPEAKER_00: Our process has to be fast.
38:47
SPEAKER_00: So what I'm seeing, I'm not, it's not a judgment.
38:50
SPEAKER_00: It's an thought, it's an awareness.
38:52
SPEAKER_00: We have to sometimes in concert dance in smaller companies in America, have to have a two-week process, three to four hours a day, make a 20-minute work.
39:02
SPEAKER_00: That is extremely fast.
39:05
SPEAKER_04: Wow.
39:05
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
39:06
SPEAKER_00: Can I do that?
39:07
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
39:07
SPEAKER_00: Could I do it in a week?
39:08
SPEAKER_00: But then I have to have it prepped.
39:09
SPEAKER_00: I have to have all the counts.
39:10
SPEAKER_00: I have to figure this out.
39:11
SPEAKER_00: And then you hear sometimes, this is just like a gossip and things that I hear.
39:15
SPEAKER_00: Europeans are like, well, some Americans are not, this is generalizing, and I don't really mean to do that.
39:20
SPEAKER_00: What I hear sometimes that, oh, Americans are having everything done.
39:25
SPEAKER_00: But I I want to preface that sometimes American choreographers have to work quickly.
39:31
SPEAKER_00: It's almost like being on television.
39:33
SPEAKER_00: We have a short process.
39:34
SPEAKER_00: We have to still have to make the same length.
39:36
SPEAKER_00: Our work suffers because we have a lack of funding.
39:40
SPEAKER_00: So our work looks like this.
39:42
SPEAKER_00: It's not only just because of our choices, but also our choices.
39:46
SPEAKER_00: We choose this because we live in a capitalistic society, nothing negative.
39:51
SPEAKER_00: That is what we're dealing with.
39:52
SPEAKER_00: We live in a fast-paced society.
39:54
SPEAKER_00: Also culturally, we work, we move, we it that I'm I'm generalizing and I don't mean to, because not all of us are like that.
40:01
SPEAKER_00: And I try not to, I work hard to always focus on a longer process.
40:06
SPEAKER_00: But having a short period of time does reflect on what the outcome of the art is going to be.
40:13
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
40:14
SPEAKER_00: And so now to circle back to the dance studio world, if we start supporting locally and start uplifting the voices in our local communities, specifically about modern and contemporary dance, I think we will thrive more.
40:25
SPEAKER_00: But we have very few jobs.
40:27
SPEAKER_00: We have a lot of dancers going to university specifically for BFA and dance.
40:32
SPEAKER_00: And I don't know the percentage, but it's very low that they're most likely going to get a job.
40:38
SPEAKER_00: But if you are training in a dance studio and you're versatile, you're more likely to be able to dance in a cruise ship, in a concert dance, concert dance meaning nonprofit company world, whatever genre that it may be, television world, Broadway, Cirque du Soleil.
40:54
SPEAKER_00: So that's why I respect dance studio world, because then these dancers have a little more at their plate.
41:00
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
41:00
SPEAKER_00: I went off on this major tangent.
41:02
SPEAKER_02: We love a tangent.
41:03
SPEAKER_02: It's so necessary.
41:05
SPEAKER_02: It's necessary to be transparent about the realities of this world post-competition world.
41:12
SPEAKER_02: Because, like you hinted at the trends of contemporary.
41:17
SPEAKER_02: Contemporary is the trendy genre to do right now.
41:20
SPEAKER_02: I mean, I can't tell you how many times I've sat through the teens senior division of competition and it took five hours to get through solos for just contemporary, which half of them are lyrical, but that's another story.
41:33
SPEAKER_02: Anyway, it's trendy.
41:40
SPEAKER_00: Yes, we thank you.
41:41
SPEAKER_02: But like, you know, and I I think that we're just following trends, what feels cool, what feels like it might win, but then what's after that?
41:50
SPEAKER_02: And oh, like you said, a lot of people are gonna go to school and the the amount of of work might not be there.
41:57
SPEAKER_02: And that's a I mean, to be honest, it's across the board in the entire dance world, not just in the professional concert world and company world of contemporary movement, but you know, the more versatility does open up the job pools even stronger.
42:11
SPEAKER_02: But I do think that it is important for people to understand that in in the genre and the world of contemporary, the movement that dancers love doing on stage at competition, it's going to be hard to continue to do that and make a complete living off of it.
42:27
SPEAKER_02: Unfortunately, you're gonna have to have supplemental income, you're gonna have to have additional jobs.
42:31
SPEAKER_02: You can do it, yes, but we need to keep those companies, those opportunities afloat and educate our dancers on seeing seeing stepping outside of the box and seeing dance companies perform.
42:47
SPEAKER_02: The amount of dancers who have never even gone to see like Alvin Ailey and the Ailey company perform, it's like that it you have to.
42:55
SPEAKER_02: You have and they go on tour for a reason.
42:58
SPEAKER_02: They come to you.
42:59
SPEAKER_02: You that like there's access.
43:02
SPEAKER_00: You're so right.
43:02
SPEAKER_00: And I I think and I started to circle back, but Mrs.
43:06
SPEAKER_00: Liz Bepalaca and Mr.
43:08
SPEAKER_00: Al Packard were revolutionary.
43:11
SPEAKER_00: What she did during my time, I mean, yes, it was a recreational dance studio, and I it but but the amount of knowledge she had themes every month of the way she would train us.
