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11. The Family Constellations Journey with Frida Kabo · Constellations and all that...

• 0:04
  Tracy: Kia ora and welcome to Constellations and All That.
• 0:07
  Tracy: I'm your host Tracey Cartwright and together we will be exploring the world of family constellations with facilitators and clients from around the world.
• 0:18
  Tracy: Looking at different perspectives and experiences in the work, having a cup of tea and just chatting with some friends around their experiences in constellations.
• 0:28
  Tracy: We'd love for you to join us.
• 0:30
  Tracy: I hope that you enjoy this series as much as I have loved making it.
• 0:37
  Tracy: Welcome everyone.
• 0:39
  Tracy: Today I have the pleasure of talking with the incredible Frida Kahlo.
• 0:44
  Tracy: I met Frida quite a few years ago now, over eight, I think nearly 10 years ago, I'm not sure, somewhere around there.
• 0:51
  Tracy: We've had quite a journey of it through our friendship and knowings.
• 0:54
  Tracy: So I'd really love to introduce Frida here and for you to get to know her a little bit more and to learn a bit about her constellation journey.
• 1:02
  Tracy: So I'll hand you over to Freda, you can share about yourself.
• 1:07
  Frida: Thank you.
• 1:07
  Frida: I'm really excited to be here.
• 1:08
  Frida: Yeah.
• 1:09
  Frida: I think we met, I've been in New Zealand now for eight years and we met just after I arrived in the country and yeah, I did the, the first family constellation session with you in a workshop setting and I was like, Oh, I need to do more of this.
• 1:27
  Frida: What is this?
• 1:27
  Frida: I have no idea what it is, but I really need to know more.
• 1:31
  Frida: Yeah, it was awesome.
• 1:34
  Frida: . That's right there was that So
• 1:35
  Tracy: Safari, wasn't it?
• 1:36
  Tracy: In Ragland?
• 1:37
  Frida: In Ragland, yeah.
• 1:38
  Frida: Yeah.
• 1:40
  Frida: You wanted me to tell a bit about me.
• 1:41
  Frida: I'm from Sweden originally, so I moved here, like I said, almost eight years ago or, or a bit more than 80 years ago with my family.
• 1:51
  Frida: So we ended up in Ragland and uh, now we're live in the far north, uh.
• 1:57
  Frida: Bush block, homeschooling my kids and having my own business online, helping healers and intuitive business owners with their business and stepping into creating more abundance, ease and flow.
• 2:10
  Tracy: Absolutely and you do such a good job of that too.
• 2:12
  Tracy: I love Freda's work so if anyone who's listening, I highly recommend that you check, check out Freda's work and you'll get a little bit more of a feel for that as we talk as well I'm sure.
• 2:24
  Tracy: As we know that I do this very intuitively and just feel into what the questions are to be asked.
• 2:30
  Tracy: I
• 2:30
  Frida: think that's so beautiful.
• 2:31
  Frida: And that's one big thing that I'm learning from you as well, because I'm doing the Family Constellation Facilitator training with Tracy right now.
• 2:38
  Frida: We have just one, one more weekend to go.
• 2:42
  Tracy: And
• 2:42
  Frida: that's really something that really learning from you is to trust, trust whatever comes up.
• 2:50
  Frida: And that's, that's really been helpful and important for me.
• 2:56
  Tracy: I think in that some of it's, you know, like just jumping straight into that, because as sometimes as human beings, we want to have a script to know exactly where we're going, where we're flowing.
• 3:06
  Tracy: And if we allow ourselves to just be in it and be with the uncomfortableness of waiting for it to come in.
• 3:15
  Tracy: Then once we get through, easily through that.
• 3:18
  Tracy: And we allow ease to get through that, then it will start to flow and those gaps of waiting for it to come in the insights or the messages, the threads that we're following, they come a lot quicker.
• 3:33
  Frida: Yeah, and that's what I love about this work as well.
• 3:37
  Frida: Because Yeah, I'm quite an overthinker.
• 3:39
  Frida: I like to analyze.
• 3:40
  Frida: I like to know.
• 3:41
  Frida: I like to really get into the details and know things.
