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Recapping A VERY WILD Wild Card Weekend · The MMQB NFL Podcast

0:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Hello, welcome to them and keep the NFL podcast.
0:08
[SPEAKER_01]: There's Albert Brear, I'm proud of our fresh off a drive up 95 north from Philadelphia when I watched the Eagles fall.
0:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Two people, trouble there, huh?
0:18
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, got diverted, which is actually kind of nice.
0:21
[SPEAKER_01]: So if you get diverted, and this is wild.
0:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, drives me like a lovely, uh, uh, Prince Stinn.
0:28
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a bourbon, uh, oh, Princeton.
0:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, like New York.
0:30
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Prince Stinn, like Rarratin, and this is actually pretty familiar with that, because like,
0:36
[SPEAKER_02]: two of my best friends from college went to Bridgewater Airport in high school and so I've been in that area a bunch and they always would take huge of fence to like when you know they'd say they're from New Jersey and people would ask them like what exit because they would swear that
1:00
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, when you do the drive between like Bridgewater and Princeton, you drive to these areas that nobody would ever associate with New Jersey correct and I actually asked my neighbor because he works at Johnson and Johnson if you drive that way, you pass Johnson and Johnson and it is a massive so it's this big pharmaceutical corporation sitting on a farm.
1:22
[SPEAKER_01]: and there's animals.
1:23
[SPEAKER_01]: What do you spend my business?
1:24
[SPEAKER_01]: What's that?
1:25
[SPEAKER_01]: What do you spend my business?
1:26
[SPEAKER_01]: What do you spend my business?
1:27
[SPEAKER_01]: What do you spend my business?
1:28
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, just taxing them, I was like, do you get to go to this place every day?
1:31
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, this looks amazing.
1:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And I guess the short answer is that it's say tax.
1:37
[SPEAKER_01]: like loophole because farmland, you know, so they're like chickens or whatever, you know, and so it's farmland, but it's also like the site of like a major pharmaceutical corporation.
1:46
[SPEAKER_01]: So anyway, very beautiful scenic drive in the advantage because we gotta get right into this, because we got a lot to talk about, is that I got 94-1WIP the whole way, which means Philadelphia, Calciniario, pretty much from the time that I left my hotel in Old City all the way back to New Jersey.
2:04
[SPEAKER_01]: And I got to see this.
2:07
[SPEAKER_01]: compliments to everybody on the morning show at WIP much more measured approach honestly like I'm not being exaggerated here um but I want to start here let's start with and there was a ton of games this weekend we'll get to all of them but I want to start here because this is where my memory is freshest and this is where I kind of have the most thoughts on this the 49ers beat the Eagles and it
2:29
[SPEAKER_01]: the Philadelphia area is kind of divided down this line, and I see people really dug it on both sides.
2:37
[SPEAKER_01]: There is the, I can't believe this offense is this bad, just fire the coordinator, and there is the equally dug infection of the quarterback needs the offense to be a certain way to suit his own creature comforts, and it's becoming less and less inventive because we're narrowing down, we're running out of ideas essentially.
2:58
[SPEAKER_01]: right to the past five and so you know I always you know in this business you try to keep an open mind and you try to wonder you know what the advantages but I remember hearing years ago right
3:11
[SPEAKER_01]: that Jalen hurts needs to see it a certain way.
3:13
[SPEAKER_01]: So we can't do a lot of motion, we can't do a lot of pre-snap motion, we can't do a lot of window dressing, because then if the defense reacts to pre-snap motion, then that muddies the picture that Jalen sees, and then he doesn't like that, right?
3:26
[SPEAKER_01]: He needs to get everything set up the way that he likes it before he takes this now.
3:31
[SPEAKER_01]: And then all of a sudden in this game, Albert, like in the third quarter,
3:35
[SPEAKER_01]: All of a sudden we see motion and it's like for one drive and tank bigs bees in in the slot and he's motioning and then Devon to smith is in at running back and this eagle's offense looks like you know Alabama with Lane Kiffin and you're like whoa like this is cool They're moving down the field like everything looks really good and then it disappears and that's when it struck me And I had this realization that like
3:59
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's going to sound like a full-throwed defensive camp tool, which is fine.
4:03
[SPEAKER_01]: But I don't think you can do that, and then not understand how to call a game.
4:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Does that make sense?
4:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I don't think that you can put together that sequence of plays that looks really cool and it's telling a story.
4:18
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, now I was like, this sounds like the smoking gun.
4:21
[SPEAKER_01]: And to me, it was like, huh, like,
4:24
[SPEAKER_01]: How come you can't do that all the time and the reason you can't do it all the time?
4:29
[SPEAKER_01]: I At least in my mind now, but and again, you could ask 10 people and five of you are gonna be our Adam and on one side of five of them are gonna be at Adam and on the other side, but that kind of that tip to me and I thought about it all the way back this morning You know because I wrote about how conservative this offense wasn't like god like
4:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Like if you're an offensive coordinator you'd want to call a cool place You'd want to push the ball down the field like you don't want to call this offense, you know?
4:55
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think it's like I like I just think they have to win a specific way and I think like The thing that's got a really hurt today for them is that they essentially did play that way Right, you know if they ran at 36 times they let me say quant played well, you know I don't think say quant barically was the problem but
5:16
[SPEAKER_02]: They're not, like, to play the way that they need to play what you own Hirsch is the quarterback, they need to be dominant in the run game.
5:23
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think not having Wayne Johnson, I mean, I think that was one of the biggest injuries in the NFL this year was losing Wayne Johnson, because I do think to some degree the same way we've talked about the Packers or the Packers, the Chargers.
5:36
[SPEAKER_02]: losing offensive lime and takes the Eagles identity away, you know, the identity was never about jail and hurts.
5:43
[SPEAKER_02]: And even wasn't, I mean, say quam barkly super charged, the identity, you know, but the identity was always through that line, through the line of scrimmage, and through the guys they have a front.
5:52
[SPEAKER_02]: And so, you know, you know, they have a little less of the guard position than they have in the past, they lost.
6:00
[SPEAKER_02]: see them all a couple of years ago and then you know they had the one year kind of band data mccye backed and so they they've had some iteration of guard and then you know i think losing the best right tackle and football and lane johnson heard right and so and not having a month's Sunday when they thought he might be able to go right right and then and then losing credit johnson and game first reaction like i think you know you look at it and it's like okay like they actually played this sort of game they
6:28
[SPEAKER_02]: But because they couldn't, like because that area of the game was just good and not great, it didn't unlock things in the past game the way it did a year ago, you know.
6:39
[SPEAKER_02]: And I just think like, I just think that the way the Eagles are built and the way the Eagles have been built and the way they've done it when they've been at their best has been with a dominant run game with Jalen Hertz as a factor in their run game and you know with
6:58
[SPEAKER_02]: putting yourself in position where jail and hurts who, like to, is credit is really common level in the big moments and doesn't, doesn't, well, lose his head, jail and go make five big throws for us, you know, when that becomes jail and go make 15 big throws for us or jail and go make 20 big throws for us, that's a different, that's a totally different equation.
7:22
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that's sort of,
7:24
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that's where they were last night.
7:25
[SPEAKER_02]: They need more big throws from him down the stretch of that game and they couldn't get him.
7:29
[SPEAKER_02]: And I thought Brock Perti, even with the text, right?
7:33
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, even with the two picks, like, I thought he was more of a difference maker for the Niners in jail and hers was for the Eagles.
7:39
[SPEAKER_02]: Right.
7:40
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
7:42
[SPEAKER_01]: I, um, it's funny.
7:44
[SPEAKER_01]: I, I, I,
7:46
[SPEAKER_01]: when this game started and watching the Eagles manufacture the points that they did.
7:52
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think it was 13 to 10 at the half.
7:55
[SPEAKER_01]: If I'm not mistaken, I think it was 13 to 10 at the half.
7:58
[SPEAKER_01]: went back and I looked at all of the other games this year where they were winning at halftime regardless of how much they were winning at halftime because the Eagles are like 27th and second half points.
8:12
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like 9.1 second half points a game.
8:15
[SPEAKER_01]: There are five coaches, three head coaches and two coordinators.