43:22
SPEAKER_00: One theme, she would bring my mother in to teach music.
43:25
SPEAKER_00: So the whole lesson plan was around music, music theory, ballet, tap, jazz, acro.
43:30
SPEAKER_00: Then she would have um another month of center around the skeletal system.
43:34
SPEAKER_00: Every genre had to speak about the the bones.
43:38
SPEAKER_00: Then it was the muscles, then it was nutrition.
43:40
SPEAKER_00: Then she brought in um her name was Mona Clifford here in in in Florida.
43:46
SPEAKER_00: It was systematic work.
43:47
SPEAKER_00: This is in the late 80s and early 90s.
43:49
SPEAKER_00: And this is a very regular dance studio that we didn't even do a lot of competitions.
43:54
SPEAKER_00: We also did a lot of community service work, and then she also it we had.
44:00
SPEAKER_00: To do a lot of um outside performances.
44:02
SPEAKER_00: The way she was building an educational system to me was um comprehensive.
44:07
SPEAKER_00: I saw Hub Hubbard Street for my first time.
44:10
SPEAKER_00: I heard about Alvin Ailey because of her.
44:12
SPEAKER_00: Then we saw a Broadway show.
44:13
SPEAKER_00: So every um twice a year, we would raise money to go see these shows.
44:17
SPEAKER_05: Oh wow.
44:18
SPEAKER_00: And that was part of our dance studio education.
44:22
SPEAKER_00: And and what I and again, not to tell, is just to I hope it inspires dance studio owners to try not to, it's a business, and I get that.
44:31
SPEAKER_00: And they lose students if they don't follow trends.
44:34
SPEAKER_00: But if we follow our vision and our mission in life, if you're centering around dance education, if you're very strong, there's a lot of dance studios that I still um belong to, um, not because the other ones are wrong, but since a young age, I've always believed in I need to go to those dance studios once a month or twice a month, even when I was living in other countries.
44:55
SPEAKER_00: I really, or I would I back in the day, I'm dating myself, they would send me VHS tapes, and that's how I would correct them and I would call them on the telephone once a month and give them notes.
45:04
SPEAKER_00: Wow.
45:04
SPEAKER_00: I believe in that.
45:06
SPEAKER_00: And that's why people are like, oh, your pieces, they're doing well.
45:08
SPEAKER_00: It's not that they were doing well because of the choreography, it's because I believed in process.
45:12
SPEAKER_00: Even in the 90s, I was doing that.
45:14
SPEAKER_00: There's something to be said about that.
45:16
SPEAKER_00: And it's a different time now, but I wish that the dance studio owners would maybe focus on the talents that they have locally a little more so they wouldn't have to resource and outsource all of us outside.
45:29
SPEAKER_00: I'm again, I don't mean to take our jobs away, but I think we can find more of a balance in general.
45:34
SPEAKER_00: And the way we develop programs, in the way we're asking photographers to join, and the way we talk about contemporary dance as well.
45:41
SPEAKER_00: And I think then to circle back, then we'll start understanding where that what that has a place in that open category, contemporary category, musical theater category.
45:51
SPEAKER_00: I just don't know how you all do it when talking about competitions.
45:54
SPEAKER_00: Like the labels, I think that's why I have such a hard time judging because the labels drive me crazy.
46:02
SPEAKER_00: And then I want to just adjudicate the system.
46:04
SPEAKER_00: I want to go into the studio and be like, can I look at your system?
46:07
SPEAKER_00: What are you no known judgment?
46:09
SPEAKER_00: It's just because I love that stuff.
46:10
SPEAKER_00: I love it.
46:11
SPEAKER_00: I just want to be brought in and be like, okay, how can I help?
46:17
SPEAKER_05: Competitions is that like I think some some of us, now don't I can't speak for every judge, but like I do kind of have to compartmentalize when I'm at a competition because here's the thing you entered a competition.
46:28
SPEAKER_05: There are categories.
46:29
SPEAKER_05: There are expectations within those categories.
46:32
SPEAKER_05: There are labels that we have put on these expectations on the categories.
46:35
SPEAKER_05: And if you're not doing the thing, I can't give you the score.
46:38
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
46:39
SPEAKER_05: In my other life, yes, I'd love to watch your very interesting weird dance and not critique it and be just curious.
46:46
SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
46:46
SPEAKER_05: But I'm not here to do that.
46:47
SPEAKER_05: And you're not here to do that.
46:48
SPEAKER_05: And if you expected that to be what's happening here, you need to reevaluate what you're doing here.
46:53
SPEAKER_05: And that's when people get mad.
46:55
SPEAKER_05: You're like, well, we worked so hard on this.
46:57
SPEAKER_05: Well, sure.
46:57
SPEAKER_05: But did you follow the directions that are within?
47:00
SPEAKER_05: Like art is subjective, but there's also directions.
47:02
SPEAKER_05: And this is a comic that has rules.
47:05
SPEAKER_00: That's I don't know.
47:06
SPEAKER_00: It's just like more of a I just love building and dreaming.
47:09
SPEAKER_00: But is there a way?
47:10
SPEAKER_00: I mean, gosh, maybe this is wrong too.
47:12
SPEAKER_00: And I'm probably opening can of worms to have have uh, I don't even want to say technical because that means a whole different thing.
47:18
SPEAKER_00: Like there's technique in everything.