• 3:46
  Frida: But with this work, you put things outside of yourself.
• 3:50
  Frida: So you put it in the field and see what happens.
• 3:53
  Frida: And I just love that because it's such a helpful way of looking at things.
• 3:58
  Frida: Because, yeah, we can easily get so close to things that we can't see the solution.
• 4:03
  Frida: But while putting it outside and seeing what happens.
• 4:07
  Frida: Yeah.
• 4:07
  Frida: It's powerful.
• 4:08
  Tracy: I think, I think as human beings, as we've evolved, we want to know, we want to sort of know how things go and how things work and, and have some almost control and structure to it.
• 4:21
  Tracy: Whereas when we were more connected.
• 4:24
  Tracy: When our ancestors were much more connected, there wasn't the need for that.
• 4:29
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 4:30
  Tracy: So we're relearning, remembering.
• 4:33
  Frida: Yeah.
• 4:34
  Frida: Yeah.
• 4:34
  Frida: We have all the answers on our fingertips with our phones, right?
• 4:37
  Frida: So just sitting with the unknown, it's not what we might default to in this connected, in that sense, connected world.
• 4:49
  Tracy: Your internal interweb.
• 4:55
  Tracy: For you, coming into Constellations, how would you describe it now?
• 5:00
  Tracy: How would you describe it to someone in your own words, however that is?
• 5:05
  Frida: I knew this question would come up and I've been thinking about it.
• 5:09
  Frida: I love listening to the podcast because everyone has slight different answers to this question.
• 5:15
  Frida: And yeah, I'm not sure.
• 5:17
  Frida: It depends on the person I'm talking to as well.
• 5:20
  Frida: But, it's really a helpful tool to look into things that you might not know the answer to.
• 5:28
  Frida: Like, yeah, really tuning in and helping you see things that you wouldn't have otherwise.
• 5:34
  Frida: So it's also looking at the healing from ancestral point of view, but it can be things that happen in your life right now as well.
• 5:44
  Frida: You see, it's, And I usually say that as well, it's difficult to find the words to explain it.
• 5:49
  Frida: You kind of have to experience it.
• 5:53
  Tracy: I think as I've gotten on, it's gotten easier to explain.
• 5:56
  Tracy: But at the beginning it was very, yeah, to find the words because we are working in the field with a much, the greater intelligence.
• 6:06
  Tracy: Then, you know, they say that as humans we only really use a small percentage of our brain, right?
• 6:12
  Tracy: And often that's really controlled with the, in the controlled mind part rather than the intuitive aspects of our brain as well.
• 6:20
  Tracy: Yeah, so being in that bigger field and allowing, allowing the space and things to come through.
• 6:27
  Tracy: Is there an experience that you are able to share or feel comfortable sharing, maybe something that you've experienced yourself or been a part of that has made a big shift for you in your life?
• 6:38
  Frida: Yeah, so yeah, I started, did my first family constellation with you almost eight years ago.
• 6:45
  Frida: And then I've been to some other of your workshops and I also went to the intensive family consolation intensive with Ansky last year or this year.
• 6:57
  Frida: And that was really interesting to see all the different.
• 7:00
  Frida: different facilitator also to see the different styles and the different focus kind of thing.
• 7:06
  Frida: But yeah, I think what's been most helpful for me through this journey is to, it's not necessarily in the big like constellations.
• 7:15
  Frida: It's also being a representative and being able to step into those different energies and creating more understanding from all those different perspectives.
• 7:27
  Frida: And I think it's what I love about this work as well.
• 7:31
  Frida: And yeah, like.
• 7:34
  Frida: Everything belongs, it's not about saying anything is right or wrong.
• 7:39
  Frida: It's about saying, okay, what, what is happening here?
• 7:42
  Frida: What, what is not being seen?
• 7:44
  Frida: What is not being acknowledged?
• 7:48
  Tracy: It's a great way to help you find your blind spot.
• 7:50
  Frida: Yeah.
• 7:51
  Frida: Yeah.
• 7:52
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 7:52
  Tracy: Especially when something keeps showing up for you.
• 7:54
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 7:55
  Tracy: For us, that's not working or we're not able to push through it.