8:19
[SPEAKER_01]: who finished ahead of them in that ranking that we're all fired a week ago.
8:25
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I looked at their play calling sequences after the half with the lead.
8:30
[SPEAKER_01]: And outside of games against really bad teams, the giants, the Raiders, one instance against the Cowboys,
8:39
[SPEAKER_01]: It was run, run, run, and then if we get back up into a past situation on 3rd and 5 plus we got a pass, run, run, run, backed up, 3rd and 5 got a pass, and I think that that's maybe where your criticism of the offensive coordinator can come in, but I looked at it and I was like, okay, what are they going to do coming out of the half, run, run against 49ers?
9:01
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I got backed up enough that I got a throw on whatever it was 3rd and 4 and it was like a swing pass, a sake one, Barclay, and he dropped it.
9:09
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's where the criticism becomes dual headed, you know, I don't think anybody did a perfect job down there in Philadelphia, but to see this and not need to confront your identity, I think is a mistake.
9:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I think that there are some teams that go into the off-season with little picture questions, I think that the Eagles have to ask themselves, like, can we keep doing this?
9:30
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, is Lane Johnson gonna retire?
9:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Jordan, my lot of gonna be elite for another three or four years, you know?
9:35
[SPEAKER_01]: can we just beat the crap out of people or so many other teams trying to do it that we got to find an edge the other way and how Roseman's great at finding it just do you think it's time to pivot?
9:45
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
9:46
[SPEAKER_02]: I think well so they're going to have a decision to make with AJ Brown I think you know because you're starting to give us a point with him where
9:55
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.
9:56
[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe I'm crazy.
9:57
[SPEAKER_02]: I think clearly lost a step this year.
9:59
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, and like he's got the knee issue, which is sort of, which is why the Titans traded him in the first place.
10:06
[SPEAKER_02]: And so like, do you like view this is the time to cut bait with AJ Brown, which, you know, like leaves you with
10:15
[SPEAKER_02]: Like a decision, like okay, like how do we replace him, you know, because I do think Devante Smith was their best receiver this year.
10:23
[SPEAKER_02]: Like then, like I think you, you know, you look at the offensive line, probably gonna have to spend a high draft, pick on a tackle whether Elaine Johnson is back or not, because you know, like you have to keep feeding what's been your identity and how he'll do that, you know?
10:38
[SPEAKER_02]: But,
10:40
[SPEAKER_02]: I think now with the age of those two guys, both lane and Jordan, like, you know, I think you do have to at least consider like, okay, you know, we need to get another one in the pipeline.
10:51
[SPEAKER_02]: So there's that, and I think you said you've got to confront the reality of where you are offensively and what it's going to look like around jail and hurts for the next two to three years.
11:07
[SPEAKER_02]: And so the good news is, and I think this is like something that a lot of people,
11:13
[SPEAKER_02]: didn't have been taking a good enough look at and haven't paid enough attention to that even the defense is a really good shape going forward.
11:22
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think I think you've got like good young talent on that side of the ball.
11:25
[SPEAKER_02]: I think the defense this year was better than last year's defense.
11:28
[SPEAKER_02]: And great.
11:29
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, between Jalen Carter, which, you know, like, there's some question, like, when you pay him, is that going to, you know, they don't have to figure that out, you know, but Jalen Carter can be, you know, certainly one of the three or four best defensive blindmen in all football, you found a young past, Russia and Jalex Hunt, you know, Jihad Campbell, I think it's going to wind up being a really, really good player, Jordan Davis, Moro is yellow, you know,
11:59
[SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, then you look at the corner spot, which is a trouble spot a couple of years ago, and you got acquainted with Mitchell and Cooper de Jean going forward there, I just like look at where they are defensively, you know, and I think that there's a, you at the very least are in a position where you've got a chance to be really good on that side of the ball for the foreseeable future, which might buy you a little time to figure it out offensively.
12:26
[SPEAKER_01]: on the flip side Albert I thought and I'm curious what your take is on this but I think a fair criticism of Kyle Shanahan has been over the years like that once the offense kind of stalls and the Shanahan machine is not rolling and they don't have you in their clutches.
12:44
[SPEAKER_01]: He kind of loses a little bit of Joseph's a play collar and then yeah when they're in long yardage or yeah and then you have this.
12:51
[SPEAKER_01]: This throwback flee flicker touchdown pass to Christian McAfrey that comes out of nowhere and Kyle said after the game it was a clay kubiak suggestion and these things are nuts when you go through it right It has to be on the right hash It has to be on the right down in distance.
13:08
[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have the right personnel on the field and you have to have the right look from the defense and they got all in all lined up and then all of a sudden
13:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Holy smokes, you got this game-breaking call from Shanahan, which I mean, and Clay Kubi I credit to him too.
13:22
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I thought that was just like, just a cherry on top of a
13:28
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, he's best coaching season.
13:30
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll say it now.
13:30
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think that's controversial.
13:31
[SPEAKER_02]: You see, like, the Joanne Jennings thing is great because somebody posted his book.
13:38
[SPEAKER_02]: I just pulled him up.
13:38
[SPEAKER_02]: Somebody posted his recruiting ranking from when he was in high school.
13:42
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, he was the sixth ranked dual threat.
13:46
[SPEAKER_02]: No, the sixth ranked.
13:48
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, sixth ranked dual threat quarterback in America in the class of 2015, right?
13:57
[SPEAKER_02]: Sam Darnold was number five.
13:59
[SPEAKER_02]: Wow.
14:01
[SPEAKER_02]: Joanne Jennings number six.
14:02
[SPEAKER_02]: Joe Burrow, committed to Ohio State, was number eight.
14:07
[SPEAKER_02]: Lamar Jackson was number 12.
14:10
[SPEAKER_02]: So he was ranked six spots above Lamar Jackson and the dual threat quarterback rankings.
14:15
[SPEAKER_02]: So I always did that stuff as fascinating, looking in these guys background and like, what a throw that was, and what a ridiculous catch.
14:24
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that would be a great catch for receiver, you know.
14:27
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's just, I mean, Christian McAfrey, his value to that team with the United States lost, and like he's the one constant, like he's the one piece, him and Trent Williams, Trent Williams, missed the one game at the end of the year, which really cost them.
14:41
[SPEAKER_02]: But,
14:42
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, I think it's pretty incredible to how the story, this, this, Niners team is how much they've had to withstand and the revolving doors so many different positions.
14:52
[SPEAKER_02]: But the one thing that they haven't lost all year is the guy who's coming off of what was like a devastating weird injury.
14:58
[SPEAKER_02]: He'll ask you that he went to like Germany to go get fixed, right?
15:02
[SPEAKER_02]: I think Christian McAfrey has had at least, you know, before we all voted on an MVP case.
15:09
[SPEAKER_02]: And that catch was another, another, you know, example of why.
15:14
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, just, I like just a spectacular spectacular individual effort.
15:20
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't say enough about this.
15:23
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'll say this too.
15:26
[SPEAKER_01]: I saw
15:32
[SPEAKER_01]: While I was sitting next to the great Nate Davis from USA today, he was locked in, and then I had an aisle seat next to me, so I had no one to say this to except for myself.
15:41
[SPEAKER_01]: And so when I saw him, the Eagles take the time out, and then you have Jalen Hurts walking back out on the field for a fourth and ten at the end of the game, and then I see Sala walk everybody up to the line of scrimmage.
15:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm willing to bet the mortgage on my house that it's over because that was it was such a move of okay the Eagles are and this is what Sierra and he said after the game we needed to take a timeout to get a picture and get an idea of what they were doing okay well you waste that timeout that could have helped you you know when you gave the ball away and possibly giving you a chance to get the ball back one more time.
16:18
[SPEAKER_01]: And you waste it to get a picture for Jalen and then solid comes right back out and says, you know what, I'm going to scramble this egg and you're going to look at something completely different.
16:28
[SPEAKER_01]: And as soon as I saw that and then he drops someone right into the zone where Jalen was looking to throw over the middle of the field and it was over.
16:35
[SPEAKER_01]: And I thought that as gutted as his unit has been, he's made some great calls in this one too and their run defense was active.
16:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, say quambarclay at 100 yards, but it really wasn't like
16:46
[SPEAKER_01]: an effective hundred yards.
16:48
[SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?
16:49
[SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't one of those hundred yards that rips your heart out.
16:52
[SPEAKER_02]: So it was, and like I said, like that's the difference is like the Eagles played the type of game they wanted to play, but it was good, not great.
17:01
[SPEAKER_02]: You know what I mean?
17:02
[SPEAKER_02]: Like it was SIG1 Park, Park would played fine, you know?
17:06
[SPEAKER_02]: And SIG1 Park was the problem, but he also wasn't taking a game in the game over, which like I don't know
17:16
[SPEAKER_02]: like it makes you so much more difficult to defend in the passing him when that's happening, you know, and because I don't think they had that gear the same way they had that gear last year, it's just, it just looked different.
17:29
[SPEAKER_02]: And again, I don't think that's a product that's safe one barically.
17:32
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, I think that's a product of the offensive line not being quite as dominant as it was, you know, because of the injury issues and because of some of the
17:42
[SPEAKER_02]: uh... let's move on we got a lot of games to get to uh... but that was a cool one i thought you didn't say the w ip i do want to do one thing really quick because you didn't say w ip was measured right yeah did you see the kid like the six-year-old that uh... one of the local new stations no interviewed no i'm gonna play this for you maybe shellbe can uh... can can drop the video out drop the bit drop the drop the video in later give me one second here
18:12
[SPEAKER_01]: This is a 40 something year old Albert highway directing technology in the middle.
18:24
[SPEAKER_02]: He's probably older than six.
18:25
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm being fair, but here, here you go.
18:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, it was a huge lot down.
18:29
[SPEAKER_00]: This is my Christmas present.
18:31
[SPEAKER_00]: I got a loss.
18:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, probably feeling two of two things.
18:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, I want AJ Brown packing these bags and I want him somewhere else that is not here.
18:42
[SPEAKER_00]: I love you AJ, but like, you can't make those drops in that game and I also want Kevin Petoulo flipping burgers at like the local McDonald's or something.
18:51
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't care if you can slide it through that.
18:52
[SPEAKER_00]: Whenever he's an offensive coordinator, it's like he's flipping burgers.
18:56
[SPEAKER_00]: One side, he's cooking, one half he's cooking and the other half is completely raw.
19:03
[SPEAKER_02]: Like he thought like the flipping burger is comment was going to be a total insult, but it actually wasn't just kind of a mixed bag, you know?
19:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean he added that he was cooking.
19:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Nice talking.
19:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
19:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
19:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I thought that was well done.
19:17
[SPEAKER_02]: Give that kid an internship, WIP.
19:20
[SPEAKER_01]: By the way, we've got a lot of really just tiresome media arguments coming out of this Super Bowl weekend, but I will say this.
19:27
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm not going to step in it.
19:29
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we'll get to the Jaguars game.
19:31
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we'll get to the Jaguars game, but I'm going to try not to step in that one, but if you're AJ Brown, I'm sorry, man.
19:39
[SPEAKER_01]: And I've gone all the way with AJ Brown.
19:43
[SPEAKER_01]: I went from sky, I don't think is...
19:49
[SPEAKER_01]: the guy that you would want on this team to coming full circle to, you know, getting to know his story and his background a little bit better and being like, you know what, like, I think we need to do a better job of trying to reach him and to understand him and go through this self development process that he's going through to, like,
20:05
[SPEAKER_01]: you can't complain about the offense, drop a couple of balls and then not say anything after the game.
20:11
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm not one of those guys where you need to nail yourself to across afterwards.
20:16
[SPEAKER_01]: But you can't have it to ways where you question the efficacy of the offense and then not go up there and be like, yeah, a couple of big spots.
20:25
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I dropped the ball.
20:26
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that that's simple.
20:33
[SPEAKER_02]: The older guys the highest pay guys generally are the voices of the team and like if someone in that position Like isn't vocal doesn't talk very much.
20:44
[SPEAKER_02]: You know what I mean like that's fine If he doesn't talk after after game like this, but if you are that guy sometimes you sort of have to be that guy all the time.
20:54
[SPEAKER_02]: You know
20:56
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[SPEAKER_01]: Alright, let's move on to, let's go to the Rams in the Panthers.
21:55
[SPEAKER_01]: We go from a big game to one that like, I mean, this was a great game, but, and I don't know if it was just the circumstances of it, I initially listened to the fourth quarter on the radio and then I went back and I watched it in real time.
22:10
[SPEAKER_01]: So maybe it just didn't feel as big to me, but,
22:13
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
22:14
[SPEAKER_01]: What were your takeaways from this one, Albert?
22:15
[SPEAKER_01]: This was a game where if you would have told me that Puka gets 111 yards in a touchdown, Matt Stafford throws three touchdowns and you know what?
22:26
[SPEAKER_01]: The Rams don't lose any fumbles.
22:29
[SPEAKER_01]: They actually recover a fumble.
22:32
[SPEAKER_01]: I would have said, oh, wow, did they win by 40 points?
22:35
[SPEAKER_02]: But this was a great game from Carolina.
22:41
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so the Rams lose the C-hawks on the Thursday night, right?
22:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Like whatever that was, almost a month ago now.
22:48
[SPEAKER_02]: Then they come back and they get their doors blown off by the, didn't get their doors blown off, but like didn't look great against the Falcons.
22:59
[SPEAKER_02]: So McVay says, okay, we really have to go back to the drawing board here and all the guys are gonna play against the Cardinals.
23:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Then they looked okay in that game, but not like what you would expect.
23:12
[SPEAKER_02]: And I sort of thought, all right, like, they're going to put their foot on the gas, and we are going to see the Rams that we saw in October and November, right?
23:23
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, this is going to be the full on Rams.
23:25
[SPEAKER_02]: And I would say there are two things that I come away from that game thinking.
23:32
[SPEAKER_02]: I think number one, Matthew Stafford.
23:36
[SPEAKER_02]: the guts that he showed and a toughness that he showed and like his finger clearly something happened right and his numbers it was very very clear like his numbers were not the same and somehow in the fourth quarter he was able to gather himself and
23:55
[SPEAKER_02]: put together two game winning drives right and make high level throws and I I can pull up the numbers I mean it was really pretty insane like when you look at like the discrepancy because he got off to a pretty hot start and I just looking at it here and you
24:16
[SPEAKER_02]: So he hit his first nine throws for 118 yards to give them the 14 and nothing.
24:24
[SPEAKER_02]: We take advantage of the turnover turnover on downs after that.
24:28
[SPEAKER_02]: He went three for his next 18 for 53 yards and after the finger got jammed into D.J.
24:42
[SPEAKER_02]: when the Panthers took their first lead.
24:45
[SPEAKER_02]: From that point forward, he was 12 of 15 for 143 and two touchdowns.
24:51
[SPEAKER_02]: Right.
24:52
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that's like ridiculous, you know.
24:58
[SPEAKER_02]: Like you hurt your finger, everyone knows it.
25:01
[SPEAKER_02]: It's clearly affecting the way you play.
25:02
[SPEAKER_02]: And then you're able to come back in the fourth quarter and play, I just, that's statistical.
25:12
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, if Matthew Stafford wins the Sioux rule this year, if he winds up being the end of NFL MVP, like this is something I'm in a remember because this was more about just being more than just about being great.
25:23
[SPEAKER_02]: This was like that guy boat up when you needed to.
25:27
[SPEAKER_02]: The end.
25:28
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the Panthers also are getting as your Avril back.
25:33
[SPEAKER_01]: I think which is probably the biggest news for this team at this point, especially after you've seen them play down the back stretch.
25:38
[SPEAKER_01]: This was one of the worst defenses in NFL history last year.
25:42
[SPEAKER_01]: And with minimal upgrades, I mean, he got them to a spot where I think that they're in really good shape.
25:48
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I think bringing back running this thing back, I mean, we don't know who the Falcons are going to hire as a head coach at this point, but I think that you have to like,
25:57
[SPEAKER_01]: what you're seeing at a Carolina and I think if you're Tampa, you got to nail this offensive coordinator higher.