47:19
SPEAKER_00: Performance art to tap to acro, there's technique in everything.
47:22
SPEAKER_00: But is there something that focuses on the the skills that we want in that genre?
47:28
SPEAKER_00: Is there something one focusing on?
47:30
SPEAKER_00: I don't even want to say emotional, the artistic side of what is subjective to them.
47:35
SPEAKER_00: Is there something about musicality?
47:37
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
47:38
SPEAKER_00: Like, yeah, are the is there a adjudicator for each?
47:41
SPEAKER_00: But that's also it's just there's some comps that do that actually.
47:44
SPEAKER_00: They do.
47:45
SPEAKER_00: Does it work?
47:46
SPEAKER_00: How do you I'm not sure?
47:47
SPEAKER_02: I've never done it, but I've heard it's one that we actually work with, and they have their judge, it's Elevation on Tour, and they have like a technique judge, and then they have an artistry judge, and then they have uh, you know, different stat different, you know, individual things in that we're watching within, and like their critique is centered around those elements, which I think is really unique.
48:07
SPEAKER_02: Instead of packaging it all into one and then all three judges are saying the same thing.
48:12
SPEAKER_02: But that being said, I'm curious.
48:14
SPEAKER_02: So you kind of talked about like skills.
48:17
SPEAKER_02: What would you describe are would be some of the movement vocabulary that you would see in contemporary, let's say, you know, and like I kind of hinted at a lot of the times at comp, and it doesn't have to be competition specific, it could be contemporary as a genre in general.
48:32
SPEAKER_02: But like I've hinted at like there's a lot of times I sit back and I watch a dance and I'm like, this is lyrical.
48:38
SPEAKER_02: And why I feel like this is lyrical, even though you've labeled it as contemporary, is because it feels a little bit more balletic.
48:44
SPEAKER_02: It has more turned out, more airy quality to the movement.
48:47
SPEAKER_02: And yes, that can be contemporary, but in the world of competition, this when we have those labels, it feels like this was miscategorized in this world.
48:58
SPEAKER_02: But then with that, is there any specific things that like when you see it, you're like, this is definitely contemporary?
49:05
SPEAKER_02: Like, do you know what I'm saying?
49:06
SPEAKER_02: Like, I want to know like some movement vocabulary that feels like we can lay label it, unfortunately, as more something I love seeing in contemporary dance.
49:15
SPEAKER_02: So you expect to see.
49:16
SPEAKER_00: If we're gonna talk about like some some labels or some some things to focus on, you know, but then I'm gonna I'll say what I'm thinking off the top of my head, and then I'm gonna contradict myself in a second.
49:27
SPEAKER_00: But you know, it focuses on a blend of like fluidity, but also there, I mean, I do see there's a lot of fluidity.
49:34
SPEAKER_00: There's a blend of styles, there's floor work, but then there can also be punches and staccatoness.
49:39
SPEAKER_00: But there's a different, I don't want to say a different, I guess the quality seems a little more expansive.
49:48
SPEAKER_00: But then does modern dance have that?
49:50
SPEAKER_00: Does ballet have that?
49:52
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
49:52
SPEAKER_00: Does tap have fluidity?
49:54
SPEAKER_00: Yes, right.
49:55
SPEAKER_00: So the for lack of a better word, I I use this word a lot in my company.
49:59
SPEAKER_00: I love to smear the concepts and the ideas.
50:02
SPEAKER_00: I blend a lot of qigong and tai chi principles, traditional Chinese medicine thoughts with jazz and improvisation.
50:10
SPEAKER_00: You know, Tai Chi uses uh an aspect of improvisation, uh, and so does qigong.
50:16
SPEAKER_00: And so we do that as well in contemporary.
50:19
SPEAKER_00: So for me, the quality, things look smeared and maybe sometimes muddled.
50:24
SPEAKER_00: I don't know if that's really giving a direct answer, but you can have that.
50:28
SPEAKER_00: You can find floor work, fluidity, uh staccato in modern dance as well.
50:33
SPEAKER_00: So I think for me, like if I'm labeling, it goes to the like I'm almost wondering.
50:38
SPEAKER_00: I think modern dance comes from this era, postmodern is this era, contemporary.
50:43
SPEAKER_00: We I have to reference those if I'm speaking about them.
50:46
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
50:47
SPEAKER_00: I'm I'm thinking that that helps me, but that's how I would kind of talk about contemporary dance.
50:55
SPEAKER_00: I don't know if that's helpful.
50:57
SPEAKER_02: I'm curious to know.
50:59
SPEAKER_02: Do you do you feel that and this is a and I have two questions, sort of.
51:04
SPEAKER_02: Do you feel that we talked about how ballet is an important aspect, but it's not the end all be all, but it is an important aspect of dance training and laying the foundation for multiple genres of dance.
51:15
SPEAKER_02: Do you feel that modern is necessary for dancers to understand and learn and learn the foundation of before touching contemporary?
51:27
SPEAKER_02: Or can contemporary be touched before modern?
51:30
SPEAKER_02: Because currently I feel it is the second we're doing contemporary and we might not really know exactly what we're doing.
51:39
SPEAKER_02: And then we get into a structured modern class in college, but should it be reversed?
51:44
SPEAKER_00: You know, so this is where I don't give straight answers.