• 7:58
  Tracy: Um, yeah, it is.
• 8:03
  Tracy: Something that you're trying to say, say, for example, you're trying to release an addiction or like cigarettes or, or alcohol or something like that.
• 8:11
  Tracy: It's, it's a really, I find it a really safe and gentle way to see what's behind that.
• 8:19
  Tracy: Because often we get caught up in it's our, it's, it's, it's us.
• 8:22
  Tracy: Yes, we have, there is an addiction running through us, but quite often it's standard behind us.
• 8:28
  Tracy: Maybe one or two or even 10 generations ago.
• 8:31
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 8:32
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 8:32
  Frida: And what I
• 8:33
  Tracy: love also, especially with
• 8:35
  Frida: you as a trainer, I feel like you're focusing a lot on the, the resourcing on like seeing.
• 8:46
  Frida: Okay.
• 8:46
  Frida: It's not just trauma back there.
• 8:49
  Frida: There's also a lot of power in our ancestral lines and there's a lot of support to be had.
• 8:54
  Frida: So just feeling that unconditional love from, from the parents and from, from the ancestors, it's yeah.
• 9:02
  Frida: Amazing.
• 9:03
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 9:04
  Tracy: I think my own journey, having experienced so much, so many layers of trauma, you know, which brings through the complex PTSD.
• 9:11
  Tracy: And then as I've worked through the layers.
• 9:14
  Tracy: And I'm still working through stuff.
• 9:16
  Tracy: What used to be a trauma that would be like here, and here in my face, or here it was almost like people would see the trauma before they'd seen me, or they'd feel the trauma.
• 9:27
  Tracy: And now, I feel like they stand behind me, and I take the good from that, like the silver lining, I guess.
• 9:34
  Tracy: Because everything does have that.
• 9:36
  Tracy: There is a resource in everything that we experience.
• 9:39
  Frida: Hmm.
• 9:40
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 9:40
  Tracy: Absolutely.
• 9:41
  Tracy: Beautiful.
• 9:41
  Tracy: So you work with highly sensitive people, business, um, people and change makers, healers.
• 9:49
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 9:50
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 9:51
  Tracy: How are you going to, how are you seeing at this moment in time, how are you seeing constellations fitting into this?
• 9:58
  Frida: So yeah, I'm doing the training now because I, I just felt like I needed to do more, more of this.
• 10:04
  Frida: This is such an important work that I want to have out in the world.
• 10:08
  Frida: And also because I'm feeling there's things that we can't just solve by, by coaching or by pushing through or by like, there's other things that need solving.
• 10:20
  Frida: So I definitely see that helping healers and, and, and business owners to overcome some things, but also to resource themselves.
• 10:32
  Tracy: Yeah, yeah.
• 10:34
  Tracy: I'm thinking, just as you were talking, I'm thinking about, um, a piece that Mark Wallin shared, and he's the author of It Didn't Start With You, which is the book that is featured on Netflix on the program, on the series Another Self, and in there he talks about, um, the brother and sister.
• 10:54
  Tracy: who were business people, who were actually millionaires, and, but they were millionaires many times, and they, but they also lost their money many times as well.
• 11:03
  Tracy: They couldn't seem to keep it.
• 11:05
  Tracy: I think one of them had a bit of addiction going on as well.
• 11:08
  Tracy: And when he worked with them, he worked with them separately, but each of them was entangled in a different way with their great Or great, great grandfather who'd been a slave owner and one of them was entangled with the energy of having, owning other, you know, making their profit and making their wealth off the lives of others.
• 11:32
  Tracy: And then the other one was entangled with the, the oppression and the slavery and, and that side of things.
• 11:40
  Tracy: So they were both, they were different, but they sort of, they came from the same thread.
• 11:45
  Tracy: And after working with them, they were both able to, once again, make money.
• 11:50
  Tracy: And once again, this time they were able to keep it.
• 11:53
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 11:53
  Tracy: So they had a real ease for making money, but they couldn't keep it because there was this underlying, yeah, imbalance and guilt and unease in the system.
• 12:02
  Tracy: So, yeah.