26:04
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you know, like the Panthers, they showed.
26:07
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, they, they've stood down the Rams.
26:10
[SPEAKER_01]: So I still think, I still think through the best team in the NFL.
26:12
[SPEAKER_01]: And I know I'm sounding like a Rams Apologist, but like they've gone toe to toe with this team twice now.
26:17
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think you have to like what you see out in this guy.
26:20
[SPEAKER_02]: I gave you that.
26:21
[SPEAKER_02]: That's my positive.
26:22
[SPEAKER_02]: Here's my negative.
26:24
[SPEAKER_02]: I see two areas where the Rams haven't invested as much money and haven't invested as many draft picks that I think showed up as an issue corner corner offensive line yep like I just think when you watched it like the the
26:42
[SPEAKER_02]: Panthers were able to get to, and this is a credit to Ezra, right?
26:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, but the Panthers were able to get to Matthew Stafford, and the Rams told us in training for Roger McCreary in the Middle East in the corner was an issue.
26:59
[SPEAKER_02]: But part of it is philosophical, right?
27:01
[SPEAKER_02]: Like if you look like really there was a pivot point coming out of, you know, Jalen Ramsey and, you know, like where they really moved way towards, like we're going all in undefensive Lyme and an offensive skill players.
27:13
[SPEAKER_02]: And if you look like over the last couple of years, like heavy, heavy investment in those areas, with the belief like we can make a work.
27:21
[SPEAKER_02]: corner, like where they view it as those, even the best corners or speed bumps in today's game, not stop signs.
27:29
[SPEAKER_02]: And then we can make a work on the offensive line.
27:32
[SPEAKER_02]: And I, and I do wonder how much of what the Panthers put on tape there against the Rams.
27:39
[SPEAKER_02]: now shows up with the bears and shows up with DJ Moore and Roman Dunze and Luther Burton and shows up with Montez sweat and that group like I you know how much is Dennis Allen able to take advantage of some of the things that may be easier I'll put on tape like that that to me is going to be interesting because I I'm with the I think the ramp still I think the ramp still the highest ceiling of any team right
28:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Like there were some things in that game where I was like, yeah, I wonder if that's not just a clip, you know, every team has something ugly that they're hiding under the surface and that's one, you know, everybody's kind of, you know, everybody's kind of mask in it and we'll see who does a better job.
28:19
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's ultimately what it comes down to on the, we'll stay here and actually let's flip over the AFC because I got some.
28:33
[SPEAKER_02]: Like I view the Panthers the Jaguar is the Patriots like there were a few teams that I think were like sort of house money teams going into the playoffs like even if they lose Really great season a lot to build on.
28:45
[SPEAKER_01]: I think the Panthers are in that category great season for Dave Camalas in that group Let's go to the night game from that one Chicago Bears won 31 to 27 and I Don't know about you, but when Brandon McMahon is mixed miss the kick right before the half
29:02
[SPEAKER_01]: I just had this chilling feeling for Matt LaForex.
29:07
[SPEAKER_01]: I do like Matt LaForex.
29:08
[SPEAKER_01]: I think he's a good coach, I think he's a good dude.
29:10
[SPEAKER_01]: And I just had this chilling feeling, especially when I watched him do the half-time interview.
29:15
[SPEAKER_01]: And I wonder if he knew that like the bears were going to come back out of this like a house on fire.
29:20
[SPEAKER_01]: And they did.
29:21
[SPEAKER_01]: And ended up being what 25 fourth quarter points.
29:27
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, my god.
29:29
[SPEAKER_02]: I thought,
29:30
[SPEAKER_02]: I thought, well, we could start with the bears, and then we'll get to a floor, right?
29:35
[SPEAKER_02]: So I thought this was not to oversimplify it, but this was like a Ben Johnson and Caleb Williams game, you know what I mean?
29:42
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, and I just, that's why I think it starts for me with some of the things that Ben did in that game.
29:51
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think you can kind of see the advantages that he's giving the team and the conflict that he's putting defenses in nonstop, right?
29:59
[SPEAKER_02]: Right.
30:00
[SPEAKER_02]: So there's the two point conversion that I believe cut the lead to three, the pack or three to three, right?
30:05
[SPEAKER_02]: Where they come out and you see him, I think you saw him in the silent, they're all doing the flex, right?
30:10
[SPEAKER_02]: Like to like to go jumbo.
30:12
[SPEAKER_02]: So they, I don't know, was two or three tight ends, but they threw a big personnel grouping out there and they line
30:18
[SPEAKER_02]: And that big personnel grouping on the two yard line and then they spread out and they got Colston Lovelin isolated on a linebackers or results.
30:30
[SPEAKER_02]: So for people who don't know, the reason you would do that is because you've got like this clean on the chess board in Lovelin, right?
30:36
[SPEAKER_02]: And so it's how can we generate a matchup for them?
30:40
[SPEAKER_02]: And by putting bigger personnel out there, you're forcing the other team to take their defense and backs off the field and put bigger people out there.
30:48
[SPEAKER_02]: So you're you're you're you're you're you're compromise in them.
30:51
[SPEAKER_02]: And so you saw that like where you compromise them got Colson leveling one on one with a um
30:58
[SPEAKER_02]: with a lineback or easy to point conversion.
31:02
[SPEAKER_02]: And then the game wasn't touched down.
31:03
[SPEAKER_02]: And I asked DJ Moore about this after the game.
31:05
[SPEAKER_02]: He, I was wide open.
31:06
[SPEAKER_02]: This wasn't like a high level Caleb Williams throw, right?
31:09
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, why, why the f-ulton?
31:13
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
31:13
[SPEAKER_02]: DJ explained to me and I had to go back and look at it.
31:16
[SPEAKER_02]: But DJ explained to me, like how the fake screen on that, right?
31:20
[SPEAKER_02]: So you had a fake screen on that.
31:23
[SPEAKER_02]: And then you had loveland who was out there to block on the screen.
31:27
[SPEAKER_02]: The two guys out there, and you made the defenders choose, or you're going to cover loveland or more.
31:33
[SPEAKER_02]: And so they had to cover the screen.
31:36
[SPEAKER_02]: So they're covering it coming down to cover the screen.
31:39
[SPEAKER_02]: And then the guys in the back end, like, so you have, you know, the safety's in the back end.
31:44
[SPEAKER_02]: And now they've got a both respect the screen and oh wait a minute, those guys are now running down.
31:50
[SPEAKER_02]: And we got a pick one to cover.
31:52
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, DJ Moore was like, I mean, it was a it was an easy, you know, obviously easy, easy throw there for for Caleb to make.
32:00
[SPEAKER_02]: So that's the benefit advantage.
32:02
[SPEAKER_02]: And then Caleb, that fourth and eighth throw is one of the best throws I've ever seen.
32:07
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
32:15
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, both of his feet were off the ground, both of them.
32:28
[SPEAKER_02]: against them and his momentum like this is a thing you're you're rolling left your right hand a quarterback.
32:35
[SPEAKER_02]: You're not like running into your you're you're throwing against your momentum.
32:39
[SPEAKER_02]: uh... and that spot he put it into two but it was like i mean it was just dropped right into roma dunza like you had two defenders high and you had two defenders low and he just drops it right in there was ridiculous so here's the advantage of k-lib and i've been thinking about this lot having watched jaylin hurts
33:00
[SPEAKER_01]: it in person and then having seen the bear's game.
33:03
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think it kind of struck me this weekend and curious what you thought is on this.
33:07
[SPEAKER_01]: When the game is out of hand, theoretically, and you're put into obvious passing situations.
33:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Caleb is kind of the great equalizer, because like Mahomes or like Allen, he can extend plays, and he has the arm talent to drop balls into past first coverages.
33:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Probably unlike at most anybody else in the NFL.
33:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Now we're gonna get
33:32
[SPEAKER_01]: hyperbolic here and we're going to say oh he's the greatest and the greatest and the greatest and he's on a heater right now he's all-time confident there's no question about it but that is part of the reason why the cardiac nature of this team is part of its identity because Caleb can bring them back I think if the bears had Jalen Hertz or you know Jalen is just the example I'm using right now I think a lot of these games where they've got down they would
33:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Caleb has this arm talent.