51:48
SPEAKER_00: I think as long as the intention is always the intention's always there and education is at the center, then I don't think we can go wrong.
51:56
SPEAKER_00: Because I grew up in a day where people are like, oh, they shouldn't do jazz at this certain point.
51:59
SPEAKER_00: But I'm like, well, now we're getting into we can be getting into a cultural issue.
52:03
SPEAKER_00: And that's why I left my my teacher sh later on.
52:07
SPEAKER_00: She's like, no, this we learn movements like this.
52:10
SPEAKER_00: Why can't an eight-year-old learn jazz dance?
52:13
SPEAKER_00: We should be.
52:13
SPEAKER_00: This is a cultural thing too, as well.
52:15
SPEAKER_00: We want to celebrate as long as we're honoring all the lineages that these things come from.
52:19
SPEAKER_00: And granted, it's very hard to know everything.
52:22
SPEAKER_00: Like, but if we lead with intention and transparency, I think, and instead of like getting upset and defensive, I'm the first one to have humility.
52:30
SPEAKER_00: I have no problem saying I'm so sorry, because half the time it's not my intention to hurt, but people get hurt, right?
52:37
SPEAKER_00: So I personally, if I if I if you want to go into the professional contemporary dance realm, like dance company world, I think you need both.
52:46
SPEAKER_00: I I am an advocate.
52:49
SPEAKER_00: If you do jazz, because for me, Horton is also like jazz.
52:53
SPEAKER_00: It's a it's it's amazing.
52:55
SPEAKER_00: I love Horton.
52:56
SPEAKER_00: But again, if you're doing a tondue and jazz class, it's the same tongue and ballet, it's just maybe different music and maybe a different portable.
53:04
SPEAKER_00: But I'm sorry, the the foundational idea, the biomechanics of a turned-out tondue and a parallel tondu are this should be the same.
53:13
SPEAKER_00: So that that's why I go back to it doesn't matter what you're teaching, as long as it's taught with intention.
53:19
SPEAKER_00: I don't want to say taught well, taught with intention and holding the students accountable.
53:23
SPEAKER_00: And but again, I think modern dance is so what modern dance taught me, it taught me floor work, it taught me weight shifting, it taught me um rhythm changes.
53:34
SPEAKER_00: So did jazz.
53:35
SPEAKER_00: Jazz did too.
53:36
SPEAKER_00: Jazz taught me coordination, but you get that in ballet.
53:39
SPEAKER_00: But I really think, but also you can also go the other direction.
53:42
SPEAKER_00: Then we need to do work on house, we need to work on hip-hop that teachers footwork.
53:46
SPEAKER_00: So I just think stick, we just like the university systems.
53:50
SPEAKER_00: I feel like we're all trying to do everything.
53:53
SPEAKER_00: I don't think it's bad to say, you know what, we are a hip-hop school, we are a ballet school.
54:00
SPEAKER_00: I don't think it's bad to say we're gonna focus on ballet and hip-hop, or we're gonna focus on modern and jazz funk.
54:07
SPEAKER_00: I don't think that's bad.
54:08
SPEAKER_00: I think we're trying to fit so much in right now.
54:10
SPEAKER_00: And I'm probably gonna hear some feedback on this, but I just think sometimes we're trying to do so, so, so, so much.
54:18
SPEAKER_00: But that's why I loved what my teacher did going back to the dance studio world.
54:22
SPEAKER_00: Have a theme for every semester and every month.
54:25
SPEAKER_00: And if you do that in four years, you're gonna get a lot.
54:28
SPEAKER_04: Right.
54:29
SPEAKER_00: As educators, if we have missions and we have a syllabi or syllabus, that will keep us on track.
54:35
SPEAKER_00: And then no one can say, okay, so if I'm running a true this university, then I'll be like, in these four years, this is what I want to.
54:41
SPEAKER_00: And then the student body will know what they're getting into.
54:44
SPEAKER_00: And I'll say the reason why I can't get into this jazz funk class or that top class is because I'm trying to do this, but at least I'm getting the rhythms here.
54:51
SPEAKER_00: And I feel like we're trying to do so much that the dancers, it's just like it's not sitting in their bodies sometimes.
54:57
SPEAKER_01: Right.
54:58
SPEAKER_00: That I appreciate the programs that are offering everything.
55:01
SPEAKER_01: Right.
55:02
SPEAKER_00: But it's it the dancers are getting overwhelmed.
55:04
SPEAKER_00: So if they want to get into a professional dance company like Hubbard Street, then we also need to look at what are they doing at Hubbard Street ballet.
55:11
SPEAKER_00: And important.
55:12
SPEAKER_00: And so then though maybe if the dance studio wants to go that direction, maybe we can start going moving in that direction.
55:18
SPEAKER_02: Right.
55:18
SPEAKER_02: Or guiding that dancer into summer programs or things that can them prepare for that goal of theirs or that dream of theirs.
55:26
SPEAKER_02: And I think that there has to be a point in time in a dancer's training where they make that shift and they make that choice and they uh sit down with their teacher and their teacher can guide them and say, This uh this is a summer program that you need to apply for because you need to get this training that I don't provide you.
55:42
SPEAKER_02: I don't provide you, Horton, but you need access to this.
55:44
SPEAKER_02: If you want to get into this program after college or whatever, and start doing it now.
55:48
SPEAKER_02: Like the teachers need to guide.