• 12:05
  Tracy: So I'm just thinking about as you, sorry, as you talk about working with the healers and the change makers, you know, we just don't know what is behind us and what is blocking us.
• 12:14
  Tracy: Right.
• 12:14
  Tracy: Sometimes we know a little bit of our history and we don't realize the impacts that that has within us.
• 12:22
  Frida: Yeah, definitely.
• 12:23
  Frida: Especially as sensitives, we take on a lot from, from our system that we don't know about.
• 12:30
  Frida: And I'm, I'm also thinking that a lot of the, the money mindset work is around what, how did your parents look at money and what, what happened when you were young with money.
• 12:42
  Frida: But taking that back to even further is, is really powerful.
• 12:47
  Tracy: Oh,
• 12:48
  Frida: yeah.
• 12:49
  Frida: And also what I like is, is looking at it like from an outside perspective, you don't have to know exactly who did what or, or what happened.
• 12:57
  Frida: You just, you can put money in the field and you in the field and see, Oh, what is happening?
• 13:05
  Frida: Yeah.
• 13:05
  Frida: Yeah,
• 13:06
  Tracy: that's right.
• 13:08
  Tracy: I did a big piece around money.
• 13:09
  Tracy: Well, actually, it was a little exercise that Angala Rabel had put together in Sydney many years ago.
• 13:16
  Tracy: And it was around, you got someone to represent you and someone to represent money.
• 13:20
  Tracy: And then you would witness the interaction between you and money.
• 13:24
  Tracy: And, um, and I, and I was like representing for others and, and their, and their interaction.
• 13:31
  Tracy: And then when it was my turn to witness my own, it was a really different experience to what others had been experiencing.
• 13:38
  Tracy: And I felt really overwhelmed.
• 13:40
  Tracy: So Ngala invited me to sit in the hot seat, and through a little conversation, we ended up putting up my mum in the field.
• 13:49
  Tracy: And then, and mum was like, wasn't really able to stand up so well, so she put another person behind her to help to strengthen her.
• 13:57
  Tracy: And that was her mother, and she couldn't stand up very well, she was leaning on mum.
• 14:01
  Tracy: But of course, my representatives in the field, and they're all leaning on me.
• 14:05
  Tracy: And then my great grandmother.
• 14:06
  Tracy: My great grandmother was leaning on my grandmother was leaning on my mother leaning on me and I went back 20 generations before we found a woman that could stand up that wasn't leaning towards or yeah or collapsing on us so I've had to do a lot of work because she said oh now we can see what's there you go home and do some homework I was like What the?
• 14:29
  Tracy: Okay, it wasn't a resolution that one, it was an insight and more to unfold.
• 14:36
  Tracy: And it's, it's been a powerful journey, but seeing, I, yeah, I would have had no idea that that was where that thread of my connection with money was being blocked.
• 14:48
  Frida: Um, yeah, yeah.
• 14:52
  Frida: And also that what I'm getting used to with family constellations as well, like there's not always a resolution.
• 15:00
  Frida: There's, there's always a, an observing and seeing and, and new information coming up, but it's not like, Everyone goes from the session like, yeah, let's go like in, in coaching that usually happens, like you feel energized.
• 15:17
  Frida: You feel like, yeah, it can happen in family consolation too, of course, but it's, it's more of a softer approach.
• 15:24
  Frida: And it's also trickling down.
• 15:28
  Frida: Afterwards, but not, it's not always that obvious that that is what may help it.
• 15:34
  Frida: But looking at it from our perspective, we can see that that's what happened.
• 15:39
  Tracy: Because we all want that happy Disney ending, right?
• 15:42
  Frida: Yeah.
• 15:42
  Tracy: But, you know, we feel like everything's lined up.
• 15:45
  Tracy: And sometimes that does happen.
• 15:48
  Tracy: I'm just using the terminology Disney ending because that's that feel good when you're a little fantasy thing.
• 15:54
  Tracy: But sometimes you do have a constellation that will let that happen.
• 15:57
  Tracy: And in a space that feels really, there's been a resolution and everything's lined up and it does have that really joyful, peaceful energy.
• 16:06
  Tracy: And other times there is a clarity.