34:01
[SPEAKER_01]: He has this evasiveness and he has this confidence.
34:04
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, we've said it both ways too, because I don't want to talk out of both sides of my mouth.
34:08
[SPEAKER_01]: It's it's cost them and he's made bad throws in those situations.
34:13
[SPEAKER_01]: But he's on an all-time heater.
34:14
[SPEAKER_01]: He's making good throws.
34:15
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't shake him.
34:17
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't shake him.
34:18
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and I think like part of that is
34:22
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, the amount of big game experience he has, you know, I mean, this is a kid who I believe like his first college action, he was he was dropped into the red river shoot out, you know, right, like and like and wound up like winning that game and stealing the job from Spencer Ratler that year is a true freshman.
34:40
[SPEAKER_02]: And so, like, I think, you know, just the experiences he's had, like, playing in big games and college, playing in high-level situations, being on a team is last year at USC, where he needed to be the best player on every single play.
34:54
[SPEAKER_02]: Yep, give us a team of chance.
34:55
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, like, I think just that accumulation of experiences,
34:59
[SPEAKER_02]: like put him in a spot where it's like okay when things didn't go wrong early in this game or when I do throw a pick or one one does get away from me I've got this library of experiences in my head where I know I know it's not going to kill me, you know, and I just think like just how call me was in the biggest moments.
35:21
[SPEAKER_02]: That bear's team is dangerous, like you look at the three quarterbacks that went at the top of that draft holy crap like what we might be looking for the next tentative for sure yeah, yeah, I mean, it's and you know, Caleb was sort of the last one, you know, like where we
35:47
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you know, I would say as late as like November and it just he's done a really good job erasing all of those on the flip side Albert.
35:58
[SPEAKER_01]: I think this game.
36:00
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, I think I've had fun with it and we've had our fun with it, but I think about myself and how competitive I am and how football coaches are 10,000 more times competitive than any of us can be.
36:13
[SPEAKER_01]: And for Matt LaFlor to walk to midfield and see a howling Ben Johnson, like if you can see the still footage of that.
36:22
[SPEAKER_01]: And then to watch Ben go into the locker room and start screaming, you know, fuck the packers, fuck the packers.
36:28
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, and having Ben had called his shot at the beginning of the season, like just as a competitor.
36:36
[SPEAKER_01]: And whatever, no one's going to feel good, bad about a guy making whatever Matt LaFlor is making a year, but like, that has to be an absolute kick to the midsection, unlike anything that you've felt in sports, right?
36:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that is losing to your chief rival, the guy in the other sideline is a very happy, blind person, you know, one year.
36:59
[SPEAKER_01]: You know I call that like I now the discussion shifts to whether or not you're going to be brought back as the head coach Which I think he is by the way.
37:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I like you want me to give like people like a little bit of like the landscape there.
37:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Please.
37:13
[SPEAKER_02]: I have a word is so
37:14
[SPEAKER_02]: Even the nitty-gritty of it is the Packers have a new team president.
37:20
[SPEAKER_02]: His name is Ed Paul.
37:20
[SPEAKER_02]: See people who have followed the league for a few decades like I have.
37:24
[SPEAKER_02]: My recognized the name is Dad, his current policy who helped build the nine or back in the day, Joe Montana, Steve Young.
37:30
[SPEAKER_02]: So Ed Paul, see who had been there before.
37:32
[SPEAKER_02]: Like he wasn't new, like he's not new to the building, but you know, like his new and the role of team president,
37:39
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, the transition happened from Mark Murphy over the summer.
37:43
[SPEAKER_02]: He had an opportunity at the time to extend both Matt LaFlor and Brian Gooticoos to add two years left on their contracts he declined to do it, which naturally raised questions, okay, like, well, if you just got this job and you're choosing not to do it now, why?
37:59
[SPEAKER_02]: And does this mean Matt LaFlor is coaching for his job in 2025?
38:04
[SPEAKER_02]: So that's the backdrop.
38:07
[SPEAKER_02]: The other thing is that the coaching market has changed.
38:11
[SPEAKER_02]: And so, Atlas Flores value, I mean, look, I know I wrote like the $15 million number, the other day, and that got some people's attention.
38:22
[SPEAKER_02]: I would just tell you this, the guy in the other sideline, who isn't his first year's head coach, ain't far off from making that number.
38:30
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not right there, but I think it's just a couple million short of it.
38:34
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, so, and that wasn't his, his, his, his biggest offer.
38:38
[SPEAKER_02]: So like,
38:40
[SPEAKER_02]: That's just where the market is.
38:42
[SPEAKER_02]: And so are the packers willing to go there?
38:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Are they willing to go to $15 million per?
38:48
[SPEAKER_02]: I think the packers will enter into good faith negotiations to get something done.
38:53
[SPEAKER_02]: But I think where this couldn't get sideways is if the contract if the negotiation doesn't
39:00
[SPEAKER_02]: immediately get traction and doesn't immediately get going, does Matt Ryan call, you know, Matt LaFlor was Matt Ryan's position coach when Matt Ryan won the MVP and went to the Super Bowl does John Eric Sullivan call.
39:17
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, so I think that's where this is a little tricky, you know, and so I'm interested to see how that goes.
39:27
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, what does that look like
39:30
[SPEAKER_02]: I think the world of Matt LaFlorer, I think he is a damn good head coach.
39:37
[SPEAKER_02]: I think he's done a damn good job in Green Day and transitioning from Aaron Rogers to Jordan Muff.
39:46
[SPEAKER_02]: I think he did what he could with this year's team having lost Micaparsans and Devontay Wyatt.
39:53
[SPEAKER_02]: They lost Edron Cooper who's very underrated.
39:56
[SPEAKER_02]: I had him in second team all pro.
39:59
[SPEAKER_02]: But a very underrated player and I had like so they lose him in-game.
40:03
[SPEAKER_02]: They didn't have tuckered craft in the offense for the second half of the year.
40:06
[SPEAKER_02]: So I think he's a really good
40:12
[SPEAKER_02]: do the packers are the packers ready to pay them at that level right and like if they're at all if they all have trepidation if they at all have trepidation about it and someone calls will they listen and it's complicated right because
40:29
[SPEAKER_01]: it's not a cut and dry your fire situation exactly and we saw this to some degree although my guess would be a little less or a little more back of the napkin style but with the cowboys in Mike McCarthy where it's like you let him go you let him go get the point where you have to extend him and here's a below market offer that you know
40:51
[SPEAKER_01]: A coach of your stats, you probably shouldn't be accepting.
40:54
[SPEAKER_01]: If you respect what you've done and you want to stand on that.
40:59
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that that could create some chaos.
41:02
[SPEAKER_01]: But one more just kind of note that I thought was interesting for the season started and it's very relevant to this game and part of the reason, very small reason why the packers got got beaten this one.
41:13
[SPEAKER_01]: For the season started, Ben Johnson had two guys talk to,
41:18
[SPEAKER_01]: the team to new bears free agents talk to the team about the game never being over.
41:25
[SPEAKER_01]: One is Joe Tuney, his new offensive lineman, who was on one side of the 28-to-3 comeback.
41:30
[SPEAKER_01]: The other was gradie Jarrett, his new defensive lineman, who was on the other side of the 28-to-3 comeback.
41:37
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, these little things, I think, you know, sometimes you make to know how about Joe Tuney,
41:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Just unstop.
41:44
[SPEAKER_02]: Tony Joe, Tony has been in the in the conference championship game every 41 straight years.
41:49
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
41:50
[SPEAKER_02]: It's career.
41:51
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
41:51
[SPEAKER_02]: And like like the teams that he left collapsed.
41:56
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a tuna factor, man.
41:57
[SPEAKER_02]: It's unbelievable, isn't it like wild though?
42:00
[SPEAKER_02]: Like when you look at it, it's, I think I might be wrong but I think, I think he was in the Patriots in 2020 and didn't go that year with Cam as the quarterback.
42:11
[SPEAKER_02]: But I think every other year, so it would be 16, maybe not, no.
42:17
[SPEAKER_02]: See now I'm getting all mixed up.