55:51
SPEAKER_02: And I think that every, especially for the dancers that want to pursue a professional career in any capacity, there needs to be more mentoring and guiding.
55:58
SPEAKER_02: And hopefully the studio is laying the groundwork and the foundation.
56:01
SPEAKER_02: And even if they are a studio that is uh one just a ballet studio, just a hip hop, just a jazz, are you able to still guide them and offer them the tools to prepare them for whatever their individual goal is, regardless of how your studio is structured?
56:17
SPEAKER_02: A lot of that guidance is missing.
56:19
SPEAKER_02: And I think that I talk with a lot of dancers who are, I'm lost, I'm stuck, I'm not sure what to do.
56:24
SPEAKER_02: What do you recommend that I should do?
56:26
SPEAKER_02: Do you have any advice?
56:26
SPEAKER_02: Do you have any opinions on and talking to the people who are in it currently, who have done it, who have lived it?
56:32
SPEAKER_02: And I have actually had a lot of teachers come to me and say, I know nothing about the New York City musical theater world.
56:39
SPEAKER_02: You do.
56:39
SPEAKER_02: Can I pass a student to you to can you can they ask you a few questions?
56:42
SPEAKER_02: Like, sure, yeah, absolutely.
56:45
SPEAKER_02: We want to help guide this next generation, but we want to be able to give them all of the opportunities that they want to achieve.
56:52
SPEAKER_02: And we're hoping that from their time at six years old to 18 years old at your home studio, that we've given them those tools in a variety of styles.
57:01
SPEAKER_00: And sometimes if we set the intention of even educating ourselves with the students and going to see the shows, the reason why we're also not doing well as a society, as a contemporary uh dance society is like we're not in Europe in Canada.
57:14
SPEAKER_00: They go see dance, especially in the Netherlands.
57:17
SPEAKER_00: They love intermission.
57:18
SPEAKER_00: They don't, they want intermission so they can talk about the pieces.
57:21
SPEAKER_00: It's set there for a reason.
57:23
SPEAKER_00: We also at a young age, why can't a four-year-old go see a modern dance show?
57:28
SPEAKER_00: Some people are like, oh, I don't know if that's appropriate.
57:30
SPEAKER_00: Well, what's not appropriate about it?
57:32
SPEAKER_00: Maybe I mean, it's modern dance.
57:35
SPEAKER_00: I mean, it depends on uh what other things are are pen uh, it depends on other things that are being shown and what's visible.
57:42
SPEAKER_01: Right.
57:42
SPEAKER_00: But why can't we educate a five-year-old to go see a contemporary dance?
57:46
SPEAKER_00: Sometimes the music might be scary.
57:48
SPEAKER_00: We understand that.
57:49
SPEAKER_00: But put headphones on, let them watch movement.
57:51
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
57:52
SPEAKER_00: And and and the more we educate our communities, I think we'll thrive and do and do better.
57:58
SPEAKER_00: But I also understand it's very difficult for dance studio owners.
58:01
SPEAKER_00: I I want everyone that's listening to this to understand I definitely have a lot of compassion and empathy.
58:06
SPEAKER_00: There are programs that I have uh that I still may not teach for, but that I'm still talking to the directors.
58:11
SPEAKER_00: They're small programs, but they're they are mighty and are a force.
58:15
SPEAKER_00: And their students are thriving.
58:17
SPEAKER_00: And they've chosen to make their programs smaller because they can lead with intention and it's not just about their bank account.
58:23
SPEAKER_00: Yes, they're smart business people.
58:25
SPEAKER_00: And then there's a uh two studios that I still work with.
58:28
SPEAKER_00: And I just love they've been around for a while and they're constantly shifting their systems.
58:34
SPEAKER_00: And I just respect when people are adventurous and curious and not trying to follow a system and just trying to win.
58:42
SPEAKER_00: Because at the end of the day, we are a capitalistic country and culturally, America, we compete, whether I like it or not.
58:50
SPEAKER_00: We compete for everything.
58:52
SPEAKER_00: The public school system is competing for the best grades to get more money.
58:55
SPEAKER_00: Do I agree with this?
58:56
SPEAKER_00: Not necessarily.
58:57
SPEAKER_00: I'm tired of competing, I but I don't mind healthy competition.
59:01
SPEAKER_00: But why can't we start putting process and construction and deconstruction?
59:06
SPEAKER_00: And this is why I love about dance.
59:09
SPEAKER_00: It is actually I have a student that became a doctor or a surgeon.
59:13
SPEAKER_00: And we we still talk about it to this day.
59:16
SPEAKER_00: What we learn in creative process is invaluable.
59:20
SPEAKER_00: It I work when I was working at Harvard or teaching other universities, I work with people that are not dancers at all.
59:26
SPEAKER_00: But the creative process is actually analogous sometimes.
59:30
SPEAKER_00: It's not exactly the same, but it's analogous in the way they approach research and the way they uh build curiosity.
59:36
SPEAKER_00: And it sometimes helps regulate them and get into their bodies.
59:39
SPEAKER_00: And that's why I think dance studios can offer more somatic practices and more process-driven and more conversation for classes.
59:47
SPEAKER_00: Not that you're turning into an education system, but why can't we offer that to your competition company dance teams?
59:54
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
59:54
SPEAKER_00: And because I've been doing this since the 90s, I'm still getting conversations from parents that I don't know what to do or directors.