• 16:09
  Tracy: An insight and there's a new movement forward here.
• 16:13
  Tracy: So, yeah, that's beautiful.
• 16:19
  Tracy: Have you noticed within your family system?
• 16:21
  Tracy: I'm just curious because I don't think I've asked you this question.
• 16:25
  Tracy: Have you noticed any ripple down effects within your system or out siblings or children or parents?
• 16:33
  Frida: So for me, it's a bit different since the rest of my, my family lives in Sweden, so I don't, I'm not that, I don't see them that often.
• 16:43
  Frida: I do talk to them, especially my mom, every week.
• 16:47
  Frida: And they're coming here in January, so I guess we'll see then.
• 16:52
  Frida: Yeah, there's definitely been shifts, especially within me that I see.
• 16:56
  Frida: Because I'm showing up in a different way.
• 16:58
  Frida: So, so do they.
• 17:00
  Frida: And with the kids as well, we've been working on some quite big pieces in the training as well.
• 17:08
  Frida: That has had some pretty big shifts within my, with my kids as well.
• 17:15
  Frida: Yeah, I'm really grateful for the work and for your guidance and for everything that I'm learning.
• 17:20
  Tracy: You're welcome.
• 17:21
  Tracy: So good to have you.
• 17:22
  Tracy: And um, I love, because you ask such great questions as well in the training, it's really good.
• 17:28
  Tracy: It's always helping me to expand more too, you know, like I have to, oh yeah, often think, I think a lot and sometimes I don't always express it.
• 17:38
  Tracy: So I think it's good to have someone ask me the question so I can voice it and then it's out right.
• 17:43
  Tracy: Has there been anything that you found really, really challenging in, in the work?
• 17:48
  Frida: Yeah, definitely.
• 17:50
  Frida: And it's what we talked about before, like the overthinking, like the need to, to know, to have proof.
• 17:57
  Frida: So one big thing that has come up for me in the field is that I probably had a twin, twin pregnancy.
• 18:06
  Frida: How do you say it?
• 18:06
  Frida: I was a twin in my mother's belly,
• 18:09
  Tracy: but I was a twin.
• 18:11
  Frida: Yeah, the surviving twin.
• 18:14
  Frida: Yeah, that has taken me down the journey of, oh, I need to know is that, is that really so?
• 18:19
  Frida: Is that, where's the facts?
• 18:21
  Frida: And there has definitely been clues and, uh, feelings that, yeah, it's definitely the case.
• 18:29
  Frida: And it also has made some really big shifts for me.
• 18:34
  Frida: I've become a bit emotional, but yeah, just feeling that I don't have to chase or I don't have to look for, cause I didn't know, but I had a feeling like there was something missing and that I was searching for something and I didn't know what.
• 18:50
  Frida: And so, yeah, that has definitely made a huge shift.
• 18:54
  Frida: And also with the work that I do, because I work with highly sensitives, and that's something that I talked a bit more about before, when I discovered that I was highly sensitive, it was a big shift for me as well.
• 19:08
  Frida: But there was still something that was missing.
• 19:10
  Frida: And I feel like this is.
• 19:12
  Frida: The part that, that was missing.
• 19:15
  Tracy: Yeah, I, I understand that about the integrating of that as well.
• 19:19
  Tracy: Because myself also am a Vannish twin.
• 19:22
  Tracy: And at first it was really exciting.
• 19:25
  Tracy: And it made sense.
• 19:26
  Tracy: And it felt like, yeah, this is what I've been looking for.
• 19:30
  Tracy: And then there was a part of me that wasn't integrating it, that wasn't allowing it fully in, so there's been more to the journey as well.
• 19:38
  Tracy: So, I think, you know, when it comes to, it can be part of the abandonment as well, there's a sense of abandonment in that, and that deep sense of loss.
• 19:50
  Tracy: Yeah, and also it can, um, you know, then you spend your lifetime looking for something that you don't know what you're looking for, and then it's around trust, right?
• 20:00
  Tracy: We have to go through that next layer of learning to trust and to acknowledge that, okay, well, I've been doing this all my life.