42:19
[SPEAKER_02]: But he went to at least three with the Patriots.
42:21
[SPEAKER_02]: And one, two superables with the Patriots, then one, two superables with the Chiefs, when the conference title game every year he was there, and now he goes to the Bears and well, and behold, they're one one away from getting to that level.
42:35
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think like honestly, like all joking aside, like he's a real difference maker.
42:40
[SPEAKER_02]: Like he, I think he changed the culture and that offensive line room, and you know, very much gave the Bears what they need with so many new guys
42:52
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
42:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Man.
42:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Tunie.
42:56
[SPEAKER_01]: I've got to go out and trade for him.
42:59
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the only way.
43:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Two more here to get to.
43:03
[SPEAKER_01]: I want to get New England and the Chargers out of the way.
43:06
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's not to not give the Patriots, their flowers.
43:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I thought that this was an okay game, but I also don't think it's controversial.
43:13
[SPEAKER_01]: I've ever to say that if they played this way against just about anybody else in this playoff field, they might lose that game by 10 points.
43:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Is that incorrect?
43:23
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think like the one thing that would be encouraging from the Patriots perspective is they were able to win a game on defense, yep, and like Drake was not Drake was not as best Drake, Drake missed some throws and I think you do have like a little bit of a weather concern there because of the way that the Buffalo game got away from him in December.
43:43
[SPEAKER_02]: He did put on the capo need to like he had the 37 year run at the end of the first half which put them in a position to take a lead and then, you know, he makes the throw to throw to hunter Henry to essentially put the game away and so I think defensively, you know, what you were able to get as far as pressuring just in Herbert.
44:04
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think it was something like 16 pressures and six sacks, right?
44:07
[SPEAKER_01]: Whatever the number was, so that the disruption rate, if you combined all disruptive things, Justin Herbert was under directs on almost 70% of his dropbacks, which is the bulkers.
44:19
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a lot.
44:21
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
44:21
[SPEAKER_02]: So, I mean, like, I like that the question, of course, then would be does that translate
44:27
[SPEAKER_02]: with against, you know, the Houston offensive line may be does that translate against the Pittsburgh offensive line may be does that translate against the Buffalo or Denver offensive line probably not, you know, like so I think that that that piece of it to me.
44:45
[SPEAKER_02]: How is this translate?
44:47
[SPEAKER_02]: I think you give them credit.
44:49
[SPEAKER_02]: They're more complete than they show that they were more, a little more complete than maybe people thought they were coming into the weekend.
44:56
[SPEAKER_02]: I think the question is that outstanding defensive effort, what does it look like against a team that doesn't have an offensive line that is just
45:05
[SPEAKER_01]: I like an offensive line group has been an infirmary all year, you know, they were over three in the red zone, New England and Jesse Minner, he's a tough coordinator to go against, and so that makes a lot of sense.
45:19
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I thought Jesse Minner kept them in the game.
45:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, quite frankly.
45:24
[SPEAKER_01]: But you know, you go over three in the red zone if you're New England.
45:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I think, you know, the chance to have whatever it was, nine points become 21 points or I forget what it was at the end.
45:36
[SPEAKER_01]: But those are things that are gonna come back to haunt you.
45:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Obviously, protection, especially on that left side.
45:43
[SPEAKER_01]: And you have ball security issues.
45:45
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, this is one of those things that
45:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Here's what's wild about this variable team is that Albert.
45:51
[SPEAKER_01]: This was the largest margin of victory on wild card weekend so far.
45:55
[SPEAKER_01]: And now we're still the Steelers and Texans.
45:57
[SPEAKER_02]: This is the one game that really wasn't in and out at the end.
45:59
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
45:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
46:00
[SPEAKER_01]: And I guess that's the other thing I want to get to very quickly in that one is where in God's name was the urgency from this team, this charge of steam.
46:09
[SPEAKER_01]: And I get it.
46:11
[SPEAKER_01]: I get it.
46:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Herbert's banged up.
46:12
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a constant pat near constant pass rush.
46:16
[SPEAKER_01]: you want this guy to survive.
46:18
[SPEAKER_01]: And I understand that, but I remember, I was in my, I was in my lovely Marriott, looked freshly renovated, really nice.
46:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And just like jumping on the bed,
46:29
[SPEAKER_02]: wondering why when Christian Gonzalez isn't out you aren't in like the like a cocaine huddle like let's go like I throw every time I think you know I think you saw it at the end of the game to they did start to move it at the very end of the game but like you got to start way sooner or more yeah and I think you know what that is is kind of like where I mean to me it was like
46:53
[SPEAKER_02]: If you play that slow all year, right, which they had to do, like that was their whole M.O.
46:59
[SPEAKER_02]: was we're dragging games into a dark alley, we're going to bleed the play clock.
47:05
[SPEAKER_02]: We're going to dominate time and possession.
47:07
[SPEAKER_02]: We're going to limit possessions for the other team and lean into what we feel is our strength, which is the defense, right?
47:13
[SPEAKER_02]: So I think they led the NFL, or they were near the top of the NFL.
47:16
[SPEAKER_02]: They had like 33 minutes time and possession average,
47:23
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think they effectively did that in the first half, right?
47:26
[SPEAKER_02]: Like they were able to kind of keep the game sort of, sort of played in a phone booth, you know, and it's just,
47:38
[SPEAKER_02]: When do you get the point where it's like you're you got to pull the rep cart cord and go you know what I mean like and you got a and you got to get yourself out of that mode where every single I mean everything looked hard for them you know what I mean like every single play that they made offensively was in traffic or It just you kind of and Justin Herbert didn't play great like I'm not exonerating him.
48:00
[SPEAKER_02]: But you kind of felt for him a little bit like, and it wasn't just the injuries, it was like at some point doing you have to make an adjustment and like start to play tempo and like do something to dictate terms the defense where they can't just dial up pressure after pressure after pressure because it felt like, you know, Zach curve is done a great job as the interim DC and doing one like they could do whatever they wanted, you know, and I think part of that was related back to the charger's pace of play.
48:31
[SPEAKER_01]: I, I stepped in in a little bit last night because I was a little bit more raw.
48:36
[SPEAKER_01]: I taped a show with my buddies, Dan and Mark right after that game and I was like, you know, this team, once they lose Jesse Minner, like, what's going to happen here?
48:46
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he's kept them in a lot of games this year and I got a lot of pushback from that.
48:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, just waiting till Harbo's got his offensive line back and they're going to be rough and tumble rough and tumble and they're going to be able to play that way that they want to play that's true Albert, but like you can't count on a healthy offensive line there has to be something that transcends that, you know, I think like so so that that you
49:10
[SPEAKER_02]: obviously you hope like that you'll have and that's a bad injury sliders coming back from all joe all it'll be fine like that's right or something is a bad one you know like so like the Patella tendon for a big man always if he and we saw two of those this weekend which is always tough to see with Aussie trippill and I think you keep equino both at them right so but I get that that point right like which is
49:36
[SPEAKER_02]: If we had the two tackles, like a Marion Hampton barely played, like clearly he wasn't himself and he tried to give it a go and it didn't work.
49:47
[SPEAKER_02]: So when they have Hampton running behind those two guys, like I think they certainly will have more of a chance, but you're right, like you do have to build in, like a little flexibility.
49:58
[SPEAKER_02]: And so, you know, like obviously like I think you
50:05
[SPEAKER_02]: Um, you have to look at Ladbaconkey.
50:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Why don't we get more out of him?
50:09
[SPEAKER_02]: You're going to have to make a decision on Quentin Johnston.
50:12
[SPEAKER_02]: Yep.
50:12
[SPEAKER_02]: So like this offseason, I think for them is going to be a lot.
50:15
[SPEAKER_02]: It's going to be much about how do we find a way to maybe get a weapon or two that is going to at the very least keep defense as honest and at best.
50:27
[SPEAKER_02]: put us in a position where if Slater all do go down for a game or two or we don't have Hampton for a stretch, we still have, you know, we have another lever that we can pull.
50:39
[SPEAKER_01]: The last one here, and you know, we'll move on.
50:43
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, listen, I'm not gonna do the Patriots thing anymore.