1:00:01
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, you've been in this for 40 years.
1:00:03
SPEAKER_01: Right.
1:00:03
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:00:04
SPEAKER_01: Right.
1:00:04
SPEAKER_00: And we have so much accessible to us right now.
1:00:09
SPEAKER_05: Well, and if anything, you know, we talk about this a lot, but COVID taught us that there are so many more ways to present dance, to bring in somebody, to have a conversation.
1:00:19
SPEAKER_05: And I think, like you said, you know, you were being sent videotapes back in the 90s to give critiques.
1:00:24
SPEAKER_05: Well, we have this moment right here where I can speak to you.
1:00:27
SPEAKER_05: And we're in New York and you're in Florida.
1:00:29
SPEAKER_05: And like who says we can't do that in a dance class once a month?
1:00:32
SPEAKER_05: Bring in Peter Chu to have a discussion, to have a class, to have a whatever.
1:00:37
SPEAKER_05: And, you know, how much more money, energy, time is that going to take when that could be so beneficial for everyone?
1:00:43
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:00:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:00:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:00:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they love it.
1:00:46
SPEAKER_02: I'm curious to know if you would be willing to share to help educate some of our listeners out there to do their homework and research, some of your favorite current contemporary dance companies around the world, any that you want to give a shout out to that you love the work that they're doing, maybe any companies that you've had the honor of working with.
1:01:06
SPEAKER_02: Who's leading the charge right now in this genre?
1:01:11
SPEAKER_02: From your perfect your opinion.
1:01:13
SPEAKER_00: It's so difficult.
1:01:14
SPEAKER_02: I'm sure.
1:01:16
SPEAKER_00: You know.
1:01:17
SPEAKER_02: Who should like who should who do they need to look up and and know?
1:01:21
SPEAKER_00: That's yeah.
1:01:21
SPEAKER_00: Okay, so I'll approach it this way.
1:01:24
SPEAKER_00: I well, uh I recently choreographed for the Give Me Dance Company.
1:01:28
SPEAKER_00: I and I'm what I'm prefacing is uh it's not that I'm thinking these companies are the and all be all.
1:01:33
SPEAKER_00: I it's an amazing contemporary dance company.
1:01:35
SPEAKER_00: The artists are just so lovely to work with.
1:01:39
SPEAKER_00: And for me, I I want to work with generous people, but I also experienced that at Kansas City Ballet and Cincinnati Ballet as well.
1:01:47
SPEAKER_00: That, you know, so um that that is my closest what I've worked with people I've worked with recently.
1:01:53
SPEAKER_00: But of course, as an educator, I'm gonna say, okay, companies in America, Alvinelli American uh Dance Theater.
1:02:00
SPEAKER_00: You also have the Paul Taylor Dance Company, you also have uh, which I want to give a shout out, Nani Chen Dance Company.
1:02:07
SPEAKER_00: What I love about what she's a Taiwanese American and her husband's continuing her on her legacy.
1:02:13
SPEAKER_00: And I just respect what he's doing and what he will continue to do in the future and where it's going.
1:02:19
SPEAKER_00: And she's blent um a lot of martial arts and Tai Chi Qigang.
1:02:23
SPEAKER_00: And I think it's called, she has her own methodology and approach.
1:02:28
SPEAKER_00: And I I love and want to uplift they're going to bring more modern and contemporary dance and creative process into the mix in the future.
1:02:36
SPEAKER_00: Also, CloudGate in Taiwan.
1:02:39
SPEAKER_00: I'm just I'm uh it's uh Lin Huai Min, it was the old director.
1:02:44
SPEAKER_00: And they also blend Chinese opera, martial arts, and and what's also happening in China, there's all these incredible dance companies.
1:02:53
SPEAKER_00: Check out Ballet Jazz in Montréal, Ballet BC, Gothenburg in Sweden.
1:02:58
SPEAKER_00: They center a lot of their their, they curate a lot of um choreographers that um emphasize process.
1:03:07
SPEAKER_00: Netherlands Dance Theater, of course, but then you also have Scepino, a ballet, I think, Scepino Ballet in Rotterdam.
1:03:13
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
1:03:14
SPEAKER_00: And then an upcoming one that I want to give a shout out.
1:03:17
SPEAKER_00: And I love what um Kirsten's doing is Ballet Edmonton in Edmonton, Canada.
1:03:22
SPEAKER_00: Hobbert Street.
1:03:23
SPEAKER_00: And then uh there's one more, you know, there's so many dance companies that that I just but I also want to support local dance companies as well.
1:03:33
SPEAKER_00: And I want to preface the ones that I'm naming do have a lot of, they do get probably a lot more funding than most people.
1:03:40
SPEAKER_00: But Shiva is another one in Israel.
1:03:43
SPEAKER_00: But I'm trying to support a more North American right now just because that is my where I'm living.
1:03:51
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:03:51
SPEAKER_00: And this continent.
1:03:52
SPEAKER_00: But then you also have people um in the contemporary dance world, uh, like Matzek, like Ohad Naharan, Pina Bausch, that really paved the way for like dance theater.
1:04:04
SPEAKER_00: I William Foresight, Yiri Killian, but I I like to say Nani Chen from a uh Chinese American.
1:04:11
SPEAKER_00: She paved the way for uh Chinese American and uh incorporating um Eastern philosophy in modern and contemporary dance.