• 20:08
  Tracy: All this time by myself and now I know that there is actually another part that stands beside me, another sibling.
• 20:16
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 20:17
  Tracy: So I hear you.
• 20:18
  Tracy: It does take a little while.
• 20:21
  Frida: Yeah.
• 20:21
  Frida: Yeah, definitely.
• 20:22
  Frida: And also trusting again and having that knowing that there are different layers and not everything will be solved in one go.
• 20:34
  Tracy: Mm.
• 20:35
  Tracy: Mm.
• 20:36
  Tracy: They can be sometimes We can be very big perpetual onions and other times it's, it's just a few layers to get through it.
• 20:45
  Tracy: Sometimes it's just one.
• 20:48
  Frida: Yeah.
• 20:49
  Frida: Yeah.
• 20:49
  Frida: So that, that has been a really big shift for me and also a challenge, but also like the knowing the feeling of, okay, but what are the steps?
• 20:59
  Frida: How do I do this?
• 21:00
  Frida: Instead of this.
• 21:01
  Frida: Relax, drop into your body.
• 21:04
  Frida: It's going to be okay.
• 21:05
  Frida: Just trust.
• 21:09
  Tracy: And I say, I say to you all, you can ask the field, what would Tracy do?
• 21:14
  Tracy: What would Tracy do?
• 21:17
  Tracy: What would Bert Hellinger do?
• 21:18
  Tracy: What would he do?
• 21:20
  Tracy: And sometimes it's just asking.
• 21:22
  Tracy: You know, it's that, and being in the, allowing it to drop in, allowing the answer to drop in, sometimes it's someone else says something that it's like, oh, okay, there's the next step.
• 21:37
  Tracy: Speaking it, eh?
• 21:38
  Frida: Um, yeah, it was quite funny when we did the online workshop, um, test clients and the feedback from, from my fellow trainees, they said, yeah, we could definitely hear that you were telling Tracy some of the questions.
• 21:55
  Frida: I take that as a compliment.
• 22:00
  Tracy: Take care.
• 22:00
  Tracy: Take care.
• 22:01
  Tracy: You know, I just said a question then and that's completely gone out of my head.
• 22:06
  Tracy: Well, let's see if we can pull that train back in.
• 22:09
  Tracy: Train of thought.
• 22:10
  Tracy: Oh, that's what I was going to ask you about.
• 22:13
  Tracy: So at the beginning of my training, part of the invitation is to make a drum, and this is what the listeners and the viewers say that they, how was that experience for you?
• 22:23
  Tracy: Because for me as the trainer, there's a whole nother reason why I get you to, we birth the drum together.
• 22:32
  Tracy: I would really like you to have a resource because the drumming is so good for clearing the energy, for clearing yourself, for allowing you to drop into meditation and so many good reasons why you have a drum.
• 22:45
  Tracy: For you as the process, I think you're the first one who I've spoken to who's made a drum with me, birthed a drum.
• 22:53
  Tracy: I just thought I'd just ask that question because drums have been really in my field today.
• 22:59
  Frida: I loved it.
• 23:00
  Frida: I loved making my drum.
• 23:02
  Frida: Yeah, I had heard some stories before that didn't have such a great experience with making the drum.
• 23:12
  Frida: But yeah, I.
• 23:14
  Frida: I just felt kind of like I was made to do that, like it was something that's in my genes and I just felt like my ancestors would have done something similar.
• 23:27
  Frida: Definitely.
• 23:28
  Tracy: Well, absolutely.
• 23:29
  Tracy: Scandinavian.
• 23:31
  Frida: But it's also interesting, though, because because when we had one week and when we did it and it all went brilliantly well for me, I did my drum and yeah, no problem.
• 23:43
  Frida: So I just felt like this is.
• 23:45
  Frida: This is what I'm here to do.
• 23:46
  Frida: And then we started doing the back side of it where you bind it.
• 23:50
  Frida: So you bind it.
• 23:52
  Frida: So you, um, how do you say it?
• 23:55
  Frida: You make the skin tighter.
• 23:57
  Frida: And then it started breaking.
• 24:00
  Frida: Um, so that was really like Whoa, what's happening?