50:47
[SPEAKER_01]: I think they've won in so many different ways.
50:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think this game proves that they've been resilient, they've been exhaustive, they've been high flying, they've been grinded out.
50:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just, I'm just, I'm just, you're definitely a wolf in my variable credit too.
51:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
51:01
[SPEAKER_01]: They hit on just about everybody.
51:03
[SPEAKER_01]: And we talked about that where it was, you know, so often,
51:08
[SPEAKER_01]: When you're bringing over pieces from a place that you were before, it feels very like post-Bella check and a lot of what is assistance used to do where it was like, let me just go get this guy because and
51:22
[SPEAKER_01]: never as a working out you pay a bunch of money for them and don't play well this was I need to bring over guys of character I need to bring over guys that really kind of fit the flow of what we're doing and like spleen and there's there's a couple examples like that right where guys they knew like spleen Harold Landry Carl Davis was what Terrell Williams and Detroit
51:44
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, Morgan Moes, this wasn't coached directly by Todd Downing, but they were together, you know, with the jets.
51:50
[SPEAKER_02]: So there are definitely examples of it.
51:52
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
51:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, let's get to Albert last, but not least, uh, Buffalo beating Jacksonville, 27 to 24.
52:00
[SPEAKER_01]: I think this is one of those gutted out wins for the bills that they needed.
52:05
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, I want to, you know, you have to refresh your memory and remember how crappy some of these teams that won the Super Bowl looked in the first few rounds of the playoffs.
52:15
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like once we get to the Super Bowl and the team wins the Super Bowl,
52:19
[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like we always rewrite their history like they were Nick Saban's Alabama or like Newt Rockney's Notre Dame and how this was always destined in the stars when really there's a lot of messed up moments that these guys are just simply weathering and getting past and buffalo needed but you talk about Caleb Williams.
52:37
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that was the best throw the playoffs Josh Allen though to Brandon Cooks was probably the second one he was getting while up to yeah.
52:45
[SPEAKER_02]: But when you saw that, who was it there on the on the blitz there?
52:49
[SPEAKER_02]: Like whoever that was, like, just had a free shot at him.
52:55
[SPEAKER_02]: And I watched that, like, and I saw, I mean, I like it was like, is he gonna get the ball there?
53:03
[SPEAKER_02]: And I mean, this guy is, again, we've said it over and over again.
53:10
[SPEAKER_02]: There's no one like him, and you almost feel bad watching them play.
53:15
[SPEAKER_02]: How could I not vote for him for MVP?
53:17
[SPEAKER_02]: He's the best player in the sport.
53:19
[SPEAKER_02]: He's like nobody means as much to their team as Josh Allen means to the bills.
53:24
[SPEAKER_02]: And just
53:27
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, like that throw to me, his ability to bring them back, like the the willingness to run and put himself in there and stick his nose in there and then you can see how like even like the the the funky like 10 yard push play there at the like that but that to me tells you like how all in the it's great.
53:51
[SPEAKER_02]: right it is the effort you're seeing and it's like we're going to take him or gonna push him all the way into the end zone I think it sort of says something for where they're at you know right it also and I think this is an important point because we've there's been lots of arguments over the last decade over fourth down theory and everything else
54:09
[SPEAKER_02]: I thought it was super interesting how Sean McDermott went the other way in this game.
54:15
[SPEAKER_02]: It was actually really conservative and didn't chase points.
54:19
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think when I look at that,
54:23
[SPEAKER_02]: Shelby, you can hit the beat button here.
54:25
[SPEAKER_02]: That was basically his approach.
54:28
[SPEAKER_02]: And those and being conservative in those situations was I have Josh fucking out, right?
54:34
[SPEAKER_02]: And I know that as long as I put my team in a position to win this game at the end,
54:40
[SPEAKER_02]: My guy is better than your guy, and that's why you play that way, right?
54:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Like you play that way because it's like, all right, like instead of handing the other team momentum, I'm going to take the points and I'm going to play to get to the end of the game because when we get to the end of the game, my guy is going to make every play he needs to make to win the game.
54:58
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's the ultimate, like to me, a respect and confidence.
55:01
[SPEAKER_02]: I have three written down here.
55:03
[SPEAKER_02]: So there was the fourth and four, where they were flagged.
55:08
[SPEAKER_02]: And so they kicked a 50-yard field goal there in the first half, Matt Prader hits that field goal, right?
55:15
[SPEAKER_02]: So that was a long field goal for a kicker who was banged up, but they choose not to go forward on fourth and four.
55:20
[SPEAKER_02]: So the decision was the same there.
55:22
[SPEAKER_02]: Then there was another fourth and fourth in the Jaguar's 45 at the end of the half where they pundit and took the delay, right?
55:30
[SPEAKER_02]: And that was, I think, all right, we're good, you know, we don't, we don't need to chase points here.
55:37
[SPEAKER_02]: And then, um,
55:39
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, in the early and the second half, I think this is the first second possession of the second half.
55:43
[SPEAKER_02]: There was a fourth and four from the Jags 29, where they send prey to out there again.
55:50
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a 47-yard field goal, and that one, yep, it was the first possession of the second half, put them up 13 to seven.
55:59
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think just those decisions essentially are like,
56:03
[SPEAKER_02]: We don't need to go nuts, but we don't at the end, we get the best player, you know, and we know what he's capable of doing and, you know, sure enough, Josh Allen made the throws he needed to make at the end of the game to win it.
56:15
[SPEAKER_02]: And, uh, man, I, I don't root for, I haven't rooted for anyone in an NFL game in over 20 years, but I want to see him on a Super Bowl stage.
56:27
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, I, I, I, I just the idea of having that player on that stage.
56:31
[SPEAKER_02]: I can just, it has to happen at some point.
56:34
[SPEAKER_02]: You know what I mean?
56:34
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, and I feel like with him turning 30 in the off season, it's kind of like,
56:39
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, if you feel like every time it doesn't happen, you kind of, it's almost taking away from the league a little bit, you know?
56:47
[SPEAKER_01]: So I agree.
56:49
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's why I pick, I picked the Rams Bill's Super Bowl because I'm tired of predicting.
56:53
[SPEAKER_02]: I didn't know you knew what's been on that.
56:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I am.
56:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, my second chance, my initial one was Eagles Bills.
57:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
57:01
[SPEAKER_01]: And at the beginning of the season, and then when we did it again, mids, end of season before the playoff started, I wanted Rams Bills.
57:08
[SPEAKER_02]: I didn't use in mid-season and of season Ramsville, so every good for you.
57:13
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a mid-a-stick insistent.
57:14
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, because I never get it right, so I figured if I had a chance here and in mid-season it was looking pretty good, it's like I have a chance here, I'd better stick with it.
57:24
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, I think this too, and I want to say one thing about Liam Cohen, who my God, I mean, pushed
57:33
[SPEAKER_01]: buffalo to the absolute brink in this one.
57:37
[SPEAKER_01]: And if your day to criticism of him is that you didn't run the ball enough in the second half.
57:46
[SPEAKER_01]: And I suppose.
57:49
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, that's that's something that you can get on them for, but like that to me feels like champagne problems at this point, honestly, I mean, you know, and yes, it was like a 71% rushing success rate and clearly the bills are compromised in that way.
58:07
[SPEAKER_01]: But at the same time, the same principle, we're trying to develop this monolith and Trevor Lawrence that Buffalo has in Josh Allen that the bears have are starting to get in Caleb Williams where
58:19
[SPEAKER_01]: He transcends game plan and moment, and sometimes in those situations, Albert, I mean, I thought a lot about this on the way home from Philly too, where I was prepared to just, you know, kick Liam Cohen up and down the street and say,
58:41
[SPEAKER_01]: The Jaguarists don't necessarily have a world-beating offensive line, they're schemeed well, but maybe he just wasn't getting a looks that he needed, you know, and I just think, you know, if that's your criticism of Liam after this when I think he did a pretty good job.
58:53
[SPEAKER_02]: I also think, like, honestly, I'm just like looking at the inactive list for Buffalo.
59:00
[SPEAKER_02]: They could get better over the course the next couple of weeks.