1:04:20
SPEAKER_00: Uh Lin Huai Min, Akram Khan, incredible choreographer that fuses contemporary and traditional um Indian dance.
1:04:30
SPEAKER_01: Wow.
1:04:30
SPEAKER_00: I just named a lot, but I mean I don't want to say Crystal Pite.
1:04:36
SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh, I work with Crystal Pite, Sharon Ayell.
1:04:38
SPEAKER_00: There's people, uh but I also love there are so many people I have not labeled that are from here.
1:04:45
SPEAKER_00: Jermaine Spivey, a dear colleague of mine, I love what he's doing.
1:04:48
SPEAKER_00: He's a dear, he's he adds a lot of improvisation in his work and uh when he's constructing and develops a lot of systems.
1:04:56
SPEAKER_00: And I find that very intriguing and interesting.
1:04:59
SPEAKER_00: These are just, you know, you have Twilight Tharp, look these people up and make it um.
1:05:04
SPEAKER_00: I'm not giving a wide range right now, but I think as educators, including like if I were to run a dance studio program, let's start playing games and offering these names more.
1:05:16
SPEAKER_00: We need more historical references.
1:05:19
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, right.
1:05:20
SPEAKER_00: Completely also Frank Hatchet.
1:05:22
SPEAKER_00: Please give him a shout out.
1:05:24
SPEAKER_05: Also, Frank Hatchet.
1:05:25
SPEAKER_05: Frank Hatchet gets mentioned a lot on this podcast.
1:05:27
SPEAKER_05: Really?
1:05:28
SPEAKER_05: I love it.
1:05:29
SPEAKER_00: I love it.
1:05:29
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
1:05:30
SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
1:05:31
SPEAKER_02: Wow.
1:05:32
SPEAKER_02: This was great.
1:05:33
SPEAKER_02: I loved learning from you.
1:05:35
SPEAKER_02: I think you have so much to share and so many great experiences that you've um encountered in your professional career.
1:05:43
SPEAKER_02: And every single bit of this conversation was eye opening and informative for me.
1:05:49
SPEAKER_02: And especially I moved to New York to be what I thought was a contemporary dancer.
1:05:56
SPEAKER_02: I wanted to be that when I was young.
1:05:58
SPEAKER_02: And I think a lot of dancers.
1:06:00
SPEAKER_02: Are you gonna do the same, you know, especially because of the trend of where they're coming from?
1:06:04
SPEAKER_02: Contemporary is cool.
1:06:05
SPEAKER_02: I mean, when I it wasn't cool when I was young, it was just starting out.
1:06:09
SPEAKER_02: Like, no, everyone's like, what is what are you doing?
1:06:12
SPEAKER_02: I was in the modern category, but it wasn't modern.
1:06:14
SPEAKER_02: It was technically contemporary.
1:06:16
SPEAKER_02: But, you know, that was my introduction to it.
1:06:19
SPEAKER_02: And then I was like, oh wow, I I like this movement style.
1:06:22
SPEAKER_02: I I'm good at this movement style.
1:06:23
SPEAKER_02: It feels good on my body.
1:06:25
SPEAKER_02: I want to do this for a living.
1:06:26
SPEAKER_02: And my my contemporary training has helped me a lot, even in my more of a commercial career.
1:06:33
SPEAKER_02: I was the dancer that could be considered for some of those ballet features, some of those contemporary modern features in musicals.
1:06:41
SPEAKER_02: Like because there is a blend that's happening and a crossover that's happening in the Broadway community with a lot of contemporary vocabulary that's entering the stage now.
1:06:49
SPEAKER_02: Contemporary Broadway isn't just what you think these days.
1:06:52
SPEAKER_02: So I think that a lot of we have concert dance choreographers from companies choreographing on Broadway stages and commercial stages in Los Angeles for artists that are going on tour.
1:07:03
SPEAKER_02: So I do think that the the, especially now, 20 years later, going back from my contemporary dance, what I thought it was in competition, it's evolved so much to now be more in the mainstream commercial world.
1:07:15
SPEAKER_02: And I do think that there are opportunities for those dancers that want to continue to pursue this more than there used to be commercially.
1:07:22
SPEAKER_02: But there's so many different avenues and it and those all of those people that you just listed are leading the charge of this beautiful dance contemporary, modern concert performance world that I think dancers need to really do their their research in history and study.
1:07:40
SPEAKER_02: And what I mean, YouTube is accessible to most.
1:07:44
SPEAKER_02: Utilize that, go see a live performance.
1:07:46
SPEAKER_02: Go whenever you're, you know, look for tours that are coming through your area, support uh smaller dance companies that are in that are local to you.
1:07:54
SPEAKER_02: Continue to uh help contribute to our our arts community because we really need it um more than ever now.
1:08:02
SPEAKER_02: And that might spark your interest in wanting to take this to the next level for you and really be inspired in in your choreographic voice, in your choreography voice, in your performance voice, in your education voice.
1:08:15
SPEAKER_02: So uh I think it's important for everyone to continue to support live, live dance, live performance.
1:08:22
SPEAKER_00: I agree.
1:08:22
SPEAKER_00: Can can I add one more thing or two more thoughts?
1:08:25
SPEAKER_02: And your these will be like your final thoughts.
1:08:27
SPEAKER_00: Okay, final thoughts.