• 24:08
  Frida: I thought I was made to do this and then it just started breaking.
• 24:12
  Frida: But yeah, it was good.
• 24:14
  Frida: We found a solution to that as well.
• 24:16
  Tracy: There was a beautiful thing about it, wasn't it?
• 24:18
  Tracy: We found a new way of doing it.
• 24:21
  Frida: Yeah.
• 24:23
  Frida: And you're so funny.
• 24:24
  Frida: It's like, yeah, I've never had anyone's drum do this.
• 24:29
  Frida: But we found a solution.
• 24:31
  Frida: So yeah,
• 24:32
  Tracy: all good.
• 24:32
  Frida: Yeah, but it's definitely a process of, and you could see around the room as well, like people had different experiences with it.
• 24:41
  Frida: So interesting, interesting process.
• 24:45
  Frida: Yes.
• 24:46
  Frida: And I love having that resource now.
• 24:49
  Frida: And it was one, one thing that I really looked forward to with the training as well.
• 24:55
  Frida: Brilliant.
• 24:56
  Frida: That's so good.
• 24:57
  Tracy: And we've been able to come together with our drums and create some sound and just sharing and activating the.
• 25:06
  Tracy: Because not everybody is as comfortable and as familiar with drums.
• 25:10
  Tracy: Myself even, when the first time I was asked to make a drum, and when I say I was asked, I was very, very resistant to making drums.
• 25:21
  Tracy: People would say to me, oh you're a shaman, you could, you know, if I went to a healing circle or something like that, yeah you take the drum and you can play.
• 25:30
  Tracy: And I'd be like, oh do not call me a shaman.
• 25:33
  Tracy: You know, I've just felt this incredible.
• 25:36
  Tracy: resistance to that.
• 25:38
  Tracy: I didn't feel like I'd earned that title and I do find that sometimes the word shaman or shamanic is probably a bit overused these days.
• 25:50
  Tracy: I sort of resonate with medicine woman or just intuitive really.
• 25:56
  Tracy: So anyway, I was really, really resistant to making a drum or touching a drum.
• 26:00
  Tracy: And then I woke up one morning after having a nice dream and spirit had said to me that I had to make a drum.
• 26:08
  Tracy: And I first, I woke up and my first words were, In my head where, what do you mean I've got to make a, um, um, drum?
• 26:15
  Tracy: What?
• 26:16
  Tracy: Like really questioning sort of, and it was those voices that I know that are really clear.
• 26:22
  Tracy: And I would, there was no arguing with it.
• 26:25
  Tracy: I've learned that one over the years.
• 26:27
  Tracy: So yeah, I got, I got in touch with a drum maker who ended up, turned out he lived in the same village as me.
• 26:34
  Tracy: that I used to live in many years ago, and I nearly bought his house before I moved up here to Whangarei.
• 26:39
  Tracy: And so he came up and taught us how to make drums and I fell in love with drums.
• 26:44
  Tracy: And went on to become a drum dueler myself.
• 26:46
  Tracy: So yeah, it's taught me so much about, about me in the process, as well as the resources that it brings.
• 26:56
  Tracy: So that's part of the reason why I offer it, because I think it's, It's an invaluable resource and most cultures in the world have some form of drumming, whether it's drumming onto a log or onto like a seed frame or an actual hide of an animal.
• 27:14
  Tracy: Yeah, most cultures.
• 27:17
  Tracy: How have you found, because I know that you work a lot online and some people prefer to work in person, And some people, and I know that you've been doing a little bit of practice.
• 27:28
  Tracy: So how are you finding the difference between in person and working online with the constellations?
• 27:35
  Tracy: Because I know you do a lot of other work online as well.
• 27:39
  Frida: I have mostly done online with the constellations as well, because it's, yeah, it's where I work.
• 27:47
  Frida: So it's only natural for me to go that way.
• 27:51
  Frida: And yeah, it's, it's powerful.
• 27:54
  Frida: It's a bit different than in person.
• 27:57
  Frida: But it's also Also powerful.
• 28:00
  Frida: So, yeah, I think both work.
• 28:02
  Frida: We work with the field.