59:02
[SPEAKER_02]: Sure can.
59:03
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, Terrell Bernard didn't play.
59:05
[SPEAKER_02]: Ty Johnson didn't play.
59:07
[SPEAKER_02]: Harrison didn't play.
59:09
[SPEAKER_02]: That's their first round pick for people who don't know.
59:13
[SPEAKER_02]: Could they get in an all-ver-back?
59:15
[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe, you know, like an head of Oliver's probably,
59:20
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know for my money.
59:21
[SPEAKER_02]: They're best defense of player, right?
59:22
[SPEAKER_02]: Right.
59:24
[SPEAKER_02]: So like this is a Buffalo team that over the course of the playoffs could get better.
59:31
[SPEAKER_02]: And I mean, you know, again, like I just, I think there's a little something going on there.
59:37
[SPEAKER_02]: I do think you can kind of feel the urgency and look there should be, right?
59:41
[SPEAKER_02]: No Patrick Mahomes, no Lamar Jackson, no Joe Burrow in the playoffs.
59:45
[SPEAKER_02]: So, and I think like,
59:48
[SPEAKER_02]: in a weird way, and maybe this is just a dumb media thing, maybe it is.
59:52
[SPEAKER_02]: But I think there's a lot of pressure on them to win the yesterday.
59:56
[SPEAKER_02]: Yep.
59:57
[SPEAKER_02]: I think there was a ton of pressure on them to win the yesterday.
59:59
[SPEAKER_02]: And I do wonder if getting through that, you know, and getting through beating the upstart Jaguar and a really good Jaguar team, I wonder if getting through that has like some sort of liberating effect where now they can just go play, you know.
1:00:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the road playoff game, it's a legit thing, right?
1:00:17
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that the bills have been dealing with this in one way or another throughout the season.
1:00:21
[SPEAKER_01]: And maybe too, McDermott, you get that monkey off your back.
1:00:25
[SPEAKER_01]: Because I said this going into the game, all of a sudden,
1:00:28
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, John Harbogg, it's fired.
1:00:30
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
1:00:30
[SPEAKER_01]: Mike Tom, when we're still talking about him, Matt LaFlor, like you said Albert, we're talking about this as good faith negotiations, but we're adding that massive caveat here that this could break down because Green Bay is saying, I don't want to give you that much.
1:00:43
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think it worth that much money.
1:00:45
[SPEAKER_01]: And so if you're McDermott, you're sitting there and you're going, well, shit.
1:00:50
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, look what's happening to all these other guys.
1:00:52
[SPEAKER_01]: Like all I do is win, but I don't win enough.
1:00:55
[SPEAKER_01]: And sometimes ownership, it's like a disease of group thought.
1:00:59
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think just making it to the next round there, probably freeze him up to be like, okay, I could take some more chances.
1:01:05
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, because I saw, we were talking in the Eagles press box, actually, about this.
1:01:09
[SPEAKER_01]: And before we get out of here, I curious your take on this, too.
1:01:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Why didn't McDermott kneel?
1:01:16
[SPEAKER_02]: the clock and milk more time before the end of the game and that was an interesting one because I remember there was no one game earlier in the year do you remember this one Drake made died at the one yard line yes and against Tampa and I sort of was wondering do you do something like that right?
1:01:33
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
1:01:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And so it was me and the great Adam Kilgore from the Washington Post, great Jory absolutely love you know me and Kilgore were together at the Boston Globe.
1:01:43
[SPEAKER_02]: I was the National NFL writer and Kilgore was the beat guy.
1:01:47
[SPEAKER_01]: I do remember that.
1:01:48
[SPEAKER_02]: Kilgore had some fun nice.
1:01:50
[SPEAKER_02]: I was still
1:01:51
[SPEAKER_02]: still in my 20s at that point.
1:01:53
[SPEAKER_02]: So there you go.
1:01:55
[SPEAKER_01]: There you go.
1:01:56
[SPEAKER_02]: So we're going to get after it.
1:01:57
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh yeah.
1:01:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Legend.
1:01:59
[SPEAKER_01]: One of the great one of the great feature men in our business, but we were all arguing about it and Adam was right.
1:02:05
[SPEAKER_01]: He's like, why didn't you know more time off the clock?
1:02:08
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, my response was
1:02:11
[SPEAKER_01]: If I feel secure in my job, I'm probably kneeling the clock down.
1:02:15
[SPEAKER_01]: If I'm worried that one more dumbass mistake is gonna get me fired if I lose this game, I'm scoring the touchdown and then I'm betting on myself as a defensive mind ahead coach to think that I could plug the gap on the other end.
1:02:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that, yeah, I'm not saying that sort of came down to, but my overarching point is that I do think McDermott probably gets freed up a little bit by this victory and that can be the best thing that can happen for the bills at this point.
1:02:40
[SPEAKER_02]: I can't remember, they're being that much pressure on someone like that's on a cogent quarterback that are seated sixth in the bracket, you know what I mean?
1:02:52
[SPEAKER_02]: Like right, like again, like we talked about the house money dynamic again, I think the Patriots, the Jaguars, the the Panthers, there are some teams that are like definitely the house money teams where if they lost, if they lose at any point in the playoffs,
1:03:13
[SPEAKER_02]: Whether or not the season is a success is going to be determined by what happens in a playoffs role with the bills like they think that's like at another level just because they've been so close because of who's not in the playoffs this year.
1:03:25
[SPEAKER_02]: There's just like another level of pressure on them and you know again, gain that first one against a really tough.
1:03:33
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I'm so impressed with the way the Jaguar has played the last month and a half like I I think they have something real
1:03:39
[SPEAKER_02]: you know, and to be able to beat that team in their place, um, just, I think says a lot about where the bills are and maybe we'll get your bills ramps to a rule now.
1:03:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Hello.
1:03:50
[SPEAKER_01]: All right.
1:03:51
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, so we are going to, uh, we're going to prep Albert.
1:03:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm probably going to cook, uh, something up for, uh, Monday night football here.
1:03:58
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
1:03:58
[SPEAKER_02]: So, you know, tweet at the play, too.
1:04:00
[SPEAKER_01]: I might tweet out the play.
1:04:01
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I, I'm just, uh, I'm not creative
1:04:09
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, I would say before the weekend knowing that I was going to go away and everything it was like, let's make some ground beef and then throw it on top of some Doritos like we're kind of getting there.
1:04:19
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I'm getting my little bit of my creativity back.
1:04:23
[SPEAKER_01]: I might try to, uh, to get some festive going here from here.
1:04:27
[SPEAKER_02]: You want to trade trade info with Emily here?
1:04:29
[SPEAKER_02]: She's, uh,
1:04:30
[SPEAKER_02]: She's, but she's really got into it in the last six months or so.
1:04:33
[SPEAKER_02]: I think she's going to do a short or a bra me tonight, which I'm, um, I'm interested in.
1:04:37
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
1:04:37
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
1:04:37
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
1:04:38
[SPEAKER_02]: She's been on the cry.
1:04:39
[SPEAKER_02]: Are you a big crock park guy?
1:04:41
[SPEAKER_01]: When I have the time and the energy and which I think you and I both know at this point in the game, uh, time and you're the tall grass.
1:04:49
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm out of those.
1:04:50
[SPEAKER_02]: We're out of the tall grass now.
1:04:52
[SPEAKER_02]: You're right.
1:04:52
[SPEAKER_02]: All grass.
1:04:53
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
1:04:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, but, you know, we might celebrate on that and we got Bills, Broncos Bills to look forward to in Denver.
1:04:59
[SPEAKER_01]: We have New England and the winner of Steelers, Texans, look forward to, we've Seahawks and 49ers and Bears Rams and we're going to be back on Wednesday, Thursday, um, with some coaching carousel updates, maybe we'll re-match our best candidates and, uh, hey, comment, subscribe, like, tell us what you want on YouTube, uh, tell us what you want on Apple Podcasts when you leave review.
1:05:22
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll do it.
1:05:23
[SPEAKER_01]: We're not like the Eagles.
1:05:26
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll change.
1:05:27
[SPEAKER_01]: We promise.
1:05:28
[SPEAKER_01]: See you next time.