1:08:28
SPEAKER_00: Well, I mean it's more of uh what you were just saying.
1:08:30
SPEAKER_00: Cindy Salgado introduced me.
1:08:32
SPEAKER_00: Well, I I kind of knew Andy Blank Bueller just because he he would cease pieces that I made when he used to be with um uh a convention.
1:08:41
SPEAKER_00: And he brought me into Only Gold in 2013, I think it was 2013, and then I got to do his workshop in 2018.
1:08:48
SPEAKER_00: I didn't do the latest one.
1:08:49
SPEAKER_01: Okay, yep.
1:08:50
SPEAKER_00: But what I love about him is he's bringing people from the this, the nonprofit concert dance world, whatever genre, and then the commercial world and the jazz, the rocket world, and he's bringing all of us are in the room dancing, and we come from many different backgrounds, and he's using all of like his choreography, but like he's using all of our gifts and celebrating and that him as a choreographer, he blends a lot of that.
1:09:15
SPEAKER_00: He still makes it Andy in his own rhythms and whatnot, but I really respect what he does.
1:09:20
SPEAKER_00: He has a diverse, diverse dancers in in genre and and look.
1:09:25
SPEAKER_00: Um, and I just really uh appreciate what he stands for.
1:09:29
SPEAKER_00: And I and I want to go back to just to maybe find to close on this, that I do work closely with Springboard Dance.
1:09:36
SPEAKER_00: Um, Alexandra Wells was a teacher of mine um when I went to school and it's been a mentor and a deer friend um for the past few decades.
1:09:45
SPEAKER_00: And I like to shed light on her only because I I well not only, I just believe in what she stands for.
1:09:51
SPEAKER_00: And for the dance studio directors that want a little more knowledge, Springboard Dance is now based in America and will be held at Point Park University every summer from now on.
1:10:04
SPEAKER_00: It's a three-week program and it's usually from 18 on up.
1:10:08
SPEAKER_00: However, she runs two programs during the year.
1:10:12
SPEAKER_00: I think one's uh on the West Coast and one's on the East Coast called Springboard X.
1:10:17
SPEAKER_00: And basically those weekend workshops used to, I don't know if they'll still do it, but they used to comprise of two groups, a younger group and an older group.
1:10:25
SPEAKER_00: So 13 to 8, uh 18 and then 18 and up.
1:10:29
SPEAKER_00: And those are workshops that get you prepared to work with incredible choreographers, not just from America, but from around the world, and people that are affiliated with her.
1:10:38
SPEAKER_00: And that's also want to shed light on Kyle Abraham's AIM company.
1:10:41
SPEAKER_00: Check him out.
1:10:42
SPEAKER_00: I love what Sidra Bell is doing.
1:10:44
SPEAKER_00: I love her process.
1:10:46
SPEAKER_00: And they're also close to Alexander Wells.
1:10:48
SPEAKER_00: And if you check these programs out, those are weekend workshops.
1:10:52
SPEAKER_00: I think also Jacob Spillow has a program called 360.
1:10:55
SPEAKER_00: You can do these workshops maybe in replace of a convention.
1:10:59
SPEAKER_00: And I try to uh I hold a thing called true this perspectives.
1:11:03
SPEAKER_00: I only do like a handful a year because and I I run these programs to supplement what's not being offered at their conventions or competitions.
1:11:11
SPEAKER_00: And it's just a supplement.
1:11:12
SPEAKER_00: And I do it one time at one studio for that year in that season.
1:11:16
SPEAKER_00: So I try to, I want to invite the directors to think maybe they don't need to do this other competition, but they'll go bring their dancers to the West Coast, if they're on the West Coast, to this university to do springboard dance.
1:11:27
SPEAKER_00: They're gonna get floor technique, they're gonna get dance theater, they're gonna get contemporary fluid movement, um, they'll get something more balletic.
1:11:35
SPEAKER_00: They're gonna get all of what we've discussed today, and that is springboard dance.
1:11:39
SPEAKER_00: And that's an organization that needs help.
1:11:40
SPEAKER_00: And that organization in our dance community, specifically the contemporary dance scene in America, a lot of us have benefited from not just the program, but from Alexander Wells.
1:11:50
SPEAKER_00: And I really like to pay respect to her.
1:11:56
SPEAKER_02: We hope you've enjoyed our latest episode all about the genre of contemporary dance.
1:12:02
SPEAKER_02: Huge shout out to our guest, Peter Chu, for joining us on this discussion.
1:12:06
SPEAKER_02: Don't forget to follow him on Instagram at PeterChooThis.
1:12:10
SPEAKER_02: And to learn more about his upcoming projects and his project-based dance company, To This, visit his website at peter2thists.net or click the link in our show notes.
1:12:22
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1:12:43
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1:12:49
SPEAKER_02: Be sure to check out our popular service, IDA's Online Judges Critique.
1:12:54
SPEAKER_02: Our experienced judges will provide you with a video critique of your performance.
1:12:58
SPEAKER_02: But with IDA's Online Judges Critiques, we take it one step further than your standard competition critique.
1:13:04
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1:13:15
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1:13:21
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1:13:33
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1:13:36
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1:13:38
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1:13:47
SPEAKER_05: Season six of Making the Impact concludes next week with our takeaway episode.
1:13:52
SPEAKER_02: Tune in next week to hear it then.