• 28:03
  Frida: We work with whatever comes up.
• 28:05
  Frida: Right.
• 28:06
  Frida: So, and it's funny.
• 28:09
  Frida: One of the comments that I had was because they look like small Pac mans kind of thing on the screen.
• 28:14
  Frida: And she was like, it's amazing how much information you can get from small Pac mans on the screen.
• 28:22
  Tracy: That's when you're using the app.
• 28:23
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 28:23
  Frida: Yeah.
• 28:24
  Tracy: Yeah.
• 28:24
  Tracy: And they look like little, little Pac man With the little mouth open and, yeah, yeah.
• 28:31
  Tracy: I say that too with the discs that I use here as well.
• 28:34
  Tracy: And so when you're, so say, for example, if you're working with someone in Sweden, how is it for you translating what I've taught you in English into Swedish?
• 28:44
  Frida: It's a bit of a practice.
• 28:46
  Frida: It's interesting when you, when you learn something in one language.
• 28:50
  Frida: It takes a bit to find the right terms in, in the other language, even if it is my, my mother tongue.
• 28:59
  Frida: Um, but yeah, it works great.
• 29:02
  Frida: Sometimes we just take the English word and use that because it's, it represents better.
• 29:09
  Frida: Okay.
• 29:10
  Frida: Yeah.
• 29:11
  Frida: Oh, very cool.
• 29:13
  Frida: Yeah, but yeah, I really do want to do in in person workshops as well because I think that's, that's one of the amazing things of working, how you work with one of the constellations because you really see other people.
• 29:28
  Frida: Representing the things that are happening for you so someone can represent your mom and you see them do exactly how your mom would do without them actually knowing your mom.
• 29:42
  Frida: And yeah, it's, it's.
• 29:44
  Frida: It's so fascinating.
• 29:46
  Frida: So that's, yeah, that's what I, why I want to do it.
• 29:49
  Frida: And I don't know anyone up here in, in the far, far North doing it.
• 29:54
  Frida: So I just feel like it's important to get it out because it's such an
• 29:57
  Tracy: Yes, we were talking about this last night, weren't we?
• 29:59
  Tracy: So you're in Hirakino.
• 30:02
  Tracy: So you'll be doing some work up there somewhere or somewhere closer?
• 30:06
  Tracy: What would be the closest?
• 30:07
  Tracy: Kaitaia, maybe?
• 30:08
  Frida: Yeah, Kaitaia
• 30:10
  Tracy: So if there are any listeners out there that, um, please get in touch with Frida or if you know anyone that lives in Kaitaia that you feel that might be interested as well, yeah,
• 30:21
  Frida: to reach out.
• 30:21
  Frida: That would be awesome so I can start practicing in person and really getting the work out there.
• 30:27
  Tracy: Yeah,
• 30:27
  Frida: yeah, absolutely, absolutely.
• 30:30
  Tracy: I feel like we've had a really good sort of like a, just a touching of the surface and I know that as you're going to go through this work, there's going to be so much more to share.
• 30:41
  Tracy: So we'll touch base again in the, in the near future.
• 30:45
  Tracy: And I'm so grateful that you were able to join with me today.
• 30:49
  Frida: Thank you for having me.
• 30:53
  Tracy: So for those listeners who would like to get in touch with you, how can they find you, Frida?
• 31:00
  Frida: Yeah, they find me online and Instagram at Frida Kabo, F R I D A K A B O.
• 31:08
  Frida: And fridakabo.
• 31:09
  Frida: com is my website.
• 31:10
  Frida: So just reach out.
• 31:13
  Frida: Beautiful.
• 31:14
  Frida: So grateful.
• 31:16
  Frida: Thank you so much.
• 31:18
  Tracy: Thank you for listening.
• 31:19
  Tracy: Head over to Instagram and tell me what's resonated for you with this episode.
• 31:24
  Tracy: You'll find me at tracy.
• 31:26
  Tracy: cartwright, that's tracy with no e dot cartwright, and or head over to my website tracycartwright dot co dot nz and receive a free audio with the gift from your ancestors.
• 31:40
  Tracy: So until next time, be kind to yourself and have fun doing it.